WEBVTT
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Hi and welcome back to Grieving Greatly.
00:00:04.799 --> 00:00:10.640
Today's episode is a little different because grief doesn't just affect one person.
00:00:11.439 --> 00:00:18.719
It moves through families quietly, deeply, and often in ways we don't talk about.
00:00:19.440 --> 00:00:33.520
Today I'm sitting down with my mum to talk about what it was like not just losing Harry, but watching our whole family fall apart and trying to hold us through it.
00:00:34.079 --> 00:00:36.640
Mum, thanks so much for being here.
00:00:37.920 --> 00:00:42.719
Before we start, I just want to say there's no pressure to say anything perfectly.
00:00:42.960 --> 00:00:45.920
We'll just talk and go gently.
00:00:46.960 --> 00:00:50.799
Can you take me back to when you first found out about Harry?
00:00:51.520 --> 00:00:52.479
Yes I can.
00:00:52.640 --> 00:00:56.159
I was at a function at a club and was called to the phone.
00:00:56.320 --> 00:01:01.439
It's all a blur what was said really, but I knew we had to get to the hospital.
00:01:01.679 --> 00:01:03.600
I prayed all the way.
00:01:03.840 --> 00:01:06.879
The message did not say that Harry was dead.
00:01:07.120 --> 00:01:08.560
So there was hope.
00:01:08.799 --> 00:01:09.920
I felt numb.
00:01:10.159 --> 00:01:14.000
Harry's power was driving the car, but there was silence.
00:01:14.400 --> 00:01:16.640
Non-belief is what I felt.
00:01:16.959 --> 00:01:18.400
This cannot be happening.
00:01:18.560 --> 00:01:19.840
This cannot be true.
00:01:20.079 --> 00:01:21.920
Will I wake up soon?
00:01:22.319 --> 00:01:34.400
Reality struck me when I saw Eugen slumped over Harry's body, and I saw my son-in-law fall onto the floor when there was no more hope.
00:01:34.640 --> 00:01:37.599
I felt numb, but mostly helpless.
00:01:37.840 --> 00:01:44.799
My beautiful baby grandson had passed, and his parents were destroyed, and I could do nothing.
00:01:45.439 --> 00:01:46.719
I didn't want this.
00:01:46.879 --> 00:01:48.560
I wanted it to go away.
00:01:48.799 --> 00:01:50.959
I called people on my phone.
00:01:51.120 --> 00:01:52.560
What could they do though?
00:01:52.799 --> 00:01:55.439
Goodness knows what they said or what I said.
00:01:55.519 --> 00:01:56.719
I was just babbling on.
00:01:56.879 --> 00:02:01.599
They may have said something to try and comfort, but I just wanted it all fixed.
00:02:02.560 --> 00:02:04.319
I could not understand.
00:02:04.400 --> 00:02:10.080
I had waved to Harry earlier in the car, leaving my home, and he was smiling.
00:02:10.319 --> 00:02:12.000
That was our happy day out.
00:02:12.240 --> 00:02:14.719
I wanted it all to go back to that day.
00:02:14.960 --> 00:02:16.800
I wanted it to go away.
00:02:18.080 --> 00:02:20.000
Thanks so much for sharing that.
00:02:20.240 --> 00:02:28.479
I think that sometimes people don't realise that you weren't just hearing about a loss, you were watching your daughter's life change instantly.
00:02:28.719 --> 00:02:32.080
And I didn't realise that until I started doing this also.
00:02:32.879 --> 00:02:35.680
What was it like watching me go through that?
00:02:36.400 --> 00:02:40.960
It was heart-wrenching torture because at that time I could not help.
00:02:41.120 --> 00:02:44.080
I could not fix things that I'd always done.
00:02:44.319 --> 00:02:50.639
I felt lost, but I knew at that moment it was going to be my job to try and hold you together.
00:02:50.960 --> 00:02:56.639
Try to hold the family tight to be able to move forward in some sort of manner.
00:02:56.960 --> 00:03:03.439
The hardest part for me was the anger, the whys and the blame that no one could answer.
00:03:03.680 --> 00:03:06.800
I talked for hours feeling it was not heard.
00:03:07.039 --> 00:03:10.319
Maybe it was a comfort, but I did not feel that way.
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I was getting through it in any way I could.
00:03:13.919 --> 00:03:17.680
I think back now, and maybe I should have just understood more.
00:03:18.159 --> 00:03:27.360
But to see you, my daughter, just laying in that dark room in bed day after day, sobbing, not functioning, not communicating.
00:03:27.599 --> 00:03:32.240
And only when you did, it was all an act put on for others.
00:03:32.879 --> 00:03:40.000
I was heartbroken, not for Harry at this time, but for my child and for our family life, which was gone.
00:03:40.240 --> 00:03:42.719
Nothing was normal anymore.
00:03:42.960 --> 00:03:45.599
I prayed at night to save my child.
00:03:45.759 --> 00:03:47.039
I was angry at God.
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He had taken our baby and I was going to lose my daughter.
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Your choices in dealing with grief were dangerous in my eyes, but I understood.
00:03:57.280 --> 00:03:59.520
You were trying to escape the agony.
00:04:00.080 --> 00:04:05.599
And in the daily pain you had every day, understanding wasn't the issue.
00:04:05.840 --> 00:04:10.639
I had the job to rise up, support, and help get you through this.
00:04:10.960 --> 00:04:18.480
All I could do was physical stuff, cleaning, cooking, and holding things together, just being there if needed.
00:04:18.800 --> 00:04:27.360
I felt lost so many times when I left driving home from your house in tears, laying in bed at night, hoping you would be okay.
00:04:27.759 --> 00:04:30.079
One day I stopped at the lake on my way home.
00:04:30.240 --> 00:04:34.079
I called out, God, just help me, I can't do this anymore.
00:04:34.319 --> 00:04:36.480
I always feeled I would lose you.
00:04:36.560 --> 00:04:37.839
I always felt that.
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And because my life was to prop you up and be there for you, my girl and my family.
00:04:45.120 --> 00:04:49.199
Hardest part, Jen, was when you would say, You don't understand.
00:04:49.519 --> 00:04:56.480
Truth was, I did understand I was watching and could not do a damn thing that would change things.
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I do remember saying that, and at that time I didn't think you understood, but now I know you had an extra layer there.
00:05:04.000 --> 00:05:10.000
I felt like I've never understood your side of it, and I'm really thanking you for sharing that now.
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Do you feel like your grief wasn't seen at the time?
00:05:14.240 --> 00:05:18.160
Even to this day, I don't feel I've grieved properly for Harry.
00:05:18.399 --> 00:05:22.560
Now, all these years later, small things do trigger a tear into my eye.
00:05:22.720 --> 00:05:33.839
Reading your podcasts have helped me cope with my grief, and at the same time, has let me remember precious times that we had together with Harry and the closeness that we all shared.
00:05:34.639 --> 00:05:46.639
I know I've always held things in and always been a strong one, but at times because it's become so hard, and then I fold and I go off and have some quiet time to myself.
00:05:46.959 --> 00:05:53.920
I never ever felt I could fall apart as I felt others in my family needed me to be first priority.
00:05:54.160 --> 00:05:59.600
I knew the relationship I had with Harry and it kept all inside of me.
00:05:59.759 --> 00:06:03.680
His part grooved every day, but he kept it to himself.
00:06:04.160 --> 00:06:09.360
Support was given by others, but no one understands unless it's happened to them.
00:06:09.680 --> 00:06:19.519
I know I have a special way of coping, and after I go and reflect for a while, then I can shake myself up and say, go forward, you can do this.
00:06:22.399 --> 00:06:26.079
And you've always encouraged me to do that, and I think that's what kept me going.
00:06:26.160 --> 00:06:30.000
But I think what you went through is just something that we don't talk about enough.
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The people that do grieve differently or they are holding everything together are often hurting just as deeply.
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How did this change your life beyond just the loss itself?
00:06:41.680 --> 00:06:45.600
I see the world as a beautiful place with some very caring people in it.
00:06:45.759 --> 00:06:47.680
But there are some very cruel people.
00:06:47.839 --> 00:06:51.920
Some think it is time you should just move on and get over things.
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But I've been lucky with those around me, but I have watched you lose a lot of your friends, Jen, from a place of no understanding.
00:07:00.560 --> 00:07:07.360
Grief sorts people out, and I've seen you making lasting close ref close friendships through this tragedy.
00:07:07.680 --> 00:07:11.040
I believe in safety in life, and we should all be more careful.
00:07:11.199 --> 00:07:15.120
But also in later years I've come to believe there is a better place.
00:07:15.759 --> 00:07:22.879
And as I age, I do feel closer to God, and I believe our Harry is in that place, and that I will meet him sometime again.
00:07:23.120 --> 00:07:32.879
I am a people person and always like to have fun in life, but Harry's death has changed the carefree, spontaneous person that I used to be, always having fun.
00:07:33.040 --> 00:07:36.720
I've become a more planned and think about it type person.
00:07:37.199 --> 00:07:41.120
And yeah, a lot of my fun did go with that little man.
00:07:42.240 --> 00:07:47.519
Definitely grief just doesn't stay in that one moment and it changes how you move through life.
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Looking back now, what do you think people got right in supporting you?
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My friends were there for me, but I don't feel anyone knows that pain inside.
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I feel we just just get on with things and make it better for them, really.
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Make them feel better.
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I wish people understood there was no time limit in grief.
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I remember one one woman while I was playing lawn bowls, she said, your daughter should get over things.
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Of course she had never experienced the grief we had.
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Yeah, I definitely think that's something so many people struggle with and we don't talk a lot.
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They are still there wanting to help, but not knowing how.
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And how do you carry Harry with you now?
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I carry him with me every day.
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I wear a ring with his name on it, and I wear his initial round my neck, and all my passwords have his name in it.
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I remember him in my car singing, and I always feel he finds his old mama a car park when I ask him.
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We always have a smile.
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I I always asked him to help his mum to cope in my prayers, and I do feel he is around, and we need to believe that.
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Grief has made me a much stronger person, as I've had to be there for others.
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The tearing pain in my being has now passed, and we can all function a bit better, but there will always be that little flutter in my heart when Harry's name comes up.
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He brightened our life.
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He sure did.
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And if there is one thing that you want people to understand about this kind of grief, what would it be?
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Grief is habilitating, but unfortunately we all have to face it.
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It is a heartbreaking journey which tests our inner being.
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I say to you, if grieving, just love yourself and remember your special person with all your heart.
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And remember they will always be with you, and they will be proud of what you are doing and how you are surviving this very painful time.
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I just want to say thank you so much for holding me when I couldn't hold myself, and I know for a fact that I wouldn't be here today if it wasn't for you.
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And I really know and understand that I was difficult during that time and I was an understanding of your grief, and no wonder you are still grieving that way now.
00:10:10.159 --> 00:10:24.000
And I do know grief doesn't just live in one person, it moves through families, through relationships, through the people who love us, and sometimes the people holding everything together are carrying more than we realise.
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And at that time I was just in too much pain to notice yours, and I'm so sorry about that.
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If this episode resonated with you, I'm really glad that you found this space.
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And before you go, I want you to hear this.
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You'll always be enough for me, and you'll never be too much.
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I'll be here with you in the next one.
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For Harry and for anyone learning to live with loss, thank you for being here, truly.
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And just a gentle reminder: if today brought up anything difficult, please reach out for support.
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You can contact Brief Australia on 1-800-642-066 or Lifeline Australia on 13114 or myself on 10431 212 575.
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You don't have to go through this alone.
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And thank you so much for doing this interview with me today, mum.
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I love you very much.
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Now thank you.
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Thank you.
00:00:01.439 --> 00:00:04.559
Hi and welcome back to Grieving Greatly.
00:00:04.799 --> 00:00:10.640
Today's episode is a little different because grief doesn't just affect one person.
00:00:11.439 --> 00:00:18.719
It moves through families quietly, deeply, and often in ways we don't talk about.
00:00:19.440 --> 00:00:33.520
Today I'm sitting down with my mum to talk about what it was like not just losing Harry, but watching our whole family fall apart and trying to hold us through it.
00:00:34.079 --> 00:00:36.640
Mum, thanks so much for being here.
00:00:37.920 --> 00:00:42.719
Before we start, I just want to say there's no pressure to say anything perfectly.
00:00:42.960 --> 00:00:45.920
We'll just talk and go gently.
00:00:46.960 --> 00:00:50.799
Can you take me back to when you first found out about Harry?
00:00:51.520 --> 00:00:52.479
Yes I can.
00:00:52.640 --> 00:00:56.159
I was at a function at a club and was called to the phone.
00:00:56.320 --> 00:01:01.439
It's all a blur what was said really, but I knew we had to get to the hospital.
00:01:01.679 --> 00:01:03.600
I prayed all the way.
00:01:03.840 --> 00:01:06.879
The message did not say that Harry was dead.
00:01:07.120 --> 00:01:08.560
So there was hope.
00:01:08.799 --> 00:01:09.920
I felt numb.
00:01:10.159 --> 00:01:14.000
Harry's power was driving the car, but there was silence.
00:01:14.400 --> 00:01:16.640
Non-belief is what I felt.
00:01:16.959 --> 00:01:18.400
This cannot be happening.
00:01:18.560 --> 00:01:19.840
This cannot be true.
00:01:20.079 --> 00:01:21.920
Will I wake up soon?
00:01:22.319 --> 00:01:34.400
Reality struck me when I saw Eugen slumped over Harry's body, and I saw my son-in-law fall onto the floor when there was no more hope.
00:01:34.640 --> 00:01:37.599
I felt numb, but mostly helpless.
00:01:37.840 --> 00:01:44.799
My beautiful baby grandson had passed, and his parents were destroyed, and I could do nothing.
00:01:45.439 --> 00:01:46.719
I didn't want this.
00:01:46.879 --> 00:01:48.560
I wanted it to go away.
00:01:48.799 --> 00:01:50.959
I called people on my phone.
00:01:51.120 --> 00:01:52.560
What could they do though?
00:01:52.799 --> 00:01:55.439
Goodness knows what they said or what I said.
00:01:55.519 --> 00:01:56.719
I was just babbling on.
00:01:56.879 --> 00:02:01.599
They may have said something to try and comfort, but I just wanted it all fixed.
00:02:02.560 --> 00:02:04.319
I could not understand.
00:02:04.400 --> 00:02:10.080
I had waved to Harry earlier in the car, leaving my home, and he was smiling.
00:02:10.319 --> 00:02:12.000
That was our happy day out.
00:02:12.240 --> 00:02:14.719
I wanted it all to go back to that day.
00:02:14.960 --> 00:02:16.800
I wanted it to go away.
00:02:18.080 --> 00:02:20.000
Thanks so much for sharing that.
00:02:20.240 --> 00:02:28.479
I think that sometimes people don't realise that you weren't just hearing about a loss, you were watching your daughter's life change instantly.
00:02:28.719 --> 00:02:32.080
And I didn't realise that until I started doing this also.
00:02:32.879 --> 00:02:35.680
What was it like watching me go through that?
00:02:36.400 --> 00:02:40.960
It was heart-wrenching torture because at that time I could not help.
00:02:41.120 --> 00:02:44.080
I could not fix things that I'd always done.
00:02:44.319 --> 00:02:50.639
I felt lost, but I knew at that moment it was going to be my job to try and hold you together.
00:02:50.960 --> 00:02:56.639
Try to hold the family tight to be able to move forward in some sort of manner.
00:02:56.960 --> 00:03:03.439
The hardest part for me was the anger, the whys and the blame that no one could answer.
00:03:03.680 --> 00:03:06.800
I talked for hours feeling it was not heard.
00:03:07.039 --> 00:03:10.319
Maybe it was a comfort, but I did not feel that way.
00:03:10.560 --> 00:03:13.759
I was getting through it in any way I could.
00:03:13.919 --> 00:03:17.680
I think back now, and maybe I should have just understood more.
00:03:18.159 --> 00:03:27.360
But to see you, my daughter, just laying in that dark room in bed day after day, sobbing, not functioning, not communicating.
00:03:27.599 --> 00:03:32.240
And only when you did, it was all an act put on for others.
00:03:32.879 --> 00:03:40.000
I was heartbroken, not for Harry at this time, but for my child and for our family life, which was gone.
00:03:40.240 --> 00:03:42.719
Nothing was normal anymore.
00:03:42.960 --> 00:03:45.599
I prayed at night to save my child.
00:03:45.759 --> 00:03:47.039
I was angry at God.
00:03:47.280 --> 00:03:51.680
He had taken our baby and I was going to lose my daughter.
00:03:52.240 --> 00:03:57.039
Your choices in dealing with grief were dangerous in my eyes, but I understood.
00:03:57.280 --> 00:03:59.520
You were trying to escape the agony.
00:04:00.080 --> 00:04:05.599
And in the daily pain you had every day, understanding wasn't the issue.
00:04:05.840 --> 00:04:10.639
I had the job to rise up, support, and help get you through this.
00:04:10.960 --> 00:04:18.480
All I could do was physical stuff, cleaning, cooking, and holding things together, just being there if needed.
00:04:18.800 --> 00:04:27.360
I felt lost so many times when I left driving home from your house in tears, laying in bed at night, hoping you would be okay.
00:04:27.759 --> 00:04:30.079
One day I stopped at the lake on my way home.
00:04:30.240 --> 00:04:34.079
I called out, God, just help me, I can't do this anymore.
00:04:34.319 --> 00:04:36.480
I always feeled I would lose you.
00:04:36.560 --> 00:04:37.839
I always felt that.
00:04:38.800 --> 00:04:44.720
And because my life was to prop you up and be there for you, my girl and my family.
00:04:45.120 --> 00:04:49.199
Hardest part, Jen, was when you would say, You don't understand.
00:04:49.519 --> 00:04:56.480
Truth was, I did understand I was watching and could not do a damn thing that would change things.
00:04:57.360 --> 00:05:03.839
I do remember saying that, and at that time I didn't think you understood, but now I know you had an extra layer there.
00:05:04.000 --> 00:05:10.000
I felt like I've never understood your side of it, and I'm really thanking you for sharing that now.
00:05:10.800 --> 00:05:13.920
Do you feel like your grief wasn't seen at the time?
00:05:14.240 --> 00:05:18.160
Even to this day, I don't feel I've grieved properly for Harry.
00:05:18.399 --> 00:05:22.560
Now, all these years later, small things do trigger a tear into my eye.
00:05:22.720 --> 00:05:33.839
Reading your podcasts have helped me cope with my grief, and at the same time, has let me remember precious times that we had together with Harry and the closeness that we all shared.
00:05:34.639 --> 00:05:46.639
I know I've always held things in and always been a strong one, but at times because it's become so hard, and then I fold and I go off and have some quiet time to myself.
00:05:46.959 --> 00:05:53.920
I never ever felt I could fall apart as I felt others in my family needed me to be first priority.
00:05:54.160 --> 00:05:59.600
I knew the relationship I had with Harry and it kept all inside of me.
00:05:59.759 --> 00:06:03.680
His part grooved every day, but he kept it to himself.
00:06:04.160 --> 00:06:09.360
Support was given by others, but no one understands unless it's happened to them.
00:06:09.680 --> 00:06:19.519
I know I have a special way of coping, and after I go and reflect for a while, then I can shake myself up and say, go forward, you can do this.
00:06:22.399 --> 00:06:26.079
And you've always encouraged me to do that, and I think that's what kept me going.
00:06:26.160 --> 00:06:30.000
But I think what you went through is just something that we don't talk about enough.
00:06:30.240 --> 00:06:36.800
The people that do grieve differently or they are holding everything together are often hurting just as deeply.
00:06:37.439 --> 00:06:40.879
How did this change your life beyond just the loss itself?
00:06:41.680 --> 00:06:45.600
I see the world as a beautiful place with some very caring people in it.
00:06:45.759 --> 00:06:47.680
But there are some very cruel people.
00:06:47.839 --> 00:06:51.920
Some think it is time you should just move on and get over things.
00:06:52.240 --> 00:07:00.319
But I've been lucky with those around me, but I have watched you lose a lot of your friends, Jen, from a place of no understanding.
00:07:00.560 --> 00:07:07.360
Grief sorts people out, and I've seen you making lasting close ref close friendships through this tragedy.
00:07:07.680 --> 00:07:11.040
I believe in safety in life, and we should all be more careful.
00:07:11.199 --> 00:07:15.120
But also in later years I've come to believe there is a better place.
00:07:15.759 --> 00:07:22.879
And as I age, I do feel closer to God, and I believe our Harry is in that place, and that I will meet him sometime again.
00:07:23.120 --> 00:07:32.879
I am a people person and always like to have fun in life, but Harry's death has changed the carefree, spontaneous person that I used to be, always having fun.
00:07:33.040 --> 00:07:36.720
I've become a more planned and think about it type person.
00:07:37.199 --> 00:07:41.120
And yeah, a lot of my fun did go with that little man.
00:07:42.240 --> 00:07:47.519
Definitely grief just doesn't stay in that one moment and it changes how you move through life.
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Looking back now, what do you think people got right in supporting you?
00:07:52.800 --> 00:07:57.680
My friends were there for me, but I don't feel anyone knows that pain inside.
00:07:57.839 --> 00:08:03.279
I feel we just just get on with things and make it better for them, really.
00:08:03.519 --> 00:08:04.720
Make them feel better.
00:08:04.879 --> 00:08:08.319
I wish people understood there was no time limit in grief.
00:08:08.480 --> 00:08:14.160
I remember one one woman while I was playing lawn bowls, she said, your daughter should get over things.
00:08:14.399 --> 00:08:17.920
Of course she had never experienced the grief we had.
00:08:18.879 --> 00:08:24.079
Yeah, I definitely think that's something so many people struggle with and we don't talk a lot.
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They are still there wanting to help, but not knowing how.
00:08:28.079 --> 00:08:30.560
And how do you carry Harry with you now?
00:08:31.199 --> 00:08:33.200
I carry him with me every day.
00:08:33.360 --> 00:08:40.799
I wear a ring with his name on it, and I wear his initial round my neck, and all my passwords have his name in it.
00:08:41.039 --> 00:08:47.919
I remember him in my car singing, and I always feel he finds his old mama a car park when I ask him.
00:08:48.159 --> 00:08:49.600
We always have a smile.
00:08:49.840 --> 00:08:58.080
I I always asked him to help his mum to cope in my prayers, and I do feel he is around, and we need to believe that.
00:08:58.559 --> 00:09:04.240
Grief has made me a much stronger person, as I've had to be there for others.
00:09:05.679 --> 00:09:15.600
The tearing pain in my being has now passed, and we can all function a bit better, but there will always be that little flutter in my heart when Harry's name comes up.
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He brightened our life.
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He sure did.
00:09:19.759 --> 00:09:25.519
And if there is one thing that you want people to understand about this kind of grief, what would it be?
00:09:26.320 --> 00:09:30.000
Grief is habilitating, but unfortunately we all have to face it.
00:09:30.159 --> 00:09:33.840
It is a heartbreaking journey which tests our inner being.
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I say to you, if grieving, just love yourself and remember your special person with all your heart.
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And remember they will always be with you, and they will be proud of what you are doing and how you are surviving this very painful time.
00:09:53.039 --> 00:10:01.279
I just want to say thank you so much for holding me when I couldn't hold myself, and I know for a fact that I wouldn't be here today if it wasn't for you.
00:10:01.440 --> 00:10:09.919
And I really know and understand that I was difficult during that time and I was an understanding of your grief, and no wonder you are still grieving that way now.
00:10:10.159 --> 00:10:24.000
And I do know grief doesn't just live in one person, it moves through families, through relationships, through the people who love us, and sometimes the people holding everything together are carrying more than we realise.
00:10:24.240 --> 00:10:29.600
And at that time I was just in too much pain to notice yours, and I'm so sorry about that.
00:10:29.919 --> 00:10:34.480
If this episode resonated with you, I'm really glad that you found this space.
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And before you go, I want you to hear this.
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You'll always be enough for me, and you'll never be too much.
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I'll be here with you in the next one.
00:10:43.279 --> 00:10:48.720
For Harry and for anyone learning to live with loss, thank you for being here, truly.
00:10:48.879 --> 00:10:54.799
And just a gentle reminder: if today brought up anything difficult, please reach out for support.
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You can contact Brief Australia on 1-800-642-066 or Lifeline Australia on 13114 or myself on 10431 212 575.
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You don't have to go through this alone.
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And thank you so much for doing this interview with me today, mum.
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I love you very much.
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Now thank you.
00:11:19.759 --> 00:11:20.720
Thank you.
