Red Dragon

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Well, Ryan, I'm very excited to announce that we have
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a new intern.
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Okay.
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From Bridgewater State. Oh, wow. They were the only school that...
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Would accept us. Responded to my letters. Yep.
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If one of your interns passes away mysteriously, they should
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be worried.
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That's true. And they sent us like profiles, like resumes,
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I guess. You don't really have much of a resume
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if you're in college. And they had pictures with all
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of them. So let me tell you, I picked quite
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a girl for us. Her name is Julia.
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For us. For us.
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Her name is Julia. She's a beautiful, beautiful girl. She's
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a major or something. I don't remember what her major is.
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Okay.
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But she goes to Bridgewater State. Okay. And she'll be
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starting this weekend working on the pod.
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Production's been lagging, so it's pretty glad to hear that
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we're going to have some hands here.
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Yeah, you don't need to be involved. Me and Julia
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are going to have some private onboarding. I don't.
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Want to be involved. Thank you.
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And yeah, so we should, we'll be, it's a remote location.
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You know, it sounds to me, it sounds based on
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this news that someone's lunar trip might be landing back
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on Earth soon, based on this news. Just a, just
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a theory.
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Are you referring to, you're referring to Pastor Rich and Cheyenne?
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I think he might.
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This is completely different.
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He might get news and he might show back up.
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Honestly, I don't want to.
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That's been his trend.
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I don't want to introduce the two of them. But, yeah, no,
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that's the good news. That's great. We'll see how it
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turns out.
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We should introduce Julia on the next episode.
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We will.
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Yeah.
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Welcome back to Cuff's Basement. I'm your co-host, Tim. And
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I'm with my co-host, Ryan.
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Hey, everyone.
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And it's October, guys. It's that spooky season already. Woo!
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Spooky season.
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Leaves are changing.
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So, we're recording this in August, but I'm going to
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release it in October.
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Okay.
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That's, you know. Wow. Look behind the curtain.
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Wow.
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Yeah.
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Are you that? Like, you have that many episodes to release?
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I think it's appropriate.
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Um, okay, sure.
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I think you could say this is like a, maybe
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not a horror movie, but a thriller.
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Definitely. Definitely a thriller.
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Um, but I'm here with a very special guest. It
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is my sister! Woo! Megan. Uh, not Brittany. I do
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have two sisters. And we're talking about the film Dragon
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of Red. Yep. Um, which is a... Comedy? comedy yes
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actually yes it is a romance in a way it
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isn't romance yeah it is so i would say well
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we we had talked about on the silence of the
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lambs pod because when we were here last year that's
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when we did silence of the lambs right yes um
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and i think you said last year you wanted to
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do red dragon i did and uh we had said
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that silence of the lambs was the first horror movie
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to win best picture but then we were like is
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it a horror movie so i think that silence of
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the lambs is probably more of a horror movie and
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has more horror elements than this movie, in my opinion.
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I think it's scarier.
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You got the skin suit. You got the night vision scenes.
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You got, like, the girl in the hole.
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You got Lecter's whole thing at the end.
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You got Lecter's whole thing at the end. Very violent.
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But I think, like, when you say... I think when
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people say, like, it has horror elements, but I don't
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see it as, like, a horror movie. You know what
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I mean?
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Agree.
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And this is based on... This is a 1981 novel
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called Red Dragon by Thomas Harris. And it was written
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before Silence of the Lambs.
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Yes.
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But then Silence of the Lambs comes out. Obviously, it
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was a massive success.
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1991?
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Silence of the Lambs is 91.
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Yeah. And they had already made a movie of the
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book Red Dragon before Silence of the Lambs.
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Yeah.
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So for those of you that don't know that, there
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was a Hannibal Lecter movie that came out before Anthony
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Hopkins played him in Signs of the Lambs. It was
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called Manhunter. It came out in what year?
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1986.
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1986, the year I was born. And it's starring William Peterson,
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who is Grissom in CSI. Oh. He's Will Graham.
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Oh, I love Grissom.
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And he also played Mr. Walker in Fear with Mark Wahlberg.
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I love Fear. Reese Witherspoon.
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Great one.
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And Hannibal Lecter was played by Brian Cox from Succession.
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Yep. Wow.
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Okay.
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So really good casting. Great cast. Now, I had never
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seen Manhunter. So Ryan had seen it.
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Correct.
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So I watched it. You didn't get to see it
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this week.
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I did not. I'm sorry.
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I was able to watch it this week just because
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I had seen Red Dragon, but I had never seen Manhunter.
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And I thought, if I'm ever going to watch it,
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I was shocked by how.
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Scene for scene, like cookie cutter. The, the two are like,
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like most of red dragon is, is man Hunter, like
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line for line.
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Yeah.
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Like the script is exactly the same. Now granted they're
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based off a novel. So maybe the novel just was
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like this. There are some key differences, which I think
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we can talk about later. So when I was watching
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man Hunter, I was like, Oh, this makes me respect,
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respect red dragon less. And I like this movie more because,
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But then by the end, I was like, no, Red
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Dragon is better. Red Dragon is a better version of
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the two. What do you think?
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I think Manhunt... I think because they're both... We talked
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on text about this. I'm always fascinated by this idea
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where two people for very different reasons do the same story.
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Do the completely different book. And not like a remake.
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This person made the movie as a police procedural in 1986.
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This person or this team of people... made this movie
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to be a sequel to a very classic movie, or
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a prequel to it, but have the same vibe as
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The Silence of the Lambs. So it's very different operations.
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I think Manhunter, if you're criticizing it as a film,
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is probably better than Red Dragon. This cast is so
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goddamn good in Red Dragon, I would watch Red Dragon.
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So the reason I disagree with you that the film
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Red Dragon is better is the director of Manhunter is better.
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But I don't think, I think the story of Red
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Dragon is better.
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I think because, truly, I think the interest from Manhunter is, like,
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this is the Will Graham story. Like, they do cut
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back to Francis Dollar Hyde. By the way, amazing Francis
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Dollar Hyde in Manhunter as well.
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Tom Noonan?
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Tom Noonan. He passed away last year as well.
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Tom Noonan is the villain from Robocop 2.
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Yep.
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He's the villain in Last Action Hero.
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Yep.
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Really creepy, super tall dude.
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Very, very tall. Used in a lot of movies. People
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definitely recognize him if they see him. They cut back
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to Dollar Hyde a lot, but it's still very police procedural, stark,
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person at the end of their wits kind of thing.
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Where this movie is like, let's kind of do the ensemble.
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Dollar Hyde gets a whole, you follow him for a while,
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you follow Will for a while. They kind of jump
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around a lot, which gives you a fuller picture of
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the story. I just think Manhunter's more concise. This movie, like,
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my problem with Red Dragon is that it needs an eye.
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It needs a director who had a style to it because...
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There's no style to it. There's no style. But again,
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you have such great actors doing great stuff, you can
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be like, hey, you know what? Who cares?
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The script is better. Again, we'll get into it, but
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there's a couple key plot points that Manhunter does not
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do that I think make Red Dragon better. Now, for...
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Just for the backstory, so Manhunter comes out It's kind
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of a flop.
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Yeah, it does not exist at all.
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And one criticism about it. So I was watching Manhunter.
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It's very 80s. Extremely. It's like very Art Deco. Like,
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you know, like a translucent wall you would have in
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a shower of like blocks? Yes. That's very 80s Art Deco. Yes.
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Tons of those walls. So I thought, oh, just it
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was the 80s. But then I was reading reviews that
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came out at the time. And the reviews were like,
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this entire movie looks like an episode of Miami Vice.
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Like, what is going on?
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So, and I don't think it really lends itself to the,
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this is not like an art deco story, in my opinion. No.
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I feel like it's this weird thing that we have
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this Rosetta Stone of Silence of the Lambs being like, oh,
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this is how you do like a Hannibal Lecter-esque story now. Like,
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that's how we, that's our foundation for everything. This movie
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at that time didn't give a shit about that. They even,
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his name is spelled differently too, I think, in Manhunter.
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It's not, Yeah, it's L-E-C-K-T-O-R.
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Or something like that. It's a very different vibe. So
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I feel like they just didn't care. And this movie
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we're watching is truly trying, down to the crew, is
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trying to be Silence of the Lambs again. Which is smart.
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Don't get me wrong.
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Barney.
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And I think we'll talk about the director of Red Dragon.
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So then, Silence of the Lambs in 1991. Then they
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came out with Hannibal, which was what year?
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2001, ten years later.
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And it was awful. People hated it. It was critically panned.
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I've seen it. The book is genuinely terrible.
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Yes, I read it. I don't like the book.
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The book is terrible.
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Terrible.
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Jodie Foster wouldn't be in it.
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Made a shit ton of money. Exactly. Made a shit
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ton of money.
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So, then they decide, Dino De Laurentiis, right? Yep. Decides, okay,
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you know what? Let me just remake, because we made
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Manhunter without Hannibal.
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People didn't know it existed, to be honest with you.
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I think the general public didn't know it existed.
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Without Anthony Hopkins, let's just do Manhunter again with Anthony Hopkins.
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And a lot of people thought that was a bad idea.
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And I think maybe... why they chose Brett Ratner, who
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we'll talk about, is Brett Ratner is a very, like...
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I think he's a director that could be easily controlled
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by production and other people on the crew.
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Extraneous stuff outside of his work. Just talking about the
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movies he's made. He's a solid director. He will point
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and shoot. That's my thing.
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He will point and shoot. Yeah. He will point and shoot.
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Let me go over. This is all of Brett Ratner's films.
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Money Talks, 1997. Great one. Rush Hour. The Family Man,
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which I actually ride.
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I love The Family Man.
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I ride for The Family Man.
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We love The Family Man.
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I ride for The Family Man. Rush Hour 2. Red Dragon.
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After the Sunset. X-Men 3, which was terrible.
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Crime.
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Rush Hour 3.
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Extra crime.
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Tower Heist. Ugh. 2014's Hercules. Is that with The Rock?
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It is. I didn't see it, though. Have you seen it?
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And then his last movie after 2014, 2026's Melania.
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Oh! Oh, no. You didn't know that?
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No. You didn't know that?
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No. Yes.
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He directed that?
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Yes.
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What? So let's talk about it. So, okay. Wow. Brett Ratner.
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This is obviously Megan chose a Brett Ratner film because
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she really just supports the man. In 2017, numerous women
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in Hollywood came forward with allegations of rape and sexual
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assault against Brett Ratner. All of his business deals and
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prospective film projects got canceled immediately. Warner Brothers distanced themselves
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from him, and he subsequently immigrated to Israel. He no
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longer lives in the United States.
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Wow.
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Israel, bad look, harboring some... Isn't Alan Dershowitz....
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Is he really there?
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I think so. I think there's a few people. Yikes.
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Ratner is personal friends with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu
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and was invited to Netanyahu to attend a speech at
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the United Nations a photo released in December 2025 as
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part of the Epstein files showed Ratner posing with Jean-Luc
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Brunel an associate of financier and child sex trafficker Jeffrey
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Epstein there is a further photo released in 2026 showing
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Ratner on a sofa with Epstein and two.
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Young women Ooh, I'm sorry, everyone.
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One of them was showing Ratner cuddling with the women,
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and he has met with Epstein on multiple occasions. So,
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just a little bit more I wanted to add.
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Oh, dear.
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During the Me Too movement, a former talent agent employee
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accused Ratner of rape. Six women, including Olivia Munn, shout
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out her, Natasha Henstridge, species, love her, accused Ratner of
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sexual assault and harassment. Also, Gal Gadot said she would
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never work with him.
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Oh, really? I love Gal Gadot.
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He has been accused of following an actress into a
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bathroom without invitation and pleasuring himself.
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Oh, Tim.
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Elliot Page, who was in The Odyssey, we were just
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talking about that, accused Ratner of sexual harassment and outing
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the 18-year-old Page as a lesbian... Before Paige had come
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out at all... In front of many onlookers... Including Anna Paquin...
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Who later confirmed the story.
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There was... Russell Simmons... A model... Claimed that... She performed
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sex acts on Russell Simmons... As Brett Ratner watched... The
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same day of all these allegations came out... Warner Brothers announced...
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It was completely severing ties with him... He was stepping
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away from all... WB related activities... they would not renew
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his $ 450 million production deal with Rat Pack.
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They had a lot of, yeah, Rat Pack had a
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lot of superhero stuff.
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That's his company. A lot of the DC stuff. He
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has denied all allegations.
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No.
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So, I think that he can point and shoot and
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his movies can be entertaining, but he's not like a
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very stylistic artsy director. So, Dino De Laurentiis was probably like,
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do exactly this and he was like okay.
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I there's very little trivia about making this movie which
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i was kind of surprised to see based on the
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amount of the cast but apparently what they did is
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before they announced the crew or who was making it
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they were like we bought the rights to red dragon
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we're going to make it and they offered like philips
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and hoffman ray fine stuff like that and they were
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like no we're good because again the handle response was
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very negative even though it's successful yeah so ted tally
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is the screenwriter who wrote silence of the lambs He
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won an Oscar for it. They were able to get
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him to come back and write Red Dragon. And he
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was like, I would, cause he was famously was like,
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I'm not doing Hannibal. I don't think that was very good.
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I'm not going to write the script for it.
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Okay.
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He agreed to do Red Dragon because he came back
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as a writer. A lot of these actors felt like, okay,
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we're going to have some kind of prestige. I wondered
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if like, cause I was surprised there's like, I'm like,
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no other director was interested in doing this? I was
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so surprised by that. I was like, no other big
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name would want to do this and do their own
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spin on this? I was so surprised.
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Is it what I said where maybe there were, but
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the studio wanted it to be a very specific thing
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and they felt like they couldn't control another director?
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I feel like I'd be so curious because now there's
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so much money to be made. At that time, I
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was doing this last night. This is just so nerdy
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and pathetic. I was like, who in 2002 or 2001...
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would do this movie and be worth it. The only
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person I thought of who would do something interesting with
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it was Fernando Morales. And if you guys know him,
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we did the episode about it, but City of God.
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Because his next movie is The Constant Gardener with Ralph Fiennes.
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And I was like, his eye, just a different look,
340
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would be so interesting.
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That's a good guess.
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Who directed Silence of the Lambs?
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So it's Jonathan Gemme.
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Okay, and why he didn't want.
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To do this? So he, he was in a lot of, we,
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I think we talked about a little bit on the
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sounds lens episode, but he was in talks to do Hannibal. He,
348
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he actually wanted to do like, he wanted to do
349
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a followup with Clarice after he took it. That'd be interesting.
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00:16:02.409 --> 00:16:04.370
But he said like, the book is bad. Can we
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do something different? Like I will do this, but I
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will do something different.
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Yeah.
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And they were like, we're going to keep doing it,
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keep doing it. And then Jodie Foster's rules, like if
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he's out, I'm out. And then they kept going. And
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then eventually just the deals fell through. I think they
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backed up a fucking Brink's truck to Anthony Hopkins and
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was like, well, do it and get paid. Why not?
360
00:16:22.110 --> 00:16:24.629
Well, I have some trivia about that, Ryan, actually.
361
00:16:24.690 --> 00:16:26.789
Before you give your trivia, one more other point I
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00:16:26.809 --> 00:16:29.210
want to make about Brett Ratner, going back to Melania.
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So after all the shit I just read came out,
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after all of that was known about Brett Ratner, they're
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going to make Melania, and who are we going to
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get to direct it? Ah, Brett Ratner will probably do it.
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And then they asked him, even knowing all this, and
368
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he was like, yep.
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Sure will. I've been dying to do a millennia story.
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It's just like, that goes to show everyone involved with
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that movie what they're like.
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He never got prosecuted or charged?
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Well, that's probably why he moved to Israel. Because Israel,
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I don't think they would extradite, right?
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I think so.
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Am I wrong?
377
00:17:03.200 --> 00:17:05.380
No, they probably would. They probably would. They probably have
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an extradition treaty.
379
00:17:06.980 --> 00:17:09.880
Megan's going to make a point about the trivia here,
380
00:17:09.900 --> 00:17:11.900
but I want to point out, before we jump in,
381
00:17:12.980 --> 00:17:15.869
So in addition to Ted Talley, this movie has Christy
382
00:17:15.930 --> 00:17:20.109
Zia or Zay and Dante Spinotti. So Dante Spinotti is
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00:17:20.150 --> 00:17:24.289
a cinematographer who shot Manhunter. Oh. He's back in this
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00:17:24.349 --> 00:17:26.430
movie and he'd done a few movies with Brett Ratner.
385
00:17:26.809 --> 00:17:30.400
Christy Zia was the production designer, sets and stuff, for
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Silence of the Lambs. They brought her back. She's also
387
00:17:32.859 --> 00:17:35.940
done Goodfellas, a lot of Scorsese movies. So they brought,
388
00:17:36.599 --> 00:17:40.799
I think, pretty interesting heavy hitters from other past movies involved.
389
00:17:40.819 --> 00:17:43.079
So I'm like, They're aware of this stuff. There's no
390
00:17:43.099 --> 00:17:44.700
way they're not aware of this stuff in any way.
391
00:17:45.880 --> 00:17:47.519
But you were saying, we had some trivia about him.
392
00:17:47.569 --> 00:17:50.690
Yeah, no, I was just, so the cast, as you said, Tim,
393
00:17:50.970 --> 00:17:53.930
is dynamite. I mean, we can go through the cast.
394
00:17:53.950 --> 00:17:54.829
It's a murderer's row.
395
00:17:54.869 --> 00:17:55.349
Incredible.
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00:17:56.009 --> 00:17:59.259
Anthony Hopkins, I was so curious why he agreed to
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do this, you know, so long after Silence of the Lambs.
398
00:18:02.519 --> 00:18:06.000
And according to IMDb, it said that one of the
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00:18:06.039 --> 00:18:07.900
reasons that he wanted to play him for a final
400
00:18:07.940 --> 00:18:12.059
time was because he thought that Hannibal had become seen
401
00:18:12.079 --> 00:18:15.890
too much as a likable anti-hero by audiences. So he
402
00:18:15.950 --> 00:18:18.410
wanted to portray him as the evil person that he was.
403
00:18:18.430 --> 00:18:22.609
I think that's a really good point. Also money. Also
404
00:18:23.289 --> 00:18:26.170
to see Hannibal. Also, a lot of people were like,
405
00:18:26.230 --> 00:18:27.349
this should be a trilogy.
406
00:18:27.369 --> 00:18:28.650
Yeah.
407
00:18:28.759 --> 00:18:31.980
And also Hannibal has such a bad taste in people's mouths.
408
00:18:32.019 --> 00:18:34.940
He probably wanted to like do something better as a
409
00:18:36.079 --> 00:18:36.940
exit for Hannibal.
410
00:18:37.200 --> 00:18:39.559
Can I, Can I ask you guys a question about that? So,
411
00:18:39.619 --> 00:18:42.609
Hannibal is a year before this. One year. And Hannibal
412
00:18:42.619 --> 00:18:45.930
takes place, I think it's 15 or 10 years away,
413
00:18:46.289 --> 00:18:50.210
from Silence of the Lambs. So, movie real-world life. You
414
00:18:50.250 --> 00:18:53.250
just gave us this massive hit movie, good or bad,
415
00:18:53.470 --> 00:18:56.440
about Hannibal older. Yes. You're now giving us a prequel,
416
00:18:57.180 --> 00:19:01.339
probably 11 months or 10 months later, playing him 10
417
00:19:01.339 --> 00:19:03.880
years before that happens, and they really don't do a.
418
00:19:03.859 --> 00:19:06.130
Good job of, like, No, they dye his hair.
419
00:19:06.420 --> 00:19:09.059
They give him a ponytail. Fucking kill me.
420
00:19:09.079 --> 00:19:11.640
So that's my note. I wrote ponytail Hannibal?
421
00:19:11.759 --> 00:19:12.819
No. It's just.
422
00:19:13.440 --> 00:19:16.480
First of all, any male with a ponytail, red flag.
423
00:19:16.839 --> 00:19:17.359
Red flag.
424
00:19:17.539 --> 00:19:19.900
That's really in the movie, was red flag. For a
425
00:19:19.900 --> 00:19:21.799
lot of reasons, I guess, apparently.
426
00:19:21.960 --> 00:19:25.109
There's a guy I work with that Ryan knows, well,
427
00:19:25.210 --> 00:19:27.809
I used to work with, named Dan, who's just the nicest,
428
00:19:27.890 --> 00:19:31.230
most reliable, friendly, great guy. And I said to somebody,
429
00:19:31.250 --> 00:19:34.170
I was like, have you seen Dan recently? They were like, no, why?
430
00:19:34.740 --> 00:19:37.539
He has a ponytail. And they were like, what?
431
00:19:37.619 --> 00:19:38.000
Why are you.
432
00:19:38.680 --> 00:19:40.099
And I just didn't know, like, what would that mean?
433
00:19:40.140 --> 00:19:41.420
If you saw somebody you hadn't seen in a while
434
00:19:41.440 --> 00:19:43.430
and they had a ponytail, you'd be like, oh, no.
435
00:19:43.450 --> 00:19:46.890
If it was a man. Yes. Sorry.
436
00:19:47.049 --> 00:19:47.789
I'd be curious.
437
00:19:47.829 --> 00:19:48.329
No, that's it.
438
00:19:48.349 --> 00:19:48.750
That was all.
439
00:19:48.789 --> 00:19:50.450
I thought that was an interesting... tidbit.
440
00:19:50.529 --> 00:19:52.380
Was there any other actors you wanted to, I mean,
441
00:19:52.390 --> 00:19:53.170
Harvey Keitel?
442
00:19:53.730 --> 00:19:57.059
Well, I mean, I saw when Edward Norton comes on
443
00:19:57.099 --> 00:20:01.140
the screen, it was like, I loved Edward Norton. He
444
00:20:01.200 --> 00:20:04.380
is such a good actor. And so I did a
445
00:20:04.440 --> 00:20:06.799
dive after this because where did Edward Norton go?
446
00:20:06.819 --> 00:20:09.960
He, It's weird with him. It feels like he... I
447
00:20:09.960 --> 00:20:12.960
don't know how to say it best. I feel like
448
00:20:12.980 --> 00:20:17.619
he got very burned by a lot of his experiences
449
00:20:17.839 --> 00:20:19.759
business-wise with movies.
450
00:20:20.460 --> 00:20:22.079
He was really mad at Marvel about Hulk.
451
00:20:22.099 --> 00:20:26.299
Well, I heard, according to my internet research, he's a
452
00:20:26.380 --> 00:20:29.160
little difficult. Yes, he famously did that. He likes to
453
00:20:29.289 --> 00:20:33.029
rewrite scripts, is what they said. And so with Hulk,
454
00:20:33.069 --> 00:20:35.869
it didn't work out because he was rewriting the script.
455
00:20:36.400 --> 00:20:38.740
which I can imagine doesn't go over so well with
456
00:20:38.839 --> 00:20:40.599
the screenwriter or the director.
457
00:20:40.619 --> 00:20:44.160
He had rewritten Hulk so much they almost literally had
458
00:20:44.200 --> 00:20:47.259
to legally credit him as a screenwriter in the movie.
459
00:20:47.460 --> 00:20:49.200
They had no choice but to credit him. They didn't
460
00:20:49.220 --> 00:20:49.880
do it, but still.
461
00:20:49.960 --> 00:20:51.619
I will say, because I'm going to keep going back
462
00:20:51.660 --> 00:20:55.509
to Manhunter, Edward Norton is a better actor than William Peterson.
463
00:20:55.529 --> 00:20:55.789
Agreed.
464
00:20:55.970 --> 00:20:58.829
I think William Peterson gives a better performance as Will
465
00:20:58.849 --> 00:21:00.990
Graham than Edward Norton. And I think part of that
466
00:21:01.029 --> 00:21:04.420
is the Brett Ratner thing of the vanilla-ness of... of
467
00:21:04.460 --> 00:21:07.609
this movie, maybe a director would have gotten more out
468
00:21:07.650 --> 00:21:09.690
of it. Or maybe there's not really much to do.
469
00:21:10.009 --> 00:21:13.470
But I feel like Harvey Keitel is just there. And
470
00:21:13.589 --> 00:21:15.630
I feel like Will Graham, for the most part, Edward
471
00:21:15.670 --> 00:21:17.769
Norton's character, is just kind of there. He's just like
472
00:21:17.789 --> 00:21:20.089
a good guy. How would you explain who he is?
473
00:21:20.109 --> 00:21:22.009
He's just like a nice man who loves his family?
474
00:21:23.049 --> 00:21:26.250
No, he's got a gift. He has a gift. He
475
00:21:26.289 --> 00:21:30.130
can visualize the killer's mind. Tim's biting his lips.
476
00:21:30.190 --> 00:21:33.970
They tell you that, but there's no... There's no struggle
477
00:21:34.009 --> 00:21:35.369
within him that I see.
478
00:21:35.410 --> 00:21:38.750
No, he has that scene. Yeah, he has that scene
479
00:21:38.789 --> 00:21:44.869
where he pictures the dolls and the mirrors and the eyes.
480
00:21:45.029 --> 00:21:46.579
And it does bother him.
481
00:21:46.599 --> 00:21:49.839
Because he can profile. He can create the story of
482
00:21:50.019 --> 00:21:51.759
what the person's doing.
483
00:21:51.799 --> 00:21:55.680
He's a genius forensic profiler, criminal profiler.
484
00:21:55.740 --> 00:21:59.539
I agree that the performance, I think, again, like you're saying,
485
00:22:00.730 --> 00:22:03.369
I think someone else directing this who may be like
486
00:22:03.789 --> 00:22:05.549
Jonathan Demme when you watch Silence of the Lambs you're
487
00:22:05.569 --> 00:22:09.130
like this person's interested in Clarice in terms of like
488
00:22:09.650 --> 00:22:12.609
what not only is like we're solving a murder it's
489
00:22:12.650 --> 00:22:16.710
this whole big story that way it's how does this
490
00:22:16.799 --> 00:22:19.759
person navigate this world also what is her talents that
491
00:22:19.799 --> 00:22:24.819
let her surface and this one's could have been just
492
00:22:24.859 --> 00:22:27.240
as interesting we're like okay well now you're seeing that
493
00:22:27.299 --> 00:22:30.819
from a man who is incredibly accomplished.
494
00:22:30.720 --> 00:22:33.079
Yeah, not like, because Clarice isn't accomplished at all.
495
00:22:33.119 --> 00:22:35.779
Yeah, she's a novice at the time. Right. And then
496
00:22:35.799 --> 00:22:38.440
the idea, too, is that this person's incredibly accomplished, but
497
00:22:39.099 --> 00:22:43.180
kind of fascinating. The movie does an okay job with this, but, like,
498
00:22:43.559 --> 00:22:45.069
the person he was working with who was helping him
499
00:22:45.089 --> 00:22:46.910
figure this out is the guy he was looking for,
500
00:22:46.950 --> 00:22:49.390
and he did not see that coming. And then the
501
00:22:49.410 --> 00:22:51.150
whole idea is that's a flaw that should be following
502
00:22:51.170 --> 00:22:52.609
him the entire movie. Like, how the fuck did I
503
00:22:52.670 --> 00:22:53.990
not see what was right in front of my face?
504
00:22:54.009 --> 00:22:55.269
Because he's supposed to be a genius.
505
00:22:55.329 --> 00:22:58.450
Exactly. Do I go too deep too quick? and I
506
00:22:58.470 --> 00:23:00.609
don't see what's right in front of my face. And
507
00:23:00.829 --> 00:23:02.950
it's like, that could have been interesting. The movie doesn't
508
00:23:02.970 --> 00:23:05.430
really go into that a ton, but I think that's
509
00:23:05.450 --> 00:23:07.430
an interesting idea and kind of a cool thing that
510
00:23:07.470 --> 00:23:09.460
could have been done in a more interesting way. I
511
00:23:09.480 --> 00:23:10.420
guess that's the way to put it.
512
00:23:10.759 --> 00:23:13.059
Okay, well, should we just get into... Sure.
513
00:23:13.740 --> 00:23:15.240
Do you want to say anything else about the cast?
514
00:23:15.500 --> 00:23:17.779
I mean, Philip Seymour Hoffman deserves a mention.
515
00:23:17.799 --> 00:23:19.059
He's great.
516
00:23:19.460 --> 00:23:21.509
I think we'll come across people and talk about them.
517
00:23:21.589 --> 00:23:25.789
Philip Seymour Hoffman, because we're going to do By the
518
00:23:25.809 --> 00:23:27.970
time this comes out, there will be blood will have
519
00:23:28.069 --> 00:23:30.569
already come out as a pod. We're talking about Daniel
520
00:23:30.589 --> 00:23:33.710
Day-Lewis being like the greatest actor of all time. Philip
521
00:23:33.730 --> 00:23:35.849
Seymour Hoffman has got to be up there.
522
00:23:35.970 --> 00:23:39.619
I think now people kind of consider him in a
523
00:23:39.660 --> 00:23:40.140
way more.
524
00:23:41.000 --> 00:23:41.200
Yeah.
525
00:23:41.299 --> 00:23:42.700
And like more potent.
526
00:23:43.640 --> 00:23:48.220
And I read something for this that Anthony Hopkins and
527
00:23:48.329 --> 00:23:51.630
Philip Seymour Hoffman had no scenes together, but that Anthony
528
00:23:51.670 --> 00:23:53.849
Hopkins came to the set one day just to watch
529
00:23:53.869 --> 00:23:54.950
Philip Seymour Hoffman work.
530
00:23:54.970 --> 00:23:55.109
Wow.
531
00:23:55.700 --> 00:23:59.819
And Ryan sent me a picture of Philip Seymour Hoffman's face. Oh, yes.
532
00:24:00.119 --> 00:24:01.279
I think he sent it to both of us.
533
00:24:01.339 --> 00:24:05.990
Yeah, it's just so good. His facial expressions. Me and
534
00:24:06.049 --> 00:24:08.549
Eric and Ryan have a group text where the photo
535
00:24:08.650 --> 00:24:13.069
is Philip Seymour Hoffman's facial expression. It's unbelievable.
536
00:24:13.410 --> 00:24:17.660
We'll get to a scene later. It's amazing because it's
537
00:24:17.700 --> 00:24:20.339
not flashy that he's doing so well, especially because in
538
00:24:20.359 --> 00:24:21.779
this movie you're kind of like, why is he in
539
00:24:21.799 --> 00:24:24.309
this movie? yeah he's so good.
540
00:24:24.230 --> 00:24:26.609
At just money yeah why is he in this movie
541
00:24:26.690 --> 00:24:27.950
he has a smaller role.
542
00:24:27.890 --> 00:24:30.960
It's a big profile movie big huge movie huge actors
543
00:24:31.099 --> 00:24:35.079
again you're playing someone you could argue is worse than
544
00:24:35.119 --> 00:24:36.980
the killer no just kidding.
545
00:24:37.099 --> 00:24:39.859
Maybe not maybe not I don't think so but maybe
546
00:24:39.880 --> 00:24:43.740
and Emily Watson what happened to Emily Watson she was
547
00:24:43.789 --> 00:24:44.990
so good too I.
548
00:24:44.970 --> 00:24:49.490
Mean it's tough with that like Emily Watson's so good
549
00:24:49.869 --> 00:24:52.160
she got big at that point in time I just
550
00:24:52.180 --> 00:24:53.630
think a lot of, I think especially a lot of
551
00:24:53.650 --> 00:24:56.250
British actors, they just like will either do Hollywood or
552
00:24:56.289 --> 00:24:58.829
be like, I'm in this machinery and if things work out,
553
00:24:59.009 --> 00:25:01.529
I'm fine. If not, I can work in the UK,
554
00:25:01.569 --> 00:25:02.849
do stage, like stuff like that.
555
00:25:02.910 --> 00:25:05.450
Cause right. Cause I'm not trying to, she's amazing, but
556
00:25:05.490 --> 00:25:09.160
like the evil superficial Hollywood machine, like what are they
557
00:25:09.180 --> 00:25:09.700
going to do with her?
558
00:25:10.200 --> 00:25:11.500
And she shouldn't care about it.
559
00:25:11.660 --> 00:25:13.900
She's a woman that's now going to be older. And
560
00:25:13.940 --> 00:25:15.559
when we were talking about on the drive here, we're
561
00:25:15.579 --> 00:25:18.880
talking about Diane Lane and how like she, she just
562
00:25:18.900 --> 00:25:20.900
fell off a cliff because she got old. And that's
563
00:25:20.920 --> 00:25:23.779
what happens in, In Hollywood, what?
564
00:25:24.000 --> 00:25:27.240
Her and Philip Seymour Hoffman the same year in Punch
565
00:25:27.259 --> 00:25:27.759
Drunk Love.
566
00:25:28.539 --> 00:25:30.460
Oh, okay. I don't even remember her being in that.
567
00:25:30.660 --> 00:25:33.690
She's Adam Sandler's eye of his affection.
568
00:25:38.190 --> 00:25:45.400
Oh, okay. Emily Watson's not for Hollywood women's standards. Oh, Tim.
569
00:25:45.440 --> 00:25:47.119
She's not like a knockout.
570
00:25:47.140 --> 00:25:47.539
Gotcha. Gotcha.
571
00:25:48.279 --> 00:25:51.549
And she's getting older. Hollywood doesn't care about a talented
572
00:25:51.589 --> 00:25:55.210
female actress that's not super sexy hot and is getting older.
573
00:25:55.230 --> 00:25:57.450
They're throwing her in the garbage bin every time.
574
00:25:57.789 --> 00:26:00.930
I mean, who is the other British actress who's phenomenal
575
00:26:00.950 --> 00:26:06.170
and all this stuff? She's in Shape of Water. Sally... Oh, yeah.
576
00:26:06.599 --> 00:26:07.410
Sally McNally.
577
00:26:07.559 --> 00:26:08.900
Sally McNally, yeah. That's her name.
578
00:26:09.319 --> 00:26:10.180
I know who you're talking about, though.
579
00:26:10.200 --> 00:26:13.759
But she's great. But again, especially with women, Hollywood's brutal
580
00:26:13.779 --> 00:26:17.839
with that. She's over 30. They don't care. It's awful.
581
00:26:18.119 --> 00:26:20.420
I don't know why I like that so much.
582
00:26:20.789 --> 00:26:22.410
Sally McNally presents this episode.
583
00:26:22.809 --> 00:26:24.509
I thought that you were being serious.
584
00:26:24.569 --> 00:26:24.869
No.
585
00:26:25.549 --> 00:26:27.410
No. Oh, Struthers. Struthers.
586
00:26:28.349 --> 00:26:29.329
Sally Struthers?
587
00:26:29.390 --> 00:26:29.890
No.
588
00:26:29.950 --> 00:26:31.009
Not Sally Struthers.
589
00:26:31.470 --> 00:26:35.269
So, okay. It is Baltimore. Shout out Baltimore, where I
590
00:26:35.309 --> 00:26:39.339
used to live. 1980. And it is.
591
00:26:39.359 --> 00:26:40.299
Eric's performing.
592
00:26:40.779 --> 00:26:44.779
Eric is performing at the symphony... And Hannibal Lecter is
593
00:26:44.799 --> 00:26:45.279
in the crowd.
594
00:26:46.519 --> 00:26:47.859
Composer shout out, by the way.
595
00:26:48.500 --> 00:26:48.700
Who?
596
00:26:48.900 --> 00:26:50.420
Lalo Schifrin is the conductor.
597
00:26:50.440 --> 00:26:51.140
Okay.
598
00:26:51.240 --> 00:26:53.240
He's the composer for the music for Rush Hour. Also,
599
00:26:53.279 --> 00:26:55.140
the Mission Impossible theme was created by him.
600
00:26:55.460 --> 00:26:55.960
Oh, wow.
601
00:26:56.079 --> 00:26:57.660
Ryan, how great of a shout out out there.
602
00:26:57.980 --> 00:26:58.740
Great trivia.
603
00:26:58.759 --> 00:26:59.279
There we go.
604
00:27:00.099 --> 00:27:02.900
Lecter's in the crowd and he grimaces because he noticed,
605
00:27:03.119 --> 00:27:05.140
is it a flautist? Is that what you call it?
606
00:27:05.619 --> 00:27:06.420
I believe that's true.
607
00:27:06.440 --> 00:27:08.460
That's the name? The flautist. A fluter.
608
00:27:08.880 --> 00:27:09.289
Fluter.
609
00:27:09.980 --> 00:27:11.029
Pippa was a flautist.
610
00:27:11.170 --> 00:27:14.059
She was a flautist. Yes. Yeah, um.
611
00:27:15.259 --> 00:27:17.599
Made a little boo-boo, right?
612
00:27:17.819 --> 00:27:20.099
Yeah, he's a little... He messed up. He's a little off,
613
00:27:20.440 --> 00:27:24.279
and Hannibal's kind of like, uh... Now we're at a
614
00:27:24.400 --> 00:27:25.119
dinner party that.
615
00:27:25.180 --> 00:27:27.619
Wait, I would... My note is, I would not want
616
00:27:27.640 --> 00:27:29.430
to capture Hannibal Lecter's attention.
617
00:27:30.089 --> 00:27:30.509
No.
618
00:27:31.410 --> 00:27:31.529
No.
619
00:27:31.549 --> 00:27:32.329
For any reason.
620
00:27:32.349 --> 00:27:33.230
As a woman.
621
00:27:33.250 --> 00:27:35.210
The guy was beating himself up enough, I was like, Hannibal, dude,
622
00:27:35.230 --> 00:27:36.470
let this guy go. Like, he was.
623
00:27:36.490 --> 00:27:38.809
Does Hannibal kill women? Has he killed women?
624
00:27:39.829 --> 00:27:41.150
Yes, the nurse, he ate her face.
625
00:27:42.029 --> 00:27:42.470
Oh, right.
626
00:27:42.549 --> 00:27:44.960
He ate her face. No, it's a crazy thing to say.
627
00:27:44.970 --> 00:27:46.509
It's actually true. Yeah.
628
00:27:46.529 --> 00:27:47.650
They don't even show you the picture, they show the
629
00:27:47.710 --> 00:27:49.009
back of the picture, and you're just like, oh.
630
00:27:49.089 --> 00:27:52.049
Oh, also, we forgot to mention Hannibal Rising. Hannibal Rising was...
631
00:27:51.869 --> 00:27:53.259
It's actually really good.
632
00:27:53.410 --> 00:27:53.890
Even worse.
633
00:27:54.150 --> 00:27:55.440
A prequel to Red Dragon.
634
00:27:55.519 --> 00:27:56.019
It's awful. It's bad.
635
00:27:56.039 --> 00:27:56.119
Yeah.
636
00:27:56.140 --> 00:27:57.799
As much as I love that kind of stuff, it's bad.
637
00:27:58.400 --> 00:28:02.359
And Hannibal's having a... He is Hannibal at this time.
638
00:28:02.420 --> 00:28:08.890
He's not a criminal. He's a very... renowned psychologist psychiatrist
639
00:28:09.210 --> 00:28:13.289
psychiatrist and intellectual um and he's at this like he's
640
00:28:13.309 --> 00:28:16.910
having like a dinner party with all these rich you
641
00:28:16.930 --> 00:28:22.150
know hoity-toity white people and um they're one of the
642
00:28:22.210 --> 00:28:25.990
women says what is this fine looking amuse-bouche and he
643
00:28:26.049 --> 00:28:28.109
says if I told you you won't even try it
644
00:28:29.450 --> 00:28:29.769
and you.
645
00:28:29.710 --> 00:28:30.930
Do you think he put a lot of emphasis on
646
00:28:30.950 --> 00:28:35.420
that line I think he did okay nice thought I
647
00:28:35.500 --> 00:28:36.349
thought he undersold it.
648
00:28:36.779 --> 00:28:39.980
And basically it's indicated you're eating the flautist. Yes.
649
00:28:40.269 --> 00:28:40.529
Yeah.
650
00:28:40.720 --> 00:28:41.029
Yes.
651
00:28:41.460 --> 00:28:45.789
Because then they make mention of how the person was missing.
652
00:28:45.809 --> 00:28:48.349
Oh, yeah, yeah. They go like, oh, yeah.
653
00:28:48.609 --> 00:28:50.509
That guy was actually.
654
00:28:50.549 --> 00:28:51.890
One of the guys was like, I'm kind of glad
655
00:28:51.910 --> 00:28:52.250
he's missing.
656
00:28:52.269 --> 00:28:54.130
That was actually kind of funny. I'm not going to lie.
657
00:28:54.150 --> 00:28:57.950
That was kind of funny to put that in there.
658
00:28:57.970 --> 00:29:01.309
So after this party wraps up, Will Graham is visiting
659
00:29:01.369 --> 00:29:05.170
him at night. Because they're working on this case together.
660
00:29:05.190 --> 00:29:08.529
Because Hannibal is working with the FBI because he's such
661
00:29:08.589 --> 00:29:16.440
a great psychiatrist and profiler of criminals. So Will is saying,
662
00:29:16.500 --> 00:29:20.099
I'm figuring this out more. This serial killer we're going after.
663
00:29:20.119 --> 00:29:23.839
And we thought he was collecting body parts. But Will says,
664
00:29:23.880 --> 00:29:25.910
I realize he's not collecting the body parts. What is
665
00:29:25.950 --> 00:29:26.269
he doing?
666
00:29:26.710 --> 00:29:27.490
He's eating them.
667
00:29:27.609 --> 00:29:28.730
He's eating the body parts.
668
00:29:29.049 --> 00:29:29.210
Yeah.
669
00:29:30.069 --> 00:29:33.779
And because of this movie, I have always thought of
670
00:29:33.819 --> 00:29:38.250
this term for the rest of my life, the term oysters. Oh, yes.
671
00:29:38.329 --> 00:29:42.099
And I think of it with myself. It's basically sort
672
00:29:42.140 --> 00:29:46.539
of like your lower back love handle. So I'm not,
673
00:29:47.779 --> 00:29:50.660
believe it or not, I'm not genetically naturally an Adonis.
674
00:29:51.200 --> 00:29:53.890
So whenever I feel the fat in my lower back
675
00:29:53.930 --> 00:29:56.410
love handle, I think, oh, those are my oysters because
676
00:29:56.430 --> 00:29:59.970
of this movie. So Will's like, Molly, his wife, was
677
00:30:00.039 --> 00:30:03.319
showing my son the oysters of a chicken. And it's
678
00:30:03.359 --> 00:30:06.579
the fatty back section. And then I realized that, oh,
679
00:30:06.640 --> 00:30:11.480
he's eating like the oysters of a person. And then Lecter,
680
00:30:11.500 --> 00:30:13.920
do you remember what he asked at this point? Have
681
00:30:13.940 --> 00:30:17.960
you informed the Bureau of your theory? And well, Will
682
00:30:18.059 --> 00:30:23.279
very stupidly goes, no, I haven't told him. And then
683
00:30:23.400 --> 00:30:26.299
Will also, I thought this was so strange. Will's like,
684
00:30:26.539 --> 00:30:29.079
how come you didn't figure this out? He says, that's
685
00:30:29.140 --> 00:30:29.460
a Lecter.
686
00:30:29.769 --> 00:30:30.509
Does he say that?
687
00:30:30.650 --> 00:30:36.089
Yeah, because Will's brain is like fighting right now with...
688
00:30:36.670 --> 00:30:39.069
He kind of thinks it's Lecter, but he doesn't realize
689
00:30:39.109 --> 00:30:41.769
he thinks it's Lecter. But he's realizing it doesn't make
690
00:30:41.809 --> 00:30:44.470
sense that Lecter hasn't figured this out. Because he's like,
691
00:30:44.490 --> 00:30:48.059
you're such a genius profiler of criminals. How did you
692
00:30:48.099 --> 00:30:49.859
not figure out he was eating the parts? And then
693
00:30:50.650 --> 00:30:53.039
Lecter was like, oh, he makes a joke.
694
00:30:53.079 --> 00:30:55.880
They both have mental blocks. You don't want to believe
695
00:30:55.920 --> 00:30:57.359
the person you're working with is doing it.
696
00:30:57.599 --> 00:30:58.299
Correct.
697
00:30:58.339 --> 00:30:58.420
And.
698
00:31:00.039 --> 00:31:03.799
Lecter says, he basically says, will you excuse me, Will?
699
00:31:04.099 --> 00:31:07.279
I'll be right back. And Will's kind of just like
700
00:31:07.900 --> 00:31:09.039
milling about his office.
701
00:31:09.579 --> 00:31:10.559
It's a lovely office.
702
00:31:10.579 --> 00:31:11.759
It's a nice little area.
703
00:31:11.839 --> 00:31:12.819
Beautiful study.
704
00:31:13.099 --> 00:31:14.819
Beautiful study. Lots of books.
705
00:31:15.140 --> 00:31:18.599
And he finds a book in the library called La
706
00:31:18.660 --> 00:31:21.119
Russe Gastronomique. It's a cooking book. Oui.
707
00:31:21.779 --> 00:31:21.900
Oui.
708
00:31:21.920 --> 00:31:30.430
Tribune. And he sees like there's like a page that's noted.
709
00:31:30.779 --> 00:31:32.059
Hannibal, come on, man.
710
00:31:32.150 --> 00:31:35.299
Come on, man. He opens it and there's a section
711
00:31:35.400 --> 00:31:39.460
on the oysters. Oof. So Will has a realization.
712
00:31:39.480 --> 00:31:41.140
It says shortbreads.
713
00:31:41.920 --> 00:31:45.059
Sweetbreads, not shortbreads. It's not a dessert. Sweetbreads is actually,
714
00:31:45.380 --> 00:31:46.680
what is the definition of sweetbreads?
715
00:31:47.180 --> 00:31:47.859
I don't know.
716
00:31:48.299 --> 00:31:48.819
It's a meat.
717
00:31:49.359 --> 00:31:50.880
I'm pretty sure it says shortbreads.
718
00:31:51.099 --> 00:31:53.420
I'm not connected to the internet. Can you Google it? Yeah.
719
00:31:53.559 --> 00:31:56.519
Because it is actually a meat. You got it? I
720
00:31:56.539 --> 00:31:59.130
think it's like Organ meat, maybe?
721
00:32:00.130 --> 00:32:00.230
Eh.
722
00:32:01.309 --> 00:32:02.250
Or something like that.
723
00:32:02.269 --> 00:32:06.289
It's a culinary type of offal made from the thymus gland,
724
00:32:06.450 --> 00:32:08.789
throat sweetbread, or pancreas.
725
00:32:09.089 --> 00:32:09.410
Yikes.
726
00:32:09.670 --> 00:32:17.250
Harder stomach sweetbread of young animals, most commonly calves or lambs. Oh.
727
00:32:17.259 --> 00:32:18.480
Can you hear them screaming, guys?
728
00:32:18.500 --> 00:32:25.339
Wow. So then Will sees this and realizes, oh my god, Hannibal...
729
00:32:25.480 --> 00:32:27.109
Is this guy? Is the killer.
730
00:32:27.269 --> 00:32:29.109
He should have said it out loud.
731
00:32:29.269 --> 00:32:33.269
That would be great. That would be great. And he
732
00:32:33.349 --> 00:32:36.450
turns around to like, I don't know what. And then
733
00:32:36.529 --> 00:32:37.269
what happens, Meg?
734
00:32:37.450 --> 00:32:42.650
He gets stabbed. Hannibal stabs him. And I gasped out loud.
735
00:32:43.230 --> 00:32:45.630
I had forgotten this whole opening.
736
00:32:45.690 --> 00:32:46.230
Yeah, really?
737
00:32:46.730 --> 00:32:49.950
Yeah, I did. I really did. I remembered other parts
738
00:32:49.970 --> 00:32:52.019
of the movies, completely blacked this part out.
739
00:32:52.039 --> 00:32:52.339
Really?
740
00:32:52.359 --> 00:32:55.519
So one of the main... The best part about this movie, really,
741
00:32:55.579 --> 00:32:57.920
is the opening. This is an incredible opening.
742
00:32:58.019 --> 00:32:59.180
Yes, this is a great opening.
743
00:32:59.220 --> 00:33:00.940
And Manhunter does not have this opening.
744
00:33:01.259 --> 00:33:01.839
Oh, really?
745
00:33:01.920 --> 00:33:04.519
So when Manhunter starts, Lecter's in prison.
746
00:33:05.700 --> 00:33:05.980
Oh, okay.
747
00:33:06.000 --> 00:33:07.039
So I think that's a missed fight.
748
00:33:07.079 --> 00:33:07.799
Because there's no.
749
00:33:08.160 --> 00:33:10.019
This was such a good opening.
750
00:33:10.950 --> 00:33:11.349
So good.
751
00:33:11.390 --> 00:33:14.890
And he, yeah, he gets stabbed. And, oh, you just
752
00:33:14.930 --> 00:33:16.960
know that it's a bad one. It's a really bad one.
753
00:33:16.970 --> 00:33:19.470
First of all, when Lecter, I rewound this because I
754
00:33:19.490 --> 00:33:21.890
was like, did I mishear this? And I rewound it.
755
00:33:22.250 --> 00:33:25.690
And when Lecter stabs him, he hisses. He goes like,
756
00:33:25.910 --> 00:33:28.190
as he's doing it. And then I wrote the, because
757
00:33:28.210 --> 00:33:32.750
this is so, so fucked. So Lecter, because Lecter, you know,
758
00:33:32.839 --> 00:33:34.990
Lecter is a guy like, that's the thing about, you
759
00:33:35.039 --> 00:33:37.859
were talking about Anthony Hopkins saying people think Lecter's an antihero,
760
00:33:37.880 --> 00:33:41.940
but he's not. Lecter has like a code. In a way. Yeah. Like,
761
00:33:41.960 --> 00:33:44.759
he won't kill Barney in prison. He would never harm Barney.
762
00:33:44.940 --> 00:33:45.240
Right.
763
00:33:45.619 --> 00:33:47.799
You know Lecter truly respects Will.
764
00:33:47.960 --> 00:33:48.640
Yeah.
765
00:33:48.799 --> 00:33:51.579
And he doesn't really want to kill Will. But he knows, like,
766
00:33:51.599 --> 00:33:55.460
I'm fucked. I have to kill Will. So he thinks he's, like,
767
00:33:55.609 --> 00:33:59.569
being kind. And he says, this is just, like, imagine
768
00:33:59.589 --> 00:34:01.309
how psycho you have to be to say this is
769
00:34:01.349 --> 00:34:04.170
somebody you're stabbing. He goes, don't move. You're in shock now.
770
00:34:04.630 --> 00:34:07.069
I don't want you to feel any pain. In a moment,
771
00:34:07.410 --> 00:34:11.079
you'll begin to feel lightheaded, then drowsy. Don't resist. It's
772
00:34:11.179 --> 00:34:14.840
so gentle, like slipping into a warm bath. I regret
773
00:34:14.889 --> 00:34:16.670
it came to this will, but every game must have
774
00:34:16.710 --> 00:34:19.690
its ending. It's like slipping into a warm bath, describing
775
00:34:19.829 --> 00:34:24.489
your death as you're being stabbed, and then he says,
776
00:34:24.550 --> 00:34:26.699
as well as I collapse into the floor, you're a
777
00:34:26.699 --> 00:34:29.940
remarkable boy. I do admire your courage. I think I'll
778
00:34:29.960 --> 00:34:30.599
eat your heart.
779
00:34:31.960 --> 00:34:33.800
That was, yeah.
780
00:34:33.860 --> 00:34:35.199
That's an awesome line.
781
00:34:35.280 --> 00:34:38.599
That's, that's, my note is, what an opening.
782
00:34:38.920 --> 00:34:39.739
What an opening.
783
00:34:39.880 --> 00:34:40.300
What an opening.
784
00:34:40.320 --> 00:34:42.760
What an opening. And then what happens next, Ryan?
785
00:34:44.480 --> 00:34:47.619
Will is able to stab Lecter with three arrows.
786
00:34:47.909 --> 00:34:50.679
Yeah, because Lecter, because he has like all these weird,
787
00:34:50.929 --> 00:34:52.289
it's almost like Bruce Wayne's.
788
00:34:52.650 --> 00:34:54.070
Yeah, actually, very good point.
789
00:34:54.309 --> 00:34:56.909
Bruce Wayne will have like an African mask and like,
790
00:34:57.369 --> 00:34:58.630
you know, from traveling the world.
791
00:34:58.710 --> 00:34:58.969
Yeah.
792
00:34:59.170 --> 00:35:02.360
And Lecter has this quiver of arrows from God knows what.
793
00:35:02.500 --> 00:35:02.739
Yeah.
794
00:35:03.199 --> 00:35:06.380
And Will grabs the, has grabbed the arrow secretly and
795
00:35:06.420 --> 00:35:09.579
then stabs Lecter back. And then Lecter's kind of in
796
00:35:09.619 --> 00:35:11.980
shock that he just got stabbed and then Will shoots him.
797
00:35:12.219 --> 00:35:12.440
Yes.
798
00:35:14.010 --> 00:35:17.650
And then the movie opens. The movie opens. It says, uh,
799
00:35:17.690 --> 00:35:21.550
dragon of bread. That's, that's an A plus.
800
00:35:21.670 --> 00:35:23.510
That's an A plus. That's probably the best part of
801
00:35:23.550 --> 00:35:24.590
the movie. I think you said that.
802
00:35:25.449 --> 00:35:29.349
I did. And I agree. Um, So, yeah, Manhunter does
803
00:35:29.369 --> 00:35:33.590
not have that. So now the movie is starting. It's
804
00:35:33.780 --> 00:35:36.679
in the future. I think it says sometime later. I
805
00:35:36.699 --> 00:35:37.619
think it literally says that.
806
00:35:37.840 --> 00:35:43.960
We should put out opening credits, our news footage, news papers,
807
00:35:44.500 --> 00:35:46.940
of just how everything transpired after this.
808
00:35:47.659 --> 00:35:51.539
One thing that I think this movie does not capture accurately,
809
00:35:51.579 --> 00:35:54.300
and I know it was the 80s. It's a different time. But, like, the.
810
00:35:56.159 --> 00:35:59.550
Dollar Hyde, who we'll go into, and Lecter, there would
811
00:35:59.570 --> 00:36:03.409
just be... This would be the biggest crime story of
812
00:36:03.489 --> 00:36:03.909
all time.
813
00:36:03.929 --> 00:36:04.030
Yeah.
814
00:36:04.489 --> 00:36:08.050
Like, the FBI was using a psychiatrist to help them
815
00:36:08.110 --> 00:36:10.889
solve a serial killer. Yeah. And it turns out that
816
00:36:10.929 --> 00:36:14.179
psychiatrist they chose was the serial killer. Yeah. This would
817
00:36:14.219 --> 00:36:15.900
be the most... There would be a thousand books written
818
00:36:15.960 --> 00:36:16.260
on this.
819
00:36:16.539 --> 00:36:18.179
Yes. The movie... I thought the opening credits did a
820
00:36:18.199 --> 00:36:20.760
great job of that. Like, yes, this would be gigantic news.
821
00:36:21.099 --> 00:36:22.480
Tons of newspaper articles.
822
00:36:22.519 --> 00:36:22.760
Yeah.
823
00:36:22.860 --> 00:36:25.090
And then we'll go into Dollar Hyde later, but Dollar
824
00:36:25.130 --> 00:36:29.239
Hyde is... going to affluent white suburbs and killing an
825
00:36:29.300 --> 00:36:33.179
entire white family in their home. Every cop in the
826
00:36:33.400 --> 00:36:37.340
world would be looking for this guy. We'll get into
827
00:36:37.380 --> 00:36:41.320
it later. Anyways, so Will is now in, it looks
828
00:36:41.340 --> 00:36:41.940
like Florida.
829
00:36:42.099 --> 00:36:43.119
Marathon, Florida.
830
00:36:43.320 --> 00:36:46.760
Marathon, Florida. He's working on a boat with his son.
831
00:36:48.010 --> 00:36:49.250
He went to the psych hospital.
832
00:36:50.090 --> 00:36:51.949
He did go to the psych hospital. And there's a
833
00:36:51.989 --> 00:36:55.699
great line in Mindhunter. where his son says to him,
834
00:36:55.719 --> 00:36:58.980
they're grocery shopping, and he says, like, Jimmy in class
835
00:36:59.019 --> 00:37:03.559
said that you were in the nuthouse. And then Will says, well,
836
00:37:03.579 --> 00:37:07.179
do you remember when that man hurt me? And his
837
00:37:07.199 --> 00:37:10.119
son's like, yeah. He says, well, my body healed, but
838
00:37:10.159 --> 00:37:13.460
my mind didn't. And I was like, that's a great
839
00:37:13.480 --> 00:37:18.900
way to describe that to a kid. And yeah, so classic,
840
00:37:18.940 --> 00:37:21.699
this is like a movie trope that's happened 90 billion times.
841
00:37:22.230 --> 00:37:26.760
It's the retired expert and the guy from his old
842
00:37:26.840 --> 00:37:29.300
team is coming back and saying, we just need you
843
00:37:29.780 --> 00:37:33.079
one more time. Nothing bad will happen this time.
844
00:37:33.099 --> 00:37:34.900
That's a big ask, too.
845
00:37:35.480 --> 00:37:35.989
For work.
846
00:37:36.409 --> 00:37:40.230
For work to have you go visit the person that tried.
847
00:37:40.090 --> 00:37:42.730
To kill you. And this is Harvey Keitel playing this role.
848
00:37:42.769 --> 00:37:43.869
What's the character's name?
849
00:37:43.929 --> 00:37:44.489
Jack Crawford.
850
00:37:44.789 --> 00:37:47.610
Jack Crawford. So Jack Crawford was played Harvey Keitel in
851
00:37:47.639 --> 00:37:51.630
this movie. Dennis Farina and Manhunter, and Scott Glenn in
852
00:37:51.670 --> 00:37:54.369
Silence of the Lambs. So Scott Glenn is Jodie Foster's
853
00:37:54.409 --> 00:37:57.010
boss in Silence of the Lambs. And you had texted,
854
00:37:57.070 --> 00:37:59.250
who's the best? Jack Crawford. And I said, I'm a
855
00:37:59.289 --> 00:38:02.309
Scott Glenn guy. Same. In general, I love Scott Glenn. Yeah.
856
00:38:02.510 --> 00:38:05.179
He's great in that movie. Backdraft, Training Day.
857
00:38:05.199 --> 00:38:06.219
Yeah.
858
00:38:06.340 --> 00:38:09.800
He's a great, great character actor. And I would say
859
00:38:10.280 --> 00:38:13.039
Dennis Farina would be too, just because Harvey Keitel, very
860
00:38:13.059 --> 00:38:16.280
talented actor. I like Harvey Keitel. Jack is just there
861
00:38:16.579 --> 00:38:17.320
reading lines.
862
00:38:17.679 --> 00:38:21.059
Like they're holding up on a cue card. They really are.
863
00:38:21.099 --> 00:38:22.780
There's nothing to him at all.
864
00:38:22.880 --> 00:38:25.000
It's the best line of this entire movie later that
865
00:38:25.019 --> 00:38:26.679
made me laugh so hard. I loved it.
866
00:38:27.019 --> 00:38:30.239
Um, and he's in Jack. Jack is in this movie
867
00:38:30.320 --> 00:38:33.760
in particular is a complete cancer. Like anybody that comes
868
00:38:33.860 --> 00:38:35.929
in his orbit is just fucked.
869
00:38:35.949 --> 00:38:37.090
Done. Done.
870
00:38:37.730 --> 00:38:41.610
And Will's like, no, I can't do that. And he says, um,
871
00:38:44.239 --> 00:38:48.190
If you join this case, we will catch this guy
872
00:38:48.289 --> 00:38:52.389
faster than if you don't. So if you don't join
873
00:38:52.429 --> 00:38:55.849
this case, you are possibly costing an entire family their lives.
874
00:38:55.869 --> 00:38:56.250
Thank you, man.
875
00:38:56.590 --> 00:38:59.210
Yeah, that's what I mean. Like, that's a pretty big...
876
00:38:58.969 --> 00:39:01.170
I mean, Jack's... Big ask.
877
00:39:01.250 --> 00:39:01.989
Technically, Jack is.
878
00:39:01.989 --> 00:39:02.369
He is right.
879
00:39:02.510 --> 00:39:03.050
Jack is right?
880
00:39:03.090 --> 00:39:04.030
He is right, but still.
881
00:39:04.269 --> 00:39:07.369
That's a big, big, big ask. And so Will's trying
882
00:39:07.389 --> 00:39:09.389
to convince his wife, and as a married man, I
883
00:39:09.429 --> 00:39:10.670
know that that would not go very well.
884
00:39:10.989 --> 00:39:14.059
No, man. Can I tell you guys something?
885
00:39:14.079 --> 00:39:14.280
Sure.
886
00:39:14.639 --> 00:39:17.269
So I watched this with my husband, Kevin, who I
887
00:39:17.309 --> 00:39:22.289
think you know. And when he leaves, the scene where
888
00:39:22.289 --> 00:39:25.969
he's like getting in the taxi, he takes a very
889
00:39:25.969 --> 00:39:29.409
small bag. I don't I didn't notice it Kevin noticed
890
00:39:29.550 --> 00:39:32.039
it he said wow that's that's a really small bag
891
00:39:32.079 --> 00:39:34.000
for a couple days so then for the rest of
892
00:39:34.019 --> 00:39:38.360
the movie every outfit that Edward Norton is wearing. Kevin's like, oh,
893
00:39:38.380 --> 00:39:40.599
that was in his bag. He packed a suit jacket. Oh,
894
00:39:40.659 --> 00:39:43.039
he had a button-down shirt. Oh, wow, he had a vest.
895
00:39:43.059 --> 00:39:47.199
So the story was so compelling that he had.
896
00:39:47.280 --> 00:39:50.260
So that was very distracting to me because he does
897
00:39:50.300 --> 00:39:53.159
have a lot of outfit changes and he only carries
898
00:39:53.320 --> 00:39:55.739
a very small duffel to the taxi.
899
00:39:55.760 --> 00:39:57.659
Maybe he's buying stuff while he's there.
900
00:39:57.969 --> 00:39:59.429
Yeah, maybe. Yeah, maybe.
901
00:40:01.929 --> 00:40:04.809
Yeah, so this is like... So he decides, I'm going
902
00:40:04.829 --> 00:40:05.329
to join the case.
903
00:40:05.449 --> 00:40:05.570
Yeah.
904
00:40:06.800 --> 00:40:10.050
And this serial killer, who we'll later find out about,
905
00:40:10.809 --> 00:40:14.030
who's called the Tooth Fairy, goes into a home and
906
00:40:14.070 --> 00:40:16.650
murders an entire family. So Jack goes and visits the home,
907
00:40:16.690 --> 00:40:20.719
and I'm like, okay, again, this guy is killing white
908
00:40:20.780 --> 00:40:23.519
families of a married white couple with, like, a son
909
00:40:23.559 --> 00:40:26.659
and a daughter or something in an affluent white suburb,
910
00:40:27.119 --> 00:40:31.380
and there's no reporters staked out outside the house when
911
00:40:31.420 --> 00:40:35.289
Will goes in. It's just, like, a quiet neighborhood, like, Well.
912
00:40:35.369 --> 00:40:37.989
And also he went in at night in the dark.
913
00:40:38.340 --> 00:40:40.480
That really bothered me. Why did he go in the
914
00:40:40.519 --> 00:40:41.019
first time?
915
00:40:41.059 --> 00:40:43.500
Because he wanted to be in the killer's shoes.
916
00:40:43.860 --> 00:40:46.480
Okay. But like in the middle of the night in
917
00:40:46.500 --> 00:40:49.300
the dark, he doesn't even turn on a light. I mean,
918
00:40:49.420 --> 00:40:51.699
it's very tense and it's very scary.
919
00:40:51.719 --> 00:40:53.780
I feel you.
920
00:40:54.000 --> 00:40:55.000
But you know what I mean?
921
00:40:55.519 --> 00:40:56.300
Yeah, no, I agree.
922
00:40:56.519 --> 00:40:57.159
I agree.
923
00:40:57.199 --> 00:41:02.400
So the MO, modus operandi, is the killer goes in,
924
00:41:03.039 --> 00:41:06.650
slits the husband's throat in his sleep, disables the wife,
925
00:41:06.690 --> 00:41:09.170
so like shoots her, injures her, but doesn't kill her,
926
00:41:10.010 --> 00:41:13.090
shoots the kids in their sleep, drags their bodies down
927
00:41:13.150 --> 00:41:15.409
the hall, and there's like blood trails of where he's
928
00:41:15.449 --> 00:41:20.389
dragging these dead children. Then he breaks the mirror in
929
00:41:20.429 --> 00:41:23.179
the house and puts shards of glass in their eyes.
930
00:41:24.039 --> 00:41:26.239
So Will says he wants there to be an audience.
931
00:41:27.800 --> 00:41:31.340
And then he finds that there's talcum powder, which is
932
00:41:31.389 --> 00:41:33.409
inside of a latex glove. Oh, you had to take
933
00:41:33.429 --> 00:41:35.369
the gloves off because you had to touch her. So
934
00:41:35.769 --> 00:41:38.230
everything that he's realizing, like he's, everything is focused on
935
00:41:38.449 --> 00:41:45.079
the mom. Um, and he, the, the, there's a very
936
00:41:45.119 --> 00:41:46.719
specific bite pattern.
937
00:41:46.960 --> 00:41:47.139
Yeah.
938
00:41:47.280 --> 00:41:49.239
That's why they call him the tooth fairy. Cause he's biting.
939
00:41:49.500 --> 00:41:50.420
Yeah. Yeah.
940
00:41:50.500 --> 00:41:51.019
Which I get.
941
00:41:51.039 --> 00:41:53.639
Right.
942
00:41:53.820 --> 00:41:55.610
You're big into that. That's a big, that's a big,
943
00:41:55.630 --> 00:41:56.670
like a chat GPT narrative.
944
00:41:56.710 --> 00:41:57.130
Yeah.
945
00:41:58.380 --> 00:42:01.380
Then just a really good famous actor that's in a
946
00:42:01.400 --> 00:42:07.260
movie for five seconds. The FBI office, Bill Duke. He's
947
00:42:07.280 --> 00:42:09.409
in this movie for literally five seconds. Who is that?
948
00:42:09.429 --> 00:42:11.989
Mary Louise Parker is Will's wife and she's barely in
949
00:42:12.010 --> 00:42:12.409
the movie too.
950
00:42:12.530 --> 00:42:15.550
That's true. Well, yeah.
951
00:42:15.789 --> 00:42:19.090
It's great. Every part is overcast. It's great to see.
952
00:42:19.670 --> 00:42:21.309
But it's also just kind of like.
953
00:42:21.349 --> 00:42:23.730
Bill Duke is an older black dude with a shaved head.
954
00:42:24.420 --> 00:42:26.099
Okay.
955
00:42:26.119 --> 00:42:28.059
He was in the original Predator with Arnold Schwarzenegger.
956
00:42:28.340 --> 00:42:29.380
Okay. He was a director himself.
957
00:42:29.880 --> 00:42:30.239
Oh, did he?
958
00:42:31.590 --> 00:42:34.809
Like, what's the one with Lawrence Fishburne and Jeff Goldblum?
959
00:42:37.170 --> 00:42:38.929
Directed Sister Act 2.
960
00:42:38.929 --> 00:42:39.429
Did he?
961
00:42:39.710 --> 00:42:39.909
Yeah.
962
00:42:39.929 --> 00:42:45.760
Oh, my God. And they're going over, like, you know,
963
00:42:47.519 --> 00:42:50.860
what they need to do. And somebody asks, why won't
964
00:42:50.880 --> 00:42:54.789
he just stop? And then Will says, it makes him
965
00:42:54.809 --> 00:42:57.369
feel like God. Would you give that up? That's kind
966
00:42:57.409 --> 00:42:59.869
of a red flag comment by Will, in my opinion.
967
00:42:59.989 --> 00:43:00.769
It is.
968
00:43:00.989 --> 00:43:02.090
Kind of know-it-all-y.
969
00:43:02.869 --> 00:43:03.110
Yes.
970
00:43:03.730 --> 00:43:04.030
Yeah.
971
00:43:04.849 --> 00:43:06.929
He also, which is my least favorite thing about the
972
00:43:06.949 --> 00:43:10.719
Tooth Fairy, he always kills the family pet. Yes. And
973
00:43:10.739 --> 00:43:12.099
he kills a cat and a dog.
974
00:43:12.320 --> 00:43:12.800
I know.
975
00:43:12.820 --> 00:43:15.039
That was a good one. I didn't understand that. The dog,
976
00:43:15.099 --> 00:43:16.880
I was kind of like, okay, because the dog will
977
00:43:16.960 --> 00:43:17.519
freak out.
978
00:43:17.719 --> 00:43:18.199
Yeah, it'll bark.
979
00:43:18.219 --> 00:43:19.579
And you're trying to do this thing. But the cat,
980
00:43:19.599 --> 00:43:20.320
I was like, why?
981
00:43:20.380 --> 00:43:22.809
The cat's just evil. Like, why kill a cat? Because
982
00:43:22.829 --> 00:43:24.750
the cat's not going to... First of all, the cat
983
00:43:24.769 --> 00:43:27.789
would be like, leave you alone. Be like, welcome. Sure. Yeah, like,
984
00:43:27.809 --> 00:43:29.929
come on in. What's the cat going to do?
985
00:43:30.269 --> 00:43:34.130
Yeah. I don't know. Maybe dragons are afraid of cats.
986
00:43:34.190 --> 00:43:38.980
We don't know. So I think, if I remember correctly,
987
00:43:39.000 --> 00:43:44.039
they're leaving the office and they run into Philip Seymour Hoffman.
988
00:43:44.920 --> 00:43:45.079
Yeah.
989
00:43:45.480 --> 00:43:47.179
So how would you describe, Meg, how would you describe
990
00:43:47.239 --> 00:43:50.280
Philip Seymour Hoffman's character? Other than a class act.
991
00:43:50.409 --> 00:43:55.269
Slimy. Slimy is the first word that comes to mind. Sleazy.
992
00:43:56.389 --> 00:44:01.590
His shirt's untucked. He's overweight. He just looks greasy. Love it. Right?
993
00:44:02.130 --> 00:44:03.989
He is a newspaper reporter.
994
00:44:04.010 --> 00:44:04.690
That's so funny.
995
00:44:05.030 --> 00:44:08.429
Yeah. He will do anything for a story.
996
00:44:08.449 --> 00:44:09.250
He's a reporter.
997
00:44:09.329 --> 00:44:10.110
He's a reporter.
998
00:44:10.170 --> 00:44:12.090
For this tabloid. Yes. The tabloid.
999
00:44:12.690 --> 00:44:16.429
And it becomes evident that he has done a story
1000
00:44:16.489 --> 00:44:20.989
on Will and his mental breakdown after the whole Hannibal
1001
00:44:21.010 --> 00:44:25.389
Lecter thing. And, yeah, he's just a slime ball.
1002
00:44:25.769 --> 00:44:29.809
His claim to fame is that he broke into the
1003
00:44:29.849 --> 00:44:31.489
hospital where Will was and took photos of him.
1004
00:44:31.690 --> 00:44:32.510
Yes, that's right.
1005
00:44:32.530 --> 00:44:33.440
And Will was in the hospital bed.
1006
00:44:33.449 --> 00:44:35.000
That was his big time.
1007
00:44:35.039 --> 00:44:40.179
Very, very bad performance in Manhunter. The guy, the villain
1008
00:44:40.239 --> 00:44:41.039
from Avatar?
1009
00:44:41.539 --> 00:44:42.139
Stephen Lang.
1010
00:44:42.320 --> 00:44:44.320
Stephen Lang is terrible in Manhunter.
1011
00:44:44.429 --> 00:44:45.469
That's the news reporter?
1012
00:44:45.530 --> 00:44:45.849
Yes.
1013
00:44:46.090 --> 00:44:50.389
He basically... It's like Bill Hader doing an impression of
1014
00:44:50.469 --> 00:44:54.590
this guy. That's how he plays it. He's like a gum-chewing,
1015
00:44:54.670 --> 00:44:58.269
he has a thick New York accent. He's like, bippin'
1016
00:44:58.309 --> 00:45:02.690
and boppin'. It's just terrible. But anyways, he's trying to
1017
00:45:02.710 --> 00:45:06.530
get a story. So Jack, who's completely emotionless this entire movie,
1018
00:45:06.869 --> 00:45:10.090
Harvey Keitel says, Hey, we need somebody to talk to Lecter.
1019
00:45:10.130 --> 00:45:13.360
You should do it. And Will's like, No. Remember Lecter
1020
00:45:13.380 --> 00:45:15.800
tried to kill me? He says, yeah, but Lecter will
1021
00:45:15.920 --> 00:45:18.420
only talk to you. Which makes sense. Lecter is a
1022
00:45:18.440 --> 00:45:19.019
dick like that.
1023
00:45:19.260 --> 00:45:19.460
Yeah.
1024
00:45:19.639 --> 00:45:20.260
Mm-hmm.
1025
00:45:21.280 --> 00:45:23.699
And Anthony Heald, is that his name?
1026
00:45:23.719 --> 00:45:23.789
Yep.
1027
00:45:24.260 --> 00:45:25.519
His back is Dr. Chilton.
1028
00:45:25.599 --> 00:45:25.780
Yeah.
1029
00:45:26.559 --> 00:45:26.860
Yes.
1030
00:45:27.260 --> 00:45:29.159
And he actually does look younger somehow.
1031
00:45:29.469 --> 00:45:30.269
That one did work.
1032
00:45:30.429 --> 00:45:30.650
Yeah.
1033
00:45:30.670 --> 00:45:31.530
That one I was like, okay.
1034
00:45:31.690 --> 00:45:33.309
Yeah, his beautiful hair. Yeah.
1035
00:45:33.329 --> 00:45:34.389
They made his hair longer.
1036
00:45:34.889 --> 00:45:35.230
Yeah.
1037
00:45:35.429 --> 00:45:35.610
Right?
1038
00:45:35.630 --> 00:45:36.469
Yeah. Yeah.
1039
00:45:36.570 --> 00:45:37.190
That one did work.
1040
00:45:37.349 --> 00:45:38.090
Yeah, that worked.
1041
00:45:38.449 --> 00:45:40.750
I thought this was a pretty stupid line. So Dr.
1042
00:45:40.789 --> 00:45:43.860
Chilton says... You caught Lecter. What was your trick? And
1043
00:45:43.880 --> 00:45:45.300
Will says, I let him kill me.
1044
00:45:45.320 --> 00:45:48.909
I feel like a trailer line.
1045
00:45:49.110 --> 00:45:55.170
Yes. Yeah. This is my favorite exchange between them and
1046
00:45:55.190 --> 00:45:55.650
the movie.
1047
00:45:56.369 --> 00:45:57.800
When he first goes down to his cell.
1048
00:45:57.949 --> 00:46:01.119
And Lecter's trying to figure out, like, are you smarter
1049
00:46:01.139 --> 00:46:03.000
than me? How did you catch me? Yes. So I
1050
00:46:03.019 --> 00:46:05.219
wrote down this exchange. Well, wait.
1051
00:46:05.280 --> 00:46:08.219
Before that, the very first thing that Hannibal says to
1052
00:46:08.239 --> 00:46:10.710
Will is he comments on his smell and which is
1053
00:46:10.750 --> 00:46:13.050
the exact same thing he did with Jodie Foster, I think,
1054
00:46:13.110 --> 00:46:13.989
in Silence of the Lambs.
1055
00:46:14.469 --> 00:46:17.300
Yeah, and that's another thing I don't really like about
1056
00:46:17.320 --> 00:46:19.380
Hannibal Lecter, which we talked about in Silence of the Lambs,
1057
00:46:19.400 --> 00:46:22.300
how this portrayal of the serial killer is the evil genius,
1058
00:46:22.340 --> 00:46:25.679
like the Dr. Moriarty, when in reality most serial killers
1059
00:46:25.719 --> 00:46:30.530
are like alcoholic losers who are borderline mentally handicapped. So
1060
00:46:30.710 --> 00:46:33.829
why does he have a super sense of smell? Like, what?
1061
00:46:34.769 --> 00:46:40.289
Yeah, I mean, he appreciated cuisine. taste and smell. He
1062
00:46:40.309 --> 00:46:41.150
was into food.
1063
00:46:41.170 --> 00:46:43.610
He was foodie. I mean, as bad as the sounds.
1064
00:46:43.650 --> 00:46:45.630
He's a foodie because he ate people. You call him
1065
00:46:45.710 --> 00:46:46.150
a foodie?
1066
00:46:46.289 --> 00:46:48.389
He's a foodie. Well, I think he would have, I
1067
00:46:48.429 --> 00:46:50.929
picture Hannibal having a refined palate.
1068
00:46:50.989 --> 00:46:52.269
Yeah, he goes to nice restaurants.
1069
00:46:52.289 --> 00:46:52.570
Yes.
1070
00:46:53.130 --> 00:46:56.730
And this, as grim as this sounds, these, you know,
1071
00:46:56.989 --> 00:46:58.869
the serial killers, like they reference in Silence of the Lambs,
1072
00:46:58.909 --> 00:47:02.269
when people are hunters, like they are learning to pick
1073
00:47:02.329 --> 00:47:05.889
up on things so they can get someone's trust and
1074
00:47:05.909 --> 00:47:08.719
betray them and capture them. Like, I think they just
1075
00:47:08.760 --> 00:47:10.980
think of things in a different way, as bad as
1076
00:47:11.000 --> 00:47:12.920
that sounds. Like they just learn to, what's it, covet?
1077
00:47:13.000 --> 00:47:14.519
That's the word in Silence of the Lambs, right?
1078
00:47:14.559 --> 00:47:14.760
Yes.
1079
00:47:14.780 --> 00:47:14.960
Yeah.
1080
00:47:15.940 --> 00:47:17.619
I have a note here. This is just like Good
1081
00:47:17.639 --> 00:47:20.420
Will Hunting, a therapist and his beloved patient, Will.
1082
00:47:21.039 --> 00:47:23.360
Yeah. There's actually no difference.
1083
00:47:23.380 --> 00:47:23.860
Matt Damon.
1084
00:47:24.219 --> 00:47:25.659
I felt like I was watching.
1085
00:47:25.719 --> 00:47:28.239
Matt Damon would be a very good Will Graham.
1086
00:47:28.300 --> 00:47:29.300
He would be a good Will Graham.
1087
00:47:29.320 --> 00:47:31.199
Oh, actually, Edward Norton was born in Boston.
1088
00:47:31.559 --> 00:47:31.800
Was he?
1089
00:47:31.820 --> 00:47:33.019
That's right. That's right. That's true.
1090
00:47:33.079 --> 00:47:33.260
Yeah.
1091
00:47:34.530 --> 00:47:36.269
It's a very Good Will Hunting vibe.
1092
00:47:36.309 --> 00:47:38.030
Hannibal, fucking tell me now.
1093
00:47:38.179 --> 00:47:40.880
Gone to sea about a girl.
1094
00:47:41.539 --> 00:47:44.199
Lecter says, no, that's what Lecter would say at the
1095
00:47:44.219 --> 00:47:44.800
end of the movie.
1096
00:47:45.059 --> 00:47:46.260
Imagine this is a letter written.
1097
00:47:47.099 --> 00:47:49.400
Lecter says, why would I help you, Will? And Will says,
1098
00:47:49.420 --> 00:47:52.489
I can get you research materials. And then Will says,
1099
00:47:54.329 --> 00:47:56.250
being a genius that Will is, he says, I thought
1100
00:47:56.329 --> 00:47:59.690
also you might enjoy the challenge. You can try to
1101
00:47:59.730 --> 00:48:02.010
figure out if you're smarter than this guy, meaning the
1102
00:48:02.030 --> 00:48:04.599
Tooth Fairy. And Lecter says, if you caught me, do
1103
00:48:04.699 --> 00:48:07.219
you think you're smarter than I am? And Will says, no,
1104
00:48:07.440 --> 00:48:10.639
I know I'm not smarter than you. And Lecter said, well,
1105
00:48:10.679 --> 00:48:12.539
if that's the case, then how did you catch me?
1106
00:48:13.239 --> 00:48:16.260
You had certain disadvantages. And Lecter says, what disadvantages do
1107
00:48:16.300 --> 00:48:17.860
you mean? And Will says, you're insane.
1108
00:48:19.219 --> 00:48:20.119
That was a good moment.
1109
00:48:20.460 --> 00:48:23.079
Great moment. And I love how Will, what I love
1110
00:48:23.099 --> 00:48:26.920
about Will, no bullshit. He hates Lecter, has no respect
1111
00:48:26.940 --> 00:48:31.550
for Lecter, doesn't play the games, where Clarice is like, oh, like, oh.
1112
00:48:32.239 --> 00:48:34.519
And everything Hannibal says, Clarice is kind of like eating
1113
00:48:34.559 --> 00:48:37.619
with a spoon. And Will is literally basically saying, like,
1114
00:48:37.679 --> 00:48:39.719
all right, fuck this, and then walking away several times.
1115
00:48:40.139 --> 00:48:41.070
Yes.
1116
00:48:41.320 --> 00:48:44.309
And he says, you're very ten, Will. Your hands are rough.
1117
00:48:44.889 --> 00:48:46.789
And then Will just is like, oh, God. And he says,
1118
00:48:47.090 --> 00:48:49.960
either do it or don't. And then Lecter says, Let
1119
00:48:50.019 --> 00:48:52.179
me keep some of the photos of the crime scene
1120
00:48:52.519 --> 00:48:54.429
and I will consider it. And Will says, no. Why?
1121
00:48:54.650 --> 00:48:55.269
Why do you need this?
1122
00:48:55.329 --> 00:48:57.230
But I love how Will just goes, no. Like, cause
1123
00:48:57.269 --> 00:49:01.510
Clarice would be like, oh, okay. Like, let me ask Jack, maybe.
1124
00:49:01.570 --> 00:49:03.769
And Will just goes, no. Uh, and then he says,
1125
00:49:03.829 --> 00:49:06.219
do you dream much, Will? And Will says, goodbye. He
1126
00:49:06.239 --> 00:49:10.719
just walks away. He goes, goodbye. Uh, I, I, cause
1127
00:49:10.739 --> 00:49:13.719
that's how he should be treated. Cause like, fuck him. Right.
1128
00:49:15.599 --> 00:49:18.480
Um, and, Wait, is this when he says, I have
1129
00:49:18.500 --> 00:49:19.690
a quote, but I don't want to say it yet
1130
00:49:19.730 --> 00:49:21.219
if it's not... the part so this.
1131
00:49:21.139 --> 00:49:23.340
Is Will starts to walk away and then and then
1132
00:49:23.539 --> 00:49:26.179
Hannibal says like no stop he's basically like I will
1133
00:49:26.500 --> 00:49:29.239
look at it yeah so is that what you're referring to.
1134
00:49:29.039 --> 00:49:31.030
And he says you need to see them living the
1135
00:49:31.050 --> 00:49:31.989
way they caught his eye yes.
1136
00:49:32.309 --> 00:49:37.730
Yes and he's The Tooth Fairy may be disfigured. Also,
1137
00:49:37.769 --> 00:49:39.909
he loves yards. And is he nude in the dark?
1138
00:49:39.969 --> 00:49:40.769
Like, what?
1139
00:49:41.710 --> 00:49:45.139
He's talking about blood is black at night and it
1140
00:49:45.179 --> 00:49:47.239
may be perfect to view when you're nude. And you're like,
1141
00:49:47.500 --> 00:49:48.619
what are you talking about?
1142
00:49:48.639 --> 00:49:49.860
Actually, wait.
1143
00:49:49.900 --> 00:49:51.079
You do a good handful, Hector.
1144
00:49:51.440 --> 00:49:54.000
Oh, thank you. So the Tooth Fairy is in these
1145
00:49:54.039 --> 00:49:57.719
people's fucking yard naked. He's standing in the back. Can
1146
00:49:57.760 --> 00:50:00.570
you imagine? Like, never mind he's a serial killer. And
1147
00:50:00.590 --> 00:50:02.510
you know what? That's a great thing about Shadow Kevin
1148
00:50:02.530 --> 00:50:05.739
because Kevin loves Ari Aster. A great thing that Ari
1149
00:50:05.800 --> 00:50:08.920
Aster does that no other director does is use male
1150
00:50:09.019 --> 00:50:12.739
nudity for horror purposes. Because which is scarier to you, Megan,
1151
00:50:13.300 --> 00:50:15.820
if you come down in the kitchen and there's a
1152
00:50:15.860 --> 00:50:18.840
person that broke in holding a knife or a person
1153
00:50:18.880 --> 00:50:22.320
that broke in holding a knife naked? Which is worse
1154
00:50:22.380 --> 00:50:22.659
to you?
1155
00:50:22.679 --> 00:50:26.289
They're both really bad. Maybe the naked person.
1156
00:50:26.309 --> 00:50:29.409
Nude is way worse. So if you saw a guy
1157
00:50:29.429 --> 00:50:31.010
just standing in the backyard without a knife.
1158
00:50:31.389 --> 00:50:32.829
Plus, I mean, you think about.
1159
00:50:32.710 --> 00:50:35.909
The true situation. No, actually, I think the clothed knife-wielding person,
1160
00:50:35.969 --> 00:50:39.460
because the naked knife-wielding person is, like, so crazy. I
1161
00:50:39.980 --> 00:50:41.920
might have a chance. Like, they could be on drugs.
1162
00:50:42.199 --> 00:50:43.460
What if he's like, hear me out?
1163
00:50:44.059 --> 00:50:45.960
I would say there's actually less of a chance you
1164
00:50:45.980 --> 00:50:48.579
could get to them if they're the naked person. They've committed.
1165
00:50:49.059 --> 00:50:49.440
Yeah.
1166
00:50:49.460 --> 00:50:51.679
We'll see this in the movie later. Someone realizes, I'm
1167
00:50:51.699 --> 00:50:52.199
not going.
1168
00:50:52.119 --> 00:50:53.519
To make it out of this. I think they're crazy
1169
00:50:53.679 --> 00:50:57.309
or on drugs. I might be able to get away. Clothed,
1170
00:50:57.530 --> 00:51:00.090
it's like a Brian Koberger situation. You're in trouble.
1171
00:51:00.110 --> 00:51:00.210
Okay.
1172
00:51:00.380 --> 00:51:02.320
That's the sorority.
1173
00:51:02.360 --> 00:51:03.320
Yeah, Idaho.
1174
00:51:03.480 --> 00:51:06.460
University of Idaho. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That guy who pulled
1175
00:51:06.500 --> 00:51:08.650
off the perfect crime and immediately got caught.
1176
00:51:08.809 --> 00:51:09.210
Loser.
1177
00:51:10.670 --> 00:51:12.869
Those are the, like, the real life Hannibal Lecter is
1178
00:51:12.909 --> 00:51:18.469
that guy who thinks he's so smart and immediately gets caught. So, okay. So, basically,
1179
00:51:18.610 --> 00:51:21.980
Lecter agrees to work on the case. And I don't
1180
00:51:22.000 --> 00:51:24.219
remember if there's any other further discussion. But the next
1181
00:51:24.239 --> 00:51:28.179
note I have is when Will is watching the video
1182
00:51:28.199 --> 00:51:29.320
of the Leeds family.
1183
00:51:29.400 --> 00:51:29.579
Yeah.
1184
00:51:30.289 --> 00:51:32.570
Yes, but we should also just say, like, shout out Barney.
1185
00:51:33.289 --> 00:51:34.050
Barney's right there.
1186
00:51:34.110 --> 00:51:34.769
Barney's there.
1187
00:51:34.809 --> 00:51:36.889
He's in all four movies.
1188
00:51:37.070 --> 00:51:37.780
Is he really?
1189
00:51:37.800 --> 00:51:38.010
Yeah.
1190
00:51:38.280 --> 00:51:38.860
Oh, I didn't know that.
1191
00:51:38.880 --> 00:51:42.159
He doesn't play Barney in Manhunter, but he's in Manhunter. Yeah.
1192
00:51:42.699 --> 00:51:44.079
And what's the fourth one that he's in?
1193
00:51:44.400 --> 00:51:47.380
He's in Sansa Lam's Red Dragon and Hannibal. Yeah.
1194
00:51:47.820 --> 00:51:48.519
Wow.
1195
00:51:48.579 --> 00:51:48.800
Yeah.
1196
00:51:48.980 --> 00:51:49.880
Who's he in Hannibal?
1197
00:51:50.659 --> 00:51:50.960
Barney.
1198
00:51:52.159 --> 00:51:55.679
Clarice finds the Hannibal merch on eBay, and she's like,
1199
00:51:55.739 --> 00:51:57.519
who the fuck would get this? And it's only him.
1200
00:51:57.619 --> 00:51:59.139
And he's like, I need to make money on it.
1201
00:51:59.840 --> 00:52:02.579
I love that they cast Barney.
1202
00:52:02.599 --> 00:52:03.699
The great Frankie Faison.
1203
00:52:03.719 --> 00:52:04.340
So great.
1204
00:52:04.760 --> 00:52:07.869
And yeah, and Lecter would... He hates all the guards.
1205
00:52:07.949 --> 00:52:09.769
He hates Chilton. He wants to kill all of them.
1206
00:52:09.789 --> 00:52:10.489
He hates Chilton.
1207
00:52:10.590 --> 00:52:13.690
But Barney always treats Lecter with respect and Lecter would
1208
00:52:13.730 --> 00:52:18.050
never harm Barney because Lecter has a very weird....
1209
00:52:18.750 --> 00:52:19.530
Moral compass.
1210
00:52:19.690 --> 00:52:23.110
Yeah, very incorrect moral compass, but he has some sort
1211
00:52:23.130 --> 00:52:25.090
of moral compass. So he.
1212
00:52:27.139 --> 00:52:32.260
Will watches the Leeds video, and then he goes to Birmingham, Alabama.
1213
00:52:32.280 --> 00:52:37.820
Because the two murders are in Birmingham and where? Atlanta? Birmingham, Alabama,
1214
00:52:37.900 --> 00:52:39.039
and then there's another one somewhere else.
1215
00:52:39.099 --> 00:52:42.880
Leeds family is Birmingham, and I think, was it the Jacobis?
1216
00:52:43.179 --> 00:52:43.480
Yeah.
1217
00:52:43.500 --> 00:52:44.920
Which one? Is Leeds the one we actually see in
1218
00:52:44.940 --> 00:52:46.880
the beginning? Or are we, like, that's the crime scene?
1219
00:52:46.900 --> 00:52:48.079
Jacobi's the second one.
1220
00:52:48.179 --> 00:52:49.260
Okay, so Jacobi's the second one, okay.
1221
00:52:49.280 --> 00:52:49.539
Yeah.
1222
00:52:49.840 --> 00:52:52.159
So he goes to Birmingham, and he somehow figures out
1223
00:52:52.639 --> 00:52:56.159
that the Tooth Fairy was watching them from a tree.
1224
00:52:57.420 --> 00:52:58.420
No, wait, that's Jacobi.
1225
00:52:58.820 --> 00:53:01.360
That's the Jacobis? Yeah. Okay, so that's Birmingham.
1226
00:53:02.090 --> 00:53:02.949
Okay.
1227
00:53:03.110 --> 00:53:07.510
Leeds is first. Leeds is Baltimore. So the Leeds, I believe,
1228
00:53:07.789 --> 00:53:12.250
chronologically in the movie, is shown first, but happens second.
1229
00:53:12.369 --> 00:53:13.860
Okay, gotcha. It would make sense.
1230
00:53:13.920 --> 00:53:16.099
You know what I mean? Yeah, I gotcha. So he
1231
00:53:16.179 --> 00:53:19.139
goes to Birmingham, he goes in their yard, he climbs
1232
00:53:19.199 --> 00:53:22.099
a tree, and he's like, Tooth Fairy was in this tree,
1233
00:53:22.219 --> 00:53:24.610
and then he sees this kanji symbol.
1234
00:53:25.239 --> 00:53:25.699
Mm-hmm.
1235
00:53:25.760 --> 00:53:26.800
That's, like, carved in the tree.
1236
00:53:26.820 --> 00:53:31.820
Mm-hmm. Kevin also had a lot of feedback about that.
1237
00:53:31.840 --> 00:53:33.699
He was like, that's a pretty lucky find.
1238
00:53:33.719 --> 00:53:34.460
I agree.
1239
00:53:34.780 --> 00:53:35.400
He's in the woods.
1240
00:53:35.420 --> 00:53:36.079
Also, beautiful carving.
1241
00:53:37.159 --> 00:53:39.059
Yeah, the carving was, like, too good.
1242
00:53:39.079 --> 00:53:41.409
Dad, there's a nude man with, like, a lot of
1243
00:53:41.429 --> 00:53:44.829
tattoos in the tree up there hunched over.
1244
00:53:45.369 --> 00:53:46.150
That would be very scary.
1245
00:53:46.170 --> 00:53:47.750
I just need to get the carving right.
1246
00:53:48.070 --> 00:53:48.269
Yeah.
1247
00:53:48.289 --> 00:53:48.789
It's like, yeah.
1248
00:53:49.269 --> 00:53:51.690
Well, he finds a soda can lid thingy, right?
1249
00:53:51.710 --> 00:53:51.789
Yes.
1250
00:53:51.989 --> 00:53:55.190
And then he looks... He decides to climb the tree?
1251
00:53:55.690 --> 00:53:55.929
Yes.
1252
00:53:56.809 --> 00:54:00.690
And then he finds the dragon carving in the tree.
1253
00:54:01.110 --> 00:54:04.530
Then we are introduced to my favorite character in the movie, Dee.
1254
00:54:05.880 --> 00:54:08.219
Like many movies with this actor, this movie goes up
1255
00:54:08.239 --> 00:54:10.449
about 75 points because this person shows up.
1256
00:54:11.460 --> 00:54:12.619
So, he is played by?
1257
00:54:12.639 --> 00:54:13.599
Ralph Fiennes.
1258
00:54:13.940 --> 00:54:18.480
Ralph Fiennes plays the Tooth Fairy, who is named Frances Dollarhyde.
1259
00:54:19.119 --> 00:54:22.739
And I wrote... So, like, for me, you know some people...
1260
00:54:23.409 --> 00:54:26.909
I don't think it's funny, but if somebody slips and falls,
1261
00:54:27.150 --> 00:54:29.570
a lot of people burst out laughing. Some people I
1262
00:54:29.630 --> 00:54:32.309
know love puking. If you see a person puke, you
1263
00:54:32.670 --> 00:54:37.309
burst out laughing. My thing is seeing someone act completely
1264
00:54:37.429 --> 00:54:42.750
unhinged and irrational is my slipping and falling. I wrote,
1265
00:54:43.639 --> 00:54:48.059
Dollar Hyde, I love him so much. Yikes! He makes
1266
00:54:48.079 --> 00:54:51.980
me laugh this entire movie. Every scene is unintentional comedy
1267
00:54:52.000 --> 00:54:54.900
with Dollar Hyde. And the reason for this is just
1268
00:54:54.960 --> 00:54:58.849
the start. The start to Dollar Hyde. The intro is
1269
00:54:58.909 --> 00:55:04.369
he is aggressively bench pressing while having a flashback of
1270
00:55:04.409 --> 00:55:06.670
his grandmother threatening to cut his penis off.
1271
00:55:07.409 --> 00:55:08.489
Stretch it out.
1272
00:55:08.510 --> 00:55:12.079
So his grandmother, basically the flashback is he peed his pants.
1273
00:55:12.260 --> 00:55:15.099
Well, wait, you need to set the scene because they start,
1274
00:55:15.659 --> 00:55:18.320
they flash to Dollar Hyde for the very first time.
1275
00:55:18.900 --> 00:55:22.050
And you see that it was a former mental hospital, right?
1276
00:55:22.480 --> 00:55:23.380
There's a little plaque.
1277
00:55:23.599 --> 00:55:25.840
Or home of someone. Maybe. Home.
1278
00:55:25.860 --> 00:55:26.619
There's a plaque.
1279
00:55:26.639 --> 00:55:28.909
It's a gothic castle? Yeah, it's a gothic castle.
1280
00:55:28.989 --> 00:55:30.429
I think it's a mental hospital.
1281
00:55:30.449 --> 00:55:31.329
Yeah.
1282
00:55:31.590 --> 00:55:34.889
And then they go down the driveway and you see
1283
00:55:34.949 --> 00:55:37.789
this very decrepit looking old house.
1284
00:55:37.889 --> 00:55:38.070
Yeah.
1285
00:55:38.530 --> 00:55:41.320
And then you go in the house and you can
1286
00:55:41.360 --> 00:55:42.030
hear the voice.
1287
00:55:42.679 --> 00:55:42.880
Yes.
1288
00:55:43.239 --> 00:55:44.920
And then they're going up the stairs.
1289
00:55:44.940 --> 00:55:45.539
Yeah.
1290
00:55:45.559 --> 00:55:51.440
You see like discarded wheelchairs and other like assistive devices.
1291
00:55:51.460 --> 00:55:51.599
Yeah.
1292
00:55:53.000 --> 00:55:54.980
And you hear this voice and you're going up the
1293
00:55:55.059 --> 00:55:58.650
stairs and the home is so run down. And it
1294
00:55:58.730 --> 00:56:03.829
is so scary and creepy in this moment and tense.
1295
00:56:05.489 --> 00:56:09.010
I think it's very well done. And then, Tim, continue.
1296
00:56:09.030 --> 00:56:10.230
They introduce Ralph Fiennes.
1297
00:56:10.489 --> 00:56:13.800
So he is he's having a flashback of his grandmother.
1298
00:56:13.860 --> 00:56:16.880
He peed his pants and his grandmother is threatening to
1299
00:56:16.980 --> 00:56:20.699
cut his penis off. And he is bench pressing, thinking
1300
00:56:20.739 --> 00:56:26.469
of this. And as he's actually making the lift, you know,
1301
00:56:26.510 --> 00:56:28.690
like people would grunt, like, ugh, you know, when you're
1302
00:56:28.710 --> 00:56:32.670
trying to bench press. He's going, no, Grandma. No, Grandma.
1303
00:56:33.289 --> 00:56:38.039
Imagining this. And I'm like, whoa, whoa. This is all
1304
00:56:38.079 --> 00:56:38.940
kinds of red flags.
1305
00:56:39.059 --> 00:56:41.360
Wait, doesn't he have the nylons on his head, too?
1306
00:56:41.719 --> 00:56:42.679
He does. He does.
1307
00:56:42.699 --> 00:56:43.219
That's scary.
1308
00:56:45.190 --> 00:56:47.679
He did say so. That's pretty scary. I thought this
1309
00:56:47.719 --> 00:56:48.179
was insane.
1310
00:56:48.360 --> 00:56:50.320
I never knew this. I texted you guys about this.
1311
00:56:50.699 --> 00:56:52.539
The voice of the grandmother is Ellen Bernstein.
1312
00:56:52.559 --> 00:56:53.340
I can't believe that.
1313
00:56:53.360 --> 00:56:53.719
That's crazy.
1314
00:56:53.739 --> 00:56:56.420
And the voice of young Frances Dollarhide is, do you
1315
00:56:56.440 --> 00:56:59.730
know Alex D. Lins? No. He was in Home Alone 3.
1316
00:56:59.730 --> 00:56:59.989
Yes.
1317
00:57:00.150 --> 00:57:00.889
He was like a kid actor.
1318
00:57:00.929 --> 00:57:01.570
Yes, yes, yes.
1319
00:57:01.590 --> 00:57:02.929
He's the voice of young Dollarhide.
1320
00:57:03.230 --> 00:57:03.730
Yes.
1321
00:57:03.909 --> 00:57:06.230
I wrote, what movie is this in? That's what I've seen.
1322
00:57:06.250 --> 00:57:09.130
That's what I wrote. The music in here is so
1323
00:57:09.190 --> 00:57:12.019
gothic and so weird. I was like, what planet are
1324
00:57:12.039 --> 00:57:12.380
we on?
1325
00:57:12.480 --> 00:57:14.760
It is so, so, so, so, so creepy.
1326
00:57:14.900 --> 00:57:17.260
Ray Fiennes. I'm going to say, Ray Fiennes is 2002,
1327
00:57:17.260 --> 00:57:19.619
and this is insane. A movie called Spider, where he
1328
00:57:19.679 --> 00:57:22.940
pretty much plays Francis Dollar Hyde. A movie called The
1329
00:57:22.980 --> 00:57:25.469
Good Thief I've Not Seen, Red Dragon, and Made in Manhattan.
1330
00:57:26.690 --> 00:57:27.570
I love that.
1331
00:57:27.670 --> 00:57:28.690
No. Oh, yeah, that's right.
1332
00:57:28.710 --> 00:57:30.250
He's the love interest of Jennifer Lopez. Yeah, in the
1333
00:57:30.269 --> 00:57:30.610
same year.
1334
00:57:30.769 --> 00:57:31.389
If only she knew.
1335
00:57:31.690 --> 00:57:35.130
So, again, I always think of this movie with the
1336
00:57:35.309 --> 00:57:38.420
term oysters. Oysters. When I was potty training Cece, I
1337
00:57:38.440 --> 00:57:40.559
thought of this movie. Because this movie is what not
1338
00:57:40.579 --> 00:57:41.619
to do when potty training.
1339
00:57:42.139 --> 00:57:43.360
Yep.
1340
00:57:43.420 --> 00:57:47.119
The shame. Yeah. Shaming your child for having an accident.
1341
00:57:47.469 --> 00:57:49.630
And we should also say that his teeth are fake.
1342
00:57:49.710 --> 00:57:52.710
They're dentures. Yes. The whole thing. And he has different teeth.
1343
00:57:52.869 --> 00:57:55.630
Yeah. He has different teeth. And so there's a thing.
1344
00:57:55.710 --> 00:57:58.730
It's kind of been debunked. But there's a thing called
1345
00:57:58.750 --> 00:58:02.199
the serial killer triarchy. And it's like if you... had
1346
00:58:02.239 --> 00:58:04.860
these three things. It's like guaranteed you're going to be
1347
00:58:04.900 --> 00:58:06.280
a serial killer or something like that.
1348
00:58:06.409 --> 00:58:07.219
Sociopathy.
1349
00:58:07.329 --> 00:58:11.349
Sociopathy. But it was peeing your pants. Bedwetting. Bedwetting when
1350
00:58:11.369 --> 00:58:12.849
you're too old to really do it.
1351
00:58:13.050 --> 00:58:14.010
Okay.
1352
00:58:14.409 --> 00:58:17.789
Starting fires or arson. And then was Harming Animals?
1353
00:58:17.809 --> 00:58:18.929
Yes, Harming Animals.
1354
00:58:18.989 --> 00:58:20.090
I've always heard that.
1355
00:58:20.130 --> 00:58:21.050
I've always heard that.
1356
00:58:21.090 --> 00:58:21.260
Yeah.
1357
00:58:21.280 --> 00:58:23.880
So Gary Ridgway, the Green River Killer, he was a
1358
00:58:23.940 --> 00:58:29.000
big dollar hide. His mother would shame him. So Gary Ridgway,
1359
00:58:29.039 --> 00:58:32.190
who killed like 50 prostitutes, He would pee his pants
1360
00:58:32.210 --> 00:58:34.769
when he was too old and his mother would take him.
1361
00:58:35.230 --> 00:58:37.610
She would parade him around the house going like, Gary
1362
00:58:37.650 --> 00:58:40.030
peed his pants. Gary's a little baby. And then she
1363
00:58:40.050 --> 00:58:43.659
would take Gary into the bathtub, strip him naked and
1364
00:58:43.760 --> 00:58:46.900
scrub his penis aggressively. And you know what? He turned
1365
00:58:46.940 --> 00:58:48.380
out to be a serial killer. No way. Who would
1366
00:58:48.420 --> 00:58:49.179
have ever thought?
1367
00:58:50.449 --> 00:58:54.230
Is there like a weird sexual abuse innuendo with the
1368
00:58:54.269 --> 00:58:54.989
grandmother too?
1369
00:58:55.010 --> 00:58:55.590
Oh, I think so.
1370
00:58:55.630 --> 00:58:57.909
Yeah. I think so. I think so.
1371
00:58:57.929 --> 00:58:58.369
Absolutely.
1372
00:58:58.570 --> 00:59:00.010
And I thought you were going to ask me at
1373
00:59:00.010 --> 00:59:01.969
the beginning, but you didn't. Like, why did I pick
1374
00:59:01.969 --> 00:59:02.440
this movie?
1375
00:59:02.440 --> 00:59:04.010
Oh, yeah. i should well i i just thought there
1376
00:59:04.030 --> 00:59:06.150
was a given it was like cause of silence.
1377
00:59:05.750 --> 00:59:10.110
Well yes but i love psychological thrillers and i love
1378
00:59:10.179 --> 00:59:14.159
movies that are like smart scary and not gratuitous violence
1379
00:59:14.199 --> 00:59:17.519
and gore and i think this like silence of the
1380
00:59:17.539 --> 00:59:22.219
lambs as crazy as this may sound it's not that
1381
00:59:22.619 --> 00:59:24.280
gory or violence silence of the.
1382
00:59:24.159 --> 00:59:26.039
Lambs is way more gory than this.
1383
00:59:26.260 --> 00:59:30.789
Like this one is still incredibly scary but you don't
1384
00:59:30.829 --> 00:59:32.519
even see the violence.
1385
00:59:32.840 --> 00:59:33.500
It's the intention.
1386
00:59:33.880 --> 00:59:38.380
Yes, yes. I think Silence of the Lambs is definitely worse.
1387
00:59:38.699 --> 00:59:41.980
When Lecter escapes from prison, that whole scene is horrifying. Yes, yes.
1388
00:59:42.059 --> 00:59:43.760
And this movie doesn't really have that.
1389
00:59:44.139 --> 00:59:45.099
It doesn't actually go that far.
1390
00:59:45.119 --> 00:59:47.030
When they were going up the stairs in this movie
1391
00:59:47.070 --> 00:59:50.190
before you see Ralph Fiennes for the first time, I
1392
00:59:50.210 --> 00:59:51.789
was so scared and tense.
1393
00:59:52.130 --> 00:59:54.110
Yeah, I was relieved.
1394
00:59:54.650 --> 00:59:55.650
Felt at home? I felt at home.
1395
00:59:55.869 --> 01:00:00.039
I felt at home. It's like looking in a mirror.
1396
01:00:01.119 --> 01:00:01.760
Which he actually does.
1397
01:00:02.079 --> 01:00:03.619
And also, he plays Voldemort.
1398
01:00:04.159 --> 01:00:04.760
He does.
1399
01:00:04.780 --> 01:00:05.659
So he's a good bad guy.
1400
01:00:05.679 --> 01:00:10.500
He also plays Eamon Goath, my favorite sociopath of all time.
1401
01:00:10.760 --> 01:00:13.820
So if I had my Mount Rushmore of movie villains,
1402
01:00:14.300 --> 01:00:18.409
it would be Heath Ledger's The Joker, Bill the Butcher,
1403
01:00:18.510 --> 01:00:21.690
Daniel Day-Lewis. I think Eamon Goath, Ralph Fiennes would be
1404
01:00:21.750 --> 01:00:24.170
on there. Eamon Goath is a fucking monster.
1405
01:00:24.210 --> 01:00:24.889
What is that from?
1406
01:00:25.269 --> 01:00:26.030
Schindler's List.
1407
01:00:26.349 --> 01:00:26.809
Oh, yes.
1408
01:00:26.889 --> 01:00:27.170
Okay.
1409
01:00:27.780 --> 01:00:30.059
The famous line, the Nazis hung him.
1410
01:00:30.800 --> 01:00:35.030
Yeah, he was so bad, the Nazis put him to death.
1411
01:00:36.050 --> 01:00:38.090
Ray Fiennes is the definition of, even to this day,
1412
01:00:38.650 --> 01:00:40.639
any movie, when he shows up, the movie just goes up.
1413
01:00:40.829 --> 01:00:42.130
He's such a good actor.
1414
01:00:42.429 --> 01:00:44.570
It's amazing because, like you said, he played Voldemort and
1415
01:00:44.590 --> 01:00:49.130
did an incredible job with that. He appears in 28
1416
01:00:49.130 --> 01:00:51.710
years later, and when he shows up, I'm kind of like, well,
1417
01:00:52.250 --> 01:00:54.139
this is going to go bad for them if he's here.
1418
01:00:54.530 --> 01:00:57.090
And he's actually this wonderfully kind, loving person. You kind
1419
01:00:57.110 --> 01:00:58.650
of just don't believe it the whole movie.
1420
01:00:58.710 --> 01:00:59.670
Yeah.
1421
01:00:59.769 --> 01:01:02.570
But he's always, he's never going to be bad at anything.
1422
01:01:03.219 --> 01:01:07.920
So he, Dollar Hyde, the Tooth Fairy, checks his diary. Ryan,
1423
01:01:07.960 --> 01:01:09.039
how would you describe his diary?
1424
01:01:09.639 --> 01:01:13.300
This is a lot. This diary is the size of
1425
01:01:13.360 --> 01:01:17.099
a cinder block. It's huge. And he's furiously, he can
1426
01:01:17.139 --> 01:01:20.380
buy glue, glue sticking an article that's an article that's
1427
01:01:20.480 --> 01:01:22.599
a photo of Will on the crime scene.
1428
01:01:22.780 --> 01:01:23.000
Yes.
1429
01:01:23.019 --> 01:01:25.539
So people are snooping on it. And then we, I think,
1430
01:01:25.619 --> 01:01:27.940
is it the first page is Behold the Great Red Dragon?
1431
01:01:28.280 --> 01:01:30.219
Behold a Great Red Dragon is the first page?
1432
01:01:30.480 --> 01:01:30.760
Yes.
1433
01:01:30.780 --> 01:01:31.440
It's a text book.
1434
01:01:31.599 --> 01:01:31.880
Yes.
1435
01:01:32.119 --> 01:01:33.199
And it's the picture of the painting.
1436
01:01:33.489 --> 01:01:37.469
Yes. The painting of the Red Dragon, which is, we'll
1437
01:01:37.489 --> 01:01:41.469
get into it later, but it's a famous painting that
1438
01:01:41.530 --> 01:01:42.329
exists in real life.
1439
01:01:42.409 --> 01:01:43.590
Yes. Well.
1440
01:01:44.510 --> 01:01:46.590
Not anymore. Not anymore. Let's go get into it.
1441
01:01:47.929 --> 01:01:49.250
And wait, sorry, I have a note that it was
1442
01:01:49.289 --> 01:01:49.949
a nursing home.
1443
01:01:50.440 --> 01:01:52.239
It was a nursing home.
1444
01:01:52.340 --> 01:01:53.449
It wasn't a psych hospital.
1445
01:01:53.530 --> 01:01:55.269
That's what I thought, but I didn't want to be like, no,
1446
01:01:55.289 --> 01:02:05.309
it's a nursing home. So Will is walking around the...
1447
01:02:04.210 --> 01:02:04.869
What is he doing now?
1448
01:02:05.150 --> 01:02:09.250
Will goes back to the hospital and he's walking in
1449
01:02:09.309 --> 01:02:13.239
that room and you see Lecter approach him. Yes. And
1450
01:02:13.260 --> 01:02:15.360
then you realize Lecter is on some kind of leash.
1451
01:02:15.900 --> 01:02:16.679
Oh, yes.
1452
01:02:16.880 --> 01:02:19.099
Oh, yeah. I wrote, this setup is insane and I
1453
01:02:19.099 --> 01:02:21.340
didn't know what I was referring to. Lecter has an
1454
01:02:21.559 --> 01:02:23.860
exercise room that's like a gymnasium.
1455
01:02:23.960 --> 01:02:24.619
Like a track.
1456
01:02:25.219 --> 01:02:28.159
But he has this leash on him and he's allowed
1457
01:02:28.199 --> 01:02:29.260
to walk in this circle.
1458
01:02:29.539 --> 01:02:29.840
Yes.
1459
01:02:30.420 --> 01:02:32.820
And there's like a big painted on the ground like
1460
01:02:32.929 --> 01:02:35.550
yellow circle and it says do not step beyond this point.
1461
01:02:36.190 --> 01:02:36.329
Yeah.
1462
01:02:36.369 --> 01:02:39.789
Like Lecter is basically like I don't even know how
1463
01:02:39.809 --> 01:02:41.869
to describe it. Just he's so dangerous.
1464
01:02:42.489 --> 01:02:45.469
So here was my thing. I know this is probably
1465
01:02:45.489 --> 01:02:48.269
going way back. Wait did we do Bruce crawling out
1466
01:02:48.309 --> 01:02:49.239
of the hole yet?
1467
01:02:50.170 --> 01:02:52.429
Bruce crawling out of the hole? At the end. Oh,
1468
01:02:52.630 --> 01:02:55.199
we're talking about... Ryan's making fun of himself because he
1469
01:02:55.219 --> 01:02:56.920
kept asking that during the Dark Knight Rises.
1470
01:02:56.940 --> 01:02:57.659
Too annihilated.
1471
01:02:57.820 --> 01:02:58.119
Yeah.
1472
01:02:58.340 --> 01:02:59.219
Here's my theory of this movie.
1473
01:02:59.239 --> 01:02:59.679
That's okay.
1474
01:02:59.719 --> 01:03:01.840
Getting to this point. So this is 45 minutes into
1475
01:03:01.860 --> 01:03:05.719
the movie. We see Lecter before when he first visits
1476
01:03:05.760 --> 01:03:10.050
him at the hospital 30 minutes in. I think... I
1477
01:03:10.070 --> 01:03:12.750
know you guys love that scene. Don't have the opening
1478
01:03:12.769 --> 01:03:17.269
scene with Will and Lecter. Don't have it. You just
1479
01:03:17.289 --> 01:03:20.369
have the scene. Open the movie with Crawford... Maybe someone
1480
01:03:20.389 --> 01:03:23.110
a little bit more awake playing Crawford. Yeah. Talking to
1481
01:03:23.130 --> 01:03:25.429
Will about doing the crime scene. Have the opening credits
1482
01:03:25.449 --> 01:03:28.000
where they tell you all this shit went bad. All
1483
01:03:28.039 --> 01:03:30.940
this shit went nowhere. You as a viewer have no
1484
01:03:31.039 --> 01:03:33.780
clue what truly happened in terms of details.
1485
01:03:33.800 --> 01:03:34.719
You're talking about Manhunter, right?
1486
01:03:35.469 --> 01:03:37.510
No, I'm saying with this movie. Just picture this movie
1487
01:03:37.530 --> 01:03:38.869
this way. Oh, okay.
1488
01:03:38.929 --> 01:03:40.590
He's rewriting the script.
1489
01:03:40.630 --> 01:03:41.969
What you're describing is Manhunter.
1490
01:03:42.150 --> 01:03:45.889
Well, Manhunter doesn't... care about lector he is a function
1491
01:03:45.929 --> 01:03:48.179
of their story yes he is not like a character
1492
01:03:48.340 --> 01:03:51.380
yes we as audiences are dying to see anthony hopkins
1493
01:03:51.420 --> 01:03:55.159
play yes so i think what they should do in
1494
01:03:55.199 --> 01:03:57.880
my opinion was like this was like i feel like
1495
01:03:57.900 --> 01:04:00.659
we see lector after the crime too quickly and it
1496
01:04:00.699 --> 01:04:02.599
doesn't have to build up because the genius of the
1497
01:04:02.639 --> 01:04:05.239
build-up in silence of lambs was like why is he
1498
01:04:05.300 --> 01:04:08.219
so calm why is he so in control yeah and
1499
01:04:08.239 --> 01:04:09.889
you're not used to it in this movie he's a
1500
01:04:09.929 --> 01:04:13.530
little too evil and i get why i thought If
1501
01:04:13.570 --> 01:04:17.250
you didn't see the first attack, you only saw Lecter,
1502
01:04:17.369 --> 01:04:19.809
you didn't have the first scene where he meets him
1503
01:04:19.829 --> 01:04:23.349
in the cell, then this is the first time Will
1504
01:04:23.409 --> 01:04:26.170
is allowed to go see him. And Crawford treats this like,
1505
01:04:26.289 --> 01:04:28.829
as a last resort, we should ask Lecter for help.
1506
01:04:29.329 --> 01:04:31.030
And then you see him here, and they have the
1507
01:04:31.090 --> 01:04:34.070
conversation from the first scene in the cell. I'm like,
1508
01:04:34.500 --> 01:04:37.480
that would be like, oh, fuck, this is bad news.
1509
01:04:37.980 --> 01:04:41.139
And this would have a much better buildup. So I'm
1510
01:04:41.179 --> 01:04:43.780
re-editing it. I'm calling it the Ryan Cut. It's coming
1511
01:04:43.860 --> 01:04:44.980
out on YouTube next week.
1512
01:04:45.159 --> 01:04:46.280
That's so exciting, Ryan.
1513
01:04:46.300 --> 01:04:47.159
Congratulations.
1514
01:04:47.219 --> 01:04:47.599
Thank you.
1515
01:04:48.000 --> 01:04:49.420
If some butts were candy and nuts.
1516
01:04:50.139 --> 01:04:52.260
You're right. I just think, to me, it kind of
1517
01:04:52.280 --> 01:04:53.880
deflates the balloon of the movie. But then again, I
1518
01:04:53.920 --> 01:04:55.929
get it. People came here to see Hannibal Lecter, so
1519
01:04:55.949 --> 01:04:57.260
they put him in as much as they possibly could.
1520
01:04:57.969 --> 01:05:01.789
So I think that a good line here is, Will
1521
01:05:01.809 --> 01:05:04.710
was like, why did he make all these mistakes in Birmingham?
1522
01:05:04.750 --> 01:05:07.909
It doesn't make sense. He's so meticulous. He's this genius
1523
01:05:07.929 --> 01:05:10.869
serial killer. And Lecter said, says it was his first time.
1524
01:05:10.889 --> 01:05:13.110
He was sloppy. People are sloppy their first time. They
1525
01:05:13.130 --> 01:05:18.010
don't know what they're doing. And Barney's back. So Barney's there.
1526
01:05:18.030 --> 01:05:21.039
What do you think of the hiss? The Lecter hiss?
1527
01:05:22.360 --> 01:05:23.619
When he gives Will a good scare. What do you
1528
01:05:23.639 --> 01:05:24.019
think of that?
1529
01:05:24.159 --> 01:05:26.179
Well, he did that when Tim said that.
1530
01:05:26.199 --> 01:05:28.880
When he stabbed him. Yeah. That's pretty creepy.
1531
01:05:28.900 --> 01:05:29.719
You're getting sloppy too.
1532
01:05:29.980 --> 01:05:31.519
It's like Ric Flair going, woo!
1533
01:05:32.889 --> 01:05:35.190
I would love if Lecter was doing the woo's.
1534
01:05:36.190 --> 01:05:36.530
Whoa.
1535
01:05:36.650 --> 01:05:38.670
I would not want to be on a receiving end
1536
01:05:38.710 --> 01:05:40.469
of a hiss. A hint of a Lecter hiss.
1537
01:05:40.969 --> 01:05:43.869
No. Or anybody's hiss, really. I don't like being hissed at.
1538
01:05:43.889 --> 01:05:46.510
Yeah.
1539
01:05:46.610 --> 01:05:50.820
But, okay. Lecter then says he needs to make a call.
1540
01:05:50.840 --> 01:05:53.960
My note is, Barney looking great! Exclamation point. That's what
1541
01:05:53.980 --> 01:05:55.000
it says. That's all it says.
1542
01:05:56.159 --> 01:05:58.440
I have a problem with this. So, like, they give
1543
01:05:58.500 --> 01:05:59.199
Lecter a phone.
1544
01:05:59.280 --> 01:06:01.239
I have a major problem with this, too, Tim.
1545
01:06:01.360 --> 01:06:03.800
And they're not allowed to listen because he's calling his attorney.
1546
01:06:04.139 --> 01:06:04.320
Yuck.
1547
01:06:04.929 --> 01:06:08.230
But he actually uses the opportunity to call the FBI
1548
01:06:08.309 --> 01:06:10.010
office and get Will's home address.
1549
01:06:10.130 --> 01:06:13.510
So could, I'm guessing the technology was that older phones,
1550
01:06:14.050 --> 01:06:16.809
if you press the dials, you could redial the last number.
1551
01:06:17.269 --> 01:06:18.110
That was my impression.
1552
01:06:18.349 --> 01:06:19.929
Yeah, I was wondering about that. Like, how did they
1553
01:06:19.949 --> 01:06:20.150
do that?
1554
01:06:20.170 --> 01:06:21.239
Because they do it in Manhunter, too.
1555
01:06:21.260 --> 01:06:22.889
Like, he's able to figure out, like, how you redial.
1556
01:06:22.909 --> 01:06:24.070
Because this is the early 80s.
1557
01:06:24.159 --> 01:06:26.719
Yes. I don't know if that's true.
1558
01:06:26.780 --> 01:06:30.539
He gets some secretary, and he's like, hi, I'm Professor so-and-so.
1559
01:06:30.559 --> 01:06:33.119
I'm supposed to send Will Graham, like, this information.
1560
01:06:33.139 --> 01:06:33.500
A gift.
1561
01:06:34.110 --> 01:06:35.989
And she's like, oh, I'm not allowed to give it out.
1562
01:06:36.469 --> 01:06:40.670
And he's like, oh, I'm so sorry. And he convinces her.
1563
01:06:41.309 --> 01:06:41.949
It's like this young.
1564
01:06:42.110 --> 01:06:42.769
So stupid.
1565
01:06:42.789 --> 01:06:45.329
Would you have rather he'd done the Manhunter version where
1566
01:06:45.409 --> 01:06:48.360
Brian Cox does an impression of a southern belle?
1567
01:06:49.360 --> 01:06:51.579
I do declare I need this phone number.
1568
01:06:51.619 --> 01:06:52.440
It's like, it's insane.
1569
01:06:52.659 --> 01:06:55.280
Yeah, I mean, it probably is what happens in the book.
1570
01:06:55.320 --> 01:06:56.019
I haven't read the book.
1571
01:06:56.460 --> 01:06:58.519
Yeah.
1572
01:06:58.679 --> 01:07:01.519
So he gets Will's... He doesn't get Will's home address
1573
01:07:01.599 --> 01:07:04.800
because Will's not that stupid... The woman says Will doesn't
1574
01:07:04.820 --> 01:07:07.920
have a home address listed, but he has a P.O. box,
1575
01:07:07.980 --> 01:07:10.300
which is in Marathon, Florida.
1576
01:07:10.460 --> 01:07:14.480
You've got to train these admins better.
1577
01:07:15.599 --> 01:07:19.110
Yeah, exactly. I think so. Now I think that we
1578
01:07:19.550 --> 01:07:22.230
are going to be introduced at this point to a
1579
01:07:23.489 --> 01:07:27.969
blind person. And I have my thoughts on that, on them.
1580
01:07:28.769 --> 01:07:30.690
But I think we should bring this to a part two.
1581
01:07:30.710 --> 01:07:30.829
Sure.
1582
01:07:31.690 --> 01:07:34.400
And we can talk about We can talk about a
1583
01:07:34.460 --> 01:07:35.820
beautiful romance.
1584
01:07:37.719 --> 01:07:38.420
The love story.
1585
01:07:38.480 --> 01:07:42.269
What could have been. We can talk about how hot
1586
01:07:42.289 --> 01:07:45.929
and sexy tiger dates are. And Manhunter does have a
1587
01:07:45.949 --> 01:07:46.409
tiger date.
1588
01:07:46.929 --> 01:07:51.230
Tiger King? Do they have a tiger date too? In Manhunter?
1589
01:07:51.250 --> 01:07:54.050
They have a tiger date in Manhunter. They absolutely have one.
1590
01:07:54.070 --> 01:07:54.250
Yeah.
1591
01:07:54.269 --> 01:07:56.489
Raise your hand if you haven't had a tiger date.
1592
01:07:56.510 --> 01:08:00.619
I have not had a tiger date. Explains a lot. Um.
1593
01:08:01.250 --> 01:08:03.179
But okay, all right, thank you for listening, and we
1594
01:08:03.239 --> 01:08:04.260
will see you in part two.