2.10 Breaking the Cycle: Foster Care, Domestic Abuse, and Military Service with Mattie Jones

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Somewhere between the corner office, the carpool line, and the third glass of wine, a lot of women lose themselves.
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Allie Trimble Lizzano, she found her way back, and she's not keeping the roadmap to herself.
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This is Airing Out Your Vagina.
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Grace, grit, and a splash of sarcasm.
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Here's Allie.
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Hi, I'm Allie.
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Welcome back to Airing Out Your Vagina, the podcast, where we talk about things that sometimes other people don't necessarily want to talk about, but we shine a light on them anyway.
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And so my saying here is that the truth comes first, comfort comes last, and honesty is non-negotiable.
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And so today I'm actually really excited to have a guest on that I'd been working to get on here for a bit, um, scheduling-wise, but her name is Maddie Jones.
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So Maddie, welcome to the show.
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Hi, thank you.
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I'm so happy to be here.
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Yeah.
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So we were joking before I hit record that Maddie and I, I mean, she's literally almost half my age, not quite because I haven't hit 50 yet, but um we're about a little over 20 years difference.
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Um, but we have an awful lot in common and we met uh actually just earlier this year um and hit it off and became fast friends.
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And so we met for coffee recently, and I told her I'd always wanted a baby sister, and now I feel like I have one.
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Well, and I love it.
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I love I I had a not really a good family, but I did grow up with siblings, but none like you.
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So I'm super excited to be in addition to your family.
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Well, there you go.
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We're you're I told you lifers.
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So I wanted to share um a little bit about where I met you um and kind of let that take us into um really kind of what I see as the journey of your life.
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And um I talk to a lot of different women that have navigated a lot of different things.
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Um, but I was invited this year um by the Guerra family.
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They're kind of my adopted family, if you will, um, but to sit at their table at the annual CASA Gala.
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And for anybody listening that doesn't know what CASA is, um, it's an org, it's actually a national organization, and we have one here in El Paso.
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Um, and CASA stands for court appointed special advocate.
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And so what that organization does is provide services, and I'm not going to pretend to be a representative of them, um, but my knowledge base is that they essentially provide an adult representative that whose goal and job is to represent what's in the best interest of the child.
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And that's in the court system educationally, that they're getting the support that they need, the services that they need, um, and that they're never alone uh when navigating the court system.
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So I was blessed with the seat at the table for this year's gala um and was touched to the point of tears because Maddie was their spokesperson this year that got up and gave um kind of a keynote really um before the auction and some of the other um fun stuff for the night.
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And so I'm gonna ask you, Maddie, and I told you you go into as much or as little as you're comfortable with.
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But one of the things I love about this podcast is the messages that I get from people that listen.
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Um, and the goal is that people can get little nuggets from things.
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And when I look at you and we talk about some of what you've navigated, um, you know, and then in the military and now what you're doing now, it just grabbed me that you are the epitome of what we talk about when we talk about survivors and people that choose strength and grace and and keep moving forward.
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So I'm gonna pass the mic to you, so to speak, um, and let you kind of talk a little bit about uh what you shared at the gala that started our relationship.
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Um, and then we'll go on from there.
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Perfect.
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Um, so I myself was a foster child, which is part of my my gala speech.
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Um, and I didn't have a CASA, which really I want to say affected my my life growing up, um especially now being a CASA, I realized how much and how how vital they are to foster children, and not only that, but the legal system as well, because I didn't realize how much the judges take account of what I'm saying.
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Um and I feel like had I had someone like myself to show up for me and speak for me and advocate for me, then maybe things would have been different.
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Um, but the longer I dwelled on that thought, the more I thought, okay, well, then maybe I wouldn't be who I am now.
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And who I am now is a really, really great person.
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And I I wish that I didn't have to go through foster care and go through the trials of those of those um families that I was with, with along with my siblings.
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I think we had one good foster family, and um, even that one, whenever our foster mom would have to go to work, she would leave us with her brother, and her brother would keep us awake.
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He wouldn't let us sleep, he wouldn't let us pray, nothing.
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If we made a peep, we were something was happening to us.
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Um sorry, my honey is just getting home.
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Um and that I want to point out, you said that was your good foster home.
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Yes, so even in one that you qualify as good, um, was really not necessarily a healthy environment in and of itself.
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At all.
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Yeah, but I mean, as opposed to, I guess I would say my worst one was um my little sister, she had her first birthday in foster care.
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Her very she was just a baby.
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Um and obviously babies cry, and so she was throwing a fit.
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I think she was something she was teething or something was happening, and she was just very, very upset.
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And obviously they didn't want to beat her, so they beat each one of us every single time that she cried.
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And that was, I mean, she was a baby, so she cried a lot.
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So there was a lot of beatings.
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Um, so it's just kind of things like that that kind of alter um, I guess essentially your your brain function because you're like, oh, well, if I if I have feelings, if I vocalize my feelings and and tell someone this is happening, you know, what's gonna happen to me?
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Nothing good, because nothing good has happened this far.
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And a huge part of it was um the reason we went into foster care was because my my mom's boyfriend um was a pedophile, and you can imagine what he he did to me as a child.
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Um, and I told my mother about it, and she told me that I can't tell anyone because he would go to jail.
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She didn't have a worry in the world about what would happen to her kids, only that her source of income and the love of her life would be arrested.
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And after it was all said and done, he didn't even go to jail.
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We just got taken away because it just they didn't necessarily care so much about him, more as who she was as a parent.
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Was she qualified?
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And clearly she wasn't.
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Um and so I was trying to navigate that as well, uh, and being kind of a source of a guardian and parents and my siblings.
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Um, so I feel like I had to grow up really early.
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And how old were you, Maddie, when that that particular piece?
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We I was seven.
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I was seven years old.
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There goes the cat.
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I told you, you never know.
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Well, I'm sure you've been hearing my puppy, so um, but yeah, just so just a so it's seven years old.
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You're navigating, and you just said I was trying to be kind of a guardian and a protector.
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You're you're seven years old.
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Yeah, you're still a baby yourself.
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Exactly.
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Wow.
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And so it it was a a lot of pressure, a lot of pressure, and um I don't I think looking back, um it kind of gave me a new perspective on families and parents, um, because I thought that's how every family was.
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And I thought, I mean, we went through several foster homes as well, and the best one was still not a good one.
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And it's like, dang, they're all really like this.
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Like, there's no good family.
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And so it makes you think, okay, well, I deserve this.
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You know, this is how everyone's life is, and it normalizes it, yeah.
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It makes you think that this is what this, I guess this is what happens behind every closed door.
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Exactly.
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And it was it was crazy because only recently did I realize, wait, Maddie, that's not true.
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You know, families are supposed to love each other and and moms are supposed to care for their kids and and want their kids to be loved and to grow.
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Um, because I never got that.
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Even as a teenager, even now, I'm I still feel like my mom thinks that I I'm better, but I don't necessarily feel like that.
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I just feel like I wanted more, and that's okay.
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You wanted something different, yeah, exactly.
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Like I wanted to break the cycle, you know.
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I didn't want to have a little girl like me.
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I wanted to be able to be, you know, different.
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Yeah.
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They talk a lot about, and I actually saw um a visual, and uh, I mean, it's all over the place, so I'm sure you've seen it too.
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But it was a person that had stood up a bunch of really tall, like fireplace matches that you would use, the longer matches, and they stood them all up in this, you know, wooden thing so that they would all stand.
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And they lit one on one side, and it immediately, of course, starts catching the next and the next and the next.
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And they literally pulled one out and it stopped.
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It didn't ignite the rest.
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And I think it was such a kind of profound visualization of it really can just be that one matchstick.
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So, you know, in in your uh sharing that I you wanted to be a cycle breaker, you didn't want to then have your own family.
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Um, and you mentioned having your own daughter at some point and having them live out that same sort of life fate, if you will.
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Yes, exactly.
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Yeah, I think those things, I mean, the the strength it takes.
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Um, you know, when you and you shared some of this at the gala, but when you talked about, you know, really feeling like it was kind of your role to be the protector and try to make sure, you know, that the siblings stayed together.
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And and how many of there were you or are you?
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It's my older sister, me, my younger brother, my little sister.
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Okay, yeah.
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So I yeah, I mean, I can't even imagine a four-year-old trying to kind of huddle together the four of you um and figure out really at that point, it's not living life, it's surviving, it's getting to the next phase um or the next foster home.
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Or and I do want to say, um, and I know you would agree with me, I have actually have a couple of friends that are foster parents.
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Um, and I don't live in their home.
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So even this is kind of outside looking in.
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But from everything I've seen and from the way that the children that are there have thrived, um, certainly not all foster homes are horrible.
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And we need foster parents.
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We need people that are willing to do that and take on that responsibility.
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But unfortunately, um whether it is the primary, you know, the biological mother and parents, as in your situation, that don't necessarily rise to the occasion of motherhood and protect you.
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And um, I've shared with you, you know, that my friend Nicole runs um the Center of Hope in El Paso, which is the anti-human trafficking organization here.
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Um, and the often the stories that come out of there, the individuals that are actually trafficking the children are their own biological parents.
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Um, and so this isn't something I think a lot of people think this is the very, very rare, very, very exception to the rule, very uncommon.
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And I think that's a misnomer.
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Do you think so?
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Yes, absolutely.
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Yeah, I think um, you know, trying to figure out and that's what do you feel like?
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Um, and you shared a little bit about that, but your involvement um with Casa, what do you feel like that has done um for you personally, um, from a healing perspective?
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And maybe, you know, what you feel like maybe it gave back to some of the kids that you've worked with.
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Um, for me personally, I think um I say this a lot, my little girl, right?
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Because obviously I'm a grown woman, but there's you have the little versions of yourself that are have been broken throughout your life.
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Um, so I think for me, becoming a casa, my little girl has felt um it's been bittersweet for her because knowing how easy it is to give that love, it's kind of heartbreaking that it wasn't, I never received it, if that makes sense.
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Because I I'm giving all of these, and I have more than one cause a case, and I'm managing them very well, like and more, like more than just hitting the bare minimum um tasks that you have to complete monthly.
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I mean, I'm checking in, I'm answering calls, stuff like that.
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Just if if I need it, I'm I'm putting myself there for those people, for those families.
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And so seeing how easy it is to do that, it's kind of like, oh man, I wish, I wish I had that, you know.
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But at the same time, it's like, okay, Maddie, but had you had that, maybe you wouldn't respond how you do.
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Maybe you wouldn't care as much as you do, maybe you wouldn't um take it as seriously as you do.
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And you know, you know what it feels like to not.
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So why wouldn't you give 110% of yourself?
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Because you don't know the the effect you're having on someone else.
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And I truthfully didn't realize how, even at the gala, I knew the effect I had as a casa because I didn't have one, but I didn't realize the impact it would have on the people who heard my speech.
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I didn't realize how impactful it was and and how much people really appreciated and the difference that it made.
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I genuinely felt like I was just gonna say a bunch of words and then that was it.
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There was gonna be some clapping and then sit down.
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But the amount of people, even yourself, came up to me and was telling me how meaningful and inspiring, um, and just how appreciated and loved I am.
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I I never felt like that.
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And so that in itself was like, wow, Maddie, like you have a purpose.
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You might not have known, you know, what you're here for, but you matter.
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This is important.
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What you're doing matters to someone.
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Someone's listening.
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So keep talking, keep speaking, don't make yourself small, make yourself big.
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You know, so I think that in itself has been super healing for me because I I'm I am one of those people that apologizes for everything, even stuff out of my control.
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I I am one of those people that fit myself into a box so other people can maybe fit better or have more space to be themselves.
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Um, so I think for me it's been that.
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And I think for my kiddos, it's been um, it's just been, I would hope to say healing for them as well, just because they know, you know, maybe out of 20 or out of 30 days, 25 of them, I have no one to talk to.
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I have to just go through emotions.
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I have to, you know, do my chores and go to therapy and stuff like that and say what I need to say to hopefully get out of this situation, right?
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But when it comes to, you know, those five days where they speak to me, it's like I can really say how I'm feeling.
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I can tell you real.
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Exactly.
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And and raw, you know, no filter because it's not my place to judge, it's my place to listen, it's my place to to be an ear, you know, not necessarily to give guidance or advice, but just to make them feel heard, you know, to kind of validate their feelings because for 25 days they're invalidated.
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So I think I think that's a big part of what I do, and it's nice.
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I would I can't even imagine.
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And you know, you mentioned at the gala and how you know you expected to just get up and give your speech and then go sit down.
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And I think I said to you that night, and I I love that you call him your honey, but your fiance, your honey, was sitting with you.
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Um, and I remember when I went over to introduce myself and talked to you for a few minutes, and I just said, I think one of the things that makes your story resonate.
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And one of the reasons that it wasn't a speech, it was a pause in a room full of people really taking in what you shared was because you did it from such a real raw, vulnerable place.
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And I think in today's society, um, you know, uncomfortable conversations or things that have happened to us, it's it's if it's discussed at all, it's discussed from a very kind of superficial um data point with statistics and and things along those lines.
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And I think one of the things um that CASA here does really well is that they make sure that the people that speak about it um have personally been impacted by it.
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Now, that doesn't mean they all had stories like yours.
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There's plenty of CASA um volunteers that had healthy childhoods.
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Um, but uh they it's a calling.
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And I think it's because of that, and you getting up there and speaking the way that you did from such a vulnerable space um and sharing some of the things that you navigated as a child.
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And you've said multiple times here, you know, doing it yourself now and serving in that role now makes you realize, man, you know, in some ways, like you said, maybe because I didn't have that, I my life path took this path, and maybe I wouldn't be the strong, independent, you know, incredibly kind and a soul that pours into others.
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I don't know.
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But it's also you can't help but wonder, had you had that?
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Um, and at least those like you mentioned earlier, you know, some days a month you had somebody that was there to listen.
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Um, and not, you know, I call when I talk to people about real deep stuff, I call it the judgment free zone because we all have our junk.
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And, you know, I'm not here, I'm not a counselor.
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I tell people all the time I am not a psychologist, I am not an attorney, I'm a nurse that just talks about things um and tries to get other people to share their experiences because somebody will listen to this episode or the one that I did on postpartum depression or the one and they'll get something from it that might help them just a tiny bit.
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Yes.
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Um yeah.
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And I think that's what in my in my eyes, that's a big part of what you're doing with Casa.
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Yes, I agree.
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I completely agree, and I love it.
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I love that you're there.
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Um, and I know that they're thrilled to have you there.
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I was at an executive forum meeting this week and I saw the executive director, and I told her, I said, Maddie and I finally met for coffee.
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So um, yeah, I think you know, they're thrilled to have you.
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Um, and I'm so glad that I met you that day.
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But let's talk a little bit.
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So we've talked about CASA.
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Um, you know, you shared a little bit about your childhood and and upbringing.
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Um, and I want to kind of move from there into um, you know, you ended up, you chose military service.
00:20:10.960 --> 00:20:16.799
So let's talk a little bit about how, if you're willing, about how that decision came about.
00:20:17.200 --> 00:20:21.680
Um, because I think again, when we talk about breaking that cycle, right?
00:20:22.000 --> 00:20:32.240
Um, you had talked with me a little bit and shared a little about how um, you know, you got out of that situation and into not, you know, another not so great one.
00:20:32.400 --> 00:20:34.079
Um and yeah.
00:20:34.319 --> 00:20:41.440
And so, and I also I'd love if you would share um about your friend um mom and how they kind of took you.
00:20:41.519 --> 00:20:43.920
Yes, I think that's huge.
00:20:44.160 --> 00:20:58.240
Yes, and that's the I I wouldn't say the biggest part of my story, but um, I have a saying where it's when I become a millionaire or I make it huge, there's gonna be a couple people that I'm gonna take with me that I'm gonna owe everything to.
00:20:58.480 --> 00:21:03.839
And my best friend and her mom and her sister are three of them, and they'll be right up there with me.
00:21:03.920 --> 00:21:06.079
So I'm definitely gonna speak about that.
00:21:06.240 --> 00:21:21.599
Um, but as far as my my military service, it's actually it's funny because my birth mom had initially tried to um sign me up for the Air Force because I graduated high school when I was 17.
00:21:21.920 --> 00:21:24.799
And so she had tried to sign me up for that.
00:21:25.039 --> 00:21:29.680
But at the time, I was working two jobs in high school paying the bills.
00:21:29.839 --> 00:21:40.160
And I couldn't imagine after you know, you've been raising your family since seven years old, you've been working since 14 years old, you know, two jobs and getting all these great grades.
00:21:40.400 --> 00:21:43.440
You just you can't imagine leaving your family behind.
00:21:43.519 --> 00:21:44.960
Um, what's gonna happen to them?
00:21:45.039 --> 00:21:47.279
So I I told her I was like, I'm not willing to do that.
00:21:47.359 --> 00:21:52.640
I'll stay here and do community college and I'll continue to work and we'll keep living in the trailer.
00:21:52.720 --> 00:21:55.279
And that's just that's just gonna be our life.
00:21:55.440 --> 00:21:57.279
Um, and she wasn't happy with that.
00:21:57.359 --> 00:21:59.759
I don't know if it was I liked, I would like to.
00:22:00.240 --> 00:22:04.720
Say that it's because she wanted better for me than to work two jobs and go to community college.
00:22:04.880 --> 00:22:06.799
That's what my little girl wants to say.
00:22:06.880 --> 00:22:16.319
But in reality, I think it was the fact that I rebelled against what she wanted because she wanted to continue to hold that control.
00:22:16.559 --> 00:22:21.440
Because after all these years, you know, I was like um like a bag accessory.
00:22:21.519 --> 00:22:25.039
You know, look at my shiny new bag charm or something like that.
00:22:25.200 --> 00:22:28.240
Um, and she wanted to continue to have that control.
00:22:28.799 --> 00:22:32.799
So I I don't know, I can't speak for where her head was at.
00:22:32.880 --> 00:22:36.960
But, anyways, after all of that, she told me basically to get lost.
00:22:37.119 --> 00:22:38.400
And so I did.
00:22:38.640 --> 00:22:44.079
Um, and I got lost into my car and I was living out of my car for a little while.
00:22:44.160 --> 00:22:50.720
Um, and then I started working a new job at this restaurant, and that's where I met my my best friend and her mom.
00:22:50.880 --> 00:23:03.440
My best friend was a server, and her mom was actually getting a job, the same job that I was applying for, um, because she had worked at a trucking company, but she wanted a second job too, because times are hard.
00:23:03.599 --> 00:23:06.720
Everyone needed to work at least like more than one job.
00:23:06.880 --> 00:23:20.799
Um, so she was in my little orientation, and um things were good for a couple of weeks, and then one day um me and her, the mom had got off at the same time, but the daughter was still serving because she clothes or something.
00:23:21.119 --> 00:23:29.599
And um she had come outside, I think, for a smoke break or something, and she saw me in my car changing, getting ready for bed.
00:23:29.839 --> 00:23:35.200
Um, and then she called her daughter and asked her daughter to come out for a smoke break.
00:23:35.279 --> 00:23:40.160
And then her daughter came up to my car and was like, Hey, I we were thinking about having a movie night.
00:23:40.240 --> 00:23:41.440
Would you like to come over?
00:23:41.680 --> 00:23:44.400
And after that, history, history.
00:23:45.200 --> 00:23:49.440
So um never to this day, never brought it up, you know.
00:23:49.519 --> 00:23:51.599
Like just after that, I was her daughter.
00:23:51.759 --> 00:23:57.440
Um, she made me feel very seen, but not judged, if that makes sense.
00:23:57.680 --> 00:23:58.480
Very much so.
00:23:58.720 --> 00:24:00.000
Yes, very much so.
00:24:00.480 --> 00:24:03.680
I'm living with her, and at the time I met this guy.
00:24:03.839 --> 00:24:07.839
Um, and you know, I was young, I was 18 years, 17, 18 years old.
00:24:08.000 --> 00:24:10.079
I met this guy, he was older than me.
00:24:10.240 --> 00:24:18.240
He's he was an electric, uh some kind of an apprentice, but um, he just very looked very appealing to me, and I really liked him.
00:24:18.400 --> 00:24:19.839
Um, and I thought he was great.
00:24:19.920 --> 00:24:23.920
So I brought him home to meet Mindy, which is my best friend's mom.
00:24:24.160 --> 00:24:28.160
And she told me, um, no, it's not gonna work.
00:24:28.319 --> 00:24:29.839
Trust me on this, it's not gonna work.
00:24:30.000 --> 00:24:32.240
And she was like, if that's what you want to do, do it.
00:24:32.319 --> 00:24:34.079
But I'm telling you, like, he's a bad guy.
00:24:34.240 --> 00:24:40.720
And then the more he came over, um, there were mannerisms he had that showed his true colors.
00:24:41.200 --> 00:24:44.799
And um, one, so my mom was like, No, you can't, you're not gonna be with him.
00:24:44.880 --> 00:24:53.519
I'm not gonna watch my daughter kill herself because essentially, you know, by being with him, he was very emotionally and mentally abusive towards me.
00:24:53.839 --> 00:24:56.160
And that's all I saw growing up.
00:24:56.240 --> 00:25:00.240
So, of course, that's what I was drawn to because I didn't know any different, right?
00:25:00.559 --> 00:25:11.440
Um, and it wasn't until I came home from his house one day after not following my mom's guidance that um I came home and she had all my stuff packed up on her front porch.
00:25:11.680 --> 00:25:14.960
And she said, you know, Maddie, I love you.
00:25:15.039 --> 00:25:16.640
You're you're always gonna be my daughter.
00:25:16.720 --> 00:25:20.880
But like I said, I can't, I'm not gonna watch you kill yourself because that's what's gonna happen.
00:25:21.039 --> 00:25:32.480
And leading up to this, my mom would send me links about abuse and and uh manipulation and narcissism, all these things, you know, just looking out for me, just treating me like a daughter.
00:25:32.720 --> 00:25:37.599
And um, yeah, and to be clear, you're not talking about your biological mom.
00:25:37.839 --> 00:25:42.240
You're talking about the woman that took you in because she saw you changing clothes in your car.
00:25:42.559 --> 00:25:44.000
Yes, exactly.
00:25:44.240 --> 00:25:50.880
Um, and so I think another reason why I rebelled against her because again, I wasn't used to someone caring.
00:25:50.960 --> 00:25:54.480
I was just thinking about she doesn't want to let me go.
00:25:54.640 --> 00:25:58.000
She doesn't want to let me grow because that's what I was so used to.
00:25:58.240 --> 00:26:02.160
Um, and so yeah, I came home, my stuff was packed.
00:26:02.480 --> 00:26:08.480
I ended up going to his house and and moving in with him with my trash bags full of stuff.
00:26:08.720 --> 00:26:12.319
And that night was the first night he ever punched me in the face.
00:26:12.559 --> 00:26:12.960
Wow.
00:26:13.200 --> 00:26:15.920
And he had never, never physically harmed me.
00:26:16.000 --> 00:26:18.079
It was just emotionally putting me down.
00:26:18.319 --> 00:26:23.039
Um, but yeah, that that night was the first night he ever physically laid his hands on me.
00:26:23.200 --> 00:26:34.880
And then um, I think I was in it for I want to say a couple months before because it was, I'm sorry, it was, it was this isn't like me, you know, all of those things that they say, right?
00:26:35.200 --> 00:26:38.799
And finally I was like, I'm I'm gonna die.
00:26:39.039 --> 00:26:43.680
And I knew I at the time I didn't think I had the strength to leave.
00:26:43.839 --> 00:26:44.480
I didn't.
00:26:44.720 --> 00:26:48.880
So I was like, what can I do that's gonna make me leave the military?
00:26:49.119 --> 00:26:53.119
If if I don't, if I sign up for the military and I don't go, I will go to jail.
00:26:53.279 --> 00:26:54.720
So what do you want to do, Maddie?
00:26:54.799 --> 00:26:55.599
Do you want to die?
00:26:55.839 --> 00:27:05.359
Or and so I I went and um I fell in love, but in the process of basic training, I was very lonely.
00:27:05.440 --> 00:27:07.839
So of course I wrote a letter to my birth mom.
00:27:08.240 --> 00:27:16.640
And um I in writing her these letters, I was clinging to her words, clinging to them, and then get out, and the things are the exact same.
00:27:16.799 --> 00:27:22.400
The whole reason was for money, for money, because I came out, no money, all my money was gone.
00:27:22.559 --> 00:27:23.599
Where did it go?
00:27:23.839 --> 00:27:33.680
Yeah, so um that and then when I finally got to Fort Bliss, this guy, the abusive guy, had actually even followed me.
00:27:33.920 --> 00:27:49.920
I was getting calls from unknown numbers, no caller IDs, um, messages saying I'm here and I'm so even um my I guess my squad leader and my leadership even had to figure out like I had to show pictures, all of that stuff, make sure.
00:27:50.160 --> 00:27:57.839
Um, so that was a little bit, and it was nice joining the military because I've got that sense of brotherhood.
00:27:58.000 --> 00:28:02.559
Um, it was people that didn't have to care about you, but they did.
00:28:02.640 --> 00:28:05.920
You know, you build these relationships and and these connections.
00:28:06.079 --> 00:28:15.119
And um I think I grew a lot when I joined the military as well because I showed myself, you know what, like you you can do hard things.
00:28:15.279 --> 00:28:15.759
You can.
00:28:16.079 --> 00:28:18.160
And if you struggle, that's okay.
00:28:18.319 --> 00:28:21.039
You know, everyone else around you is struggling too.
00:28:21.119 --> 00:28:23.119
So you welcome it, you know.
00:28:23.359 --> 00:28:27.200
Don't try to hide and act like you got it all figured out because you don't.
00:28:27.680 --> 00:28:30.480
It's their job to beat you down, overcome it.
00:28:30.640 --> 00:28:38.640
And so it was it was really nice because the Maddie that was getting beat could never have imagined that I was tough enough to take it, you know.
00:28:38.799 --> 00:28:42.400
Looking back, I'm thinking, wow, Maddie, you probably could have left.
00:28:42.559 --> 00:28:46.480
You just didn't think you could because of his words, you know.
00:28:46.640 --> 00:28:47.119
Yeah.
00:28:47.440 --> 00:28:50.720
So well, and I think, you know, you said it best.
00:28:50.880 --> 00:28:54.160
I think so often the strength is there.
00:28:54.640 --> 00:29:20.000
Um, but when you're in a relationship like that or you're in a situation like that, whether it's as a child, young in a home environment, um, where you're literally physically, emotionally, financially dependent upon, you know, parental figures to provide for you, or you're, you know, older and you're in um a relationship and you feel like, yeah, but if I leave, where am I gonna go?
00:29:20.079 --> 00:29:21.359
Or how am I gonna survive?
00:29:21.440 --> 00:29:22.079
Or how's this?
00:29:22.160 --> 00:29:27.519
And I mean, it goes back to your mom, you know, when you told her about what was happening with your boyfriend.
00:29:27.599 --> 00:29:37.119
And she's like, okay, but don't tell anybody again, because in her mind, well, if he leaves or if he gets arrested, you know, how do I pay the bills and take care?
00:29:37.279 --> 00:30:08.640
And I think so often, um, and especially as women, I, you know, I talk a lot about um women, I don't, I won't say in our age group because our age groups are very different, but I think as we get older um and we start growing up, uh, and you do start getting into college and whatever, and you do start in those relationships, having uh, you know, some form of a nest egg so that if you do end up in a situation of violence or you do end up in an unhealthy relationship, that there's a way out of it.
00:30:09.839 --> 00:30:15.519
Um, and I think often we don't see a way out of it when we're navigating it, right?
00:30:15.599 --> 00:30:19.759
Um, or we don't think we're strong enough to get to the other side of that particular thing.
00:30:19.920 --> 00:30:26.960
And um, that's one of the reasons I was excited to have you on because I wanted you to talk about, you know, some of the experiences that you've had.
00:30:27.119 --> 00:30:31.440
Um, you know, you mentioned the brotherhood of um the military.
00:30:31.599 --> 00:30:42.799
And I know you've lost some people that were incredibly close to you, some brothers, if you will, um, from PTSD and um and suicide.
00:30:42.880 --> 00:30:47.359
And, you know, that's something I think doesn't get talked about enough.
00:30:47.519 --> 00:30:56.000
I talk about it some from a healthcare perspective too, because I say we talk about PTSD and military um because it's so extreme.
00:30:56.400 --> 00:31:07.839
Um, and the things that, you know, are are seen and that you all live through and manage during a military career um are extreme to the point that, you know, most civilians can't comprehend that.
00:31:08.079 --> 00:31:15.359
But I think um it's worth, you know, at least touching on a bit because um I think it's it's so prevalent.
00:31:15.519 --> 00:31:23.920
And I think, you know, as suicide numbers continue to increase, um, both in the military and and honestly in the civilian side.
00:31:24.079 --> 00:31:31.680
Um, so I don't know if you'd be willing to talk a little bit um maybe about your experience with that and your loss there.
00:31:32.079 --> 00:31:32.480
Yes.
00:31:32.720 --> 00:31:37.200
Um I honestly can't talk about suicide prevention enough.
00:31:37.359 --> 00:31:44.799
I will talk it to I'm blue in the face because it it is very important and it's near and dear to my heart, obviously.
00:31:45.039 --> 00:31:50.480
Um in I don't know if it's every military installation.
00:31:50.640 --> 00:31:57.359
I would hope to say that, you know, there are leaders out there that genuinely care about their soldiers, and I'm sure that there are.
00:31:57.599 --> 00:32:09.200
And I'm sure that it might even be similar in like um police forces and fire departments and and border patrols and anything that's kind of like that enforcement career.
00:32:09.680 --> 00:32:12.480
Um, I'm sure they have similar issues.
00:32:12.720 --> 00:32:17.200
Um, but I obviously can't speak to their perspectives or anything like that.
00:32:17.279 --> 00:32:21.759
But for me personally, um, my leadership wasn't really the best.
00:32:22.079 --> 00:32:24.160
Um, they just didn't really listen.
00:32:24.400 --> 00:32:28.960
It was frowned upon if you sprained your ankle and wanted to go see the medic.
00:32:29.200 --> 00:32:31.039
You just they put you down for it.
00:32:31.200 --> 00:32:34.559
They made fun of you, um, they judged you.
00:32:34.799 --> 00:32:39.759
And then another big part of it is the mission must go on, of course, right?
00:32:39.839 --> 00:32:44.559
Where there were America's, you know, fighting element.
00:32:44.799 --> 00:32:47.200
So, of course, of course, the mission must go on.
00:32:47.519 --> 00:32:51.599
But how are you gonna complete a mission if you have no soldiers, right?
00:32:52.160 --> 00:32:57.759
So um you would think that they would care for the, but it was far and few.
00:32:57.839 --> 00:33:06.319
I think I had maybe a couple good NCOs, but that's a couple out of an entire military installation, you know.
00:33:06.559 --> 00:33:11.440
So um all of these guys were in my battalion 167.
00:33:11.839 --> 00:33:14.400
Um, and I will call them out every time.
00:33:14.559 --> 00:33:16.400
I that's just how I am.
00:33:16.559 --> 00:33:21.759
Um, but um yeah, my my really good guy friend, he was sick.
00:33:22.079 --> 00:33:26.480
He was barely, barely didn't even turn 21, but he was barely 20.
00:33:26.640 --> 00:33:29.519
Um, he got sick while we were in the field in Korea.
00:33:29.680 --> 00:33:39.119
And instead of taking him out of the field, um, they made him stay there in a sleeping bed, John Dis and all, just completely yellow, hallucinating out of his mind.
00:33:39.279 --> 00:33:52.160
Um, and then they wouldn't, we finally came back to El Paso after that, and um, they wouldn't let him go home to see his family because they were trying to do the medical process to discharge him medically.
00:33:52.559 --> 00:34:02.559
But for some reason, the process takes so long, and all of his friends are going home and he's stuck here, you know, cat sitting or dog sitting for the soldiers that went home.
00:34:02.720 --> 00:34:11.360
And of course, it's sad, and he's young, like I said, 20 years old, just really, really young and sick, and you need someone to talk to you.
00:34:11.599 --> 00:34:13.119
And no one was listening.
00:34:13.280 --> 00:34:19.199
Well, you know, he ended up taking his life in his friend's apartment, the friend of what she was cat sitting for.
00:34:19.360 --> 00:34:22.880
And it's it's awful, it's but there was nothing you know we could have done.
00:34:23.039 --> 00:34:26.880
And then I had another friend who was the very first one.
00:34:27.039 --> 00:34:36.480
Um, he we were on leave again for Christmas, and he took his life in his vehicle, and that was the end of that.
00:34:36.559 --> 00:34:39.119
For and he was under the same leadership as well.
00:34:39.360 --> 00:34:51.119
And then um one that's really, really personal to me is my the first real connection and relationship that I had here in El Paso when I first got here.
00:34:51.360 --> 00:34:56.400
Um, he was a best friend, he was a boyfriend, a first real love, if you will.
00:34:56.639 --> 00:34:58.880
Um just everything.
00:34:59.119 --> 00:35:00.400
He was everything.
00:35:00.639 --> 00:35:06.639
Um, he had the same issue, terrible leadership, didn't really care about anything he had to say.
00:35:06.880 --> 00:35:14.320
Um, he was having trouble with finances, he was having trouble at home, um, just a bunch of stuff.
00:35:14.480 --> 00:35:19.519
And and instead of taking what he was saying seriously, they looked at him as a bad soldier.
00:35:19.760 --> 00:35:22.719
He's a bad soldier, he's um a scumbag.
00:35:23.039 --> 00:35:24.079
That's what they would say.
00:35:24.159 --> 00:35:28.159
You know, he just you didn't want to, they didn't want anything to do with him.
00:35:28.320 --> 00:35:38.800
And they went as far to tell me to stay away because I was a new soldier, you know, and if you're who you're around is basically who you are in their eyes.
00:35:39.039 --> 00:35:44.000
Um so yeah, he he ended up taking his life as well.
00:35:44.239 --> 00:35:48.400
And I think that was a big part of my heartache.
00:35:48.559 --> 00:36:04.079
I felt like in my mind, I'm thinking, okay, Maddie, you you went through child abuse, you went through um neglect from your from your mother, you know, you went through physical abuse from a relationship, you went through all of these things and you made it out on the other side.
00:36:04.159 --> 00:36:07.440
But this one guy takes his life and you're ready to go with him.
00:36:07.599 --> 00:36:09.840
Like, what is what's going on with that?
00:36:10.079 --> 00:36:14.239
Um, but it was the loss of it was literally the loss of my life.
00:36:14.320 --> 00:36:16.159
I I genuinely feel like that.
00:36:16.320 --> 00:36:20.639
And I I think a big part of it was it just kept happening.
00:36:20.880 --> 00:36:28.559
And every time I would lose another one, it brought me right back to him, you know, and I I loved all of these.
00:36:28.639 --> 00:36:30.880
These were my brothers, they really were.
00:36:31.599 --> 00:36:34.000
And I can't save them.
00:36:34.320 --> 00:36:45.599
And it's hard because when you're a protector your entire life and you couldn't protect them from this, it it was hard for me to to separate myself from that.
00:36:45.920 --> 00:36:47.599
You know, I I couldn't.
00:36:48.239 --> 00:36:50.639
I think when you and you touched on a couple of things.
00:36:50.800 --> 00:36:53.119
One, um, the mission must go on.
00:36:53.599 --> 00:37:24.320
And I think, you know, when I touched on earlier, um, you know, whether it's in a situation like that, um, and to your point, again, uh, you know, I I don't want to compare the two as though they're at the same level, but I think um, you know, I speak on on my part a lot about, you know, people talk about a nursing shortage and there's not, you know, there's not enough nurses, there's not enough paramedics, there's not enough of these, you know, kind of frontline healthcare workers.
00:37:24.719 --> 00:37:31.760
Um, but it's not because we're not graduating as many, we're graduating more than ever, but more and more are leaving.
00:37:32.000 --> 00:37:33.519
And it's in attrition.
00:37:33.679 --> 00:37:37.760
And so it's not, it's not a shortage, it's a retention problem.
00:37:38.159 --> 00:37:52.800
And a lot of it has to do, you know, COVID was unbelievably traumatic for the healthcare workers on the front lines, for the people that were actually caring for patients and losing them left and right and trying to be there to comfort them.
00:37:52.960 --> 00:38:10.000
And I think, you know, when you look at um, and you mentioned, you know, other law enforcement agencies, I think, you know, it's I I feel like we use first responders for a very small group of people, but the reality is, you know, first responders are, you know, your honey is a firefighter.
00:38:10.159 --> 00:38:24.159
Um, whether it's firefighters, medics, police officers, it's the nurses on the front line caring for the patients, it's the military that's there on the front line to protect, you know, our interests and and our country.
00:38:24.400 --> 00:38:30.880
I think we tend to overlook the toll that it takes on people.
00:38:31.199 --> 00:38:36.079
Um, and then on so you talked about the shame, right?
00:38:36.239 --> 00:38:41.920
So we don't you don't talk about it because you get judged, you get made fun of, or you get called names or whatever.
00:38:42.000 --> 00:38:46.639
And so we we tend to assume that everybody's fine.
00:38:46.880 --> 00:39:01.519
And it's, you know, I I shared that meme with you where I'm like, it's you know, a woman under water, like under swamp water, and she's got her two thumbs sticking out just above the water, heads already underneath, and it says, I'm fine, it's fine, everything's fine.
00:39:02.159 --> 00:39:19.440
Um, and I think I can't imagine you um with your history and then losing him and then continuing to lose other brothers um to suicide and the feelings that, and that's why I say I tell people all the time, it's okay to not always be okay.
00:39:19.599 --> 00:39:21.679
There's days that we are we're not okay.
00:39:21.920 --> 00:39:28.159
But I think until we talk about it like this, and I love that you said, you know, I'll talk about suicide prevention all day, every day.
00:39:28.400 --> 00:39:47.360
But I think until we talk about things like this and start to normalize mental health challenges and struggles with PTSD and the realities of what it is to serve in the military or to serve as a frontline um uh what am I trying to say, first responder.
00:39:47.679 --> 00:39:57.360
I think until we really talk about those things in an open way, um, where it's okay to not be okay, it I don't see how it changes.
00:39:57.519 --> 00:40:02.320
And I think there's been, you know, there's been some movement in the right direction.
00:40:02.480 --> 00:40:06.159
Um, but I think we definitely have a long way to go for sure.
00:40:06.960 --> 00:40:07.760
Absolutely.
00:40:08.239 --> 00:40:08.880
Yeah.
00:40:09.280 --> 00:40:17.360
So I wanted you to talk a little bit about um, okay, so you came out of, and I mean, this is fresh out of military.
00:40:17.599 --> 00:40:33.840
Um and kind of what you're doing now and what your your path forward is um a little bit because I think to me that's part of um the inspiration you bring, that it's like, look, all of these things have happened and I've navigated all of these things.
00:40:34.000 --> 00:40:38.719
And I appreciate you sharing, you know, in that moment the thoughts, right?
00:40:38.880 --> 00:40:44.719
Where it's like, okay, well, this was my person and I've already been through all of this stuff, and now he's gone.
00:40:44.960 --> 00:40:48.239
So I don't know that I want to be here anymore myself.
00:40:48.559 --> 00:41:02.159
Um, and to know that you've been in that place and you've done the work and you've continued pushing um and kind of where you are now and where you're headed, I think that's something that um people deserve to hear about.
00:41:02.559 --> 00:41:02.880
Okay.
00:41:03.119 --> 00:41:13.920
Well, thank you, first of all, for um appreciating everything that I have to say and kind of actually listening because it you can hear something all day, but listening is what's important.
00:41:14.000 --> 00:41:15.199
So I appreciate that.
00:41:15.840 --> 00:41:25.599
Um I think so right now, I am currently pursuing a bachelor's in social work, and then hopefully I'll go for um my master's as well.
00:41:25.760 --> 00:41:34.239
I am freshly out of the military, July was my last month, so it's it's bittersweet because um that's all I knew.
00:41:34.559 --> 00:41:38.000
And in a lot of ways, the military saved me.
00:41:38.159 --> 00:41:41.599
Um, but also in more ways, it took from me.
00:41:41.840 --> 00:41:51.360
Um, but I will I will also say that if you have like if anyone wanted to join, I would say go for it because it brought me here.
00:41:51.679 --> 00:41:57.840
I am so blessed now because of the decision I made to join, all of the benefits, all of that stuff.
00:41:58.000 --> 00:42:03.920
So but it just it's it's kind of like you have to weigh what what do you want more type thing.
00:42:04.079 --> 00:42:14.719
Um yeah, I was just gonna say it's a balancing act, yes, um, and nothing's ever perfect, and you know, God willing, nothing ever is just total garbage.
00:42:14.880 --> 00:42:29.280
And so it's finding finding the good, yeah um amongst the bad and realizing that, and there's a lot of people, Maddie, that say, yeah, the military was hard, like it, you know, in some ways it broke me and then rebuilt me.
00:42:29.360 --> 00:42:40.559
And then some ways, you know, the the PTSD and the suffering and the things that I witnessed, you know, especially those in uh wartime, the losses, um, losing comrades like you have.
00:42:40.719 --> 00:42:51.039
But then I hear from so many people what you just said that they they really do say that joining the military not just changed, but saved their life.
00:42:51.199 --> 00:42:59.679
It gave them a door, it gave them an outlet, it gave them a way out of a really bad situation, um things like that.
00:42:59.840 --> 00:43:04.400
I know um I have a friend actually was a colleague for a while that was a veteran.
00:43:04.480 --> 00:43:06.400
Um, and he would talk about his story.
00:43:06.480 --> 00:43:12.880
And he had um a pretty significant, well, not significant, a very severe drug addiction.
00:43:13.039 --> 00:43:22.559
Um and he went through and he got cleaned up and he said, I knew if I went back to my friend group or I went back to my home, I'd be right back where I was.
00:43:22.719 --> 00:43:27.119
And he said, So when I got out, I went straight and I signed up for the military.
00:43:27.360 --> 00:43:36.480
And he he tells that story to anybody that'll listen and credits the military um and the structure there um for saving his life.
00:43:36.559 --> 00:43:38.719
So I think that I love that you said that.
00:43:38.880 --> 00:43:48.079
Um, but I also love that you and you even did the balance, the hand balance, because it is nothing's ever um just all great or all awful.
00:43:48.480 --> 00:43:50.400
There's lessons to be learned by all of it.
00:43:50.480 --> 00:43:56.000
But yeah, so you have started your bachelor's degree for social work.
00:43:56.239 --> 00:43:59.679
Yes, you're looking to get um, you know, your goal is to go back.
00:44:00.239 --> 00:44:03.199
Once you complete that for a master's degree.
00:44:03.440 --> 00:44:07.440
And what is it like, what's the pie in the sky job for Maddie Jones?
00:44:07.519 --> 00:44:08.639
What is it that you want to do?
00:44:08.719 --> 00:44:10.159
Who do you want to work with?
00:44:10.800 --> 00:44:11.760
How do you want to?
00:44:11.840 --> 00:44:20.719
Because I think what you're doing with Casa right now is an example already of using what you've navigated, the knowledge that you have.
00:44:20.880 --> 00:44:26.639
And again, just like I say, I'm not a counselor, I'm not an attorney, I'm a I'm a listener and I'm a learner.
00:44:26.719 --> 00:44:30.320
And I try to listen from other people and their stories and learn from them.
00:44:30.480 --> 00:44:34.719
And I think that's very much what you're doing for the kids at CASA.
00:44:35.199 --> 00:44:39.599
But as you go into social work, like what is it that you envision doing?
00:44:39.840 --> 00:44:43.519
Um what is it that, you know, what's your goal with that?
00:44:43.920 --> 00:44:51.519
Honestly, I want to say that I would want to be a caseworker.
00:44:51.679 --> 00:44:58.239
And, you know, but I also want to be able to do what I can do now.
00:44:58.400 --> 00:45:07.440
I know obviously caseworkers make a big difference in in children's lives as well, but they also burn burn out just as anyone else would, you know, with a huge workload.
00:45:07.519 --> 00:45:09.039
They they do burn out.
00:45:09.280 --> 00:45:14.159
And I think my gift is too meaningful to burn out.
00:45:14.320 --> 00:45:14.559
Yeah.
00:45:15.280 --> 00:45:27.119
But I also know myself and I will continue to give and give and give until I'm physically ill just because am I gonna be?
00:45:27.199 --> 00:45:36.159
You know, maybe the second that I feel like I have nothing else to give, maybe that's the second that someone really, really needs something and I can't be 100 for them, you know.
00:45:36.320 --> 00:45:49.599
So um you and I've had conversations about boundaries, yes, and the fact that, you know, you and we, you know, I we've joked about how similar we are in certain ways, where we take on somebody else's problem.
00:45:49.840 --> 00:45:52.800
We take it on as our own, and here, let me help you solve that.
00:45:52.960 --> 00:45:58.079
And so learning um much earlier than I did, let me tell you.
00:45:58.239 --> 00:46:02.400
Um, but yeah, learning that you want to pour into people.
00:46:02.639 --> 00:46:18.800
Um, and I told you my my learning last year about the where we talk about, you know, you can't pour from an empty cup, and we've all heard that, and I'd heard it a thousand times, and people would tell me, they'd be like, Allie, you can't keep doing this, you're pouring from an empty cup.
00:46:18.960 --> 00:46:22.719
And I'm like, No, I got two drops yesterday, so I'm sharing my two drops.
00:46:22.960 --> 00:46:28.320
And it sounds ridiculous, but I shared it on a podcast um in season one.
00:46:28.639 --> 00:46:40.239
Actually, I think it was episode one with Norma, and she was talking to me, and I we were talking about the fact that it was there that I learned from her at Noble House that the idea is you pour from a full cup.
00:46:40.480 --> 00:46:52.400
So your cup is full, and so it's overflowing, and it's what's overflowing that we're supposed to be sharing and pouring into someone else, not the three drops in the bottom that are barely sustaining us.
00:46:52.639 --> 00:47:01.920
And so if my goal, if or if my point as your big sister is to help you realize that years before I realized it, then I will take that on.
00:47:02.159 --> 00:47:08.000
Um, but yeah, I think the social worker piece, I can I can see you doing that.
00:47:08.159 --> 00:47:11.840
When you told me when we met um for coffee, that was what you were doing.
00:47:11.920 --> 00:47:13.199
I was like, of course you are.
00:47:13.599 --> 00:47:14.559
Of course you are.
00:47:14.800 --> 00:47:15.599
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:47:15.920 --> 00:47:18.480
I and I no, go ahead.
00:47:18.719 --> 00:47:22.000
Um, I do, I I like it, I do love it.
00:47:22.159 --> 00:47:33.119
Um, I would like to either speak for foster children or veterans because those are the two points that I've lived and I know the severity of both.
00:47:33.360 --> 00:47:38.880
Um and a huge passion of mine is rescue animals.
00:47:39.199 --> 00:47:57.039
So my end goal is to hopefully be able to be kind of an independent organization, kind of like Casa is, where I have my own function as um a social worker, but also maybe working with a rescue or a shelter.
00:47:57.119 --> 00:48:03.039
So when we get new foster kids, that kind of like how veterans, when they have PTSD, they'll open up to a dog.
00:48:03.280 --> 00:48:09.519
I kind of want to be able to give that to little children as well, because adults are intimidating.
00:48:09.679 --> 00:48:15.679
You know, when I was seven years old and someone was making me draw where I was hurt, I didn't know what to do.
00:48:15.760 --> 00:48:18.400
I didn't know if I could talk to this person, you know.
00:48:18.719 --> 00:48:24.719
But when I'm home alone and I have my puppies and something's bothering me, I will talk to them like they can talk back.
00:48:24.880 --> 00:48:26.559
It's just it's just what we do.
00:48:26.719 --> 00:48:31.199
And so I feel like that would be an immense help for these children.
00:48:31.360 --> 00:48:39.280
And so eventually, hopefully, that's something I can can bring to these kids and and hopefully these rescue dogs too, because it'll help them just as much.
00:48:39.519 --> 00:48:41.440
So hopefully that's that's the end goal.
00:48:41.519 --> 00:48:42.159
That's what I want.
00:48:42.320 --> 00:48:42.639
We'll see.
00:48:42.960 --> 00:48:43.360
I love that.
00:48:44.559 --> 00:48:45.039
I love that.
00:48:45.119 --> 00:48:47.360
And you hadn't shared, I mean, I know your love for dogs.
00:48:47.519 --> 00:48:57.039
We knew I knew that, but I did you hadn't shared this piece with me, and I'm thrilled to hear it because when you were talking about maybe a caseworker, but then they get burnt out, and I don't want that to happen.
00:48:57.199 --> 00:49:03.360
And we've talked about your level of empathy being a risk factor um for you from that perspective.
00:49:03.519 --> 00:49:21.519
Um, I was literally thinking in my head, like an amazing role for you would be working with a nonprofit, um, working with you know victims of of crime, or like you were talking, like I was even thinking center of hope and the you know, the children there that have been exploited and whatnot.
00:49:21.760 --> 00:49:29.679
But um then for you to kind of bring in the the rescue animal, I mean, all we don't buy animals, we rescue animals.
00:49:29.920 --> 00:49:38.880
So I've got a cat named marshmallow that was a stray barn cat that you heard multiple times during today's podcast, I'm sure.
00:49:39.280 --> 00:49:48.719
Um, I have noble, which you've seen, who is an albino boxer that weighs 95 pounds and thinks he's a lap dog and has a massive underbite and drool.
00:49:49.280 --> 00:49:51.440
Um, and then I have Dolly.
00:49:51.519 --> 00:50:03.599
And you know, Dolly was I I'm I choose to believe that, you know, her owners, she was hit or something happened because she had a broken hip and they left her in the parking lot at the Humane Society.
00:50:03.760 --> 00:50:09.599
So I choose to believe that she was injured and they couldn't afford to help her, so they took her somewhere where she could get help.
00:50:09.679 --> 00:50:14.000
Um, and we adopted her, and she's 13 years old as a boxer.
00:50:14.400 --> 00:50:15.760
It's pretty incredible.
00:50:16.320 --> 00:50:22.960
But when you talk about, and I love that you said, and I just talk to them like they can talk back because I do it all the time.
00:50:23.119 --> 00:50:27.760
When we left this morning for school, AJ and I, I always tell him, bye babies, I'll be back.
00:50:28.000 --> 00:50:29.360
And AJ laughs.
00:50:29.519 --> 00:50:37.519
But this morning when we left for school, I walked out the door before him and I died laughing because he's like, Mama, I'll be back soon, guys.
00:50:37.679 --> 00:50:38.719
Have a good day.
00:50:39.039 --> 00:50:45.119
Um but in those moments, um, and I've shared with you, you know, some recent struggles.
00:50:45.199 --> 00:50:57.280
And so in those moments where you do have the quiet and you do have the peace and you have some time to process and say some things out loud that you need to say and share some thoughts.
00:50:57.519 --> 00:50:59.519
Um, you know, noble's the first one.
00:50:59.599 --> 00:51:03.039
If I cry, he just comes out of nowhere.
00:51:03.119 --> 00:51:11.199
It's like he's on the other side of the house and he hears me crying and he'll come and he crawls up and he's licking tears and snuggling and dollies at my feet, you know.
00:51:11.440 --> 00:51:19.840
I think the power of animals um is highly underrated and very underestimated.
00:51:20.000 --> 00:51:23.039
And so I'm girl, I'm in.
00:51:23.199 --> 00:51:26.960
Yeah, I'll volunteer, I'll, you know, I'll help do whatever I think.
00:51:27.039 --> 00:51:28.960
That's a phenomenal idea.
00:51:29.119 --> 00:51:32.719
And I think it would serve it would serve people very, very well.
00:51:32.880 --> 00:51:33.599
I love that.
00:51:33.840 --> 00:51:37.039
I'm I'm glad because that was my my first time seeing it out loud.
00:51:37.119 --> 00:51:47.280
I've just kind of kept it and I thought, oh, maybe someone will think this is not a good idea, or maybe it'll fail, or you know, but I'm I'm glad that you think it's a good idea.
00:51:47.840 --> 00:51:49.199
I think it's fantastic.
00:51:49.440 --> 00:51:49.840
Yeah.
00:51:50.079 --> 00:51:53.920
I used to tell people that my goal was to open a winery.
00:51:54.159 --> 00:52:02.960
Um, I know nothing about wine or grapes or anything else, but my goal was to open a winery that was also an animal rescue.
00:52:03.119 --> 00:52:07.679
And so the proceeds from the winery is what supported the animal rescue.
00:52:07.840 --> 00:52:13.360
So maybe we'll do a winery animal rescue slash, yeah.
00:52:13.599 --> 00:52:16.400
I think you know, do it together.
00:52:17.599 --> 00:52:19.280
I'm that's fantastic.
00:52:19.440 --> 00:52:20.239
I love it.
00:52:20.960 --> 00:52:23.920
Well, I know, um, and I want to congratulate you.
00:52:24.079 --> 00:52:29.760
I know you're getting ready, you're sketch, you're uh planning a wedding, which is a huge undertaking.
00:52:30.159 --> 00:52:34.079
Um but I love that you've got a great honeymoon coming up.
00:52:34.320 --> 00:52:35.360
Yes, amazing.
00:52:35.440 --> 00:52:37.760
Thanks to someone incredible.
00:52:38.159 --> 00:52:42.079
Well, and I I just I love where your future is headed.
00:52:42.159 --> 00:52:48.400
Um, I love the fact that you're so open and vulnerably raw about sharing what you've navigated.
00:52:48.559 --> 00:52:58.239
Um, I think there's so many people when times get tough and you know you're sitting there and it's really easy to think, why me?
00:52:58.400 --> 00:52:59.679
Or is it just me?
00:52:59.840 --> 00:53:03.119
Or am I the only one that can't figure out how to get out of this hole?
00:53:03.280 --> 00:53:16.480
And I think listening to stories like yours of perseverance and strength and grace and and navigating things that most of us couldn't even imagine navigating.
00:53:16.639 --> 00:53:19.920
Um, and then coming out of it the way that you are.
00:53:20.000 --> 00:53:22.719
And that doesn't mean um everything's perfect.
00:53:22.800 --> 00:53:27.199
And I know that you still have really hard days and really tough moments.
00:53:27.360 --> 00:53:41.519
And I think um that's also something to own and not gloss over because there's no, I say all the time, I wish I had a magic wand um for the people that I love and hell for myself, that we could just wave the magic wand and everything would be great.
00:53:41.760 --> 00:53:46.320
But it takes work and it takes willingness to go really deep within.
00:53:46.559 --> 00:53:56.480
And people like you are inspiring um for other people navigating things because it's like, well, if she can, then why not me?
00:53:56.719 --> 00:53:57.199
Exactly.
00:53:57.360 --> 00:54:01.199
And so that was my biggest goal for having you on today.
00:54:01.360 --> 00:54:24.079
Um, and I wanted to kind of finish up, and I know I told you I ask all my guests this, and I think from what you've shared so far, you've kind of talked to it a bit, but I wanted to ask you if there was one belief that you held for, you know, in the past that you either had to change your idea on or completely let go of to become the Maddie Jones you are today, what would that be?
00:54:25.280 --> 00:54:31.440
Um I actually have given this question some thought, like deep thought.
00:54:31.679 --> 00:54:47.280
Um I think for me personally, my biggest my biggest thing was it is okay to accept help because I very much was someone who was like, I have to do it, I have to do it myself.
00:54:47.440 --> 00:54:50.320
I can't bother anyone, I can't burden anyone, you know.
00:54:50.559 --> 00:55:02.719
You see what people what people go through and how you show up for other people, and you're like, wow, like life is really chaotic, you know, with yes, my life is chaotic, but so is theirs, you know, just as I'm going through stuff, so are they.
00:55:02.960 --> 00:55:16.719
And I think I really had to let go of that mindset because you people need people, you know, we we need each other, and if we can't rely on each other, then how are we gonna make it?
00:55:16.880 --> 00:55:20.559
You know, there's so that was that was one thing.
00:55:20.800 --> 00:55:30.719
I think I have hyper independence, and so my honey has actually been the one to kind of teach me like, let me do this, you know, I can do this, I can help you.
00:55:30.800 --> 00:55:36.400
You don't have to do this all by yourself, and so it's been very, very refreshing to see that.
00:55:36.559 --> 00:55:47.840
And I think another thing that I held really strongly was, and it might sound sound a little bit insensitive, um, but carrying people's weight.
00:55:48.079 --> 00:56:07.920
I had to start telling myself, especially when my friends were passing away, I kept telling myself, oh, well, if if I would have just had one more conversation, if I would have just took one more call, if I would have done this, if I would have done that, making myself hold guilt that wasn't mine to hold, because there was nothing I could have done.
00:56:08.239 --> 00:56:12.559
So harshly I had to learn, Maddie, why do you think you're that special?
00:56:12.719 --> 00:56:16.800
Why do you think you're special enough to have such a deep effect?
00:56:16.960 --> 00:56:23.119
It and it sound it does sound harsh, but I mean it in the sense of there's nothing I could have done.
00:56:23.360 --> 00:56:32.159
Their mind was made up, you did what you could, your relationship with those people mattered, but it wasn't enough, and that's okay.
00:56:32.960 --> 00:56:39.679
And that's that's both of those are still something that I'm I'm learning, but I I definitely learned them the hard ways, so yeah.
00:56:40.000 --> 00:56:43.599
Well, and I think so often we don't learn lessons from the wins.
00:56:43.760 --> 00:56:52.960
The wins are fun, and when things go great, it's fun, but the lessons come and the life lessons certainly come from the losses.
00:56:53.119 --> 00:56:55.599
Um, and I think I love both of them.
00:56:55.760 --> 00:56:59.280
Um, and I they're so you, first of all.
00:56:59.440 --> 00:57:05.360
Um, but I think the idea that I'm still learning that it's okay to ask for help.
00:57:05.519 --> 00:57:11.199
Um, you know, I had a friend the other day that, you know, reached out and she was like, Well, why didn't you tell me you were struggling?
00:57:11.360 --> 00:57:18.639
And I'm like, Well, because your plate is totally full and you have so much going on in your life, like I don't want my heavy to add to your heavy.
00:57:18.880 --> 00:57:19.119
Right.
00:57:19.280 --> 00:57:31.119
Um, and then I saw, and I think I sent it to you after we met, but I saw this thing and I love Simon Sinek and I saw um just a little clip of an interview that he did somewhere on some stage.
00:57:31.199 --> 00:57:36.880
And he was sharing that this friend of his had apparently really been having a very difficult time.
00:57:37.039 --> 00:57:44.079
And they met for a drink or coffee or whatever, and she shared and he said, Well, why didn't you call me and or reach out?
00:57:44.239 --> 00:57:51.199
And she said, Well, I did, and he scrolled back on his phone thinking, no, you didn't, and she'd send a message like, you know, hey, how's it going?
00:57:51.360 --> 00:57:55.840
Or what's going on, or some, you know, nonchalant nothing, and he missed it.
00:57:55.920 --> 00:57:58.079
He got busy and he didn't respond and whatever.
00:57:58.159 --> 00:58:06.000
And so he said, you know what, from now on, if either one of us needs something, you know, the code is do you have eight minutes or seven minutes?
00:58:06.079 --> 00:58:07.280
I forget the number.
00:58:07.519 --> 00:58:18.079
But the idea behind it was to ensure that one, if you're the person being reached out to, that if somebody really, really needs you, we can all give somebody five minutes.
00:58:18.239 --> 00:58:19.920
We can all give somebody eight minutes.
00:58:20.159 --> 00:58:30.159
And if you're the person that needs that, to also be confident enough or not confident, comfortable enough to say, hey, I'm really struggling.
00:58:30.239 --> 00:58:31.679
Do you have a couple minutes?
00:58:32.000 --> 00:58:34.079
Because we can't know.
00:58:34.320 --> 00:58:39.920
Um, and I think that feeds into what you shared with the second one is not carrying somebody else's, right?
00:58:40.000 --> 00:58:55.199
Not carrying the guilt, not we I think in life have to learn that we can support other people, we can guide other people, um, we can do everything in our power to to love them and support them, but we can't save somebody else.
00:58:55.440 --> 00:58:59.760
Um, the only way to save somebody is to help them figure out how to save themselves.
00:58:59.920 --> 00:59:08.480
And I think sometimes when, and especially in an extreme circumstance like this, we're left with that guilt of if I had only.
00:59:09.119 --> 00:59:19.599
And so learning to put down the weight, learning to set the suitcase that we're carrying full of stuff that isn't ours because we have enough that we're carrying for ourselves.
00:59:19.840 --> 00:59:22.079
I love both of those very, very much.
00:59:22.320 --> 00:59:25.119
You are far wise beyond your years, my friend.
00:59:25.760 --> 00:59:26.559
Well, thank you.
00:59:26.719 --> 00:59:27.920
I pride myself on that.
00:59:28.079 --> 00:59:28.880
I love that.
00:59:29.039 --> 00:59:32.320
And I I'm I appreciate you having me on your podcast today.
00:59:32.480 --> 00:59:38.559
Um, I'm I'm actually very honored because I find you very inspiring and I love everything you stand for.
00:59:38.719 --> 00:59:41.440
So um I am very honored to be here.
00:59:41.679 --> 00:59:52.880
And uh like you said, I I hope that someone can watch this and and resonate with it and feel like, okay, well, she did this and this is how it worked for her.
00:59:52.960 --> 01:00:00.079
So let me maybe do something different so I can end up somewhere different, or you know, go through it for yourself, you know, figure it out yourself.
01:00:00.159 --> 01:00:06.639
But I I hope this helped someone because I know um our relationship has surely helped me.
01:00:06.800 --> 01:00:09.280
So I'm just thank you for having me.
01:00:09.599 --> 01:00:10.960
No, it was my pleasure.
01:00:11.119 --> 01:00:15.199
I'm glad we finally got to get recorded um before you head out of town again.
01:00:15.599 --> 01:00:28.400
Um, but we will definitely have coffee when you're back, and I am so grateful um for the relationship, the friendship, the sisterhood, um, and for you being being willing to come on and share so openly with so many people.
01:00:28.719 --> 01:00:30.239
Of course, of course.
01:00:30.559 --> 01:00:31.199
All right.
01:00:31.519 --> 01:00:35.840
Well, everyone listening, I hope you got some nuggets from Miss Maddie today.
01:00:35.920 --> 01:00:37.840
Um, I can't imagine that you would not.
01:00:38.000 --> 01:00:41.280
She's an incredible human being that's continuing to do incredible things.
01:00:41.360 --> 01:00:43.599
And I wish her nothing but the best in the future.
01:00:43.840 --> 01:00:47.760
And until we meet again, I will see you next week.