WEBVTT
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BBHC, the frequency.
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Boulder County was formed in 1861 with three county commissioners.
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And we've had three county commissioners since we had a couple thousand people live in this county.
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Now we have 330,000 people live in the county.
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We've doubled the size of the county in the last 50 years, but we're still at three commissioners the same as we had in 1861.
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Should Boulder County add two commissioners?
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And if so, who should they represent?
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Happy Friday, frequency listeners.
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I'm Shay Castle, and today we're continuing our exploration of your very long ballot with a look at questions 200 and 201.
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Before we dive in, here's a word from our sponsor.
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Today's episode is brought to you by Boulder Bookstore.
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Come visit Boulder's Community Bookstore on the Pearl Street Mall.
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Besides having an amazing selection of books, they host author events every week.
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On Friday, October 16th, come see Neil Stevenson, author of D, Heavy Water, starting at 6.30 p.m.
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Visit BoulderBookstore.com to buy tickets, see a full list of upcoming events, and to support the store's Literacy Foundation in its mission to donate books to schools and students in need.
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That link, once again, is Boulderbookstore.com.
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Okay, back to your ballots.
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200 covers the yes or no vote on adding two commissioners.
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So let's start there.
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State law allows counties to have either three or five commissioners.
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Neighboring Larimer and Gilpin counties have only three elected officials.
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So does the more populous Jefferson County.
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But five others, including Weldon Adams County, have moved to five commissioners.
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And Douglas County voters are weighing the same question as Boulder County voters are right now.
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People like Bob Yates, whose voice you just heard, say the job of governing has gotten infinitely more complex since the three commissioner system was implemented more than 150 years ago.
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The county's population has expanded enormously, and local governments are handling more than they ever used to, from homelessness to housing, increasing wildfire risk, and more impacts of climate change.
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I worked with commissioners, both from my council seat and then from some nonprofits and chamber, and just came into contact enough to see that it looks like a really hard job and a big job to begin with.
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They have a more administrative component than like city council does.
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So they're doing a lot of work with a small number of people with a budget that's approaching a billion.
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That's Rachel Friend.
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She and Bob were part of Big Tent BOCO, a campaign that got these questions on the ballot via citizen petition.
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They both also used to serve on Boulder City Council.
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As I reported back in January, Big Tent is led almost exclusively by people who've held or run for public office, including sitting state senator Judy Amabale and current County Commissioner Ashley Stoltzman.
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Since our interview, a friend launched a campaign for Boulder County Treasurer.
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After winning her primary, she's now running unopposed.
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And if you look at the supporters now, it's pretty vast the political diversity of people who are like, yeah, this is more democracy is good.
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So it's not people who have the same political agenda, but just people who I think are clamoring for just more representation and more voice.
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Bob, Rachel, and others say more commissioners would spread out the workload and balance power.
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When I was on city council, when there was nine council members, I had to find four people that agree with me on something.
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I couldn't get something passed on my own, or even with one or two colleagues.
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I had to find four people which force compromise, which force discussion, which force listening.
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When you only have three representatives and two of them disagree, the person in the middle is the swing vote, right?
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One person is making all these decisions.
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And we don't have to look much farther than Washington, D.C.
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to see where when one person makes decisions, often turns out badly.
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And so I think with five, you're going to be put in a situation where three people have to agree on something rather than simply one.
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And that's going to drive, I think, better governance.
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That's why I think Douglas County is going to move to five commissioners.
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And that's why I think Boulder County should move to five commissioners.
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Former Commissioner Claire Levy argues the opposite.
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Most of the work is administrative, done behind the scenes rather than in public meetings, she told Colorado Hometown Weekly, arguing more people would only slow down the process and make getting things done more difficult.
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Claire's opposition to the measure is, quote, not about me and my job.
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It's just about good governance and whether this is going to solve problems or create problems.
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Fellow Commissioner Marta Lochemin is also opposed to the expansion.
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Boulder's labor union didn't endorse the measure because of the extra cost it would add.
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Commissioners are paid a$120,000 salary, mandated by state law.
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Proponents of question 200 say that's just a drop in the bucket of the county's overall$750 million budget and a worthwhile trade-off for what is hopefully an expansion of perspectives and expertise.
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I think these incremental two commissioners were in their keep.
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The City of Boulder has nine city council members who represent$100,000 people.
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City Longmont has seven city council members who represent 100,000 people.
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If that's the strongest argument that people can make, well, we should stick to our cling to our 1861 three-county commissioner model, I think it fails.
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So that's question 200.
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Question 201 would decide how new commissioners are distributed.
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Here's another clip from our January episode to explain.
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Two new commissioners could be added at large, meaning they would represent the entire county.
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That's how adjacent Weld County runs things.
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Or the measure could result in five redrawn districts with a representative from each, a la Arapaho County.
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That latter option is what Big Ten organizer Mason Moyer wants to see.
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And the way it's kind of divided up with districts right now for the three, we always end up with somebody from the western portion of Boulder City.
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And that person's it is wildly different from Boulder to the Mountains.
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The skill set, just the personalities, everything wildly different.
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And it's like anything.
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If you're gonna represent those people and you have a district that is as diverse as this county is as well, um you have to go, you gotta go there.
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You gotta be with the people, you have to be relatable, you have to understand what the problems are.
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And we don't have that.
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You know, we just haven't had it.
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And I think it's important not only for us in the mountains, but as somebody who's raised on a farm and has a deep connection to farmers, I think about everybody on the eastern side, and they deserve representation.
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Moyer is a resident of Ward who has also lived in Jamestown, Netherland, and Raymond.
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She wants more representation for rural communities in the mountains and eastern plains.
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In our January interview, she pointed out that the current commissioners are from Longmont, Boulder, and Louisville.
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And nearly all commissioners in recent history have hailed from one of Boulder County's bigger cities.
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Simply adding two at-large positions would likely only give more representation to the populous parts of the county.
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Because where the most people live is also where the most votes come from.
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That's left mountain folks feeling underrepresented and underserved when it comes to things like responses to and resilience building for natural disasters and climate change.
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People don't come up there and even campaign.
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We're just people in these towns.
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Where's our representation?
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Again, just like farmers, these folks were raised with uh a fierce independence.
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We do things for ourselves.
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We can, we are hardy folk, we can handle this.
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But nobody should have to be begging for resources.
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Not everyone in Boulder County's small towns agree with Mason.
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The commissioner issue has become an interesting divide in NIWAT as residents battle over whether or not to incorporate as their own town and get out from under county control.
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Neighbors for NIWAT, the group opposing incorporation, is endorsing the addition of two commissioners.
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A statement on their campaign website reads: with a five-member board, especially under the district model, the NYWAT area would have a much stronger chance of electing a commissioner who lives here, understands our community, and advocates for our interest at the county level.
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Pro-incorporation organizer Nick Little said the campaign's official position is that more commissioners won't make any difference to the small town of about 4,500.
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There's nobody to advocate on our part.
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We have no voting power, so we're 1.4% of the population of Boulder County.
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So we have no meaningful way to sort of impact the vote.
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And then there's even like a proposal to move it to five commissioners.
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That doesn't change it.
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We will still have like a negligible impact on the vote.
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Our position is vote however you want.
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That isn't going to solve our local problems.
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Personally, I mean, I don't think it's going to help.
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Because it doesn't change the fundamental governance structure, and it doesn't change, it just means you have five people rather than a local government.
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Some proponents of ballot question 200 and 201 question whether it will provide more representation.
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Brian Keegan, a CU Boulder data scientist, is supporting the expansion, but wants to add two commissioners at large rather than in districts.
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Because state law requires the districts be proportional and fair based on population, he worries about carving up the two biggest cities into Franken districts, opening the door to what he calls gerrymandering and election shenanigans.
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Boulder County has about 330,000 people.
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So if we divide it three ways, that's three groups of 110,000.
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And so Boulder and Longmont are both, coincidentally, around 110,000 people.
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So it's fairly straightforward to draw a district for Boulder, a district for Longmont, then a third district for everyone else.
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And so what I worry about with a five-district model is that that would end up being like five districts of about 66,000 people, is that you would end up having to split up Longmont and Boulder in some kind of way.
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Whenever you think about like trying to split up communities, that opens up room for shenanigans around gerrymandarine or territoriality.
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In making his case for at-large commissioners, Keegan directly acknowledges what Mason and other small-town residents are saying.
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More elected officials without districts essentially gives Boulder and Longmont residents three times the voting power as everyone else.
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Is there a risk that a three plus two model ends up just kind of giving Boulder and Longmont four votes on the council to like do whatever they want?
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I think that's definitely like a real and valid concern and override mountain and rural communities.
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But again, there's no guarantees that the at-large candidates have to be drawn from Longmont or Boulder either, although in reality they almost certainly will be.
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If you believe that we should have equitable representation, particularly if you live in a maybe a smaller town like Naiwat or Lyons or you live up in the mountains or Audenese County, you might want five districts because you might want to have someone who is kind of your representative.
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You don't want Boulder and Longmont to dominate things, and you would like to have a district that's drawn that represents your interests.
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Whichever way the district vote goes, if Measure 200 passes, it will be up to the current commissioners to redraw district boundaries.
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They would have until July 1st, 2027, to do so.
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The five commissioners elected in 2028 will serve according to whichever maps are approved.
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Big Tent as an organization isn't taking a stance on districts versus at large.
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At the end of the day, Bob said, the most important thing is evolving the county government to meet our modern day challenges.
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It's 165 years coming, and I think it's time for us to move to five.
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How the voters decide they like to do that three plus two versus five is really their choice.
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And I think people are going to kind of consider what they think is in their best interest and how they can have the best representation and the greater greatest access to commissioners.
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And that's really what we're striving for, regardless of which method the voters pick.
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One final note on campaign fundraising for this issue.
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Big Tent raised big bucks, including some very large donations from wealthy individuals.
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According to campaign finance records, Boulder mayoral candidate Achilles Lagrave gave$10,000.
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Former tech exec Dan Caruso donated$25,000.
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A Denver-based election reform group called Courageous Colorado gave another$10,000.
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Both Theory and Courageous Colorado have advocated for ranked choice voting throughout the state.
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Big Ten organizers said the campaign needed to hire petition gatherers in order to make the ballot.
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That explanation makes sense to me.
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It's expensive to get things on the ballot.
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But whenever I see big money in a campaign, it raises red flags, particularly when most of the funding comes from a handful of super wealthy millionaires and billionaires.
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I fully realize this is a personal bias, but I don't trust rich people to have my best interest at heart.
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To quote a very old, very pertinent working man slogan: none but General Lud means the poor man any good.
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That's all for today's show.
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Our election coverage continues next week with a look at the many, many taxes on your ballot.
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As always, thanks for listening.
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BBHC, the frequency.
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Boulder County was formed in 1861 with three county commissioners.
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And we've had three county commissioners since we had a couple thousand people live in this county.
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Now we have 330,000 people live in the county.
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We've doubled the size of the county in the last 50 years, but we're still at three commissioners the same as we had in 1861.
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Should Boulder County add two commissioners?
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And if so, who should they represent?
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Happy Friday, frequency listeners.
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I'm Shay Castle, and today we're continuing our exploration of your very long ballot with a look at questions 200 and 201.
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Before we dive in, here's a word from our sponsor.
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Today's episode is brought to you by Boulder Bookstore.
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Come visit Boulder's Community Bookstore on the Pearl Street Mall.
00:00:50.479 --> 00:00:54.880
Besides having an amazing selection of books, they host author events every week.
00:00:55.039 --> 00:01:03.439
On Friday, October 16th, come see Neil Stevenson, author of D, Heavy Water, starting at 6.30 p.m.
00:01:03.840 --> 00:01:14.400
Visit BoulderBookstore.com to buy tickets, see a full list of upcoming events, and to support the store's Literacy Foundation in its mission to donate books to schools and students in need.
00:01:14.879 --> 00:01:18.480
That link, once again, is Boulderbookstore.com.
00:01:18.959 --> 00:01:21.439
Okay, back to your ballots.
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200 covers the yes or no vote on adding two commissioners.
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So let's start there.
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State law allows counties to have either three or five commissioners.
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Neighboring Larimer and Gilpin counties have only three elected officials.
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So does the more populous Jefferson County.
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But five others, including Weldon Adams County, have moved to five commissioners.
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And Douglas County voters are weighing the same question as Boulder County voters are right now.
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People like Bob Yates, whose voice you just heard, say the job of governing has gotten infinitely more complex since the three commissioner system was implemented more than 150 years ago.
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The county's population has expanded enormously, and local governments are handling more than they ever used to, from homelessness to housing, increasing wildfire risk, and more impacts of climate change.
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I worked with commissioners, both from my council seat and then from some nonprofits and chamber, and just came into contact enough to see that it looks like a really hard job and a big job to begin with.
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They have a more administrative component than like city council does.
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So they're doing a lot of work with a small number of people with a budget that's approaching a billion.
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That's Rachel Friend.
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She and Bob were part of Big Tent BOCO, a campaign that got these questions on the ballot via citizen petition.
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They both also used to serve on Boulder City Council.
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As I reported back in January, Big Tent is led almost exclusively by people who've held or run for public office, including sitting state senator Judy Amabale and current County Commissioner Ashley Stoltzman.
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Since our interview, a friend launched a campaign for Boulder County Treasurer.
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After winning her primary, she's now running unopposed.
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And if you look at the supporters now, it's pretty vast the political diversity of people who are like, yeah, this is more democracy is good.
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So it's not people who have the same political agenda, but just people who I think are clamoring for just more representation and more voice.
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Bob, Rachel, and others say more commissioners would spread out the workload and balance power.
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When I was on city council, when there was nine council members, I had to find four people that agree with me on something.
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I couldn't get something passed on my own, or even with one or two colleagues.
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I had to find four people which force compromise, which force discussion, which force listening.
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When you only have three representatives and two of them disagree, the person in the middle is the swing vote, right?
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One person is making all these decisions.
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And we don't have to look much farther than Washington, D.C.
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to see where when one person makes decisions, often turns out badly.
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And so I think with five, you're going to be put in a situation where three people have to agree on something rather than simply one.
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And that's going to drive, I think, better governance.
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That's why I think Douglas County is going to move to five commissioners.
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And that's why I think Boulder County should move to five commissioners.
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Former Commissioner Claire Levy argues the opposite.
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Most of the work is administrative, done behind the scenes rather than in public meetings, she told Colorado Hometown Weekly, arguing more people would only slow down the process and make getting things done more difficult.
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Claire's opposition to the measure is, quote, not about me and my job.
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It's just about good governance and whether this is going to solve problems or create problems.
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Fellow Commissioner Marta Lochemin is also opposed to the expansion.
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Boulder's labor union didn't endorse the measure because of the extra cost it would add.
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Commissioners are paid a$120,000 salary, mandated by state law.
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Proponents of question 200 say that's just a drop in the bucket of the county's overall$750 million budget and a worthwhile trade-off for what is hopefully an expansion of perspectives and expertise.
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I think these incremental two commissioners were in their keep.
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The City of Boulder has nine city council members who represent$100,000 people.
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City Longmont has seven city council members who represent 100,000 people.
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If that's the strongest argument that people can make, well, we should stick to our cling to our 1861 three-county commissioner model, I think it fails.
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So that's question 200.
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Question 201 would decide how new commissioners are distributed.
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Here's another clip from our January episode to explain.
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Two new commissioners could be added at large, meaning they would represent the entire county.
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That's how adjacent Weld County runs things.
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Or the measure could result in five redrawn districts with a representative from each, a la Arapaho County.
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That latter option is what Big Ten organizer Mason Moyer wants to see.
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And the way it's kind of divided up with districts right now for the three, we always end up with somebody from the western portion of Boulder City.
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And that person's it is wildly different from Boulder to the Mountains.
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The skill set, just the personalities, everything wildly different.
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And it's like anything.
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If you're gonna represent those people and you have a district that is as diverse as this county is as well, um you have to go, you gotta go there.
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You gotta be with the people, you have to be relatable, you have to understand what the problems are.
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And we don't have that.
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You know, we just haven't had it.
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And I think it's important not only for us in the mountains, but as somebody who's raised on a farm and has a deep connection to farmers, I think about everybody on the eastern side, and they deserve representation.
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Moyer is a resident of Ward who has also lived in Jamestown, Netherland, and Raymond.
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She wants more representation for rural communities in the mountains and eastern plains.
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In our January interview, she pointed out that the current commissioners are from Longmont, Boulder, and Louisville.
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And nearly all commissioners in recent history have hailed from one of Boulder County's bigger cities.
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Simply adding two at-large positions would likely only give more representation to the populous parts of the county.
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Because where the most people live is also where the most votes come from.
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That's left mountain folks feeling underrepresented and underserved when it comes to things like responses to and resilience building for natural disasters and climate change.
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People don't come up there and even campaign.
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We're just people in these towns.
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Where's our representation?
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Again, just like farmers, these folks were raised with uh a fierce independence.
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We do things for ourselves.
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We can, we are hardy folk, we can handle this.
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But nobody should have to be begging for resources.
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Not everyone in Boulder County's small towns agree with Mason.
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The commissioner issue has become an interesting divide in NIWAT as residents battle over whether or not to incorporate as their own town and get out from under county control.
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Neighbors for NIWAT, the group opposing incorporation, is endorsing the addition of two commissioners.
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A statement on their campaign website reads: with a five-member board, especially under the district model, the NYWAT area would have a much stronger chance of electing a commissioner who lives here, understands our community, and advocates for our interest at the county level.
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Pro-incorporation organizer Nick Little said the campaign's official position is that more commissioners won't make any difference to the small town of about 4,500.
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There's nobody to advocate on our part.
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We have no voting power, so we're 1.4% of the population of Boulder County.
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So we have no meaningful way to sort of impact the vote.
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And then there's even like a proposal to move it to five commissioners.
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That doesn't change it.
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We will still have like a negligible impact on the vote.
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Our position is vote however you want.
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That isn't going to solve our local problems.
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Personally, I mean, I don't think it's going to help.
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Because it doesn't change the fundamental governance structure, and it doesn't change, it just means you have five people rather than a local government.
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Some proponents of ballot question 200 and 201 question whether it will provide more representation.
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Brian Keegan, a CU Boulder data scientist, is supporting the expansion, but wants to add two commissioners at large rather than in districts.
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Because state law requires the districts be proportional and fair based on population, he worries about carving up the two biggest cities into Franken districts, opening the door to what he calls gerrymandering and election shenanigans.
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Boulder County has about 330,000 people.
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So if we divide it three ways, that's three groups of 110,000.
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And so Boulder and Longmont are both, coincidentally, around 110,000 people.
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So it's fairly straightforward to draw a district for Boulder, a district for Longmont, then a third district for everyone else.
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And so what I worry about with a five-district model is that that would end up being like five districts of about 66,000 people, is that you would end up having to split up Longmont and Boulder in some kind of way.
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Whenever you think about like trying to split up communities, that opens up room for shenanigans around gerrymandarine or territoriality.
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In making his case for at-large commissioners, Keegan directly acknowledges what Mason and other small-town residents are saying.
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More elected officials without districts essentially gives Boulder and Longmont residents three times the voting power as everyone else.
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Is there a risk that a three plus two model ends up just kind of giving Boulder and Longmont four votes on the council to like do whatever they want?
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I think that's definitely like a real and valid concern and override mountain and rural communities.
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But again, there's no guarantees that the at-large candidates have to be drawn from Longmont or Boulder either, although in reality they almost certainly will be.
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If you believe that we should have equitable representation, particularly if you live in a maybe a smaller town like Naiwat or Lyons or you live up in the mountains or Audenese County, you might want five districts because you might want to have someone who is kind of your representative.
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You don't want Boulder and Longmont to dominate things, and you would like to have a district that's drawn that represents your interests.
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Whichever way the district vote goes, if Measure 200 passes, it will be up to the current commissioners to redraw district boundaries.
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They would have until July 1st, 2027, to do so.
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The five commissioners elected in 2028 will serve according to whichever maps are approved.
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Big Tent as an organization isn't taking a stance on districts versus at large.
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At the end of the day, Bob said, the most important thing is evolving the county government to meet our modern day challenges.
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It's 165 years coming, and I think it's time for us to move to five.
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How the voters decide they like to do that three plus two versus five is really their choice.
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And I think people are going to kind of consider what they think is in their best interest and how they can have the best representation and the greater greatest access to commissioners.
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And that's really what we're striving for, regardless of which method the voters pick.
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One final note on campaign fundraising for this issue.
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Big Tent raised big bucks, including some very large donations from wealthy individuals.
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According to campaign finance records, Boulder mayoral candidate Achilles Lagrave gave$10,000.
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Former tech exec Dan Caruso donated$25,000.
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A Denver-based election reform group called Courageous Colorado gave another$10,000.
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Both Theory and Courageous Colorado have advocated for ranked choice voting throughout the state.
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Big Ten organizers said the campaign needed to hire petition gatherers in order to make the ballot.
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That explanation makes sense to me.
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It's expensive to get things on the ballot.
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But whenever I see big money in a campaign, it raises red flags, particularly when most of the funding comes from a handful of super wealthy millionaires and billionaires.
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I fully realize this is a personal bias, but I don't trust rich people to have my best interest at heart.
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To quote a very old, very pertinent working man slogan: none but General Lud means the poor man any good.
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That's all for today's show.
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Our election coverage continues next week with a look at the many, many taxes on your ballot.
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As always, thanks for listening.
