ABOUT THIS EPISODE
In Episode 63 of The Alchemy Podcast, Doug Cartwright reconnects with his former high school coach and mentor, Benjamin Ohai, for one of the most profound conversations in the show's history. What begins as a conversation about elite athletics transforms into an unforgettable exploration of consciousness, ego death, and what lies beyond.
Ben shares his journey from growing up in primitive 1950s Hawaii to becoming one of BYU's greatest wrestlers—undefeated in WAC competition with a record of 180-9. But the heart of this episode centers on Ben's 2017 near-death experience during a West Nile virus infection, where he encountered something that shattered his understanding of reality and fundamentally changed who he is.
This conversation explores the psychology of world-class performance, the intangible quality that separates elite athletes from everyone else, the terror of ego dissolution, Carl Jung's concept of the shadow self, and how facing your deepest fears can paradoxically make you more courageous. Ben's story will challenge your assumptions about success, identity, and what truly matters in the fourth quarter of life.
Timestamps of Key Moments
02:00 – Growing up in primitive 1950s Hawaii before statehood
06:10 – "I hated it": the love-hate relationship with wrestling and hard things
09:13 – The breakthrough moment: winning the Five Counties tournament as a junior
11:27 – "The subconscious only believes what you've done, not what you say"
16:06 – Hal Simone: the transformative junior college coach
21:03 – How great coaches believe in you more than you believe in yourself
22:17 – BYU wrestling career: 180-9 record, avenging every single loss
24:07 – Breaking the mental block: yelling "Fuck" and tapping into flow state
26:02 – What separates athletes who "have it" from those who don't
30:03 – Raising NCAA champions through the baby steps philosophy
35:58 – The two-hour flight to Houston that saved his life
40:58 – The near-death experience begins: "I wasn't afraid—I WAS fear itself"
42:31 – The mirror: being forced to confront the shadow self
43:49 – The worst part: believing it's forever with no escape
45:19 – "You never existed—your family was fake": the ultimate terror
47:13 – Discovering others had the exact same experience
50:03 – Carl Jung's shadow: the breakthrough that reframed everything
53:14 – How losing ego made him dramatically more courageous
58:37 – Synchronicity and second witnesses: "Psalm 35" tattooed on her ribs
01:03:10 – The fourth quarter: savoring sunrises and rediscovering wonder
01:06:10 – "You're not going to find a depressed person who's grateful"
Follow Doug:
IG: https://www.instagram.com/doug_cartwright/
Join the Alchemy Accelerator: https://www.alchemysalescoaching.com/
Subscribe to my YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/@AlchemyPodwithDougCartwright
Follow Benjamin:
IG: https://www.instagram.com/benjamin8675309
