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Consider One Another is a podcast focused on each other.
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Thank you for tuning in to this podcast that is all about stirring up love and good works in one another.
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Hello everyone, and thank you for tuning in once again to the Consider One Another podcast.
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This will be the last solo episode of season three, as this is now officially the month of October, the first Friday of every month.
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I like to put out something that I have been considering, and hopefully you enjoy these episodes.
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I really enjoy them, and I have gotten a lot of really good feedback on most of them.
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So hopefully you enjoy these devotional type podcasts.
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Today we're considering podcasts.
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It feels kind of meta, but I'm excited to share it with you.
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We're officially in fall now, which is exciting.
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It's postseason baseball, or as Mariners fans call it, the off-season.
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For Dodgers fans, everything is right in the world.
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It's gray skies out today, but I'm liking it.
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It feels like a calm is upon us and we can rest a little bit more after the busyness of summer.
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We should have three more interview episodes after this, which I'm excited about.
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And of course, that's what the people love about the podcast.
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The people love it for the people and the interviews.
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That's the point of the Consider One Another podcast.
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And I've had so much fun with these interviews.
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But these solo, more devotional episodes have been fun for me, and I'm especially excited about this one because as we wrap up season three, I was considering all the things that I have learned from these interviews and podcasting.
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When I started podcasting a couple years ago now, I didn't know what I was doing.
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I was just kind of making it up as I went on an idea that I thought was fun.
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And now as I have pursued that idea for a lot of episodes now, I should have counted them.
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Probably close to about 75 podcasts now.
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I've learned so much, especially from these interviews, not just about podcasting, but way more importantly than that, I've learned a lot about life and connecting with people and some skills that I was really falling short in that I've had to learn from the hard way.
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So I want to share with you guys what I've learned and how that can really transform our interpersonal relationships.
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In this episode, we are considering podcasts.
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Please consider this meta idea with me.
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But first, before we get into these three life lessons from podcasting, we're gonna jump into scripture.
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And because we're talking about the podcast itself, we gotta go to the title track.
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Read with me Hebrews 10, starting in verse 19.
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Of course, the podcast comes from verse 24, but let's get the context.
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Hebrews 10, verse 19.
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Therefore, brethren, having boldness to enter the holiest by the blood of Jesus, by a new and living way which He consecrated for us through the veil, that is his flesh, and having a high priest over the house of God, let us draw near with a true heart, in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
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Let us hold fast the confession of our hope, without wavering, for he who promised his faithful.
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Verse twenty four, and let us consider one another in order to stir up love and good works, not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some, but exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the day approaching.
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That again is the title track, so I thought it would be a good place to leave season three.
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It's a verse that we all love so much.
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We've got our consider one another break built into our services, and now we have this consider one another podcast because the image of this verse is so encouraging to me.
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It reminds me of my role and the reason why we show up to services.
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So often Hebrews 10.25 was cited to me without any context, but rather just a rule and a command that you have to show up at 9.30.
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I don't really understand why, but that was just a rule, and so it felt more like a threat than an opportunity.
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But when we learn the opportunity that exists by coming to services becomes one we don't want to miss out on.
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I don't want to miss the assembling because I don't want to miss out on being encouraged.
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I don't want to miss out on the opportunity to consider my brothers and sisters.
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That's the point of the podcast.
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The point of the podcast gives us another way to consider one another.
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There's lots of ways we can do that by coming to the assembly, by writing cards, by reaching out to people.
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This podcast became a new way for me to consider brothers and sisters.
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And in my work where I get so many opportunities to have spiritual conversations with you guys at 2 o'clock on a Tuesday, or more likely 6 30 on a Monday, I wanted to share that and put it in a way that it could be absorbed and appreciated by all of you.
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And you guys have reached out to me in so many kind ways to let me know that this has been encouraging to you.
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So thank you.
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Thank you for encouraging me in this process that I hope would be encouraging, and I think it really has been.
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Having a podcast dedicated to people and truly considering them has really helped me, I think, become a better person.
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Before getting into our three points, I will vulnerably share this.
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My goal for starting this podcast was not so that I would learn these things and become a better person.
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That's really not why I started it, unfortunately.
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Instead, I was honestly just trying to make as good of a podcast as possible.
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That's what I wanted to do.
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And I'm still learning lots about podcasting.
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But what I have learned about considering others has been far more valuable than the podcast itself.
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I want to share a couple of funny things that I have learned, and then we'll get to the serious ones.
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Before we get to the funny ones, let me share one danger of the podcast that I do want to caution you to.
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When I originally came up with this idea, again years ago, I remember talking to a mentor about the idea.
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And I think I'd said this to a couple of you guys before, but when I originally wanted to start a podcast, everyone who I asked about it told me not to.
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My father-in-law told me, Will, I think there are enough podcasts in the world.
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And I said, Thank you for that.
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But I went on anyway, and I found what I thought would be encouraging.
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Not just devotional episodes like this one, but the interviews and the considering of people and bringing out people's stories so that we can have more spiritual conversations with each other.
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That's the direction I went.
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And when I ran that idea by another mentor, a person cautioned me of this.
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Said, Will, I want to make sure that people of a congregation do not use virtual ways of learning about people to replace their actual connecting with people.
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Meaning, if we never show up to services, it's okay because I don't have to learn from a person directly to know their story.
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I can just hear their podcast episode and feel like I'm connected to a group.
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This mentor was worried about artificial connections, or rather surface-level connections that aren't real but are just consumed.
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I thought that was a little bit harsh at the time when I heard it, but I can imagine how it has been true for some of us.
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Rather than making the connections ourselves, it becomes easy because there's a podcast for that, and if I just listen for 30 minutes a week, now I've got the mandated connection time.
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Hopefully that's not at all what you have done with the podcast, but it is tempting for all of us to do.
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So I want to caution us of that.
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Let's not just use these remote ways of learning about each other like fun facts, but rather use it as a launching point to connect and really consider each other in person.
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That's really important.
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Don't just hear about the person, learn about them so that you can connect with them personally, one-on-one.
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That's something that I have learned so far.
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Not one of our main three takeaways, but I wanted to caution us about it.
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Don't just learn facts about a person.
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Let's go consider each other in person, launching from the podcast into personal conversations.
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Some funny things that I've learned, the value of blooper reels.
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I put in a blooper reel early on when something funny happened, just to see if people actually listened to the end of the podcast.
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And I would know that you did by you commenting on the blooper that happened.
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That's what I call it.
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Some sort of out-of-the-ordinary funny thing that doesn't belong in the final cut.
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I just put that at the end of the podcast, and people would laugh at them and say, hey, that was a funny thing that happened.
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One time I didn't put the blooper reel in, and I was sure to find out that Debbie McVicker was not happy about this.
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She would say, Great podcast, but where was the blooper reel?
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Uh so people love the funny things.
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Hopefully it just showed a bit of transparency and uh human interaction.
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This isn't meant to be some grand production, it's just meant to be conversation that can be heard via Spotify or wherever you listen to podcasts.
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So there's value in the funny blooper reels.
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One more funny thing was I learned a lot about people's and my own nervous sayings.
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I would do my best to delete the sayings that would keep coming up.
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But as I edit these podcasts, I get a little transcript of the words that are said, and so I can see exactly how many times someone said a certain phrase or a certain word.
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All of us have these nervous words that we use when we don't know what to say.
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For some people it was you know, and with any sort of pause in their thought progression, they would add in a you know or a type thing.
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It'd say, you know, that type thing.
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They'd add it to every single ending of a sentence or every beginning.
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Some people would start with I mean, or a well.
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Those sort of nervous habits really came out in the podcast, and I would delete them.
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But I found it interesting that we would really go back to so many of our nervous habits.
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For me, hopefully as a speaker, I've learned what my own are and I've gotten rid of them.
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It's really hard to listen to yourself.
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Maybe for those who've been on the podcast, you've listened to yourself and kind of cringed a little bit.
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We don't like the sound of our own voices, but it's helped me a lot learn about my nervous ticks, the phrases that I need to stop using so much, and the words that I can use to be more encouraging, less filler words, and more constructive words.
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There's a lot of value we can get from just learning from these podcasts.
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At least for me, the biggest lessons I learned was by editing the podcasts and going back and listening to my own voice, listening to my own interrupting and things that I did wrong that I should have done differently.
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Going back and editing really taught me a lot about myself and the lessons that I want to bring out today.
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So here they are, three of them.
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The first one is this the value of listening.
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Sometimes we like talking to people more for the talking part than the listening part.
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For a podcast, it seemed to me like there would have to be a lot of talking on my end to make the best episode possible.
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What I ended up learning was the best episodes are the ones where I did the most listening.
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I'll give us a podcast example and then a real life example.
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When I started this podcast back in Florida, I remember listening to an episode with my wife, as one of the first ones that came out, that I was really proud of.
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But then she rightly explained during the podcast that I need to let the person that I am talking to make the points that I was making.
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In the episode, my buddy Brian, shout out Brian, was making a really good point that I apparently had something that I wanted to talk about.
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So as he was making his point in my own preacher way, I kindly took the ball and then ran with his point, saying all the things that I thought would be good to say.
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And I remember when my wife told me this, that I should have let him make that point that I thought was so good instead of taking it myself, I was not very happy about it.
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I just wanted her to pat me on the back for the good thing that I thought that I said.
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Instead, it didn't really matter what I said, because I should have been listening.
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And I'm sure I continue to do this, it's not like I've fixed it by just one podcast, but at least now I know it is something that I should be working on.
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Whoever you are, you should be working on your listening.
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Go read the book of Proverbs.
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It won't take you very long.
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A couple chapters a day, and you'll have it done in a month, but you will find in that month most of the book is about the value of talking less.
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So much throughout the book will be about talking less.
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Here's one good example.
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It's Proverbs 18, 13.
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He who gives an answer before he hears, it is folly and shame to him.
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Next time you're having a conversation with someone, ask yourself if you are there to talk or to listen.
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Even if you are the one initiating the conversation, people can tell if your motivation is to talk more than to listen.
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Go listen more.
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It happened to me once as a kid at camp.
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A counselor had learned that I really like baseball.
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So he asked me, he said, Hey Will, uh have you ever thrown a no-hitter?
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Which to me was a crazy specific question to ask that I was really excited to answer.
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Because that season I was like two outs away one time from throwing a no-hitter.
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And so I told him that really excitedly.
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And he goes, Oh I have which clearly showed his intention for asking me this question was not to learn about me or to really wonder if I had ever thrown a no-hitter.
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Rather, the question, the initiation, the whole conversation was to tell me about something he was proud about.
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Even if you're the one initiating and asking the questions, it'll come out later if your motivation was to talk about yourself.
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My encouragement from having to listen to myself so many times, so many times I'm listening to myself as I edit these podcasts, I'm listening to myself listen to other people.
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So many times I've heard myself cut others off, interrupt, or talk about what I wanted to say in the first place.
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Please learn from this long process of years of episodes and editing.
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Whoever you are, no matter how good you think you are at listening, go listen more.
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Please.
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And when you do use your words, use them to dig deeper.
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Point number one, there's value in listening more.
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Point number two, I learned the value of digging deeper.
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Something I learned by interviewing so many people, then going back and editing and having to listen through these conversations, is that the second thing someone has to say is often much more honest and vulnerable than the first thing that they say.
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I would have a question written out that I'd give someone in advance, and I felt like that question was good enough to uncover what I was hoping they would say.
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But they would often not get deeper until I dug deeper or just listened longer.
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Oftentimes I'd want someone to just share and be vulnerable and share the story or the struggle right off the bat because I asked a broad enough question.
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But people I learned aren't typically like that.
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Even if you encourage them to be vulnerable, right off the bat, people usually are not going to be their most vulnerable.
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If you want to really learn about someone or really understand their struggles, use your words to dig deeper.
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That's not just for the podcast, it translates directly to our everyday conversations.
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Sometimes we know that we need to check in on someone.
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I emphasize this constantly, the value of checking in on people, brothers and sisters.
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And hopefully you're someone who does that.
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Often when I am trying to do just that, that thing that I'm saying we should be doing, I will reach out to someone, like I know I'm supposed to, and I will say, Hey, how are you doing?
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And almost without fail, the person will say something very surface level and basically I'm doing good.
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And then at that I feel like I did my job.
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I know that they weren't at church on Sunday, I know I should reach out to them, so I do.
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I say, hey, is everything okay?
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And they say yes, I am fine.
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And then I say, okay, if they're not doing good, then that's on them because I tried.
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But in reality, whether we're checking in on people or just trying to learn more about them, that's just not how people work.
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People are not usually automatically vulnerable.
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In reality, people do not want to share their vulnerable struggles just from the first question.
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You have to dig deeper before you can honestly expect someone to share something they are struggling with.
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Sometimes this is just by asking a better question or a deeper question.
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If you just ask someone how they are, maybe after that you could ask something deeper, like, is there anything I can be praying about for you?
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They can say I'm doing just fine, and you can take that, but then add on to it.
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Okay, we're all struggling those.
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There's something I can be praying about for you.
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Take the answer that they give you as as generic or as surface level as it may be, and dig deeper.
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Ask a harder question.
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Sometimes though, the digging deep has to come before the conversation itself.
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Again, going back to the podcast, to be able to record episodes with people and have vulnerable conversations required a relationship first.
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I wouldn't even know the right questions to ask someone if I didn't know the person at least a little bit.
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People don't want to be vulnerable with someone who they don't have a relationship with.
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And this required a lot of conversations in the pews, at coffee shops, in people's homes, to then uncover, wow, there is so much here for me to ask about and learn about.
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I think this person will be vulnerable because we have this relationship.
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If your only relationship with a person is texting them, how are they doing, or shaking their hand in the pew, don't blame them when they're not vulnerable with you.
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That's just not how people work.
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Again, this is just evidenced by the hours of podcasts and interviewing that I have done.
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As much as you might want people to be, they're not usually vulnerable right off the bat, especially if they feel uncomfortable or unknown.
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Make the person feel known first, have a relationship with them, then start uncovering some of the struggles, some of the vulnerable things that are happening.
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Even then it's going to be hard to uncover what's going on for a person.
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Start first with a relationship, then dig deeper.
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Make relationships with people, show them that you're interested in who they are, not just going to them because you've got something you want to say or you want to see them more at church.
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Instead, start with a relationship and then dig deeper.
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When you dig in these deeper ways, you will usually get somewhat further.
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Dig deeper with people you are trying to connect with and consider.
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Don't expect people's outer layer to be their most vulnerable.
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Find people in other contexts.
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Invite them into your home, invite them out to coffee.
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Don't just assume this person is fine because they are not emotionally vulnerable with you in the pews.
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Dig deeper.
00:19:05.279 --> 00:19:15.279
If I can add on to this point quickly, even when someone is talking with you, maybe you have gotten past that first outer layer of vulnerability and we're getting somewhere deeper now.
00:19:15.519 --> 00:19:22.960
Something I've learned through podcasting is a lot of times we don't fully understand what someone is saying the first time.
00:19:23.279 --> 00:19:26.000
Here's the podcast example before the application.
00:19:26.160 --> 00:19:32.880
Going back and editing a podcast is when I would usually learn about what a poor job I did understanding someone.
00:19:33.119 --> 00:19:48.960
I would think that based off someone's sentence that they said, that I understood what they meant and where they were going, and then I would just riff off of that and add on to what I thought they said, only to realize in post that they meant something completely different than what I assumed they meant.
00:19:49.279 --> 00:19:53.200
So then in post I would just delete my comment that had nothing to do with anything.
00:19:53.359 --> 00:19:54.559
But life isn't like that.
00:19:54.799 --> 00:19:59.680
We don't get a chance to see a manuscript or a transcript of all of our conversations.
00:19:59.920 --> 00:20:07.359
Sometimes someone can say something and we can cling on to that, assuming we know what they meant when in reality we're going off of what we think they meant.
00:20:07.599 --> 00:20:15.759
So before you assume you understand what someone is saying and then saying what you want to say about that thing, ask a clarifying question.
00:20:16.000 --> 00:20:20.319
Don't assume too much from tone or something that someone might have misspoke.
00:20:20.480 --> 00:20:22.240
Instead, clarify first.
00:20:22.480 --> 00:20:32.240
Seek to really understand what someone is really meaning and feeling before you take the ball and run with it based on something that you are probably confused about.
00:20:32.480 --> 00:20:40.720
Clarify first and then dig deeper in conversations in your relationships, and you will learn so much more about people.
00:20:41.039 --> 00:20:42.720
Which brings us to our last point.
00:20:42.880 --> 00:20:46.880
Point number three, the value of learning from everyone.
00:20:47.119 --> 00:20:55.920
I even started with this mindset that we could learn from everyone, not just paid speakers or elders or people who usually speak in services.
00:20:56.160 --> 00:20:59.119
The whole point of the podcast was we can learn from everyone.
00:20:59.279 --> 00:21:09.759
But even with that mindset, I was still further impressed the value of learning from everyone and how much there is to learn from people because everyone has a story.
00:21:09.920 --> 00:21:18.400
Sometimes we forget that someone who is serving as an elder ever came out of the world in the first place to give their life to Christ.
00:21:18.640 --> 00:21:24.079
Sometimes someone who is quieter by nature, we assume just doesn't have much to say.
00:21:24.319 --> 00:21:28.240
But they have very valuable things to share as well.
00:21:28.640 --> 00:21:36.559
Consider one another, not just a preacher, not just the one leading the Lord's Supper talk, not just the people who have been on the podcast.
00:21:36.799 --> 00:21:40.079
Consider everyone in our assembly.
00:21:40.319 --> 00:21:46.079
Consider the visitor, consider the new Christian, consider that quiet person on the back row.
00:21:46.319 --> 00:21:50.880
Everyone has a story and everyone has something that we can learn from.
00:21:51.039 --> 00:21:56.000
Don't assume in relationships if you are supposed to be the teacher or the learner.
00:21:56.240 --> 00:22:03.039
Sometimes we make those assumptions just based off of age or Status of what we must be in that relationship.
00:22:03.200 --> 00:22:04.960
Don't assume either way.
00:22:05.359 --> 00:22:11.039
Hopefully, in every relationship and conversation, we should be both teaching and learning.
00:22:11.200 --> 00:22:14.640
Don't assume because of someone's age that you cannot learn from them.
00:22:14.960 --> 00:22:19.680
Don't assume because of someone's newness to the faith that you cannot learn from them.
00:22:19.920 --> 00:22:22.880
And don't make those assumptions about yourself either.
00:22:23.200 --> 00:22:24.880
You have things to share.
00:22:25.119 --> 00:22:27.039
You have stories to offer.
00:22:27.279 --> 00:22:28.960
We can learn from you.
00:22:29.440 --> 00:22:34.640
It's hard to if if we're not present in the assembly, like Hebrews 10 25 says.
00:22:34.799 --> 00:22:40.240
It's hard to if we're showing up just to squeak out by the Amen at the last prayer.
00:22:40.400 --> 00:22:41.200
Don't do that.
00:22:41.359 --> 00:22:43.759
Give us a chance to consider you and learn from you.
00:22:43.920 --> 00:22:53.920
And on the flip side, if if someone is tired of being preached to and just is showing up so people can talk to them, you can understand why someone might just be ready to leave right at the Amen.
00:22:54.240 --> 00:22:58.799
Instead give someone that chance to share their story, to learn from them.
00:22:59.119 --> 00:23:06.480
Because if we're only learning from a certain few, our growth will be very confined to the few that we're able to learn from.
00:23:06.640 --> 00:23:11.119
Hopefully those few are very good at teaching and have a lot of lessons to share.
00:23:11.279 --> 00:23:20.000
But if we've got seventy-five people in an assembly and we're only learning from one or two of them, that very much so limits our growth and what we can learn.
00:23:20.240 --> 00:23:27.039
And if those certain few are not learning from everyone else, well then our growth will probably be negative.
00:23:27.359 --> 00:23:29.519
Instead, let's learn from each other.
00:23:29.759 --> 00:23:36.799
All of us consider each one because everyone has a story, everyone has something we can learn from.
00:23:37.279 --> 00:23:46.640
The point of all this is it took me starting a podcast, unfortunately, to understand truly, truly understand the value of these things.
00:23:46.880 --> 00:23:49.119
Don't let it just be for the podcast though.
00:23:49.279 --> 00:23:54.240
I'm ashamed that it took a podcast for me to realize these maybe obvious lessons.
00:23:54.319 --> 00:24:02.640
But I've seen them in real ways by editing these episodes and listening to them hundreds of hours of listening to myself fall short in these ways.
00:24:02.960 --> 00:24:04.559
Please learn from me.
00:24:04.720 --> 00:24:06.799
Learn the value of listening more.
00:24:06.960 --> 00:24:09.039
No matter how good you are at listening, listen more.
00:24:09.200 --> 00:24:13.440
Dig deeper in the relationships you are forming because you can learn from everyone.
00:24:13.599 --> 00:24:16.000
Don't let it stop at just the podcast.
00:24:16.240 --> 00:24:21.839
Employ these in your everyday conversations, and we will grow so much because of it.
00:24:22.160 --> 00:24:27.359
Thank you to everyone who has listened to these episodes, especially those who have reached out and encouraged me about them.
00:24:27.519 --> 00:24:34.000
If I have not gotten to you yet to record an episode and interview you, I'd really hope that I get to soon.
00:24:34.240 --> 00:24:39.680
But please remember that this podcast is supposed to encourage all of us to love and good works.
00:24:39.920 --> 00:24:43.519
So the way that we learn from everyone is not just via the podcast.
00:24:43.680 --> 00:24:45.200
We can't have everyone on the podcast.
00:24:45.279 --> 00:24:47.279
It'd be impossible, and it's not the point.
00:24:47.519 --> 00:24:51.680
The point is for the podcast to launch us into these skills in our own lives.
00:24:51.920 --> 00:24:55.519
Don't use the podcast just to learn facts about people.
00:24:55.759 --> 00:25:04.160
Please use this podcast as a launching point to dig deeper into people's lives, form further relationships, and learn from everyone.
00:25:04.480 --> 00:25:12.400
Consider podcasts, not just more podcasts to listen to and consume, but what we can learn from podcasting and interviewing.
00:25:12.640 --> 00:25:15.279
Consider listening way more than you are currently.
00:25:15.519 --> 00:25:21.759
Consider digging deeper with someone who might be struggling, and consider learning from everyone.
00:25:22.400 --> 00:25:37.359
And let us consider one another in order to stir up love and good works, not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some, but exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the day approaching.
00:25:38.240 --> 00:25:43.759
The Bible tells us to consider one another in order to stir up love and good works in each other.
00:25:43.920 --> 00:25:49.440
So thank you for stirring up love and good works in me just by listening to this episode.
00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:04.160
Consider One Another is a podcast focused on each other.
00:00:04.400 --> 00:00:11.839
Thank you for tuning in to this podcast that is all about stirring up love and good works in one another.
00:00:14.240 --> 00:00:20.719
Hello everyone, and thank you for tuning in once again to the Consider One Another podcast.
00:00:20.879 --> 00:00:30.480
This will be the last solo episode of season three, as this is now officially the month of October, the first Friday of every month.
00:00:30.559 --> 00:00:35.920
I like to put out something that I have been considering, and hopefully you enjoy these episodes.
00:00:36.240 --> 00:00:40.479
I really enjoy them, and I have gotten a lot of really good feedback on most of them.
00:00:40.640 --> 00:00:44.240
So hopefully you enjoy these devotional type podcasts.
00:00:44.399 --> 00:00:46.000
Today we're considering podcasts.
00:00:46.079 --> 00:00:49.439
It feels kind of meta, but I'm excited to share it with you.
00:00:49.840 --> 00:00:52.560
We're officially in fall now, which is exciting.
00:00:52.640 --> 00:00:57.759
It's postseason baseball, or as Mariners fans call it, the off-season.
00:00:58.000 --> 00:01:01.439
For Dodgers fans, everything is right in the world.
00:01:01.600 --> 00:01:04.480
It's gray skies out today, but I'm liking it.
00:01:04.560 --> 00:01:10.799
It feels like a calm is upon us and we can rest a little bit more after the busyness of summer.
00:01:11.040 --> 00:01:16.000
We should have three more interview episodes after this, which I'm excited about.
00:01:16.159 --> 00:01:18.959
And of course, that's what the people love about the podcast.
00:01:19.120 --> 00:01:22.000
The people love it for the people and the interviews.
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That's the point of the Consider One Another podcast.
00:01:25.519 --> 00:01:28.079
And I've had so much fun with these interviews.
00:01:28.239 --> 00:01:41.680
But these solo, more devotional episodes have been fun for me, and I'm especially excited about this one because as we wrap up season three, I was considering all the things that I have learned from these interviews and podcasting.
00:01:41.840 --> 00:01:46.079
When I started podcasting a couple years ago now, I didn't know what I was doing.
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I was just kind of making it up as I went on an idea that I thought was fun.
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And now as I have pursued that idea for a lot of episodes now, I should have counted them.
00:01:55.680 --> 00:01:58.319
Probably close to about 75 podcasts now.
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I've learned so much, especially from these interviews, not just about podcasting, but way more importantly than that, I've learned a lot about life and connecting with people and some skills that I was really falling short in that I've had to learn from the hard way.
00:02:13.360 --> 00:02:19.280
So I want to share with you guys what I've learned and how that can really transform our interpersonal relationships.
00:02:19.439 --> 00:02:22.159
In this episode, we are considering podcasts.
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Please consider this meta idea with me.
00:02:25.680 --> 00:02:31.360
But first, before we get into these three life lessons from podcasting, we're gonna jump into scripture.
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And because we're talking about the podcast itself, we gotta go to the title track.
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Read with me Hebrews 10, starting in verse 19.
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Of course, the podcast comes from verse 24, but let's get the context.
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Hebrews 10, verse 19.
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Therefore, brethren, having boldness to enter the holiest by the blood of Jesus, by a new and living way which He consecrated for us through the veil, that is his flesh, and having a high priest over the house of God, let us draw near with a true heart, in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
00:03:10.240 --> 00:03:16.240
Let us hold fast the confession of our hope, without wavering, for he who promised his faithful.
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Verse twenty four, and let us consider one another in order to stir up love and good works, not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some, but exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the day approaching.
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That again is the title track, so I thought it would be a good place to leave season three.
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It's a verse that we all love so much.
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We've got our consider one another break built into our services, and now we have this consider one another podcast because the image of this verse is so encouraging to me.
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It reminds me of my role and the reason why we show up to services.
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So often Hebrews 10.25 was cited to me without any context, but rather just a rule and a command that you have to show up at 9.30.
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I don't really understand why, but that was just a rule, and so it felt more like a threat than an opportunity.
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But when we learn the opportunity that exists by coming to services becomes one we don't want to miss out on.
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I don't want to miss the assembling because I don't want to miss out on being encouraged.
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I don't want to miss out on the opportunity to consider my brothers and sisters.
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That's the point of the podcast.
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The point of the podcast gives us another way to consider one another.
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There's lots of ways we can do that by coming to the assembly, by writing cards, by reaching out to people.
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This podcast became a new way for me to consider brothers and sisters.
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And in my work where I get so many opportunities to have spiritual conversations with you guys at 2 o'clock on a Tuesday, or more likely 6 30 on a Monday, I wanted to share that and put it in a way that it could be absorbed and appreciated by all of you.
00:05:01.680 --> 00:05:07.519
And you guys have reached out to me in so many kind ways to let me know that this has been encouraging to you.
00:05:07.680 --> 00:05:08.480
So thank you.
00:05:08.639 --> 00:05:14.639
Thank you for encouraging me in this process that I hope would be encouraging, and I think it really has been.
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Having a podcast dedicated to people and truly considering them has really helped me, I think, become a better person.
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Before getting into our three points, I will vulnerably share this.
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My goal for starting this podcast was not so that I would learn these things and become a better person.
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That's really not why I started it, unfortunately.
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Instead, I was honestly just trying to make as good of a podcast as possible.
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That's what I wanted to do.
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And I'm still learning lots about podcasting.
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But what I have learned about considering others has been far more valuable than the podcast itself.
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I want to share a couple of funny things that I have learned, and then we'll get to the serious ones.
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Before we get to the funny ones, let me share one danger of the podcast that I do want to caution you to.
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When I originally came up with this idea, again years ago, I remember talking to a mentor about the idea.
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And I think I'd said this to a couple of you guys before, but when I originally wanted to start a podcast, everyone who I asked about it told me not to.
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My father-in-law told me, Will, I think there are enough podcasts in the world.
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And I said, Thank you for that.
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But I went on anyway, and I found what I thought would be encouraging.
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Not just devotional episodes like this one, but the interviews and the considering of people and bringing out people's stories so that we can have more spiritual conversations with each other.
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That's the direction I went.
00:06:39.279 --> 00:06:43.439
And when I ran that idea by another mentor, a person cautioned me of this.
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Said, Will, I want to make sure that people of a congregation do not use virtual ways of learning about people to replace their actual connecting with people.
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Meaning, if we never show up to services, it's okay because I don't have to learn from a person directly to know their story.
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I can just hear their podcast episode and feel like I'm connected to a group.
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This mentor was worried about artificial connections, or rather surface-level connections that aren't real but are just consumed.
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I thought that was a little bit harsh at the time when I heard it, but I can imagine how it has been true for some of us.
00:07:23.040 --> 00:07:33.519
Rather than making the connections ourselves, it becomes easy because there's a podcast for that, and if I just listen for 30 minutes a week, now I've got the mandated connection time.
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Hopefully that's not at all what you have done with the podcast, but it is tempting for all of us to do.
00:07:38.160 --> 00:07:40.079
So I want to caution us of that.
00:07:40.240 --> 00:07:49.920
Let's not just use these remote ways of learning about each other like fun facts, but rather use it as a launching point to connect and really consider each other in person.
00:07:50.240 --> 00:07:51.199
That's really important.
00:07:51.360 --> 00:07:57.279
Don't just hear about the person, learn about them so that you can connect with them personally, one-on-one.
00:07:57.600 --> 00:07:59.439
That's something that I have learned so far.
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Not one of our main three takeaways, but I wanted to caution us about it.
00:08:03.120 --> 00:08:05.040
Don't just learn facts about a person.
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Let's go consider each other in person, launching from the podcast into personal conversations.
00:08:11.920 --> 00:08:14.959
Some funny things that I've learned, the value of blooper reels.
00:08:15.199 --> 00:08:22.399
I put in a blooper reel early on when something funny happened, just to see if people actually listened to the end of the podcast.
00:08:22.560 --> 00:08:26.560
And I would know that you did by you commenting on the blooper that happened.
00:08:26.639 --> 00:08:27.439
That's what I call it.
00:08:27.519 --> 00:08:32.399
Some sort of out-of-the-ordinary funny thing that doesn't belong in the final cut.
00:08:32.559 --> 00:08:38.960
I just put that at the end of the podcast, and people would laugh at them and say, hey, that was a funny thing that happened.
00:08:39.200 --> 00:08:45.120
One time I didn't put the blooper reel in, and I was sure to find out that Debbie McVicker was not happy about this.
00:08:45.279 --> 00:08:48.240
She would say, Great podcast, but where was the blooper reel?
00:08:48.399 --> 00:08:50.399
Uh so people love the funny things.
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Hopefully it just showed a bit of transparency and uh human interaction.
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This isn't meant to be some grand production, it's just meant to be conversation that can be heard via Spotify or wherever you listen to podcasts.
00:09:04.320 --> 00:09:06.799
So there's value in the funny blooper reels.
00:09:06.879 --> 00:09:14.000
One more funny thing was I learned a lot about people's and my own nervous sayings.
00:09:14.320 --> 00:09:18.080
I would do my best to delete the sayings that would keep coming up.
00:09:18.240 --> 00:09:29.039
But as I edit these podcasts, I get a little transcript of the words that are said, and so I can see exactly how many times someone said a certain phrase or a certain word.
00:09:29.279 --> 00:09:34.000
All of us have these nervous words that we use when we don't know what to say.
00:09:34.240 --> 00:09:44.240
For some people it was you know, and with any sort of pause in their thought progression, they would add in a you know or a type thing.
00:09:44.320 --> 00:09:46.000
It'd say, you know, that type thing.
00:09:46.080 --> 00:09:49.519
They'd add it to every single ending of a sentence or every beginning.
00:09:49.679 --> 00:09:53.039
Some people would start with I mean, or a well.
00:09:53.440 --> 00:09:57.759
Those sort of nervous habits really came out in the podcast, and I would delete them.
00:09:57.840 --> 00:10:02.080
But I found it interesting that we would really go back to so many of our nervous habits.
00:10:02.240 --> 00:10:06.480
For me, hopefully as a speaker, I've learned what my own are and I've gotten rid of them.
00:10:06.639 --> 00:10:08.240
It's really hard to listen to yourself.
00:10:08.399 --> 00:10:12.480
Maybe for those who've been on the podcast, you've listened to yourself and kind of cringed a little bit.
00:10:12.639 --> 00:10:26.080
We don't like the sound of our own voices, but it's helped me a lot learn about my nervous ticks, the phrases that I need to stop using so much, and the words that I can use to be more encouraging, less filler words, and more constructive words.
00:10:26.320 --> 00:10:29.840
There's a lot of value we can get from just learning from these podcasts.
00:10:29.919 --> 00:10:40.720
At least for me, the biggest lessons I learned was by editing the podcasts and going back and listening to my own voice, listening to my own interrupting and things that I did wrong that I should have done differently.
00:10:40.879 --> 00:10:46.399
Going back and editing really taught me a lot about myself and the lessons that I want to bring out today.
00:10:46.559 --> 00:10:48.000
So here they are, three of them.
00:10:48.240 --> 00:10:51.840
The first one is this the value of listening.
00:10:52.080 --> 00:10:57.759
Sometimes we like talking to people more for the talking part than the listening part.
00:10:58.000 --> 00:11:04.559
For a podcast, it seemed to me like there would have to be a lot of talking on my end to make the best episode possible.
00:11:04.799 --> 00:11:09.600
What I ended up learning was the best episodes are the ones where I did the most listening.
00:11:09.840 --> 00:11:13.279
I'll give us a podcast example and then a real life example.
00:11:13.519 --> 00:11:21.360
When I started this podcast back in Florida, I remember listening to an episode with my wife, as one of the first ones that came out, that I was really proud of.
00:11:21.600 --> 00:11:29.519
But then she rightly explained during the podcast that I need to let the person that I am talking to make the points that I was making.
00:11:29.759 --> 00:11:37.200
In the episode, my buddy Brian, shout out Brian, was making a really good point that I apparently had something that I wanted to talk about.
00:11:37.440 --> 00:11:46.159
So as he was making his point in my own preacher way, I kindly took the ball and then ran with his point, saying all the things that I thought would be good to say.
00:11:46.399 --> 00:11:55.200
And I remember when my wife told me this, that I should have let him make that point that I thought was so good instead of taking it myself, I was not very happy about it.
00:11:55.360 --> 00:11:59.600
I just wanted her to pat me on the back for the good thing that I thought that I said.
00:11:59.919 --> 00:12:04.480
Instead, it didn't really matter what I said, because I should have been listening.
00:12:04.720 --> 00:12:13.759
And I'm sure I continue to do this, it's not like I've fixed it by just one podcast, but at least now I know it is something that I should be working on.
00:12:13.919 --> 00:12:17.600
Whoever you are, you should be working on your listening.
00:12:17.840 --> 00:12:19.440
Go read the book of Proverbs.
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It won't take you very long.
00:12:21.120 --> 00:12:28.960
A couple chapters a day, and you'll have it done in a month, but you will find in that month most of the book is about the value of talking less.
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So much throughout the book will be about talking less.
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Here's one good example.
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It's Proverbs 18, 13.
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He who gives an answer before he hears, it is folly and shame to him.
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Next time you're having a conversation with someone, ask yourself if you are there to talk or to listen.
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Even if you are the one initiating the conversation, people can tell if your motivation is to talk more than to listen.
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Go listen more.
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It happened to me once as a kid at camp.
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A counselor had learned that I really like baseball.
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So he asked me, he said, Hey Will, uh have you ever thrown a no-hitter?
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Which to me was a crazy specific question to ask that I was really excited to answer.
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Because that season I was like two outs away one time from throwing a no-hitter.
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And so I told him that really excitedly.
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And he goes, Oh I have which clearly showed his intention for asking me this question was not to learn about me or to really wonder if I had ever thrown a no-hitter.
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Rather, the question, the initiation, the whole conversation was to tell me about something he was proud about.
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Even if you're the one initiating and asking the questions, it'll come out later if your motivation was to talk about yourself.
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My encouragement from having to listen to myself so many times, so many times I'm listening to myself as I edit these podcasts, I'm listening to myself listen to other people.
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So many times I've heard myself cut others off, interrupt, or talk about what I wanted to say in the first place.
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Please learn from this long process of years of episodes and editing.
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Whoever you are, no matter how good you think you are at listening, go listen more.
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Please.
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And when you do use your words, use them to dig deeper.
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Point number one, there's value in listening more.
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Point number two, I learned the value of digging deeper.
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Something I learned by interviewing so many people, then going back and editing and having to listen through these conversations, is that the second thing someone has to say is often much more honest and vulnerable than the first thing that they say.
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I would have a question written out that I'd give someone in advance, and I felt like that question was good enough to uncover what I was hoping they would say.
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But they would often not get deeper until I dug deeper or just listened longer.
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Oftentimes I'd want someone to just share and be vulnerable and share the story or the struggle right off the bat because I asked a broad enough question.
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But people I learned aren't typically like that.
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Even if you encourage them to be vulnerable, right off the bat, people usually are not going to be their most vulnerable.
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If you want to really learn about someone or really understand their struggles, use your words to dig deeper.
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That's not just for the podcast, it translates directly to our everyday conversations.
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Sometimes we know that we need to check in on someone.
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I emphasize this constantly, the value of checking in on people, brothers and sisters.
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And hopefully you're someone who does that.
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Often when I am trying to do just that, that thing that I'm saying we should be doing, I will reach out to someone, like I know I'm supposed to, and I will say, Hey, how are you doing?
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And almost without fail, the person will say something very surface level and basically I'm doing good.
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And then at that I feel like I did my job.
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I know that they weren't at church on Sunday, I know I should reach out to them, so I do.
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I say, hey, is everything okay?
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And they say yes, I am fine.
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And then I say, okay, if they're not doing good, then that's on them because I tried.
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But in reality, whether we're checking in on people or just trying to learn more about them, that's just not how people work.
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People are not usually automatically vulnerable.
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In reality, people do not want to share their vulnerable struggles just from the first question.
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You have to dig deeper before you can honestly expect someone to share something they are struggling with.
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Sometimes this is just by asking a better question or a deeper question.
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If you just ask someone how they are, maybe after that you could ask something deeper, like, is there anything I can be praying about for you?
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They can say I'm doing just fine, and you can take that, but then add on to it.
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Okay, we're all struggling those.
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There's something I can be praying about for you.
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Take the answer that they give you as as generic or as surface level as it may be, and dig deeper.
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Ask a harder question.
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Sometimes though, the digging deep has to come before the conversation itself.
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Again, going back to the podcast, to be able to record episodes with people and have vulnerable conversations required a relationship first.
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I wouldn't even know the right questions to ask someone if I didn't know the person at least a little bit.
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People don't want to be vulnerable with someone who they don't have a relationship with.
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And this required a lot of conversations in the pews, at coffee shops, in people's homes, to then uncover, wow, there is so much here for me to ask about and learn about.
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I think this person will be vulnerable because we have this relationship.
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If your only relationship with a person is texting them, how are they doing, or shaking their hand in the pew, don't blame them when they're not vulnerable with you.
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That's just not how people work.
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Again, this is just evidenced by the hours of podcasts and interviewing that I have done.
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As much as you might want people to be, they're not usually vulnerable right off the bat, especially if they feel uncomfortable or unknown.
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Make the person feel known first, have a relationship with them, then start uncovering some of the struggles, some of the vulnerable things that are happening.
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Even then it's going to be hard to uncover what's going on for a person.
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Start first with a relationship, then dig deeper.
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Make relationships with people, show them that you're interested in who they are, not just going to them because you've got something you want to say or you want to see them more at church.
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Instead, start with a relationship and then dig deeper.
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When you dig in these deeper ways, you will usually get somewhat further.
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Dig deeper with people you are trying to connect with and consider.
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Don't expect people's outer layer to be their most vulnerable.
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Find people in other contexts.
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Invite them into your home, invite them out to coffee.
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Don't just assume this person is fine because they are not emotionally vulnerable with you in the pews.
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Dig deeper.
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If I can add on to this point quickly, even when someone is talking with you, maybe you have gotten past that first outer layer of vulnerability and we're getting somewhere deeper now.
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Something I've learned through podcasting is a lot of times we don't fully understand what someone is saying the first time.
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Here's the podcast example before the application.
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Going back and editing a podcast is when I would usually learn about what a poor job I did understanding someone.
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I would think that based off someone's sentence that they said, that I understood what they meant and where they were going, and then I would just riff off of that and add on to what I thought they said, only to realize in post that they meant something completely different than what I assumed they meant.
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So then in post I would just delete my comment that had nothing to do with anything.
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But life isn't like that.
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We don't get a chance to see a manuscript or a transcript of all of our conversations.
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Sometimes someone can say something and we can cling on to that, assuming we know what they meant when in reality we're going off of what we think they meant.
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So before you assume you understand what someone is saying and then saying what you want to say about that thing, ask a clarifying question.
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Don't assume too much from tone or something that someone might have misspoke.
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Instead, clarify first.
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Seek to really understand what someone is really meaning and feeling before you take the ball and run with it based on something that you are probably confused about.
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Clarify first and then dig deeper in conversations in your relationships, and you will learn so much more about people.
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Which brings us to our last point.
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Point number three, the value of learning from everyone.
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I even started with this mindset that we could learn from everyone, not just paid speakers or elders or people who usually speak in services.
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The whole point of the podcast was we can learn from everyone.
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But even with that mindset, I was still further impressed the value of learning from everyone and how much there is to learn from people because everyone has a story.
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Sometimes we forget that someone who is serving as an elder ever came out of the world in the first place to give their life to Christ.
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Sometimes someone who is quieter by nature, we assume just doesn't have much to say.
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But they have very valuable things to share as well.
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Consider one another, not just a preacher, not just the one leading the Lord's Supper talk, not just the people who have been on the podcast.
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Consider everyone in our assembly.
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Consider the visitor, consider the new Christian, consider that quiet person on the back row.
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Everyone has a story and everyone has something that we can learn from.
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Don't assume in relationships if you are supposed to be the teacher or the learner.
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Sometimes we make those assumptions just based off of age or Status of what we must be in that relationship.
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Don't assume either way.
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Hopefully, in every relationship and conversation, we should be both teaching and learning.
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Don't assume because of someone's age that you cannot learn from them.
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Don't assume because of someone's newness to the faith that you cannot learn from them.
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And don't make those assumptions about yourself either.
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You have things to share.
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You have stories to offer.
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We can learn from you.
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It's hard to if if we're not present in the assembly, like Hebrews 10 25 says.
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It's hard to if we're showing up just to squeak out by the Amen at the last prayer.
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Don't do that.
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Give us a chance to consider you and learn from you.
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And on the flip side, if if someone is tired of being preached to and just is showing up so people can talk to them, you can understand why someone might just be ready to leave right at the Amen.
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Instead give someone that chance to share their story, to learn from them.
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Because if we're only learning from a certain few, our growth will be very confined to the few that we're able to learn from.
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Hopefully those few are very good at teaching and have a lot of lessons to share.
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But if we've got seventy-five people in an assembly and we're only learning from one or two of them, that very much so limits our growth and what we can learn.
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And if those certain few are not learning from everyone else, well then our growth will probably be negative.
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Instead, let's learn from each other.
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All of us consider each one because everyone has a story, everyone has something we can learn from.
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The point of all this is it took me starting a podcast, unfortunately, to understand truly, truly understand the value of these things.
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Don't let it just be for the podcast though.
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I'm ashamed that it took a podcast for me to realize these maybe obvious lessons.
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But I've seen them in real ways by editing these episodes and listening to them hundreds of hours of listening to myself fall short in these ways.
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Please learn from me.
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Learn the value of listening more.
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No matter how good you are at listening, listen more.
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Dig deeper in the relationships you are forming because you can learn from everyone.
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Don't let it stop at just the podcast.
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Employ these in your everyday conversations, and we will grow so much because of it.
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Thank you to everyone who has listened to these episodes, especially those who have reached out and encouraged me about them.
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If I have not gotten to you yet to record an episode and interview you, I'd really hope that I get to soon.
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But please remember that this podcast is supposed to encourage all of us to love and good works.
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So the way that we learn from everyone is not just via the podcast.
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We can't have everyone on the podcast.
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It'd be impossible, and it's not the point.
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The point is for the podcast to launch us into these skills in our own lives.
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Don't use the podcast just to learn facts about people.
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Please use this podcast as a launching point to dig deeper into people's lives, form further relationships, and learn from everyone.
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Consider podcasts, not just more podcasts to listen to and consume, but what we can learn from podcasting and interviewing.
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Consider listening way more than you are currently.
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Consider digging deeper with someone who might be struggling, and consider learning from everyone.
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And let us consider one another in order to stir up love and good works, not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some, but exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the day approaching.
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The Bible tells us to consider one another in order to stir up love and good works in each other.
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So thank you for stirring up love and good works in me just by listening to this episode.
