WEBVTT
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Hey everyone, welcome to Faith Curious.
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So, what makes this conversation about faith different?
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Okay, we're just two guys with no hidden agenda.
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What you see is what you get.
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It is a brand new day.
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Faith Curious Nation, thank you so much for being here.
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I am Larry Horton with uh Jim McColly.
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Oh man, I didn't get a chance to give you the podcast extraordinaire.
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Yeah, I preempted the podcast Extraordinaire.
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And I wasn't planning on doing that, but it felt right.
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Hey, go for it.
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I live in the moment.
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I love that.
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I love that.
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Yeah.
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How you doing, man?
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Good, man.
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How you doing?
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How's uh oh hi oh don't you know?
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Oh, it's it's good, it's good.
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It's uh it's been rainy as a son of a gun here, uh, which is okay because I don't yet have my motorcycle.
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Uh you know, it hasn't been delivered yet.
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I thought it was supposed to arrive last week.
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Uh, it was supposed to arrive last week, and I called them in my panic and said, I don't see my motorcycle.
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And he said, Oh, it's in my walkie, it'll be here next week at a brown this time.
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So it's either today, tomorrow, or the next day.
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And I'm like, uh, I'm Jones and it's a it's it's messed up.
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Uh you know, I'm not, I don't want to jinx it.
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Sounds like you got some kind of like Ferris Bueller thing going on here, right?
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Like, there is there is definitely there is some dude with long hair, no helmet, in a on a back road of Kentucky, just right, you know, and now all he's trying to do is trying to figure out how to reverse the odometer so he can actually return it to you, but he hasn't figured it out.
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Right, I can just see him like doing jumps.
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He's on some kind of back road doing jumps.
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Yeah, yeah.
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Uh so I know you're from Oregon, but still you haven't you haven't lived in rain in quite some time.
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Like coming from the desert, I tell people like when you come and live in the desert, man, like one of the biggest differences, not everything happens.
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Anything on your schedule happens.
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There's no rain out, softball games.
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Everything happens according to the schedule, and now you're in a completely different environment.
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How are you doing with it?
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It is a strange phenomenon to actually have to look at the weather on a daily basis because something might change as opposed to right uh the ease, literally, possibly the easiest job in Arizona is uh the news weather person.
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Uh so yeah, the easiest job in the one of the easiest jobs in the world.
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This is fascinating.
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Yeah, I joke when I look at the weather, this is this is what it is.
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It's 102, 101, 101, 102, 101, 101, 102.
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Like, like that's it.
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Well, unless you get a cold front coming in down to 99, you're getting like 98.
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Yeah, and that doesn't have to like a winter storm, basically.
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Yeah.
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In in light of your uh recent transition to Ohio, um, I thought we'd do a little uh little Ohio QA and uh and see if you've uh see what kind of knowledge you have about your newfound home state.
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Uh you ready for that?
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I I hit me with a buckeye quiz.
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So, first of all, Larry, uh, why is Ohio nicknamed the mother of presidents?
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Oh, did you know Ohio was nicknamed the mother of presidents?
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I think a better question is, yeah, that's the better question.
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Is did I know?
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All right, well, can't do you have a guess?
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Do you want to log a guess or just me tell me just I I'm gonna say that uh several presidents' mothers live in Ohio?
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Um Ohio has produced more US presidents than any state except Virginia.
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Eight.
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Oh wow has produced eight presidents.
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Wow, yeah, wow, impressive.
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Yeah, that's so um I you know, like so it makes perfect sense that I'm here as well.
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Yeah, maybe you're number, maybe you're number nine.
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Like, who who who can really say?
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Who can really say you could not there?
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There's not a way in the world that you could get me to take that job.
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No, no, not a chance.
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What summer delicacy?
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So we're talking about a food, was invented in Ohio, and where did the invention take place?
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Wow, I like that.
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Um, I'm gonna take a stab at the hot dog.
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Well, it was a summer delicacy, that's what gave it away.
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Uh yeah, well, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
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Did I get it?
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Well, yeah, but here it is.
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The hot dog was allegedly, and you're a cop, so I think allegedly fits, allegedly invented in Ohio, and you got German immigrants in Cincinnati and Frankfurt who both claim it.
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So we don't really know, but it, but there's uh there's a claim that the hot dog was invented in Ohio.
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And every Oktoberfest, it gets really ugly.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
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All right.
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Now here's one.
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Here's one I think you probably know because you've visited Ohio for a while.
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What does three-way chili consist of?
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Oh, you've got the uh the spaghetti, correct?
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Right, you've got the actual chili, and there's beans in it.
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That's the thing, okay, right?
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Am I with this?
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Oh so you got your you got your three, four, and five-way chili.
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Oh in in Ohio.
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The three, you're you're like two-thirds of there.
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Spaghetti, meat sauce, shredded cheese.
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That's your three-way chili.
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Okay, okay.
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Meat sauce.
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Now that was my nickname in high school.
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If you want to make it four-way, you add either kidney beans or diced onions.
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Not both.
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Either or that that's your four-way.
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If you want your five-way, you add both.
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Oh, wow.
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Okay, wow.
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Yeah.
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See, this is great.
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This is why this is edutainment.
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I mean, we're not just providing like a major podcast, but we're also providing information.
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All right, and here's here's one more.
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I got one more for you.
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The Ohio is the only, I don't know if it's only as accurate, one of the only states to not have a rectangular flag.
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Ah, do you know what do you know what shape the flag is in?
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It's kind of a weird triangle situation with the with the uh the end is kind of like a serpent's tongue situation.
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Okay, it you know what?
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You're right, it's called a swallow tail pennant shape.
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Oh also known, also known as a burgey.
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Oh, burgee.
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That's a new term.
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I did not know that.
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I'm gonna use that though.
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It it has uh its shape um it replicates some type of fish.
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Like that's what that so there's a a history of the history of fishing um in the state, yeah.
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Yeah, see, I knew this, and this is where sports are so impressive because the reason I knew that is because of the Columbus Blue Jackets in their in their background.
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So yeah, okay.
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All right.
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Now, here's some more knowledge.
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So again, you know, like when you meet your neighbors, you know, you can you can throw this stuff out there.
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Um did on the flag, did you know the triangles represent Ohio's hills and valleys?
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Oh, naturally, yeah, makes sense.
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And the red and white stripes represent its waterways and roads.
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Oh, uh I wonder which one is which.
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See, do do you know what the letter O or the circle in the middle represents?
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The no, I was gonna call it.
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The letter O and a buckeye nut.
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Ah and and it's so because our rival obviously is the Michigan Wolverines, and you put up a Wolverine versus a poisonous nut, and it's just you know, as far as mascots go, it's just really lacking.
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Is is a is a buckeye poisonous?
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I didn't know that.
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I I think they they try to sell it as poison to make it tougher.
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I don't know, otherwise it's just a cashew.
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I mean, I mean, it's yeah, yeah, it's a legume.
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Yeah, it's it's the worst.
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Yeah, good.
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See, now I I feel uh more more comfortable that as you're roaming the streets of the neighborhood, you know, meeting people.
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Um, you know, you got you got some material, you got some material, and so they can go inside and be like, what the what is up with that Larry guy?
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And his you know, strangely, nobody calls me back.
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I don't know what's going on with that.
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Right, right, right, right.
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They invited us over for three-way chili.
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What yeah, what is that?
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I I gotta be like, they're gonna be like, Who what?
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Yeah, that's funny.
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I did see a skyline chili restaurant.
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Ah, okay.
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All right, uh, but you haven't gone.
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Uh, not yet.
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Yeah, chili guy, yeah.
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I don't know if I'm there.
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I don't know.
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I'm not a chili guy either, really.
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Yeah, yeah.
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Hit the Bob Evans, though.
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Hit that pretty hard.
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But I'll tell you what, the spaghetti and meat sauce, like so.
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Now you're really not talking about chili.
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I mean, you're talking about a bowl of spaghetti.
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This is this is the crux right here.
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I mean, yeah.
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And you know what I'd do?
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You know what I would do?
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A hundred percent.
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I'd be like, I'm gonna take the three-way chili, no cheese.
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Just give me a bowl of spaghetti and meat sauce.
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Just really throw a curveball at him.
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Because we're contrarians.
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I mean, this is the way we approach life.
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I don't know.
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I can't order off a menu forgotten.
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I see what you're trying to push on me, and I'm gonna go this direction.
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Exactly.
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I don't I fight you.
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I fight you.
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So I am uh I'm sitting here.
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Thank you for that.
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Thank you for indulging uh indulging me in that.
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No, that was great, great research, too, by the way.
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Uh I'm sitting here now.
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Um, and I'm like, all right, how do we because we're we're really good at our segues into the show?
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Oh, yeah.
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How do we go from three-way chili or a poisonous nut to prayer?
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How how how do does that even work?
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So the train, yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna take a stab at this because I've been kind of working it out in my brain as we've been talking.
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Um and and you know, you get out there and you deal with the Wolverine is pretty pretty straightforward, right?
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Yeah, I don't want to be attacked by this uh very vicious rodent, but uh you know, you're out in the forest and you're foraging and you come across a poisonous nut that happens to be the state nut of uh Ohio, uh, and and you ingest it, not realizing that it's actually toxic.
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You know, for me, I would ask you to say a prayer for me and to say, you know, hey, listen, I hope that I don't get injured horribly.
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Speaking of prayer, okay, and then I would go on.
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Yeah, so it was horrible.
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It really was like an island.
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Uh it was like a it was like a boat adrift.
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It was really not good.
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You did think of it.
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Well, and if that happens, man, you better have that prayer in your back pocket too.
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Like, I like like if it happens to me and I'm eating the poisonous nut, I I should have the prayer in the back pocket.
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Uh, there's also something there with like there should be some kind of prayer, like, dear Lord, help me to never forage.
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Like, why do I want to forage?
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Right.
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Well, I think that's an opportunity, and I think it's been missed uh in the past.
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So I'm gonna go ahead and open us up with a prayer right now.
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Um, dear God, our Lord and Savior.
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Um when when the the trade deadline comes, please have the Arizona Diamondbacks be buyers and not sellers.
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Uh, and uh please just help us win the the the division title and uh please help that the the the Dodgers just come up with a collective team digestive worm or something.
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Uh and uh in in your name we pray, amen.
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Because that's really uh that's a legitimate prayer right there.
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No, I I um do you mind if I critique your prayer?
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Yeah, please.
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No, I don't mind at all.
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Yeah, why don't you ask for the World Series title?
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Like, why division title?
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I don't want to be selfish.
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Um it's a big God, Larry.
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It's a big, big God.
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And and we we joke, we we we laugh, but at the end of the day, I mean I think people actually look at prayer like that.
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And and there's always that that whole thing about uh, you know, you're praying for your team to win, and God has a lot more, you know, bigger things to bigger fish to fry than than uh so obviously uh our our topic today is prayer, and uh this is a big one.
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This is a big one because uh this one has a lot of really weird uh association to it, or or uh, you know, just kind of misnomers and things like that.
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Uh so I you know, I'm I'm curious to what your experience with prayer has been so far, and and and uh just let's kind of just kind of jump right in right there.
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Well, um yeah, thank you.
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Uh and listeners, thank you for indulging us um in the sh the shenanigans of Ohio and and and whatever, what else so the other things that uh that jump into our minds and we can't get rid of until we say them.
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Um but uh okay, so prayer.
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You know, we're we're on this journey of uh of just sharing right our faith with people that maybe have been hurt by faith or confused or doubt or don't know how to pursue.
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And you know, we're just we're just here to uh to to to help and share our experience in in the hope that that um that helps someone um you know take the next step.
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And it's about relationship, right?
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I mean, everything we're talking about is our relationship with Jesus, and prayer is a central, man, a central piece of it.
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Last week we talked about the Bible.
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This week we're going to prayer.
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So um I'm gonna I want to share like my prayer.
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It's a prayer experience in real life that's been going on with me.
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All right.
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So I I've been praying for something that and actually this same prayer.
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Um I won't say every morning, right?
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But I I try I try to pray every morning.
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The mornings that I pray, the same prayer for somewhere between five and ten years.
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Okay.
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Wow.
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Um that's amazing.
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I'm not gonna tell you who it's for, but I'll tell you it's someone I love more than just about anything in this world.
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Um, and what I'm praying for is something fairly simple, I guess you could say.
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Something good.
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Something this person wants for themselves.
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And it just hasn't happened yet, right?
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Which is why I've been praying for it for you know, five to ten years.
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So every time I bring it to God, um I you know, if I'm being real, like I feel hope.
00:14:40.960 --> 00:14:42.320
Like I keep praying it.
00:14:43.120 --> 00:14:51.840
Not because I'm angry that it hasn't happened or I don't, you know, I think if I just keep praying it, then it's no, I I feel hope, right?
00:14:51.919 --> 00:14:54.240
And and and saying the prayer makes me feel good.
00:14:54.799 --> 00:15:01.200
Um I don't know how God's gonna answer it, but I I believe he will.
00:15:01.600 --> 00:15:10.320
And that's like one of the tough things about prayer is we have our idea of things that should happen, and then we have you know, we have God's will, right?
00:15:10.960 --> 00:15:15.919
But that really isn't the hard part, like not knowing, because I know he will answer it.
00:15:16.799 --> 00:15:28.080
The hard part is kind of the the quiet voice in me um that shows up sometimes and says something like, Ah, this is my fault, right?
00:15:28.320 --> 00:15:38.080
Um what if my this prayer isn't being answered because of the things I did, bad choices, old behavior, you know.
00:15:38.399 --> 00:15:40.960
Um and and like hear me.
00:15:41.679 --> 00:15:44.879
I don't think I don't believe God punishes me, right?
00:15:45.039 --> 00:15:46.399
I don't believe that at all.
00:15:46.559 --> 00:15:47.600
That's not what I'm thinking.
00:15:48.159 --> 00:15:57.120
But I do believe in consequences, and consequences come in all shapes and sizes, and they don't just land on me, you know, they can land on people close to me.
00:15:57.519 --> 00:16:02.799
So I'm not saying it's my fault, but if I'm being real, I struggle with that, right?
00:16:03.360 --> 00:16:06.879
Because I somewhere inside of me, I'm like, why isn't it being answered?
00:16:08.080 --> 00:16:16.480
Um what I so what I know is you know, this thing I want for this person, it's just it's hard to see them in pain, right?
00:16:16.639 --> 00:16:17.840
Because it's not happening.
00:16:18.480 --> 00:16:33.279
So maybe for this episode, it's actually a good place to start talking about prayer, not with a success story, not with some testimony about the time God came through in a really big way, but with the years of waiting, you know, a little hope, a lot of surrender.
00:16:33.840 --> 00:16:37.519
And I've if I'm being honest, you know, some guilt I'm still working through.
00:16:38.159 --> 00:16:42.399
And yet I I couldn't imagine my life without prayer.
00:16:42.639 --> 00:16:45.120
Um, so that's where I am.
00:16:45.360 --> 00:16:50.000
And if that resonates with you, then uh I hope you stick around for the rest of the show.
00:16:50.480 --> 00:16:58.559
So I have some curiosity about what you said because and I'm and I'm also trying to put myself in the listener's frame as well.
00:17:00.080 --> 00:17:08.880
You you have a prayer that has gone unanswered, which is like culturally and and along our norms and mores, just this coup.
00:17:09.920 --> 00:17:13.359
Yet you said that you have hope.
00:17:14.079 --> 00:17:18.000
So that to me is a little paradoxical.
00:17:20.160 --> 00:17:27.920
You you haven't gotten the the prayer answer or even a result necessarily, yet you still have hope.
00:17:28.240 --> 00:17:29.839
So talk to me a little bit about that.
00:17:31.839 --> 00:17:38.880
Um, I think it's it's uh it's what we think of when we think of prayer.
00:17:39.279 --> 00:17:40.400
Like what do we expect?
00:17:40.880 --> 00:17:41.200
Okay.
00:17:41.759 --> 00:17:54.960
And I think as humans, especially if we're new believers, and we're figuring all this thing out, but even seasoned believers, we are we're human, so we have the tendency to think I know what's best for me.
00:17:55.680 --> 00:17:58.799
I could get angry, like, okay, then why isn't it being answered?
00:17:59.039 --> 00:18:00.160
But I don't think in those terms.
00:18:00.319 --> 00:18:07.279
I think in terms of, yeah, I'm human, I have needs, I have wants, I have, you know, things that I think should happen.
00:18:07.440 --> 00:18:08.720
And so I pray for them.
00:18:09.279 --> 00:18:13.440
But I also know uh maybe I'm wrong.
00:18:13.759 --> 00:18:17.279
You know, maybe God has a different plan, a better plan.
00:18:17.440 --> 00:18:24.000
Um, I mean, his plan is always good, it's always loving, it's always in my best interest.
00:18:24.400 --> 00:18:29.759
Um but I don't think in those big godly ways, right?
00:18:29.920 --> 00:18:33.599
I think in the human ways, and I want this thing to happen, so I'm gonna pray for it.
00:18:34.000 --> 00:18:37.279
And it's good, and so why isn't it happening?
00:18:38.079 --> 00:18:40.559
So I don't hear any anger, right?
00:18:41.119 --> 00:18:51.200
Yeah, which is strange because I think that that's a lot of what folks have experienced when they don't get the the answer to their prayer.
00:18:52.079 --> 00:18:55.440
But do you think anger is okay in prayer?
00:18:56.000 --> 00:19:18.160
Yes, but I think you know, to you can have a response that says, Yes, I'm angry that this prayer hasn't been answered, but I think it also needs to it cannot go without self-reflection to cut to be hand in hand with that anger to find out okay, why am I angry that this did not get answered?
00:19:18.400 --> 00:19:22.880
Because it so let me ask you this the the other thing I don't hear is doubt.
00:19:23.279 --> 00:19:31.119
Yeah, um, although there you did talk a little bit about, you know, maybe it's this, or maybe it's me, or maybe it's consequences, or what have you.
00:19:31.440 --> 00:19:32.720
Is that doubt?
00:19:34.640 --> 00:19:38.160
Um, well, it depends on what you mean by doubt.
00:19:38.559 --> 00:19:46.880
Is it is it doubt that um do I have doubt that this prayer is going to be answered in the way I want it to be?
00:19:47.519 --> 00:19:48.400
A hundred percent.
00:19:49.279 --> 00:19:49.680
Right?
00:19:50.160 --> 00:20:05.839
Um but I don't have doubt that it's going to be answered in the right way, you know, the way that the way that God needs, you know, the way that the way that God needs things to happen, right?
00:20:06.240 --> 00:20:17.839
And and in many, you know, in many, many ways, I'm not big enough uh to understand his ways most of the time.
00:20:18.799 --> 00:20:25.039
This I think about Evan Almighty, that movie with uh I think it's Jim Carrey.
00:20:25.519 --> 00:20:26.160
Is that the one?
00:20:26.240 --> 00:20:27.599
Is it is Evan Almighty?
00:20:27.839 --> 00:20:30.319
I was gonna say Steve Carrell, but I could be totally wrong.
00:20:30.480 --> 00:20:30.799
You know what?
00:20:30.960 --> 00:20:32.160
There's there's there's multiple ones.
00:20:32.400 --> 00:20:35.839
The one I'm thinking of was with Jim Carrey and Bruce Almighty.
00:20:35.920 --> 00:20:38.480
That's the one it's not Chris Rock, it's not Chris Rock.
00:20:38.559 --> 00:21:03.519
I know, yeah, but it there's a section in there where Bruce Almighty and he's answering all the prayers, and and it just leads into this massive anarchy because all the prayers are answered, uh in in the affirmation, and I think that is this is a massive crux, and I'm gonna make this up, and I but I don't think I'm far off.
00:21:04.000 --> 00:21:11.599
Folks can give up on the entire thing uh with the prayer thing, they can say, you know what?
00:21:12.319 --> 00:21:23.440
I get it, I get the Bible's legit, I get that this guy walked the earth, I get that he he's benevolently sacrificing himself for me, but I am not getting my prayer answered, so I'm out.
00:21:24.880 --> 00:21:42.079
And because who hasn't experienced a loss, some really significant grieving, and then turn to prayer in that moment and then just been not fulfilled, right?
00:21:42.640 --> 00:21:50.640
The unanswered prayer in that situation is enough to turn some people to the point where they'll just reject and turn their back on this entire thing, right?
00:21:51.039 --> 00:21:59.759
And I think that's where we really gotta take a look at this because, like you're talking about, I I and I love just.
00:22:00.240 --> 00:22:11.599
The zen attitude that you're bringing to that unanswered prayer, which and and first of all, let me also just say thank you for bringing that aspect to it as opposed to what you talked about in regards to some kind of win.
00:22:11.839 --> 00:22:13.599
We're starting kind of with a loss.
00:22:13.839 --> 00:22:14.079
Yeah.
00:22:15.599 --> 00:22:18.960
Well, and um so a couple things.
00:22:19.119 --> 00:22:28.559
Uh for I I had a this person knows that I'm praying this prayer, right?
00:22:28.640 --> 00:22:30.799
I mean, we've we've talked about it.
00:22:31.119 --> 00:22:34.400
Um, I've actually asked this person at some point, what would you like me to pray for?
00:22:34.559 --> 00:22:39.599
And this is, you know, um, and I got things back, but this is one of them.
00:22:39.839 --> 00:22:57.440
Um and at one point um they communicated to me that they were angry and that they had that they were um expressing that anger to God, right?
00:22:57.519 --> 00:23:01.759
So I'm I'm following up on the the the anger point, right?
00:23:02.160 --> 00:23:13.279
And I think there was uh I think there was some uh um guilt, like you know, I got angry and maybe I shouldn't have.
00:23:13.359 --> 00:23:17.119
And I I would say no, like God wants authenticity.
00:23:17.279 --> 00:23:21.200
If you're angry, he doesn't want you to fake it, he wants you to be angry, you know.
00:23:21.359 --> 00:23:27.200
If that if it's rage, like what like he wants us to be authentic, right?
00:23:27.519 --> 00:23:40.160
He wants, you know, um, and and and I think like that's really important to understand that there is, you know, Jesus in the Bible talks about prayer and how to pray and everything, and like it's like don't be a hypocrite, right?
00:23:40.240 --> 00:23:51.119
Like, don't try to use fancy words and you know say the right things and you know, um, and and and pray in a way that other people see you, so they're like, oh, look at that person, look at them praying, right?
00:23:51.279 --> 00:24:00.559
Right now, no, man, he like it's it's about relationship, it's between me and God, and whatever I'm experiencing, I should communicate.
00:24:00.960 --> 00:24:04.319
So the question it sounds like is why?
00:24:05.599 --> 00:24:16.799
And I think unless you have really have a hold on that, then it's it unless you ask yourself, why do I want to pray?
00:24:17.680 --> 00:24:21.759
Then it's it's almost like you're putting the cart before the horse.
00:24:22.240 --> 00:24:23.759
And here's my argument to that.
00:24:23.920 --> 00:24:24.400
What do you mean?
00:24:24.640 --> 00:24:30.000
What do you mean you put what I think a lot of folks confuse prayer with control?
00:24:31.200 --> 00:24:37.039
And I think there's there's a lot of folks out there who think to themselves, okay, I want this.
00:24:37.759 --> 00:24:43.519
And I've I've read somewhere that if you ask for it, God will give it to you.
00:24:43.839 --> 00:24:44.400
True.
00:24:44.480 --> 00:24:45.279
Yeah, right.
00:24:45.440 --> 00:24:48.240
And and again, we talked about this in the last episode.
00:24:48.319 --> 00:24:53.519
You take that out of context, and it's and it seems like very uh empowering and entitling, right?
00:24:53.680 --> 00:24:54.319
Right.
00:24:54.960 --> 00:24:57.680
In the ask, why am I praying?
00:24:57.839 --> 00:25:01.920
If I'm praying so that I can control God, it ain't gonna work.
00:25:02.000 --> 00:25:04.799
And that's not a reason to pray, and that's not prayer, right?
00:25:04.880 --> 00:25:05.279
Right.
00:25:05.440 --> 00:25:10.400
And I think that's that's what we really, I mean, this so how do you answer that?
00:25:10.559 --> 00:25:11.680
Why do you pray?
00:25:12.000 --> 00:25:27.839
The reason I pray is because there's the same reason that I want my daughter to talk to me, or I want my son to talk to me, and that is because I want to know you, I want to know what my daughter needs, and if it's in my daughter's best interest, me as the parent, knowing that.
00:25:28.079 --> 00:25:38.079
All right, because I I I mean, it's as my job as a parent is not to just say yes and have all the sugar you want and please jump off of this very high thing at the risk of breaking your leg.
00:25:38.160 --> 00:25:38.799
No, no, no.
00:25:38.880 --> 00:25:40.640
I don't, I don't consent, right?
00:25:41.359 --> 00:25:47.519
I will in some cases, if it is good for you, but there's a lot of no happening.
00:25:47.759 --> 00:25:54.319
The the same reason that I want my daughter to talk to me, I think is the same reason that uh I uh why do I want to pray?
00:25:54.640 --> 00:25:56.559
Because I want to engage with my higher power.
00:25:56.640 --> 00:26:12.799
I want to engage with God in a relationship, not so that I can get what I want and control God, which is just impossible, anyways, but so that I can have that experience and that engagement and that relationship back and forth.
00:26:14.640 --> 00:26:24.000
When a when a prayer actually does get answered, when it all works, I mean, that is some punch you in the face, like knock you down stuff.
00:26:24.480 --> 00:26:25.599
It is impressive.
00:26:25.839 --> 00:26:27.200
It is impressive.
00:26:28.400 --> 00:26:37.920
When it when it happens and you see it happen not on your time, that also is a uh a mind job.
00:26:38.480 --> 00:26:43.920
Because I've had prayers that I prayed and like literally two years later they came around.
00:26:44.160 --> 00:26:51.599
And then at the at the actual answer, I saw the path, and I was like, okay, I get that there's a much bigger plan here.
00:26:51.839 --> 00:26:57.599
I want to make sure that we don't gloss over something because you use the analogy of you and your daughter, right?
00:26:58.079 --> 00:27:05.440
Yeah, and and and you know, I'll ask the rhetorical question like, do you give your daughter everything she asks for?
00:27:05.519 --> 00:27:06.480
Of course not, right?
00:27:06.640 --> 00:27:07.519
Of course not.
00:27:07.839 --> 00:27:21.519
But what I want to hone in on is and not and not take for granted that the listener isn't a is aware of this, but the relationship between you and your daughter, me and my daughter, me and my father, my dad, right?
00:27:22.240 --> 00:27:25.519
Is the same relationship between God and I.
00:27:26.079 --> 00:27:27.279
God's my father.
00:27:27.759 --> 00:27:30.559
Okay, I am my daughter's father.
00:27:31.200 --> 00:27:36.160
So do I want her just to stop communicating with me?
00:27:36.480 --> 00:27:38.160
Of course not, right?
00:27:38.480 --> 00:27:41.039
Um, am I gonna give her everything she asked for?
00:27:41.599 --> 00:27:44.640
Of course not, because some things aren't best for her, right?
00:27:44.880 --> 00:27:52.000
Um but that you know, the other thing you said was the the communicating.
00:27:52.160 --> 00:27:55.599
So so it's about having a relationship, right?
00:27:55.759 --> 00:28:03.839
Which means I'm sharing, I'm talking, I'm expressing myself from where I'm at, right?
00:28:04.160 --> 00:28:05.839
Good, bad, or indifferent.
00:28:06.160 --> 00:28:14.079
I'm expressing myself, and you're getting to know me because of how I'm showing up, and then I also have to stop and listen.
00:28:16.319 --> 00:28:18.079
Bring that in bold, my friend.
00:28:18.480 --> 00:28:19.759
That's the communication, right?
00:28:19.839 --> 00:28:20.799
Like it's a two-way street.
00:28:21.039 --> 00:28:36.000
It is absolutely a two-to-way street, and God is going to talk to me, and again, I'm not saying it's Jim hit the brakes hard, you know, like you are going to get it.
00:28:36.079 --> 00:28:44.240
And no, but God talks to me, like my experiences in there's feelings, right?
00:28:44.400 --> 00:28:46.559
I don't always recognize it when it's happening.
00:28:46.640 --> 00:28:48.640
Sometimes I recognize it after the fact.
00:28:48.799 --> 00:28:55.599
Um but if I'm not listening, if I'm not open to that, then like he can talk all he wants.
00:28:56.160 --> 00:29:01.039
It's not going to land because I'm I have to be an active participant.
00:29:01.200 --> 00:29:06.720
So all that to say, like you know, expressing myself and then listening, it's about relationship.
00:29:06.799 --> 00:29:11.039
The same relationship that you want with your daughter, we want with God.
00:29:11.200 --> 00:29:13.119
And the same things have to happen.
00:29:13.359 --> 00:29:17.839
And there's a maturity and a growth aspect, and I think is huge, right?
00:29:18.640 --> 00:29:37.680
Because the the needs um as an infant, the needs as a as a as a uh you know, elementary school kid, the needs as a teenager, the needs as an adult, the as the maturity happens, the needs and the understanding and and that relationship and that exchange change.
00:29:38.079 --> 00:29:52.720
And I absolutely grow through my spiritual journey and my understanding of that relationship and my roles and and and the roles and the surrender that that I need to have in this back and forth.
00:29:53.200 --> 00:29:55.519
That's a growth that I'm going to experience.
00:29:55.680 --> 00:29:59.359
And I'm gonna be having bad days in that process.
00:29:59.519 --> 00:30:03.920
I'm gonna be having unanswered prayers in that process that really make me angry.
00:30:04.079 --> 00:30:08.240
I'm gonna have I'm gonna have some lows and I'm gonna have some highs, right?
00:30:08.319 --> 00:30:13.680
But I'm it's gonna be a thing to where it's not just me getting everything I want.
00:30:14.079 --> 00:30:24.400
And that understanding and that maturity level is is is part of the growth, and it's part of that um, you know, that back and forth, and that you know, that's the evolution of this prayer.
00:30:24.559 --> 00:30:27.920
And I think a lot of folks aren't interested in the growth.
00:30:28.160 --> 00:30:40.319
I think a lot of folks they they just want they they want the instantaneous pleasure drop, bam, you know, I I I ask and I get, and that's just not the way this works, man.
00:30:40.480 --> 00:30:49.839
That's not the way this works, and well, and it and it doesn't work that way because you know the relationship isn't transactional, right?
00:30:50.079 --> 00:30:50.480
Amen.
00:30:50.720 --> 00:31:00.160
Oh, and the relationship, the relationship, um like any relationship, you have to work at it, right?
00:31:00.319 --> 00:31:03.680
Now, not to say I have to work at it to make God love me.
00:31:03.759 --> 00:31:04.319
That's not true.
00:31:04.480 --> 00:31:05.839
Like God loves me, right?
00:31:06.240 --> 00:31:11.279
But still, the more time I spend with Him, you know, that's why we're talking about reading the Bible.
00:31:11.359 --> 00:31:17.359
There's more the more time I'm in the Bible, I'm learning about God, I'm building a relationship.
00:31:17.519 --> 00:31:21.599
The more I pray, and I don't, you know, I try to pray every day.
00:31:21.839 --> 00:31:30.960
I try to pray, you know, um, about things, you know, that are going on in other people's lives or experiencing some kind of loss or pain or whatever.
00:31:31.200 --> 00:31:38.319
I try to pray for that stuff, but if I'm being honest, I don't, I don't always remember, I'm not always in the right frame of mind.
00:31:38.480 --> 00:31:39.839
Like I'm human, right?
00:31:40.160 --> 00:31:54.960
Um, but then there are times when I'm kind of snapped back into reality and I ask myself, hey man, like if you really believe in prayer, then you you should pray more often, right?
00:31:55.200 --> 00:32:02.400
And you should spend more time, not to get what I want, but just to further the relationship.
00:32:03.119 --> 00:32:08.480
How would you compare you and your growth in that practice?
00:32:08.640 --> 00:32:16.559
All right, which some would call meditation, compared to the person that you were before who didn't do that.
00:32:17.279 --> 00:32:21.440
Oh, I um I I mean vastly different, better, right?
00:32:21.599 --> 00:32:34.559
Um I'm better um because uh, you know, we we together read a book, um, something about the world in order.
00:32:34.720 --> 00:32:36.640
I know you know what book I'm referring to.
00:32:36.799 --> 00:32:39.519
Um uh Ordering Your World.
00:32:39.759 --> 00:32:41.680
Oh, yes, yes, ordering your world.
00:32:41.759 --> 00:32:42.400
Okay, I remember that.
00:32:42.559 --> 00:32:44.079
And it's about priorities.
00:32:44.319 --> 00:32:44.640
Okay.
00:32:45.279 --> 00:32:54.319
And you go through this exercise and it sounds cumbersome, but it's really not like I think you take a day or two days or something like that, and you know, you just jot down where you're spending your time.
00:32:54.480 --> 00:32:55.839
It's not how right.
00:32:56.480 --> 00:33:04.400
And then you align that with what you say your priorities are, and either you're full of shitty or not, right?
00:33:04.480 --> 00:33:06.079
Like right, legit.
00:33:06.559 --> 00:33:19.279
Yeah, like I can tell you, I can tell you that a priority is to have a relationship with God, but if I'm not reading the Bible, if I'm not stopping and praying, um no, it's not like it's just not.
00:33:19.599 --> 00:33:27.039
So I I and I say all that to say in the back of my mind, like, so that's always there, right?
00:33:27.599 --> 00:33:28.799
What's your priority?
00:33:28.880 --> 00:33:36.160
You know, if I tell some, if someone shares something with me, they're going through, you know, um, and they ask for prayer, right?
00:33:37.119 --> 00:33:43.359
What I will always try to do is, yes, I'll pray is is to pray for them.
00:33:43.440 --> 00:33:56.400
And usually I'll do it right there, either with them or I'll find someplace quiet and just take 30 seconds and I will say a prayer, I will honor that promise I just made to that person, right?
00:33:56.559 --> 00:34:09.440
Now, the old Jim, years ago, Jim, would have had every intention of saying that prayer, but you know, it was 50-50 at best, whether or not it was gonna happen.
00:34:09.519 --> 00:34:11.360
Um, and I got to a point where I didn't feel good about that.
00:34:11.440 --> 00:34:12.320
I'm like, what am I doing?
00:34:12.400 --> 00:34:16.320
Like, again, do I believe that this prayer is important or don't I?
00:34:16.480 --> 00:34:18.000
And where's my priorities?
00:34:18.320 --> 00:34:31.280
And okay, I know inside if I'm not if I'm not um doing the things I need to do to hit my priorities, and it doesn't feel good, and that and and you know, that has to change.
00:34:32.320 --> 00:34:36.960
I I think another question that comes around a lot is does it work?
00:34:37.360 --> 00:34:49.599
Right, and that kind of feeds into some of the other stuff that we've been talking about, and and to that question, my story is uh uh early recovery, which was dark.
00:34:49.760 --> 00:34:56.159
I mean, it was like I remember uh just entering the program.
00:34:56.880 --> 00:34:59.519
I mean, rock bottom.
00:34:59.679 --> 00:35:01.199
Life, life is not good.
00:35:01.360 --> 00:35:03.440
Life is not, I'm barely holding on, right?
00:35:03.679 --> 00:35:07.440
I mean, nobody knew it on the outside, but on the inside, I mean, I was a wreck.
00:35:07.599 --> 00:35:18.800
Yeah, and and I'm not buying this whole spiritual thing because I I came from this very punitive religious background, and I'm thinking to myself, you know, there's no benevolent God, he's he's just this is what I deserve.
00:35:18.960 --> 00:35:20.800
That was the that was the narrative in my head.
00:35:20.880 --> 00:35:23.920
It was like I this is all a result of my own doing.
00:35:24.800 --> 00:35:30.239
And I remember, you know, uh, so the serenity prayer is obviously very popular.
00:35:30.559 --> 00:35:37.119
God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference.
00:35:37.760 --> 00:35:40.800
And it's so simple, right?
00:35:40.880 --> 00:35:44.079
It's such a simple thing with very profound at the end of the day.
00:35:44.320 --> 00:35:54.000
But the the other thing that is very powerful about that is I I mean, that I would go minute to minute repeating that that mantra over and over again to the tune of when I was at the lowest.
00:35:54.159 --> 00:35:58.880
I mean, that was probably um one of the few things that got me through.
00:35:59.119 --> 00:36:10.960
And then what would happen is you'd get you you'd get your head above water, and you'd you'd cruise for a little bit, maybe it'd be a week, and then you'd hit something, and then you'd be right back into this thing.
00:36:11.039 --> 00:36:16.000
And then and it was that constant back and forth, and I'm asking for help.
00:36:16.239 --> 00:36:20.239
I am on a sinking ship, I am like life preserver, please.
00:36:20.320 --> 00:36:21.840
I need this right now.
00:36:22.079 --> 00:36:25.280
Not a lot of patience, not a lot of surrender happening right there.
00:36:26.400 --> 00:36:30.800
But funny, and so does it work, man.
00:36:32.000 --> 00:36:34.400
100% it does work, right?
00:36:35.039 --> 00:36:50.639
And eventually it it was that engagement with God where I was growing into the person I wanted to be, and holy cow, that person didn't act like a coping mechanism.
00:36:50.800 --> 00:37:00.960
That person actually gave up some control and actually you know surrendered and and and took it in.
00:37:01.199 --> 00:37:04.320
And man, let me tell you, so does it work a hundred percent?
00:37:04.719 --> 00:37:07.840
Does it work when I want it to on my time frame?
00:37:08.480 --> 00:37:15.760
Well, almost never when when and how, right, but does it work when and how you want it to?
00:37:16.239 --> 00:37:18.000
Not necessarily, right?
00:37:18.239 --> 00:37:22.639
Okay, and going back going back to we don't always know what's best for us, right?
00:37:23.119 --> 00:37:26.320
Right, yeah, and it and that's that'll piss you off.
00:37:27.039 --> 00:38:01.920
Well, and but some people might hear that too and be like, yeah, bullshit, like you know, especially in this culture, like you know, um, but and and and not that like you know, not that we're all we're all smart and we're all loving and we're all capable, but that doesn't mean we have all the answers, and I know that you know, everything that is best for me, I can be wrong, and and all I have to do is look back and point to you all the times that I've been wrong when I thought I knew a hundred percent that I was right, you know.
00:38:02.079 --> 00:38:04.559
You said, Does it work absolutely?
00:38:05.199 --> 00:38:08.000
But also ask yourself like what's your expectation?
00:38:08.159 --> 00:38:15.519
What does work if if now you and I both said we pray because of the relationship?
00:38:15.679 --> 00:38:19.519
Now I I pray because there's things that I ask for, right?
00:38:19.840 --> 00:38:23.360
But the bigger picture is I'm praying to further the relationship.
00:38:23.599 --> 00:38:24.960
So does it work?
00:38:25.280 --> 00:38:27.119
Does it further my relationship?
00:38:27.599 --> 00:38:30.639
Like, forget about like, do I get what I'm asking for?
00:38:30.800 --> 00:38:32.400
Am I asking for it?
00:38:32.960 --> 00:38:42.320
My relationship with Jesus is more full, it's closer because of a bunch of things, but because of prayer for sure.
00:38:43.920 --> 00:38:46.400
You you you get to ask for things.
00:38:46.639 --> 00:38:48.159
We're not saying that you don't.
00:38:48.719 --> 00:38:49.760
That is not what we're saying.
00:38:49.920 --> 00:38:50.320
100%.
00:38:50.800 --> 00:39:01.360
You but in that ask, you you know, and and in and in the repeated ask, and the asks that seem to be righteous to us, as I'm as I'm kind of like hearkening back to your example.
00:39:02.000 --> 00:39:05.039
But we we continue to ask, and that's okay.
00:39:05.280 --> 00:39:07.199
There's there's no wrong answer there.
00:39:07.360 --> 00:39:09.360
It's okay to ask, yeah.
00:39:09.519 --> 00:39:12.400
And I think that's important for our listeners to hear.
00:39:12.719 --> 00:39:14.000
Absolutely, absolutely.
00:39:14.159 --> 00:39:20.480
You know, you uh and you mentioned the serenity prayer, and early on in your recovery, you said it over and over and over and over again.
00:39:20.639 --> 00:39:22.639
Um, you know, which which is so cool.
00:39:22.719 --> 00:39:24.320
You know, I have a recovery background as well.
00:39:24.400 --> 00:39:33.360
And the serenity to this day, when I pray in the morning, um, I usually start with the our father and the serenity prayer.
00:39:33.519 --> 00:39:33.840
Okay.
00:39:34.159 --> 00:39:38.079
Now I have a little different thing I do with the serenity prayer, right?
00:39:38.239 --> 00:39:42.719
But it's interesting that we both have a thing like you, yours was repeated.
00:39:42.960 --> 00:39:50.719
Mine was I slowed it down, you know, and I said, God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change.
00:39:51.199 --> 00:39:54.079
And those things are everyone else.
00:39:54.559 --> 00:39:59.199
Like everyone every control else.
00:39:59.440 --> 00:40:01.360
I can I do not control.
00:40:02.239 --> 00:40:09.920
And the courage to change the things I can, and then I stop and I say, me, like right here, right now.
00:40:10.000 --> 00:40:12.960
Yeah, like that's all I can change.
00:40:13.760 --> 00:40:30.639
And then and the wisdom to know the difference, like you know, it's and I just stop and think about like those words, because if I don't know the difference between what I can control and what I can't control, none of it means anything.
00:40:31.280 --> 00:40:37.519
So yeah, so and so you man, give me the wisdom, give me, give me the wisdom, yeah.
00:40:37.840 --> 00:40:44.880
To see myself truly and fully and in the grand scheme that I'm not something, I am part of something.
00:40:45.199 --> 00:40:45.519
Amen.
00:40:46.000 --> 00:40:46.639
Yeah.
00:40:47.199 --> 00:40:59.920
Last one of the last things I'll ask is like you know, uh obviously you've been praying the same thing for a while in that particular vein, but is there other are there other things that you typically pray for?
00:41:00.880 --> 00:41:06.400
Yeah, so I mean, that's something I I prayed, I've been praying for for a while.
00:41:06.639 --> 00:41:18.480
Um, I pray there's someone else who I love, you know, more than just about anyone else in this world, a few other people, um, but who I pray a specific prayer for every day.
00:41:18.559 --> 00:41:19.760
And I have been.
00:41:20.079 --> 00:41:33.599
Um, and and that's one where if I stop and I look back and I and I realize what I've been praying for all these years, like it it has happened, it is happening.
00:41:33.840 --> 00:41:36.079
Um, you know, that's a that's a win.
00:41:36.320 --> 00:41:46.000
I pray for yeah, I pray for, you know, my my wife, um, you know, and things that she has she shares with me about what she's going through.
00:41:46.159 --> 00:41:47.599
I pray for our marriage.
00:41:47.760 --> 00:41:58.000
I pray for, you know, I pray for you and the family um, you know, that has moved away and is experiencing new things, other people we know who have moved to other states.
00:41:58.239 --> 00:42:04.559
Um, I pray for people in our orbit that I know are going through difficult times.
00:42:04.719 --> 00:42:19.519
And um, you know, so so and I and I I typically, you know, I I have I don't know, but I'll just say like 10 different groups of people or whatever that I will pray for.
00:42:19.599 --> 00:42:30.559
I don't pray for all of them, but I typically kind of go through those and um and have the usual suspects, and then I'll add, you know, something or someone to that uh uh every now and then.
00:42:30.639 --> 00:42:34.719
But it tends it tends to be a lot of the same stuff.
00:42:35.280 --> 00:42:36.559
Strong, strong.
00:42:36.880 --> 00:42:37.599
How about you?
00:42:38.079 --> 00:42:59.440
I typically pray against my fears, and I I do that very intentionally because um I think especially in today's day and age with with you, you got a lot of news coming at you, and and you know, you gotta I think there's this fear culture out there that people dig uh and make money off of.
00:42:59.519 --> 00:43:05.840
And and I think that at the end of the day, uh and it is it a coper?
00:43:06.000 --> 00:43:21.599
I I mean, I suppose, but this is a coping mechanism that I truly, honestly, legitimately, and fervently believe in that instead of being afraid of X, Y, and Z, just to relinquish the control, surrender it up and say, Hey, listen, God, here's here's the deal.
00:43:21.760 --> 00:43:25.199
Yeah, um, yeah, I need your help right here to understand this.
00:43:25.760 --> 00:43:36.480
Um and I'm talking about like hardcore stuff that is you know happening uh on all levels, globally, but also like personally.
00:43:36.960 --> 00:43:42.960
Like I pray for the strength to forgive, which I struggle with so much, right?
00:43:43.199 --> 00:43:45.360
Yeah, and that's where I need a lot of help.
00:43:45.440 --> 00:43:55.599
But and and and I I pray for the tools and the and and and the other thing I is is I you know I I'm not afraid to admit that I pray to hear the voice that is Christ.
00:43:55.679 --> 00:43:58.159
And I think that is I I I need help with that, man.
00:43:58.239 --> 00:43:59.599
I think I struggle with that probably the.
00:44:00.159 --> 00:44:04.400
Most of anything is to hear the voice and the response.
00:44:04.639 --> 00:44:04.880
Yeah.
00:44:05.599 --> 00:44:08.639
Did you say you're did you say you're ashamed to admit that?
00:44:09.360 --> 00:44:10.400
Uh yeah, a little bit.
00:44:10.480 --> 00:44:10.719
Yeah.
00:44:10.800 --> 00:44:11.039
Yeah.
00:44:11.119 --> 00:44:12.719
Oh man, dude, dude, dude.
00:44:12.800 --> 00:44:15.840
I'm I'm glad you're listening to this podcast today, Larry.
00:44:16.000 --> 00:44:20.079
Um it's one of the things I pray for all the time.
00:44:20.159 --> 00:44:25.360
And I the the prayer is just asking God, you know, tell me what I need to hear.
00:44:25.679 --> 00:44:26.079
Amen.
00:44:26.320 --> 00:44:26.639
Yeah.
00:44:26.960 --> 00:44:31.119
Yeah, tell me, tell me what I need to hear and have my ears be open, right?
00:44:31.280 --> 00:44:40.320
Because I know, you know, um, uh, yeah, I don't think I can't tell you how to feel, but man, there's no shame in that.
00:44:40.400 --> 00:44:42.719
Like that's that's that's humanist, you know.
00:44:42.800 --> 00:44:53.679
But it's interesting, like in the Bible, um, again, like there's so there's you know, different parts of the Bible, you know, Paul talks about uh our gifts, right?
00:44:53.840 --> 00:45:03.039
And you know, the gifts of prophecy and teaching and leading and um encouraging and uh being being generous and all these things.
00:45:03.280 --> 00:45:04.960
I pray for those things, right?
00:45:05.039 --> 00:45:11.440
I pray for um for me, I tend to pray for peace, you know, for peace for me.
00:45:11.599 --> 00:45:21.360
I mean, I don't know how many times in the New Testament the the word peace is used or you know, or Jesus references peace, but it is a lot, right?
00:45:21.519 --> 00:45:24.480
I pray for peace, I pay for wisdom, right?
00:45:24.639 --> 00:45:33.039
Like, God, give me wisdom, you know, to to speak into things, to to make decisions you need to make.
00:45:33.199 --> 00:45:37.599
I pray to be loving, um, for strength, right?
00:45:37.760 --> 00:45:39.039
Because life is hard, man.
00:45:39.360 --> 00:45:41.679
For faith, I pray for my faith.
00:45:41.840 --> 00:45:47.840
Um, because it's not it's not a hundred percent all on all the time.
00:45:48.079 --> 00:46:12.320
Um so you know, like uh, and and I think um, you know, we're not gonna really get into like what does Jesus say about prayer, but go to Matthew chapter six, um, and like around verse five and on, Jesus talks about praying and and what his what his views are on praying and how to pray.
00:46:12.400 --> 00:46:19.360
The Our Father, you know, when the disciples ask him how how should we pray, because they saw him pray all the time.
00:46:19.519 --> 00:46:21.840
Like, here's the Son of God, he you know, right?
00:46:22.400 --> 00:46:29.280
God, like praying to God, like one of the most powerful things in the New Testament is him him praying.
00:46:29.599 --> 00:46:35.920
Man, don't make me do this, don't you know, like like we like the crucification, the crucifixion.
00:46:36.159 --> 00:46:40.559
We hey man, if it's your will, God, take this from me.
00:46:41.440 --> 00:46:43.760
But if not, like here I am, right?
00:46:43.920 --> 00:46:46.000
Like this is God praying to God, right?
00:46:46.079 --> 00:46:49.519
That's the the human in human form praying to God.
00:46:49.760 --> 00:47:00.960
Um, but he and and when they ask him how to pray, he says, you know, he gives them the our father, pray this way, and then that's where the hour father comes from, is is right out of the Bible.
00:47:01.039 --> 00:47:14.400
Um, so there's there's so many good examples in the Bible of Jesus, you know, they don't make a big deal out of it, but they're going through whatever, and it's like, and Jesus went off um in the wilderness to find quiet and pray.
00:47:15.599 --> 00:47:19.039
And and he like all the time.
00:47:20.239 --> 00:47:22.320
Yeah, yeah, all the time.
00:47:22.880 --> 00:47:24.960
So it's one of those things that we get it.
00:47:25.039 --> 00:47:39.199
It's I I will say that uh in the journey of the the books that I've read about prayer and and the active pursuit that I've I've done the research on prayer has been probably the most significant faith growth for me.
00:47:39.679 --> 00:47:44.960
Um like just leaps forward, leaps forward, uh, and that's been a lot of fun.
00:47:45.280 --> 00:47:50.159
I would say, you know, like to kind of just close out the topic.
00:47:50.320 --> 00:47:59.039
Um, you know, if you're out there and um, you know, you're thinking about prayer, uh, you cannot do it wrong.
00:47:59.199 --> 00:48:09.280
I don't like I like I don't think I don't like if you're hesitating because you don't know how to do it, you don't know what to say, how to say it, words to you can't do it wrong, man.
00:48:09.440 --> 00:48:12.320
Like there be you, be you.
00:48:12.719 --> 00:48:17.760
Um, I would say the only thing we can get wrong is our expectation.
00:48:18.079 --> 00:48:25.360
The the motivation is to build a relationship with God and ask for things, right?
00:48:25.519 --> 00:48:28.159
Even if you don't know if it's like the right thing, ask for it.
00:48:28.239 --> 00:48:30.559
It's what it's what you want, it's what your heart is telling.
00:48:30.800 --> 00:48:39.840
Ask for it, and then keep asking for it, keep asking for it, and maybe you'll find that ask changes or it doesn't change, or I don't know.
00:48:40.159 --> 00:48:44.639
But man, just like take one step, one step every day.
00:48:44.719 --> 00:48:45.519
Keep going.
00:48:46.480 --> 00:48:57.280
We we cannot thank you as a listener enough for for taking a risk and and engaging us on your growth journey, because growth is not necessarily fun all the time.
00:48:57.440 --> 00:49:07.760
And and as you are growing in your faith and you're super curious as to like what's this all about, you're risking and listening to what we have to say and being part of this conversational journey.
00:49:08.000 --> 00:49:10.639
So uh just huge gratitude for that.
00:49:10.880 --> 00:49:24.079
Uh, we're praying for our listeners, uh, and and uh that the message gets out there that we fully believe is righteous and just uh just so happy to engage with you guys and be able to do this.
00:49:24.239 --> 00:49:30.960
So uh as as we come to a close, just uh looking forward to our next episodes.
00:49:31.119 --> 00:49:32.000
Uh, thank you so much.
00:49:32.159 --> 00:49:35.679
I also want to shout out to our new YouTube channel.
00:49:35.840 --> 00:49:37.360
By all means, check that out.
00:49:37.440 --> 00:49:39.440
We're gonna be adding some more content on there.
00:49:39.679 --> 00:49:40.159
Take care.
00:49:40.400 --> 00:49:40.719
Awesome.
00:49:40.880 --> 00:49:41.360
Take care.
00:49:41.599 --> 00:49:42.960
Hey, thanks for hanging out with us.
00:49:43.119 --> 00:49:49.280
Wherever you are with faith, whether it's curious, skeptical, or just tired, we're glad you're here.
00:49:49.440 --> 00:49:52.960
And if this stirred up thoughts or questions, don't rush past them.
00:49:53.440 --> 00:49:54.800
Just sit with them.
00:49:55.119 --> 00:49:56.960
We'll keep the conversation going.
00:00:15.759 --> 00:00:18.480
Hey everyone, welcome to Faith Curious.
00:00:18.719 --> 00:00:21.839
So, what makes this conversation about faith different?
00:00:22.079 --> 00:00:25.120
Okay, we're just two guys with no hidden agenda.
00:00:25.280 --> 00:00:26.719
What you see is what you get.
00:00:26.960 --> 00:00:28.480
It is a brand new day.
00:00:28.640 --> 00:00:31.600
Faith Curious Nation, thank you so much for being here.
00:00:31.760 --> 00:00:35.200
I am Larry Horton with uh Jim McColly.
00:00:35.439 --> 00:00:39.039
Oh man, I didn't get a chance to give you the podcast extraordinaire.
00:00:39.200 --> 00:00:42.000
Yeah, I preempted the podcast Extraordinaire.
00:00:42.079 --> 00:00:44.079
And I wasn't planning on doing that, but it felt right.
00:00:44.240 --> 00:00:45.119
Hey, go for it.
00:00:45.200 --> 00:00:46.159
I live in the moment.
00:00:46.240 --> 00:00:46.719
I love that.
00:00:46.880 --> 00:00:47.439
I love that.
00:00:47.600 --> 00:00:47.840
Yeah.
00:00:47.920 --> 00:00:48.960
How you doing, man?
00:00:49.200 --> 00:00:49.679
Good, man.
00:00:49.759 --> 00:00:50.240
How you doing?
00:00:50.320 --> 00:00:52.479
How's uh oh hi oh don't you know?
00:00:52.640 --> 00:00:54.640
Oh, it's it's good, it's good.
00:00:54.719 --> 00:01:02.479
It's uh it's been rainy as a son of a gun here, uh, which is okay because I don't yet have my motorcycle.
00:01:02.560 --> 00:01:04.879
Uh you know, it hasn't been delivered yet.
00:01:05.040 --> 00:01:06.799
I thought it was supposed to arrive last week.
00:01:07.040 --> 00:01:12.159
Uh, it was supposed to arrive last week, and I called them in my panic and said, I don't see my motorcycle.
00:01:12.239 --> 00:01:15.680
And he said, Oh, it's in my walkie, it'll be here next week at a brown this time.
00:01:15.760 --> 00:01:17.599
So it's either today, tomorrow, or the next day.
00:01:17.680 --> 00:01:20.959
And I'm like, uh, I'm Jones and it's a it's it's messed up.
00:01:21.120 --> 00:01:23.359
Uh you know, I'm not, I don't want to jinx it.
00:01:23.519 --> 00:01:26.480
Sounds like you got some kind of like Ferris Bueller thing going on here, right?
00:01:26.560 --> 00:01:45.519
Like, there is there is definitely there is some dude with long hair, no helmet, in a on a back road of Kentucky, just right, you know, and now all he's trying to do is trying to figure out how to reverse the odometer so he can actually return it to you, but he hasn't figured it out.
00:01:45.840 --> 00:01:50.480
Right, I can just see him like doing jumps.
00:01:50.959 --> 00:01:52.799
He's on some kind of back road doing jumps.
00:01:52.959 --> 00:01:53.519
Yeah, yeah.
00:01:53.599 --> 00:02:01.760
Uh so I know you're from Oregon, but still you haven't you haven't lived in rain in quite some time.
00:02:01.920 --> 00:02:11.520
Like coming from the desert, I tell people like when you come and live in the desert, man, like one of the biggest differences, not everything happens.
00:02:11.840 --> 00:02:13.680
Anything on your schedule happens.
00:02:13.759 --> 00:02:15.840
There's no rain out, softball games.
00:02:16.159 --> 00:02:22.319
Everything happens according to the schedule, and now you're in a completely different environment.
00:02:22.400 --> 00:02:23.599
How are you doing with it?
00:02:24.080 --> 00:02:37.919
It is a strange phenomenon to actually have to look at the weather on a daily basis because something might change as opposed to right uh the ease, literally, possibly the easiest job in Arizona is uh the news weather person.
00:02:38.000 --> 00:02:40.960
Uh so yeah, the easiest job in the one of the easiest jobs in the world.
00:02:41.199 --> 00:02:41.919
This is fascinating.
00:02:42.000 --> 00:02:45.520
Yeah, I joke when I look at the weather, this is this is what it is.
00:02:45.680 --> 00:02:52.159
It's 102, 101, 101, 102, 101, 101, 102.
00:02:52.240 --> 00:02:54.159
Like, like that's it.
00:02:54.560 --> 00:02:58.080
Well, unless you get a cold front coming in down to 99, you're getting like 98.
00:02:58.479 --> 00:03:01.039
Yeah, and that doesn't have to like a winter storm, basically.
00:03:01.199 --> 00:03:01.759
Yeah.
00:03:02.080 --> 00:03:16.800
In in light of your uh recent transition to Ohio, um, I thought we'd do a little uh little Ohio QA and uh and see if you've uh see what kind of knowledge you have about your newfound home state.
00:03:16.879 --> 00:03:17.919
Uh you ready for that?
00:03:18.159 --> 00:03:20.319
I I hit me with a buckeye quiz.
00:03:20.639 --> 00:03:26.800
So, first of all, Larry, uh, why is Ohio nicknamed the mother of presidents?
00:03:27.360 --> 00:03:31.919
Oh, did you know Ohio was nicknamed the mother of presidents?
00:03:32.159 --> 00:03:34.479
I think a better question is, yeah, that's the better question.
00:03:34.560 --> 00:03:35.520
Is did I know?
00:03:36.159 --> 00:03:37.919
All right, well, can't do you have a guess?
00:03:38.000 --> 00:03:44.879
Do you want to log a guess or just me tell me just I I'm gonna say that uh several presidents' mothers live in Ohio?
00:03:45.520 --> 00:03:52.560
Um Ohio has produced more US presidents than any state except Virginia.
00:03:52.719 --> 00:03:53.039
Eight.
00:03:53.199 --> 00:03:55.759
Oh wow has produced eight presidents.
00:03:56.080 --> 00:03:58.080
Wow, yeah, wow, impressive.
00:03:58.240 --> 00:04:03.280
Yeah, that's so um I you know, like so it makes perfect sense that I'm here as well.
00:04:03.520 --> 00:04:05.360
Yeah, maybe you're number, maybe you're number nine.
00:04:05.439 --> 00:04:06.879
Like, who who who can really say?
00:04:07.039 --> 00:04:08.639
Who can really say you could not there?
00:04:09.199 --> 00:04:12.319
There's not a way in the world that you could get me to take that job.
00:04:12.719 --> 00:04:14.319
No, no, not a chance.
00:04:14.639 --> 00:04:16.480
What summer delicacy?
00:04:16.639 --> 00:04:22.000
So we're talking about a food, was invented in Ohio, and where did the invention take place?
00:04:23.040 --> 00:04:25.680
Wow, I like that.
00:04:25.920 --> 00:04:29.439
Um, I'm gonna take a stab at the hot dog.
00:04:30.240 --> 00:04:33.040
Well, it was a summer delicacy, that's what gave it away.
00:04:33.519 --> 00:04:35.279
Uh yeah, well, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:04:35.680 --> 00:04:36.399
Did I get it?
00:04:36.560 --> 00:04:37.680
Well, yeah, but here it is.
00:04:37.759 --> 00:04:52.959
The hot dog was allegedly, and you're a cop, so I think allegedly fits, allegedly invented in Ohio, and you got German immigrants in Cincinnati and Frankfurt who both claim it.
00:04:53.680 --> 00:05:00.000
So we don't really know, but it, but there's uh there's a claim that the hot dog was invented in Ohio.
00:05:00.240 --> 00:05:02.639
And every Oktoberfest, it gets really ugly.
00:05:02.800 --> 00:05:04.480
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:05:04.639 --> 00:05:04.959
All right.
00:05:05.040 --> 00:05:05.920
Now here's one.
00:05:06.079 --> 00:05:10.160
Here's one I think you probably know because you've visited Ohio for a while.
00:05:10.480 --> 00:05:13.040
What does three-way chili consist of?
00:05:13.360 --> 00:05:17.120
Oh, you've got the uh the spaghetti, correct?
00:05:17.279 --> 00:05:20.399
Right, you've got the actual chili, and there's beans in it.
00:05:20.480 --> 00:05:22.639
That's the thing, okay, right?
00:05:23.120 --> 00:05:24.319
Am I with this?
00:05:25.360 --> 00:05:32.079
Oh so you got your you got your three, four, and five-way chili.
00:05:32.639 --> 00:05:34.319
Oh in in Ohio.
00:05:34.480 --> 00:05:37.279
The three, you're you're like two-thirds of there.
00:05:37.360 --> 00:05:40.319
Spaghetti, meat sauce, shredded cheese.
00:05:40.480 --> 00:05:41.839
That's your three-way chili.
00:05:42.079 --> 00:05:42.800
Okay, okay.
00:05:42.959 --> 00:05:43.759
Meat sauce.
00:05:43.920 --> 00:05:45.759
Now that was my nickname in high school.
00:05:46.000 --> 00:05:52.639
If you want to make it four-way, you add either kidney beans or diced onions.
00:05:53.360 --> 00:05:54.319
Not both.
00:05:54.720 --> 00:05:56.959
Either or that that's your four-way.
00:05:57.360 --> 00:05:59.279
If you want your five-way, you add both.
00:05:59.439 --> 00:06:00.240
Oh, wow.
00:06:00.480 --> 00:06:01.360
Okay, wow.
00:06:01.600 --> 00:06:02.000
Yeah.
00:06:02.319 --> 00:06:03.120
See, this is great.
00:06:03.199 --> 00:06:04.959
This is why this is edutainment.
00:06:05.120 --> 00:06:11.360
I mean, we're not just providing like a major podcast, but we're also providing information.
00:06:11.759 --> 00:06:13.199
All right, and here's here's one more.
00:06:13.279 --> 00:06:14.160
I got one more for you.
00:06:14.399 --> 00:06:20.879
The Ohio is the only, I don't know if it's only as accurate, one of the only states to not have a rectangular flag.
00:06:21.040 --> 00:06:24.639
Ah, do you know what do you know what shape the flag is in?
00:06:24.800 --> 00:06:30.560
It's kind of a weird triangle situation with the with the uh the end is kind of like a serpent's tongue situation.
00:06:30.879 --> 00:06:32.319
Okay, it you know what?
00:06:32.399 --> 00:06:35.839
You're right, it's called a swallow tail pennant shape.
00:06:36.000 --> 00:06:38.720
Oh also known, also known as a burgey.
00:06:39.040 --> 00:06:40.000
Oh, burgee.
00:06:40.240 --> 00:06:40.879
That's a new term.
00:06:40.959 --> 00:06:41.519
I did not know that.
00:06:41.680 --> 00:06:42.639
I'm gonna use that though.
00:06:42.879 --> 00:06:49.600
It it has uh its shape um it replicates some type of fish.
00:06:49.680 --> 00:06:56.240
Like that's what that so there's a a history of the history of fishing um in the state, yeah.
00:06:56.399 --> 00:07:03.839
Yeah, see, I knew this, and this is where sports are so impressive because the reason I knew that is because of the Columbus Blue Jackets in their in their background.
00:07:04.000 --> 00:07:04.720
So yeah, okay.
00:07:04.879 --> 00:07:05.199
All right.
00:07:05.360 --> 00:07:06.720
Now, here's some more knowledge.
00:07:06.800 --> 00:07:10.879
So again, you know, like when you meet your neighbors, you know, you can you can throw this stuff out there.
00:07:11.040 --> 00:07:17.519
Um did on the flag, did you know the triangles represent Ohio's hills and valleys?
00:07:17.920 --> 00:07:20.240
Oh, naturally, yeah, makes sense.
00:07:20.560 --> 00:07:26.160
And the red and white stripes represent its waterways and roads.
00:07:26.480 --> 00:07:29.600
Oh, uh I wonder which one is which.
00:07:29.759 --> 00:07:36.959
See, do do you know what the letter O or the circle in the middle represents?
00:07:38.480 --> 00:07:41.120
The no, I was gonna call it.
00:07:42.720 --> 00:07:45.680
The letter O and a buckeye nut.
00:07:46.160 --> 00:07:59.920
Ah and and it's so because our rival obviously is the Michigan Wolverines, and you put up a Wolverine versus a poisonous nut, and it's just you know, as far as mascots go, it's just really lacking.
00:08:00.319 --> 00:08:02.480
Is is a is a buckeye poisonous?
00:08:02.560 --> 00:08:03.199
I didn't know that.
00:08:03.279 --> 00:08:06.639
I I think they they try to sell it as poison to make it tougher.
00:08:07.600 --> 00:08:09.600
I don't know, otherwise it's just a cashew.
00:08:09.680 --> 00:08:12.240
I mean, I mean, it's yeah, yeah, it's a legume.
00:08:12.319 --> 00:08:14.000
Yeah, it's it's the worst.
00:08:14.160 --> 00:08:15.279
Yeah, good.
00:08:15.600 --> 00:08:22.160
See, now I I feel uh more more comfortable that as you're roaming the streets of the neighborhood, you know, meeting people.
00:08:22.319 --> 00:08:29.439
Um, you know, you got you got some material, you got some material, and so they can go inside and be like, what the what is up with that Larry guy?
00:08:29.519 --> 00:08:32.879
And his you know, strangely, nobody calls me back.
00:08:32.960 --> 00:08:35.120
I don't know what's going on with that.
00:08:35.360 --> 00:08:36.480
Right, right, right, right.
00:08:36.639 --> 00:08:39.360
They invited us over for three-way chili.
00:08:39.600 --> 00:08:40.799
What yeah, what is that?
00:08:40.960 --> 00:08:42.879
I I gotta be like, they're gonna be like, Who what?
00:08:43.039 --> 00:08:44.080
Yeah, that's funny.
00:08:44.399 --> 00:08:46.879
I did see a skyline chili restaurant.
00:08:47.200 --> 00:08:48.080
Ah, okay.
00:08:48.399 --> 00:08:50.399
All right, uh, but you haven't gone.
00:08:50.960 --> 00:08:52.240
Uh, not yet.
00:08:52.399 --> 00:08:53.279
Yeah, chili guy, yeah.
00:08:54.080 --> 00:08:54.639
I don't know if I'm there.
00:08:54.799 --> 00:08:55.120
I don't know.
00:08:55.279 --> 00:08:56.399
I'm not a chili guy either, really.
00:08:56.480 --> 00:08:56.799
Yeah, yeah.
00:08:56.960 --> 00:08:58.080
Hit the Bob Evans, though.
00:08:58.240 --> 00:08:58.960
Hit that pretty hard.
00:08:59.279 --> 00:09:02.320
But I'll tell you what, the spaghetti and meat sauce, like so.
00:09:02.399 --> 00:09:04.159
Now you're really not talking about chili.
00:09:04.240 --> 00:09:06.559
I mean, you're talking about a bowl of spaghetti.
00:09:07.120 --> 00:09:09.120
This is this is the crux right here.
00:09:09.279 --> 00:09:10.080
I mean, yeah.
00:09:10.320 --> 00:09:11.279
And you know what I'd do?
00:09:11.360 --> 00:09:12.559
You know what I would do?
00:09:12.960 --> 00:09:13.759
A hundred percent.
00:09:13.919 --> 00:09:18.159
I'd be like, I'm gonna take the three-way chili, no cheese.
00:09:18.320 --> 00:09:20.559
Just give me a bowl of spaghetti and meat sauce.
00:09:20.799 --> 00:09:22.879
Just really throw a curveball at him.
00:09:23.200 --> 00:09:24.399
Because we're contrarians.
00:09:24.480 --> 00:09:25.919
I mean, this is the way we approach life.
00:09:26.000 --> 00:09:26.799
I don't know.
00:09:26.879 --> 00:09:28.399
I can't order off a menu forgotten.
00:09:28.559 --> 00:09:31.200
I see what you're trying to push on me, and I'm gonna go this direction.
00:09:31.519 --> 00:09:32.000
Exactly.
00:09:32.399 --> 00:09:33.440
I don't I fight you.
00:09:33.519 --> 00:09:34.320
I fight you.
00:09:34.559 --> 00:09:36.799
So I am uh I'm sitting here.
00:09:37.120 --> 00:09:37.600
Thank you for that.
00:09:37.679 --> 00:09:39.919
Thank you for indulging uh indulging me in that.
00:09:40.080 --> 00:09:42.399
No, that was great, great research, too, by the way.
00:09:42.480 --> 00:09:44.000
Uh I'm sitting here now.
00:09:44.159 --> 00:09:52.399
Um, and I'm like, all right, how do we because we're we're really good at our segues into the show?
00:09:52.639 --> 00:09:53.120
Oh, yeah.
00:09:53.360 --> 00:09:59.039
How do we go from three-way chili or a poisonous nut to prayer?
00:09:59.360 --> 00:10:00.879
How how how do does that even work?
00:10:01.200 --> 00:10:05.840
So the train, yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna take a stab at this because I've been kind of working it out in my brain as we've been talking.
00:10:06.080 --> 00:10:13.360
Um and and you know, you get out there and you deal with the Wolverine is pretty pretty straightforward, right?
00:10:13.440 --> 00:10:29.200
Yeah, I don't want to be attacked by this uh very vicious rodent, but uh you know, you're out in the forest and you're foraging and you come across a poisonous nut that happens to be the state nut of uh Ohio, uh, and and you ingest it, not realizing that it's actually toxic.
00:10:29.840 --> 00:10:39.200
You know, for me, I would ask you to say a prayer for me and to say, you know, hey, listen, I hope that I don't get injured horribly.
00:10:39.519 --> 00:10:42.320
Speaking of prayer, okay, and then I would go on.
00:10:42.480 --> 00:10:44.320
Yeah, so it was horrible.
00:10:44.480 --> 00:10:45.840
It really was like an island.
00:10:45.919 --> 00:10:48.240
Uh it was like a it was like a boat adrift.
00:10:48.320 --> 00:10:49.120
It was really not good.
00:10:49.360 --> 00:10:50.159
You did think of it.
00:10:50.240 --> 00:10:52.960
Well, and if that happens, man, you better have that prayer in your back pocket too.
00:10:53.039 --> 00:10:58.399
Like, I like like if it happens to me and I'm eating the poisonous nut, I I should have the prayer in the back pocket.
00:10:58.559 --> 00:11:05.679
Uh, there's also something there with like there should be some kind of prayer, like, dear Lord, help me to never forage.
00:11:05.759 --> 00:11:07.279
Like, why do I want to forage?
00:11:07.360 --> 00:11:07.519
Right.
00:11:07.679 --> 00:11:10.720
Well, I think that's an opportunity, and I think it's been missed uh in the past.
00:11:10.799 --> 00:11:13.600
So I'm gonna go ahead and open us up with a prayer right now.
00:11:13.919 --> 00:11:16.480
Um, dear God, our Lord and Savior.
00:11:16.720 --> 00:11:23.360
Um when when the the trade deadline comes, please have the Arizona Diamondbacks be buyers and not sellers.
00:11:23.440 --> 00:11:36.320
Uh, and uh please just help us win the the the division title and uh please help that the the the Dodgers just come up with a collective team digestive worm or something.
00:11:36.639 --> 00:11:39.519
Uh and uh in in your name we pray, amen.
00:11:39.759 --> 00:11:42.960
Because that's really uh that's a legitimate prayer right there.
00:11:43.279 --> 00:11:46.960
No, I I um do you mind if I critique your prayer?
00:11:47.120 --> 00:11:47.679
Yeah, please.
00:11:47.759 --> 00:11:48.720
No, I don't mind at all.
00:11:48.799 --> 00:11:51.200
Yeah, why don't you ask for the World Series title?
00:11:51.279 --> 00:11:52.559
Like, why division title?
00:11:52.879 --> 00:11:54.320
I don't want to be selfish.
00:11:54.960 --> 00:11:56.879
Um it's a big God, Larry.
00:11:56.960 --> 00:11:58.240
It's a big, big God.
00:11:58.879 --> 00:12:05.039
And and we we joke, we we we laugh, but at the end of the day, I mean I think people actually look at prayer like that.
00:12:05.200 --> 00:12:21.679
And and there's always that that whole thing about uh, you know, you're praying for your team to win, and God has a lot more, you know, bigger things to bigger fish to fry than than uh so obviously uh our our topic today is prayer, and uh this is a big one.
00:12:22.000 --> 00:12:31.919
This is a big one because uh this one has a lot of really weird uh association to it, or or uh, you know, just kind of misnomers and things like that.
00:12:32.159 --> 00:12:42.320
Uh so I you know, I'm I'm curious to what your experience with prayer has been so far, and and and uh just let's kind of just kind of jump right in right there.
00:12:42.639 --> 00:12:44.639
Well, um yeah, thank you.
00:12:44.720 --> 00:12:59.120
Uh and listeners, thank you for indulging us um in the sh the shenanigans of Ohio and and and whatever, what else so the other things that uh that jump into our minds and we can't get rid of until we say them.
00:12:59.279 --> 00:13:02.000
Um but uh okay, so prayer.
00:13:02.080 --> 00:13:15.440
You know, we're we're on this journey of uh of just sharing right our faith with people that maybe have been hurt by faith or confused or doubt or don't know how to pursue.
00:13:15.519 --> 00:13:27.120
And you know, we're just we're just here to uh to to to help and share our experience in in the hope that that um that helps someone um you know take the next step.
00:13:27.279 --> 00:13:29.039
And it's about relationship, right?
00:13:29.120 --> 00:13:35.759
I mean, everything we're talking about is our relationship with Jesus, and prayer is a central, man, a central piece of it.
00:13:35.919 --> 00:13:37.360
Last week we talked about the Bible.
00:13:37.519 --> 00:13:38.879
This week we're going to prayer.
00:13:39.039 --> 00:13:43.360
So um I'm gonna I want to share like my prayer.
00:13:43.519 --> 00:13:47.039
It's a prayer experience in real life that's been going on with me.
00:13:47.120 --> 00:13:47.600
All right.
00:13:47.840 --> 00:13:52.559
So I I've been praying for something that and actually this same prayer.
00:13:52.799 --> 00:13:55.919
Um I won't say every morning, right?
00:13:56.080 --> 00:13:58.240
But I I try I try to pray every morning.
00:13:58.559 --> 00:14:03.519
The mornings that I pray, the same prayer for somewhere between five and ten years.
00:14:03.919 --> 00:14:04.240
Okay.
00:14:04.639 --> 00:14:05.120
Wow.
00:14:05.440 --> 00:14:06.960
Um that's amazing.
00:14:07.600 --> 00:14:14.320
I'm not gonna tell you who it's for, but I'll tell you it's someone I love more than just about anything in this world.
00:14:14.720 --> 00:14:20.799
Um, and what I'm praying for is something fairly simple, I guess you could say.
00:14:21.120 --> 00:14:22.000
Something good.
00:14:23.120 --> 00:14:25.440
Something this person wants for themselves.
00:14:26.240 --> 00:14:28.720
And it just hasn't happened yet, right?
00:14:29.120 --> 00:14:33.360
Which is why I've been praying for it for you know, five to ten years.
00:14:35.120 --> 00:14:40.720
So every time I bring it to God, um I you know, if I'm being real, like I feel hope.
00:14:40.960 --> 00:14:42.320
Like I keep praying it.
00:14:43.120 --> 00:14:51.840
Not because I'm angry that it hasn't happened or I don't, you know, I think if I just keep praying it, then it's no, I I feel hope, right?
00:14:51.919 --> 00:14:54.240
And and and saying the prayer makes me feel good.
00:14:54.799 --> 00:15:01.200
Um I don't know how God's gonna answer it, but I I believe he will.
00:15:01.600 --> 00:15:10.320
And that's like one of the tough things about prayer is we have our idea of things that should happen, and then we have you know, we have God's will, right?
00:15:10.960 --> 00:15:15.919
But that really isn't the hard part, like not knowing, because I know he will answer it.
00:15:16.799 --> 00:15:28.080
The hard part is kind of the the quiet voice in me um that shows up sometimes and says something like, Ah, this is my fault, right?
00:15:28.320 --> 00:15:38.080
Um what if my this prayer isn't being answered because of the things I did, bad choices, old behavior, you know.
00:15:38.399 --> 00:15:40.960
Um and and like hear me.
00:15:41.679 --> 00:15:44.879
I don't think I don't believe God punishes me, right?
00:15:45.039 --> 00:15:46.399
I don't believe that at all.
00:15:46.559 --> 00:15:47.600
That's not what I'm thinking.
00:15:48.159 --> 00:15:57.120
But I do believe in consequences, and consequences come in all shapes and sizes, and they don't just land on me, you know, they can land on people close to me.
00:15:57.519 --> 00:16:02.799
So I'm not saying it's my fault, but if I'm being real, I struggle with that, right?
00:16:03.360 --> 00:16:06.879
Because I somewhere inside of me, I'm like, why isn't it being answered?
00:16:08.080 --> 00:16:16.480
Um what I so what I know is you know, this thing I want for this person, it's just it's hard to see them in pain, right?
00:16:16.639 --> 00:16:17.840
Because it's not happening.
00:16:18.480 --> 00:16:33.279
So maybe for this episode, it's actually a good place to start talking about prayer, not with a success story, not with some testimony about the time God came through in a really big way, but with the years of waiting, you know, a little hope, a lot of surrender.
00:16:33.840 --> 00:16:37.519
And I've if I'm being honest, you know, some guilt I'm still working through.
00:16:38.159 --> 00:16:42.399
And yet I I couldn't imagine my life without prayer.
00:16:42.639 --> 00:16:45.120
Um, so that's where I am.
00:16:45.360 --> 00:16:50.000
And if that resonates with you, then uh I hope you stick around for the rest of the show.
00:16:50.480 --> 00:16:58.559
So I have some curiosity about what you said because and I'm and I'm also trying to put myself in the listener's frame as well.
00:17:00.080 --> 00:17:08.880
You you have a prayer that has gone unanswered, which is like culturally and and along our norms and mores, just this coup.
00:17:09.920 --> 00:17:13.359
Yet you said that you have hope.
00:17:14.079 --> 00:17:18.000
So that to me is a little paradoxical.
00:17:20.160 --> 00:17:27.920
You you haven't gotten the the prayer answer or even a result necessarily, yet you still have hope.
00:17:28.240 --> 00:17:29.839
So talk to me a little bit about that.
00:17:31.839 --> 00:17:38.880
Um, I think it's it's uh it's what we think of when we think of prayer.
00:17:39.279 --> 00:17:40.400
Like what do we expect?
00:17:40.880 --> 00:17:41.200
Okay.
00:17:41.759 --> 00:17:54.960
And I think as humans, especially if we're new believers, and we're figuring all this thing out, but even seasoned believers, we are we're human, so we have the tendency to think I know what's best for me.
00:17:55.680 --> 00:17:58.799
I could get angry, like, okay, then why isn't it being answered?
00:17:59.039 --> 00:18:00.160
But I don't think in those terms.
00:18:00.319 --> 00:18:07.279
I think in terms of, yeah, I'm human, I have needs, I have wants, I have, you know, things that I think should happen.
00:18:07.440 --> 00:18:08.720
And so I pray for them.
00:18:09.279 --> 00:18:13.440
But I also know uh maybe I'm wrong.
00:18:13.759 --> 00:18:17.279
You know, maybe God has a different plan, a better plan.
00:18:17.440 --> 00:18:24.000
Um, I mean, his plan is always good, it's always loving, it's always in my best interest.
00:18:24.400 --> 00:18:29.759
Um but I don't think in those big godly ways, right?
00:18:29.920 --> 00:18:33.599
I think in the human ways, and I want this thing to happen, so I'm gonna pray for it.
00:18:34.000 --> 00:18:37.279
And it's good, and so why isn't it happening?
00:18:38.079 --> 00:18:40.559
So I don't hear any anger, right?
00:18:41.119 --> 00:18:51.200
Yeah, which is strange because I think that that's a lot of what folks have experienced when they don't get the the answer to their prayer.
00:18:52.079 --> 00:18:55.440
But do you think anger is okay in prayer?
00:18:56.000 --> 00:19:18.160
Yes, but I think you know, to you can have a response that says, Yes, I'm angry that this prayer hasn't been answered, but I think it also needs to it cannot go without self-reflection to cut to be hand in hand with that anger to find out okay, why am I angry that this did not get answered?
00:19:18.400 --> 00:19:22.880
Because it so let me ask you this the the other thing I don't hear is doubt.
00:19:23.279 --> 00:19:31.119
Yeah, um, although there you did talk a little bit about, you know, maybe it's this, or maybe it's me, or maybe it's consequences, or what have you.
00:19:31.440 --> 00:19:32.720
Is that doubt?
00:19:34.640 --> 00:19:38.160
Um, well, it depends on what you mean by doubt.
00:19:38.559 --> 00:19:46.880
Is it is it doubt that um do I have doubt that this prayer is going to be answered in the way I want it to be?
00:19:47.519 --> 00:19:48.400
A hundred percent.
00:19:49.279 --> 00:19:49.680
Right?
00:19:50.160 --> 00:20:05.839
Um but I don't have doubt that it's going to be answered in the right way, you know, the way that the way that God needs, you know, the way that the way that God needs things to happen, right?
00:20:06.240 --> 00:20:17.839
And and in many, you know, in many, many ways, I'm not big enough uh to understand his ways most of the time.
00:20:18.799 --> 00:20:25.039
This I think about Evan Almighty, that movie with uh I think it's Jim Carrey.
00:20:25.519 --> 00:20:26.160
Is that the one?
00:20:26.240 --> 00:20:27.599
Is it is Evan Almighty?
00:20:27.839 --> 00:20:30.319
I was gonna say Steve Carrell, but I could be totally wrong.
00:20:30.480 --> 00:20:30.799
You know what?
00:20:30.960 --> 00:20:32.160
There's there's there's multiple ones.
00:20:32.400 --> 00:20:35.839
The one I'm thinking of was with Jim Carrey and Bruce Almighty.
00:20:35.920 --> 00:20:38.480
That's the one it's not Chris Rock, it's not Chris Rock.
00:20:38.559 --> 00:21:03.519
I know, yeah, but it there's a section in there where Bruce Almighty and he's answering all the prayers, and and it just leads into this massive anarchy because all the prayers are answered, uh in in the affirmation, and I think that is this is a massive crux, and I'm gonna make this up, and I but I don't think I'm far off.
00:21:04.000 --> 00:21:11.599
Folks can give up on the entire thing uh with the prayer thing, they can say, you know what?
00:21:12.319 --> 00:21:23.440
I get it, I get the Bible's legit, I get that this guy walked the earth, I get that he he's benevolently sacrificing himself for me, but I am not getting my prayer answered, so I'm out.
00:21:24.880 --> 00:21:42.079
And because who hasn't experienced a loss, some really significant grieving, and then turn to prayer in that moment and then just been not fulfilled, right?
00:21:42.640 --> 00:21:50.640
The unanswered prayer in that situation is enough to turn some people to the point where they'll just reject and turn their back on this entire thing, right?
00:21:51.039 --> 00:21:59.759
And I think that's where we really gotta take a look at this because, like you're talking about, I I and I love just.
00:22:00.240 --> 00:22:11.599
The zen attitude that you're bringing to that unanswered prayer, which and and first of all, let me also just say thank you for bringing that aspect to it as opposed to what you talked about in regards to some kind of win.
00:22:11.839 --> 00:22:13.599
We're starting kind of with a loss.
00:22:13.839 --> 00:22:14.079
Yeah.
00:22:15.599 --> 00:22:18.960
Well, and um so a couple things.
00:22:19.119 --> 00:22:28.559
Uh for I I had a this person knows that I'm praying this prayer, right?
00:22:28.640 --> 00:22:30.799
I mean, we've we've talked about it.
00:22:31.119 --> 00:22:34.400
Um, I've actually asked this person at some point, what would you like me to pray for?
00:22:34.559 --> 00:22:39.599
And this is, you know, um, and I got things back, but this is one of them.
00:22:39.839 --> 00:22:57.440
Um and at one point um they communicated to me that they were angry and that they had that they were um expressing that anger to God, right?
00:22:57.519 --> 00:23:01.759
So I'm I'm following up on the the the anger point, right?
00:23:02.160 --> 00:23:13.279
And I think there was uh I think there was some uh um guilt, like you know, I got angry and maybe I shouldn't have.
00:23:13.359 --> 00:23:17.119
And I I would say no, like God wants authenticity.
00:23:17.279 --> 00:23:21.200
If you're angry, he doesn't want you to fake it, he wants you to be angry, you know.
00:23:21.359 --> 00:23:27.200
If that if it's rage, like what like he wants us to be authentic, right?
00:23:27.519 --> 00:23:40.160
He wants, you know, um, and and and I think like that's really important to understand that there is, you know, Jesus in the Bible talks about prayer and how to pray and everything, and like it's like don't be a hypocrite, right?
00:23:40.240 --> 00:23:51.119
Like, don't try to use fancy words and you know say the right things and you know, um, and and and pray in a way that other people see you, so they're like, oh, look at that person, look at them praying, right?
00:23:51.279 --> 00:24:00.559
Right now, no, man, he like it's it's about relationship, it's between me and God, and whatever I'm experiencing, I should communicate.
00:24:00.960 --> 00:24:04.319
So the question it sounds like is why?
00:24:05.599 --> 00:24:16.799
And I think unless you have really have a hold on that, then it's it unless you ask yourself, why do I want to pray?
00:24:17.680 --> 00:24:21.759
Then it's it's almost like you're putting the cart before the horse.
00:24:22.240 --> 00:24:23.759
And here's my argument to that.
00:24:23.920 --> 00:24:24.400
What do you mean?
00:24:24.640 --> 00:24:30.000
What do you mean you put what I think a lot of folks confuse prayer with control?
00:24:31.200 --> 00:24:37.039
And I think there's there's a lot of folks out there who think to themselves, okay, I want this.
00:24:37.759 --> 00:24:43.519
And I've I've read somewhere that if you ask for it, God will give it to you.
00:24:43.839 --> 00:24:44.400
True.
00:24:44.480 --> 00:24:45.279
Yeah, right.
00:24:45.440 --> 00:24:48.240
And and again, we talked about this in the last episode.
00:24:48.319 --> 00:24:53.519
You take that out of context, and it's and it seems like very uh empowering and entitling, right?
00:24:53.680 --> 00:24:54.319
Right.
00:24:54.960 --> 00:24:57.680
In the ask, why am I praying?
00:24:57.839 --> 00:25:01.920
If I'm praying so that I can control God, it ain't gonna work.
00:25:02.000 --> 00:25:04.799
And that's not a reason to pray, and that's not prayer, right?
00:25:04.880 --> 00:25:05.279
Right.
00:25:05.440 --> 00:25:10.400
And I think that's that's what we really, I mean, this so how do you answer that?
00:25:10.559 --> 00:25:11.680
Why do you pray?
00:25:12.000 --> 00:25:27.839
The reason I pray is because there's the same reason that I want my daughter to talk to me, or I want my son to talk to me, and that is because I want to know you, I want to know what my daughter needs, and if it's in my daughter's best interest, me as the parent, knowing that.
00:25:28.079 --> 00:25:38.079
All right, because I I I mean, it's as my job as a parent is not to just say yes and have all the sugar you want and please jump off of this very high thing at the risk of breaking your leg.
00:25:38.160 --> 00:25:38.799
No, no, no.
00:25:38.880 --> 00:25:40.640
I don't, I don't consent, right?
00:25:41.359 --> 00:25:47.519
I will in some cases, if it is good for you, but there's a lot of no happening.
00:25:47.759 --> 00:25:54.319
The the same reason that I want my daughter to talk to me, I think is the same reason that uh I uh why do I want to pray?
00:25:54.640 --> 00:25:56.559
Because I want to engage with my higher power.
00:25:56.640 --> 00:26:12.799
I want to engage with God in a relationship, not so that I can get what I want and control God, which is just impossible, anyways, but so that I can have that experience and that engagement and that relationship back and forth.
00:26:14.640 --> 00:26:24.000
When a when a prayer actually does get answered, when it all works, I mean, that is some punch you in the face, like knock you down stuff.
00:26:24.480 --> 00:26:25.599
It is impressive.
00:26:25.839 --> 00:26:27.200
It is impressive.
00:26:28.400 --> 00:26:37.920
When it when it happens and you see it happen not on your time, that also is a uh a mind job.
00:26:38.480 --> 00:26:43.920
Because I've had prayers that I prayed and like literally two years later they came around.
00:26:44.160 --> 00:26:51.599
And then at the at the actual answer, I saw the path, and I was like, okay, I get that there's a much bigger plan here.
00:26:51.839 --> 00:26:57.599
I want to make sure that we don't gloss over something because you use the analogy of you and your daughter, right?
00:26:58.079 --> 00:27:05.440
Yeah, and and and you know, I'll ask the rhetorical question like, do you give your daughter everything she asks for?
00:27:05.519 --> 00:27:06.480
Of course not, right?
00:27:06.640 --> 00:27:07.519
Of course not.
00:27:07.839 --> 00:27:21.519
But what I want to hone in on is and not and not take for granted that the listener isn't a is aware of this, but the relationship between you and your daughter, me and my daughter, me and my father, my dad, right?
00:27:22.240 --> 00:27:25.519
Is the same relationship between God and I.
00:27:26.079 --> 00:27:27.279
God's my father.
00:27:27.759 --> 00:27:30.559
Okay, I am my daughter's father.
00:27:31.200 --> 00:27:36.160
So do I want her just to stop communicating with me?
00:27:36.480 --> 00:27:38.160
Of course not, right?
00:27:38.480 --> 00:27:41.039
Um, am I gonna give her everything she asked for?
00:27:41.599 --> 00:27:44.640
Of course not, because some things aren't best for her, right?
00:27:44.880 --> 00:27:52.000
Um but that you know, the other thing you said was the the communicating.
00:27:52.160 --> 00:27:55.599
So so it's about having a relationship, right?
00:27:55.759 --> 00:28:03.839
Which means I'm sharing, I'm talking, I'm expressing myself from where I'm at, right?
00:28:04.160 --> 00:28:05.839
Good, bad, or indifferent.
00:28:06.160 --> 00:28:14.079
I'm expressing myself, and you're getting to know me because of how I'm showing up, and then I also have to stop and listen.
00:28:16.319 --> 00:28:18.079
Bring that in bold, my friend.
00:28:18.480 --> 00:28:19.759
That's the communication, right?
00:28:19.839 --> 00:28:20.799
Like it's a two-way street.
00:28:21.039 --> 00:28:36.000
It is absolutely a two-to-way street, and God is going to talk to me, and again, I'm not saying it's Jim hit the brakes hard, you know, like you are going to get it.
00:28:36.079 --> 00:28:44.240
And no, but God talks to me, like my experiences in there's feelings, right?
00:28:44.400 --> 00:28:46.559
I don't always recognize it when it's happening.
00:28:46.640 --> 00:28:48.640
Sometimes I recognize it after the fact.
00:28:48.799 --> 00:28:55.599
Um but if I'm not listening, if I'm not open to that, then like he can talk all he wants.
00:28:56.160 --> 00:29:01.039
It's not going to land because I'm I have to be an active participant.
00:29:01.200 --> 00:29:06.720
So all that to say, like you know, expressing myself and then listening, it's about relationship.
00:29:06.799 --> 00:29:11.039
The same relationship that you want with your daughter, we want with God.
00:29:11.200 --> 00:29:13.119
And the same things have to happen.
00:29:13.359 --> 00:29:17.839
And there's a maturity and a growth aspect, and I think is huge, right?
00:29:18.640 --> 00:29:37.680
Because the the needs um as an infant, the needs as a as a as a uh you know, elementary school kid, the needs as a teenager, the needs as an adult, the as the maturity happens, the needs and the understanding and and that relationship and that exchange change.
00:29:38.079 --> 00:29:52.720
And I absolutely grow through my spiritual journey and my understanding of that relationship and my roles and and and the roles and the surrender that that I need to have in this back and forth.
00:29:53.200 --> 00:29:55.519
That's a growth that I'm going to experience.
00:29:55.680 --> 00:29:59.359
And I'm gonna be having bad days in that process.
00:29:59.519 --> 00:30:03.920
I'm gonna be having unanswered prayers in that process that really make me angry.
00:30:04.079 --> 00:30:08.240
I'm gonna have I'm gonna have some lows and I'm gonna have some highs, right?
00:30:08.319 --> 00:30:13.680
But I'm it's gonna be a thing to where it's not just me getting everything I want.
00:30:14.079 --> 00:30:24.400
And that understanding and that maturity level is is is part of the growth, and it's part of that um, you know, that back and forth, and that you know, that's the evolution of this prayer.
00:30:24.559 --> 00:30:27.920
And I think a lot of folks aren't interested in the growth.
00:30:28.160 --> 00:30:40.319
I think a lot of folks they they just want they they want the instantaneous pleasure drop, bam, you know, I I I ask and I get, and that's just not the way this works, man.
00:30:40.480 --> 00:30:49.839
That's not the way this works, and well, and it and it doesn't work that way because you know the relationship isn't transactional, right?
00:30:50.079 --> 00:30:50.480
Amen.
00:30:50.720 --> 00:31:00.160
Oh, and the relationship, the relationship, um like any relationship, you have to work at it, right?
00:31:00.319 --> 00:31:03.680
Now, not to say I have to work at it to make God love me.
00:31:03.759 --> 00:31:04.319
That's not true.
00:31:04.480 --> 00:31:05.839
Like God loves me, right?
00:31:06.240 --> 00:31:11.279
But still, the more time I spend with Him, you know, that's why we're talking about reading the Bible.
00:31:11.359 --> 00:31:17.359
There's more the more time I'm in the Bible, I'm learning about God, I'm building a relationship.
00:31:17.519 --> 00:31:21.599
The more I pray, and I don't, you know, I try to pray every day.
00:31:21.839 --> 00:31:30.960
I try to pray, you know, um, about things, you know, that are going on in other people's lives or experiencing some kind of loss or pain or whatever.
00:31:31.200 --> 00:31:38.319
I try to pray for that stuff, but if I'm being honest, I don't, I don't always remember, I'm not always in the right frame of mind.
00:31:38.480 --> 00:31:39.839
Like I'm human, right?
00:31:40.160 --> 00:31:54.960
Um, but then there are times when I'm kind of snapped back into reality and I ask myself, hey man, like if you really believe in prayer, then you you should pray more often, right?
00:31:55.200 --> 00:32:02.400
And you should spend more time, not to get what I want, but just to further the relationship.
00:32:03.119 --> 00:32:08.480
How would you compare you and your growth in that practice?
00:32:08.640 --> 00:32:16.559
All right, which some would call meditation, compared to the person that you were before who didn't do that.
00:32:17.279 --> 00:32:21.440
Oh, I um I I mean vastly different, better, right?
00:32:21.599 --> 00:32:34.559
Um I'm better um because uh, you know, we we together read a book, um, something about the world in order.
00:32:34.720 --> 00:32:36.640
I know you know what book I'm referring to.
00:32:36.799 --> 00:32:39.519
Um uh Ordering Your World.
00:32:39.759 --> 00:32:41.680
Oh, yes, yes, ordering your world.
00:32:41.759 --> 00:32:42.400
Okay, I remember that.
00:32:42.559 --> 00:32:44.079
And it's about priorities.
00:32:44.319 --> 00:32:44.640
Okay.
00:32:45.279 --> 00:32:54.319
And you go through this exercise and it sounds cumbersome, but it's really not like I think you take a day or two days or something like that, and you know, you just jot down where you're spending your time.
00:32:54.480 --> 00:32:55.839
It's not how right.
00:32:56.480 --> 00:33:04.400
And then you align that with what you say your priorities are, and either you're full of shitty or not, right?
00:33:04.480 --> 00:33:06.079
Like right, legit.
00:33:06.559 --> 00:33:19.279
Yeah, like I can tell you, I can tell you that a priority is to have a relationship with God, but if I'm not reading the Bible, if I'm not stopping and praying, um no, it's not like it's just not.
00:33:19.599 --> 00:33:27.039
So I I and I say all that to say in the back of my mind, like, so that's always there, right?
00:33:27.599 --> 00:33:28.799
What's your priority?
00:33:28.880 --> 00:33:36.160
You know, if I tell some, if someone shares something with me, they're going through, you know, um, and they ask for prayer, right?
00:33:37.119 --> 00:33:43.359
What I will always try to do is, yes, I'll pray is is to pray for them.
00:33:43.440 --> 00:33:56.400
And usually I'll do it right there, either with them or I'll find someplace quiet and just take 30 seconds and I will say a prayer, I will honor that promise I just made to that person, right?
00:33:56.559 --> 00:34:09.440
Now, the old Jim, years ago, Jim, would have had every intention of saying that prayer, but you know, it was 50-50 at best, whether or not it was gonna happen.
00:34:09.519 --> 00:34:11.360
Um, and I got to a point where I didn't feel good about that.
00:34:11.440 --> 00:34:12.320
I'm like, what am I doing?
00:34:12.400 --> 00:34:16.320
Like, again, do I believe that this prayer is important or don't I?
00:34:16.480 --> 00:34:18.000
And where's my priorities?
00:34:18.320 --> 00:34:31.280
And okay, I know inside if I'm not if I'm not um doing the things I need to do to hit my priorities, and it doesn't feel good, and that and and you know, that has to change.
00:34:32.320 --> 00:34:36.960
I I think another question that comes around a lot is does it work?
00:34:37.360 --> 00:34:49.599
Right, and that kind of feeds into some of the other stuff that we've been talking about, and and to that question, my story is uh uh early recovery, which was dark.
00:34:49.760 --> 00:34:56.159
I mean, it was like I remember uh just entering the program.
00:34:56.880 --> 00:34:59.519
I mean, rock bottom.
00:34:59.679 --> 00:35:01.199
Life, life is not good.
00:35:01.360 --> 00:35:03.440
Life is not, I'm barely holding on, right?
00:35:03.679 --> 00:35:07.440
I mean, nobody knew it on the outside, but on the inside, I mean, I was a wreck.
00:35:07.599 --> 00:35:18.800
Yeah, and and I'm not buying this whole spiritual thing because I I came from this very punitive religious background, and I'm thinking to myself, you know, there's no benevolent God, he's he's just this is what I deserve.
00:35:18.960 --> 00:35:20.800
That was the that was the narrative in my head.
00:35:20.880 --> 00:35:23.920
It was like I this is all a result of my own doing.
00:35:24.800 --> 00:35:30.239
And I remember, you know, uh, so the serenity prayer is obviously very popular.
00:35:30.559 --> 00:35:37.119
God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference.
00:35:37.760 --> 00:35:40.800
And it's so simple, right?
00:35:40.880 --> 00:35:44.079
It's such a simple thing with very profound at the end of the day.
00:35:44.320 --> 00:35:54.000
But the the other thing that is very powerful about that is I I mean, that I would go minute to minute repeating that that mantra over and over again to the tune of when I was at the lowest.
00:35:54.159 --> 00:35:58.880
I mean, that was probably um one of the few things that got me through.
00:35:59.119 --> 00:36:10.960
And then what would happen is you'd get you you'd get your head above water, and you'd you'd cruise for a little bit, maybe it'd be a week, and then you'd hit something, and then you'd be right back into this thing.
00:36:11.039 --> 00:36:16.000
And then and it was that constant back and forth, and I'm asking for help.
00:36:16.239 --> 00:36:20.239
I am on a sinking ship, I am like life preserver, please.
00:36:20.320 --> 00:36:21.840
I need this right now.
00:36:22.079 --> 00:36:25.280
Not a lot of patience, not a lot of surrender happening right there.
00:36:26.400 --> 00:36:30.800
But funny, and so does it work, man.
00:36:32.000 --> 00:36:34.400
100% it does work, right?
00:36:35.039 --> 00:36:50.639
And eventually it it was that engagement with God where I was growing into the person I wanted to be, and holy cow, that person didn't act like a coping mechanism.
00:36:50.800 --> 00:37:00.960
That person actually gave up some control and actually you know surrendered and and and took it in.
00:37:01.199 --> 00:37:04.320
And man, let me tell you, so does it work a hundred percent?
00:37:04.719 --> 00:37:07.840
Does it work when I want it to on my time frame?
00:37:08.480 --> 00:37:15.760
Well, almost never when when and how, right, but does it work when and how you want it to?
00:37:16.239 --> 00:37:18.000
Not necessarily, right?
00:37:18.239 --> 00:37:22.639
Okay, and going back going back to we don't always know what's best for us, right?
00:37:23.119 --> 00:37:26.320
Right, yeah, and it and that's that'll piss you off.
00:37:27.039 --> 00:38:01.920
Well, and but some people might hear that too and be like, yeah, bullshit, like you know, especially in this culture, like you know, um, but and and and not that like you know, not that we're all we're all smart and we're all loving and we're all capable, but that doesn't mean we have all the answers, and I know that you know, everything that is best for me, I can be wrong, and and all I have to do is look back and point to you all the times that I've been wrong when I thought I knew a hundred percent that I was right, you know.
00:38:02.079 --> 00:38:04.559
You said, Does it work absolutely?
00:38:05.199 --> 00:38:08.000
But also ask yourself like what's your expectation?
00:38:08.159 --> 00:38:15.519
What does work if if now you and I both said we pray because of the relationship?
00:38:15.679 --> 00:38:19.519
Now I I pray because there's things that I ask for, right?
00:38:19.840 --> 00:38:23.360
But the bigger picture is I'm praying to further the relationship.
00:38:23.599 --> 00:38:24.960
So does it work?
00:38:25.280 --> 00:38:27.119
Does it further my relationship?
00:38:27.599 --> 00:38:30.639
Like, forget about like, do I get what I'm asking for?
00:38:30.800 --> 00:38:32.400
Am I asking for it?
00:38:32.960 --> 00:38:42.320
My relationship with Jesus is more full, it's closer because of a bunch of things, but because of prayer for sure.
00:38:43.920 --> 00:38:46.400
You you you get to ask for things.
00:38:46.639 --> 00:38:48.159
We're not saying that you don't.
00:38:48.719 --> 00:38:49.760
That is not what we're saying.
00:38:49.920 --> 00:38:50.320
100%.
00:38:50.800 --> 00:39:01.360
You but in that ask, you you know, and and in and in the repeated ask, and the asks that seem to be righteous to us, as I'm as I'm kind of like hearkening back to your example.
00:39:02.000 --> 00:39:05.039
But we we continue to ask, and that's okay.
00:39:05.280 --> 00:39:07.199
There's there's no wrong answer there.
00:39:07.360 --> 00:39:09.360
It's okay to ask, yeah.
00:39:09.519 --> 00:39:12.400
And I think that's important for our listeners to hear.
00:39:12.719 --> 00:39:14.000
Absolutely, absolutely.
00:39:14.159 --> 00:39:20.480
You know, you uh and you mentioned the serenity prayer, and early on in your recovery, you said it over and over and over and over again.
00:39:20.639 --> 00:39:22.639
Um, you know, which which is so cool.
00:39:22.719 --> 00:39:24.320
You know, I have a recovery background as well.
00:39:24.400 --> 00:39:33.360
And the serenity to this day, when I pray in the morning, um, I usually start with the our father and the serenity prayer.
00:39:33.519 --> 00:39:33.840
Okay.
00:39:34.159 --> 00:39:38.079
Now I have a little different thing I do with the serenity prayer, right?
00:39:38.239 --> 00:39:42.719
But it's interesting that we both have a thing like you, yours was repeated.
00:39:42.960 --> 00:39:50.719
Mine was I slowed it down, you know, and I said, God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change.
00:39:51.199 --> 00:39:54.079
And those things are everyone else.
00:39:54.559 --> 00:39:59.199
Like everyone every control else.
00:39:59.440 --> 00:40:01.360
I can I do not control.
00:40:02.239 --> 00:40:09.920
And the courage to change the things I can, and then I stop and I say, me, like right here, right now.
00:40:10.000 --> 00:40:12.960
Yeah, like that's all I can change.
00:40:13.760 --> 00:40:30.639
And then and the wisdom to know the difference, like you know, it's and I just stop and think about like those words, because if I don't know the difference between what I can control and what I can't control, none of it means anything.
00:40:31.280 --> 00:40:37.519
So yeah, so and so you man, give me the wisdom, give me, give me the wisdom, yeah.
00:40:37.840 --> 00:40:44.880
To see myself truly and fully and in the grand scheme that I'm not something, I am part of something.
00:40:45.199 --> 00:40:45.519
Amen.
00:40:46.000 --> 00:40:46.639
Yeah.
00:40:47.199 --> 00:40:59.920
Last one of the last things I'll ask is like you know, uh obviously you've been praying the same thing for a while in that particular vein, but is there other are there other things that you typically pray for?
00:41:00.880 --> 00:41:06.400
Yeah, so I mean, that's something I I prayed, I've been praying for for a while.
00:41:06.639 --> 00:41:18.480
Um, I pray there's someone else who I love, you know, more than just about anyone else in this world, a few other people, um, but who I pray a specific prayer for every day.
00:41:18.559 --> 00:41:19.760
And I have been.
00:41:20.079 --> 00:41:33.599
Um, and and that's one where if I stop and I look back and I and I realize what I've been praying for all these years, like it it has happened, it is happening.
00:41:33.840 --> 00:41:36.079
Um, you know, that's a that's a win.
00:41:36.320 --> 00:41:46.000
I pray for yeah, I pray for, you know, my my wife, um, you know, and things that she has she shares with me about what she's going through.
00:41:46.159 --> 00:41:47.599
I pray for our marriage.
00:41:47.760 --> 00:41:58.000
I pray for, you know, I pray for you and the family um, you know, that has moved away and is experiencing new things, other people we know who have moved to other states.
00:41:58.239 --> 00:42:04.559
Um, I pray for people in our orbit that I know are going through difficult times.
00:42:04.719 --> 00:42:19.519
And um, you know, so so and I and I I typically, you know, I I have I don't know, but I'll just say like 10 different groups of people or whatever that I will pray for.
00:42:19.599 --> 00:42:30.559
I don't pray for all of them, but I typically kind of go through those and um and have the usual suspects, and then I'll add, you know, something or someone to that uh uh every now and then.
00:42:30.639 --> 00:42:34.719
But it tends it tends to be a lot of the same stuff.
00:42:35.280 --> 00:42:36.559
Strong, strong.
00:42:36.880 --> 00:42:37.599
How about you?
00:42:38.079 --> 00:42:59.440
I typically pray against my fears, and I I do that very intentionally because um I think especially in today's day and age with with you, you got a lot of news coming at you, and and you know, you gotta I think there's this fear culture out there that people dig uh and make money off of.
00:42:59.519 --> 00:43:05.840
And and I think that at the end of the day, uh and it is it a coper?
00:43:06.000 --> 00:43:21.599
I I mean, I suppose, but this is a coping mechanism that I truly, honestly, legitimately, and fervently believe in that instead of being afraid of X, Y, and Z, just to relinquish the control, surrender it up and say, Hey, listen, God, here's here's the deal.
00:43:21.760 --> 00:43:25.199
Yeah, um, yeah, I need your help right here to understand this.
00:43:25.760 --> 00:43:36.480
Um and I'm talking about like hardcore stuff that is you know happening uh on all levels, globally, but also like personally.
00:43:36.960 --> 00:43:42.960
Like I pray for the strength to forgive, which I struggle with so much, right?
00:43:43.199 --> 00:43:45.360
Yeah, and that's where I need a lot of help.
00:43:45.440 --> 00:43:55.599
But and and and I I pray for the tools and the and and and the other thing I is is I you know I I'm not afraid to admit that I pray to hear the voice that is Christ.
00:43:55.679 --> 00:43:58.159
And I think that is I I I need help with that, man.
00:43:58.239 --> 00:43:59.599
I think I struggle with that probably the.
00:44:00.159 --> 00:44:04.400
Most of anything is to hear the voice and the response.
00:44:04.639 --> 00:44:04.880
Yeah.
00:44:05.599 --> 00:44:08.639
Did you say you're did you say you're ashamed to admit that?
00:44:09.360 --> 00:44:10.400
Uh yeah, a little bit.
00:44:10.480 --> 00:44:10.719
Yeah.
00:44:10.800 --> 00:44:11.039
Yeah.
00:44:11.119 --> 00:44:12.719
Oh man, dude, dude, dude.
00:44:12.800 --> 00:44:15.840
I'm I'm glad you're listening to this podcast today, Larry.
00:44:16.000 --> 00:44:20.079
Um it's one of the things I pray for all the time.
00:44:20.159 --> 00:44:25.360
And I the the prayer is just asking God, you know, tell me what I need to hear.
00:44:25.679 --> 00:44:26.079
Amen.
00:44:26.320 --> 00:44:26.639
Yeah.
00:44:26.960 --> 00:44:31.119
Yeah, tell me, tell me what I need to hear and have my ears be open, right?
00:44:31.280 --> 00:44:40.320
Because I know, you know, um, uh, yeah, I don't think I can't tell you how to feel, but man, there's no shame in that.
00:44:40.400 --> 00:44:42.719
Like that's that's that's humanist, you know.
00:44:42.800 --> 00:44:53.679
But it's interesting, like in the Bible, um, again, like there's so there's you know, different parts of the Bible, you know, Paul talks about uh our gifts, right?
00:44:53.840 --> 00:45:03.039
And you know, the gifts of prophecy and teaching and leading and um encouraging and uh being being generous and all these things.
00:45:03.280 --> 00:45:04.960
I pray for those things, right?
00:45:05.039 --> 00:45:11.440
I pray for um for me, I tend to pray for peace, you know, for peace for me.
00:45:11.599 --> 00:45:21.360
I mean, I don't know how many times in the New Testament the the word peace is used or you know, or Jesus references peace, but it is a lot, right?
00:45:21.519 --> 00:45:24.480
I pray for peace, I pay for wisdom, right?
00:45:24.639 --> 00:45:33.039
Like, God, give me wisdom, you know, to to speak into things, to to make decisions you need to make.
00:45:33.199 --> 00:45:37.599
I pray to be loving, um, for strength, right?
00:45:37.760 --> 00:45:39.039
Because life is hard, man.
00:45:39.360 --> 00:45:41.679
For faith, I pray for my faith.
00:45:41.840 --> 00:45:47.840
Um, because it's not it's not a hundred percent all on all the time.
00:45:48.079 --> 00:46:12.320
Um so you know, like uh, and and I think um, you know, we're not gonna really get into like what does Jesus say about prayer, but go to Matthew chapter six, um, and like around verse five and on, Jesus talks about praying and and what his what his views are on praying and how to pray.
00:46:12.400 --> 00:46:19.360
The Our Father, you know, when the disciples ask him how how should we pray, because they saw him pray all the time.
00:46:19.519 --> 00:46:21.840
Like, here's the Son of God, he you know, right?
00:46:22.400 --> 00:46:29.280
God, like praying to God, like one of the most powerful things in the New Testament is him him praying.
00:46:29.599 --> 00:46:35.920
Man, don't make me do this, don't you know, like like we like the crucification, the crucifixion.
00:46:36.159 --> 00:46:40.559
We hey man, if it's your will, God, take this from me.
00:46:41.440 --> 00:46:43.760
But if not, like here I am, right?
00:46:43.920 --> 00:46:46.000
Like this is God praying to God, right?
00:46:46.079 --> 00:46:49.519
That's the the human in human form praying to God.
00:46:49.760 --> 00:47:00.960
Um, but he and and when they ask him how to pray, he says, you know, he gives them the our father, pray this way, and then that's where the hour father comes from, is is right out of the Bible.
00:47:01.039 --> 00:47:14.400
Um, so there's there's so many good examples in the Bible of Jesus, you know, they don't make a big deal out of it, but they're going through whatever, and it's like, and Jesus went off um in the wilderness to find quiet and pray.
00:47:15.599 --> 00:47:19.039
And and he like all the time.
00:47:20.239 --> 00:47:22.320
Yeah, yeah, all the time.
00:47:22.880 --> 00:47:24.960
So it's one of those things that we get it.
00:47:25.039 --> 00:47:39.199
It's I I will say that uh in the journey of the the books that I've read about prayer and and the active pursuit that I've I've done the research on prayer has been probably the most significant faith growth for me.
00:47:39.679 --> 00:47:44.960
Um like just leaps forward, leaps forward, uh, and that's been a lot of fun.
00:47:45.280 --> 00:47:50.159
I would say, you know, like to kind of just close out the topic.
00:47:50.320 --> 00:47:59.039
Um, you know, if you're out there and um, you know, you're thinking about prayer, uh, you cannot do it wrong.
00:47:59.199 --> 00:48:09.280
I don't like I like I don't think I don't like if you're hesitating because you don't know how to do it, you don't know what to say, how to say it, words to you can't do it wrong, man.
00:48:09.440 --> 00:48:12.320
Like there be you, be you.
00:48:12.719 --> 00:48:17.760
Um, I would say the only thing we can get wrong is our expectation.
00:48:18.079 --> 00:48:25.360
The the motivation is to build a relationship with God and ask for things, right?
00:48:25.519 --> 00:48:28.159
Even if you don't know if it's like the right thing, ask for it.
00:48:28.239 --> 00:48:30.559
It's what it's what you want, it's what your heart is telling.
00:48:30.800 --> 00:48:39.840
Ask for it, and then keep asking for it, keep asking for it, and maybe you'll find that ask changes or it doesn't change, or I don't know.
00:48:40.159 --> 00:48:44.639
But man, just like take one step, one step every day.
00:48:44.719 --> 00:48:45.519
Keep going.
00:48:46.480 --> 00:48:57.280
We we cannot thank you as a listener enough for for taking a risk and and engaging us on your growth journey, because growth is not necessarily fun all the time.
00:48:57.440 --> 00:49:07.760
And and as you are growing in your faith and you're super curious as to like what's this all about, you're risking and listening to what we have to say and being part of this conversational journey.
00:49:08.000 --> 00:49:10.639
So uh just huge gratitude for that.
00:49:10.880 --> 00:49:24.079
Uh, we're praying for our listeners, uh, and and uh that the message gets out there that we fully believe is righteous and just uh just so happy to engage with you guys and be able to do this.
00:49:24.239 --> 00:49:30.960
So uh as as we come to a close, just uh looking forward to our next episodes.
00:49:31.119 --> 00:49:32.000
Uh, thank you so much.
00:49:32.159 --> 00:49:35.679
I also want to shout out to our new YouTube channel.
00:49:35.840 --> 00:49:37.360
By all means, check that out.
00:49:37.440 --> 00:49:39.440
We're gonna be adding some more content on there.
00:49:39.679 --> 00:49:40.159
Take care.
00:49:40.400 --> 00:49:40.719
Awesome.
00:49:40.880 --> 00:49:41.360
Take care.
00:49:41.599 --> 00:49:42.960
Hey, thanks for hanging out with us.
00:49:43.119 --> 00:49:49.280
Wherever you are with faith, whether it's curious, skeptical, or just tired, we're glad you're here.
00:49:49.440 --> 00:49:52.960
And if this stirred up thoughts or questions, don't rush past them.
00:49:53.440 --> 00:49:54.800
Just sit with them.
00:49:55.119 --> 00:49:56.960
We'll keep the conversation going.
