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Welcome to Hacking Your Leadership. I'm Chris and I'm Lorenzo,
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and Lorenzo on this episode, I want to go over
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something pretty important and special and different and I can't
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even think of the right words because there there are
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no words. But this is, for at least the foreseeable future,
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the last episode of Hacking Your Leadership.
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Bump bump, Yes, yes it is. I think it's. You know,
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we've had a lot of years in this game and
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doing this show, and we know we've talked about it
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multiple times. When do you decide and when do you
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figure it out? And when do you kind of evolve
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or change or move on or stop? And there's never
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a shortage of leadership topics to talk about. But I
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also know that, like, as we've grown and developed, and
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as we've found things to get into and things to
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work on, there's always a good time to take a pause.
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And after this many years of consistent episodes, it felt
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right to uh get to this point of a you know,
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yearly anniversary of the show and then say, hey, let's
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uh let's take a break and let's uh let's figure
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out what happens from here.
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Yeah, I think it's I think it's important to sometimes
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figure out what things, what the things in our lives,
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what value they add, and and sometimes it's hard to
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figure that out when you're in that rhythm right. Sometimes
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you have to change things up to figure out if
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you've done the right thing or not. And that might
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be the case, like were, there might be you know,
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massive public backlash from all of our fans saying, you know,
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get your butts back in the studio and keep going
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because we depend on this, and you know, and it
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might look a little different. It might it might be
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a few months, it might be longer, it might not
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might be ever. But there's you know, my favorite band
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of all time is You Two, and it's kind of
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kind of cheesy, but a long time ago, the lead
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singer of You Two, Bono, said that the band was
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going to break up. This is like back in nineteen
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eighty nine. He says, it's time to go to go
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away and dream it all back up again. And and
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you know, with the with the idea fully in his
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mind that it might not be ever like that. It
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might dreaming it all up again might not mean that
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it comes back at all. And I think that's kind
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of where I am right now or where we are
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right now, which is just that we don't know what
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the next iteration will look like or if there will
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be one. But but we're trying to figure out what
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value this show adds to our own lives from the investment.
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And I'm not talking about money. I'm talking about just
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the emotional capital and the fact that as as working
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parents of young children and limited time, trying to figure
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out where that where it fits in and the value
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that it brings in the trade offs in time that
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that it comes with, and you.
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Know, it's got to be worth it.
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It's got to be worth it, and it has to
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be something that we that we want to continue doing
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because of the value that it brings. And we're trying
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to figure out what that looks like and if it does
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still does still fit within our lives in some way,
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and that'll take some time to figure out.
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Yeah, you know, it's interesting because I think over the
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over the years, one of the questions that I get
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constantly from people it's around podcasting is like, how do
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you guys do it? How how are you so consistent?
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And how you done it for so long? How do
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you make sure that you've always got content? In this
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type of thing, and I think we've done a really
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nice job of just refining it. And you know, from
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the first episode, we were like, we just want to
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talk about it. We don't want any script, We don't
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want to you know, overproduce this, we don't want to
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over edit this. We just want to talk about leadership
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and answer questions and provide our perspective. And I think
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over the years we've done a really good job of
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like getting that down to just like hit the record button,
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here's the topic, let's go. But also to your point,
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you know, I think that there there's other vehicles. We've
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tried some different ways of also continuing to talk about
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leadership and whether that's in you know, we started interviewing guests,
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we started doing you know, writing and newsletters and clubhouse
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you know talk club clubhouse exactly, yep, clubhouse audio, right, Like,
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just a lot of stuff that we did to just share,
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to share our perspective and provide, you know, what we
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thought would be helpful for people. And there are a
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ton of other leadership people that are in the space
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that we are fans of that we like that we
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often reference or or share, and that's another part of
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this platform that you know, we've talked a lot about us,
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how can we use this to help others that have
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great messages get their messages out there? That's always been
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really important and I think that's something that you know,
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we're not going to delete the channel, We're not going
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to delete the library. You know, these episodes and there's
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a lot of them, will continue to exist in a
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space where people can listen to them and check them out.
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And who knows, from time to time, we might we
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might feel the need to you know, put some content out,
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whether it's our somebody else's, just to be able to
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continue to share in the initial idea of the show,
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which is like, how do we do our best to
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share thoughts, perspectives and advice you know, to other leaders
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in the work that you do in leading people. And
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I think, you know, in our eight years of doing
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the show, a lot of our own leadership has matured
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and solidified, and our perspectives have sharpened as a result
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of the conversations that we've had with each other and
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with guests that we've had on.
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I agree completely with that.
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I think they're you know, the the most to me,
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the most valuable content for the show comes from our
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own personal experiences, and so you know, it can start
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out with a listener question or an article we saw
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online or a video that we saw that that resonated
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with us. But the reason that resonated with us, or
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the reason why the question was something that we thought
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it was nice to be a nice thing to answer,
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is because some one of us experienced something in our
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own lives and our own leadership journey that we can say, oh,
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you know what, I have some perspective on this, like
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I went through something similar or sometimes the exact same thing,
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and I can I can share how either I made
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the wrong move and learned from it, or made the
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right move by luck, or made the right move by
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skill because I had been in this situation before, and
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like it all, it all stems from just the experiences
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that we have, and that's where the content becomes most valuable.
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And you know that content or that those experiences continue
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to happen over the last eight years as we were
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talking about them, which is why there was really never
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a shortage of topics because it wasn't just about like
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you know, it's not like a sitcom where you have
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to just find a new trope.
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Or a new a new joke to write every week.
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This is just thinking about real life and the interactions
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that we have with the people who report to us,
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the people we interact with in our own leadership lives,
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and then talking about those experiences in a way that
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is meaningful and that shows the learnings that we have
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had from them. And I think that that's that's why
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the show has resonated with with so many people, is
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because it's not it's not made up, you know, it's
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it's based on the real things that happen in our
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lives and and the vulnerability that comes with, you know,
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sharing those learnings and those missteps especially.
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Yeah, exactly, I think, you know, sharing places where we've
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made mistakes or things that we've learned, sharing you know,
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passionately about you know, processes and strategies and approaches to leadership.
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And you know, I think over the years we've we've
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we've had all kinds of conversations from like funny times
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of things that have happened to silly stuff that happens
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in different industries, to serious topics that you know, have
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a real impact on people, to topics that you know,
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over the years have evolved in how we see them
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in society, how we see them in the workforce, you know,
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to leaders and maybe strategies and discussions that we had
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eight years ago to then getting through you know, twenty
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twenty and COVID and all that type of thing, to
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then kind of the new iteration of that, and we
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talked a lot about what things have really solidified and
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then what things are new, and what things are wide open,
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and how is you know, the you know, how are
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our people, the workforce, the culture now in a place
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where we're holding leaders accountable in a very different way
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and in a good way, which is just raising the
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bar of what should be expected from having a leader
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that's supposed to be there to inspire and motivate, you know,
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help support people do the work that they're doing. And
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I think that that's been a really fun part of
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the journey, is just being a part of conversations that
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I think we're relevant really closely in the moment. Like
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I immediately get brought back to the We did an
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episode about a hurricane that happened in Florida, and oh yeah,
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it was a you know, come to work anyway. It
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was like a pizza place that was just like we
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don't care go to work, right. We just talked about
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that and it was like, how ridiculous is that? And
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you know, that was something that we read in the news.
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And there's just those moments that happened that I think
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really skyrocketed what what is the expectation of leadership and
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what is the what are the right things to do
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or the right way to handle things? And I think
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that's probably been the most fun for me is just
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the amount of listeners that have reached out in so
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many different ways continue to share our content. It just
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happened last week somebody shared one of our short clips
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on LinkedIn and talked about how important this subject was
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and how it was something they struggled with and they
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work through. So, you know, I just it's been a
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fun journey. But I think I've just enjoyed watching the
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conversations that we've had continue to go through other listeners
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and leaders that feel the same way or want to
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share their perspective on some of the topics.
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Yeah, the example you gave just now of that hurricane thing,
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it kind of made me think of something that I
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think is important to kind of discuss, and that's that
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that it's it's hard not to think that our own,
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like our experience in leadership, both as a leader of
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people and as as someone who has reported to leaders
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throughout our journeys, we've all had, we've all always had,
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we both always had a boss at any given time.
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There's always been one, sometimes more than one. And the
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examples of like that that hurricane in Florida is it's
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really difficult sometimes not to think that our own perspective
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or our own experience as employees reporting to leaders, it's
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hard not to think that that's the norm, because I
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think both of have been very fortunate in our leadership
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journeys that we've had goodly bosses and bad bosses. I
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can definitely, you know, place them in a hierarchical order, right.
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I've learned from the good ones that I've learned sometimes
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even more from the bad ones, but none of them
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have ever risen to that level of like, you know,
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I don't care about your safety.
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Come to work at a pizza place.
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You know, And and because of that, it's it's sometimes
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it's hard not to not to chuckle at that a
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little bit and think like that's it's almost satire, but
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it's not. And I think over the years, the instances
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of that happening are far less than it would have been,
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you know, thirty forty fifty years ago. I think a
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lot of it has to do with, you know, the
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visibility to things like that happening. If if that happened,
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if that interaction happened between the pizza place owner and
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the employee in nineteen eighty two, no one would ever
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know about it because there'd be no place to show it,
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to share it with everybody, right, and that would just happen.
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And nowadays it gets shared and there's a there's a
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level of social accountability that at least has helped keep
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some leaders, you know, on the straight and narrow a
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little bit, you know, for even if not for the
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right reasons, sometimes doing the right thing for the wrong
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reasons is still the right thing, right.
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You know, you're still doing it.
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And I think that has kind of moved the needle
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on the experience employees have. But there are still areas
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where it is not good. There are still areas, there
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are still places across the workforce where the employee experience
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is not great.
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And I think anytime that is the case, all roads
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lead back to leadership.
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All roads of the of a negative employee experience lead
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back to the effectiveness of the leadership team in that
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organization and what they're doing or how they're prioritizing the
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employee experience and.
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Whether or not they do it.
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All to begin with Yeah, No, it's it's a great call,
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and I think it's a you know, yeah, I'm just
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I'm just I'm just stuck in the space of just
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thinking about, like, how do you possibly provide thank you
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user gratitude to all of the people that have like
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pushed our show forward, from whether it be guests that
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said yes right away, you know, like I think of
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you know, we for a long time we didn't do guests,
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and then we really wanted to build some space to say, like, well,
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we want to talk to the people that we want
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to talk to. And then it was kind of like
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nerve wrecking, Well let's reach let's reach out to the
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people that we want to talk to. And the fact
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that so many of them said yes and they're like yeah,
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of course, absolutely, Like that was tremendous. I think of
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all of the listener questions and the text messages dms,
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the screenshots that were sent to me about people listening
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to the show, just like the continual push forward from
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people to say like, hey love this, love that I'm
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using it this way.
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You know.
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We've had leaders from from organizations reach out and say, hey,
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we've put together a collection of what we think are
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the ten shows that resonate most with our workforce, and
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we've turned this into like a training document.
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Is that cool?
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And we're like yeah, of course, like you know, like
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whatever whatever you want to do, Like the whole point
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of this is like, yeah, use it for whatever you can.
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But like, I just think about all of those listeners, uh,
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and people that helped to push us to continue to
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like evolve what we talked about evolve, you know, the
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way that we were doing our episodes, the you know,
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the the guests interviews that pay it Forward Fridays, the
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employee engagement Thursdays, the Thoughtful Thursdays. Like we did so
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many things that I think we were driven by people
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that listen to the show. And I think that's something
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that's cool about the podcasting space when you have that
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connection with an audience, is that you know you can
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adjust and move and pivot to the places that they
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want you to go to. And and I think that
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that's been a fun part of the journey. It's just
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continuing to like, you know, have people that have an
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influence on how I'm thinking about leadership that I don't
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even know, you know what I'm saying, not alone, like
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don't work with every day, but like complete strangers and
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thousands of them saying, hey, you should talk about this,
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or we need to talk about that, and things that
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maybe I hadn't even considered in my own leadership or
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things that I hadn't come across yet that I now
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had to have an opinion on and had to think through.
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And I think that was super fun and helpful.
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Yeah, it has made me better at leadership.
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Right, there's just the interactions with our audience and the
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the things that we've had to contemplate and think about
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and and you know, it's we talked, we talk off
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on the show about the importance of at of leading
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with values, right about figuring out what is important to
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you and then leading with that and allowing that to
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guide your decision making process as a leader. And then
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and then if you allow it to go your decision
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making process as a leader, and the outcome isn't what
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you what what it needed to be. Then Okay, then
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does that mean that you didn't really use that as
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a guide or does it mean that your your values
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need to tweak or change a little.
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Bit based on the the.
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Time are you are?
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You?
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Are they not well defined yet because of the experience
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or lack thereof that you that you have in the workforce,
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Like all these things happen over time, and and as you.
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The more you do it, the better a process it becomes.
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And the the process of doing that through the lens
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of the of the things that our listeners have asked
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of us and kind of thinking, Okay, this hasn't happened
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to me, but it's happening to one of our listeners
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who's who's asking for advice on this? How how would
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I deal with this? And And it's a lot harder
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to do that hypothetically than it is if it's if
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it's really happening, because you actually have to make the decision.
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But it really has helped me test my values as
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a leader by putting those situations through through the kind
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of the mill of my personal values to see if
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the outcome aligns with what is a appropriate for the
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situation and b doesn't. But heads with my values right.
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It kind of checks my values in the process to
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see if they are still right, if they're still appropriate,
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or if I need to tweak them. Because you if
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you're never tweaking your values, it doesn't mean that you're steadfast.
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It means that you are you know, unwilling to change
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to changing times. Because your values should change over time.
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They should just change thoughtfully and methodically and based on
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like real true evidence, not you know, not whimsically, but
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they but they should not remain the same, you know,
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for forever. And these examples that we've gotten from our
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our listeners has they've They've definitely caused me to to
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to think through my values and what's important to me
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and and make make tweaks or changes when appropriate. And
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I think it's it's it's been very valuable to me too,
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not just to our.
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Listeners, absolutely, And with that it brings us to the
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end of this chapter for hacking your leadership.
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Before we go, I just you know, I know that
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when we talked about doing this, Lorenzo, you said that
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you really wanted to put some time and effort into
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thinking through kind of like if you had one piece
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of advice, like one nugget of advice for our listeners that,
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you know, for somebody who is going into leadership or
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new to leadership, or.
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If they're just struggling with leadership in general.
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You know, the thing that you'd want to have on
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the wall in front of you every day that you
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could look up at and and and read to yourself
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and kind of like a rock or an anchor of
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leadership advice to our listeners. You said you felt it
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was really important to kind of have that kind of
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like get to let our audience kind of take away
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at the at the end of the last episode. And
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I really like that idea, and you know, I know
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you've already shared it with me, and I think it's fantastic.
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I think you did a really great job of kind
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of narrowing it down and thinking about something where the
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rubber really meets the road that our our listeners can
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take with them as they as they depart from the
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show for a while. And so I'll let you take
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it away and end the episode with this with this kernel.
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But this is a really fantastic stuff here.
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I mean, you know, we've had these one minute hacks
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for the entire period, and I kind of felt that like,
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this is really important to kind of like eight years,
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you know, like over thousand episodes, how you slice it,
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decades of leadership experience between the two of us, really
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trying to boil this down to say, like what what
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do you say and how do you help to guide
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someone into their future? How do you help to take
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someone who has been a leader for a long time
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and give them something that may reshape the way they
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think about leadership and can leave an impressed and very
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like it kind of an impression of people that they
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will take with them forever. People we always have those
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quotes that we heard some people say that they just
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stick with us and they help us, and those those
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really tough times. And so you know what I would
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say is like, you know, boiling it all down, all
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that time, all that tenure, all that experience, all the
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conversations that we've had, the tens of thousands of minutes
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and hours of dialogue. For me, you know, leadership really
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just comes down to this one very simple statement, and
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that is
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Welcome to Hacking Your Leadership. I'm Chris and I'm Lorenzo,
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and Lorenzo on this episode, I want to go over
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something pretty important and special and different and I can't
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even think of the right words because there there are
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no words. But this is, for at least the foreseeable future,
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the last episode of Hacking Your Leadership.
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Bump bump, Yes, yes it is. I think it's. You know,
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we've had a lot of years in this game and
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doing this show, and we know we've talked about it
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multiple times. When do you decide and when do you
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figure it out? And when do you kind of evolve
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or change or move on or stop? And there's never
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a shortage of leadership topics to talk about. But I
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also know that, like, as we've grown and developed, and
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as we've found things to get into and things to
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work on, there's always a good time to take a pause.
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And after this many years of consistent episodes, it felt
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right to uh get to this point of a you know,
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yearly anniversary of the show and then say, hey, let's
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uh let's take a break and let's uh let's figure
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out what happens from here.
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Yeah, I think it's I think it's important to sometimes
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figure out what things, what the things in our lives,
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what value they add, and and sometimes it's hard to
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figure that out when you're in that rhythm right. Sometimes
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you have to change things up to figure out if
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you've done the right thing or not. And that might
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be the case, like were, there might be you know,
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massive public backlash from all of our fans saying, you know,
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get your butts back in the studio and keep going
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because we depend on this, and you know, and it
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might look a little different. It might it might be
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a few months, it might be longer, it might not
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might be ever. But there's you know, my favorite band
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of all time is You Two, and it's kind of
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kind of cheesy, but a long time ago, the lead
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singer of You Two, Bono, said that the band was
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going to break up. This is like back in nineteen
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eighty nine. He says, it's time to go to go
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away and dream it all back up again. And and
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you know, with the with the idea fully in his
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mind that it might not be ever like that. It
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might dreaming it all up again might not mean that
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it comes back at all. And I think that's kind
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of where I am right now or where we are
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right now, which is just that we don't know what
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the next iteration will look like or if there will
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be one. But but we're trying to figure out what
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value this show adds to our own lives from the investment.
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And I'm not talking about money. I'm talking about just
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the emotional capital and the fact that as as working
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parents of young children and limited time, trying to figure
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out where that where it fits in and the value
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that it brings in the trade offs in time that
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that it comes with, and you.
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Know, it's got to be worth it.
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It's got to be worth it, and it has to
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be something that we that we want to continue doing
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because of the value that it brings. And we're trying
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to figure out what that looks like and if it does
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still does still fit within our lives in some way,
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and that'll take some time to figure out.
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Yeah, you know, it's interesting because I think over the
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over the years, one of the questions that I get
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constantly from people it's around podcasting is like, how do
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you guys do it? How how are you so consistent?
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And how you done it for so long? How do
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you make sure that you've always got content? In this
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type of thing, and I think we've done a really
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nice job of just refining it. And you know, from
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the first episode, we were like, we just want to
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talk about it. We don't want any script, We don't
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want to you know, overproduce this, we don't want to
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over edit this. We just want to talk about leadership
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and answer questions and provide our perspective. And I think
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over the years we've done a really good job of
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like getting that down to just like hit the record button,
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here's the topic, let's go. But also to your point,
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you know, I think that there there's other vehicles. We've
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tried some different ways of also continuing to talk about
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leadership and whether that's in you know, we started interviewing guests,
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we started doing you know, writing and newsletters and clubhouse
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you know talk club clubhouse exactly, yep, clubhouse audio, right, Like,
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just a lot of stuff that we did to just share,
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to share our perspective and provide, you know, what we
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thought would be helpful for people. And there are a
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ton of other leadership people that are in the space
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that we are fans of that we like that we
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often reference or or share, and that's another part of
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this platform that you know, we've talked a lot about us,
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how can we use this to help others that have
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great messages get their messages out there? That's always been
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really important and I think that's something that you know,
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we're not going to delete the channel, We're not going
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to delete the library. You know, these episodes and there's
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a lot of them, will continue to exist in a
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space where people can listen to them and check them out.
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And who knows, from time to time, we might we
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might feel the need to you know, put some content out,
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whether it's our somebody else's, just to be able to
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continue to share in the initial idea of the show,
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which is like, how do we do our best to
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share thoughts, perspectives and advice you know, to other leaders
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in the work that you do in leading people. And
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I think, you know, in our eight years of doing
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the show, a lot of our own leadership has matured
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and solidified, and our perspectives have sharpened as a result
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of the conversations that we've had with each other and
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with guests that we've had on.
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I agree completely with that.
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I think they're you know, the the most to me,
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the most valuable content for the show comes from our
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own personal experiences, and so you know, it can start
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out with a listener question or an article we saw
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online or a video that we saw that that resonated
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with us. But the reason that resonated with us, or
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the reason why the question was something that we thought
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it was nice to be a nice thing to answer,
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is because some one of us experienced something in our
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own lives and our own leadership journey that we can say, oh,
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you know what, I have some perspective on this, like
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I went through something similar or sometimes the exact same thing,
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and I can I can share how either I made
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the wrong move and learned from it, or made the
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right move by luck, or made the right move by
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skill because I had been in this situation before, and
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like it all, it all stems from just the experiences
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that we have, and that's where the content becomes most valuable.
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And you know that content or that those experiences continue
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to happen over the last eight years as we were
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talking about them, which is why there was really never
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a shortage of topics because it wasn't just about like
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you know, it's not like a sitcom where you have
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to just find a new trope.
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Or a new a new joke to write every week.
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This is just thinking about real life and the interactions
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that we have with the people who report to us,
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the people we interact with in our own leadership lives,
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and then talking about those experiences in a way that
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is meaningful and that shows the learnings that we have
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had from them. And I think that that's that's why
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the show has resonated with with so many people, is
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because it's not it's not made up, you know, it's
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it's based on the real things that happen in our
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lives and and the vulnerability that comes with, you know,
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sharing those learnings and those missteps especially.
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Yeah, exactly, I think, you know, sharing places where we've
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made mistakes or things that we've learned, sharing you know,
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passionately about you know, processes and strategies and approaches to leadership.
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And you know, I think over the years we've we've
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we've had all kinds of conversations from like funny times
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of things that have happened to silly stuff that happens
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in different industries, to serious topics that you know, have
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a real impact on people, to topics that you know,
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over the years have evolved in how we see them
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in society, how we see them in the workforce, you know,
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to leaders and maybe strategies and discussions that we had
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eight years ago to then getting through you know, twenty
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twenty and COVID and all that type of thing, to
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then kind of the new iteration of that, and we
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talked a lot about what things have really solidified and
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then what things are new, and what things are wide open,
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and how is you know, the you know, how are
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our people, the workforce, the culture now in a place
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where we're holding leaders accountable in a very different way
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and in a good way, which is just raising the
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bar of what should be expected from having a leader
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that's supposed to be there to inspire and motivate, you know,
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help support people do the work that they're doing. And
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I think that that's been a really fun part of
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the journey, is just being a part of conversations that
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I think we're relevant really closely in the moment. Like
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I immediately get brought back to the We did an
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episode about a hurricane that happened in Florida, and oh yeah,
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it was a you know, come to work anyway. It
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was like a pizza place that was just like we
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don't care go to work, right. We just talked about
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that and it was like, how ridiculous is that? And
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you know, that was something that we read in the news.
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And there's just those moments that happened that I think
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really skyrocketed what what is the expectation of leadership and
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what is the what are the right things to do
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or the right way to handle things? And I think
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that's probably been the most fun for me is just
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the amount of listeners that have reached out in so
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many different ways continue to share our content. It just
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happened last week somebody shared one of our short clips
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on LinkedIn and talked about how important this subject was
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and how it was something they struggled with and they
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work through. So, you know, I just it's been a
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fun journey. But I think I've just enjoyed watching the
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conversations that we've had continue to go through other listeners
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and leaders that feel the same way or want to
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share their perspective on some of the topics.
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Yeah, the example you gave just now of that hurricane thing,
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it kind of made me think of something that I
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think is important to kind of discuss, and that's that
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that it's it's hard not to think that our own,
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like our experience in leadership, both as a leader of
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people and as as someone who has reported to leaders
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throughout our journeys, we've all had, we've all always had,
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we both always had a boss at any given time.
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There's always been one, sometimes more than one. And the
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examples of like that that hurricane in Florida is it's
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really difficult sometimes not to think that our own perspective
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or our own experience as employees reporting to leaders, it's
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hard not to think that that's the norm, because I
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think both of have been very fortunate in our leadership
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journeys that we've had goodly bosses and bad bosses. I
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can definitely, you know, place them in a hierarchical order, right.
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I've learned from the good ones that I've learned sometimes
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even more from the bad ones, but none of them
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have ever risen to that level of like, you know,
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I don't care about your safety.
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Come to work at a pizza place.
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You know, And and because of that, it's it's sometimes
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it's hard not to not to chuckle at that a
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little bit and think like that's it's almost satire, but
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it's not. And I think over the years, the instances
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of that happening are far less than it would have been,
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you know, thirty forty fifty years ago. I think a
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lot of it has to do with, you know, the
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visibility to things like that happening. If if that happened,
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if that interaction happened between the pizza place owner and
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the employee in nineteen eighty two, no one would ever
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know about it because there'd be no place to show it,
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to share it with everybody, right, and that would just happen.
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And nowadays it gets shared and there's a there's a
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level of social accountability that at least has helped keep
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some leaders, you know, on the straight and narrow a
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little bit, you know, for even if not for the
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right reasons, sometimes doing the right thing for the wrong
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reasons is still the right thing, right.
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You know, you're still doing it.
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And I think that has kind of moved the needle
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on the experience employees have. But there are still areas
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where it is not good. There are still areas, there
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are still places across the workforce where the employee experience
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is not great.
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And I think anytime that is the case, all roads
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lead back to leadership.
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All roads of the of a negative employee experience lead
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back to the effectiveness of the leadership team in that
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organization and what they're doing or how they're prioritizing the
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employee experience and.
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Whether or not they do it.
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All to begin with Yeah, No, it's it's a great call,
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and I think it's a you know, yeah, I'm just
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I'm just I'm just stuck in the space of just
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thinking about, like, how do you possibly provide thank you
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user gratitude to all of the people that have like
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pushed our show forward, from whether it be guests that
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said yes right away, you know, like I think of
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you know, we for a long time we didn't do guests,
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and then we really wanted to build some space to say, like, well,
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we want to talk to the people that we want
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to talk to. And then it was kind of like
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nerve wrecking, Well let's reach let's reach out to the
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people that we want to talk to. And the fact
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that so many of them said yes and they're like yeah,
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of course, absolutely, Like that was tremendous. I think of
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all of the listener questions and the text messages dms,
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the screenshots that were sent to me about people listening
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to the show, just like the continual push forward from
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people to say like, hey love this, love that I'm
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using it this way.
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You know.
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We've had leaders from from organizations reach out and say, hey,
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we've put together a collection of what we think are
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the ten shows that resonate most with our workforce, and
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we've turned this into like a training document.
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Is that cool?
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And we're like yeah, of course, like you know, like
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whatever whatever you want to do, Like the whole point
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of this is like, yeah, use it for whatever you can.
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But like, I just think about all of those listeners, uh,
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and people that helped to push us to continue to
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like evolve what we talked about evolve, you know, the
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way that we were doing our episodes, the you know,
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the the guests interviews that pay it Forward Fridays, the
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employee engagement Thursdays, the Thoughtful Thursdays. Like we did so
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many things that I think we were driven by people
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that listen to the show. And I think that's something
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that's cool about the podcasting space when you have that
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connection with an audience, is that you know you can
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adjust and move and pivot to the places that they
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want you to go to. And and I think that
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that's been a fun part of the journey. It's just
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continuing to like, you know, have people that have an
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influence on how I'm thinking about leadership that I don't
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even know, you know what I'm saying, not alone, like
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don't work with every day, but like complete strangers and
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thousands of them saying, hey, you should talk about this,
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or we need to talk about that, and things that
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maybe I hadn't even considered in my own leadership or
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things that I hadn't come across yet that I now
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had to have an opinion on and had to think through.
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And I think that was super fun and helpful.
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Yeah, it has made me better at leadership.
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Right, there's just the interactions with our audience and the
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the things that we've had to contemplate and think about
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and and you know, it's we talked, we talk off
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on the show about the importance of at of leading
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with values, right about figuring out what is important to
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you and then leading with that and allowing that to
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guide your decision making process as a leader. And then
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and then if you allow it to go your decision
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making process as a leader, and the outcome isn't what
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you what what it needed to be. Then Okay, then
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does that mean that you didn't really use that as
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a guide or does it mean that your your values
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need to tweak or change a little.
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Bit based on the the.
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Time are you are?
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You?
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Are they not well defined yet because of the experience
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or lack thereof that you that you have in the workforce,
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Like all these things happen over time, and and as you.
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The more you do it, the better a process it becomes.
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And the the process of doing that through the lens
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of the of the things that our listeners have asked
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of us and kind of thinking, Okay, this hasn't happened
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to me, but it's happening to one of our listeners
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who's who's asking for advice on this? How how would
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I deal with this? And And it's a lot harder
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to do that hypothetically than it is if it's if
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it's really happening, because you actually have to make the decision.
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But it really has helped me test my values as
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a leader by putting those situations through through the kind
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of the mill of my personal values to see if
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the outcome aligns with what is a appropriate for the
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situation and b doesn't. But heads with my values right.
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It kind of checks my values in the process to
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see if they are still right, if they're still appropriate,
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or if I need to tweak them. Because you if
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you're never tweaking your values, it doesn't mean that you're steadfast.
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It means that you are you know, unwilling to change
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to changing times. Because your values should change over time.
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They should just change thoughtfully and methodically and based on
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like real true evidence, not you know, not whimsically, but
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they but they should not remain the same, you know,
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for forever. And these examples that we've gotten from our
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our listeners has they've They've definitely caused me to to
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to think through my values and what's important to me
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and and make make tweaks or changes when appropriate. And
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I think it's it's it's been very valuable to me too,
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not just to our.
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Listeners, absolutely, And with that it brings us to the
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end of this chapter for hacking your leadership.
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Before we go, I just you know, I know that
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when we talked about doing this, Lorenzo, you said that
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you really wanted to put some time and effort into
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thinking through kind of like if you had one piece
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of advice, like one nugget of advice for our listeners that,
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you know, for somebody who is going into leadership or
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new to leadership, or.
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If they're just struggling with leadership in general.
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You know, the thing that you'd want to have on
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the wall in front of you every day that you
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could look up at and and and read to yourself
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and kind of like a rock or an anchor of
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leadership advice to our listeners. You said you felt it
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was really important to kind of have that kind of
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like get to let our audience kind of take away
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at the at the end of the last episode. And
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I really like that idea, and you know, I know
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you've already shared it with me, and I think it's fantastic.
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I think you did a really great job of kind
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of narrowing it down and thinking about something where the
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rubber really meets the road that our our listeners can
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take with them as they as they depart from the
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show for a while. And so I'll let you take
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it away and end the episode with this with this kernel.
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But this is a really fantastic stuff here.
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I mean, you know, we've had these one minute hacks
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for the entire period, and I kind of felt that like,
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this is really important to kind of like eight years,
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you know, like over thousand episodes, how you slice it,
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decades of leadership experience between the two of us, really
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trying to boil this down to say, like what what
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do you say and how do you help to guide
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someone into their future? How do you help to take
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someone who has been a leader for a long time
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and give them something that may reshape the way they
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think about leadership and can leave an impressed and very
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like it kind of an impression of people that they
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will take with them forever. People we always have those
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quotes that we heard some people say that they just
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stick with us and they help us, and those those
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really tough times. And so you know what I would
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say is like, you know, boiling it all down, all
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that time, all that tenure, all that experience, all the
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conversations that we've had, the tens of thousands of minutes
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and hours of dialogue. For me, you know, leadership really
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just comes down to this one very simple statement, and
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that is
