Interview Mashup: Session Two (with Joshua Bandoch, Andrea Waltz, Alan Stein, Jr & J.R. Briggs)-046

WEBVTT
00:00:00.160 --> 00:00:05.200
Uh what if you could have a sneak peek into the highlights of past interviews on the show?
00:00:06.080 --> 00:00:14.000
What if just for example, I took the past four interviews and found key segments and mashed them together for your viewing and listening pleasure.
00:00:14.880 --> 00:00:20.399
Well, I'm that kind of guy and cured this special sauce for you at no additional charge.
00:00:20.640 --> 00:00:22.640
So let's get to it.
00:00:25.519 --> 00:00:35.520
Welcome to the Elite Business Connector Podcast, where we believe how you interact with people will make or break your opportunity to develop a real and influential connection.
00:00:35.840 --> 00:00:41.600
Now, whether you're a rookie or a rock star with people, you're in the right place right now.
00:00:42.320 --> 00:00:43.520
Let's do this.
00:00:49.840 --> 00:00:52.079
Welcome to the Elite Business Connector Podcast.
00:00:52.159 --> 00:01:00.799
I'm your host, Brian Buckley, husband of one, father of five, and on a mission to help you develop, deepen, and master your business communication skills.
00:01:01.359 --> 00:01:12.560
And my promise to you, every single week, is that if you listen and subscribe, I'm going to bring my best content and energy to help you get better at communicating and connecting but in a business environment.
00:01:13.200 --> 00:01:20.879
So if you're in sales or a customer experience, or if you're leading any of these teams, you're in the right place right now.
00:01:22.000 --> 00:01:26.959
Well, today you'll be hearing from four subject matter experts, and here's the starting lineup.
00:01:27.599 --> 00:01:33.519
First is Alan Stein Jr., a former NBA performance coach and three-time author.
00:01:34.239 --> 00:01:41.519
Second will be Andrea Waltz, author of Go for No, Yes is the Destination, and No is How You Get There.
00:01:41.840 --> 00:01:45.599
Then we'll do a short break, and after the break, you'll hear from Dr.
00:01:45.840 --> 00:01:46.159
J.R.
00:01:46.319 --> 00:01:49.840
Briggs, author of The Art of Asking Better Questions.
00:01:50.319 --> 00:01:58.400
And lastly, number four will be Joshua Bandock, author of How to Get What You Want, Mastering the Art and Science of Persuasion.
00:01:59.120 --> 00:02:01.760
So, are you ready for the masterclass?
00:02:02.079 --> 00:02:02.959
It's go time.
00:02:03.359 --> 00:02:03.599
Sure.
00:02:03.840 --> 00:02:06.400
So what I'll do is I'll give kind of the quick Cliff Notes version.
00:02:06.480 --> 00:02:12.960
And then if any of your viewers or listeners are interested, if you go to my YouTube channel, you can see a much more theatrical production of it.
00:02:13.120 --> 00:02:21.759
But back in 2007, which is crazy to think it's been almost 20 years now, I was working the Kobe Bryant Skills Academy for Nike out in Los Angeles.
00:02:21.840 --> 00:02:28.319
And I got up really early one morning to watch one of Kobe's private workouts because I'd always heard just how insanely intense they were.
00:02:28.560 --> 00:02:30.400
And I was like, Wasn't it like before 4 a.m.?
00:02:30.560 --> 00:02:31.840
Wasn't it something crazy like that time?
00:02:32.560 --> 00:02:35.039
I mean, I got there at 3 30 and he was already at the gym.
00:02:35.120 --> 00:02:38.960
So that's he he's certainly legendary for those early morning workouts.
00:02:39.039 --> 00:02:42.240
And I'll in a moment I'll explain why he chose to do that.
00:02:42.400 --> 00:02:52.080
But what I remember as a young coach watching Kobe was here, you know, at that time he was arguably the best player in the world, and he just kept drilling down on very basic drills.
00:02:52.159 --> 00:03:00.719
You know, he was doing some pivoting drills and some offensive moves and some things that honestly I had done with middle school age players, and and that really surprised me.
00:03:00.800 --> 00:03:11.759
I expected, especially getting up that early in the morning, that I was gonna go see the best player in the world doing some stuff with some flash and some sizzle, and instead he was just drilling down on the basics.
00:03:11.919 --> 00:03:22.800
And later that day at camp, I had a chance to have a conversation with him and I asked him, you know, why a player of his stature, why the best player in the world, would be doing such basic drills.
00:03:22.879 --> 00:03:30.560
And he smiled at me, he winked, and he said something that that changed my life forever, changed my perspective, my philosophy, and my approach forever.
00:03:30.719 --> 00:03:33.599
He said, Why do you think I'm the best player in the world?
00:03:33.840 --> 00:03:35.840
I never get bored with the basics.
00:03:36.080 --> 00:03:47.439
And I remember in that moment as a young coach thinking, if the best basketball player on the planet can commit to refinement and mastery of the basic fundamentals, then I can certainly do the same.
00:03:47.599 --> 00:04:03.840
And ever since then, in every area of my life where I've aimed for excellence, you know, I want to be an excellent father, I want to be an excellent keynote speaker, you know, whatever the domain, my approach now is I try to figure out what are the fundamentals or the basic building blocks of being excellent in that area.
00:04:04.000 --> 00:04:09.840
And then I commit to working towards refining and mastering those skill sets during the unseen hours.
00:04:09.919 --> 00:04:12.159
And so I try not to overcomplicate anything.
00:04:12.319 --> 00:04:17.120
For anyone that's watching right now, you can see the neon sign above my head about simplifying success.
00:04:17.199 --> 00:04:33.600
And that's that's really my calling card now is I try to untether from the unnecessarily complex and I try to simplify every area of my life and say, all right, if I want to be the best father I can be, what are three or four things I need to do consistently to be a good father?
00:04:33.759 --> 00:04:37.680
What are the what are three or four things I need to do to be an exceptional keynote speaker?
00:04:37.839 --> 00:04:47.920
The refinement and the simplicity has allowed me not only to reach a much higher level of performance and productivity, but it's made things so much more fulfilling as well.
00:04:48.240 --> 00:04:49.120
Love that, Alan.
00:04:49.199 --> 00:04:53.199
And it and it ties into really the basics we talked about in the first five minutes.
00:04:53.360 --> 00:04:53.519
Yeah.
00:04:53.839 --> 00:04:56.160
You know, these aren't revolutionary things.
00:04:56.319 --> 00:05:00.480
We're just contextualizing them, them in the most important minutes of a business conversation.
00:05:00.560 --> 00:05:05.120
Because if you if you nail the first five, the next 25, the next 55 is so much easier.
00:05:05.279 --> 00:05:08.319
But if you blow them, it's so much harder.
00:05:08.560 --> 00:05:17.439
So listening, what we know about, asking questions, eye contact, you know, being present, you know, not distracted, all those things are the basics.
00:05:17.600 --> 00:05:22.000
And it kind of leads into in in Raise Your Game, which I want to give a shout-out to right now.
00:05:22.079 --> 00:05:31.199
My my second oldest son, 22, right now, getting his master's in sport psychology, ironically enough, he's reading Raise Your Game right now, which I absolutely love.
00:05:31.279 --> 00:05:32.560
I think that's super, super cool.
00:05:32.800 --> 00:05:42.480
But in there, you talk about one of the virtues that's huge is critical is awareness, not talent, not hustle, but self-awareness.
00:05:42.639 --> 00:05:47.279
So make the case, why does everything else fall apart without it?
00:05:48.000 --> 00:05:57.040
I I know this analogy is a little bit overused, but there's a reason that we have analogies and cliches that that sometimes feel overused, and that's because there's truth behind him.
00:05:57.199 --> 00:06:05.439
And, you know, I I always joke, you know, I know what things in life I'm pretty good at, and I know what things that I'm not, you know, my biggest opportunities for growth.
00:06:05.600 --> 00:06:12.800
And I've uh I mean, even prior to to smartphones and GPS, I've always had trouble with direction.
00:06:13.040 --> 00:06:19.920
So uh now the fact that that we have GPS, you know, tethered to our devices uh makes life a lot easier for me.
00:06:20.000 --> 00:06:32.639
And one of the things I've noticed with GPS, which I use all of the time, even in my hometown where I should know where everything is, is in order for a GPS to work, there's only two coordinates that you need.
00:06:32.879 --> 00:06:35.040
You need, or the GPS needs, rather.
00:06:35.120 --> 00:06:41.120
The GPS needs to know exactly where you are in this moment, and it needs to know exactly where you're trying to go.
00:06:41.279 --> 00:06:46.000
And if you know those two points, then it will give you the most efficient way possible.
00:06:46.160 --> 00:06:53.600
And if you use an app like Waze, it will give you the most effective and efficient way to get there based on the moment and track instruction.
00:06:53.839 --> 00:06:54.959
It's absolutely incredible.
00:06:55.120 --> 00:07:04.560
And and the reason I love that analogy is I believe all of us as human beings in every facet of our life should know what those two components are.
00:07:04.720 --> 00:07:09.120
We need to know where we are, and I say that figuratively in air quotes.
00:07:09.279 --> 00:07:18.160
You know, we we need to know who we are and where we are in time and space, and we need to have an idea of where it is that we're trying to go or the person that we're trying to become.
00:07:18.319 --> 00:07:25.759
And if if we can get crystal clear on those two things, um, it will make life much more uh efficient and our route to get there more effective.
00:07:25.839 --> 00:07:32.079
And and self-awareness falls under that first coordinate of who and where am I in this world right now?
00:07:32.240 --> 00:07:54.319
And and self-awareness um is a combination of knowing the things that you do well, your your strengths and your talents, but it's also having the courage to look under the hood at the things that maybe are weaknesses or areas of growth, or, you know, even if we dive deeper, these are your fears and your insecurities and baggage that you might be dragging from the past.
00:07:54.480 --> 00:08:10.480
And and once we take a holistic view, we know our hopes, our dreams, our strengths, we know our fears, our insecurities, our weaknesses, then if we have a very accurate um, you know, uh uh uh evaluation of what those things are, then we have a pretty good idea of who we are as a human being.
00:08:10.560 --> 00:08:27.360
And and I think it's important to look at all of that stuff through an unbiased lens, not to use any of that to be critical of ourselves, to put ourselves down, uh, to compare ourselves to someone else and saying, you know, I'm I'm really behind where I should be in my life because so-and-so is doing better.
00:08:27.519 --> 00:08:29.600
It's it should not be used as that tool.
00:08:29.759 --> 00:08:36.799
It should be simply used as sterile, unbiased information to really get a grip on who you are and where you are right now.
00:08:37.039 --> 00:08:44.159
And then I highly recommend you put equal attention into casting the vision of who you want to be and where you're trying to go.
00:08:44.320 --> 00:08:48.240
And and I, you know, I'm recalibrating those two things all of the time.
00:08:48.320 --> 00:08:57.600
And and self-awareness, um, very similar to physical fitness, which was something you and I were talking about before we hit record, um, it's an ongoing evolution.
00:08:57.759 --> 00:09:00.639
It's not something that you you ever arrive at.
00:09:00.720 --> 00:09:06.159
You know, there are times in my life where I'm just more in tune and I'm more self-aware than other times.
00:09:06.320 --> 00:09:11.279
You know, there's other times in my life where I'm I'm riddled with blind spots and I need some help.
00:09:11.440 --> 00:09:13.360
Um, and all of those things are okay.
00:09:13.519 --> 00:09:18.879
They're part of being human and they're part of the human condition, but it's something that you have to consistently work on.
00:09:19.039 --> 00:09:23.200
You know, if you get yourself in great physical shape, like you've done, man, kudos to you.
00:09:23.360 --> 00:09:32.000
But you realize that that means you have to continue doing the stuff that got you into this shape in the first place if you want to keep that same level of results.
00:09:32.159 --> 00:09:40.960
So if you've made some changes to your diet and to your workouts, if you just stop doing all of that, then your body will revert to what it looked like before.
00:09:41.120 --> 00:09:46.799
But if you want to maintain that, you know, your new sleek physique, then you need to make sure that you continue doing those things.
00:09:46.879 --> 00:09:48.639
And it's the same thing with self-awareness.
00:09:48.799 --> 00:10:01.200
You can't plant your flag in the ground and announce to the world, hey, everyone, I'm self-aware, and then stop working on the reflection and the recalibration and the things that you need to do to continue to be self-aware.
00:10:01.440 --> 00:10:02.720
Yeah, I love that you brought that up.
00:10:02.799 --> 00:10:08.960
And I did intentionally write next play and helping folks develop a next play mentality in a very specific way.
00:10:09.039 --> 00:10:13.679
It's about a third of the page count and word count of my previous two books.
00:10:13.840 --> 00:10:20.720
And I tried to write it in a way that was very digestible and short as opposed to some of the lengthier works that I've had before.
00:10:21.200 --> 00:10:22.080
Isn't that hard though?
00:10:22.639 --> 00:10:23.279
Wasn't that hard?
00:10:23.440 --> 00:10:25.440
I'm the same, same with the first five minutes.
00:10:25.679 --> 00:10:26.480
I did the same thing.
00:10:26.559 --> 00:10:27.440
It's so hard.
00:10:27.759 --> 00:10:36.159
Yeah, being concise and trimming the fat is incredibly difficult in every area of our life, but that's also what made it so worthwhile and so rewarding.
00:10:36.240 --> 00:10:48.480
And there's really three lenses that I use a next play mentality with and that I recommend folks at least consider, and I put that in the book, and then we'll drill down in what you just asked because that's really the first lens.
00:10:48.559 --> 00:10:54.879
And the first lens is how do you use next play in the micro, in the moment, in our day-to-day?
00:10:55.039 --> 00:10:59.519
That is when you know a basketball player misses a shot and needs to move to the next play.
00:10:59.679 --> 00:11:02.639
A sales professional loses the sale, next play.
00:11:02.799 --> 00:11:06.399
A mother or father has an argument with their teenage kid, next play.
00:11:06.559 --> 00:11:13.600
So it's it's how do we quickly reframe and refocus the lens when the day-to-day stuff doesn't go the way that we'd hoped?
00:11:13.759 --> 00:11:17.120
A Starbucks barista messes up your order and you're late for a meeting.
00:11:17.279 --> 00:11:20.720
You get stuck in a traffic jam and you're the day-to-day nuances.
00:11:20.879 --> 00:11:31.840
The second lens is when we zoom back out and we look at it through a macro lens and we say, all right, what are some of the big life transitions that most of us will experience?
00:11:32.080 --> 00:11:39.600
Everybody is not cut from the same cloth, but generally speaking, most of us go through similar transitions.
00:11:39.759 --> 00:11:44.559
We go from being in high school to either going to university or getting our first job.
00:11:44.720 --> 00:11:47.600
We go from living with our parents to living on our own.
00:11:47.759 --> 00:11:50.000
We go from being single to being married.
00:11:50.159 --> 00:11:53.120
We go from being married with no children to married with children.
00:11:53.279 --> 00:11:56.399
In some cases, we go from being married to not being married.
00:11:56.639 --> 00:11:58.240
We go from job to job.
00:11:58.399 --> 00:12:00.399
Sometimes we move from city to city.
00:12:00.480 --> 00:12:08.320
You know, we go from having many times parents who are young and vivacious and in great health to parents who maybe are not in great health or pass away.
00:12:08.480 --> 00:12:13.440
We maybe get a diagnosis of some type of illness or disease that's not favorable.
00:12:13.600 --> 00:12:15.840
There's so many different things that we go through.
00:12:16.000 --> 00:12:18.639
You go from having kids at home to being an empty nester.
00:12:19.120 --> 00:12:22.080
There's a handful of things that most of us will experience.
00:12:22.240 --> 00:12:29.919
And I want folks to look at the next play through a macro lens and learn how to prepare for many of those situations.
00:12:30.080 --> 00:12:34.080
And this is never about being paranoid, but it's about being prepared.
00:12:34.240 --> 00:12:36.879
It's about saying, okay, I have to say that again.
00:12:37.039 --> 00:12:37.600
Say that again.
00:12:37.679 --> 00:12:38.559
That's a great quote.
00:12:38.799 --> 00:12:41.360
It's not about being paranoid, it's about being prepared.
00:12:41.440 --> 00:12:47.519
And it's about saying, you know, as I announced before, I have 16-year-old twin sons and a 14-year-old daughter.
00:12:47.679 --> 00:12:53.279
In the blink of an eye, they will be out of the house doing whatever it is they choose to do post-high school.
00:12:53.519 --> 00:13:01.440
So, what is my next play going to be as a father and as a man when my current circumstances of having three kids changes?
00:13:01.519 --> 00:13:06.320
And I'll have three kids, they'll still be my three kids, but they'll be living somewhere else with a heavy heart.
00:13:06.480 --> 00:13:11.279
My mom passed away this past fall, almost a year ago now, from a battle with dementia.
00:13:11.440 --> 00:13:19.360
So I've had to step into a next play of spending 50 years of having a mom to now not having a mom in the physical form.
00:13:19.440 --> 00:13:24.159
And the writing's on the wall that, you know, my dad may not be around for that much longer.
00:13:24.240 --> 00:13:33.440
So it's like I'm trying to be proactive in figuring out how I can step into these different circumstance changes and make my next play my best play.
00:13:33.600 --> 00:13:39.600
And then the third lens that we should or can use the next play mentality is with setting goals.
00:13:39.840 --> 00:13:44.080
Generally speaking, goals are rather binary by design.
00:13:44.240 --> 00:13:46.240
Either you achieve them or you don't.
00:13:46.480 --> 00:13:51.039
But whether you hit your goal or you fall short, the question should still be the same.
00:13:51.120 --> 00:13:53.039
And that is what is my next play?
00:13:53.200 --> 00:13:59.679
If I hit my goal, so so as a keynote speaker, I have a revenue goal, a speaking revenue goal each year.
00:13:59.840 --> 00:14:04.639
Well, when I hit that goal, certainly I want to celebrate it and feel good about the accomplishment.
00:14:04.799 --> 00:14:08.240
But then I need to say, okay, well, what's my next play for the following year?
00:14:08.399 --> 00:14:11.919
You know, am I going to raise the bar and try and achieve a higher goal?
00:14:12.080 --> 00:14:15.279
Am I going to try to see if I can hit the same goal for back-to-back years?
00:14:15.440 --> 00:14:18.000
You know, but but I still need to figure out what's next.
00:14:18.320 --> 00:14:21.679
I don't want to rest on the performance that I had the previous year.
00:14:21.759 --> 00:14:23.600
I want to be able to figure out what's next.
00:14:23.759 --> 00:14:27.840
If and when I fall short of the goal, which has happened plenty of times, same thing.
00:14:28.000 --> 00:14:30.480
I need to recalibrate and go, all right, what's the next play?
00:14:30.639 --> 00:14:34.639
Do I need to change the goal or do I need to change my approach or my behaviors?
00:14:34.799 --> 00:14:51.120
You know, so if we can jockey in and out of using next play on the day-to-day, zoom out and use it on the big stuff, and use it with every goal we set in every area of our life, that type of next play mentality for me has been arguably the most helpful frame and tool that I have.
00:14:51.360 --> 00:15:01.039
How does the fear of hearing the word no, Andrew, specifically in business opportunities, not just in sales, but in how people show up in conversations?
00:15:01.360 --> 00:15:02.879
Yeah, how does that look?
00:15:03.279 --> 00:15:05.200
So a few things actually.
00:15:05.279 --> 00:15:13.120
And we all know what the impact is of not speaking up, of not taking initiative, taking a leadership role.
00:15:13.360 --> 00:15:25.600
We know the impact is worse results, fewer sales, fewer opportunities, wondering why this person over there always seems to get the promotion or get the thing, and you don't.
00:15:25.840 --> 00:15:33.679
And what we have found is oftentimes it doesn't mean that you somehow lack talent, that you're not as capable as somebody else.
00:15:33.840 --> 00:15:49.039
Sometimes it's just being that squeaky wheel and saying, hey, this is what I'm interested in, or being that person that does take that leadership role and serves their customers and their clients at a higher level, which means starting those conversations, which means connecting with people.
00:15:49.440 --> 00:15:51.600
So those are kind of some of the results.
00:15:51.759 --> 00:16:06.879
What it looks like typically, the number one thing, and this is the thing that people have to be so careful about, Brian, and that is instead of being willing to hear no from somebody else, or experience even implicit rejection.
00:16:07.039 --> 00:16:09.039
Like it doesn't have to be a flat out no.
00:16:09.200 --> 00:16:15.919
It could just be somebody is maybe they don't re even respond, or you just don't get the sense that they're interested.
00:16:16.000 --> 00:16:18.159
And so you kind of it kind of drifts away.
00:16:18.960 --> 00:16:21.759
It's not a firm yes, but it's just it's it's not a firm yes.
00:16:21.840 --> 00:16:24.720
So we just you pretty much accept, okay, this is probably a no.
00:16:24.799 --> 00:16:26.720
This out this very much sounds like a no.
00:16:27.039 --> 00:16:33.600
So what happens is instead of being willing to get that from the external source, we give ourselves the no.
00:16:34.080 --> 00:16:40.399
Talk ourselves out of it and say, hey, I don't, I'm not of high enough status to approach this person.
00:16:40.639 --> 00:16:43.360
This is the vice president, this is a president of a company.
00:16:43.519 --> 00:16:47.200
I shouldn't go out, I shouldn't walk up to this person and start the conversation.
00:16:47.519 --> 00:16:50.960
This guest is not somebody I should make this offer to.
00:16:51.120 --> 00:16:52.240
It's not the right time.
00:16:52.399 --> 00:16:52.639
Right.
00:16:52.799 --> 00:17:04.319
So we talk ourselves out of all of these things, basically essentially giving ourselves the no instead of being willing to accept the no.
00:17:04.480 --> 00:17:14.079
And as professionals, as sales and service professionals, we really are the ones that have to have the burden of this on our shoulders.
00:17:14.400 --> 00:17:17.920
Our customers don't know what they don't know.
00:17:18.160 --> 00:17:31.440
And so it is on us to educate them on what things they could do, what things are out there, how you know what the prices are, what the benefits are, how it can help people solve their problems.
00:17:31.759 --> 00:17:33.759
All of that falls on our shoulders.
00:17:33.920 --> 00:17:35.519
And I have to tell you a story.
00:17:35.680 --> 00:17:39.119
So I always thought that I was a superstar salesperson.
00:17:39.599 --> 00:17:47.680
And when I learned to go for no, I had to get honest with myself and recognize, you know what, the truth is, I don't love hearing the word no.
00:17:47.839 --> 00:17:49.200
I don't like being rejected.
00:17:49.359 --> 00:17:53.279
I would rather, you know, not have to go through that awkwardness.
00:17:53.519 --> 00:17:59.920
So I would look at a customer and I would say, okay, this is what I think they will do.
00:18:00.319 --> 00:18:02.480
This is what I think they have to spend.
00:18:02.640 --> 00:18:05.440
And so I would couch all my offers that way.
00:18:05.599 --> 00:18:12.720
I would show things that I knew would get me the yes and maybe throw the things out or leave them aside, the things that I would I thought they'll just say.
00:18:13.119 --> 00:18:14.880
Remove the possible, remove the possible no's.
00:18:15.200 --> 00:18:16.400
Remove the possible no's.
00:18:16.480 --> 00:18:16.960
Exactly.
00:18:17.200 --> 00:18:19.839
And in my head, I was doing this great service.
00:18:19.920 --> 00:18:28.880
And what I recognize now is I was actually doing such a disservice because the true service would have been to say, hey, I don't know if this is for you.
00:18:29.119 --> 00:18:32.400
It may be above your budget, it may, or, or maybe not even go there.
00:18:32.559 --> 00:18:35.839
Maybe just say, I don't know if it's for you, but here's what we have.
00:18:36.000 --> 00:18:41.440
I want to give you all the options so that you can make the best, most educated decision for you.
00:18:41.680 --> 00:18:45.599
But so I really realized that I was the one protecting myself.
00:18:45.759 --> 00:18:57.359
And when I stopped doing that and just did the go for no thing, which was, hey, here's everything, here's why you might do this, here's why you might not do this, and let the customer decide.
00:18:57.599 --> 00:19:01.440
My sales went up, and I think people ultimately were more satisfied.
00:19:01.599 --> 00:19:06.559
So it's really easy to think that you're really good at reading people.
00:19:06.720 --> 00:19:10.319
Oh, I can read that, I know what they're gonna do, I know what they're you know.
00:19:10.559 --> 00:19:14.079
No, not that is not necessarily true, and it's really not fair.
00:19:14.240 --> 00:19:17.359
It's certainly not coming at it from a service perspective.
00:19:18.000 --> 00:19:19.680
And I love that attitude of that.
00:19:20.000 --> 00:19:22.160
So let me still go back to something you had said earlier.
00:19:22.400 --> 00:19:24.720
We talked about a no response.
00:19:25.920 --> 00:19:27.279
It has that word no in there.
00:19:28.000 --> 00:19:30.240
So let's push back a little bit.
00:19:30.319 --> 00:19:33.119
If how do you know going back to the word no?
00:19:33.200 --> 00:19:34.400
And now I'm using it all the time, right?
00:19:34.559 --> 00:19:35.440
Don't say no.
00:19:36.240 --> 00:19:48.640
How do you know when all of a sudden the no response is a no or it's a no response because they're just busy or they're on to other things and it's really not you, but then you go back to your comment that you made.
00:19:48.880 --> 00:19:51.279
I'm reading into that, so all of a sudden, well, it must be me.
00:19:51.440 --> 00:19:53.119
They're not interested, yada, yada, yada.
00:19:53.359 --> 00:19:55.039
So where's the tension?
00:19:55.200 --> 00:19:56.559
So unpack that a little bit.
00:19:56.960 --> 00:19:58.240
Yeah, such a good thing.
00:19:58.480 --> 00:20:00.559
And these days, people are busy.
00:20:00.720 --> 00:20:04.000
So this is probably the number one issue that I run into, Brian, actually.
00:20:04.160 --> 00:20:08.880
So I'm glad you brought this up is just getting silence, just not getting a no response.
00:20:09.039 --> 00:20:14.319
And salespeople especially are really good at seeing those whether they're there or not.
00:20:14.640 --> 00:20:16.079
You know, just like it's a no.
00:20:16.240 --> 00:20:18.720
You know, you automatically just can't categorize it as a no.
00:20:19.279 --> 00:20:22.799
And you have to go like, wait a minute, is that story true or not?
00:20:23.119 --> 00:20:24.079
No, that's a good question.
00:20:24.240 --> 00:20:24.960
Say that question again.
00:20:26.160 --> 00:20:27.519
Is that story true or not?
00:20:27.920 --> 00:20:28.240
That's good.
00:20:28.400 --> 00:20:29.119
That's so good.
00:20:30.000 --> 00:20:36.079
And so here we are, you've maybe you it has been a few touches, a few touch points.
00:20:36.240 --> 00:20:40.160
Maybe you feel like, you know what, I this person understands my offer.
00:20:40.240 --> 00:20:50.160
And that's one of the things that we always want people to be clear on is does the person really understand what you're asking and what they're supposed to do?
00:20:50.559 --> 00:20:52.480
What is the call to action here?
00:20:52.720 --> 00:20:58.559
Or are you just kind of presenting and you're not really asking for the next step?
00:20:58.720 --> 00:21:09.759
I remember a guy in one of my GoForNo challenge cohorts and he said, Andrew, he goes, What I've learned is that I do a lot of talking and presenting over the phone, but I don't do very much asking.
00:21:10.000 --> 00:21:13.039
I'm not asking people to, hey, can we have a meeting?
00:21:13.200 --> 00:21:16.480
Hey, would it make sense to for us to jump on Zoom?
00:21:16.640 --> 00:21:20.640
You know, it's just like he goes, I just I'm just presenting and I'm never asking.
00:21:20.799 --> 00:21:23.519
So getting clarity on that, I think, is really important.
00:21:23.599 --> 00:21:30.000
But Brian, let's say, to your point, let's say you've done all of that and now you just feel like you're chasing.
00:21:30.240 --> 00:21:32.400
And so you have a couple options.
00:21:32.720 --> 00:21:46.400
One of my favorites is always that when you when you see what's going on, to not try to be cagey and smooth and try to be perfect, call out exactly what's happening.
00:21:46.640 --> 00:21:54.480
So don't be afraid to say, Hey, Brian, I've called you three or four times, I texted you, I sent you an email.
00:21:54.720 --> 00:22:00.880
Hey, it sounds it seems like you're really busy, and that maybe the summer is not a good Time for you.
00:22:01.119 --> 00:22:02.319
So here's what I'm going to do.
00:22:02.480 --> 00:22:03.519
Now you have a choice.
00:22:03.759 --> 00:22:07.200
You can just tell them what you're going to do, or you could make a recommendation.
00:22:07.359 --> 00:22:10.400
I think sometimes it's just better to tell them here's what I'm going to do.
00:22:10.640 --> 00:22:17.519
I'm going to put this whole thing on pause because maybe your priorities changed, or maybe you're just busy, but you haven't got back to me.
00:22:17.599 --> 00:22:21.359
I'm going to put this whole thing on pause and I'm going to follow up with you in September.
00:22:21.599 --> 00:22:26.319
If I've misread something or our wires got crossed, please just reach out to me, let me know.
00:22:26.400 --> 00:22:29.119
But otherwise, you know, I'll reach out in September.
00:22:29.359 --> 00:22:32.799
And so what you've done there is you've gone ahead and assumed the no.
00:22:32.880 --> 00:22:37.839
You've called out what's happening without you're not trying to blame, you're not trying to guilt trip anybody.
00:22:37.920 --> 00:22:41.119
You're just saying, hey, I've reached out a couple of times, I'm not hearing from you.
00:22:41.200 --> 00:22:43.759
So I'm going to assume that it's a no for now.
00:22:44.240 --> 00:22:46.960
But I'm not just going to abandon you.
00:22:47.119 --> 00:22:49.359
We're going to pick this up at a later time.
00:22:49.519 --> 00:22:52.000
And if I've got it wrong, get back to me.
00:22:52.319 --> 00:22:54.480
Well, three words you said, which were very powerful.
00:22:54.799 --> 00:22:55.680
No for now.
00:22:56.960 --> 00:22:57.839
And I love that.
00:22:57.920 --> 00:23:00.240
And it, Andrew, so this could not be more practical.
00:23:00.400 --> 00:23:04.799
Just this morning, on LinkedIn, same thing, reaching out to a company.
00:23:05.039 --> 00:23:06.160
Initially there was interest.
00:23:06.319 --> 00:23:07.759
Hey, I'd love to have you come in.
00:23:08.000 --> 00:23:12.480
Then back to this the radio silence, which is very easy for me to make the assumption on that.
00:23:12.799 --> 00:23:16.640
David, you applied, or you just mentioned to apply, reach out to you.
00:23:16.720 --> 00:23:20.240
Hey, maybe it's summer right now, maybe it's a busy time for here.
00:23:20.480 --> 00:23:22.400
Just wanted to say, I'm aware of that.
00:23:22.559 --> 00:23:24.480
I'm going to circle back in the fall.
00:23:24.559 --> 00:23:25.839
Please let me know.
00:23:26.160 --> 00:23:30.160
If right now you're not interested, or you prefer me to reach back out in the fall.
00:23:30.400 --> 00:23:32.240
And within an hour, Andrea, guess what?
00:23:32.319 --> 00:23:33.519
I got a response back.
00:23:33.759 --> 00:23:38.000
Oh, this quarter, quarter two ended up being so much busier than planned right now.
00:23:38.079 --> 00:23:40.559
I've turned the quarter for here for quarter three.
00:23:40.720 --> 00:23:43.279
And uh let's, you know, let's get on a call next week.
00:23:43.519 --> 00:23:46.000
So that is so practical, Andrea.
00:23:46.240 --> 00:23:47.680
So any any more thoughts on that?
00:23:48.160 --> 00:23:48.400
Yeah.
00:23:48.480 --> 00:23:58.000
Well, first of all, it I'm so glad that you gave that example because and what it takes to do that, Brian, is just one, having the courage to do it, right?
00:23:58.160 --> 00:24:07.680
I think it's so much, I think sometimes it's just easier for people to say, nah, it's just not gonna happen, or I and I don't know how to do it, you know, that that's a big one.
00:24:07.839 --> 00:24:13.759
We all know, I think in general that we should, but our brain loves to default to easy.
00:24:13.920 --> 00:24:16.720
So our brain thinks, you know what, it's just easier not not to.
00:24:16.960 --> 00:24:22.799
And also, if you have a bunch of baggage when it comes to quote selling, right?
00:24:22.960 --> 00:24:28.000
Like if you thought to yourself, well, I don't want to look desperate, I don't want to look like I'm begging.
00:24:28.160 --> 00:24:34.880
Well, first of all, you've no matter what you do for a living, you've got to get that out of the way.
00:24:35.039 --> 00:24:39.519
Because I know for somebody like you, you're like, hey, no, I'm bringing value to this company.
00:24:39.759 --> 00:24:41.920
They'll be better off if they hire me.
00:24:42.000 --> 00:24:44.000
So I'm going to, and they're qualified.
00:24:44.079 --> 00:24:52.400
So I'm going to do my darndest to get in their aura and to work with them because I know they'll be better off for it.
00:24:52.640 --> 00:24:55.440
And that's really coming at it from a different perspective.
00:24:55.599 --> 00:25:04.559
I think sometimes people shut themselves down because they think, well, I'm just trying to sell and it's all about me, and I look selfish and I look like I'm desperate or begging.
00:25:04.720 --> 00:25:09.440
When you've got to look at it from a how am I really helping people, how am I serving them perspective.
00:25:09.519 --> 00:25:11.440
Aaron Powell How do we handle that a little bit more?
00:25:11.519 --> 00:25:22.720
So let's drill down, double-click on that of asking questions to potentially get the know or get the yes and being okay with getting the no because we've asked those type of questions.
00:25:23.039 --> 00:25:24.240
So this is really interesting.
00:25:24.319 --> 00:25:27.279
And there's all different ways to do this.
00:25:27.440 --> 00:25:45.200
And I will tell you that from the go for no standpoint, we come at things from I guess the model you'd call it would be high like a high probability sales type model, which is ask the toughest questions up front first.
00:25:46.000 --> 00:26:02.559
And what I mean by that is figure out who is your best customer, client, prospect as quickly as possible so that you can continue to build rapport with that person and that relationship and know that they are qualified buyers.
00:26:02.640 --> 00:26:07.359
So this, Brian, is really kind of where we're talking more about sales.
00:26:07.519 --> 00:26:09.680
Now that's kind of the sales standpoint.
00:26:10.000 --> 00:26:17.759
If we're just talking about building connections and relationships, I think sometimes we don't know where it's gonna go, right?
00:26:17.839 --> 00:26:22.000
We don't know there is no necessarily sales component to it.
00:26:22.079 --> 00:26:27.839
Maybe you're just trying to get to know somebody and you have no idea whether they're a good fit, you're a good fit.
00:26:28.000 --> 00:26:36.240
And so from that standpoint, that's where you have to default to a program like yours where you learn how to have those conversations, right?
00:26:36.400 --> 00:26:40.160
And you learn how to how to skillfully handle that first five minutes.
00:26:40.240 --> 00:26:51.119
From a go-for-no mindset standpoint, the key is don't talk yourself out of it and don't say no to yourself before you approach that person and start your first five minutes.
00:26:51.279 --> 00:26:53.519
That's kind of the go-for-no mindset there.
00:26:53.759 --> 00:27:05.039
From the sales standpoint, going back is really can you determine very quickly who is a really good fit and who maybe isn't a good fit by the questions you ask.
00:27:05.200 --> 00:27:18.160
So, for example, one of the things that we have done in our business from the very beginning when we were prospecting is asking a company like, hey, do you all have annual sales conferences?
00:27:18.240 --> 00:27:19.359
Do you have sales meetings?
00:27:19.680 --> 00:27:26.880
And if they say no to that, for our purposes, we say, Okay, great, thank you very much.
00:27:27.119 --> 00:27:27.680
We're done.
00:27:28.079 --> 00:27:38.160
Like there's no other question because if they don't, at least for us, we're not offering anything else except speaking services at that moment.
00:27:38.559 --> 00:27:46.559
And so if they don't have a meeting, we're not gonna try to convince them that they are all of a sudden needed to throw 200 grand at having a sales meeting for all their salespeople.
00:27:47.039 --> 00:27:47.599
Well that makes sense.
00:27:48.400 --> 00:27:48.880
Yeah, absolutely.
00:27:48.960 --> 00:27:55.119
In fact, it's learning to ask the question that's gonna give you a true defining yes or no.
00:27:55.519 --> 00:27:56.079
Yes.
00:27:56.319 --> 00:27:58.720
There's no ambiguity that is there.
00:27:58.880 --> 00:28:01.680
You're gonna get the clarity that you very well need.
00:28:01.839 --> 00:28:03.519
And I just want to touch back on something too.
00:28:03.759 --> 00:28:14.720
Uh what I love about the overlay between the two of us is if I build that connection in the first five minutes, I feel like I'm I connect better with that person.
00:28:14.799 --> 00:28:22.880
And I feel like I could ask the question, and there's a little bit more relationship that's there where I can receive that know a little bit better.
00:28:23.039 --> 00:28:23.920
Does that make sense?
00:28:24.319 --> 00:28:24.880
Absolutely.
00:28:25.039 --> 00:28:27.519
My friend Leslie Vin, I can't pronounce her name.
00:28:27.759 --> 00:28:29.119
Anyway, I'll just say my friend Leslie.
00:28:29.359 --> 00:28:32.480
She's a great say amazing sales trainer, and she's a good one.
00:28:32.880 --> 00:28:34.000
One of those last names, right?
00:28:34.160 --> 00:28:34.720
Yeah, yeah.
00:28:34.880 --> 00:28:38.319
She uses the phrase earn the right, which I love that phrase.
00:28:38.480 --> 00:28:40.000
And you just made me think of that.
00:28:40.160 --> 00:29:05.039
So, yeah, that when you build that initial five minutes correctly, you do earn the right to ask those pointed questions, which I think tells you whether or not things are gonna continue or whether you just part ways as colleagues, friends, like without having to like take the relationship to kind of some next level where you know it doesn't necessarily benefit either one of you and it's not really gonna go anywhere, you know.
00:29:05.200 --> 00:29:06.799
So yeah, I like that you said that.
00:29:07.200 --> 00:29:19.519
Well, and I think too, it creates maybe a maybe there's some maturity where you're not as defensive in that moment where all of a sudden you're like, Whoa, well, you haven't thought about this, and you well, you know what I'm saying?
00:29:19.599 --> 00:29:29.599
And we take it personally, or we feel like we gotta defend our point, and we don't truly accept the no as the no with that, and we're still okay with that.
00:29:29.920 --> 00:29:31.759
And also, too, you said it earlier, Andrea.
00:29:32.079 --> 00:29:33.759
Sometimes it's just no for now.
00:29:34.480 --> 00:29:39.200
And if we shut that down, we miss the for the for the later.
00:29:39.440 --> 00:29:41.680
And I have that happen a lot, as I'm sure you do on LinkedIn.
00:29:41.839 --> 00:29:44.640
I'm reaching out to somebody, hey Brian, you know, now's not a good time.
00:29:44.960 --> 00:29:48.000
I was just talking to a VP of sales, and he's brand new to his role.
00:29:48.400 --> 00:29:50.799
And so he says, I just I gotta get my feet under me here.
00:29:50.880 --> 00:29:52.559
Let's definitely talk in the fall.
00:29:52.799 --> 00:30:02.880
I had one of those earlier, and now all of a sudden coming back, touching base with him, and it was a no for then, but now he's in a spot where he's in a better spot to have a conversation out of that.
00:30:03.039 --> 00:30:04.960
So I think there's a lot that's there.
00:30:05.359 --> 00:30:09.039
Let's transition that a little bit if we can to let's say it is hospitality.
00:30:09.680 --> 00:30:20.160
Let's say we're in that environment and we're getting a little bit of heat from the other person, and we're asking a question and they're saying no, and that's a little bit more of an awkward dynamic.
00:30:20.400 --> 00:30:23.599
So can you unpack that a little bit there in the context of hospitality?
00:30:24.240 --> 00:30:24.559
Yeah.
00:30:24.720 --> 00:30:37.279
So I mean, if you're I think whenever it comes to asking anything, my rule is always context, giving context for why uh you're asking the question.
00:30:37.440 --> 00:30:43.039
And sometimes it even helps to ask somebody if you can ask them a question.
00:30:43.200 --> 00:30:46.079
So because people love to talk about themselves, right?
00:30:46.559 --> 00:30:50.799
And so if if you were to say to somebody, Do you mind if I ask you a question?
00:30:51.440 --> 00:30:56.799
Now they're excited because they're thinking, Oh, this is interesting, because this is going to be about me.
00:30:57.039 --> 00:30:58.880
And yes, of course I want to answer.
00:30:59.039 --> 00:31:00.319
Of course I want you to ask me a question.
00:31:00.400 --> 00:31:02.240
So then it's do you mind if I ask you a question?
00:31:02.559 --> 00:31:06.559
Have you considered, have you taken a look, whatever it happens to be, right?
00:31:06.720 --> 00:31:13.359
Whatever you want, are you open to keeping the question very open and very curiosity-based.
00:31:13.519 --> 00:31:16.880
I love, are you open to, have you thought about?
00:31:17.519 --> 00:31:20.240
You know, I stay away from why questions.
00:31:20.640 --> 00:31:21.119
Phil M.
00:31:21.279 --> 00:31:24.240
Jones wrote a book called Exactly What to Say, fantastic book.
00:31:25.440 --> 00:31:28.319
One of the tips he has in there is never ask why.
00:31:28.480 --> 00:31:38.480
You know, he talks about like the better phrase is what makes you say that, what you know, and I love asking what questions, how questions, are you open questions?
00:31:38.720 --> 00:31:47.200
And I think that diffuses a lot of that awkwardness, or if you feel like you've you've stepped over the line, perhaps.
00:31:47.440 --> 00:31:57.680
And in retail, in sales, in hospitality, there's always a chance that you're gonna say or do something that's gonna just rub somebody the wrong way.
00:31:58.240 --> 00:32:06.400
And that fear, though, I think holds us back a lot of times from just performing at the highest level.
00:32:06.799 --> 00:32:18.319
And so what you have to understand is there's nothing wrong with apologizing, and there's nothing wrong with saying, Oh, I apologize, I just get so excited, our spa just opened up, and so we're talking to everybody about it.
00:32:18.480 --> 00:32:22.640
We're, you know, we're asking everybody if they want to try it, but no worries.
00:32:22.960 --> 00:32:43.200
Understand that you can pull your toe back to safety, that it doesn't have to be a huge thing, and that the fear of asking, that the fear of putting yourself out there is holding back your ability to sell and serve much more than the fear that you have of, oh, I'm gonna upset somebody and they're gonna ask to talk to my manager and then it's gonna be a big thing.
00:32:43.279 --> 00:32:43.759
That's it.
00:32:43.920 --> 00:32:44.559
That's so good.
00:32:44.720 --> 00:32:46.079
Yeah, it's so good.
00:32:46.960 --> 00:32:48.160
Hey, quick break.
00:32:48.319 --> 00:32:50.799
I want to tell you about something brand new.
00:32:51.039 --> 00:32:52.640
It's called the first five.
00:32:52.880 --> 00:32:58.400
It's your weekly guide to leveraging better conversations to build connection, trust, and influence.
00:32:58.640 --> 00:33:07.200
I've created a brand new email newsletter that brings the first five minutes to life, or a practical way that you can use immediately in the upcoming week.
00:33:07.680 --> 00:33:08.480
Here's the deal.
00:33:08.640 --> 00:33:10.720
Every week you give one idea.
00:33:10.960 --> 00:33:12.559
Five minutes in five minutes.
00:33:13.119 --> 00:33:16.720
First is a story, something real that makes the idea light.
00:33:17.359 --> 00:33:18.640
Second's an idea.
00:33:18.799 --> 00:33:21.119
What's actually going on in one?
00:33:22.400 --> 00:33:23.279
First is cool.
00:33:23.599 --> 00:33:26.880
Something you can use with a phrase or specific.
00:33:29.359 --> 00:33:31.279
What's it trying your very best?
00:33:33.759 --> 00:33:34.400
It's a question.
00:33:34.720 --> 00:33:35.440
It's a question.
00:33:37.039 --> 00:33:37.839
That's it.
00:33:38.079 --> 00:33:45.039
Five minutes, one idea, you'll actually know it's free and it lands in your inbox.
00:33:46.400 --> 00:33:48.160
Sign up in the show notes.
00:33:48.559 --> 00:33:49.279
Go right now.
00:33:49.359 --> 00:33:53.359
Go grab it, and I'll see you in your next five.
00:33:54.079 --> 00:33:57.440
Now, back to our regularly scheduled program.
00:33:59.440 --> 00:34:01.279
Why do people struggle so much?
00:34:01.359 --> 00:34:07.440
And what are some obstacles of why people don't ask questions, especially in those important critical first five minutes?
00:34:07.680 --> 00:34:07.920
Yeah.
00:34:08.159 --> 00:34:11.519
There are many obstacles and a few of them that come to mind.
00:34:11.679 --> 00:34:13.760
First of all, we live in an attention-seeking age.
00:34:13.840 --> 00:34:18.800
You know, I mean, some people have called this conversational narcissism, where the arrows are pointing in.
00:34:18.960 --> 00:34:19.679
Look at me.
00:34:19.840 --> 00:34:21.679
You know, I walk in the room, here I am.
00:34:21.920 --> 00:34:26.800
There's very few people that walk in a room and have their arrows pointing outward and say, look at you, there you are.
00:34:27.039 --> 00:34:30.320
And so, you know, as the joke goes, enough about me, what do you think about me?
00:34:30.480 --> 00:34:38.639
And so because we live in this uh narcissistic age, it's really hard because questions point the arrows away from us and toward other people.
00:34:38.800 --> 00:34:41.199
Um, the other thing, it's not modeled very well.
00:34:41.440 --> 00:34:50.719
And because, you know, just like I want to learn to be a better dad or to uh swing a baseball bat or a good golf swing, I've got to have that modeled well.
00:34:50.880 --> 00:34:54.239
And because it's not modeled well, it's hard to know how to do it well.
00:34:54.400 --> 00:34:59.039
But I think the other one, in addition to poor modeling, it's viewed as being inefficient.
00:34:59.199 --> 00:35:06.320
And for people, especially in business or sales, you know, we get a lot of type A strivers and people that get things done.
00:35:06.400 --> 00:35:10.320
I I'm a type A, I like to accomplish things, check things off the box.
00:35:10.480 --> 00:35:13.760
Well, questions can be perceived as being inefficient.
00:35:13.920 --> 00:35:15.599
How many times have we been in a meeting?
00:35:15.760 --> 00:35:20.400
We're about wrapping up, we're grabbing our computer and our notebook and about to leave, and someone says, any questions?
00:35:20.480 --> 00:35:23.039
And someone raises their hand and goes, Oh, come on, man.
00:35:23.119 --> 00:35:26.000
Like that guy, you're slowing us down here.
00:35:26.159 --> 00:35:33.920
And yet there are times we need to just keep moving, but there are also times to slow down and it feels inefficient.
00:35:34.079 --> 00:35:39.119
But it it's inefficient in the short term, but it's wildly effective in the long term if we ask the right questions.
00:35:39.199 --> 00:35:42.400
So there's some say that, say that last line again.
00:35:42.639 --> 00:35:48.239
Yeah, questions can feel inefficient in the short term, but wildly effective over the long term.
00:35:48.400 --> 00:35:55.679
And if we can have a longer-term mindset, a long-term mindset, it will help us learn to ask better questions in the moment.
00:35:56.079 --> 00:36:00.719
Well, and think about somebody in the sales, they're building relationship and the building asks those questions.
00:36:00.800 --> 00:36:05.039
And that's a phrase that you mentioned earlier that we say all the time is look at you, not look at me.
00:36:05.280 --> 00:36:07.199
Be interested, not interesting.
00:36:07.519 --> 00:36:12.159
How within the obstacles, let's let's move over to because that could be for the service world, for the sales world.
00:36:12.639 --> 00:36:19.119
Somebody in hospitality, all of a sudden you're coming up to me, let's say it's at a hotel or restaurant or whatever.
00:36:19.360 --> 00:36:25.440
How what are some of the obstacles potentially that somebody would not want to ask questions given that context?
00:36:25.760 --> 00:36:26.159
Yeah.
00:36:26.400 --> 00:36:30.000
So I think we assume that people don't want to be asked questions.
00:36:30.239 --> 00:36:32.960
And I think in hospitality, I'm just gonna leave them alone, right?
00:36:33.039 --> 00:36:37.440
They're tired, they're coming in late, you know, and they might be, and we need to read the room.
00:36:37.679 --> 00:36:40.559
But remember, there's an epidemic of loneliness right now.
00:36:40.719 --> 00:36:45.280
And there are a lot of people that are asked generic junk questions.
00:36:45.519 --> 00:36:46.239
How are you?
00:36:46.400 --> 00:36:47.119
How's it going?
00:36:47.280 --> 00:37:04.719
You know, but if we can ask really thoughtful questions and we can see it as a gift, in fact, I think one of the greatest forms of hospitality in our culture today is to ask someone a very thoughtful question and to give them the patience and the attention to answer, that we actually listen to them.
00:37:04.960 --> 00:37:10.000
For example, there's a great book, Unreasonable Hospitality, Will Gadera, amazing book.
00:37:10.159 --> 00:37:12.239
And so what is what is hospitality about?
00:37:12.320 --> 00:37:13.679
It's about connection.
00:37:14.159 --> 00:37:23.280
And sometimes we over-emphasize that questions are just about information, that's certainly part of it, but it's also about engagement and connection.
00:37:23.679 --> 00:37:32.000
We know in leadership or in sales and business hospitality that trust is the engine by which the vehicle runs on.
00:37:32.159 --> 00:37:37.280
So we can have a beautiful looking vehicle, but if the tank is empty of trust, we ain't going anywhere.
00:37:37.440 --> 00:37:40.239
And so, how do we put trust in the tank?
00:37:40.480 --> 00:37:44.800
One of the ways we do that is to ask really thoughtful questions of other people.
00:37:45.119 --> 00:37:48.480
And yeah, sometimes there's so much trust I have with people.
00:37:48.559 --> 00:37:51.920
I'll say, I don't care what you charge me, I trust you, just send me the bill.
00:37:52.400 --> 00:37:53.039
Why is that?
00:37:53.199 --> 00:37:56.400
Because I've earned enough trust with them over a period of time.
00:37:56.559 --> 00:38:03.760
And I think hospitality is a wonderful way that we can just take the and I'm not saying ask 50 questions of someone.
00:38:03.920 --> 00:38:08.159
That could be overwhelming and actually make them exhausted and make it awkward.
00:38:08.400 --> 00:38:17.360
But can I go the extra five or ten or fifteen percent of intentionality to be able to ask them a thoughtful question that they say, huh?
00:38:17.519 --> 00:38:19.519
You know, no one's ever asked me that before.
00:38:19.840 --> 00:38:20.960
You know, huh?
00:38:21.360 --> 00:38:22.480
Thanks for asking.
00:38:22.639 --> 00:38:24.239
Well, and then they finish.
00:38:24.400 --> 00:38:25.440
I think these are gifts.
00:38:25.519 --> 00:38:34.320
And I don't think we often see questions as gifts because we only see it as transactional currency when really it's relational currency.
00:38:34.480 --> 00:38:40.639
And so if we can see them as gifts, we give people gifts, that's an amazing form of hospitality we give to others.
00:38:40.960 --> 00:38:46.800
Well, I love the framing of that, and uh that it is a gift and it is not an annoyance of that.
00:38:47.199 --> 00:39:00.159
In the book, you reference a book that I'd read, which I'd loved when you unpacked that um How to Know a Person by David Brooks, and you referenced a key point which actually you brought more to light, which is a diminisher versus an illuminator.
00:39:00.320 --> 00:39:04.559
So unpack that for us, especially in the context of asking questions.
00:39:05.199 --> 00:39:06.960
Yeah, I'm a big David Brooks fan.
00:39:07.119 --> 00:39:11.280
In fact, I think he asks great questions in his writing and in his speaking a great deal.
00:39:11.360 --> 00:39:20.320
So I was very excited to get the book and uh actually wanted to actually interview him for the book, was unable to get a hold of him or get a response back because I think he is so good at that.
00:39:20.480 --> 00:39:23.679
But he talked about that he said there are two types of people in the world.
00:39:23.920 --> 00:39:26.719
In every crowd, there are diminishers and there are illuminators.
00:39:26.800 --> 00:39:32.559
Uh, diminishers are those people that make them feel really small, invisible, unvalued.
00:39:32.800 --> 00:39:36.800
They kind of use people rather than engage with people.
00:39:36.880 --> 00:39:41.280
They see them not to be befriended, but to be utilized.
00:39:41.440 --> 00:39:43.599
And so they often stereotype and ignore.
00:39:43.760 --> 00:39:47.840
But on the other side of the crowd, you will see illuminators.
00:39:47.920 --> 00:39:51.119
These are the people that they're just curious about other people.
00:39:51.599 --> 00:39:58.320
They have been trained or trained themselves to learn to ask great questions and to understand other people.
00:39:58.480 --> 00:40:03.840
And they just water the flowers of these people to see them bloom more.
00:40:04.480 --> 00:40:09.599
And they they just there's a brightness to them, there's a magnetic side to them.
00:40:09.679 --> 00:40:17.199
And if you know about that framework now, Brian, if you walk in a room and you kind of say, Who in this room are diminishers and who are illuminators?
00:40:17.360 --> 00:40:18.880
It's amazing what comes to light.
00:40:19.039 --> 00:40:24.400
I mentioned earlier the difference between those that had inspiring stories and those that live small stories.
00:40:24.639 --> 00:40:27.360
One were illuminators, one were diminishers.
00:40:27.519 --> 00:40:33.760
And I want to be an illuminator, which means I want to hang out with illuminators, which means I've got to learn to ask better questions.
00:40:33.840 --> 00:40:42.159
And so that idea of when I give people the gift of hospitality, of asking a good question, um, I'm illuminating them.
00:40:42.239 --> 00:40:48.880
I may have me illuminating their thinking in a new creative way, illuminating them by adding value to who they are as humans.
00:40:49.039 --> 00:40:53.840
I may be illuminating the conversation and adding value to the business meeting that I'm a part of.
00:40:54.079 --> 00:40:59.440
But can I walk in and ask myself the question, how can I illuminate other people in this room?
00:40:59.679 --> 00:41:05.280
And just by that simple framework and question, it's amazing how our mindset can shift.
00:41:05.920 --> 00:41:09.760
Well, you had a challenge in there with four words.
00:41:10.000 --> 00:41:12.639
I want to actually three, I want to be.
00:41:13.519 --> 00:41:18.000
And you have a choice of being an illuminator, or by default, being a diminisher on that.
00:41:18.159 --> 00:41:21.679
So I just want to make sure we capture the gold on that, is that it's a choice.
00:41:21.920 --> 00:41:22.880
It's a great question.
00:41:23.039 --> 00:41:24.559
And it's uh others focused.
00:41:24.639 --> 00:41:28.239
So we really need to work at I want to be an illuminator.
00:41:28.480 --> 00:41:34.400
The some of the gold that I found in your book, you had these different levels, the four essentials of asking better questions.
00:41:34.639 --> 00:41:44.800
And I think it's going to be very revealing as you work through those four of where we kind of stop, where we aspire to be, but where we think we are, maybe two completely different things.
00:41:44.880 --> 00:41:46.880
So let's unpack those four essentials.
00:41:47.280 --> 00:41:47.679
Sure.
00:41:48.000 --> 00:41:59.199
Well, in my dissertation research, was some what of one of the things that I found was that every good question, people say, What's what's the difference between a good question and a bad question, or between a great one and a good one?
00:41:59.360 --> 00:42:00.000
There are four things.
00:42:00.079 --> 00:42:03.840
You get you have to have wisdom, curiosity, humility, and courage.
00:42:04.000 --> 00:42:05.599
I don't know how you ask a good question without curious.
00:42:05.920 --> 00:42:06.559
Repeat those four.
00:42:06.800 --> 00:42:10.159
Yeah, wisdom, curiosity, humility, and courage.
00:42:10.880 --> 00:42:12.239
All four of those are essential.
00:42:12.639 --> 00:42:15.280
Wisdom, I could ask 10,000 different questions.
00:42:15.440 --> 00:42:21.440
I need the wisdom to know what's the right question to ask at the right time for the right reason to the right person.
00:42:21.679 --> 00:42:22.960
I also need curiosity.
00:42:23.119 --> 00:42:26.000
I don't know how you ask a genuine question without being curious.
00:42:26.159 --> 00:42:29.760
I need humility because I'm basically admitting I don't know.
00:42:29.920 --> 00:42:30.159
I don't know.
00:42:30.400 --> 00:42:31.920
If I'm gonna ask a question, I don't know.
00:42:32.079 --> 00:42:33.840
I'm not gonna fake it, I'm gonna ask it.
00:42:33.920 --> 00:42:41.440
And lastly, if we're gonna put ourselves out there and say we don't know, that's gonna take some courage because sometimes people will say, Really?
00:42:41.599 --> 00:42:42.559
You don't know that?
00:42:42.800 --> 00:42:45.599
And so to put ourselves out there requires vulnerability.
00:42:45.760 --> 00:42:54.639
Now, with that being said, wisdom, courage, curiosity, and humility, one of the other things I found in my research is there are four levels of questions.
00:42:54.880 --> 00:42:59.440
I think we know in our bones that not all questions are created equal.
00:42:59.599 --> 00:43:04.079
But I'm not sure we had a framework to know why are some more valued than others.
00:43:04.320 --> 00:43:08.719
And so one of the things I noticed is there are different, what I call different levels of questions.
00:43:08.960 --> 00:43:18.800
And those four levels indicate basically the level of relationship or trust that I have, whether it's a business relationship, a romantic relationship, a friendship, whatever it might be.
00:43:18.960 --> 00:43:23.760
And so level one questions are questions for information, just simple facts.
00:43:24.000 --> 00:43:28.000
They're transactional, they're straightforward with clear answers.
00:43:28.159 --> 00:43:29.440
It's very low risk.
00:43:29.599 --> 00:43:30.559
Yeah, they're very safe.
00:43:30.719 --> 00:43:32.159
And we need those in our culture.
00:43:32.400 --> 00:43:37.599
So you could walk up to a stranger, Brian, and ask this question, and it wouldn't be awkward.
00:43:37.679 --> 00:43:38.800
You know, what's your name?
00:43:38.960 --> 00:43:39.920
What time is it?
00:43:40.079 --> 00:43:41.840
Um, what time does the show begin?
00:43:42.000 --> 00:43:43.519
No one's gonna be like, whoa, you're a creep.
00:43:43.599 --> 00:43:44.400
What are you talking about?
00:43:44.800 --> 00:43:48.000
It's a very easy, safe entry level low bar.
00:43:48.559 --> 00:43:49.280
Low bar.
00:43:49.519 --> 00:43:58.000
When there's enough trust developed there, and that could be over weeks or in just a few seconds or minutes, I can actually begin to ask level two questions.
00:43:58.079 --> 00:43:59.440
And that's where I go a little bit deeper.
00:44:00.000 --> 00:44:02.480
Level two questions are questions for interaction.
00:44:02.639 --> 00:44:04.960
This is where we talk about thoughts and emotions.
00:44:05.119 --> 00:44:07.519
We're sharing a little bit more of ourselves.
00:44:07.840 --> 00:44:11.679
So a little bit of relational context or trust is required there.
00:44:11.840 --> 00:44:15.360
So for example, it could be how are you feeling about today's meeting?
00:44:15.440 --> 00:44:17.840
Or I noticed our numbers are down this quarter.
00:44:18.079 --> 00:44:19.519
How does that make you feel?
00:44:19.760 --> 00:44:23.599
So I'm asking them to give a little bit beyond just pure facts.
00:44:24.000 --> 00:44:30.400
And so often the realm of small talk in level one, which is great, this is where it takes it just a little bit deeper.
00:44:30.559 --> 00:44:32.880
It requires revealing something of me.
00:44:33.280 --> 00:44:36.320
If we're really close to someone, we can move to level three.
00:44:36.400 --> 00:44:44.159
And level three is where these this is questions for understanding, where it will require feelings and desires on our part.
00:44:44.320 --> 00:44:47.360
So there has to be mutual trust and vulnerability.
00:44:47.519 --> 00:44:52.800
So this might be a close friend, maybe some coworkers you know really well.
00:44:53.199 --> 00:44:57.360
And this is where you begin to share your hopes or dreams or disappointments.
00:44:57.599 --> 00:45:02.880
So you might begin to ask things like, what do you really want out of your role here at this job?
00:45:03.119 --> 00:45:06.880
Or what are some of your deepest fears as you enter into this new quarter?
00:45:06.960 --> 00:45:08.800
Um as we face these challenges?
00:45:09.119 --> 00:45:10.159
What are you afraid of?
00:45:10.400 --> 00:45:13.199
And so it's the heart of meaningful relationships.
00:45:13.360 --> 00:45:20.639
I think if we can look at our close friends and really healthy relationships over a period of time, a lot of them will be in the level three.
00:45:20.880 --> 00:45:35.360
Level four, though, Brian, is that the deepest level where we're plumbing the depths of human experience, and only a few people do we feel comfortable with receiving a question or asking a question at this level because it requires vulnerability and intimacy.
00:45:35.599 --> 00:45:48.159
So this might be a spouse, a best friend for 30 years, a therapist, a pastor, somebody you really, really trust where you're sharing some deep stuff with you and do you trust them immensely?
00:45:48.320 --> 00:45:56.960
And I think one of the things that's important is to realize you ever been in a conversation where someone asked a question and you went, Whoa, whoa, I'm not ready to go there.
00:45:57.039 --> 00:45:58.239
I mean, I don't know you that well.
00:45:58.400 --> 00:46:02.800
It's what happened is they jumped to a level that we had not established trust yet.
00:46:02.880 --> 00:46:06.239
And it felt weird and creepy or a little awkward too soon.
00:46:06.400 --> 00:46:16.079
The other side, Brian, is sometimes we have relationships where I've said, you know, I've known this person for 30 years, and all we talk about is the weather and sports and how big the fish was that I caught last week.
00:46:16.480 --> 00:46:20.559
What we realize is we've been hanging out in level one, maybe level two.
00:46:21.119 --> 00:46:22.719
And maybe it's time to bring it down.
00:46:22.800 --> 00:46:28.079
So we need courage and wisdom there to say, is this the time to take a risk to go to the next level?
00:46:28.400 --> 00:46:34.239
And I like the correlation between the essentials, just as you had mentioned the courage and the humility to get to these different levels.
00:46:34.400 --> 00:46:36.559
So let's let's double click on this a little bit.
00:46:37.199 --> 00:46:55.679
Obviously, when somebody's meeting somebody for the first time in the first five minutes, which is most of our context, whether it's in hospitality or whether it's service professionals, whether it's sales, is it easy to just maybe stay too long in those safe level one when there's an opportunity when you feel a connection?
00:46:55.840 --> 00:47:03.920
I mean, we we chatted like girls just for a couple minutes before this, and I felt like you I could ask you a level two question, you could ask me a level two question back and forth with there.
00:47:04.159 --> 00:47:07.119
So can you unpack that just a little bit as far as kind of how we navigate those?
00:47:07.440 --> 00:47:07.679
Sure.
00:47:07.760 --> 00:47:12.639
And I know you work uh with leaders and those in the field, different various fields on the first five minutes.
00:47:12.800 --> 00:47:12.960
Yeah.
00:47:13.199 --> 00:47:19.519
If we started with a level two or a level three, we might catch people off guard real quick and make it awkward from the start.
00:47:19.679 --> 00:47:20.960
And we want to avoid that, right?
00:47:21.119 --> 00:47:25.360
So we wouldn't ask things like uh um, see, do you love your job or do you hate it?
00:47:25.519 --> 00:47:27.599
You know, it's like, whoa, uh, what's your name again?
00:47:27.920 --> 00:47:28.480
Exactly.
00:47:29.440 --> 00:47:37.920
So um, so we want to avoid that, but if we only linger at the level one, we can begin to ask vanilla or predictable questions.
00:47:38.079 --> 00:47:39.199
Yeah, good word predictable questions.
00:47:39.360 --> 00:47:46.239
Brian, one of the things that I've found, it's that there's a universal rule uh principle when it comes to asking questions.
00:47:46.400 --> 00:47:53.119
If I ask generic, thoughtless questions, I will most often get generic thoughtless answers.
00:47:53.280 --> 00:47:54.559
However, right?
00:47:54.719 --> 00:47:54.960
Yeah.
00:47:55.119 --> 00:48:02.079
But if I ask a thoughtful, engaging, caring question, I will often get a thoughtful, engaging, caring answer.
00:48:02.159 --> 00:48:04.320
It's as predictable as a communist election.
00:48:04.480 --> 00:48:06.000
It's amazing how that works.
00:48:06.239 --> 00:48:09.440
And so we may need to start with, how are you doing?
00:48:09.599 --> 00:48:10.559
Where do you work?
00:48:10.639 --> 00:48:11.840
You know, where do you live?
00:48:12.000 --> 00:48:13.039
Those are fine.
00:48:13.360 --> 00:48:20.960
But if we can read the room that, hey, there's been trust established in the first 30 seconds, then it's time to say, Oh, how long have you been with the company?
00:48:21.280 --> 00:48:23.199
Sometimes people say, Oh, I've been there 11 years.
00:48:23.360 --> 00:48:27.760
I asked a gentleman last night at a concert, how long have you been with the the uh the the company you're with?
00:48:27.920 --> 00:48:28.480
11 years.
00:48:28.639 --> 00:48:31.679
And I just asked, uh, does it feel like 11 years?
00:48:32.000 --> 00:48:32.559
Good follow-up.
00:48:32.880 --> 00:48:37.360
Now it's just it's a simple question, and he could take that however he wants of wow, woo, it's felt longer.
00:48:37.440 --> 00:48:38.960
It's been a rough, rough road.
00:48:39.119 --> 00:48:40.960
Or, no, it's flown by.
00:48:41.199 --> 00:48:44.320
Well, that's a little bit more of a thoughtful question.
00:48:44.480 --> 00:48:48.960
And and he even said, Huh, I hadn't really thought about that, how I felt after 11 years.
00:48:49.280 --> 00:49:04.320
So I'm just trying to give him a gift to help him think a little bit more, and then when he responds to say, Oh, thanks for sharing, you know, or nodding my head of kind of giving that feedback back to him, we're developing trust through a lot of nonverbals in those first 60 seconds as well.
00:49:04.639 --> 00:49:06.719
So, how does it establish connection?
00:49:07.119 --> 00:49:17.199
Because when we're talking about persuasion, at some point in the conversation, and what I love about your book, Josh, is we overlay a lot with the first five minutes framework of talking about asking questions about listening within that.
00:49:17.360 --> 00:49:27.039
So let's kind of start from there as far as the way that persuasion actually interfaces with connecting, which seems almost countercultural.
00:49:27.519 --> 00:49:29.519
Uh totally seems countercultural.
00:49:29.760 --> 00:49:33.280
And so it starts a little bit with that shared aspect of shared action.
00:49:33.440 --> 00:49:35.199
Okay, so what exactly?
00:49:35.360 --> 00:49:39.039
Well, we are wired to think all about ourselves.
00:49:39.599 --> 00:49:45.360
And the trouble is that that's not persuasive, and that to be persuasive, you have to put them first.
00:49:45.679 --> 00:49:51.199
I'll start with a story I had an intern a couple of summers ago, a smart kid, nice kid, still connect with him.
00:49:51.280 --> 00:49:52.639
We texted a few weeks ago.
00:49:52.800 --> 00:49:53.679
His name was John.
00:49:54.000 --> 00:50:02.639
And John thought that the best way to show how smart he was was to wave his hand, say, hey, hey, look at me, talk a lot, and just showcase his brilliance for all to see.
00:50:02.800 --> 00:50:05.280
He even loved to interrupt people, love to interrupt me.
00:50:05.599 --> 00:50:08.559
Problem was that was really not a good way to be a great colleague.
00:50:08.639 --> 00:50:16.480
And I had to help John understand that if he wanted to succeed in his internship, he had to really put us, the team, first and to deliver what we needed.
00:50:16.639 --> 00:50:27.920
And over the course of summer, he did this 180 where he actually started to put the needs of the team first, and he outperformed all the other interns such that we kept him on and gave him a promotion, only in turn to get that.
00:50:28.079 --> 00:50:34.320
He learned that to get what he wanted, which was more accolades, promotion, all that kind of stuff, he had to put them, us first.
00:50:34.639 --> 00:50:39.039
So the trouble is that talking about ourselves, it's a survival mechanism.
00:50:39.119 --> 00:50:42.079
That's what our ancestors used to survive, thinking about ourselves.
00:50:42.239 --> 00:50:45.920
Talking about ourselves generates the same sensations in our brain as sex and money.
00:50:46.079 --> 00:50:47.599
So it feels really good.
00:50:47.760 --> 00:50:50.320
So we adopt what I call a me first mindset.
00:50:50.559 --> 00:50:54.800
The problem is, Brian, when I make it all about me, how persuasive is that to you?
00:50:55.360 --> 00:50:55.679
Zero.
00:50:56.239 --> 00:50:56.639
Zero.
00:50:56.800 --> 00:50:57.280
Exactly.
00:50:57.440 --> 00:51:01.360
That's why you have to totally flip the script and put them first.
00:51:01.519 --> 00:51:03.679
And that's how you establish connection.
00:51:03.920 --> 00:51:05.360
As you said, how do you do that?
00:51:05.599 --> 00:51:07.119
Listening, listening, listening.
00:51:07.280 --> 00:51:29.360
We think that the speaker is in control and the speaker is actually not in control because when I'm speaking, let's say that I'm a potential client and you're there listening, and I'm talking, talking, talking about all the things that I want, all the things that I need, you're getting extremely valuable information about how you could potentially serve those needs, whether we're gonna be a good fit.
00:51:29.599 --> 00:51:36.239
You let me do all the talking and then you vacuum in that information, and then you can figure out how to use it to get what you want.
00:51:36.400 --> 00:51:38.639
So that's why listening is so foundational.
00:51:39.119 --> 00:51:42.480
So let's unpack that because you're literally talking about the first minute.
00:51:42.559 --> 00:51:42.719
Yeah.
00:51:43.039 --> 00:51:45.599
And so many of us assume on the first impression.
00:51:45.760 --> 00:51:47.440
Well, I've got to make a good first impression.
00:51:47.519 --> 00:51:50.400
And I personally think most people have first impressions all wrong.
00:51:50.480 --> 00:51:50.639
Yeah.
00:51:50.800 --> 00:51:58.320
So you're saying here, in order for us to even just begin the persuasion process, it's got to be a look at you, not look at me mindset.
00:51:58.400 --> 00:52:00.559
I got to be interested, not interesting, correct?
00:52:01.119 --> 00:52:01.519
100%.
00:52:01.840 --> 00:52:03.199
And then connect with them.
00:52:03.440 --> 00:52:11.119
So, you know, you can ask them questions, open-ended questions, listen, listen, listen, demonstrate that you understand them.
00:52:11.280 --> 00:52:15.039
Say, okay, please correct me if I have misunderstood you.
00:52:15.280 --> 00:52:17.280
These are your three biggest goals.
00:52:17.440 --> 00:52:20.320
And they're like, yeah, oh man, cool, this guy gets me.
00:52:20.400 --> 00:52:23.840
Or, yes, two of those, I would actually phrase out one a little bit differently.
00:52:24.079 --> 00:52:24.719
Okay, cool.
00:52:24.880 --> 00:52:27.760
I didn't quite understand it, but thank you for clarifying.
00:52:27.920 --> 00:52:29.280
They know that you're dialed in.
00:52:29.360 --> 00:52:34.719
That forms connection right there because so often we treat conversations as ping-pong or tennis, right?
00:52:34.880 --> 00:52:37.280
Just waiting to bat the ball back over the net.
00:52:37.360 --> 00:52:38.320
And that's not effective.
00:52:38.400 --> 00:52:42.079
It's actually kind of annoying because you know that they aren't they aren't listening.
00:52:42.320 --> 00:52:47.360
One of the really hard parts about listening is that nobody ever teaches us how to do it.
00:52:47.599 --> 00:52:49.599
You can major in communications.
00:52:49.760 --> 00:52:51.920
There are no corresponding majors to listening.
00:52:52.000 --> 00:52:52.960
It'd be a really weird thing.
00:52:53.039 --> 00:53:02.639
And even in those communication courses, throughout somebody's entire career majoring in communications, they might not have even a single class day over what, 20 classes for a major.
00:53:02.719 --> 00:53:04.880
They might not have a single class day on listening.
00:53:05.039 --> 00:53:06.400
So we never learn how to do it.
00:53:06.719 --> 00:53:12.239
How do we handle that if we're going with that persuasion mindset of not forcing it like we've been talking about?
00:53:12.639 --> 00:53:23.679
When somebody's coming hot, let's say, you know, you you love to listen, you want to really do persuasion, you know, all these things, you know, you read the book, you listen to your podcast, all these things, and then someone's coming in hot and heavy.
00:53:23.760 --> 00:53:24.480
Oh my God.
00:53:24.719 --> 00:53:29.840
Well, again, part of persuasion is deciding if you can make a deal with somebody.
00:53:29.920 --> 00:53:30.480
Maybe you can't.
00:53:30.639 --> 00:53:43.760
But here's like the really cool thing about the listen first uh approach to things is that you just ask people who love to come in hot, ask them questions and let them overshare because they will.
00:53:43.920 --> 00:53:47.440
And they're just giving you boatloads of information.
00:53:47.760 --> 00:53:53.760
So if somebody just loves to talk, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, then just ask them, you know, like, what are your priorities?
00:53:53.920 --> 00:53:55.440
What would a good outcome look like?
00:53:55.599 --> 00:53:56.719
What are you looking for?
00:53:56.880 --> 00:53:58.559
What would make a good deal for you?
00:53:58.800 --> 00:54:05.119
And probably they're gonna say so many things that you're gonna say, check, check, check.
00:54:05.199 --> 00:54:07.039
That's actually that's good for me too.
00:54:07.199 --> 00:54:09.599
So then you could write down maybe eight or 10 of them.
00:54:09.679 --> 00:54:14.639
You could say, look, um, you know, these are like, you know, eight or 10 things you you really want from this.
00:54:14.719 --> 00:54:15.440
Like, am I wrong?
00:54:15.519 --> 00:54:17.519
And they're like, oh yeah, it'd be great.
00:54:17.599 --> 00:54:18.719
You're like, cool, okay.
00:54:18.880 --> 00:54:23.920
Having captured, okay, you say, look, I can offer this if you give me these couple of things.
00:54:24.159 --> 00:54:27.920
You, if you had talked first, you might have asked for these things anyways.
00:54:28.079 --> 00:54:36.480
And so now in offering this person who shared way too much, you can then come in and say, Well, I can give you these eight things you want if you give me these four things.
00:54:36.639 --> 00:54:38.480
But you wanted the eight things anyways.
00:54:38.559 --> 00:54:42.239
And because maybe you even pause, you're like, okay, let me think about this.
00:54:42.400 --> 00:54:45.679
I think I can probably do these things as long as you do this.
00:54:45.920 --> 00:54:51.199
And you don't tell them that you would be delighted even if you just got two or three of those things if you had asked first.
00:54:51.360 --> 00:54:53.039
So use all that information against them.
00:54:53.199 --> 00:55:02.480
Let them talk, talk, talk, come in hot and uh tell you all the things you need to know about how to get what you want, which still incidentally, by the way, will get them things that they want.
00:55:02.559 --> 00:55:03.519
So Yeah, absolutely.
00:55:03.679 --> 00:55:04.000
Absolutely.
00:55:04.239 --> 00:55:09.679
What I love about it too is you're in the mail of three minutes, we talk about the all-in approach, which is ask, listen, and learn.
00:55:09.760 --> 00:55:09.920
Yeah.
00:55:10.079 --> 00:55:11.519
And you've hit on all three of those, Josh.
00:55:11.679 --> 00:55:17.199
And the last one's very, very important because I can ask questions that I could kind of listen, but what am I doing with that intel?
00:55:17.360 --> 00:55:21.119
And if I'm going with the persuasion mindset, I'm using that to learn.
00:55:21.440 --> 00:55:23.519
Well, we'll learn for what, both now and for later.
00:55:23.760 --> 00:55:27.440
And so I can learn those things, and sometimes that comes by the nature of our questions.
00:55:27.519 --> 00:55:41.679
It's a curious question or a continual question, which you're obviously administrating here with the amount of questions, but then sometimes it's a clarifying question to try to get to exactly what is the heart of the issue and where do they see the resolution going.
00:55:41.840 --> 00:55:45.440
And I have one quote that uh a leader said not too long ago to me, which is great.
00:55:45.840 --> 00:55:51.679
He said this how do we make the best of this difficult situation?
00:55:52.960 --> 00:55:58.400
And what I loved about the question is he recognized the fact that it was a difficult situation.
00:55:58.480 --> 00:55:58.800
Yeah.
00:55:59.360 --> 00:56:01.199
And just saying, How do we make the best of it?
00:56:01.519 --> 00:56:06.079
You know, and I I thought it was a great question that we could apply in so many different ways of that.
00:56:06.239 --> 00:56:07.440
So thoughts, feelings?
00:56:07.840 --> 00:56:12.559
I mean, that's great because he is recognizing, hey, team, this is tough.
00:56:12.639 --> 00:56:14.159
And then he's inviting feedback.
00:56:14.239 --> 00:56:20.480
And then if he listens, and there are gonna be some good ideas there because our vision, what we see is so limited.
00:56:20.639 --> 00:56:22.559
Like, I don't know what my hand's doing, right?
00:56:22.639 --> 00:56:23.519
You can see it, but I can't.
00:56:23.599 --> 00:56:24.559
I don't know what my hand's doing.
00:56:24.880 --> 00:56:27.840
So, like, necessarily, we, you know, we are limited.
00:56:28.000 --> 00:56:40.480
So if this leader approaches it with emotional intelligence, humility as well, intellectual humility, which actually is persuasive, and just listens and takes some ideas from the team and then calls the team out for those good ideas.
00:56:40.719 --> 00:56:43.679
You know, Susan, that is a fantastic insight.
00:56:43.760 --> 00:56:46.400
Um, can you write me up a memo on how we would do that?
00:56:46.559 --> 00:56:48.159
And then you take Susan's idea.
00:56:48.400 --> 00:56:51.840
Next team meeting, everyone, I want to pause and give Susan a shout out.
00:56:52.000 --> 00:57:01.599
Last time we talked about a really difficult situation, and Susan brought to me a great idea, wrote up this highly actionable memo, and we're doing exactly that.
00:57:01.679 --> 00:57:02.639
And she's driving this.
00:57:02.719 --> 00:57:06.480
And Susan, I could not be more grateful for the awesome work that you're doing.
00:57:06.639 --> 00:57:08.880
Like, everyone, please, let's give Susan a round of applause.
00:57:09.039 --> 00:57:10.480
How often does that happen?
00:57:10.719 --> 00:57:13.920
I would say, like, uh painfully, not that often.
00:57:14.000 --> 00:57:15.199
And that's what leaders do.
00:57:15.360 --> 00:57:19.440
They lean on their team, they have strong people, and they celebrate their excellent work.
00:57:19.679 --> 00:57:24.239
And maybe before all that, the leader should have said, Look, team, we're dealing with a bad situation.
00:57:24.400 --> 00:57:26.400
And I take full responsibility for this.
00:57:26.639 --> 00:57:33.760
Like, I am I'm the president, I'm the CEO, and um, I should have been more thoughtful about these things and I wish that I had.
00:57:33.840 --> 00:57:35.920
So please help me course correct that going forward.
00:57:36.079 --> 00:57:36.320
Right?
00:57:36.480 --> 00:57:46.159
Really invite the feedback and the vulnerability that brings, and again, the intellectual humility, that is so persuasive because people don't look at you as incompetent.
00:57:46.239 --> 00:57:50.239
People look at you as a human being who wants to work as a team and learn from other people.
00:57:50.559 --> 00:57:55.280
Well, I hope you've enjoyed these segments from Alan Stein Jr., Andrea Waltz, Dr.
00:57:55.360 --> 00:57:55.760
J.R.
00:57:55.840 --> 00:57:57.599
Briggs, and Joshua Bandot.
00:57:58.000 --> 00:58:02.639
And I encourage you to go back and listen to the full episode if you've missed that interview.
00:58:02.960 --> 00:58:05.920
Or maybe you just need to go back to revisit their content.
00:58:06.719 --> 00:58:10.639
These are the action items of the elite business connectors.
00:58:10.960 --> 00:58:14.320
And I encourage you to download those episodes right now.
00:58:15.199 --> 00:58:21.519
And did you know that both Apple Podcasts and Spotify offer a video option in addition to just the audio?
00:58:22.159 --> 00:58:28.000
And this then gives you the ability to actually watch the Elite Business Connector Podcast, which is just brilliant.
00:58:28.239 --> 00:58:30.559
So I hope you check that out if you've been a listener only.
00:58:31.199 --> 00:58:38.800
And I'm hearing from more and more listeners who are trying this option right now in Apple Podcasts or Spotify and really enjoying this feature.
00:58:39.280 --> 00:58:44.960
So check out this option if you've not done so before and make the podcast come all the more live right now.
00:58:45.840 --> 00:58:52.960
Lastly, if you want to bring the first five minutes to your team, your conference, or your next company event, reach out.
00:58:53.119 --> 00:58:55.840
I would absolutely love to have that conversation.
00:58:56.000 --> 00:59:04.480
And you can find me on LinkedIn, Brian BuckleySpeaks.com or Brian B R Y N at Brian BuckleySpeaks.com.
00:59:05.119 --> 00:59:06.960
It's my Chicago Bears channel.
00:59:07.119 --> 00:59:08.079
Good, better, best.
00:59:08.400 --> 00:59:11.920
Never let it rest till your good gets better and your better gets best.
00:59:12.400 --> 00:59:19.360
Until next time, keep improving your communication, conversation, and connection skills every single day.
00:59:19.679 --> 00:59:22.159
Put those reps in become a left.
00:59:23.039 --> 00:59:25.440
As my dad always said, thanks for coming.
00:59:25.920 --> 00:59:28.159
But most of all, thanks for leaving.
00:59:28.719 --> 00:59:29.199
I'm out.
00:59:29.920 --> 00:59:30.480
You got this.