Hi, welcome back to we will go down with this ship. I'm Heather. I'm Chelsea. And today we are so lucky to talk to Kaylene, who is also Doa Kulas, who has written a fanfic that I'm sure all of our ghlse see shippers know as ruined. And it's on ao three, and we're just gonna sit and chat about Coolsei.
So, Kay, why don't you just talk a little bit just about yourself really quick, just so we know. Oh, who you are. We know it's Canada day when we're recording, so happy Canada day. Thank you. Yep.
Yeah. So I'm Kaylene orkay. So I am in my real life. I'm a vet tech. I also work in pet insurance as well.
And I've been writing since I was a teenager. I've never published anything yet, but it's always been fanfiction. Started out on deviantartch. Remember those days? Yes.
Yeah. And then fanfiction.net, and of course I got a little toxic. So moved to ao three, and this is where we are now. What was your first ever ship? Oh, my God, I don't even know.
I was. Started writing. First thing I wrote fanfiction wise was, I think, a harvest moon fan fiction. I was, like, in that world for a long time, and I don't remember where I went off after that. But for the first ship couple I've ever shipped, I don't even remember it just been so.
There's so many ships that I love. Right? Yes. Right. Okay, let's do a top three.
Like, if you had top three.
From the top of my head, things that I was recently looking at, obviously, Cooper and Lucy will see or vault gool as I've heard a call too. But I think when the fallout show came out, I spent, like, three weeks just like on ao three reading fanfic. I was hyper fixated. It was. It was really embarrassing.
It's not embarrassing. Yeah. And trying to think what else is looking. Oh, yeah. Jack Sparrow and Elizabeth.
That's my sh tooab, Beth. I love them. And I've heard some my friends, like, no. I'm like, yes, yes, 100% yes. That if he has to be with.
If he has to be with anyone, it's Lizzie. Or else don't make him with. I think this is why the fourth movie didn't do as well, because no, no one believed that, like, Penelope Cruz is obviously gorgeous, but it was like just a weird kind of, like, out of nowhere kind of thing, you know? And I was just. And personally, like, the way they wrote Lizzie, like, in the first one, she was perfect.
And then just shit happened that I don't understand, but it's fine. But, yeah, I feel like if you're gonna make him with anyone, make him with Lizzie or don't have him be with anyone, because I do not believe that he would commit to anyone besides her. Oh, no. He's a scoundrel for sure. Y.
Exactly. Yeah. That's. She's the only woman I've ever really seen him with for, like, a commitment, long term kind of things. Yeah.
Also, I've been looking up lately. Oh, yeah. We've been watching Jurassic park. So I've been obsessed with Doctor Alan Grant. I call him doctor daddy.
So that's Jeff Goldblum, right? No, sa Sam Neil. Yeah. And I read, like, a fanic that was, like, the girl from the first movie, the teenager, Lex Murphy. She was, like, grown up, and then they had, like, a thing, but then it got.
There's not much else on there fanfic wise for that pairing, except for, like, underage stuff. And I'm like, yeah, no, we're getting away from that. No, thank you. But, yeah, other than that, I can't even think of I. What else I've been looking up.
I just. I was so consumed with ghlsei, I guess pretty much, yeah, it was. It was a really. It was a fixation. It was really, really bad, actually.
Honestly. Like, that's how I felt after watching the show for the first time. Like, I was consumed with the fanfic, but also the YouTube, like, videos that people did of them and then edit. Yeah, the edits. TikTok edits.
So it was like, my whole for you page was all superowered. I was like, all right. Chelsea sent me, like, 16 in a row in the span of, like, two minutes. I was like, I'm like, all for it. Like, yes, give me more.
But then it's like, for me, like, I'm reading. I'm, like, reading all of these, like, fanfics, including yours, and, like, I'll just start gigglinguse like, it's right about the sex, and my husband will be like, what are you reading? And I'm like, nothing. I'm just. I'm reading a book that I'm reading right now.
Like, just super awkward about it. And it's like. Or, like, I'm, like, turning super red, and my kids are right there, and I have to make sure they can't read over shoulder. Yes. Y yesake will never judge me for reading my fanficics.
Like, I love him. He will send me glse. See smut that he finds, like, on Reddit. I love that. Yeah, mine doesn't judge me either, so.
Yeah, my husband doesn't either. It's just, like, I sometimes saying it out loud, like, it's kind of like, I want to keep this my secret, and I don't. I just. I'm in the middle of something, dear. Like, anyway.
But, yeah, I think that's good that we have supportive partners and that they're not threatened by us reading about, you know, sex with the ghoul. Right? Like, I feel like they benefit out of it anyway, so. Oh, God, yes. Like, that's why, like, sends me fix.
He's like, I know I'm gonna have a good day. He knows what he's doing. He knows. Oh, man. Okay, so what made you ship the ghoul and Lucy?
Like, was there a moment in the show? Did you start shipping them before it even came out? Like, what made you jump in on this? So I obviously, like, I saw the promo pickics and the trailer, and'm like, that's a hot ghoul. Okay, that's one thing straight.
And I didn't. I didn't know that they'd be traveling together, obviously, but as soon as they met in Philly, I was like, hmm, they're gonna make them travel together, and there's no other way. And, of course, and this sounds really bad, but when he had LA sued her and started using her as bait, I'm like, yep, that's it. Done. That does not sound bad.
Just wait until our episodes come out. I think spend, like, 15 minutes just, like, colasso. Like, calm down, wal and goggins. Like, I am with my husband right here. Like, what?
You need to stop. Like, I. Anyway, yeah, it's. I'm a huge stand for enemies to lovers and the older man, younger women, woman tropes. I have my friends.
I have a couple friends who make fun of me for it. I was telling one of my friends that I was on, like, this followed fixation, and I'm like, yeah, I'm in love with Cooper Howard. She's like, of course, he's over 200 years old. I'm like, yeah, pretty much. Okay, experience.
Experience is a good thing. Well, I. Like, literally, Max is sitting across from her basically saying it's like a pimple exploding. And you want me to ship her with him? Like, come on.
Like, are we being serious right now? Like. But, like, I knew I was gonna ship, the two. And I'm not even, like, a game player. I saw.
It's like you said, I saw the ghoul. I was like, oh, shit. Like, this is interesting. I saw a little of Lucy and I was like, oh, my gosh. The grumpy sunshine.
The enemies to lovers. The age gap. Like, it's all there, right? For me. If he had been her teacher in some other life, I would have been dead.
Like, I it, right? And I love that. I just, like, it's just all there for me. And I'm like, u like, so, yeah, but that's for sure. And.
And it's sort of like, so, yeah, I knew that that was going toa be the ship. And I just think that everything that you said, like, the meeting, like, the second they meet and how she's kind of, like, on this high force about we shouldn't be violent, and instead of killing her, which is what he did to everybody else, and it wasn't because she's a woman. Like, I'm sure he killed a few women in his life, but it's like, o, yeah, the little head tilt, the, like, staring her down and the little amuse smirk. I was. I was done.
I was like, no, they totally love each other already. Like, that head toill give me chills. And of course, when he started calling her sweetheart, sweetie, darlin giggling, kicking my feet. Yes, exactly. Like, I love that.
Oh, my gosh. So, yeah, so that's. I totally get that. I love that you're into the age gap, too. Like, I am, too.
I love the professor student niche. Like, I love it when there's an imbalance of power. Like, I love that. But obviously, she has more power than he does. If we're really.
Yeah, of course. Yeah, for sure. So I was reading your author's notes, and so you actually play the games then, right? Yep. Sorry.
What you gonna say? No, no. So I was just gonna ask, with you playing the games, how do you think that the show did when you're already familiar with this world? Because I've heard mixed reviews from people who are so familiar with the games. And being an outsider, I'm like, oh, the show is perfect.
But, yeah. So what did you think? So, I mean, I'll start by saying, like, my husband has never played any of the games, but he thought the show was fantastic as well. It's just. It's so good.
And I've played Fallout new Vegas, fallout three, and fallout four. Fallout new Vegas is my favorite, but I found, like, they really did a good job. Keeping you to the lore. I mean, the storyline, obviously, it's its own different storyline, but keeping to the general, the general story of Fallout. Yes.
That's what I'm trying to say. Yeah. I mean, they did a great job of making Lucy as the perfect, naive, vault dweller character that you play in the game. Like, the OC playing the game where they're kind of, like, super clueless about the world around them and just some of the things she says, it's just like, that sounds like something a character would say. Like your character would say.
So I think they did a really good job, personally. Like, the writing was fantastic, the setting and just the ending where Hank ended up in new Vegas, I squealed. I was like, oh, my God. I can't believe that's where we're ending up. So, yeah, I mean, I think they did great.
So, Chelsea, do you have any questions you want to jump in with really quick?
Have you had any experiences with Ghoulcy antis, or do you keep your feeds kind of clean of those?
Sorry, you said Ghoulcy antis, so, like, y in the reviewers. Yeah, yeah. She just cut out a little bit, so I just wanted to confirm. Yeah, like, not really like, my feed are pretty clean of that. TikTok knows what I want.
Right. So I had had some, you know, Max and Lucy edits as well, which I think are super cute. And then you see the comments, like, I don't know why they're shipping everyone, shipping her with Cooper. And I'm just like, well, so I just, I watch. Avoid those.
You'see? Why. Yeah, exactly. Mean, I'm not against, but, like, Cooper's just what I prefer. Oh, for sure.
Like, Max. Max is, you know, he's a very sweet character. The actor is very handsome. Let's get that straight. Oh, that's what we say too.
And he's very charming. Like, he's funny if you watch him in interviews. Oh, my God. I mean, yeah, I. For sure, yeah, I mean, he's just, he's too naive for her.
And he has this hidden anger that, you know, at least Cooper doesn't try to hide it. And he hasn't really lied to her. He's kind of just, I'm an asshole. And that's, I can't wait for you to see my Maximus crack theories when the episodes drop. Oh, yeah.
I'm excited. It's no, and we think the same thing, and it's, I just, it's such good storytelling. The, all of the characters are so compelling, whether it's like, the little side characters or even, like, barb. Like, I do not like her, but I'm very curious, like, what? How did you divorce?
Where are you right now? Like, what's going on? I just think that they did such a good job with this, you know, being the first season and the setup and everything like that. So where did you get the idea for ruined? Like, what made you think, like, what inspired you?
So, like I said, so. Ever watched. We watched the show the first time, I was like, okay, I'm gonna go searching for fanfic. So I've read a whole bunch, and I'm like, okay, I'm gonna start writing. And for me, my writing process is super chaotic.
So I'm always like, when I'm falling asleep, I'm, like, writing scenes in my head. Okay, I'm falling asleep. I'm in bed, and I'm like, my imagination is just wild all the time. I'm always thinking about stuff. So I think I had.
I don't even know. I think I had, like, just a certain scene plan. I think when I was like, I think if he takes care of her when she's sick, let's just go for that. And then I just kind of expanded off that. I finally know where I'm ending.
But as for the idea, I don't think. I don't even know where I came up with it. It just. It was just so much research and reading and watching the show a few times, I'm like, okay, we need to write a fanfiction this. Yeah, for sure.
Do you. What's easier, Cooper's point of view or Lucy's? Because you go back and forth, and I feel like you do a really good job in their heads. Yeah. Yeah.
So Cooper's is more fun because he's very possessive, toxic. Let's get that straight. Toxic in his obsession. But Lucy's. I can relate to it a little bit more because, you know, I don't know if either one is easier.
His is more fun, but I really enjoy being in her pov as well, just because she's, you know, with, like, my latest chapter, she's like, okay, I love this man. And she's just trying to show her love for him without saying the three words. Without saying the words, because, you know, that might send him running away. But, yeah, I I really like. I don't think either one is easier than the other.
They're just. They're both really. They're both fun for me. So do you have any plans to write more after you finish this one, or do you kind of need to take a break and like, figure out if you get any plot bunnies or what's that sort of part of the process for you, maybe. So it's been a while since I've, like, written and posted any fanfiction.
Lost time was on fanfiction.net and then I got tired of it and like, deleted my account or like, deleted all my stories kind of thing. I was just done with it and then Fallout had inspired me to write more, so I might need a break. I'm a slow writer. I just, I write and then I spend days editing and so I already took like a month break or so between the last chapter I posted and this one, but I'm not sure I have some. I love this pairing.
So I'd love to write more. I just need to wait to get more inspiration, I guess, to what I want to do. Yep. So for sure, sometimes it's really good to just like, wait and ruminate on it and like, take your time with it. I'm a very slow writer also.
Yeah, I've made, I've made mistakes before where I've written stuff too fast and pushed it out, and then I'm just like, I don't like this. So, yeah, I don't want to do that. So, um, out of all of the scenes that you currently have posted right now are chapters. Do you have a favorite scene that you've written?
Yeah, um, I think it's chapter three when they're in the dressing room. I I was to. Yep. I'm like, yep. I thought of that before.
I think I thought of that. Like, when I started the first chapter, I'm like, yepah, this is, this is what I want to do. This is what's going to happen. Yeah. And a very fast burn.
I did not expect this to be fast burn, but here we are. I mean, it worked for the fic. I thought that it was u, like, seamless. Like, I feel like sometimes when they rush it, it, it you, you're kind of like, no, whoa, dude. Like, we need to build it up.
But I felt like even the first two chapters and just being in each character's head, like, I felt like that was enough. And there was obviously a time passage between them, which I thought you established really well. So it's like, even though when you're reading the fic, it is a fast burn being in chapter three, in reality, it's not a fast burn between them because they have already been on the road together for a certain amount of time anyway, you know? Yeah. Because, I mean, I don't know the exact distance, but I'm sure from California to the Mojave, it's a little bit far of a walk.
Right. So I'm assuming we're looking on weeks, maybe months, you know? So, yeah, that's what I was worried about, of course, is making, you know, the smut happen too early. Right. But, yeah, I'm hoping I conveyed the passage of time.
Okay. So I think, so. She did a good job than you. What was the most difficult one, do you think? Or what did you struggle with the most?
Which scene? U. So I think just violence in general. I'm not good at writing it. Like.
So I did have to write that one quite a few times. Just the when she got held at gunpoint kind of thing. But again, it's in her pov, so she's kind of hiding, and she doesn't see anything. Just years, which worked out great for me, for the writing perspective, but, yeah, I have more violence coming up, I think, in his point of view. So I'venna have to work on that a lot, I think.
But, yeah, yeah. Like I said, just writing, fighting is just not my forte. But trying. I don't know. When Cooper says something like, okay, if we're doing this, your mind, and then he proceeds to tell her how he was going to, like, kill the guy who held her up at gunpoint or knife point.
I think I was like, that was very descriptive, and I loved every single second of it. Yes. Yes. Absolutely love that. Yeah.
Fantic. And I love the whole healed, like skin and eat any man who's to her, like, yes. I'm so here for that. Thank you. Yeah.
Oh, my gosh. There's spoiler alert, I guess. But I do have a plan for that. Like, someone does, like, try to touch her, and he does make good on his word. And she's, like, not.
Not expecting it. Let's just say that. Yeah, I totally get what you'saying. I love it. I love it.
I'm so here for it. Yeah, for sure. Okay, so, Chelsea, why don't you tell her what your favorite line is? Like, she literally sends me this screen grab of it. It's so cute.
Yeah, I love my favorite line in the whole fic. Is that I. He swallowed. Here fucking goes. You're like the goddamn son, Lucy.
The only bright spot I've had in 200 years of this purgatory, he locked her in place with his. That you make me feel alive. Like, I love it. Love. No, that was my second favorite.
My first favorite was, um. Okay, he knew he wanted to ruin her, but he never stopped to think for 1 second that she would be able to ruin him. Like, I feel like Chelsea's and then that one. Like, I know we don't. We aren't sitting in the writers s room, but I feel like that is such a head canon of who Cooper Howard is.
Like, he is. So I think even you say it in, in your, in one of your author's notes, like, oh, he's. He's pulling away again or something like that. He's. He doesn't believe he deserves to be happy or.
Yeah, you know, whatever. And I just feel like Lucy is, is literally the sunshine. And so he's like this, this grump and I just. It's, like, perfect. And he, and I feel like he would completely, 100% be attracted to Lucy.
Like, and he wouldn't deny it. I think that he's not an idiot. Like, she's a good looking girl, but I think that he would be taken by surprise when she affects him in a way that he's not expecting. I think it's already happening. Like, while they're talking to each other.
Oh, yeah. Especially after the, you know, golden rule, motherfucker. Like, I feel like I think he fell in love at that point. Yeah, I was like, he's done. Yeah, I think so too.
Like, for. He's killed, like, everyone he's come across, really. And, you know, his 219 years, I believe. And it's just this girl, this vault dweller who hates vlt tech, and then she saves his sorry ass, right? And he's like, well, fuck, like, all right, gonna bring her along with me, I guess.
And I was like, oh, yes. I cannot wait for season two. And the way they ended, episode eight was so good. Yeah, I know. So good.
I cannot wait for season two either. And I'm, like, dying every day that we don't have it yet. I know. I thought it was so poignant because, like, his back is to her and so he knows she has a gun and it's like, she could. He's.
Even though obviously he knows, like, if he shoots, besides, if it's a headshot, he. He's not going to die necessarily. But he could still turn around, pull on her, kill her, because when, when she, when she, like, locks in the gun, when she's ready to fire, he hears it, you see it flashes to him, and he doesn't do anything. He's going to give her this choice. And he kills, you know, she kills his, you know, her mom mercy killing the same way that he did for Roger, essentially.
And it's just like, I felt like that moment right there when, like you said, he's been killing everybody. He's not discriminate when it comes to killing. And the fact that he gave her that choice of, like, who are you going to become? Like, which way are you going to go? Like, to me, like, it sounds so morbid, but I'm like, that is so romantic, Cooper.
Like, oh, and I also loved that he was kind enough not to say I told you so, even though he totally could have. Oh, for sure. We'll see. We'll see about her dad. I can see him saying it, like, three days later, though.
Like, hey, by the way, I fucking told you, like, right in that moment that in chose not to say I told you so. Like, for me, that was huge. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Absolutely.
I mean, he'snna be so hard on her the next season, but literally, literally. But I really, really hope that they go that direction that we're hoping for. The force, proximity, the enemies to lovers. Like, of's. Like, please give me the only one bad trope.
I was just about to say that. I was like, better be one bed. The one. The one that you did, who did this to you? When he sees the scar on, like, okay, yeah.
Me and Chelsea were talking. The moments that we can't wait for is when she finds out who he really is and definitely the scar for sure, because me and Chelsea are like, it's very persephone's hades or beauty and the beast, and, like, they could completely lean into this. And I feel like if you remember episode two when Lucy's, like, kind of starry eyed over Max, who's a literal knight in shining armor, I'm really hoping that the writers did that on purpose where they were really on the nose with everything, because I'm like, okay, sure. He's the first handsome guy that, you know, is not related to her. And so I totally get that.
But I'm also hoping that it's one of those things where it's like, you shouldn't be with that quintessential Prince Charming. You should be with the guy who, like, makes you a better person and teaches you the lessons that you need to know to be that better person. And obviously, that's Cooper. Like, when we break down episode four, we like, their max is nowhere in that episode at all. And so it's like both of them have that mirror moment or that reflection against each other.
They're both teaching each other lessons, and I just. I love that so much. So, yeah. So, yeah, I really like. I mean, it's a lot of writers, headcanons that I'm sure she had a crush on Cooper Howard, the actor.
Right? There's. I mean, that's. That's what, you know, Hank made. I'm sure Hank had, like, weekly movie nights watching the same movie over and over again.
Right? So. Yes. Really? That.
That man as a crush on Cooper too. Let's be. He would be fine if Lucy was calling him Daddy. He'd be like, I get it. Oh, yeah.
But, I mean, yeah, it's obvious. I mean, it's not a stretch to say that she has a crush on the actor, right? So when she finds out who it really is, I'm just like, oh, my God, I can't wait. I know. Wait, either.
Also, can we talk about the thing where she realizes that he has her finger in your f. Oh, yeah. That was so amazing. I was like, ah, yes. And then the girl that got me.
Hey, he always wears gloves, right? So. Right. But in this show, I was like, when he was sewing on her finger, I was like, oh, my God, here we go. And it's just, like, the heart shaped loop in the thread.
Like, you can't tell me that's not on purpose. Shut up. Like, right? Like, obviously, you could argue that. Yeah, it was.
It was there, but he didn't have to keep it. He put it in his pocket, right? He didn't have to keep the damn finger, so he did, and he sewed her finger on there. But we also didn't have to take the fall for her for what went down at the organ market. Yeah, my.
My favorite part, though, even though, you know, it's morbid, but, like, there you are. Little killer. Like, we literally say, that's our favorite line. That is our favorite line in the whole damn show. Like, oh, my gosh.
It was so there's no judgment here, by the way. Like, yeah, worries. So judgin. Like, the. I mean, I had wrote it in my fick, right?
But the eye contact between the two of them, between him at that. At least him at that moment where, you know, he's cutting off her finger. I was like, oh, this man is. Is into it. He doesn't know yet, but's into it.
I think I told Chelsea he got hard the second that she. Oh, finger. Like, let's be real. Yeah. Oh, yeah.
With that. There you are, your little killer. Like, yeah, no shit. Like, that man is. He's in love, and he does not even know it.
Yeah. Exly. Yep. Oh, man. His character and tomb Raider walked so Cooper Howard could run.
I swear to God.
But going back to the who did this to you? Thing. Yeah. Like, I had a commenter the other day on my fix say, like, you know, I've read tons of go see fix and I haven't had anyone address that scar, right? And I was like, yeah.
And because it's one of my favorite tropes. And so I'm like, okay, I'm gonna throw that in there. But I feel I'm wondering if they're gonna throw that in the show because once he sees that the who the fuck did this to you? Kind of thing, I'm really hoping that we get that because we're feral for it. Ye, I'm so hoping also.
Oh, yeah, yeah. I mean, it's like they have so much potential and obviously, like, fallout isn't just this romance. But if we're talking about giving Cooper Howard his humanity back, this is part of that where he cares about somebody else outside of Jane, outside of, you know, if he still cares about Barb, I guess you can make the argument either way, but it's like caring about not only some other person but a vault tech, you know, vaulty, whatever. I think that that would be really poignant in terms of his character transformation. And like, me and Chelsea, one of our head canons going into season two is that he is going to be super possessive and protective, but he's going to give her shit.
So, like, o yeah, he'll give her shit. He'll like, do whatever. But the second anyone even looks at her the wrong way, it's. It's done. Like, he is not having it.
And so, like, I could even picture the scene in my head where she's like, she has to change out of her clothes for some odd reason. And he, of course, happens to be looking and he sees the scar and he stops her or from putting her shirt on and says, what is this? Who did this to you? Like, whatever. And, you know, I don't know.
And I think that what I loved about your fic too, that I have noticed not a lot of people touching it is the psychology behind touch. And, like, I feel like Cooper Howard doesn't want to be touched and he doesn't touch other people. And so that is very intimate. Just that, you know, the touching of his face and things like that, you know, and asking him to take his gloves off also. Yes.
Yeah. Yeah. Because, I mean, like, he's, you know, he's horny for her. Right. But he doesn't want her to, you know, think that he's a monster already more than she already does, which, you know, but, yeah, the, like you said, the psychology of touch.
Like, he. There's no way. Like, I'm sure he's hasn't been celibate the past 200 years, but I can't imagine that he's been, like, fully naked, taking all of his armor off. You know, his clothes are like, his armor. Right.
So myso my head canon for that. Is that, like, he's just looking, like either. Like, having sex is, like, one part of his humanity. Like, everyone has needs, right? He's been alive for 217 years, but, like, I think it's a quick fuck that he's paying for.
I totally think he's paying for it, and I think that he, you know, he's not taking clothes off. He probably brings the woman. Like, he makes her comment, everything like that. I don't think that's so much an issue, but I don't think that that's his. His desire.
Like, he's just looking to get off. And if she gets off before him, fine. But I think that with Lucy, it's different, obviously, you know? And I think that, again, it's that monster versus man. And that's, like, I feel like one of his trajectories in terms of his character transformation is finding that balance because he's only been regarded as a monster for so long that he believes it of himself.
And so it's like, even in your story, where it's like, he's pushing her away because he doesn't want the pity. And I think part of him, too, is that fear of, like, I know I'm a monster, but if she thinks I'm a monster, that's just gonna break my heart, too, you know? Yeah. One thing that I thought you did super well in your fic, and I loved it so hard, is that Lucy sees his humanity and treats him like a person, despite what he looks like, despite the radiation and how it's changed him and all this kind of stuff. Like, she just treats him like a person.
And I loved everything about that. Ye yeah. Even in the show, too. Like, I mean, she had. She had a moment where she's like, what are, like, what are you?
Or who are you? I think she said. And, you know, but I never saw any real disgust on her face. Right. Because I'm sure she didn't know what ghouls were or when she came out of.
Until she came out of revolt and saw him. Right. So even the show, that's why I kind of brought it in my fit, because I don't think she would be like, oh, this man is disgusting. Why is he touching me? Like, like, what?
I feel like, you know, he thinks, like, I can't believe she can even stand to touch me. Right? So, and that's a great thing they did in the show when she released all those ghouls, even the feral ones, like, you know, not necessarily knowing that the feral ghouls were going to be a problem in theego organ market, but, like, she sees them as much as people as anybody else. And I love that about Lucy. And you did that so well in your fic.
Thank you. Well, and we see it, too. Me and Chelsea talk about this, where she has so many opportunities to, like, flinch when he touches her. Like she's mad for genuine, like, for how he treats her, not for what he looks like. And, and she, and there are so, like I said, there's so many opportunities for her to actually say something about it or comment about it.
And it's like, she doesn't. I think that's what scares Cooper so much about her is that she doesn't see him as a monster. And he's wanted to forget his past and forget who he was before all of this. And for her to see him in this way, it brings up so much for him that he has to, like, push her away in order to try and remember, like, no, I am a monster. I need to be a monster.
But, like, I think even Walton Goggins, like, when he's doing his interviews, he's talking about, like, you know, he's, you know, like, he's using her for bait. He's trying to teach her a lesson. He's trying to do x, Y and z. And if you even have the actor portraying the ghoul, like, think this way, like, I don't even, I wouldn't even consider that he, like, he hates vault tech and he probably hates her to agree based on what she represents. But I think that the fact that he would even waste his time trying to have a conversation with her, trying to teach her things, says that he sees her almost like an equal or he's trying to protect her from turning into this.
You know, I'm just go. Going toa believe whatever Vaul tech tells me, you know, and he, he's going toa be a dick about it, but he wouldn't waste his time with anybody else trying to teach him this kind of lesson. You know, so I think already that that is a huge deal just for him as a character. Yeah. I'm wondering, too, if he would have changed his mind when he sold her off if he didn't collapse on the ground.
That's. I'm that's what I'm wondering because, I mean, like, like, I agree with you'trying to teach her a lesson, but I don't know personally if he would have just let her get sold like that if he didn't. Like, I mean, in the end, if he wouldn't have come in and rescued her or whatever. But I don't. Like, I'm not sure if he was at the point yet to want to rescue her, but I think knows.
I think potentially, I think potentially he would only because, and only because he knew her name. And so if he wants revenge because he. He finds out about her name before she gets sold. And what me and Chelsea point out is that, first of all, he takes her to a medical center first. His first intention was not to sell her off, but if he's trying to get back to Jane, to Janie, he needs these ches.
And so, yeah, me and Chelsea actually talk about, like, do you think he would have? And I don't. I think he's going to. If we're looking at it from, like, a non shipper standpoint in terms of practicality, I think that if he wants to get to Hank, having his daughter alive is a really good bargaining chip. So I think it's more of if he doesn't collapse, he'd probably demand the chemss right away.
U after sending her in. And I think once he secured the chems, he would grab her and not necessarily in a romantic way because he could continue to do this at other sort of like markets like that. So. So, yeah. Oh, like running a con.
I like that. Yeah. Oh, for sure. But u but, yeah. So do you have any other head canons for either Lucy herself, Cooper himself, or just together or any theories of season two that you kind of have, especially since you played the game?
So you kind of know maybe a little bit about what might happen. Yeah. So for season two. So my, my real. I don't have, like, a huge.
I'm not really sure where they're gonna go ultimately. I mean, I know at the end of season one, Hank is heading off to new Vegas, and you can see it looks a little rough, but the lucky 38, where Mister House is presumably in, is still standing. So I think have. I know you haven't, Heather, but, Chelsea, have you played fallout new Vegas at all? Or do you know about the ending?
Yes, it is. It is on my list. I'mkay. No worries. Dicking around and fall out for no worries.
There's so much to do and fall up for. But the reason I'm asking is cause there's, like, four different endings to fall at new Vegas, no matter, like, which route you choose. And the mister house route, um, is, I mean, the only route where he would stay alive. So, um, there is a point where you can kill him, but u in his row, if you're siding with him, he's going toa take over Vegas and keep the strip pristine and exclusive. So I'm wondering if that is the route that they went with, just based on how a lucky 38 casino is looking in the distance and how the rest of new Vegas is a little, like, ruined, looking more ruined than it was.
So it's either. It's either that or maybe the NCR, I'm not sure. So either way, Hank is gonna try to find what he's looking for. As for the rest of it, I'm not 100% sure if Cooper is going to find his family alive. Barb is a survivor.
That woman is probably survived somehow, whether in, you know, cryo or whatever. But I don't know about Janie. Presumably Barb would keep her, want to keep her alive, because, I mean, she has her daughter. She does love her, you know, but I don't think it's going to be a happy ending for him. I just have that gut feeling, personally.
So, I mean, you don't really get. You kind of get, like, an okay ending, an acceptable ending in the followout games. So I feel like the show's not going to be, like, oh, unicorns and rainbows, everyone's happy now. I feel like that's not where it's gon toa go, but again, I can only speculate. Right.
So I'm not entirely sure where they're going with it. But what. What's your opinion on. So let's hypothetically say that Barb is alive, and that's what Chelsea and I think, too, in some form or another. Do you think that Cooper.
Do you think he. Do you think he hates Barb, but do you think he wants to get back together with her? Like, where do you think his headspace is at the end of season one? And, like, what would you predict would be a good, maybe not a unicorn ending for that storyline, per se, but, like, how would you want to see that whole storyline get wrapped up? Um, so as for Barb.
I mean, I I personally think he hates her. She's, you know, she's. She's done so much to him. Like you said, she's a very intriguing character, but, I mean, she's perpetuated the bombings, right? Presumably, you know, in the fallout games, there's kind of ambiguous who dropped the bombs first to end, you know, end the world, I guess.
But the show is confirmed. He. It's vault tech. So the fact that she was involved in that he. He hates her, and the fact, you know, they're divorced, and.
I don't know. We haven't heard. Obviously, we haven't seen what happened with. With Janie, and I'm assuming that Barb had come and taken Janie from him because, you know, he's. He burned into, you know, by the radiation and turned into the ghoul.
So I'm assuming she took her daughter into a vault somewhere. Whether it's vault 31 or it's a different upper management vault, I don't know. But I feel like he does hate her, and I think he is going to kill her. Please, God, please. I know.
U that's. That's the only way I see that ending. Like, I don't see a world where they end up together. Like, I I'm sure she hates him, too, to be honest, and the fact that. But I feel like when she sees him as the ghoul, it's not gonna be good.
She's not gonna be attracted to him or want to get together with him. I mean, you know, and as for Janie, I hope she's alive, but there's a chance that she could be a ghoul, too. I don't know. Right. So it's a good ending would be, at least he finds her.
But whether hopefully she's not dead, that's, you know, wouldn't it suck if he. If Janie was a ghoul and Cooper had the mercy kill her? Yeah, the same. The same way Lucy did with her mom. Yeah.
You know, I just thought of that right now. My. Yeah, I thought of that, too. I, um, I've read a few fanfictions where, like, she's Janee Z in pro storage, um, in vault 31. I've read one where she is a ghoul, and Barb is working with Fallau Tech to reverse the glouification process, but I don't know what direction they're gonna go.
I really hope she's alive, because that man deserves some ounce of happiness. Oh, yeah. Yeahah. So much. I think, like, so Chelsea and I, our biggest concern is that they're going toa try to give him a redemption arc.
And so, like, because obviously his. His transformation is finding his humanity again. Ye, and, like, obviously the biggest show of that would be for him to make some kind of sacrifice, not necessarily to save Janie, but to save the person who made him the way that he is, which would be Barb. Yeah. We are hoping that he's getting the transformation from this newfound family between him.
Lucy and CX 404, dog meat, whatever. And, like, I just. And it would be very interesting if he had to make some kind of choice between his old family and his new family. Like, do you go back into the past and try to, you know, reclaim it, or do you move on to this unknown future with, you know, this. These people that you've surrounded yourself with?
So as long as they don't sort of either redeem Barb or try to have Cooper make some kind of, you know, really, like, stupid sacrifice to show, now finally, he's human again or whatever, I'm fine with whatever they do because they did a really solid job of season one. Like, for sure, I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt, but at the same time, there is that in the back of my head that at least in mainstream pops culture, you can't just ever have a morally gray, a true morally gray character without some kind of, like, no pun intended, but fallout from it, right? Like, if we're even looking at Daemon Targaryen, I don't know. Have you. Have you watched House of Dragon?
So it's sort of like everybody loves him, but now all of a sudden, it's like, I mean, I was telling Chelsea this before we started talking. It was really frustrating when the writers came out and said, why is Damon the Internet's boyfriend? He's such a terrible person. And I'm like, well, like, do we have to explain it, really? Yeah.
And that's what I said. Like, how do you not understand this? And so now it feels like they have to make him do kind of uncharacteristic things that. To make everyone sort of believe he's a bad guy. Now do you get what I'm saying?
Like, and I don't want that to happen to Cooper because I think he's just so perfect. And luckily, Walton Goggins has come out saying it's very collaborative so he can go to the writers and talk to them about his character. So, yeah, so that's my biggest thing with Barb. Like, I just, you know, I just don't want it to be where it's like they're going to try to be a family again. And Barb is redeemed, and she's so sorry, and Coop is just so willing to forgive her.
I'm like, dude, she wouldn't even let him take the dog into the vault. Okay? There's no for that. So, yeah, I hear that that was Barb's idea to not allow dogs in the vaults because you could tell she didn't like Roosevelt at all. And I'm just like, you bitch.
Yeah, I agree with that, actually. But, yeah, you know, like, what you're saying, heather, like, I swear, if they try to make him into some kind of murder or some kind of hero, I will be so upset because, like, we can't ever have, like, I know the point of Fallout isn't the romance and being in love with this ghoul, right? But the fact we can never have a true villain. Right? So, like, Cooper's not a villain.
He'an antihero. Right. But I don't want him to turn into some hero. No. And, like, there's a reason why we read books, like, with, like, true villains, because they will be a villain for everyone else but the person they love.
And that's where I hope that they go with it for Cooper. And if they don't, it'snna be. It's gonna be sad, because if he. If he. If there is some way where he has to sacrifice himself or Janie or Barb or something, I be pissed.
Well, and that's interesting. Have you. Did you. Have you seen justified at all or. No.
Okay, so Walton Goggins is also unjustified, and he plays Boyd, who is the bad guy in that. And the canononical relationship between him and Ava is just. It's perfect. I mean, granted, I'm only in season five. I just.
And there are six seasons, but that is essentially he is this morally great character. Granted, he's not the main character the way that Timothy Olafhan s character is, but he's literally ready to burn the world down for Ava, and he makes no apologies for it. And so far in the first four seasons, that has not changed. And so I'm like, this is what I need more of. Like, I need more of that unapologetic obsession for this person that they love and they are willing to do whatever it takes for that person.
And so that is why, like, I don't want Cooper. Like, and that's what Chelsea and I were talking about is I want Cooper to. I want Lucy to accept Cooper for who he is right now. And I think that she's on that verge of doing it, especially when they start spending so much time together. And I just think that by turning him good, I don't.
I think it's too kitschy. I don't need this fairy tale ending. I want him to be exactly who he is and still get a happy ending because he deserves a happy. You don't have to be this perfect person to get a happy ending, you know? And I'm hoping that the nuance of fallout shows this, because we see the people who are supposed to be good are actually evil.
The people who are not great actually are. Have some redeeming qualities. Like even. Even the chicken fucker saved our. Saved that sa boy.
I mean, in a way, turning into a ghoul. I mean, he did save him, but also I felt like that was ironic justice for Thaddeus, though, with all the thoughts put in his head by the brotherhood. But I just love Thaddeus and, like, I hope we get to see more of him in the future. I hope he wasn't just a season one character because he's adorable and we love him. Yeah, no, he's great.
That was. That was definitely a good end for him. Like, yeah, the brotherhood's not gonna like that. No. But can you imagine if Cooper had to, like, show thadys the ropes on, like, how to be a ghoul?
Like, yeah. Oh, my God, I. You die. That would be so good. Yeah, but I loved in your story because this is one of my head canons.
Is that, like, when they start on their road trip? Like, right now, obviously, Lucy'sort, of, like, in mourning, but once she kind of gets past that, she's not going to be able to shut up. And he is gonna get so annoyed with her, and they're just gonna fight all the time, and she's just go. Going to be asking him questions. Like, that is one of, like, my theories, my headanons, whatever you want to call it.
Ye. Yeah, yeah. No, for sure. She's gonna annoy the hell out of him, and it's gonna be great when, you know, he claps back and then she gets upset and I feel like he's gonna be like, oh, shit, like, what did I just do? We'll see.
We'll see. But, yeah, one of my other headanons, too, ism, when you were saying about, you know, him, like, accepting his past, like, that's good. Like, I hope he does accept his past, but I don't want him to go back to that, certainly, because I mean, that's not who he is anymore. And, you know, I've every faniction I've read with those two, you know, she's always calling him Coop instead of Cooper. And I feel I have the had canon that, you know, he doesn't want to be called Coop because that is a huge reminder of his past.
Like Cooper is it. And you know, I put that in my story because I'm just, I saw that. Yeahus, I'm just like, I feel like he personally, in my opinion, I feel like that's not it for him. That's just gonna remind him. He already has enough reminders of us past with her presence.
Just her and vault tech and, you know, I just. But I don't want them to go back for him to have that redemption arc of like, oh, my past is great now. Like, let's go back to the way it wh before. No, no, no, no. I agree.
If you were writing the show and we get what we want, obviouslye, how would you have them sort of get together? Because I'm a big fan of the slow burn with little moments progressing the relationship forward. So you don't necessarily have to say like, oh, they have to, you know, like let's pretend it's three, five, whatever seasons. It doesn't matter. What is the moment where Lucy realizes she loves Cooper, where Cooper realizes he loves Lucy and how they get together?
Like, if you could write the story, I feel like the way it would most make sense is in a situation where he has to save her life. Like, that's the only way that I feel like it would, it would have to go. You know, she gets herself into trouble. She talks so much, right? And she, she is good with the gun, but I mean, like, she's not, she's book smart.
She's not street smart. So she, she somehow made her way through the first season to the observatory by herself. Mostly she made her way, but, you know, I just feel like she's gonna get herself into the wrong situation and he's gonna have to save her's. That's what I feel like. So what about you, Chelsea?
What do you think? I have a weird headcanon that like, as they're growing closer and this like, found family feeling is building, she's going to do something stupid in an attempt to protect him and this new found found family that she has with him and dog meat and she's go going to do something in an attempt to protect him or defend him. That almost gets her hurt or killed. And then he has this light bulb moment of, oh, sh. I care.
I care a lot. I might actually love this person. That was so stupid. Why the fuck would you do that? Like, I, like, that's my head.
Can I like that too? Yeah, that's good. My headcanon is, I would love to see Lucy be forced to choose, like, between going with Max. Like, oh, he thinks that because my. My thing is when Max wakes up, he thinks the ghoul takes her by force because he doesn't.
They made that promise, and he has no reason to believe that she would not, you know, follow through with that promise. And so he thinks he's actually going to save her only to realize, like, oh, they're getting along. He's not trying to hurt her, and he's going to force her to choose between returning with. With Max or whatever or staying with Cooper. And I think Cooper's automatically going to assume she's going toa go off with Max, but in reality, she's going to choose Cooper, and that's only gonna, like, piss Max off.
And because he's risked so much, he's done so much. And so I think in that moment when Lucy decides to stick it out with him versus the traditionally attractive, the younger guy, the guy who, you know, ticks off all the right boxes, I think when that happens, he's going to realize, like, oh, shit, she did that for me. Like, not even Barb did that for me. Like, no one has done that for accepting him as the ghoul. Not, you know, Cooper Howard or whatever, o for sure.
So, like, I would love to see something like that, but, yeah, that's. And that would play into my favorite crack theory really well. You should just tell her. You should tell her. I have a crack theory that Maximus is actually going to become a villain.
And, like, I could see him being such a charismatic bad guy and, like, maybe end up even, like, rising further through the ranks of the brotherhood and running the brotherhood after he has his downward spiral moment when he realizes that Lucy is not going to choose him. Like, I'm so here for that. I would love to see Aaron Moton play. Oh, yeah. That arc.
Like, I think it would be beautiful and he would do a fantastic job and he would be a sexy bad guy. I'm just. Oh, yeah. Like, come on, guys. Oh, for sure.
I have the theory, too. Like, when, when we watch the show the first time, it was just surprising how. Well, not surprising, but how he is the good guy, right? But he has this dark side. Like, when he, when he's trying to get his, the power armor suit back and he's just, like, bashing in heads, you're like, all right, there's something going on with him, right?
And. But he is just so indoctrinated into the brotherhood that I totally agree with you, Chelsea, that he is probably going to become a villain, and I'm totally here for it. Oh, I need to see him commit war crimes. I need to see it happen. Pleaseutely ab the writers, if you are listening, can you please give us badass Maximus as a bad guy?
Because that would be so hot, first of all. And, like, it makes sense with the character arc as it's already set up, and I'm just like, well, because me and Chelsea were talking about it, like, and even in that second episode, like, the one where you, where you say where he's trying to get that armor back, it's like, you even, um, gosh, even when he was with Titus, right. It's like you're, you're at the point where you're rooting for him, but then he makes a questionable choice where it's like you're getting too much enjoyment watching Titus die. Like, that's a little, a little strange. Or like when he was about to crush freaking Thaddeus'head and Thadus.
Yeah. I was like, y, oh, this is weird. But he doesn't, and so it's like, you're kind of like, as when I was watching it the first time, I was like, this feels weird, but I don't know why because he technically hasn't done anything wrong. But then the second he lied to Lucy about when they were in vauved, gosh, four, I think it was, and, like, all of that, I was like, dude, you lied. First of all, you obviously lied to her about who you are.
So I'm already, like, not with you at this point, but then to, like, lie to her about this when she's so accepting of so much, I'm just like, okay, I don't, I don't, I can't ship this. And I don't know, like, again, if I'm, like, just in my villain era, I'm like, oh, yeah, you do. You. But, like, yeah, I'm in my, like, Lucy, I gotta back her up. I'm like, dude, no.
Get away from him. Lucy, like, go with Coope, because Cooper will handle it. Like, Cooper's honest about who and what he is. Exactly. Exactly.
Exactly. If, if Cooper wasn't in this, then, yeah, like, totally like, Lucy Maximus. Like, I totally support, you know, them together. Like, as, you know, him being a villain, like, like we said and. But unfortunately, withop there's Cooper Howard and I'm sorry.
And like, I saw somebody on Twitter yesterday that was answering a tweet that somebody said, like, why did you freak make Walton goggins into a sex symbol? And I'm like, hold the fuck up. He did that by himself for all. He is so sexy. He always has been.
I don't even care. I thought he was adorable way the fuck back in Shanghai noon. Like, don't play with my boy. He is fine. He is.
He is very fine. But yeah, no, I I don't know. With, with Max, it's just like, I think. I think he sees Lucy, you know, as this happy, like, optimistic person and he is trying to be a hero for her. Right.
You know'that? Knight in shining armor saving her from Cooper and then know he's trying to be her hero. But he's gott to realize that's not really who he is based on his dark side, which, I mean, living in the world that they do. Of course you got to do what you do have to do to survive. But he, like you guys had said, he's definitely going to most likely think that Cooper had kidnapped her.
Right. But how he goes about that whether, like you said, heather, he's going to make her choose, which is entirely possible, which I can see that as well. That's a beautiful headc canon.
I read a fan fiction to where I don't think it's complete, but where they were going allh back to Vaut 33 and Max had kidnapped norm to, for the brotherhood to use against Hank because theyn they didn't know where Lucy was, right. So. Which I thought was pretty interesting. And I'm wondering if that is something that they'renna go for because the brotherhoods, they're gonna get what they're gonna try to get what they want. They're gonna go after Hank for sure.
So, yeah, I don't know. It's all very interesting. I I'm like, I'm excited about it. I'm like, I wouldn't say I'm worried. There are.
There is that potential of like, things being fucked and I'm hoping that they don't do it. And that's what me and Chelsea say. If you're not going to give us the ship, then fine, but don't, don't do something stupid. Like, even Walton Goggins has come out saying it's not father daughter. So once that came out, like.
Like, what could you say? Okay, yeah, maybe it's platonic, fine, but, like, it's not father. Don't make this weird just because, you know, he's older than she is. Like, it's not that. So, yeah, I.
And I think that Max is a very interesting character, and, yeah, unfortunately for everyone, or fortunately for us, Cooper is in the show. And I just. I just think that there's something just attractive about he, you know, and it's interesting because a lot of the anties or whatever are like, well, you know, he abused her. He tried. He sold her.
He did all of these things to her. And it's really hard, you know, not to defend it, but to be, like, you have to understand his character motivation about why he's doing all of that. So, technically speaking, he could have killed her and still used her as bait, but he didn't. She kept her alive, you know, and he didn't immediately sell her. They went to that medical center, and they saw Raj.
And I love that moment because that's where Lucy really saw. I mean, at the time, she didn't, but I think she realizes it now is that glimmer of humanity where, you know, you know, Cooper mercy kills Roger. Right? And I just. I don't know.
I think that there's so, so much potential of, like, this world and the story, and I just. I want it. If you're not go going toa give me that necessarily, like, okayu Cooper and Lucy are go goingna rightide off into the sunset. Fine, but don't have Lucy get with Max, or don't have Cooper go back with barbber. Don't force it.
Like, I don't want that either. You know? Like, I'd rather just not have anything than to have it be like, yeah, but anyway, have it be, like, destroyed. Yeah, exact bullshit.
Sorry. I totally agree. Like, I really. If if they don't do it, fine. There's always fan fiction, right?
But if they do do it, I really hope it's satisfying. And, you know, like, we've all read some really good fanfics about this pairing, so if it's go. Going toa be as satisfying as some of the top fanfics we've read, who knows? But I'd rather them not do it. I'd rather them have Cooper and Lucy be platonic if they're gonna just make him sacrifice himself or whatever, you know?
So we'll see. We'll see. Will see. So, Chelsea, do you have any other questions? U.
Not at the moment. And I actually am gonna have to wrap soon because Hurricane barrel might come in this direction. And we've got to take a generator to my cousin just in case they need it for power. My husband just fixed their generator for him. And we're going toa take the generator over there and drop it off.
Wow. Yeah. That's sucks. Stay safe. Seriously, like, that's terrifying.
And I think such s a normal part of life down here. Like, yeah's to be normal about this. I feel like we don't get hurricanes sometime as we get tornadoes, but tornadoes scare the hell to me. So I I just not. I'm not with it.
Yeah. In'm the same way. I don't like tornadoes either. Ugh. But anyway, Kate, thank you so much for coming on and hanging out with us and just talking us about fallout.
We will let you know when the episode comes out. Do you have any other questions for us or anything like that? Not really. I mean, we've. We've talked over the past.
I don't even how long we've been talking. Like an hour and a bit like we've been talking for a while. So off the top of my head, I can't really think of anything awesome. Well, than you. Thank you so much for writing.
So good. I love thank you for reading. I appreciate it. Yes. I'm a developmental editor.
I read books like every day for my job. And I have really, genuinely enjoyed your fanfic. And I love. Thank you. That makes me happy.
Yeah. So if anyone wants to know, like, the best way to contribute to fanfic authors, it's just leave a review. Like. Or, you know, like a kudos, sure. But, like, any comments?
That's respectful. That's nice. Like, that's the thing that's really going to help fler the story. And like, I know it's said, but, like, you guys aren't getting paid for this and so you're donating your time and being part of something. And I just think it's such a beautiful thing because you have something like fallout and that begets more creativity in fanfic or fanr or in these, you know, these edits.
And just, I love just the beauty of that creation based on, you know, this fandom. And so thank you for what you're doing because you are contributing in such a positive way. And honestly, like, it's like, if I have a bad day, I can just pull up your fic and like, get sucked back into it and just forget about it. So. And thank you for talking to us.
We had so much fun. We love talking to you. Everyone, please go check out heric. Yes. On a zero three.
It's excellent. I highly recommend it. Yes. And we'll link it down in the show notes. But, yeah.
Until next time. Thanks again. Kay. And we will soon. I'm sure we'll like season two.
We want to definitely talk again and see if our crack theories or our head canons came out to play. Yeah, absolutely. I'd love to talk again, you guys. It was super awesome. Thanks.
Having so much. Of course. Thank you for joining us. It's been fabulous. Y, it's been awesome.
All right. Bye.
