WEBVTT
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00:00:08.720This week we take a break from some of the deeper chats that we're having this season for a jovial conversation with the two winners of the In situ ticket giveaway.
00:00:09.039 -->
00:00:14.320A prerequisite of them winning the tickets was that they had to sit down with me and have a quick chat.
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00:00:26.000And I thought a quick fire question and answer session would be a good way to get them engaged and also just get a little insight into the thinking behind some architects out there in New Zealand.
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00:00:37.039Hamish and Rob were both willing participants and had some great insights into the way they design and their thought processes behind architecture and the built environment in general.
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00:00:39.200Hope you guys take something away from this.
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00:00:43.600If anybody else wants to get in on a question and answer session, help me out.
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00:00:44.560It was heaps of fun.
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00:00:46.560Pretty keen to do them again.
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00:00:47.359Enjoy.
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00:01:16.239Hamish, do you want to give yourself a little intro?
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00:01:18.400Uh hi, I'm Hamish McLaughlin.
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00:01:24.560Um director at Bowen and Loughlin Architects, but also work at Architecture Zero Zero based near Christchurch.
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00:01:24.799Yeah.
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00:01:27.359Uh Robert Paulin.
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00:01:32.000I uh sole director of Paulin' Studio down in uh Clyde, Central Otago.
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00:01:33.280Um Yeah.
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00:01:33.840All right.
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00:01:37.840Today we're gonna do a little quick fire question and answer series.
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00:01:42.159Just a little bit of taste on design background of a couple of architects here at Insitchu.
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00:01:46.159So first question, and whoever wants to answer it can just jump in.
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00:01:49.680When you begin a project, what questions do you ask yourself first?
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00:01:50.719I will take this.
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00:01:54.400The first thing I ask is are we gonna be a good fit for the client?
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00:01:54.799Nice.
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00:01:59.519Because I think if you don't get a good client relationship, probably don't take the project.
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00:02:03.439And also we're very collaborative and we give projects to other companies.
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00:02:05.840When they don't fit when they don't fit what we want to do.
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00:02:06.159Yeah.
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00:02:06.959Nice, interesting.
00:02:07.120 -->
00:02:08.159Feel like that's quite a good take.
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00:02:10.719Feel like architects are often quite guarded and won't do that.
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00:02:12.639So interesting, interesting direction.
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00:02:13.360What about you, Rob?
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00:02:27.439I guess it'd be um looking at alignment, um, the way you're thinking with the client and um whether you think that it'll be a affable working relationship and if it'll result in some uh someone It also depends on the fee, right?
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00:02:28.319Yeah.
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00:02:29.840Well, yeah.
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00:02:36.000If you somebody came to you that was not a good fit, but the fee was out the gate, would you still take it?
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00:02:37.840I think you just take it.
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00:02:40.319Fair enough.
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00:02:40.960Understandable.
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00:02:41.199Yeah.
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00:02:43.360Maybe a clause in the contract uh early exit.
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00:02:46.080How much how much pre-research do you do on your clients?
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00:02:50.400We have a um sort of a questionnaire that we do, and then we do a couple of interviews.
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00:02:50.800Yeah.
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00:02:51.120Right.
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00:02:58.479And so we you know, projects do take a lot of time, and um, you know, from start to end for even a house is a couple of years.
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00:02:59.599So you've got to commit to that.
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00:03:02.000It's quite a thorough research process.
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00:03:05.280But I guess it's no different than essentially applying for a job.
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00:03:05.840Yeah.
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00:03:10.639Yeah, you'd you'd probably take longer doing a job, but you're not spending that much money.
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00:03:11.520Yeah.
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00:03:13.120And a lot of the time we are interviewing.
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00:03:16.080Yeah, we're not always the only person being approached for a project.
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00:03:20.000So it's really important to get the face-to-face with these clients.
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00:03:20.560Nice.
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00:03:23.120All right, randomness of the questions is gonna fly in here.
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00:03:25.199So nice and nice and deep to begin with.
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00:03:30.960Second one, which season or time of day inspires you particularly in design the most and why?
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00:03:33.840Mine it be uh always morning.
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00:03:36.639Always morning and normally fringe season, spring or autumn.
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00:03:40.240Yeah, well I'm a it's probably seasonless.
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00:03:44.000I'm a bit of a night owl, and all my ideas come in the darkness.
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00:03:45.280So seasonless.
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00:03:46.240You're a vampire.
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00:03:49.439How does following on from that, actually, this is quite good, Hamry started with you?
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00:03:52.400How does light impact your design decisions given that you design in the dark?
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00:03:54.319Oh I do turn the light on.
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00:03:59.680Well, light is probably the defining factor of good architecture, I would say.
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00:04:04.560You know, pointing the building in the right direction, getting the daylight right, you know, and then artificial light.
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00:04:09.120We try not to have any direct light, so everything's kind of diffused in a in a project.
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00:04:15.280Um and also, yeah, using like automated lights where you you know stuff turns on when you go into rooms and stuff is very exciting.
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00:04:17.759And so yeah, we use light like quite a lot.
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00:04:27.680Also, light changes throughout the day completely, you know, like the temperature of the colour of the light coming in, the angle it's coming in, obviously, completely changes the way it washes over the materials.
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00:04:32.000And yes, I think that's one of the first thoughts towards any design.
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00:04:50.319Do you do guys do quite I mean we we do in our studio do quite a lot of light research and thorough like site investigation around light and the way that it um hits site, particularly in regions we operate in Wellington and a lot of the time in Central Otago, so you're very much governed by probably shading more than light.
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00:04:57.120Um do you guys do quite a bit of research into the site before you start work and understanding the light and the way that it impacts the site?
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00:05:07.600Yeah, well, we use I think most people use just NSCE now, so we would build the context and you can kind of run like a winter and a summer and you can kind of get a pretty good feeling of the light at concept.
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00:05:12.240So I think that's that's we know it's not that scientific, but you can kind of get the massing right.
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00:05:14.319Yeah, yeah, nice.
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00:05:16.480All right, moving on to design lessons.
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00:05:19.680What design lesson did you have to learn the hard way?
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00:05:30.480Probably early days being a grad was doing a lot of site measurements um and it was measure twice, cut once, but you know um accuracy, especially when it comes to existing buildings, yeah.
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00:05:35.439The amount of times I've had to drill accuracy into grads is yeah.
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00:05:35.759Yeah.
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00:05:37.680Yeah, it's ad nauseum, to be honest.
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00:05:51.920And it's amazing how much they don't understand until you get on site and actually start to build that a couple of mils difference here, or not quite positioning something in an as built in the right place can completely derail a design if you haven't picked it up through that design process.
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00:05:53.600Old buildings aren't straight either, you know.
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00:05:54.959Yeah, yeah.
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00:06:02.800Also, what also inevitably happens if you do like a site investigation is you'll take a bunch of photos and the photo you want won't be there.
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00:06:03.279Of course.
00:06:03.519 -->
00:06:06.319And then you just it's you know, that's we do video, so we're still gonna do that.
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00:06:07.759Smart, smart.
00:06:07.839 -->
00:06:09.199I hadn't thought about the video side of things.
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00:06:12.800Because I'm the same, like every time I go to site, I'm like, I'm gonna take more photos than I need.
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00:06:14.639I still do not take the one that you also.
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00:06:17.199How high was that door?
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00:06:18.000Yeah, yeah.
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00:06:19.920Yeah, make it up.
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00:06:20.160Yeah.
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00:06:21.120Yeah, it's funny.
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00:06:24.959The I reckon my hardest design lesson was probably around QA.
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00:06:42.399I had designed a balustrade, had assumed that the engineers had picked it up, hadn't checked, that it had been coordinated, it went through consent, never got picked up, got built on site, got called to site, and the contractor was like, Is it a balustrade on the second level of this theatre supposed to be this flexible?
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00:06:42.639Yeah.
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00:06:43.439People don't check.
00:06:43.680 -->
00:06:45.519Why do you specify a shower screen?
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00:06:49.680It was just free-floating cane mail.
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00:06:50.079Yeah.
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00:06:53.600So that was a that was a financially learnt the hard way lesson for me.
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00:06:58.319All right, how do you guys approach designing for both beauty and resilience?
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00:07:00.560Particularly uh in New Zealand.
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00:07:06.879I think they're kind of the same question because things that aren't beautiful people don't keep.
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00:07:07.199Yeah.
00:07:07.519 -->
00:07:17.920So if you if you if you build something that, you know, can tickle the boxes and stuff, but actually make it a little bit ugly, I think after, you know, ten, twelve years you could see that building not being used.
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00:07:25.120Whereas if you make a beautiful building and maybe it doesn't meet some of the you know thermal performance, it probably will last longer.
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00:07:27.199So it it's a big argument about that.
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00:07:30.079Optimistically, if your budget's big, you do everything.
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00:07:30.480Yeah.
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00:07:32.000But things have to be beautiful.
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00:07:40.560Designing with beauty like engages the client in wanting to uh make the building last, you know, for the longevity of it.
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00:07:41.279Like, you know.
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00:07:53.360Yeah, it also I think gets them you know, they're more likely to spend money on something that is visually nice, then you can kind of sneak in all the the other things that you need to do.
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00:08:07.920The resilience and resilience and timelessness, um well this kind of leads into the next question, but uh having moved back to Dunedin recently, really now appreciate the quality in quality or the quality and quality of design.
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00:08:20.000And you think about the big old beautiful homes there, or the big old beautiful like civic buildings, so much care and attention and detail has gone into them, and there's a real timelessness and like strong historic nature to it as well.
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00:08:29.439Whereas if you think about buildings now that don't quite have that same prestige or esteem, they're not gonna last, like you said, because people are gonna care less about them.
00:08:29.519 -->
00:08:32.000But you have a look at something like the Dundeedon railway station, yeah.
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00:08:35.919It's so beautifully crafted and there's so much care and attention, that thing will last forever.
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00:08:39.440Glass and aluminium doesn't age like brick and brick and concrete.
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00:08:40.399Yeah, exactly.
00:08:40.639 -->
00:08:45.360I think that yeah, I think what they sort of call it is long life loose fit is what we should design to.
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00:08:51.679You kind of build the shallow and core super high quality and you don't sweat the small stuff because over time it kind of changes anyway.
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00:08:52.320Interesting.
00:08:52.399 -->
00:08:54.960And that kind of comes onto this next this next question.
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00:08:57.519How would you guys define timelessness in design?
00:08:58.799 -->
00:09:00.159Well Is it the same idea?
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00:09:04.159Well, no, timelessness so every architecture has a different style.
00:09:04.320 -->
00:09:06.799And a style's kind of a to be word, but it does.
00:09:06.879 -->
00:09:12.320And I think there's good stuff in every style, and I think you should just be designing in the current style.
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00:09:15.679And and if it's good, it'll be timeless.
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00:09:18.879Yeah, timeless, timeless outlast style, you know.
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00:09:19.120Yeah.
00:09:19.279 -->
00:09:20.320I think there's a risk in that though.
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00:09:27.600There's a risk in designing to current style and leaning too hard into trend and then it it going through a cyclic nature.
00:09:27.919 -->
00:09:35.919Obviously, trend's a far wider time spectrum in architecture than it is in say clothing or other aspects of design.
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00:09:37.120Yeah, but there is a risk.
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00:09:43.440You can build a beautiful stone building now, but it's probably like not the economics we had a hundred years ago to build out of stone.
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00:09:47.120So you probably get a nicer building building out of the current materials.
00:09:47.279 -->
00:09:51.360And I think the people who can do that the best, they'll the ones that'll last.
00:09:51.679 -->
00:09:54.639And you think that that will still hold it will still hold its prestige.
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00:10:02.480Yeah, because like some of those, like I everyone's going back to the mid-century bit, which I would say our parents' generation don't really like.
00:10:02.720 -->
00:10:05.919But what we we see it through a lens of all the good ones left.
00:10:06.480 -->
00:10:09.519And so that's why I think you only see the best with the the good ones.
00:10:09.840 -->
00:10:13.360So what's lasted is the is is the quality and what the good timelessness.
00:10:13.679 -->
00:10:16.240All the bad buildings and probably well, some of them are there.
00:10:16.639 -->
00:10:18.399Like all the all the best ones will always survive.
00:10:18.480 -->
00:10:18.799So yeah.
00:10:19.120 -->
00:10:21.279Is there any timelessness in spec houses?
00:10:22.080 -->
00:10:25.440Can you can you find any redeeming feature in them?
00:10:26.480 -->
00:10:27.679I don't say no.
00:10:27.919 -->
00:10:29.679Well maybe an interesting conversation would be like, you know.
00:10:30.000 -->
00:10:31.759But spec house is a broad term though.
00:10:31.919 -->
00:10:36.480Speculative housing, so it's it's it's built to be sold or it's built to be like for profit.
00:10:36.720 -->
00:10:37.279Correct.
00:10:37.519 -->
00:10:44.559I think there's actually a if engagement is right and with the with the right people, like uh lots of architects are involved in spec houses.
00:10:44.720 -->
00:10:51.919And there can be timelessness built into them, just like the way there was timelessness built into public housing, you know, especially in the UK and here and things like that.
00:10:52.080 -->
00:10:58.879Like there's buildings that we that have appreciated with time um in a visual sense because and they were speculative.
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00:11:08.240Maybe it is just that maybe it is that that grace of time and that separation that you can look back on and appreciate some quality in the future that we don't aren't quite appreciating now.
00:11:08.480 -->
00:11:12.559Like in terms of spec homes, if you were to look into the past, uh workers' cottages.
00:11:12.799 -->
00:11:13.039Yeah, yeah.
00:11:13.200 -->
00:11:15.120I don't think at the time were very beautiful.
00:11:15.360 -->
00:11:18.320Now they're like, you know, people are finding merit in the yeah.
00:11:18.399 -->
00:11:20.639Yeah, put the details back and undercover the tiles.
00:11:21.039 -->
00:11:28.240You can tell when someone's cared though, like when the entry door detail is being considered in some of those cottages or some of those workers' spaces.
00:11:28.480 -->
00:11:30.639Or and that is what lasts.
00:11:30.799 -->
00:11:36.799That's what you still see at the front of a lot of the heritage streets in in Christchurch and Dunit and Auckland, you know.
00:11:37.279 -->
00:11:42.320I feel like we're in a relatively benign design epoch at the moment.
00:11:42.639 -->
00:11:50.799But it will be interesting in 30, 40, 50 years if we look back on this period and there's these nuggets that we aren't appreciating now that we ultimately will.
00:11:50.960 -->
00:11:51.840I don't know what they are.
00:11:52.240 -->
00:11:56.240Well we don't have the gift of perspective right now to know what the era we're in in a way.
00:11:56.559 -->
00:11:59.679It's so hard to say what you'd call modern design in New Zealand right now.
00:12:00.000 -->
00:12:03.759I'd say architecture globally feels like it's we're in a globalization era.
00:12:04.080 -->
00:12:08.320There's a level playing field kind of across the world and the design in the design and built environment.
00:12:08.559 -->
00:12:10.480And that's due to access.
00:12:10.720 -->
00:12:13.120I think access to aesthetic globally.
00:12:13.600 -->
00:12:17.679You can just jump on Instagram and it's just like I think we're actually in a pretty interesting uh time.
00:12:17.919 -->
00:12:25.759And I yeah, sort of talking to people around the conference is kind of interesting that we're in this kind of inflection, moving more into sustainable design.
00:12:25.919 -->
00:12:36.639Maybe that's not the right word, but everyone's and I think our generation is much uh more keen on maybe not starker tech stuff, but more like just building like good stuff, building better.
00:12:36.799 -->
00:12:37.039Yeah, yeah.
00:12:37.200 -->
00:12:40.639And building the background better and building like just yeah.
00:12:40.879 -->
00:12:42.960I think I think we're in a really interesting time.
00:12:43.360 -->
00:12:44.480Foundational architecture.
00:12:44.799 -->
00:12:45.039Yeah.
00:12:45.440 -->
00:12:47.039This continues on this theme.
00:12:47.360 -->
00:12:50.399How do you approach materiality when designing for longevity?
00:12:50.639 -->
00:12:53.200Speaking of that, long-term timelessness.
00:12:53.679 -->
00:12:58.320Well, I th I think longevity, I don't think any material is longer.
00:12:58.559 -->
00:13:04.480Like if you like what I was saying before, if it's an ugly building, it's gonna get pulled down irrelevant if it's made of something nice or like something expensive.
00:13:04.720 -->
00:13:07.120But in our office, we're really pushing timber.
00:13:07.279 -->
00:13:10.159So we just want to do a lot of timber design, sort of mass timber.
00:13:10.320 -->
00:13:15.039And like if we have a steel beam, we'll try to do it out of timber first and then weigh it up if it's expensive or not.
00:13:15.279 -->
00:13:19.679Because you can get the builder to do it, you don't have to use sub trades, there's advantages on site to do it.
00:13:19.840 -->
00:13:22.960But also then this like timber's just great and it's all grown here.
00:13:23.120 -->
00:13:24.559It's such a strong New Zealand vernacular.
00:13:24.720 -->
00:13:24.799Yeah.
00:13:25.200 -->
00:13:27.440I think we need to lean into our local materials.
00:13:27.840 -->
00:13:36.879I think there's something to be said though, for and interestingly, the talk this morning, um, you know, she was talking about those using those granite slabs as a cladding material.
00:13:37.039 -->
00:13:40.159And I was like, how why why haven't we just done mass stone?
00:13:40.320 -->
00:13:43.600Basically just slotted in between steel structure as a cladding solution.
00:13:43.679 -->
00:13:44.879I was like, Jesus, what have I got?
00:13:45.039 -->
00:13:47.600And stone interestingly is super carbon low.
00:13:47.759 -->
00:13:48.000Yeah.
00:13:48.240 -->
00:13:50.480Because you're basically just putting on a truck and moving it.
00:13:50.720 -->
00:13:51.759Yeah, and cut and cutting it.
00:13:51.840 -->
00:13:57.440Like as a vernacular material, every country in every part of the world has access to some form of stone.
00:13:57.600 -->
00:14:00.879So is this common is the topic of this is open the quarries?
00:14:03.440 -->
00:14:06.159Uh it's uh me and Sam, we live too close.
00:14:06.720 -->
00:14:07.679Particularly relevant to us.
00:14:07.919 -->
00:14:08.879Yeah, it is down in the sun.
00:14:10.240 -->
00:14:12.960As long as it's not gold, we're not cladding our houses in gold.
00:14:13.279 -->
00:14:15.200Okay, um, slightly different angle now.
00:14:15.279 -->
00:14:17.759What is your favourite detail in your own home?
00:14:17.840 -->
00:14:20.879Hamish, you've just renovated your home and Rob, you're building your own home.
00:14:21.120 -->
00:14:23.279What's going to be your favourite detail and what is your favourite?
00:14:23.600 -->
00:14:35.600My favourite detail are we uh We're at a 1959 um cedar clad kind of one and a half story house designed and built in the 50s, and it just was kind of carpeted everywhere.
00:14:35.759 -->
00:14:43.600Our best detail is we ripped the carpet off and we sanded the remote floors just in the kitchen, living, and mini room, and that's that's easily the best detail.
00:14:43.840 -->
00:14:47.840Just having that texture just throughout is this like awesome thing.
00:14:48.000 -->
00:14:54.720Also, you know, we didn't have the budget to replace all the boards that had woodworm and stuff, so it's kind of got a bit of that wabi-sabi lived in detail.
00:14:55.759 -->
00:14:56.879The natural patina of time.
00:14:57.120 -->
00:15:04.799And we also took off all our skirting boards and just put them back on nice and into the new renovation, and we didn't even clean them because we can be bothered.
00:15:04.960 -->
00:15:08.240So uh it already feels lived in, so it doesn't feel precious.
00:15:08.399 -->
00:15:13.360And I think that's the best detail we did was it doesn't feel with kids too precious.
00:15:13.600 -->
00:15:14.240Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:15:14.639 -->
00:15:16.799Probably still um I'll probably talk about it.
00:15:16.960 -->
00:15:26.240Uh we renovated a house in Christchurch um back when I lived there, and most of my favourite details always lived in the kitchen and had a bit to do with me and my partner and how we lived our lives.
00:15:26.320 -->
00:15:35.360And we had the stainless bench top, and then we had the island and recycled remote, and it was just like having a fully welded-in sink and a stainless bench, never going away from it.
00:15:35.679 -->
00:15:35.840Yes.
00:15:36.320 -->
00:15:37.120I love it so much.
00:15:37.440 -->
00:15:38.240It's just so good.
00:15:38.480 -->
00:15:39.600Start scratching and stuff.
00:15:39.679 -->
00:15:45.519It's commercial kitchens, and then having a wooden portion somewhere, like having that timber um aspect.
00:15:45.679 -->
00:15:52.799My partner does a lot of baking, so it's like it's just having that space where you've got exactly what you want and able to live with a lot of things.
00:15:53.039 -->
00:15:55.360Shout out to Master Studio who did both out there.
00:15:56.000 -->
00:15:56.159Nice.
00:15:56.240 -->
00:15:56.639I love that.
00:15:56.720 -->
00:15:57.759I like the little plug.
00:15:58.080 -->
00:16:10.000My my favourite detail our homes are funny, it's a big old character villa, 1912s, and we have this window in the master bedroom, and it's a bay window, but it's a very sharp triangle bay window.
00:16:10.080 -->
00:16:10.399Ooh.
00:16:10.559 -->
00:16:16.240And the exact same window is in Ovalston, the historic home in Dunedin.
00:16:16.320 -->
00:16:20.799It was built in 1908, and our home was built in 1912, and clearly they stole it.
00:16:21.039 -->
00:16:21.360Yeah, yeah.
00:16:21.519 -->
00:16:22.399But like we were one of there.
00:16:22.480 -->
00:16:23.039From Overstone.
00:16:23.120 -->
00:16:23.600But I love borrowing.
00:16:23.840 -->
00:16:24.320You can borrow stuff.
00:16:24.480 -->
00:16:25.120You can borrow, of course.
00:16:25.360 -->
00:16:31.039But I love that we've kind of got this little nod to you know, one of the most prominent Dunedin homes, um, which is which is pretty cool.
00:16:31.200 -->
00:16:31.519All right.
00:16:31.679 -->
00:16:32.559Uh, next one.
00:16:32.720 -->
00:16:34.399How do you incorporate imperfection?
00:16:34.559 -->
00:16:37.600Homas, you talked about your dirty skirting boards.
00:16:38.320 -->
00:16:42.000How do you incorporate into your work?
00:16:42.480 -->
00:16:44.240I think imperfection's important.
00:16:44.399 -->
00:16:48.639I think we see too much of perfect stuff on the internet and just random story.
00:16:48.960 -->
00:16:52.480We buy a heap of stuff of trademark and stuff, and you obviously go around to other people's houses and stuff.
00:16:52.559 -->
00:16:56.480And we went to someone's house to pick up this, I think it was a couch or something.
00:16:56.720 -->
00:16:59.519And their house was very matchy matchy same, same.
00:16:59.600 -->
00:17:00.399It was perfect.
00:17:00.559 -->
00:17:04.799All of the furniture looked, you know, scandy, but it didn't have the soul.
00:17:05.119 -->
00:17:05.279Yeah.
00:17:05.759 -->
00:17:11.519Whereas when it's worn in and you can kind of like I love like old stairs where you've seen where people have walked.
00:17:11.599 -->
00:17:13.119Yeah, it's kind of a divot.
00:17:13.279 -->
00:17:14.640So yeah, very pro.
00:17:14.880 -->
00:17:17.279But I'd say, how do you bake an ev bake it in from the start?
00:17:17.519 -->
00:17:18.559It's hard to design an imperfection.
00:17:18.799 -->
00:17:22.079I think you have to like leave space for things to be worn in.
00:17:22.559 -->
00:17:23.359Let a patina.
00:17:23.519 -->
00:17:24.000Yeah, yeah.
00:17:24.160 -->
00:17:27.680Um you can't build in a patina because sometimes it actually looks worse.
00:17:27.839 -->
00:17:28.000Yeah.
00:17:28.720 -->
00:17:35.039Sometimes an acid wash on and some corrugate or something might actually look a little strange because it's matched right next to a brand new window or something.
00:17:35.200 -->
00:17:42.720You know, like so well incorporating uh found objects and stuff is always really good, you know, a recycled window or a recycled piece of furniture and stuff.
00:17:43.200 -->
00:17:52.960I like the idea of picking materials or allowing things to be raw in nature and let them lean away from perfection, you know, white walls or whatever gross.
00:17:53.200 -->
00:18:02.319Lean into the the use of the house or the use of the building or the use of whatever it is and let it just take the hits, take the knocks, take the wares, you know, from day one.
00:18:02.480 -->
00:18:08.480Like you said, like that idea of not being precious about the the place from day one, I think, is is pretty key.
00:18:08.720 -->
00:18:11.920But you can do that through a modicum of different methods.
00:18:12.480 -->
00:18:12.880Right.
00:18:12.960 -->
00:18:17.359Uh what is a design risk you took that completely paid off?
00:18:18.480 -->
00:18:21.279And were you and were you scared in taking that risk?
00:18:21.839 -->
00:18:22.559Design risk.
00:18:22.799 -->
00:18:23.519That's a hard one.
00:18:23.839 -->
00:18:24.160Yeah.
00:18:24.480 -->
00:18:24.960I don't know.
00:18:25.119 -->
00:18:28.720We're a pretty new company, so we haven't taken many risks.
00:18:29.119 -->
00:18:32.559But um yeah, I don't I don't know if I can answer that one.
00:18:32.720 -->
00:18:33.119I don't know.
00:18:34.240 -->
00:18:35.039Do you have a story, Sam?
00:18:35.519 -->
00:18:37.039My biggest one, and this is rigging.
00:18:37.440 -->
00:18:47.759And this is this is my biggest one, and this was uh total proof of concept project was the Krakatow we did in in Wellington, in Eastbourne, up on the hills.
00:18:48.400 -->
00:18:50.720Very, very, very, very, very poor access.
00:18:51.119 -->
00:18:54.000One single-lane, big rickety stair kind of situation.
00:18:54.319 -->
00:18:59.039And from the get-go, we were like, Oh, we we could we could helicopter this building into place.
00:18:59.519 -->
00:19:04.960And that idea stuck, stuck with us through designers, stuck with the clients throughout the whole project.
00:19:05.200 -->
00:19:11.920And the entire time I was in the back of my head constantly going, Oh shit, can we actually make this happen?
00:19:12.160 -->
00:19:19.839And the design idea was that we would build this thing in three modules, lift it all on into site in one day, and have it weathertight by by dinner time.
00:19:19.920 -->
00:19:21.519Um and it was a massive design risk for us.
00:19:21.599 -->
00:19:22.880We'd never done anything like it before.
00:19:22.960 -->
00:19:29.920It's kind of like our first foray into um prefab and and this type of delivery structure onto site.
00:19:30.240 -->
00:19:34.160But we workshopped it thoroughly and had a pretty good team on it.
00:19:34.240 -->
00:19:36.400Shout out to makers, a fabrication in Wellington.
00:19:36.640 -->
00:19:39.440And yeah, like it it it was a great success.
00:19:39.599 -->
00:19:46.160We like totally put the proof in the pudding, but it was a massive risk and could have gone catastrophically wrong.
00:19:46.400 -->
00:19:46.640Yeah.
00:19:47.599 -->
00:19:53.920When seeing the helicopter lifting, you know, a ton of house over other houses, it's pretty stressful.
00:19:54.079 -->
00:19:54.400Yeah.
00:19:54.720 -->
00:20:00.160It's a hard one as well, because like a lot of the risk actually falls on the client and trusting you.
00:20:00.400 -->
00:20:02.480You know, like we're taking design risks.
00:20:02.640 -->
00:20:05.519You call them design risks, but we're taking design decisions all the time.
00:20:05.759 -->
00:20:09.279But I think we'll just answer that question.
00:20:09.359 -->
00:20:17.839I um straight out of Union worked at architecture workshop and was working on the Lindis Lodge, which I feel like every detail in that was a design risk.
00:20:18.079 -->
00:20:21.440I feel like everything I do is not as complex as that, so everything is fine.
00:20:21.680 -->
00:20:22.559Yeah, it's it is like that.
00:20:24.319 -->
00:20:25.759You've had you've had the test.
00:20:26.000 -->
00:20:28.160Truly got like sort of confidence that you can do anything.
00:20:28.240 -->
00:20:28.319Yeah.
00:20:28.480 -->
00:20:31.839And so then you can't, you know, we're professionals we can work through it.
00:20:32.079 -->
00:20:35.200It's nice to have had that exposure early on to give you that confidence.
00:20:35.359 -->
00:20:35.519Yeah.
00:20:35.680 -->
00:20:41.440Because I imagine that would be a hard thing to gain through experience because you're constantly scared of the code.
00:20:41.599 -->
00:20:46.720Well, it was a prototype building, and a lot of it came through conversations with the builder on how they wanted to do it.
00:20:47.039 -->
00:20:48.319So it was a it was always evolving.
00:20:48.559 -->
00:20:50.640I think trust in your builder gets rid of the risk.
00:20:50.960 -->
00:20:52.799Oh, that's exactly like our situation, right?
00:20:52.960 -->
00:20:59.839Like it's that having that team around you and that conversation, that collaboration throughout the project kind of de-risks things completely.
00:21:00.000 -->
00:21:00.319Yeah.
00:21:00.559 -->
00:21:00.960Nice.
00:21:01.200 -->
00:21:01.519All right.
00:21:01.599 -->
00:21:06.960What small detail do you believe makes the biggest impact in a space?
00:21:08.160 -->
00:21:09.119Did I say small detail.
00:21:09.359 -->
00:21:09.839Small detail.
00:21:10.880 -->
00:21:12.240You've already talked about lighting.
00:21:12.400 -->
00:21:12.799Yeah.
00:21:13.039 -->
00:21:16.400And controllability and the way that it can impact a space.
00:21:16.720 -->
00:21:31.759I'd probably say like I've been to lots of architecture comp uh talks and things where they talk about it, but uh items you touch in a house, you know, like the front door handle or the light switches or just little things that you run your hand over, handrails is a classic one.
00:21:31.920 -->
00:21:36.079Like those can really change a space and it probably yeah.
00:21:36.400 -->
00:21:37.359Not squeaky taps.
00:21:37.519 -->
00:21:38.559Not squeaky taps.
00:21:38.640 -->
00:21:38.799Yeah.
00:21:39.039 -->
00:21:50.079Um Not making mistakes yeah, it's probably things that annoy you more that changes, you know, as in not making the mistakes of black tap wear or like stuff like that.
00:21:50.160 -->
00:21:54.160Um This is the third time this season that black tap wear's been bagged on the pod.
00:21:54.480 -->
00:21:56.079Oh no, you're not gonna get a sponsor by them.
00:21:56.319 -->
00:21:59.599I think it's 'cause it was so popular for like for a good ten years there.
00:22:00.640 -->
00:22:11.920Yeah, well it's not a small detail, but I do think if you get the plan right and spend a lot of time on the plan and less and less time on the specification of products, it will be a better thing.
00:22:12.319 -->
00:22:14.160It can seem like a small detail, but it's massive.
00:22:14.640 -->
00:22:23.759That's often you kind of zoom past that and you get into the kind of getting the big stuff right is quite is it is a small detail because you don't have to do it.
00:22:24.240 -->
00:22:29.920For me through design, I think that it's not necessarily a small detail, but it can seem like a small aspect.
00:22:30.319 -->
00:22:34.400Try and design out almost completely if I can, transition space.
00:22:34.799 -->
00:22:42.640Always anywhere that you need to where whenever and wherever you need to move through somewhere to get to somewhere else, it has to have a double function.
00:22:42.960 -->
00:22:44.480It can't just be a hallway.
00:22:44.720 -->
00:22:52.880And that's not always possible, but if you can limit that to like a very small percentage of your overall floor plan, I think you've got a successful plan, like you said.
00:22:53.039 -->
00:22:53.599Yeah.
00:22:53.839 -->
00:22:54.160Nice.
00:22:54.319 -->
00:22:56.480A few more here before we wrap up.
00:22:57.279 -->
00:23:00.240What feelings drive your material palette?
00:23:00.480 -->
00:23:05.039And actually I'll keep your legs and I'll add another this, another question to this.
00:23:05.200 -->
00:23:11.680Do you feel like you have a material palette that you return to consistently, or are you pretty uh material fluid?
00:23:12.079 -->
00:23:13.759Probably quite material fluid.
00:23:13.920 -->
00:23:16.079I I feel like you don't want to lock that in.
00:23:16.240 -->
00:23:19.039I think uh every client's different, every project's different.
00:23:19.200 -->
00:23:23.200I think that's something you want to play with on project-to-project basis.
00:23:23.519 -->
00:23:27.359But basic, like natural materials, obviously, and stuff that wears well.
00:23:28.000 -->
00:23:28.240Yeah.
00:23:28.640 -->
00:23:29.680Yeah, you've got to be flexible.
00:23:29.759 -->
00:23:32.559Like you've every material has its place, like somewhere, you know.
00:23:32.720 -->
00:23:40.000Like even the ones we think are nasty, they've got some use that makes them perfect for that that specific job.
00:23:40.400 -->
00:23:46.480But further to that conversation, what we always do in our project and with our clients is we A B the spaces.
00:23:46.640 -->
00:23:49.680We basically go around and go, is this an A space or is this a B space?
00:23:49.920 -->
00:23:50.240Interesting.
00:23:50.480 -->
00:23:55.039So if this is like a second bathroom that you're gonna use to clean the dog or whatever, it's a B space.
00:23:55.279 -->
00:23:58.880Yeah, we're chucking some vinyl down, that's plaster board, whatever, we're gonna paint it.
00:23:59.119 -->
00:24:01.839And therefore you get the cash to do the good stuff.
00:24:02.079 -->
00:24:02.640I love that concept.
00:24:02.880 -->
00:24:05.920And then you go like, oh, kids' bedrooms, well, they're gonna maybe draw on the walls.
00:24:06.000 -->
00:24:07.359Like just don't invest in it.
00:24:07.599 -->
00:24:08.079Yeah, right.
00:24:08.240 -->
00:24:08.400Yeah.
00:24:08.480 -->
00:24:09.759So A B it all.
00:24:09.920 -->
00:24:10.160Yeah.
00:24:10.480 -->
00:24:10.720Cool.
00:24:10.880 -->
00:24:11.279I like that.
00:24:11.440 -->
00:24:12.160I like that approach.
00:24:12.240 -->
00:24:14.640I'm gonna steal that or borrow that design concept.
00:24:14.720 -->
00:24:16.480You're gonna see me A-B all over the place.
00:24:16.880 -->
00:24:20.720It's a fun conversation with clients as well because it really prioritizes what's important.
00:24:20.880 -->
00:24:20.960Yeah.
00:24:21.519 -->
00:24:23.359And you have to get one A space.
00:24:23.599 -->
00:24:25.920Even if it's a small, cheap project, you need one A space.
00:24:26.160 -->
00:24:26.559I like that.
00:24:26.799 -->
00:24:28.799It always that becomes the key driver.
00:24:29.039 -->
00:24:48.000And it actually just kind of leads on to the discussion we had earlier in the season with the interior designers where we have a place in any scale of project, be it be it your budget, 10 grand to you know, do up a bathroom through to, you know, multi-million dollar commercial space, like architects can touch a project in any certain way.
00:24:48.160 -->
00:24:54.559And even just identifying that one little move that can change the way that space is used or or felt or whatever, I think, is critical.
00:24:54.960 -->
00:24:56.880To just better building in general.
00:24:57.359 -->
00:24:57.839Alright.
00:24:57.920 -->
00:25:00.079Um, what's a material finish?
00:25:00.240 -->
00:25:07.359Or I'll also add to this construction methodology you're excited to see evolve in the next decade.
00:25:09.359 -->
00:25:10.079I don't know.
00:25:10.240 -->
00:25:13.920That that last lecture we went to with all the rammed earth was pretty exciting.
00:25:14.480 -->
00:25:25.920And I think if that came down in price, because it's so low carbon, and often the the building materials from the site, if that became more accessible, I think that'd be a very exciting product to use.
00:25:26.160 -->
00:25:30.559Yeah, I think in New Zealand there's a strong limitation from a code perspective towards that.
00:25:30.640 -->
00:25:30.799Yeah.
00:25:30.960 -->
00:25:33.279But you have no better vernacular.
00:25:33.359 -->
00:25:33.519Yeah.
00:25:34.000 -->
00:25:34.799It's beautiful stuff.
00:25:34.960 -->
00:25:35.119Yeah.
00:25:35.279 -->
00:25:39.119That's actually two lectures back to back today that have been focused on rammed earth.
00:25:39.359 -->
00:25:47.359We're seeing some of it though, like some of the there's like the straw sips and this some of the the hemp crete things and those sorts of like um additives that are coming on top of the colour.
00:25:47.519 -->
00:25:48.559They're kind of there though, right?
00:25:48.640 -->
00:25:50.480But it's like that's a sort of like a hybrid model.
00:25:50.799 -->
00:25:51.519Yeah, it's really hard.
00:25:51.599 -->
00:25:52.079Like, yeah.
00:25:52.160 -->
00:25:54.559Um and it's also driven by price and things like that.
00:25:54.799 -->
00:25:58.880Straw houses and all that always remind me of grand designs projects that go wrong.
00:25:59.519 -->
00:26:03.119Um yeah, there's a lot happening in that space, particularly down in the central region.
00:26:03.279 -->
00:26:03.680Yeah, yeah.
00:26:03.920 -->
00:26:12.160There's quite a few suppliers now, and they're you know, to their credit, working through the trials and tribulations of trying to get a new product to the market.
00:26:12.240 -->
00:26:12.640Yeah.
00:26:12.880 -->
00:26:25.839And for you know, for for my own sons, I've wanted to use it, but it's just not been financially viable, and you're sort of waiting for them to get to the point where they've gone through the RD so it becomes, you know, it's a more viable um solution.
00:26:26.000 -->
00:26:27.839So I can see definitely see some space in there.
00:26:27.920 -->
00:26:34.640And I think that just leads into the whole idea and prefabrication, be that whole building modules or even just building elements.
00:26:34.799 -->
00:26:40.319I think that's the that's the direction that things need to shift to for affordability and and speed and construction.
00:26:40.480 -->
00:26:41.039Yeah.
00:26:41.359 -->
00:26:41.759All right.
00:26:42.000 -->
00:26:43.200Last couple.
00:26:43.759 -->
00:26:48.640What is a small habit that genuinely improves your day?
00:26:48.960 -->
00:26:49.759Coffee.
00:26:50.720 -->
00:26:51.759So much coffee.
00:26:51.920 -->
00:26:53.839I think I've had like four coffees today.
00:26:54.079 -->
00:26:54.240Yeah.
00:26:54.559 -->
00:26:56.079Oh, geez, mate, you're gonna be buzzing.
00:26:56.319 -->
00:26:57.519No, this is just my level.
00:26:59.839 -->
00:27:13.039Uh well, to answer the question truthfully, I think I have there's two things I do that are super productive, is I always have a notebook in front of me when I'm working, but I offload like things that I need to do in the future onto the notebook, not digital, analog.
00:27:13.440 -->
00:27:17.759The other thing is if I get stuck, I will stand up and do something else and then I come back and then it'll keep going.
00:27:17.920 -->
00:27:18.000Yeah.
00:27:18.160 -->
00:27:18.319Nice.
00:27:18.400 -->
00:27:19.279So that might too have it.
00:27:19.440 -->
00:27:19.839Reset.
00:27:20.160 -->
00:27:20.880Exercise probably.
00:27:21.039 -->
00:27:21.279Yeah.
00:27:21.839 -->
00:27:22.160Yeah.
00:27:22.480 -->
00:27:27.119New dog owners are taking a dog for a walk is it's so good to have something you have to do.
00:27:27.359 -->
00:27:27.759Good excuse.
00:27:28.079 -->
00:27:28.319Yeah, yeah.
00:27:28.559 -->
00:27:39.599Just having to go do something to get off your desk, like especially for us soul practitioners or whatnot, where you can just lock in and be stuck on your desk for like six hours without moving and then so just making sure you get off that desk.
00:27:39.839 -->
00:27:40.000Nice.
00:27:40.079 -->
00:27:53.759Yeah, we a couple of years ago now we um started a relationship with a health and be well-being, I guess, coach in our studio, and she kind of took a look at our personality types and the way that we work together as a team and individually and with each other and things like that.
00:27:53.920 -->
00:28:02.720And through the course of these last couple of years, and we have like seasonal check-ins to see how we're kind of going with work and and life um each season.
00:28:03.039 -->
00:28:11.359Every single season she makes us take a look at ourselves and put into action something that will help improve our day.
00:28:11.519 -->
00:28:17.599Yes, and you know, the main one for me has always been like getting some fresh air outside, some sun on your face, some oxygen.
00:28:17.839 -->
00:28:26.240You're difficult in the deep south, but um you know, just getting getting airflow kind of through the body is a is a critical one and movement, yeah.
00:28:26.319 -->
00:28:26.480Yeah.
00:28:26.720 -->
00:28:29.920So I think that's another thing that kind of rings true between between all of us.
00:28:30.079 -->
00:28:34.160Um all right, and last question, and thank you guys very much for your time.
00:28:34.319 -->
00:28:37.279I know you've got a a good talk to to head off to.
00:28:37.599 -->
00:28:41.359What's one element you believe every great space actually I've got two questions.
00:28:41.440 -->
00:28:43.440Well, this next one's just the one from me.
00:28:43.599 -->
00:28:47.759But uh, what's one element you believe every great space needs before the final zinger?
00:28:49.200 -->
00:28:55.039Uh well, in terms of housing, yeah, you need this might sound funny, you need kids running around.
00:28:55.440 -->
00:29:00.400Because because like that changes how you see houses.
00:29:00.640 -->
00:29:00.880Yep.
00:29:00.960 -->
00:29:01.200Yeah.
00:29:01.359 -->
00:29:06.640I I genuinely I think it's been the biggest kind of shift in how I would design a house after having kids.
00:29:06.960 -->
00:29:12.319The reality of that and how that works and how great it changes everything.
00:29:12.480 -->
00:29:12.799Nice.
00:29:12.960 -->
00:29:13.920You'll be soon.
00:29:15.279 -->
00:29:17.359I I I'd say just generosity.
00:29:17.519 -->
00:29:27.599Like I just a space I think needs to be like generous and it doesn't have to be in the volume of the space, but it has to be generous to what it gives and takes from outside and what it gives to the occupants, you know.
00:29:27.759 -->
00:29:28.079Yep.
00:29:28.319 -->
00:29:29.359It's quite broad, but yeah.
00:29:29.680 -->
00:29:31.119Yeah, I think one would be interconnection.
00:29:31.279 -->
00:29:34.640I think you l you want the your spaces to be able to speak to each other.
00:29:34.880 -->
00:29:38.400I think that's critical of of of any type of architecture, really.
00:29:38.559 -->
00:29:41.359Um be it be it commercial, be it residential, be it whatever.
00:29:41.440 -->
00:29:59.039And then my final question, which I'm actually asking to kind of everybody that we're interviewing here at In situ uh over the next couple of days, but gaze into the future, 10, 20, 50 years, what is your hope for the architectural landscape in New Zealand?
00:29:59.839 -->
00:30:00.880That's a huge question.
00:30:01.119 -->
00:30:02.400It's a big question.
00:30:02.720 -->
00:30:11.039Well, I think yeah, maybe I touched on it earlier, but I think we need to stop doing the Starchitect stuff and we've got to start working together.
00:30:11.200 -->
00:30:12.720Also, I think we need to collab more.
00:30:12.880 -->
00:30:16.319Like if someone's better at it than you, you should let them do it.
00:30:16.880 -->
00:30:17.039Yeah.
00:30:17.440 -->
00:30:19.920I think just to get architects to get more piece of the pie.
00:30:20.000 -->
00:30:24.079What is it, where like five percent of all building houses are built in New Zealand aren't by architects.
00:30:24.240 -->
00:30:29.519So like if we can make that 10% and be a part of it in the next 50 years, I think that'd be awesome.
00:30:29.680 -->
00:30:31.440Like we'll see way better results, hopefully.
00:30:31.680 -->
00:30:32.720Yeah, I I I agree.
00:30:32.880 -->
00:30:36.799I think for me it's just having architects touch more of the built environment.
00:30:36.960 -->
00:30:44.000There's too much of it that uh that's left up to development and chance at the moment, and and it and it is really visually suffering.
00:30:44.319 -->
00:30:52.880And so I think having architects more involved, um, and it's been a big topic of this season as well, but advocacy, that's that'll be the big changing landscape.
00:30:53.039 -->
00:30:53.680Yeah.
00:30:54.079 -->
00:30:54.480Cool.
00:30:54.799 -->
00:30:55.440Awesome, guys.
00:30:55.680 -->
00:30:56.160Thanks very much.
00:30:56.400 -->
00:30:56.799Cheers.
00:30:56.960 -->
00:30:59.279Enjoy the rest of uh the conference.
