ABOUT THIS EPISODE
Steve and Mack get into the legalities of militias, and they may not be what you think. They’re definitely more complicated.
REFERENCES
A bunch of farmers that run home to get their guns to come to the common defense against the Redcoats:
American Battlefield Trust. “Lexington and Concord.” https://www.battlefields.org/learn/revolutionary-war/battles/lexington-and-concord
Even though we have selective service:
Selective Service System. “About Selective Service.” https://www.sss.gov/about/
We haven’t had the draft be active for a while:
Selective Service System. “Return to the Draft.” https://www.sss.gov/about/return-to-draft/
As refenced in the Second Amendment:
Constitution Annotated. “Second Amendment.” Congress.gov. https://constitution.congress.gov/constitution/amendment-2/
Appropriations are a bit of a bureaucratic rabbit hole, but the following gives a nice overview. In it, they use the specific examples of the Army being a multi-year appropriation (specifically, 2 years) and the Navy being a no-year appropriation:
Aherne, Drew C. “Appropriations Duration of Availability: One-Year, Multi-Year, and No-Year Funds.” June 7, 2024. Congress.gov. https://www.congress.gov/crs-product/R48087
It’s totally legit:
America’s Navy. “Riverine Command Boat.” Updated October 14, 2021. https://www.navy.mil/Resources/Fact-Files/Display-FactFiles/Article/2171638/riverine-command-boat/
We’re talking about the Barbary pirates:
Office of the Historian. “Barbary Wars, 1801–1805 and 1815–1816.” https://history.state.gov/milestones/1801-1829/barbary-wars
The Panama Canal, when Roosevelt sent warships (not armies):
Office of the Historian. “Building the Panama Canal, 1903–1914.” https://history.state.gov/milestones/1899-1913/panama-canal
Since Mack has let us down, here is a discussion about why the founding fathers didn’t want a standing army:
Mulligan, Steve P. “The Army Clause, Part 1: Overview and Historical Background” July 22, 2024. Congress.gov. https://www.congress.gov/crs-product/LSB11204
The subjugation of Ukraine is a long, sad history. Steve has a point that Stalin rather effectively oppressed the populace by land-based means:
Kiger, Patrick J. “How Joseph Stalin Starved Millions in the Ukrainian Famine.” Updated April 15, 2025. History.com https://www.history.com/articles/ukrainian-famine-stalin
But Anne and Mack have a point that you really can’t discount the role of the Black Sea in the situation:
Satanovskii, Sergei. “Why the Black Sea is so important to Russia and Ukraine.” March 28, 2025. DW. https://www.dw.com/en/why-the-black-sea-is-so-important-to-russia-and-ukraine/a-72048886
When the Marines were created:
Marines. “Brief History of the Corp.” https://www.usmcu.edu/Research/Marine-Corps-History-Division/Brief-Histories/
The first documented use of armed forces was in 1572 (calm down, Steve):
Merriam-Webster.com. “Word History.” https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/armed%20forces#word-history
Again, appropriations are complicated, y’all. The short answer is no, the Air Force and the Space Force appropriations are not necessarily limited by 2 years. The Army is the only military branch that has a specific time limit because it is the only one where that time limit is established in the Constitution. For all other military matters (including some having to do with the Navy), Congress has the ability to establish whatever time limits they want when they create the appropriation. If you want to learn more about this topic, please see the previously referenced article and/or visit the office of the Comptroller. Here's an interesting history about the Comptroller:
Under Secretary of Defense (Comptroller). “A Brief History of the Comptroller's Office [PDF].” https://comptroller.defense.gov/Portals/45/Documents/OUSDC_History/OUSDC_History.pdf?ver=-6sQPmgwiezg_pYKtL44tw%3d%3d
Not only do all the states have a National Guard, the U.S. Territories have them as well:
https://www.nationalguard.mil/
There are separate State Guards for some states:
Haskell, Bob. “State Guards.” June 2022. National Guard Magazine. https://www.ngaus.org/magazine/state-guards
Congress has the power…:
Constitution Annotated. “ArtI.S8.C15.1 Congress's Power to Call Militias.” Congress.gov. https://constitution.congress.gov/browse/essay/artI-S8-C15-1/ALDE_00001077/
Sorry Mack, “The President shall be Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States”:
Constitution Annotated. “Article II Executive Branch.” Congress.gov. https://constitution.congress.gov/browse/article-2/section-2/
The president can call them up and federalize them:
Siripurapu, Anshu and Berman, Noah. “What does the U.S. National Guard Do?” Updated April 3, 2024. Council on Foreign Relations. https://www.cfr.org/backgrounder/what-does-us-national-guard-do
We have Texas National Guard units at our border because the governor has declared an emergency:
Garcia, Uriel J. “Texas to build 80-acre base in Eagle Pass for National Guard troops.” February 16, 2024. https://www.texastribune.org/2024/02/16/texas-border-national-guard-base-eagle-pass/
If you want to get into the whole spate of federal emergencies, they are all documented by the Office of the Law Revision Counsel of the United States House of Representatives:
https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=(title:50%20section:1621%20edition:prelim)
The immigration executive order:
The White House. “Protecting The American People Against Invasion.” January 20, 2025. https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/01/protecting-the-american-people-against-invasion/
The executive order that reinterpreted part of the Fourteenth Amendment:
The White House. “Protecting The Meaning And Value Of American Citizenship.” January 20, 2025. https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/01/protecting-the-meaning-and-value-of-american-citizenship/
The Insurrection Act of 1807:
Faguy, Ana. “Could Trump Invoke Another Rarely-Used Law at the Border?” April 21, 2025. BBC. https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c9qwez9zz7jo
One article about the rumors of the Insurrection Act being used on January 6, 2021, from the time:
Dupuy, Beatrice. “Trump Has Not Invoked the Insurrection Act of 1807.” January 13, 2021. AP News. https://apnews.com/article/fact-checking-9881219261
Military officers are obligated to not follow unlawful orders:
Toropin, Konstantin. “What Happens if the President Issues a Potentially Illegal Order to the Military?” July 12, 2024. Military.com. https://www.military.com/daily-news/2024/07/12/what-happens-if-president-issues-potentially-illegal-order-military.html
In combat, they could get shot:
Sullivan, Dwight. “The Military's Death Penalty System.” Excerpt from 1998. Death Penalty Information Center. https://deathpenaltyinfo.org/state-and-federal-info/military/the-militarys-death-penalty-system
Presser v. Illinois (1886):
Legal Information Institute. “Presser v. State of Illinois.” Cornell Law School. https://www.law.cornell.edu/supremecourt/text/116/252
According to Google Translate, the German word for hooliganism is rowdytum.
The Chicago Police Department was founded on August 15, 1835:
https://www.chicagopolice.org/about/history/
Operation Lone Star has been hitting the National Guard pretty hard:
Solorio, Gabriella Alcorta. “At least 17 Texas National Guardsman have died patrolling the southern border, including several suicides.” December 9, 2024. Texas Standard. https://www.texasstandard.org/stories/texas-national-guard-operation-lone-star-soldier-deaths-suicides/
If you are unfamiliar with the Border Patrol presence in Texas:
U.S. Customs and Border Protection. “Sectors and Stations.” https://www.cbp.gov/border-security/along-us-borders/border-patrol-sectors
Is this an effective thing:
Serrano, Alejandro. “Migrant apprehensions are down at the Texas border. Have state policies had an impact?” April 22, 2024. The Texas Tribune. https://www.texastribune.org/2024/04/22/texas-border-migrant-apprehensions-abbott-operation-lone-star/
How is the reserve different than the National Guard:
The Council of State Governments. “Military 101: Understanding the Differences between Active Duty, National Guard and Reserves.” December 19, 2023. https://csg.org/2023/12/19/military-101-understanding-the-differences-between-active-duty-national-guard-and-reserves/
For those of you who are unfamiliar, here’s a brief history of San Antonio’s Fiesta and the Battle of Flowers parade:
Fiesta San Antonio. “History of Fiesta.” https://fiestasanantonio.org/history-of-fiesta/
San Jacinto Day:
San Jacinto Battlefield and Museum. “San Jacinto Day Celebration.” https://www.sanjacinto-museum.org/Visit/Calendar/San_Jacinto_Day_Celebration/
Mack is correct that the parade was once attended by President McKinley. Several presidents have visited, but the first president at the first Fiesta was President Harrison:
Fanning, Timothy. “132 years ago, San Antonio's first presidential visit came during the first Fiesta.” April 19, 2023. San Antonio Express-News. https://www.expressnews.com/news/article/fiesta-san-antonio-first-president-visit-17905885.php
If you are unfamiliar with the mole being referenced in our new cocktail, Holy Mole:
America’s Test Kitchen. “Mole Sauce: What It Is, Where It Comes From, and How to Make It.” September 15, 2021. https://www.americastestkitchen.com/articles/1057-all-about-mole-what-it-is-where-it-comes-from-and-how-to-make-it
According to Google translate 43 in Spanish is cuarenta y tres.
Catorce tres means 14-3.
A reserved, factual take on the Philadelphia Experiment (you’re on your own for the other versions):
Naval History and Heritage Command. “Philadelphia Experiment.” November 20, 2017. https://www.history.navy.mil/research/library/online-reading-room/title-list-alphabetically/p/philadelphia-experiment.html
The guy Tesla:
Whitaker Hunt, Inez. “Nikola Tesla.” Updated April 24, 2025. Britannica. https://www.britannica.com/biography/Nikola-Tesla
There were a lot of old warships from World War II that we gave to friendly navies. This is a practice we still do:
Conference of Maritime Economists and Industrial Engineers. “The Legacy of Former U.S. Navy Ships Transferred Overseas.” https://www.coltoncompany.com/index/shipbldg/transfer.htm/
What’s degaussing:
Torpedo Bay Navy Museum. “Degaussing.” https://navymuseum.co.nz/explore/by-themes/technology-and-weapons/degaussing-2/
The official Stephenville, Texas website:
https://www.stephenvilletx.gov/
Y’all, the name of the cow on the pole is Moo-La! (Don’t worry, we got pictures):
Whitis, Joyce. “Moo-la.” The Chamber. https://www.stephenvilletexas.org/moo-la
The Wikipedia entry for Stephenville, Texas at the time of this episode isn’t as exciting as it once was:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephenville,_Texas
The airship in Aurora, Texas:
AuroraTexas.gov. “History.” https://www.auroratexas.gov/community/history/
Zeppelins were invented in 1900:
National Inventors Hall of Fame. “Ferdinand von Zeppelin.” https://www.invent.org/inductees/ferdinand-von-zeppelin
If you aren’t familiar with Abrego Garcia’s case:
Sardarizadeh, Shayan; Thomas, Merlyn; Horton, Jake; and Wendling, Mike. “What we know about Kilmar Abrego Garcia and MS-13 allegations.” April 30, 2025. BBC. https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c1k4072e3nno
The Alien Enemies Act:
Yon Ebright, Katherine. “The Alien Enemies Act, Explained.” Updated May 1, 2025. Brennan Center For Justice. https://www.brennancenter.org/our-work/research-reports/alien-enemies-act-explained
During this podcast, we used certain terms like “illegal alien.” There have been several discussions over the past few years on how best to refer to the legal status of immigrants to the United States. The following article discusses the topic, and we apologize if we offended anyone with our choice of words:
Bryant, Erica. “No Person is Illegal: The Language We use for Immigration Matters.” April 4, 2023. Vera. https://www.vera.org/news/no-person-is-illegal-the-language-we-use-for-immigration-matters
You get due process of law:
Legal Information Institute. “Due Process.” Cornell Law School. https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/due_process
What was brought to the Supreme Court:
Supreme Court of the Unites States. “Kristi Noem, Secretary, Department of Homeland Security, et al., Applicants v. Kilmar Armando Abrego Garcia, et al.” April 7, 2025. https://www.supremecourt.gov/search.aspx?filename=/docket/docketfiles/html/public/24a949.html
Administrative Procedure Act:
Legal Information Institute. “Administrative Procedure Act.” Cornell Law School. https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/administrative_procedure_act
Habeas corpus:
Doyle, Charles. “Federal Habeas Corpus: A Legal Overview.” October 1, 2024. Congress.gov. https://www.congress.gov/crs-product/RL33391
They’re not sending them back to the countries they came from:
Vega, Cecilia. “U.S. Sent 238 Migrants to Salvadoran Mega-prison; Documents Indicate Most Have No Apparent Criminal Records [Video and transcript].” April 6, 2025. CBS News. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/what-records-show-about-migrants-sent-to-salvadoran-prison-60-minutes-transcript/
A prison known for abuse and torture:
Goebertus, Juanita. “Human Rights Watch declaration on prison conditions in El Salvador for the J.G.G. v. Trump case.” March 19, 2025. Human Rights Watch. https://www.hrw.org/news/2025/03/20/human-rights-watch-declaration-prison-conditions-el-salvador-jgg-v-trump-case
After this recording, people who were born here, whose parents were not legal residents, were indeed deported to a place that was not their home country:
Halpert, Madaline. “Three U.S. Citizen Children, One With Cancer, Deported to Honduras, Lawyers Say.” April 28, 2025. BBC. https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c4g8yj2n33yo
Not a line that’s never been crossed before:
Federal Judicial Center. “Executive Enforcement of Judicial Orders.” https://www.fjc.gov/history/administration/executive-enforcement-judicial-orders
Separation of powers:
Congress.gov. “Intro.7.2 Separation of Powers Under the Constitution.” https://constitution.congress.gov/browse/essay/intro.7-2/ALDE_00000031/
Why some people assume the Supreme Court is in Trump’s pocket:
Breidbart, Samuel. “The Supreme Court’s Presidential Immunity Ruling Undermines Democracy.” October 1, 2024. Brennan Center for Justice. https://www.brennancenter.org/our-work/analysis-opinion/supreme-courts-presidential-immunity-ruling-undermines-democracy
A commentary on Gorsuch’s history of rulings on Native American issues:
Davidson Sorkin, Amy. “Does It Matter That Neil Gorsuch Is Committed to Native American Rights?” June 26, 2023. The New Yorker. https://www.newyorker.com/news/daily-comment/does-it-matter-that-neil-gorsuch-is-committed-to-native-american-rights
About that Wisconsin election:
Iqbal, Nomia and Matza, Max. “Democratic-backed judge wins Wisconsin race in setback for Elon Musk.” April 2, 2025. BBC. https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cp8km3zg3kyo
The ACLU:
He’ll flash the gold card:
Venugopal Ramaswamy, Swapna. “For world's wealthy, a 'gold card' path to American citizenship is almost here.” April 10, 2025. USA Today. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2025/04/10/gold-card-trump-lutnick-millionaires/83033022007/
50501:
Derek May’s article about the march in Austin, Texas, published by our collaborator Flapper Press:
May, Derek. “My First Protest.” March 13, 2025. Flapper Press. https://www.flapperpress.com/post/my-first-protest
Very good, concise guides about it:
Drexel University. “Safety Tips for Protests, Rallies, and Marches.” https://drexel.edu/publicsafety/crime-reports-prevention/safety-tips/safety-tips-for-protests-rallies-marches
If you would like to read the Constitution:
National Archives. “The Constitution of the United States: A Transcription.” https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs/constitution-transcript
And Wolverine is a Marvel character who has healing powers, an adamantium-enhanced skeleton, and rage issues. But you already knew that.
