WEBVTT
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So, hi everybody, welcome to our webinar today titled The Digital Disruption of Directorship: How Technology is Modernizing an Ancient Art.
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Now we have two special and new guests for our webinar today, Ben Mikavoy and Sorin Thommer.
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And we are joined by Helen Van Orten, who most of you should know already.
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So welcome, team.
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My name is Sean MacDonald, and I shall be your moderator in the background for the next 40 odd minutes.
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Firstly, thank you for attending today.
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We always appreciate the effort you make to be here for our uh live webinar events and join the session.
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It just enables us to keep a track of things as we're going through the session.
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And we'll try and answer as many of those questions as we have time for.
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And finally, if you stay through till the end, which of course we hope you will do, and even Tony in New York, if he stays awake, we have a really short one-minute survey for you at the end of the webinar, which we would love you to consider.
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Your feedback really helps us bring relevant content to you week after week, and it enables us to position the uh the great team of experts that we have.
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Uh so please take a minute to complete the webinar at the end of the survey at the end of the webinar, I should say.
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So, for those not too familiar with BoardPro, we are a board software provider, sometimes called a board portal, and we serve just over 35,000 users around the world, servicing about 4,000 boards and about 8,500 committees, would you believe?
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We enable organizations to prepare for and run their board meetings more efficiently and effectively, with less time, and deliver more impact and value for the organization.
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So for the next 45 odd minutes, just sit back and relax and add to the discussion by asking as many questions as you would like.
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A full recording of the webinar along with the slide deck and transcript will be sent to you not long after our webinar today.
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So let me have uh our new team introduce themselves, starting with you first, Ben.
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Well, thanks, Sean.
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Uh, my name is Ben McAvoy, um, managing director of digital directors.
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This is a membership-based social enterprise that is very much interested in the topic of today.
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Uh, championing digital governance excellence is our tagline.
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So we're here to support aspiring and established and senior directors bring digital capabilities onto boardrooms and governing bodies.
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Thanks, Ben.
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Sorin, to you, sir.
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My name is Soren Toma.
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Um, I'm also a board director of the Sydney Isaka chapter.
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Uh, I do a lot of board advisory work when it comes to cybersecurity and artificial intelligence, primarily from a governance and strategic perspective.
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Thanks, Soren.
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And everyone should know Helen, but uh Helen, would you like to introduce yourself to those that don't?
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Thanks, Sean.
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Kira, everyone.
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I'm Helen Van Outten.
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I'm an experienced board director and chair, um, and I also run a training consulting business directly.
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Um, and at directly we empower boards and execs to lead with confidence in the AI era, um, offering training, insights, um, and governance frameworks to help you lead through this new technology in this new era and really turn that technology into strategic advantage.
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Thank you.
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Thanks, Helen.
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Thanks, team.
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So over to you, Ben.
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Lovely.
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So let me know when you can see my screen.
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Yep.
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Fantastic.
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All right.
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Well, you know us all already.
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So uh let's jump in and I want to frame things today um uh from the context of the impact of not just digital governance but digital trends around the world on governance.
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So um for uh for for those of us here in Australia, uh obviously this matter spans across Australia and New Zealand, um, and in fact around the world.
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But for those of us in Australia, where it kind of starts here.
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This is Joe Longo, he's the ASIC chair, so that's our corporate regulator here in Australia.
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Uh, and he's been lighting the signal fires around uh digital governance expectations in boardrooms in Australia for a number of years now.
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Um, this is his quote uh from an AI CD presentation he gave in 2025.
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Australia's falling to the back of the pack in the global race to fit innovation.
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Uh, and he connects that to the capabilities of digital governance in corporate boardrooms.
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So he's concerned about the lit the links between national prosperity and the lack of boardroom capability in this area.
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Uh and Joe Longo has a point.
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Uh, the Harvard study on uh economic resilience, essentially how sophisticated an economy is.
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Uh, Australia ranks 105th of the 145 countries measured.
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Um, we are just behind Botswana in 104th.
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So our economic growth has dropped 80% in our lifetimes and is currently the lowest it has been in 60 years.
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Now, New Zealand are a little better than us at 68th.
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Uh but both countries languish well below the mean.
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So amongst OECD countries, we are the first worst, that's Australia, and third worst, that's New Zealand, on this measure of economic complexity, with Chile between us, right?
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That's a country where the average income is about$20,000 a year.
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So if you place your eye on that black dot of New Zealand and you run it to the left, to the mean line, above which all OE other OECD countries live, other than Canada, you can see there.
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That distance is what I call the lucky quotient.
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That's where, based on the sophistication of our economies, um, we would sit if it wasn't for the fortunes of geography, history, and natural resources.
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So trace trace left from New Zealand, you can see where you'd hit uh that line.
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Um now do the same for Australia.
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If we weren't blessed by those factors, the lack of technological development in our economy will put our GDP per capita in the bottom third of the world, well below that 100 mark, which is the GDP average.
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And this is ranked on purchasing power per capita, that's PPP, uh, which is about$38,000.
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So we'd be about 20% below that, based on the sophistication of our economy, if it wasn't for the blessing of those natural resources and history.
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So truly, we are the lucky country.
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So Joe Longo thinks Australia's falling uh behind in innovation, particularly when it comes to digital technologies.
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And just before he left ASIC in 2026, uh earlier this year, uh he echoed that same sentiment in an address to the Tech Council of Australia.
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He linked those consequences more directly.
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He said, if we do not embrace new market technologies now, we will be poorer as a nation for it in the future.
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And Joe Longo has a point.
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This is data from the IMD World Digital Competitiveness Rankings.
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We do okay.
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69 major economies ranked, 23rd Australia, we're ahead of New Zealand this time, which is nice.
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Uh, at 28th of 69.
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Um But that is a measure which takes in things like credit rating, talent, education, regulatory frameworks, and modern technology adoption amongst the society.
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But once we begin to look at measures which are relevant to organizations and boards, we get a very different picture.
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We drop from the top third to the bottom third when it comes to capital deployment for future technology, uh technological investment.
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This is a major function of the board.
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And in business agility, uh, this is essentially innovation.
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Uh, we drop even further, both Australia and New Zealand slide even further in those rankings.
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Um, and to give you a sense of how we measure up against those other economies, Australia in 53rd and New Zealand in 46th, just above us is Nigeria ahead of Australia, and Botswana again, just ahead of New Zealand.
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There is one category in this study which is most relevant to directors, uh, and it speaks specifically to the function of boards.
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So the first is opportunities and threats.
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So this is strategy and risk governance.
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Sliding again, this is Australia's measure 57th.
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And then adaptability and flexibility is measuring innovation.
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We're we're fifth last in the world at corporate innovation, business agility.
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Um, it's as it's New Zealand's lowest ranking in this in this study at at 47th.
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That's the that's their lowest ranking of every measure on that study at 47th.
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So Joe Longo thinks that a big part of that problem is board composition.
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He's repeated over and over.
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We need more science in the in the boardroom.
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We need, in particular, more technology backrooms, uh, backgrounds in our boardrooms.
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Uh and Joe Longo has a point.
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Just 7.7% of directors uh in publicly listed companies in Australia have a technology background.
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Um, when you survey directors, not even one in six claim to have any level of digital competence above basic familiarity or literacy.
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Um now the good news is 7.7% feels low, but it's rising.
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It's up from 7.1%.
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The bad news is it took four years to rise that much.
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At that pace, and if you think the average number of um board members in a board is about seven, at that pace we will have one digitally competent director in every boardroom in ASX publicly listed companies by 2055 at that pace.
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The New Zealand figures are similar.
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Recent IOD report shows that when measuring experience amongst Crown and NSX 53 corporations, remember, these are the most well-governed organizations in New Zealand.
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Technology is ranked as the third last skill above only farming and HR.
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And when it comes to formal qualifications, technology is dead last of qualifications held by directors.
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So, what would the benefits be of having more digital skills on boards?
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Well, uh in the US, by comparison, the MIT study uh in 2019 uh measured digitally savvy boards, what they call digitally savvy, which means having at least three directors with digital expertise.
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They, those boards outperformed their peers by between 17 and 38% on these key metrics you see on this screen here.
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Um, and when this was released in 2019, just 24% of public US boards met this criteria.
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24% met it in 2019.
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Last year, that was 72%, with three or more digitally expert directors.
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And this standard is now so widely adopted that it has basically become redundant.
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Almost every public um board now meets this measure in the US.
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Um, and so the reporting now has turned, MIT have turned it from digitally savvy boards now to AI savvy boards, uh, where they demonstrate that AI savvy boards um have another 20% competitive advantage over um their peer organizations.
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Uh let's compare that to the ASX.
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These are again our most well-governed organizations in in Australia.
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Only 30% of them even list digital skills as a competency in their skills matrix.
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And when they do measure it, 49% of the time, it's the least well-represented skill, almost half the time.
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And if you go to the second least represented skill, that number jumps from 49% to 73%.
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So digital skills, if it's even on the matrix, is is very frequently the last or the second last in terms of representation on the boards.
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And here's the kicker the ASX Tech Index, the ATEC, it's 53 of Australia's most leading technology-related companies.
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Just six of them would meet an MIT digitally savvy criteria of having three directors with um digital expertise.
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So let's talk about the impact of digital competence in boardrooms, the changes in the digital age that brings to our um expectations of governance.
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We can talk about the need for digital expertise on boards.
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What are the challenges of bringing that expertise into boardrooms, whether it's people with digital backgrounds or whether it's bringing those skills to existing directors?
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Uh let's talk about the changing regulator expectations.
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ASIC and APRA have both been clear about those expectations on directors now increasing in terms of digital competence.
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Uh, we can talk about how digital directors bring to the board new ways of thinking.
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Um, people with technology backgrounds think differently, they address problems differently, and that diversity of thought is valuable in the boardroom.
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Uh, how the pace of change is challenging traditional governance controls when AI is iterating so rapidly.
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Um, the ASD just released uh a um a message recently that said that if you have set your risk profile for cybersecurity more than six months ago, AI have has already changed that.
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And you can't wait another year or two years to go back and reassess your risk framework.
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It was invalidated a couple of weeks ago.
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Um technology in the boardroom, the use of AI for um dealing with minutes, dealing with board papers, what is the use?
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And sometimes we even hear about uh virtual board members, right, in the in the boardroom.
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So technology is making its way physically into the boardroom.
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Uh and then we'll finish with quite the few childs.
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All right, so let me let me get started uh and bring Helen and Sorin in.
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Um so let's talk first of all about the pace of change.
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So I think AI is really challenging digital controls.
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And and if you have questions on this, by the way, on any of those topics, please put them in the chat and we'll make sure that we get to to answering those and we'll put them to Sorin and Helen as well.
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But Sorin, maybe you can lead us off.
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Pace of change, uh, AI is challenging digital controls.
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Um, give us your thoughts on that.
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So, look, uh, AI is having a major impact because it's starting to get into areas that have been the same at board level for many decades.
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For example, audit.
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So audits have always taken place the same way.
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Yes, technology has come in 20, 25 years ago, and that's improved things a little bit.
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Well, AI coming now has a major, major impact.
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Um, and in some cases, we have a lot of interesting combinations that we haven't thought about.
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So many companies like the Commonwealth Bank, Telstra, they're already using AI in many areas within their companies.
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And so if you're using AI for audit, you have AI auditing AI, and that has certain implications that are not understood.
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Um, for example, the challenge is trust, because we know that AI can hallucinate sometimes.
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So the question becomes in an audit environment where accuracy is absolutely critical, um, what happens when AI gets it wrong?
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Uh so you can see that the change coming through is massive.
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Another implication there would be we no longer need to do just sampling when we do audit.
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We could actually audit everything, but that turns AI into big brother.
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Do you want every transaction actually being audited?
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And what happens if you have many false positives and it generates a lot of work that shouldn't be there?
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So um technology and and nowadays it's mostly about AI, uh, is going to have a major impact, is going to change things, and it can change things for the better.
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But before it does, there is a bit of a work to be done.
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What do you think, Ellen?
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I was just going to build on that.
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Sorry, and I love that you chose the audit as an example because I was actually at the IOD governing AI forum a couple of months ago.
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And in that, KPMG actually walked us through how they're using AI in audit.
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Um, and it's to exactly your point.
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It moves from instead of just doing a whole load of samples on a data set and just picking up those anomalies, it's now moving from that instead of being 45 transactions and extrapolating the information, it's now becoming exception-based.
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So it's testing everything and going for the outliers.
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Um, and that's a really big change.
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And I think a lot of audit committees haven't caught up with it.
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Uh, I think a lot of us in the room at the time were hoping, in fact, they asked us to do a show of hands.
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Um, and we all thought that the audit costs were going to come down.
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Sadly, that wasn't the case.
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Uh, it just means that the time from the auditors is going to be used differently.
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Um, but to your wider question, Ben, around that pace of change, um, I think, you know, auditing is one element of one profession.
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Um, but in the AICD survey that they did earlier this year, more than half of the directors surveyed were saying about the pace of change is already faster than their organization can handle.
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And again, if we step back to a board-level thinking around that, it's there's a challenge on our board cycles around keeping up with that.
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You know, depending on your board, you might have six, eight, twelve meetings a year, but the papers are often written a couple of weeks out, decisions coming in a month after that.
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Um, and by the time you've approved something, it's probably completely out of date.
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We literally had a, I was at a meeting this morning with one of my boards, and we were talking about cyber, and literally all of the stuff that's happened in the last few weeks had happened since the papers were submitted to directors because they've got to be there a week before the board.
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And so just that whole cycle is really, really challenging to keep up.
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Um, so you know, we need to think as boards, what does that mean for our reporting?
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Uh, not just risk, you know, adoption, spend, what's working, what's been switched on in our organization, what have management, you know, made decisions um around, and particularly in that AI space, as a board, are we making sure that we're seeing that at every board meeting rather than just a sort of a backward-looking report a couple of times a year?
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Um, yeah.
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Yeah, yeah, I think that's really good insight.
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Um, Helen, the the and we talked about the disruption to an ancient art here, and it may just be that the pace of change in the digital age just means that some of these established cycles, the six-month, quarterly, annual, through biannual cycles, need review when it comes to specifically dealing with digital matters.
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And let's face it, digital matters have a very broad-ranging impact throughout the um the organization, modern organizations, right?
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Um, technologies in in everything.
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Um, there's a great question here uh about um the why digital is lacking in boardrooms.
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Do you think it's related to education of those board members who may not have had digital teaching during their education?
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So maybe we can talk about that.
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Questions on the need for digital skills, um, you know, boards signing off on things that they don't understand.
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Um, Helen, give us your thoughts on those skills in the boardroom, you know, and and that directors grappling with that kind of new education they need to bring to themselves, I guess.
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Yeah, it's funny when I read that earlier, I was thinking, gosh, back in the day I did part of my degree in computing.
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So I don't know if that uh qualifies me as a digital director, because I don't know that learning Pascal coding uh probably qualified me for anything at this stage in my career.
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But um there we go.
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Um I think there's definitely part of it, but I mean, all of us have different career trajectories.
00:21:42.160 --> 00:21:52.000
And I um, having started my career in computing, went off and did a whole load of other things and didn't come back into the tech element literally until I was on an exec team.
00:21:52.240 --> 00:21:58.799
Um so I think part of it, I mean what I always talk to directors about is actually curiosity.
00:21:58.960 --> 00:21:59.759
So curiosity.
00:22:00.319 --> 00:22:11.759
I think it is the most important attribute to have as a director, and particularly in this AI world, being curious and the fact that you've turned up today means that you are curious, which is great.
00:22:12.799 --> 00:22:19.359
I'll probably jump on to a little bit about what we were talking about, we were going to talk about a little later in the session, if you're okay, Ben.
00:22:20.000 --> 00:22:27.759
But that whole AI knowledge piece is around the amount of boards who want to bring on that AI knowledge.
00:22:27.839 --> 00:22:31.440
And you had a load of stats from New Zealand, Australia, the US.
00:22:32.000 --> 00:22:36.000
Deloitte did a big study last year, which I'm waiting for the updated version to come out.
00:22:36.160 --> 00:22:42.799
But at that point, they were saying 40% of boards were looking to bring on a director specifically with AI knowledge.
00:22:42.960 --> 00:22:54.799
And to your point, Ben, the challenge is there's literally not enough people in the market who've got that deep capability and the broader governance experience that you need for the board seat, which is where digital directors comes in.
00:22:54.960 --> 00:23:06.559
But um and Hydric and Struggles in the US again did some surveying on in March this year, and the new director appointments at that point, only 6% of them have got that technology.
00:23:06.720 --> 00:23:10.640
Um so sure that's the US, but that pool is really small.
00:23:10.799 --> 00:23:18.000
So as a board, I think if you're waiting for that unicorn candidate to come along, you might be waiting a really, really long time.
00:23:19.200 --> 00:23:25.359
But there is a really important piece for us as directors to think about what are the skills we bring to the table.
00:23:25.440 --> 00:23:30.000
Um I don't want to talk for too long because I want to make sure Sorin's got a chance to jump in as well.
00:23:30.160 --> 00:23:34.559
But um the T-shape director that we always talk about.
00:23:34.640 --> 00:23:51.599
So you've got your deep vertical knowledge, which might be marketing or accounting or finance or law or whatever is, or probably two or three of those for most directors, but then that T across the top of it, and this will be answering your question, um, Suzanne, as well, which is making sure that you've got enough knowledge across the top.
00:23:51.759 --> 00:24:00.480
Like I'm not an accountant, but I can still ask good questions about the financials in the board meeting because I've made sure that I've upskilled myself to uh get that coverage.
00:24:00.720 --> 00:24:04.160
But to your question, how do you uplift the board capability?
00:24:04.319 --> 00:24:13.200
And you're a big NZX board or an ASX board, then sure you're going to be bringing in your Deloits and your PWCs, etc., and they'll be helping support that training.
00:24:13.359 --> 00:24:30.319
Um, but there's a lot of people and companies like myself and and Sorin who actually go in and help boards with their AI training and capability, which is actually elevating the board's overall internal baseline so everyone on that board table can ask the right questions and have the right knowledge across.
00:24:30.400 --> 00:24:40.400
And Deloitte did some research on that earlier this year, and most boards are building that capability through briefings, director education rather than just through direct recruitment.
00:24:40.480 --> 00:24:47.519
Um, another thing you can do, which is we've done on one of our boards, is on our technology committee, we've brought in an external technologist.
00:24:47.680 --> 00:24:52.160
So they don't sit on the main board, but they bring that deep expertise into the technology committee.
00:24:52.319 --> 00:24:53.279
Sorry, I've talked enough.
00:24:53.359 --> 00:24:53.680
Sorry.
00:24:54.240 --> 00:24:55.039
That's all good.
00:24:55.680 --> 00:25:02.799
The minute that you mention the word cybersecurity, say, for example, in a board context, most directors think, oh, technical.
00:25:02.880 --> 00:25:03.200
That's it.
00:25:03.279 --> 00:25:04.000
I'm past that.
00:25:04.079 --> 00:25:05.440
That's beyond it's below me.
00:25:05.519 --> 00:25:06.960
It's it's somewhere over there.
00:25:07.440 --> 00:25:19.200
And one of the things that I have to do when I talk to b boards is immediately break that link because our brains have been wired to think, oh, cybersecurity is all about technology, it's all technical.
00:25:19.440 --> 00:25:20.400
No, it isn't.
00:25:20.559 --> 00:25:26.400
At the board level, it is all about risk, it's all about exposure, it's all about resilience.
00:25:26.559 --> 00:25:33.119
So if something happens, how quickly can your organization get over it and continue to trade and uh prosper?
00:25:33.680 --> 00:25:36.319
And it's also about enterprise value.
00:25:36.480 --> 00:25:38.000
So I'll give you an example.
00:25:38.160 --> 00:25:45.519
There was a proposal that was presented to a board to bring in a new security incident event management system, and it was going to cost$50 million.
00:25:46.319 --> 00:25:52.240
So I asked a simple question what is the exposure that you're trying to mitigate?
00:25:52.480 --> 00:25:58.640
And people thought I was asking for a big risks matrix, and suddenly I got this spreadsheet with about 50,000 line items.
00:25:58.720 --> 00:25:59.759
I'm like, no, no.
00:26:00.000 --> 00:26:01.119
What is the amount?
00:26:01.279 --> 00:26:05.359
What's the worst case scenario for the risk that you're trying to mitigate?
00:26:05.519 --> 00:26:07.680
And it turned out that it was only 10 million.
00:26:07.839 --> 00:26:18.559
So I'm going to spend$50 million to mitigate a$10 million risk, assuming that the numbers are correct and the basis for it is is all okay.
00:26:19.119 --> 00:26:26.000
And so it doesn't make sense because people are not actually thinking about cybersecurity in terms of enterprise value.
00:26:26.160 --> 00:26:31.279
And the board was going to wave through the$50 million proposal because they didn't understand it.
00:26:31.359 --> 00:26:33.440
They didn't understand the exposure.
00:26:33.759 --> 00:26:39.759
So the key thing for me when it comes to the board is do you understand your risk appetite?
00:26:40.000 --> 00:26:41.920
What are you prepared to live with?
00:26:42.319 --> 00:26:46.240
How secure do we need to be in relation to our exposure?
00:26:46.400 --> 00:26:47.920
What is our exposure?
00:26:48.079 --> 00:26:56.720
Uh, boards are not there to select tools or to endorse tools or or to get through the vendor hype and the technical jargon.
00:26:56.880 --> 00:27:08.640
Boards are purely simply there to make sure that the expenditure actually achieves the purpose that it has, that the resilience is and the exposure are mitigated and that things progress.
00:27:08.799 --> 00:27:09.920
Does that make sense?
00:27:11.599 --> 00:27:23.680
Yeah, there's a really good insight around under if you understand the technology underneath the question, the governance question, then you can ask better, uh, you can challenge that proposal in a different way.
00:27:23.839 --> 00:27:27.440
And I think that's kind of the the underpinning to this.
00:27:27.599 --> 00:27:31.519
The question is sort of uh why are these digital skills lacking in boardrooms?
00:27:31.680 --> 00:27:32.400
Is it education?
00:27:32.559 --> 00:27:34.400
And I think it is in some cases.
00:27:34.559 --> 00:27:44.640
Many people in their um careers will have interacted with IT as the help desk that helps me make sure that my email is working, my laptop's switched on, and it's an administrative function.
00:27:44.799 --> 00:27:59.839
And so their depth of understanding of that function um isn't uh at the same level as, say, their commercial awareness or um financial control or so on, because they just haven't spent as much time in that world.
00:28:00.160 --> 00:28:03.599
And um, you know, self-education is important.
00:28:03.759 --> 00:28:10.640
Uh, I guess I would say that there is a step below the surface level just understanding what cybersecurity means.
00:28:10.880 --> 00:28:24.319
There is a fundamental requirement, I think, that is emerging now for directors that if you don't understand the fundamentals of how technology operates at a really quite a base level, then there's some self-education that you should be going to do there.
00:28:24.480 --> 00:28:38.720
In the same way that I, as a technologist, um went and made sure I was informed sufficiently on financial fundamentals, you know, managing PLs, you know, that's that's that's not a watch a webinar for an hour uh exercise.
00:28:38.799 --> 00:28:43.680
There's some effort there to educate yourself sufficiently to be able to actually ask those questions.
00:28:43.759 --> 00:28:53.519
And if you don't have that level of digital competence, if you're if you're still in that kind of familiarity, I've heard of it kind of land, I think it's time to start moving yourself in that direction.
00:28:53.599 --> 00:28:55.839
And and the and the regulators seem to agree.
00:28:56.000 --> 00:28:59.759
So I would say, Margaret, yes, I think it's education along the way.
00:28:59.920 --> 00:29:05.599
Um, you know, even um the AICD, there are two forums that they run every year.
00:29:05.759 --> 00:29:13.039
They run a governance forum and then they separate out the digital forum and they run it as a separate exercise somewhere else, right?
00:29:13.279 --> 00:29:19.359
So those two worlds um just naturally don't come together in our experience, right?
00:29:19.440 --> 00:29:23.440
So you do have to go out of your way to go and get that digital competence.
00:29:23.519 --> 00:29:33.279
You know, last year, governance forums in Sydney, you have to get on a plane and fly to Brisbane to get the technology governance experience, which I think uh and exposure, which I think you do need to do.
00:29:33.359 --> 00:29:36.000
So there is a you need to go and get it at the moment.
00:29:36.160 --> 00:29:39.039
I'm hoping that in the future those things will just be integrated.
00:29:39.119 --> 00:29:43.920
We'll think of technology governance as part of just a natural part of governance.
00:29:44.079 --> 00:29:46.640
Um and and I guess technologists need to go the other way.
00:29:46.799 --> 00:29:56.960
If you're a technologist moving into a boardroom setting, you need to learn the foundations, that T-shape you're talking about, Helen, but also how to speak to boards and um how to store it.
00:29:57.119 --> 00:29:58.079
You're absolutely right.
00:29:59.039 --> 00:30:01.200
Ben look, I'm I'm making the transition.
00:30:01.279 --> 00:30:06.960
I I've been a director of startups, and making the transition from startups to mainstream boards.
00:30:07.200 --> 00:30:09.279
Um, I was really surprised.
00:30:09.519 --> 00:30:14.480
Um, there is this element of fear of technology and cybersecurity.
00:30:14.559 --> 00:30:18.400
You mentioned cybersecurity, and suddenly everyone goes, Oh, I don't know anything about that.
00:30:18.480 --> 00:30:20.400
Oh no, that's that's highly risky.
00:30:20.559 --> 00:30:24.079
So you've got to be really careful, and you're absolutely right.
00:30:24.160 --> 00:30:32.559
You have to learn the language and the specific um details, the way that specific boards like to work and they like to communicate.
00:30:32.799 --> 00:30:34.480
And you've got to fit into that.
00:30:34.640 --> 00:30:40.160
And the second thing I have to do once I break the cybersecurity technology link is to break this fear.
00:30:40.640 --> 00:30:55.119
Um, there is nothing to be afraid of if you actually understand risk, and a lot of the board members are lawyers, and so therefore they have a commercial and risk background, then cybersecurity, there is no magic behind it.
00:30:55.279 --> 00:30:58.799
You can actually talk about it from a risk and resilience perspective.
00:30:58.960 --> 00:31:06.319
And once people understand that, um, they actually open up and they go, Oh, I know this, I can do this.
00:31:06.559 --> 00:31:10.640
Um, and um, you're right, training needs to be there.
00:31:10.880 --> 00:31:16.160
All of us, whether we have a technology background or not, you need continuous refresher training.
00:31:16.240 --> 00:31:19.279
Um, and AACD is very good at providing that.
00:31:19.440 --> 00:31:29.359
Um, but enabling boards to understand those two key things literally improves the performance in the communication and the function of the board.
00:31:29.680 --> 00:31:30.160
Yeah.
00:31:30.640 --> 00:31:32.000
So let's talk about also going to be.
00:31:32.240 --> 00:31:34.160
We have a number of uh questions that have come in, Ben.
00:31:34.319 --> 00:31:35.119
Do you want to tackle those?
00:31:35.200 --> 00:31:36.240
We've got a few minutes left.
00:31:36.640 --> 00:31:38.400
Yep, let me jump onto some of those.
00:31:38.480 --> 00:31:43.200
So there was a great question here on uh an AI board member.
00:31:43.279 --> 00:31:44.960
So let's talk about board composition.
00:31:45.200 --> 00:31:51.759
Is the answer a digital director with deep technology, or is it a digital champion or a different way of working?
00:31:51.920 --> 00:31:53.759
Helen, you touched on some of those.
00:31:54.000 --> 00:31:59.839
So the question here was: are you aware of any board that has an AI board member as an observer or advisor?
00:32:00.079 --> 00:32:02.319
Telstra is the one that I refer to.
00:32:02.400 --> 00:32:06.640
So they they have what they call uh an AI advisor in the room.
00:32:06.720 --> 00:32:16.319
So they um created an AI and pointed it at a whole bunch of governance information, and now they have live access to that facility inside.
00:32:16.480 --> 00:32:20.720
Um the AI CD published a um a piece on this just recently.
00:32:20.880 --> 00:32:33.839
So that's an example where the technology is literally altering how governance is done live in the boardroom with access to you know controlled data in a controlled way with guardrails around it.
00:32:34.000 --> 00:32:45.519
Um I've heard anecdotally people also using AI in boardrooms as uh, well, we can't get access to that expert, so let's have the AI play the role of are we we're thinking about an MA.
00:32:45.680 --> 00:32:49.279
What would the target of our MA process?
00:32:49.440 --> 00:32:51.680
How would they respond if we asked them these questions?
00:32:51.759 --> 00:32:53.920
Because sometimes you can't have them in the room, right?
00:32:54.160 --> 00:33:03.519
So there are these use cases that are coming in, but you know, maybe uh Helen, you talked about T-shape directors, um, digital champions.
00:33:03.599 --> 00:33:05.759
Maybe just unpack that one one more level.
00:33:05.920 --> 00:33:10.640
You you mentioned that you have somebody that you bring in that's not necessarily on the board as an advisor.
00:33:10.799 --> 00:33:13.279
What are the options available that you see that work?
00:33:13.680 --> 00:33:17.759
Um, I think that is one of the really powerful ways to bring someone through into your technology um committee.
00:33:17.920 --> 00:33:23.279
Funnily enough, when I read that question, I actually thought they were talking about a large language model in the boardroom.
00:33:23.440 --> 00:33:38.000
Uh, and I was going to uh refer to um IHC up in the United Arab Emirates, who in 2024, I think it was, brought on Aidan as their board member and exactly what you were talking about, that that LLM has knowledge and access to everything in the organization.
00:33:38.240 --> 00:33:41.039
Very important to note they do not have voting rights.
00:33:41.279 --> 00:33:44.400
Um, another question I just wanted to uh pick up on.
00:33:44.480 --> 00:33:49.839
So Angela asked a great question Is there a future where AI replaces the CEO as a reporter to the board?
00:33:50.000 --> 00:34:00.799
Funnily enough, Sam Altman, who is the chief executive of OpenAI, came out in the last week saying uh very soon AI is going to be able to run a company uh better than even I can.
00:34:00.960 --> 00:34:03.279
And I wasn't sure if that was a good comparison or not.
00:34:03.440 --> 00:34:12.480
But um anyway, uh so and there is a there's a whole load, you could listen to a whole load of podcasts at the moment about is AI going to actually take over the CEO?
00:34:12.639 --> 00:34:22.960
If you look at these new uh, you know, the unicorn companies, which are literally making millions and millions of dollars with two or three employees, they're doing that using AI.
00:34:23.199 --> 00:34:24.960
So is there a future with that?
00:34:25.039 --> 00:34:26.719
Possibly, I think it's a long way off.
00:34:26.880 --> 00:34:34.480
Um, one of the things that I always talk about when I'm talking about AI is as an organization, think about the time that you are freeing up.
00:34:34.559 --> 00:34:35.599
What are you going to use it for?
00:34:35.679 --> 00:34:41.920
And that is where being superhuman and all of those really important human elements are so important around the table.
00:34:42.000 --> 00:34:49.280
And as directors, it's that convergence of thinking that is our superpower rather than we can do it faster with AI.
00:34:49.360 --> 00:34:51.199
So yeah, I'm not sure about that.
00:34:51.440 --> 00:34:53.599
Um, there's a few other questions there.
00:34:53.679 --> 00:34:56.880
Maybe, um, Ben, did you want to pick up one of the others or Sorin?
00:34:57.360 --> 00:35:09.360
I think Sorin had a um it was he had maybe an anecdote to share about his personal experience about transitioning from executive into board roles and that, you know, board composition question.
00:35:09.519 --> 00:35:11.119
Um, Sorin, did you want to chip in?
00:35:11.599 --> 00:35:12.400
Yep, certainly.
00:35:12.559 --> 00:35:20.320
Um, so look, there is a bit of a dilemma um that I came across when I started making this transition.
00:35:20.719 --> 00:35:24.880
Um, because advisors to the board can be ignored.
00:35:24.960 --> 00:35:28.320
So they can provide the advice, and the board can go in a different direction.
00:35:28.480 --> 00:35:32.239
And that is a good thing in a lot of instances.
00:35:32.400 --> 00:35:47.599
Uh, some boards, however, prefer to have someone who actually has a stake in the board and one of their own directors who actually understands the technology, they're more likely to listen to that person than they are to an advisor or an external advisor.
00:35:48.000 --> 00:35:53.760
And uh so there isn't really, I think, um one way or another.
00:35:53.840 --> 00:35:57.760
I think it's up to boards to decide which way they want to go.
00:35:58.000 --> 00:36:12.480
Some boards might, especially um bigger boards, may be able to bring on a director with specific expertise, other smaller boards where they run smaller organizations or small to medium business, they may not be able to afford to have a digital director.
00:36:12.559 --> 00:36:17.039
So bringing in an advisor is better than not having access to that expertise.
00:36:17.280 --> 00:36:21.920
But that fear of technology and cybersecurity has to be overcome.
00:36:22.159 --> 00:36:26.159
And the only way to overcome that is to get rid of the jargon.
00:36:26.320 --> 00:36:39.280
So, one of the things I'd point to, um, you know how there have been uh announcements from Anthropic and Mythos that it's broken out and it's hacking companies all over the internet and doing all sorts of nasty things.
00:36:39.599 --> 00:36:46.480
Well, there is an element of misinformation that's attached to that because Mythos did what it was asked to do.
00:36:46.559 --> 00:36:51.679
It's just that the test bed and the boundary conditions of that test were not very well set up.
00:36:51.840 --> 00:36:54.559
So it was super efficient of hacking.
00:36:54.719 --> 00:36:56.400
Um, that's not so new.
00:36:56.480 --> 00:36:59.599
I mean, governments have been using that kind of capability for many years.
00:36:59.760 --> 00:37:04.320
It's just now that it's breaking into private industry and out in the open on the internet.
00:37:04.800 --> 00:37:14.400
So it's a question of governance rather than the actual AI um uh algorithm itself doing things that it wasn't supposed to do.
00:37:14.719 --> 00:37:25.679
And and so that question as to what expertise and how do we source the expertise, as long as the board has access to it, and and I take your point, Ben, you're right.
00:37:25.840 --> 00:37:37.920
We do need to actually move up on those indexes if we want to attract in attract investment in Australia and attract business, we need to get closer to the US ideal where we have digital expertise on boards.
00:37:38.159 --> 00:37:41.039
I mean, and can I just add one other thing, Ben?
00:37:41.119 --> 00:37:50.320
Uh, which is um adding on to what you said, Soran, but also asking Nicola's question around if you've only got the one savvy board member in this space.
00:37:50.559 --> 00:37:58.960
Um if even if you've got the expert on the board, it's so important they're not there to do technology any more than the accountant is there to do the accounting.
00:37:59.119 --> 00:38:05.039
All of the board, going back to that t-shirt, all of the board need to be asking questions, need to be thinking.
00:38:05.119 --> 00:38:12.719
Um, and if the rest of your board table goes quiet because they think that that expert's got it covered, you are not fulfilling your duties as a director.
00:38:12.880 --> 00:38:16.800
So that would just be the one flag I would say to be really cautious of.
00:38:16.960 --> 00:38:19.199
Don't delegate that responsibility.
00:38:19.920 --> 00:38:50.320
One of the things that we at digital directors um do is we support those digitally expert directors in boardrooms to have an impact to champion those matters inside the boardroom and have those conversations with people who perhaps aren't as far down that maturity um pathway and say, Hey, let me explain what this is about, or let me have an offline conversation with you, or let me offer you some time to help to brief those other directors or to bring their knowledge up over time, right?
00:38:50.480 --> 00:39:04.559
If you're a champion in the room and you're offering that expertise and you're able to actually lift and bring that across the whole board, not just, as you say, taking on the delegation yourself, that's a more effective approach, I think, um uh overall and over time.
00:39:04.800 --> 00:39:08.320
Um so look, Sean, I I know we're running short uh on time.
00:39:08.719 --> 00:39:14.719
Uh Helen, I think you had one last piece you wanted to mention when we talk about what the future holds.
00:39:14.880 --> 00:39:21.360
I know that um uh board pro has some sessions coming up, uh which addresses exactly this subject, right?
00:39:21.760 --> 00:39:24.559
Yeah, um, so this is um just coming up.
00:39:24.639 --> 00:39:31.760
We have got uh BoardPro are running a governing with impact roadshow across Australia and New Zealand, which is running late October, November.
00:39:31.840 --> 00:39:35.519
I'm sure Sean will be briefly mentioning it, but I'll do the job for him.
00:39:35.599 --> 00:39:40.719
Um and that is all about how directors move from AI anxiety to AI advantage.
00:39:40.880 --> 00:39:54.800
Um and at that um road show, I'll be one of the speakers in New Zealand and Alexei uh will be uh speaking, who's my often my co-host on these things, will be speaking on the same topic in Australia.
00:39:54.960 --> 00:39:59.199
Um and this whole uh this whole road show is around governing with impact.
00:39:59.280 --> 00:40:02.480
And so it will be really, really powerful for those of you who do want to know.
00:40:02.639 --> 00:40:05.760
And I am I right in saying early bird tickets are still on sale, Sean?
00:40:05.920 --> 00:40:08.559
Or are you proposing until the 30th of September?
00:40:08.880 --> 00:40:09.920
Okay, beautiful.
00:40:10.000 --> 00:40:18.320
Uh and so we'll be talking about uh how boards should be governing AI in a way that creates value rather than just thinking about how we manage the risk.
00:40:18.400 --> 00:40:23.119
But I know you've got amazing speakers on a whole range of different topics on AI in particular.
00:40:23.440 --> 00:40:24.320
Sean, back to you.
00:40:24.719 --> 00:40:35.280
And I would I would add to that, sorry, Helen, I would add to that that um there's a couple of questions here about insights around the not-for-profit space and how we get digital governance um moving and and digitally savvy boards.
00:40:35.519 --> 00:40:48.159
Digital directors, we're a we're a social enterprise, um, we're membership-based, and we can support boards and directors who are pursuing um digital upskilling and also um digital governance reviews for your boards.
00:40:48.320 --> 00:40:52.719
So um we we can offer those services um to those who reach out to us.
00:40:52.960 --> 00:40:58.000
Uh so Sean, I guess um, we talked about digital governance obligations increasing.
00:40:58.079 --> 00:41:06.079
We've talked about the need for these skills in the boardroom uh and um you know digital risks that are emerging as well and the pace of change.
00:41:06.239 --> 00:41:10.400
Uh I think there's a lot to do in boardrooms, but I'll hand back to you to close out.
00:41:10.880 --> 00:41:11.599
Thanks, Ben.
00:41:11.840 --> 00:41:12.960
So thanks again, team.
00:41:13.039 --> 00:41:16.079
Uh, please feel free to connect with our presenters, everybody on LinkedIn.
00:41:16.159 --> 00:41:18.320
I'm sure they'll look forward to your connection.
00:41:18.639 --> 00:41:27.679
And as Helen mentioned, we've got some exciting uh things coming your way at the roadshow, October and November for Kiwis and Aussies, that is.
00:41:28.079 --> 00:41:32.559
Um, you can find out all about it on our website homepage.
00:41:32.639 --> 00:41:34.079
You'll see it uh listed there.
00:41:34.159 --> 00:41:38.559
So we'd love to see you there and finally put a face to the name, as it were.
00:41:38.800 --> 00:41:42.000
As Helen said, early bird tickets are available.
00:41:42.480 --> 00:41:49.840
Uh you get 35% off the ticket price if you book now between now and the 30th of September.
00:41:51.599 --> 00:42:01.360
So if you're looking for past webinars, of which there are many, hundreds, uh, to hone your knowledge, then you'll find a library of webinars in our community portal.
00:42:01.519 --> 00:42:02.880
It's free to join.
00:42:03.280 --> 00:42:06.880
Um, so we invite you to be part of that growing community there.
00:42:07.199 --> 00:42:15.440
You'll find uh all of the slide decks from the webinars, the transcripts, and all of the other uh resources as well.
00:42:15.760 --> 00:42:24.400
Uh you'll receive an email from me tomorrow now, which will include a recording of today's webinar, the transcript and the presentation slides.
00:42:24.800 --> 00:42:28.480
They'll also be hosted on the community portal, as I just said.
00:42:28.719 --> 00:42:34.480
And of course, if you're considering board management software for your organization, we would love to hear from you.
00:42:34.639 --> 00:42:38.320
Better still, why not try our free 30-day free trial?
00:42:38.480 --> 00:42:43.199
It's really simple and straightforward, doesn't require any credit cards to get started.
00:42:43.599 --> 00:42:46.400
So thank you again for your attendance, everybody.
00:42:46.480 --> 00:42:48.800
I hope you enjoyed the session today as I did.
00:42:48.960 --> 00:42:51.039
Thank you, Ben, Sorin, and Helen.
00:42:51.440 --> 00:42:53.760
Uh, look forward to seeing you all at our next webinar.
00:42:53.840 --> 00:42:55.119
Everybody, have a great day.
00:00:08.400 --> 00:00:16.640
So, hi everybody, welcome to our webinar today titled The Digital Disruption of Directorship: How Technology is Modernizing an Ancient Art.
00:00:16.879 --> 00:00:23.280
Now we have two special and new guests for our webinar today, Ben Mikavoy and Sorin Thommer.
00:00:23.440 --> 00:00:28.079
And we are joined by Helen Van Orten, who most of you should know already.
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So welcome, team.
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My name is Sean MacDonald, and I shall be your moderator in the background for the next 40 odd minutes.
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Firstly, thank you for attending today.
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We always appreciate the effort you make to be here for our uh live webinar events and join the session.
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If you have any questions, of course, which we hope you will do, please try and use the QA button on your toolbar as against chat.
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It just enables us to keep a track of things as we're going through the session.
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And we'll try and answer as many of those questions as we have time for.
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And finally, if you stay through till the end, which of course we hope you will do, and even Tony in New York, if he stays awake, we have a really short one-minute survey for you at the end of the webinar, which we would love you to consider.
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Your feedback really helps us bring relevant content to you week after week, and it enables us to position the uh the great team of experts that we have.
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Uh so please take a minute to complete the webinar at the end of the survey at the end of the webinar, I should say.
00:01:32.480 --> 00:01:49.840
So, for those not too familiar with BoardPro, we are a board software provider, sometimes called a board portal, and we serve just over 35,000 users around the world, servicing about 4,000 boards and about 8,500 committees, would you believe?
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We enable organizations to prepare for and run their board meetings more efficiently and effectively, with less time, and deliver more impact and value for the organization.
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And as much as we are a board software provider, part of our wider mission here at BoardPro is to make the fundamentals of governance free and easy to implement for all organizations, but especially those organizations with resource constraints.
00:02:17.599 --> 00:02:37.039
These webinars that we host every week and the many templates, guides, and white papers on our website, on the resources page of our website, funnily enough, are a really great tangible example of how we look to achieve our mission for nonprofits and small businesses, small medium businesses around the world.
00:02:38.000 --> 00:02:45.439
So for the next 45 odd minutes, just sit back and relax and add to the discussion by asking as many questions as you would like.
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A full recording of the webinar along with the slide deck and transcript will be sent to you not long after our webinar today.
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So let me have uh our new team introduce themselves, starting with you first, Ben.
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Well, thanks, Sean.
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Uh, my name is Ben McAvoy, um, managing director of digital directors.
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This is a membership-based social enterprise that is very much interested in the topic of today.
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Uh, championing digital governance excellence is our tagline.
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So we're here to support aspiring and established and senior directors bring digital capabilities onto boardrooms and governing bodies.
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Thanks, Ben.
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Sorin, to you, sir.
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My name is Soren Toma.
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Um, I'm also a board director of the Sydney Isaka chapter.
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Uh, I do a lot of board advisory work when it comes to cybersecurity and artificial intelligence, primarily from a governance and strategic perspective.
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Thanks, Soren.
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And everyone should know Helen, but uh Helen, would you like to introduce yourself to those that don't?
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Thanks, Sean.
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Kira, everyone.
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I'm Helen Van Outten.
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I'm an experienced board director and chair, um, and I also run a training consulting business directly.
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Um, and at directly we empower boards and execs to lead with confidence in the AI era, um, offering training, insights, um, and governance frameworks to help you lead through this new technology in this new era and really turn that technology into strategic advantage.
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Thank you.
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Thanks, Helen.
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Thanks, team.
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So over to you, Ben.
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Lovely.
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So let me know when you can see my screen.
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Yep.
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Fantastic.
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All right.
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Well, you know us all already.
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So uh let's jump in and I want to frame things today um uh from the context of the impact of not just digital governance but digital trends around the world on governance.
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So um for uh for for those of us here in Australia, uh obviously this matter spans across Australia and New Zealand, um, and in fact around the world.
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But for those of us in Australia, where it kind of starts here.
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This is Joe Longo, he's the ASIC chair, so that's our corporate regulator here in Australia.
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Uh, and he's been lighting the signal fires around uh digital governance expectations in boardrooms in Australia for a number of years now.
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Um, this is his quote uh from an AI CD presentation he gave in 2025.
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Australia's falling to the back of the pack in the global race to fit innovation.
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Uh, and he connects that to the capabilities of digital governance in corporate boardrooms.
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So he's concerned about the lit the links between national prosperity and the lack of boardroom capability in this area.
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Uh and Joe Longo has a point.
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Uh, the Harvard study on uh economic resilience, essentially how sophisticated an economy is.
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Uh, Australia ranks 105th of the 145 countries measured.
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Um, we are just behind Botswana in 104th.
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So our economic growth has dropped 80% in our lifetimes and is currently the lowest it has been in 60 years.
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Now, New Zealand are a little better than us at 68th.
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Uh but both countries languish well below the mean.
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So amongst OECD countries, we are the first worst, that's Australia, and third worst, that's New Zealand, on this measure of economic complexity, with Chile between us, right?
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That's a country where the average income is about$20,000 a year.
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So if you place your eye on that black dot of New Zealand and you run it to the left, to the mean line, above which all OE other OECD countries live, other than Canada, you can see there.
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That distance is what I call the lucky quotient.
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That's where, based on the sophistication of our economies, um, we would sit if it wasn't for the fortunes of geography, history, and natural resources.
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So trace trace left from New Zealand, you can see where you'd hit uh that line.
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Um now do the same for Australia.
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If we weren't blessed by those factors, the lack of technological development in our economy will put our GDP per capita in the bottom third of the world, well below that 100 mark, which is the GDP average.
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And this is ranked on purchasing power per capita, that's PPP, uh, which is about$38,000.
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So we'd be about 20% below that, based on the sophistication of our economy, if it wasn't for the blessing of those natural resources and history.
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So truly, we are the lucky country.
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So Joe Longo thinks Australia's falling uh behind in innovation, particularly when it comes to digital technologies.
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And just before he left ASIC in 2026, uh earlier this year, uh he echoed that same sentiment in an address to the Tech Council of Australia.
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He linked those consequences more directly.
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He said, if we do not embrace new market technologies now, we will be poorer as a nation for it in the future.
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And Joe Longo has a point.
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This is data from the IMD World Digital Competitiveness Rankings.
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We do okay.
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69 major economies ranked, 23rd Australia, we're ahead of New Zealand this time, which is nice.
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Uh, at 28th of 69.
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Um But that is a measure which takes in things like credit rating, talent, education, regulatory frameworks, and modern technology adoption amongst the society.
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But once we begin to look at measures which are relevant to organizations and boards, we get a very different picture.
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We drop from the top third to the bottom third when it comes to capital deployment for future technology, uh technological investment.
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This is a major function of the board.
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And in business agility, uh, this is essentially innovation.
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Uh, we drop even further, both Australia and New Zealand slide even further in those rankings.
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Um, and to give you a sense of how we measure up against those other economies, Australia in 53rd and New Zealand in 46th, just above us is Nigeria ahead of Australia, and Botswana again, just ahead of New Zealand.
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There is one category in this study which is most relevant to directors, uh, and it speaks specifically to the function of boards.
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So the first is opportunities and threats.
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So this is strategy and risk governance.
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Sliding again, this is Australia's measure 57th.
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And then adaptability and flexibility is measuring innovation.
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We're we're fifth last in the world at corporate innovation, business agility.
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Um, it's as it's New Zealand's lowest ranking in this in this study at at 47th.
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That's the that's their lowest ranking of every measure on that study at 47th.
00:10:13.759 --> 00:10:18.399
So Joe Longo thinks that a big part of that problem is board composition.
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He's repeated over and over.
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We need more science in the in the boardroom.
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We need, in particular, more technology backrooms, uh, backgrounds in our boardrooms.
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Uh and Joe Longo has a point.
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Just 7.7% of directors uh in publicly listed companies in Australia have a technology background.
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Um, when you survey directors, not even one in six claim to have any level of digital competence above basic familiarity or literacy.
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Um now the good news is 7.7% feels low, but it's rising.
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It's up from 7.1%.
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The bad news is it took four years to rise that much.
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At that pace, and if you think the average number of um board members in a board is about seven, at that pace we will have one digitally competent director in every boardroom in ASX publicly listed companies by 2055 at that pace.
00:11:21.679 --> 00:11:23.519
The New Zealand figures are similar.
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Recent IOD report shows that when measuring experience amongst Crown and NSX 53 corporations, remember, these are the most well-governed organizations in New Zealand.
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Technology is ranked as the third last skill above only farming and HR.
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And when it comes to formal qualifications, technology is dead last of qualifications held by directors.
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So, what would the benefits be of having more digital skills on boards?
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Well, uh in the US, by comparison, the MIT study uh in 2019 uh measured digitally savvy boards, what they call digitally savvy, which means having at least three directors with digital expertise.
00:12:04.399 --> 00:12:11.360
They, those boards outperformed their peers by between 17 and 38% on these key metrics you see on this screen here.
00:12:11.679 --> 00:12:18.399
Um, and when this was released in 2019, just 24% of public US boards met this criteria.
00:12:18.559 --> 00:12:21.039
24% met it in 2019.
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Last year, that was 72%, with three or more digitally expert directors.
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And this standard is now so widely adopted that it has basically become redundant.
00:12:32.799 --> 00:12:37.039
Almost every public um board now meets this measure in the US.
00:12:37.200 --> 00:12:52.960
Um, and so the reporting now has turned, MIT have turned it from digitally savvy boards now to AI savvy boards, uh, where they demonstrate that AI savvy boards um have another 20% competitive advantage over um their peer organizations.
00:12:54.799 --> 00:12:57.039
Uh let's compare that to the ASX.
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These are again our most well-governed organizations in in Australia.
00:13:01.519 --> 00:13:07.120
Only 30% of them even list digital skills as a competency in their skills matrix.
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And when they do measure it, 49% of the time, it's the least well-represented skill, almost half the time.
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And if you go to the second least represented skill, that number jumps from 49% to 73%.
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So digital skills, if it's even on the matrix, is is very frequently the last or the second last in terms of representation on the boards.
00:13:34.639 --> 00:13:43.840
And here's the kicker the ASX Tech Index, the ATEC, it's 53 of Australia's most leading technology-related companies.
00:13:44.159 --> 00:13:52.480
Just six of them would meet an MIT digitally savvy criteria of having three directors with um digital expertise.
00:13:57.360 --> 00:14:08.639
So let's talk about the impact of digital competence in boardrooms, the changes in the digital age that brings to our um expectations of governance.
00:14:08.960 --> 00:14:12.799
We can talk about the need for digital expertise on boards.
00:14:13.039 --> 00:14:20.399
What are the challenges of bringing that expertise into boardrooms, whether it's people with digital backgrounds or whether it's bringing those skills to existing directors?
00:14:20.639 --> 00:14:24.480
Uh let's talk about the changing regulator expectations.
00:14:24.720 --> 00:14:31.679
ASIC and APRA have both been clear about those expectations on directors now increasing in terms of digital competence.
00:14:31.840 --> 00:14:37.120
Uh, we can talk about how digital directors bring to the board new ways of thinking.
00:14:37.200 --> 00:14:44.399
Um, people with technology backgrounds think differently, they address problems differently, and that diversity of thought is valuable in the boardroom.
00:14:44.559 --> 00:14:51.440
Uh, how the pace of change is challenging traditional governance controls when AI is iterating so rapidly.
00:14:51.600 --> 00:15:05.600
Um, the ASD just released uh a um a message recently that said that if you have set your risk profile for cybersecurity more than six months ago, AI have has already changed that.
00:15:05.759 --> 00:15:09.919
And you can't wait another year or two years to go back and reassess your risk framework.
00:15:10.000 --> 00:15:12.320
It was invalidated a couple of weeks ago.
00:15:12.559 --> 00:15:21.679
Um technology in the boardroom, the use of AI for um dealing with minutes, dealing with board papers, what is the use?
00:15:21.840 --> 00:15:26.399
And sometimes we even hear about uh virtual board members, right, in the in the boardroom.
00:15:26.480 --> 00:15:29.600
So technology is making its way physically into the boardroom.
00:15:29.759 --> 00:15:32.720
Uh and then we'll finish with quite the few childs.
00:15:34.320 --> 00:15:40.480
All right, so let me let me get started uh and bring Helen and Sorin in.
00:15:40.720 --> 00:15:45.360
Um so let's talk first of all about the pace of change.
00:15:45.679 --> 00:15:49.759
So I think AI is really challenging digital controls.
00:15:49.840 --> 00:15:58.159
And and if you have questions on this, by the way, on any of those topics, please put them in the chat and we'll make sure that we get to to answering those and we'll put them to Sorin and Helen as well.
00:15:58.320 --> 00:15:59.840
But Sorin, maybe you can lead us off.
00:16:00.000 --> 00:16:03.600
Pace of change, uh, AI is challenging digital controls.
00:16:03.759 --> 00:16:06.000
Um, give us your thoughts on that.
00:16:07.279 --> 00:16:17.279
So, look, uh, AI is having a major impact because it's starting to get into areas that have been the same at board level for many decades.
00:16:17.440 --> 00:16:18.639
For example, audit.
00:16:18.799 --> 00:16:21.360
So audits have always taken place the same way.
00:16:21.600 --> 00:16:26.480
Yes, technology has come in 20, 25 years ago, and that's improved things a little bit.
00:16:26.639 --> 00:16:30.559
Well, AI coming now has a major, major impact.
00:16:30.960 --> 00:16:36.159
Um, and in some cases, we have a lot of interesting combinations that we haven't thought about.
00:16:36.240 --> 00:16:42.960
So many companies like the Commonwealth Bank, Telstra, they're already using AI in many areas within their companies.
00:16:43.039 --> 00:16:51.679
And so if you're using AI for audit, you have AI auditing AI, and that has certain implications that are not understood.
00:16:51.840 --> 00:16:59.759
Um, for example, the challenge is trust, because we know that AI can hallucinate sometimes.
00:17:00.000 --> 00:17:10.319
So the question becomes in an audit environment where accuracy is absolutely critical, um, what happens when AI gets it wrong?
00:17:10.559 --> 00:17:14.000
Uh so you can see that the change coming through is massive.
00:17:14.160 --> 00:17:19.359
Another implication there would be we no longer need to do just sampling when we do audit.
00:17:19.440 --> 00:17:24.319
We could actually audit everything, but that turns AI into big brother.
00:17:24.480 --> 00:17:27.440
Do you want every transaction actually being audited?
00:17:27.519 --> 00:17:33.200
And what happens if you have many false positives and it generates a lot of work that shouldn't be there?
00:17:33.599 --> 00:17:46.480
So um technology and and nowadays it's mostly about AI, uh, is going to have a major impact, is going to change things, and it can change things for the better.
00:17:46.640 --> 00:17:50.640
But before it does, there is a bit of a work to be done.
00:17:52.319 --> 00:17:53.519
What do you think, Ellen?
00:17:53.920 --> 00:17:54.799
I was just going to build on that.
00:17:54.880 --> 00:18:02.799
Sorry, and I love that you chose the audit as an example because I was actually at the IOD governing AI forum a couple of months ago.
00:18:02.880 --> 00:18:07.200
And in that, KPMG actually walked us through how they're using AI in audit.
00:18:07.279 --> 00:18:09.039
Um, and it's to exactly your point.
00:18:09.200 --> 00:18:23.039
It moves from instead of just doing a whole load of samples on a data set and just picking up those anomalies, it's now moving from that instead of being 45 transactions and extrapolating the information, it's now becoming exception-based.
00:18:23.200 --> 00:18:26.319
So it's testing everything and going for the outliers.
00:18:26.480 --> 00:18:28.240
Um, and that's a really big change.
00:18:28.319 --> 00:18:31.599
And I think a lot of audit committees haven't caught up with it.
00:18:31.759 --> 00:18:36.720
Uh, I think a lot of us in the room at the time were hoping, in fact, they asked us to do a show of hands.
00:18:36.799 --> 00:18:39.599
Um, and we all thought that the audit costs were going to come down.
00:18:39.759 --> 00:18:41.119
Sadly, that wasn't the case.
00:18:41.200 --> 00:18:45.119
Uh, it just means that the time from the auditors is going to be used differently.
00:18:45.279 --> 00:18:53.680
Um, but to your wider question, Ben, around that pace of change, um, I think, you know, auditing is one element of one profession.
00:18:54.000 --> 00:19:05.599
Um, but in the AICD survey that they did earlier this year, more than half of the directors surveyed were saying about the pace of change is already faster than their organization can handle.
00:19:05.759 --> 00:19:15.039
And again, if we step back to a board-level thinking around that, it's there's a challenge on our board cycles around keeping up with that.
00:19:15.119 --> 00:19:23.519
You know, depending on your board, you might have six, eight, twelve meetings a year, but the papers are often written a couple of weeks out, decisions coming in a month after that.
00:19:23.680 --> 00:19:27.200
Um, and by the time you've approved something, it's probably completely out of date.
00:19:27.359 --> 00:19:41.440
We literally had a, I was at a meeting this morning with one of my boards, and we were talking about cyber, and literally all of the stuff that's happened in the last few weeks had happened since the papers were submitted to directors because they've got to be there a week before the board.
00:19:41.680 --> 00:19:45.920
And so just that whole cycle is really, really challenging to keep up.
00:19:46.079 --> 00:19:51.359
Um, so you know, we need to think as boards, what does that mean for our reporting?
00:19:51.440 --> 00:20:11.839
Uh, not just risk, you know, adoption, spend, what's working, what's been switched on in our organization, what have management, you know, made decisions um around, and particularly in that AI space, as a board, are we making sure that we're seeing that at every board meeting rather than just a sort of a backward-looking report a couple of times a year?
00:20:12.079 --> 00:20:13.279
Um, yeah.
00:20:13.680 --> 00:20:15.920
Yeah, yeah, I think that's really good insight.
00:20:16.000 --> 00:20:38.000
Um, Helen, the the and we talked about the disruption to an ancient art here, and it may just be that the pace of change in the digital age just means that some of these established cycles, the six-month, quarterly, annual, through biannual cycles, need review when it comes to specifically dealing with digital matters.
00:20:38.160 --> 00:20:44.799
And let's face it, digital matters have a very broad-ranging impact throughout the um the organization, modern organizations, right?
00:20:44.880 --> 00:20:46.960
Um, technologies in in everything.
00:20:47.119 --> 00:20:54.079
Um, there's a great question here uh about um the why digital is lacking in boardrooms.
00:20:54.240 --> 00:21:00.799
Do you think it's related to education of those board members who may not have had digital teaching during their education?
00:21:01.039 --> 00:21:02.400
So maybe we can talk about that.
00:21:02.559 --> 00:21:09.839
Questions on the need for digital skills, um, you know, boards signing off on things that they don't understand.
00:21:10.079 --> 00:21:21.839
Um, Helen, give us your thoughts on those skills in the boardroom, you know, and and that directors grappling with that kind of new education they need to bring to themselves, I guess.
00:21:22.160 --> 00:21:26.720
Yeah, it's funny when I read that earlier, I was thinking, gosh, back in the day I did part of my degree in computing.
00:21:26.799 --> 00:21:35.839
So I don't know if that uh qualifies me as a digital director, because I don't know that learning Pascal coding uh probably qualified me for anything at this stage in my career.
00:21:36.000 --> 00:21:37.200
But um there we go.
00:21:37.359 --> 00:21:42.079
Um I think there's definitely part of it, but I mean, all of us have different career trajectories.
00:21:42.160 --> 00:21:52.000
And I um, having started my career in computing, went off and did a whole load of other things and didn't come back into the tech element literally until I was on an exec team.
00:21:52.240 --> 00:21:58.799
Um so I think part of it, I mean what I always talk to directors about is actually curiosity.
00:21:58.960 --> 00:21:59.759
So curiosity.
00:22:00.319 --> 00:22:11.759
I think it is the most important attribute to have as a director, and particularly in this AI world, being curious and the fact that you've turned up today means that you are curious, which is great.
00:22:12.799 --> 00:22:19.359
I'll probably jump on to a little bit about what we were talking about, we were going to talk about a little later in the session, if you're okay, Ben.
00:22:20.000 --> 00:22:27.759
But that whole AI knowledge piece is around the amount of boards who want to bring on that AI knowledge.
00:22:27.839 --> 00:22:31.440
And you had a load of stats from New Zealand, Australia, the US.
00:22:32.000 --> 00:22:36.000
Deloitte did a big study last year, which I'm waiting for the updated version to come out.
00:22:36.160 --> 00:22:42.799
But at that point, they were saying 40% of boards were looking to bring on a director specifically with AI knowledge.
00:22:42.960 --> 00:22:54.799
And to your point, Ben, the challenge is there's literally not enough people in the market who've got that deep capability and the broader governance experience that you need for the board seat, which is where digital directors comes in.
00:22:54.960 --> 00:23:06.559
But um and Hydric and Struggles in the US again did some surveying on in March this year, and the new director appointments at that point, only 6% of them have got that technology.
00:23:06.720 --> 00:23:10.640
Um so sure that's the US, but that pool is really small.
00:23:10.799 --> 00:23:18.000
So as a board, I think if you're waiting for that unicorn candidate to come along, you might be waiting a really, really long time.
00:23:19.200 --> 00:23:25.359
But there is a really important piece for us as directors to think about what are the skills we bring to the table.
00:23:25.440 --> 00:23:30.000
Um I don't want to talk for too long because I want to make sure Sorin's got a chance to jump in as well.
00:23:30.160 --> 00:23:34.559
But um the T-shape director that we always talk about.
00:23:34.640 --> 00:23:51.599
So you've got your deep vertical knowledge, which might be marketing or accounting or finance or law or whatever is, or probably two or three of those for most directors, but then that T across the top of it, and this will be answering your question, um, Suzanne, as well, which is making sure that you've got enough knowledge across the top.
00:23:51.759 --> 00:24:00.480
Like I'm not an accountant, but I can still ask good questions about the financials in the board meeting because I've made sure that I've upskilled myself to uh get that coverage.
00:24:00.720 --> 00:24:04.160
But to your question, how do you uplift the board capability?
00:24:04.319 --> 00:24:13.200
And you're a big NZX board or an ASX board, then sure you're going to be bringing in your Deloits and your PWCs, etc., and they'll be helping support that training.
00:24:13.359 --> 00:24:30.319
Um, but there's a lot of people and companies like myself and and Sorin who actually go in and help boards with their AI training and capability, which is actually elevating the board's overall internal baseline so everyone on that board table can ask the right questions and have the right knowledge across.
00:24:30.400 --> 00:24:40.400
And Deloitte did some research on that earlier this year, and most boards are building that capability through briefings, director education rather than just through direct recruitment.
00:24:40.480 --> 00:24:47.519
Um, another thing you can do, which is we've done on one of our boards, is on our technology committee, we've brought in an external technologist.
00:24:47.680 --> 00:24:52.160
So they don't sit on the main board, but they bring that deep expertise into the technology committee.
00:24:52.319 --> 00:24:53.279
Sorry, I've talked enough.
00:24:53.359 --> 00:24:53.680
Sorry.
00:24:54.240 --> 00:24:55.039
That's all good.
00:24:55.680 --> 00:25:02.799
The minute that you mention the word cybersecurity, say, for example, in a board context, most directors think, oh, technical.
00:25:02.880 --> 00:25:03.200
That's it.
00:25:03.279 --> 00:25:04.000
I'm past that.
00:25:04.079 --> 00:25:05.440
That's beyond it's below me.
00:25:05.519 --> 00:25:06.960
It's it's somewhere over there.
00:25:07.440 --> 00:25:19.200
And one of the things that I have to do when I talk to b boards is immediately break that link because our brains have been wired to think, oh, cybersecurity is all about technology, it's all technical.
00:25:19.440 --> 00:25:20.400
No, it isn't.
00:25:20.559 --> 00:25:26.400
At the board level, it is all about risk, it's all about exposure, it's all about resilience.
00:25:26.559 --> 00:25:33.119
So if something happens, how quickly can your organization get over it and continue to trade and uh prosper?
00:25:33.680 --> 00:25:36.319
And it's also about enterprise value.
00:25:36.480 --> 00:25:38.000
So I'll give you an example.
00:25:38.160 --> 00:25:45.519
There was a proposal that was presented to a board to bring in a new security incident event management system, and it was going to cost$50 million.
00:25:46.319 --> 00:25:52.240
So I asked a simple question what is the exposure that you're trying to mitigate?
00:25:52.480 --> 00:25:58.640
And people thought I was asking for a big risks matrix, and suddenly I got this spreadsheet with about 50,000 line items.
00:25:58.720 --> 00:25:59.759
I'm like, no, no.
00:26:00.000 --> 00:26:01.119
What is the amount?
00:26:01.279 --> 00:26:05.359
What's the worst case scenario for the risk that you're trying to mitigate?
00:26:05.519 --> 00:26:07.680
And it turned out that it was only 10 million.
00:26:07.839 --> 00:26:18.559
So I'm going to spend$50 million to mitigate a$10 million risk, assuming that the numbers are correct and the basis for it is is all okay.
00:26:19.119 --> 00:26:26.000
And so it doesn't make sense because people are not actually thinking about cybersecurity in terms of enterprise value.
00:26:26.160 --> 00:26:31.279
And the board was going to wave through the$50 million proposal because they didn't understand it.
00:26:31.359 --> 00:26:33.440
They didn't understand the exposure.
00:26:33.759 --> 00:26:39.759
So the key thing for me when it comes to the board is do you understand your risk appetite?
00:26:40.000 --> 00:26:41.920
What are you prepared to live with?
00:26:42.319 --> 00:26:46.240
How secure do we need to be in relation to our exposure?
00:26:46.400 --> 00:26:47.920
What is our exposure?
00:26:48.079 --> 00:26:56.720
Uh, boards are not there to select tools or to endorse tools or or to get through the vendor hype and the technical jargon.
00:26:56.880 --> 00:27:08.640
Boards are purely simply there to make sure that the expenditure actually achieves the purpose that it has, that the resilience is and the exposure are mitigated and that things progress.
00:27:08.799 --> 00:27:09.920
Does that make sense?
00:27:11.599 --> 00:27:23.680
Yeah, there's a really good insight around under if you understand the technology underneath the question, the governance question, then you can ask better, uh, you can challenge that proposal in a different way.
00:27:23.839 --> 00:27:27.440
And I think that's kind of the the underpinning to this.
00:27:27.599 --> 00:27:31.519
The question is sort of uh why are these digital skills lacking in boardrooms?
00:27:31.680 --> 00:27:32.400
Is it education?
00:27:32.559 --> 00:27:34.400
And I think it is in some cases.
00:27:34.559 --> 00:27:44.640
Many people in their um careers will have interacted with IT as the help desk that helps me make sure that my email is working, my laptop's switched on, and it's an administrative function.
00:27:44.799 --> 00:27:59.839
And so their depth of understanding of that function um isn't uh at the same level as, say, their commercial awareness or um financial control or so on, because they just haven't spent as much time in that world.
00:28:00.160 --> 00:28:03.599
And um, you know, self-education is important.
00:28:03.759 --> 00:28:10.640
Uh, I guess I would say that there is a step below the surface level just understanding what cybersecurity means.
00:28:10.880 --> 00:28:24.319
There is a fundamental requirement, I think, that is emerging now for directors that if you don't understand the fundamentals of how technology operates at a really quite a base level, then there's some self-education that you should be going to do there.
00:28:24.480 --> 00:28:38.720
In the same way that I, as a technologist, um went and made sure I was informed sufficiently on financial fundamentals, you know, managing PLs, you know, that's that's that's not a watch a webinar for an hour uh exercise.
00:28:38.799 --> 00:28:43.680
There's some effort there to educate yourself sufficiently to be able to actually ask those questions.
00:28:43.759 --> 00:28:53.519
And if you don't have that level of digital competence, if you're if you're still in that kind of familiarity, I've heard of it kind of land, I think it's time to start moving yourself in that direction.
00:28:53.599 --> 00:28:55.839
And and the and the regulators seem to agree.
00:28:56.000 --> 00:28:59.759
So I would say, Margaret, yes, I think it's education along the way.
00:28:59.920 --> 00:29:05.599
Um, you know, even um the AICD, there are two forums that they run every year.
00:29:05.759 --> 00:29:13.039
They run a governance forum and then they separate out the digital forum and they run it as a separate exercise somewhere else, right?
00:29:13.279 --> 00:29:19.359
So those two worlds um just naturally don't come together in our experience, right?
00:29:19.440 --> 00:29:23.440
So you do have to go out of your way to go and get that digital competence.
00:29:23.519 --> 00:29:33.279
You know, last year, governance forums in Sydney, you have to get on a plane and fly to Brisbane to get the technology governance experience, which I think uh and exposure, which I think you do need to do.
00:29:33.359 --> 00:29:36.000
So there is a you need to go and get it at the moment.
00:29:36.160 --> 00:29:39.039
I'm hoping that in the future those things will just be integrated.
00:29:39.119 --> 00:29:43.920
We'll think of technology governance as part of just a natural part of governance.
00:29:44.079 --> 00:29:46.640
Um and and I guess technologists need to go the other way.
00:29:46.799 --> 00:29:56.960
If you're a technologist moving into a boardroom setting, you need to learn the foundations, that T-shape you're talking about, Helen, but also how to speak to boards and um how to store it.
00:29:57.119 --> 00:29:58.079
You're absolutely right.
00:29:59.039 --> 00:30:01.200
Ben look, I'm I'm making the transition.
00:30:01.279 --> 00:30:06.960
I I've been a director of startups, and making the transition from startups to mainstream boards.
00:30:07.200 --> 00:30:09.279
Um, I was really surprised.
00:30:09.519 --> 00:30:14.480
Um, there is this element of fear of technology and cybersecurity.
00:30:14.559 --> 00:30:18.400
You mentioned cybersecurity, and suddenly everyone goes, Oh, I don't know anything about that.
00:30:18.480 --> 00:30:20.400
Oh no, that's that's highly risky.
00:30:20.559 --> 00:30:24.079
So you've got to be really careful, and you're absolutely right.
00:30:24.160 --> 00:30:32.559
You have to learn the language and the specific um details, the way that specific boards like to work and they like to communicate.
00:30:32.799 --> 00:30:34.480
And you've got to fit into that.
00:30:34.640 --> 00:30:40.160
And the second thing I have to do once I break the cybersecurity technology link is to break this fear.
00:30:40.640 --> 00:30:55.119
Um, there is nothing to be afraid of if you actually understand risk, and a lot of the board members are lawyers, and so therefore they have a commercial and risk background, then cybersecurity, there is no magic behind it.
00:30:55.279 --> 00:30:58.799
You can actually talk about it from a risk and resilience perspective.
00:30:58.960 --> 00:31:06.319
And once people understand that, um, they actually open up and they go, Oh, I know this, I can do this.
00:31:06.559 --> 00:31:10.640
Um, and um, you're right, training needs to be there.
00:31:10.880 --> 00:31:16.160
All of us, whether we have a technology background or not, you need continuous refresher training.
00:31:16.240 --> 00:31:19.279
Um, and AACD is very good at providing that.
00:31:19.440 --> 00:31:29.359
Um, but enabling boards to understand those two key things literally improves the performance in the communication and the function of the board.
00:31:29.680 --> 00:31:30.160
Yeah.
00:31:30.640 --> 00:31:32.000
So let's talk about also going to be.
00:31:32.240 --> 00:31:34.160
We have a number of uh questions that have come in, Ben.
00:31:34.319 --> 00:31:35.119
Do you want to tackle those?
00:31:35.200 --> 00:31:36.240
We've got a few minutes left.
00:31:36.640 --> 00:31:38.400
Yep, let me jump onto some of those.
00:31:38.480 --> 00:31:43.200
So there was a great question here on uh an AI board member.
00:31:43.279 --> 00:31:44.960
So let's talk about board composition.
00:31:45.200 --> 00:31:51.759
Is the answer a digital director with deep technology, or is it a digital champion or a different way of working?
00:31:51.920 --> 00:31:53.759
Helen, you touched on some of those.
00:31:54.000 --> 00:31:59.839
So the question here was: are you aware of any board that has an AI board member as an observer or advisor?
00:32:00.079 --> 00:32:02.319
Telstra is the one that I refer to.
00:32:02.400 --> 00:32:06.640
So they they have what they call uh an AI advisor in the room.
00:32:06.720 --> 00:32:16.319
So they um created an AI and pointed it at a whole bunch of governance information, and now they have live access to that facility inside.
00:32:16.480 --> 00:32:20.720
Um the AI CD published a um a piece on this just recently.
00:32:20.880 --> 00:32:33.839
So that's an example where the technology is literally altering how governance is done live in the boardroom with access to you know controlled data in a controlled way with guardrails around it.
00:32:34.000 --> 00:32:45.519
Um I've heard anecdotally people also using AI in boardrooms as uh, well, we can't get access to that expert, so let's have the AI play the role of are we we're thinking about an MA.
00:32:45.680 --> 00:32:49.279
What would the target of our MA process?
00:32:49.440 --> 00:32:51.680
How would they respond if we asked them these questions?
00:32:51.759 --> 00:32:53.920
Because sometimes you can't have them in the room, right?
00:32:54.160 --> 00:33:03.519
So there are these use cases that are coming in, but you know, maybe uh Helen, you talked about T-shape directors, um, digital champions.
00:33:03.599 --> 00:33:05.759
Maybe just unpack that one one more level.
00:33:05.920 --> 00:33:10.640
You you mentioned that you have somebody that you bring in that's not necessarily on the board as an advisor.
00:33:10.799 --> 00:33:13.279
What are the options available that you see that work?
00:33:13.680 --> 00:33:17.759
Um, I think that is one of the really powerful ways to bring someone through into your technology um committee.
00:33:17.920 --> 00:33:23.279
Funnily enough, when I read that question, I actually thought they were talking about a large language model in the boardroom.
00:33:23.440 --> 00:33:38.000
Uh, and I was going to uh refer to um IHC up in the United Arab Emirates, who in 2024, I think it was, brought on Aidan as their board member and exactly what you were talking about, that that LLM has knowledge and access to everything in the organization.
00:33:38.240 --> 00:33:41.039
Very important to note they do not have voting rights.
00:33:41.279 --> 00:33:44.400
Um, another question I just wanted to uh pick up on.
00:33:44.480 --> 00:33:49.839
So Angela asked a great question Is there a future where AI replaces the CEO as a reporter to the board?
00:33:50.000 --> 00:34:00.799
Funnily enough, Sam Altman, who is the chief executive of OpenAI, came out in the last week saying uh very soon AI is going to be able to run a company uh better than even I can.
00:34:00.960 --> 00:34:03.279
And I wasn't sure if that was a good comparison or not.
00:34:03.440 --> 00:34:12.480
But um anyway, uh so and there is a there's a whole load, you could listen to a whole load of podcasts at the moment about is AI going to actually take over the CEO?
00:34:12.639 --> 00:34:22.960
If you look at these new uh, you know, the unicorn companies, which are literally making millions and millions of dollars with two or three employees, they're doing that using AI.
00:34:23.199 --> 00:34:24.960
So is there a future with that?
00:34:25.039 --> 00:34:26.719
Possibly, I think it's a long way off.
00:34:26.880 --> 00:34:34.480
Um, one of the things that I always talk about when I'm talking about AI is as an organization, think about the time that you are freeing up.
00:34:34.559 --> 00:34:35.599
What are you going to use it for?
00:34:35.679 --> 00:34:41.920
And that is where being superhuman and all of those really important human elements are so important around the table.
00:34:42.000 --> 00:34:49.280
And as directors, it's that convergence of thinking that is our superpower rather than we can do it faster with AI.
00:34:49.360 --> 00:34:51.199
So yeah, I'm not sure about that.
00:34:51.440 --> 00:34:53.599
Um, there's a few other questions there.
00:34:53.679 --> 00:34:56.880
Maybe, um, Ben, did you want to pick up one of the others or Sorin?
00:34:57.360 --> 00:35:09.360
I think Sorin had a um it was he had maybe an anecdote to share about his personal experience about transitioning from executive into board roles and that, you know, board composition question.
00:35:09.519 --> 00:35:11.119
Um, Sorin, did you want to chip in?
00:35:11.599 --> 00:35:12.400
Yep, certainly.
00:35:12.559 --> 00:35:20.320
Um, so look, there is a bit of a dilemma um that I came across when I started making this transition.
00:35:20.719 --> 00:35:24.880
Um, because advisors to the board can be ignored.
00:35:24.960 --> 00:35:28.320
So they can provide the advice, and the board can go in a different direction.
00:35:28.480 --> 00:35:32.239
And that is a good thing in a lot of instances.
00:35:32.400 --> 00:35:47.599
Uh, some boards, however, prefer to have someone who actually has a stake in the board and one of their own directors who actually understands the technology, they're more likely to listen to that person than they are to an advisor or an external advisor.
00:35:48.000 --> 00:35:53.760
And uh so there isn't really, I think, um one way or another.
00:35:53.840 --> 00:35:57.760
I think it's up to boards to decide which way they want to go.
00:35:58.000 --> 00:36:12.480
Some boards might, especially um bigger boards, may be able to bring on a director with specific expertise, other smaller boards where they run smaller organizations or small to medium business, they may not be able to afford to have a digital director.
00:36:12.559 --> 00:36:17.039
So bringing in an advisor is better than not having access to that expertise.
00:36:17.280 --> 00:36:21.920
But that fear of technology and cybersecurity has to be overcome.
00:36:22.159 --> 00:36:26.159
And the only way to overcome that is to get rid of the jargon.
00:36:26.320 --> 00:36:39.280
So, one of the things I'd point to, um, you know how there have been uh announcements from Anthropic and Mythos that it's broken out and it's hacking companies all over the internet and doing all sorts of nasty things.
00:36:39.599 --> 00:36:46.480
Well, there is an element of misinformation that's attached to that because Mythos did what it was asked to do.
00:36:46.559 --> 00:36:51.679
It's just that the test bed and the boundary conditions of that test were not very well set up.
00:36:51.840 --> 00:36:54.559
So it was super efficient of hacking.
00:36:54.719 --> 00:36:56.400
Um, that's not so new.
00:36:56.480 --> 00:36:59.599
I mean, governments have been using that kind of capability for many years.
00:36:59.760 --> 00:37:04.320
It's just now that it's breaking into private industry and out in the open on the internet.
00:37:04.800 --> 00:37:14.400
So it's a question of governance rather than the actual AI um uh algorithm itself doing things that it wasn't supposed to do.
00:37:14.719 --> 00:37:25.679
And and so that question as to what expertise and how do we source the expertise, as long as the board has access to it, and and I take your point, Ben, you're right.
00:37:25.840 --> 00:37:37.920
We do need to actually move up on those indexes if we want to attract in attract investment in Australia and attract business, we need to get closer to the US ideal where we have digital expertise on boards.
00:37:38.159 --> 00:37:41.039
I mean, and can I just add one other thing, Ben?
00:37:41.119 --> 00:37:50.320
Uh, which is um adding on to what you said, Soran, but also asking Nicola's question around if you've only got the one savvy board member in this space.
00:37:50.559 --> 00:37:58.960
Um if even if you've got the expert on the board, it's so important they're not there to do technology any more than the accountant is there to do the accounting.
00:37:59.119 --> 00:38:05.039
All of the board, going back to that t-shirt, all of the board need to be asking questions, need to be thinking.
00:38:05.119 --> 00:38:12.719
Um, and if the rest of your board table goes quiet because they think that that expert's got it covered, you are not fulfilling your duties as a director.
00:38:12.880 --> 00:38:16.800
So that would just be the one flag I would say to be really cautious of.
00:38:16.960 --> 00:38:19.199
Don't delegate that responsibility.
00:38:19.920 --> 00:38:50.320
One of the things that we at digital directors um do is we support those digitally expert directors in boardrooms to have an impact to champion those matters inside the boardroom and have those conversations with people who perhaps aren't as far down that maturity um pathway and say, Hey, let me explain what this is about, or let me have an offline conversation with you, or let me offer you some time to help to brief those other directors or to bring their knowledge up over time, right?
00:38:50.480 --> 00:39:04.559
If you're a champion in the room and you're offering that expertise and you're able to actually lift and bring that across the whole board, not just, as you say, taking on the delegation yourself, that's a more effective approach, I think, um uh overall and over time.
00:39:04.800 --> 00:39:08.320
Um so look, Sean, I I know we're running short uh on time.
00:39:08.719 --> 00:39:14.719
Uh Helen, I think you had one last piece you wanted to mention when we talk about what the future holds.
00:39:14.880 --> 00:39:21.360
I know that um uh board pro has some sessions coming up, uh which addresses exactly this subject, right?
00:39:21.760 --> 00:39:24.559
Yeah, um, so this is um just coming up.
00:39:24.639 --> 00:39:31.760
We have got uh BoardPro are running a governing with impact roadshow across Australia and New Zealand, which is running late October, November.
00:39:31.840 --> 00:39:35.519
I'm sure Sean will be briefly mentioning it, but I'll do the job for him.
00:39:35.599 --> 00:39:40.719
Um and that is all about how directors move from AI anxiety to AI advantage.
00:39:40.880 --> 00:39:54.800
Um and at that um road show, I'll be one of the speakers in New Zealand and Alexei uh will be uh speaking, who's my often my co-host on these things, will be speaking on the same topic in Australia.
00:39:54.960 --> 00:39:59.199
Um and this whole uh this whole road show is around governing with impact.
00:39:59.280 --> 00:40:02.480
And so it will be really, really powerful for those of you who do want to know.
00:40:02.639 --> 00:40:05.760
And I am I right in saying early bird tickets are still on sale, Sean?
00:40:05.920 --> 00:40:08.559
Or are you proposing until the 30th of September?
00:40:08.880 --> 00:40:09.920
Okay, beautiful.
00:40:10.000 --> 00:40:18.320
Uh and so we'll be talking about uh how boards should be governing AI in a way that creates value rather than just thinking about how we manage the risk.
00:40:18.400 --> 00:40:23.119
But I know you've got amazing speakers on a whole range of different topics on AI in particular.
00:40:23.440 --> 00:40:24.320
Sean, back to you.
00:40:24.719 --> 00:40:35.280
And I would I would add to that, sorry, Helen, I would add to that that um there's a couple of questions here about insights around the not-for-profit space and how we get digital governance um moving and and digitally savvy boards.
00:40:35.519 --> 00:40:48.159
Digital directors, we're a we're a social enterprise, um, we're membership-based, and we can support boards and directors who are pursuing um digital upskilling and also um digital governance reviews for your boards.
00:40:48.320 --> 00:40:52.719
So um we we can offer those services um to those who reach out to us.
00:40:52.960 --> 00:40:58.000
Uh so Sean, I guess um, we talked about digital governance obligations increasing.
00:40:58.079 --> 00:41:06.079
We've talked about the need for these skills in the boardroom uh and um you know digital risks that are emerging as well and the pace of change.
00:41:06.239 --> 00:41:10.400
Uh I think there's a lot to do in boardrooms, but I'll hand back to you to close out.
00:41:10.880 --> 00:41:11.599
Thanks, Ben.
00:41:11.840 --> 00:41:12.960
So thanks again, team.
00:41:13.039 --> 00:41:16.079
Uh, please feel free to connect with our presenters, everybody on LinkedIn.
00:41:16.159 --> 00:41:18.320
I'm sure they'll look forward to your connection.
00:41:18.639 --> 00:41:27.679
And as Helen mentioned, we've got some exciting uh things coming your way at the roadshow, October and November for Kiwis and Aussies, that is.
00:41:28.079 --> 00:41:32.559
Um, you can find out all about it on our website homepage.
00:41:32.639 --> 00:41:34.079
You'll see it uh listed there.
00:41:34.159 --> 00:41:38.559
So we'd love to see you there and finally put a face to the name, as it were.
00:41:38.800 --> 00:41:42.000
As Helen said, early bird tickets are available.
00:41:42.480 --> 00:41:49.840
Uh you get 35% off the ticket price if you book now between now and the 30th of September.
00:41:51.599 --> 00:42:01.360
So if you're looking for past webinars, of which there are many, hundreds, uh, to hone your knowledge, then you'll find a library of webinars in our community portal.
00:42:01.519 --> 00:42:02.880
It's free to join.
00:42:03.280 --> 00:42:06.880
Um, so we invite you to be part of that growing community there.
00:42:07.199 --> 00:42:15.440
You'll find uh all of the slide decks from the webinars, the transcripts, and all of the other uh resources as well.
00:42:15.760 --> 00:42:24.400
Uh you'll receive an email from me tomorrow now, which will include a recording of today's webinar, the transcript and the presentation slides.
00:42:24.800 --> 00:42:28.480
They'll also be hosted on the community portal, as I just said.
00:42:28.719 --> 00:42:34.480
And of course, if you're considering board management software for your organization, we would love to hear from you.
00:42:34.639 --> 00:42:38.320
Better still, why not try our free 30-day free trial?
00:42:38.480 --> 00:42:43.199
It's really simple and straightforward, doesn't require any credit cards to get started.
00:42:43.599 --> 00:42:46.400
So thank you again for your attendance, everybody.
00:42:46.480 --> 00:42:48.800
I hope you enjoyed the session today as I did.
00:42:48.960 --> 00:42:51.039
Thank you, Ben, Sorin, and Helen.
00:42:51.440 --> 00:42:53.760
Uh, look forward to seeing you all at our next webinar.
00:42:53.840 --> 00:42:55.119
Everybody, have a great day.
