Black Perspective: July 2, 2023

WEBVTT
1
00:00:00.160 --> 00:00:04.599
It's July second, and today we
dive right into three rulings from the Supreme
2
00:00:04.639 --> 00:00:10.119
Court that have major ramifications for Black
people and the LGBTQ community. We also
3
00:00:10.199 --> 00:00:14.480
visit Chicago and talk to founders of
an orchestra that is helping artists around the
4
00:00:14.519 --> 00:00:19.559
world, and Doug Davis is combining
your Black business and the Gospel Truth.
5
00:00:20.000 --> 00:00:24.039
Those stories are more on The Black
Perspective. I'm your host, Mike Isla.
6
00:00:24.559 --> 00:00:28.719
Welcome to the Black Perspective, a
weekly community affairs program on the Black
7
00:00:28.719 --> 00:00:33.840
Information Network featuring interviews and discussions on
issues important to the black community. In
8
00:00:33.880 --> 00:00:38.079
a sixty three ruling, the US
Supreme Court has ruled affirmative action policies at
9
00:00:38.119 --> 00:00:43.880
colleges to be unconstitutional. The ruling
will dramatically alter admissions policies that have been
10
00:00:43.920 --> 00:00:48.359
in place for decades at many universities
where race has been a factor in selecting
11
00:00:48.359 --> 00:00:51.960
a student population that mirrors the makeup
of the nation as a whole. The
12
00:00:52.000 --> 00:00:56.719
Black Information Networks Vanessa Tyler spoke with
a Florida A and M University law professor
13
00:00:56.960 --> 00:01:00.560
about the ruling and what it means
for potential black students moving forward. Decades
14
00:01:00.600 --> 00:01:06.159
of precedent gone with one decision from
what President Biden says is not a normal
15
00:01:06.239 --> 00:01:10.680
court. But is there some wiggle
room in the High Court's ruling. Helping
16
00:01:10.760 --> 00:01:15.879
us dig into the decision is FAMU
International Law Professor doctor Jeremy Levitt. Doctor
17
00:01:15.959 --> 00:01:19.959
Levitt, Welcome to the Black Information
Network. Great to be with you,
18
00:01:19.560 --> 00:01:25.560
doctor Levitt. What does this mean
for black students applying to Harvard and the
19
00:01:25.680 --> 00:01:30.400
University of North Carolina. Well,
what this means for black students applying to
20
00:01:30.799 --> 00:01:37.120
any predominantly white institution is that race
cannot be used as a factor in the
21
00:01:37.159 --> 00:01:42.319
emission process. So no longer can
an emissions committee looking at two candidates,
22
00:01:42.359 --> 00:01:47.760
all things being equal, and then
deciding to admit the black person on the
23
00:01:47.799 --> 00:01:53.079
basis they're trying to diversify the student
body. That no longer is permissible according
24
00:01:53.120 --> 00:01:56.200
to this ruling. Just to be
clear, how much did race play into
25
00:01:56.200 --> 00:02:00.760
admissions in the first place, Well, I think significant, And the Supreme
26
00:02:00.799 --> 00:02:07.519
Court has slowly been chiseling away at
that, beginning with the Baky decision in
27
00:02:07.560 --> 00:02:15.400
the eighties and then the Grutter decision
after that. It's slowly been chiseling away.
28
00:02:15.680 --> 00:02:19.240
We really haven't had affirmative action in
this country. When you look at
29
00:02:19.319 --> 00:02:23.199
how long it took the desagregate after
Brown versus Board of Education, we're really
30
00:02:23.199 --> 00:02:28.879
talking about the nineteen seventies. So
now when you look at the Baki decision
31
00:02:28.919 --> 00:02:35.280
in the eighties and then the Grutter
decision in the nineties, decisions that kind
32
00:02:35.280 --> 00:02:39.840
of reversed the openness and the open
period of trying to repair historic discrimination.
33
00:02:40.840 --> 00:02:46.120
Now we have this decision, and
obviously you had the University of Texas decision
34
00:02:46.159 --> 00:02:51.159
in twenty thirteen, the Ficial decision, which basically said that in order for
35
00:02:51.199 --> 00:02:55.680
a university use race, they had
to have a compelling governmental interest and the
36
00:02:55.800 --> 00:03:00.400
use of that had to be narrowly
tailored, meaning necessary to achieve that interest.
37
00:03:00.840 --> 00:03:06.759
So there's been this slow attack on
affirmative action which really didn't exist in
38
00:03:06.800 --> 00:03:12.280
any significant way for any significant amount
of time to today's decision, which eliminates
39
00:03:12.280 --> 00:03:17.080
except for military schools. Isn't that
interesting that they can take black and brown
40
00:03:17.120 --> 00:03:23.879
people into the military using their race, but universities aren't allowed to consider race
41
00:03:23.919 --> 00:03:27.960
for purpose of admissions. That is
interesting. Is there any wiggle room?
42
00:03:28.240 --> 00:03:30.680
What about essays? President Biden referred
to that in this comments. Well,
43
00:03:30.719 --> 00:03:36.639
basically, what the opinion says is
that if a student wants to use a
44
00:03:36.759 --> 00:03:40.800
reference to race and identifying their kind
of life experience in their essay, that's
45
00:03:40.840 --> 00:03:46.719
permissible. But what's not permissible is
the university relying on that notification of race
46
00:03:46.800 --> 00:03:52.599
in an essay for purposes of admission. So it's kind of a nod wink
47
00:03:52.719 --> 00:03:55.680
kind of thing, right, So
students will fly to their race and universities
48
00:03:55.719 --> 00:04:00.639
will find other ways to admit them
without relying on race, where prior to
49
00:04:00.719 --> 00:04:05.319
this it could be used as a
as a formidable and formal factor in admissions.
50
00:04:06.560 --> 00:04:12.319
Well, what does this due to
the so called legacy enrollments that favored
51
00:04:12.319 --> 00:04:18.839
the wealthy, Well favors white people
predominantly, right, and so it doesn't
52
00:04:18.839 --> 00:04:24.519
do anything to it, right.
You know what's been interesting is the individual
53
00:04:25.399 --> 00:04:34.000
who it's really behind this litigation couldn't
find white students that would make a formidable
54
00:04:35.160 --> 00:04:41.639
case, and so they found Asians. So here you have conservative Asian students
55
00:04:41.680 --> 00:04:47.240
willing to be a part of this
lawsuit suing basically saying that they weren't admitted,
56
00:04:47.879 --> 00:04:53.839
they had higher numbers in black blacks
admitted, they were disadvantaged and discriminated
57
00:04:53.879 --> 00:04:58.879
against based on race because race was
used as a as a vehicle to admit
58
00:04:58.959 --> 00:05:02.800
other people and out them. So
it's kind of like using two minorities to
59
00:05:02.839 --> 00:05:05.920
fight one another. And this is, you know, I think going to
60
00:05:06.000 --> 00:05:12.079
bring to the forefront an entirely different
discussion, right because we're in a period
61
00:05:12.079 --> 00:05:15.240
now where we're looking at Asian civil
rights and human rights where the Asian group
62
00:05:15.360 --> 00:05:20.279
standing up saying you shouldn't be involved
litigation that are going to disadvantage African Americans.
63
00:05:20.279 --> 00:05:24.040
Well none of them aren't. And
so this is this is a huge
64
00:05:24.399 --> 00:05:28.959
problem, and it goes back to
the original sentiments that not everyone is equal
65
00:05:29.240 --> 00:05:33.319
in their minority status. So the
people of color paradigm, the diversity paradigm,
66
00:05:33.600 --> 00:05:38.959
the minority paradigm have always been black
plus, meaning originally it was just
67
00:05:39.120 --> 00:05:42.399
us, and then as others began
migrating to the country, we began to
68
00:05:42.480 --> 00:05:46.800
include them in this big pie called
minority ism. It hasn't worked well for
69
00:05:46.839 --> 00:05:50.360
African Americans, and perhaps this case
is the greatest example. Then what does
70
00:05:50.360 --> 00:05:55.439
this do for education for everyone?
Black? White, and Asian diversity really
71
00:05:55.439 --> 00:06:03.399
helps everybody? Well, it's an
interesting question. Certainly if universities don't find
72
00:06:03.480 --> 00:06:13.439
another way to create a diverse class, whether it's using socioeconomic status, whether
73
00:06:13.439 --> 00:06:19.199
it's using public service, those broad
categories for which African Americans fall into,
74
00:06:19.600 --> 00:06:24.279
it's going to shrink the number of
diverse candidates. But on the other side,
75
00:06:24.879 --> 00:06:28.639
what might happen is it could increase
the numbers at historically black universities,
76
00:06:29.439 --> 00:06:32.000
and that wouldn't be such a bad
thing, to be quite honest. So
77
00:06:32.279 --> 00:06:39.839
we got to start thinking for ourselves
and really quit reacting to what predominantly white
78
00:06:39.879 --> 00:06:43.480
institutions in America, including the Supreme
Court, have done. It has been
79
00:06:43.519 --> 00:06:46.519
one of the most oppressive mechanisms for
black people in the country, beginning with
80
00:06:46.560 --> 00:06:50.240
the dread Scott decision in eighteen fifty
seven when it said that black people were
81
00:06:50.240 --> 00:06:54.399
not citizens of the country, we
were property, We were never intended to
82
00:06:54.399 --> 00:06:58.279
be a part of the political community
called America, and that the black man
83
00:06:58.319 --> 00:07:00.319
and woman had no rights for which
the white man was bound to respect.
84
00:07:00.360 --> 00:07:04.759
Those are quotes from Justice taining in
that decision. And then we moved to
85
00:07:04.800 --> 00:07:10.759
Plessy versus ferguson Right, which occurs
after the Fourteenth Amendment protested clause, which
86
00:07:10.800 --> 00:07:14.839
was designed for black people to be
equal in America and separate but equal.
87
00:07:14.879 --> 00:07:17.360
In eighteen ninety six basically said,
look, we're invading the fourteenth Amendment.
88
00:07:17.360 --> 00:07:20.560
We're just gonna make it so it's
separate, but it's still gonna be equal,
89
00:07:20.560 --> 00:07:24.319
so we'll comply with the law.
Well, that was a disaster that
90
00:07:24.439 --> 00:07:29.639
brought forward a whole new air of
Jim Crow segregation, black codes, etc.
91
00:07:30.240 --> 00:07:32.480
And then we have that order of
the day in America till nineteen fifty
92
00:07:32.480 --> 00:07:38.040
four Versusport of Education, which it
took us thirty years to implement properly.
93
00:07:38.360 --> 00:07:42.439
So we really haven't had a break
from historic discrimination. So this case,
94
00:07:42.680 --> 00:07:46.839
this is another slap in the face
by a court that has never represented the
95
00:07:46.920 --> 00:07:49.639
rights of black people. The President
said, this court especially is not a
96
00:07:49.720 --> 00:07:54.360
normal court. From what you're saying, it pretty much goes to part of
97
00:07:54.360 --> 00:07:58.720
what they've been doing throughout history.
But I'm just curious what could happen next,
98
00:07:59.199 --> 00:08:01.920
especially with pro grahams that encourage a
diversity outside of education. Well,
99
00:08:03.199 --> 00:08:09.800
it's a great question because how does
this affect disadvantaged business enterprises right minority contracting.
100
00:08:09.680 --> 00:08:16.480
How will it affect African Americans in
the corporate sphere with all of the
101
00:08:16.639 --> 00:08:20.600
DNI programs. Remember that we're we're
three years outside of the murder George Floyd,
102
00:08:20.639 --> 00:08:26.160
when we saw this kind of you
know, transition in America. Who
103
00:08:28.279 --> 00:08:33.799
what Republicans hate wokeness and now we're
seeing a reverse of that. I call
104
00:08:33.879 --> 00:08:37.759
this a kind of lawfare on black
people. It's another way that the Supreme
105
00:08:37.799 --> 00:08:45.200
Court and those who hold those values
make warfare legally against black people. It's
106
00:08:45.200 --> 00:08:48.039
a kind of lawfare against black people. So I think it's going to have
107
00:08:48.200 --> 00:08:54.840
significant impacts in the workforce. It's
going to further justify the pushback in places
108
00:08:54.879 --> 00:08:58.200
like Florida where I'm at, where
we have an attack on critical race theory,
109
00:08:58.200 --> 00:09:01.559
even though people don't know what that
is, diversity and inclusion and First
110
00:09:01.559 --> 00:09:07.360
Amendment protections and so forth. So
I think it fits along the continuum that
111
00:09:07.399 --> 00:09:13.919
we've seen, particularly in the American
South. What must other institutions be thinking
112
00:09:13.000 --> 00:09:18.559
right now? Are they going to
think creatively, maybe a little outside of
113
00:09:18.559 --> 00:09:20.360
the box, or are they just
gonna go with it. Well, they're
114
00:09:20.360 --> 00:09:24.480
gonna have to think creatively. They're
gonna have to push back. You know,
115
00:09:24.759 --> 00:09:26.879
there are a couple of things that, in my view need to be
116
00:09:26.879 --> 00:09:28.799
done. We need to drop the
SAT, and we need to drop the
117
00:09:28.919 --> 00:09:35.159
l s AT or the MCAT or
the gr And there is a movement among
118
00:09:35.320 --> 00:09:43.600
universities to drop the SAT and some
of the graduate admission exams because they do
119
00:09:43.320 --> 00:09:50.840
demonstrate a form of racial bias.
Either either they demonstrate racial bias or our
120
00:09:50.919 --> 00:09:56.080
African Americans are intellectually inferior. Right, you can't have it both ways,
121
00:09:56.720 --> 00:10:01.000
right, So you take two people
from the same background, one's black,
122
00:10:01.039 --> 00:10:05.120
ones white, middle class, and
on average going to the same schools,
123
00:10:05.120 --> 00:10:07.000
on average, African Americans score north. So what is it? Is this
124
00:10:07.080 --> 00:10:13.919
person inferior innately or is there something
wrong with the exam itself? So we
125
00:10:13.960 --> 00:10:18.440
have to move to a test optional
approach where these essays that they write and
126
00:10:18.600 --> 00:10:22.559
the totality of their experience it's used
to admit them. I do the first
127
00:10:22.600 --> 00:10:26.440
thing. The other thing is I
think we need to take a look at
128
00:10:26.480 --> 00:10:33.000
the historically black university and reevaluate whether
we need modern black universities in the north.
129
00:10:33.360 --> 00:10:35.519
We have historically black university in the
South, we have none in the
130
00:10:35.559 --> 00:10:39.759
northern part of the country. And
I think this could be an opportunity to
131
00:10:39.879 --> 00:10:46.919
grow privately owned modern black universities focusing
on the areas where there are deficits in
132
00:10:46.960 --> 00:10:50.480
our community, like STEM in the
North. We need it. There's only
133
00:10:50.480 --> 00:10:54.240
one that I'm familiar with, Charles
Ruin in Los Angeles and medical School,
134
00:10:54.399 --> 00:10:58.279
but there are no others. So
we got to think out the box as
135
00:10:58.320 --> 00:11:01.879
African Americans and quit working out of
convention. You have to think out of
136
00:11:01.919 --> 00:11:05.399
the box to conceive of a new
paradox. We don't think out of the
137
00:11:05.440 --> 00:11:09.120
box that conceiving new paradox. We're
going to continue to be disappointed by the
138
00:11:09.279 --> 00:11:13.600
edicts of this government. And here
I'm talking about the executive, the legislative,
139
00:11:13.600 --> 00:11:18.639
and the judiciary. So true,
Doctor Jeremy Lovett, Law Professor at
140
00:11:18.759 --> 00:11:22.559
HBCU, FAM you thank you for
joining the Black Information Network. Thanks Vanessa,
141
00:11:22.720 --> 00:11:28.320
and the Black Perspective will return in
thirty seconds. Join the Rainbow Push
142
00:11:28.360 --> 00:11:33.440
Coalition, Citizenship Education Fund, and
Push Excel for its annual international convention July
143
00:11:33.559 --> 00:11:39.360
fifteenth through the nineteenth. This year's
theme is the Perilous Journey from Freedom to
144
00:11:39.440 --> 00:11:45.159
Equality. The convention features many distinguished
session speakers on topics of educational equity and
145
00:11:45.240 --> 00:11:50.600
shaping public policy at the state and
federal levels. Of government register at Rainbow
146
00:11:50.600 --> 00:11:54.840
Push dot org. That's Rainbow Push
dot org. The Supreme Court made substantial
147
00:11:54.919 --> 00:12:00.159
rulings this week that affected a lot
of Americans now and moving forward. This
148
00:12:00.240 --> 00:12:03.879
next ruling, the Supreme Court blocked
President Biden's student loan Forgiveness plan, rejecting
149
00:12:03.919 --> 00:12:09.320
a program aimed at delivering up to
twenty thousand dollars of relief to millions of
150
00:12:09.360 --> 00:12:13.639
borrowers struggling with outstanding debt. The
Black Information That Works Mimi Brown speaks to
151
00:12:13.679 --> 00:12:18.480
a student loan expert to find out
how this affects the Black community. I
152
00:12:18.600 --> 00:12:20.879
me Me Brown with the Black Information
Network, and in light of the recent
153
00:12:20.919 --> 00:12:24.879
Supreme Court decision on student loan debt
relief, we are talking to an expert
154
00:12:24.919 --> 00:12:28.320
in the field. Her name is
Sonia Lewis, also known as the Student
155
00:12:28.360 --> 00:12:33.080
Loan Doctor. She's going to shed
some light on this crucial topic and provide
156
00:12:33.080 --> 00:12:37.519
guidance on what it all means and
how now to navigate the student loan landscape.
157
00:12:37.559 --> 00:12:41.120
Thank you so much for being here
with me today, Sonia, Thank
158
00:12:41.159 --> 00:12:45.320
you Me Me for having me absolutely. I want to start by getting your
159
00:12:45.360 --> 00:12:48.399
initial reaction to the Supreme Court's decision. Well, you know, Mimia.
160
00:12:48.480 --> 00:12:54.799
Unfortunately, I was not surprised and
the latest development with the other decisions that
161
00:12:54.840 --> 00:12:58.879
the Supreme Court has been making,
I was truly not surprised. I'm saddy,
162
00:12:58.039 --> 00:13:03.120
but not shot. Our listeners,
can you explain and simple terms what
163
00:13:03.240 --> 00:13:07.480
exactly the ruling means for student loan
debt relief? Yes, so it's very
164
00:13:07.480 --> 00:13:11.639
important for listeners to know that although
the Supreme Court did not rule in favor
165
00:13:11.679 --> 00:13:16.200
of the Biden loan forgiveness program,
it does not rule out the ability for
166
00:13:16.320 --> 00:13:20.759
Biden to pursue other endeavors for his
loan forgiveness program. So the ruling basically
167
00:13:20.759 --> 00:13:26.279
said that they found that the program
was unconstitutional to be awarded through the Hero's
168
00:13:26.360 --> 00:13:31.360
at which was put into provision through
President Trump. However, there are other
169
00:13:31.519 --> 00:13:37.360
endeavors that the Biden administration may pursue
to steal push through the ten or the
170
00:13:37.399 --> 00:13:39.600
twenty thousand of forgiveness. And for
those who don't know, can you explain
171
00:13:39.679 --> 00:13:45.080
what the Heroes Act meant and why
Biden was trying to go through use that
172
00:13:45.120 --> 00:13:48.399
avenue for student loan debt relief.
The hero allowed the Secretary of Education to
173
00:13:48.559 --> 00:13:54.799
wait to modify statutory or regulatory provisions
when it came to federals to the loan
174
00:13:54.840 --> 00:13:58.039
debt, and so basically it wanted
to make sure that far we're not in
175
00:13:58.080 --> 00:14:03.440
the worst position due to the pandemic. However, the Supreme Court had decided
176
00:14:03.720 --> 00:14:09.720
it was not used or should not
be used to grant forgiveness overall, which
177
00:14:09.720 --> 00:14:13.399
would have costed the country about four
hundred billion dollars. And how do you
178
00:14:13.440 --> 00:14:18.919
anticipate this ruling, well, specifically
impact the Black community who are already facing
179
00:14:18.759 --> 00:14:24.039
significant financial challenges. Well, meaning, it's really unfortunate because I know that
180
00:14:24.039 --> 00:14:26.360
there are a lot of people that
are looking forward to receiving the ten or
181
00:14:26.399 --> 00:14:30.440
twenty thousand. It could have been
just the thing that would have cleared your
182
00:14:30.440 --> 00:14:33.759
student loan debt. However, when
we look at the broader landscape of studo
183
00:14:33.799 --> 00:14:37.399
loan debt as it affects African Americans, particularly African American women, it really
184
00:14:37.440 --> 00:14:43.000
did not provide a drop in the
buffet an African Americans owns generally owe about
185
00:14:43.039 --> 00:14:45.600
fifty thousand or more in s to
the loan debt. So it would have
186
00:14:45.600 --> 00:14:48.679
been a nice for free or would
have done a nice production, but it
187
00:14:48.720 --> 00:14:52.120
would not have made much of a
contribution to the overall debt, particularly when
188
00:14:52.159 --> 00:14:56.120
we talk about those that have a
master or doctoral degree behind your name,
189
00:14:56.559 --> 00:15:00.600
that is more of a six figures
to the loan that problem. So what
190
00:15:00.679 --> 00:15:03.720
we're looking for, Mimi in this
case is we're looking to see what the
191
00:15:03.759 --> 00:15:07.240
President can do, possibly through the
Higher Education Act of nineteen sixty five,
192
00:15:07.559 --> 00:15:13.000
which would allow people really to have
a bigger replet with sudent loan debt.
193
00:15:13.200 --> 00:15:15.919
That may be the way that this
should go. I mean Brown with the
194
00:15:15.960 --> 00:15:18.759
Black Information Network, and I am
talking with Sounda. Lewis, aka the
195
00:15:18.799 --> 00:15:24.039
Student Loan Doctor, and we are
talking about the recent Supreme Court ruling striking
196
00:15:24.080 --> 00:15:28.480
down Biden's student loan debt relief plan. So yeah, I wanted to ask
197
00:15:28.519 --> 00:15:33.519
you, are there any existing federal
or state level programs that could potentially help
198
00:15:33.559 --> 00:15:37.440
alleviate the burden of student loan debt
despite the Supreme Court ruling. Oh yes,
199
00:15:37.480 --> 00:15:41.320
I'm very very excited. I'm passionate
about the Public Service Loan Forgiveness program.
200
00:15:41.559 --> 00:15:43.799
This is the number one program,
Menia. I believe that it's going
201
00:15:43.840 --> 00:15:48.360
to help our community, the black
community, get out of student loan debt.
202
00:15:48.559 --> 00:15:50.559
And what that looks like, is
if that person works for a public
203
00:15:50.559 --> 00:15:54.960
service job, government, nonprofit,
education, healthcare, if they could be
204
00:15:56.000 --> 00:16:00.320
eligible through their work endeavors to secure
loan forgiveness. Now what's really cool is
205
00:16:00.360 --> 00:16:04.960
the Biden administration had did what we
call back data forgiveness. So if you
206
00:16:06.039 --> 00:16:10.679
had worked at one of these qualified
organizations since two thousand and stepping forward,
207
00:16:11.120 --> 00:16:14.559
as soon as you hit ten years
of work, even if you had not
208
00:16:14.639 --> 00:16:18.039
made a payment on your loans,
meaning you could be qualified for low forgiveness.
209
00:16:18.240 --> 00:16:22.519
So I can attest that I've seen
millions through my community secure loan forgiveness,
210
00:16:22.639 --> 00:16:26.440
and overall their estimating the numbers to
be at this point about sixty six
211
00:16:26.480 --> 00:16:30.879
billion dollars. So I would tell
anyone that's listening that if you are eligible
212
00:16:30.960 --> 00:16:34.080
or you may have been eligible in
the past, you work history for the
213
00:16:34.159 --> 00:16:37.879
public service loan Forgiveness program, it
is not too late to still apply.
214
00:16:38.200 --> 00:16:42.480
They are still accepting applications. And
how would one apply for the public service
215
00:16:42.519 --> 00:16:47.679
loan forgiveness program. Absolutely, they
would go to student aid dot com,
216
00:16:47.799 --> 00:16:51.480
student aid dot Go. Public Service
Loan Forgiveness would be where you would start
217
00:16:51.720 --> 00:16:56.639
and you would complete your employment application
to verify your work history in light of
218
00:16:56.679 --> 00:16:59.759
the decision. What advice though,
would you get to individuals who are currently
219
00:16:59.759 --> 00:17:03.920
struggling with student loan debt and relying
who are relying on that relief plan to
220
00:17:03.960 --> 00:17:07.599
go through. So here's the thing. It is unfortunate that the forgiveness will
221
00:17:07.640 --> 00:17:11.640
not be passed through. What I
will say is that there are some new
222
00:17:11.720 --> 00:17:15.759
things that are coming up as of
July first for student loan debts. So
223
00:17:15.839 --> 00:17:18.400
one of the things is that they're
going to be lower payment plans enacted to
224
00:17:18.480 --> 00:17:23.839
The Bising administration is revising a plan
called repay that many people are familiar with,
225
00:17:25.160 --> 00:17:27.599
so that when it's time to go
back into student and repayment comes September,
226
00:17:27.839 --> 00:17:32.519
they will have a lower repayment to
go into. Another thing meaning that's
227
00:17:32.519 --> 00:17:36.720
really exciting is that there's going to
be what's called a one time account adjustment
228
00:17:37.119 --> 00:17:40.359
where the Department Education said, hey, listen, if you were ever in
229
00:17:40.480 --> 00:17:45.680
forbearance and that means you're unable to
make payments due to financial circumstances, you
230
00:17:45.720 --> 00:17:51.160
are able to get credits of up
to thirty six months applied to your account
231
00:17:51.559 --> 00:17:56.920
for either an income driven repayment or
public service loan forgiveness. So there's gonna
232
00:17:56.920 --> 00:18:00.039
be more details coming out about debt. But meaning what that means over we
233
00:18:00.119 --> 00:18:02.799
all, just to boil it down, is that there are going to be
234
00:18:02.839 --> 00:18:07.440
people that are going to experience loan
forgiveness in the next few months because of
235
00:18:07.440 --> 00:18:11.720
that one time account adjustment. So
although this was not a fortunate win for
236
00:18:11.920 --> 00:18:15.599
our community, there are going to
be a lot of people that have been
237
00:18:15.640 --> 00:18:19.599
in repayment through an income driven plan
or public service, no forgiveness that's going
238
00:18:19.680 --> 00:18:23.000
to give them from credit and it's
going to help some people get over the
239
00:18:23.000 --> 00:18:26.799
top in terms of being done with
stud alone debt. So I'm actually very
240
00:18:26.799 --> 00:18:30.960
excited for the next few months and
I'm very hopeful as to what's to come
241
00:18:30.000 --> 00:18:34.319
from those adjustments. Sonya lewis always
always a pleasure to speak with you,
242
00:18:34.519 --> 00:18:37.359
the Student Loan Doctor. Please let
our listeners know where they can find you.
243
00:18:37.599 --> 00:18:41.359
Sure, please locate us. We
are very popular on social media,
244
00:18:41.400 --> 00:18:47.359
particularly Instagram the Sudalone Doctor. Our
website is doctor Please help me dot com
245
00:18:47.680 --> 00:18:51.359
and we have a YouTube channel that
has all of the latest updates the news
246
00:18:51.440 --> 00:18:55.000
sites that you may need and we
put into perspective for our audience, thanks
247
00:18:55.039 --> 00:18:59.640
Mami. In another ruling, the
Supreme Court stated that a Christian website,
248
00:18:59.680 --> 00:19:03.480
Desire, doesn't have to make wedding
websites for same sex couples due to religious
249
00:19:03.519 --> 00:19:08.279
beliefs. This is looked at as
another blow to the LGBTQ community. Our
250
00:19:08.359 --> 00:19:12.279
next guest as an author who speaks
to our own Esther Dillard, about how
251
00:19:12.359 --> 00:19:17.880
TV and film has led to a
lot of negative policy against the trans community.
252
00:19:17.920 --> 00:19:22.559
In this week's episode of The Color
Between the Lines, him aster Dillard
253
00:19:22.640 --> 00:19:26.119
on the Black Information Network, chatting
with writers and authors who offer an added
254
00:19:26.160 --> 00:19:37.279
perspective for our listeners. This is
the Color between the Lines. In this
255
00:19:37.519 --> 00:19:41.640
edition of The Color between the Lines, we're speaking with award winning journalist Trevelle
256
00:19:41.920 --> 00:19:47.359
Anderson. Anderson is the former director
of Culture and Entertainment at Out Magazine,
257
00:19:47.400 --> 00:19:52.440
as well as a film reporter with
the Los Angeles Times. Travel also co
258
00:19:52.640 --> 00:19:59.119
hosts two podcasts and writes and reports
for Essence, Teen Vogel, The Washington
259
00:19:59.200 --> 00:20:03.240
Post, Esquire, and Time Magazine
and many more. And still, despite
260
00:20:03.240 --> 00:20:07.599
that very busy schedule, trey Velle
has managed to write a book entitled We
261
00:20:07.759 --> 00:20:11.839
See each Other, a Black trans
Journey through TV and film. Thank you
262
00:20:11.920 --> 00:20:17.240
Trey Velle for joining us on the
bi N Thanks so much, Thanks so
263
00:20:17.319 --> 00:20:21.200
much for having me asther well.
In your book, you wrote about a
264
00:20:21.279 --> 00:20:26.359
lot of things, influences growing up
and influences on the screen. You said
265
00:20:26.440 --> 00:20:33.440
in your introduction you pretty much felt
like you learn to be homophobic from both
266
00:20:33.519 --> 00:20:37.160
influences. I wondered if you could
just elaborate on that and how those influences
267
00:20:37.200 --> 00:20:41.519
kind of led you to where you
are today as a writer. Absolutely well.
268
00:20:41.559 --> 00:20:44.480
You know, I feel like we
we all grew up in an era,
269
00:20:45.039 --> 00:20:48.000
right, because all of our eras
that we grew up in are different
270
00:20:48.079 --> 00:20:52.720
than the one we are in today, in which homophobia transphobia was like baked
271
00:20:52.759 --> 00:20:56.599
into the cake, right, And
so we all remember the jokes in our
272
00:20:56.720 --> 00:21:03.400
favorite TV shows about someone who was
thought to be gay, right, but
273
00:21:03.559 --> 00:21:07.039
no one really talked about and so
you just heard the jokes or I like
274
00:21:07.119 --> 00:21:11.160
to. I speak a lot in
the book about my relationship to media,
275
00:21:11.319 --> 00:21:18.400
Tyler Perry's character of media, and
in my adulthood, I have recognized how
276
00:21:18.839 --> 00:21:25.720
the same types of jokes that were
made on screen about gay people, about
277
00:21:25.799 --> 00:21:32.640
trans people, about about women who
were played by men right, and so
278
00:21:32.720 --> 00:21:37.279
there were always jokes about their quote
unquote male features. Right. How that
279
00:21:37.400 --> 00:21:42.519
has manifested in real life as the
same violence that we as black trans women
280
00:21:42.559 --> 00:21:47.960
in films experience in community. And
so that's what I mean when I say
281
00:21:48.000 --> 00:21:52.559
that I was taught to be homophobic
in transphobic, because we all were taught
282
00:21:52.599 --> 00:21:56.480
to be homophobic in transphobic. And
like, the goal and the work that
283
00:21:56.519 --> 00:22:03.119
we all should be doing, in
my eyes, are to challenge and interrogate
284
00:22:03.680 --> 00:22:07.319
the some of the things that we
accepted as fact right when we were younger,
285
00:22:07.599 --> 00:22:12.440
that may not be reality, right, that may not have been informed
286
00:22:14.400 --> 00:22:18.799
by, you know, the truth
of a variety of folks's experiences. And
287
00:22:18.839 --> 00:22:22.160
so that's what I mean when I
say I was taught to be homophobic and
288
00:22:22.200 --> 00:22:25.960
transphobic. It's just that everything around
me, from the images that I saw
289
00:22:26.000 --> 00:22:30.000
on screen, to the jokes that
my family members were making, to the
290
00:22:30.039 --> 00:22:33.039
ways that they tried to police how
I was showing up in real life,
291
00:22:33.200 --> 00:22:37.400
it all taught me that the person
who I knew that I was deep down
292
00:22:37.400 --> 00:22:41.599
inside since I was four years old
didn't have the language when I was four,
293
00:22:41.720 --> 00:22:45.559
but I knew I was quote unquote
different. I knew that I was
294
00:22:45.559 --> 00:22:48.039
showing up in the world in ways
that my mom and my dad and my
295
00:22:48.160 --> 00:22:53.519
pastor grandmother were saying that I shouldn't
show up right, and so they basically
296
00:22:53.519 --> 00:22:57.400
taught me to hate myself. And
many of us have been taught to hate
297
00:22:57.400 --> 00:23:04.279
ourselves and spend a life time trying
to undo that education. Did that that
298
00:23:04.480 --> 00:23:08.599
help you gain the strength to kind
of push towards what your goal was,
299
00:23:08.680 --> 00:23:12.400
which was I think, to become
a really great writer. And in this
300
00:23:12.440 --> 00:23:18.440
industry of the television and film industry, you know, I actually I think
301
00:23:18.480 --> 00:23:19.519
a lot of it for me goes
back to my time I went to more
302
00:23:19.559 --> 00:23:26.039
House for undergrad and to be in
that specific space. I'm talking to black
303
00:23:26.039 --> 00:23:27.880
folks, so I know y'all know
what I mean when I say that,
304
00:23:29.599 --> 00:23:37.839
to be in that specific space as
someone whose gender identity was becoming so much
305
00:23:37.920 --> 00:23:42.759
in conflict with the stereotypical idea of
what a more House man is supposed to
306
00:23:42.799 --> 00:23:49.640
be was interesting, to say the
least. We always hear folks say,
307
00:23:49.839 --> 00:23:53.160
you know, you can't be what
you can't see, But for so many
308
00:23:53.200 --> 00:23:59.200
trans folks, we have created ourselves
out of the depths of our imagination,
309
00:23:59.680 --> 00:24:06.160
not having a mirror in society to
reflect something back to us. And I'm
310
00:24:06.200 --> 00:24:10.920
grateful that I have blossomed into this
wonderful individual that is before you right now.
311
00:24:11.920 --> 00:24:17.720
But imagine who I could have been
if my younger self was supported and
312
00:24:17.759 --> 00:24:22.359
affirmed. Using my voice my pen
in that particular way has been a motivator,
313
00:24:22.640 --> 00:24:25.960
one to tell my story, but
also to tell the stories of other
314
00:24:26.000 --> 00:24:29.759
people like me, who live,
who love and exist like me. We
315
00:24:29.839 --> 00:24:34.000
have existed since the beginning of time
in every culture on this planet, and
316
00:24:34.079 --> 00:24:37.880
a lot of that history many folks
just don't know. They think we dropped
317
00:24:37.880 --> 00:24:40.759
off onto the face of the earth
with Laverne Cocks on Oranges and New Black
318
00:24:40.920 --> 00:24:44.599
in twenty fourteen. But we've always
been here, So it's important for me
319
00:24:44.640 --> 00:24:48.279
to remind folks that we've always been
here. Well, it's funny you led
320
00:24:48.279 --> 00:24:52.400
me write to my next question and
talking about the historical timeline of how translives
321
00:24:52.440 --> 00:24:56.359
are kind of portrayed in film and
television. Can you explain what you believe
322
00:24:56.400 --> 00:25:00.519
I guess we're really key moments that
needed to be addressed and why you wanted
323
00:25:00.519 --> 00:25:07.119
to highlight those in the book This
last decade has been wild when you consider
324
00:25:07.440 --> 00:25:11.960
where we started ten years ago and
where we are now in terms of just
325
00:25:11.000 --> 00:25:17.039
like the prevalence of trans people in
conversations about trans people not only on screen
326
00:25:17.079 --> 00:25:19.720
but also in culture writ large,
right, and now we're seeing, you
327
00:25:19.759 --> 00:25:25.359
know, a certain type of backlash
happening in state legislatures across the country towards
328
00:25:25.480 --> 00:25:30.480
trans people, trans women and girls
specifically. And so because of that,
329
00:25:30.880 --> 00:25:34.119
I think that is why it feels
like, you know, we often hear
330
00:25:34.160 --> 00:25:38.839
people say that like we are,
you know, forcing transnis down their throat,
331
00:25:40.920 --> 00:25:44.559
and that's because, prior to Laverne
Cox in the quote unquote transit,
332
00:25:44.599 --> 00:25:48.400
they're tipping point, you didn't see
many of us on screen, right,
333
00:25:48.920 --> 00:25:53.559
and it led you to believe that
you don't know any trans people. And
334
00:25:53.599 --> 00:25:59.759
the reality is we just have not
created a culture right in which trans people
335
00:25:59.759 --> 00:26:04.440
feel comfortable letting you know that we
are trans. And so we move through
336
00:26:04.480 --> 00:26:08.319
spaces, we go to the same
churches as you all. We are your
337
00:26:08.440 --> 00:26:12.720
Starbucks barista, we are the person
bagging your groceries at the grocery store,
338
00:26:12.720 --> 00:26:17.480
and you don't know that we're trans
because we don't feel safe enough to tell
339
00:26:17.559 --> 00:26:21.519
you that we are trans, and
so when we think about the history of
340
00:26:21.559 --> 00:26:25.680
the ways in which the community has
been represented on screen, it's important for
341
00:26:25.799 --> 00:26:29.799
us to take a look at a
film like Psycho or a filmlike Silence of
342
00:26:29.839 --> 00:26:33.119
the Lambs right in which you have
these serial killer types who are dressing up
343
00:26:33.160 --> 00:26:38.079
as women whose identities have been conflated
with trans identities. That now lead us
344
00:26:38.119 --> 00:26:45.200
to today when we have state legislators
assuming that we are serial killers, assuming
345
00:26:45.279 --> 00:26:49.039
that we are trying to prey upon, you know, a variety of different
346
00:26:49.039 --> 00:26:52.119
folks. It's because they saw it
on screen first. Because when you look
347
00:26:52.160 --> 00:26:56.960
at the reality, trans people are
just trying to use the bathroom. We're
348
00:26:56.000 --> 00:27:00.640
not trying to you know, We're
just trying to peep like everybody out.
349
00:27:02.160 --> 00:27:04.519
We're not trying to take up any
space, you know, We're not trying
350
00:27:04.519 --> 00:27:07.240
We're not trying to do the things
that they are trying to say that we're
351
00:27:07.279 --> 00:27:11.920
trying to do. But they've learned
so much of that hatred in the same
352
00:27:11.920 --> 00:27:15.759
way that I learned so much of
that hatred from the things we see on
353
00:27:15.839 --> 00:27:18.960
screen. And so it was important
to talk about those moments, but then
354
00:27:18.960 --> 00:27:26.039
to also properly contextualize them. While
also talking about in particular the last decade
355
00:27:26.359 --> 00:27:29.880
or so, where we are the
most visible we've ever been, but also
356
00:27:29.920 --> 00:27:36.039
the most vulnerable because visibility alone does
not protect any community. Yeah, it's
357
00:27:36.400 --> 00:27:40.279
interesting, how you know, you're
talking about black characters and television and how
358
00:27:40.319 --> 00:27:42.279
that they've changed. I mean,
if you look at the black characters in
359
00:27:42.359 --> 00:27:48.200
TV and film in the seventies and
eighties, that's a whole different There's so
360
00:27:48.240 --> 00:27:52.440
many layers now of different Black characters
in film and television. You can see
361
00:27:52.480 --> 00:27:57.880
so many different types of characters.
Now when you talk about the black trans
362
00:27:59.240 --> 00:28:04.519
community, it's changing too. Um. Watching Pose, I thought Pose kind
363
00:28:04.519 --> 00:28:08.960
of still fed into the whole stereotypical
thing. Did you feel that when you
364
00:28:10.000 --> 00:28:15.319
watched it? Yeah, it gave
people a look into the different layers of
365
00:28:15.680 --> 00:28:21.240
black, the black trans experience and
made many people who just didn't see them,
366
00:28:21.440 --> 00:28:23.880
they saw them as other and not
human. They gave they gave them
367
00:28:23.920 --> 00:28:29.359
more of a humanity. But do
you think that more of those characters are
368
00:28:29.359 --> 00:28:33.960
now going to change even more?
Now we're going to see a different arrange.
369
00:28:33.079 --> 00:28:37.119
Do you think in the next couple
of years. I hope so.
370
00:28:37.480 --> 00:28:40.240
I mean, you know the thing
that you just did there with the show
371
00:28:40.279 --> 00:28:45.599
like Pose, which is like honor
it for its bad boundary breaking, you
372
00:28:45.599 --> 00:28:49.680
know, groundbreaking existence because it was
right for what it was showing us,
373
00:28:49.880 --> 00:28:53.559
but also being able to recognize some
of the complexities they're in. Right.
374
00:28:53.799 --> 00:29:00.640
There is an age old stereotype in
Trope of trans characters being set X workers,
375
00:29:00.039 --> 00:29:04.880
right if you I used to love
Lono to ask vu, right,
376
00:29:06.160 --> 00:29:10.880
And every single time there was a
trans character on shows like that, right,
377
00:29:11.000 --> 00:29:15.079
they were sex workers, they were
down and out, they were the
378
00:29:15.160 --> 00:29:18.200
victim. And so I think the
goal is that we get to a point
379
00:29:18.279 --> 00:29:25.599
where we have as varied as possible
images of trans people on screen in the
380
00:29:25.680 --> 00:29:30.200
same ways that we're just I would
say, beginning to see a multiplicity of
381
00:29:30.240 --> 00:29:36.039
representation of different types of black people
on screen. And I also gathered from
382
00:29:36.039 --> 00:29:38.799
this book that you really wanted to
drive home the message of representation matters.
383
00:29:40.000 --> 00:29:42.359
It's not just in front of the
camera, but behind the scenes. In
384
00:29:42.400 --> 00:29:45.759
your experience in the industry, do
you think it's getting better? You know,
385
00:29:45.799 --> 00:29:49.720
it's interesting because I'm always reticent to
say, you know, yes,
386
00:29:49.960 --> 00:29:55.319
progress is happening, because I think
we get comfortable as an industry. So
387
00:29:55.359 --> 00:29:59.839
easily. I think that's one of
the reasons why we as black people right
388
00:30:00.880 --> 00:30:04.240
large are still clamoring and struggling,
and like, you know, we're still
389
00:30:04.319 --> 00:30:07.440
having when you look at the Hollywood
industry, we're still having the first black
390
00:30:07.480 --> 00:30:11.880
person nominated for this award, right, We're still having the second black person
391
00:30:11.920 --> 00:30:17.400
nominated for this award, And like
that's wild when you consider the contributions that
392
00:30:17.440 --> 00:30:22.559
we as black people have made to
this industry. But the exact same circumstances
393
00:30:22.599 --> 00:30:26.039
there are what we're dealing with as
as black trans people specifically and trans people
394
00:30:26.359 --> 00:30:33.079
more broadly. You know, yes, representation matters, And it sounds kind
395
00:30:33.119 --> 00:30:38.000
of cliche to say, I know
everybody's rolling their eyes Asian matters, but
396
00:30:38.079 --> 00:30:44.599
it does right because it acts.
It allows people to access so many possibilities
397
00:30:44.640 --> 00:30:48.039
of how we can move through the
world. Right and when the representation,
398
00:30:48.079 --> 00:30:52.079
when the only representation you have is
something that is stereotypical, with something that
399
00:30:52.160 --> 00:30:59.640
is written in in tropes, which
black folks know all too well, you
400
00:30:59.680 --> 00:31:03.160
know how that begins to turn into
policy. And so, yes, things
401
00:31:03.160 --> 00:31:07.920
are changing, not fast enough for
my own personal liking. And I would
402
00:31:07.960 --> 00:31:11.680
also say that there needs to be
a huge shift made because when you look
403
00:31:11.680 --> 00:31:17.000
at the people at the tippy top
of you know, the studios who are
404
00:31:17.000 --> 00:31:21.319
making the green light decisions for all
content that we see, it's still the
405
00:31:21.359 --> 00:31:25.559
same people, same type of people
in many ways. And then also this
406
00:31:25.839 --> 00:31:32.079
actual same individuals who have had the
jobs for fifteen twenty plus years, right.
407
00:31:32.400 --> 00:31:34.480
And you know, I don't I
don't like to tell people that they
408
00:31:34.559 --> 00:31:37.279
need to, you know, lose
their job because we all got bills to
409
00:31:37.359 --> 00:31:42.400
pay. But when the same people
are in the executive suite, right,
410
00:31:42.720 --> 00:31:48.200
who were there fifteen years ago,
twenty years ago, or the same mindset
411
00:31:48.279 --> 00:31:52.279
at minimum is in that suite,
we will never get to a place where
412
00:31:52.319 --> 00:31:57.240
black people have a variety of images
of ourselves on screen in the ways that
413
00:31:57.319 --> 00:32:01.359
represent the complexity of our actual lived
experience. We always say black people,
414
00:32:01.400 --> 00:32:05.519
I'm not a monolith, but you
would not necessarily know that when you turn
415
00:32:05.559 --> 00:32:07.519
on the TV screen sometimes, and
it's the same way with trans people.
416
00:32:07.720 --> 00:32:14.240
Well, you have been a wonderful
conversation here. I enjoyed it. Thank
417
00:32:14.279 --> 00:32:17.640
you so much, Trevelle Anderson for
joining us on the bi N Thanks so
418
00:32:17.680 --> 00:32:22.279
much for having me. Well,
the book is we see each other a
419
00:32:22.359 --> 00:32:25.880
Black trans journey through TV and film. That's it for this edition of The
420
00:32:25.920 --> 00:32:38.839
Color Between the Lines. I'm Aster
Dillard's on the Black Information Network. Join
421
00:32:38.920 --> 00:32:45.039
the Rainbow Push Coalition, Citizenship Education
Fund, and Push Excel for its annual
422
00:32:45.079 --> 00:32:50.759
international convention July fifteenth through the nineteenth. This year's theme is the Perilous Journey
423
00:32:50.920 --> 00:32:55.240
from Freedom to Equality. The convention
features many distinguished session speakers on topics of
424
00:32:55.359 --> 00:33:00.359
educational equity and shaping public policy at
the state and federal levels of government.
425
00:33:00.599 --> 00:33:07.640
Register at Rainbow Push dot org.
That's Rainbow Push. As the Black Information
426
00:33:07.680 --> 00:33:13.599
Networks, Terry McCready visits the Chicago
Jazz Philharmonic and talks to the founders about
427
00:33:13.640 --> 00:33:17.680
how they are helping future musicians all
around the world. We are welcoming mark
428
00:33:17.839 --> 00:33:22.960
Ingram and orber Davis, founders of
the Chicago Jazz phil Harmon MC Orchestra,
429
00:33:22.279 --> 00:33:27.119
to the Black Information Network. And
at first, before we even get started,
430
00:33:27.160 --> 00:33:31.000
I just want to say congratulations on
your award or best Orchestra in Illinois,
431
00:33:31.240 --> 00:33:37.599
a very distinguished recognition. Thank you
so much, and we're honored truly.
432
00:33:37.680 --> 00:33:39.799
So just for context, if you
wouldn't mind just telling us a bit
433
00:33:39.839 --> 00:33:45.279
about the mission of the CJP.
I know, providing that a stellar musical
434
00:33:45.440 --> 00:33:50.279
education to global students is just one
major objective. So Chatba James Gormonic.
435
00:33:50.799 --> 00:33:53.839
There's no orchestra like it because it's
when we think of the symphony orchestra,
436
00:33:53.920 --> 00:33:58.960
we think classical music. We think
a string section, you know, massive
437
00:33:59.039 --> 00:34:02.319
with horns and you know, percussion
and whatnot, and a conductor in the
438
00:34:02.319 --> 00:34:07.680
middle. But Chicago Jazz Philharmonic is
a jazz orchestra. So it looks like
439
00:34:07.680 --> 00:34:12.280
a symphony orchestra, but at the
heart is the jazz. The rhythm section,
440
00:34:12.599 --> 00:34:21.000
the concept of improvisation, the historical
esthetics of being African in America,
441
00:34:21.079 --> 00:34:25.320
and the music that came out of
that experience is all intertwined in the concept
442
00:34:25.519 --> 00:34:29.800
for the structure, if you will, of the symphony orchestra. It actually
443
00:34:29.840 --> 00:34:36.199
started out as a arts education program, right you know, that kind of
444
00:34:36.199 --> 00:34:40.280
grew into a full service performing arts
orchestra. You know, so Orbit has
445
00:34:40.320 --> 00:34:45.079
been in education, especially arts education, for as long as I've been doing
446
00:34:45.119 --> 00:34:49.440
it. So we started off doing
you know, building curriculum using the arts,
447
00:34:50.079 --> 00:34:53.719
especially for art's sake, which turned
into you know, using arts to
448
00:34:53.840 --> 00:35:00.280
teach reading and math which turned into
a performing arts orchestra, right because we
449
00:35:00.559 --> 00:35:05.280
and everything that we do, we
want to actually expose the arts to youth.
450
00:35:05.679 --> 00:35:07.000
And what the best way to do
that is connect them to what they
451
00:35:07.079 --> 00:35:14.079
like best is entertainment music. Putting
it a bit more about jazz alive,
452
00:35:14.760 --> 00:35:16.679
just the grander essence of what this
is all about. I have to say,
453
00:35:16.800 --> 00:35:22.119
this is an impressive array of ensembles. That you have, a sixty
454
00:35:22.199 --> 00:35:28.239
piece orchestra, double quartet, an
incredibly roared repertoire. Talk about more of
455
00:35:28.280 --> 00:35:31.119
some of the more unique distinctions.
You know, the sky's the limit,
456
00:35:31.639 --> 00:35:37.119
especially even when when we think of
the history of jazz from the development of
457
00:35:37.440 --> 00:35:44.440
ragtime to swing to bebop to modern
jazz, and then how jazz infused every
458
00:35:44.519 --> 00:35:50.599
music that it that was surrounding it, you know, from classical to pop
459
00:35:50.760 --> 00:35:52.960
to R and B. I mean, you think of the there's not an
460
00:35:53.079 --> 00:35:59.639
artist alive or from the past couple
of centuries who was not influenced by jazz.
461
00:36:00.320 --> 00:36:04.159
It's really the soundtrack of America.
So with our experience, we can
462
00:36:04.440 --> 00:36:07.159
we can draw from many different different
angles, you know, we can we
463
00:36:07.239 --> 00:36:13.239
can be historic and historic ensemble,
you know, giving giving honor to the
464
00:36:13.280 --> 00:36:16.480
greats like Duke Galling, Dinner Account
Basie, But then we can also take
465
00:36:16.519 --> 00:36:22.760
our concept to new and different heights. Our last concert was our fourth edition
466
00:36:22.880 --> 00:36:27.480
of what we call Chicago Immigrant Stories, where we take apart the aesthetics of
467
00:36:27.559 --> 00:36:31.440
jazz and classical and bring in a
cultural element, you know, and to
468
00:36:31.559 --> 00:36:37.840
feature immigrants from various countries with the
music they play, but surrounding it with
469
00:36:38.000 --> 00:36:43.159
this concept of the jazz symphony orchestra. Yeah, I was actually examining that.
470
00:36:43.199 --> 00:36:46.000
It was absolutely palpable, and it
was just so fascinating that you see
471
00:36:46.000 --> 00:36:52.960
this explosion of musical flavor and culture, and then you have this sheer brilliance
472
00:36:52.039 --> 00:36:57.920
of a finale with artists from you
know, the city's indigenous populations, Japanese,
473
00:36:57.960 --> 00:37:02.360
Brazilian neighborhoods, Ukrainians. This was
an unprecedented display. I thought,
474
00:37:02.639 --> 00:37:06.199
thank you. You know. The
interesting thing is that many of the artists
475
00:37:06.239 --> 00:37:08.639
that we feature have been friends of
ours for so long, you know,
476
00:37:08.719 --> 00:37:12.400
So it's not we don't we don't
we're not typecasting, or we don't we
477
00:37:12.400 --> 00:37:15.039
don't put out a call to find
you know, various musicians. They're really
478
00:37:15.079 --> 00:37:19.159
part of the network of musicians that
Mark and I have worked with in our
479
00:37:19.199 --> 00:37:23.320
in our many years of being professionals
in Chicago. So it's basically having this
480
00:37:23.320 --> 00:37:30.360
this m platform where we can not
only feature the artists, but to explore
481
00:37:30.400 --> 00:37:35.039
the possibilities of the music. We
start the concept of each concert actually a
482
00:37:35.119 --> 00:37:39.119
year in advance with conversations and that's
why we call it Immigrant Stories and so
483
00:37:39.159 --> 00:37:44.320
the music that girls are from the
very conversations that we have. So on
484
00:37:44.440 --> 00:37:47.519
that note, so I understand this
is the Philharmonic's eighteenth performance season, So
485
00:37:47.559 --> 00:37:52.519
I'd like to ask you individually about
your vision going forward and then talk a
486
00:37:52.519 --> 00:37:55.920
little bit more about what you have
on tap. The vision going forward for
487
00:37:57.039 --> 00:38:02.079
me is and we've done quite a
few and not an enough international performances where
488
00:38:02.079 --> 00:38:08.119
we would take the core musicians of
the Chicago Jazz Philharmonic to other countries and
489
00:38:08.320 --> 00:38:15.159
partner with with world class orchestras,
whether they're world class orchestras from universities or
490
00:38:15.199 --> 00:38:19.920
just the world class orchestras like the
CSO and Chicago Chicago Symphony Orchestra, and
491
00:38:19.960 --> 00:38:24.039
they become Chicago Jazz Philharmonic and we
perform the music of Chicago jets for harmonic
492
00:38:24.079 --> 00:38:29.559
with these orchestras. But part of
that hook in doing that, it has
493
00:38:29.599 --> 00:38:34.000
to be an education component. So
when we go to countries like Bulgaria where
494
00:38:34.000 --> 00:38:40.599
we've where we've gone Poland, we
actually went to Kiev the Ukraine, is
495
00:38:40.599 --> 00:38:45.280
to partner with universities they are,
or even high schools where we do master
496
00:38:45.360 --> 00:38:50.320
classes in that and not only talk
about our music, but the culture,
497
00:38:50.559 --> 00:38:53.880
the history of our music. And
so we want to do more of that,
498
00:38:54.440 --> 00:39:00.719
get out of Chicago and do more
of that, and the whole concept
499
00:39:00.880 --> 00:39:05.039
surrounding third stream, which orbit can
get more into. That's that's our Our
500
00:39:05.159 --> 00:39:08.119
genre is third stream. You can, yeah, it's it's it's the blending
501
00:39:08.119 --> 00:39:10.960
of classical and jazz. It was. The phrase was coined in the late
502
00:39:12.000 --> 00:39:15.639
fifties by a classical musician gun Through
Schuler, who actually was really good friends
503
00:39:15.639 --> 00:39:19.880
with Duke Kellington and coom Basie and
Sammy Davis Junior. So you know,
504
00:39:19.920 --> 00:39:22.920
at night he was playing his classical
music, but but I'm started during the
505
00:39:22.960 --> 00:39:24.559
day, but then at night he'd
hang up on hang out all night with
506
00:39:24.599 --> 00:39:30.480
the just the legends of our music. So he discovered a way to blend
507
00:39:30.719 --> 00:39:34.880
classical and jazz by calling it a
third stream. So we actually had the
508
00:39:34.920 --> 00:39:37.000
pleasure of working with him a few
years ago before he passed away, and
509
00:39:37.239 --> 00:39:40.320
he passed the baton of third stream
to us. One thing that Mark when
510
00:39:40.360 --> 00:39:46.400
he Mark mentioned I guess I get
goose bumps because the greatest example of this
511
00:39:46.519 --> 00:39:52.400
international exchange happened in Havada, Cuba
twenty fourteen. We were there working with
512
00:39:52.960 --> 00:40:00.599
sixty student musicians at the University Don
Dallas Artists in Havana, and the second
513
00:40:00.679 --> 00:40:06.320
day of our rehearsal was when President
Obama and Castro normalized relations. So imagine
514
00:40:06.400 --> 00:40:08.800
we're in Havana, you know,
in a sense, quote unquote enemies to
515
00:40:08.880 --> 00:40:12.800
these kids. You know, we
don't know what they've heard from their parents,
516
00:40:12.800 --> 00:40:15.760
but they they know the embargo and
what's going on in the United States.
517
00:40:15.920 --> 00:40:17.760
Then all of a sudden, we
become history. So that weekend,
518
00:40:17.800 --> 00:40:21.760
Mark and I were on sixty Minutes
with Scott Pellett and we got to tell
519
00:40:21.760 --> 00:40:25.239
our story. We became sort of
the poster children and started a movement with
520
00:40:25.280 --> 00:40:29.760
these kids who are now a major
part of our family. We're part of
521
00:40:29.760 --> 00:40:34.000
their families. We have a couple
of students right now at DePaul University and
522
00:40:34.000 --> 00:40:38.360
their master's program from Havana because we
were able to help facilitate and open that
523
00:40:38.440 --> 00:40:43.280
door for them. But the thing
that's amazing is that these musicians are some
524
00:40:43.320 --> 00:40:46.920
of the greatest musicians we have ever
ever met in our lives and their kids,
525
00:40:47.800 --> 00:40:52.000
you know. So the power of
what we discover is it's more than
526
00:40:52.039 --> 00:40:59.199
just going to a country and working
together. There's something just magical that happens
527
00:40:59.320 --> 00:41:02.480
at a deep level within sharing music
this way, you know. So we
528
00:41:04.079 --> 00:41:07.840
became very purposeful in our mission that
we're not just going to do concerts.
529
00:41:08.039 --> 00:41:13.480
We're going to play and do things
that can transform people, change the way
530
00:41:13.519 --> 00:41:20.000
people think, and even hopefully create
a better future for everybody. Well have
531
00:41:20.079 --> 00:41:22.920
to say thank you, gentlemen so
much for sort of taking us behind the
532
00:41:22.960 --> 00:41:27.679
scenes sure of the business and the
education of music. This has been an
533
00:41:27.719 --> 00:41:31.519
incredible treat and on behalf of the
Black Information Network, I'm want to once
534
00:41:31.559 --> 00:41:37.760
again extend our congratulations to you on
your reward for best orchestra in Illinois.
535
00:41:37.119 --> 00:41:42.800
And we've been speaking with Mark kram
Or Davis, founders of the Chicago Jazz
536
00:41:42.840 --> 00:41:45.360
bil Harmonic Orchestra. Right there on
the Black Information Network. Thank you both
537
00:41:45.440 --> 00:41:49.960
again so much, Fluch for joining, Thank you for having us, Thanks
538
00:41:50.079 --> 00:41:53.840
Terry. The Direct Reliefs Fund for
Health Equity was created to increase access to
539
00:41:53.880 --> 00:42:00.960
healthcare and improve health outcomes for marginalized
communities. The Black Information Works Mimi Brown
540
00:42:00.079 --> 00:42:06.199
is back with an organization that talked
about how direct relief has benefited their community.
541
00:42:06.480 --> 00:42:10.599
We are thrilled to highlight a remarkable
institution that continues to transform the lives
542
00:42:10.599 --> 00:42:15.119
of countless individuals and families, the
Institute for Family Health. Joining me to
543
00:42:15.159 --> 00:42:22.559
discuss this exceptional organization is the senior
vice president of Planning and Development, Maxine
544
00:42:22.679 --> 00:42:24.760
Gullup. Thank you so much for
joining us today. How are you,
545
00:42:25.119 --> 00:42:29.760
I'm fine, I'm excited to talk
with you. Thank you. So let's
546
00:42:29.840 --> 00:42:34.800
jump right in. Can you provide
an overview of the services and programs offered
547
00:42:34.840 --> 00:42:38.519
by the Institute of Family Health SURE. The Institute is what's known as a
548
00:42:38.719 --> 00:42:45.679
federally qualified healthcare network. We are
partially funded by the federal government to make
549
00:42:45.719 --> 00:42:52.280
sure that we can provide our services
to anyone who needs them, regardless of
550
00:42:52.320 --> 00:42:59.199
their ability to pay. We operate
about twenty nine locations in New York State.
551
00:43:00.239 --> 00:43:06.159
Most in New York City and six
in two counties further north. We
552
00:43:06.360 --> 00:43:13.679
provide medical care, dental care,
and behavioral healthcare really to anyone who needs
553
00:43:13.719 --> 00:43:17.320
it, And how does the Institute
for Family Health ensure that underserved communities have
554
00:43:17.519 --> 00:43:23.159
access to high quality healthcare services.
All of our care is provided by family
555
00:43:23.199 --> 00:43:30.960
physicians and family nurse practitioners who have
a very broad base of training so that
556
00:43:30.000 --> 00:43:35.639
they can take care of anyone.
It's sometimes called cradle to grave medicine,
557
00:43:35.719 --> 00:43:39.280
which is in our favorite description,
but it certainly does paint the picture.
558
00:43:39.800 --> 00:43:45.480
We do prenatal care. We take
care of babies and children. We take
559
00:43:45.480 --> 00:43:50.239
care of adults, We take care
of women. We provide special services to
560
00:43:50.599 --> 00:43:54.599
lots of what we consider to be
more vulnerable populations, like people who are
561
00:43:54.639 --> 00:44:01.440
homeless, people who are transgendered or
LBGTQ IDEA, and deified. We provide
562
00:44:02.239 --> 00:44:09.920
healthcare to people who have chronic,
serious psychological problems. There's really no one
563
00:44:10.039 --> 00:44:15.639
that we don't see, and we
see them regardless of their ability to pay,
564
00:44:15.239 --> 00:44:22.000
regardless of their health insurance status.
What role does community engagement play in
565
00:44:22.039 --> 00:44:27.519
the work of the Institute for Family
Health. It's critical. We really try
566
00:44:27.519 --> 00:44:31.280
to get out of the office as
much as possible to meet people where they
567
00:44:31.360 --> 00:44:37.440
are and let them know that our
services are available. It's not easy to
568
00:44:37.519 --> 00:44:42.679
do. We are very dependent on
grant resources for that kind of effort because
569
00:44:42.719 --> 00:44:47.079
of course, as a healthcare provider, we're dependent on reimbursement for the services
570
00:44:47.159 --> 00:44:53.719
we provide, and there's really no
reimbursement for any kind of outreach or health
571
00:44:53.840 --> 00:45:01.199
education, health promotion, care coordination
except for grant funding. And unfortunately the
572
00:45:01.320 --> 00:45:06.840
grantston't always cover all the costs involved. But we still try to get out
573
00:45:06.840 --> 00:45:10.480
there and let people know that care
is available to them. As I said,
574
00:45:10.519 --> 00:45:16.960
the Immigrant Health Group reaches out to
people, many of whom haven't seen
575
00:45:17.000 --> 00:45:22.480
a doctor for years. We had
a woman that came in referred by one
576
00:45:22.519 --> 00:45:28.239
of our outreach workers, who came
into one of our clinics. She literally
577
00:45:28.280 --> 00:45:32.159
had not seen a physician for twenty
years, and finally her son brought her
578
00:45:32.199 --> 00:45:37.559
in because she had terrible pain and
terrible mass and it turned out that she
579
00:45:37.719 --> 00:45:45.280
had a large tumor in her stomach
and really needed extensive care. And we
580
00:45:45.440 --> 00:45:50.800
do have people like that throughout New
York City who are either undocumented or simply
581
00:45:50.920 --> 00:45:55.519
afraid of medical care, and we
try our best to find them and bring
582
00:45:55.559 --> 00:46:00.519
them in. Imm Brown from the
Black Information Network and I'm in conversation with
583
00:46:00.639 --> 00:46:04.960
Maxim Gallop from the Institute for Family
Health, and we're talking about all the
584
00:46:05.000 --> 00:46:08.519
ways in which the Institution for Family
Health is transforming the lies of those in
585
00:46:08.599 --> 00:46:15.280
their community, from preventive care to
routine and checkups to managing chronic conditions.
586
00:46:15.320 --> 00:46:20.760
They provide a range of services to
ensure that every individual received the attention and
587
00:46:20.880 --> 00:46:25.079
support that they deserve. And how
has the Direct Relief grant impacted your organization
588
00:46:25.320 --> 00:46:31.840
and the community you serve well.
I cannot overstate how generous Direct Relief has
589
00:46:31.880 --> 00:46:40.559
been with us, and they have
supported projects over many years. Diabetes initiatives,
590
00:46:42.039 --> 00:46:49.320
COVID initiatives, a training initiative to
get to reach out and train care
591
00:46:49.400 --> 00:46:55.280
managers who came from backgrounds that would
not necessarily have gotten them into these kinds
592
00:46:55.320 --> 00:47:01.000
of jobs. When we look for
people who have shared experience, lived experience
593
00:47:01.039 --> 00:47:07.199
with the patients that we're serving through
directly roof, we're able to train a
594
00:47:07.280 --> 00:47:14.000
cadre of folks who really would not
have otherwise been hired because they just didn't
595
00:47:14.039 --> 00:47:19.400
have the basic prerequisites, but because
we had grant funding, we'll were able
596
00:47:19.400 --> 00:47:23.360
to bring these folks in give them
really extra training, and they've turned out
597
00:47:23.360 --> 00:47:30.079
to be really some of our best
care navigators and community health workers. Currently,
598
00:47:30.199 --> 00:47:36.920
they're funding a new project that has
not opened yet, and we are
599
00:47:37.079 --> 00:47:42.679
working with a community based organization in
New York City called the West Side Federation
600
00:47:42.719 --> 00:47:46.000
of Senior and Support of Housing.
They have just opened up a brand new
601
00:47:46.079 --> 00:47:53.559
complex with two hundred units of housing. One hundred and twenty of those units
602
00:47:53.559 --> 00:47:59.920
are supportive housing for people who were
formerly homeless, many of whom have history
603
00:48:00.159 --> 00:48:06.880
of mental illness and substance use,
and eighty units of affordable housing, and
604
00:48:06.920 --> 00:48:09.719
we are building a health center on
the first floor of that building which will
605
00:48:09.760 --> 00:48:15.119
provide care for not just the people
in that complex, but the community at
606
00:48:15.280 --> 00:48:23.079
large. And Direct Relief is supporting
us by allowing paying for some of the
607
00:48:23.199 --> 00:48:28.800
upfront costs, not capital costs,
which we had some funding for, but
608
00:48:29.320 --> 00:48:34.159
sort of the upfront costs that are
involved in staffing a site before it gets
609
00:48:34.199 --> 00:48:39.840
fully operational. And again, some
of the work we do just would not
610
00:48:39.960 --> 00:48:45.400
be possible without that kind of support. What do you see as a long
611
00:48:45.519 --> 00:48:51.559
term impact of the grant on your
organization in the community. Over time,
612
00:48:51.679 --> 00:48:55.320
it takes two to three years for
a practice like this to become fully operational
613
00:48:55.519 --> 00:49:04.039
because you really have to get it
staffed up and ramped up. And right
614
00:49:04.079 --> 00:49:09.599
now we're struggling because truthfully, our
day to day reimbursement rates don't really cover
615
00:49:09.760 --> 00:49:15.880
the cost of care. I'll just
give you a clue that over the last
616
00:49:15.920 --> 00:49:22.440
five to six years, our operating
costs have gone up by about forty five
617
00:49:22.559 --> 00:49:29.639
percent when you look at staffed costs
due to physician shortages, nurse shortages,
618
00:49:29.800 --> 00:49:36.360
behavioral health specialist shortages, and our
reimbursement rates. Because we are largely supported
619
00:49:36.360 --> 00:49:42.159
by public funding Medicaid and Medicare,
our reimbursement rates have only gone up six
620
00:49:42.280 --> 00:49:49.119
percent in that same time period.
So basically we're losing money on every visit
621
00:49:49.199 --> 00:49:58.000
that we provide. So startup funding
like direct Relief is providing to enable this
622
00:49:59.280 --> 00:50:05.760
practice to get up to speed is
really critical. If we didn't have that
623
00:50:05.840 --> 00:50:09.280
kind of support, I don't you
know, we just wouldn't be able to
624
00:50:09.360 --> 00:50:13.639
ramp up as quickly. We wouldn't
be able to provide as much care as
625
00:50:13.639 --> 00:50:17.079
we will be able to provide a
Maxine, is there anything else you would
626
00:50:17.159 --> 00:50:22.000
like to share about your organization with
our listeners that perhaps we didn't cover increasing
627
00:50:22.039 --> 00:50:28.360
the diversity of the healthcare staff.
And we've been really quite fortunate lately that
628
00:50:28.360 --> 00:50:34.960
we've been able to increase the diversity
in our residency training programs. But there's
629
00:50:35.039 --> 00:50:38.880
got to be a big push to
change who's getting accepted into medical schools so
630
00:50:38.920 --> 00:50:45.679
that percentage of providers of color,
Spanish speaking providers, etc. Can continue
631
00:50:45.719 --> 00:50:50.079
to grow. Well, Maxine Goal, thank you so much for taking the
632
00:50:50.159 --> 00:50:54.760
time to share with us more about
your organization. Your passion and dedication to
633
00:50:54.960 --> 00:50:59.760
all that you do is so obvious. Thank you for sharing your journey with
634
00:50:59.800 --> 00:51:04.519
our listeners. We really appreciate it. Well, thank you for the opportunity.
635
00:51:04.599 --> 00:51:08.360
I appreciate it. Davis is doing
double duty by combining the gospel truth
636
00:51:08.440 --> 00:51:13.960
and your black business as he speaks
to a veteran in the gospel music industry
637
00:51:14.199 --> 00:51:17.760
about the current state of the industry. Doug, Thanks Mike, Doug Davis
638
00:51:17.800 --> 00:51:22.280
here with another You're a black business
and we're taking a deep dive into the
639
00:51:22.320 --> 00:51:25.119
world of gospel music with us today. As Andrea R. Williams, a
640
00:51:25.239 --> 00:51:30.400
veteran in the gospel music industry.
She will soon be launching her new business
641
00:51:30.519 --> 00:51:34.760
entitled Worthy Calling. It's a one
stop shop for a new and upcoming gospel
642
00:51:34.880 --> 00:51:37.320
artist. Williams is no newcomer in
the game. She has over twenty five
643
00:51:37.400 --> 00:51:42.519
years of experience in the music industry. She spent almost a decade as a
644
00:51:42.559 --> 00:51:46.559
manager for the Grammy Awards and represented
a slew of award winning and nominated gospel
645
00:51:46.679 --> 00:51:52.440
artists over a span of seventeen years. She graduated suma cum laude from the
646
00:51:52.480 --> 00:51:55.199
prestigious Berkeley College of Music. And
she's my home girl. We went to
647
00:51:55.280 --> 00:51:59.440
high school together. Welcome to the
b I n And you're a black business
648
00:51:59.559 --> 00:52:02.119
Andrea are Williams. Thank you so
much for having me, Doug, I
649
00:52:02.239 --> 00:52:06.320
so appreciate it. Good to hear
your voice. It's been quite some time.
650
00:52:06.960 --> 00:52:10.159
Tell me about the company, Worthy
Calling, and what it's all about
651
00:52:10.239 --> 00:52:14.280
and why you came up with it. Yeah, you know, Worthy Calling
652
00:52:14.559 --> 00:52:22.480
is actually it's one of a consulting
agency for Christian and gospel artists. The
653
00:52:22.559 --> 00:52:28.039
reason that I came up with it
is I found that many artists look at
654
00:52:28.119 --> 00:52:36.079
I should say many gospel artists look
at their music career more from a secular
655
00:52:36.239 --> 00:52:42.360
should we say, mainstream mindset as
opposed to looking at it from a spiritual
656
00:52:42.400 --> 00:52:45.760
one in addition to a business one. So where are the calling In addition
657
00:52:45.840 --> 00:52:52.239
to sharing the experience that I have
in the music business, worthy calling really
658
00:52:52.320 --> 00:52:58.760
aims to get the focus back on
what's really important in gospel music, which
659
00:52:58.880 --> 00:53:04.400
is the Lord's So that's really why
I saw a need to kind of get
660
00:53:04.400 --> 00:53:07.199
back to the basics when it came
to gospel music. And so that's one
661
00:53:07.199 --> 00:53:10.400
of the reasons why, Yeah,
let's let's talk about that, because the
662
00:53:10.480 --> 00:53:15.440
gospel music that we grew up on
is a lot different, and I get
663
00:53:15.480 --> 00:53:19.360
it right, times change, you
know, I'm hearing more gospel with you
664
00:53:19.400 --> 00:53:22.960
know, more hip hop beats,
which is okay, right, you know,
665
00:53:22.440 --> 00:53:29.119
but I feel today's gospel music it
doesn't feel like gospel. It feels,
666
00:53:29.159 --> 00:53:32.519
like you said, secular music.
Share with us your thoughts about gospel
667
00:53:32.639 --> 00:53:38.440
music as a whole. You know, I think that gospel music has always
668
00:53:38.440 --> 00:53:45.119
been z music. I mean people
who are oversee European people, I mean
669
00:53:45.199 --> 00:53:49.599
all over the world. Gospel music
is a recognized it's a joyous and it's
670
00:53:49.800 --> 00:53:55.280
happy, spirit lifting type of music. It's so different from any other type
671
00:53:55.320 --> 00:54:01.800
of music or any other genre that
exists, and not just the chord sounds
672
00:54:01.800 --> 00:54:07.800
and the court changes, but it's
it's just the spirit and the vibe behind
673
00:54:07.920 --> 00:54:12.000
it. Um. It has always
been there for us as a people,
674
00:54:12.039 --> 00:54:16.320
and it's brought us through, um, some very hard and very dark time.
675
00:54:17.039 --> 00:54:21.800
So gospel music, I think is
just I think it's the crux of
676
00:54:21.840 --> 00:54:27.679
the African American experience because the church
really is. And when it comes to
677
00:54:27.679 --> 00:54:31.320
to my history, UM, you
know, I have always loved gospel music,
678
00:54:31.559 --> 00:54:37.079
always loves the Hawkins, always loved
like Andre Crouds Wine and just grow
679
00:54:37.239 --> 00:54:45.440
up on their music, and specifically
Tremaine Hawkins was my favorite SOLOISTUM. And
680
00:54:45.480 --> 00:54:50.920
so when I started really exploring music
and finding out, Okay, I really
681
00:54:51.039 --> 00:54:52.559
like this thing, how do I
do this thing? How can I,
682
00:54:52.599 --> 00:54:57.719
you know, do this music?
UM ended up joining my church in DC,
683
00:54:58.880 --> 00:55:02.679
where which you're smaller. UM was
the accompanist and actually the assistant director.
684
00:55:02.719 --> 00:55:06.599
And at the time he was not
like ze brig or small and he
685
00:55:06.679 --> 00:55:10.079
was just a guy who's really good
on the keys, you know, and
686
00:55:10.199 --> 00:55:17.760
so UM and just sitting under him
and looking at him and learning not only
687
00:55:19.239 --> 00:55:22.719
his style of gospel music but the
classical vibe that he brought to it.
688
00:55:22.280 --> 00:55:27.480
Um that was such a great time
during the eighties with the choirs and things
689
00:55:27.480 --> 00:55:30.079
like that, and and that just
kind of ignited my soul. And I've
690
00:55:30.079 --> 00:55:35.320
been blessed to have, you know, car directors like Ricky Dillard and Byron
691
00:55:35.440 --> 00:55:39.920
Change and Ernest Puke as car directors
as well, and it was just an
692
00:55:39.960 --> 00:55:45.559
awesome experience sit under them and to
learn from them, and that really kind
693
00:55:45.559 --> 00:55:51.679
of launched me into doing my own
ministry, writing my own songs and singing,
694
00:55:52.039 --> 00:55:54.239
you know, the songs that I
felt like I was giving me so
695
00:55:54.400 --> 00:55:59.000
custom music has just been such a
huge part of my life. I have
696
00:55:59.119 --> 00:56:05.719
singers on size of my family and
it's just something that is so incredibly important
697
00:56:05.719 --> 00:56:08.760
to me in my life. And
then not only just me as an artist,
698
00:56:09.199 --> 00:56:14.719
but then also starting businesses, you
know, that are related to gospel
699
00:56:14.800 --> 00:56:21.800
music to really try to support artists
that are really trying to move this genre
700
00:56:21.920 --> 00:56:27.119
forward. How is the financial health
of the gospel music industry today? I
701
00:56:27.119 --> 00:56:30.280
mean, you know, CDs,
you know, used to be really the
702
00:56:30.400 --> 00:56:35.480
thing for for gospel artists. Not
only they would make money from their tours,
703
00:56:35.559 --> 00:56:38.159
but then they would sell their CDs
afterwards. Now that's pretty much gone
704
00:56:38.199 --> 00:56:43.199
away, or are there still a
lot of folks that are still buying CDs?
705
00:56:43.280 --> 00:56:45.159
I mean, you know, gospel
seems to be very traditional, right
706
00:56:45.360 --> 00:56:51.320
exactly. And you bring up a
great point. Jazz and gospel artists can
707
00:56:51.679 --> 00:56:57.280
still get away with selling CDs,
and especially when you're talking about at events,
708
00:56:57.400 --> 00:56:59.920
you know, whether it's on tour
or you know, any type of
709
00:57:00.280 --> 00:57:04.519
concert. You know, at venues, you will definitely still see artists selling
710
00:57:04.559 --> 00:57:12.320
CDs. That's the only UM place
that I've actually seen artists really sell UM
711
00:57:12.559 --> 00:57:17.440
CDs. But you know, as
far as the financial health of gospel music,
712
00:57:17.480 --> 00:57:22.079
I think I think a lot of
artists are struggling, just to be
713
00:57:22.119 --> 00:57:28.000
honest, and not even just the
gospel music in general. Because of streaming.
714
00:57:28.679 --> 00:57:35.440
You know, so consumers are now
more interested in and in consuming it
715
00:57:35.480 --> 00:57:38.480
in a way where they don't necessarily
have to buy it that they just want
716
00:57:38.480 --> 00:57:44.719
to access. And when that shift
happened, when CDs started to kind of
717
00:57:44.719 --> 00:57:52.800
disappear, um, then it really
it really was a artists really started to
718
00:57:52.840 --> 00:57:57.159
have financial issues because the streaming,
you know, for one, stream.
719
00:57:57.280 --> 00:58:01.119
It's it's so minuscule, right,
but you get it's not it's nowhere near
720
00:58:01.159 --> 00:58:07.400
a penny right for each stream or
something like that. Yeah, it's something
721
00:58:07.800 --> 00:58:12.920
really really small. And even when
I get my statement sometimes I'm like really,
722
00:58:14.239 --> 00:58:16.800
um. And so honestly that means
that the artists really has to be
723
00:58:16.840 --> 00:58:22.000
dedicated and really in it for the
love of it, you know, until
724
00:58:22.119 --> 00:58:28.360
they started generating a sand base that's
large enough to support their their musical dreams.
725
00:58:28.599 --> 00:58:31.360
But yeah, um, you know, now, of course that's very
726
00:58:31.400 --> 00:58:36.480
different if you if you're talking about
an artist, a huge artist, you
727
00:58:36.519 --> 00:58:39.159
know, a household name, then
you know that's a little different. Before
728
00:58:39.159 --> 00:58:43.400
we go, how can folks reach
you? So? I can be found
729
00:58:43.440 --> 00:58:51.920
at Andrea R. Williams on Facebook. Um. I'm also on Instagram and
730
00:58:51.920 --> 00:58:58.639
Andrea Renee Music. Um, and
then on Twitter at Andrea Renee Music.
731
00:58:59.519 --> 00:59:04.599
They can find Yeah. Andrea R. Williams, veteran in the gospel music
732
00:59:04.599 --> 00:59:08.400
industry, soon launching her new business
called Worthy Calling one stop shop for a
733
00:59:08.400 --> 00:59:13.000
new and upcoming gospel artist. Thanks
for sharing a couple of tidbits. This
734
00:59:13.119 --> 00:59:16.239
is Doug Davis and you're listening to
your black business. Thanks Doug. For
735
00:59:16.360 --> 00:59:21.440
more on these stories, Listen to
the Black Information Network on the iHeartRadio app
736
00:59:21.719 --> 00:59:25.159
or log on to binnews dot com
where you can hear this program in its
737
00:59:25.320 --> 00:59:30.599
entirety on demand. Also follow us
on social media at Black Information Network and
738
00:59:30.719 --> 00:59:35.480
on Twitter at Black Infonet. Well, thank you for joining us on the
739
00:59:35.519 --> 00:59:39.239
Black perspective and look forward to continuing
to have needed conversations for the black community.
740
00:59:39.480 --> 00:59:44.239
Next week, I'm Mike Island on
the Black Information Network.