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designing a three-year degree for select programs or providing that as an option and measuring the results is a tool to that end of being truly student-centered and research-based.
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Welcome to the Engaged by Design podcast, where we help you engage more learners more effectively.
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And welcome to part two of our conversation with Dr.
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Lori Carroll, the Chancellor of the University of Minnesota, Rochester.
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And we continue our conversation today about leadership and leading change, especially in regards to the three-year degree, where we shorten the requirements for a bachelor's degree from 120 credits or about four years to a three-year degree in 90 to 96 credits for some students.
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Let's jump right back into the conversation with Vernon and with Lori and see what we can learn today I think this is pretty core to what you're talking about, and that is you're looking for collective wisdom.
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You have sprints, you have convenings, you have all of these things that you've put in place to gather that wisdom.
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Are there specific things that, that you did to lead that so that you avoid the turf wars and the, you know, all of the conflicts that can happen in academia so that you could come to that collective wisdom?
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What seemed to work, or what didn't work?
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My answer may be interpreted as Pollyanna, but it's real.
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I think we have to start with a question to ourselves.
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Are we true believers in the power of learning?
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Are we?
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Mm-hmm.
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Yes.
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Uh,
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Good.
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And, and
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Thank you.
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doesn't
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Yes.
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uh, to me.
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That do- that sounds like, you know,
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Because then things like needing to delay gratification, needing to work through, you know, inherent conflict without personalization, needing to name barriers that are inadvertent, some policy that made sense in 1957 and is now standing in the way.
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As I mentioned earlier, being humble and authentic in looking at the outcomes of the collective, which, you know, we're squandering human potential every day in higher ed.
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That should grieve us if we are true believers.
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So that true belief in me is so deep that persevering through what looks like barriers is worthwhile.
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And we're not doing this for our own sake.
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Like,"Hey, Bob, let's find something that makes us famous." Like in his case, he's already famous.
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In my case, I don't care.
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I, I have a local campus I love.
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We're-- That is not it.
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It's what if higher ed could support more students because we have a way to design things that is more affordable and has better outcomes?
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The only way to test that is to actually do it and measure and then, you know, change based on what we learn.
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That takes a lot of time.
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So we're at the beginning, even though it's expanding rapidly.
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Uh, but this idea is a good one, and if we proceed with integrity and look at the data to make decisions, I think we might really have something
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L- Lori, to be clear, w- we're not talking about the end of the four-year baccalaureate degree.
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Would you talk about your thinking around that and the purpose and the value of that four-year degree still?
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No, we're talking about the revitalization of higher ed,
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Mm-hmm
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designing a three-year degree for select programs or providing that as an option and measuring the results is a tool to that end of being truly student-centered and research-based.
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If higher ed took on those two mantras, more students would succeed, more students would be attracted, and the common good would be served.
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Now, specifically to contrast the outcomes of four-year and three-year degrees is an intention of this experiment.
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Mm-hmm
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We know the outcomes in terms of completion at present for four-year degrees.
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We know that 120 credits, uh, or more in some cases accomplished does not necessarily mean, uh, career success, wellbeing, both physical and, uh, also financial.
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We know is-- there's not a guarantee there.
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We know that there are demographics that are stronger in the group that doesn't complete, you know, than the group that does.
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That's not okay, right?
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And it's on us to meet students from any background who we admit to our campuses to meet them with practices that will support their success.
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And there you have it.
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I love that because, you know, you're talking about this is a much larger conversation, and to look at it just as a three-year degree is missing the point.
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It's missing the big picture, which is reform of all higher education, so that it's evidence-based, it's concentrated on student outcomes and student success, and doing a much better job.
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I mean, US higher education is very diverse.
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It's got a lot of just wonderful things, obviously we, we could be better.
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You know, Lori, there in the formation and the, appearance of these different, three-year degrees, there's been some opposition that's starting to raise its head.
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What are the things that you would hope that the folks that are really, I would say, either aware of or afraid of or, you know, see big red flags for this, what are those things that you would hope that they would understand and understand about the approach here?
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Well, first I would invite them to keep raising their concerns, right?
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This is how all of us get better, and skepticism is, you know There's plenty of it in higher ed, right?
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We, we think critically, and that is good.
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So all of this is about a conversation, and the collective wisdom is going to be fed by the questions.
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Uh, and, uh, I hope we'd start with an assumption of positive intent.
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Always good.
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Always good.
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Uh, that the motivation here is to design better undergraduate education for better success and to as- have that be more affordable as well.
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You know, we had this, uh, privilege here on the Rochester campus of the University of Minnesota to have a blank canvas.
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We're a newer campus, and who gets this, right?
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Uh, it was such a gift and such a privilege, and we've taken it very seriously.
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And College in 3 is just a little bit like that.
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Uh, we ask faculty across disciplines who come together to think, what if you had a blank canvas?
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How could you design something that's student-centered, that's informed by data, research about how people learn?
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Think of it.
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What could it look like?
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You know, and, uh, those brainstorming activities get to glorious places where, you know, we just immerse in an environment and the questions that come up, you know, uh, way beyond what College in 3, you know, parameters are.
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But just really thinking about, uh, the redesign together.
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So, uh, I would say start with there's an assumption of positive intent, and it's right and good and helpful to raise the concerns about inadvertent consequences, and then to inspect our own assumptions.
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So a first is that because the four years and the 120 credits is a long-standing tradition, uh, that we shouldn't question it.
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Well, come on now.
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Isn't there a little dissonance if you're being skeptical that you won't be skeptical about our own practice?
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And hey, how about let's look at the data.
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Who is it that's not completing?
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Uh, and do we know that there are research-based practices that could help more people from a particular demographic, let's say the first in their generation in their family to go to college, that we might be able to, uh...
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We, we know some practices that help them.
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What if we design that in there?
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So bringing skepticism in all directions.
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Of course, our current context in higher education is, what's the word?
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Fraught, right?
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So,
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I think you're right.
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I think that's how, you nailed it
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And so that, that Context could fuel anxiety, legit anxiety, a-about a number of things and, you know, could inform a perspective that, like, this is one more way that the value of higher education is being undermined or attacked.
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Well, you know, my reply to that, if there's someone who wants to hear the other perspective, has to do with leading change from within to the benefit of the common good, our society, our democracy, and to the benefit of individual students that we have admitted to our campuses.
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Uh, so, uh, I, uh, listen very carefully and read those who are questioning or dismantling or, you know, nay-saying or whatever.
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I read those, uh, much more carefully, uh, than the rah-rahs at this point because I want to learn.
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Uh, may we all continue to want to learn in higher education.
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Absolutely.
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And hearing those voices, not trying to silence voices, but to hear those voices, it's, uh, so important for if we're actually honest about gathering data and getting perspectives, uh, for doing this.
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Lori, I'd like you to brag a little bit about, you don't have to brag, but, uh, I think there's something, uh, that can be bragged about your experience at, uh, University of Minnesota Rochester.
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And, uh, if you would talk a little bit about your, your attempt or your first, uh, and, and the, the unique nature of the three-year degree that you did on, on this brand-new start from scratch Greenfield campus and, uh, uh, how that has impacted and informed others.
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I just want you to talk about your experience there and, and what, what this has done.
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Well, Ed, let's be clear, the bragging is on the faculty, uh, because it was a faculty design team, and it was
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great statement by a chancellor.
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That is a, a well-known, a very
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Yeah
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that says that.
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Well, it's a, it's a truth.
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it is, true
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it is the truth.
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Uh, we do have these three principles here, that students are at the center, research informs practice, and partners make it possible.
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We have many partners that are important part of this as well.
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It's a different kind of culture for a campus because, uh, we got to start with that blank canvas, and some early decisions set us on this trajectory and, you know, uh, we could spend the rest of the time thanking all those people who contributed to that.
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But that, that first design, uh, embedded, uh, evidence-based practice, including a paid internship with an employer partner, Mayo Clinic.
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Uh, and, uh, that was a critical element of the design.
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It was year-round block scheduled seven-week courses integrated around a theme.
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We are a campus focused on health in a wide array of kinds of health careers.
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And so that is our golden thread that can weave through all courses and connect to student motivation.
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We structured it in a cohort model with living/learning communities and first-year experience and community-engaged learning and individually planned capstones and all flipped active interdisciplinary team teaching.
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We had all the goodies.
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Mm-hmm
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and the outcomes were good.
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It was a small pilot.
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Uh, and we were, you know, paddling through the unknowns of the pandemic.
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Uh, so where we are now is that those characteristics, uh, including opportunity for internship, though not all engage in an internship.
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We're at about eighty-six percent with work-based learning with our employer partner.
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Uh, but those elements I just named, living/learning communities, community-engaged learning, flipped active instruction, work-based learning opportunities, and capstone are, uh, those are a part of every major and degree that we offer, every student's experience here.
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And as a result, uh, in multiple years, most of the years since twenty seventeen, with two-thirds of our student body underrepresented, historically underrepresented in higher education, over two-thirds, we have no gap in completion, uh, with students who are not from underrepresented backgrounds.
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And that's what res- Research-based practice and good design will do.
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That is an important outcome.
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So at present, we've expanded into a whole array of programs we call Get Forward Faster, and about 30% of our students are completing in three years or fewer
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Wow.
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Wow.
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This is-- Talk about your partnership, uh, that you, uh, did.
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How did the, as you approach partners in business and, and, and the medical field, and how did they receive the, this, uh, approach that you, MR, w- was, was contemplating?
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Well, I have to look back for a minute, and that looking back involves how the campus came to be.
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So Rochester, Minnesota is America's city for health, the home of Mayo Clinic, serving three million patients and their companions every year, the number one hospital in the world year after year.
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It's a very special community.
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It attracts many innovators, and the research output is high.
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In the early sixties, a woman and then a group of friends, and then the momentum grew, uh, observed that a University of Minnesota campus was needed in this community, given the nature of the community and the talent needs of the community.
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Health, technology, science, all were a part of that dream, and citizen advocates worked for decades to make that dream come true.
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Mayo Clinic was one of the primary advocates for bringing this campus here.
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And note that very few new public university campuses have been started in this century.
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Uh, so, uh, there was a large welcome mat when it finally happened, our first graduating class in twenty thirteen.
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So already was established the expectation that this campus would produce talent.
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That we would do it in partnership came from some early decisions to plant the campus right in the middle of downtown Rochester, embedded in Mayo spaces.
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Mm-hmm
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uh, our, our physical plant has continued to seek adjacencies with, uh, the employers that we serve.
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So that history is important.
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I know that wasn't your question,
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No,
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they're-
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is important.
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The context means it
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Yes.
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much
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And so the readiness for the conversation about Mayo Clinic, if you have brand new talent coming from college, what do they most need?
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And we were able, with a variety of angles and perspectives from Mayo Clinic, which of course is vast, uh, to identify proficiencies and habits that they would want a new college grad to have.
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And then our faculty designed around those.
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That conversation continues.
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We just had another one last Friday.
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Uh, what are those evolving competencies or proficiencies?
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And they are evolving so rapidly as we look at digital health and AI and automation.
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The core competency that is currently desired is, wait for it, I love it, curiosity Right?
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So it used to be can they code in R or some such, you know, discrete skill, which is not really what higher education is about.
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But an appetite fueled by curiosity to solve problems that require multidisciplinary thinking and the awareness that there's no solution on the shelf for this thing, so we're gonna have to work together.
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So to design an undergraduate education that produces hyper curious people who think with, uh, multiple disciplinary perspectives, what a beautiful challenge for us.
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So that partnership with this employer is, uh, longstanding and evolving and, uh, and it's a partnership for which we are very grateful
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That's wonderful.
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And yes, Mayo Clinic, my wife actually worked for Mayo Clinic, and one of the things I was always impressed w- by was they said the only interest to be considered is the interest of the patient.
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And it seems that, you know, that type of patient-centeredness values align quite well with what you're trying to do at, uh, UMR
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And in fact, we have a chart And our, our needs of the student come first, uh, their learning, their development, their wellbeing, and that aligns with the-- It's a hyperfocus.
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We know why we exist.
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Mayo knows why it exists.
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The needs of the patient come first, and there's high integrity at all facets of their operation.
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We know why we exist.
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Uh, we are here for one purpose, and that is the development of human potential, right?
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For the student success, you can talk about it as workforce, but there's a journey between a childhood ambition to make a difference in the world through a career in health and readiness to do so.
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And we get to be a part of that journey in the middle, and we must put the needs, the learning and development needs of the student first
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Uh, I, I so much love that.
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Lori, i- in, at, in your current position, and you talked about a book that's coming out, so we're gonna be looking for that book.
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But, what are some things on the future, on the horizon that, you know, not necessarily things that keep you up at night, but, what's on the chancellor's mind, these days, in addition to the things you talk about with students?
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Well, of course, I mentioned the students who've just arrived, uh, we're enthusiastic about supporting their success, and that's always the first priority.
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W- And, uh, the University of Minnesota broadly, uh, with its five campuses, has committed through a strategic roadmap called Elevate Extraordinary 2030 to some strategic imperatives, as is true on campuses a- across the country.
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One of those strategic imperatives is innovate to transform the future of learning.
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When I saw that on the final draft, I felt a sense of satisfaction and excitement for adventure at the extreme.
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What is possible when the University of Minnesota world-class institution commits to using its strength in learning research to catapult revitalization that supports student success?
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We'll be having a convening of those who do research on student learning and development and those who lead programs that are evidence-based to support student success in October.
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And from that, uh, will emerge a newly designed accelerator of learning innovation that we have committed to, uh, informing new designs.
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Some of them may be accelerated.
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We shall see.
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Uh, new designs that you students and employers in the co-design are research-based and support increased student success in all of its facets.
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And those pilots will be funded, and we'll study them, and we hope that, uh, all of that will create a design process that contributes not only to greater success for students across the University of Minnesota but puts in place a design process that might be of use to others across higher education.
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So this excitement for the next adventure across the University of Minnesota's campuses is pretty high.
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That's my answer to your question.
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I love that.
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Well, we're all about engaging, and design, and so it seems that you're doing both of those things.
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Michael, I wanted to see if you wanted to jump here with any questions.
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Yeah, I, I think I, I tried to get to it a little bit earlier, and that is how do you lead this kind of change, right?
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What kinds of specific things do you need to do as the chancellor to allow this change to continue?
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There's the curiosity mindset, there's the adventure, but are there specific things operationally that you had to put in place to make the changes happen, to get collaboration, to actually have a solid design you could execute?
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Is there anything special in what you did over the last few years?
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I think remember our advantage of starting from scratch.
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Yes
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that has to be acknowledged.
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That was a gift unto us, right?
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And then creating principles and engaging every single staff and faculty member in creating those principles.
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And, you know, we are linked arms, uh, around those principles that students are at the center, research informs practice, and partners make it possible, and it informs all our decisions, and when we set something aside, it's been informed by that.
00:26:15.160 --> 00:26:17.150
We're all in and we all know that.
00:26:17.160 --> 00:26:23.259
So that, that is culture, and here it was fed by, in the beginning, there were only 13 people.
00:26:23.259 --> 00:26:25.500
They sat in a circle and made decisions, right?
00:26:25.500 --> 00:26:26.089
And so that-
00:26:26.253 --> 00:26:26.804
easier.
00:26:27.119 --> 00:26:27.559
Yeah.
00:26:27.650 --> 00:26:28.190
That's right.
00:26:28.500 --> 00:26:43.220
Uh, and, and so keeping that spirit of collaboration and innovation and student-centeredness, uh, in mind as we design organizational structure to be as flat as possible, as inclusive as possible.
00:26:43.609 --> 00:26:48.049
Uh, a reminder that my discipline is human communication,
00:26:48.220 --> 00:26:48.819
Mm-hmm
00:26:49.299 --> 00:27:19.640
have studied how we use the spoken word to bring about change, and the principles around that and various approaches like the revitalization movement or diffusion of innovation, all of that come down to human, uh, communication and connection and, uh, asking questions and getting answers and being transparent, uh, in, in how we get to those answers and coming back to the principles.
00:27:19.930 --> 00:27:25.009
So operationally we're at a point where we're scaling.
00:27:25.240 --> 00:27:33.756
You know, the, the first graduating class in 20, uh, 13 had- 57 souls, uh, what trailblazers they were.
00:27:34.096 --> 00:27:47.316
Uh, and, uh, we'll be announcing numbers on day 10, of course, not before, but, you know, we're well over our first target, um, by a few hundred, and that first target was 1,000.
00:27:47.316 --> 00:27:52.326
Uh, we're moving on to 2,500 students and expanding our spaces.
00:27:52.326 --> 00:28:02.506
And so our question has become: How do we sustain our innovative, collaborative culture that is student-centered and research-informed as we scale?
00:28:02.806 --> 00:28:20.986
So we have deployed action teams that are, you know, short period of time to imagine the practice, let's say community-engaged learning or flipped active learning or capstone, you know, the lists that I had before, uh, to imagine that at scale.
00:28:21.006 --> 00:28:24.135
So we have 2,500 students in that.
00:28:24.145 --> 00:28:25.945
What can that look like?
00:28:26.165 --> 00:28:30.306
It, it can't look like it looks today at 12 or 1,300.
00:28:30.566 --> 00:28:31.615
What will that look like?
00:28:31.615 --> 00:28:34.536
And then let's backwards design to that and phase.
00:28:34.596 --> 00:28:38.925
So every year is an anomaly, uh, right, as we phase.
00:28:38.976 --> 00:28:52.726
Well, this year we're doing it this way because we've agreed to how we're gonna get to having this practice when we scale, so we still have the same kinds of student outcomes.
00:28:52.965 --> 00:28:57.736
And it's, it's an everybody in sort of thing, so those who are...
00:28:57.965 --> 00:29:01.026
Success coaching is one of our evidence-based practices.
00:29:01.026 --> 00:29:03.516
It's like a life coach from beginning to end.
00:29:03.945 --> 00:29:15.736
Uh, and, uh, so the coaches themselves imagined us at scale and, uh, made recommendations, and we're gonna use those to inform how we move forward.
00:29:15.746 --> 00:29:34.425
So, uh, the inclusiveness, the planning, the transparency, the organizational structure, and, uh, the attraction of people who are convicted by the same belief system that I described earlier, that learning really matters and higher ed fuels the common good
00:29:36.781 --> 00:29:39.902
Oh, that was so, uh, exciting.
00:29:39.912 --> 00:29:58.991
It's also thoughtful, and it also speaks a lot to your leadership, uh, your approach and it is nice having a greenfield or a s- first start because it, you can shape the culture and keep that culture coherent, have integrity so that it doesn't drift, which can often happen at, with scale.
00:29:59.640 --> 00:30:07.650
Well, let me just note one thing, and that is, uh, when I first arrived we did, uh, we sought out campuses that were new.
00:30:07.710 --> 00:30:10.930
None of them were under 50 years old.
00:30:11.180 --> 00:30:14.220
Uh, but all of them had a common theme.
00:30:14.230 --> 00:30:17.529
They said the original innovators became the blockade.
00:30:18.690 --> 00:30:22.869
And so we, we will not do that.
00:30:23.519 --> 00:30:28.069
We know what was working early on, but everything's changing.
00:30:28.299 --> 00:30:30.329
Uh, we have to keep changing too.
00:30:30.740 --> 00:30:35.690
Uh, we're-- Our enterprise is about learning, so we better be a learning organization ourselves.
00:30:35.700 --> 00:30:43.829
So hopefully I won't be one of those who become the blockade ever by saying,"Oh, that's the thing that's innovative." It's like, no.
00:30:44.250 --> 00:30:45.900
Today's student, what do they need?
00:30:45.910 --> 00:30:47.019
How can we provide it?
00:30:47.019 --> 00:30:49.349
Let's study it and then let's adapt
00:30:50.599 --> 00:31:02.210
I always think that great leaders know how to remove barriers, even if it is, if they look around and say,"Okay, I might be the barrier here." A, a great leader knows how to move things and let folks do their jobs.
00:31:02.690 --> 00:31:05.140
Lori, it's been such a pleasure having you on here.
00:31:05.220 --> 00:31:07.490
We are excited about the work you're doing.
00:31:07.490 --> 00:31:14.839
We're also really impressed by the intentionality, the design, the thoughtfulness.
00:31:14.849 --> 00:31:19.500
I mean, your, your faculty heart comes through, your care for students comes through with this.
00:31:19.829 --> 00:31:30.650
We, we like to end our, uh, by asking our guests the question, and that is: How do you engage more learners more effectively?
00:31:31.099 --> 00:31:32.589
And whatever your answer is.
00:31:32.589 --> 00:31:37.180
So Lori, Chance- Chancellor Carrell, how do you engage more learners more effectively?
00:31:38.842 --> 00:31:54.162
Well, I think that I've answered it already, but I will be happy to get out my highlighter and, you know, personally, I'm no good if I don't know learners and I don't listen to them.
00:31:54.612 --> 00:31:59.112
So I have a group of students who inform and fuel me.
00:32:00.261 --> 00:32:13.571
At the collective level, as we together pursue wisdom, we must also listen to learners, and we do that collectively at scale through data.
00:32:14.112 --> 00:32:16.692
So how do students learn and develop?
00:32:16.771 --> 00:32:23.481
We must be constantly collecting that information, analyzing it, and then adapting.
00:32:23.932 --> 00:32:27.172
And that's how we will engage more learners.
00:32:27.201 --> 00:32:35.471
We are also a growing campus here, and there are many challenges to growth across higher education right now.
00:32:35.491 --> 00:32:55.122
But your question does lead me to think about that and our action team process where we're imagining the evidence-based practices that we know today, scaling to meet future students' needs has been a critical element as well.
00:32:55.561 --> 00:33:09.961
But I wanna repeat, if you're in higher education and you haven't listened to an eighteen or nineteen-year-old learner for a while, sit yourself down and enjoy.
00:33:10.461 --> 00:33:27.491
It, it really matters that the perspective of the ones we serve are taken into consideration as we pursue doing things better, doing them differently to do them better
00:33:29.559 --> 00:33:29.839
Oh.
00:33:31.140 --> 00:33:32.720
Ah, I'm just so excited.
00:33:32.980 --> 00:33:35.240
Lori, this has been an absolute pleasure.
00:33:35.289 --> 00:33:36.970
Um, you.
00:33:36.970 --> 00:33:51.500
I, we were sort of going down with one story, but it, it actually gave us a better story, a more in-depth story of not only your leadership journey, as well as the, the UMR, uh, journey and with Collagen 3.
00:33:51.500 --> 00:33:53.569
So it's, it's been just such a pleasure.
00:33:53.569 --> 00:33:55.210
We are so thankful for your time.
00:33:55.470 --> 00:34:07.900
I know that you probably have to get back to, uh, the scavenger hunt and, and other things like that, but we, we really appreciate your time, and Lori, thank you for joining us on the Engaged by Design podcast
00:34:09.268 --> 00:34:10.188
Thank you for having me.
00:34:10.188 --> 00:34:11.987
It's been a pleasure to talk with you
00:34:12.427 --> 00:34:19.608
Thank you, K- thank you, Lori Thank you for listening to part two of our conversation with Dr.
00:34:19.608 --> 00:34:38.568
Lori Carroll, where we learned more about that three-year degree and about leadership and leading through change in a way that is very inclusive and human and creates stronger connections within our institutions and across institutions as we try to make change happen all across the higher ed industry.
00:34:39.907 --> 00:34:52.577
Join us next time for our next fabulous guest, where I'm sure we will learn more about how to lead innovation in higher education and how we can engage by design.
00:00:07.411 --> 00:00:25.972
designing a three-year degree for select programs or providing that as an option and measuring the results is a tool to that end of being truly student-centered and research-based.
00:00:29.821 --> 00:00:36.762
Welcome to the Engaged by Design podcast, where we help you engage more learners more effectively.
00:00:37.371 --> 00:00:40.371
And welcome to part two of our conversation with Dr.
00:00:40.371 --> 00:00:45.061
Lori Carroll, the Chancellor of the University of Minnesota, Rochester.
00:00:45.521 --> 00:01:04.632
And we continue our conversation today about leadership and leading change, especially in regards to the three-year degree, where we shorten the requirements for a bachelor's degree from 120 credits or about four years to a three-year degree in 90 to 96 credits for some students.
00:01:05.412 --> 00:01:18.941
Let's jump right back into the conversation with Vernon and with Lori and see what we can learn today I think this is pretty core to what you're talking about, and that is you're looking for collective wisdom.
00:01:19.840 --> 00:01:26.361
You have sprints, you have convenings, you have all of these things that you've put in place to gather that wisdom.
00:01:27.301 --> 00:01:39.661
Are there specific things that, that you did to lead that so that you avoid the turf wars and the, you know, all of the conflicts that can happen in academia so that you could come to that collective wisdom?
00:01:40.271 --> 00:01:42.120
What seemed to work, or what didn't work?
00:01:44.611 --> 00:01:50.021
My answer may be interpreted as Pollyanna, but it's real.
00:01:50.850 --> 00:01:55.561
I think we have to start with a question to ourselves.
00:01:55.850 --> 00:02:00.581
Are we true believers in the power of learning?
00:02:02.763 --> 00:02:03.373
Are we?
00:02:04.094 --> 00:02:04.814
Mm-hmm.
00:02:04.984 --> 00:02:05.564
Yes.
00:02:06.295 --> 00:02:06.635
Uh,
00:02:06.697 --> 00:02:07.046
Good.
00:02:07.344 --> 00:02:07.564
And, and
00:02:07.807 --> 00:02:08.146
Thank you.
00:02:08.235 --> 00:02:08.485
doesn't
00:02:08.687 --> 00:02:09.157
Yes.
00:02:09.724 --> 00:02:10.254
uh, to me.
00:02:10.264 --> 00:02:11.985
That do- that sounds like, you know,
00:02:12.007 --> 00:02:40.917
Because then things like needing to delay gratification, needing to work through, you know, inherent conflict without personalization, needing to name barriers that are inadvertent, some policy that made sense in 1957 and is now standing in the way.
00:02:41.986 --> 00:02:58.377
As I mentioned earlier, being humble and authentic in looking at the outcomes of the collective, which, you know, we're squandering human potential every day in higher ed.
00:02:58.776 --> 00:03:03.676
That should grieve us if we are true believers.
00:03:04.046 --> 00:03:15.956
So that true belief in me is so deep that persevering through what looks like barriers is worthwhile.
00:03:16.717 --> 00:03:23.116
And we're not doing this for our own sake.
00:03:23.176 --> 00:03:31.567
Like,"Hey, Bob, let's find something that makes us famous." Like in his case, he's already famous.
00:03:31.567 --> 00:03:33.306
In my case, I don't care.
00:03:33.336 --> 00:03:35.747
I, I have a local campus I love.
00:03:36.046 --> 00:03:37.616
We're-- That is not it.
00:03:38.106 --> 00:03:51.227
It's what if higher ed could support more students because we have a way to design things that is more affordable and has better outcomes?
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The only way to test that is to actually do it and measure and then, you know, change based on what we learn.
00:04:02.266 --> 00:04:04.007
That takes a lot of time.
00:04:04.306 --> 00:04:09.076
So we're at the beginning, even though it's expanding rapidly.
00:04:09.396 --> 00:04:24.396
Uh, but this idea is a good one, and if we proceed with integrity and look at the data to make decisions, I think we might really have something
00:04:26.228 --> 00:04:30.978
L- Lori, to be clear, w- we're not talking about the end of the four-year baccalaureate degree.
00:04:30.988 --> 00:04:38.678
Would you talk about your thinking around that and the purpose and the value of that four-year degree still?
00:04:39.293 --> 00:04:42.843
No, we're talking about the revitalization of higher ed,
00:04:43.579 --> 00:04:44.038
Mm-hmm
00:04:44.952 --> 00:05:03.512
designing a three-year degree for select programs or providing that as an option and measuring the results is a tool to that end of being truly student-centered and research-based.
00:05:04.132 --> 00:05:17.343
If higher ed took on those two mantras, more students would succeed, more students would be attracted, and the common good would be served.
00:05:18.033 --> 00:05:28.773
Now, specifically to contrast the outcomes of four-year and three-year degrees is an intention of this experiment.
00:05:29.178 --> 00:05:29.709
Mm-hmm
00:05:29.932 --> 00:05:36.783
We know the outcomes in terms of completion at present for four-year degrees.
00:05:37.142 --> 00:05:56.872
We know that 120 credits, uh, or more in some cases accomplished does not necessarily mean, uh, career success, wellbeing, both physical and, uh, also financial.
00:05:57.083 --> 00:05:58.952
We know is-- there's not a guarantee there.
00:05:59.142 --> 00:06:11.233
We know that there are demographics that are stronger in the group that doesn't complete, you know, than the group that does.
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That's not okay, right?
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And it's on us to meet students from any background who we admit to our campuses to meet them with practices that will support their success.
00:06:27.572 --> 00:06:29.512
And there you have it.
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I love that because, you know, you're talking about this is a much larger conversation, and to look at it just as a three-year degree is missing the point.
00:06:39.449 --> 00:06:48.968
It's missing the big picture, which is reform of all higher education, so that it's evidence-based, it's concentrated on student outcomes and student success, and doing a much better job.
00:06:49.309 --> 00:06:52.048
I mean, US higher education is very diverse.
00:06:52.048 --> 00:06:56.678
It's got a lot of just wonderful things, obviously we, we could be better.
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You know, Lori, there in the formation and the, appearance of these different, three-year degrees, there's been some opposition that's starting to raise its head.
00:07:06.699 --> 00:07:24.978
What are the things that you would hope that the folks that are really, I would say, either aware of or afraid of or, you know, see big red flags for this, what are those things that you would hope that they would understand and understand about the approach here?
00:07:26.257 --> 00:07:31.627
Well, first I would invite them to keep raising their concerns, right?
00:07:31.627 --> 00:07:41.209
This is how all of us get better, and skepticism is, you know There's plenty of it in higher ed, right?
00:07:41.209 --> 00:07:44.838
We, we think critically, and that is good.
00:07:45.149 --> 00:07:53.238
So all of this is about a conversation, and the collective wisdom is going to be fed by the questions.
00:07:53.588 --> 00:07:58.869
Uh, and, uh, I hope we'd start with an assumption of positive intent.
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Always good.
00:08:00.718 --> 00:08:01.639
Always good.
00:08:01.968 --> 00:08:13.218
Uh, that the motivation here is to design better undergraduate education for better success and to as- have that be more affordable as well.
00:08:13.689 --> 00:08:20.178
You know, we had this, uh, privilege here on the Rochester campus of the University of Minnesota to have a blank canvas.
00:08:20.199 --> 00:08:24.608
We're a newer campus, and who gets this, right?
00:08:24.968 --> 00:08:31.608
Uh, it was such a gift and such a privilege, and we've taken it very seriously.
00:08:31.619 --> 00:08:34.839
And College in 3 is just a little bit like that.
00:08:35.239 --> 00:08:42.009
Uh, we ask faculty across disciplines who come together to think, what if you had a blank canvas?
00:08:42.678 --> 00:08:49.028
How could you design something that's student-centered, that's informed by data, research about how people learn?
00:08:49.249 --> 00:08:50.099
Think of it.
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What could it look like?
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You know, and, uh, those brainstorming activities get to glorious places where, you know, we just immerse in an environment and the questions that come up, you know, uh, way beyond what College in 3, you know, parameters are.
00:09:06.568 --> 00:09:12.519
But just really thinking about, uh, the redesign together.
00:09:12.528 --> 00:09:26.879
So, uh, I would say start with there's an assumption of positive intent, and it's right and good and helpful to raise the concerns about inadvertent consequences, and then to inspect our own assumptions.
00:09:26.889 --> 00:09:37.318
So a first is that because the four years and the 120 credits is a long-standing tradition, uh, that we shouldn't question it.
00:09:37.688 --> 00:09:39.278
Well, come on now.
00:09:39.298 --> 00:09:45.058
Isn't there a little dissonance if you're being skeptical that you won't be skeptical about our own practice?
00:09:45.249 --> 00:09:47.889
And hey, how about let's look at the data.
00:09:48.278 --> 00:09:50.448
Who is it that's not completing?
00:09:50.899 --> 00:10:04.119
Uh, and do we know that there are research-based practices that could help more people from a particular demographic, let's say the first in their generation in their family to go to college, that we might be able to, uh...
00:10:04.308 --> 00:10:06.609
We, we know some practices that help them.
00:10:06.609 --> 00:10:08.308
What if we design that in there?
00:10:08.318 --> 00:10:12.438
So bringing skepticism in all directions.
00:10:12.849 --> 00:10:19.729
Of course, our current context in higher education is, what's the word?
00:10:19.828 --> 00:10:21.639
Fraught, right?
00:10:21.649 --> 00:10:22.099
So,
00:10:22.899 --> 00:10:23.458
I think you're right.
00:10:23.458 --> 00:10:24.859
I think that's how, you nailed it
00:10:25.538 --> 00:10:50.554
And so that, that Context could fuel anxiety, legit anxiety, a-about a number of things and, you know, could inform a perspective that, like, this is one more way that the value of higher education is being undermined or attacked.
00:10:51.164 --> 00:11:12.975
Well, you know, my reply to that, if there's someone who wants to hear the other perspective, has to do with leading change from within to the benefit of the common good, our society, our democracy, and to the benefit of individual students that we have admitted to our campuses.
00:11:13.424 --> 00:11:28.945
Uh, so, uh, I, uh, listen very carefully and read those who are questioning or dismantling or, you know, nay-saying or whatever.
00:11:28.945 --> 00:11:37.195
I read those, uh, much more carefully, uh, than the rah-rahs at this point because I want to learn.
00:11:37.554 --> 00:11:41.705
Uh, may we all continue to want to learn in higher education.
00:11:42.575 --> 00:11:43.144
Absolutely.
00:11:43.144 --> 00:11:56.134
And hearing those voices, not trying to silence voices, but to hear those voices, it's, uh, so important for if we're actually honest about gathering data and getting perspectives, uh, for doing this.
00:11:56.434 --> 00:12:07.715
Lori, I'd like you to brag a little bit about, you don't have to brag, but, uh, I think there's something, uh, that can be bragged about your experience at, uh, University of Minnesota Rochester.
00:12:08.014 --> 00:12:25.534
And, uh, if you would talk a little bit about your, your attempt or your first, uh, and, and the, the unique nature of the three-year degree that you did on, on this brand-new start from scratch Greenfield campus and, uh, uh, how that has impacted and informed others.
00:12:25.575 --> 00:12:30.014
I just want you to talk about your experience there and, and what, what this has done.
00:12:31.249 --> 00:12:40.568
Well, Ed, let's be clear, the bragging is on the faculty, uh, because it was a faculty design team, and it was
00:12:40.692 --> 00:12:42.342
great statement by a chancellor.
00:12:42.383 --> 00:12:44.753
That is a, a well-known, a very
00:12:44.966 --> 00:12:45.326
Yeah
00:12:45.543 --> 00:12:46.222
that says that.
00:12:46.769 --> 00:12:48.428
Well, it's a, it's a truth.
00:12:48.633 --> 00:12:49.293
it is, true
00:12:49.578 --> 00:12:50.479
it is the truth.
00:12:51.058 --> 00:12:57.369
Uh, we do have these three principles here, that students are at the center, research informs practice, and partners make it possible.
00:12:57.379 --> 00:13:00.958
We have many partners that are important part of this as well.
00:13:01.178 --> 00:13:17.489
It's a different kind of culture for a campus because, uh, we got to start with that blank canvas, and some early decisions set us on this trajectory and, you know, uh, we could spend the rest of the time thanking all those people who contributed to that.
00:13:17.918 --> 00:13:30.958
But that, that first design, uh, embedded, uh, evidence-based practice, including a paid internship with an employer partner, Mayo Clinic.
00:13:31.239 --> 00:13:36.629
Uh, and, uh, that was a critical element of the design.
00:13:37.058 --> 00:13:46.698
It was year-round block scheduled seven-week courses integrated around a theme.
00:13:47.359 --> 00:13:56.389
We are a campus focused on health in a wide array of kinds of health careers.
00:13:56.629 --> 00:14:05.839
And so that is our golden thread that can weave through all courses and connect to student motivation.
00:14:06.298 --> 00:14:24.948
We structured it in a cohort model with living/learning communities and first-year experience and community-engaged learning and individually planned capstones and all flipped active interdisciplinary team teaching.
00:14:24.948 --> 00:14:27.028
We had all the goodies.
00:14:27.394 --> 00:14:27.914
Mm-hmm
00:14:29.178 --> 00:14:31.028
and the outcomes were good.
00:14:31.249 --> 00:14:32.979
It was a small pilot.
00:14:33.589 --> 00:14:39.879
Uh, and we were, you know, paddling through the unknowns of the pandemic.
00:14:40.369 --> 00:14:54.698
Uh, so where we are now is that those characteristics, uh, including opportunity for internship, though not all engage in an internship.
00:14:54.698 --> 00:14:59.538
We're at about eighty-six percent with work-based learning with our employer partner.
00:14:59.908 --> 00:15:20.928
Uh, but those elements I just named, living/learning communities, community-engaged learning, flipped active instruction, work-based learning opportunities, and capstone are, uh, those are a part of every major and degree that we offer, every student's experience here.
00:15:21.438 --> 00:15:45.379
And as a result, uh, in multiple years, most of the years since twenty seventeen, with two-thirds of our student body underrepresented, historically underrepresented in higher education, over two-thirds, we have no gap in completion, uh, with students who are not from underrepresented backgrounds.
00:15:45.399 --> 00:15:50.907
And that's what res- Research-based practice and good design will do.
00:15:51.006 --> 00:15:54.067
That is an important outcome.
00:15:54.177 --> 00:16:10.287
So at present, we've expanded into a whole array of programs we call Get Forward Faster, and about 30% of our students are completing in three years or fewer
00:16:11.236 --> 00:16:11.657
Wow.
00:16:11.976 --> 00:16:12.376
Wow.
00:16:12.417 --> 00:16:16.917
This is-- Talk about your partnership, uh, that you, uh, did.
00:16:16.917 --> 00:16:27.586
How did the, as you approach partners in business and, and, and the medical field, and how did they receive the, this, uh, approach that you, MR, w- was, was contemplating?
00:16:29.274 --> 00:16:37.134
Well, I have to look back for a minute, and that looking back involves how the campus came to be.
00:16:37.855 --> 00:16:52.014
So Rochester, Minnesota is America's city for health, the home of Mayo Clinic, serving three million patients and their companions every year, the number one hospital in the world year after year.
00:16:52.595 --> 00:16:55.565
It's a very special community.
00:16:56.455 --> 00:17:01.554
It attracts many innovators, and the research output is high.
00:17:02.375 --> 00:17:21.625
In the early sixties, a woman and then a group of friends, and then the momentum grew, uh, observed that a University of Minnesota campus was needed in this community, given the nature of the community and the talent needs of the community.
00:17:22.095 --> 00:17:32.384
Health, technology, science, all were a part of that dream, and citizen advocates worked for decades to make that dream come true.
00:17:33.434 --> 00:17:39.884
Mayo Clinic was one of the primary advocates for bringing this campus here.
00:17:40.144 --> 00:17:47.865
And note that very few new public university campuses have been started in this century.
00:17:48.335 --> 00:17:59.224
Uh, so, uh, there was a large welcome mat when it finally happened, our first graduating class in twenty thirteen.
00:17:59.704 --> 00:18:07.724
So already was established the expectation that this campus would produce talent.
00:18:08.244 --> 00:18:19.164
That we would do it in partnership came from some early decisions to plant the campus right in the middle of downtown Rochester, embedded in Mayo spaces.
00:18:19.651 --> 00:18:20.171
Mm-hmm
00:18:21.065 --> 00:18:29.884
uh, our, our physical plant has continued to seek adjacencies with, uh, the employers that we serve.
00:18:29.894 --> 00:18:31.644
So that history is important.
00:18:31.644 --> 00:18:33.255
I know that wasn't your question,
00:18:33.424 --> 00:18:33.714
No,
00:18:33.744 --> 00:18:33.954
they're-
00:18:34.065 --> 00:18:34.684
is important.
00:18:34.684 --> 00:18:35.884
The context means it
00:18:36.134 --> 00:18:36.634
Yes.
00:18:36.694 --> 00:18:36.704
much
00:18:37.625 --> 00:18:50.605
And so the readiness for the conversation about Mayo Clinic, if you have brand new talent coming from college, what do they most need?
00:18:51.015 --> 00:19:06.355
And we were able, with a variety of angles and perspectives from Mayo Clinic, which of course is vast, uh, to identify proficiencies and habits that they would want a new college grad to have.
00:19:06.875 --> 00:19:11.464
And then our faculty designed around those.
00:19:11.694 --> 00:19:14.484
That conversation continues.
00:19:14.634 --> 00:19:17.045
We just had another one last Friday.
00:19:17.545 --> 00:19:21.785
Uh, what are those evolving competencies or proficiencies?
00:19:22.815 --> 00:19:28.894
And they are evolving so rapidly as we look at digital health and AI and automation.
00:19:29.244 --> 00:19:40.919
The core competency that is currently desired is, wait for it, I love it, curiosity Right?
00:19:40.929 --> 00:19:48.959
So it used to be can they code in R or some such, you know, discrete skill, which is not really what higher education is about.
00:19:49.209 --> 00:20:03.388
But an appetite fueled by curiosity to solve problems that require multidisciplinary thinking and the awareness that there's no solution on the shelf for this thing, so we're gonna have to work together.
00:20:03.729 --> 00:20:19.298
So to design an undergraduate education that produces hyper curious people who think with, uh, multiple disciplinary perspectives, what a beautiful challenge for us.
00:20:19.628 --> 00:20:29.888
So that partnership with this employer is, uh, longstanding and evolving and, uh, and it's a partnership for which we are very grateful
00:20:31.303 --> 00:20:32.053
That's wonderful.
00:20:32.153 --> 00:20:40.573
And yes, Mayo Clinic, my wife actually worked for Mayo Clinic, and one of the things I was always impressed w- by was they said the only interest to be considered is the interest of the patient.
00:20:40.932 --> 00:20:49.303
And it seems that, you know, that type of patient-centeredness values align quite well with what you're trying to do at, uh, UMR
00:20:50.219 --> 00:21:06.578
And in fact, we have a chart And our, our needs of the student come first, uh, their learning, their development, their wellbeing, and that aligns with the-- It's a hyperfocus.
00:21:06.808 --> 00:21:09.298
We know why we exist.
00:21:09.709 --> 00:21:11.598
Mayo knows why it exists.
00:21:11.598 --> 00:21:17.368
The needs of the patient come first, and there's high integrity at all facets of their operation.
00:21:17.648 --> 00:21:19.479
We know why we exist.
00:21:19.749 --> 00:21:24.769
Uh, we are here for one purpose, and that is the development of human potential, right?
00:21:24.848 --> 00:21:39.888
For the student success, you can talk about it as workforce, but there's a journey between a childhood ambition to make a difference in the world through a career in health and readiness to do so.
00:21:39.939 --> 00:21:48.269
And we get to be a part of that journey in the middle, and we must put the needs, the learning and development needs of the student first
00:21:49.426 --> 00:21:51.106
Uh, I, I so much love that.
00:21:51.567 --> 00:21:57.576
Lori, i- in, at, in your current position, and you talked about a book that's coming out, so we're gonna be looking for that book.
00:21:57.987 --> 00:22:10.186
But, what are some things on the future, on the horizon that, you know, not necessarily things that keep you up at night, but, what's on the chancellor's mind, these days, in addition to the things you talk about with students?
00:22:11.724 --> 00:22:21.285
Well, of course, I mentioned the students who've just arrived, uh, we're enthusiastic about supporting their success, and that's always the first priority.
00:22:21.944 --> 00:22:42.075
W- And, uh, the University of Minnesota broadly, uh, with its five campuses, has committed through a strategic roadmap called Elevate Extraordinary 2030 to some strategic imperatives, as is true on campuses a- across the country.
00:22:42.714 --> 00:22:49.884
One of those strategic imperatives is innovate to transform the future of learning.
00:22:51.775 --> 00:23:06.065
When I saw that on the final draft, I felt a sense of satisfaction and excitement for adventure at the extreme.
00:23:07.085 --> 00:23:25.734
What is possible when the University of Minnesota world-class institution commits to using its strength in learning research to catapult revitalization that supports student success?
00:23:26.105 --> 00:23:40.414
We'll be having a convening of those who do research on student learning and development and those who lead programs that are evidence-based to support student success in October.
00:23:40.625 --> 00:23:54.585
And from that, uh, will emerge a newly designed accelerator of learning innovation that we have committed to, uh, informing new designs.
00:23:54.595 --> 00:23:56.744
Some of them may be accelerated.
00:23:56.894 --> 00:23:58.105
We shall see.
00:23:58.404 --> 00:24:12.914
Uh, new designs that you students and employers in the co-design are research-based and support increased student success in all of its facets.
00:24:13.174 --> 00:24:37.434
And those pilots will be funded, and we'll study them, and we hope that, uh, all of that will create a design process that contributes not only to greater success for students across the University of Minnesota but puts in place a design process that might be of use to others across higher education.
00:24:37.835 --> 00:24:47.184
So this excitement for the next adventure across the University of Minnesota's campuses is pretty high.
00:24:47.444 --> 00:24:49.444
That's my answer to your question.
00:24:50.318 --> 00:24:50.618
I love that.
00:24:50.618 --> 00:24:58.159
Well, we're all about engaging, and design, and so it seems that you're doing both of those things.
00:24:58.469 --> 00:25:01.489
Michael, I wanted to see if you wanted to jump here with any questions.
00:25:01.808 --> 00:25:10.598
Yeah, I, I think I, I tried to get to it a little bit earlier, and that is how do you lead this kind of change, right?
00:25:10.969 --> 00:25:19.528
What kinds of specific things do you need to do as the chancellor to allow this change to continue?
00:25:19.528 --> 00:25:33.385
There's the curiosity mindset, there's the adventure, but are there specific things operationally that you had to put in place to make the changes happen, to get collaboration, to actually have a solid design you could execute?
00:25:34.016 --> 00:25:36.965
Is there anything special in what you did over the last few years?
00:25:38.680 --> 00:25:41.890
I think remember our advantage of starting from scratch.
00:25:41.961 --> 00:25:42.592
Yes
00:25:43.250 --> 00:25:45.710
that has to be acknowledged.
00:25:45.720 --> 00:25:49.309
That was a gift unto us, right?
00:25:49.609 --> 00:26:00.170
And then creating principles and engaging every single staff and faculty member in creating those principles.
00:26:00.440 --> 00:26:14.849
And, you know, we are linked arms, uh, around those principles that students are at the center, research informs practice, and partners make it possible, and it informs all our decisions, and when we set something aside, it's been informed by that.
00:26:15.160 --> 00:26:17.150
We're all in and we all know that.
00:26:17.160 --> 00:26:23.259
So that, that is culture, and here it was fed by, in the beginning, there were only 13 people.
00:26:23.259 --> 00:26:25.500
They sat in a circle and made decisions, right?
00:26:25.500 --> 00:26:26.089
And so that-
00:26:26.253 --> 00:26:26.804
easier.
00:26:27.119 --> 00:26:27.559
Yeah.
00:26:27.650 --> 00:26:28.190
That's right.
00:26:28.500 --> 00:26:43.220
Uh, and, and so keeping that spirit of collaboration and innovation and student-centeredness, uh, in mind as we design organizational structure to be as flat as possible, as inclusive as possible.
00:26:43.609 --> 00:26:48.049
Uh, a reminder that my discipline is human communication,
00:26:48.220 --> 00:26:48.819
Mm-hmm
00:26:49.299 --> 00:27:19.640
have studied how we use the spoken word to bring about change, and the principles around that and various approaches like the revitalization movement or diffusion of innovation, all of that come down to human, uh, communication and connection and, uh, asking questions and getting answers and being transparent, uh, in, in how we get to those answers and coming back to the principles.
00:27:19.930 --> 00:27:25.009
So operationally we're at a point where we're scaling.
00:27:25.240 --> 00:27:33.756
You know, the, the first graduating class in 20, uh, 13 had- 57 souls, uh, what trailblazers they were.
00:27:34.096 --> 00:27:47.316
Uh, and, uh, we'll be announcing numbers on day 10, of course, not before, but, you know, we're well over our first target, um, by a few hundred, and that first target was 1,000.
00:27:47.316 --> 00:27:52.326
Uh, we're moving on to 2,500 students and expanding our spaces.
00:27:52.326 --> 00:28:02.506
And so our question has become: How do we sustain our innovative, collaborative culture that is student-centered and research-informed as we scale?
00:28:02.806 --> 00:28:20.986
So we have deployed action teams that are, you know, short period of time to imagine the practice, let's say community-engaged learning or flipped active learning or capstone, you know, the lists that I had before, uh, to imagine that at scale.
00:28:21.006 --> 00:28:24.135
So we have 2,500 students in that.
00:28:24.145 --> 00:28:25.945
What can that look like?
00:28:26.165 --> 00:28:30.306
It, it can't look like it looks today at 12 or 1,300.
00:28:30.566 --> 00:28:31.615
What will that look like?
00:28:31.615 --> 00:28:34.536
And then let's backwards design to that and phase.
00:28:34.596 --> 00:28:38.925
So every year is an anomaly, uh, right, as we phase.
00:28:38.976 --> 00:28:52.726
Well, this year we're doing it this way because we've agreed to how we're gonna get to having this practice when we scale, so we still have the same kinds of student outcomes.
00:28:52.965 --> 00:28:57.736
And it's, it's an everybody in sort of thing, so those who are...
00:28:57.965 --> 00:29:01.026
Success coaching is one of our evidence-based practices.
00:29:01.026 --> 00:29:03.516
It's like a life coach from beginning to end.
00:29:03.945 --> 00:29:15.736
Uh, and, uh, so the coaches themselves imagined us at scale and, uh, made recommendations, and we're gonna use those to inform how we move forward.
00:29:15.746 --> 00:29:34.425
So, uh, the inclusiveness, the planning, the transparency, the organizational structure, and, uh, the attraction of people who are convicted by the same belief system that I described earlier, that learning really matters and higher ed fuels the common good
00:29:36.781 --> 00:29:39.902
Oh, that was so, uh, exciting.
00:29:39.912 --> 00:29:58.991
It's also thoughtful, and it also speaks a lot to your leadership, uh, your approach and it is nice having a greenfield or a s- first start because it, you can shape the culture and keep that culture coherent, have integrity so that it doesn't drift, which can often happen at, with scale.
00:29:59.640 --> 00:30:07.650
Well, let me just note one thing, and that is, uh, when I first arrived we did, uh, we sought out campuses that were new.
00:30:07.710 --> 00:30:10.930
None of them were under 50 years old.
00:30:11.180 --> 00:30:14.220
Uh, but all of them had a common theme.
00:30:14.230 --> 00:30:17.529
They said the original innovators became the blockade.
00:30:18.690 --> 00:30:22.869
And so we, we will not do that.
00:30:23.519 --> 00:30:28.069
We know what was working early on, but everything's changing.
00:30:28.299 --> 00:30:30.329
Uh, we have to keep changing too.
00:30:30.740 --> 00:30:35.690
Uh, we're-- Our enterprise is about learning, so we better be a learning organization ourselves.
00:30:35.700 --> 00:30:43.829
So hopefully I won't be one of those who become the blockade ever by saying,"Oh, that's the thing that's innovative." It's like, no.
00:30:44.250 --> 00:30:45.900
Today's student, what do they need?
00:30:45.910 --> 00:30:47.019
How can we provide it?
00:30:47.019 --> 00:30:49.349
Let's study it and then let's adapt
00:30:50.599 --> 00:31:02.210
I always think that great leaders know how to remove barriers, even if it is, if they look around and say,"Okay, I might be the barrier here." A, a great leader knows how to move things and let folks do their jobs.
00:31:02.690 --> 00:31:05.140
Lori, it's been such a pleasure having you on here.
00:31:05.220 --> 00:31:07.490
We are excited about the work you're doing.
00:31:07.490 --> 00:31:14.839
We're also really impressed by the intentionality, the design, the thoughtfulness.
00:31:14.849 --> 00:31:19.500
I mean, your, your faculty heart comes through, your care for students comes through with this.
00:31:19.829 --> 00:31:30.650
We, we like to end our, uh, by asking our guests the question, and that is: How do you engage more learners more effectively?
00:31:31.099 --> 00:31:32.589
And whatever your answer is.
00:31:32.589 --> 00:31:37.180
So Lori, Chance- Chancellor Carrell, how do you engage more learners more effectively?
00:31:38.842 --> 00:31:54.162
Well, I think that I've answered it already, but I will be happy to get out my highlighter and, you know, personally, I'm no good if I don't know learners and I don't listen to them.
00:31:54.612 --> 00:31:59.112
So I have a group of students who inform and fuel me.
00:32:00.261 --> 00:32:13.571
At the collective level, as we together pursue wisdom, we must also listen to learners, and we do that collectively at scale through data.
00:32:14.112 --> 00:32:16.692
So how do students learn and develop?
00:32:16.771 --> 00:32:23.481
We must be constantly collecting that information, analyzing it, and then adapting.
00:32:23.932 --> 00:32:27.172
And that's how we will engage more learners.
00:32:27.201 --> 00:32:35.471
We are also a growing campus here, and there are many challenges to growth across higher education right now.
00:32:35.491 --> 00:32:55.122
But your question does lead me to think about that and our action team process where we're imagining the evidence-based practices that we know today, scaling to meet future students' needs has been a critical element as well.
00:32:55.561 --> 00:33:09.961
But I wanna repeat, if you're in higher education and you haven't listened to an eighteen or nineteen-year-old learner for a while, sit yourself down and enjoy.
00:33:10.461 --> 00:33:27.491
It, it really matters that the perspective of the ones we serve are taken into consideration as we pursue doing things better, doing them differently to do them better
00:33:29.559 --> 00:33:29.839
Oh.
00:33:31.140 --> 00:33:32.720
Ah, I'm just so excited.
00:33:32.980 --> 00:33:35.240
Lori, this has been an absolute pleasure.
00:33:35.289 --> 00:33:36.970
Um, you.
00:33:36.970 --> 00:33:51.500
I, we were sort of going down with one story, but it, it actually gave us a better story, a more in-depth story of not only your leadership journey, as well as the, the UMR, uh, journey and with Collagen 3.
00:33:51.500 --> 00:33:53.569
So it's, it's been just such a pleasure.
00:33:53.569 --> 00:33:55.210
We are so thankful for your time.
00:33:55.470 --> 00:34:07.900
I know that you probably have to get back to, uh, the scavenger hunt and, and other things like that, but we, we really appreciate your time, and Lori, thank you for joining us on the Engaged by Design podcast
00:34:09.268 --> 00:34:10.188
Thank you for having me.
00:34:10.188 --> 00:34:11.987
It's been a pleasure to talk with you
00:34:12.427 --> 00:34:19.608
Thank you, K- thank you, Lori Thank you for listening to part two of our conversation with Dr.
00:34:19.608 --> 00:34:38.568
Lori Carroll, where we learned more about that three-year degree and about leadership and leading through change in a way that is very inclusive and human and creates stronger connections within our institutions and across institutions as we try to make change happen all across the higher ed industry.
00:34:39.907 --> 00:34:52.577
Join us next time for our next fabulous guest, where I'm sure we will learn more about how to lead innovation in higher education and how we can engage by design.
