Brewsers #274- Steve Gonzalez

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Welcome to Bruisers podcast about beer, coffee, booze and bruisers.
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I'm your host, Rody John and today we talked to
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Steve Gonzalez. We talked about his lengthy career in alcohol,
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what is happening in beer, and so much more. Steve
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has done a little bit of everything, all going all
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the way back to the nineties. He's worked in Sierra Nevada,
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he worked with Gallo, He's worked with right now he's
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at Stone Brewing. He's done so much, and you don't
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want to hear from me, you want to hear from him. So,
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without further ado, here is Steve Gonzalez. Yeah, it is
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so weird that Hogan died today. And then yeah, tell
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us about So I didn't hear about that other person.
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So Jack mccauliffe, he founded New Albion Brewing Company in
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seventy six, I think it was, and they folded in
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nineteen eighty three. A New Albion was a reference to
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how Sir Francis Drake when he came through Sonoma. Okay, yeah,
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he's okay, when he came through Sonoma, he called it
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New Albion, Albion being the poetic name for England and
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he British style beers and pretty much Sierra Nevada formed
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their you know what they launched with kind of based
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on that model. Really yeah. Yeah, so kind of started
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the whole thing, which is kind of amazing, and then
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kind of a forgotten guy these days. Yeah. So he yeah,
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just passed I think six days ago. Wow.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's crazy. I keep hearing people, you know,
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obviously deaths coming threes and they think, now Hogan's the third,
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but then like, no, there's been other like musicians that
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have also died, and it's like, yeah, we got these
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brewery pioneers as well, and it's like, you know, when
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will it end?
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Yeah?
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Well, I mean, so I want to talk about Cier
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and Abada, but I want to go all the way
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back in time, real fast. What is your earliest memory
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of beer?
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Uh? I remember wanting to like it so bad school
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and it was a long, long, long time ago. I
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must have been sixteen, and I had a Boston lagger
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from Sam Adams, and I know my taste changed a lot,
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but it was way more bitter back in the eighties. Yeah,
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and I was just like hmm, it's good, and yeah
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it was. I don't know, there's just uh, there's this
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TikTok guy that says, like, you know, like he hates beer.
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He's like, this one's really good. Yeah, that reminds me
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of shoe leather. That was kind of That was kind
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of where I started because I, I don't know my
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my my family on my dad's side were did a
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lot of hospitality stuff. My grandma owned restaurants, So I
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I was always interested in food and stuff, and everyone
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talks about, you know, beer and single malt whiskey, and
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I wanted to try all that stuff.
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What was what was the what was your gateway craft beer?
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Then? Oh, gosh, probably probably Duval from Yeah, yeah, my
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my my godfather had some of that in his basement
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and said you want to try some of these? I
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was like yeah, and that was like that that blew
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my mind.
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What It's funny you say that because so Sierra Nevada
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is actually one of the most popular gateway craft beers.
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Anytime I asked that, it's always it's almost always Sierra Nevada.
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M H.
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So you started working there in ninety five. How did
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you even get was how did the what was the
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process like for you from actually finding beer that you
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enjoy too, because I had read that you did some
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home brewing in college and then you ended up working
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at Sierra. How did you end up at Sierra Nevada,
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especially in the nineties, Oh.
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Gosh, just taken. I was taken some brewing classes and
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there were a lot of people trying to get into
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the industry, and it was it was actually the training
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just couldn't keep up with the demand for brewers. Shockingly,
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but there was a guy that they offered the sh
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if the shift brewer job to. It's year in about
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a guy named Doug. And I don't even know if
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he's still in the industry. I don't I don't think
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he is. But he turned them down and he said, hey,
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I think they I told them they might like you.
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So why they why they took the recommendation from somebody
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that turned the job down, I don't know.
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Well, they wanted to pick them, so they obviously trust
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them enough to make beer, and you know, they probably
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trust their decision making as well.
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Maybe maybe, but but yeah, So I went up there
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and it was a it was a funny interview. It
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was like, I think it was only about half an
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hour long, and it was mostly with Steve Dresser, who
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just very distracted, like you know, he wasn't looking me
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in the eye, and like he's like, yeah, your benefits
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kick in after one year, and you know, and this
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is what you get. And I was like, you're not
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asking me about me or why I want to work here.
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And then he's like okay, and so we'll go we'll
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go talk to Ken and if Ken's not there, then
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we'll go have a beer. And so I go into
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Ken's office and Ken Ken was the ultimate auto did act.
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And that was my first impression of him was he
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had this big drafting table and he was actually drawing
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plans for for what we called the West Side Brewery,
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but the brewer that was he was working on next
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door to the to the to the you know, the
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Copper Clad or the not Copper claud the Copper Brewery.
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And uh, that was like, whoa, this is kind of intimidating.
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This giant you know, drafting table sits down, looks at
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my resume. He's like, well, it looks like you did
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a kind of an internship here. You just want to
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come here and work for a couple of years and
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then go be the head brewer. There. I was like, no,
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he's like Steve, I've got too many Steves here, No thanks,
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and like it's at his sense, and like he didn't
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laugh or anything, but it was like yea and yeah,
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like I said, it was about half an hour, and
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I just I drove back to where I was living
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in Northern California at the time, and I just I
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felt like, maybe think as a slug, you know, that's
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that up. Yeah, they called me the next day with.
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The job offer, so hilarious.
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Yeah, I don't know. I don't know how I made
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an impression. I'm not sure.
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Well, so you are growing up in the California area,
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obviously working at Sierra Nevada, and do you know the
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impact that that beer is having across the country, because
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I feel like once you kind of are working on something,
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you almost end up in a bubble unless you do
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maybe travel out and kind of see what else is
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out there. But from what I've read about you do
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seem like a very curious guy that you're always kind
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of figure, kind of always having your pulse on whatever's happening.
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Did you realize what was happening with Sierra Nevada when
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it came to the rest of that country.
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Yeah, I I mean, I I'd been reading you know,
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Michael James Jackson, you know, the beer author for a
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really long time. Of course, he thought very highly of
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Sierra Nevada. Everyone raved about Sierra Nevada and what like
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just their their their quality was very well known, and
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so yeah, absolutely it was extremely intimidating going to work
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my first, my first full time job out of college. Frankly,
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oh wow, yeah, so I got very very I was
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very fortunate. I was prepared as as prepared as you
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can be. But at the same time, it was like
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it was pretty intense.
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Yeah, well, so I read that you I mean, you've
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you've kind of touched almost a little bit of everything
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when it comes to the world of alcohol. You've done
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some distilling, you've worked in the wine making. How did
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you end up going and then working for Gallo? Because
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Gallo is for people that don't know, Gallo is just
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just giant can conglomerate of like all these different It's
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almost like an umbrella conglomerate situation because like people might
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know about like Constellation because of the fact that they
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own so much of the beer world, and also they're
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getting out of the wine. I believe they're maybe getting
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out of spirits, but they are for sure getting out
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of wine. But they gallow is basically the same thing.
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And they owned the Barefoot, they own obviously Galla Wines
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and so many other things. How did you end up
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going over there, because you know you are kind of
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touching a little bit of everything wired over there.
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Yeah, so it'll get a little bit personal here. But
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my first wife was very ill at the time and
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I was working for She ended up passing away a
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few years after I made that move. But a bunch
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of people from the company I had been working for,
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which was was Miller Brewing for about five years, they
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had they had jumped ship for for Gallo. So Gallo
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offered me a job, and then simultaneous to that, stone
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out of the blue, Mitch Steel, the brewmaster here at
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the time, called with the job offer to run the
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quality program here and and then Miller ended up counteroffering me,
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and I just like, because my wife was so sick,
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it was like what do I do here? And I
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literally all the benefits, paperwork and everything on the table.
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And the position they were offering was the quality quality
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manager for their NAPA locations which sounded great. Napa, California.
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I've always been in love with that.
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It's so beautiful there. I've said I could just live
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on a cot in the back of some place and
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just waking up to that and going like, it's just beautiful.
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Like if anybody's never been out there, you don't have
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to stop at one winery just driving through it. It's
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just so it's fantastic.
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Yeah, and you know, you get up into Calistoga and
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drive up over the mountains. Yeah, that's like another world.
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But it kind of it finally kind of came down
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to that component. It's like, well, my wife probably can't
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travel anymore, so let's at least live somewhere really really nice.
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The Miller job was killing me. I was down to
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about three Sundays a month as my days off, and
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it wasn't it wasn't worth it. Stone just the benefits
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package wasn't there yet. We're much better company now, but
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in terms of what we offer in terms of you know,
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compensation and benefits all that, it wouldn't have been an issue.
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But yeah, you know, but there's a different company then.
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A long story, and then I had actually always wanted
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to do I always wanted to run a group up.
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I always wanted to work multinational brewery. I always wanted
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to work for a regional brewery. I always wanted to
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work for a winery. I always wanted to learn distilling
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at some point, and I thought I thought I would
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do all that maybe by the time I was seventy five.
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But I got the opportunity to do all that before
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I was forty. That's nice. So it was a little
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bit of it was drive, but also it was just
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it just happened to kind of fall in my lap
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a little bit, right.
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Yeah, when you got something that's gonna fall in your
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lap like that, how are you gonna I mean, Plus,
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like you said, you don't want to spend all of
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your time at work because you have things at home
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that are obviously far more pressing. But yeah, obviously you
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still have to pay bills. You have to make sure
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the insurance is still going to where you are. So
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I mean that you know that move makes sense?
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Yeah versus history?
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Huh? Yes, Well, I am sorry for your loss, but
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obviously it brought some fantastic imagine memories being in the
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Sonoma for as long as you were. So how was
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how was the end for her was it. Did she
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enjoy that area as much as everybody else.
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She loved living in Napa and when I, you know,
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when I when I so, most of my family's from
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southern California, most of her family is from southern California,
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and it's like, I don't know, you know, there are
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days where I just I feel bad taking you away
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from all that. And she's like, I wish I had
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recordings of you talking about how freaking miserable you were
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at six and a half million beer barrels a year.
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Pretty oh, yeah, it's a lot of beer. And it
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was like, and I talked to another one of the
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former Miller guys that I was working with at Gallo,
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and he's like, my wife says the exact same thing,
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and make the right decision. But yeah, yeah, Gallo did
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a good job of taking care of me. I will
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say they it's a very very big company. It can
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be a little bit impersonal sometimes, but family did really
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matter to that company. So you know, that was cool.
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That is awesome. Yeah, I work for a distributor down
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here in Texas and they we do sell Gallows, So yeah,
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I've only dabbled with them a little bit, but it
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does seem like a very good company that does actually
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care about his people, not just one of those giant
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corporate conglomerates that like, eh whatever. Now, how did you
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end up over at Stone Brewing? Because you've been there
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for a little over thirteen years now and to a
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lot of people in America, and I've also now read
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the world it is one of the best breweries around.
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Like I know that we love it here obviously whenever
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we can get our hands on anything from Stone. But
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what is it? I mean, you've worked for Sierra Nevada,
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now you work for Stone, some of the best breweries
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in the country. How is how did you end up
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over at Stone? And what's that process been like for you?
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Uh? So, Lee Chase, who is the head brewer here
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for a long long time, very early days with the company.
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He started working for Stone, I think in ninety six,
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and so I had known him since ninety four and
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he had he had offered me a job in two
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thousand and two that I couldn't I couldn't take unfortunately,
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and then that was you know, that was before five
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years later Mitch offered me the job. But but yeah,
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well I've always had that tie here to Stone, so
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some people refer to it as the ten year interview
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process when I finally finally came aboard. So he offered
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me a job here in two thousand and two, which
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I didn't take also, so it took three job offers
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before I was able to kind of finally come work here.
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If that was what was the I know Straw that
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you were like, you know what, I guess finally I'll
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give this a chance.
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Well, I I had thought they would never hire me
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after telling him no twice right then. I just wasn't
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I wasn't too happy where I ended up working for
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for Gallo, you know, Modesto didn't do it for me
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after NAPA, you know. So I just emailed Mitch, who
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was our brewmaster here then in twenty twelve, and it
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was like he will never hire me, but you know,
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and then he got he got back to me within
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like an hour. Wow, And Mitch was not Mitch was.
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Mitch has always been known for that. You email him
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and he'll email you like right away, and I'm like,
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why do you do that? He's like, because I'll forget
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if I don't.
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Yeah, I can understand that. I'm also one of those
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guys that I don't like seeing the notification thing on there.
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So yeah, yeah, So it all happened pretty quickly after that,
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they you know, HR called me and said, you know,
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we've got got a couple of different openings, which one
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do you want the most? And I was like, well,
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the one I'm the most qualified for is the the
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research and small batch manager it was called at the time,
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So like, when can you come down? And I was like, well,
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actually down there for July fourth weekend, okay, and then
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I don't know, I think it was a month or
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something after that finally got the job.
295
00:17:32.759 --> 00:17:36.039
Damn you just just backing up into these jobs.
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Like it's yeah, it's kind of surreal.
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Actually, what if what do you feel like you learned
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the most? Well, I guess let's start it because you've
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been in different worlds. Obviously, where did you Let's start
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at Sierra Nevada. What did you Well, no, you can
301
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actually go back. No, yeah, you started at Sierra Nevada
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and then Miller, right or was it Miller and then
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Sierra Nevada, Nevada?
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First?
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Okay, what do you think you in the most from
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Sierra Nevada?
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You know that was definitely a devil's in the details
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kind of. So, you know, Sierra Nevada be in a
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bottle conditioned beer. They had this formula and you know
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beer is usually you know, around two point five volumes
311
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of CO two, and so they would they would take
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a measurement off of the bright tank. Okay, one point
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five volumes of CO two. They'd have a tape measure Okay,
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you know, look at the table, it's one hundred and
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eighty beer barrels. It's going to require this much sugar,
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this much yeast. And then you know, it would kind
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of like package and then go through a warmer and
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then sit in the warehouse for a temperature control warehouse
319
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for two weeks, refermenting in the bottle till it hit
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the and then you know they'd analyze it periodically and
321
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see where the CO two was. It was like it
322
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was a pretty The recipe itself is pretty basic first
323
00:19:00.960 --> 00:19:03.279
year and about of pale ale. It's you know, cascade
324
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hops and two different malts and that's really it. But
325
00:19:08.960 --> 00:19:11.960
that's it's a little bit more complicated than that, but
326
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not much, but but just that bottle conditioning and it
327
00:19:15.599 --> 00:19:18.920
was like it was wild I mean that was that
328
00:19:19.039 --> 00:19:21.400
was like hard to believe that someone was still doing that,
329
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you know, but yeah, pretty cool.
330
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And then let's go to Galla. What do you think
331
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you learned the most kind of touch in all that world?
332
00:19:31.960 --> 00:19:36.200
Yeah, I think one of the really interesting things that
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00:19:36.200 --> 00:19:38.920
winemakers do, and it's it's a really hard thing to
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00:19:39.359 --> 00:19:41.599
teach people if they don't get it. Is like, you know,
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you take two cases of something and something you're working
336
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on and okay, let's put you know, this oak chip,
337
00:19:51.480 --> 00:19:55.799
it's a point one two five pounds per one hundred
338
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gallons that this oak chip works for us in this style,
339
00:20:00.039 --> 00:20:02.680
and then we'll do two pounds in the next one.
340
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And then you know, you'd have a case with like
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all these different treatments and then you just kind of
342
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blend them together and like take all these really meticulous
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notes and years later, that's how I developed Tangerine Express
344
00:20:14.359 --> 00:20:18.079
using that exact same methodology. It's like, you know, there's
345
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just a bunch of different stuff on the table and
346
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we started kind of blending together. And that was a
347
00:20:23.000 --> 00:20:27.640
weird beer because it supposed to be it was all
348
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supposed to go to just one account on the East
349
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Coast and then it landed and Craft Brewers Conference was
350
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in Philadelphia that year, and the sales reps out there
351
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got it in front of Greg Cook, who was one
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of our founders, and like I got an email from
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again Mitch, our brewmaster the next day saying like, I
354
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need to know what's in Tangerine Express. They got it
355
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in front of Greg, and then Greg went back with
356
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one of my one of my colleagues, Jeremy to the
357
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to the bar to taste it again the next day
358
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and it was gone. It was all sold out. So
359
00:21:07.640 --> 00:21:10.599
then it was just a done deal at that point. Yeah,
360
00:21:10.680 --> 00:21:14.759
but yeah, that's that's kind of I don't know, that
361
00:21:14.839 --> 00:21:17.480
method of product development is still it's still a tool
362
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that I use today, you know, like mixing things together
363
00:21:21.039 --> 00:21:24.039
on a bench scale, and like big things can happen
364
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from like literally a case of beers sometimes.
365
00:21:26.960 --> 00:21:29.960
Yeah. Well so and then let's finally, now, let's what
366
00:21:30.240 --> 00:21:31.920
have you learned the most do you think working now
367
00:21:31.920 --> 00:21:33.079
at Stone?
368
00:21:35.759 --> 00:21:39.559
So in the interview process here, which was only an
369
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hour actually, uh, and it was a panel interview, yeah,
370
00:21:45.759 --> 00:21:48.759
but it was like literally five people interviewing me and
371
00:21:48.799 --> 00:21:52.480
it was only an hour. But uh, you know, I said,
372
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like hey, you know, I know I'll be running the
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pilot brewery. Just you know, I calculate everything by hand.
374
00:21:58.160 --> 00:22:03.359
I don't use brewing software and throw that's fine, and
375
00:22:03.400 --> 00:22:06.640
I still do that. I still I use a spreadsheet
376
00:22:06.680 --> 00:22:10.119
once we're ready to scale it up. Every pilot brew
377
00:22:10.160 --> 00:22:14.839
I do by hand. And I think you have to
378
00:22:14.960 --> 00:22:20.680
because like, sometimes there's a number in spreadsheets and software
379
00:22:20.759 --> 00:22:23.799
and all that that you use that and the numbers
380
00:22:23.839 --> 00:22:26.759
just don't make sense, and it's like, yeah, okay, let's
381
00:22:26.759 --> 00:22:28.720
recalculate it by hand. And then you go, you know,
382
00:22:29.279 --> 00:22:31.200
you spend an hour or two going through the spreadsheet
383
00:22:31.240 --> 00:22:33.440
trying to find where the error is and then correcting it.
384
00:22:33.440 --> 00:22:37.799
It's like, could you just use the you know, pencil
385
00:22:37.839 --> 00:22:39.680
and piece of paper.
386
00:22:42.119 --> 00:22:45.559
Well, so, so you're obviously an avid note taker, What
387
00:22:45.839 --> 00:22:49.839
where did you kind of where did that process come
388
00:22:49.920 --> 00:22:50.160
for you?
389
00:22:50.319 --> 00:22:51.200
Was it something in.
390
00:22:51.160 --> 00:22:53.440
School that you started to do, or was it when
391
00:22:53.440 --> 00:22:56.519
you actually started homebrewing yourself, or even when you got
392
00:22:56.519 --> 00:22:58.799
to maybe one of the bigger brewers.
393
00:22:59.160 --> 00:23:02.279
Oh gosh, yeah, it goes back to college. Really, I mean,
394
00:23:04.079 --> 00:23:10.559
I uh, getting through you know, physics and chemistry, and
395
00:23:11.039 --> 00:23:14.319
I actually I don't know. I never got over my
396
00:23:14.400 --> 00:23:17.200
childhood love of Indiana Jones stuff. So I actually took
397
00:23:17.240 --> 00:23:17.920
Greek in Latin.
398
00:23:18.079 --> 00:23:21.640
You know, wow, how much how fluent are you in
399
00:23:21.680 --> 00:23:22.200
both of those?
400
00:23:22.759 --> 00:23:28.279
I can still read Greek okay, but you know, I
401
00:23:28.599 --> 00:23:32.400
wasn't very good at languages. But you know, I learned
402
00:23:32.440 --> 00:23:35.240
pretty early on that there's like value to like writing
403
00:23:35.279 --> 00:23:41.519
things down. And really there's something about that muscle brain memory.
404
00:23:41.519 --> 00:23:44.480
I don't know like it, and it even if I
405
00:23:44.519 --> 00:23:46.400
never look at the notes again, which often I don't,
406
00:23:46.480 --> 00:23:49.680
it's it kind of helps it stick.
407
00:23:49.960 --> 00:23:52.000
Right because it's not just still living in your brain.
408
00:23:52.119 --> 00:23:55.079
You've actually put it out there. And they do say
409
00:23:55.119 --> 00:23:57.880
if you want something to happen or remember something, obviously
410
00:23:57.960 --> 00:23:59.279
write it physically, write it out.
411
00:23:59.759 --> 00:24:01.799
Yeah, yeah, it helps. Yeah.
412
00:24:04.279 --> 00:24:07.599
Well, you told me that you your family has been charitable,
413
00:24:07.720 --> 00:24:10.160
you know, basically your entire life, even at one point
414
00:24:10.240 --> 00:24:13.680
you went to Uganda. How did all that start? And
415
00:24:13.759 --> 00:24:16.880
what does that really kind of helped you? Obviously to
416
00:24:16.920 --> 00:24:17.880
this day continue that?
417
00:24:19.839 --> 00:24:25.400
Yeah? You know, I I my dad was my dad's
418
00:24:25.480 --> 00:24:28.079
you know, family were business people and there still are
419
00:24:28.160 --> 00:24:32.960
business people politicians that kind of thing as well. And
420
00:24:33.960 --> 00:24:36.160
my dad kind of wanted no part of that life.
421
00:24:37.240 --> 00:24:41.960
He never never cared about money also, so you know,
422
00:24:42.000 --> 00:24:46.160
he he wanted to become a doctor. Ah. You know,
423
00:24:46.240 --> 00:24:49.240
I'm not an especially religious person, but my my grandma
424
00:24:49.240 --> 00:24:53.519
converted to Seventh Dadminism. They love medicine in that religion.
425
00:24:55.759 --> 00:25:00.519
And so he went to a Seventh Dad school in
426
00:25:00.559 --> 00:25:03.319
this country and ended up going to a Seventh Dadis
427
00:25:03.480 --> 00:25:08.160
medical school and missionary work. Medical missionary work is just
428
00:25:08.160 --> 00:25:12.319
really common and he he just liked it, so they
429
00:25:12.359 --> 00:25:14.880
just kept doing it. My mom, my mom's eighty one,
430
00:25:14.920 --> 00:25:17.920
and she still goes to this thing in Chiapas that
431
00:25:18.000 --> 00:25:22.240
they do and that is all pretty much covered. Somebody
432
00:25:22.279 --> 00:25:25.279
donated like a bunch of money when they passed away
433
00:25:25.359 --> 00:25:29.839
to that charity and and she loves it. You know,
434
00:25:29.880 --> 00:25:31.680
you just pay your plane ticket and pretty much everything
435
00:25:31.680 --> 00:25:36.640
else is covered. But yeah, I'll be real quick on
436
00:25:36.680 --> 00:25:38.160
this story. It's going to take me a minute to
437
00:25:38.160 --> 00:25:40.799
get there. But my dad also had three medical students
438
00:25:40.839 --> 00:25:44.799
that he he trained. And I've got two brothers and
439
00:25:44.839 --> 00:25:47.279
they were like his fourth, fifth, and sixth sons. And
440
00:25:47.319 --> 00:25:50.400
my mom was like, hey, what do you think I'm
441
00:25:50.440 --> 00:25:53.960
thinking about going to Ghana with Jonathan. And as soon
442
00:25:53.960 --> 00:25:55.880
as she said Jonathan. I knew exactly who she was
443
00:25:55.880 --> 00:25:58.720
talking about, one of my dad's really close medical students.
444
00:25:58.720 --> 00:26:01.240
And I was like, oh, cool, you should definitely go.
445
00:26:01.440 --> 00:26:04.079
I hear great things. And and then I went back
446
00:26:04.119 --> 00:26:05.960
to her. I have just happened to visit her the
447
00:26:06.000 --> 00:26:08.359
next weekend and she's like, I got this tourist book
448
00:26:08.400 --> 00:26:12.279
for this trip to Ghana and it said Uganda Kenya.
449
00:26:12.799 --> 00:26:14.680
And I was like, I don't think you're going to
450
00:26:14.680 --> 00:26:17.519
Ghana if this is the tour bo yeah, You're like, no,
451
00:26:17.599 --> 00:26:19.000
it's Ghana. And I was like, I think you're going
452
00:26:19.000 --> 00:26:21.799
to Uganda. Yeah, and I think I'm going with you.
453
00:26:21.920 --> 00:26:23.920
She's like, well, you don't have a you don't have
454
00:26:23.960 --> 00:26:27.480
a medical background or anything. And I was like, I'm
455
00:26:27.519 --> 00:26:29.359
a brewer. I can I know how to use a broom.
456
00:26:29.599 --> 00:26:32.920
You know, I can claim like nobody's business.
457
00:26:33.039 --> 00:26:35.880
Yeah. Yeah. So it's like I ended up managing the
458
00:26:35.880 --> 00:26:38.119
pharmacy because I have, you know, a lot of chemistry
459
00:26:38.119 --> 00:26:40.799
and stuff. And it was fun. Man. So I eight
460
00:26:40.880 --> 00:26:42.480
thousand patients in five days.
461
00:26:42.839 --> 00:26:44.400
That's insanity.
462
00:26:44.680 --> 00:26:49.200
Yeah yeah, wow, Yeah, I'll get back out there at
463
00:26:49.200 --> 00:26:49.599
some point.
464
00:26:50.480 --> 00:26:51.200
That's awesome.
465
00:26:51.640 --> 00:26:53.880
Yeah, maybe the chap is tripped the next time I go.
466
00:26:53.880 --> 00:26:57.680
Down there, you go, yeah, Well, as someone who kind
467
00:26:57.680 --> 00:27:00.279
of also keeps up with the trends as to what
468
00:27:00.359 --> 00:27:02.519
is happening, because I mean, you're also a judge for
469
00:27:02.640 --> 00:27:04.960
the World Beer Cup, which is awesome, by the way,
470
00:27:07.079 --> 00:27:11.240
What do you kind of see what is happening right
471
00:27:11.279 --> 00:27:15.119
now when it does come to the next trends or
472
00:27:15.160 --> 00:27:18.440
what should we be looking for as we're recording. It's
473
00:27:18.480 --> 00:27:23.240
the end of July. Obviously stout season is about to
474
00:27:23.240 --> 00:27:25.599
come upon us, and I imagine, you know, from what
475
00:27:25.680 --> 00:27:28.920
I've heard, the pumpkin spice lattes coming out, so we'll
476
00:27:28.960 --> 00:27:31.000
have a lot of pumpkin beers coming up soon. But
477
00:27:31.039 --> 00:27:33.079
there's also still trends happening, like you were just in
478
00:27:33.119 --> 00:27:38.119
New Zealand and that that hop is becoming far more
479
00:27:38.160 --> 00:27:40.559
popular over here in America. I saw it for the
480
00:27:40.559 --> 00:27:42.680
first time in like two years ago, I think after
481
00:27:43.079 --> 00:27:48.160
I interviewed somebody from a Dallas brewery and I was like,
482
00:27:48.599 --> 00:27:50.720
is that where we're at now? This is New Zealand Hops?
483
00:27:50.720 --> 00:27:52.880
And then sure enough, yeah, get rolling out. So what
484
00:27:52.920 --> 00:27:56.200
do you kind of see the rest of twenty twenty five,
485
00:27:56.440 --> 00:27:59.319
you know, into twenty twenty six, looking like, yes.
486
00:27:59.200 --> 00:28:01.480
We just had a big meat with our biggest distributor,
487
00:28:01.559 --> 00:28:03.880
and we showed them a bunch of a bunch of
488
00:28:03.880 --> 00:28:06.680
beers and you know, my colleague Chris catch them. He wins.
489
00:28:06.799 --> 00:28:10.000
He just won another gold medal at the US Beer Open.
490
00:28:10.000 --> 00:28:13.400
I think it's called for his Simerian Portal, which is
491
00:28:13.440 --> 00:28:15.759
a stout he's been making for a really long time.
492
00:28:16.039 --> 00:28:18.400
He uses like flaked barley and all that, which is
493
00:28:18.960 --> 00:28:25.160
really traditional Irish dry stout ingredient. And you know, we
494
00:28:25.440 --> 00:28:27.160
showed them as brown ale. We showed them a bunch
495
00:28:27.160 --> 00:28:29.200
of stuff. These are seasonals we're thinking about. You know,
496
00:28:29.240 --> 00:28:32.319
they're not going to cannibalize stone ipa and and we
497
00:28:32.359 --> 00:28:34.359
also showed them a cold ipa and the one that
498
00:28:34.400 --> 00:28:36.799
they really gravitated to was the cold ipa. And they're like,
499
00:28:36.839 --> 00:28:41.119
we love all of these. We can't sell these right now.
500
00:28:41.160 --> 00:28:43.920
What we're facing is a lot of places have cut
501
00:28:43.960 --> 00:28:46.839
their taps in half. Right, Yeah, they've got yeah, they've
502
00:28:46.880 --> 00:28:49.480
got one West Coast, the Logger, they've got a hazy
503
00:28:51.079 --> 00:28:54.359
and then you know, maybe a couple of rotators. So
504
00:28:55.880 --> 00:28:59.519
give us an ipa and we can sell it. And
505
00:29:01.039 --> 00:29:03.359
I think, you know, we we had a beer that
506
00:29:03.400 --> 00:29:08.160
was very successful that my team developed, Scorpion Bowl, and
507
00:29:08.839 --> 00:29:11.880
it was a really much softer style. I p a,
508
00:29:13.440 --> 00:29:14.839
I want to do a little bit more of that
509
00:29:14.880 --> 00:29:18.079
because we've we've got West Coast really aggressive West Coast
510
00:29:18.119 --> 00:29:21.599
i PA is covered, We've got the covered. So I
511
00:29:21.599 --> 00:29:23.880
want to take a look at that. I think that
512
00:29:23.880 --> 00:29:28.559
that's maybe got some legs. Being in New Zealand, I
513
00:29:28.599 --> 00:29:31.640
was really impressed with the Nectaron and the Super Dela
514
00:29:31.680 --> 00:29:34.519
Cops that I smelled out there. It was like those
515
00:29:34.519 --> 00:29:38.039
are pretty new. And I wasn't super impressed with the
516
00:29:38.079 --> 00:29:41.039
Nectaron when I first smelled it, but like it's coming
517
00:29:41.119 --> 00:29:43.480
a lot. It's really come a long way. I think
518
00:29:43.519 --> 00:29:46.640
I want to do something with that, giving up all
519
00:29:46.640 --> 00:29:51.319
my secrets here. But yeah, to some extent, what's old
520
00:29:51.400 --> 00:29:55.240
is new and and and you know, stoutzer Stounts are
521
00:29:55.240 --> 00:29:59.119
a tough cell with just not out of tap handles anymore.
522
00:29:59.160 --> 00:30:01.799
You know, there's of being able to do a bar
523
00:30:01.799 --> 00:30:06.319
early one an Imperial Stout. You know, makeing Belgians are
524
00:30:06.359 --> 00:30:11.200
pretty much on hiatus right now. Yeah, and I missed
525
00:30:11.240 --> 00:30:14.599
those days. But I also love IPAs and I'm part
526
00:30:14.640 --> 00:30:18.240
of the problem. I really thank them either, you know, yeah,
527
00:30:19.640 --> 00:30:21.720
would like maybe once a month and be like, oh
528
00:30:21.880 --> 00:30:23.519
that sounds great. Yeah.
529
00:30:24.720 --> 00:30:28.039
So yeah, I've said it a lot of times on
530
00:30:28.079 --> 00:30:30.559
the show. I think that we've hit tilt when it
531
00:30:30.599 --> 00:30:34.880
came to the stouts, the craziness throwing, you know, sixteen
532
00:30:34.880 --> 00:30:37.920
different cheesecakes and all the vanilla into one beer. And
533
00:30:37.960 --> 00:30:40.200
then now we're back to, like you said, what's old
534
00:30:40.279 --> 00:30:44.119
is new again? The lagger. Like that is, if you
535
00:30:44.200 --> 00:30:46.559
are showing off you're a good brewer, you're showing off
536
00:30:46.559 --> 00:30:49.119
how good your logger is. Because I hear so many
537
00:30:49.160 --> 00:30:52.160
different brewers will go into other breweries and it's like
538
00:30:52.279 --> 00:30:54.359
when you go to a donut shop, you wanna try
539
00:30:54.359 --> 00:30:56.359
the glaze donut first, because if they fucked that up,
540
00:30:56.440 --> 00:30:57.680
the rest of us is not going to be good either.
541
00:30:58.319 --> 00:31:00.240
That's what they do. They'll go try the logger. If
542
00:31:00.279 --> 00:31:02.920
the lagger's not good, there's no reason to taste anything
543
00:31:02.920 --> 00:31:05.200
else because you can hide everything else in the other
544
00:31:05.240 --> 00:31:08.559
beers the lagger. Nope, you're not hading nothing.
545
00:31:08.920 --> 00:31:11.839
Yeah, we're really loving the happier style laggers too. And
546
00:31:11.960 --> 00:31:14.519
that's kind of where my colleague is really taking. You know,
547
00:31:14.640 --> 00:31:17.880
cold ip as and kind of embraced that. It's like, man,
548
00:31:17.920 --> 00:31:21.079
you did another one, but you know what, it's really good,
549
00:31:21.119 --> 00:31:24.039
so to keep it. I can't falter for that. It's fantastic.
550
00:31:26.319 --> 00:31:29.119
So yeah, but yeah, we're we're definitely doing a hell
551
00:31:29.160 --> 00:31:32.839
of a lot more. Yeah, it's flying.
552
00:31:33.359 --> 00:31:36.279
Yeah, well, I mean it's also summertime, so people need
553
00:31:36.319 --> 00:31:41.640
something nice sessionable and uh yeah patio pounders as they say, yeah, yeah.
554
00:31:42.480 --> 00:31:45.599
Yeah and oh sorry, no go for I was going
555
00:31:45.640 --> 00:31:49.559
to make on that front, patio Pounders. We just launched
556
00:31:49.599 --> 00:31:53.200
our first nationwide release of a session I p A
557
00:31:53.279 --> 00:31:58.079
and a long time so that style seemed pretty much
558
00:31:58.119 --> 00:32:00.720
dead for a while, but it seems to be back. Yeah,
559
00:32:01.440 --> 00:32:01.839
love it.
560
00:32:02.920 --> 00:32:09.279
I think the ipie's definitely went through that. You know,
561
00:32:09.440 --> 00:32:11.559
like they have that commercial of the guys with the
562
00:32:11.599 --> 00:32:13.960
super long beards and it's like, how happy is it?
563
00:32:14.000 --> 00:32:16.079
And it's like, we don't all like that. Yes, there
564
00:32:16.079 --> 00:32:18.000
are people that are very much into that, but there
565
00:32:18.079 --> 00:32:20.240
you know, there are the people that do want the
566
00:32:20.279 --> 00:32:22.920
hazies or like the sessionables, or the ones that are
567
00:32:22.960 --> 00:32:24.559
just on the you know, the lighter side of the
568
00:32:24.599 --> 00:32:27.319
ip as. We don't need. Oh god, that's every hop
569
00:32:27.359 --> 00:32:28.400
I could taste.
570
00:32:29.559 --> 00:32:31.920
Yeah, but I mean that that's.
571
00:32:31.599 --> 00:32:33.960
Just beer in general. Like you get any when any
572
00:32:34.039 --> 00:32:38.799
of the different styles, there's variances and there's range of
573
00:32:38.920 --> 00:32:41.519
like you can go this heavy or you can go
574
00:32:41.559 --> 00:32:43.519
this light with it. So and that's that's what's so
575
00:32:43.599 --> 00:32:46.519
great about the whole world of brewing in general, is
576
00:32:46.559 --> 00:32:49.400
that it is that art and science put together and like,
577
00:32:49.759 --> 00:32:51.480
all right, let's see what we can do and we
578
00:32:51.680 --> 00:32:55.480
find out what we can't do. So well, I have
579
00:32:55.519 --> 00:32:57.680
a segment I saw. I have a segment on the show.
580
00:32:57.680 --> 00:33:00.599
I call it the five count, which has five random questions.
581
00:33:01.160 --> 00:33:02.640
What are you nerding out on right now?
582
00:33:04.839 --> 00:33:09.400
I just completed the e learning for my Advanced Recreational
583
00:33:09.440 --> 00:33:11.039
TRIMEX diving class.
584
00:33:11.640 --> 00:33:13.799
I was going to get into Scooby, we got to.
585
00:33:13.880 --> 00:33:15.200
We ran that a time, a little bit. You are
586
00:33:15.240 --> 00:33:18.640
a very avid scuba diver for over forty years. That's
587
00:33:18.680 --> 00:33:21.079
awesome that you're continuing to learn obviously more.
588
00:33:21.680 --> 00:33:26.200
Yeah. Yeah, So you know, trimix is a helium mixture,
589
00:33:27.079 --> 00:33:29.039
so you can breathe a little bit deeper and be
590
00:33:29.519 --> 00:33:30.720
not get so fuzzy headed.
591
00:33:31.039 --> 00:33:31.240
Uh.
592
00:33:31.839 --> 00:33:34.640
And I've never done it before, so it's it's it's
593
00:33:34.640 --> 00:33:37.680
gonna be something I cross off the bucket list in October.
594
00:33:38.240 --> 00:33:41.160
It is still fascinating me that we know less about
595
00:33:41.160 --> 00:33:43.920
the sea than anything else, like really on the plane,
596
00:33:44.039 --> 00:33:47.279
like it's so crazy, you know, And James Cameron is
597
00:33:47.319 --> 00:33:48.880
the one that went the deepest in the ocean, like
598
00:33:48.880 --> 00:33:49.480
what are we doing?
599
00:33:49.559 --> 00:33:52.119
Hey? Yeah? Yeah. A friend of mine was like, why
600
00:33:52.119 --> 00:33:56.440
are we so concerned about exploring other planets when like this,
601
00:33:57.240 --> 00:34:01.759
just like this planet is like super Sorry I got
602
00:34:01.759 --> 00:34:04.920
the pronouns wrong, they because Robin goes by they. But
603
00:34:05.920 --> 00:34:10.360
you know, Robin was like, there's so much cool life
604
00:34:10.360 --> 00:34:12.400
and there's so much to see, and it's just like,
605
00:34:12.599 --> 00:34:15.960
you know, that's a great point. I love that feel
606
00:34:15.960 --> 00:34:16.480
the same way.
607
00:34:16.920 --> 00:34:19.280
Yeah, yeah, we're gonna if we find another planet, we'll
608
00:34:19.280 --> 00:34:24.719
suck it up too. So yeah, we're the problem. That's
609
00:34:24.159 --> 00:34:26.360
that's yeah. Uh.
610
00:34:26.559 --> 00:34:27.000
Number two.
611
00:34:27.039 --> 00:34:29.280
If you're a progress or mm A fighter, what would
612
00:34:29.280 --> 00:34:29.679
your name be?
613
00:34:29.880 --> 00:34:34.239
Oh gosh, uh, I want to say the cave diver
614
00:34:34.360 --> 00:34:36.920
or something, but I don't know that's good, you know what?
615
00:34:36.920 --> 00:34:37.840
That could be my stick?
616
00:34:37.880 --> 00:34:42.079
Actually, yeah, nobody's done it.
617
00:34:42.119 --> 00:34:44.079
Come out with some gills and maybe like you know,
618
00:34:44.199 --> 00:34:47.480
like yeah, like you know, some like kind of a
619
00:34:48.199 --> 00:34:51.119
arm Guard with like it.
620
00:34:51.360 --> 00:34:53.480
Yeah oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
621
00:34:53.440 --> 00:34:56.039
I don't know. Maybe maybe the Barracuda. Then let's go
622
00:34:56.119 --> 00:34:56.440
with that.
623
00:34:57.079 --> 00:35:00.920
This is good. Who was your first celebrity crush?
624
00:35:00.320 --> 00:35:05.000
Uh? I had it bad for Oh gosh, Patricia kat
625
00:35:05.480 --> 00:35:07.639
Oh yeah, Oh my gosh.
626
00:35:07.679 --> 00:35:09.119
She got better with age too.
627
00:35:09.280 --> 00:35:11.960
She looks great. Yeah, more gray hair, but she still
628
00:35:11.960 --> 00:35:12.440
looks great.
629
00:35:12.599 --> 00:35:15.000
There are there are so many people that worry about
630
00:35:15.000 --> 00:35:17.199
the gray hair, and I think it just adds a
631
00:35:17.199 --> 00:35:21.400
lot of character to a lot of people. Luckily, as men,
632
00:35:21.719 --> 00:35:24.679
we could just gradually do it. Women freak out about it.
633
00:35:24.679 --> 00:35:28.280
It's hilarious. Yeah. Uh Who are what inspires you?
634
00:35:28.639 --> 00:35:33.559
Uh? Geez. I was thinking about a bunch of my
635
00:35:33.639 --> 00:35:35.639
heroes the other day, and there's just there are there
636
00:35:35.679 --> 00:35:39.679
are a lot of them. Well, I suppose I could
637
00:35:39.679 --> 00:35:43.079
take that to a question that somebody asked me, who, who,
638
00:35:43.239 --> 00:35:46.519
what do? What? Two people would you have dinner with?
639
00:35:46.599 --> 00:35:50.280
And my my answer was James Cameron and Neil deGrasse Tyson. Yes,
640
00:35:50.880 --> 00:35:54.000
you know, I know, I know the dinner conversation will
641
00:35:54.039 --> 00:35:56.639
be all about the Titanic and and all about space
642
00:35:56.679 --> 00:35:59.440
and all about how consciousness there's no proof of consciousness
643
00:35:59.800 --> 00:36:02.119
kind of just after death and the same things I've
644
00:36:02.159 --> 00:36:04.519
heard both of them say like a billion times, but
645
00:36:04.599 --> 00:36:06.960
it would still be so entertaining.
646
00:36:07.039 --> 00:36:09.639
But well, because then you're actually part of the conversation too,
647
00:36:09.719 --> 00:36:11.920
So who knows where that will really even.
648
00:36:11.760 --> 00:36:15.079
Stee it either absolutely, yeah, yeah, I don't know. I
649
00:36:16.079 --> 00:36:17.519
suppose I'll stick with that answer.
650
00:36:18.039 --> 00:36:20.480
Those are two good people. What would you tire your
651
00:36:20.519 --> 00:36:21.360
seventeen year old.
652
00:36:21.199 --> 00:36:25.079
Self, get your heartbroken more? You know, but it'll be
653
00:36:25.159 --> 00:36:25.559
worth it.
654
00:36:25.679 --> 00:36:27.639
I'm going through that right now, So I completely understand.
655
00:36:29.559 --> 00:36:31.159
Now if people wanted to find out more about you,
656
00:36:31.320 --> 00:36:33.519
follow you online, see what you're up to next, see
657
00:36:33.559 --> 00:36:35.719
what Stone Brewing is going. How can they do all
658
00:36:35.719 --> 00:36:36.079
the things?
659
00:36:36.800 --> 00:36:40.400
I'm at Real Phantom Brewer on Instagram when I'm on Instagram,
660
00:36:41.000 --> 00:36:44.079
And then I think we have a mailing list you
661
00:36:44.119 --> 00:36:48.119
can subscribe to on on stone Brewing dot com, so
662
00:36:49.880 --> 00:36:51.719
you know, those are probably the best ways to figure
663
00:36:51.719 --> 00:36:55.559
out what I'm doing. A YouTube channel, but I don't
664
00:36:55.800 --> 00:36:59.480
I don't remember the handle exactly, but if you look
665
00:36:59.559 --> 00:37:04.280
up cosmel Spider Man dive when I scuba dived in
666
00:37:04.320 --> 00:37:08.519
a Spider Man costume on Halloween down in cos Smell,
667
00:37:08.599 --> 00:37:11.000
and it ends with some video of some really cool
668
00:37:11.039 --> 00:37:11.719
under shirts.
669
00:37:12.119 --> 00:37:13.920
Well I know what I'm doing right after we're done here.
670
00:37:14.039 --> 00:37:15.599
Yeah, you can probably find me that way.
671
00:37:15.880 --> 00:37:18.519
That's awesome, Steve, Thank you so much for your time.
672
00:37:18.599 --> 00:37:19.199
This has been fun.
673
00:37:19.320 --> 00:37:22.000
I don't think we've even scratched the surface of everything
674
00:37:22.039 --> 00:37:24.719
that you could talk about, So I please come back.
675
00:37:25.039 --> 00:37:27.639
And I have not been a stone in forever. Uh,
676
00:37:27.679 --> 00:37:29.719
so I need to make it out there without adult.
677
00:37:30.239 --> 00:37:30.679
Awesome.
678
00:37:30.719 --> 00:37:44.840
Thanks John, thank you, Thank you.
679
00:37:44.760 --> 00:37:46.440
So much to Steve for being on the show again.
680
00:37:46.719 --> 00:37:48.679
I feel like I've just scratched the surface with him,
681
00:37:48.679 --> 00:37:51.320
and he is more than welcome back anytime because there
682
00:37:51.360 --> 00:37:53.760
are so many more stories and so much more that
683
00:37:53.840 --> 00:37:56.480
I want to hear from him. So uh, definitely find
684
00:37:56.480 --> 00:37:58.639
out what is happening with him, but why you're doing that.
685
00:37:58.719 --> 00:38:00.960
Make sure to follow us on social media. It is
686
00:38:01.000 --> 00:38:03.159
bruisers Pod. That is b R E W S C
687
00:38:03.360 --> 00:38:06.159
R S p O D on the Instagram, the threads,
688
00:38:06.199 --> 00:38:08.639
and the Twitter. If you want to send us an email,
689
00:38:08.679 --> 00:38:10.679
it is Bruispod dot gmail dot com. If you want
690
00:38:10.679 --> 00:38:12.639
to follow me directly, it is Roady John. That is
691
00:38:12.760 --> 00:38:15.400
R O D I E j O N. Roady John
692
00:38:15.519 --> 00:38:18.159
is the name on the Twitter and untapped. Could you
693
00:38:18.199 --> 00:38:19.599
want to find out I'm drinking. Maybe we're gonna have
694
00:38:19.599 --> 00:38:21.239
a beer together. If you want off of follow me
695
00:38:21.320 --> 00:38:24.400
on the threads or the Instagram. It is official Roady John.
696
00:38:24.679 --> 00:38:27.280
So until next time, make sure to enjoy life, drink local,
697
00:38:27.360 --> 00:38:44.280
and cheers