00:00:01
Speaker 1: You're with John Pullman on 702.
00:00:03
Speaker 2: Let's walk the talk.
00:00:05
Speaker 1: 702 Drive, 20 past five. Rwanda has a 10-year agreement to bring Grand Prix racing to that country, starting sometime in the early 2030s. There is no specific start date, as I understand it yet, but it's a massive breakthrough for anyone seeking to bring Formula One and high-level motorsports in general to the African continent. So, Let's look at the significance and perhaps, you know, consider a few thoughts about whether South Africa had an opportunity that they let slip to answer these questions and give us his thoughts. We're joined once again by the director and founder of Cash & Sport, Ngobile Ndlovu. Welcome to 702 Drive. How did Rwanda pull this off? Good afternoon to you.
00:00:52
Speaker 2: Democracy is overrated in some ways, John. When you have a country that's pulling in one direction, you can do things like this, which unfortunately we don't have. And unfortunately, Rwanda has pipped up to the post.
00:01:08
Speaker 1: Is their opportunity our loss or is their bid and ours unconnected?
00:01:16
Speaker 2: Well, I think they're unconnected in that they have a very clear vision around what's called MICE, which is meetings, incentives, conferences and events. That's part of how they're looking to grow the economy. And it's basically attract as many people to Rwanda as possible throughout the year and get them to spend dollars, euros, pounds. With ours, we have very different things that we need to take care of. We have a failing economy. We have education and so on and so on. And when we want to spend money in sports, people ask, well, is it not better spent in other places? But in terms of the sports element, I think they're a little bit separate and different because we're in a very different place in terms of the ability to host. It's just the political appetite to do it. It's just not there.
00:02:06
Speaker 1: Just to ask you to make this clear, and you'll tell me if I'm making it clearer or murkier, but it's not like a bid for the Olympics or the World Cup. There wasn't a bid date set and by which time the competing countries would be known. And then you get a winner out of that voted on. There are a whole lot of parallel processes going on. We were doing our thing. Rwanda is doing theirs. Would that be a fair description that that's exactly what was happening rather than bids must be in by day X, decision by day Y?
00:02:41
Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely. So every country that wants to host essentially approaches Formula One and says, we want to host. But to host, there's a whole bunch of requirements. The biggest one is money in terms of government commitment and also obviously having a track. But we already have a track. We've just been in a different part of the process and we've got a big stumbling block in that the political will to put that money forward To put that money forward and say we have the money to host just isn't there yet. And there's been, you know, approaches to sponsors and so on and so on to help us to get there. So we are much further down the line than Rwanda is because they don't even have a track. But they've got the one big tick box done, which is the money and the political will to do it. And this is why I believe that we could still probably host as a country before Rwanda, because we don't have far to go to actually get to a point of physically being able to host a race. They don't even have a track that exists to host a race. So there's a lot of work still to do there.
00:03:46
Speaker 1: But would it be unkind of me to say we have a track? People in Formula One who assess tracks said, not only have you got a track, but you've got a very good one. And yet at the point at which we could or should have stood up and said loud and clear, we have a track. This is our track. Please come to our track. We said, well, this is a track, but maybe we'll take it to another track and we might even consider a city that doesn't have a track at all. I mean- Did we not display a degree of unseriousness at that point?
00:04:18
Speaker 2: No, I think from the government point of view, we've been very clear around Kailaami being the preferred host. What's happened is that with Kailaami being the preferred host, there comes a request to say, okay, government, you have to put up, I think it's somewhere in the region of $ 30 million as a guarantee. which we haven't been able to do. But Rwanda has said, well, we will put up that guarantee, which is why they signed the contract. They've put up the guarantee and the government has said, not only will we put our own money in, there's money coming in from Qatar and we've got other partners who are going to help us. to actually fund it? That's the biggest question, which we haven't been able to answer. So in terms of the track, and there've been other people who've said, yes, we want to also host, which is Neil Frunderman, the former CEO of Cydania, the mining company. He said he wants to put his own money. That's a different conversation altogether. That doesn't currently have government support. In terms of what has government support, it's Kyle Army and the fact that they want to host it. And my understanding is the Minister of Sports, Arts and Culture and Government still fully want to bring it. It's just there's other people within government who are not buying it. And the minister has to go through other means and ways to try and get the money and the guarantees to make it happen.
00:05:35
Speaker 1: Is this a case where Formula One is thinking, okay, let's tick a box and give Africa a Grand Prix slot, but then we're kind of done there? You seem to have a different view, but I'd just like you to flesh that out, if I've understood you correctly, Ngobele, that there could very well be two Grands Prix in Africa. This is not just a case of, well, let's get this done, World Cup in Africa 2020, and then we move on.
00:06:06
Speaker 2: No, absolutely. I don't think it's a tick box exercise. I think Africa presents a huge opportunity for a Grand Prix. In terms of time zone, it's perfect. There's not many races where, you know, you don't want to go to America, et cetera, et cetera. In terms of time zone, South Africa is perfect and Rwanda is perfect. In terms of climate, we're also very good. So there's a lot less chance of disruptions in terms of rain or races being rained out, et cetera, et cetera. Also in terms of location, Africa in terms of growing middle class is growing really quickly. Where are the audiences going to be in 20 to 30 years' time? Are they still going to be in Europe? you know, Asia, et cetera, et cetera. Africa will be one of those regions in 20 to 30 years' time that is spending just as much as other regions are. So they're looking at the future. They're not looking at the right now. My contention, though, is that up until now, we haven't had governments that have been willing to put the money in to actually do it. The appetite hasn't been there. I know Morocco has tried. But there's big political tension. And I think that Rwanda also has a political problem that they haven't answered because the geopolitical region in terms of next door with the DRC and the infighting between Kagame and the DRC government is still a problem that we haven't discussed yet. This is why I also think that there might be some challenges coming from Rwanda, which is also part of the reason why Formula One didn't specify a date. They said early 2030s. They didn't say 2031. And I think there's some tensions and challenges there. But they've put up the guarantee, which is a big tick-box thing that they needed to do.
00:07:40
Speaker 1: Thank you so much. Much, much more to discuss, but we will have to leave it there with Nobile Ndlovu, who's director and founder of Cash & Sports. 27 minutes past five.
Speaker 1: You're with John Pullman on 702.
00:00:03
Speaker 2: Let's walk the talk.
00:00:05
Speaker 1: 702 Drive, 20 past five. Rwanda has a 10-year agreement to bring Grand Prix racing to that country, starting sometime in the early 2030s. There is no specific start date, as I understand it yet, but it's a massive breakthrough for anyone seeking to bring Formula One and high-level motorsports in general to the African continent. So, Let's look at the significance and perhaps, you know, consider a few thoughts about whether South Africa had an opportunity that they let slip to answer these questions and give us his thoughts. We're joined once again by the director and founder of Cash & Sport, Ngobile Ndlovu. Welcome to 702 Drive. How did Rwanda pull this off? Good afternoon to you.
00:00:52
Speaker 2: Democracy is overrated in some ways, John. When you have a country that's pulling in one direction, you can do things like this, which unfortunately we don't have. And unfortunately, Rwanda has pipped up to the post.
00:01:08
Speaker 1: Is their opportunity our loss or is their bid and ours unconnected?
00:01:16
Speaker 2: Well, I think they're unconnected in that they have a very clear vision around what's called MICE, which is meetings, incentives, conferences and events. That's part of how they're looking to grow the economy. And it's basically attract as many people to Rwanda as possible throughout the year and get them to spend dollars, euros, pounds. With ours, we have very different things that we need to take care of. We have a failing economy. We have education and so on and so on. And when we want to spend money in sports, people ask, well, is it not better spent in other places? But in terms of the sports element, I think they're a little bit separate and different because we're in a very different place in terms of the ability to host. It's just the political appetite to do it. It's just not there.
00:02:06
Speaker 1: Just to ask you to make this clear, and you'll tell me if I'm making it clearer or murkier, but it's not like a bid for the Olympics or the World Cup. There wasn't a bid date set and by which time the competing countries would be known. And then you get a winner out of that voted on. There are a whole lot of parallel processes going on. We were doing our thing. Rwanda is doing theirs. Would that be a fair description that that's exactly what was happening rather than bids must be in by day X, decision by day Y?
00:02:41
Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely. So every country that wants to host essentially approaches Formula One and says, we want to host. But to host, there's a whole bunch of requirements. The biggest one is money in terms of government commitment and also obviously having a track. But we already have a track. We've just been in a different part of the process and we've got a big stumbling block in that the political will to put that money forward To put that money forward and say we have the money to host just isn't there yet. And there's been, you know, approaches to sponsors and so on and so on to help us to get there. So we are much further down the line than Rwanda is because they don't even have a track. But they've got the one big tick box done, which is the money and the political will to do it. And this is why I believe that we could still probably host as a country before Rwanda, because we don't have far to go to actually get to a point of physically being able to host a race. They don't even have a track that exists to host a race. So there's a lot of work still to do there.
00:03:46
Speaker 1: But would it be unkind of me to say we have a track? People in Formula One who assess tracks said, not only have you got a track, but you've got a very good one. And yet at the point at which we could or should have stood up and said loud and clear, we have a track. This is our track. Please come to our track. We said, well, this is a track, but maybe we'll take it to another track and we might even consider a city that doesn't have a track at all. I mean- Did we not display a degree of unseriousness at that point?
00:04:18
Speaker 2: No, I think from the government point of view, we've been very clear around Kailaami being the preferred host. What's happened is that with Kailaami being the preferred host, there comes a request to say, okay, government, you have to put up, I think it's somewhere in the region of $ 30 million as a guarantee. which we haven't been able to do. But Rwanda has said, well, we will put up that guarantee, which is why they signed the contract. They've put up the guarantee and the government has said, not only will we put our own money in, there's money coming in from Qatar and we've got other partners who are going to help us. to actually fund it? That's the biggest question, which we haven't been able to answer. So in terms of the track, and there've been other people who've said, yes, we want to also host, which is Neil Frunderman, the former CEO of Cydania, the mining company. He said he wants to put his own money. That's a different conversation altogether. That doesn't currently have government support. In terms of what has government support, it's Kyle Army and the fact that they want to host it. And my understanding is the Minister of Sports, Arts and Culture and Government still fully want to bring it. It's just there's other people within government who are not buying it. And the minister has to go through other means and ways to try and get the money and the guarantees to make it happen.
00:05:35
Speaker 1: Is this a case where Formula One is thinking, okay, let's tick a box and give Africa a Grand Prix slot, but then we're kind of done there? You seem to have a different view, but I'd just like you to flesh that out, if I've understood you correctly, Ngobele, that there could very well be two Grands Prix in Africa. This is not just a case of, well, let's get this done, World Cup in Africa 2020, and then we move on.
00:06:06
Speaker 2: No, absolutely. I don't think it's a tick box exercise. I think Africa presents a huge opportunity for a Grand Prix. In terms of time zone, it's perfect. There's not many races where, you know, you don't want to go to America, et cetera, et cetera. In terms of time zone, South Africa is perfect and Rwanda is perfect. In terms of climate, we're also very good. So there's a lot less chance of disruptions in terms of rain or races being rained out, et cetera, et cetera. Also in terms of location, Africa in terms of growing middle class is growing really quickly. Where are the audiences going to be in 20 to 30 years' time? Are they still going to be in Europe? you know, Asia, et cetera, et cetera. Africa will be one of those regions in 20 to 30 years' time that is spending just as much as other regions are. So they're looking at the future. They're not looking at the right now. My contention, though, is that up until now, we haven't had governments that have been willing to put the money in to actually do it. The appetite hasn't been there. I know Morocco has tried. But there's big political tension. And I think that Rwanda also has a political problem that they haven't answered because the geopolitical region in terms of next door with the DRC and the infighting between Kagame and the DRC government is still a problem that we haven't discussed yet. This is why I also think that there might be some challenges coming from Rwanda, which is also part of the reason why Formula One didn't specify a date. They said early 2030s. They didn't say 2031. And I think there's some tensions and challenges there. But they've put up the guarantee, which is a big tick-box thing that they needed to do.
00:07:40
Speaker 1: Thank you so much. Much, much more to discuss, but we will have to leave it there with Nobile Ndlovu, who's director and founder of Cash & Sports. 27 minutes past five.
