Team Loyalty vs. Getting that Bag

Mike McDermott: Hey, good morning, everybody. This is Mike McDermott with the Hashmarks and Working Tools podcast. And good morning, Joel. What's going on? Hey
Joel Cade: Morning. Hey, I notice you're wearing the Steelers jersey today.
Mike McDermott: Yes. Yes, I am. So normally we Steelers fans don't wear s jerseys unless it's a game day. But you know, I just had that feeling this morning. I just I just I just I just had to. I just had to wear it, you know, I had to show my color, show my support, you know, for my team. And I I've I was really proud of them over the past week, right? So,
Joel Cade: Okay.
Mike McDermott: you know, just kind of like a proud Papa as the As the kids, you know, grow up and do the things that you want to and stuff, that's what the Steelers were doing for me, right? So Omar Khan with the Steelers, he's a general manager. He was he was getting all the right players in the right place. He said
Joel Cade: All right.
Mike McDermott: he said, It's okay to have four quarterbacks, right? He said he said, Joey Porter Junior, we do want you, but we're not writing a new contract during your rookie season. So All of those things. So I I'm feeling really good about the picks that were made, who was kept in the in the roster of fifty three. And yeah. Yeah.
Joel Cade: All right. So who who are you reping with the jersey?
Mike McDermott: so this is this would be John Kolb. John Kolb
Joel Cade: Okay.
Mike McDermott: is a offen was an offensive tackle for the Pittsburgh Steelers. I believe, yeah, in the early 70s and stuff like that. he is
Joel Cade: Okay.
Mike McDermott: he is he won he has four Super Bowl rings. Four Super
Joel Cade: Okay, okay.
Mike McDermott: Bowl rings on this man, and he also won the world strongest man competition twice in his life. So John Kolb.
Joel Cade: Wow. Okay.
Mike McDermott: Shout out to you today.
Joel Cade: Nice. Hey, on a complete side note, for anybody listening, Mike and I got to go watch the Tip City Red Devils at the Piqua Indians. So if anybody's watching, you'll notice right there where my finger is at is a Piqua high school football helmet. I was not I'm just gonna be careful of my words here. I was hoping for a better performance by the Indians, and Sorry that we didn't get a better performance.
Mike McDermott: It was it was interesting. I was I I was expecting a little bit more lively activity on the Pick with Sidelines because I was sitting over there on the Pick with Sidelines with you. So I did, caught a t shirt, mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: Yeah and and Mike caught a shirt from from the people throwing the shirts coming out and you know, I mean maybe I should rep that I mean I opened that shirt, maybe I should show you guys. Give me a second, I I got it right here.
Mike McDermott: yeah. Yeah. I I haven't seen it.
Joel Cade: got that bad boy. Can we see it now? There we go.
Mike McDermott: Hey, all right, Picma Indian. Okay.
Joel Cade: Got the Indian head, got the Yeah, yep, yep. So there you go, Mike. That was the shirt that you sh Mike, you know, being a tipsity Red Devil parent, didn't want to be repping the the Piqua
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: Indians. around his family later. So
Mike McDermott: Really couldn't.
Joel Cade: so I I d I don't blame you. I don't blame you. I mean I just
Mike McDermott: Really couldn't. Yeah.
Joel Cade: yeah, I I get it. So yeah, I mean Piqua I mean I I have these things that I try to get during the season. I call them the trifectas. Okay?
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: And a trifecta is when Piqua High School wins, my University of Notre Dame Fighting Irish wins, and then the Cleveland Browns win. Now in a good season, I can get like like Notre Dame is rock steady, right? Like you can always count on Notre Dame. Right?
Mike McDermott: Mm. Yeah.
Joel Cade: And And Pickwell for the most part has been a five hundred team the last two seasons. Although the performance we saw Friday, I'm I'm thinking I might not get a trifecta this year. And and the Cleveland Browns
Mike McDermott: huh.
Joel Cade: are are really you know less than five hundred teams. So I think last year
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: I hit two trifectas, and now I don't know. I don't know if I'm gonna get one this year, but we'll see, but
Mike McDermott: Yeah, it's gonna be it's gonna be a hard one, I think, after watching watching that performance. I I think I you know, I mean it's the it was the first game of the season. and you know, for you know well no it wasn't. It wasn't the first game, second game of the season.
Joel Cade: The second game it was week two. It's high high school week two in Ohio.
Mike McDermott: I was gonna give it I was gonna give you the, you know, the mulligan there on the first you know, the first game, you know, maybe they're a little jittery and nervous and stuff, but yeah, it really didn't look like that out there. They just looked tired. It's look kinda, you know, exhausted.
Joel Cade: I don't know. I don't know. I I heard somebody behind us saying that maybe there were some kerfuffles up in Lima the week before and and maybe the team had been chastised about extracurricular activities and that may have affected the way the performance on the field looked. I mean, y you swing the pendulum one way and y you just you just can't swing the opposite. I mean, they looked like Yikes. So I I as an alum, I don't wanna put anything negative out there about my my high school program, but there wasn't a lot positive to say after that performance. It was I mean for perspective, anybody who's wondering, the there's my dog saying hi. for perspective, the the clock was a running clock to start the second half, which means the teams either had to agree to that or they were up by belief forty five points, but I think it was only forty two to nothing at halftime, so So
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: I think they just agreed like, yeah, let's just run the clock and get this over with. So it was that bad of a performance. So I I guess the positive to say is that it can only get better, right? I mean I'm not sure you can I'm not
Mike McDermott: Yeah, well yeah. Yeah.
Joel Cade: sure Pickwick can get worse than that situation I just watched on Friday night. And I will be skipping
Mike McDermott: Yeah, absolutely. Well, yeah.
Joel Cade: the Pickwat Troy game this year because I'm not gonna watch that twice in one season.
Mike McDermott: Well, you know, one of the one of the things that I shared with you earlier before the game and stuff was, you know, I I I think a lot of the high school outcomes end up because you have one team that studies film really tightly and does a really good job of that, and then the other team will not, right? So I
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: think you saw a little bit of that on Friday night was you know, when when you saw some of those bubble screens and stuff and they were getting stopped in the backfield, right? Because they knew it was coming, right? They knew exactly
Joel Cade: Yeah.
Mike McDermott: how to you know what to expect and be ready and and prepared for it. Right. And so that's you know that's that's part of preparing for the you know for the football season, right? There's the there's lifting, there's running, there's meditation, there's diet, nutrition, exercise, there's practice, practice of the plays and stuff like that, recovery, all this stuff,
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: and watching tape. Lots of tape. So
Joel Cade: Yeah, I I would say this in response to that, and I think you you hit a good point, but I would also say Pekua is generally the model of preparation. I mean, I was a senior when Bill Neese was his first year as a head coach, and the man prepares. At least back
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: when I was playing. And then when I saw him as a defensive coordinator, you know, the man was like the model of preparation. And he'd watched film, he t he had game plans. This was back in the mid nineties when that wasn't really a thing. So either Either he's kind of slowing down thirty years later, and I mean more than that, probably thirty five years later he's slowing down. Or the fire is gone. I mean, I'm I'm saying too much. I don't know. It didn't look like a team that was prepared, and they didn't look like a team that was fired up to play a game of football. So again, I don't I'm not I don't have my head in the program. I don't know what's going on inside of there. That that could have been Given where the program is at, that could have been the model of preparedness and fight, but it it I I don't know. I'm I'm not my head is not in that program, so j just
Mike McDermott: Sure, absolutely.
Joel Cade: somebody from the stands and I've coached enough football to know that somebody from the stands doesn't know what's actually happening. So Alright. Okay, anyway, let's
Mike McDermott: There you go. There you go. You know what you don't know. Yeah.
Joel Cade: get back to Pittsburgh. So what's Pittsburgh doing with the roster since we're here to talk about the Steelers and the
Mike McDermott: gosh.
Joel Cade: Browns and Freemasonry and all that stuff.
Mike McDermott: Well, like, you know, the roster, the I think the biggest biggest thing that was up in the air was Joey Porter Jr., right? We had talked about him in prior episodes. You know, he's
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: he's in his last year of his rookie contract, right? So I'm sure they had they I'm sure they sat down, right? These are all private conversations. You know, we don't know what's going on there, but we I'm sure they sat down
Joel Cade: Right.
Mike McDermott: and and and Joey Porter Jr.'s agent, you know, was like, you know, hey, you know, we're really looking at you would really like you to sign you know, a thirty-five million dollar a year contract with us that would extend his contract, right? So he he basically
Joel Cade: Yep.
Mike McDermott: he's contracted with his rookie contract for the rest of the year, right? So the entire,
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: you know, the ti this entire football season, he's a rookie, he's getting paid as a rookie, stuff like that. So the Steelers have him, right? I mean he can't go anywhere. he, you know, he could be offered, right, you know, by another team and stuff like that, but that wasn't coming either to him. Right. So so he did get removed from the pup list and he's returned to the field of practice. Whether or not he's practicing, I'm not on the on the field to see, but all all hope is is that he is. So
Joel Cade: Trying to figure out what the cap hit will be. for the fifth year option. 'Cause you got to pay like
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: I I didn't do my homework on the fifth year options, I'm sorry. I I came unprepared. I became I was make a rude comment, but I'm not. I
Mike McDermott: No, yeah. No, yeah.
Joel Cade: came unprepared. I forget what the actual numbers, but there's an actual calibrated number for the fifth year options. trying to find a fifth year option projection for he was what round? He was a second round pick, right?
Mike McDermott: Second round, yeah.
Joel Cade: have just had a over the cap, but I mean He was in the twenty three class, is that right?
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: Well, if he's got a if he's if he's a second round he doesn't have a fifth year option, 'cause that goes on with the the first round picks. First round picks have fifth year options, second round picks don't have fifth year options, so they're they're letting him play out his fourth year, correct? And then they're they're gonna just try to let him become a free agent and then negotiate along with every other team?
Mike McDermott: Yes, yes.
Joel Cade: So they're gambling that his loyalty to Pittsburgh will get them a hometown discount.
Mike McDermott: Yes. Well, and then well, yeah, yes. And
Joel Cade: Okay.
Mike McDermott: also a lot of there's been several corners that have signed enormous, enormous contracts re recently, right? So we need to kind of get the
Joel Cade: Right. Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: air to clear. We need to get the air to clear the excitement for, you know, paying, you know, twenty five, thirty, thirty five million dollars for a cornerback. We need to get that excitement out of the air. I think that's what they're looking for most from the from the back office is to allow some of the excitement about that much money. and then seeing how those guys perform, right? Seeing how this twenty twenty six season performs with guys contracted at that rate. Right. So you see w what did you get for your money, right?
Joel Cade: Well, you know, also Pittsburgh is Pittsburgh is literally going into twenty twenty seven, according to quick AI situation, is going into twenty twenty seven already with an attracted negative five million balance. So you can't they may not financially, not in terms they don't have the money, but they may not be able to financially in terms of the cap right now to even afford to to pay him. The problem with that is I mean you can you could easily finagle the cap, right? You you've got Watt hitting a forty-two million cap hit, Metcalf's got a thirty-eight million hat cap hit, Pittman's got a twenty-six million cap hit, Herbig, I didn't realize you guys paid Herbig. P Herbig's
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: got a twenty-five million cap hit, Hayward would would Hayward retire, you think?
Mike McDermott: Heywood Hay yeah, Hayward may retire after this year.
Joel Cade: Okay, that would eliminate a twenty three million dollar cap hit. So I mean if you're okay with you know bonusing one of these guys out or, you know, 'cause some let's say you wanna we're gonna keep Met Calf long term, right? You could
Mike McDermott: Yeah, I
Joel Cade: you could bonus him out, give him a couple void years, or
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: you know, extend him a couple years and and pay for Porter. So it's it's able to be done. I think It just depends on where Pittsburgh is at. I mean Pittsburgh and and no offense, Mike, 'cause you guys are successful with it, but to tend to operate on this nineteen nineties model. Like, you know, we don't pay players, you know, w we're gonna wait out to the last minute, and it's kind of an owner kind of is gonna dictate what's happening situation. It it's very much an us versus them kind of ownership versus players in terms
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: of negotiations. It's not so much hey, let's just get the you know, like the Browns are
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: are are different, like, hey, let's just get the job done. We want
Mike McDermott: Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: You know, that doesn't seem to be their game. So they they tend to it's like the draft, right? You guys tend to sit and just pick. You know, you don't try to play the game with the draft, you just kinda sit
Mike McDermott: Right.
Joel Cade: and pick. You don't try to play the game with the players, you just kinda pay who you're gonna pay and not pay who you're not gonna pay. It's it's very
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: much a a nineties model, so
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: I I hate to think you guys would cut somebody to to sign Porter, but I I don't know. I'll say this for Porter. If you don't pay him now, you're gonna pay him later. He's cheaper now than he is
Mike McDermott: Mm.
Joel Cade: tomorrow.
Mike McDermott: Yeah. Yep. Should be. Should be.
Joel Cade: I mean, you get him hit the market, let him see what his value is. Maybe the Steelers think his value in the market is not what he thinks his value on the market is.
Mike McDermott: Yeah. No, I mean he's a he's a I mean he's a dynastic person, right? He's you know, he's got a football dynasty built by his dad, right? You know, he's a Pittsburgh guy. Like when you go when you go to Pittsburgh and walk around downtown and stuff, you know, you see him. He's I mean, he's just walk he's just a regular dude just walking around, right? I mean it's it's it's not a big deal, right? And
Joel Cade: Right.
Mike McDermott: you know, so I I don't think he's leaving. I I don't think but but I but yeah, I agree. I I don't know if it's much a as a nineties kind of operation, but I but it is an older style of operation,
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: right? So the f you know, the the ownership right now, like what is it? Omar Khan was talking about letting Alandon Roberts go, right? So that was one of the guys we had to let go. So we were really excited to have him last year and we had to let Elandon Roberts go. And one of the press guys asked him to say, so what happened about Alandon Roberts? You know, what's the deal there? And he goes, or, you know, would you like to get him back? He goes, I'd love to get E Rob back. You know, I am not turning my back on that guy. Right.
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: So so that means like there's gonna be some more churn in the in the roster. And but just to have the jan general manager
Joel Cade: Wha what what did he play? What position did he play? 'Cause
Mike McDermott: gosh.
Joel Cade: I'm not familiar with l linebacker. Okay, go ahead. All right.
Mike McDermott: Yes. Yeah. Yeah. So so when does the general manager of the team, you know, abbreviate somebody's name, E Rob, you know, it's because he had a personal relationship with them. And I think that
Joel Cade: Right.
Mike McDermott: really happens with every one of the players on the Steeler team, right? So yeah, with the general manager.
Joel Cade: With the general manager? Absolutely. I just think your owner is in a different situation than the general manager is.
Mike McDermott: Right. Right. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. But that's the
Joel Cade: And and the owner w pulls the purse strings. So, yeah.
Mike McDermott: no, I mean that is the that's the relationship that those guys have with them, right? And I don't I don't think every team's like that though, Joel. I mean, would you agree? You know?
Joel Cade: I maybe not. I I don't know. I know I know the Browns generally kind of have a more the coaches handle the players, the general manager handles the I mean there there's a division there, and not to say that Andrew Barry doesn't get along with players, but like it's more like that's the coach's realm. Like, we'll
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: handle that. And and Andrew Barry is more of a analytics. I won't say he's like a robot, but he's an analytics new school. He he kinda has one hand in both, right? He does
Mike McDermott: Yeah. Yeah.
Joel Cade: and he does the the relationships and and the analytics and he doesn't one and I'm not saying Omar Khan's not. I'm just saying there's a little bit more of a distance with with Andrew Berry. he
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm. Right.
Joel Cade: tends to let the o the the coach be the hands on kind of guy. But so yeah,
Mike McDermott: Right. Yeah. I
Joel Cade: I'm not sure every team has that kind of relationship like Omar Khan does.
Mike McDermott: Yeah, yeah. And I I would say, like, I mean, you know, LA Rams, you know, that like there's I mean, there's all kinds of other teams out there that don't have that kind of relationship with their players. And I think the Steelers
Joel Cade: Right.
Mike McDermott: have that. So so it's one of those things like if you want to be a Steeler, you get all of this. You get personalized service, right? You know, you you you have you you know, you go you you hang out at our house. You go out to dinner with us, you're part of the family, all of that kind of stuff. I think that's really part of the realm of Steeler nation that folks don't understand. They're like sort of like, well, why did he leave? Right. Well, it's it's folks leave the Steelers, right? players leave the Steelers specifically for money, right? That's that's the thing. It's like, hey, I want
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Mike McDermott: to be the top paid guy in my position, bar none. I believe that's me, right? And that that's why, that's why folks leave. A ask Antonio Brown. That's exactly what he did. Right. You know, it's
Joel Cade: And and I will say this to interject on that. I have no problems with players going out and maximizing their value. In fact, I think players should always go out and maximize their value, which is why I never have issues with players standing up for their rights to get paid. But I think there are ways to handle that and ways not to handle that, but go ahead.
Mike McDermott: Yeah, so they you know, these players leave the team, right? Because it's more important for them to get their bag than it is to be a stealer, right? And so Yeah.
Joel Cade: Especially that first contract. That first contract is generally where players are going out to say I'm gonna get paid because it's it's it's
Mike McDermott: huh.
Joel Cade: the money but it's also the status. Like
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: I got paid as a top five corner because I am a top five corner. And once you get that status, the second contract is a little bit more
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: like home discount, you know, kind of thing. But anyway, go ahead.
Mike McDermott: Yeah, no, I mean I agree. Yeah, that's you know, money is the status and they take it on the field, right? That you know, that's the the you know, wearing it on your shoulder is what you do. The thing is, is that you know, we have all seen those guys that are the top five corner, right? You know, and get absolutely laid out in a game and carted off,
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: you know, carted off the field, right? No, I mean those, you know, I mean it doesn't at the end of the day, it doesn't matter, you know, the size of your bag, you know, you can still get injured. You can still fail. you know, to to to, you know, intercept the ball, right? You can still do that. You
Joel Cade: Right. Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: know, we're just talking about your money. So the the the
Joel Cade: Yeah.
Mike McDermott: the folks who really keep it serious, you know, of the players that are serious about being Steelers, they really are, right? You know, Mason Rudolph doesn't want to go anywhere that, you know, there was a risk that he was gonna not play for the Steelers this year, right? And he was like, you know, I don't think I'm going anywhere else. I you know, he he won't he won't play for another team even for money.
Joel Cade: Mm. Yeah, it it I think it's like I think it's like all of us. We find a place where we like and we like
Mike McDermott: Right? He's a s he's a stealer. He's a stealer. Yeah.
Joel Cade: to be there and you really have to ask yourself, is the money worth the loss of the culture that I like to be at? You know?
Mike McDermott: Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. He he wasn't gonna play for any other NFL team. Right?
Joel Cade: Yeah, I I think with this Joey Porter situation, man, I mean i the the the the history might create complications, but I think ultimately something'll get done. But you know,
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: Porter might I think the the Steelers or maybe the owner here might be leveraging our culture versus where you would go somewhere else. you're gonna take less to be here in Pittsburgh and he might be saying, Look, I I have a a long historical dynastic presence, like you said. I'm worth the money. Right? And that that might be the clash right now. I mean, I think the whole our culture thing works
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: after that first contract
Mike McDermott: Yeah. Yeah.
Joel Cade: Right? That first contract, people want their bag, they want taken care of, they want somebody to show them the respect that they're worth the money that we paid them. Right?
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: After that situation, that's when people start taking hometown discounts and things like that. So it'll be interesting to see how this plays out. I mean I I honestly I
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: I think Porter holds a lot and I'm I'm indifferent. You can sign you can not sign whatever.
Mike McDermott: It it's it it's really for Steeler Nation. It's it's it's put up or shut up, right? That's
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: that's what it is. This is the th that's what this season is, is Omar Khan is coming into the room and is saying, Hey, I've got, you know, I have several new weapons on offense, I have several new weapons on defense, and I have you on the team. I'm gonna the Steelers are gonna make a Super Bowl run this year. And they're gonna be serious about it.
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: And we want you to be a part of that team. If you get us to the Super Bowl, you are gonna get exactly what you want. You're gonna get your bag. So
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm. You know, again you're coming into a f already five million under the cap. If you get another five percent rate, which would be a lot, but if you get another ten, twenty million on the cap, which has been the thing you could afford him, you still may have to shave off, you know, some some some salary, but it's doable. The question just is what's the number?
Mike McDermott: Yeah, it's a restructuring of of two or three of the large contracts that are on there. That's really all it is, you know.
Joel Cade: Yeah. So anybody surprise you with the cuts from the Steelers?
Mike McDermott: not really. Not really. I I I think there was a feel keep keeper, right? So Eli Heidenreich, he's a Pittsburgh boy, right? It's the same thing we did with Kenny Pickett, right? Right, he was like, he was a Pittsburgh boy, we gotta take him. We're gonna he's available on the draft. We're gonna take him, right? So we we pulled Eli Heidenreich off during the draft and he performed okay. you know, in practice in preseason. And we and
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: we kept him in on the roster. Right. And so that was a surprise to me that we were that we kept such a kind of of still formative rookie at his position as I believe he's receiver. Yes. Yes.
Joel Cade: What's his position? I'm not familiar with Heidenrich. Okay. Does he play special teams? Okay. Alright. He better. I'm just saying, like
Mike McDermott: Ha ha ha ha.
Joel Cade: I that that comes to one of these Browns situations that I have no sympathy for, but you know
Mike McDermott: Right.
Joel Cade: I just it it kind of parallels the situation grown by the Browns, but
Mike McDermott: Yeah. Well, so like Eli so like he's got a whole story. So Pittsburgh guy, grown up in Pittsburgh, played for Navy, right? So he's a military, military guy.
Joel Cade: Okay.
Mike McDermott: You know, thank you for our sir for your service. And you know, then we and we picked him up. So like he's a good he's a good kid, you know, whether or not he shakes out on the Steelers, we you know, we'll see.
Joel Cade: Is it one of those situations where like if he's not playing in the NFL he has to go do his service?
Mike McDermott: I'm not sh I'm not sure about that. Yeah.
Joel Cade: I I for a for a long time those those those academies would not let their players go to the NFL because you
Mike McDermott: Right.
Joel Cade: know, they've they've got a required number of service to pay for their education.
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: And so you would draft these guys and then they would like you can't do anything with them because they're off doing their military service. And then the military academies decided to grant like a temporary stay or whatever, letting you basically go play the NFL if you can, but then once your career was over you had to go into military service.
Mike McDermott: Mm.
Joel Cade: So you wonder if he gets cut, if he doesn't get picked up on an active roster, if that means hey, he has to go Complete his duty. Yeah, he has to go do his military service.
Mike McDermott: He gets back on a boat. Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: I don't know. That that maybe maybe Pittsburgh sees enough in him that they're like, we'll carry him on the roster because we don't want to lose- because if you cut him, he may be just gone. Like, there's no practice squad for the guy. So, you know, he just he's gone. So
Mike McDermott: Yes. Yeah, that's exactly what it says. Eli Heidenreich still has to complete his military service, but his active duty requirement is deferred so he can play in the NFL for the Steelers.
Joel Cade: Yep, that's how that works. Alright, so traded Broderick Jones. received
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: a third and a sixth in twenty seven. And the Steelers sent Broderick Jones and a fourth in
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: twenty seven. So essentially you traded Broderick Jones, your former wasn't he first rounder?
Mike McDermott: He was a first rounder.
Joel Cade: First rounder and a fourth rounder to get a third and a six. So the Steelers giving up on Broderick Jones, right? Okay, because that that's what that's what a give up trade
Mike McDermott: Absolutely. Yeah. Fans gave up on him.
Joel Cade: looks like.
Mike McDermott: Yeah, fans gave up on him years ago, even before his injury, but then after he broke his neck.
Joel Cade: Yeah.
Mike McDermott: in a game and then had to do rehab and then came back. no the only thing
Joel Cade: I I'm gonna say this, that's impressive if you gotta have a guy that broke his neck and you still got a third round out of him. That
Mike McDermott: Yeah. And then comes back at tackle. Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: that's impressive. I I'm gonna hand that one over to to to impressive for the Steelers on that.
Mike McDermott: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It was i it was interesting. No, I mean, there's so much tape on a guy. I hate this because of because now I mean position dynamics like offensive tackle. I totally understand that with my kid playing that, right? You know, I'm just like
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: so I hate watching, you know, ti tape where you get embarrassed by the defensive end or the D tack, right? Yeah. So there was a lot of that with him.
Joel Cade: Wasn't wasn't Broderick Jones like just super big? Like this there was this time in the NFL where
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: you tried to get like these dynamic, ginormous, gigantic guys.
Mike McDermott: Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: And then I was like, Why are you getting these people? Is it just 'cause you think it takes longer to physically run around
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: them? Is that's what it is? But if they can't move, then what's the point? And Broderick Jones
Mike McDermott: Yeah. We were
Joel Cade: seemed to me like a guy who just couldn't move.
Mike McDermott: Yeah, w during the time when we when when we drafted him, Joel, the the NFL was really big in the big guys like that, right? And so everybody
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: was everybody was drafting out of Alabama and Georgia, right? That's we're
Joel Cade: Right.
Mike McDermott: just going after SEC SEC Biggins and putting them on
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: the line, right? That was that that was the that was the plan. And so we yeah, we drafted him. We said, Hey, we need an absolutely mo absolute monster at offensive tackle. We brought him in and guess what position we put him in?
Joel Cade: Did you put in a card?
Mike McDermott: Right guard.
Joel Cade: yeah, so the evolution of this is a good teaching moment by the way. So if you draft a tackle, okay, and you're playing him a tackle and you realize this guy can't play tackle. Either because he can't move or he doesn't have the technique or whatever it was. You say, okay, I got this tackle, but we can always move him inside, and we can hide some of those flaws by moving him inside. So the fact that you already put him at guard to start with when you drafted him as a tackle, that's not a good sign for Broderick Jones. And and I remember watching some of his tape and thinking, This guy's gonna get moved pretty quick and it sounds like he did. I the Browns have a guy that's like super big like this. They got him in like the fifth round out of Ohio State and People just love him and I'm just like, I don't know.
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: you know, he we ended up drafting Fano to play left tackle because the guy's hurt all the time. And now the best case scenario is he plays right tackle. And just this idea, like the Bengals have some huge guy. They're still going
Mike McDermott: They do. my
Joel Cade: on they're still going on this model. I d I don't know. That like it it just seems like If you can get a huge guy that's athletic, that's one thing. If you get a huge guy just because he's a huge guy, like who was that guy, the Makai Becton, right? With the Jets? I'm like, why
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Joel Cade: would you even draft this guy? He could not move. Like, you could just watch it on the tape. He's gonna get killed. And yeah, he he got killed.
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: But that was the style, like, right? We we're gonna go get the big guy, and we're seeing three or four years out of that that that's really not working out for teams.
Mike McDermott: Exactly.
Joel Cade: I mean the Browns have moved on, Steelers are moving on, the Jets have
Mike McDermott: Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: moved on, you know Okay. Well, we tried it, you know. All right, so
Mike McDermott: Yeah. But yeah.
Joel Cade: Caleb Johnson going to the Packers for a six. That sounds like the Packers needed somebody, didn't want to take a chance on a on a cut situation. Was was Caleb Johnson on the bubble?
Mike McDermott: He was. He he was. We gave him we gave him ample time to kind of show himself as a as a stealer. And he just i he was kinda unremarkable, right? It it's one
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: of those things that, you know, if you're you get to a point where you have a lot of studs on your team and, you know, that have proven th proven themselves historically or are on the up ramp, right? They're going up the ramp, they're going and hitting it hard. And then you got the guys that are just kind of This kind of cruising. So I mean he was doing pretty average stuff, right? And so for a team that wants to go for a Super Bowl, you know, you can't have that guy. You can't have that guy.
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm. So so is he on a rookie deal? I'm s I've got your transactions on the screen on the on the right here to me. That's that's what I'm looking I'm looking at the Steelers' transactions. So
Mike McDermott: Okay. All right, all right. Yeah.
Joel Cade: I mean was he is he still on a rookie deal? Okay. Alright.
Mike McDermott: Yeah, I think so. Yeah. Yeah.
Joel Cade: That makes sense. I mean if you're gonna cut him anyway, like like I said last week, savvy teams will attempt
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Joel Cade: to trade these people that are on the bubble and try to get something back for looks like the Steelers did that pretty well. So
Mike McDermott: Yeah, he's still on he was still on his rookie deal. He did his first year with us and you know, he had twenty eight carries and just sixty nine yards with a two point five yards per carry and no touchdowns. So
Joel Cade: So what kind of a back is he like a power back, speed back?
Mike McDermott: So yeah, not big, right? Yeah.
Joel Cade: Okay.
Mike McDermott: So that gives us yes less utility, right? So Kenny Gainwell is twice as fat twice as fast as Caleb Johnson. Okay. So he's super fast, but he's small. Cal Caleb
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: Johnson is small but not fast. So
Joel Cade: Okay.
Mike McDermott: so and then we got Jalen Warren, who's a beast, right? And he's not fast, but that's okay, right?
Joel Cade: Right. So y yeah, we we have this guy in Cleveland, his name's Raheem Sanders. the joke
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: the joke in my house, we the we had him for two years now. The joke in my house is that Raheem Sanders will get you two yards. No matter what happens, he's gonna get you two yards. There could be this gigantic hole, he's gonna get you two yards. There could be nothing there, he's gonna get you two yards. Like so whenever it's like fourth and one, I'm like, just give it to Raheem Sanders, he'll give you two yards. They call him Rocket Sanders. I have no idea why they call him Rocket, because like there's nothing there's
Mike McDermott: 'Cause he's not a rocket.
Joel Cade: nothing fast. If if if Rocket means like he's on that pad that like takes five days to get to the launch pad, that that's who
Mike McDermott: huh. Yes, that guy, yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Joel Cade: Raheem Sanders is, but you know, fourth and one he can get you two yards. You know? First and ten with a gigantic hole you can drive a Mac truck through, he'll get you two yards.
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: I he just doesn't have the speed. He's got great vision, but
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: his speed is awful.
Mike McDermott: Yeah. Yeah.
Joel Cade: But great vision to give you two yards.
Mike McDermott: Yeah. I mean a great football player in in college, right? In college you can go at you can go ahead and hide a lot of your lack of speed with you know,
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: with juking and you know, all kinds of stuff. Dynamic, you know, good field vision, right? All that kind of stuff. Yeah, you can hide that as a running back, you know, in in college, but when you get it you get absolutely exposed in the NFL when tight ends are faster than you. Defensive ends are faster than you. D tackles are faster than you. Right? You got a real problem there.
Joel Cade: Yeah, I I remember watching a a Browns game, I've probably mentioned this a hundred thousand times, it's one my favorite stories. I was watching Jacoby Brissett play for the quarterback for the Browns and watched a three hundred and thirty pound defensive tackle run him down from behind. Like Jacob Jacoby Brissett is not the answer. He's not
Mike McDermott: Ha ha ha.
Joel Cade: like when you get run down by a three hundred and thirty pound nose tackle that looks like he has no athleticism You know you're in trouble. All right, let's let's switch over to the Browns. Let's just get anything else. Wrap it up on the Steelers for me. What else you got on the Steelers?
Mike McDermott: Yeah, that's really it. No, I mean you we I think we were covered it comprehensively. yeah, Caleb Johnson matter, right? We
Joel Cade: Okay.
Mike McDermott: got the yeah, let's let's move on to the Browns.
Joel Cade: Alright, well let's let's delay for a second what everybody's talking about. Let's talk about a couple other things. One, let's talk about Miles Garrett, who has not practiced in a month in Los Angeles. His
Mike McDermott: Dude, what what is going on there?
Joel Cade: knee apparently is just swelling and swelling and swelling. So the question is, does he have arthritis? But you would think that the Rams would have caught that before they traded for him.
Mike McDermott: Yeah, they d did a medical, I'm sure, you know?
Joel Cade: Yeah, you're trading away Jared Verz, you're getting a medical, right? So the other question is did he tear a meniscus or does he have some kind of MCL or ACL sprain or something? You don't think there's a tear, but meniscus could be torn. But if he's got a torn meniscus, I don't th I don't think he's playing this season.
Mike McDermott: That's over. At his age. At his age, that's over.
Joel Cade: He may have we may have just I I don't mean to laugh, but we may have just traded him on the high and then he went to camp somewhere else, got hurt, probably 'cause they made him practice and he's not used to that. And Miles Garrett does Miles Garrett stuff, so
Mike McDermott: Hey guys, we got Miles Garrett over here. Watch him run.
Joel Cade: Yeah, my Miles Garrett does Miles Garrett. So I I almost feel like there's some poetic justice to this right now for Miles Garrett
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: because like the way he's just acted in Cleveland and the way he kind of forced himself out, not last year but the year before, trying to be
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: like the LeBron James. I mean, he literally signed with LeBron James's agent and was taking advice from LeBron James and the NFL Instead of the Haslums, you know, doing a Deshaun Watson with them where you try like, let's play that game, the Browns were like, No, we're sticking to our guns and now he gets traded. And I'm sure they've paid him. You know, that's that's Miles Garrett's game too, is I'm getting paid. But I I don't want to wish ill on anybody, but I'm not sad to see that situation happen. And we'll take Jared Verse and we'll take some draft picks and and we'll move on. So I wanted to address that. I did see this meme. It kinda cracked me up. Where Again we're still on Miles Garrett where Todd Monkey was talking about he wants to run a clean operation, doesn't want these stupid penalties and somebody, you know, you get one of these things where somebody's holding up a sign, right? It was Miles Garrett holding up a sign saying, I jumped off sides forty five times during my tenure with Cleveland, gave up X amount of first downs, gave up X amount of yards, X d this, this and that. So I thought, Yeah, that's perfect. Yeah.
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: I jumped off sides forty five times. That's a complete lack of discipline. So that's that's Miles Garrett. Out there doing Miles Garrett stuff. other things going on with the Browns. Luke Floria. I think it's Luke. I'll find the exact name. Floria, Luke, it was Luke. Luke Floria, run wide receiver, scored two touchdowns in the last preseason game. fans, he's from the Cleveland area. Fans are all like Luke Floria got job because he was cut. But Luke Florey is a wide receiver, doesn't return kicks, doesn't play special teams, and you've also just drafted two picks. You've also got Jerry Judy sitting there. it's gonna be hard to make the team as a wide receiver if you don't play special teams. And he got cut, and that's just the nature of the beast. I mean, a lot of fans are upset about it, but in the same time, you have to maximize your value as a player. Play special teams. Return kicks.
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: Come on.
Mike McDermott: What he he just refused to do that, or how does that even work?
Joel Cade: I don't I don't think it's a skill set that he has. Like like he didn't come into the NFL having return kicks.
Mike McDermott: Okay.
Joel Cade: He's just a wide receiver. I mean he's he played pretty good against threes. Okay.
Mike McDermott: Yeah. You guys are gonna just have all rookies at Receiver outside of Judy, right?
Joel Cade: I I don't think so. I think we kept a couple other people that aren't rookies, but I I mean, is there any is do we really need to talk about receivers past three? I mean, Isaiah Bond is there. Isaiah Bond is fast, so
Mike McDermott: Somebody has to catch the ball, right? If we're gonna be throwing the ball, you know?
Joel Cade: But you got a pretty good top four. You've got Judy, who is
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: recognized he was a first round pick and he's a good wide receiver. You've got Concepcion that everybody's excited about. You've got Denzel Boss that everybody's excited about. We'll see. They're rookies. And you've got Isaiah Bond. So that's that's a pretty good top four. So you need your last two to kick, return kicks, be gunners, play on special
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Joel Cade: teams. And Luke Floria doesn't do that stuff. So I mean
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: KC Concepciono returned kicks. I mean, I watched him against the Bears hit a hole, get out into the open field, and then fall over. Like it was the most Browns thing I've ever watched. My son and I were just laughing. Laughing. Like, this is the most Browns thing I've ever seen, right? You get a big
Mike McDermott: yeah.
Joel Cade: hole, your your first round draft pick is running through the hole, he's out in the open and he's free and he falls over. So
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm. Wow.
Joel Cade: welcome to Cleveland, Casey Concepts. Of course, you know the field was terrible in Chicago and it was like wet, so I I kinda understand, but kinda understand. the other big news out of Cleveland was this Michael Coates Jr. kid. Have you heard about this? So
Mike McDermott: No, no.
Joel Cade: Michael Coates Jr. is a corner and the browns are thin at corner. And the corner room is not a good room right now. I mean, beyond like top two, like like Denzel Ward and and Tyson Campbell are are pretty good, but beyond that, we got some problems. And Michael Coach Jr. did not play high school football until like his junior or senior year, had to walk on to a community college, got to a big time school, got taken on by the Browns as an undrafted free agent, and then makes the roster, right? So everybody's going crazy. He
Mike McDermott: No way.
Joel Cade: made the roster, he made the roster. The next day, the Browns signed Noah Igbinoga. I don't know who this guy is. First round pick in 2020 by the Dolphins, played for the Seahawks last year. And after signing Noah Igbinoga, they cut Michael Coase. So for the you got this feel-good story going on. And then he gets cut the next day. the Browns also signed Sam Williams off the Cowboys. they I think they claimed Sam Williams from the Cowboys as an Edge player. I think he was a second round pick at one point. So you know, Browns are kind of bolstering some weak spots. Edge has been a weak spot. They signed Bennett, I can't think of his first name. He used to play for the Jet or the Eagles defensive end, so I'll find the name. Wasn't real excited about it, but they're addressing through some of these things, the situation they they need with corner and defensive end.
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: Not a lot of pickups in terms of the offense, and I don't think there's a lot of people that are they've picked up that are actually making the team. so I think it's kind of an uneventful
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: situation. Other than other than I don't I don't know. I watched that third preseason game and you're like, who who is who is this guy playing quarterback? Like, where in the world did
Mike McDermott: You're talking about Dylan Gabriel.
Joel Cade: where in the world did Dylan Gabriel come from? Like, Dylan Gabriel, like I told the story, the 4.2 second pass, rainbow pass that was in the air longer than a punt that got his first touchdown in the of his career. And He comes out and he makes decisions, he throws the football, he hits receivers open, and I can't help but think that like did Buffalo just not care? I mean like I could see that, right? Did did they just walk into the game and be like, we just don't care because they did all the real work during the inter squad game, inter squad practice, the joint practice with
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm. Prior yeah, prior to the game. Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: prior to the game. So every both teams are out there throwing the garbage out there because they gotta
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: play a game, but they got all their real work done during the week. So you got Dylan Gabriel out there with like the third team offensive line and you got Talon Green with the third team offensive line. And Talen Green looks like like a running back that like plays quarterback. Like
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Joel Cade: he was all over the place. If you could teach him to throw the football, you could have like the next Lamar Jackson. Like but that was the thing with Lamar Jackson. You had to teach him to throw the football. And
Mike McDermott: Right. Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: he's had to progress over the years of like early in his career did nothing but run and now he tries to throw and I'm gonna emphasize tries to throw. And Talen Green's kinda like that same player. Like, is he a wide receiver? Is he a quarterback? You know.
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: But after that preseason performance, you're like, you can't cut him because
Mike McDermott: No.
Joel Cade: if you cut him, somebody's gonna pick him up. I mean, I'd pick him up. I'd find a spot on my roster for that kid. Like, he had like the highest athleticism score ever at the combine. Like the most athletic person to ever come out of the combine.
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: So you you gotta find a way, especially if you can run, you wanna you wanna find a way to get that guy on your roster.
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: So but Dylan Gabriel made it hard because he actually played like an NFL quarterback. And so what
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: was once an easy cut now becomes like, hey, can we get some value for him? And
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: that opens the discussion of all these quarterbacks, right? Will Levis, Pafum Mayonnais, number eight, got cut.
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: I think there was a trade. I think the Packers traded a quarterback to the Dolphins.
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: Which is interesting 'cause now they have two former Packer quarterbacks on their roster. so I think the Dolphins are taking, but We'll we'll leave that to be what it is. And then you've got a lot of teams carrying four quarterbacks, like the Steelers are carrying four. The Browns put
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: Dylan Gabriel on the physical unable to perform list. Apparently there was an injury during the game, and he played through it because he knew that this was the only time he was gonna get a chance to play. And then the practices after that he wasn't practicing, but nobody reported it, which I'm sure is because the Browns were trying to trade him, to see if they can get Stefansky to grab him. which they didn't, which they should have. I mean look they're gonna roll out with Tua. Do you see this thing with Tua Tangova? Where he's
Mike McDermott: my god.
Joel Cade: like liking his own Instagram posts saying you can do it, bro Like
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: I had a friend who you'd argue with him, right? And you'd argue with him on Twitter or whatever and he would cite his own texts as like or his own posts as evidence for his argument. Like that's
Mike McDermott: Yeah. Yeah.
Joel Cade: not how the way this works, dude. You can't just sit there and cite a tweet you sent out earlier to say that like you're right. Like this this this isn't
Mike McDermott: He he needs to get off Twitter. Yeah.
Joel Cade: I don't even understand what Tua's doing. Like I and I call Dylan Gabriel, you know, Costco Tua because it's about the same height, same arm, kind of motion,
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: left handed, but not as talented as Tua Tungo Violoa. So he's like Costco Tua Tungo Violoa. so they put
Mike McDermott: Yeah, but he's he's brand new to a though. He hasn't been beaten up. He hasn't had three thousand concussions, right?
Joel Cade: Do you really want to put him out there and let him get three thousand concussions? I
Mike McDermott: Well,
Joel Cade: is that what the NFL wants? I don't know, Costco Tua got put on got put on the the physically nable perform list, yeah.
Mike McDermott: Pop list. Yeah.
Joel Cade: So the Browns kept Taylon Green. You figured they're gonna find some way to keep Taylor Green and they're probably just gambling
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: I mean, once you put him on that list, you have to be on there for four weeks. But you don't have to come off after four weeks.
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: you have to have this you have to be designated to return, which he had to designate to return tag, but you have to activate that by like week ten or something. Some kind of obscure rule on that. So he they could leave him out almost the entire season. And it it really wouldn't matter.
Mike McDermott: yeah. Absolutely. You know, it just hey, if you know, you know, if I've if we we have some injuries, right, we have some
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: illness or something like that, you know, you could have all kinds of stuff, you know.
Joel Cade: And and given that Watson hasn't played an entire season in almost five years,
Mike McDermott: Yes.
Joel Cade: I I seriously doubt that Watson's gonna be able to play an entire season. So
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: have we talked about that fiasco on this podcast? Deshaun Watson. Did we talk about that last week?
Mike McDermott: No. I don't what which which fiasco?
Joel Cade: the the we named him as the starter field. I think we did, 'cause I think I went on a little rant. I think I went on a little
Mike McDermott: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, we did.
Joel Cade: rant. I don't need to revisit that rant, not that I even want to, but I I
Mike McDermott: No, no.
Joel Cade: on in some respects I think the Browns are I don't know if they're protecting Shador, if they don't believe in Shador. Of course that's always the topic. You know, Watson, Shador. I think by the end of this whole situation, those two will both be off the roster. I would be surprised if either one of them is on the Browns roster heading into twenty twenty seven. If if they believed in Shador, they'd have put him out there. Right? And if they think they have to protect him, then they clearly think he's not ready. Even if you're putting Watson out there for two weeks to protect him against, you know, first place NFC South, first place AFC South teams to start the season. before the home game and then you're gonna throw Shador in there in a home game, which I don't think is what the plan is. But even if that was the plan, there's there's no merit in that. Like what are you doing to get ready to play with the first with the ones if
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: that's the case? I mean they've already said they're gonna split the two reps or the practice squad reps between Shador and Taylor Green. So it tells me already they think there's something in Taylor Green they like more than they like what they got in Shador.
Mike McDermott: Yeah. Well, and I I think what we've seen at least from the externally, you know, Shador is definitely way different than his dad. Like, you know, his
Joel Cade: Right.
Mike McDermott: his dad is hard as nails. You know, he's you know, he's straight to your face, right? You know, he and he knows he's great, right? You know, Shador he's he's a bit on the softer side. I mean he no, I mean at least appearances like s when he gets interviewed and asked about why Deshaun Watson is gonna be the starter and stuff. Like he's like, I gonna I he's pretty good, you know, I I'll have my time. I'm just here, you know. And like I'm like, bro, that is that's not your dad. You he'd never say that.
Joel Cade: you know, Shador grew up different than Dion, right? Like
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: Shador's like a Cosby kid, man. He he's not grown up in the ghetto.
Mike McDermott: Huh.
Joel Cade: He's not grown up in the ghetto, right? He he the He's like one of those Cosby kids. Like you you just
Mike McDermott: Yeah, he's not hard, right? You know, he's Yeah.
Joel Cade: You know, you have a little bit, not say a silver spoon, but at least you don't have
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: you don't have that rough background. Dion did a good job of like elevating himself from his circumstances into a better circumstance and he wants to
Mike McDermott: Okay.
Joel Cade: his kids to start from that better circumstance and elevate off that circumstance. So
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: I I I get it. Right. So he's taught him how to talk to the media and how to this and how to that and be grateful and thankful and all these kind of things, but I I don't get the sense that he's had anything difficult in his life to deal with. And this is the first
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: thing he's dealing with. That's difficult. And sounds like he's handling it well. At least he's not out there doing what Dion would do, which is, you know, Deshaun Watson, blah blah blah. Because that would have made the situation ten times worse. You could say that in like
Mike McDermott: yeah.
Joel Cade: I always like to pick on Carolina, right? You can say that in Carolina and nobody's gonna care. You say that in Cleveland with the history of whatever agenda the NFL has with the Cleveland Browns and that thing's getting thrown all over every sports media, news outlet as it is. You know, so if he just sits there and says the right thing, which he has, it's still a a story everybody wants to talk about, but at least he's not throwing fuel on the fire, you know?
Mike McDermott: Yeah. If the Browns are smart this year, they're gonna bench Deshaun Watson and then they're gonna put Shador and and what's his nuts in there? Yeah.
Joel Cade: Gabriel? You think they'll put Gabriel in? I don't think they'll put Gabriel in.
Mike McDermott: Look look, you you have a storied history of quarterbacks with the Cleveland Browns. Like an absolute storied history. The most quarterbacks ever. Like
Joel Cade: Well, I'll tell you another storied history where you had a one quarterback appear in ten straight championship games. So there's another storied history. But you know the I mean these things all happened in order, so I it it's easy to just look at the current I mean, like there was a period of like thirty
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: nine years the Steelers were in existence before they won a division championship. I mean, so it's
Mike McDermott: Yeah. Yeah.
Joel Cade: bad times happen to teams. And It's okay. You'll get through it.
Mike McDermott: I'm talking about the quarterback I'm talking about the quarterback room specifically, right? No, I'm not talking about the entire team.
Joel Cade: I know, I know. Every game you gotta I I it's just I'm sick of listening to that narrative. Every game
Mike McDermott: Well
Joel Cade: you get their narrative up there since nineteen ninety nine,
Mike McDermott: Why
Joel Cade: blah blah blah. Well in the last five years the Browns haven't played the most quarterbacks in the NFL. In the last ten years the Browns haven't played the most quarterbacks in the NFL. But if you take it back to nineteen ninety nine, you can make that case. And so they're so the stat
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: is a more about the early to mid two thousands
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: than it is about recent
Mike McDermott: Well, yeah, the w
Joel Cade: History.
Mike McDermott: the point I was trying to make there is like, you know, there's there's a history of you guys not, you know, not respecting a the number one position, right? And putting number two in, number three in, right? And then kinda
Joel Cade: okay.
Mike McDermott: shed shedding quarterbacks, right? You shed quarterbacks like, you know.
Joel Cade: Yeah, I think I think there's some panic in terms of coaches and they don't wanna roll out there with the guy or they just not drafted quarterbacks well. I mean that there's there's a lot of reasons for a lot of this. When you pick Johnny Manzell because the homeless guy told you to do it, you're gonna have problems. I mean, Johnny Manzel by the way, do ever watch that draft or did you ever watch him get drafted? Like, he's got he wanted to play for the Cowboys, right? And he's got
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: a basically a Dallas Cowboys suit on. when he gets drafted. Like, just look at the suit he's wearing. It looks like he was expected to get drafted by the Dallas Cowboys. And i it it looks so weird for him to have a Browns hat on. Like he was just
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: expec all that would have worked perfectly with the Cowboys. He was trying to force him way in his way into Dallas. And he didn't go to Dallas
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: and I think he just lost interest. 'cause he's Johnny Manzel. And now he makes a living
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: by trashing the Browns. So okay. Way to stay relevant.
Mike McDermott: Now did did you wa did you watch the Steeler game the lat the the third Steeler preseason game? Okay. So
Joel Cade: I have not. I mean I figured it was all just backups so I wasn't gonna watch it.
Mike McDermott: I'm just gonna go off on preseason broadcasting again. You guys suck, every single one of you. what you do what what you do is you put the Steeler game on, you let everybody watch it on NFL Network, right? And then and then as soon as Fernando Mendoza steps foot on the field, they Cut the split screen, right? So the game
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: I'm watching is now half the size, right? You know, and then now I gotta go watch I Could Care Less Fernando Mendoza over here, you know, playing football. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, yeah.
Joel Cade: Against against third teamers. Yeah, exactly. Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: I'm like, wow, he's just as amazing as we thought. Right. And so like the so they not only put the split screen, but the primary broadcast, which was the Steeler game. They cut the audio to it, right? So I'll I'm just sitting here listening to what the the the analysts glaze Mendoza, right? While my game is going on over here, silent in the left hand corner, and they're making touchdowns, right? Steeler touchdown. Didn't even know about it because we're talking about Mendoza. All right, I'm done.
Joel Cade: I would just say welcome to being a Browns fan. That this is this is our existence. If the game's even on or or you know, I I I get it. Like this the NFL network wants to make money and and they may not think that third steamer third teamer Steelers is worth watching over number one overall draft pick Mendoza. Like and you know at this point ESPN owns the NFL network, right? They have that agreement where like
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: You know, they have I mean, I think maybe we've talked about it, where like they're basically revenue sharing advertisements is the
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: the deal here. But ESPN basically has control over the NFO network. So we'll we'll get more of like nonstop New York Giants, nonstop, you know, Dallas Cowboys, nonstop
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: Pittsburgh Steelers coverage and you know, maybe the Rams if they're interesting 'cause it's Los Angeles and you so you're gonna get New York, Dallas.
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: Pittsburgh in the middle of the fe in the middle of the country and you're gonna get a lot of Los Angeles coverage because those are your big markets. Right? And I think if the Browns became an interesting team worth talking about other than just making fun of and grinding to the ground, you know, we have a very solid span base that could support a large, you know,
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: audience. But I don't know. Th that's what you get out of ESPN though.
Mike McDermott: I Yeah.
Joel Cade: You get about four teams out of ESPN. That's what you got.
Mike McDermott: Yeah, well, I I I hope they also fix their camera action, right? Their camera the the the the shoddy work that's going on, the the the terrible work going on with camera coverage and play coverage and stuff like that is is is has just been horrendous during preseason. So I hope they fix that for regular season. I hope they bring in the the first stringers to to run camera because we actually missed an interception, right? You know, w our quarterback throws the ball right and the And the cameraman just like drifts off into the crowd. I'm like, what is going on? Where'd the ball go? Right? You know? And they're like,
Joel Cade: Mm-hmm.
Mike McDermott: it's intercepted. I'm like, I didn't get to see it. So it didn't get intercepted. Right. What are you doing? I hope they get that fixed.
Joel Cade: I I hope so. Generally those preseason games are broadcast by the hometown team. I mean I'm sure they've got like, hey, we're gonna try to work in this guy or that guy or this guy. Like
Mike McDermott: Uh-huh.
Joel Cade: meaning like the broadcast, not necessarily the crew, right? The crew is
Mike McDermott: Okay.
Joel Cade: generally the the crew from whatever station is broadcasting, being NFL
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: network, CBS, ABC, NBC, whatever. you know, they got their field crew. Maybe they're working in new people. I mean the broadcasts typically stink because the game typically stinks and there's not much drama and there's not much excitement and so they're trying to drum up everything
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: they can. It's not good. I remember listening to Bernie Kosar one time again in a Rams game, basically started saying stuff like, Lord forgive me for I have watched terrible football, you know, 'cause he's notoriously a Catholic and so he's like you know, doing the whole you know, I have to repent because I've watched this terrible stuff and
Mike McDermott: Right.
Joel Cade: it was bad stuff. And the funny thing is the guy that he was making fun of, the Browns signed three years later as a backup. So
Mike McDermott: Right.
Joel Cade: yeah, it was it was it was yeah. NFL preseason is not good. We just need to get to the regular season, we just need to kit get
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: moving.
Mike McDermott: Right. All right. I feel exhausted. Better broadcasting.
Joel Cade: Okay.
Mike McDermott: Come on. You know.
Joel Cade: Hey well, we just had week zero of the of college football and
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: you've got the team members or the teams in the SEC threatening to do everything from refusing to play L S U to actively attempting to get L S U thrown out of the conference over this whole NFL player thing. I'm I'm guessing what's happening here is Lane Kiffin is basically saying we're gonna play these former NFL players and if you don't like it, suspend me, I'll take you to court, get an injunction, there's
Mike McDermott: Yeah.
Joel Cade: no way you're gonna enforce that. So I don't know. We'll we'll see what happens. Lane Kiffin is single-handedly going to bring down the NCAA and probably the SEC.
Mike McDermott: Yeah, it's it's quite the nightmare. It's gonna
Joel Cade: So
Mike McDermott: are we gonna rewrite the rules like across the board?
Joel Cade: I don't know. I my point here is just week one of college football is coming up and there's gonna be a lot of former NFL players playing college football, so you might have some good football this weekend. maybe.
Mike McDermott: Unless unless you're at UNLV.
Joel Cade: Maybe. I don't know. I don't know.
Mike McDermott: my gosh.
Joel Cade: I don't know. Week zero is usually like preseason NFL stuff. You got,
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: you know, players and teams, that's why they always put these cupcakes out there. I think they should just broadcast these scrimmages they have, like preseason
Mike McDermott: Mm-hmm.
Joel Cade: college games. They should just like broadcast Notre Dame scrimmaging against Indiana or something. They're in state. Just ps play us
Mike McDermott: Yeah. It'd be fun.
Joel Cade: play a friendly, like they say in soccer, right?
Mike McDermott: Player friendly. All right, man. Well, I'm just gonna wrap it up here. Okay,
Joel Cade: All right, sounds good.
Mike McDermott: sounds good. Thank you everybody for joining us for the Hashmarks and Working Tools podcast. Joel, I had a great time today. Spent a lot of time working on working through all the all the details, all the details of football.
Joel Cade: Yeah. Unfortunately we didn't get to the Bengals or the Ravens, but well. Not real sad. Not real sad.
Mike McDermott: Ooh. Nah, yeah, we missed we missed commenting on them. we'll do that next week. How about that?
Joel Cade: Yep. We'll do that. Since we don't have a game this week, we gotta talk about something.
Mike McDermott: Right, exactly. Okay, thanks a lot. Thanks for joining us. Take care. Bye-bye.