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Speaker 1: So I have dogs Biggie Smalls at b I G G Y S M A L l Z. If you want to follow dogs that really don't do much there mid level dogs. They've even been I've even been told by trainers at their middle of the pack dogs. And I always knew that before um I got a trainer. I said, there's sort of just like two Irish guys sitting at a bar drinking beer that are really loving and really nice and really loyal. Um Smalls is a little bit of like a criminal. There was a movie State of Grace and then the Town with Ben Affleck and he's like the Jeremy Rennert character, and Biggie's the guy who was like a little bit more the guy who drove the getaway the Getaway to get Getaway vam and they were stealing all the money. Biggie we call little Lumpy. So then we had a train and I used to say their mid level guys like Bigy we get in trouble and forget the keys to the VAM and he's driving away from the crime scene and small As always has like things that he's working on. He's always operating, and small As tremendous anxiety. Like I feel like one of these successful people that says their dog needs a therapist, only because I'm successful and I can say that, I promise you my dog is massive anxiety shakes, the tongue goes down to the floor, doesn't like music, doesn't like water, doesn't like um when people ring the doorbell. But I mean not and not like a normal dog that just barks like shaking. Tremendously massive anxiety disorder. This dog. So we give them CBD. And he's got a thunder vest and he's he's got some issues. For their brothers there one litter. They're twins, but they're like fifteen pounds difference, so I call them they're one dog. They're literally are never they've never been an inch away from each other. One time one of them ran after a dog on the beach and the other one was whimpering quant crying. I think it was smalls crying. So they're fiercely loyal, but they're flawed dogs. They pe the four years old. It's shameful. I'm embarrassed. They pee on anything furry, like the corner of anything furry. They pick certain corners of couches. They like the corner of a curtain, like the bottom corner of a curtain, they like the corner of a couch. And we walked them all the time. In fact, it became too much. We were walking them because I think they think it's a p for all. They think you could just pee anytime you want, and what's crazy is that. And you're supposed to leave dogs water because if they go outside they're hot, aren't they dehydrated and thirsty. So we got in this trainer. His name is Bash and I think he's training. I know he's trained Ronald Reagan's dog, and I think he was called by the Bidens, and I think the Wrenda gave him to me. But he's this famous dog trainer. He came over. I was going to send them away for like three weeks, which seemed counterintuitive because you send them away, but they're not at home, so they're not learning habits at home. And Brin was devastated and so historically hysterically crying because when she was little and we got them a couple of months after because of the same problem, we sent them away, and she feels like she missed a lot of their childhood. So she feels like she missed too much, and she cries if she thinks about them moving away. She's very sensitive and she'll h historically cry and she always has a spear. I'm giving them away, which I am never giving them away, and live for them. They're my children. But they do pe They p. You know you have dogs, They pee in other rooms. They hide it. You can't figure it out. You can't catch them in the crime. Oddly, if I catch them in the crime, I'm excited because I get to have a loud voice about it. But it never happens. They're really smooth criminals. I don't even know who the culprit really is. I don't know if it's one of them, two of them. Seems like they double down, so I don't know who the guilty culprit really is. And it maybe both of them. It could be like a double crime scene. I don't know. So this trainer comes over and he's teaching us sits and stays, and I don't give a good funk about if they sit or stay. I only care about the peen. And by the way, this is what I did with Cookie, and this is what I started doing with these guys, And what to me was best method ever was crate training, create training because it was structure and if you're getting a dog, crate training is the best for people who are out more because you're not sitting home and then your dogs are around you and then they go pee. If you're out all day, you have someone after four hours, let them out to pee, put them back in the crate. They know when you get home it's time to go out and pee. And they basically when they're puppies, they're in the crate and their feet don't touch the ground until they're put outside. So he said, get a crate ore and the ore might be jamming us up. Or put them in a small room that you know they're comfortable and you know they won't pee in. So there's certain areas. If it's a bathroom you put them in. They don't pee where they hang out. They don't pee where they sleep. So what you do is the minute you wake up, because they sleep in bed with me and they don't pee in bed or pee in the room unless I let them wander, So they sleep in bed. The second you wake up. You take them right downstairs. Water first, water and food first. Then let them out. One of the problems is all the marking too. If you're walking them, don't let them be like the little P on every tree. It's supposed to be like the big P, which is very hard to control. So water first, not crazy crazy amounts of water, but water, you know, let them hydrate. Then you take them out. Then you bring them back and they're either where you can see them and they're not gonna pee, or they're in their crate or some room for approximately four hours. And then this was how the boot camp started. And then after the four hours you repeat the same process, but you don't give water before the last walk, and if they're desker for water, you give them ice. This is counterintuitive because we are told to hydrate, hydrate, hydrate. You hear my water, hydrate. Drink all the day, Drink all day. Drink as much as you can hold the water supply. Drink a toilet bowl, drink, drink, drink. Release the bladder, release your bladder, Let the bladder go. The minute you have before you have sex P, after you have sex P, when you wake up, pete, when you go to bed, pe pe pe pee, peep. We're telling them, don't hydrate all the time, don't leave water down only the water right before they go on walks. Do not leave the ter down and hold it in, hold it in for four hours. So of course they've been watching me live my life, and that's why they're probably living this way because they say me paying whenever I want, So why wouldn't they pay when they want? They don't understand, So now we have to teach them to hold for four hours. And I do recognize this because my dog Cookie that I create trained, did have a great ability to hold for four and even longer if you have an emergency or something going on. So it's been working in the sense that they're not paying really as much. One morning, I we woke up and they had been obviously in bed all night, and I just went in so I could pay. And then I came back in the room and they had pe that was one breaking of their diet. And then the other day they pee it on the corner of a carpet and a poof that I told you about, like a little ottoman multiple times, so I felt like really defeated in like a failure. But that's two times in over six weeks, and it's the reason they're not really paying that much. Is because I'm on them, so I don't know if it's working at But I do think that you can teach old dogs new tricks because they would be three or four times a week. And I'm a grown ass adult woman who's successful in many ways, but not in this way. So what do you think of dog training? Can you teach old dogs new tricks? Um? Do you think it's wrong? And I know I'm gonna get a lot of hate mail because it's gonna be summer and it's gonna be hot, But I think in that case, you have to give them a little water at the end. And when the dogs are de hydrid, I've seen smalls to be thirsty and I'll just give him water, but then let them out again for that last relief pee. It's like your own it's like your own food plan. You have to kind of tailor to your own needs. It's great that the trainer told me this, but he's not living in this house with a dog it's dehydrated, So I'm not gonna do that. So I'm trying to adjust it to what makes it work for me. What's hard is getting home and you've only been out for an hour and not letting them immediately out. So maybe we'll adjust to that, but right now it's happening as I'm waiting the four hours. I think you're teaching them to hold it and then they're not supposed to pay inside. I think that's what it is, that they just don't. You don't want them to associate inside with peing, only outside with ping, and you want them to know to drink a lot of water before because they start to realize they're not going to get it all the time. So I think that it's sort of that's the training of it. Let me know what you think. My guest today is Matthew McConaughey. He is an actor, a producer, and a philanthropist. He first gained notice for his performance in Days and Confused, which is considered by many to be his breakout role, and he has gone on to dazzle audiences with many beloved performances, including Dallas Buyers Club, which he won an Oscar for. Today, we talk about the importance of knowing when to step back from opportunities in order to stay on your true path. How being open to chance meetings can change your life. Why timing is everything, but persistence is also key and how to beat the paralysis of analysis. This is an incredible conversation and I think you're going to enjoy it as much as I did. How are you? I'm good my fellow scorpio born on the same day. I can't believe you know that. I'm so surprised. Yes, and did he and Kathy Griffin also share our birthday? Yes? Yes, indeed. Intense passionate people, it appears. I think I'm like three. I think I'm Diddy's elder brother by that three hours. Really, where are you? What is that amazing space that you're in? This is one of my four air streams. This one is called the Smithsonian. So what you're seeing Oli here is a world map that's backlit. This is my galley area. Um, this is my latest one. I designed this one from the ground up and this is when we got to set. We go travel, this goes. This is where we live in half time. Oh, that's so fun It's so funny because I was researching air streams to put in my backyard. It's just like a bar hangout place, sort of like a clubhouse for my daughter. I love it. Love to three of them on the property right now. Wow, that's so funny. It's like a little like a like a man den or a lady cave or whatever you want to do. Yeah, the only challenge with it is you hang out over here for a while, it becomes preferable to the big house. I get it, I get it. Um. I first have to just thank you for helping me with be strong un Um. You're beautiful and sweet and caring wife because she did a lot of research and she really wanted to understand exactly where the money went, which I do appreciate. But you helped a lot of people in Texas with Ppe, and I appreciate and Louisiana, I believe and I appreciate your help. Well, You're welcome and thank you. You worked well with us, and I know Camilla with you and your team. You know, y'all did a lot of a lot of back and forth and work together. So thank you well, thanks so much. You are the first uh actor that I've had on because of it adhered really uh strongly to what I believe that this should be and the conversations I want to have and what someone needs to represent and reflect and you absolutely the more I look into you and I've always obviously known who you are and been aware of you. But the more that I research you and your book Green Lights congratulations twenty seven weeks on the best seller list New York Times best Seller Lists, and I know what that's like. And it's like building a rocketship and keeping it in the air and your number one. Um. But in reading about you there and other places, I realize that you have a very solid intentional brand and you have built it one brick at a time with what made to us seem like casual, being handsome and doing these great rule But it seems very intentional. That's the word that keeps coming back that you've you've you've had this whole chessboard that you've been working on and planning, and it makes it look effortless, but it cannot be effortless. No, And thank you for noticing that. You know, my closest friends know me the best have thrown that word at me or to others when they asked about me. Uh, that word intentional, um, And I think I guess I am very intentional. I mean I have been very intentional and had great plans that never panned out. Um. I think, Uh, there's a certain moral bottom line? Uh, who I have like that I have as a person that I was never going to be foolish with along the way, I can bullshit and sell and hustle and you know, um, trade you one, trade you one, keep you five now for your one because I hope I get ten later. I I got do all that. Um at the same time. Um oh, I think what's from is I've always had kind of a long view, like I know, a big win right now? Is is it gonna be a win twenty years from now? Is it gonna be is it gonna is it something? Or like intentional choices I'm making now, I'm making choices now that I'm going, Okay, do I want to spend my time on that? I only want to spend my time on something that hopefully will have grown when I'm on my deathbed and I can thin can it will survive after I am gone? Like legacy choices, I'm trying to be very intentional about that. Now. Well, I have two things I talked about, and one is the bucket theory, which is I would rather have six buckets full than fifteen and a half full, Meaning what's giving you an r O? I in a philanthropic means, is it more time with your family? Is it the big picture? Like you said, you're maybe not making a lot of money now, but you're making a decision. It's gonna make a change. You walk away from money because you're gonna other things are going to come if you believe in yourself. And then also you're talking about the chess board, but you're aware of the pieces. What's going on today is the pieces. But you're looking at the board, always looking at the board, and you're trying to teach people around it. You work with look at the board. Don't get stuck in the weeds. You might be with weeds that it might be weeds, but you've got to know that. You gotta yes, yeah, but understand that and even and then when you get in those weeds, understand that, oh that's just part of the garden. There's still flowers in the garden, but you are in the weeds right now. I mean, I I write about this my book I called conservatively conservative early liberal late and that's not a political term. What I mean is that studied the game the chessboard, look at the overall board, know that there are daily moves that are intentional that are in the here and now, But there's a big game being played, and time moves slower than we think. It's actually at least on our side. So I say, I like to create my weather so I can blow in the breeze, and that would be as you said earlier. Maybe it looks like, hey, just roll out of it and just do that now constantly look at me. What's what's the way can I create the weather here? What are the rules of this particular game? What's the context of this zone? No? My zone, but I'm in it. But if I play this move now, maybe this isn't maybe not be the zone that I want to be, and I actually want to be in that one over there. I'm gonna stay in my zone here because if I keep my head down and do this job well, I can end up being where I want to be. And that's happened. If you quite a few time, will you get in the car and you have a plan for the most part, but you might run out of gas, you might hit a roadblock. That's when the work happens. That's what you're talking about. I mean conflict. You probably we have the same birthday. I don't know you, but you probably when something is challenging, you like to work the problem, maybe step away from it, let it breathe for a second, to figure out how how to work the problem. And then people think that was part of one of your great decisions, but it's probably just because somebody made a move you didn't know, somebody's disappointed you, something happen and then you have to shake it up. The pandemic. I mean, I'm as far as amount that I'm absolutely intentional, set the goal, go get it no matter what. I Also, I've looked around and I would say even more so in my life, it's the times where I was I didn't know what it was. I wanted to just get in the damn game and let's call audibles along the way. Let's just the thing out where it was a moment where you're on take the mic, I'm like, oh jeez, I I didn't even know us. But uh, And those are the times where I've been like improvised that have led to actually more success in life and quality in life. That's good for people listening because they want to build something in a non traditional way. Their business people, they want to create their own toolbox and you're It doesn't matter whether they're selling toothpaste or a blockbuster Academy Award winner like you are. It matters. It's it's it's about the way you operate. And I want to know how you How are your beginnings they humble? What's your relationship to money? What was success mean in your house? Like work ethic, that kind of thing it was? I guess it was humble. We were were raised, uh middle class um that paid the rent. He had food on the table. He never let us know that at times that may have been hard to do, but he worked, worked enough and was successful enough that he we couldn't read that on him, that, oh maybe he was going through tough times, which later in life, after he passed away, I found out there were times he was. Work ethic was big. The don't half acid, whatever it is you're doing was drilled into us. The break you down to be thankful that the damn sun rose this morning. And if you're walking in here to eat breakfast in a bad mood because you didn't get enough sleep, or you just grumpy, get your backside back in bed. Don't come out of here, because I'm in here, my mom and my mom's I'm making you breakfast, and there was no guarantee that someone gonna rise today. It was really a oh yeah, you're bitching about your shoes. Your bitch about no shoes, Let me introduce you to give it no feet. It was really whoa wow, slam you down to humility and be grateful for what you have. Um At the same time, there was a sort of outlaw logic, like my mother and father would push into his mom. Don't you walk in that place like you want to buy it. You walk in there like you own it. Whether that was that was going to the prom and you were nervous, you know about your day and do you have the right cassage or you couldn't afford the cossage. You don't need the cossage you whether the cassage is what you wear, it's not wearing you. So since you don't have when you don't need, you know, whatever that was, it was get relative quick, Well that how does that work on a movie set? I mean that must be that you must have taken that with you your entire life and everything you do. I see it in your confidence. I mean you're confident person. I mean everyone on here, everyone from billionaires to to to Hillary Clinton talks about preparation. Everybody talks about the relationship of luck to success and says, doesn't matter how lucky you are, doesn't matter where the fish are. You be prepared. If those fish come, you know where to go. That's okay. So talk about preparation. That's amazing. That's the toolbox you're talking about. Now, you get your toolbox in shape and you get prepared. You you know, again conservative, very liberally. You do the work so you can then play. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You you study the playbooks. You can get in the game and be confident enough to call an audible when the other team doesn't do what you expected them to do. Um. You you prepare, You work on this delayed gratification. You prepare for the interview the week before, so you don't go in there that Monday morning going oh shoot, I'm not even prepared. And and that's not where you improvise. It's much easier to improvise and call the audibles if your toolboxes in shape and you go, if this goes as I plant going, I am ready, and then it never goes that way. Yeah, so you never end up using all the tools you think you needed to use. Most things don't happen. But exactly that's exactly right. It's insurance. So you have kids and young kids, and um a great partner, and I'm wondering because I'm listening to how you were raised and how your father instill this work ethic and don't complain and don't explain, you know, and hardcore, and it's obviously within you. And I have I have a I have an eleven year old daughter too, and I you know, I had a very challenging childhood. But how do we raise And I asked Mark Cuban this question, how do we raise kids being wealthy and try to explain to them whenever you know you're you're not going to fly in a private plan and tell them to walk. So so how do you do it? It's got to be twice as hard. It's a great question, and it's a great opportunity for us. But I hear you. I mean, you know housekeepers showed up to the house. Never had a housekeeper my house. Um, I got this great coat, my son. Um, we fly private that often. But when a studio would fly me private, we take the family and the car would come pick us up and and uh. At four years old when we would fly private, I would never tell him because I think we're going to the airport're gonna go out commercial. We pull up to the heat in his baby seat in the back row, four years old, as we pull up to the gate that he the signature gate or whatever, that he knows it's private now, and he goes, oh, yippie, popeye, I sure do love taking the black car of the little plane more than the yellow car of the big one. I went, oh. I was like, that's awesome. And then I tell him, you've got big ideas these things? You know? Now, how to explain how we get these things? How did they come? Now? The other thing is with the affluents. And as you know, it's much harder to say no and to follow through on no you cannot, and it is to say yes. And when you're an affluent position, it's easy to say yes, Oh that toy broke, Oh, let's get another one, instead of going, let's get the toolbox out and let's and see if we can maintain that. Because I know it was only a twenty, and I've got twenty. It's not a matter if I have the twenty or nine. You don't spend it because you got it, We have it and it broke. Now let's go fix it. Instead of said, oh, can you get another one? Or putting a patch on a damn soccer ball, I'm gonna sad of No, we're not just gonna go get another soccer ball. And do you do that? That's great? And are you strict because I don't think strict has anything. I know people who have no money who spoil their kids because it's the path at least resistance. I do not negotiate with terrorists. If I say we're not going to do something. If you do something, I always follow through because then you'll have no leverage with your kids. They'll not believe you. It's they'll call your bluff. Well we we, yes, we have rules and expectations and we do follow through the discipline for for those and and as I was saying the no, the following through and the consequences for kids doing something that we know, if we let that slide, they're not gonna be well, they're not gonna be equipped to go through life. You gotta understand if you do that when you're out of the house, the world's gonna come back and and it hits you square in the face. You canna end up, you know, hurt and jail whatever. No, so there are consequences. It's harder to follow through on them time wise, because you've been there. You think it's either night, good night, they're all down to sleep, and all of a sudden something that comes up. You're like, I gotta deal with this now, don't I dude, damn it, But you gotta follow through on it. Um or Yeah, they will call your bluff. Um. I think, yeah, it's it's it's also I like to say, it's like, how how high is the limb on the tree that our kids? This is a metaphor, how high is the limb on the tree that our kids climb out on? How How high do we let them go? Yeah? Keep climbing, right, We had no supervision. We ran out the back door. Yeah yeah. But you look below, you go, well, that's that's about a tin footfall. It's on grass. He's gonna have bruises and scrapes. That's worth it. He not afraid of hight you. But then where do you go? Whoa that fall? We're going to the emergency room or worse that's smart. Check this out down here, because you don't want to make them because kids aren't afraid lights until they fall. But how when do you when do you let them learn on their own? Because what are they going to really remember? We can teach them as much we want, as much as we want, but those experiences that get up that great plan they had not work out. I love that, and you have a six I mean, this is a tricky expression, but I talked too many successful people who are in relationships with successful people, so I call it successful relationships to double entendre. And obviously nobody's relationship is perfect that I've spoken to. But people have different rules. Like I've spoken of one person who said to me, um, I don't fix her. I fixed myself, or I let my partner on, you know, a loose leash. They have to be who they are allowing to be who they are. And another great thing was we don't worry about the optics of what it's supposed to be like. So how do you describe or definition or tools for a successful relationship with another successful, strong personality. It's a different disparity than you grew up with. You grew up with your father put the food on the table, and you're talking about a different dynamic than an equal in that way. Yeah, well, I mean I would. I would jump on the train of the last two, the three you brought up. Um. Yeah, we allow each other a loosen leash that we're not over on each other's over each other's shoulder and everything. But then we try to practice let's come together at the end of the day and just kind of say, hey, so we're so we're up to date because I can get going. I can go head down and get going, and all of a sudden look up and I come to Kamilla and I'm like, so, here's what I got. And she's like, whoa, you know, And I'm giving it the notice version because I've been working on it and it's going through my head. It makes clear sense to me because I've been working on for a month and now I'm just unloaded in her and she's like, whoa, I didn't even know that was an area you were heading. To slow it down. Um, And then we try not to. We don't compete. We're not playing the well you get to do that, so I get to do this. There's certain things that you know, I mean look she makes. She makes more sacrifices for me than in my work life than than she asked me to make for her. Um, me and me and our me and our family. I mean, she said, very early on, when we decided we were gonna have children, she put her hands on the night we decided, Okay, let's pull the goat. She put her hands on my shoulders and said, one rule, if we do this, I go what she goes, you go, we go there. Every time I go to work coming, I've been together fifteen years, Mary for coming on nine the longest we've been a part of. Nine days. We kids, everybody, we pulled them up out of school. If she drops everything, Popeye is going to work in Mauritius or rakovec or New York City, we all go. That's why I'm negotiable. So when I'm dealing with the studios, like, that's not negotiable. I needed the house. My family is coming. We're bringing a tutor. This is the package you're gonna get if you're getting me. And so we're a traveling band like that. Um, And that's been I mean, in ways I can't even say how important that's been for us as well. And you didn't. It's not great you decided it. It's a mandate and it's not a want, it's a need. So there's difference between wants and needs. It's a need. And that goes to what you said about we don't live in the same word. We don't trying to say, well, what does the world think about how you do this? No, we gotta make our own bubble Camilla. This is our bubble. We gotta do but how we do it? And you know, people can keep handing these books. You know when you have first have a kid, here's what you should read. I always think a bit like a little forward. I was like, let me ask you for some persistence first, people to give you advice, like, no, we gotta do it by our own and bubble. We know what makes us happen. We know what keeps us tight as a family. It may not be our others do it, and we got to keep that bubble tight um because when we get up and we get away from it, we look back and we go we were slipping on our fundamental we left left or we thought someone had a bright new idea over there. Oh, look how they do it. And now we're doing the math. You know, Oh that's the grass wasn't greener. It actually didn't work out what we thought was really successful. Actually that math did not that up for them. Yeah. And I always talk about unsolicited advice, not loving to give it and not loving to get it, Like it's unsolicited. I'm not. No, there's no perfect parents, there's no perfect child. So if you don't want advice, you don't have to take it. No one's an expert, your father. Is it defining character in your life? It is so prevalent? Uh, you took I mean obviously the roads less traveled is any road you take. But you took the road less traveled in your house, the road that he didn't really paid for you. And it seems like it's defined you. And you've been very authentic in addition to intentional. So can you like describe what that brings up for you, what that means to you? Can I was I always expect to go to law school. I was gonna be the lawyer. That was it. I mean from from twelve years old on and I went to University of Texas heading toward law school, and all of a sudden was having traveled, getting sleeping at night with the idea of I can graduate. Now I gotta go another three years to law school. I won't be doing having an imprint on the world until I'm in my thirties, and I don't want to spend my whole twenties studying. So I was writing a lot and sharing stories and decide I wanted to go be a storyteller. I want to go to film school. Well, this is gonna be a big ask from my dad. It was paying my way, and I was really nervous about asking. Might call him one night, made sure it was seven thirty at night and it would be home from work, having to be with my mom in a good mood, amiable to the amicable to the idea, and I said Dad, I said, uh, he goes. What's upbody? I said, I don't want to go to film school anymore. I don't want to law school anymore. I want to go to film school. Because he's sure that's what you want to do. I said, yes, sir, five second posity as well. Don't half ascid with that. He gave me approval, he gave me privilege, he gave me responsibility, he gave me accountability, He gave me a kick in the backside. He gave me for all of it, but the way he said don't have asset, he gave it. Now here's what I realized just in the last five years, because that decision was when I was twenty and I think this is what every parent actually once. So we raise our children in a structured because if you do this, you're gonna follow these rules, stick with this plan, you're gonna be able to go succeed in life. And if they do that, we're happy. But what it makes us really happy, just like in every great entrepreneur in the world, when the child goes, uh, I'm going my own way and I'm not asking permission. When I asked my dad that night and said I called him to say I don't want to go to film school. I don't want to low school, want to go film school. I really wouldn't ask me. And he heard my voice that I was not bluffing and I really wasn't asking his permission. And so in the twenty technic call, which ended with him saying don't have asset, I think he inside felt like, yes, I bothered him right, he didn't. He came to me I could help by his voice. Wow, he knew I wasn't bluffing, And I think that day is when he goes I was a good father to him. I raised me have this the confidence to go, I'm going my own way. I'm breaking out amazing. That sounds like a major pivotal life changing point. And he did give you terms, don't have asset, I'll pay. That could be your next book, don't have asset. It could be like a giving the actual advice to business. Uh. You know people often think that, well many actors uh and celebrities. I want to have a brand, be a brand, attached to a brand, slap their names on things. And I notice you do not slap your name on things. You have had a long standing relationship with Lincoln, you've aligned yourself. What's the alcohol brand? Wild Turkey. They're both very on brand. They're both very solid, they're very smooth, they're very quality. Like it makes sense and who how do you know this? Because branding, which is something that I am good at, and most people do not adhere to the brand. They don't protect the realm. And the realm isn't necessarily the forty movies you've done, that's the vehicles for the whole realm, which is the brand of you. I I that is very clear to me, and I want to understand that because that's being a business person. That's why I wanted to talk to you. That's a business in itself. You are a business. What was that now used earlier? Rather have six than twelve buckets? Buckets? Call them camp fires or valhallas. I mean, you don't want too many. You don't want camp fires or it's like what do you You're dabbling, You're dangling the toe and everything. I'm not sure what you're really for. So you can. You don't want to over leverage yourself. If you're in a position to anchor yourself with another product in a brand end that hopefully, in success you become synonymous with, then you don't. You don't want to over leverage yourself because you get people get mixed messages. Now you lose some equity. Yeah, So I mean there are those are two American made brands. They're two sort of American inventions. Um, the automobile and bourbon. I like both of them. I and I drink it. I say to myself, UM, and I have to say no. Obviously, thankfully a lot more than I say yes, um, what what am I going to be involved in with that? I'm thinking about it on Saturday night, I'm thinking about it on Tuesday, I'm thinking about it in church. It's something that's in my consciousness. Oh, you know, would be a good idea for the ad that we're gonna do with Wild Turkey, or you know what, it's gonna be a good idea with the Lincoln that that It's not something that I have to show up on my desk. You Okay, Now I gotta put on this hat. My mind creatively it goes to ways to sell those brands. And that's how you're a good partner because it's authentic you're building. And then the next partnership you do will build upon those two things. And then you know, you gotta obviously you have to watch if you have when I say over leveraging yourself, you have to watch if you get like, for instance, say my deal with Wild Turkeys. Okay, I've got a contract with him. I can't do anything. I can't be a part of pushing any other brown liquor, but maybe say I could do white liquor and say if hockey company comes to me and they want to do the thing. I have to think, wait a minute, even though I may be able to if I was, that's going to delude, That might delude my I'm long branch wild Turkey guy, and I like that. Yeah, I could get some more cash on my cow here today again, maybe for the next few years. But it's a short term thought. It's a short yet, McConaughey, because you lost equity that when you're you're a say it one time guy with Wild, you're a say it one time guy are with Lincoln, you don't have to repeat yourself. And if you start spreading then or get categories that are closed, you have to start listening a little bit. But wait, did you hear what I said? You know the way? I gotta say it again because you're not. You're only people are only listening half as half as closely because they see you. Oh wait, you're doing both those. I thought you were just one say what you mean and mean what you say? Did you think you had the thing growing up the gut inside like I might have something different, special, like I should go for this, or did you just put one foot in front of the other with just a passion? I mean, did you have that drive that fire. I'll tell you this, I'm competitive, But starting at about fifteen, I started to go, wait a minute, you may like ping pong and be a good player, but you're not gonna be a professional ping pong player. So if you get when I would get beat, it didn't bother me being like things in my life that I would lose that, I was like, this is not my what I'm gonna do. I gotta figar out what I'm gonna do and then I want to be Then I want to be the champion and fighting. So I started to allow the things that I was competitive to go. No, that's I don't mind losing it that because I'm not that's not my dedication in life. Um I got I out. I would I could out hustle people I got. I mean, I was the guy that got sometimes picked for coming in second five times in a row over the person who won the first race by ten yards because I kept going back and re entering the race trying to win, and I got picked on. I went, I went Charlie hustle over here. So persistence was was was one thing. The other thing was we were taught early you're knock on a door and you get a know today that's not final. You can go back tomorrow because maybe the person on the other side of that door was in a bad mood yesterday and maybe they got a better night's sleep tonight and had a good morning with their wife or spouse this morning and now a little so timing um in context of timing and when to come back to someone with the same product where they gonna be. It's like when I called my dad that night on the phone, Mall, I picked out seven thirty pm on a Tuesday night, because I said, he's home from work, he's eating dinner, he's having to be with mom on the couch, he's relaxing. That's the time to tell him I want to go to film school, not at nine am when he's stressing going to work to copel on the phone. So picking out when you when you when you want to go to your target is something that I was getting turned onto early on. I would grew up in a family of salesman right, got it? And it sounds like and it's amazing, does it? The passion forget your family? We're talking about business mostly today. What makes you who you are? The way your mind works, the passion. What's the greatest passion in a in a hobby, in the cars, in in a passion project? Which movie didn't make you money but you loved it? Like where have you been the most alive? Or where are you the most alive? And this whole sort of business acting success journey when my work as an artist translates, for instance, with with with with the book that I'm running around with for twenty eight weeks. All right, when someone tells me, I saw I'm seeing my stories and your stories, I'm going, oh, I have a little reciprocity going here. Did I tap a nerve? Did I tell something very personal that tapped the nerve of humanity that people are seeing? Oh, I'm seeing myself in you. I'm going, oh, here we go. So as an artist, that's my one is to communicate my product. Now I do movies and and I and and and I got more successful it personally selfishly my acting career. When I said f the bucks, I'm going for the experience. When I put my head down and some of them didn't make any money, my movie started making more money when I said F the box, I got that's the big picture. That's the big picture. That's the thing. When people are negotiating deals, you have to know don't try to take every nickel off the floor because you could make a decision. I was going back to a TV show and I didn't care what I got, hey, but I wanted to be able to be allowed to do Shark Tank. Like sometimes you'll say, Okay, give gives that don't aren't obvious. The give isn't always the money. The give is is just to give some being creative with a contract, you don't have to be a lawyer. You just gotta think about what you're willing to give and what you want. That's what you're talking about, and that's passion. You're you you're very passionate about this book, and it's from a true place. Certainly, I didn't go to Harvard, but I assume you make a lot more money on your your movies than you do on this book. But you want to connect your your your a certain age and you're having an experience and you want to love what you're doing. I mean, that's the best part about It's passionate. Yeah. Well, look, I love making movies and I love acting, and I've I've some of my favorite experiences have been movies that didn't do well. Gold was an extraordinary experience for me because that was me being able to live with my idea of my father in that character for three months. Movie didn't do any good box office, but I loved the experience, loved it perfect. Um So when your father passed away, Uh, some people say you have to lose a parent of a I'm a man. I didn't. I haven't heard about a woman. But did you feel like you became a man? Sure as hell? Kick started me? I mean a major kickstart. And that was the green light of his passing away. There were you know, values that he was raising me on that I was practicing, but I was making b minuses and c pluses in them because I knew I had him. He had my back. At the if the s h I t really hit the fan, my dad was there. He was above law and government, you know, if I really crutch, he was. He was a safety net for me, subconsciously even knowing that. And then he physically passes away and leaves his life all a sudden, I go, he's not there to catch you if you really need him. WHOA? So I started going, you better quit being a boy and just practicing these little things. You better look the world in the eye. And I mean I stood taller, My heart went higher, and chin went up. I remember this, all these things, mortal things in life that I had reverence for, fame, money, people, they lowered down the eye level. I looked him in the at all these things that I've been patronizing and sluffing off is not worthy of me. And whatever rose up at eye level, and I remember going, damn at the world's flat. My peripheral vision got wider, I could see further, I could see clearer, and I was I became a lot more courageous to go, let's quit act like one, let's start being one. And that whether that was a man, or whether that would be more me or whatever it was, I was like, it's time for you to walk stand up straight. Matthew walked through this world and it was the green light. It was a shift I do with my daughter at night. Rose and thorn of the day, the high and the low. So of you this career. What was what's been the rose and what's been the thorn? Wow? I mean, Jesus been a lot more roses for me. Um, you know, walking on the right bar and getting cast in my first film days confused that was in a bar. I don't think that I didn't know that. I walked in the right bar at the right time. And I was in film school and I only went to this bar because I knew the bartender. He was in film school with me and give me free drinks. He comes in my drink. It was at the top of the Hyatt in Austin, Texas. The guy in the bars in town producing the film went down and introduced me to him. Four hours later, me and that guy, Don Phillips get kicked out of this bar. On the way home, He's ride with me is I'm taking a taxi back to my house to drop me off. He says, we ever done any acting? I said, well, man, I was in a middle Light commercial and a Trisian You'rewood video. I didn't say anything, and he goes, you might be right for this part. Come to this address tomorrow morning. I go down three lines. I go back three lines from into three weeks work. I go back to school for a year after that great summer where I found what would become more than a hobby for me, where I found what would turn out to be a career move out to Hollywood. First two auditions I went on, I got the part. Wow what were they? What were the angels in the outfield? Wow? Wow? Then a time to kill as all of a sudden, Now I become famous, big studio movie. I'm the lead the Grisham novel. It works over the weekend. Now that introduces its first thorns of fame where the world becomes a mirror. And now I'm not meeting strangers anymore, and I have no anonymity. But I'm gonna deal with that. And as you read the book, I just put on backpacks and got the hell out of Dodge to go. Hear myself think. I went to places like Peru and Africa on my own. And then the work that I did I had um did warm films, and then had a great run of romantic comedies. Now here comes a big thorn romantic comedies. I started getting so successful in them that if I want to do a drama, the studios are like, no way, no, McConaughey, he's cute, shirtless boy. I'm com I'm like, I like the wrong coms, but it's there. The success of these is disallowing me from me even being considered to do those Basically the insers, yes, stay in your zone. So I couldn't do what I wanted to do. I said, I'm gonna stop doing what I was doing. I pulled the plug, moved to Texas, called my age and everybody. I said, no more rom Coms. Nothing I do in anymore. No, but that's scary stuff. That sounds cute now because we have the playbook of what happened. But that's the big picture. That's that's the big picture. And into limbo a right and nobody. It's being in the rom Com actor from twenty into being nothing like you were a big deal, but like you've had longevity. That's what we talked about this whole time. This is so interesting. You had to make a big choice and give up a lot of money at the moment for the moment to have the big to jump to fly. Okay, give a couple of examples on this. So I come down and I shed many a teer on Camilla's shoulder about this choice, and she was like, we're gonna do it, and she repeated my dad's words to me because we were like, we don't know how long you won't work all my money, manager, do I have to have I saved my money because I may not be working for a while. You've saved it well, and I go, okay, So we say no, how old are you? How old you at the time? This is twelve years ago? Some fort that's courageous. Okay, So I don't Nothing comes in, but wrom content now? I say, no, I read him? I said no, I read him. I said that this one comes in with a with a five million dollar off I read it, No, thank you. They come back eight million dollar offer, said don't even need to read again. No, no, no, thank you, already read it. They come back, tend me, no thank you, twelve million, no thank you. They come back at fourteen point five million dollars. Same script that they offered me from five that I said no to. What do you think I said when they offered me fourteen point five? I said, let me read that again. I read the same script that I said no to a five man with a fourteen point five million dollar offer, and guess what it was the exact same words. But it was a better script. It was funnier, it was more dramatic. It had angles. Who I might be able to make this baby work right here. Ultimately I go no, thank you. Now, when I said no to fourteen point five, I think a little lightning go through Hollywood that they go again, Like my dad, McConnaughey ain't bluffing, He's really not doing it. As soon as that happens, now, nothing comes in. For one year and two months, for fourteen more months, nothing comes in. Now, I'm like, I think I may have had my last day in Hollywood. I gotta think about new careers. I gotta I think maybe we want to go to be a high school football coach or orchestral conductor. I'm thinking about other careers. I may not ever work in Hollywood again. Well, what happened twenty months after I have said no? Phone rings? Well? Guests, who's now a new novel? Interesting casting? Good idea for the drama Lincoln Lawyer? Guests, who's now a new novel? Good idea for Killer Joe, for Mud, for Magic Mike for True Detective, for Dallas Buyer's Club. Bernie McConaughey. Why because I had that twenty months I unbranded. I was forgotten. We don't know where's McConaughey be. And he's not in our Eaters is a romcom guys. Not our TV's a romcom guy. He's not shirtless on the beach. There's no beaches in Texas and Austin. Where is he? So went from He's not all right, he's out. He's not doing those two all of a sudden, like, where the hell is McConaughey, what's he doing? So then all of a sudden that was gone enough out of people's eye, got some anonymity. For all of a sudden, somebody go, you know, would be an interesting idea to go to McConaughey for the dramas that I wanted. When they came, I just jumped on. So I unbranded brand. You did a rinse because I was on a very you know, questionable television show. And you can't hate what made you. That's the problem. People think you think you're better than it because you that's what made you. But you're trying to be something else, and you're trying to look at the board and you gotta do the rints and it's tempting to dip back in, but the second you dip back in, you unrint. So you really did a couragious game change or pivotal rinse. Wow, so your rose was your thorn. You have the same thing, and that enhanced the red lightstern green my thorn. It was the penance, it was a sacrifice, and I bet on it and gurrant, and it took many a wobbly day by me for Camilla to go, stay on the track, stay on. We were gonna outlast this. She's good, she's a she's tough, she's a partner. Wow. Okay, that's amazing. And then that led to many of the other roses that I've had. I mean, I love my work I've been able to do I I love making films. I love finding characters that scare me in the right way, and I've been doing it for twenty nine years. Well, I want to say something. I'm really glad that you're here today. You're obviously way more like successful and famous than I am. But I have some really interesting people, and I've stuck to my brand of what I'm doing here. And like I said, some famous people have said they want to come on, and it's tempting to me because they're super famous. But I want to talk about this, and I'm so glad that my gut instinct really thought of you as a brand in a business and you're so authentic and I'm so impressed by you. And I'm you know, the sitting you're almost the same age. But I'm proud of you because you just made such great decisions and for people at home, every little decision makes a difference. Don't get sucked up in it and don't torch yourself. But this is literally a puzzle and a house that you've built one brick at a time. And I see it that way. So that's what I want the show to be, to show people how you built the house. I'm so grateful for you today. This is my rose. Awesome, awesome talking to you, you know, on that on that that note you just said to the to the listeners about the choices we make. I mean, I will say this, Sometimes we can get into what we call paralysis of analysis. For like wait to do A do I do B? Do I do A do do B and you can look up in a decade, can be gone. Sometimes it's like just make a choice and commit to it. It's gonna may be the wrong. It'll reveal though itself and then you'll know and you go ah, okay. Or to reveal a new track for you. But sometimes it's like john't don't fall, But in putting in, commit to don't have facet and it'll reveal itself and turn out sometimes to be Oh, the decision wasn't that different from the other one either. I mean there's many outcomes from it. But I've got friends and I've seen it, and I've done it myself at times being caught in limbo and looking up and going year just went by. All roads lead to Rome. Just get in the damp car and make a left, make a right, right out of gas. You are amazing at this end. Please buy this book, this book green Lights. It's so authentic. I'm just impressed. And if there's anything you want to say at everybody, say hello, are your wife and your family? But if does any mantra already do you want to close with Otherwise? Just if we all made sense of humor r and default emotion, we might all get along a little better. All right, Well that's why we like each other. Matthew, have a wonderful day. Tone Nicole, I said hello and thank you for doing this. Thank you much awesome. I haven't wanted many celebrities and actors on here if they don't really fit the mold of what we're talking about, um of really being able to teach us or give us stories, or humanize themselves and be vulnerable and and provide wisdom about all the little decisions that it takes to be successful. Matthew McConaughey is the quintessential example of someone who has stayed true to himself, adhered to the brand, protected the realm, been in, had integrity, been intentional, and really has a career and a family and a business and a brand to show for it. Like we really just unwrapped and sort of did a reverse engineer on Matthew McConaughey and how he got here, and it now makes sense. He's certainly not just some good looking, shiny shirtless actor. That's the last thing. So I'm so glad that he had him on. It's one of my favorite interviews and I'm just grateful. There's so much to learn the misinjury about life and law, us and love and parenting and business and entertainment and writing a book. So thank you all for listening. Remember to rate, review, and subscribe. Thrilled, Thank You Just Be is hosted an executive produced by me Bethany Frankel. Just Be as a production of the Real Productions and I Heart Radio. Our Managing Producer is Fiona Smith and our producer is Stephanie Stender. Our EP is Morgan Lavoy. To catch more moments from the show, follow us on Instagram and just be with Betty
Speaker 1: So I have dogs Biggie Smalls at b I G G Y S M A L l Z. If you want to follow dogs that really don't do much there mid level dogs. They've even been I've even been told by trainers at their middle of the pack dogs. And I always knew that before um I got a trainer. I said, there's sort of just like two Irish guys sitting at a bar drinking beer that are really loving and really nice and really loyal. Um Smalls is a little bit of like a criminal. There was a movie State of Grace and then the Town with Ben Affleck and he's like the Jeremy Rennert character, and Biggie's the guy who was like a little bit more the guy who drove the getaway the Getaway to get Getaway vam and they were stealing all the money. Biggie we call little Lumpy. So then we had a train and I used to say their mid level guys like Bigy we get in trouble and forget the keys to the VAM and he's driving away from the crime scene and small As always has like things that he's working on. He's always operating, and small As tremendous anxiety. Like I feel like one of these successful people that says their dog needs a therapist, only because I'm successful and I can say that, I promise you my dog is massive anxiety shakes, the tongue goes down to the floor, doesn't like music, doesn't like water, doesn't like um when people ring the doorbell. But I mean not and not like a normal dog that just barks like shaking. Tremendously massive anxiety disorder. This dog. So we give them CBD. And he's got a thunder vest and he's he's got some issues. For their brothers there one litter. They're twins, but they're like fifteen pounds difference, so I call them they're one dog. They're literally are never they've never been an inch away from each other. One time one of them ran after a dog on the beach and the other one was whimpering quant crying. I think it was smalls crying. So they're fiercely loyal, but they're flawed dogs. They pe the four years old. It's shameful. I'm embarrassed. They pee on anything furry, like the corner of anything furry. They pick certain corners of couches. They like the corner of a curtain, like the bottom corner of a curtain, they like the corner of a couch. And we walked them all the time. In fact, it became too much. We were walking them because I think they think it's a p for all. They think you could just pee anytime you want, and what's crazy is that. And you're supposed to leave dogs water because if they go outside they're hot, aren't they dehydrated and thirsty. So we got in this trainer. His name is Bash and I think he's training. I know he's trained Ronald Reagan's dog, and I think he was called by the Bidens, and I think the Wrenda gave him to me. But he's this famous dog trainer. He came over. I was going to send them away for like three weeks, which seemed counterintuitive because you send them away, but they're not at home, so they're not learning habits at home. And Brin was devastated and so historically hysterically crying because when she was little and we got them a couple of months after because of the same problem, we sent them away, and she feels like she missed a lot of their childhood. So she feels like she missed too much, and she cries if she thinks about them moving away. She's very sensitive and she'll h historically cry and she always has a spear. I'm giving them away, which I am never giving them away, and live for them. They're my children. But they do pe They p. You know you have dogs, They pee in other rooms. They hide it. You can't figure it out. You can't catch them in the crime. Oddly, if I catch them in the crime, I'm excited because I get to have a loud voice about it. But it never happens. They're really smooth criminals. I don't even know who the culprit really is. I don't know if it's one of them, two of them. Seems like they double down, so I don't know who the guilty culprit really is. And it maybe both of them. It could be like a double crime scene. I don't know. So this trainer comes over and he's teaching us sits and stays, and I don't give a good funk about if they sit or stay. I only care about the peen. And by the way, this is what I did with Cookie, and this is what I started doing with these guys, And what to me was best method ever was crate training, create training because it was structure and if you're getting a dog, crate training is the best for people who are out more because you're not sitting home and then your dogs are around you and then they go pee. If you're out all day, you have someone after four hours, let them out to pee, put them back in the crate. They know when you get home it's time to go out and pee. And they basically when they're puppies, they're in the crate and their feet don't touch the ground until they're put outside. So he said, get a crate ore and the ore might be jamming us up. Or put them in a small room that you know they're comfortable and you know they won't pee in. So there's certain areas. If it's a bathroom you put them in. They don't pee where they hang out. They don't pee where they sleep. So what you do is the minute you wake up, because they sleep in bed with me and they don't pee in bed or pee in the room unless I let them wander, So they sleep in bed. The second you wake up. You take them right downstairs. Water first, water and food first. Then let them out. One of the problems is all the marking too. If you're walking them, don't let them be like the little P on every tree. It's supposed to be like the big P, which is very hard to control. So water first, not crazy crazy amounts of water, but water, you know, let them hydrate. Then you take them out. Then you bring them back and they're either where you can see them and they're not gonna pee, or they're in their crate or some room for approximately four hours. And then this was how the boot camp started. And then after the four hours you repeat the same process, but you don't give water before the last walk, and if they're desker for water, you give them ice. This is counterintuitive because we are told to hydrate, hydrate, hydrate. You hear my water, hydrate. Drink all the day, Drink all day. Drink as much as you can hold the water supply. Drink a toilet bowl, drink, drink, drink. Release the bladder, release your bladder, Let the bladder go. The minute you have before you have sex P, after you have sex P, when you wake up, pete, when you go to bed, pe pe pe pee, peep. We're telling them, don't hydrate all the time, don't leave water down only the water right before they go on walks. Do not leave the ter down and hold it in, hold it in for four hours. So of course they've been watching me live my life, and that's why they're probably living this way because they say me paying whenever I want, So why wouldn't they pay when they want? They don't understand, So now we have to teach them to hold for four hours. And I do recognize this because my dog Cookie that I create trained, did have a great ability to hold for four and even longer if you have an emergency or something going on. So it's been working in the sense that they're not paying really as much. One morning, I we woke up and they had been obviously in bed all night, and I just went in so I could pay. And then I came back in the room and they had pe that was one breaking of their diet. And then the other day they pee it on the corner of a carpet and a poof that I told you about, like a little ottoman multiple times, so I felt like really defeated in like a failure. But that's two times in over six weeks, and it's the reason they're not really paying that much. Is because I'm on them, so I don't know if it's working at But I do think that you can teach old dogs new tricks because they would be three or four times a week. And I'm a grown ass adult woman who's successful in many ways, but not in this way. So what do you think of dog training? Can you teach old dogs new tricks? Um? Do you think it's wrong? And I know I'm gonna get a lot of hate mail because it's gonna be summer and it's gonna be hot, But I think in that case, you have to give them a little water at the end. And when the dogs are de hydrid, I've seen smalls to be thirsty and I'll just give him water, but then let them out again for that last relief pee. It's like your own it's like your own food plan. You have to kind of tailor to your own needs. It's great that the trainer told me this, but he's not living in this house with a dog it's dehydrated, So I'm not gonna do that. So I'm trying to adjust it to what makes it work for me. What's hard is getting home and you've only been out for an hour and not letting them immediately out. So maybe we'll adjust to that, but right now it's happening as I'm waiting the four hours. I think you're teaching them to hold it and then they're not supposed to pay inside. I think that's what it is, that they just don't. You don't want them to associate inside with peing, only outside with ping, and you want them to know to drink a lot of water before because they start to realize they're not going to get it all the time. So I think that it's sort of that's the training of it. Let me know what you think. My guest today is Matthew McConaughey. He is an actor, a producer, and a philanthropist. He first gained notice for his performance in Days and Confused, which is considered by many to be his breakout role, and he has gone on to dazzle audiences with many beloved performances, including Dallas Buyers Club, which he won an Oscar for. Today, we talk about the importance of knowing when to step back from opportunities in order to stay on your true path. How being open to chance meetings can change your life. Why timing is everything, but persistence is also key and how to beat the paralysis of analysis. This is an incredible conversation and I think you're going to enjoy it as much as I did. How are you? I'm good my fellow scorpio born on the same day. I can't believe you know that. I'm so surprised. Yes, and did he and Kathy Griffin also share our birthday? Yes? Yes, indeed. Intense passionate people, it appears. I think I'm like three. I think I'm Diddy's elder brother by that three hours. Really, where are you? What is that amazing space that you're in? This is one of my four air streams. This one is called the Smithsonian. So what you're seeing Oli here is a world map that's backlit. This is my galley area. Um, this is my latest one. I designed this one from the ground up and this is when we got to set. We go travel, this goes. This is where we live in half time. Oh, that's so fun It's so funny because I was researching air streams to put in my backyard. It's just like a bar hangout place, sort of like a clubhouse for my daughter. I love it. Love to three of them on the property right now. Wow, that's so funny. It's like a little like a like a man den or a lady cave or whatever you want to do. Yeah, the only challenge with it is you hang out over here for a while, it becomes preferable to the big house. I get it, I get it. Um. I first have to just thank you for helping me with be strong un Um. You're beautiful and sweet and caring wife because she did a lot of research and she really wanted to understand exactly where the money went, which I do appreciate. But you helped a lot of people in Texas with Ppe, and I appreciate and Louisiana, I believe and I appreciate your help. Well, You're welcome and thank you. You worked well with us, and I know Camilla with you and your team. You know, y'all did a lot of a lot of back and forth and work together. So thank you well, thanks so much. You are the first uh actor that I've had on because of it adhered really uh strongly to what I believe that this should be and the conversations I want to have and what someone needs to represent and reflect and you absolutely the more I look into you and I've always obviously known who you are and been aware of you. But the more that I research you and your book Green Lights congratulations twenty seven weeks on the best seller list New York Times best Seller Lists, and I know what that's like. And it's like building a rocketship and keeping it in the air and your number one. Um. But in reading about you there and other places, I realize that you have a very solid intentional brand and you have built it one brick at a time with what made to us seem like casual, being handsome and doing these great rule But it seems very intentional. That's the word that keeps coming back that you've you've you've had this whole chessboard that you've been working on and planning, and it makes it look effortless, but it cannot be effortless. No, And thank you for noticing that. You know, my closest friends know me the best have thrown that word at me or to others when they asked about me. Uh, that word intentional, um, And I think I guess I am very intentional. I mean I have been very intentional and had great plans that never panned out. Um. I think, Uh, there's a certain moral bottom line? Uh, who I have like that I have as a person that I was never going to be foolish with along the way, I can bullshit and sell and hustle and you know, um, trade you one, trade you one, keep you five now for your one because I hope I get ten later. I I got do all that. Um at the same time. Um oh, I think what's from is I've always had kind of a long view, like I know, a big win right now? Is is it gonna be a win twenty years from now? Is it gonna be is it gonna is it something? Or like intentional choices I'm making now, I'm making choices now that I'm going, Okay, do I want to spend my time on that? I only want to spend my time on something that hopefully will have grown when I'm on my deathbed and I can thin can it will survive after I am gone? Like legacy choices, I'm trying to be very intentional about that. Now. Well, I have two things I talked about, and one is the bucket theory, which is I would rather have six buckets full than fifteen and a half full, Meaning what's giving you an r O? I in a philanthropic means, is it more time with your family? Is it the big picture? Like you said, you're maybe not making a lot of money now, but you're making a decision. It's gonna make a change. You walk away from money because you're gonna other things are going to come if you believe in yourself. And then also you're talking about the chess board, but you're aware of the pieces. What's going on today is the pieces. But you're looking at the board, always looking at the board, and you're trying to teach people around it. You work with look at the board. Don't get stuck in the weeds. You might be with weeds that it might be weeds, but you've got to know that. You gotta yes, yeah, but understand that and even and then when you get in those weeds, understand that, oh that's just part of the garden. There's still flowers in the garden, but you are in the weeds right now. I mean, I I write about this my book I called conservatively conservative early liberal late and that's not a political term. What I mean is that studied the game the chessboard, look at the overall board, know that there are daily moves that are intentional that are in the here and now, But there's a big game being played, and time moves slower than we think. It's actually at least on our side. So I say, I like to create my weather so I can blow in the breeze, and that would be as you said earlier. Maybe it looks like, hey, just roll out of it and just do that now constantly look at me. What's what's the way can I create the weather here? What are the rules of this particular game? What's the context of this zone? No? My zone, but I'm in it. But if I play this move now, maybe this isn't maybe not be the zone that I want to be, and I actually want to be in that one over there. I'm gonna stay in my zone here because if I keep my head down and do this job well, I can end up being where I want to be. And that's happened. If you quite a few time, will you get in the car and you have a plan for the most part, but you might run out of gas, you might hit a roadblock. That's when the work happens. That's what you're talking about. I mean conflict. You probably we have the same birthday. I don't know you, but you probably when something is challenging, you like to work the problem, maybe step away from it, let it breathe for a second, to figure out how how to work the problem. And then people think that was part of one of your great decisions, but it's probably just because somebody made a move you didn't know, somebody's disappointed you, something happen and then you have to shake it up. The pandemic. I mean, I'm as far as amount that I'm absolutely intentional, set the goal, go get it no matter what. I Also, I've looked around and I would say even more so in my life, it's the times where I was I didn't know what it was. I wanted to just get in the damn game and let's call audibles along the way. Let's just the thing out where it was a moment where you're on take the mic, I'm like, oh jeez, I I didn't even know us. But uh, And those are the times where I've been like improvised that have led to actually more success in life and quality in life. That's good for people listening because they want to build something in a non traditional way. Their business people, they want to create their own toolbox and you're It doesn't matter whether they're selling toothpaste or a blockbuster Academy Award winner like you are. It matters. It's it's it's about the way you operate. And I want to know how you How are your beginnings they humble? What's your relationship to money? What was success mean in your house? Like work ethic, that kind of thing it was? I guess it was humble. We were were raised, uh middle class um that paid the rent. He had food on the table. He never let us know that at times that may have been hard to do, but he worked, worked enough and was successful enough that he we couldn't read that on him, that, oh maybe he was going through tough times, which later in life, after he passed away, I found out there were times he was. Work ethic was big. The don't half acid, whatever it is you're doing was drilled into us. The break you down to be thankful that the damn sun rose this morning. And if you're walking in here to eat breakfast in a bad mood because you didn't get enough sleep, or you just grumpy, get your backside back in bed. Don't come out of here, because I'm in here, my mom and my mom's I'm making you breakfast, and there was no guarantee that someone gonna rise today. It was really a oh yeah, you're bitching about your shoes. Your bitch about no shoes, Let me introduce you to give it no feet. It was really whoa wow, slam you down to humility and be grateful for what you have. Um At the same time, there was a sort of outlaw logic, like my mother and father would push into his mom. Don't you walk in that place like you want to buy it. You walk in there like you own it. Whether that was that was going to the prom and you were nervous, you know about your day and do you have the right cassage or you couldn't afford the cossage. You don't need the cossage you whether the cassage is what you wear, it's not wearing you. So since you don't have when you don't need, you know, whatever that was, it was get relative quick, Well that how does that work on a movie set? I mean that must be that you must have taken that with you your entire life and everything you do. I see it in your confidence. I mean you're confident person. I mean everyone on here, everyone from billionaires to to to Hillary Clinton talks about preparation. Everybody talks about the relationship of luck to success and says, doesn't matter how lucky you are, doesn't matter where the fish are. You be prepared. If those fish come, you know where to go. That's okay. So talk about preparation. That's amazing. That's the toolbox you're talking about. Now, you get your toolbox in shape and you get prepared. You you know, again conservative, very liberally. You do the work so you can then play. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You you study the playbooks. You can get in the game and be confident enough to call an audible when the other team doesn't do what you expected them to do. Um. You you prepare, You work on this delayed gratification. You prepare for the interview the week before, so you don't go in there that Monday morning going oh shoot, I'm not even prepared. And and that's not where you improvise. It's much easier to improvise and call the audibles if your toolboxes in shape and you go, if this goes as I plant going, I am ready, and then it never goes that way. Yeah, so you never end up using all the tools you think you needed to use. Most things don't happen. But exactly that's exactly right. It's insurance. So you have kids and young kids, and um a great partner, and I'm wondering because I'm listening to how you were raised and how your father instill this work ethic and don't complain and don't explain, you know, and hardcore, and it's obviously within you. And I have I have a I have an eleven year old daughter too, and I you know, I had a very challenging childhood. But how do we raise And I asked Mark Cuban this question, how do we raise kids being wealthy and try to explain to them whenever you know you're you're not going to fly in a private plan and tell them to walk. So so how do you do it? It's got to be twice as hard. It's a great question, and it's a great opportunity for us. But I hear you. I mean, you know housekeepers showed up to the house. Never had a housekeeper my house. Um, I got this great coat, my son. Um, we fly private that often. But when a studio would fly me private, we take the family and the car would come pick us up and and uh. At four years old when we would fly private, I would never tell him because I think we're going to the airport're gonna go out commercial. We pull up to the heat in his baby seat in the back row, four years old, as we pull up to the gate that he the signature gate or whatever, that he knows it's private now, and he goes, oh, yippie, popeye, I sure do love taking the black car of the little plane more than the yellow car of the big one. I went, oh. I was like, that's awesome. And then I tell him, you've got big ideas these things? You know? Now, how to explain how we get these things? How did they come? Now? The other thing is with the affluents. And as you know, it's much harder to say no and to follow through on no you cannot, and it is to say yes. And when you're an affluent position, it's easy to say yes, Oh that toy broke, Oh, let's get another one, instead of going, let's get the toolbox out and let's and see if we can maintain that. Because I know it was only a twenty, and I've got twenty. It's not a matter if I have the twenty or nine. You don't spend it because you got it, We have it and it broke. Now let's go fix it. Instead of said, oh, can you get another one? Or putting a patch on a damn soccer ball, I'm gonna sad of No, we're not just gonna go get another soccer ball. And do you do that? That's great? And are you strict because I don't think strict has anything. I know people who have no money who spoil their kids because it's the path at least resistance. I do not negotiate with terrorists. If I say we're not going to do something. If you do something, I always follow through because then you'll have no leverage with your kids. They'll not believe you. It's they'll call your bluff. Well we we, yes, we have rules and expectations and we do follow through the discipline for for those and and as I was saying the no, the following through and the consequences for kids doing something that we know, if we let that slide, they're not gonna be well, they're not gonna be equipped to go through life. You gotta understand if you do that when you're out of the house, the world's gonna come back and and it hits you square in the face. You canna end up, you know, hurt and jail whatever. No, so there are consequences. It's harder to follow through on them time wise, because you've been there. You think it's either night, good night, they're all down to sleep, and all of a sudden something that comes up. You're like, I gotta deal with this now, don't I dude, damn it, But you gotta follow through on it. Um or Yeah, they will call your bluff. Um. I think, yeah, it's it's it's also I like to say, it's like, how how high is the limb on the tree that our kids? This is a metaphor, how high is the limb on the tree that our kids climb out on? How How high do we let them go? Yeah? Keep climbing, right, We had no supervision. We ran out the back door. Yeah yeah. But you look below, you go, well, that's that's about a tin footfall. It's on grass. He's gonna have bruises and scrapes. That's worth it. He not afraid of hight you. But then where do you go? Whoa that fall? We're going to the emergency room or worse that's smart. Check this out down here, because you don't want to make them because kids aren't afraid lights until they fall. But how when do you when do you let them learn on their own? Because what are they going to really remember? We can teach them as much we want, as much as we want, but those experiences that get up that great plan they had not work out. I love that, and you have a six I mean, this is a tricky expression, but I talked too many successful people who are in relationships with successful people, so I call it successful relationships to double entendre. And obviously nobody's relationship is perfect that I've spoken to. But people have different rules. Like I've spoken of one person who said to me, um, I don't fix her. I fixed myself, or I let my partner on, you know, a loose leash. They have to be who they are allowing to be who they are. And another great thing was we don't worry about the optics of what it's supposed to be like. So how do you describe or definition or tools for a successful relationship with another successful, strong personality. It's a different disparity than you grew up with. You grew up with your father put the food on the table, and you're talking about a different dynamic than an equal in that way. Yeah, well, I mean I would. I would jump on the train of the last two, the three you brought up. Um. Yeah, we allow each other a loosen leash that we're not over on each other's over each other's shoulder and everything. But then we try to practice let's come together at the end of the day and just kind of say, hey, so we're so we're up to date because I can get going. I can go head down and get going, and all of a sudden look up and I come to Kamilla and I'm like, so, here's what I got. And she's like, whoa, you know, And I'm giving it the notice version because I've been working on it and it's going through my head. It makes clear sense to me because I've been working on for a month and now I'm just unloaded in her and she's like, whoa, I didn't even know that was an area you were heading. To slow it down. Um, And then we try not to. We don't compete. We're not playing the well you get to do that, so I get to do this. There's certain things that you know, I mean look she makes. She makes more sacrifices for me than in my work life than than she asked me to make for her. Um, me and me and our me and our family. I mean, she said, very early on, when we decided we were gonna have children, she put her hands on the night we decided, Okay, let's pull the goat. She put her hands on my shoulders and said, one rule, if we do this, I go what she goes, you go, we go there. Every time I go to work coming, I've been together fifteen years, Mary for coming on nine the longest we've been a part of. Nine days. We kids, everybody, we pulled them up out of school. If she drops everything, Popeye is going to work in Mauritius or rakovec or New York City, we all go. That's why I'm negotiable. So when I'm dealing with the studios, like, that's not negotiable. I needed the house. My family is coming. We're bringing a tutor. This is the package you're gonna get if you're getting me. And so we're a traveling band like that. Um, And that's been I mean, in ways I can't even say how important that's been for us as well. And you didn't. It's not great you decided it. It's a mandate and it's not a want, it's a need. So there's difference between wants and needs. It's a need. And that goes to what you said about we don't live in the same word. We don't trying to say, well, what does the world think about how you do this? No, we gotta make our own bubble Camilla. This is our bubble. We gotta do but how we do it? And you know, people can keep handing these books. You know when you have first have a kid, here's what you should read. I always think a bit like a little forward. I was like, let me ask you for some persistence first, people to give you advice, like, no, we gotta do it by our own and bubble. We know what makes us happen. We know what keeps us tight as a family. It may not be our others do it, and we got to keep that bubble tight um because when we get up and we get away from it, we look back and we go we were slipping on our fundamental we left left or we thought someone had a bright new idea over there. Oh, look how they do it. And now we're doing the math. You know, Oh that's the grass wasn't greener. It actually didn't work out what we thought was really successful. Actually that math did not that up for them. Yeah. And I always talk about unsolicited advice, not loving to give it and not loving to get it, Like it's unsolicited. I'm not. No, there's no perfect parents, there's no perfect child. So if you don't want advice, you don't have to take it. No one's an expert, your father. Is it defining character in your life? It is so prevalent? Uh, you took I mean obviously the roads less traveled is any road you take. But you took the road less traveled in your house, the road that he didn't really paid for you. And it seems like it's defined you. And you've been very authentic in addition to intentional. So can you like describe what that brings up for you, what that means to you? Can I was I always expect to go to law school. I was gonna be the lawyer. That was it. I mean from from twelve years old on and I went to University of Texas heading toward law school, and all of a sudden was having traveled, getting sleeping at night with the idea of I can graduate. Now I gotta go another three years to law school. I won't be doing having an imprint on the world until I'm in my thirties, and I don't want to spend my whole twenties studying. So I was writing a lot and sharing stories and decide I wanted to go be a storyteller. I want to go to film school. Well, this is gonna be a big ask from my dad. It was paying my way, and I was really nervous about asking. Might call him one night, made sure it was seven thirty at night and it would be home from work, having to be with my mom in a good mood, amiable to the amicable to the idea, and I said Dad, I said, uh, he goes. What's upbody? I said, I don't want to go to film school anymore. I don't want to law school anymore. I want to go to film school. Because he's sure that's what you want to do. I said, yes, sir, five second posity as well. Don't half ascid with that. He gave me approval, he gave me privilege, he gave me responsibility, he gave me accountability, He gave me a kick in the backside. He gave me for all of it, but the way he said don't have asset, he gave it. Now here's what I realized just in the last five years, because that decision was when I was twenty and I think this is what every parent actually once. So we raise our children in a structured because if you do this, you're gonna follow these rules, stick with this plan, you're gonna be able to go succeed in life. And if they do that, we're happy. But what it makes us really happy, just like in every great entrepreneur in the world, when the child goes, uh, I'm going my own way and I'm not asking permission. When I asked my dad that night and said I called him to say I don't want to go to film school. I don't want to low school, want to go film school. I really wouldn't ask me. And he heard my voice that I was not bluffing and I really wasn't asking his permission. And so in the twenty technic call, which ended with him saying don't have asset, I think he inside felt like, yes, I bothered him right, he didn't. He came to me I could help by his voice. Wow, he knew I wasn't bluffing, And I think that day is when he goes I was a good father to him. I raised me have this the confidence to go, I'm going my own way. I'm breaking out amazing. That sounds like a major pivotal life changing point. And he did give you terms, don't have asset, I'll pay. That could be your next book, don't have asset. It could be like a giving the actual advice to business. Uh. You know people often think that, well many actors uh and celebrities. I want to have a brand, be a brand, attached to a brand, slap their names on things. And I notice you do not slap your name on things. You have had a long standing relationship with Lincoln, you've aligned yourself. What's the alcohol brand? Wild Turkey. They're both very on brand. They're both very solid, they're very smooth, they're very quality. Like it makes sense and who how do you know this? Because branding, which is something that I am good at, and most people do not adhere to the brand. They don't protect the realm. And the realm isn't necessarily the forty movies you've done, that's the vehicles for the whole realm, which is the brand of you. I I that is very clear to me, and I want to understand that because that's being a business person. That's why I wanted to talk to you. That's a business in itself. You are a business. What was that now used earlier? Rather have six than twelve buckets? Buckets? Call them camp fires or valhallas. I mean, you don't want too many. You don't want camp fires or it's like what do you You're dabbling, You're dangling the toe and everything. I'm not sure what you're really for. So you can. You don't want to over leverage yourself. If you're in a position to anchor yourself with another product in a brand end that hopefully, in success you become synonymous with, then you don't. You don't want to over leverage yourself because you get people get mixed messages. Now you lose some equity. Yeah, So I mean there are those are two American made brands. They're two sort of American inventions. Um, the automobile and bourbon. I like both of them. I and I drink it. I say to myself, UM, and I have to say no. Obviously, thankfully a lot more than I say yes, um, what what am I going to be involved in with that? I'm thinking about it on Saturday night, I'm thinking about it on Tuesday, I'm thinking about it in church. It's something that's in my consciousness. Oh, you know, would be a good idea for the ad that we're gonna do with Wild Turkey, or you know what, it's gonna be a good idea with the Lincoln that that It's not something that I have to show up on my desk. You Okay, Now I gotta put on this hat. My mind creatively it goes to ways to sell those brands. And that's how you're a good partner because it's authentic you're building. And then the next partnership you do will build upon those two things. And then you know, you gotta obviously you have to watch if you have when I say over leveraging yourself, you have to watch if you get like, for instance, say my deal with Wild Turkeys. Okay, I've got a contract with him. I can't do anything. I can't be a part of pushing any other brown liquor, but maybe say I could do white liquor and say if hockey company comes to me and they want to do the thing. I have to think, wait a minute, even though I may be able to if I was, that's going to delude, That might delude my I'm long branch wild Turkey guy, and I like that. Yeah, I could get some more cash on my cow here today again, maybe for the next few years. But it's a short term thought. It's a short yet, McConaughey, because you lost equity that when you're you're a say it one time guy with Wild, you're a say it one time guy are with Lincoln, you don't have to repeat yourself. And if you start spreading then or get categories that are closed, you have to start listening a little bit. But wait, did you hear what I said? You know the way? I gotta say it again because you're not. You're only people are only listening half as half as closely because they see you. Oh wait, you're doing both those. I thought you were just one say what you mean and mean what you say? Did you think you had the thing growing up the gut inside like I might have something different, special, like I should go for this, or did you just put one foot in front of the other with just a passion? I mean, did you have that drive that fire. I'll tell you this, I'm competitive, But starting at about fifteen, I started to go, wait a minute, you may like ping pong and be a good player, but you're not gonna be a professional ping pong player. So if you get when I would get beat, it didn't bother me being like things in my life that I would lose that, I was like, this is not my what I'm gonna do. I gotta figar out what I'm gonna do and then I want to be Then I want to be the champion and fighting. So I started to allow the things that I was competitive to go. No, that's I don't mind losing it that because I'm not that's not my dedication in life. Um I got I out. I would I could out hustle people I got. I mean, I was the guy that got sometimes picked for coming in second five times in a row over the person who won the first race by ten yards because I kept going back and re entering the race trying to win, and I got picked on. I went, I went Charlie hustle over here. So persistence was was was one thing. The other thing was we were taught early you're knock on a door and you get a know today that's not final. You can go back tomorrow because maybe the person on the other side of that door was in a bad mood yesterday and maybe they got a better night's sleep tonight and had a good morning with their wife or spouse this morning and now a little so timing um in context of timing and when to come back to someone with the same product where they gonna be. It's like when I called my dad that night on the phone, Mall, I picked out seven thirty pm on a Tuesday night, because I said, he's home from work, he's eating dinner, he's having to be with mom on the couch, he's relaxing. That's the time to tell him I want to go to film school, not at nine am when he's stressing going to work to copel on the phone. So picking out when you when you when you want to go to your target is something that I was getting turned onto early on. I would grew up in a family of salesman right, got it? And it sounds like and it's amazing, does it? The passion forget your family? We're talking about business mostly today. What makes you who you are? The way your mind works, the passion. What's the greatest passion in a in a hobby, in the cars, in in a passion project? Which movie didn't make you money but you loved it? Like where have you been the most alive? Or where are you the most alive? And this whole sort of business acting success journey when my work as an artist translates, for instance, with with with with the book that I'm running around with for twenty eight weeks. All right, when someone tells me, I saw I'm seeing my stories and your stories, I'm going, oh, I have a little reciprocity going here. Did I tap a nerve? Did I tell something very personal that tapped the nerve of humanity that people are seeing? Oh, I'm seeing myself in you. I'm going, oh, here we go. So as an artist, that's my one is to communicate my product. Now I do movies and and I and and and I got more successful it personally selfishly my acting career. When I said f the bucks, I'm going for the experience. When I put my head down and some of them didn't make any money, my movie started making more money when I said F the box, I got that's the big picture. That's the big picture. That's the thing. When people are negotiating deals, you have to know don't try to take every nickel off the floor because you could make a decision. I was going back to a TV show and I didn't care what I got, hey, but I wanted to be able to be allowed to do Shark Tank. Like sometimes you'll say, Okay, give gives that don't aren't obvious. The give isn't always the money. The give is is just to give some being creative with a contract, you don't have to be a lawyer. You just gotta think about what you're willing to give and what you want. That's what you're talking about, and that's passion. You're you you're very passionate about this book, and it's from a true place. Certainly, I didn't go to Harvard, but I assume you make a lot more money on your your movies than you do on this book. But you want to connect your your your a certain age and you're having an experience and you want to love what you're doing. I mean, that's the best part about It's passionate. Yeah. Well, look, I love making movies and I love acting, and I've I've some of my favorite experiences have been movies that didn't do well. Gold was an extraordinary experience for me because that was me being able to live with my idea of my father in that character for three months. Movie didn't do any good box office, but I loved the experience, loved it perfect. Um So when your father passed away, Uh, some people say you have to lose a parent of a I'm a man. I didn't. I haven't heard about a woman. But did you feel like you became a man? Sure as hell? Kick started me? I mean a major kickstart. And that was the green light of his passing away. There were you know, values that he was raising me on that I was practicing, but I was making b minuses and c pluses in them because I knew I had him. He had my back. At the if the s h I t really hit the fan, my dad was there. He was above law and government, you know, if I really crutch, he was. He was a safety net for me, subconsciously even knowing that. And then he physically passes away and leaves his life all a sudden, I go, he's not there to catch you if you really need him. WHOA? So I started going, you better quit being a boy and just practicing these little things. You better look the world in the eye. And I mean I stood taller, My heart went higher, and chin went up. I remember this, all these things, mortal things in life that I had reverence for, fame, money, people, they lowered down the eye level. I looked him in the at all these things that I've been patronizing and sluffing off is not worthy of me. And whatever rose up at eye level, and I remember going, damn at the world's flat. My peripheral vision got wider, I could see further, I could see clearer, and I was I became a lot more courageous to go, let's quit act like one, let's start being one. And that whether that was a man, or whether that would be more me or whatever it was, I was like, it's time for you to walk stand up straight. Matthew walked through this world and it was the green light. It was a shift I do with my daughter at night. Rose and thorn of the day, the high and the low. So of you this career. What was what's been the rose and what's been the thorn? Wow? I mean, Jesus been a lot more roses for me. Um, you know, walking on the right bar and getting cast in my first film days confused that was in a bar. I don't think that I didn't know that. I walked in the right bar at the right time. And I was in film school and I only went to this bar because I knew the bartender. He was in film school with me and give me free drinks. He comes in my drink. It was at the top of the Hyatt in Austin, Texas. The guy in the bars in town producing the film went down and introduced me to him. Four hours later, me and that guy, Don Phillips get kicked out of this bar. On the way home, He's ride with me is I'm taking a taxi back to my house to drop me off. He says, we ever done any acting? I said, well, man, I was in a middle Light commercial and a Trisian You'rewood video. I didn't say anything, and he goes, you might be right for this part. Come to this address tomorrow morning. I go down three lines. I go back three lines from into three weeks work. I go back to school for a year after that great summer where I found what would become more than a hobby for me, where I found what would turn out to be a career move out to Hollywood. First two auditions I went on, I got the part. Wow what were they? What were the angels in the outfield? Wow? Wow? Then a time to kill as all of a sudden, Now I become famous, big studio movie. I'm the lead the Grisham novel. It works over the weekend. Now that introduces its first thorns of fame where the world becomes a mirror. And now I'm not meeting strangers anymore, and I have no anonymity. But I'm gonna deal with that. And as you read the book, I just put on backpacks and got the hell out of Dodge to go. Hear myself think. I went to places like Peru and Africa on my own. And then the work that I did I had um did warm films, and then had a great run of romantic comedies. Now here comes a big thorn romantic comedies. I started getting so successful in them that if I want to do a drama, the studios are like, no way, no, McConaughey, he's cute, shirtless boy. I'm com I'm like, I like the wrong coms, but it's there. The success of these is disallowing me from me even being considered to do those Basically the insers, yes, stay in your zone. So I couldn't do what I wanted to do. I said, I'm gonna stop doing what I was doing. I pulled the plug, moved to Texas, called my age and everybody. I said, no more rom Coms. Nothing I do in anymore. No, but that's scary stuff. That sounds cute now because we have the playbook of what happened. But that's the big picture. That's that's the big picture. And into limbo a right and nobody. It's being in the rom Com actor from twenty into being nothing like you were a big deal, but like you've had longevity. That's what we talked about this whole time. This is so interesting. You had to make a big choice and give up a lot of money at the moment for the moment to have the big to jump to fly. Okay, give a couple of examples on this. So I come down and I shed many a teer on Camilla's shoulder about this choice, and she was like, we're gonna do it, and she repeated my dad's words to me because we were like, we don't know how long you won't work all my money, manager, do I have to have I saved my money because I may not be working for a while. You've saved it well, and I go, okay, So we say no, how old are you? How old you at the time? This is twelve years ago? Some fort that's courageous. Okay, So I don't Nothing comes in, but wrom content now? I say, no, I read him? I said no, I read him. I said that this one comes in with a with a five million dollar off I read it, No, thank you. They come back eight million dollar offer, said don't even need to read again. No, no, no, thank you, already read it. They come back, tend me, no thank you, twelve million, no thank you. They come back at fourteen point five million dollars. Same script that they offered me from five that I said no to. What do you think I said when they offered me fourteen point five? I said, let me read that again. I read the same script that I said no to a five man with a fourteen point five million dollar offer, and guess what it was the exact same words. But it was a better script. It was funnier, it was more dramatic. It had angles. Who I might be able to make this baby work right here. Ultimately I go no, thank you. Now, when I said no to fourteen point five, I think a little lightning go through Hollywood that they go again, Like my dad, McConnaughey ain't bluffing, He's really not doing it. As soon as that happens, now, nothing comes in. For one year and two months, for fourteen more months, nothing comes in. Now, I'm like, I think I may have had my last day in Hollywood. I gotta think about new careers. I gotta I think maybe we want to go to be a high school football coach or orchestral conductor. I'm thinking about other careers. I may not ever work in Hollywood again. Well, what happened twenty months after I have said no? Phone rings? Well? Guests, who's now a new novel? Interesting casting? Good idea for the drama Lincoln Lawyer? Guests, who's now a new novel? Good idea for Killer Joe, for Mud, for Magic Mike for True Detective, for Dallas Buyer's Club. Bernie McConaughey. Why because I had that twenty months I unbranded. I was forgotten. We don't know where's McConaughey be. And he's not in our Eaters is a romcom guys. Not our TV's a romcom guy. He's not shirtless on the beach. There's no beaches in Texas and Austin. Where is he? So went from He's not all right, he's out. He's not doing those two all of a sudden, like, where the hell is McConaughey, what's he doing? So then all of a sudden that was gone enough out of people's eye, got some anonymity. For all of a sudden, somebody go, you know, would be an interesting idea to go to McConaughey for the dramas that I wanted. When they came, I just jumped on. So I unbranded brand. You did a rinse because I was on a very you know, questionable television show. And you can't hate what made you. That's the problem. People think you think you're better than it because you that's what made you. But you're trying to be something else, and you're trying to look at the board and you gotta do the rints and it's tempting to dip back in, but the second you dip back in, you unrint. So you really did a couragious game change or pivotal rinse. Wow, so your rose was your thorn. You have the same thing, and that enhanced the red lightstern green my thorn. It was the penance, it was a sacrifice, and I bet on it and gurrant, and it took many a wobbly day by me for Camilla to go, stay on the track, stay on. We were gonna outlast this. She's good, she's a she's tough, she's a partner. Wow. Okay, that's amazing. And then that led to many of the other roses that I've had. I mean, I love my work I've been able to do I I love making films. I love finding characters that scare me in the right way, and I've been doing it for twenty nine years. Well, I want to say something. I'm really glad that you're here today. You're obviously way more like successful and famous than I am. But I have some really interesting people, and I've stuck to my brand of what I'm doing here. And like I said, some famous people have said they want to come on, and it's tempting to me because they're super famous. But I want to talk about this, and I'm so glad that my gut instinct really thought of you as a brand in a business and you're so authentic and I'm so impressed by you. And I'm you know, the sitting you're almost the same age. But I'm proud of you because you just made such great decisions and for people at home, every little decision makes a difference. Don't get sucked up in it and don't torch yourself. But this is literally a puzzle and a house that you've built one brick at a time. And I see it that way. So that's what I want the show to be, to show people how you built the house. I'm so grateful for you today. This is my rose. Awesome, awesome talking to you, you know, on that on that that note you just said to the to the listeners about the choices we make. I mean, I will say this, Sometimes we can get into what we call paralysis of analysis. For like wait to do A do I do B? Do I do A do do B and you can look up in a decade, can be gone. Sometimes it's like just make a choice and commit to it. It's gonna may be the wrong. It'll reveal though itself and then you'll know and you go ah, okay. Or to reveal a new track for you. But sometimes it's like john't don't fall, But in putting in, commit to don't have facet and it'll reveal itself and turn out sometimes to be Oh, the decision wasn't that different from the other one either. I mean there's many outcomes from it. But I've got friends and I've seen it, and I've done it myself at times being caught in limbo and looking up and going year just went by. All roads lead to Rome. Just get in the damp car and make a left, make a right, right out of gas. You are amazing at this end. Please buy this book, this book green Lights. It's so authentic. I'm just impressed. And if there's anything you want to say at everybody, say hello, are your wife and your family? But if does any mantra already do you want to close with Otherwise? Just if we all made sense of humor r and default emotion, we might all get along a little better. All right, Well that's why we like each other. Matthew, have a wonderful day. Tone Nicole, I said hello and thank you for doing this. Thank you much awesome. I haven't wanted many celebrities and actors on here if they don't really fit the mold of what we're talking about, um of really being able to teach us or give us stories, or humanize themselves and be vulnerable and and provide wisdom about all the little decisions that it takes to be successful. Matthew McConaughey is the quintessential example of someone who has stayed true to himself, adhered to the brand, protected the realm, been in, had integrity, been intentional, and really has a career and a family and a business and a brand to show for it. Like we really just unwrapped and sort of did a reverse engineer on Matthew McConaughey and how he got here, and it now makes sense. He's certainly not just some good looking, shiny shirtless actor. That's the last thing. So I'm so glad that he had him on. It's one of my favorite interviews and I'm just grateful. There's so much to learn the misinjury about life and law, us and love and parenting and business and entertainment and writing a book. So thank you all for listening. Remember to rate, review, and subscribe. Thrilled, Thank You Just Be is hosted an executive produced by me Bethany Frankel. Just Be as a production of the Real Productions and I Heart Radio. Our Managing Producer is Fiona Smith and our producer is Stephanie Stender. Our EP is Morgan Lavoy. To catch more moments from the show, follow us on Instagram and just be with Betty
