Liisa Thomas: Welcome to Compliance Chronicles, where we learn from professionals shaping the world of compliance. I'm your host, Lisa Thomas, Outside Privacy and Compliance Council, an adjunct professor at Northwestern Law School, and a lifelong learner of organizational change. From personal journeys to hard-earned lessons, these are the chronicles that inspire and guide. Let's dive in. So we are back. For another episode of Compliance Chronicles, and I am thrilled to be joined today by my friend Corey. Corey, I'm gonna turn it over to you to introduce yourself.
Corey Tanner: Sure. I am Corey Tanner. I am the Deputy General Counsel over Corporate and Employment Law at Albemarle Corporation.
Liisa Thomas: All right. So that has not always been your job. So talk to us a little bit your journey to get to where you're at.
Corey Tanner: when I was in college, I knew that I wanted to, think about law school. I took a job with a local law firm that was focused in employment law. And that really opened my eyes to, what it's like to solve problems in the corporate world and in the workplace. once I did that at this small law firm I was hooked and I decided law school was a good idea. And actually when I came out of law school, I went back to that law firm. I always joke that I got promoted from secretary to attorney and did employment law work there for a number of years before going to do internal investigations at the University of Texas. from there I went to a large global labor and employment law firm where I did employment work. Compliance work, litigation, investigations. And I just found it fascinating, all the different things that people do and why they do them, and how it gets done and how it gets resolved. So after a few years in that larger law firm, then I went in-house. So had a job before Albemarle, and then when I came here, I created the employment law function from the ground up. For me, it's always been the human element of understanding why people do the things that they do and untangling, all of the complicated facts around that.
Liisa Thomas: All right, so that takes us to our next topic, which is the challenges that you faced. So whether it's dealing with tricky people problems or other issues, what are some of the challenges that you faced during your career?
Corey Tanner: I would say when I was a young lawyer, I really wanted what I saw as the best possible outcome for my client. And I couldn't really do that unless I divorced the case from the facts entirely. I used to really stress out. I had a mentor. who was very good who was like, Corey, you can't change the facts. all you can do is work through the problem in front of you based on the facts and circumstances that you have. And for me, who was a control freak, particularly when I was first getting started, it was very freeing I think another challenging aspect of navigating compliance is that a lot of times the people that you encounter in the workplace they make a negative assumption like, you're from legal or you're from compliance and you're here and I'm in trouble. And so really learning how to create those trusted partnerships and being seen as a value add across, the company rather than a hurdle to be overcome. that's something that every person in a role like this has to figure out in order to really be successful at it long term.
Liisa Thomas: How did you get people not to think of you as, the department of no or as you said, I'm in trouble.
Corey Tanner: Well, I try to be cool. just like interested in someone on a human and personal level to be like, we're more than just these desks that we sit at. if you can build a little bit of that relationship, that helps. I also strategically when I'm called in to help with something or solve a problem, I try to start with okay, where do you want to go? what is the outcome that you're looking for here? And then I can work backwards from that. it may not be that we're going to go from A to Z, immediately, But if we go to A to B to X, Y, Z, we can still get you there. I would rather be with you all along the way and help you design, really good path to get to an outcome than be the person that you don't talk to who comes in at the very end and is like, here's all the roadblocks and red flags, we can't go forward.
Liisa Thomas: Any other challenges?
Corey Tanner: on a personal level, figuring out how to do what can be a very heavy job and still be a partner and a mother and a friend. I think that's tough for anybody that takes on, big jobs with heavy consequences. I don't always get that balance right. but between, getting older and smarter and wiser over time, exercising and keeping my priorities straight. That's that's been helpful to balance.
Liisa Thomas: that takes us to our next topic, which is key lessons that you've learned through your career, I think one of them you just said, one day at a time.
Corey Tanner: I always say this thing to my kids when I think that they're tempted to tell a little fib. And it is like a core belief in my life, both at home and at work. And I just remind myself, Martha Stewart did not go to jail for insider trading. she was sentenced to prison because they found that she lied to investigators. one of my personal maxims is Everybody makes mistakes. what matters is how you handle it and what you do afterwards and whether you can be honest about it and, work to make it better or if you hide it. I have very little tolerance for people that wanna hide it. in your in your legal practice, of course, you never want to make a mistake, but when you're doing something like an investigation and you know someone has made a mistake and they just won't say it and they'll do anything to cover it, for me I feel like if you had just owned up to the mistake, this might have all gone away. But now that you've lied about it, I don't have any patience for that. almost every mistake is fixable, unless you've completely blown a statute of limitations. my instinct is always that you wanna reach out and get the help and support that you need to try to get it corrected appropriately. I think almost every lawyer, or person in a big job could tell you a story like I remember, I made this big mistake. I thought it was the end of the world and, it turned out to be fine. But in that moment it feels so big to you. there are a handful of cases that I lost as a litigator, and I learned way more from those cases than any of the cases that I won. I don't think about the cases I won. I still think about the cases that I lost. whatever you perceive as failure can be a really good thing in the long run, just very painful in the short run. I always try to be very careful about what I call moral drift. you're willing to compromise a little bit here, and then you're willing to compromise a little bit more here, and then all of a sudden you're way out here and you don't know how you got there. And it's because you took one little step at a time. and then you're dealing with, serious legal issues or serious personal issues. my last thing that I learned is that most people believe what they are telling you, even if you know that it is incorrect. when I was younger, I used to think why would this person lie to me about this? And the reality is they don't believe they're lying. to them, what they experienced, what they perceived, they think that that's reality. when stories diverge and it feels confusing, I've learned to accept, this is the human experience. it's not necessarily that someone is trying to be misleading. It's that we're imperfect about what we recall and what we perceive. we think that we're more trustworthy narrators than we actually are. that's been interesting in the intersection in my work between employment law and clients as well.
Liisa Thomas: Parting advice for people either just starting out or that have been doing this for a long time and are looking for inspiration. Or both.
Corey Tanner: I think that what sets people apart in the workplace and what makes the most successful leaders is to bring authenticity with you when you come to work. I spent, a lot of my younger career trying to be professional and this is how a professional acts and what a professional does. And I have never been more comfortable or more successful than when I threw all that out the window and thought, I'm gonna bring everything that I have to the table. And I think people really respond to that. I think it's very rare. and so I would encourage people to, be authentic. be professional and respectful, but be a real person. I think that brings a lot of value. And then I think having a sense of humor is really important. not everything that we do is funny, but some of it is kind of funny. being able to laugh and recognize some of the absurdity. helps, especially if you're dealing with heavy subject matter. And then humility. I often I work with these genius experts of engineering and science. And I will say to them, hey, I don't understand this at all. could you explain this to me as if I were a third grader? And people really like that because it shows that they're the expert and they get to be the teacher it helps me learn their world and it helps them feel that respect that I'm not coming in here pretending to know it all. so
Liisa Thomas: Building those relationships, all those things you just said are so helpful when you're trying to partner with someone. these are great words of wisdom, wonderful advice. Courtney, thank you for joining me and making the time to have this conversation. I hope you enjoyed this episode of Compliance Chronicles, where we get guidance and inspiration from the personal journeys of leaders in the profession. If you did, I'd love it if you'd consider subscribing or leaving a rating or review. It helps others discover the show.
Corey Tanner: Sure. I am Corey Tanner. I am the Deputy General Counsel over Corporate and Employment Law at Albemarle Corporation.
Liisa Thomas: All right. So that has not always been your job. So talk to us a little bit your journey to get to where you're at.
Corey Tanner: when I was in college, I knew that I wanted to, think about law school. I took a job with a local law firm that was focused in employment law. And that really opened my eyes to, what it's like to solve problems in the corporate world and in the workplace. once I did that at this small law firm I was hooked and I decided law school was a good idea. And actually when I came out of law school, I went back to that law firm. I always joke that I got promoted from secretary to attorney and did employment law work there for a number of years before going to do internal investigations at the University of Texas. from there I went to a large global labor and employment law firm where I did employment work. Compliance work, litigation, investigations. And I just found it fascinating, all the different things that people do and why they do them, and how it gets done and how it gets resolved. So after a few years in that larger law firm, then I went in-house. So had a job before Albemarle, and then when I came here, I created the employment law function from the ground up. For me, it's always been the human element of understanding why people do the things that they do and untangling, all of the complicated facts around that.
Liisa Thomas: All right, so that takes us to our next topic, which is the challenges that you faced. So whether it's dealing with tricky people problems or other issues, what are some of the challenges that you faced during your career?
Corey Tanner: I would say when I was a young lawyer, I really wanted what I saw as the best possible outcome for my client. And I couldn't really do that unless I divorced the case from the facts entirely. I used to really stress out. I had a mentor. who was very good who was like, Corey, you can't change the facts. all you can do is work through the problem in front of you based on the facts and circumstances that you have. And for me, who was a control freak, particularly when I was first getting started, it was very freeing I think another challenging aspect of navigating compliance is that a lot of times the people that you encounter in the workplace they make a negative assumption like, you're from legal or you're from compliance and you're here and I'm in trouble. And so really learning how to create those trusted partnerships and being seen as a value add across, the company rather than a hurdle to be overcome. that's something that every person in a role like this has to figure out in order to really be successful at it long term.
Liisa Thomas: How did you get people not to think of you as, the department of no or as you said, I'm in trouble.
Corey Tanner: Well, I try to be cool. just like interested in someone on a human and personal level to be like, we're more than just these desks that we sit at. if you can build a little bit of that relationship, that helps. I also strategically when I'm called in to help with something or solve a problem, I try to start with okay, where do you want to go? what is the outcome that you're looking for here? And then I can work backwards from that. it may not be that we're going to go from A to Z, immediately, But if we go to A to B to X, Y, Z, we can still get you there. I would rather be with you all along the way and help you design, really good path to get to an outcome than be the person that you don't talk to who comes in at the very end and is like, here's all the roadblocks and red flags, we can't go forward.
Liisa Thomas: Any other challenges?
Corey Tanner: on a personal level, figuring out how to do what can be a very heavy job and still be a partner and a mother and a friend. I think that's tough for anybody that takes on, big jobs with heavy consequences. I don't always get that balance right. but between, getting older and smarter and wiser over time, exercising and keeping my priorities straight. That's that's been helpful to balance.
Liisa Thomas: that takes us to our next topic, which is key lessons that you've learned through your career, I think one of them you just said, one day at a time.
Corey Tanner: I always say this thing to my kids when I think that they're tempted to tell a little fib. And it is like a core belief in my life, both at home and at work. And I just remind myself, Martha Stewart did not go to jail for insider trading. she was sentenced to prison because they found that she lied to investigators. one of my personal maxims is Everybody makes mistakes. what matters is how you handle it and what you do afterwards and whether you can be honest about it and, work to make it better or if you hide it. I have very little tolerance for people that wanna hide it. in your in your legal practice, of course, you never want to make a mistake, but when you're doing something like an investigation and you know someone has made a mistake and they just won't say it and they'll do anything to cover it, for me I feel like if you had just owned up to the mistake, this might have all gone away. But now that you've lied about it, I don't have any patience for that. almost every mistake is fixable, unless you've completely blown a statute of limitations. my instinct is always that you wanna reach out and get the help and support that you need to try to get it corrected appropriately. I think almost every lawyer, or person in a big job could tell you a story like I remember, I made this big mistake. I thought it was the end of the world and, it turned out to be fine. But in that moment it feels so big to you. there are a handful of cases that I lost as a litigator, and I learned way more from those cases than any of the cases that I won. I don't think about the cases I won. I still think about the cases that I lost. whatever you perceive as failure can be a really good thing in the long run, just very painful in the short run. I always try to be very careful about what I call moral drift. you're willing to compromise a little bit here, and then you're willing to compromise a little bit more here, and then all of a sudden you're way out here and you don't know how you got there. And it's because you took one little step at a time. and then you're dealing with, serious legal issues or serious personal issues. my last thing that I learned is that most people believe what they are telling you, even if you know that it is incorrect. when I was younger, I used to think why would this person lie to me about this? And the reality is they don't believe they're lying. to them, what they experienced, what they perceived, they think that that's reality. when stories diverge and it feels confusing, I've learned to accept, this is the human experience. it's not necessarily that someone is trying to be misleading. It's that we're imperfect about what we recall and what we perceive. we think that we're more trustworthy narrators than we actually are. that's been interesting in the intersection in my work between employment law and clients as well.
Liisa Thomas: Parting advice for people either just starting out or that have been doing this for a long time and are looking for inspiration. Or both.
Corey Tanner: I think that what sets people apart in the workplace and what makes the most successful leaders is to bring authenticity with you when you come to work. I spent, a lot of my younger career trying to be professional and this is how a professional acts and what a professional does. And I have never been more comfortable or more successful than when I threw all that out the window and thought, I'm gonna bring everything that I have to the table. And I think people really respond to that. I think it's very rare. and so I would encourage people to, be authentic. be professional and respectful, but be a real person. I think that brings a lot of value. And then I think having a sense of humor is really important. not everything that we do is funny, but some of it is kind of funny. being able to laugh and recognize some of the absurdity. helps, especially if you're dealing with heavy subject matter. And then humility. I often I work with these genius experts of engineering and science. And I will say to them, hey, I don't understand this at all. could you explain this to me as if I were a third grader? And people really like that because it shows that they're the expert and they get to be the teacher it helps me learn their world and it helps them feel that respect that I'm not coming in here pretending to know it all. so
Liisa Thomas: Building those relationships, all those things you just said are so helpful when you're trying to partner with someone. these are great words of wisdom, wonderful advice. Courtney, thank you for joining me and making the time to have this conversation. I hope you enjoyed this episode of Compliance Chronicles, where we get guidance and inspiration from the personal journeys of leaders in the profession. If you did, I'd love it if you'd consider subscribing or leaving a rating or review. It helps others discover the show.
