Ep.4_Built Different: World Class Care at RSM Sports Med with Dr. Jeremy

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Welcome back to Balanced and Sane, the podcast, where we explore simple, realistic ways to support our health, our mindset, and our everyday lives without getting lost in the overwhelm of the wellness world.
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Today I'm joined by Jeremy, the owner of Marcus and Sports Medicine in Red Bank, New Jersey, a practice he built from the ground up because he med up with the healthcare system that wasn't actually delivering results for people.
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Dr.
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Jeremy has a story that I think a lot of you will relate to on a personal level.
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And what he's built in response to that experience is pretty remarkable.
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We're going to get into it all today.
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The frustrations, the turning point, and what world climate care actually looks like in competence.
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Welcome to the public for individuals who want to feel healthy, and critical health or difficulty.
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No extremes, no overwhelming, just practical tools that make you feel better inside and out.
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Let's get into it.
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Hey, Dr.
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Jeremy, thanks for joining me today on Balanced Insane.
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I'm so excited to have you.
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Thank you so much for having me.
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I'm very excited to be on here and share a little bit more about myself and the practice and hear about what you guys do as well.
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Yeah, awesome.
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So for those that don't know you, you are the owner of RSM in Redbank, New Jersey.
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Can you tell us a little bit about your practice and what it is that you do?
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Yeah, so we're considered a sports medicine facility in downtown Redbank.
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We have our own spot now, which is awesome.
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So we got to custom build everything, hand pick all the equipment.
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And I always wanted to make kind of a half-gym setting, half clinic setting.
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So we got to be able to do that.
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Last May we moved in, and the practice is just built around resilience, strength, and movement was picked on purpose.
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And so we're a chiropractic clinic technically, but we do so much more than that.
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We like to bridge the gap from pain all the way back to performance.
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So we take people through our programs that are customized for each individual, and we start them, you know, in the pain relief phase.
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We go through the rebuild phase and then we go into the integration phase, which is straight back into training or surfing or hiking or picking up grandkids or going on a two-mile walk, whatever that person's dream outcome is, we are the full from the from the moment they start with us to the moment they get there.
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That's our only goal is to get people from pain relief to top mountain top mountain mountaintop outcome.
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Amazing.
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So what kind of people do you work with?
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You mentioned surfing, hiking.
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Is there a specific individual who would come to you for specific pain management, right?
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And then that milestone of hiking the mountain.
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So we started the practice pretty much doing like strictly weightlifting, crossfit, powerlifting, strong men, um, strong women.
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Um you know, that that niche was how I started the practice because I was a powerlifter.
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I played football for 15 years, and that was kind of like what I knew best.
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Um, but as the practice grew, it it evolved into any active adult.
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Um, we ended up getting gymnastics, people that were younger, um, age nine, all the way up through through college, um, high school athletes.
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So it evolved over time and we kind of opened up the niche to people who just have failed other places for PT, Cairo, acupuncture, um, whatever route they took in the past.
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And we just gave them the individualized attention and care that they deserved.
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So we kind of built our name in the community for that.
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And um, almost like a last stop shop for the older people that are trying to avoid surgery and they want to prolong those last 20 years of activity and you know, family time and quality time with their with their loved ones.
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That's kind of what we've developed into now is more of that niche.
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Um, but we still do a wide variety of people goals.
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Um the good thing about our system is that it's applicable to any human being.
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So we take a top-to-bottom approach, everything from your skull down to your toes.
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Um, we are looking at to make sure that we are intervening at the right place and not just getting tunnel vision on the one side of pain, which is what most clinics do.
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Amazing.
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So, yeah, you mentioned um nine-year-olds, and it sounds like older adults as well.
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So it sounds like you work with everybody of all ages of the lifespan and truly customize their treatment to them, their abilities, and their needs.
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Is that right?
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That's correct.
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So we always meet people where they're at, exactly.
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So, again, we do a detailed history, we do a phone call, then we do a free discovery visit.
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So we get to know the people even before we start so that we're clear-cut on what their goal is, what their fitness level is, what they're trying to get out of our program.
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So that way we can make sure that they actually attain that goal and that we can make it the most efficient way possible.
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And because again, some people don't have access to a full gym, which is the stuff we have in here.
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Some people just have a couple of things at home.
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So we always say, like, we'll meet you where you're at, um, and we will give you homework assignments based on whatever you have at home or what gym you go to.
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So we make sure that they have access to the exercises that we're assigning so that they can actually fulfill the plan.
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Amazing.
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Cool.
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So before we do a deep dive into truly that treatment treatment and programming and how you meet people where they're at, um, the services you offer in person and even virtually, because I know you work with my husband, and that has been game changer for him and me.
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Um tell me, tell me a little bit more about your personal backstory, right?
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Where did you come from?
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What happened in your life that you had this light bulb moment to start RSM?
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Wow, it's a great question.
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So uh we'll rewind to college football.
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I had a sideline injury, um, just tackling someone out of bounds, and I had a really bad neck injury.
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I woke up in the training room with STEM, ice, uh, so concussion, neck pain, yeah, all the way down to my arm.
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Um, and I thought that, you know, I was going to be out for a couple months.
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I didn't know anything.
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I was 19, 20 years old, never been to a chiropractor before, but my neighbor happened to be a chiropractor, and he saw me pull up back in my house in my driveway with the neck brace on, and I couldn't turn my neck at all.
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And so I would say he kind of swindled me into his office because we were friendly, friendly enough.
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Friendly enough.
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Um, old school Italian guy who um was like, bro, come in, I'll fix your neck.
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And um, I was like, all right, let's just you I'll go in, but like there's no way you're touching my neck.
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And so to make a long story short, I ended up going into his office and um he was adjusting my you know hips, my back, and then he gets to my neck, and I was like, There's no way you're touching my neck, like it doesn't move, like there's no range of motion, and it's really really painful.
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So he promised me he would sell me his practice and give it to me if I if I got hurt.
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So I agreed to that deal.
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And I had one of those miracle, you know, adjustments.
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It was my first time ever getting adjusted.
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Um I was really nervous, but once I loosened up, he cracked it and did the adjustment, and I was like full range of motion.
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I didn't have the zinger down my arm, so I had like a like a holy moly moment.
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And um, I was like, what is this sorcery that just happened to me?
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So I ended up going back to football, finishing out the season, and then when I when football was done, he asked me to work for him.
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And so I worked for him for uh about two years, and I saw the that side of chiropractic, I call it.
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So it's uh in-network, high volume, a lot of patients, uh, motor vehicle accidents specifically.
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And so I saw kind of uh thankfully, I saw what I didn't really want to do because it was just rapid fire, adjust as many people as you can, um, fulfill the needs for their motor vehicle case, and you know, they kind of get pushed around the ringer and they don't really get anywhere, but they're looking to, you know, get that get that big paycheck from the car accident case.
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Uh so I knew that I didn't want to do that, and I almost did not go to school because I was like, this is not for me.
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I'm just I'm here as an assistant and I'm getting a paycheck and I'm learning a little bit about health and fitness, but um, I learned a lot of stuff through through my 15 years of football with strength and conditioning, and so that was kind of more my passion.
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And so he actually, I will thank him always for this.
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That he pushed me to go to school.
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He just had a gut feeling that I would be good with people and good with helping them.
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So I shadowed a PT place just in case I wanted to do that.
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And I shadowed the wrong PT place, and I was like, I'm absolutely not doing that.
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And I knew I didn't want to do this type of chiropractic.
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So I just said, you know what, I'm gonna go and I'll figure it out.
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And so, again, to make a long story short, I go through my first year of chiropractic school, just nose in the books, libraries all day, didn't really get to experience Southern California as I wanted to.
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And um about a year in after part one boards, uh, I had that like, oh no, moment.
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Like, I got like two years left of school.
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I have no idea what I want to do and practice like just pass my part one.
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There's three more parts to pass, but like I gotta start figuring out what I'm gonna do.
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So I uh kind of brought that athlete football mentality to my profession where I was just aggressive and shadowing up and down the coast of California.
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It didn't matter if you were a physical therapist, Cairo, trainer.
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If you were known in the space and you were like known as the person to go to, I was I was in that office learning everything I could, um, forcing my way into some offices.
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Some people said they weren't taking internships, and I just said I'm I'm gonna be here.
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So might as well accept me now.
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And one of those guys ended up being my really big mentors.
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He was very, very smart.
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He taught like the sports diplomate program across the country.
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He would fly to the Pan Am games, he was he was a big dog in our field, and so I I got huge mentorship from him in terms of clinical application.
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Uh but the business side of things, he was kind of like uh he he he didn't really care.
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So he had a great practice just because of his uh like his name.
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Um, but business-wise, he really wasn't thriving.
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So I took that clinical part of his brain, and then I shouted another guy, did my internship with another place that also was doing 45-minute appointments, which was kind of rare back then.
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Unheard of even now, right?
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Yeah, so I was like, oh, this is interesting, like 45-minute appointments, exercise based.
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Sometimes he didn't even touch a patient, and he was a chiropractor.
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So I I gotta also give credit to him um for you know, kind of showing me the ropes in terms of how to practice that way.
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So I got to spend uh at least a year with him um and learn his clinical thought process, how he structured like the 45 minutes.
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Um, and then when that was finished, I knew that I was going back to New Jersey for my last semester.
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So I found another guy through um the circle that I was in.
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I got I got uh really lucky that I got pulled into this group of clinicians that were movement based, they wanted to push the profession in the right direction, and they took me under their wing because I was showing up to all these continue ed courses by myself as a as a young Cairo student.
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So they they appreciated that and they took me under their wing and they got me connected with a guy in New Jersey.
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Uh and so he was uh doing the movement stuff and he knew the business side of things, he was doing a cash-based practice already.
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So I got in with him, he's still my mentor to this day, and um I gotta learn a lot from him.
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I still do every day.
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And um that gave me the confidence to say, you know, after I did five interviews, I graduated, did a couple interviews, and was like, I'm not, I'm not, I'm not doing this.
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I'm not doing what they're offering.
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So at that point I had no choice.
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I started my practice and um straight out of the gates from school, pretty much.
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And um, all of those mentors and and uh all that information that I learned from all the people from the West Coast and then Justin from here, it gave me the confidence to say, like, I could do this, like I know I can do this.
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And um a little bit of blind confidence, but that that self-belief is is powerful, and I knew that I could pull it off.
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And so I started from a corner of a gym.
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My high school strength coach offered me the room, and um I just I said, All right, here's my table.
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I'm starting right now, and and then that it's history from there.
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Wow, what a really great story.
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Um so I've I've got a few thoughts.
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One is, you know, you say blind confidence, right?
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There's there's a special um a special characteristic of entrepreneurs where I think we all like have these have these moments, right?
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You had this experience where you did these internships, you shadowed these people, and you knew it sounds like even as a student, what you didn't want your career to be and what you didn't want to do as a chiropractor.
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Um, so it takes a it takes a special characteristic as an entrepreneur to have this blind confidence in yourself and and also just go against the grain.
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So kudos to you to just going all in from day one and saying, I don't want this, this is what I want.
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And I'm gonna figure it out because every day we're all just figuring it out as entrepreneurs sometimes.
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Um, so yeah, what a great story.
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Thank you for sharing that and um telling us a little bit about what it is you noticed that you didn't want to do as a quote unquote traditional chiropractor, if you will.
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Because from what I know about you and what I see you doing with my husband, you're in Red Bank, we're in South Florida virtually, it has been a game changer for his injury, um, which for people that don't know that are listening, Chance and Jeremy went to high school together, right?
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We played against each other.
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You played against each other in high school.
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Okay, that's the story.
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So they both played high school football against each other, we're rivals, and um they have found their romance back to one another.
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And Jeremy's been treating Chance for a few months now.
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So Chance at some point last year was sleeping on the floor of our living room because he could not move because of his back pain.
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And he has a history of back surgeries, and um, he one day, I think, was just like, there's this guy, Jeremy, who I played football with, and I'm gonna reach out to him.
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And it's been a game changer.
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He's no longer sleeping on the floor, he has better range of motion, um, he's moving better.
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And you guys meet regularly, and we had the privilege of seeing you in person not too long ago when we were up in New Jersey.
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And I'm super grateful because you know, you don't ever want to see your partner struggle.
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So I feel like we're a true testament to this journey that you just took me on.
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You were a student in school, you did these internships, you recognize what you don't want to do, and then you saw an opportunity to create something different, and that's what you're doing.
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Matt Simmid, what is so different about your practice?
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And you mentioned those kind of 45-minute um sessions, right, or appointments.
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I know our big healthcare systems are like right in and out, right?
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Rinse, wash, repeat, like how many people can use in a given hour?
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And then let's let's code that appointment, let's get the money from insurance.
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So so tell us a little bit about how your practice operates from a I guess payment standpoint and then treatment standpoint in terms of how you facilitate your appointments with your patients.
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Awesome.
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Yeah.
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So I think again, going back to like why I was so blindly confident and passionate about this, is because people like chance and myself, honestly, towards the end of my uh football career, knocked the neck.
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I had a different injury um towards the end.
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And um you just get passed from office to office, you get different answers from every person, you don't get better.
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Um, and so the the big buzzword that we use here is is root cause.
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Like, what is the root cause of the problem?
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And um, I realize that a lot a lot of the times in traditional healthcare, they're just giving you the protocol, the sheet of exercises, or the protocol for back pain, or the protocol for shoulder pain.
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And it's for every single person that walks through the door.
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And I just could never resonate with that.
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And especially since it happened to me, and I was going from office to office, I got the MRIs, I got the specialist opinion, I got all of that, and nothing was helping.
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And eventually, like that cut my career short.
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And so I'm I have a little bit of a chip on my shoulder from that.
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And I always knew that there was more for people that are active and want to train hard and want to keep going, and not just accepting that as like this is just how it's gonna be.
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Um, I never wanted to do that for other people either.
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And so that's why we're so obsessed here with the one-on-one, one hour individualized attention.
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You're with the doctor the entire time.
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Um, and we do programs.
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So the smallest package, as you guys know, is 12.
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Um, and so we're at least spending the evaluations an hour, so at least 13 hours together so that the people can actually get to the bottom of why it's happening.
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And I can help them reverse engineer that process through muscle work, um, cupping, adjustments, whatever we have to do in the room to make you feel good clinically to help those um results accelerate.
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And then to cement it is the customized one-on-one rehab exercises and then strength training based on all of the assessment results.
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So we're never really guessing, we're showing people on our whiteboard, hey, this is the root cause.
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This I'll circle one or two things max and I'll show them like this is a problem, right?
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This hip's at three degrees, this one's at 45.
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Like, can you see how if you put a barbell on your back, like that's a problem.
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So we're showing them, we're educating the patients.
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I think that's another big part of our practice, is the education piece.
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So they're learning about their bodies, they're learning about the exercises that work and help for them specifically, so that they don't need us forever.
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They can understand and and use these exercises for themselves when we're not around.
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Because, as you know, one session a week, like there's six other days, we don't have control over those days.
00:18:21.839 --> 00:18:24.799
So we give them your assigned homework to do that throughout the week.
00:18:24.880 --> 00:18:27.839
And we always test and retest to make sure that those things are working.
00:18:28.000 --> 00:18:30.880
So if they're if if it's working, yes, that's your homework, right?
00:18:30.960 --> 00:18:32.799
If it's not, all right, what did I miss?
00:18:32.960 --> 00:18:34.240
What can I what can I switch to?
00:18:34.319 --> 00:18:40.400
What can I hot right to hot route to to make that an efficient exercise for that person so that we know that that's going to be working for them?
00:18:40.559 --> 00:18:44.319
And now way by the end of the program, they're smooth sailing.
00:18:44.720 --> 00:18:45.519
Amazing.
00:18:45.680 --> 00:19:00.000
So when you decided to start RSM and um, you know, you decided that these appointments were going to be longer and you're going to find root causes, what was the core promise you made to yourself about how you would be different?
00:19:00.400 --> 00:19:01.759
Ooh, that's good.
00:19:01.920 --> 00:19:13.119
Um, I really think that the uh the one one is just so tremendous and like communicating with patients, maybe too much in the beginning, um making my cell phone available.
00:19:13.599 --> 00:19:21.519
Um but looking at everything from a video standpoint, I always tell people to record their exercises, record their training, right?
00:19:21.599 --> 00:19:30.480
Because I can give someone the best rehab plan in the world, but if their training's still off or their programming still off, it's it's kind of like, you know, where are we gonna go with that?
00:19:30.720 --> 00:19:44.319
So we look at everything, uh, how they train, how they move, um, how much how what's the volume of it, frequency, um, technique, all of those things matter when you're trying to help someone with chronic pain because they've tried everything else.
00:19:44.720 --> 00:19:50.799
So I've always wanted to be the person that went above and beyond, got to know the patient themselves, understand them and their goals.
00:19:51.119 --> 00:19:56.400
And I think that just being the human part of that is definitely how we set ourselves apart.
00:19:56.640 --> 00:20:00.480
The part that we just genuinely care about them getting to their outcome.
00:20:00.799 --> 00:20:03.920
Most places you go, it's just like, oh, it's just another, you know, here we go.
00:20:04.000 --> 00:20:08.079
Let's milk this insurance as much as we can, get another person in the door, get another person in the door.
00:20:08.240 --> 00:20:12.240
It's like there's no human interaction, it's just very transactional.
00:20:12.559 --> 00:20:14.240
And here it's more about relationships.
00:20:14.319 --> 00:20:15.680
I I joke, but I'm serious.
00:20:15.759 --> 00:20:18.319
Like, probably 80% of my patients become friends.
00:20:18.720 --> 00:20:21.440
Um, we go out to dinners, we meet at the park.
00:20:21.519 --> 00:20:31.039
Like, it's it's not just like a transactional thing, and I think that that also helps with the recovery process because they trust you, um, they feel comfortable when they come to the office.
00:20:31.200 --> 00:20:34.640
I'm not wearing a white coat, not checking blood pressure every time.
00:20:34.880 --> 00:20:39.599
Um, so it's uh it's more humane and um they connect with that.
00:20:39.680 --> 00:20:42.319
So I think that you know that definitely sets us apart.
00:20:42.480 --> 00:20:47.039
And when people come in here and I look them in the eye and I tell them what they need, and it's not cheap.
00:20:47.200 --> 00:20:51.680
We're out of network, we're we don't take insurance, we've eliminated a billing team completely.
00:20:51.759 --> 00:20:53.119
Um, so it's cash-based.
00:20:53.200 --> 00:21:01.200
And so, but when I look at someone in the eye, I tell them this is what I need, and I know I can help you, they they take that to heart and I appreciate that because I know that I can.
00:21:01.519 --> 00:21:02.559
Yeah, that's awesome.
00:21:02.720 --> 00:21:05.759
I empathize a lot with some of the things you're saying.
00:21:06.000 --> 00:21:08.640
My background, I worked inpatient psych for many years.
00:21:08.799 --> 00:21:14.960
And um, you know, during COVID, I was very grateful to have a place to go to leave my house and go work and go help people.
00:21:15.039 --> 00:21:17.519
And I somehow COVID really impacted people.
00:21:17.839 --> 00:21:28.559
But I also somehow people in white coats were were, you know, playing around with meds to keep patients in the hospital longer, which resulted in what, more money from their insurance company.
00:21:28.720 --> 00:21:37.599
Um, and I, like consciously and in good faith, could not proceed in that in that line of work, knowing that our system is broken.
00:21:37.759 --> 00:21:42.880
Um, so I did like a complete career change in my own fitness studios.
00:21:43.039 --> 00:21:53.839
Um, but I relate to what you're saying about technique because that's something that we talk about with our members and our studio is is our technique is a practice, and then the more you do it, the better you get it.
00:21:53.920 --> 00:21:59.759
And then our instructors are different because even though you're in a group setting, you're getting the one on one experience of hands on career.
00:22:00.480 --> 00:22:05.440
And interactions where if you're working in improper form and alignment, we're going to fix you and adjust you.
00:22:05.519 --> 00:22:07.039
So you don't have pain, right?
00:22:07.119 --> 00:22:11.359
So you don't walk out of this class and feel like you got hurt from it, right?
00:22:11.519 --> 00:22:12.079
You feel stronger.
00:22:12.240 --> 00:22:14.559
So I really empathize and relate to them.
00:22:15.359 --> 00:22:21.039
And on a personal level, I think also what sets my business apart is that it's not a transaction.
00:22:21.200 --> 00:22:29.279
Yes, people are purchasing a monthly membership with me, but I genuinely care about my members, their families, their lives.
00:22:29.359 --> 00:22:32.079
I just texted someone the other day who is seasonal with us.
00:22:32.240 --> 00:22:34.160
I know her daughter is getting married next weekend.
00:22:34.240 --> 00:22:38.720
And I'm like, I'm just thinking about you before the craziness, like, don't forget to send pictures.
00:22:38.880 --> 00:22:40.799
And I think that's what sets businesses apart.
00:22:40.880 --> 00:22:48.640
And I think that's why when you look people in the eyes and say, this isn't going to be cheap, but I know I can help you, they don't blink and they don't guess twice.
00:22:48.720 --> 00:22:56.240
Um, or they don't guess about it and they don't question your expertise and your possible relationship with them.
00:22:56.400 --> 00:23:00.000
So yeah, I really just empathize with them and thank you for sharing them.
00:23:00.079 --> 00:23:05.039
And I know for sure that's what sets you apart from the root combos to the relationship.
00:23:05.279 --> 00:23:11.839
Like I said, when chance reached out to you and he did his evaluation and and you told him his root combos, he's like, well, I'm just gonna do this.
00:23:11.920 --> 00:23:13.440
It wasn't even a conversation in our house.
00:23:13.519 --> 00:23:16.799
And I was like, at this point, what do you have left like to lose?
00:23:16.960 --> 00:23:23.279
Like you've you've tried the traditional chiropractor, you've you've tried the physical therapy, you've tried the this, you've tried the that.
00:23:23.440 --> 00:23:27.680
And and now you haven't been able to work out for X amount of months, which keeps him sane.
00:23:27.920 --> 00:23:36.319
Um, so we we we really can again speak from experience and and give you a testimonial about how this works.
00:23:36.480 --> 00:23:42.319
Um, and not that there's a problem with our marriage, but right, it saved our our marriage from like my husband sleeping on the floor.
00:23:42.400 --> 00:23:45.200
Um you know, he gets to lay his head next to me at night.
00:23:45.359 --> 00:23:53.440
And so so that that said, other professionals, physical therapists, I know you've joked that PTs hate you.
00:23:53.599 --> 00:23:56.000
Um why is that?
00:23:56.160 --> 00:23:58.079
I I need to hear the story.
00:23:58.480 --> 00:24:03.519
Well, there's always been like a weird divide between Kairos and PTs.
00:24:04.160 --> 00:24:10.000
And if you are a world-class clinician, like we say, you're doing both.
00:24:10.240 --> 00:24:13.200
Um even pelvic floor specifically, right?
00:24:13.279 --> 00:24:15.359
Like there's pelvic floor specialists.
00:24:15.519 --> 00:24:35.359
Um and maybe you know, uh, we don't do any, you know, gloved work and internal work, but like every clinician, uh, if you're in the rehab space, should be uh doing both exercise and manual therapy and understanding the body and how the pelvic floor plays a huge role in that, or your diaphragm diaphragm plays a huge role in that.
00:24:35.599 --> 00:24:37.839
Like top to bottom, you should be looking at movement.
00:24:38.480 --> 00:24:44.000
Um and so most PTs get salty because they see a chiropractor posting only exercises.
00:24:44.079 --> 00:24:48.640
I've never posted an adjustment in my whole life for the seven years I've been posting.
00:24:49.039 --> 00:25:11.200
And you know, they get a little bit in their feelings because I'm posting exercises that are making fun of their exercises, and you know, I've run into a couple um you know comments online, and and it's funny because you know, you call someone out on their uh protocol exercises and they just go up in flames because that's all they know, and you're attacking who they are as an as a like an identity thing.
00:25:11.279 --> 00:25:14.480
Um, and they're so attached to that identity, they just freak out.
00:25:14.720 --> 00:25:17.680
Um, but thankfully I never had an identity as just a chiropractor.
00:25:18.079 --> 00:25:25.759
Um, I never really even marketed myself as a chiropractor because I knew that most people associate that with just cracking backs and taking insurance.
00:25:26.079 --> 00:25:28.400
And so I made it a point since day one.
00:25:28.559 --> 00:25:36.799
I've again I'm never posted just a crack with the with the speaker next to the spine and trying to get views with like an OnlyFans person on my table.
00:25:36.960 --> 00:25:39.039
Uh, that's not that's not my content.
00:25:39.279 --> 00:25:43.519
So I like to provide as much value as possible while showing a little personality.
00:25:43.759 --> 00:25:59.519
Um, and also the content is uh designed to address the objections that we get in the sales process because people will tell you crazy things to try to avoid committing to a plan of care, even though there's life-changing results here, like husband being able to sleep in a bed again, um, a wedding.
00:25:59.680 --> 00:26:01.039
This was a great one I just posted.
00:26:01.200 --> 00:26:05.599
Uh on female, she literally had a wedding in three, four weeks.
00:26:05.920 --> 00:26:12.240
She tried PT, she was at Witz End, almost had to cancel their honeymoon, was very worried about walking down the aisle.
00:26:12.400 --> 00:26:14.720
Um, and that ended up as a home run.
00:26:14.799 --> 00:26:18.480
No pain down the aisle, didn't have to freak out, didn't have to cancel Hawaii.
00:26:18.799 --> 00:26:21.599
Yeah, her one main thing was to be able to hike in Hawaii.
00:26:21.759 --> 00:26:23.039
That was accomplished.
00:26:23.279 --> 00:26:36.240
Um, that those are like the results that we get that it allows me to be confident online and in person to say, like, you could say whatever you want about my piece of paper that says I'm a chiropractor, but like this is what we're doing in here, so it's good for you.
00:26:36.480 --> 00:26:39.200
If you don't, if you don't appreciate it, good for you.
00:26:41.039 --> 00:26:46.480
So so that thinking about that, and I know you said it a little bit earlier, right?
00:26:46.640 --> 00:26:48.160
And and we've talked about it.
00:26:48.319 --> 00:26:51.200
Sometimes people come to you as a last resort.
00:26:51.279 --> 00:27:00.880
As you said in this case, that individual was getting ready to walk down the aisle, had tried PT, and three, four weeks out from her wedding, um, she she seeks you out.
00:27:01.039 --> 00:27:07.759
So how how do you like how do people come to you as a last resort and say, I've done everything?
00:27:07.920 --> 00:27:11.759
Um, you know, like how does how does that even develop?
00:27:11.839 --> 00:27:15.119
How did that reputation, how does it develop and I've done everything else?
00:27:15.279 --> 00:27:16.880
I guess now I'm gonna go see Dr.
00:27:16.960 --> 00:27:22.000
Jeremy and see if he can he can, you know, walk the walk, talk the talk.
00:27:23.200 --> 00:27:36.160
I think I honestly I haven't thought much about that, but if I'm thinking right off the cuff, it's probably because it's not cheap and we don't just accept the$50 copay and just take everybody in, right?
00:27:36.240 --> 00:27:38.079
It's a whole process to get in here.
00:27:38.240 --> 00:27:44.400
Um, it's a phone call, it's a discovery visit, then it's the evaluation, and then they commit to the plan of care.
00:27:44.799 --> 00:27:49.359
So I think you know, we've we've been recognized now as like we're not cheap.
00:27:49.680 --> 00:27:54.240
Um, but if you if you tried everything else, like we know we can help you.
00:27:54.720 --> 00:27:59.839
So I think that's kind of how it developed, is because we're out of network, it's kind of against the grain.
00:28:00.240 --> 00:28:04.160
Um it's a big commitment, like one hour you know, a week.
00:28:04.319 --> 00:28:10.160
Some people travel, like we've gotten people from Philadelphia, the Poconos, it's a two-hour each-way drive.
00:28:10.480 --> 00:28:13.599
Um, upstate New York, like we're in central Jersey.
00:28:14.079 --> 00:28:16.160
Um, so those are big commitments.
00:28:16.640 --> 00:28:29.599
But uh I'm very thankful that Instagram and and social media has you know, it's worked very well for us because we show the results um and we post valuable content, and those people get something out of that content.
00:28:30.000 --> 00:28:33.039
And so I'm I'm always like, imagine what happens in person, right?
00:28:33.200 --> 00:28:37.119
Like when chance came to visit that one day, I was like, this is this is different.
00:28:37.200 --> 00:28:42.480
Like right, he's getting my hands for doing muscle work, we're doing the exercises one-on-one in the clinic.
00:28:42.799 --> 00:28:50.079
Um, most people are not getting that individualized attention and understanding of human biomechanics and why it's happening.
00:28:50.720 --> 00:29:00.559
So I think that you know, people try their things because it's just easy access, it's inexpensive, um, it's close, whatever the you know, reason may be.
00:29:00.880 --> 00:29:10.000
But then when that doesn't work and the frustration builds up and now things are starting to be taken away from your life, it's like, all right, well, you know, kind of you get what you pay for type of thing.
00:29:10.160 --> 00:29:12.480
Um, let me just give this guy a shot.
00:29:12.799 --> 00:29:13.119
Yeah.
00:29:13.359 --> 00:29:14.079
And you know what?
00:29:14.160 --> 00:29:17.119
You you can't put a price tag on your health.
00:29:17.279 --> 00:29:27.519
Um again, like you're saying you're not cheap, but but if your health is really your top priority as just a person, it it shouldn't matter.
00:29:27.680 --> 00:29:36.480
Again, if you're looking people in the eyes and saying, trust me, I can get you to 100, I can get you to to hike on your honeymoon in Hawaii.
00:29:36.559 --> 00:29:38.640
Um, they they shouldn't second guess it.
00:29:38.720 --> 00:29:42.559
And again, like I said, when chance is like, I'm gonna do this, what do you have to lose?
00:29:42.720 --> 00:29:48.240
Okay, some money, but like even if you're 50% better, that's better than where you are right now.
00:29:48.559 --> 00:29:54.400
Um, yeah, when we were in person with you, he walked out of the net and he's like, this is just, it's been game changer for him.
00:29:54.559 --> 00:29:56.640
Truly, we can't thank you enough.
00:29:56.880 --> 00:30:08.079
Um and and I think I want to highlight that again, you're in Jersey, we're in Florida, and chance has seen you once in person and you've done everything with him virtually.
00:30:08.400 --> 00:30:18.160
And that's another testament to your abilities, your knowledge, your professionalism to be able to work with somebody through a computer screen and say, and I hear it.
00:30:18.319 --> 00:30:22.240
I've been around during some of those sessions and you're telling him how to move.
00:30:22.319 --> 00:30:24.559
I mean, heck, you've told me, like, hey, I need you to do this.
00:30:24.640 --> 00:30:27.119
And I'm over there like helping him a little bit.
00:30:27.200 --> 00:30:30.000
And it's it's a team effort for sure.
00:30:30.240 --> 00:30:36.079
But talk a little bit about even that, because we talk about accessibility, right?
00:30:36.240 --> 00:30:38.960
Insurance, what's accessible, co-pays, blah, blah, blah.
00:30:39.359 --> 00:30:40.480
We're not gonna harp on that.
00:30:40.559 --> 00:30:41.920
That's not why we're here.
00:30:42.079 --> 00:30:49.759
Um, but just the fact that people are driving to you from the Poconos, they're driving to you from, you know, Philly, wherever it is.
00:30:49.920 --> 00:30:54.319
And again, I'm I'm from up north, so I'm fully aware what that drive looks like.
00:30:54.640 --> 00:31:02.319
The accessibility for somebody to still work with you, even if they're listening to this today and they're in California or they are in Florida.
00:31:02.559 --> 00:31:05.119
What is what is just talk us through that a little bit?
00:31:05.200 --> 00:31:09.039
How do you accomplish everything you do in person virtually?
00:31:09.680 --> 00:31:11.039
Oh, that's another great one.
00:31:11.279 --> 00:31:20.880
So I knew going back to earlier in the conversation, how we were talking about like traditional kairos, the biggest fear I had was doing the same thing for 20 years in a row.
00:31:21.039 --> 00:31:23.759
So that's what unfortunately most chiropractors do.
00:31:23.839 --> 00:31:28.000
They go to school, they get out, and they just do that for 20 years and then they call a career, and that's it.
00:31:28.640 --> 00:31:30.079
I never wanted to do that.
00:31:30.240 --> 00:31:35.920
I wanted to evolve constantly with my education, um, be on top of you know the newest information.
00:31:36.000 --> 00:31:38.799
And so I I have done that since day one.
00:31:39.200 --> 00:31:53.759
And during COVID, um, that was actually an insane time for me because June I quit my job that I was taking, I was doing part-time as I started my practice at a part-time job, quit that to go all in June 2020.
00:31:54.400 --> 00:32:00.799
Got married at the end of the month, and then uh went all in, like I was saying, in July 1st at another gym.
00:32:00.960 --> 00:32:04.880
So I left the first gym I was at, found another gym in the middle of a shutdown.
00:32:04.960 --> 00:32:06.240
So there was nobody at the gym.
00:32:06.480 --> 00:32:07.119
Oh wow.
00:32:07.279 --> 00:32:09.039
Um, so it was pretty insane.
00:32:09.119 --> 00:32:12.160
And then we got a house in July, and then my wife was pregnant in September.
00:32:12.240 --> 00:32:16.640
So that was like a crazy personal life uh COVID uh COVID story.
00:32:17.119 --> 00:32:23.519
But on top of that, I had to figure out how am I gonna run my business now seven days a week when there's a global shutdown.
00:32:23.920 --> 00:32:30.640
Um and so I was aggressive as I usually am in finding the answers for that.
00:32:30.799 --> 00:32:46.559
And so I got again with a I got in with a good crew um and I we did weekly calls, we we talked about assessments on the screens, how we can identify movement issues through the screen, how we can implement exercises based on those limitations through the screen.
00:32:46.799 --> 00:32:49.039
And so I took clients on during that time frame.
00:32:49.279 --> 00:33:00.319
I did online programming for strength training, and then I did online virtual appointments for people in Canada, Turkey, California, Oregon, um, Florida, all over the place.
00:33:00.720 --> 00:33:02.720
And I started to get better and better and better at it.
00:33:02.799 --> 00:33:06.799
And I again that gave me the confidence to say, like, I could do this from anyone.
00:33:07.279 --> 00:33:09.200
Um ideally, I get my hands on it.
00:33:09.440 --> 00:33:10.559
I love doing the muscle work.
00:33:10.880 --> 00:33:36.079
Um, but I was able to prove to myself that I can treat somebody just fine and dandy through the screen based on the principles that I learned and the movement uh, you know, movement identification points that I can see through the screen, putting them through the assessment, I can still see enough valuable information where I can implement specifically for each person, which is still better than going to a run-out mill place where they get just the same exercise that everybody else gets.
00:33:36.559 --> 00:33:42.559
So that definitely um during COVID sharpened my uh my arsenal.
00:33:42.880 --> 00:33:50.000
And um I slowly stopped once everything opened back up, but I still took the people here and there that were from way too far away.
00:33:50.319 --> 00:33:56.160
Europe um just it was always like uh, yeah, this is kind of how I I do it in person.
00:33:56.240 --> 00:34:00.240
I'm just gonna do it through the screen um and help you, you know, without touching it.
00:34:00.319 --> 00:34:09.440
And which is also kind of empowering to the client because they're not reliant on the doctor to like loosen up a muscle or do an adjustment or cut this part of their body.
00:34:09.599 --> 00:34:17.840
Um it's it's honestly more empowering for the client and they get the education on top of that so that they can help themselves without me even being there.
00:34:18.159 --> 00:34:29.920
Again, when you think about entrepreneurship and the skill set you have to have to be able to pivot and and innovate because your livelihood depends on it, it's it's a skill set that not everybody has.
00:34:30.079 --> 00:34:33.119
And that time for sure was insane for everyone.
00:34:33.199 --> 00:34:38.960
And and unfortunately, the people that weren't able to innovate no longer are in practice or business.
00:34:39.039 --> 00:34:43.280
And that's super sad because you never want to see that as a fellow small business owner and entrepreneur.
00:34:43.679 --> 00:34:54.639
Um so yeah, so talk about this is a great kind of like pivot into a little bit more about how you how you lead your practice, how all of this has helped you evolve.
00:34:54.719 --> 00:35:02.559
Like you said, you sharpened your arsenal so you can, you've always continued your education, it sounds like, to be better for your patients and your practice.
00:35:02.800 --> 00:35:06.559
Um, but I'm I'm just thinking, like, what does it actually take?
00:35:06.639 --> 00:35:18.880
What do you think it actually takes to run this high quality, independently owned practice that in a space where everything is dominated by our by our healthcare system?
00:35:19.760 --> 00:35:31.039
Um I think an easy answer, like a straightforward answer would be standards, holding a very, very high standard of yourself and of the practice and the people that are in this building with you.
00:35:31.519 --> 00:35:43.199
Um because I noticed when I was part-time at the other clinic that it wasn't really standards, it was just like you clock in, you clock out, like you treat the patients, and that's really it.
00:35:43.679 --> 00:35:49.920
Um there wasn't like there wasn't many expectations um in terms of like high-level treatment.
00:35:50.320 --> 00:35:51.760
Are you doing the full assessment?
00:35:52.000 --> 00:35:53.360
Are you communicating with the patient?
00:35:53.519 --> 00:35:55.519
Are you making sure you understand their goals?
00:35:55.840 --> 00:35:58.639
Like our sales process is very in-depth.
00:35:58.719 --> 00:35:58.880
Uh-huh.
00:35:59.039 --> 00:36:02.000
And the standard is like the standard is the standard.
00:36:02.239 --> 00:36:05.039
Like we need to know that information, like, no matter what.
00:36:05.199 --> 00:36:12.400
There's not a single person that walks in the door that we don't know their their objection in a sale or their outcome required, which is like the main goal.
00:36:12.719 --> 00:36:14.559
Like, that's just that's just how it is.
00:36:14.880 --> 00:36:17.519
Um, then it's also a standard that we do the full hour.
00:36:18.159 --> 00:36:21.679
It's a standard that we do half in the room, half in the gym.
00:36:21.840 --> 00:36:23.599
Um, like there's no exceptions.
00:36:23.679 --> 00:36:25.840
There's not, there's no one getting a 15-minute appointment.
00:36:26.000 --> 00:36:28.960
There's no one-off sessions, there's none of that.
00:36:29.119 --> 00:36:31.360
There's just this is like how it is here.
00:36:31.519 --> 00:36:35.440
And anything outside of that, like you're wrong and you're gone.
00:36:36.400 --> 00:36:38.480
You're just you're just straight up wrong.
00:36:38.719 --> 00:36:40.400
I um I want to know.
00:36:40.480 --> 00:36:43.920
Um, I've been thinking about this a little bit as you've been been talking, right?
00:36:44.000 --> 00:36:46.639
You you've talked about PTs and your relationship with them.
00:36:46.719 --> 00:36:51.039
This is like kind of, I'm like pivoting back a little bit, but it's just at my in it's just in my brain.
00:36:51.199 --> 00:36:57.599
Um, have you ever gotten shade from other chiropractors about what you do and and how you practice?
00:36:58.559 --> 00:37:00.880
Yeah, I see you shaking your head.
00:37:01.440 --> 00:37:02.320
Oh, yeah.
00:37:02.559 --> 00:37:04.320
Um, a lot of people, honestly.
00:37:04.400 --> 00:37:06.000
Um, that's so expensive.
00:37:06.239 --> 00:37:07.920
What the hell are they doing in there?
00:37:08.079 --> 00:37:12.079
Uh, he's a glorified personal trainer, he's a wannabe PT.
00:37:12.400 --> 00:37:13.760
Um, I made a post about this.
00:37:13.840 --> 00:37:15.920
This I'm gonna go find it.
00:37:16.079 --> 00:37:17.519
Yeah, it's good, it's good.
00:37:17.679 --> 00:37:18.880
It's just me laughing.
00:37:19.039 --> 00:37:24.880
Um, but yeah, I've gotten a bunch of shade from um mostly other clinicians, right?
00:37:24.960 --> 00:37:37.280
Because it's you're you're kind of like exposing them and their weak points, especially when you can prove that you you know get results and you you know can identify someone's actual root cause instead of having that tunnel vision.
00:37:37.519 --> 00:37:43.119
The the prime example I give is that you know, you go into a place and we hear it all uh multiple times a day.
00:37:43.199 --> 00:37:45.760
So this is not like this is this is not theory.
00:37:46.000 --> 00:37:51.360
They go into a place and you have lower back pain, and let's just say you have both hip and lower back pain, right?
00:37:52.000 --> 00:37:58.239
But because insurance only covers one area of the body, they're only gonna pick one and they make the patient pick one.
00:37:58.320 --> 00:37:59.440
So which one feels worse?
00:37:59.760 --> 00:38:01.039
Your hip or your lower back?
00:38:01.440 --> 00:38:02.079
Well, guess what?
00:38:02.159 --> 00:38:04.960
What if you pick the lower back and the root cause is the hip?
00:38:05.199 --> 00:38:06.320
Oh no, right?
00:38:06.400 --> 00:38:11.840
And so now that person doesn't get results, and now it's oh well, we tried this conservative care, now that didn't work.
00:38:12.000 --> 00:38:12.960
Let's do injections.
00:38:13.039 --> 00:38:13.440
All right.
00:38:13.920 --> 00:38:18.000
The injection again doesn't address anything of the root cause, it doesn't do much.
00:38:18.159 --> 00:38:21.039
Maybe you get relief for a little bit, but it comes right back.
00:38:21.199 --> 00:38:23.039
And now it's like, okay, that didn't work.
00:38:23.199 --> 00:38:25.280
Now you're gonna have to go for a surgical console.
00:38:25.519 --> 00:38:52.320
And now this person's on the table for getting surgery rather than them doing the full assessment and seeing, like, wow, this this hip is actually the problem, or this foot is a problem, or this left shoulder on the opposite side is a problem, or the way you know you your squatting is a problem, like whatever the case may be, it's that's the downhill slope, and that's again why I'm so passionate in the sales process, is because I know that we are not leaving any stones unturned.
00:38:52.719 --> 00:38:58.960
They they go to a different place, and it's a downhill spiral fast because they're not addressing everything.
00:38:59.280 --> 00:39:09.679
And then that's how you get down the that's how you get addicted to pain meds, that's how you get an unnecessary surgery, that's how you get a meniscus uh SNCC, whatever they call it, um, for no reason.
00:39:09.840 --> 00:39:12.000
And now you're changing anatomy forever.
00:39:12.400 --> 00:39:17.280
And now there's other compensations happening, and you still never address the root cause.
00:39:17.599 --> 00:39:21.119
So I'm I'm very passionate in the sales process because of that.
00:39:21.199 --> 00:39:28.639
And I can look someone in the eye and tell them like, I know that we're gonna do a full assessment and understand your body better than anyone else.
00:39:28.800 --> 00:39:31.360
So, like, it's up to you.
00:39:31.920 --> 00:39:33.039
It's up to you.
00:39:33.519 --> 00:39:35.199
This is terrifying.
00:39:35.599 --> 00:39:42.880
Like when you actually think about that, and and I have my own personal opinions on everybody sleeping in the same bed together, right?
00:39:42.960 --> 00:39:51.519
And so, like, doctors want to prescribe medication, they want you to be addicted to pain meds because it's it's just more money for bake pharma, um, which is a rabbit hole we can go down.
00:39:51.599 --> 00:40:00.000
But when I'm now thinking about this specific example, you you don't manage the back pain, you have surgery, you're still complaining of pain.
00:40:00.159 --> 00:40:01.360
And and what happens?
00:40:01.519 --> 00:40:03.760
You're now gonna go through this cycle all over again.
00:40:03.920 --> 00:40:07.599
But this time, you're not gonna say the back is more painful.
00:40:07.760 --> 00:40:10.960
Now you're gonna go and then hopefully code and get treated for the hip.
00:40:11.119 --> 00:40:20.159
And then maybe the root cause will be solved, or maybe you'll go down this rabbit hole again and now you're two surgeries deep, three surgeries deep, um, whatever it is.
00:40:20.239 --> 00:40:32.320
So this then that just terrifies me as a person sitting here that thankfully, like doesn't have problems knocking on wood and doesn't need to go see a doctor or or whatnot.
00:40:32.480 --> 00:40:34.800
I I manage, I manage, right?
00:40:34.880 --> 00:40:39.679
I take care of myself and um we we manage so that hopefully nothing gets to a point.
00:40:39.760 --> 00:40:42.079
And I was a competitive gymnast for 13 years, right?
00:40:42.159 --> 00:40:56.079
Like I went to physical therapy for for my knee, and I remember, I won't forget it to this day because I've explained it to people at my fitness studio, um, the way my like patella sits with my knee joint and whatnot, it's shifted.
00:40:56.159 --> 00:40:59.280
So if you actually look at one of my knees, it kind of points inward.
00:40:59.440 --> 00:41:06.320
And the PT was like, well, we need to strengthen your quad because that muscle is going to lift and pull whatever.
00:41:06.480 --> 00:41:17.119
Um, and luckily I haven't had knee pain in all of these years, unless it's like gonna rain or like something wacky, it's just a little sore, but but I work out and exercise so much.
00:41:17.199 --> 00:41:21.440
And I do think that my quads are so strong that I I don't experience the pain.
00:41:21.519 --> 00:41:25.280
I just modify and adjust as I need to so that nothing hurts more.
00:41:25.440 --> 00:41:36.559
Um but I can't imagine if I went there and they didn't tell me that if I would have needed surgery, and then surgery would have evolved into medication, which I don't even take Tymel if I have a headache.
00:41:36.719 --> 00:41:40.239
So um so that would not work well for me.
00:41:40.320 --> 00:41:43.360
You know, I got my wisdom teeth in that and I was like gonna want any of the drugs.
00:41:43.599 --> 00:42:04.079
Um so yeah, again, I'm just someone that's sitting here reflecting and thinking about the things that I've been through or the the smaller injuries I've had, unlike yourself and chance, how this could really, really snowball into years, forget months of chronic pain and problems and surgeries and money.
00:42:04.239 --> 00:42:11.119
And really at the end of the day, they're probably shelling out more money than they would have if they just came to see you and invested in themselves in the first place.
00:42:11.519 --> 00:42:14.559
Um I'm wondering two different things.
00:42:14.719 --> 00:42:16.719
You talk about the root cause, right?
00:42:17.280 --> 00:42:25.280
Do you do x-rays or anything to kind of like see internally what's happening, or you in your assessment, figure it out?
00:42:25.440 --> 00:42:30.960
And and if you do x-rays, at what point are you like, yes, let's do this versus not?
00:42:31.840 --> 00:42:33.760
That's a great question.
00:42:34.639 --> 00:42:37.840
Um, I don't use any imaging.
00:42:37.920 --> 00:42:44.719
Um, I've probably sent out five people in my career for MRIs, and those are like red flags.
00:42:45.039 --> 00:42:51.280
Um because the structure, again, is just the symptom of why it's happening.
00:42:51.599 --> 00:42:54.239
And if they want peace of mind, I'm all for it.
00:42:54.639 --> 00:42:55.440
You go for it.
00:42:55.599 --> 00:43:03.280
If you want to know what disk is exactly you know irritated, or you want to know exactly what's happening in your knee, go for it.
00:43:03.679 --> 00:43:05.119
I personally don't need it.
00:43:05.280 --> 00:43:08.400
If I have it, great, I could see it and look at it and be like, great.
00:43:08.880 --> 00:43:14.320
But diagnosis-wise, like first of all, I wanted to say this earlier too.
00:43:14.800 --> 00:43:16.960
Language is very, very, very important.
00:43:17.119 --> 00:43:24.719
And the way that most clinicians talk to patients, it's like we're damaged, this is very bad, we have to, you know, go under the knife.
00:43:24.880 --> 00:43:27.280
It's like very intimidating and fear-mongering.
00:43:27.760 --> 00:43:30.719
I'm very, very, very particular with my language with people.
00:43:31.199 --> 00:43:42.480
And that's that's one of the things is like not to say I want to dismiss what the actual structure is, but I also don't want you to identify as like a sciatica person.
00:43:42.960 --> 00:43:45.840
I don't want you to identify as my left hip is bad.
00:43:46.400 --> 00:43:48.800
I the that language is a standard.
00:43:49.440 --> 00:43:50.159
Not allowed here.
00:43:50.559 --> 00:43:52.719
We're not talking about one side's worse than the other.
00:43:52.880 --> 00:43:56.000
I'm not talking about you're a cervical ridiculopathy person.
00:43:56.239 --> 00:43:58.719
I'm not gonna call you that when you walk in the door.
00:43:58.880 --> 00:43:59.840
Oh, that's my cervical disc.
00:44:00.320 --> 00:44:00.719
Patient.
00:44:00.880 --> 00:44:02.719
Like that's never happening here.
00:44:03.039 --> 00:44:11.280
So our assessment process is so thorough that we don't really need to know what structure it is because how it got there is way more important.
00:44:13.280 --> 00:44:18.960
Again, brings back that education component for your um your patients, right?
00:44:19.039 --> 00:44:20.960
And the people that are choosing to come to you.
00:44:21.440 --> 00:44:34.800
That just that the way you go above and beyond to truly take this time and explain this and again use this positive language and retrain even our brains from what we're so used to hearing in our healthcare system, right?
00:44:34.880 --> 00:44:36.159
That we're not damaged.
00:44:36.239 --> 00:44:39.920
Um and we just need we just need a little love to remain healthy.
00:44:40.159 --> 00:44:40.639
That's it.
00:44:41.599 --> 00:44:42.880
That's what I'm gonna say.
00:44:43.440 --> 00:44:45.920
And I think that that plays a role in the recovery process.
00:44:46.480 --> 00:44:48.639
Yeah, your mind is super powerful.
00:44:48.880 --> 00:44:50.079
I I believe in that.
00:44:50.480 --> 00:44:53.519
I think I'm super optimist.
00:44:53.679 --> 00:44:56.960
Um chance is realist, he says.
00:44:57.119 --> 00:45:00.400
But I'm I really do believe in the power of your mind.
00:45:00.559 --> 00:45:04.639
Um and and how now you heard this on a different podcast recently, right?
00:45:04.719 --> 00:45:09.519
If you're always saying I'm tired, I'm tired, I'm tired, well, you're gonna feel freaking tired, but right.
00:45:09.599 --> 00:45:18.320
But if you're like positive affirmations, like I'm strong, I feel great, I'm energized, then then your body's just like, all right, here we are, we made the decision.
00:45:18.400 --> 00:45:24.559
So I do think that mindset is a huge factor in um in how you heal and how you rehab.
00:45:24.800 --> 00:45:30.800
Have you had to have you had to like deal with that with any of your patients, people that come in and are like, Dr.
00:45:31.039 --> 00:45:32.800
Jeremy, I'm broken.
00:45:33.039 --> 00:45:34.719
This is never gonna work.
00:45:36.239 --> 00:45:38.960
Well, more than I can ever explain.
00:45:39.599 --> 00:45:42.000
Um, yeah, it's a big piece of it.
00:45:42.079 --> 00:45:48.239
And um, the way that they perceive pain, the the way that they perceive their day-to-day life because of pain.
00:45:48.400 --> 00:45:50.079
Um, literally last night.
00:45:50.159 --> 00:45:51.119
This is a true story.
00:45:51.280 --> 00:45:52.000
Last night.
00:45:52.159 --> 00:45:56.239
Um, one of my one of the best cases, probably in my career.
00:45:56.400 --> 00:46:00.159
Um, he started in December of 23 and he's still with me.
00:46:00.400 --> 00:46:00.800
Wow.
00:46:00.960 --> 00:46:05.039
Um, yeah, he had a crazy story, um, discernation.
00:46:05.360 --> 00:46:08.800
Um, went to the wrong place first and they scared the hell out of him.
00:46:08.960 --> 00:46:10.800
He was bedridden for a year and a half.
00:46:11.360 --> 00:46:15.760
Um, yeah, found me somehow through Instagram, uh, decided to take the leap.
00:46:16.239 --> 00:46:18.800
So technically started in January of 24.
00:46:19.280 --> 00:46:27.760
And um it's been uh it's been a lot of mindset, um, the the psychological component of it.
00:46:27.920 --> 00:46:30.719
Um trusting his body again, the confidence.
00:46:31.119 --> 00:46:34.079
Like we're still working together two and a half years uh later.
00:46:34.400 --> 00:46:42.480
Um and last night he texted me, he said, uh, I think I'm too, you know, I'm too fatigued to finish my my back and bicep workout.
00:46:42.880 --> 00:46:45.039
Should I if you say go back, I'll go back.
00:46:45.119 --> 00:46:48.320
And I said, go back, finish it.
00:46:48.800 --> 00:46:51.199
And he did it, he finished it, and he thanked me.
00:46:51.280 --> 00:46:53.119
And this is still two and a half years in.
00:46:53.519 --> 00:46:54.000
Wow.
00:46:54.239 --> 00:46:56.159
Yeah, and I just I'm grateful.
00:46:56.480 --> 00:46:58.400
He's the one that I posted the wedding for.
00:46:58.559 --> 00:47:03.920
So his I got invited to his wedding, um, had such an impact on him.
00:47:04.079 --> 00:47:07.599
He gave me probably two minutes of his wedding speech.
00:47:08.079 --> 00:47:09.679
And I yeah, I lost it.
00:47:12.000 --> 00:47:14.159
Oh, that's that's so beautiful.
00:47:14.320 --> 00:47:15.440
I might cry too.
00:47:16.079 --> 00:47:17.599
It was unbelievable.
00:47:17.840 --> 00:47:22.400
He danced the night away, didn't worry about his back one time, and that was always the goal.
00:47:22.639 --> 00:47:25.360
Um, I called my wife when I got in the car.
00:47:25.440 --> 00:47:27.280
I was like, I think I could retire now.
00:47:27.599 --> 00:47:29.039
Like that was that was it.
00:47:29.199 --> 00:47:30.960
Like I got I got part of a speech.
00:47:31.119 --> 00:47:33.119
I got invited to the wedding in the first place.
00:47:33.360 --> 00:47:36.159
Everybody there was coming up to me, like thanking me.
00:47:36.320 --> 00:47:37.920
Um, it was surreal.
00:47:38.159 --> 00:47:48.239
And uh yeah, it's it a lot of him was had nothing to do with biomechanics, and yeah, the exercises are great, but like a lot of it was pushing him along, pushing him along.
00:47:48.400 --> 00:47:56.159
Um, when he first walked in, he literally walked in at like a 0.2 mile per hour rate, like literally shuffling.
00:47:56.639 --> 00:47:57.199
Wow.
00:47:57.599 --> 00:48:05.039
And I had to hide I had to hide things through the exercises to get him to move, you know, faster at like the treadmill.
00:48:05.360 --> 00:48:08.000
I would just keep talking to him and keep pressing the button.
00:48:08.480 --> 00:48:13.119
Um, we would do you know variations of deadlifts so that he could start to use his back.
00:48:13.519 --> 00:48:33.840
Um it was it was a lot of creativity, but it helped me become a way better clinician because I understood at that point like it's not just about the biomechanics, like it's that's a huge part of it is the mindset and the perception of pain and how it's affecting that person um and getting them in certain positions that actually feel good, that are kind of like hidden.
00:48:34.239 --> 00:48:37.440
Um you're still doing the same movement, but it's just in a different position.
00:48:38.000 --> 00:48:41.039
Um, so that is a huge part, and not just him.
00:48:41.199 --> 00:48:47.119
So many people come in with uh, you know, they've been to other places, so they hear how damaged they are.
00:48:47.440 --> 00:48:58.239
They don't see unfortunately, you know, that's the hardest part for me is when someone says no because you know that they're either not gonna get the help they need or they're gonna go get surgery.
00:48:58.559 --> 00:49:00.000
And that happened about a month ago.
00:49:00.320 --> 00:49:14.320
I mean, I I take blame because I obviously wasn't good enough on the uh on the sales process, but um this lady, you know, was just so so um how do I even say this?
00:49:14.480 --> 00:49:18.480
She was so committed already to getting surgery, like she just thought that that was her only option.
00:49:19.360 --> 00:49:25.280
And so she we even did the evaluation, she got a treatment um because we do treatment on that evaluation and treatment session.
00:49:25.840 --> 00:49:27.280
And she's like, I feel better.
00:49:27.599 --> 00:49:31.440
I could see how this can help me, but I just think that I'm gonna need surgery anyway.
00:49:31.840 --> 00:49:34.320
And so that for me is like I can't sleep at night sometimes.
00:49:34.480 --> 00:49:43.440
That's like it's just a mindset thing, you know, and I wasn't I wasn't good enough to communicate clearly like this is there's a way around this.
00:49:44.079 --> 00:49:44.400
Yeah.
00:49:44.719 --> 00:49:52.079
So well, that that scenario aside, you're you're out here truly changing lives, right?
00:49:52.159 --> 00:50:03.920
That's now two weddings you've spoken about, where some a female wanted to walk down the aisle, this gentleman wanted to just dance, and then and then gave a a live testament to to his entire wedding.
00:50:04.159 --> 00:50:08.800
That's gotta be, like you said, a true high of of your career.
00:50:09.039 --> 00:50:17.760
Um, I'm I'm like, I have like chills just hearing you list, like just listening to you talk about it, because that really is life-changing and and incredible.
00:50:18.079 --> 00:50:25.119
And I I imagine that when someone's bedridden and sitting there, they're truly thinking like, this is it for me.
00:50:25.360 --> 00:50:32.239
Um so I'm sure you you turn that guy's life around um and and his mindset around.
00:50:32.320 --> 00:50:36.639
And I also chuckle a little bit when you're talking about you had to hide certain things.
00:50:36.800 --> 00:50:39.599
I think about children and you've you've got, you know, kids.
00:50:39.679 --> 00:50:44.480
So it's like when you when you feed them something new and you're like, oh, it's chicken and it's not really chicken.
00:50:45.519 --> 00:50:46.000
Vegetables.
00:50:46.480 --> 00:50:48.480
The same like mindset with adults.
00:50:48.639 --> 00:50:54.400
Um, but but you do it um, you know, out of out of the goodness of your heart and with good intentions.
00:50:54.559 --> 00:50:58.079
Um so so you've got this high in your in your career.
00:50:58.239 --> 00:51:04.880
Um, is there is there something really hard in business or your career or a low that you feel like has shaped you?
00:51:05.679 --> 00:51:08.559
Oh um definitely.
00:51:08.719 --> 00:51:15.679
I mean, when I first uh pulled the band-aid from insurance, um, I I I've been talking about sales a lot.
00:51:15.760 --> 00:51:20.239
And I used to think of sales as like grimy, you know, car salesman.
00:51:20.639 --> 00:51:24.480
Think right away like you're just trying to snake oil someone.
00:51:24.719 --> 00:51:28.000
Um but then I I had a mindset shift.
00:51:28.079 --> 00:51:29.199
Um genuinely.
00:51:29.280 --> 00:51:38.159
I went like 0 for 12 one month on uh patience because I raised my packages, I raised my price, and I was unprepared in the sales.
00:51:38.400 --> 00:51:45.440
And those 12 people, like this is how I view it now, is like, what did they do after they left?
00:51:45.599 --> 00:51:51.360
Like there's no, I have no idea, and most likely it's not in their best interest.
00:51:51.599 --> 00:51:57.039
And so if you can't get someone across the line in the sales process, then you can't help those people.
00:51:57.199 --> 00:51:59.920
And that's what I you know train my my docs on now.
00:52:00.000 --> 00:52:06.159
It's like I know it sounds like this is like salesy, but think about the alternative.
00:52:06.320 --> 00:52:15.360
Like if they go down the street and they go to the person that just cracks their back and just puts heat and stim on their lower back and then sends it out, like that's on us.
00:52:15.920 --> 00:52:25.679
So I think my mindset around sales truly changed, and like the confidence I had and uh seeing the results I was getting with people translated to the sales that helped.
00:52:26.079 --> 00:52:29.679
Uh being a good person helped, but at some point that doesn't help anymore.
00:52:29.760 --> 00:52:37.199
And you have to be good at your sales process to help those people see from your lens how you can help them and why it's a good investment.
00:52:37.760 --> 00:52:46.079
Because otherwise, like I was saying, the alternative most likely they're gonna go to an in-network place that just takes insurance because they're just another number in the in the system.
00:52:46.480 --> 00:52:59.599
And so that like that chip on my shoulder of knowing what the alternative is has um drastically changed like my mindset around sales and knowing what we offer here is one of one.
00:53:00.000 --> 00:53:03.920
So we have to we have to have those people understand like why we're different.
00:53:04.239 --> 00:53:06.800
Yeah, you're finding and offering those solutions.
00:53:06.960 --> 00:53:08.719
Um, I say the same thing to my team.
00:53:08.880 --> 00:53:17.840
Yes, we're we're selling memberships, if you will, but we're also giving people a solution to where they tell us they're at in their fitness journey and what their fitness goals are.
00:53:17.920 --> 00:53:23.440
And and um similarly, right, there's a standard, and that's what makes you so successful.
00:53:23.679 --> 00:53:26.719
Um, there's, you know, standard in in my business too.
00:53:26.800 --> 00:53:29.119
And it's truly not, I had the same thoughts, right?
00:53:29.280 --> 00:53:29.760
Grimy.
00:53:30.000 --> 00:53:31.199
I'm like, I hate sales.
00:53:31.360 --> 00:53:32.639
Um I hate sales people.
00:53:32.719 --> 00:53:35.599
I'm the worst person to get on the phone if you're trying to sell me something.
00:53:35.920 --> 00:53:37.199
It's oh, it's bad.
00:53:37.280 --> 00:53:42.159
Um, I wouldn't even want to talk to myself, but it's truly, it's truly solution focused, right?
00:53:42.239 --> 00:53:46.559
Here's the problem, here's what we're identifying, here's I'm gonna help you, and and this is the solution.
00:53:46.719 --> 00:53:53.280
Um, so you know, I I believe that all of our experiences truly shape us in our journey.
00:53:53.440 --> 00:54:10.239
And when I'm sure you lose sleep or have lost sleep at night over those 12 people that walked out the door and you don't know what they went and moved on to, and you don't know if they're better or what they did, that also shaped your experience to bring you to the level that you're at here today.
00:54:10.400 --> 00:54:22.320
So you've got to be grateful for the highs and the lows equally because they truly shape you and make you a better practitioner and allow you to show up better for your business, your employees, your family.
00:54:22.480 --> 00:54:24.559
Um, which talk a little bit about that.
00:54:24.639 --> 00:54:32.239
You said during COVID you, you know, got graduated, started this business, got married, and months later your your wife was pregnant.
00:54:32.400 --> 00:54:36.480
How has that impacted and influenced your business and your practice?
00:54:37.920 --> 00:54:41.280
Um, so now we have three boys, which is unbelievable.
00:54:41.920 --> 00:54:42.880
Rambunctious.
00:54:43.039 --> 00:54:45.679
Yeah, I never thought I'd be so lucky.
00:54:45.920 --> 00:54:51.920
Um and the first guy was born, um, my schedule was okay.
00:54:52.159 --> 00:54:58.880
It was, you know, we were running a good practice, but I was still, you know, I wasn't hit there like how I am now today.
00:54:59.119 --> 00:55:06.320
Um, so the second guy was born and I started hiring people, the business was growing again, got a little more busy.
00:55:06.719 --> 00:55:16.960
And then the third guy was last year, and that's when it really hit me that I like needed to uh scale this practice without me being in the treatment room as much.
00:55:17.199 --> 00:55:25.760
Because now we have three guys, and I want to be there for the soccer games and the baseball and maybe coach and just be more present um at home.
00:55:25.840 --> 00:55:53.440
And so I think those feelings have further uh motivated me to grow a team now so that they can be the new Jeremy and I can step out of the treatment um and be more present at home and still run the practice, you know, be more of a CEO style uh practitioner where I'm treating a couple days a week and running the business things a couple days a week, and then I'm home, you know, in time for the practices and time to take into school.
00:55:53.679 --> 00:55:55.199
Um, because that is important to me.
00:55:55.679 --> 00:56:00.639
So I think that goal I never really saw for myself when I started my practice.
00:56:00.719 --> 00:56:06.800
Um, but after the third boy, I was like, I gotta figure this out fast because it's coming up quick.
00:56:07.039 --> 00:56:10.960
And um I want to make sure that I'm not missing any big moments.
00:56:11.199 --> 00:56:19.840
I want to be the dad that is, you know, always there, supportive, uh, showing up for the games, showing up for the graduations, which I've been able to do, thank God.
00:56:20.079 --> 00:56:21.920
Um, even with a crazy schedule.
00:56:22.000 --> 00:56:24.719
So I think it'll only get better as we scale.
00:56:24.880 --> 00:56:31.760
Um but yeah, it's it's been eye-opening to for me to see like, oh wow, this is definitely not just about me anymore.
00:56:31.840 --> 00:56:32.880
Like, we need people.
00:56:33.599 --> 00:56:41.599
And uh we need people to be good, and we need world-class clinicians, and we need, you know, a good sales rep, we need a good marketing person, we need good ads.
00:56:41.760 --> 00:56:44.559
Um, so being in charge of all that is fun for me now.
00:56:44.719 --> 00:56:59.280
And I still love doing what I do in the clinic, but in order for me to step out of there and and be more valuable for my family and as an owner, I have to hire more people to do the clinician, uh the clinical stuff so that I can have that that extra time.
00:57:00.159 --> 00:57:06.960
Yeah, it's a it's a beautiful and a bittersweet thing as a business owner when when you're at that moment, right?
00:57:07.039 --> 00:57:12.000
And you're like, my priorities are on family, right, is number one.
00:57:12.079 --> 00:57:18.880
But this is my business, and I need to cultivate something that is successful and and find people that live that standard that you've set.
00:57:19.039 --> 00:57:25.599
Um, and it's it's a moment where you're like so proud of how far you've come, but it's also like, well, wait, I don't want to be hands off.
00:57:25.760 --> 00:57:28.719
I had a I had a I had that similar kind of realization recently.
00:57:28.880 --> 00:57:32.800
We were out on vacation and then no internet, no one, like nothing at all.
00:57:32.960 --> 00:57:35.760
And then I came back and my team is like, yep, all's great.
00:57:35.840 --> 00:57:41.760
And I'm like, all there's there's there's nothing like everything's handled.
00:57:42.079 --> 00:57:44.960
And for a second, I'm like, doesn't he even need me?
00:57:45.199 --> 00:57:52.079
Like, you know, it's it's it's something I'm super grateful for, as I imagine you are as well.
00:57:52.159 --> 00:58:06.079
Um when you're when you're finding those people that you're entrusting to represent this beautiful thing that you've built and live that standard and continue to offer this world class experience and these world class relationships and treatment.
00:58:06.239 --> 00:58:13.199
Um, so you know, give yourself give yourself a pat on the back and also give yourself some grace that sometimes things aren't always perfect.
00:58:13.360 --> 00:58:18.960
But if you're able to show up in every area of your life, I think that translates into your business too.
00:58:19.119 --> 00:58:27.760
Um if you're you know better mother at home and you feel like your cup is filled there, your your cup is filled at work and you can show up better for your staff and your patients.
00:58:27.920 --> 00:58:29.840
Um so yeah, thanks for sharing.
00:58:30.000 --> 00:58:32.000
That's that's that's beautiful.
00:58:32.239 --> 00:58:46.719
Um so so I want I want you to share with people where they can find you, how they can find you, if they want to work with you, what they should do, because we've clearly heard that you've worked virtually with people and continue to change lives.
00:58:47.599 --> 00:58:51.599
So by far and away, the best is uh Instagram.
00:58:51.679 --> 00:58:52.960
Um there's two accounts.
00:58:53.039 --> 00:58:59.280
There's RSM Sports Med, that's our team account, and then my personal one is RSM Athlete Doc.
00:58:59.760 --> 00:59:02.880
Um, and then the website is RSMsportsmed.com.
00:59:03.519 --> 00:59:06.719
Um if you follow us on Instagram, we post a lot.
00:59:06.880 --> 00:59:08.800
So hopefully it's valuable stuff.
00:59:08.960 --> 00:59:12.079
People save the exercises or it's funny.
00:59:12.239 --> 00:59:13.840
Um, but it's a good page to follow.
00:59:14.000 --> 00:59:17.519
And then email is drjeremy at rsmsportsmen.com.
00:59:17.599 --> 00:59:21.760
If someone's interested in starting um with a phone call, that's always how we start.
00:59:21.840 --> 00:59:24.719
So we get to know the person, get to know their goals, what are they dealing with?
00:59:24.960 --> 00:59:26.159
Doesn't matter where you're at.
00:59:26.239 --> 00:59:29.599
Um, we can do virtual, so that is that is an option.
00:59:29.760 --> 00:59:30.960
Um, we just want to help.
00:59:31.760 --> 00:59:32.320
Amazing.
00:59:32.480 --> 00:59:37.199
I will link all of those in our show notes so that people can find you and reach out if needed.
00:59:37.440 --> 00:59:48.400
If someone was listening right now who's been bounced around to all of these different healthcare practices or just bounced around the system as a whole and they haven't gotten answers, what would you say to them?
00:59:49.039 --> 00:59:50.320
Don't give up.
00:59:51.039 --> 00:59:51.920
Do not give up.
00:59:52.079 --> 00:59:53.199
Do your homework.
00:59:53.440 --> 00:59:59.519
Um because it's it's funny actually, we get so many questions because we're cash-based.
00:59:59.840 --> 01:00:04.960
But I encourage those people to have the same questions everywhere they go.
01:00:05.440 --> 01:00:10.800
With an Ortho, with a Cairo, with a PT, in network, out of network.
01:00:10.960 --> 01:00:11.599
Does it matter?
01:00:12.000 --> 01:00:18.960
Do your homework, ask a lot of questions that mean that mean a lot to you so that you know you're with the right provider.
01:00:19.280 --> 01:00:23.199
And do not give up on looking for that right provider because they are out there.
01:00:23.760 --> 01:00:24.639
Amazing.
01:00:24.960 --> 01:00:30.960
I close every episode with a question to you as our guest.
01:00:31.199 --> 01:00:35.440
What does living a balanced and sane life mean to you?
01:00:37.760 --> 01:00:49.840
Balanced and sane for me is I love working hard in here, and then I also love working hard in the gym.
01:00:50.719 --> 01:00:52.880
That's a mandatory, that's a standard.
01:00:53.199 --> 01:00:54.719
And travel.
01:00:55.119 --> 01:00:57.679
So traveling for us is our big thing.
01:00:58.079 --> 01:01:01.840
We're going to Europe in August with all three kids and my wife.
01:01:02.079 --> 01:01:02.400
Nice.
01:01:02.559 --> 01:01:04.960
Um, so we're gonna test that one out for the first time.
01:01:05.119 --> 01:01:12.159
Um, but we went to Puerto Rico in March with all of them, and that was not as far of a trip, but also super successful.
01:01:12.239 --> 01:01:13.760
The our knock on wood.
01:01:14.000 --> 01:01:15.760
Our babies are very good on planes.
01:01:16.239 --> 01:01:17.519
Shout out to my wife.
01:01:17.760 --> 01:01:23.519
Um, but I I feel like if you're grinding in here, and we do grind, we grind.
01:01:24.000 --> 01:01:31.679
But you also should experience life and and congratulate yourself on your hard work, and that's definitely what I do.
01:01:32.079 --> 01:01:41.199
I I don't see a uh uh source of pride in never going on vacations, being a workaholic, um, never being home.
01:01:41.360 --> 01:01:44.000
That that for me is not something to brag about.
01:01:44.400 --> 01:01:51.440
Um, I like to enjoy those moments, and we typically do about three vacations a year because we work so hard.
01:01:51.599 --> 01:01:57.519
And we want to enjoy quality time with the family and earn earn that right for being here all the time.
01:01:57.840 --> 01:02:01.440
And the workout part is again, that's a part of my life.
01:02:01.519 --> 01:02:08.639
I'm never gonna give up working out, and that's why I'm so passionate about getting people back to training again, is because I can't imagine a life without that.
01:02:09.119 --> 01:02:09.920
Amazing.
01:02:10.159 --> 01:02:12.800
Well, I really appreciate your time here today, Jeremy.
01:02:12.880 --> 01:02:19.599
Thanks for sitting down with me, sharing about RSM, your journey, your life, how you got here, where you're going.
01:02:19.760 --> 01:02:20.880
I really do appreciate it.
01:02:21.039 --> 01:02:23.519
Again, I'll link everything in the show notes for listeners.
01:02:23.679 --> 01:02:24.880
Thanks for joining me.
01:02:25.199 --> 01:02:26.079
Thanks for having me.
01:02:26.239 --> 01:02:27.360
Appreciate it.
01:02:27.679 --> 01:02:31.519
That's a wrap on today's episode of Balanced and Sane.
01:02:31.920 --> 01:02:42.000
If you loved this conversation, I'd be so grateful if you'd follow the show, leave a review, and share this episode with a friend who's trying to stay balanced and sane too.
01:02:42.239 --> 01:02:48.400
You can connect with me on Instagram, and you'll find all episode links and resources in the show notes.
01:02:48.639 --> 01:02:51.840
Thanks for listening, and until next time, stay sane.