Hilary Cairns: Thanks so much for being with us on Aging Athletically. If you like this episode, follow the show and share it with someone who's still out there getting after it or someone who might be inspired. You can find us on Instagram and YouTube under at Aging Athletically. If you have feedback, we'd love to hear from you. Send us a message there or email us at agingathletically at gmail.com. Until next time, keep training, keep competing and keep Aging Athletically. Welcome back to the Aging Athletically podcast. I'm Hillary Karens here with my co-host, Michael Wardian. On this show, we talk with athletes, experts and each other about what it takes to keep training, competing and performing at a high level as we get older. If you're here to be inspired, laugh a little and learn something along the way, you've come to the right place. Thanks for being with us. Today's just Michael and me and we're going to chat a bit about life's goings-ons or life going on or I don't know, whatever you, happening.
Michael Wardian: gonna catch up! We're gonna catch up!
Hilary Cairns: Yes, our training, maybe some reflections on the guests we've interviewed and whatever else emerges as we go along. So hello.
Michael Wardian: Hey man, it's good to see your face. I heard your voice because I listened to your solo and I was so impressed. So good work, man. That was to hear. I was on my run and I was like, I should probably hear what we talked about. And I was like, ⁓ man, that was such a good episode. Hillary crushed it. And so was our guest. Tammy. ⁓ Yeah, She was awesome, dude.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah.
Michael Wardian: it was like really inspiring and I learned all about different weight classes and bodybuilding versus power lifting and yeah, I thought was like a really cool, inspiring episode. So good work.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, thanks. I mean, I really enjoyed talking with her and definitely learned a lot about the sport period, but I just thought she was inspirational in some different ways that love that she said when she goes to ⁓ competitions that she always tries to find the oldest people there to talk with them and just derive inspiration while she's at these things and she's meeting people that way. ⁓
Michael Wardian: Yep.
Hilary Cairns: And then, and in being vegan and just, that's what seems so counter to is out there about muscle building and yeah.
Michael Wardian: Yes. Yeah. Although like there is like a pretty cool, I don't know if it's still, used to be on Netflix, there was like a vegan, vegan superpower, athletes or something. And they had like a bot, like the world's strongest man is vegan. And then they had a guy like my buddy Scott jerk was on there for like ultra running and they had, I don't know, a bunch of other like super high level vegan athletes. And you're like, Oh, that's cool. Like that's
Hilary Cairns: Okay. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: Like, yeah, definitely the stereotype of bodybuilding is not that, you know, it's like creatine and how, you know, protein shakes and stuff.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, forgot to ask her about supplements. I should have asked her that, because I would just be interested to what she takes, if she takes the standard things or anything different.
Michael Wardian: Yeah, yeah, I don't know. That would be a good follow up. Like you could do it like the New York Times where they have like one interview and then they call her back and then marry the two and put it into like one because I just heard that with Tucker Carlson. It was like a kind of interesting, like he's somebody that I don't really pay attention to that much. And the follow up after you know, they've talking for like an hour is kind of interesting.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah, I'm almost done with that podcast. sounds like, yeah.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ did you hear that one? Yeah, it was interesting. I, ⁓ yeah, somebody don't normally pay attention to, so yeah.
Hilary Cairns: Definitely interesting. Yeah, same. So what has been going on? I'm trying to think. The last time we talked was right after cherry blossom and you were getting ready to do the four date, was it four days and 200 or so miles, the MedStar and then go to Boston and then London. And so did you do all those things?
Michael Wardian: Yep. Yeah, we did. Yeah. So I did the, was called miles across MedStar. that was, it turned into, it was a, when we planned it, was a little over 200 miles, but it was kind of cool because we just had to hit some certain locations. So as we were running, we were able to find some routes and were able to shave some miles. So it ended up being 175 miles of running. So I think the first day we ran 67 miles, kind of from Leonardtown, Maryland, all the way to downtown DC. And then the second day we ran 51 miles DC to Columbia, Maryland, and then Columbia to Baltimore, and then kind of Baltimore to Timonium the last day. So it was 67, 51, 39, and then like 13.
Hilary Cairns: Okay.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ yeah, so it was, it was, was really great. And I got to, you know, hang out, ⁓ my two friends, Chris and Chris, ⁓ who were running with me. ⁓ for both those guys, it was kind of their biggest like journey run like that. and then we had a bunch of, heat to deal with. So it was like the 90 degree days. So it turned it, it made pretty hard. but we had great support. Like we got to go to like 15 MedStar.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah.
Michael Wardian: hospitals and PT clinics and kind of outpatient centers. So that was really neat. We got to meet a ⁓ of MedStar employees. We some testing along the way. So we did like VO2 max testing before and after, and then we did some gait analysis like before, during, and after. We did blood before, during, and after. And then like echocardiograms. They thought they found that my lungs were not working at full capacity, but then I had a pulmonary follow-up test and it seems like I'm in the normal range. So that was kind of cool, just to get all the testing done around it. And then there's gonna be some research and papers done with that. So that was really neat. But the big...
Hilary Cairns: Well, wait, when I saw you were running, did, as part of it, you posted something which looked incredibly dangerous. You were running like on the highway, I think going the wrong direction. Like you were running with traffic on the highway. I was like, can you guys find a different route? It looked very precarious.
Michael Wardian: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, there was there was some tricky sections, especially in like that that part. That was actually the safer side, safer side, ⁓ it had a bigger shoulder than the other side. So yeah, sometimes you have to, you know, run where it's the safest. there were some parts where you're like, this isn't my favorite. ⁓ But for the most part, it was it really, really neat. Like we were really
Hilary Cairns: Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: cared for. had two support vehicles, had Chris's parents there for most of days. And then we had a MedStar athletic trainer with us, different ones, Brandon and Mandy, along the way. So was really nice, And then we just had like all the support of the MedStar teams when we would get places. But yeah, was just, it was a long run then really hot. And then I finished that. Thursday, home for one day on Friday, caught up on some work and just like seeing the family and then flew to Boston on Saturday. Had a podcast with Runa, which was cool. really neat to like get to hang out with them. And then, you know, Boston is just like, I don't know, that's the race that got me into running. It was my 18th of finish official finish. think I've finished it actually like 24 times with all the pacing that hasn't counted. So I'm close to like, you know, quarter century there. and then I was pacing my buddy, Matt from the apparel sponsor that I have, ⁓ and he's trying to break two hours and 40 minutes for six years, ⁓ and he up doing it. So I got to be a part of that. So he ran 239.22 and dropped me, which was awesome. So I got dropped at like a mile like 22, 23. And I finished in 241 flat. So I'm pretty stoked after running 175 miles tapering for Boston. I was home for a couple of days, had some work deadlines and then flew to London on Thursday with my wife, Jennifer.
Hilary Cairns: Okay.
Michael Wardian: We flew like the red-eye, in on Friday, had kind of a pretty busy time. I got to meet my crew chief for the Pacific Crest Trail, Sharon and her ⁓ granddaughter Mia. I to meet up with them, got to do a shakeout run with my athlete Dylan from Achilles. He's the autistic athlete. then we had the race on Sunday. and then his goal was, to run kind of as fast as he could. He was on like PR pace, which is two 56. And then we kind of fell off the last like three or four miles and ended up at three Oh four 35. So that was his third fastest, um, marathon ever and his fastest, London. then of course it was cool to be there with the guys when they broke.
Hilary Cairns: Okay. Okay. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: two hours in the marathon and like even the third place guy was two hours flat. So like that was just cool to be part of history in a couple different ways. Like we were the biggest marathon ever also. like anyone that did London can download like a Guinness world record certificate saying you participated in like the biggest marathon in the world. ⁓ they just did like a bad ass job. Like it's just like tons of fans, great course, great support.
Hilary Cairns: Okay. I didn't realize that.
Michael Wardian: fast course, somehow like mostly shaded. I don't understand how like it was shady. it's kind of cool too, cause it starts in like three or four different places. And so you kind of like go in and then at like ⁓ 5k, everyone kind marries up. So that's kind of cool to just see the logistics involved. ⁓ no, it's, it's, you get assigned by like what time they think you're going to finish. So they kind of keep.
Hilary Cairns: and you just get assigned randomly. Okay.
Michael Wardian: certain athletes in different places. We were athletes with disabilities. So we were starting between wave one and wave two. And then I had a super tight turnaround. Like the race started at 9.36 and we had a four o'clock flight. So we got done around like one and then had to get back from the finish to the hotel and then get to the airport and then fly home. So that was... It was tricky and tight, but we made it. ⁓
Hilary Cairns: Okay. Did you, were you telling Dylan that during it? It's like, we can't slow down and no, it sounds like he did great. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: No, no, no, no, no, I mean, I told him that I had to leave kind of quickly at the end. It was funny because we like jumped in like pretty common, you know, London blacktop cab to get back. And then the guy, Roy, the cabbie, like waited outside while I changed clothes and picked up Jennifer. And then he took us to the airport too. So like, it was pretty funny. Like he ended up like taking me from the race to the hotel and dropping Dylan off and then taken me to the airport. ⁓ yeah, not cheap, but it got us where we needed to go. Yeah. ⁓
Hilary Cairns: Okay. You said you've done Boston 18 times. When was the last time you raced it on your own? Have you pacing?
Michael Wardian: I've been pacing it for probably the last like or eight years. ⁓ it's probably been that long since I've ⁓ lined up for myself.
Hilary Cairns: Okay. I find it to be, I I just, did the hundredth anniversary, which was like 1996, I believe. pretty sure it was when they, was much bigger than usual. ⁓ want to sit there. ⁓ race killed my quads. I mean, if I were to do that race again, I would train so differently. I didn't, I just didn't know that you needed to really train the downhills. ⁓ My quads hurt so after that.
Michael Wardian: Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, so what have you been doing since cherry blossom then? So like I've been rattling off things, but like I didn't ask you what you've been up to.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. I've been doing more basic things. Yeah. So kind of a little bit. I feel like I'm cramming for Eagle Man, the Half Ironman, which in June, but I'm also doing another, I'm doing a High Rocks next week. I'm going to Ottawa on Monday for a High Rocks race that's at the end of the week next week. So just doing that. mean, I've started getting outside on my bike, on the gravel. ⁓
Michael Wardian: Ooh, yeah. Okay.
Hilary Cairns: So I've done, think, maybe two of those rides. So that's been good. And some, some high rocks cramming too. I don't tend to train super for high rocks, meaning, there's ⁓ ergs and stuff you do for high rocks. And I don't tend to really train those. just like, I get enough through my other things. But I did like five minutes of erg two days ago. Yeah. ⁓
Michael Wardian: Okay. So almost 2k.
Hilary Cairns: Well, it's funny because the Ergs are probably one of my strongest stations and I never train. I don't train it at all. But I think it's just, it's all the other stuff. So, I've been doing that.
Michael Wardian: That's cool. mean, if you're good at it, like, yeah, that's one thing that you can on having in your back pocket. That's nice.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, well, it's super short too. mean, it's, you know, it literally takes, I want to say like four and a half minutes. It's a thousand. It's only a thousand. Yeah. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: Is it a 2K? ⁓ yeah, ⁓ that's not. ⁓ I thought it was a 2K. 2K is actually really hard. A thousand. I mean, it's hard when you're going all out, but it's like, yeah, it's over pretty quick. Is that what it is on the SkiErg also? A thousand? ⁓ wow.
Hilary Cairns: No. Yeah, no I- ⁓ I find I'm faster the regular erg than the ski erg. I don't know, that's probably true for most people. I'm not positive about that, but I think the, the regular erg is more legs and the ski erg is more arms. So, yeah.
Michael Wardian: yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, that's cool. I, for some reason in my head, I thought it was, um, 2K. Um, okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 2K, I mean, that's like doing an all-out mile, I feel like.
Hilary Cairns: Now, it's very short, so. Yeah, and honestly, most people use those times to relax a little bit. mean, or they think, I don't personally, trying to go really hard, but I think it's harder to run off of the things than you would think. And you can really gas yourself, especially the ski org is the first one. And if you go really hard on that, you can mess up the whole race because you, you know, you're so, you're breathing so hard. you know, but remember you're sprinting in between or you're close to sprinting. mean, you're probably running, don't know, probably like 10K pace, I would say, around for the intervals in between, so it's pretty hard effort.
Michael Wardian: Yeah. And those are all a kilometer also, right? Yeah.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, yeah, which reminds me, you they just announced that there's another one in DC in September. I think there are still open slots. maybe look into it. ⁓ okay, okay. you were aware.
Michael Wardian: I know, I'm not gonna be here. I'm gonna be on the PCT. yeah, buddy was trying to get me to do it. And I was like, ⁓ that would be fun, but I'm not around. ⁓ least I don't think I will be. I think it'll be like right, it's the first couple of weekends or something.
Hilary Cairns: Okay. Yeah. I think it's Labor Day weekend.
Michael Wardian: Yeah, so I'll definitely be on the trail by so yeah. Yeah, I know it's cool. It's cool. I'm fine with that. I'm so about the PCT coming up ⁓ and then ⁓ getting ready my rowing afterwards. So I'll be doing a lot of erging and lot of like skill training around that once the PCT is done.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah, I wonder about when you're rowing on the ocean, I mean, how similar it really is to erging. I would think it's not, you think it's a lot? Okay.
Michael Wardian: I think it's pretty similar, I think it's just conditioning your back and your butt your core and everything. ⁓ But I think, yeah, it's definitely gonna be different, but I think it's a similar kind of setup with a tray that you move back and forth. ⁓ And then I think
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Okay, okay.
Michael Wardian: seems to me like Most people don't train on the Most people are training on ergs and then they do extended stints. plan is to do two, kind of like three week stints in the UK with the boat that I buy. And that's where I'll get the ocean training, but the base training will be on erg pretty much. And then hopefully on the water with Potomac Boat Club and...
Hilary Cairns: Okay. Okay.
Michael Wardian: W and L team. ⁓ my plan if everything goes well.
Hilary Cairns: Okay. Yeah, during COVID, I my foot right at the beginning. think I told you that I had it's called a Jones fracture. So I fractured my foot literally like two weeks into So I knew I wasn't going to be able to run. The pools were all closing. So we ordered as did many people. So took a while get to us, I believe, but we ordered an erg and it was the only thing that I could do because foot was in a boot, but I wasn't allowed to put any weight on it while it was healing and I could jimmy erg to be able to do the erg. So I did it, I did it just an extensive, crazy of time. So I think that's probably why I don't train anymore on it because I have so much just, it's kind awful. Yeah. But my hands, my gosh, I had blisters all over my hands. So hopefully your coach is going to have thoughts on how to minimize that with salt water and.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ Yeah. muscle memory. Actually, I want the blisters. The blisters are good. It's kind of like getting blisters on my feet or like, you know, covered in blisters. So like that like helps protect your hands, but like, that they become like your feet, right? So like when we're doing like a run across the country or journey run, like your feet are like your most important asset, like, and I feel like that's how you your hands and your back and those kind of muscles will be important to keep straight for the for the rowing. But It'll be an adventure to kind of learn all those skills yeah, and then get to try them out in real life.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. So you're training right now, guess to get ready for the PCT or, mean, are you training specifically for your next adventure are you just kind of do the same things that you've been doing or how do you alter things? ⁓
Michael Wardian: Yeah, no, I definitely like on Sunday I did a mountain run. I drove out to Shenandoah with our dog bash and we did 13 miles. the plan was to do like a marathon and then I downloaded the file to my my watch, but for some reason it didn't download the actual map. It downloaded the GPX file, but it said I didn't have the map or something. So anyhow, I was smart enough to like take a picture of the the route the trails. And so I was kind of up there and I'd done the run before and then I was just kind of messing around. then I had a championship lacrosse game last night for men's league. And I was like, like, yeah, but I was like, I don't want to miss it. Be getting lost in the mountains. so yeah, I cut it short. So we ended up doing 13, which was bash his longest run. And I wanted to see also like how he would recover and he's, he's totally fine. So like I definitely. sure that he can go further, but it was kind of like a test on that. But I got in like, think 3,300 feet of vert, which is like a fair amount, but I was looking for more like six to 8,000 feet. So like, I'll be doing like stuff like that. And then my buddy, Tom and I, I'll start doing like step ups and I've been wearing my weight vest around, just gonna get the strength down. And then right now I've been testing like different packs that I'm gonna be either purchasing or like trying to get just getting like dialing in kind of like gear and like making sure I have the strength for carrying weight because I'll have some long times by myself where I'm going to be having to carry like a tent. So like, I got to start doing all that like buying a tent. I think I have a nice sleeping pad, but I think it's more a bikepacking pad. So I'll probably need to get like a, like a hiking like type of pad for when I have to camp out overnight. Cause there's some sections that are long, like 120, 130 miles between when I can see my crew chief. So I'll have like those sections where I just go in with a big rucksack and get to camp out overnight, which will be cool.
Hilary Cairns: Okay. Okay.
Michael Wardian: Yeah, so getting ready for that. And then I've been doing some faster stuff. Like I also won the park run ⁓ on Saturday. So trying to get my legs ready. And then I just signed up for the old Dominion 100 miler. I think I'm 10th on the wait list. That's like June 5th. then I'm going be putting on the Dewey Beach 100 miler again on June 20th. So that'll just be like one mile down, one mile back Dewey Beach. So that'll be fun. So I have like basically 200 milers. I get into the old Dominion race, if not, I'll do something long. So I want to get some kind of long efforts in, but also some speed faster stuff. So it'll be a kind of a mix of like long stuff and then like trying to get leg turnover going.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, I mean the turnover stuff, just think about that myself too, is I do like kind of long slower things, but I feel like I have got to keep doing the faster stuff or it's just all gonna poof go away. But maybe that's not right. When you go back and did the, when you did the 5K, it feel like a shock to your legs? I mean, it's like you've been running that slow, but.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ no, not at all. mean, I feel like I was super fit. I did a workout, a CrossFit workout right before the, 5k and then just right from the workout to the 5k. So I didn't, I didn't like really rest or anything. And I still ran like 17, 30, 38, like 544 pace. So like, I think I could have been, faster, but then, you that really defeats the purpose. Like the point is to like,
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: get legs turning over when they're tired. ⁓ And yeah, it was nice that I still ended up winning. Like it would have been kind of annoying had I lost by like five seconds or something, cause I did a workout ahead of time, but didn't, so it good. ⁓ And then it'll fun. Like when I go to the beach, there's like a every, every Saturday and Sunday. So
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Okay.
Michael Wardian: I'll be getting into those quite a bit. And then I am like getting back into pickleball. like I did drilling session my today try to just get back into pickleball. Like every time I go now, I feel like my friends are getting so much better. So I need to like practice to like be able to play with them. So I practice so that I can. ⁓
Hilary Cairns: wrong.
Michael Wardian: like not be the worst guy on the court. like it felt really good to get some touches with the pickleball paddle also. ⁓ And then I start bocce. start men's league bocce on Wednesday night. the last time we played, were the. champions of bocce so I'm excited about ⁓ so I have tomorrow night Yeah
Hilary Cairns: Okay, well wasn't it, Lyddiard or whatever who told you that like if you want to be the best at one of these things you should like pick one? Because I'm thinking you got, just kind of keep adding to it. You didn't even mention your chess endeavors too, ⁓ so. ⁓
Michael Wardian: Yeah, yeah, yeah. He did say that. Yeah, now I've been doing that quite a bit. finally back up to, well, what happens is when I do all the running stuff, I start playing really bad chess. And so I dropped like 250 points and now I've finally like, back up to like close to where I was before like I had all those runs because I just get careless and dumb when I'm tired in chess and then I get punished. is what should happen and it does ⁓ so
Hilary Cairns: make sense.
Michael Wardian: what feels different in your training between now and 10 to 15 years ago?
Hilary Cairns: I feel quite as strong biking as I did then, but think I was just biking harder. think I probably need to be a little bit more. focused in the training if I want to be able to bike particularly at the level that I was before I just need to just decide I'm gonna ⁓ that. But definitely overall in terms of training, a more strength work. I think I used to just do, you know, maybe 20 minutes of a couple of different arm things which didn't really have purpose. It was sort of like, I should just make sure that my upper body is relatively strong. So I'll do like some pull-ups and some push-ups and you know, some
Michael Wardian: Okay.
Hilary Cairns: like curls. But now, you know, I'm really focused on like trying to make sure that my shoulders are strong, you know, specifically for some of the high rocks things. So probably the strength is, is different. Swimming, I actually probably take a little more rest than I used to in terms of time between intervals. then I think I probably go a little bit harder during the intervals themselves.
Michael Wardian: Okay. Like terms of heart rate or in terms of like pace. think you're faster now than you were or you just have to work harder. ⁓
Hilary Cairns: I'm pretty much the same. I do have to work a little bit harder to be the same pace, overall I think the effort is a bit harder in the interval itself. So taking a little more rest. But in terms of running, ⁓ think more relaxed than used to be about everything. Just like my perspective shifted a bit. I still wanna be competitive and have goals, but...
Michael Wardian: Yeah.
Hilary Cairns: In the moments, just feel like I have perspective on what I'm doing. I'm like, this is for fun. I get to do this. I'm so lucky that my body's letting me do these things. I so fortunate. I mean, I know so many people who are no longer able to run or they're, you know, they're hurt And so the fact that I don't have that and the fact that sure, I may be a little bit slower than I was before, but I know that my effort is actually the same. I know I'm working just as hard.
Michael Wardian: Yeah.
Hilary Cairns: And to be able to do that feels very similar.
Michael Wardian: Yeah, that's cool. Yeah. ⁓ I mean, I feel like it's like, I mean, it was mostly 15 years ago. It mostly just run training for the most part. Like, and I do a lot of different things now and I less miles, but I think I do more other things that more than makes up for the less miles. And I'd say my times are a bit slower. but yeah, it's,
Hilary Cairns: What about your training? Yeah.
Michael Wardian: doesn't really bother me because like I have the ability to do like, these huge projects and like, I wouldn't want to not do those to be a couple of minutes faster. ⁓
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Well, yeah, and do you think the variety, I because I feel like one of the reasons why I don't tend to get injured, I mean, yes, I've had a couple of significant injuries, but for the most part would say I'm relatively healthy. I think a lot of it is just the variety of things that I do. I'm not running every day. I'm not biking every day. You know, I'm really, I really am mixing things up. Do you feel like that's changed for you? that since you're not running in the same ways that you were?
Michael Wardian: Well, I mean, I am running every day. It's just not the same like intensity or distance, I would say. ⁓ But it's not like, ⁓ I'm going to the track on Tuesday for a track workout or something like that, or a tempo run or like, I rarely do those now. Like that's something that I actually want to get back into. So I'm hoping like, maybe when our son comes home, he doesn't even know this yet. But I was hoping maybe he would want to go.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah. Welcome home. We're going to go do workouts.
Michael Wardian: go to the track with me because he does some, yeah, yeah, you wanna be my training partner? ⁓ but yeah, I feel like I wanna back to the track and just try to get a little bit faster. I am a little motivated. Nick took my record ⁓ for ⁓ and pretty sure I could get that right now. And I've been trying to find a ⁓ 50K to and it's like surprisingly hard. So like, I feel like maybe I'll try to create one.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah.
Michael Wardian: to try to get that. But now, yeah, I can't find one I have the to get to, ⁓ at least.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Well, I was just going to say one other thing that different from for me from 15 years ago. I had a lot of hamstring stuff really over my running history and triathlon history and in the last five years or so because I ⁓ been doing more concerted lifting, I think I've strengthened my ham. Yes.
Michael Wardian: Yeah, 100%. Yeah. So like, that's something bigger, like between 10 and 15 years ago, I didn't work out with a personal trainer and I wasn't doing CrossFit until the pandemic with my buddy Tom. So like both those things. And then I'm still doing the hundred, how are your hundred burpees a day? Are you still doing those? ⁓
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. I've kind of, well yeah, I've shifted to every other day. Yeah, and sometimes every other day I'll do 150 or 200, but yeah, so cumulatively it may still be close, but I shifted away a little bit. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: It's hard, dude. It's hard. It's like, feel like the hardest part is like a lot of things. It's like getting started. The first like 10 feel really bad. And I feel like I always feel bad until I get to like 50. And then I'm like, now I'm on the downhill.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah, I do really like them a lot. What I'm hoping is, if ⁓ my time is not faster in high rocks next week, like, something is wrong. Because I have done so many burpees. That better be a faster station for me.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ my gosh, well should practice them where you have to jump, right? not jumping not when you're doing your 100.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, ⁓ ⁓ all different ways. So I'll do some of them, I'll do like the high rocks burpees, mainly I do just straight up regular burpees with full push up, full jump forward and jump up when I'm doing the 100, but then sometimes I'll shift and I'll do the jump forward. Either way, should have done something.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ okay. Okay. Okay. ⁓ you're doing way harder burpees than me. I do like step back burpees. Like I've been doing them forever. I just get them done. yeah, I do like crossfit burpees where your chest just touches. Yes. Yes. ⁓ 100%.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Just flop to the ground. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Do you want to reflect at all on any of the guests that we've had?
Michael Wardian: Cool. I like them all, man. I think we've had really good people on. was really impressed with your Tammy interview. I thought that was really great. we're still older athletes that are still getting after it. I mean, that's the cool part to me is like, we haven't given up on so chasing dreams. Right. And so I think that's important. So yeah.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah. I really liked listening again to Gene's interview because it had been a while we ended up delaying publishing his interview because for a variety of reasons. And I just thought he was really insightful and I just really love his kind of life, his outlook. talking about injury and how he'll be better on the other end of it and just such a I thought incredible attitude toward life. So I feel like I'm learning a little bit from each person who comes. like a class. get a things that are very solid takeaways from each one. And so I appreciate that.
Michael Wardian: Yeah, for sure. Yeah, I mean, I feel like that's how it is in so many things, right? It's like you get, you you listen to a lot of stuff and you find something that resonates with you and then hopefully take action on it. I mean, that's the big thing, right? Like have all this stuff going on around, but like, you know, if you can get one thing from every person you meet, that you get a lot of information, you become a better person. the goal.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. And we're about to start our expert series remember we introduced the podcast and say we're talking to experts. We have yet to have one, but we're gonna this week or by time this comes out, it'd be next week, have our first expert. So be, I think, very insightful. Learn some stuff getting older and wisdom from people who aren't just winging it. ⁓
Michael Wardian: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That'll be fun, man. what it's all about. someone listening is in ⁓ 40s or ⁓ 50s and to stay competitive, what's something you'd tell them focus on now? Your turn.
Hilary Cairns: I mean, think the starting point is what is your goal? Like what are you, not like what are you trying achieve, but what's your reason for wanting to continue in sports or start something new? is the motivator and making, if you have that core what you're always going back to like, why am I doing this? I'm doing this. to be healthy. I'm doing this to be able to see my grandchildren and run around with them. I'm doing it because I want to challenge myself to do something new. If you have that why reason that you're doing it, you can always go back to that. I think that's a good starting point. And one, which at least I revisit a lot. And I feel like I've been revisiting it much more actually since we've started having these conversations, just really been thinking about why do I do this? What is it that motivates me? can ⁓ learn how other people are approaching things and maybe I want to integrate some of that thinking into my why for doing things. So.
Michael Wardian: Yeah, I mean, I think that's good. think people might want something like more takeaway. Like, feel like, like, I feel like, ⁓ that's think sometimes it's just good to do hard things. like, I'm reading that Steve Magnus book, right? I feel like you talking about that, right? Like, do hard things. Like, I'm listening to that right now.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, like specifically. not this mushy, gushy stuff. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: I think that there's a lot of value in just, you know, putting yourself in awkward, tough circumstances and trying to figure your way through it. And, and you learn a lot about, I I've said this on a number of podcasts, but there's the person you think you are, and then there's the person you actually are. And then, you know, those things are not always the same. And like a long event or ⁓ challenging experience, like that'll show you who you are. like sometimes it's not who you think you are. But doesn't mean that you can't be that person. You're just not there yet, right? And so I think that's what I love about these type of adventures and challenges is that you do get to get stripped down your core and your base and you learn a lot about who you are and where you are.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah.
Michael Wardian: that's, think, good thing. But I would say like biggest takeaway thing ⁓ would be 100 burpees. I feel like that's changed the most impact for me. And it was somebody was asking me like, what did you, what have you gained from the 100 burpees? I feel like it's like the discipline to do something hard every day. doesn't take that long. So it's like short. It's made me a lot stronger, like just like full body ⁓ workout.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah.
Michael Wardian: more flexible, feel like, more range of motion. Yeah, so like that would be my thing. I would challenge people to like 100 burpees a day and if you can't do 100, start with 50. Don't make it 10 because 10 is way too easy. would say got to be, yeah, or cap it at 10 minutes. Like that sometimes that's what Tom and I will do if we like.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah.
Michael Wardian: Just want to get after it. We'll cap it at like seven minutes and see how many you can do in seven minutes, which is tough. That's like nonstop. But I'd say most of the time I get it done in under 15, 20 minutes. And that's like slow rolling.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, this is not totally related, but I'm wondering, is part of what you do, you thinking about yourself as a parent and the example that you're setting for your kids?
Michael Wardian: mean, somewhat. I'd like to think that but like, they've seen ⁓ doing this forever. don't think it like, doesn't move the needle them that much or at least like, I feel like they think it's cool. But, and I hope that they recognize that, you it's not something that everyone does, but I think that they've just been around it so long. They're just like, ⁓ yeah, that's what my dad does.
Hilary Cairns: need our kids the podcast at some point. And just find like, what is it like to be raised by these people? ⁓
Michael Wardian: Yeah, well, it's funny somebody who was like, ⁓ your dogs are so lucky. Yeah, and then one of my pickleball friends is like, is that lucky? Like, do you want to be the dog that has to go run all these miles with him and like do all this like crazy stuff? And so yeah, mean, I guess it goes both ways. And we talked about this before we got on but like not to be a downer, but we lost one of our dogs.
Hilary Cairns: always have someone to run with.
Michael Wardian: Rosie and that's been going on too. So that's been very sad and a very challenging thing for our family at the moment. yeah it's been yeah that's been sad.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah, I'm so sorry. And the dog has a sibling, right? I mean, not a literal sibling, have two, okay. ⁓
Michael Wardian: Yeah, thank you. Yeah, we had two V's, Rosey and Bash and Sebastian or Bash is six. So he's he's been all the love But yeah, it's just feels like the the is less full ⁓ Which I you get with like kids leaving like that kind of stuff. It's like it's just not as not as noisy and rambunctious as it normally is
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, I'm sorry.
Michael Wardian: Nah, it's okay.
Hilary Cairns: Well that was the, I think we were potentially going to talk about a high and a low or something that's happened to us recently. That definitely goes in the low category.
Michael Wardian: Well That was definitely a low. lowest that for me that you can get. also like, know, it's we talked about this, but it's part of being a dog owner and I hate that part. So ⁓ what about you? Do you have any highs or lows?
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Well, not really running or training related highs. So do some consulting I worked for the DC for city government for a really long time. And now I do some consulting, but I have a little more time on my hands these days. And so I've started working at a daycare center because ⁓ I just love little kids.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ that's fun.
Hilary Cairns: I just miss that time so much that I had with my own children. So my high is that I spend about like 15 or 20 hours working at a daycare center. And it just, these little one and two year olds are just the sweetest possible things. mean, to be experiencing life through their eyes is, you you have to be totally focused on them, not thinking about other things. I'm focused on.
Michael Wardian: ⁓
Hilary Cairns: You know, the cow says moo, the horse says nay. You know, so I'm doing all this stuff for a couple hours. And I love it. Yeah. So that's been, it's just been really fun. And I'll.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ my gosh, man, I'm so glad that you found something that you love like that.
Hilary Cairns: and a great distraction from the world. to just find a place to be where you can get away from things that don't great around you is to spend time with little children and just be present for them.
Michael Wardian: Yeah, yeah, Yeah, that's great. Yeah, I feel like that about my running people's dogs. It's like the coolest job that I get to do. And it's like, makes me happy every time. yeah, I love it.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. And they're probably like little kids too. They get so excited when Michael comes around. mean, you know, there's nothing like walking into a ⁓ little group of one and two year olds who are like, up, up. They want me to pick them up. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: Yeah! Yeah, Dude, it's the best. good. I'm glad you have that. So no lows for you then?
Hilary Cairns: Just a little fatigued. Yeah, I'm a little fatigued. That would be my low. I've learned that when I get a little fatigued, if I just back off for a couple days, the fatigue will ease. So... No magic potions. No, it's called just... No, but we would, wouldn't we? It looks tasty.
Michael Wardian: That's cool. So no like special powders or potions or anything. You're not selling AG1 yet? You
Hilary Cairns: I've never had it, but it probably, ⁓ it's not? ⁓ okay. Yeah, well, maybe we get sponsored by something that tastes really, really good.
Michael Wardian: It's not it's not I've had it ⁓ You know what had that is good? ⁓ like a vegan plant protein Kachava, right?
Hilary Cairns: Does it have chocolate? Does it have chocolate in it?
Michael Wardian: I hate chocolate, but yeah, they do have a chocolate one. Yeah, I hate it. Like, yeah, it's like, yeah, I don't like it at all.
Hilary Cairns: What? Wait, any, all chocolate? Oh my gosh, I don't have a day that goes by where I don't have at least like one candy bar. yeah, I haven't had a day without one.
Michael Wardian: really? a ca- like a peanut butter or what? Yeah, kachava is the thing. Kachava. Yeah. ⁓ like K-A-C-H-A-V-A. Yeah, that stuff is actually, I've had it a couple times, it's pretty good. ⁓ I mean they have a chocolate,
Hilary Cairns: Interesting. No, just like chocolate. Kachava, okay. But what's the flavor?
Michael Wardian: they have an acai, they have matcha. I feel like they just have like a neutral, like a vanilla or something.
Hilary Cairns: Maybe you have some kind of genetic defect. How do you know that you don't like chocolate? I don't understand. Is that possible? you ⁓ Do your kids like it? ⁓
Michael Wardian: What? Yeah, There's other people that don't like chocolate. Like everyone feel like people should come in the comments. Like, yeah, my kids, everyone else likes chocolate. Yeah, they have a super food blend and a mega blend. Yeah, they have all different flavors.
Hilary Cairns: They do, okay. All right, I'll give that a try and then we can do some outreach. But not for the chocolate. ⁓ well then, okay.
Michael Wardian: It's pretty expensive though. It's pretty expensive. Yeah, somebody I know gave me scratch. there's all kinds of good stuff like tailwind scratch, all that kind of stuff. Yeah, so. But I mean, I usually I just made my own. Like I work with like big spoon roasters and they make like nut butter. So I'll just make smoothies with their stuff. ⁓ And then it's just like, you know,
Hilary Cairns: Yeah.
Michael Wardian: berries from Whole Foods that kind of stuff. Bananas.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, I make a lot of bars, just oats and flax and chia and peanut butter chocolate chips. ⁓ But ⁓ to to, used to make them when our kids were really young too, because it just felt insanely expensive to purchase wrapped bars that you can make for much cheaper, as much as I like the wrapped bars, but.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ that's cool. Yeah, there you go. Like, yeah, yeah.
Hilary Cairns: When I'm feeling like I want to save money, I just make loads of these bars that are super easy to make.
Michael Wardian: Dude, that's cool. Yeah, we like started making our own granola too and that's fun and it tastes really good.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: But yeah, then I've got, stoked oats. I just make oatmeal and just like, I'll have that. My wife always makes fun of me though. Like I'll make some in the morning and then not eat it until like after dinner or something. She's like, that's just been sitting around all day. I'm like, I know, it's just aging. It's overnight oats, but never makes it overnight. ⁓
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. That sounds yummy to me.
Michael Wardian: is good. ⁓
Hilary Cairns: All right, so what's next for you? I'm trying think of what, I'm going to Ottawa next week. We got a couple interviews this week.
Michael Wardian: Yeah, you've got your high I forgot to say, I said FKT also in ⁓ rocks. So that ⁓ fun. That was in between all those races and the MedStar thing. ⁓
Hilary Cairns: And was that like, all running or was it like, had to hockey, hockey,
Michael Wardian: It was all running. It's only like a half up with a thousand feet of climbing. it's a mile and a half down. So I did it in like 22.51. So yeah, it was fast. It's just like boom, straight up, straight down. Yeah. So that was fun.
Hilary Cairns: Wow. We had another record broken in our house. So I guess since I can't talk about my own records, our daughter broke the family 10K record last weekend. Yeah. She ran Pike's Peak. Yeah, it is fast, but yeah, she ran 34, 30. Yeah. Yeah. So she's like getting ready for grandma's.
Michael Wardian: Ooh, where was that? ⁓ that one's super fast. Hell yeah. Yeah, yeah. Let's go!
Hilary Cairns: marathon, is in June. So I'm going to go to grandma's too, because my parents are from Minnesota. So my whole family's in Minnesota, but they want to go watch, even though I don't think it's a great viewing course, but anyway, I'm going to tote around like the grandparents to watch her run grandma's.
Michael Wardian: Okay. It is not. maybe it's easy to get around, but it's like a point to point, as you know. So you could probably see her in halfway and then probably get back for the finish.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah, I think it's gonna be something like that, so.
Michael Wardian: that's what like that's where my PR is from. That's like a fast course man. ⁓ I mean if you get the day, yeah. Yeah, ⁓ man, I hope she has a great race. She's looking for like a OT qualifier or.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, yeah, it should be good. Yeah, yeah, should be good. ⁓ but Not yet. I mean, I think in the future, but probably 240. I think between 240 and 237. Yeah. And I think for now, only run one marathon, she ran 250. And it's like, it's a big leap to go from 250 to 240. Like, let's just take it a step at a time.
Michael Wardian: And what does she need to run, 236? Yeah. Is she gonna be cramming in like 120 grams of carbs an hour?
Hilary Cairns: I don't, she's definitely practicing with a lot of different gels. So yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ that's cool. Okay. ⁓ good, man. I hope she has a great race. ⁓ Well, I've got a trip for Teva out Zion for a media trip. So that's coming up next week. And then at the end of next week, I'll be at the River Rock races down in Richmond. So I'll be down there racing the half in the And then I'm also on a panel. So that'll be really fun my buddy Kyle. And like it's part of organization so people can come see that. So that'll be like ⁓ one o'clock Saturday the 16th 15th. So next Saturday. the Now, so I'll go to Zion until, so I'll go ⁓ Zion.
Hilary Cairns: And that's ⁓ Zion.
Michael Wardian: May 11th through the 14th and then I fly home on the 14th and I'll go down to Richmond on the ⁓ 15th and then I'll race the 16th and ⁓ 17th and then I'll be and I'll be ⁓ trying to get ready. Hopefully I'll hear on the old Dominion miler if I get him off the wait list. If not, I'll do some kind of big adventure on my own.
Hilary Cairns: Okay. Okay.
Michael Wardian: kind of my like I want to run from the Monument to New York's Times Square. So that's like a 200 and 270 mile run. So that's kind of like something that I've been Trying to out like when I can do so, if I can't do Old Dominion, maybe I Spend the weekend doing that run
Hilary Cairns: have you been to Zion before? Or your first time? Okay, so.
Michael Wardian: I have, I've been a couple of times and I've run across it then I used to have the FKT for the Narrows which is like this really cool like you run in water and you like do all this stuff and then my teammate Aaron beat my record so we're gonna be out there together so it's gonna be fun like trash talking each other. ⁓
Hilary Cairns: I just Utah is so that's so great. We're actually just we're planning a trip to Saint George next. So this coming summer and which is right near Zion so.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ good! Okay. Yeah, that'll be fun. Yeah, have you been before or no?
Hilary Cairns: I've been to Moab and Arches National Park that's there. ⁓ so amazing.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ cool, yeah yeah. Yeah, yeah, I know, but that's what people say about Shenandoah and I feel like that's true. Like every time I go to Shenandoah, I'm like, wow, it's just like I was out there. Oh yeah, a hundred percent. Yeah, yeah. But still beautiful. All right.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, yeah, but so different. So, so different. Yeah, yeah, very cool. Yeah. right.
Michael Wardian: gonna catch up! We're gonna catch up!
Hilary Cairns: Yes, our training, maybe some reflections on the guests we've interviewed and whatever else emerges as we go along. So hello.
Michael Wardian: Hey man, it's good to see your face. I heard your voice because I listened to your solo and I was so impressed. So good work, man. That was to hear. I was on my run and I was like, I should probably hear what we talked about. And I was like, ⁓ man, that was such a good episode. Hillary crushed it. And so was our guest. Tammy. ⁓ Yeah, She was awesome, dude.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah.
Michael Wardian: it was like really inspiring and I learned all about different weight classes and bodybuilding versus power lifting and yeah, I thought was like a really cool, inspiring episode. So good work.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, thanks. I mean, I really enjoyed talking with her and definitely learned a lot about the sport period, but I just thought she was inspirational in some different ways that love that she said when she goes to ⁓ competitions that she always tries to find the oldest people there to talk with them and just derive inspiration while she's at these things and she's meeting people that way. ⁓
Michael Wardian: Yep.
Hilary Cairns: And then, and in being vegan and just, that's what seems so counter to is out there about muscle building and yeah.
Michael Wardian: Yes. Yeah. Although like there is like a pretty cool, I don't know if it's still, used to be on Netflix, there was like a vegan, vegan superpower, athletes or something. And they had like a bot, like the world's strongest man is vegan. And then they had a guy like my buddy Scott jerk was on there for like ultra running and they had, I don't know, a bunch of other like super high level vegan athletes. And you're like, Oh, that's cool. Like that's
Hilary Cairns: Okay. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: Like, yeah, definitely the stereotype of bodybuilding is not that, you know, it's like creatine and how, you know, protein shakes and stuff.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, forgot to ask her about supplements. I should have asked her that, because I would just be interested to what she takes, if she takes the standard things or anything different.
Michael Wardian: Yeah, yeah, I don't know. That would be a good follow up. Like you could do it like the New York Times where they have like one interview and then they call her back and then marry the two and put it into like one because I just heard that with Tucker Carlson. It was like a kind of interesting, like he's somebody that I don't really pay attention to that much. And the follow up after you know, they've talking for like an hour is kind of interesting.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah, I'm almost done with that podcast. sounds like, yeah.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ did you hear that one? Yeah, it was interesting. I, ⁓ yeah, somebody don't normally pay attention to, so yeah.
Hilary Cairns: Definitely interesting. Yeah, same. So what has been going on? I'm trying to think. The last time we talked was right after cherry blossom and you were getting ready to do the four date, was it four days and 200 or so miles, the MedStar and then go to Boston and then London. And so did you do all those things?
Michael Wardian: Yep. Yeah, we did. Yeah. So I did the, was called miles across MedStar. that was, it turned into, it was a, when we planned it, was a little over 200 miles, but it was kind of cool because we just had to hit some certain locations. So as we were running, we were able to find some routes and were able to shave some miles. So it ended up being 175 miles of running. So I think the first day we ran 67 miles, kind of from Leonardtown, Maryland, all the way to downtown DC. And then the second day we ran 51 miles DC to Columbia, Maryland, and then Columbia to Baltimore, and then kind of Baltimore to Timonium the last day. So it was 67, 51, 39, and then like 13.
Hilary Cairns: Okay.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ yeah, so it was, it was, was really great. And I got to, you know, hang out, ⁓ my two friends, Chris and Chris, ⁓ who were running with me. ⁓ for both those guys, it was kind of their biggest like journey run like that. and then we had a bunch of, heat to deal with. So it was like the 90 degree days. So it turned it, it made pretty hard. but we had great support. Like we got to go to like 15 MedStar.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah.
Michael Wardian: hospitals and PT clinics and kind of outpatient centers. So that was really neat. We got to meet a ⁓ of MedStar employees. We some testing along the way. So we did like VO2 max testing before and after, and then we did some gait analysis like before, during, and after. We did blood before, during, and after. And then like echocardiograms. They thought they found that my lungs were not working at full capacity, but then I had a pulmonary follow-up test and it seems like I'm in the normal range. So that was kind of cool, just to get all the testing done around it. And then there's gonna be some research and papers done with that. So that was really neat. But the big...
Hilary Cairns: Well, wait, when I saw you were running, did, as part of it, you posted something which looked incredibly dangerous. You were running like on the highway, I think going the wrong direction. Like you were running with traffic on the highway. I was like, can you guys find a different route? It looked very precarious.
Michael Wardian: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, there was there was some tricky sections, especially in like that that part. That was actually the safer side, safer side, ⁓ it had a bigger shoulder than the other side. So yeah, sometimes you have to, you know, run where it's the safest. there were some parts where you're like, this isn't my favorite. ⁓ But for the most part, it was it really, really neat. Like we were really
Hilary Cairns: Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: cared for. had two support vehicles, had Chris's parents there for most of days. And then we had a MedStar athletic trainer with us, different ones, Brandon and Mandy, along the way. So was really nice, And then we just had like all the support of the MedStar teams when we would get places. But yeah, was just, it was a long run then really hot. And then I finished that. Thursday, home for one day on Friday, caught up on some work and just like seeing the family and then flew to Boston on Saturday. Had a podcast with Runa, which was cool. really neat to like get to hang out with them. And then, you know, Boston is just like, I don't know, that's the race that got me into running. It was my 18th of finish official finish. think I've finished it actually like 24 times with all the pacing that hasn't counted. So I'm close to like, you know, quarter century there. and then I was pacing my buddy, Matt from the apparel sponsor that I have, ⁓ and he's trying to break two hours and 40 minutes for six years, ⁓ and he up doing it. So I got to be a part of that. So he ran 239.22 and dropped me, which was awesome. So I got dropped at like a mile like 22, 23. And I finished in 241 flat. So I'm pretty stoked after running 175 miles tapering for Boston. I was home for a couple of days, had some work deadlines and then flew to London on Thursday with my wife, Jennifer.
Hilary Cairns: Okay.
Michael Wardian: We flew like the red-eye, in on Friday, had kind of a pretty busy time. I got to meet my crew chief for the Pacific Crest Trail, Sharon and her ⁓ granddaughter Mia. I to meet up with them, got to do a shakeout run with my athlete Dylan from Achilles. He's the autistic athlete. then we had the race on Sunday. and then his goal was, to run kind of as fast as he could. He was on like PR pace, which is two 56. And then we kind of fell off the last like three or four miles and ended up at three Oh four 35. So that was his third fastest, um, marathon ever and his fastest, London. then of course it was cool to be there with the guys when they broke.
Hilary Cairns: Okay. Okay. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: two hours in the marathon and like even the third place guy was two hours flat. So like that was just cool to be part of history in a couple different ways. Like we were the biggest marathon ever also. like anyone that did London can download like a Guinness world record certificate saying you participated in like the biggest marathon in the world. ⁓ they just did like a bad ass job. Like it's just like tons of fans, great course, great support.
Hilary Cairns: Okay. I didn't realize that.
Michael Wardian: fast course, somehow like mostly shaded. I don't understand how like it was shady. it's kind of cool too, cause it starts in like three or four different places. And so you kind of like go in and then at like ⁓ 5k, everyone kind marries up. So that's kind of cool to just see the logistics involved. ⁓ no, it's, it's, you get assigned by like what time they think you're going to finish. So they kind of keep.
Hilary Cairns: and you just get assigned randomly. Okay.
Michael Wardian: certain athletes in different places. We were athletes with disabilities. So we were starting between wave one and wave two. And then I had a super tight turnaround. Like the race started at 9.36 and we had a four o'clock flight. So we got done around like one and then had to get back from the finish to the hotel and then get to the airport and then fly home. So that was... It was tricky and tight, but we made it. ⁓
Hilary Cairns: Okay. Did you, were you telling Dylan that during it? It's like, we can't slow down and no, it sounds like he did great. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: No, no, no, no, no, I mean, I told him that I had to leave kind of quickly at the end. It was funny because we like jumped in like pretty common, you know, London blacktop cab to get back. And then the guy, Roy, the cabbie, like waited outside while I changed clothes and picked up Jennifer. And then he took us to the airport too. So like, it was pretty funny. Like he ended up like taking me from the race to the hotel and dropping Dylan off and then taken me to the airport. ⁓ yeah, not cheap, but it got us where we needed to go. Yeah. ⁓
Hilary Cairns: Okay. You said you've done Boston 18 times. When was the last time you raced it on your own? Have you pacing?
Michael Wardian: I've been pacing it for probably the last like or eight years. ⁓ it's probably been that long since I've ⁓ lined up for myself.
Hilary Cairns: Okay. I find it to be, I I just, did the hundredth anniversary, which was like 1996, I believe. pretty sure it was when they, was much bigger than usual. ⁓ want to sit there. ⁓ race killed my quads. I mean, if I were to do that race again, I would train so differently. I didn't, I just didn't know that you needed to really train the downhills. ⁓ My quads hurt so after that.
Michael Wardian: Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, so what have you been doing since cherry blossom then? So like I've been rattling off things, but like I didn't ask you what you've been up to.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. I've been doing more basic things. Yeah. So kind of a little bit. I feel like I'm cramming for Eagle Man, the Half Ironman, which in June, but I'm also doing another, I'm doing a High Rocks next week. I'm going to Ottawa on Monday for a High Rocks race that's at the end of the week next week. So just doing that. mean, I've started getting outside on my bike, on the gravel. ⁓
Michael Wardian: Ooh, yeah. Okay.
Hilary Cairns: So I've done, think, maybe two of those rides. So that's been good. And some, some high rocks cramming too. I don't tend to train super for high rocks, meaning, there's ⁓ ergs and stuff you do for high rocks. And I don't tend to really train those. just like, I get enough through my other things. But I did like five minutes of erg two days ago. Yeah. ⁓
Michael Wardian: Okay. So almost 2k.
Hilary Cairns: Well, it's funny because the Ergs are probably one of my strongest stations and I never train. I don't train it at all. But I think it's just, it's all the other stuff. So, I've been doing that.
Michael Wardian: That's cool. mean, if you're good at it, like, yeah, that's one thing that you can on having in your back pocket. That's nice.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, well, it's super short too. mean, it's, you know, it literally takes, I want to say like four and a half minutes. It's a thousand. It's only a thousand. Yeah. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: Is it a 2K? ⁓ yeah, ⁓ that's not. ⁓ I thought it was a 2K. 2K is actually really hard. A thousand. I mean, it's hard when you're going all out, but it's like, yeah, it's over pretty quick. Is that what it is on the SkiErg also? A thousand? ⁓ wow.
Hilary Cairns: No. Yeah, no I- ⁓ I find I'm faster the regular erg than the ski erg. I don't know, that's probably true for most people. I'm not positive about that, but I think the, the regular erg is more legs and the ski erg is more arms. So, yeah.
Michael Wardian: yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, that's cool. I, for some reason in my head, I thought it was, um, 2K. Um, okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 2K, I mean, that's like doing an all-out mile, I feel like.
Hilary Cairns: Now, it's very short, so. Yeah, and honestly, most people use those times to relax a little bit. mean, or they think, I don't personally, trying to go really hard, but I think it's harder to run off of the things than you would think. And you can really gas yourself, especially the ski org is the first one. And if you go really hard on that, you can mess up the whole race because you, you know, you're so, you're breathing so hard. you know, but remember you're sprinting in between or you're close to sprinting. mean, you're probably running, don't know, probably like 10K pace, I would say, around for the intervals in between, so it's pretty hard effort.
Michael Wardian: Yeah. And those are all a kilometer also, right? Yeah.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, yeah, which reminds me, you they just announced that there's another one in DC in September. I think there are still open slots. maybe look into it. ⁓ okay, okay. you were aware.
Michael Wardian: I know, I'm not gonna be here. I'm gonna be on the PCT. yeah, buddy was trying to get me to do it. And I was like, ⁓ that would be fun, but I'm not around. ⁓ least I don't think I will be. I think it'll be like right, it's the first couple of weekends or something.
Hilary Cairns: Okay. Yeah. I think it's Labor Day weekend.
Michael Wardian: Yeah, so I'll definitely be on the trail by so yeah. Yeah, I know it's cool. It's cool. I'm fine with that. I'm so about the PCT coming up ⁓ and then ⁓ getting ready my rowing afterwards. So I'll be doing a lot of erging and lot of like skill training around that once the PCT is done.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah, I wonder about when you're rowing on the ocean, I mean, how similar it really is to erging. I would think it's not, you think it's a lot? Okay.
Michael Wardian: I think it's pretty similar, I think it's just conditioning your back and your butt your core and everything. ⁓ But I think, yeah, it's definitely gonna be different, but I think it's a similar kind of setup with a tray that you move back and forth. ⁓ And then I think
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Okay, okay.
Michael Wardian: seems to me like Most people don't train on the Most people are training on ergs and then they do extended stints. plan is to do two, kind of like three week stints in the UK with the boat that I buy. And that's where I'll get the ocean training, but the base training will be on erg pretty much. And then hopefully on the water with Potomac Boat Club and...
Hilary Cairns: Okay. Okay.
Michael Wardian: W and L team. ⁓ my plan if everything goes well.
Hilary Cairns: Okay. Yeah, during COVID, I my foot right at the beginning. think I told you that I had it's called a Jones fracture. So I fractured my foot literally like two weeks into So I knew I wasn't going to be able to run. The pools were all closing. So we ordered as did many people. So took a while get to us, I believe, but we ordered an erg and it was the only thing that I could do because foot was in a boot, but I wasn't allowed to put any weight on it while it was healing and I could jimmy erg to be able to do the erg. So I did it, I did it just an extensive, crazy of time. So I think that's probably why I don't train anymore on it because I have so much just, it's kind awful. Yeah. But my hands, my gosh, I had blisters all over my hands. So hopefully your coach is going to have thoughts on how to minimize that with salt water and.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ Yeah. muscle memory. Actually, I want the blisters. The blisters are good. It's kind of like getting blisters on my feet or like, you know, covered in blisters. So like that like helps protect your hands, but like, that they become like your feet, right? So like when we're doing like a run across the country or journey run, like your feet are like your most important asset, like, and I feel like that's how you your hands and your back and those kind of muscles will be important to keep straight for the for the rowing. But It'll be an adventure to kind of learn all those skills yeah, and then get to try them out in real life.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. So you're training right now, guess to get ready for the PCT or, mean, are you training specifically for your next adventure are you just kind of do the same things that you've been doing or how do you alter things? ⁓
Michael Wardian: Yeah, no, I definitely like on Sunday I did a mountain run. I drove out to Shenandoah with our dog bash and we did 13 miles. the plan was to do like a marathon and then I downloaded the file to my my watch, but for some reason it didn't download the actual map. It downloaded the GPX file, but it said I didn't have the map or something. So anyhow, I was smart enough to like take a picture of the the route the trails. And so I was kind of up there and I'd done the run before and then I was just kind of messing around. then I had a championship lacrosse game last night for men's league. And I was like, like, yeah, but I was like, I don't want to miss it. Be getting lost in the mountains. so yeah, I cut it short. So we ended up doing 13, which was bash his longest run. And I wanted to see also like how he would recover and he's, he's totally fine. So like I definitely. sure that he can go further, but it was kind of like a test on that. But I got in like, think 3,300 feet of vert, which is like a fair amount, but I was looking for more like six to 8,000 feet. So like, I'll be doing like stuff like that. And then my buddy, Tom and I, I'll start doing like step ups and I've been wearing my weight vest around, just gonna get the strength down. And then right now I've been testing like different packs that I'm gonna be either purchasing or like trying to get just getting like dialing in kind of like gear and like making sure I have the strength for carrying weight because I'll have some long times by myself where I'm going to be having to carry like a tent. So like, I got to start doing all that like buying a tent. I think I have a nice sleeping pad, but I think it's more a bikepacking pad. So I'll probably need to get like a, like a hiking like type of pad for when I have to camp out overnight. Cause there's some sections that are long, like 120, 130 miles between when I can see my crew chief. So I'll have like those sections where I just go in with a big rucksack and get to camp out overnight, which will be cool.
Hilary Cairns: Okay. Okay.
Michael Wardian: Yeah, so getting ready for that. And then I've been doing some faster stuff. Like I also won the park run ⁓ on Saturday. So trying to get my legs ready. And then I just signed up for the old Dominion 100 miler. I think I'm 10th on the wait list. That's like June 5th. then I'm going be putting on the Dewey Beach 100 miler again on June 20th. So that'll just be like one mile down, one mile back Dewey Beach. So that'll be fun. So I have like basically 200 milers. I get into the old Dominion race, if not, I'll do something long. So I want to get some kind of long efforts in, but also some speed faster stuff. So it'll be a kind of a mix of like long stuff and then like trying to get leg turnover going.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, I mean the turnover stuff, just think about that myself too, is I do like kind of long slower things, but I feel like I have got to keep doing the faster stuff or it's just all gonna poof go away. But maybe that's not right. When you go back and did the, when you did the 5K, it feel like a shock to your legs? I mean, it's like you've been running that slow, but.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ no, not at all. mean, I feel like I was super fit. I did a workout, a CrossFit workout right before the, 5k and then just right from the workout to the 5k. So I didn't, I didn't like really rest or anything. And I still ran like 17, 30, 38, like 544 pace. So like, I think I could have been, faster, but then, you that really defeats the purpose. Like the point is to like,
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: get legs turning over when they're tired. ⁓ And yeah, it was nice that I still ended up winning. Like it would have been kind of annoying had I lost by like five seconds or something, cause I did a workout ahead of time, but didn't, so it good. ⁓ And then it'll fun. Like when I go to the beach, there's like a every, every Saturday and Sunday. So
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Okay.
Michael Wardian: I'll be getting into those quite a bit. And then I am like getting back into pickleball. like I did drilling session my today try to just get back into pickleball. Like every time I go now, I feel like my friends are getting so much better. So I need to like practice to like be able to play with them. So I practice so that I can. ⁓
Hilary Cairns: wrong.
Michael Wardian: like not be the worst guy on the court. like it felt really good to get some touches with the pickleball paddle also. ⁓ And then I start bocce. start men's league bocce on Wednesday night. the last time we played, were the. champions of bocce so I'm excited about ⁓ so I have tomorrow night Yeah
Hilary Cairns: Okay, well wasn't it, Lyddiard or whatever who told you that like if you want to be the best at one of these things you should like pick one? Because I'm thinking you got, just kind of keep adding to it. You didn't even mention your chess endeavors too, ⁓ so. ⁓
Michael Wardian: Yeah, yeah, yeah. He did say that. Yeah, now I've been doing that quite a bit. finally back up to, well, what happens is when I do all the running stuff, I start playing really bad chess. And so I dropped like 250 points and now I've finally like, back up to like close to where I was before like I had all those runs because I just get careless and dumb when I'm tired in chess and then I get punished. is what should happen and it does ⁓ so
Hilary Cairns: make sense.
Michael Wardian: what feels different in your training between now and 10 to 15 years ago?
Hilary Cairns: I feel quite as strong biking as I did then, but think I was just biking harder. think I probably need to be a little bit more. focused in the training if I want to be able to bike particularly at the level that I was before I just need to just decide I'm gonna ⁓ that. But definitely overall in terms of training, a more strength work. I think I used to just do, you know, maybe 20 minutes of a couple of different arm things which didn't really have purpose. It was sort of like, I should just make sure that my upper body is relatively strong. So I'll do like some pull-ups and some push-ups and you know, some
Michael Wardian: Okay.
Hilary Cairns: like curls. But now, you know, I'm really focused on like trying to make sure that my shoulders are strong, you know, specifically for some of the high rocks things. So probably the strength is, is different. Swimming, I actually probably take a little more rest than I used to in terms of time between intervals. then I think I probably go a little bit harder during the intervals themselves.
Michael Wardian: Okay. Like terms of heart rate or in terms of like pace. think you're faster now than you were or you just have to work harder. ⁓
Hilary Cairns: I'm pretty much the same. I do have to work a little bit harder to be the same pace, overall I think the effort is a bit harder in the interval itself. So taking a little more rest. But in terms of running, ⁓ think more relaxed than used to be about everything. Just like my perspective shifted a bit. I still wanna be competitive and have goals, but...
Michael Wardian: Yeah.
Hilary Cairns: In the moments, just feel like I have perspective on what I'm doing. I'm like, this is for fun. I get to do this. I'm so lucky that my body's letting me do these things. I so fortunate. I mean, I know so many people who are no longer able to run or they're, you know, they're hurt And so the fact that I don't have that and the fact that sure, I may be a little bit slower than I was before, but I know that my effort is actually the same. I know I'm working just as hard.
Michael Wardian: Yeah.
Hilary Cairns: And to be able to do that feels very similar.
Michael Wardian: Yeah, that's cool. Yeah. ⁓ I mean, I feel like it's like, I mean, it was mostly 15 years ago. It mostly just run training for the most part. Like, and I do a lot of different things now and I less miles, but I think I do more other things that more than makes up for the less miles. And I'd say my times are a bit slower. but yeah, it's,
Hilary Cairns: What about your training? Yeah.
Michael Wardian: doesn't really bother me because like I have the ability to do like, these huge projects and like, I wouldn't want to not do those to be a couple of minutes faster. ⁓
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Well, yeah, and do you think the variety, I because I feel like one of the reasons why I don't tend to get injured, I mean, yes, I've had a couple of significant injuries, but for the most part would say I'm relatively healthy. I think a lot of it is just the variety of things that I do. I'm not running every day. I'm not biking every day. You know, I'm really, I really am mixing things up. Do you feel like that's changed for you? that since you're not running in the same ways that you were?
Michael Wardian: Well, I mean, I am running every day. It's just not the same like intensity or distance, I would say. ⁓ But it's not like, ⁓ I'm going to the track on Tuesday for a track workout or something like that, or a tempo run or like, I rarely do those now. Like that's something that I actually want to get back into. So I'm hoping like, maybe when our son comes home, he doesn't even know this yet. But I was hoping maybe he would want to go.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah. Welcome home. We're going to go do workouts.
Michael Wardian: go to the track with me because he does some, yeah, yeah, you wanna be my training partner? ⁓ but yeah, I feel like I wanna back to the track and just try to get a little bit faster. I am a little motivated. Nick took my record ⁓ for ⁓ and pretty sure I could get that right now. And I've been trying to find a ⁓ 50K to and it's like surprisingly hard. So like, I feel like maybe I'll try to create one.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah.
Michael Wardian: to try to get that. But now, yeah, I can't find one I have the to get to, ⁓ at least.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Well, I was just going to say one other thing that different from for me from 15 years ago. I had a lot of hamstring stuff really over my running history and triathlon history and in the last five years or so because I ⁓ been doing more concerted lifting, I think I've strengthened my ham. Yes.
Michael Wardian: Yeah, 100%. Yeah. So like, that's something bigger, like between 10 and 15 years ago, I didn't work out with a personal trainer and I wasn't doing CrossFit until the pandemic with my buddy Tom. So like both those things. And then I'm still doing the hundred, how are your hundred burpees a day? Are you still doing those? ⁓
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. I've kind of, well yeah, I've shifted to every other day. Yeah, and sometimes every other day I'll do 150 or 200, but yeah, so cumulatively it may still be close, but I shifted away a little bit. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: It's hard, dude. It's hard. It's like, feel like the hardest part is like a lot of things. It's like getting started. The first like 10 feel really bad. And I feel like I always feel bad until I get to like 50. And then I'm like, now I'm on the downhill.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah, I do really like them a lot. What I'm hoping is, if ⁓ my time is not faster in high rocks next week, like, something is wrong. Because I have done so many burpees. That better be a faster station for me.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ my gosh, well should practice them where you have to jump, right? not jumping not when you're doing your 100.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, ⁓ ⁓ all different ways. So I'll do some of them, I'll do like the high rocks burpees, mainly I do just straight up regular burpees with full push up, full jump forward and jump up when I'm doing the 100, but then sometimes I'll shift and I'll do the jump forward. Either way, should have done something.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ okay. Okay. Okay. ⁓ you're doing way harder burpees than me. I do like step back burpees. Like I've been doing them forever. I just get them done. yeah, I do like crossfit burpees where your chest just touches. Yes. Yes. ⁓ 100%.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Just flop to the ground. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Do you want to reflect at all on any of the guests that we've had?
Michael Wardian: Cool. I like them all, man. I think we've had really good people on. was really impressed with your Tammy interview. I thought that was really great. we're still older athletes that are still getting after it. I mean, that's the cool part to me is like, we haven't given up on so chasing dreams. Right. And so I think that's important. So yeah.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah. I really liked listening again to Gene's interview because it had been a while we ended up delaying publishing his interview because for a variety of reasons. And I just thought he was really insightful and I just really love his kind of life, his outlook. talking about injury and how he'll be better on the other end of it and just such a I thought incredible attitude toward life. So I feel like I'm learning a little bit from each person who comes. like a class. get a things that are very solid takeaways from each one. And so I appreciate that.
Michael Wardian: Yeah, for sure. Yeah, I mean, I feel like that's how it is in so many things, right? It's like you get, you you listen to a lot of stuff and you find something that resonates with you and then hopefully take action on it. I mean, that's the big thing, right? Like have all this stuff going on around, but like, you know, if you can get one thing from every person you meet, that you get a lot of information, you become a better person. the goal.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. And we're about to start our expert series remember we introduced the podcast and say we're talking to experts. We have yet to have one, but we're gonna this week or by time this comes out, it'd be next week, have our first expert. So be, I think, very insightful. Learn some stuff getting older and wisdom from people who aren't just winging it. ⁓
Michael Wardian: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That'll be fun, man. what it's all about. someone listening is in ⁓ 40s or ⁓ 50s and to stay competitive, what's something you'd tell them focus on now? Your turn.
Hilary Cairns: I mean, think the starting point is what is your goal? Like what are you, not like what are you trying achieve, but what's your reason for wanting to continue in sports or start something new? is the motivator and making, if you have that core what you're always going back to like, why am I doing this? I'm doing this. to be healthy. I'm doing this to be able to see my grandchildren and run around with them. I'm doing it because I want to challenge myself to do something new. If you have that why reason that you're doing it, you can always go back to that. I think that's a good starting point. And one, which at least I revisit a lot. And I feel like I've been revisiting it much more actually since we've started having these conversations, just really been thinking about why do I do this? What is it that motivates me? can ⁓ learn how other people are approaching things and maybe I want to integrate some of that thinking into my why for doing things. So.
Michael Wardian: Yeah, I mean, I think that's good. think people might want something like more takeaway. Like, feel like, like, I feel like, ⁓ that's think sometimes it's just good to do hard things. like, I'm reading that Steve Magnus book, right? I feel like you talking about that, right? Like, do hard things. Like, I'm listening to that right now.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, like specifically. not this mushy, gushy stuff. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: I think that there's a lot of value in just, you know, putting yourself in awkward, tough circumstances and trying to figure your way through it. And, and you learn a lot about, I I've said this on a number of podcasts, but there's the person you think you are, and then there's the person you actually are. And then, you know, those things are not always the same. And like a long event or ⁓ challenging experience, like that'll show you who you are. like sometimes it's not who you think you are. But doesn't mean that you can't be that person. You're just not there yet, right? And so I think that's what I love about these type of adventures and challenges is that you do get to get stripped down your core and your base and you learn a lot about who you are and where you are.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah.
Michael Wardian: that's, think, good thing. But I would say like biggest takeaway thing ⁓ would be 100 burpees. I feel like that's changed the most impact for me. And it was somebody was asking me like, what did you, what have you gained from the 100 burpees? I feel like it's like the discipline to do something hard every day. doesn't take that long. So it's like short. It's made me a lot stronger, like just like full body ⁓ workout.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah.
Michael Wardian: more flexible, feel like, more range of motion. Yeah, so like that would be my thing. I would challenge people to like 100 burpees a day and if you can't do 100, start with 50. Don't make it 10 because 10 is way too easy. would say got to be, yeah, or cap it at 10 minutes. Like that sometimes that's what Tom and I will do if we like.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah.
Michael Wardian: Just want to get after it. We'll cap it at like seven minutes and see how many you can do in seven minutes, which is tough. That's like nonstop. But I'd say most of the time I get it done in under 15, 20 minutes. And that's like slow rolling.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, this is not totally related, but I'm wondering, is part of what you do, you thinking about yourself as a parent and the example that you're setting for your kids?
Michael Wardian: mean, somewhat. I'd like to think that but like, they've seen ⁓ doing this forever. don't think it like, doesn't move the needle them that much or at least like, I feel like they think it's cool. But, and I hope that they recognize that, you it's not something that everyone does, but I think that they've just been around it so long. They're just like, ⁓ yeah, that's what my dad does.
Hilary Cairns: need our kids the podcast at some point. And just find like, what is it like to be raised by these people? ⁓
Michael Wardian: Yeah, well, it's funny somebody who was like, ⁓ your dogs are so lucky. Yeah, and then one of my pickleball friends is like, is that lucky? Like, do you want to be the dog that has to go run all these miles with him and like do all this like crazy stuff? And so yeah, mean, I guess it goes both ways. And we talked about this before we got on but like not to be a downer, but we lost one of our dogs.
Hilary Cairns: always have someone to run with.
Michael Wardian: Rosie and that's been going on too. So that's been very sad and a very challenging thing for our family at the moment. yeah it's been yeah that's been sad.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah, I'm so sorry. And the dog has a sibling, right? I mean, not a literal sibling, have two, okay. ⁓
Michael Wardian: Yeah, thank you. Yeah, we had two V's, Rosey and Bash and Sebastian or Bash is six. So he's he's been all the love But yeah, it's just feels like the the is less full ⁓ Which I you get with like kids leaving like that kind of stuff. It's like it's just not as not as noisy and rambunctious as it normally is
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, I'm sorry.
Michael Wardian: Nah, it's okay.
Hilary Cairns: Well that was the, I think we were potentially going to talk about a high and a low or something that's happened to us recently. That definitely goes in the low category.
Michael Wardian: Well That was definitely a low. lowest that for me that you can get. also like, know, it's we talked about this, but it's part of being a dog owner and I hate that part. So ⁓ what about you? Do you have any highs or lows?
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Well, not really running or training related highs. So do some consulting I worked for the DC for city government for a really long time. And now I do some consulting, but I have a little more time on my hands these days. And so I've started working at a daycare center because ⁓ I just love little kids.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ that's fun.
Hilary Cairns: I just miss that time so much that I had with my own children. So my high is that I spend about like 15 or 20 hours working at a daycare center. And it just, these little one and two year olds are just the sweetest possible things. mean, to be experiencing life through their eyes is, you you have to be totally focused on them, not thinking about other things. I'm focused on.
Michael Wardian: ⁓
Hilary Cairns: You know, the cow says moo, the horse says nay. You know, so I'm doing all this stuff for a couple hours. And I love it. Yeah. So that's been, it's just been really fun. And I'll.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ my gosh, man, I'm so glad that you found something that you love like that.
Hilary Cairns: and a great distraction from the world. to just find a place to be where you can get away from things that don't great around you is to spend time with little children and just be present for them.
Michael Wardian: Yeah, yeah, Yeah, that's great. Yeah, I feel like that about my running people's dogs. It's like the coolest job that I get to do. And it's like, makes me happy every time. yeah, I love it.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. And they're probably like little kids too. They get so excited when Michael comes around. mean, you know, there's nothing like walking into a ⁓ little group of one and two year olds who are like, up, up. They want me to pick them up. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: Yeah! Yeah, Dude, it's the best. good. I'm glad you have that. So no lows for you then?
Hilary Cairns: Just a little fatigued. Yeah, I'm a little fatigued. That would be my low. I've learned that when I get a little fatigued, if I just back off for a couple days, the fatigue will ease. So... No magic potions. No, it's called just... No, but we would, wouldn't we? It looks tasty.
Michael Wardian: That's cool. So no like special powders or potions or anything. You're not selling AG1 yet? You
Hilary Cairns: I've never had it, but it probably, ⁓ it's not? ⁓ okay. Yeah, well, maybe we get sponsored by something that tastes really, really good.
Michael Wardian: It's not it's not I've had it ⁓ You know what had that is good? ⁓ like a vegan plant protein Kachava, right?
Hilary Cairns: Does it have chocolate? Does it have chocolate in it?
Michael Wardian: I hate chocolate, but yeah, they do have a chocolate one. Yeah, I hate it. Like, yeah, it's like, yeah, I don't like it at all.
Hilary Cairns: What? Wait, any, all chocolate? Oh my gosh, I don't have a day that goes by where I don't have at least like one candy bar. yeah, I haven't had a day without one.
Michael Wardian: really? a ca- like a peanut butter or what? Yeah, kachava is the thing. Kachava. Yeah. ⁓ like K-A-C-H-A-V-A. Yeah, that stuff is actually, I've had it a couple times, it's pretty good. ⁓ I mean they have a chocolate,
Hilary Cairns: Interesting. No, just like chocolate. Kachava, okay. But what's the flavor?
Michael Wardian: they have an acai, they have matcha. I feel like they just have like a neutral, like a vanilla or something.
Hilary Cairns: Maybe you have some kind of genetic defect. How do you know that you don't like chocolate? I don't understand. Is that possible? you ⁓ Do your kids like it? ⁓
Michael Wardian: What? Yeah, There's other people that don't like chocolate. Like everyone feel like people should come in the comments. Like, yeah, my kids, everyone else likes chocolate. Yeah, they have a super food blend and a mega blend. Yeah, they have all different flavors.
Hilary Cairns: They do, okay. All right, I'll give that a try and then we can do some outreach. But not for the chocolate. ⁓ well then, okay.
Michael Wardian: It's pretty expensive though. It's pretty expensive. Yeah, somebody I know gave me scratch. there's all kinds of good stuff like tailwind scratch, all that kind of stuff. Yeah, so. But I mean, I usually I just made my own. Like I work with like big spoon roasters and they make like nut butter. So I'll just make smoothies with their stuff. ⁓ And then it's just like, you know,
Hilary Cairns: Yeah.
Michael Wardian: berries from Whole Foods that kind of stuff. Bananas.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, I make a lot of bars, just oats and flax and chia and peanut butter chocolate chips. ⁓ But ⁓ to to, used to make them when our kids were really young too, because it just felt insanely expensive to purchase wrapped bars that you can make for much cheaper, as much as I like the wrapped bars, but.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ that's cool. Yeah, there you go. Like, yeah, yeah.
Hilary Cairns: When I'm feeling like I want to save money, I just make loads of these bars that are super easy to make.
Michael Wardian: Dude, that's cool. Yeah, we like started making our own granola too and that's fun and it tastes really good.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: But yeah, then I've got, stoked oats. I just make oatmeal and just like, I'll have that. My wife always makes fun of me though. Like I'll make some in the morning and then not eat it until like after dinner or something. She's like, that's just been sitting around all day. I'm like, I know, it's just aging. It's overnight oats, but never makes it overnight. ⁓
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. That sounds yummy to me.
Michael Wardian: is good. ⁓
Hilary Cairns: All right, so what's next for you? I'm trying think of what, I'm going to Ottawa next week. We got a couple interviews this week.
Michael Wardian: Yeah, you've got your high I forgot to say, I said FKT also in ⁓ rocks. So that ⁓ fun. That was in between all those races and the MedStar thing. ⁓
Hilary Cairns: And was that like, all running or was it like, had to hockey, hockey,
Michael Wardian: It was all running. It's only like a half up with a thousand feet of climbing. it's a mile and a half down. So I did it in like 22.51. So yeah, it was fast. It's just like boom, straight up, straight down. Yeah. So that was fun.
Hilary Cairns: Wow. We had another record broken in our house. So I guess since I can't talk about my own records, our daughter broke the family 10K record last weekend. Yeah. She ran Pike's Peak. Yeah, it is fast, but yeah, she ran 34, 30. Yeah. Yeah. So she's like getting ready for grandma's.
Michael Wardian: Ooh, where was that? ⁓ that one's super fast. Hell yeah. Yeah, yeah. Let's go!
Hilary Cairns: marathon, is in June. So I'm going to go to grandma's too, because my parents are from Minnesota. So my whole family's in Minnesota, but they want to go watch, even though I don't think it's a great viewing course, but anyway, I'm going to tote around like the grandparents to watch her run grandma's.
Michael Wardian: Okay. It is not. maybe it's easy to get around, but it's like a point to point, as you know. So you could probably see her in halfway and then probably get back for the finish.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah. Yeah, I think it's gonna be something like that, so.
Michael Wardian: that's what like that's where my PR is from. That's like a fast course man. ⁓ I mean if you get the day, yeah. Yeah, ⁓ man, I hope she has a great race. She's looking for like a OT qualifier or.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, yeah, it should be good. Yeah, yeah, should be good. ⁓ but Not yet. I mean, I think in the future, but probably 240. I think between 240 and 237. Yeah. And I think for now, only run one marathon, she ran 250. And it's like, it's a big leap to go from 250 to 240. Like, let's just take it a step at a time.
Michael Wardian: And what does she need to run, 236? Yeah. Is she gonna be cramming in like 120 grams of carbs an hour?
Hilary Cairns: I don't, she's definitely practicing with a lot of different gels. So yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ that's cool. Okay. ⁓ good, man. I hope she has a great race. ⁓ Well, I've got a trip for Teva out Zion for a media trip. So that's coming up next week. And then at the end of next week, I'll be at the River Rock races down in Richmond. So I'll be down there racing the half in the And then I'm also on a panel. So that'll be really fun my buddy Kyle. And like it's part of organization so people can come see that. So that'll be like ⁓ one o'clock Saturday the 16th 15th. So next Saturday. the Now, so I'll go to Zion until, so I'll go ⁓ Zion.
Hilary Cairns: And that's ⁓ Zion.
Michael Wardian: May 11th through the 14th and then I fly home on the 14th and I'll go down to Richmond on the ⁓ 15th and then I'll race the 16th and ⁓ 17th and then I'll be and I'll be ⁓ trying to get ready. Hopefully I'll hear on the old Dominion miler if I get him off the wait list. If not, I'll do some kind of big adventure on my own.
Hilary Cairns: Okay. Okay.
Michael Wardian: kind of my like I want to run from the Monument to New York's Times Square. So that's like a 200 and 270 mile run. So that's kind of like something that I've been Trying to out like when I can do so, if I can't do Old Dominion, maybe I Spend the weekend doing that run
Hilary Cairns: have you been to Zion before? Or your first time? Okay, so.
Michael Wardian: I have, I've been a couple of times and I've run across it then I used to have the FKT for the Narrows which is like this really cool like you run in water and you like do all this stuff and then my teammate Aaron beat my record so we're gonna be out there together so it's gonna be fun like trash talking each other. ⁓
Hilary Cairns: I just Utah is so that's so great. We're actually just we're planning a trip to Saint George next. So this coming summer and which is right near Zion so.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ good! Okay. Yeah, that'll be fun. Yeah, have you been before or no?
Hilary Cairns: I've been to Moab and Arches National Park that's there. ⁓ so amazing.
Michael Wardian: ⁓ cool, yeah yeah. Yeah, yeah, I know, but that's what people say about Shenandoah and I feel like that's true. Like every time I go to Shenandoah, I'm like, wow, it's just like I was out there. Oh yeah, a hundred percent. Yeah, yeah. But still beautiful. All right.
Hilary Cairns: Yeah, yeah, but so different. So, so different. Yeah, yeah, very cool. Yeah. right.
