Debbie Rosenfelt:
0:01
What if there was a way forward in life that was filled with ease, empowerment and a sense of direction? I'm Debbie Rosenfelt, personal Empowerment Mentor and Guide, and you're listening to Elevated Embodiment, a way to calm the chaos in life by taking radical accountability for where you are. This day, I am feeling calmness, peace and gratitude, appreciation to the brim. I have the privilege of having one of my amazing mentors on today, who is a wise teacher, an intuitive teacher, and I will tell you, I have no doubt, that this is going to be a powerful, powerful episode. Welcome, Kathleen Cameron.
Kathleen Cameron:
1:09
Hello Debbie. How are you beautiful? You've got me in my feels already.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
1:17
Thank you for being here. I feel very, very blessed. I just wanted to have a conversation today, so everybody knows that, as I shared Kathleen's my teacher one of my teachers and mentors and she shared something with a group of us a few weeks ago and it was so, so powerful that I said, kathleen, would you please be a guest on my podcast? And she said yes, and so let me share with you what I shared with her. Kathleen, when you spoke this morning to the loss of your friend's father, now I'm getting emotional, taking his life you spoke to something deeper that touched me and had a huge impact on me when you shared the awareness of it's not about the teaching, it's showing up as an example, yet actually living it, embodying the full experience of being human, and that's what the message that we want to share today is. It's just about allowing life to experience life and, whatever journey we are on, to be with it, to allow it to embody it.
Kathleen Cameron:
2:33
And that's Debbie, I would say, a newer awareness for me.
Kathleen Cameron:
2:38
You know, when I began in this material and I started studying concepts of law of attraction and mindset manifestation, universal laws, I started to collect information and the more information I collected, the more I would know and then be able to speak back to you, you know, to be able to teach it to you. But over the course of the journey I was unconsciously competent at embodying the work. So what I mean by that is I would, naturally, without my own awareness, conscious awareness, be able to embody those concepts, those ideas, and make them my own and have them move into my body. And it wasn't until I started working with Neil Donald Walsh that I realized just how unconscious I was in that. The manifestations, or the success is because I've internalized the information, but I couldn't, I couldn't fully put words to it, I couldn't describe that. It was like, well, how, how do I say that? Because I couldn't, I wasn't fully consciously aware of my ability to do that and the how in which I was doing it.
Kathleen Cameron:
4:01
So Neil Donald Walsh was the one who assisted me, because I went to him and I said, Neil, you know, I started doing one-on-one coaching with him and I said he said how can I help you today, kathleen. I said, neil, I want to experience my human less. Help me. I want to be in spirit. I want to feel my oneness to God more. I want to be in a flow state. I want to be happy to God more. I want to be in a flow state. I want to be happy, joyful, excited all the time. I don't want to experience any of that other stuff, that sadness, grief, overwhelmed frustration. I don't want any of that. So how can you help me to stay up here? He was like Kathleen why would you not want to experience the fullness of your human?
Kathleen Cameron:
4:51
Yes, and in that moment I was just like, well, I don't necessarily like it, like I don't like to be sad, I don't like to grieve, I don't like to be overwhelmed, I don't like, you know, to be frustrated. You know, I, I like the feelings better when I'm happy. And he said okay, said okay. That's amazing. But in order to have the full experience as a human is important to understand that by law, you will always experience those things, you will always experience the full range of emotion. But when you're trying to resist the experience, you're making it feel harder. So it wasn't actually that I didn't want to ever experience them. I just want that experience to feel better, to be lighter, to be easier. And what I've since really come to learn is that it's so important for me now to allow my human to to be present, to be there, to be heard, to be felt. And now, because I'm no longer resisting those emotions, they move through me so fast, fast, yes, it's like fast, yeah, and it's just, it's so powerful.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
6:05
And the thing is not everybody knows your story of actually some trials and tribulations that you went through with your health a couple of years ago and that was a really scary time and I don't know if you want to share a little bit about that story, but you know, my heart just went out to you but also how you have shared the story and your resilience but also allowing yourself to move through it as well.
Kathleen Cameron:
6:36
Yeah. So for me, my health and my weight have been two very profound parts of my life and I used to believe they were the same thing. I no longer believe that. So, the way in which my body looks, the size of my clothing, the number on the scale, I have completely detached and removed that from the idea of health, separated those two things, and in separating those things, I've really I found freedom. Yeah, freedom from my own mind, from my own thinking, freedom from the thought that what anybody, what everybody, what everybody thinks of me, doesn't even matter. You know, loved myself through every moment of it and I stopped talking bad to her and and I truly have fallen in love with her.
Kathleen Cameron:
7:39
But in 2022, I wanted the experience of greater health and I started to think to myself what would it be like to really take care of this body? Because now I see all of the incredible opportunities available to me in this life, whereas before I didn't. So I didn't care. So long I didn't care how long this body lasts. It didn't matter. Now it matters. I want this body to last me a long time. So I started thinking about that and when I started thinking about health, you know, I made some changes. I started to walk and I cut alcohol from my diet and I stopped drinking coffee things like that.
Kathleen Cameron:
8:11
And then, april of 2022, this is where the universe responded to me in such a beautiful way and gave me an opportunity to express health in its fullest by giving me the polar opposite, which was the appearance of no health, or really poor health, and I ended up with pneumonia in my right lung. I had a pleural effusion, which is fluid on the lung, and then I ended up with four empyemas surrounding my right lung and trapping it to the size of a small coin. My organs were shutting down, so the only thing that they could do was to operate an emergency surgery in Miami on May, the 10th of 2022. So I ended up in the ICU. I had a chest tube. I could not walk, could barely move.
Kathleen Cameron:
9:03
It was one of the most challenging human experience moments that I've ever had. It took me smack to the 3D world very painful, very uncomfortable and very emotional. Nobody really talks about the emotional scars related to surgeries. And very emotional Nobody really talks about the emotional scars related to surgeries. Yes, but it was very, very emotional. So it was one of the darkest times that I've experienced.
Kathleen Cameron:
9:19
But because of this work and my focus upon ascension and growth and gratefulness and study, it took some time but I found my way kind of out of that trough and rising again into, you know, this woman that I am today, who is the healthiest I've ever been in my life, in my life, at almost 42. So I see so much gratitude for that experience and I and I actually like can't imagine it not have happening. I'm so glad it did. You know, no matter how painful it was, but in those moments where it is hard, it is like that, those are the moments where we need to honestly turn to our oneness, turn, turn to God more and um perceive that oneness. So, knowing that I was not alone, that I was supported, that is one thing that absolutely helped me.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
10:16
Yeah, and you had your family, as well as your friends, your close friends, just surrounding you and loving on you but also lifting you up and spending that time.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
10:27
And it takes resilience but it also takes that support when we go through those really difficult, those difficult times. And it's those times and you just said that as well, it's those darker times that we experience that has us really appreciate where we are in this moment today. From that, where we are in this moment today, from that, and so this conversation has just been really important to me because of two things. You know my experience about losing my first son, who died by suicide, but also seeing, you know you speaking to your friend about her dad, and he was studying this information. He had been in this information for so long and it's not just about the teaching, it's about allowing ourselves to move through whatever it is that we are experiencing and I know we all have our dark moments but it's also seeing hope and surrounding us with like-minded people who have those kind of thoughts of you know it will get better, it is getting better.
Kathleen Cameron:
11:43
Yeah, and I think there is a different experience between someone that perhaps teaches or coaches this material versus someone that exists as an embodiment of it, and that's an awareness that I have definitely found. And so so, when I had found, found out that you know he is no longer in his physical form and is now in his, in his spirit, pure spirit form, and the ways in which it had happened, my question was how, how is it possible for you to teach this and coach this and to help other people with this information, but you're not actually living it yourself? And I think that it speaks to how easily it is for us to just know a thing, but to actually know a thing spiritually means to exist as that thing. So I don't see myself as separate now from the information that I teach. I see myself as it.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
12:47
As it.
Kathleen Cameron:
12:47
It's a part of you, it's in your beingness if you will, it is In every single single day, in every way.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
12:55
I started following and listening and reading Bob's work back in 2006, when he was coming out, and I know he's been working in this for a very long time, but it's. I always believed back then that, oh, I'll read this book and then I'll know it. Well, that's not true. I mean, I started this journey with Bob and then with you. So Bob was on March 14th 2022.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
13:23
Yeah, and then I was introduced to you through Shannon Mondor back at the end of 2022. And because I was leading one of our groups, a morning call study group and the difference. There was a huge difference between what I was reading. So I was reading and I was gaining the knowledge, like you said earlier.
Kathleen Cameron:
13:48
Yeah.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
13:49
But what I was hearing from you and first off, your intuitiveness, is so right on. It's just like I feel, like you're talking to me and I know each individual that works with you feels the same way. They feel this, this, like this knowingness, and it's your energy. But as soon as I heard you share it in from your beautiful way that you teach it and share it, and about the embodiment and about embodying the information, and it's just not knowing it, it's literally living it and being in it and taking the, if you will, the action steps. And when we do allow ourselves to experience life, experience each situation as it is, not make it right, not make it wrong, it just is what it is. It just brings this richness and fullness of life and you expressed that earlier when you were working with Neil Donald Walsh, of what you noticed once he said gosh, yes, I'm sure you want to feel better, we always want to feel good. Yet if we don't allow all of it, there's this missing piece.
Kathleen Cameron:
15:11
There is, and the missing piece will show up for you in other ways of your life. So, for me, I had a separation of my marriage in February of 2022. And I do what I have always done and I'm always like I'm strong, I can get through anything. So I throw myself into my work, or you know, I started walking every single day, I started reading a bunch of books and I was like, let's go, you know, I'm fine, this is okay. And then, when I ended up sick at the end of April, somebody sent me the spiritual meaning of pneumonia and it's repressed grief. And as soon as I I heard them say that to me, I went, yeah, like I hadn't allowed myself to grieve that such an important relationship in my life changed. And and, of course, the relationship with my daughters. I lived with them 24. Seven now live with them part-time. So this is a.
Kathleen Cameron:
16:06
These were two human experiences that would have associated emotions to them that I didn't allow myself to feel, because I'm strong, like I got this, you know. So, since the surgery, I allow myself to feel every single emotion. I allow the emotion to move to and through me and I'll even say okay, what are you feeling today, right now. What is that? And it's almost like my spirit's talking to my human, saying what's the human feeling today? You know what is that? That thing? I have a journal right here, so this might be helpful for someone who does not allow their human to be experienced. I created a specific journal for myself, brand new, opened it up and right on the first page I wrote Kathleen. Brand new, opened it up and right on the first page I wrote Kathleen, this journal is here for you to experience the fullness of your human. She matters. I love you, casey. And so just a little note to myself to remind myself that this human experience, these emotions, they're important and they're powerful, and if we don't allow them to move to and through us, they will build up, they will go into our physical body and they will have a result, they will have an impact on us, you know. So that's what I realized was likely.
Kathleen Cameron:
17:21
What happened with my dear friend Madison's father is the emotions that he was feeling were not in alignment with what he was teaching, and so, because he wasn't allowing them to go to and through, he was like well, I teach this, I should know this, I should know this. So, instead of allowing himself to deal with what was going on there and allowing his human to have the full experience and present itself and be raw and vulnerable and face that truth. It actually resulted in the termination of the human experience completely, and I can see how that would happen so easily. I really can.
Kathleen Cameron:
18:00
But one of the things that Neil said to me when we talked about the experience of the human, he said to me I've never heard it referred to that way before Kathleen experience your human. And I was like no, and he's like no, that's your next book name. So I'm in the middle of writing my third book and it's called experience your human. So it's a perfect name to talk about this, this thing that we're verbalizing right now, you know. But what he said was is Kathleen, it is so important for you.
Kathleen Cameron:
18:30
You teach through experience, not through concept, and so when you teach through experience and not through concept, it's because you are an embodiment, you live it and you, you teach from what's happened to you, not what you think might happen to you, if you know, yada, yada, yada. So I think, debbie, that's what you feel, I think that's what other people feel and when, when people feel like I'm speaking directly to them. I think it's because I'm actually speaking from an experience within myself that you, likely yourself, are experiencing or have experienced, and so energetically we're coming from the same place and it just, it just feels like we're in alignment, because we are Absolutely yeah.
Kathleen Cameron:
19:19
But when somebody is but when somebody isn't necessarily fully grasping the fullness of what they're teaching and they are teaching more from concept, I think you might not recognize it, like you won't have conscious awareness to say this isn't, they're not living it, but you'll feel it within yourself. You can feel that the lack of resonance or the misalignment and I think you said a key word.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
19:44
No, actually, I know you said a key word and that is alignment. And it's for really for us to even ask the question when we're feeling those really dark moments or at any time, am I in alignment? Because our spirit, our soul, will respond to us. So I'll have a quick story to share with you. So and I know you love this book so the Untethered Soul that came into my life right after Kenny died, so it was, let's see, 2000, the beginning of 2009.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
20:16
And I was reading that book and it just spoke to my heart so deeply and it was very cathartic and therapeutic at the time. And so I think it was in June, july, and I reached out to Michael Singer. I actually emailed him through his publisher and I asked him the question will I ever be happy again? Because I was just feeling so, so sad and just grieving. And he responded back through his publisher I was, I was grateful for that, but what he said is exactly what you just shared kathleen is, and he, he shared Allow all that you're feeling, all that you're grieving, to move through you, Not to hang on to it, but to allow it to move through you and just trust the process, trust life, because this is part of life.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
21:20
So, when we allow our emotions, our feelings to move through us, it's a gift to ourselves because we're valuing and honoring the human, the human experience, and I'll never forget that. I still have that email to this day because it was very moving, and I share it with other people who have lost a loved one just to encourage and empower them to know, when we just allow everything that we're feeling to move through us.
Kathleen Cameron:
21:52
So, debbie, how would you answer your own question now, from today?
Debbie Rosenfelt:
21:56
And that is the question.
Kathleen Cameron:
21:59
About? Will I ever be happy again? What would you answer to yourself from where you are today?
Debbie Rosenfelt:
22:04
Yeah, exactly Exactly that, and that is to I just literally allow myself to feel it all. I still get angry, I still get upset, but I also know that's just the part of me and in the moment, and I don't have to do anything about it, but just to feel it it does feel uncomfortable. So what I do for myself is I go for a walk in Mother Nature, because I'm blessed where I live I live in the Pacific Northwest and surrounded by trees and mother nature and deer and yeah, and so that I even take a nap sometimes, just to release, because it's all about being able to allow it to move through release. Even music, listening to emotive music, is very honoring and, if you will, music is very honoring and, if you will, it just allows us to feel. And that's what I've been also doing is listening to very emotive music. That really moves me and I literally start crying, tears start coming, but it's allowing the emotions to come out.
Kathleen Cameron:
23:17
Absolutely so beautiful, and I think it's so important for us to do things like that. I think, sometimes, what happens, though, is that we get into the habit of continuing to replay and revisit and re-experience things over and over again. I think about there's like an episode of Friends that I used to watch and somebody was going through a breakup or something, and they go into the kitchen and they grab a tub of ice cream and spoons and put on sad music, and, you know, experience this breakup together and support each other through it, right, but then, you know, the woman does it again the next day, and then the next day, and then the next day, and then you're just like sitting in it and staying in it.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
24:00
You know so for me.
Kathleen Cameron:
24:02
So for me, what I'll do with music, debbie too, is like if I'm, if I'm feeling like there's some heaviness in my body right now and and usually I can I can go back to like what email did I just see, or what did I just hear about somebody, or who did I just think about, or who am I missing I can go back and find the root of the heavy feeling and then I will put on a song that lets me let the feeling through. So not a song that's going to distract me from the heavy feeling, because I can put on a pumped up, inspiring, beautiful song that makes me feel like a badass but that doesn't allow the emotion that's actually distracting. So I'll put on a really powerful, beautiful, emotional song you said emotive, I think that's what you mean and I'll let that emotion move through. And then, once it comes through, guess what I feel? Amazing and the that just like we feel so much better after we cry. I'm frustrated, I'm mad.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
24:59
I'm angry and then that's it, you know. So I'm getting to this point where I don't want to.
Kathleen Cameron:
25:04
I want to experience the fullness of my human and I'm practicing the ability to experience the uncomfortable feelings in a faster way so that they don't. You know, I can move through them in five minutes instead of. You know something that used to take me three days to get over I can move through it in five minutes.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
25:48
I'm noticing that too. When we allow ourselves to really feel it, it's like it happens a lot faster, a lot quicker.
Kathleen Cameron:
25:58
Absolutely, absolutely. Things that used to take me out like I used to get my feelings hurt. I would be upset, I wouldn't be able to sleep at night, I'd be thinking about it. Now I surprised myself and I'm like, wow, like I haven't even thought about it again, or wow, that really isn't bothering me. And so I'm surprised by my own ability to move past things faster. But that's good, because that's beautiful. Awareness of your growth and that's how you continue to grow is to celebrate yourself, so it's a good thing.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
26:32
Exactly. It's all a good thing, and so any last words of wisdom that you would like to share, and I just want to say thank you again so much for just being here. You've really touched my heart, so thank you.
Kathleen Cameron:
26:47
I am so honored to be here, debbie. You are such a beautiful light in my life and it just every time I listen to you speak, I'm just oh, so calming. That's what everybody says. Your voice is just so calming and so beautiful, you know.
Kathleen Cameron:
27:00
The last thing that I will say is, when people think manifestation, I really think that they think that we're talking about just manifesting some nice experiences in your life, some more money, manifesting the love of your life, you know, manifesting your dream home or the nice car. But the reality is is that what I'm actually helping people to do is to manifest an elevated human experience, whatever that means for you, right? So success might be part of it, but it is by law that we are always going to experience contrast, things that appear to be in contrast to what we want. We are going to lose people in our lives, relationships are going to change, we're going to have breakups, there will be conflict, there will be illness, there will be all of these things. No matter how much money you have in the bank, no matter if you're in a loving relationship or living in your dream home, the contrast will always be there.
Kathleen Cameron:
28:02
So I wanna help people to ride the waves of life, with greater ease and flow, with greater resilience to embody this material so that, no matter what, you remain happy and joyful and you return to who and what you really are, which is your oneness with source energy. And so, yes, it's about manifesting, and I will teach you how to manifest, but I want to teach you to keep your manifestations and to be happy while the contrast shows up, and that's the real truth and honesty of the human experience.
This was a 6-2 Studio production. Find us at six-two.studio for all your creative sound needs.
0:01
What if there was a way forward in life that was filled with ease, empowerment and a sense of direction? I'm Debbie Rosenfelt, personal Empowerment Mentor and Guide, and you're listening to Elevated Embodiment, a way to calm the chaos in life by taking radical accountability for where you are. This day, I am feeling calmness, peace and gratitude, appreciation to the brim. I have the privilege of having one of my amazing mentors on today, who is a wise teacher, an intuitive teacher, and I will tell you, I have no doubt, that this is going to be a powerful, powerful episode. Welcome, Kathleen Cameron.
Kathleen Cameron:
1:09
Hello Debbie. How are you beautiful? You've got me in my feels already.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
1:17
Thank you for being here. I feel very, very blessed. I just wanted to have a conversation today, so everybody knows that, as I shared Kathleen's my teacher one of my teachers and mentors and she shared something with a group of us a few weeks ago and it was so, so powerful that I said, kathleen, would you please be a guest on my podcast? And she said yes, and so let me share with you what I shared with her. Kathleen, when you spoke this morning to the loss of your friend's father, now I'm getting emotional, taking his life you spoke to something deeper that touched me and had a huge impact on me when you shared the awareness of it's not about the teaching, it's showing up as an example, yet actually living it, embodying the full experience of being human, and that's what the message that we want to share today is. It's just about allowing life to experience life and, whatever journey we are on, to be with it, to allow it to embody it.
Kathleen Cameron:
2:33
And that's Debbie, I would say, a newer awareness for me.
Kathleen Cameron:
2:38
You know, when I began in this material and I started studying concepts of law of attraction and mindset manifestation, universal laws, I started to collect information and the more information I collected, the more I would know and then be able to speak back to you, you know, to be able to teach it to you. But over the course of the journey I was unconsciously competent at embodying the work. So what I mean by that is I would, naturally, without my own awareness, conscious awareness, be able to embody those concepts, those ideas, and make them my own and have them move into my body. And it wasn't until I started working with Neil Donald Walsh that I realized just how unconscious I was in that. The manifestations, or the success is because I've internalized the information, but I couldn't, I couldn't fully put words to it, I couldn't describe that. It was like, well, how, how do I say that? Because I couldn't, I wasn't fully consciously aware of my ability to do that and the how in which I was doing it.
Kathleen Cameron:
4:01
So Neil Donald Walsh was the one who assisted me, because I went to him and I said, Neil, you know, I started doing one-on-one coaching with him and I said he said how can I help you today, kathleen. I said, neil, I want to experience my human less. Help me. I want to be in spirit. I want to feel my oneness to God more. I want to be in a flow state. I want to be happy to God more. I want to be in a flow state. I want to be happy, joyful, excited all the time. I don't want to experience any of that other stuff, that sadness, grief, overwhelmed frustration. I don't want any of that. So how can you help me to stay up here? He was like Kathleen why would you not want to experience the fullness of your human?
Kathleen Cameron:
4:51
Yes, and in that moment I was just like, well, I don't necessarily like it, like I don't like to be sad, I don't like to grieve, I don't like to be overwhelmed, I don't like, you know, to be frustrated. You know, I, I like the feelings better when I'm happy. And he said okay, said okay. That's amazing. But in order to have the full experience as a human is important to understand that by law, you will always experience those things, you will always experience the full range of emotion. But when you're trying to resist the experience, you're making it feel harder. So it wasn't actually that I didn't want to ever experience them. I just want that experience to feel better, to be lighter, to be easier. And what I've since really come to learn is that it's so important for me now to allow my human to to be present, to be there, to be heard, to be felt. And now, because I'm no longer resisting those emotions, they move through me so fast, fast, yes, it's like fast, yeah, and it's just, it's so powerful.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
6:05
And the thing is not everybody knows your story of actually some trials and tribulations that you went through with your health a couple of years ago and that was a really scary time and I don't know if you want to share a little bit about that story, but you know, my heart just went out to you but also how you have shared the story and your resilience but also allowing yourself to move through it as well.
Kathleen Cameron:
6:36
Yeah. So for me, my health and my weight have been two very profound parts of my life and I used to believe they were the same thing. I no longer believe that. So, the way in which my body looks, the size of my clothing, the number on the scale, I have completely detached and removed that from the idea of health, separated those two things, and in separating those things, I've really I found freedom. Yeah, freedom from my own mind, from my own thinking, freedom from the thought that what anybody, what everybody, what everybody thinks of me, doesn't even matter. You know, loved myself through every moment of it and I stopped talking bad to her and and I truly have fallen in love with her.
Kathleen Cameron:
7:39
But in 2022, I wanted the experience of greater health and I started to think to myself what would it be like to really take care of this body? Because now I see all of the incredible opportunities available to me in this life, whereas before I didn't. So I didn't care. So long I didn't care how long this body lasts. It didn't matter. Now it matters. I want this body to last me a long time. So I started thinking about that and when I started thinking about health, you know, I made some changes. I started to walk and I cut alcohol from my diet and I stopped drinking coffee things like that.
Kathleen Cameron:
8:11
And then, april of 2022, this is where the universe responded to me in such a beautiful way and gave me an opportunity to express health in its fullest by giving me the polar opposite, which was the appearance of no health, or really poor health, and I ended up with pneumonia in my right lung. I had a pleural effusion, which is fluid on the lung, and then I ended up with four empyemas surrounding my right lung and trapping it to the size of a small coin. My organs were shutting down, so the only thing that they could do was to operate an emergency surgery in Miami on May, the 10th of 2022. So I ended up in the ICU. I had a chest tube. I could not walk, could barely move.
Kathleen Cameron:
9:03
It was one of the most challenging human experience moments that I've ever had. It took me smack to the 3D world very painful, very uncomfortable and very emotional. Nobody really talks about the emotional scars related to surgeries. And very emotional Nobody really talks about the emotional scars related to surgeries. Yes, but it was very, very emotional. So it was one of the darkest times that I've experienced.
Kathleen Cameron:
9:19
But because of this work and my focus upon ascension and growth and gratefulness and study, it took some time but I found my way kind of out of that trough and rising again into, you know, this woman that I am today, who is the healthiest I've ever been in my life, in my life, at almost 42. So I see so much gratitude for that experience and I and I actually like can't imagine it not have happening. I'm so glad it did. You know, no matter how painful it was, but in those moments where it is hard, it is like that, those are the moments where we need to honestly turn to our oneness, turn, turn to God more and um perceive that oneness. So, knowing that I was not alone, that I was supported, that is one thing that absolutely helped me.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
10:16
Yeah, and you had your family, as well as your friends, your close friends, just surrounding you and loving on you but also lifting you up and spending that time.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
10:27
And it takes resilience but it also takes that support when we go through those really difficult, those difficult times. And it's those times and you just said that as well, it's those darker times that we experience that has us really appreciate where we are in this moment today. From that, where we are in this moment today, from that, and so this conversation has just been really important to me because of two things. You know my experience about losing my first son, who died by suicide, but also seeing, you know you speaking to your friend about her dad, and he was studying this information. He had been in this information for so long and it's not just about the teaching, it's about allowing ourselves to move through whatever it is that we are experiencing and I know we all have our dark moments but it's also seeing hope and surrounding us with like-minded people who have those kind of thoughts of you know it will get better, it is getting better.
Kathleen Cameron:
11:43
Yeah, and I think there is a different experience between someone that perhaps teaches or coaches this material versus someone that exists as an embodiment of it, and that's an awareness that I have definitely found. And so so, when I had found, found out that you know he is no longer in his physical form and is now in his, in his spirit, pure spirit form, and the ways in which it had happened, my question was how, how is it possible for you to teach this and coach this and to help other people with this information, but you're not actually living it yourself? And I think that it speaks to how easily it is for us to just know a thing, but to actually know a thing spiritually means to exist as that thing. So I don't see myself as separate now from the information that I teach. I see myself as it.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
12:47
As it.
Kathleen Cameron:
12:47
It's a part of you, it's in your beingness if you will, it is In every single single day, in every way.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
12:55
I started following and listening and reading Bob's work back in 2006, when he was coming out, and I know he's been working in this for a very long time, but it's. I always believed back then that, oh, I'll read this book and then I'll know it. Well, that's not true. I mean, I started this journey with Bob and then with you. So Bob was on March 14th 2022.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
13:23
Yeah, and then I was introduced to you through Shannon Mondor back at the end of 2022. And because I was leading one of our groups, a morning call study group and the difference. There was a huge difference between what I was reading. So I was reading and I was gaining the knowledge, like you said earlier.
Kathleen Cameron:
13:48
Yeah.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
13:49
But what I was hearing from you and first off, your intuitiveness, is so right on. It's just like I feel, like you're talking to me and I know each individual that works with you feels the same way. They feel this, this, like this knowingness, and it's your energy. But as soon as I heard you share it in from your beautiful way that you teach it and share it, and about the embodiment and about embodying the information, and it's just not knowing it, it's literally living it and being in it and taking the, if you will, the action steps. And when we do allow ourselves to experience life, experience each situation as it is, not make it right, not make it wrong, it just is what it is. It just brings this richness and fullness of life and you expressed that earlier when you were working with Neil Donald Walsh, of what you noticed once he said gosh, yes, I'm sure you want to feel better, we always want to feel good. Yet if we don't allow all of it, there's this missing piece.
Kathleen Cameron:
15:11
There is, and the missing piece will show up for you in other ways of your life. So, for me, I had a separation of my marriage in February of 2022. And I do what I have always done and I'm always like I'm strong, I can get through anything. So I throw myself into my work, or you know, I started walking every single day, I started reading a bunch of books and I was like, let's go, you know, I'm fine, this is okay. And then, when I ended up sick at the end of April, somebody sent me the spiritual meaning of pneumonia and it's repressed grief. And as soon as I I heard them say that to me, I went, yeah, like I hadn't allowed myself to grieve that such an important relationship in my life changed. And and, of course, the relationship with my daughters. I lived with them 24. Seven now live with them part-time. So this is a.
Kathleen Cameron:
16:06
These were two human experiences that would have associated emotions to them that I didn't allow myself to feel, because I'm strong, like I got this, you know. So, since the surgery, I allow myself to feel every single emotion. I allow the emotion to move to and through me and I'll even say okay, what are you feeling today, right now. What is that? And it's almost like my spirit's talking to my human, saying what's the human feeling today? You know what is that? That thing? I have a journal right here, so this might be helpful for someone who does not allow their human to be experienced. I created a specific journal for myself, brand new, opened it up and right on the first page I wrote Kathleen. Brand new, opened it up and right on the first page I wrote Kathleen, this journal is here for you to experience the fullness of your human. She matters. I love you, casey. And so just a little note to myself to remind myself that this human experience, these emotions, they're important and they're powerful, and if we don't allow them to move to and through us, they will build up, they will go into our physical body and they will have a result, they will have an impact on us, you know. So that's what I realized was likely.
Kathleen Cameron:
17:21
What happened with my dear friend Madison's father is the emotions that he was feeling were not in alignment with what he was teaching, and so, because he wasn't allowing them to go to and through, he was like well, I teach this, I should know this, I should know this. So, instead of allowing himself to deal with what was going on there and allowing his human to have the full experience and present itself and be raw and vulnerable and face that truth. It actually resulted in the termination of the human experience completely, and I can see how that would happen so easily. I really can.
Kathleen Cameron:
18:00
But one of the things that Neil said to me when we talked about the experience of the human, he said to me I've never heard it referred to that way before Kathleen experience your human. And I was like no, and he's like no, that's your next book name. So I'm in the middle of writing my third book and it's called experience your human. So it's a perfect name to talk about this, this thing that we're verbalizing right now, you know. But what he said was is Kathleen, it is so important for you.
Kathleen Cameron:
18:30
You teach through experience, not through concept, and so when you teach through experience and not through concept, it's because you are an embodiment, you live it and you, you teach from what's happened to you, not what you think might happen to you, if you know, yada, yada, yada. So I think, debbie, that's what you feel, I think that's what other people feel and when, when people feel like I'm speaking directly to them. I think it's because I'm actually speaking from an experience within myself that you, likely yourself, are experiencing or have experienced, and so energetically we're coming from the same place and it just, it just feels like we're in alignment, because we are Absolutely yeah.
Kathleen Cameron:
19:19
But when somebody is but when somebody isn't necessarily fully grasping the fullness of what they're teaching and they are teaching more from concept, I think you might not recognize it, like you won't have conscious awareness to say this isn't, they're not living it, but you'll feel it within yourself. You can feel that the lack of resonance or the misalignment and I think you said a key word.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
19:44
No, actually, I know you said a key word and that is alignment. And it's for really for us to even ask the question when we're feeling those really dark moments or at any time, am I in alignment? Because our spirit, our soul, will respond to us. So I'll have a quick story to share with you. So and I know you love this book so the Untethered Soul that came into my life right after Kenny died, so it was, let's see, 2000, the beginning of 2009.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
20:16
And I was reading that book and it just spoke to my heart so deeply and it was very cathartic and therapeutic at the time. And so I think it was in June, july, and I reached out to Michael Singer. I actually emailed him through his publisher and I asked him the question will I ever be happy again? Because I was just feeling so, so sad and just grieving. And he responded back through his publisher I was, I was grateful for that, but what he said is exactly what you just shared kathleen is, and he, he shared Allow all that you're feeling, all that you're grieving, to move through you, Not to hang on to it, but to allow it to move through you and just trust the process, trust life, because this is part of life.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
21:20
So, when we allow our emotions, our feelings to move through us, it's a gift to ourselves because we're valuing and honoring the human, the human experience, and I'll never forget that. I still have that email to this day because it was very moving, and I share it with other people who have lost a loved one just to encourage and empower them to know, when we just allow everything that we're feeling to move through us.
Kathleen Cameron:
21:52
So, debbie, how would you answer your own question now, from today?
Debbie Rosenfelt:
21:56
And that is the question.
Kathleen Cameron:
21:59
About? Will I ever be happy again? What would you answer to yourself from where you are today?
Debbie Rosenfelt:
22:04
Yeah, exactly Exactly that, and that is to I just literally allow myself to feel it all. I still get angry, I still get upset, but I also know that's just the part of me and in the moment, and I don't have to do anything about it, but just to feel it it does feel uncomfortable. So what I do for myself is I go for a walk in Mother Nature, because I'm blessed where I live I live in the Pacific Northwest and surrounded by trees and mother nature and deer and yeah, and so that I even take a nap sometimes, just to release, because it's all about being able to allow it to move through release. Even music, listening to emotive music, is very honoring and, if you will, music is very honoring and, if you will, it just allows us to feel. And that's what I've been also doing is listening to very emotive music. That really moves me and I literally start crying, tears start coming, but it's allowing the emotions to come out.
Kathleen Cameron:
23:17
Absolutely so beautiful, and I think it's so important for us to do things like that. I think, sometimes, what happens, though, is that we get into the habit of continuing to replay and revisit and re-experience things over and over again. I think about there's like an episode of Friends that I used to watch and somebody was going through a breakup or something, and they go into the kitchen and they grab a tub of ice cream and spoons and put on sad music, and, you know, experience this breakup together and support each other through it, right, but then, you know, the woman does it again the next day, and then the next day, and then the next day, and then you're just like sitting in it and staying in it.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
24:00
You know so for me.
Kathleen Cameron:
24:02
So for me, what I'll do with music, debbie too, is like if I'm, if I'm feeling like there's some heaviness in my body right now and and usually I can I can go back to like what email did I just see, or what did I just hear about somebody, or who did I just think about, or who am I missing I can go back and find the root of the heavy feeling and then I will put on a song that lets me let the feeling through. So not a song that's going to distract me from the heavy feeling, because I can put on a pumped up, inspiring, beautiful song that makes me feel like a badass but that doesn't allow the emotion that's actually distracting. So I'll put on a really powerful, beautiful, emotional song you said emotive, I think that's what you mean and I'll let that emotion move through. And then, once it comes through, guess what I feel? Amazing and the that just like we feel so much better after we cry. I'm frustrated, I'm mad.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
24:59
I'm angry and then that's it, you know. So I'm getting to this point where I don't want to.
Kathleen Cameron:
25:04
I want to experience the fullness of my human and I'm practicing the ability to experience the uncomfortable feelings in a faster way so that they don't. You know, I can move through them in five minutes instead of. You know something that used to take me three days to get over I can move through it in five minutes.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
25:48
I'm noticing that too. When we allow ourselves to really feel it, it's like it happens a lot faster, a lot quicker.
Kathleen Cameron:
25:58
Absolutely, absolutely. Things that used to take me out like I used to get my feelings hurt. I would be upset, I wouldn't be able to sleep at night, I'd be thinking about it. Now I surprised myself and I'm like, wow, like I haven't even thought about it again, or wow, that really isn't bothering me. And so I'm surprised by my own ability to move past things faster. But that's good, because that's beautiful. Awareness of your growth and that's how you continue to grow is to celebrate yourself, so it's a good thing.
Debbie Rosenfelt:
26:32
Exactly. It's all a good thing, and so any last words of wisdom that you would like to share, and I just want to say thank you again so much for just being here. You've really touched my heart, so thank you.
Kathleen Cameron:
26:47
I am so honored to be here, debbie. You are such a beautiful light in my life and it just every time I listen to you speak, I'm just oh, so calming. That's what everybody says. Your voice is just so calming and so beautiful, you know.
Kathleen Cameron:
27:00
The last thing that I will say is, when people think manifestation, I really think that they think that we're talking about just manifesting some nice experiences in your life, some more money, manifesting the love of your life, you know, manifesting your dream home or the nice car. But the reality is is that what I'm actually helping people to do is to manifest an elevated human experience, whatever that means for you, right? So success might be part of it, but it is by law that we are always going to experience contrast, things that appear to be in contrast to what we want. We are going to lose people in our lives, relationships are going to change, we're going to have breakups, there will be conflict, there will be illness, there will be all of these things. No matter how much money you have in the bank, no matter if you're in a loving relationship or living in your dream home, the contrast will always be there.
Kathleen Cameron:
28:02
So I wanna help people to ride the waves of life, with greater ease and flow, with greater resilience to embody this material so that, no matter what, you remain happy and joyful and you return to who and what you really are, which is your oneness with source energy. And so, yes, it's about manifesting, and I will teach you how to manifest, but I want to teach you to keep your manifestations and to be happy while the contrast shows up, and that's the real truth and honesty of the human experience.
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