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Welcome to Hacking Your ADHD, part of the ADHD Rewired
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Podcast Network. I'm your host, William Kerb, and I have ADHD.
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On this podcast, I dig into the tools, tactics, and
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best practices to help you work with your ADHD brain.
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Whenever I sit down to do some serious writing, I
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always make sure to have something to listen to. Music
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is often a key piece of how I keep myself
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engaged in the task I'm doing. In today's podcast, I'm
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going to be digging into that idea, but I won't
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be doing it alone.
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My name is Will Henschel, and I am the founder
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and the CEO of the music service called Focus at Will.
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Which is kind of like Spotify for concentration music. In
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this episode, I talk with Will about how music can
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be critical in our ability to focus, how ADHD brains
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need certain levels of stimulation to really get engaged, and
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you'll also get a taste of what you might hear
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on Focus at Will. I had a great time with
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this interview, and I hope you enjoy it too. If
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you'd like to follow along on the show notes page,
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you can find that at hackingyouradhd.com slash focusatwill. Before we
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get started, I also wanted to let you know about
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the next registration event for ADHD Rewired's coaching and accountability
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groups on Tuesday, May 18th at 1.30 p.m.
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Central.
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If you're interested in registering, just go to coachingrewired.com. If
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you've been thinking about signing up for those groups but
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still aren't sure, let me tell you that signing up
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for the groups was a turning point in my life
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and that I can say with certainty that I wouldn't
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be doing this podcast if I hadn't gone through them.
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It was a chance for me to really dive in
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deep on how my ADHD was affecting my life and
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then put into practice the things I needed to do
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to get myself into gear. While a lot of it
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is structured around learning how to manage our time better,
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the group also explores that emotional and cerebral side of
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things that really makes a difference. because we all know
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that just buying a new calendar isn't going to change things.
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And I'm still getting more and more out of the
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experience as I participate in the alumni community surrounding the
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coaching groups. With weekly calls to reinforce what I learned
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in the groups and interacting with other rewired alum, I
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can do what is often so hard for us with ADHD,
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and that's keep up with the maintenance. So if you
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want to learn more, go check out coachingrewired.com for the
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upcoming registration event on Tuesday, May 18th, That link again
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is coachingrewired.com. All right, keep on listening to find out
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how you can Focus at Will.
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Focus at Will is a unique service, and it is
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a specific type of music for people to help people
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concentrate and focus when they're working. And it is of
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particular interest to For people who have distractibility challenges, ADD, ADHD,
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which of course is why we're talking. I understand this
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fully because I feel like I'm at a meeting, I
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put my hand up and go, I'm well and I've
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got ADD. Actually, I have discovered that it's more of
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a blessing than a problem. ADD and ADHD just simply
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means that to be able to focus and concentrate on something,
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you have to have a lot of things going on
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at the same time, right? Yeah.
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And be able to, while you have a lot of
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things going on, be able to then zero in on
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the one thing.
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Exactly. And that's where the folks at will system comes in.
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So folks at will has been around for about 10 years. Um,
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my background before I do this, I do two things.
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I'm an inventor. I've got five patents, um, mostly to
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do with pro audio technology. And, uh, I'm also a
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songwriter and a composer and, um, What I'm going to
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do is I'm just going to play a little burst
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of one of the songs, one of my better known songs,
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so that you know who I am. Do you remember
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this song back in the day?
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All right.
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I've been thinking about you too. That was London Beat
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with the band. And that was a huge number one
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hit pretty much everywhere in the world in the early 90s.
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I was the founder of the band, and I was
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the mostly guitar player and the main songwriter. And it
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was fascinating. I was in the band for nine years.
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The band was called London Beat. The singers were African-American
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soul singers who lived in London at the time. And
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it was this really interesting hybrid of sort of guitar,
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a little bit of country guitar, and dance music, and
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then these beautiful soul vocals, classic souls. Mm-hmm. What it
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gave me is this sort of intrinsic understanding of the
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power of music. So I just played you, I don't know,
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20 seconds of that song. And you and anyone else
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that's ever listened to the radio anywhere in the world
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will have heard it. It was one of the most played.
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It's still one of the most played top 100 played
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songs on the radio. And when you hear it, the
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lyrics and the melody, they give you a memory usually, right?
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What were you doing in the early 90s, right? You're like, oh, yeah,
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I remember that first time I made out with someone.
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Someone told me that the other day. I'm like, oh, great.
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As a composer and as a musician, as I said,
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it got me. It really underlined how you can create
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music to have an effect on people. After I was
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in the band, I come from a long line of
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British inventors. My dad's an inventor. My granddad was an inventor.
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And I got very interested in digital audio recording and
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recording studios. And me and a couple of other guys,
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Matt Moller and a couple of other guys, invented a
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system called DigiDelivery, which is part of now part of
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Pro Tools. If anybody listening to this knows about Pro
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Audio Technology. And it's called Avid Cloud Collaboration. Now, we
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sold the company to Avid Pro Tools in 2003. Part
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of the sale of that company, I was the founder
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and the CEO, involved me having to work at Avid
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in their technology department. And so for the first time,
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I had to sit in a damn cubicle. I had
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to sit and work on demand. They were like, I
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was like, I need to work remotely. They're like, no,
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you don't. You need to be in the office with
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everybody else. I was like, oh, I'm not sure I
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could do that. So You know, there I am, day one,
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sitting in the cubicle with my headphones on, trying to
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block out the noise. And the question is, what do
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I listen to? Because if I listen to music I like,
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if I listen to music that's got lyrics that I'm
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singing along with, if I listen to Snoop Dogg, who
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is still one of my favorite all-time artists, it's incredibly distracting.
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And it is, sure, I've substituted one problem for another. So, right,
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so yes, I've blocked out the sound, and now I'm
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listening to the music. So that led me on to
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a long journey. to forming Focus at Will to find
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out which kinds of music do work. What does work
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for this? And because I just handed this sort of
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instinct that there had to be types of music. And
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the aha moment in Focus at Will came when we
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realized that different brain types need different types of music energy.
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And Dr. Ned Halliwell, I don't know if you've had
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him on your show or not, but he's the the
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leading psychiatrist physician who's an expert in ADHD. He wrote
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the book Driven to Distraction and then Driven to Distraction
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at Work, which he actually wrote listening to Vogue so well. Oh, nice.
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That's how we met him. With his help, we were
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able to figure out, we've done a lot of lab,
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we have a lab, a neuro lab, and we were
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able to figure out that there are about 36 buckets,
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if you think of like people being in, you know,
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types of brain.
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Yeah.
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And at one end, you've got the Dalai Lama. The
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Dalai Lama is very chill. We all know that, right?
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Somebody who's a super Zen person over there. And at
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the other end, you've got Elon Musk. I'm just using
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him as an example because this guy is the most
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ADD guy I know. As I was saying earlier on,
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when you're ADD, it just means you need to have
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a lot of stimulus going. And then you need to
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be able to focus on the one thing that you
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need to be doing right now. You need to be
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super focused on work while you're at work. Yeah. It's
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so easy for us to get distracted and end up
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really focusing on the wrong thing. And so that's the challenge.
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And that's where Focus at Will comes in. So I'm
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going to play a couple of bits of music for
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you just to show you. So anybody listening to this
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who is not ADD will instinctively go, well, if someone
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is really hyper, they're like a chihuahua going crazy all
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the time. What you might think is that you should
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play them some gentle music in the background, like this.
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To get them to calm the F down. Yeah, but.
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Yeah, I could just see, like, sitting there being like, okay,
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I'm supposed to be working, and I'm listening to this,
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and I'm not connecting with the music at all.
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So.
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About 40% of our listeners listen to this. This is
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a channel system called Up Tempo. And there's a whole
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channel material like this. And the channel is... Like a
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sort of a dance floor channel, but it's not because
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there's no DJ drops. There's no way by the bass
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out there's no vocals there's a number of other things
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uh in the music which are specifically engineered for focus
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jumping swiftly over to also there's a for people who
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are not quite so add there is a very popular
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channel called classical piano channel but of real interest to
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this audience is this 5% of our listeners, and we've
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got a couple of million users, listen to this. This
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is called ADHD type 1. And what this is doing
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is this is clocking your brain in a way that
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is able to keep you working. Now, I'm just going
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to turn that off. People who don't have ADD find
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that an extraordinarily annoying sound.
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Yeah, I can imagine. And it also would be your
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mood when you go into work that day. Some days
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you're a little bit more amped and some days you're
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a little bit less.
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Right, right. So there's actually on the system, there's three flavors.
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There's a low, medium and a high. And that was
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the medium version. And based on what you're just saying, yes,
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you can kind of triangulate that to where you think
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you need to be in the day. Ned Hallowell described
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it to me. really beautifully. And I'm just going to
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share with you what he said. He said, there's a
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clock at the back of the brain, which runs about
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four times a second, every 250 milliseconds. And that clock
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for people, for most people, runs about four times. And
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it goes, talk to Will. Talk to Will. Talk to Will.
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It's like, you know, those little rowing boats where you
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have someone at the back going, pull, right? Everybody pulls together.
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So this clock in my head is going, talk to Will.
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Talk to Will. Now, those of us that are ADD,
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those of us that have distraction, that clock is running slowly.
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So it's going, talk to Will. And now my conscious
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mind is like, oh, what's that? I think I left
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the window open. And, oh, I've got to remember. And
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then the clock goes, talk to Will. I'm like, oh, Will, sorry,
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what were you saying?
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Yeah, exactly. And if I have a second browser up here,
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I'll be like, Yeah.
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Bang, you're onto it, right? So he said to me,
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the reason why stimulants work, self-prescribing yourself a whole bunch
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of coffee, the obvious, you know, amphetamine-related stimulants that we
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all know of that help people with ADD, what they're
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doing is they're turning the clock up. So it's going,
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talk to Will, talk to Will, talk to Will, talk
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to Will. So we discovered there is a link. There's
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a causal link between the energy in the music stream
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and the ADD brain. So this works because it is
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speeding your clock up and it is keeping you on track.
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Talk to Will. Talk to Will. Talk to Will. Talk
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to Will. Talk to Will. And the fascinating thing about
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this is, as I said, 5% of our users listen
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to this eight hours a day. It's called It's called
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Gabba House, which is this European, really crazy, distorted techno.
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And we've actually sped it up again. It works because
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it is giving you something. It's kind of giving you
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a very driving and overriding pulse that you can connect
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to when you have ADD. And that's why it works
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so well. Now, when you're working on a computer and
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you're studying, or you're working on a spreadsheet, or if
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you're a developer, you don't have all of that stuff
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going on in your job because you're not in the
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field as a medic saving people's lives, but you're working.
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And so that is why a lot of people with
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ADD like to listen to multiple sound sources.
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Yeah.
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I mean, this was one of the things that I
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was really interested when you contacted me is because I
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was doing a lot of stuff on how multitasking works.
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And we really think we're good at multitasking when we're not,
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but our brains don't multitask exactly how it's like put out.
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Cause they're like never do multitasking. And it's like, what
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does that mean? Because yes, I can listen to music
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and do something else. Although it depends on the music,
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of course, saying the beginning, I can't do something with lyrics.
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Cause then I'm thinking about the lyrics and there is
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like a certain aspect of definitely with ADHD where like,
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I'll have like a fidget and that's going to help
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me focus a little bit more because I'm getting a
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little bit more stimulus.
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Yep. That's exactly right.
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All right, that's all we've got for today from Will Henshaw.
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I'll be back next week with the second half of
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my interview, where we continue discussing how music can play
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a critical role in our ability to concentrate, and we'll
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be exploring some more ideas about ADHD. I'd love to
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hear what you thought of this episode, and if you'd
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be interested in hearing more interviews in the future. As
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the podcast has grown, I've been getting more and more
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interview requests, so it's been something that I've been thinking
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about including more of. You can reach me on Facebook, Instagram,
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and Twitter, at HackingYourADHD, or you can connect with me
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over at hackingyouradhd.com slash contact. You can find the show
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notes for this episode at hackingyouradhd.com slash focusatwill. I'd also
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like to encourage you to go check out the other
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podcasts on the ADHD Rewired Podcast Network. For in-depth interviews
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with fellow ADHDers and ADHD experts, go check out ADHD
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Rewired with Eric Tivers. If you're a parent with ADHD
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or have a child with ADHD, definitely check out Brendan
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Mahan's show, ADHD Essentials. If you're interested in exploring issues
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of diversity in ADHD, then be sure to check out
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ADHD Diversified with MJ. For those late-diagnosed women moms and professionals,
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there's also the ADHD-Friendly Lifestyle with Moira Mapin. I also
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do a live Q & A with all the hosts
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of the ADHD Rewired Podcast Network every second Tuesday of
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the month at 10.30 a.m.
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Pacific.
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If you'd like to register for the next one, Just
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go to ADHDrewired.com slash events. And now for your moment
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of dad.
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In fact, if you and I had started the company together,
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we would have been called Focus at Wills. Yeah.
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A meeting of the Wills here.
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There we go.
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Welcome to Hacking Your ADHD, part of the ADHD Rewired
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Podcast Network. I'm your host, William Kerb, and I have ADHD.
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On this podcast, I dig into the tools, tactics, and
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best practices to help you work with your ADHD brain.
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Whenever I sit down to do some serious writing, I
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always make sure to have something to listen to. Music
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is often a key piece of how I keep myself
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engaged in the task I'm doing. In today's podcast, I'm
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going to be digging into that idea, but I won't
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be doing it alone.
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My name is Will Henschel, and I am the founder
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and the CEO of the music service called Focus at Will.
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Which is kind of like Spotify for concentration music. In
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this episode, I talk with Will about how music can
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be critical in our ability to focus, how ADHD brains
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need certain levels of stimulation to really get engaged, and
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you'll also get a taste of what you might hear
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on Focus at Will. I had a great time with
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this interview, and I hope you enjoy it too. If
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you'd like to follow along on the show notes page,
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you can find that at hackingyouradhd.com slash focusatwill. Before we
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get started, I also wanted to let you know about
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the next registration event for ADHD Rewired's coaching and accountability
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groups on Tuesday, May 18th at 1.30 p.m.
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Central.
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If you're interested in registering, just go to coachingrewired.com. If
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you've been thinking about signing up for those groups but
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still aren't sure, let me tell you that signing up
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for the groups was a turning point in my life
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and that I can say with certainty that I wouldn't
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be doing this podcast if I hadn't gone through them.
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It was a chance for me to really dive in
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deep on how my ADHD was affecting my life and
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then put into practice the things I needed to do
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to get myself into gear. While a lot of it
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is structured around learning how to manage our time better,
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the group also explores that emotional and cerebral side of
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things that really makes a difference. because we all know
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that just buying a new calendar isn't going to change things.
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And I'm still getting more and more out of the
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experience as I participate in the alumni community surrounding the
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coaching groups. With weekly calls to reinforce what I learned
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in the groups and interacting with other rewired alum, I
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can do what is often so hard for us with ADHD,
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and that's keep up with the maintenance. So if you
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want to learn more, go check out coachingrewired.com for the
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upcoming registration event on Tuesday, May 18th, That link again
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is coachingrewired.com. All right, keep on listening to find out
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how you can Focus at Will.
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Focus at Will is a unique service, and it is
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a specific type of music for people to help people
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concentrate and focus when they're working. And it is of
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particular interest to For people who have distractibility challenges, ADD, ADHD,
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which of course is why we're talking. I understand this
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fully because I feel like I'm at a meeting, I
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put my hand up and go, I'm well and I've
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got ADD. Actually, I have discovered that it's more of
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a blessing than a problem. ADD and ADHD just simply
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means that to be able to focus and concentrate on something,
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you have to have a lot of things going on
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at the same time, right? Yeah.
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And be able to, while you have a lot of
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things going on, be able to then zero in on
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the one thing.
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Exactly. And that's where the folks at will system comes in.
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So folks at will has been around for about 10 years. Um,
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my background before I do this, I do two things.
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I'm an inventor. I've got five patents, um, mostly to
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do with pro audio technology. And, uh, I'm also a
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songwriter and a composer and, um, What I'm going to
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do is I'm just going to play a little burst
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of one of the songs, one of my better known songs,
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so that you know who I am. Do you remember
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this song back in the day?
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All right.
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I've been thinking about you too. That was London Beat
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with the band. And that was a huge number one
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hit pretty much everywhere in the world in the early 90s.
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I was the founder of the band, and I was
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the mostly guitar player and the main songwriter. And it
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was fascinating. I was in the band for nine years.
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The band was called London Beat. The singers were African-American
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soul singers who lived in London at the time. And
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it was this really interesting hybrid of sort of guitar,
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a little bit of country guitar, and dance music, and
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then these beautiful soul vocals, classic souls. Mm-hmm. What it
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gave me is this sort of intrinsic understanding of the
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power of music. So I just played you, I don't know,
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20 seconds of that song. And you and anyone else
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that's ever listened to the radio anywhere in the world
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will have heard it. It was one of the most played.
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It's still one of the most played top 100 played
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songs on the radio. And when you hear it, the
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lyrics and the melody, they give you a memory usually, right?
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What were you doing in the early 90s, right? You're like, oh, yeah,
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I remember that first time I made out with someone.
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Someone told me that the other day. I'm like, oh, great.
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As a composer and as a musician, as I said,
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it got me. It really underlined how you can create
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music to have an effect on people. After I was
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in the band, I come from a long line of
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British inventors. My dad's an inventor. My granddad was an inventor.
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And I got very interested in digital audio recording and
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recording studios. And me and a couple of other guys,
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Matt Moller and a couple of other guys, invented a
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system called DigiDelivery, which is part of now part of
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Pro Tools. If anybody listening to this knows about Pro
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Audio Technology. And it's called Avid Cloud Collaboration. Now, we
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sold the company to Avid Pro Tools in 2003. Part
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of the sale of that company, I was the founder
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and the CEO, involved me having to work at Avid
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in their technology department. And so for the first time,
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I had to sit in a damn cubicle. I had
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to sit and work on demand. They were like, I
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was like, I need to work remotely. They're like, no,
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you don't. You need to be in the office with
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everybody else. I was like, oh, I'm not sure I
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could do that. So You know, there I am, day one,
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sitting in the cubicle with my headphones on, trying to
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block out the noise. And the question is, what do
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I listen to? Because if I listen to music I like,
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if I listen to music that's got lyrics that I'm
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singing along with, if I listen to Snoop Dogg, who
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is still one of my favorite all-time artists, it's incredibly distracting.
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And it is, sure, I've substituted one problem for another. So, right,
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so yes, I've blocked out the sound, and now I'm
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listening to the music. So that led me on to
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a long journey. to forming Focus at Will to find
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out which kinds of music do work. What does work
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for this? And because I just handed this sort of
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instinct that there had to be types of music. And
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the aha moment in Focus at Will came when we
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realized that different brain types need different types of music energy.
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And Dr. Ned Halliwell, I don't know if you've had
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him on your show or not, but he's the the
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leading psychiatrist physician who's an expert in ADHD. He wrote
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the book Driven to Distraction and then Driven to Distraction
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at Work, which he actually wrote listening to Vogue so well. Oh, nice.
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That's how we met him. With his help, we were
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able to figure out, we've done a lot of lab,
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we have a lab, a neuro lab, and we were
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able to figure out that there are about 36 buckets,
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if you think of like people being in, you know,
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types of brain.
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Yeah.
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And at one end, you've got the Dalai Lama. The
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Dalai Lama is very chill. We all know that, right?
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Somebody who's a super Zen person over there. And at
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the other end, you've got Elon Musk. I'm just using
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him as an example because this guy is the most
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ADD guy I know. As I was saying earlier on,
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when you're ADD, it just means you need to have
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a lot of stimulus going. And then you need to
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be able to focus on the one thing that you
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need to be doing right now. You need to be
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super focused on work while you're at work. Yeah. It's
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so easy for us to get distracted and end up
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really focusing on the wrong thing. And so that's the challenge.
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And that's where Focus at Will comes in. So I'm
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going to play a couple of bits of music for
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you just to show you. So anybody listening to this
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who is not ADD will instinctively go, well, if someone
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is really hyper, they're like a chihuahua going crazy all
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the time. What you might think is that you should
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play them some gentle music in the background, like this.
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To get them to calm the F down. Yeah, but.
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Yeah, I could just see, like, sitting there being like, okay,
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I'm supposed to be working, and I'm listening to this,
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and I'm not connecting with the music at all.
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So.
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About 40% of our listeners listen to this. This is
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a channel system called Up Tempo. And there's a whole
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channel material like this. And the channel is... Like a
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sort of a dance floor channel, but it's not because
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there's no DJ drops. There's no way by the bass
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out there's no vocals there's a number of other things
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uh in the music which are specifically engineered for focus
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jumping swiftly over to also there's a for people who
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are not quite so add there is a very popular
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channel called classical piano channel but of real interest to
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this audience is this 5% of our listeners, and we've
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got a couple of million users, listen to this. This
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is called ADHD type 1. And what this is doing
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is this is clocking your brain in a way that
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is able to keep you working. Now, I'm just going
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to turn that off. People who don't have ADD find
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that an extraordinarily annoying sound.
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Yeah, I can imagine. And it also would be your
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mood when you go into work that day. Some days
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you're a little bit more amped and some days you're
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a little bit less.
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Right, right. So there's actually on the system, there's three flavors.
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There's a low, medium and a high. And that was
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the medium version. And based on what you're just saying, yes,
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you can kind of triangulate that to where you think
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you need to be in the day. Ned Hallowell described
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it to me. really beautifully. And I'm just going to
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share with you what he said. He said, there's a
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clock at the back of the brain, which runs about
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four times a second, every 250 milliseconds. And that clock
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for people, for most people, runs about four times. And
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it goes, talk to Will. Talk to Will. Talk to Will.
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It's like, you know, those little rowing boats where you
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have someone at the back going, pull, right? Everybody pulls together.
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So this clock in my head is going, talk to Will.
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Talk to Will. Now, those of us that are ADD,
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those of us that have distraction, that clock is running slowly.
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So it's going, talk to Will. And now my conscious
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mind is like, oh, what's that? I think I left
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the window open. And, oh, I've got to remember. And
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then the clock goes, talk to Will. I'm like, oh, Will, sorry,
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what were you saying?
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Yeah, exactly. And if I have a second browser up here,
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I'll be like, Yeah.
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Bang, you're onto it, right? So he said to me,
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the reason why stimulants work, self-prescribing yourself a whole bunch
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of coffee, the obvious, you know, amphetamine-related stimulants that we
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all know of that help people with ADD, what they're
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doing is they're turning the clock up. So it's going,
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talk to Will, talk to Will, talk to Will, talk
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to Will. So we discovered there is a link. There's
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a causal link between the energy in the music stream
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and the ADD brain. So this works because it is
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speeding your clock up and it is keeping you on track.
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Talk to Will. Talk to Will. Talk to Will. Talk
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to Will. Talk to Will. And the fascinating thing about
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this is, as I said, 5% of our users listen
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to this eight hours a day. It's called It's called
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Gabba House, which is this European, really crazy, distorted techno.
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And we've actually sped it up again. It works because
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it is giving you something. It's kind of giving you
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a very driving and overriding pulse that you can connect
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to when you have ADD. And that's why it works
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so well. Now, when you're working on a computer and
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you're studying, or you're working on a spreadsheet, or if
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you're a developer, you don't have all of that stuff
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going on in your job because you're not in the
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field as a medic saving people's lives, but you're working.
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And so that is why a lot of people with
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ADD like to listen to multiple sound sources.
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Yeah.
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I mean, this was one of the things that I
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was really interested when you contacted me is because I
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was doing a lot of stuff on how multitasking works.
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And we really think we're good at multitasking when we're not,
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but our brains don't multitask exactly how it's like put out.
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Cause they're like never do multitasking. And it's like, what
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does that mean? Because yes, I can listen to music
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and do something else. Although it depends on the music,
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of course, saying the beginning, I can't do something with lyrics.
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Cause then I'm thinking about the lyrics and there is
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like a certain aspect of definitely with ADHD where like,
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I'll have like a fidget and that's going to help
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me focus a little bit more because I'm getting a
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little bit more stimulus.
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Yep. That's exactly right.
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All right, that's all we've got for today from Will Henshaw.
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I'll be back next week with the second half of
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my interview, where we continue discussing how music can play
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a critical role in our ability to concentrate, and we'll
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be exploring some more ideas about ADHD. I'd love to
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hear what you thought of this episode, and if you'd
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be interested in hearing more interviews in the future. As
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the podcast has grown, I've been getting more and more
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interview requests, so it's been something that I've been thinking
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about including more of. You can reach me on Facebook, Instagram,
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and Twitter, at HackingYourADHD, or you can connect with me
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over at hackingyouradhd.com slash contact. You can find the show
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notes for this episode at hackingyouradhd.com slash focusatwill. I'd also
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like to encourage you to go check out the other
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podcasts on the ADHD Rewired Podcast Network. For in-depth interviews
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with fellow ADHDers and ADHD experts, go check out ADHD
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Rewired with Eric Tivers. If you're a parent with ADHD
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or have a child with ADHD, definitely check out Brendan
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Mahan's show, ADHD Essentials. If you're interested in exploring issues
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of diversity in ADHD, then be sure to check out
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ADHD Diversified with MJ. For those late-diagnosed women moms and professionals,
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there's also the ADHD-Friendly Lifestyle with Moira Mapin. I also
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do a live Q & A with all the hosts
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of the ADHD Rewired Podcast Network every second Tuesday of
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the month at 10.30 a.m.
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Pacific.
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If you'd like to register for the next one, Just
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go to ADHDrewired.com slash events. And now for your moment
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of dad.
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In fact, if you and I had started the company together,
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we would have been called Focus at Wills. Yeah.
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A meeting of the Wills here.
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There we go.
