WEBVTT
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Welcome to Healthy Banta, the podcast where women's health gets real relatable and just a little bit cheeky.
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We'd like to begin this podcast by acknowledging the traditional owners on the land on which we meet today.
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We would also like to pay respects for elders past and present.
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We are incredibly lucky to be joined by Caitlin Clark today, who is an accredited exercise physiologist or EP in the Brisbane area.
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I'm going to read a quick bio to introduce you to Caitlin and let you know what she's achieved so far.
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Caitlin is an accredited exercise physiologist and exercise oncology specialist supporting patients in private practice at BodyTrack Exercise Physiology Tewong, Brisbane.
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She has completed postgraduate study in exercise medicine oncology and has a special interest in women's health.
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Caitlin works closely with patients and their medical and allied health teams to create highly individualized and evidence-based exercise interventions to optimize health outcomes and quality of life.
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She is especially interested in supporting women during the perimenopause and postmenopause transition, particularly those who have undergone medically or surgically induced menopause, where symptom burden can be unfortunately much higher.
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Caitlin is extremely passionate about the incredible benefits and power of exercise, not only as a medicine, but its capacity for women to take control of their health when life often feels like it is in control of the wheel.
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Beyond clinical practice, Caitlin is a university guest lecturer, clinical educator, and industry mentor with a passion for supporting EP students and graduates to feel more confident and capable in women's health and oncology support.
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Welcome, Caitlin.
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Thank you.
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Thank you so much for joining us today on Healthy Banta.
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We really appreciate your time.
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Thank you so much, Megan Jules, for having me.
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This has been something I've been really looking forward to having the privilege of being on this really exciting conversation that you have both instigated with some other really amazing health professionals.
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So now it's a real privilege to be on here as an exercise physiologist representative.
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Yeah.
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You're right up there with all the best of them, Caitlin.
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So we're very happy to have you.
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So happy to have you.
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Caitlin, you're like, we know how passionate you are about exercise and you know its its use as a medicine.
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What fueled this passion for you?
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Yeah, that's a great question.
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I think I've always loved uh the understanding of the ability of exercise to really sort of function as something more than just an opportunity for fitness.
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I think it really translates to a real element, particularly in the spaces that I work in in oncology and women's health, in actually being able to provide individuals with an element of control over their health when sometimes there can be quite a few elements outside of our control.
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And being able to sort of facilitate not only great social and emotional benefits, but actually really creating really meaningful physiological outcomes for someone in terms of disease prevention, disease management, injury prevention, injury management, and really being able to optimize long-term health outcomes is a pretty amazing thing to be able to do from something as um well, as simple as exercise.
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Yeah, which isn't always super simple, but that's where we as exercise physiologists can really play a role to hopefully, yeah, continue to keep breaking down those those barriers so that everyone can access this pretty amazing, uh, pretty amazing medicine.
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Yeah, totally.
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And I think that is a really good point, Caitlin, because we don't tend to think, I think, as just women functioning every day, we don't tend to think of exercise as such an important part of our lives.
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Like often we will put ourselves at the bottom of the list, and with that goes anything that we would do for ourselves, like exercise.
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I mean, I think we're very good at taking our medicines, but we quite forget that exercise is a really important medicine.
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Like it it it is doing as much for our body as some of the medications that we take are.
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Yeah, I think particularly if we're not if someone doesn't love exercise, you know, if someone if if it is a chore for someone, you know, it's a lot harder to motivate them.
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I think it's it can be hard because a lot of us actually do know how important and valuable exercise is, but sometimes we might not actually have the means or the capacity or have had problems with exercise historically that have created further barriers to being able to reintegrate with that.
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And I think that's a real privilege of the role of an exercise physiologist and being able to support individuals to open the doors to the right types of exercise for them so that they can still access those really important benefits and they're not limited by those barriers which can yeah prevent them from being able to see really good changes to their health as well.
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And I think that really does drive my passion is being able to allow more people to um uh access these great benefits who maybe might not have considered themselves exercisers in the sense of um what sometimes people may perceive as as necessary to see good change.
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Yeah.
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And and with that, I think sometimes people like you were saying, they have the motivation and they know they should be exercising, but it's like, where do I start?
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Or or or or how do I get this as a part of my life?
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What how do you how do you help women in that moment?
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Like what's your best advice for them then?
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Absolutely, and I think it's really understanding, okay, well, what's what are the elements that are going to be really important to try and from a clinical aspect, what are we, what are we needing to try and best um optimize as many aspects of of your health holistically?
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Do we need to have a bit of focus in on boring density?
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Do we need to have a bit of focus in on um maintaining muscle mass, optimizing um cardiometabolic health or heart health, um control of um our blood sugars metabolic sort of state there as well?
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And then really actually looking, okay, well, what are the sort of current barriers for that individual?
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Is it time or is it resources?
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And therefore looking at, okay, well, what um mediums do we maybe have uh available to us that can be really a little bit more concise but can still deliver us a little bit, it can still deliver us those those meaningful outcomes with that approach.
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Um, or looking at, okay, well, we have quite limited um resources or equipment available.
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Can we look at something that is really simplified to body weight, but using a slightly different approach, maybe a higher repetition approach to kind of compensate for that.
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So it's really about being able to look from that clinical lens of what we know from evidence that that works and being able to adjust that for the individual and their constraints as well.
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And that's what is really exciting, actually, because it's a really creative um job and role, and and really building a relationship with an individual and understanding what's actually gonna work best for them is a real uh privilege to be able to sort of have uh an opportunity to engage that conversation, develop some insight into day-to-day life and really establish something that's gonna be meaningful because there is a lot out there that's like, do this, these are the five best exercises you should do for this.
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And that can be really overwhelming when there's a lot of noise, like, well, I'm not doing that, so I'm actually not getting benefits.
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And that's not not the case.
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The the approach can look very different for everyone and sometimes does need to look different if we've got some extra considerations around our pelvic health, around low bone mineral density, around previous injury history.
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And that's where we take a lot of the guesswork out of all of that sort of noise that we can have around us and really find the right best approach for you.
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Can we maybe well maybe look at like why exercise for women is women specifically is so important?
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You touched on a few of those things, but can we maybe delve into a couple more of them?
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Like bone health, maybe we can start there.
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Yeah, absolutely, Meg.
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I think there's so many reasons why we as um females or as women uh benefit from exercise, and we know a lot more about that thanks to uh evidence investigating more into um the unique nature of women.
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We're not small men, we do have unique physiology.
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Thank God for that.
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I'm just saying.
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Good point.
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Yeah, and yeah, I think that's one of the biggest changes that we've we've seen in in health is understanding that unique physiology of of women and that impact of the changing levels of of hormones across our lifespan.
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Like it's such a different, there's different considerations, obviously, for those uh kind of key key milestones of hormonal change as well.
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That can be a lot of people.
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It's been a big conversation that we've had with so many people coming on.
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It's just that hormonal fluctuations drives everything.
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And it's just yeah, so it's great to hear you talking about that in the exercise space as well.
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Yeah, and it it's it's that's what is is unique.
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Like obviously for males, that does happen as well, particularly for males who maybe have prostate cancer or are undergoing some androgen deprivation therapy, they can experience some similar sort of sort of things that have a bit of a bigger change or bigger trajectory of change because of the nature of um medications that are applied there to try and reduce the hormone testosterone um rapidly.
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But for females, we we either through um sort of our natural life course or also through um different treatments or surgeries or uh different conditions can have sort of more distinct or more rapid um changes there as well.
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And that's something can definitely go into a little bit more depth, how that's a little bit different with those extra um considerations.
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But for a for a female, um over the course of our life, we're obviously going through a level of pubescent change where we're sort of really trying to support an increase in our bone mineral density to that point of what we call maximum accrual.
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So that point is where we around 25 to 30, where we've actually reached the maximum building point for our bone density and our muscle mass.
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The body's natural sort of building phase um sort of happens during that, during that period.
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And then after that, we do go through a bit of a steadier sort of decline gradually over the course of our life in our bone mineral density, our muscle mass due to aging, um, which is something we try and offset as much as possible.
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But then we start to see a bit more of a bigger um decline in our muscle mass and our bone density around that perimenopausal and menopausal period.
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And that's where we know so much more about and we can enact a lot more preventative approaches.
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And I'm seeing so many more women around that 30 to 40 year mark really benefiting from some early intervention.
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They don't want to end up in a state where they're osteoporotic or osteopenic with low bone mineral density.
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And we know that particularly exercise, the good use of progressive resistance training and impact loading can have meaningful changes in offsetting that bit more accelerated decline in in musc mass and bone mineral density around that period and with aging as well, and actually seeing better outcomes in reducing the regression to things like osteoporosis and osteopenia.
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Yeah.
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So there's a moment there, I think, too, for us as mums, looking at our, you know, adolescent and young adult children, because I'm older, I have young adult children.
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Um we really should be encouraging them to do some bone, well, some pounding type exercise, exercises that involve, you know, ground reaction forces and and movement right back at that early stage, that's going to set them up for a better perimenopause, menopause, isn't it?
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Is that right?
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Absolutely.
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And I think the key things that as um parents and as the supporters of of young women that we can really encourage is ensuring there's good energy availability is a really, really key factor.
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And um obviously Shelly, sort of in a couple of your ex um episodes as well, gave some really good insight and she has some amazing resources and different things as well.
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But some of the things we really look for, particularly in young athletes, but also adolescents uh who are generally moving, is making sure that there's enough energy availability on board, they're getting the sufficient building blocks and support to be able to appropriately maximize that accrual or that bone building and muscle mass phase.
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That's definitely priority number one.
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And then making sure that we can support them with um the right training loads as well.
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So movement is really important.
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A variety of movement is really important for particularly in that sort of adolescent and young adult um uh stage.
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We know that to sort of reduce risk for things like um stress fractures and relative energy deficiency syndrome, um, and to really support good outcomes long term is to interact with a variety of different movements and sports wherever possible, or doing good cross-training during your off-season or in between your netball season, maybe doing another um uh different sport there as well can be a really helpful thing long term.
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And and really supporting uh individuals to, as I said, around good volume.
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So we talk about volume as like our our um amount of exercise we might do on a day-to-day basis, or amount of exercise we're doing across the course of a week or across the course of a month.
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And adolescents and young adults can be sort of often doing many different sports across the course of the week.
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And that might be in say a winter season, they might be doing netball and soccer, or and then they might have a little bit of a um uh a little bit less sport sort of in in the summer season.
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Their height, their volume is much higher in that sort of winter season, so making sure that they're appropriately sort of building uh and acclimatizing the body to being able to tolerate that amount of demand, that there's the appropriate sort of rest and recovery strategies built into that, that there's good energy and nutrition available and on board for that, and then there's some opportunity to come away from that stimulus after having appropriate recovery, particularly if they're sort of in a competition season or um sort of playing quite a number of um games and and roles there as well.
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So there's diet, variety, and volume are kind of like the three biggest factors we'd look at.
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If and can I add recovery in there?
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Because that was my question, it was gonna be about that because that's it's that thing that we talk about exercise so much, but we forget to talk about the recovery.
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So you go on and then we'll jump back.
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Um I was just gonna say, like, would you would you be specifically training like there's a couple of different angles.
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I'm I'm thinking of like swimmers for for one, like with that are doing repetitive stuff in the water and not necessarily on land.
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But then, like just for I guess other land-based sports, would you be taking adolescents into a gym-based setting with resistant stuff as as well as the sports?
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Absolutely.
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And we we do know that that can actually be not just safe, but really effective in injury reduction and and long-term um uh benefits in terms of bone quality, muscle um strength, and um ability to sort of maintain that long term there as well.
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And definitely in terms of injury risk reduction, uh specific, depending on the um requirements of the sport.
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But we do know that absolutely supporting um adolescents and young adults with again gradual exposure to increasing demands, that's the key element.
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It's when all of a sudden it's like, right, let you're in the gym, you're gonna lift as heavy as possible as soon as you can.
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And it's the same for an adult of any age.
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We want to undergo a period of acclimatization to training.
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So we might start just above what you're doing on a day-to-day basis.
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Like if you can carry your school backpack that has eight kilos worth of books in it, you're probably okay to do an eight kilo goblet squat, um, for example, and then start and looking at specific strength testing, understanding the individual's appropriate baseline and prescribing what we call a relative intensity.
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So that is the right weight or load for that individual based on what we've been able to see through assessment.
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And again, that applies to any individual of any age and it's really the key to being able to understand can we reduce injury risk?
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Can we make sure that we're giving you enough stimulus, not too little, not too much, to be able to get good, meaningful outcomes for you.
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And for our peri- and post-menopausal women, that's really critical because we have less of a buffer.
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When we're sort of a little bit younger, the body is a little bit more adaptable.
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Sometimes we push, yeah, if we push beyond what we call our adaptation threshold, sometimes the consequences aren't as die, you're not spending weeks in with debilitation.
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That's when you come and see us.
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Yeah, jump over to us and with Julian A straight away.
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Um yeah, we tend to find because of that reduced sort of presence of um particularly estrogen there, that at a for our particularly for our soft tissue, for our tendons and stuff, there's not as much of that sort of buffer zone.
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So all of a sudden we do a little bit more than what the body uh has built a tolerance to, and it have it doesn't have the give for that, or it doesn't have the threshold to be able to sort of tolerate that extra demand and we have pain or we have discomfort or we might have injury.
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So then understanding, okay, well, what is the right amount to be starting with, and then working through for for that individual, for you for you, and then working through a process of gradually adding more within what we know to be the body's adaptation threshold, which typically tends to be sort of 10 to 20% increments of that.
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And and on that, that's that is also just because I mean all of our listeners out there, everyone will have a very different um experience or history with exercise and their understanding of what that is.
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So when going back to also when we talk about recovery and that um testing thresholds and things, that's why it's really important for people not to go to a gym and do the same exercises with weights and strength every single day, right?
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Like they need to have a day or two in between.
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What's your advice to people around that?
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Yeah, absolutely.
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So more is not necessarily more when it comes to exercise.
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And like there's we definitely we want to remain active.
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We know that sort of consistent movement is associated with um really good outcomes for cardiac health and reducing uh risk, particularly for females around cardiovascular disease and stroke, which we do have a bit more of an elevated um risk for.
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And we do want to obviously try to reduce sedentary or prolonged time sort of being in one position inactive.
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But it is a process of making sure that there's a good quality stimulus and then there's appropriate recovery to allow for that adaptation to occur to its full potential, that strength to progress, that um bone density to respond before we give it the next stimulus.
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So it's the same as if you are taking a medication and you're only need you're only needing to take that sort of uh in the morning.
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You don't need to be taking it in the morning and in the evening because it's too much for the system.
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It's it's it's um uh that would be an overdose essentially.
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Yeah.
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Um, it's the same for for exercise.
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We do need the appropriate amount of recovery time to be able to make sure that there's appropriate adaptation able to occur, that that recovery process that the body enacts in between the stimulus before we give it another stimulus again or another session.
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So for resistance training, that tends to be, depending on the level of intensity, around 48 hours.
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So a couple of days after them going again is optimal for the same muscle group.
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But there's a few caveats to that as well, because it it is specific to that muscle group.
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So sometimes we can do like an upper body focus session on one day and then a lower body focus session on the next day, and it doesn't have that same sort of impact.
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So this is where it starts to get okay.
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Well, it's yes, but and it starts to get a little bit this is when you need to go and see an EP.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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Because it gets complicated, doesn't it?
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Yeah, and that's where I find social media doesn't help with yes.
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Do these every day and you'll change and you'll transform your back your back pain.
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And that worked for that n equals one in individual, that one individual.
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That's great.
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And it's then sort of they've responded to the or they're engaging with what's click pain as well.
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So it is really finding that noise, but ultimately really sort of looking at okay, well what, yeah, what is really important for that individual?
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It's so so key.
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And being able to come back to finding the right movements for you because there is, it's okay, we'll do a lot of this, but don't do a lot of of that.
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And it is something that we really, I really, we really feel for um for women and and other females as well.
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Around, okay, well, I've tried this, it didn't work, or I'm finding myself just not on the right, getting the right outcomes that I that I'd hoped for.
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And that's typically when we end up seeing someone as well, is to be able to support them in finding the right pathway forward.
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And often it's a case of actually looking at their current situation.
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They're already doing a lot of amazing things, but we need to to adjust how much or we need to look at, we need a little bit more intensity and actually less repetitions to try and stimulate a bit more outcome for your body density or your muscle mass, and really sort of tweaking in into that and and yeah, making sure that it's the the right amount for your for your body and what's that.
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Because that is the other part of adaptation, isn't it, Caitlin?
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Where um so we need to stimulate the body.
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We need to then allow it some time to, as you said, let that adapt within the body so you have your recovery period.
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But the other part of that is if we then just keep doing the same thing for a very long time and we don't change our load and we don't change our reps, we're actually not going to get any adaptation, are we?
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Because we're just we're plateauing off.
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Yeah.
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So what's your advice to women sort of around that in general?
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Like what what what do you say?
00:23:55.759 --> 00:24:07.119
It's a really good point, and it's again, it's tricky because it sort of means okay, well, I finally found this thing that works, and then the body actually needs some new stimulus to to change it up.
00:24:07.200 --> 00:24:23.279
And it it's particularly important for our muscle mass and our bone density that we do introduce what's called novel stimulus or new stimulus, typically around sort of six to 12 weeks, usually like eight to 12 weeks is a good time frame to be changing.
00:24:23.359 --> 00:24:43.039
If you're doing a consistent or a progressive resistance training or strength training set of exercises, and you're trying to take your weights up gradually, um, sort of uh over the course of that time frame, you'll reach a point where the body, if for the same exercises, won't be able to continue to increase the weights.
00:24:43.119 --> 00:24:47.839
And we we call that sort of the upper limit in terms of that adaptation capacity.
00:24:48.000 --> 00:24:51.279
And that's the timing when we start to introduce new exercises.
00:24:51.359 --> 00:25:04.640
And those exercises might be a progression on the existing ones, or they might be a different variation to try and target into different muscle groups or into different um directions of load because for the bones.
00:25:04.720 --> 00:25:22.319
So the bones really need different directional forces, which is why something like running is great for the bones, but because it's only happening in a in a forward um trajectory, we're not getting sort of those other direction, directional loads for the bones.
00:25:22.400 --> 00:25:48.000
And that's where women and females often come into being a little bit higher risk for fracture if they've got that pre-existing low bone mineral density, and maybe they haven't had sort of that multi-directional uh stimulus for the bone micro architecture, which is what we know that impact and resistance training can really have a meaningful impact is that actual structure and force tolerance of the bone.
00:25:48.160 --> 00:26:02.079
So if we have something like a fall or an unexpected um uh impact, the body's established some some tolerance to that, either to that level or or beyond, and that risk of fracture is significantly lower.
00:26:02.319 --> 00:26:20.319
Um, so definitely looking at okay, making sure that we're building the body beyond what it can tolerate at the moment to being able to tolerate more, building its robustness and really being able to sort of look at all kinds of aspects of really preventative um uh implications there as well.
00:26:20.559 --> 00:26:20.880
Yeah.
00:26:21.039 --> 00:26:21.359
Yeah.
00:26:21.759 --> 00:26:22.319
Makes sense.
00:26:22.640 --> 00:26:56.799
Because the way to change exercise around would be to increase load, increase the number of repetitions you do, um, increase, as you said, the functional capacity of an exercise as well, or the complexity of an exercise in that someone at home might be doing, say, a biceps curl, but that's like a very isolated and individual exercise, which can be you could put the same amount of time and effort into something that's working a few more muscle groups and is actually a more functional part of your day.
00:26:57.039 --> 00:27:09.519
Is that when you're seeing somebody maybe for the first time, do you start right down at that level where you are doing very simple um one joint or two-joint sort of muscle exercises?
00:27:09.680 --> 00:27:15.920
Or do you or do you try and have a bit of variety and put a little bit of functional training in there from the get-go?
00:27:16.079 --> 00:27:18.640
Like what how do you how do you scope that?
00:27:19.680 --> 00:27:20.400
Absolutely.
00:27:20.559 --> 00:27:23.200
Again, that will come back to an it depends for the individual.
00:27:23.279 --> 00:27:33.599
What what is their existing, what is their existing uh exercise patterning looking like in terms of what are they exposed to already, or what have they adapted to already?
00:27:33.839 --> 00:27:40.400
So for someone who's maybe what we call like a novice or a newer exerciser or hasn't exercised for a prolonged period, we will.
00:27:40.799 --> 00:27:42.559
I would call that couch potato.
00:27:42.720 --> 00:27:43.759
Okay, Lynn you're allowed.
00:27:43.839 --> 00:27:48.559
I'd just say couch potato because I've been that at certain times in my life and it's okay.
00:27:49.359 --> 00:27:53.200
Novice sounds like novice sounds like a I'm in a nunnery somewhere, though.
00:27:53.519 --> 00:27:55.599
Like sounds like I'm a novitiate, you know.
00:27:56.319 --> 00:27:58.720
Yeah, we're very exercise amazing.
00:27:58.880 --> 00:28:02.480
No, I love it, I love it, I love it terminology, but I'm just saying.
00:28:04.240 --> 00:28:06.480
Sorry, if I interrupted, if you're a novice.
00:28:06.799 --> 00:28:08.160
No, no, no, I love it.
00:28:08.559 --> 00:28:09.440
Say your prayers.
00:28:10.240 --> 00:28:19.039
So yeah, someone who is um a uh former couch potato, novice, new or reformed.
00:28:19.119 --> 00:28:19.440
Yeah.
00:28:19.599 --> 00:28:22.000
Um see in the light.
00:28:22.160 --> 00:28:22.720
There's a light.
00:28:25.200 --> 00:28:32.240
Life will take us into circumstances where we actually have less capacity or we actually might not be able to exercise for a period.
00:28:32.400 --> 00:28:58.720
And for some people that can be really challenging because they m they might actually really rely on exercise quite a lot for sort of mental health and well-being, and they and they know how much had exercise has been a big part of their life, and things have come up in their life from in uh the areas that I work in, often a cancer diagnosis, that sort of derails what is uh typically a pretty steadily moving along trajectory.
00:28:59.200 --> 00:29:08.720
Life's busy, things are we've we've got our we've got our routine and we've got things all together, and then all of a sudden something comes up and it it it sort of sends us off our our path.
00:29:08.960 --> 00:29:20.720
So it is so common that individuals will find themselves in a state where they haven't exercised for a while, or exercise has had to look a bit different, and it can be a tricky place to start.
00:29:20.880 --> 00:29:38.880
But if we're looking for that type of individual, we're really looking ideally at starting with absolutely those bigger muscle groups or what we call compound movements, which is where you're involving multiple joints at the same time because they're gonna give us the most what we call bang for bang for your butt.
00:29:38.960 --> 00:29:42.480
That's what I that's exactly the terminology I use bang for your butt.
00:29:42.720 --> 00:29:43.200
That's what you want.
00:29:43.680 --> 00:29:44.319
Bang for your butt.
00:29:44.400 --> 00:29:49.920
Yeah, and that's what we look at for busy individuals as well is how can we create a really concise program?
00:29:50.079 --> 00:29:51.680
What's the minimum dose?
00:29:51.920 --> 00:29:57.920
If we're limited on time, what's the minimum dose of exercise that we need to see meaningful change?
00:29:58.000 --> 00:30:11.519
And we can see that with really reduced numbers of exercise or reduced frequency of exercise, because that might be all that we can we can uh accommodate for in our in our day-to-day life or with our resources that we have available to us.
00:30:11.839 --> 00:30:18.720
But on a typical, yeah, on a typical approach, it would be absolutely starting out with compound movements because we know that.
00:30:18.799 --> 00:30:28.240
So that could be something like absolutely like a squat, that could be something like a deadlift we know to be a really amazing mover, but not always something that people can start straight into.
00:30:28.319 --> 00:30:31.200
We might use a few different movements to get to that point.
00:30:31.440 --> 00:30:58.000
Things like a seated row, a lat cool down, um, are things that give us sort of multiple muscle groups at the same time and set us up to be able to then move in towards more isolated muscle groups where we could maybe look at a bit more of a split program where there's we're covering more exercises and more muscle groups over the course of a couple of different programs or a couple of different types of exercise approach.
00:30:58.079 --> 00:31:05.599
You might be doing a couple of different classes or something like that, and we need to sort of fill in the blanks so we're covering as many bases as as possible.
00:31:06.000 --> 00:31:14.960
Um, but absolutely it's it's typically working from a bigger muscle group approach, and we will get more benefits from that metabolic approach.
00:31:15.200 --> 00:31:52.960
So that body's ability to be able to increase sort of insulin sensitivity and reduce insulin resistance, which we can be a bit of a characteristic of period and post-menopause or period, and can be associated with also some of that unwanted uh fucking that we tend to see um around that period, which can be really uh challenging and distressing for women who have never had an issue for with that in their lifetime, and then all of a sudden they're seeing sort of a bit more of a difficulty sort of navigating um their the weight that they feel comfortable with, or a bit of a different sort of body image there as well.
00:31:53.200 --> 00:32:12.880
So um, yeah, that was a bit of a tangent to sort of talk about that sort of metabolic health, but absolutely stimulating those big muscle groups can play a role, role there and and really sort of relates it back to how valuable different types of exercise can be as a flow-on effect for women for many different stages as well.
00:32:17.359 --> 00:32:20.319
Well, guys, we hope you're feeling motivated after that one.
00:32:20.400 --> 00:32:21.119
We sure are.
00:32:21.279 --> 00:32:25.680
We covered a lot in there, including the basics of training.
00:32:25.839 --> 00:32:26.240
Yeah.
00:32:26.559 --> 00:32:31.039
Variety, energy, volume, and recovery.
00:32:31.359 --> 00:32:35.839
So applying these um can really help within an exercise program.
00:32:36.160 --> 00:32:39.039
Uh hope you got a lot out of it, and there's more to come next week.
00:32:39.200 --> 00:32:39.920
See you then.
00:32:40.160 --> 00:32:40.640
Bye.
00:32:41.200 --> 00:32:44.480
And that's a wrap for today's episode of Healthy Banter.
00:32:44.799 --> 00:32:50.720
We hope you're leaving with something useful and maybe something worth sharing with a friend, because that's what we're all about.
00:32:50.960 --> 00:32:54.160
Women supporting women, one honest chat at a time.
00:32:54.400 --> 00:33:05.519
If you loved hanging out with us, make sure to share, follow, or subscribe on Instagram, YouTube, Spotify, or just head to healthybanter.com.au so you never miss an episode.
00:33:05.839 --> 00:33:10.000
Take the advice that helps, ditch the guilt, and keep cheering for yourself.
00:33:10.240 --> 00:33:15.440
We'll see you next week for more stories, more science, and even more banter.
00:33:16.559 --> 00:33:20.000
Healthy Bander is hosted, produced, and edited by Megan Jules.
00:33:20.240 --> 00:33:23.039
Our main music theme is composed by Ada Akbal.
00:33:23.519 --> 00:33:26.000
Healthy Bander is not a licensed health service.
00:33:26.160 --> 00:33:30.079
It is not a substitute for professional health advice, treatment or assessment.
00:33:30.319 --> 00:33:38.720
The advice given in this episode is general in nature, but if you are in need of individual advice or consultation, please see a healthcare professional.
00:33:38.960 --> 00:33:43.599
If you are struggling, call Lifeline on 13314.
00:00:07.759 --> 00:00:14.480
Welcome to Healthy Banta, the podcast where women's health gets real relatable and just a little bit cheeky.
00:00:14.800 --> 00:00:19.839
We'd like to begin this podcast by acknowledging the traditional owners on the land on which we meet today.
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We would also like to pay respects for elders past and present.
00:00:25.920 --> 00:00:34.320
We are incredibly lucky to be joined by Caitlin Clark today, who is an accredited exercise physiologist or EP in the Brisbane area.
00:00:34.479 --> 00:00:39.359
I'm going to read a quick bio to introduce you to Caitlin and let you know what she's achieved so far.
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Caitlin is an accredited exercise physiologist and exercise oncology specialist supporting patients in private practice at BodyTrack Exercise Physiology Tewong, Brisbane.
00:00:51.679 --> 00:00:57.520
She has completed postgraduate study in exercise medicine oncology and has a special interest in women's health.
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Caitlin works closely with patients and their medical and allied health teams to create highly individualized and evidence-based exercise interventions to optimize health outcomes and quality of life.
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She is especially interested in supporting women during the perimenopause and postmenopause transition, particularly those who have undergone medically or surgically induced menopause, where symptom burden can be unfortunately much higher.
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Caitlin is extremely passionate about the incredible benefits and power of exercise, not only as a medicine, but its capacity for women to take control of their health when life often feels like it is in control of the wheel.
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Beyond clinical practice, Caitlin is a university guest lecturer, clinical educator, and industry mentor with a passion for supporting EP students and graduates to feel more confident and capable in women's health and oncology support.
00:01:53.359 --> 00:01:54.480
Welcome, Caitlin.
00:01:55.120 --> 00:01:55.599
Thank you.
00:01:55.840 --> 00:01:58.000
Thank you so much for joining us today on Healthy Banta.
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We really appreciate your time.
00:02:01.599 --> 00:02:03.920
Thank you so much, Megan Jules, for having me.
00:02:04.079 --> 00:02:15.199
This has been something I've been really looking forward to having the privilege of being on this really exciting conversation that you have both instigated with some other really amazing health professionals.
00:02:15.280 --> 00:02:19.919
So now it's a real privilege to be on here as an exercise physiologist representative.
00:02:20.159 --> 00:02:20.400
Yeah.
00:02:20.719 --> 00:02:22.800
You're right up there with all the best of them, Caitlin.
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So we're very happy to have you.
00:02:25.199 --> 00:02:26.479
So happy to have you.
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Caitlin, you're like, we know how passionate you are about exercise and you know its its use as a medicine.
00:02:34.479 --> 00:02:37.199
What fueled this passion for you?
00:02:38.159 --> 00:02:39.680
Yeah, that's a great question.
00:02:39.840 --> 00:02:51.599
I think I've always loved uh the understanding of the ability of exercise to really sort of function as something more than just an opportunity for fitness.
00:02:51.840 --> 00:03:11.199
I think it really translates to a real element, particularly in the spaces that I work in in oncology and women's health, in actually being able to provide individuals with an element of control over their health when sometimes there can be quite a few elements outside of our control.
00:03:11.680 --> 00:03:38.319
And being able to sort of facilitate not only great social and emotional benefits, but actually really creating really meaningful physiological outcomes for someone in terms of disease prevention, disease management, injury prevention, injury management, and really being able to optimize long-term health outcomes is a pretty amazing thing to be able to do from something as um well, as simple as exercise.
00:03:38.479 --> 00:03:51.599
Yeah, which isn't always super simple, but that's where we as exercise physiologists can really play a role to hopefully, yeah, continue to keep breaking down those those barriers so that everyone can access this pretty amazing, uh, pretty amazing medicine.
00:03:52.000 --> 00:03:52.719
Yeah, totally.
00:03:52.960 --> 00:04:03.280
And I think that is a really good point, Caitlin, because we don't tend to think, I think, as just women functioning every day, we don't tend to think of exercise as such an important part of our lives.
00:04:03.439 --> 00:04:10.639
Like often we will put ourselves at the bottom of the list, and with that goes anything that we would do for ourselves, like exercise.
00:04:10.800 --> 00:04:17.920
I mean, I think we're very good at taking our medicines, but we quite forget that exercise is a really important medicine.
00:04:18.240 --> 00:04:22.639
Like it it it is doing as much for our body as some of the medications that we take are.
00:04:23.199 --> 00:04:32.399
Yeah, I think particularly if we're not if someone doesn't love exercise, you know, if someone if if it is a chore for someone, you know, it's a lot harder to motivate them.
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I think it's it can be hard because a lot of us actually do know how important and valuable exercise is, but sometimes we might not actually have the means or the capacity or have had problems with exercise historically that have created further barriers to being able to reintegrate with that.
00:04:48.720 --> 00:05:10.480
And I think that's a real privilege of the role of an exercise physiologist and being able to support individuals to open the doors to the right types of exercise for them so that they can still access those really important benefits and they're not limited by those barriers which can yeah prevent them from being able to see really good changes to their health as well.
00:05:10.560 --> 00:05:27.680
And I think that really does drive my passion is being able to allow more people to um uh access these great benefits who maybe might not have considered themselves exercisers in the sense of um what sometimes people may perceive as as necessary to see good change.
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Yeah.
00:05:28.800 --> 00:05:37.680
And and with that, I think sometimes people like you were saying, they have the motivation and they know they should be exercising, but it's like, where do I start?
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Or or or or how do I get this as a part of my life?
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What how do you how do you help women in that moment?
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Like what's your best advice for them then?
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Absolutely, and I think it's really understanding, okay, well, what's what are the elements that are going to be really important to try and from a clinical aspect, what are we, what are we needing to try and best um optimize as many aspects of of your health holistically?
00:06:02.959 --> 00:06:05.199
Do we need to have a bit of focus in on boring density?
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Do we need to have a bit of focus in on um maintaining muscle mass, optimizing um cardiometabolic health or heart health, um control of um our blood sugars metabolic sort of state there as well?
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And then really actually looking, okay, well, what are the sort of current barriers for that individual?
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Is it time or is it resources?
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And therefore looking at, okay, well, what um mediums do we maybe have uh available to us that can be really a little bit more concise but can still deliver us a little bit, it can still deliver us those those meaningful outcomes with that approach.
00:06:41.839 --> 00:06:47.519
Um, or looking at, okay, well, we have quite limited um resources or equipment available.
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Can we look at something that is really simplified to body weight, but using a slightly different approach, maybe a higher repetition approach to kind of compensate for that.
00:07:00.480 --> 00:07:13.600
So it's really about being able to look from that clinical lens of what we know from evidence that that works and being able to adjust that for the individual and their constraints as well.
00:07:13.680 --> 00:07:42.240
And that's what is really exciting, actually, because it's a really creative um job and role, and and really building a relationship with an individual and understanding what's actually gonna work best for them is a real uh privilege to be able to sort of have uh an opportunity to engage that conversation, develop some insight into day-to-day life and really establish something that's gonna be meaningful because there is a lot out there that's like, do this, these are the five best exercises you should do for this.
00:07:42.319 --> 00:07:48.639
And that can be really overwhelming when there's a lot of noise, like, well, I'm not doing that, so I'm actually not getting benefits.
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And that's not not the case.
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The the approach can look very different for everyone and sometimes does need to look different if we've got some extra considerations around our pelvic health, around low bone mineral density, around previous injury history.
00:08:03.839 --> 00:08:14.000
And that's where we take a lot of the guesswork out of all of that sort of noise that we can have around us and really find the right best approach for you.
00:08:15.040 --> 00:08:23.439
Can we maybe well maybe look at like why exercise for women is women specifically is so important?
00:08:23.600 --> 00:08:27.839
You touched on a few of those things, but can we maybe delve into a couple more of them?
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Like bone health, maybe we can start there.
00:08:30.800 --> 00:08:32.720
Yeah, absolutely, Meg.
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I think there's so many reasons why we as um females or as women uh benefit from exercise, and we know a lot more about that thanks to uh evidence investigating more into um the unique nature of women.
00:08:46.720 --> 00:08:49.279
We're not small men, we do have unique physiology.
00:08:49.919 --> 00:08:50.799
Thank God for that.
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I'm just saying.
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Good point.
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Yeah, and yeah, I think that's one of the biggest changes that we've we've seen in in health is understanding that unique physiology of of women and that impact of the changing levels of of hormones across our lifespan.
00:09:10.559 --> 00:09:18.639
Like it's such a different, there's different considerations, obviously, for those uh kind of key key milestones of hormonal change as well.
00:09:18.799 --> 00:09:19.200
That can be a lot of people.
00:09:19.440 --> 00:09:23.919
It's been a big conversation that we've had with so many people coming on.
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It's just that hormonal fluctuations drives everything.
00:09:28.399 --> 00:09:33.519
And it's just yeah, so it's great to hear you talking about that in the exercise space as well.
00:09:33.919 --> 00:09:36.399
Yeah, and it it's it's that's what is is unique.
00:09:36.559 --> 00:09:59.279
Like obviously for males, that does happen as well, particularly for males who maybe have prostate cancer or are undergoing some androgen deprivation therapy, they can experience some similar sort of sort of things that have a bit of a bigger change or bigger trajectory of change because of the nature of um medications that are applied there to try and reduce the hormone testosterone um rapidly.
00:09:59.519 --> 00:10:13.919
But for females, we we either through um sort of our natural life course or also through um different treatments or surgeries or uh different conditions can have sort of more distinct or more rapid um changes there as well.
00:10:14.000 --> 00:10:21.440
And that's something can definitely go into a little bit more depth, how that's a little bit different with those extra um considerations.
00:10:21.679 --> 00:10:36.960
But for a for a female, um over the course of our life, we're obviously going through a level of pubescent change where we're sort of really trying to support an increase in our bone mineral density to that point of what we call maximum accrual.
00:10:37.440 --> 00:10:47.679
So that point is where we around 25 to 30, where we've actually reached the maximum building point for our bone density and our muscle mass.
00:10:47.840 --> 00:10:54.480
The body's natural sort of building phase um sort of happens during that, during that period.
00:10:54.639 --> 00:11:09.440
And then after that, we do go through a bit of a steadier sort of decline gradually over the course of our life in our bone mineral density, our muscle mass due to aging, um, which is something we try and offset as much as possible.
00:11:09.600 --> 00:11:18.879
But then we start to see a bit more of a bigger um decline in our muscle mass and our bone density around that perimenopausal and menopausal period.
00:11:18.960 --> 00:11:25.679
And that's where we know so much more about and we can enact a lot more preventative approaches.
00:11:25.840 --> 00:11:32.720
And I'm seeing so many more women around that 30 to 40 year mark really benefiting from some early intervention.
00:11:32.879 --> 00:11:38.639
They don't want to end up in a state where they're osteoporotic or osteopenic with low bone mineral density.
00:11:38.720 --> 00:12:03.039
And we know that particularly exercise, the good use of progressive resistance training and impact loading can have meaningful changes in offsetting that bit more accelerated decline in in musc mass and bone mineral density around that period and with aging as well, and actually seeing better outcomes in reducing the regression to things like osteoporosis and osteopenia.
00:12:03.519 --> 00:12:03.679
Yeah.
00:12:04.080 --> 00:12:12.799
So there's a moment there, I think, too, for us as mums, looking at our, you know, adolescent and young adult children, because I'm older, I have young adult children.
00:12:12.960 --> 00:12:32.960
Um we really should be encouraging them to do some bone, well, some pounding type exercise, exercises that involve, you know, ground reaction forces and and movement right back at that early stage, that's going to set them up for a better perimenopause, menopause, isn't it?
00:12:33.120 --> 00:12:33.840
Is that right?
00:12:34.639 --> 00:12:35.279
Absolutely.
00:12:35.440 --> 00:12:50.720
And I think the key things that as um parents and as the supporters of of young women that we can really encourage is ensuring there's good energy availability is a really, really key factor.
00:12:50.879 --> 00:12:59.919
And um obviously Shelly, sort of in a couple of your ex um episodes as well, gave some really good insight and she has some amazing resources and different things as well.
00:13:00.159 --> 00:13:20.399
But some of the things we really look for, particularly in young athletes, but also adolescents uh who are generally moving, is making sure that there's enough energy availability on board, they're getting the sufficient building blocks and support to be able to appropriately maximize that accrual or that bone building and muscle mass phase.
00:13:20.480 --> 00:13:22.799
That's definitely priority number one.
00:13:23.120 --> 00:13:28.879
And then making sure that we can support them with um the right training loads as well.
00:13:29.039 --> 00:13:30.399
So movement is really important.
00:13:30.480 --> 00:13:37.360
A variety of movement is really important for particularly in that sort of adolescent and young adult um uh stage.
00:13:37.600 --> 00:14:05.919
We know that to sort of reduce risk for things like um stress fractures and relative energy deficiency syndrome, um, and to really support good outcomes long term is to interact with a variety of different movements and sports wherever possible, or doing good cross-training during your off-season or in between your netball season, maybe doing another um uh different sport there as well can be a really helpful thing long term.
00:14:06.240 --> 00:14:12.480
And and really supporting uh individuals to, as I said, around good volume.
00:14:12.639 --> 00:14:23.039
So we talk about volume as like our our um amount of exercise we might do on a day-to-day basis, or amount of exercise we're doing across the course of a week or across the course of a month.
00:14:23.200 --> 00:14:30.399
And adolescents and young adults can be sort of often doing many different sports across the course of the week.
00:14:30.480 --> 00:14:41.600
And that might be in say a winter season, they might be doing netball and soccer, or and then they might have a little bit of a um uh a little bit less sport sort of in in the summer season.
00:14:41.679 --> 00:15:14.240
Their height, their volume is much higher in that sort of winter season, so making sure that they're appropriately sort of building uh and acclimatizing the body to being able to tolerate that amount of demand, that there's the appropriate sort of rest and recovery strategies built into that, that there's good energy and nutrition available and on board for that, and then there's some opportunity to come away from that stimulus after having appropriate recovery, particularly if they're sort of in a competition season or um sort of playing quite a number of um games and and roles there as well.
00:15:14.559 --> 00:15:20.720
So there's diet, variety, and volume are kind of like the three biggest factors we'd look at.
00:15:21.200 --> 00:15:23.279
If and can I add recovery in there?
00:15:23.519 --> 00:15:30.879
Because that was my question, it was gonna be about that because that's it's that thing that we talk about exercise so much, but we forget to talk about the recovery.
00:15:31.279 --> 00:15:33.200
So you go on and then we'll jump back.
00:15:33.440 --> 00:15:39.200
Um I was just gonna say, like, would you would you be specifically training like there's a couple of different angles.
00:15:39.279 --> 00:15:46.080
I'm I'm thinking of like swimmers for for one, like with that are doing repetitive stuff in the water and not necessarily on land.
00:15:46.480 --> 00:15:57.919
But then, like just for I guess other land-based sports, would you be taking adolescents into a gym-based setting with resistant stuff as as well as the sports?
00:15:58.480 --> 00:15:59.039
Absolutely.
00:15:59.200 --> 00:16:15.039
And we we do know that that can actually be not just safe, but really effective in injury reduction and and long-term um uh benefits in terms of bone quality, muscle um strength, and um ability to sort of maintain that long term there as well.
00:16:15.200 --> 00:16:22.480
And definitely in terms of injury risk reduction, uh specific, depending on the um requirements of the sport.
00:16:22.720 --> 00:16:33.759
But we do know that absolutely supporting um adolescents and young adults with again gradual exposure to increasing demands, that's the key element.
00:16:34.000 --> 00:16:41.279
It's when all of a sudden it's like, right, let you're in the gym, you're gonna lift as heavy as possible as soon as you can.
00:16:41.519 --> 00:16:43.919
And it's the same for an adult of any age.
00:16:44.000 --> 00:16:48.000
We want to undergo a period of acclimatization to training.
00:16:48.080 --> 00:16:52.639
So we might start just above what you're doing on a day-to-day basis.
00:16:52.799 --> 00:17:13.920
Like if you can carry your school backpack that has eight kilos worth of books in it, you're probably okay to do an eight kilo goblet squat, um, for example, and then start and looking at specific strength testing, understanding the individual's appropriate baseline and prescribing what we call a relative intensity.
00:17:14.079 --> 00:17:21.200
So that is the right weight or load for that individual based on what we've been able to see through assessment.
00:17:21.279 --> 00:17:30.000
And again, that applies to any individual of any age and it's really the key to being able to understand can we reduce injury risk?
00:17:30.240 --> 00:17:39.359
Can we make sure that we're giving you enough stimulus, not too little, not too much, to be able to get good, meaningful outcomes for you.
00:17:39.519 --> 00:17:45.359
And for our peri- and post-menopausal women, that's really critical because we have less of a buffer.
00:17:45.599 --> 00:17:49.359
When we're sort of a little bit younger, the body is a little bit more adaptable.
00:17:49.519 --> 00:17:58.720
Sometimes we push, yeah, if we push beyond what we call our adaptation threshold, sometimes the consequences aren't as die, you're not spending weeks in with debilitation.
00:17:59.039 --> 00:18:00.000
That's when you come and see us.
00:18:01.279 --> 00:18:05.519
Yeah, jump over to us and with Julian A straight away.
00:18:05.759 --> 00:18:21.440
Um yeah, we tend to find because of that reduced sort of presence of um particularly estrogen there, that at a for our particularly for our soft tissue, for our tendons and stuff, there's not as much of that sort of buffer zone.
00:18:21.599 --> 00:18:38.720
So all of a sudden we do a little bit more than what the body uh has built a tolerance to, and it have it doesn't have the give for that, or it doesn't have the threshold to be able to sort of tolerate that extra demand and we have pain or we have discomfort or we might have injury.
00:18:38.960 --> 00:18:58.559
So then understanding, okay, well, what is the right amount to be starting with, and then working through for for that individual, for you for you, and then working through a process of gradually adding more within what we know to be the body's adaptation threshold, which typically tends to be sort of 10 to 20% increments of that.
00:18:59.119 --> 00:19:11.519
And and on that, that's that is also just because I mean all of our listeners out there, everyone will have a very different um experience or history with exercise and their understanding of what that is.
00:19:11.920 --> 00:19:26.319
So when going back to also when we talk about recovery and that um testing thresholds and things, that's why it's really important for people not to go to a gym and do the same exercises with weights and strength every single day, right?
00:19:26.400 --> 00:19:29.519
Like they need to have a day or two in between.
00:19:29.680 --> 00:19:32.480
What's your advice to people around that?
00:19:33.519 --> 00:19:34.960
Yeah, absolutely.
00:19:35.119 --> 00:19:38.559
So more is not necessarily more when it comes to exercise.
00:19:38.640 --> 00:19:42.799
And like there's we definitely we want to remain active.
00:19:42.880 --> 00:19:57.759
We know that sort of consistent movement is associated with um really good outcomes for cardiac health and reducing uh risk, particularly for females around cardiovascular disease and stroke, which we do have a bit more of an elevated um risk for.
00:19:57.920 --> 00:20:05.839
And we do want to obviously try to reduce sedentary or prolonged time sort of being in one position inactive.
00:20:06.720 --> 00:20:27.519
But it is a process of making sure that there's a good quality stimulus and then there's appropriate recovery to allow for that adaptation to occur to its full potential, that strength to progress, that um bone density to respond before we give it the next stimulus.
00:20:27.759 --> 00:20:36.240
So it's the same as if you are taking a medication and you're only need you're only needing to take that sort of uh in the morning.
00:20:36.319 --> 00:20:40.319
You don't need to be taking it in the morning and in the evening because it's too much for the system.
00:20:40.400 --> 00:20:44.319
It's it's it's um uh that would be an overdose essentially.
00:20:44.480 --> 00:20:44.720
Yeah.
00:20:44.880 --> 00:20:46.960
Um, it's the same for for exercise.
00:20:47.119 --> 00:21:02.720
We do need the appropriate amount of recovery time to be able to make sure that there's appropriate adaptation able to occur, that that recovery process that the body enacts in between the stimulus before we give it another stimulus again or another session.
00:21:02.880 --> 00:21:09.200
So for resistance training, that tends to be, depending on the level of intensity, around 48 hours.
00:21:09.279 --> 00:21:14.640
So a couple of days after them going again is optimal for the same muscle group.
00:21:14.880 --> 00:21:21.119
But there's a few caveats to that as well, because it it is specific to that muscle group.
00:21:21.279 --> 00:21:30.880
So sometimes we can do like an upper body focus session on one day and then a lower body focus session on the next day, and it doesn't have that same sort of impact.
00:21:31.039 --> 00:21:33.759
So this is where it starts to get okay.
00:21:33.920 --> 00:21:39.440
Well, it's yes, but and it starts to get a little bit this is when you need to go and see an EP.
00:21:39.759 --> 00:21:41.519
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:21:42.000 --> 00:21:43.440
Because it gets complicated, doesn't it?
00:21:44.480 --> 00:21:49.279
Yeah, and that's where I find social media doesn't help with yes.
00:21:50.319 --> 00:21:54.400
Do these every day and you'll change and you'll transform your back your back pain.
00:21:54.480 --> 00:21:59.279
And that worked for that n equals one in individual, that one individual.
00:21:59.359 --> 00:21:59.839
That's great.
00:22:00.240 --> 00:22:07.200
And it's then sort of they've responded to the or they're engaging with what's click pain as well.
00:22:07.519 --> 00:22:19.119
So it is really finding that noise, but ultimately really sort of looking at okay, well what, yeah, what is really important for that individual?
00:22:19.200 --> 00:22:20.799
It's so so key.
00:22:21.119 --> 00:22:30.400
And being able to come back to finding the right movements for you because there is, it's okay, we'll do a lot of this, but don't do a lot of of that.
00:22:30.480 --> 00:22:36.880
And it is something that we really, I really, we really feel for um for women and and other females as well.
00:22:36.960 --> 00:22:45.839
Around, okay, well, I've tried this, it didn't work, or I'm finding myself just not on the right, getting the right outcomes that I that I'd hoped for.
00:22:45.920 --> 00:22:52.000
And that's typically when we end up seeing someone as well, is to be able to support them in finding the right pathway forward.
00:22:52.079 --> 00:22:55.839
And often it's a case of actually looking at their current situation.
00:22:55.920 --> 00:23:18.799
They're already doing a lot of amazing things, but we need to to adjust how much or we need to look at, we need a little bit more intensity and actually less repetitions to try and stimulate a bit more outcome for your body density or your muscle mass, and really sort of tweaking in into that and and yeah, making sure that it's the the right amount for your for your body and what's that.
00:23:19.119 --> 00:23:21.680
Because that is the other part of adaptation, isn't it, Caitlin?
00:23:21.920 --> 00:23:25.839
Where um so we need to stimulate the body.
00:23:26.079 --> 00:23:31.920
We need to then allow it some time to, as you said, let that adapt within the body so you have your recovery period.
00:23:32.319 --> 00:23:44.640
But the other part of that is if we then just keep doing the same thing for a very long time and we don't change our load and we don't change our reps, we're actually not going to get any adaptation, are we?
00:23:44.880 --> 00:23:46.480
Because we're just we're plateauing off.
00:23:47.759 --> 00:23:47.920
Yeah.
00:23:48.319 --> 00:23:52.720
So what's your advice to women sort of around that in general?
00:23:52.880 --> 00:23:54.400
Like what what what do you say?
00:23:55.759 --> 00:24:07.119
It's a really good point, and it's again, it's tricky because it sort of means okay, well, I finally found this thing that works, and then the body actually needs some new stimulus to to change it up.
00:24:07.200 --> 00:24:23.279
And it it's particularly important for our muscle mass and our bone density that we do introduce what's called novel stimulus or new stimulus, typically around sort of six to 12 weeks, usually like eight to 12 weeks is a good time frame to be changing.
00:24:23.359 --> 00:24:43.039
If you're doing a consistent or a progressive resistance training or strength training set of exercises, and you're trying to take your weights up gradually, um, sort of uh over the course of that time frame, you'll reach a point where the body, if for the same exercises, won't be able to continue to increase the weights.
00:24:43.119 --> 00:24:47.839
And we we call that sort of the upper limit in terms of that adaptation capacity.
00:24:48.000 --> 00:24:51.279
And that's the timing when we start to introduce new exercises.
00:24:51.359 --> 00:25:04.640
And those exercises might be a progression on the existing ones, or they might be a different variation to try and target into different muscle groups or into different um directions of load because for the bones.
00:25:04.720 --> 00:25:22.319
So the bones really need different directional forces, which is why something like running is great for the bones, but because it's only happening in a in a forward um trajectory, we're not getting sort of those other direction, directional loads for the bones.
00:25:22.400 --> 00:25:48.000
And that's where women and females often come into being a little bit higher risk for fracture if they've got that pre-existing low bone mineral density, and maybe they haven't had sort of that multi-directional uh stimulus for the bone micro architecture, which is what we know that impact and resistance training can really have a meaningful impact is that actual structure and force tolerance of the bone.
00:25:48.160 --> 00:26:02.079
So if we have something like a fall or an unexpected um uh impact, the body's established some some tolerance to that, either to that level or or beyond, and that risk of fracture is significantly lower.
00:26:02.319 --> 00:26:20.319
Um, so definitely looking at okay, making sure that we're building the body beyond what it can tolerate at the moment to being able to tolerate more, building its robustness and really being able to sort of look at all kinds of aspects of really preventative um uh implications there as well.
00:26:20.559 --> 00:26:20.880
Yeah.
00:26:21.039 --> 00:26:21.359
Yeah.
00:26:21.759 --> 00:26:22.319
Makes sense.
00:26:22.640 --> 00:26:56.799
Because the way to change exercise around would be to increase load, increase the number of repetitions you do, um, increase, as you said, the functional capacity of an exercise as well, or the complexity of an exercise in that someone at home might be doing, say, a biceps curl, but that's like a very isolated and individual exercise, which can be you could put the same amount of time and effort into something that's working a few more muscle groups and is actually a more functional part of your day.
00:26:57.039 --> 00:27:09.519
Is that when you're seeing somebody maybe for the first time, do you start right down at that level where you are doing very simple um one joint or two-joint sort of muscle exercises?
00:27:09.680 --> 00:27:15.920
Or do you or do you try and have a bit of variety and put a little bit of functional training in there from the get-go?
00:27:16.079 --> 00:27:18.640
Like what how do you how do you scope that?
00:27:19.680 --> 00:27:20.400
Absolutely.
00:27:20.559 --> 00:27:23.200
Again, that will come back to an it depends for the individual.
00:27:23.279 --> 00:27:33.599
What what is their existing, what is their existing uh exercise patterning looking like in terms of what are they exposed to already, or what have they adapted to already?
00:27:33.839 --> 00:27:40.400
So for someone who's maybe what we call like a novice or a newer exerciser or hasn't exercised for a prolonged period, we will.
00:27:40.799 --> 00:27:42.559
I would call that couch potato.
00:27:42.720 --> 00:27:43.759
Okay, Lynn you're allowed.
00:27:43.839 --> 00:27:48.559
I'd just say couch potato because I've been that at certain times in my life and it's okay.
00:27:49.359 --> 00:27:53.200
Novice sounds like novice sounds like a I'm in a nunnery somewhere, though.
00:27:53.519 --> 00:27:55.599
Like sounds like I'm a novitiate, you know.
00:27:56.319 --> 00:27:58.720
Yeah, we're very exercise amazing.
00:27:58.880 --> 00:28:02.480
No, I love it, I love it, I love it terminology, but I'm just saying.
00:28:04.240 --> 00:28:06.480
Sorry, if I interrupted, if you're a novice.
00:28:06.799 --> 00:28:08.160
No, no, no, I love it.
00:28:08.559 --> 00:28:09.440
Say your prayers.
00:28:10.240 --> 00:28:19.039
So yeah, someone who is um a uh former couch potato, novice, new or reformed.
00:28:19.119 --> 00:28:19.440
Yeah.
00:28:19.599 --> 00:28:22.000
Um see in the light.
00:28:22.160 --> 00:28:22.720
There's a light.
00:28:25.200 --> 00:28:32.240
Life will take us into circumstances where we actually have less capacity or we actually might not be able to exercise for a period.
00:28:32.400 --> 00:28:58.720
And for some people that can be really challenging because they m they might actually really rely on exercise quite a lot for sort of mental health and well-being, and they and they know how much had exercise has been a big part of their life, and things have come up in their life from in uh the areas that I work in, often a cancer diagnosis, that sort of derails what is uh typically a pretty steadily moving along trajectory.
00:28:59.200 --> 00:29:08.720
Life's busy, things are we've we've got our we've got our routine and we've got things all together, and then all of a sudden something comes up and it it it sort of sends us off our our path.
00:29:08.960 --> 00:29:20.720
So it is so common that individuals will find themselves in a state where they haven't exercised for a while, or exercise has had to look a bit different, and it can be a tricky place to start.
00:29:20.880 --> 00:29:38.880
But if we're looking for that type of individual, we're really looking ideally at starting with absolutely those bigger muscle groups or what we call compound movements, which is where you're involving multiple joints at the same time because they're gonna give us the most what we call bang for bang for your butt.
00:29:38.960 --> 00:29:42.480
That's what I that's exactly the terminology I use bang for your butt.
00:29:42.720 --> 00:29:43.200
That's what you want.
00:29:43.680 --> 00:29:44.319
Bang for your butt.
00:29:44.400 --> 00:29:49.920
Yeah, and that's what we look at for busy individuals as well is how can we create a really concise program?
00:29:50.079 --> 00:29:51.680
What's the minimum dose?
00:29:51.920 --> 00:29:57.920
If we're limited on time, what's the minimum dose of exercise that we need to see meaningful change?
00:29:58.000 --> 00:30:11.519
And we can see that with really reduced numbers of exercise or reduced frequency of exercise, because that might be all that we can we can uh accommodate for in our in our day-to-day life or with our resources that we have available to us.
00:30:11.839 --> 00:30:18.720
But on a typical, yeah, on a typical approach, it would be absolutely starting out with compound movements because we know that.
00:30:18.799 --> 00:30:28.240
So that could be something like absolutely like a squat, that could be something like a deadlift we know to be a really amazing mover, but not always something that people can start straight into.
00:30:28.319 --> 00:30:31.200
We might use a few different movements to get to that point.
00:30:31.440 --> 00:30:58.000
Things like a seated row, a lat cool down, um, are things that give us sort of multiple muscle groups at the same time and set us up to be able to then move in towards more isolated muscle groups where we could maybe look at a bit more of a split program where there's we're covering more exercises and more muscle groups over the course of a couple of different programs or a couple of different types of exercise approach.
00:30:58.079 --> 00:31:05.599
You might be doing a couple of different classes or something like that, and we need to sort of fill in the blanks so we're covering as many bases as as possible.
00:31:06.000 --> 00:31:14.960
Um, but absolutely it's it's typically working from a bigger muscle group approach, and we will get more benefits from that metabolic approach.
00:31:15.200 --> 00:31:52.960
So that body's ability to be able to increase sort of insulin sensitivity and reduce insulin resistance, which we can be a bit of a characteristic of period and post-menopause or period, and can be associated with also some of that unwanted uh fucking that we tend to see um around that period, which can be really uh challenging and distressing for women who have never had an issue for with that in their lifetime, and then all of a sudden they're seeing sort of a bit more of a difficulty sort of navigating um their the weight that they feel comfortable with, or a bit of a different sort of body image there as well.
00:31:53.200 --> 00:32:12.880
So um, yeah, that was a bit of a tangent to sort of talk about that sort of metabolic health, but absolutely stimulating those big muscle groups can play a role, role there and and really sort of relates it back to how valuable different types of exercise can be as a flow-on effect for women for many different stages as well.
00:32:17.359 --> 00:32:20.319
Well, guys, we hope you're feeling motivated after that one.
00:32:20.400 --> 00:32:21.119
We sure are.
00:32:21.279 --> 00:32:25.680
We covered a lot in there, including the basics of training.
00:32:25.839 --> 00:32:26.240
Yeah.
00:32:26.559 --> 00:32:31.039
Variety, energy, volume, and recovery.
00:32:31.359 --> 00:32:35.839
So applying these um can really help within an exercise program.
00:32:36.160 --> 00:32:39.039
Uh hope you got a lot out of it, and there's more to come next week.
00:32:39.200 --> 00:32:39.920
See you then.
00:32:40.160 --> 00:32:40.640
Bye.
00:32:41.200 --> 00:32:44.480
And that's a wrap for today's episode of Healthy Banter.
00:32:44.799 --> 00:32:50.720
We hope you're leaving with something useful and maybe something worth sharing with a friend, because that's what we're all about.
00:32:50.960 --> 00:32:54.160
Women supporting women, one honest chat at a time.
00:32:54.400 --> 00:33:05.519
If you loved hanging out with us, make sure to share, follow, or subscribe on Instagram, YouTube, Spotify, or just head to healthybanter.com.au so you never miss an episode.
00:33:05.839 --> 00:33:10.000
Take the advice that helps, ditch the guilt, and keep cheering for yourself.
00:33:10.240 --> 00:33:15.440
We'll see you next week for more stories, more science, and even more banter.
00:33:16.559 --> 00:33:20.000
Healthy Bander is hosted, produced, and edited by Megan Jules.
00:33:20.240 --> 00:33:23.039
Our main music theme is composed by Ada Akbal.
00:33:23.519 --> 00:33:26.000
Healthy Bander is not a licensed health service.
00:33:26.160 --> 00:33:30.079
It is not a substitute for professional health advice, treatment or assessment.
00:33:30.319 --> 00:33:38.720
The advice given in this episode is general in nature, but if you are in need of individual advice or consultation, please see a healthcare professional.
00:33:38.960 --> 00:33:43.599
If you are struggling, call Lifeline on 13314.
