Ep. 231 The Hidden Truth About HBCU Funding & Systemic Bias | Dr. Erin Lynch

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[SPEAKER_03]: This is not new.
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[SPEAKER_03]: This is not atypical.
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[SPEAKER_03]: This happens at every single school across the country, period.
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[SPEAKER_02]: You mentioned anti black rhetoric.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Do you find that anti black rhetoric towards the HBCUs is higher among the black people or higher among others, non black?
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[SPEAKER_02]: That's a great question.
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[SPEAKER_02]: What's the biggest risk you've ever taken on this podcast?
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[SPEAKER_02]: Welcome to another exciting episode of Durian's smiley inner circle podcast.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So smiley and with the edge of my seat here for a number of reasons for this next guest, let me just start by introducing her first.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Dr. Lynch is the president of the quality education for minorities network, a distinguished educational strategist and rare scholar holds an EDD and a PhD.
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[SPEAKER_00]: A national voice research innovation, an educational equity, she has driven transformational growth across minority, servicing institutions.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And co-chairs, the National Academies Committee on Defense Research at Minority serving institutions.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Dr. Lynch, welcome to the podcast.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Thank you.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so I'm former co-chairs in that project, we just ended it last year when Sirport came out, but yeah.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Awesome.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Awesome.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So, let me start from the top.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So, Smiley, am I in my business?
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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm on, you know, our page, you know, just checking things and responding to messages, things like that.
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[SPEAKER_00]: You know, with all going on with this, it's been going on
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[SPEAKER_00]: with Howard recently, our last guest had her one thoughts.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And so, of course, we shared her podcast like we normally do in clips and all that.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And her perspective was, you know, it was received a lot of feedback across the board, a lot of if they're across the board.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Some were there, some were like, I don't know.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And Dr. Lynch reached out to me directly via Instagram is like, hey, buddy.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Essentially, she said, you know, that's not the full, my perception was, I thought that's the full thing.
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[SPEAKER_01]: and she even commented on the fact that we have just a few a few followers which are like wait a minute wait a minute can we talk about this shots fired shots fired like wait a minute look i'm a number of girls i'm sorry i can't take it if you're a real research person you know but you know
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[SPEAKER_01]: We're sensitive.
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[SPEAKER_01]: We're young men.
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[SPEAKER_01]: We're not young, but we're sensitive.
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[SPEAKER_00]: We're sensitive.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So anyway, I'm so glad when when I respond with Hey, I'd love to talk to you about this further.
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[SPEAKER_00]: We'd like to be on the podcast and here we are.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So thank you
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[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
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[SPEAKER_00]: All right.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So let's start from the top.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So about two weeks ago and keep me honest here in the news, Howard came out and it was said, you know, they unirold about 500 students.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So understandably, you know, a lot of parents and others were kind of an uproar, you know, how can this happen, et cetera, et cetera.
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[SPEAKER_00]: There's been, and I have to say to Howard's credit, I feel like they came out in terms of being communicative and saying, okay, hey, here's, here's, you know, the picture, here's what's going on, here's what we're doing to address it.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And since then, I've also seen that a lot of students have been re-enrolled.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So let me just also state that.
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[SPEAKER_00]: But Dr. Lynch, what are your thoughts about?
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[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so let's be clear around our language, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: You said Howard came out and said, let's not what happened right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: Students came out and said, Howard would never have come out to talk about the unenrollment process that happens at every college university across this country.
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[SPEAKER_03]: This is not new.
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[SPEAKER_03]: This is not a typical.
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[SPEAKER_03]: This happens at every single school across the country period and schools do not promote it.
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[SPEAKER_03]: They do not talk about it because it's a violation of the confidentiality of students.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So they're not saying, oh, by the way, we're just going to drop all you students.
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[SPEAKER_03]: It's just a process that happens typically.
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[SPEAKER_03]: When that process happens, it's after the semester has already started, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: And so that is a major issue at college universities all across the country.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So we have this thing called a census date.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And so the federal government requires us to be able to have our final enrollment numbers done by a certain time of the year.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And those final enrollment numbers for the fall mean that you can't have any balances at that time.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So you're fully enrolled because you are in good standing with the institution, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: And so what we often times see is that universities and colleges will drop folks after the census date because they have to get them off their rosters for the federal government before they turn those numbers in to be able to get federal funding and all the things.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So the fact that Howard did this, you know, they offered just the process.
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[SPEAKER_03]: They offered admissions to, you know, 2,700 students, 2,200 of those 27 net the deadlines
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[SPEAKER_03]: 500 of those kiddos in their families did not, and there was the misunderstanding was around whether or not they had to have their balances secured by a certain date, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: But the bottom line was they all still had balances.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And that's what folks keep missing.
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[SPEAKER_03]: They still had balances.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So they had not secured payment for whether it was
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[SPEAKER_03]: Like you saw the one woman who was crying on TV, it was only $1,400.
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[SPEAKER_03]: It was only $1,400.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, but that $1,400 was still a bill that you had to have secured by July 10th.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
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[SPEAKER_03]: There were parents who reached out to me to tell me that they were impacted.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And I was like, you know, as I do as a, I was like, well, let me just talk to you as if you were one of my students, as it showed me the documentation from the university.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So there's sent me screenshots.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And these folks had balances $20,000, $10,000.
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[SPEAKER_03]: I was like, y'all still had balances.
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[SPEAKER_03]: like you still had money that had to be either secured or paid to the institution.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So I don't know why, y'all are mad, you still had balances, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: And the thing that has most bothered me about this, most bothered me is the salaciousness of the folks talking about that there's some sort of like mal-intent from the university, like there was some sort of like intentional purposeful bad actors at the university.
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[SPEAKER_01]: But the fact of matters, their classes start August 10th.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So if they want you to have your bill paid by July 10th, that means moving date is the end of July because classes start August 10th.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So what did you, when did you want the folks?
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[SPEAKER_03]: When did you want the university to me to talk about what they were gonna do about this situation?
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[SPEAKER_03]: Like, so it's all of it is just men, a misunderstanding of folks who have no connections or depth of knowledge of how higher education operates.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And then, of course, on the universities part, they didn't do very good job of communicating these things.
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[SPEAKER_03]: But yeah, so that's my initial take.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so this time a bit deeper.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So this happens across all campuses.
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[SPEAKER_00]: At some point, they have to let them know, hey, you've been on a roll, you have a balance.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Why do you think this kind of bomb went off at Howard?
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[SPEAKER_00]: Like what was it that made this one stand out compared to all the others?
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[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and this is someone's gonna be upset and clutch the pearls, but I think it's the anti black racism that is deeply entrenched in
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[SPEAKER_03]: in our communities here.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And so I think the fact that Howard caught the flag for an industry that operates this way is rooted in anti black.
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[SPEAKER_03]: hatred, period, with our own community, within our own community, we have folks within our own community who are profoundly anti-HBCU and you saw that rhetoric come out in a number of the comments, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: Well, by PDFUI, I wouldn't have done this and I such a, and you know, that's fine, that's completely fine, that you have that lived experience and that is your belief.
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[SPEAKER_03]: But the anti-black anti-HBC rhetoric that emerged from this, I think is what drove so many folks to have commentary on it without having an actual understanding of how this industry of higher education actually works.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and so a couple things coming to mind, you mentioned the comments.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So before we posted our last set of clips from our last guest, I noticed a little bit,
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[SPEAKER_00]: were so negative towards, they should have done this, they should have done that, this, no, do the victory all, just kind of just, absolutely.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and I'm surprising to me because I'm thinking, based on the, the comments, their child was even infected by this.
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[SPEAKER_00]: They're just heating that school.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So that's it out.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So the also set out is, I feel like,
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[SPEAKER_00]: The inside of that coin is there was some miscommunication for now I understand between Howard and some students that said at the end of the day something that's smiling I talk about when you know we're trying to get things done.
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[SPEAKER_00]: He and our are very similar if some of us do on August 1st, we're sending in on June 1st.
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[SPEAKER_00]: You know we're getting a done.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Who should own this as it is that the parents and the children,
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[SPEAKER_00]: Because again, I've heard from a number of sources there had been some miscommunication.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Is it the school?
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[SPEAKER_00]: Is it a joint partnership in terms of owning what happened here?
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[SPEAKER_00]: And then I have one quick follow-up and I'll give it a smile.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so so I would ask you to operationalize miscommunication.
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[SPEAKER_03]: All right, so was it a miscommunication because one thing was in print and another thing was said verbally or was there miscommunication in that what was in print someone who was receiving that message didn't understand so that's what I would ask because the parents who who I've spoken with the parents have reached out have said and you can see this in my my threads in the comments very clearly.
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[SPEAKER_03]: the university over communicated.
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[SPEAKER_03]: They said they were getting emails every week with links to how to do things, with videos on how to process things, with exact dates and timelines, every week they were getting communications.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So my question is, how are we defining this communication?
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[SPEAKER_03]: was it because there was some sort of disconnect between what you got verbally and what you got in writing or because you didn't understand what was in writing.
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[SPEAKER_03]: That's what I would ask you.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So what have you seen in terms of that miss communication argument?
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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So what I've seen are things like they told us one date, then they said a different date.
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[SPEAKER_00]: That's the miss communication I'm talking about.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not sure what a formula was in.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not sure if it was like two different emails.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not sure what that is.
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[SPEAKER_00]: But that's where
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[SPEAKER_00]: Again, everything I do is, you know, I'm a little, you know, I'm super early, the reason I'm super early and ahead of things is because the unexpected will occur, if the unexpected occurs, which is communication confusion, whatever you have time, right, to figure that out, give me your thoughts on that now pass and smile.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm wasting you.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, go ahead and smile.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, it's just wondering what you said was pretty interesting in the sense that every year all the institutions you have a certain deadline where you have to have a balance of zero.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Why did I just I just wonder out of all the HBCUs and I think there's 103 of them.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Why did everyone focus on Howard?
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[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and and I say this with love and respect for the kiddo who jumped
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[SPEAKER_03]: I think that, I think that is what jump started everything.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So once her video went viral on TikTok and Instagram, then you had this onslaught of people's like, oh, me too, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: That happened to my child.
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[SPEAKER_03]: There was a video of a woman who was in her car.
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[SPEAKER_03]: I said, that's exactly what happened in my school.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And all I have to say to all of them is show me the screenshots, show me the emails.
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[SPEAKER_03]: If you did everything accurately, and I laid this out in the discussion, if you did everything accurate, you would have evidence of that.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Your HU access portal would have evidence of that.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Your fast food documentation would be time-stamped as to when you process the parent plus loan.
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[SPEAKER_03]: to cover your student's balance, all of that is documented, and not a single instance on the social media interwebs.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Have I seen anyone provide a documentation?
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[SPEAKER_03]: The parents who sent me documentation in private messaging even the screenshots they were sending me showed 20,000, 15,000, and I was like, okay, I see where you've got your tuition assistance from the university.
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[SPEAKER_03]: I see where you have your $5,000, $5,500 on dollar loan from the federal government for your child, but I don't see the parent plus loan to secure the rest of this balance.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So how are you paying for that, all right?
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[SPEAKER_00]: And those situations, what do you advise the parent do?
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[SPEAKER_03]: In the situations where they haven't secured their balances, they mean.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, yeah, so for example, you've been on a roll, you look at this screenshot and have $20,000 and like, okay, well, I have a loan, I hasn't come through yet or that's the situation.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I have the money, I can pay the money, but they won't let me back at what do you advise?
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[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so the two different questions there.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So one, first thing is if you have the loan, then it's already been secured, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: Because overwhelmingly, HBCUs students use federal loans to pay for their college education.
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[SPEAKER_03]: the average number of health recipients at HBCU's is 74%.
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[SPEAKER_03]: How in the universe it has a very low pill number.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So they're only at about 30, when Frederick said 41% the other day, but that's not true, they're about 36%.
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[SPEAKER_03]: A spell might be 36% and they know how it is about 39%, 40%, but the back of matter is we overwhelmingly use federal dollars to be able to pay for our education.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Once you do all of the steps in the federal fast but database, once you do all those steps, your loan is secured, your payment is secured because the institution trusts that the federal government's going to cover the rest of that, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: So you're good.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Once it's secured, once you've done your master promissory note, you're good to go, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: Once you validate it as a parent, we actually have to go in, and we have to verify our IRS documentation in that database for our child, and then we're good to go.
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[SPEAKER_03]: You wouldn't have been unadrolled because your loan would have been secured.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Your balance would have been secured.
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[SPEAKER_03]: through pending payment.
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[SPEAKER_03]: The issue that we heard a lot about was these third party scholarships, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: And so folks like, well, I had a scholarship from, you know, let's just say, well, go to your wife's organization.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Well, Delta Sigma Theta chapter of Yadiyata gave me a scholarship and I'm just waiting on them to send the check to me or to the university to be able to cover, you know, whatever to put it towards my cost of attendance.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Well, in that case, when you have a third party person, that's not a federal government, you have to submit that documentation to the institution.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And even then, they're still a track record.
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[SPEAKER_03]: They're still a paper trail of you doing that.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And if parents had third party scholarships, they would have submitted that to the scholarship office.
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[SPEAKER_03]: They would have uploaded it into their actual portals, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: And they would have had possibly emails verify that that documentation was on its way or that payment was on its way.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And then what the school does is they then put it into the system as either scholarship pending or, you know, something that effect, but either way, again, there is still electronic documentation of all of these things all of these things so that's why you see so many folks who have gotten back in of the 500 they've let back in about 200 because those people did have electronic documentation of things that they had done correctly were accurately right and so.
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[SPEAKER_03]: You know, even if they missed the deadline, they still had documentation either and be emails or screenshots or something that the universe was like, okay, we'll allow you, you know, we'll do an expedited and make an exception to policy for you.
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[SPEAKER_03]: That's what it's typically called exception to policy for you and go ahead and re-admits you and re-enroll you.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So yes, I don't have advice for parents who don't have any of the documentation.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So you mentioned anti black rhetoric.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Do you find that anti black rhetoric towards the HPC use is higher among the black people or higher among others, non black?
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[SPEAKER_03]: Ooh, that's a great question.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And I'm probably going to hurt some failings.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Well, are you ready for it?
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[SPEAKER_03]: I think it's us.
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[SPEAKER_03]: I think it's us.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And I can say that from a lived experience of I was one of them, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: And so if you go to my videos, I have this pinned people talk about who why are you so HBC advocates, like, you know, why are you tendos down for HBCUs?
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[SPEAKER_03]: Because I was one of those students who grew up in Northern Virginia, Alexandria specifically, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: Where I believed HBCUs were beneath me.
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[SPEAKER_03]: I came out of high school,
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[SPEAKER_03]: that have 45 different countries, 46 different languages spoken in that high school in Northern Virginia, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: And I was like, why would I go to a school that's all black people?
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[SPEAKER_03]: Why would I do that?
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[SPEAKER_03]: I thought HBCUs were beneath me.
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[SPEAKER_03]: My mother attended an HBCU to graduate from a general graduate from U to Riss Cincinnati, but she went to Tennessee State and she went to West Virginia State, right?
16:16.518 --> 16:18.519
[SPEAKER_03]: Transfer from one to the other in the back home.
16:18.719 --> 16:24.502
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I was familiar with HBCUs because my mother wanted me to go to HBCU.
16:24.522 --> 16:25.462
[SPEAKER_03]: She wanted me to go to Fisk.
16:25.662 --> 16:31.619
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was like, first of all, I am not going to a school that has less students enrolled than my graduating class, a high school.
16:33.063 --> 16:33.604
[UNKNOWN]: I don't know.
16:35.021 --> 16:40.543
[SPEAKER_03]: but Fisk is an incredible institution, right, that I have learned years later, right?
16:40.603 --> 16:42.644
[SPEAKER_03]: And so, so I say that I think it's us.
16:42.904 --> 16:58.050
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, we have this, my heart's with feelings when I say this, even within the black community, I think we have folks who have drunk the cool way to think anything that's done by black people is not as excellent as what the majority population have done.
16:58.230 --> 16:58.450
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
16:58.550 --> 17:09.716
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, and, and I say this because I see it when we're doing stuff with black businesses, folks, you know, within our own community are upset when they see like, you I want to work with a, you know, a black designer.
17:09.736 --> 17:12.097
[SPEAKER_03]: I want to work with a, you know, a black caterer.
17:12.137 --> 17:14.439
[SPEAKER_03]: I want to work with the, you know, a black event planner.
17:14.819 --> 17:18.241
[SPEAKER_03]: And then when they get those bills is like, well, you know, why is it so high?
17:18.621 --> 17:20.062
[SPEAKER_03]: No, no, this is standard.
17:20.162 --> 17:20.862
[SPEAKER_03]: This is standard.
17:20.902 --> 17:24.164
[SPEAKER_03]: Why would you think that my services would be any less, right?
17:24.344 --> 17:26.185
[SPEAKER_03]: For my community, then, like, I don't
17:26.525 --> 17:29.306
[SPEAKER_01]: No, these are standard fees, right?
17:29.426 --> 17:38.948
[SPEAKER_03]: So I think for whatever reason, there is this underlying current that when it's done by black folks, it's not of the same caliper on quality as when it's done by majority folks.
17:39.328 --> 17:41.849
[SPEAKER_03]: And I think that resonates with how we approach education.
17:41.949 --> 17:44.969
[SPEAKER_02]: Do you say, your parents want to do to go to a HPCU the fifths?
17:45.149 --> 17:46.690
[SPEAKER_02]: If where does that start from?
17:46.750 --> 17:49.731
[SPEAKER_02]: Like when you were younger and you said, I just didn't want to go anywhere.
17:50.051 --> 17:51.691
[SPEAKER_02]: The HPCU's were beneath you.
17:52.051 --> 17:54.132
[SPEAKER_02]: Is that because of something you saw TV?
17:54.192 --> 17:55.492
[SPEAKER_02]: Is that how did that come up?
17:55.953 --> 17:58.816
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I think it's exposure.
17:59.036 --> 18:01.578
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it comes from that limited exposure.
18:01.598 --> 18:04.400
[SPEAKER_03]: My parents never took me to an HB's.
18:04.540 --> 18:06.442
[SPEAKER_03]: So I grew up, like, they know the Virginia.
18:06.482 --> 18:15.510
[SPEAKER_03]: So Howard, I was quite knowledgeable of Howard's campus and the benefits of attending an HBCU when I was in high school for the social aspects.
18:15.670 --> 18:20.454
[SPEAKER_03]: But I would never have thought academically that it would have been the challenge that I needed, right?
18:20.514 --> 18:32.082
[SPEAKER_03]: I never would have thought culturally, career-wise, that it would have been the grounds on which I would be able to thrive and become, you know, in the provision that I'm in, in education, I never thought that.
18:32.703 --> 18:38.507
[SPEAKER_03]: And secondarily to that, so I was really big in a track and feel on a high school sign of going to the school that paid for me.
18:38.627 --> 18:40.008
[SPEAKER_03]: I had a scholarship at a track scholarship.
18:40.345 --> 18:44.926
[SPEAKER_03]: So I ended up going to the school that paid for me there, and I didn't get any recruitment offers from HBCUs, right?
18:44.946 --> 18:48.568
[SPEAKER_03]: So my recruitment offers are coming from schools like I've been Pittsburgh, right?
18:48.588 --> 18:54.869
[SPEAKER_03]: Like I've been a group of letters from my Harvard, St. John's, and I'm landing at JMU, that's where I went to school from undergrad.
18:55.009 --> 18:56.970
[SPEAKER_03]: But yeah, so I think it's a combination of exposure.
18:57.130 --> 19:03.232
[SPEAKER_03]: I think it's a combination of my guidance counselor, not pushing it as an option for academic excellence.
19:03.392 --> 19:04.793
[SPEAKER_03]: You know what types of things like that?
19:04.993 --> 19:05.633
[SPEAKER_03]: So yeah.
19:05.713 --> 19:07.553
[SPEAKER_00]: So tell me about the moment when you realized
19:09.878 --> 19:10.579
[SPEAKER_03]: Absolutely.
19:10.739 --> 19:12.822
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I mean, it was like a lightning bolt.
19:13.262 --> 19:14.423
[SPEAKER_03]: It was an absolute lightning bolt.
19:14.844 --> 19:20.290
[SPEAKER_03]: So I came out of came out of school immediately went into teaching high school.
19:20.510 --> 19:22.893
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I was a high school English teacher for years.
19:23.113 --> 19:26.998
[SPEAKER_03]: And when I transitioned from K-12 to higher education,
19:27.368 --> 19:27.768
[SPEAKER_03]: Right.
19:27.828 --> 19:33.452
[SPEAKER_03]: And I realized my transition was because I realized that it wasn't my students, my high school students that were the issue.
19:33.633 --> 19:37.836
[SPEAKER_03]: It was the really shitty teachers that they were getting when they left by classroom.
19:38.356 --> 19:40.678
[SPEAKER_03]: And I was like, oh my god, I have to make better teachers.
19:40.878 --> 19:44.441
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I went into higher ed to be able to help make better teachers.
19:44.461 --> 19:45.381
[SPEAKER_03]: And I get in the higher ed.
19:45.401 --> 19:45.982
[SPEAKER_03]: And I realize
19:46.582 --> 19:48.443
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh my God, it's not the teachers.
19:48.783 --> 19:54.406
[SPEAKER_03]: It's the fact that these colleges don't have the money to be able to help make the better teachers.
19:54.606 --> 20:03.931
[SPEAKER_03]: And then when I got into that space of resource acquisition, it's when I dawn on me the profound inequities that exist between certain types of institutions.
20:04.371 --> 20:10.775
[SPEAKER_03]: And then that allowed me to start peeling back the onion on this thing of funding acquisition
20:15.975 --> 20:22.680
[SPEAKER_03]: and I saw how HPCUs were producing some of the best and brightest for our country.
20:23.361 --> 20:25.102
[SPEAKER_03]: The numbers aren't unparalleled.
20:25.455 --> 20:26.235
[SPEAKER_03]: absolutely unparalleled.
20:26.495 --> 20:31.978
[SPEAKER_03]: But then when you look at the fact that up until about four years ago, I mean, I mean, it still is like 1.2 cents.
20:32.038 --> 20:41.041
[SPEAKER_03]: But up until about four years ago, HBCs were only getting one cent on the dollar when it comes to funding resources from the federal government for research.
20:41.261 --> 20:42.221
[SPEAKER_01]: One cent on the dollar.
20:42.301 --> 20:43.602
[SPEAKER_03]: And I realized that that was it.
20:43.702 --> 20:46.083
[SPEAKER_03]: That was my awakening moment was that
20:46.759 --> 20:53.283
[SPEAKER_03]: This group of institutions has been punching them of their weight for so long and so unfairly.
20:53.463 --> 20:59.327
[SPEAKER_03]: That I will never dedicate my resources to any other group of institutions again, right?
20:59.367 --> 20:59.767
[SPEAKER_03]: And so,
21:00.583 --> 21:07.445
[SPEAKER_03]: So I have since worked for two HBCUs, I work at a nonprofit now that serves all 103 of them.
21:07.625 --> 21:11.506
[SPEAKER_03]: We serve 893 counts universities, but we also serve all 103 HBCUs.
21:11.846 --> 21:17.268
[SPEAKER_03]: My research overwhelmingly is focused on organizational development for HBCUs.
21:17.368 --> 21:19.669
[SPEAKER_03]: And because that's where I want my talents, you know, to
21:20.343 --> 21:27.248
[SPEAKER_03]: to serve our country the most is by supporting this group of institutions because I know what they do as a group of institutions.
21:27.668 --> 21:29.069
[SPEAKER_03]: So that was my awakening moment.
21:29.109 --> 21:30.811
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, I was well into my 30s.
21:30.851 --> 21:32.632
[SPEAKER_03]: When it happened, well into my 30s.
21:32.692 --> 21:34.233
[SPEAKER_03]: When it happened, um, let me have.
21:34.400 --> 21:36.361
[SPEAKER_00]: I have one comment, and I'll give it to Smiley here.
21:36.662 --> 21:38.062
[SPEAKER_00]: And some of this is accurate.
21:38.563 --> 21:41.365
[SPEAKER_00]: I look at HPCUs as a cocoon, right?
21:41.785 --> 21:45.928
[SPEAKER_00]: You go on to the cocoon where you get all the nourishment, the attention, the guidance.
21:46.148 --> 21:48.389
[SPEAKER_00]: No one there wants to see you fail.
21:48.710 --> 21:58.936
[SPEAKER_00]: Everyone there from your administration, teachers, your peer group, they all generally have this desire for you to succeed.
21:59.157 --> 22:02.139
[SPEAKER_00]: You have to have a stronger desire for yourself to fail.
22:02.939 --> 22:07.781
[SPEAKER_00]: we ignore it for that take place, we come out of the nature we see you, right?
22:07.821 --> 22:15.524
[SPEAKER_00]: Just like a cocoon, you have these wings, if you will, to take on to, you know, fly and swore to the highest heights.
22:15.704 --> 22:26.609
[SPEAKER_00]: Additionally, perhaps more importantly in today's environment, you have like this Teflon shield, right, where you feel like you could take on anything that you're faced with,
22:27.782 --> 22:30.806
[SPEAKER_03]: It's 100% shoot, 1,000%, right?
22:31.026 --> 22:35.871
[SPEAKER_03]: You actively have to want to fail if you live enrolled in HPCU.
22:36.312 --> 22:41.458
[SPEAKER_03]: You have to actively try to fail because our institutions, like you said, in general, right?
22:41.538 --> 22:45.182
[SPEAKER_03]: And then there's some one-off people, maybe at the institutions who don't need to be there.
22:45.382 --> 22:48.366
[SPEAKER_03]: But the institution as an entity itself,
22:48.826 --> 22:58.078
[SPEAKER_03]: Overwhelmingly places so many things in your path for success that you have to literally step over or around them to not be hitting the face by them, right?
22:58.398 --> 23:02.504
[SPEAKER_03]: So from the very beginning, they start most of our school start what's called the first year experience.
23:02.644 --> 23:07.350
[SPEAKER_03]: So they bring the first year students to campus before everybody else starts.
23:07.550 --> 23:22.741
[SPEAKER_03]: and they typically go through a week and a half, maybe a week of activities and sessions and workshops, all about acclimating them to the campus by showing them where the student success offices, where the advisors are, where all the things that they're gonna need, right?
23:22.842 --> 23:24.343
[SPEAKER_03]: They typically do that a week before we start.
23:24.463 --> 23:25.964
[SPEAKER_03]: My people, PWI didn't do that.
23:26.264 --> 23:28.646
[SPEAKER_03]: You just showed up, got dropped off and just went ahead and start.
23:29.086 --> 23:31.668
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know, a single HPC that doesn't do that.
23:32.028 --> 23:32.689
[SPEAKER_03]: That's the first thing.
23:32.889 --> 23:37.414
[SPEAKER_03]: Second thing is, you often have at most institutions at least two advisors, too, right?
23:37.834 --> 23:48.386
[SPEAKER_03]: You've got your academic advisor, who's in whatever major that you're in, and then you often have a professional advisor who's coming out of the title three supported student success office, right?
23:48.666 --> 23:55.093
[SPEAKER_03]: So you had at least two adults, okay, this, who are there to help you with your academic decisions, right?
23:55.253 --> 24:02.377
[SPEAKER_03]: The third thing that every institution typically has, HBC typically has, is they had these thing called early warning alert systems.
24:02.577 --> 24:10.382
[SPEAKER_03]: So in whatever my student, I'm blanking on the term, but it's their plan, our enterprise student enterprise systems, there we go.
24:10.402 --> 24:14.805
[SPEAKER_03]: So the enterprise systems, whatever enterprises and they use, they typically have some sort of early award system.
24:15.242 --> 24:16.243
[SPEAKER_03]: early alert system.
24:16.603 --> 24:31.191
[SPEAKER_03]: So if I stop showing up to class one week, my professor who's typically taking attendance, right, puts it into the earlier work system, that early alert then triggers somebody in the student's success office to then reach out to figure out what's going on with me, right?
24:31.291 --> 24:39.896
[SPEAKER_03]: So we have all of these things in place to be able to help students along the way that for me to not benefit from those means that I am purposely
24:40.336 --> 24:41.016
[SPEAKER_03]: avoiding you.
24:41.217 --> 24:42.537
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not answering emails.
24:42.617 --> 24:44.138
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not checking my text messages.
24:44.178 --> 24:52.642
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm purposefully avoiding all of these things, and then is something that our schools have just baked into their identity as institutions.
24:52.802 --> 25:04.368
[SPEAKER_03]: Because we overwhelmingly serve populations of students where college may be their first, you know, they might be the first college-holy person in their family, or they're overwhelmingly coming from communities.
25:08.010 --> 25:11.891
[SPEAKER_03]: So they might be coming from communities that are historically under-resourced financially.
25:12.431 --> 25:16.373
[SPEAKER_03]: So we have baked it into our system to be able to be able to co-coonize.
25:16.393 --> 25:17.133
[SPEAKER_03]: That's not a word.
25:17.493 --> 25:21.554
[SPEAKER_03]: Great to co-grade and baked it into the system to create this cocoon for our students.
25:21.914 --> 25:23.055
[SPEAKER_03]: And then the research shows it.
25:23.255 --> 25:31.337
[SPEAKER_03]: Like when I graduate from an HPC, HPC graduates overwhelmingly a decade later have higher quality of life reporting.
25:32.197 --> 25:34.398
[SPEAKER_03]: on standards measures for that.
25:34.798 --> 25:37.779
[SPEAKER_03]: So we overwhelmingly have lower levels of depression.
25:37.979 --> 25:43.420
[SPEAKER_03]: We overwhelmingly have higher economic, what's our economic mobility.
25:43.440 --> 25:43.760
[SPEAKER_03]: There we go.
25:43.780 --> 25:44.960
[SPEAKER_03]: High levels of economic mobility.
25:45.180 --> 25:51.402
[SPEAKER_03]: So all of the metrics show, HBCU in terms of that cocoonization thing is absolutely valid.
25:51.422 --> 25:55.023
[SPEAKER_03]: So your points are absolutely rooted in what we see in the research.
25:56.058 --> 25:56.999
[SPEAKER_03]: appreciate that as well.
25:57.019 --> 25:57.119
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
25:57.319 --> 26:09.126
[SPEAKER_02]: With the the take talk that you said or to Instagram, it was 1.8 million and you talked about the discrepancies between patents and scientists between Ivy League and HPC use.
26:09.766 --> 26:13.348
[SPEAKER_02]: And I just wanted you to talk about that because I found that fascinating.
26:13.388 --> 26:16.670
[SPEAKER_02]: I watched it two times because I love the way you broke down the numbers.
26:16.990 --> 26:24.417
[SPEAKER_02]: And you, from a number's perspective of how we promote so many scientists, but we don't get that same amount of patterns.
26:24.777 --> 26:34.106
[SPEAKER_02]: And then, during the way she did it in her TikTok, we don't even get lights at some of our laboratories where these other laboratories are so fancy and they're not producing the same.
26:34.546 --> 26:39.691
[SPEAKER_02]: We're rising in spite of all the lack of resources we have.
26:40.111 --> 26:46.754
[SPEAKER_02]: But can you talk about your findings of round that 1.8 million because that number just seemed like a big number.
26:46.914 --> 26:48.734
[SPEAKER_02]: But the way you broke it down, it was clear.
26:48.754 --> 26:50.095
[SPEAKER_02]: And I was like, why is this?
26:50.175 --> 26:52.616
[SPEAKER_02]: Why can't our country, you said, for our country?
26:52.656 --> 26:54.296
[SPEAKER_02]: And I thought that was really patriotic.
26:54.316 --> 26:57.558
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, why is in our country putting money behind the talent?
26:57.978 --> 26:58.518
[SPEAKER_02]: That's there.
26:58.778 --> 27:00.959
[SPEAKER_02]: So, that's coming on there.
27:01.179 --> 27:01.519
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
27:01.839 --> 27:04.060
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I asked myself that question all the time.
27:04.280 --> 27:07.161
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, why is the country doing the things that we do?
27:07.321 --> 27:08.842
[SPEAKER_01]: Particularly when the evidence is clear.
27:09.682 --> 27:14.567
[SPEAKER_03]: So the work that I do is called research and development ecosystem development.
27:14.767 --> 27:20.652
[SPEAKER_03]: And so we support institutions who are trying to grow their R&D ecosystems.
27:20.852 --> 27:26.297
[SPEAKER_03]: So that means the money that we're bringing into the college to be able to do really cool stuff.
27:26.517 --> 27:33.003
[SPEAKER_03]: right, like so the stuff in the labs, the stuff out in the fields, the stuff, you know, of space and on my oceans.
27:33.423 --> 27:38.608
[SPEAKER_03]: Like so we overwhelmingly support schools to be able to bring in money to do that really really cool science.
27:38.828 --> 27:50.779
[SPEAKER_03]: And I asked myself all the time why we know which institutions in this country produce and graduate the most eligible folks to be able to work in this industry of science technology.
27:50.799 --> 27:51.980
[SPEAKER_03]: It's called S&T Workforce.
27:53.728 --> 27:57.309
[SPEAKER_03]: And yet the bulk of the money still goes to the research one institutions, right?
27:57.449 --> 28:03.070
[SPEAKER_03]: They still go to the Harvard's, the Berkeley's, the Duke's, the Stanford's, right, the UCLA's.
28:03.290 --> 28:15.073
[SPEAKER_03]: That money over one leg goes to those institutions, while those institutions are not producing in bulk the same amount of students for the workforce that non-R1 institutions produce.
28:15.313 --> 28:17.234
[SPEAKER_03]: And so yes, I don't know why.
28:17.254 --> 28:18.614
[SPEAKER_03]: I don't have an answer for that.
28:18.714 --> 28:22.195
[SPEAKER_03]: But as you said, in the TED talk, my band's TEDx,
28:23.295 --> 28:35.321
[SPEAKER_03]: Because they had banned me and I actually recently just got a notification from meta that that TEDx has filed an intellectual property claim against my video What does they want to be taking now?
28:35.761 --> 28:37.062
[SPEAKER_01]: That's crazy.
28:37.082 --> 28:38.762
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so it's a whole thing and it's a whole thing.
28:40.635 --> 28:42.756
[SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, but I mean, the numbers bear it out, right?
28:42.956 --> 28:47.257
[SPEAKER_02]: But the question I have is the difference between the patterns in the scientists.
28:47.637 --> 28:54.460
[SPEAKER_02]: Because if we're creating more, why don't we or patterns reflect the amount of students or the scientists we create?
28:54.480 --> 29:00.662
[SPEAKER_02]: Because it seemed like the money follows the patterns versus the actual output of the talent or is it opposite?
29:01.102 --> 29:03.302
[SPEAKER_03]: No, no, the money, no, patterns are expensive.
29:04.103 --> 29:04.803
[SPEAKER_03]: Hats are expensive.
29:05.247 --> 29:11.270
[SPEAKER_03]: So, by the mind, to be able to be average cost for patent for institutions about $13,000.
29:11.471 --> 29:13.372
[SPEAKER_03]: That's just to pay for the patent.
29:13.512 --> 29:20.696
[SPEAKER_03]: That doesn't include all of the stuff that happens in the patent development phase before it gets to patent.
29:21.476 --> 29:26.239
[SPEAKER_03]: So to bring something to a commercial, commercializable fact, right?
29:26.259 --> 29:28.621
[SPEAKER_03]: And that's just because you have a pat, it doesn't mean it's commercializable.
29:28.821 --> 29:29.802
[SPEAKER_03]: It takes 10 years.
29:29.982 --> 29:31.763
[SPEAKER_03]: It's an average, I have a book chapter about this.
29:31.783 --> 29:35.526
[SPEAKER_03]: It takes an average of 10 years for you to take from idea to market.
29:35.746 --> 29:36.947
[SPEAKER_03]: OK?
29:37.167 --> 29:39.589
[SPEAKER_03]: And that is a very, very expensive process.
29:39.689 --> 29:48.095
[SPEAKER_03]: And so even when we have the people, which is where all the ideas are situated, even when we have the people who are doing that work, who are producing the ideas, the costs,
29:48.723 --> 29:51.949
[SPEAKER_03]: to take something to patent and market is very high.
29:52.129 --> 29:59.321
[SPEAKER_03]: And again, if I'm floating the cost of 500 students who have a $20,000 balance, that's $15 million.
30:00.684 --> 30:05.046
[SPEAKER_03]: Where am I getting the money to be able to pay for my faculty and those students to be able to pay for patents?
30:05.086 --> 30:10.228
[SPEAKER_03]: If I'm having a cover, then I had this great conversation with a colleague and a dear dear friend of mine yesterday.
30:10.428 --> 30:20.113
[SPEAKER_03]: If I'm having to cover the losses, the debt of one part of my institution over here, how am I covering the other part of things that we want to be able to do over here?
30:20.393 --> 30:22.354
[SPEAKER_03]: Like, it's a numbers game, right?
30:22.374 --> 30:22.974
[SPEAKER_03]: It's a numbers game.
30:23.054 --> 30:29.337
[SPEAKER_03]: And so you don't see that patent development because overwhelmingly schools have to reinvest that money into other things like,
30:29.817 --> 30:40.165
[SPEAKER_03]: taking care of student tuition discounts, like covering the differences of balances because they've allowed the student to go with the balance, you know, for the entire school year, and now that bill has to be paid, right?
30:40.225 --> 30:44.628
[SPEAKER_03]: So, so this is why I think we see that to your point in question.
30:44.848 --> 30:51.853
[SPEAKER_03]: Why people just won't invest in our institutions at the same rate as other institutions, that I'm still trying to answer and fix all its end up.
30:51.953 --> 30:54.336
[SPEAKER_02]: So here's, here's one before I send it back to Drake.
30:54.456 --> 31:03.307
[SPEAKER_02]: If if you had genius a bottle or I'll pick them a linda gates because she's giving a lot of money or donating a lot of money to HPC use or universities.
31:03.528 --> 31:06.431
[SPEAKER_02]: If you were sitting with her and you had them and she's like, I'm going to give you
31:07.533 --> 31:09.074
[SPEAKER_02]: $200 million.
31:09.214 --> 31:10.235
[SPEAKER_02]: $500 million.
31:10.415 --> 31:24.945
[SPEAKER_02]: What would you use that money for an HPCU, which you use it for the science and technology, which you use it to build a stadium, which you use it to, what would be the best silver bullet use case for that $500 million she just writes to check for.
31:24.965 --> 31:32.010
[SPEAKER_02]: That would just do the most impact, to real the most benefits for HPCU's overall from your data.
31:32.070 --> 31:32.350
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
31:32.510 --> 31:37.433
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so the money that McKenzie Scott has been giving has been extremely helpful.
31:37.613 --> 31:43.137
[SPEAKER_03]: The Gates Foundation is through their gifts for scholarships and student success programs has been profoundly impactful.
31:43.317 --> 31:46.639
[SPEAKER_03]: But if again, if I had a blank check, that's your point, right?
31:46.659 --> 31:48.861
[SPEAKER_03]: 500 million dollars does not go a very long way.
31:49.061 --> 31:56.726
[SPEAKER_03]: And so what I would do is I would immediately invest it into an endowment immediately because what an endowment does is you are then able to
31:59.363 --> 32:01.564
[SPEAKER_03]: right of the interest of that endowment.
32:01.764 --> 32:03.045
[SPEAKER_03]: And so I actually did a video about this.
32:03.065 --> 32:04.225
[SPEAKER_03]: I'll email to you all later.
32:04.265 --> 32:09.428
[SPEAKER_03]: I did a video about this about why folks were like, well, you know, McKenzie Scott is helping to close the gap.
32:09.775 --> 32:10.535
[SPEAKER_03]: for HPC use.
32:10.675 --> 32:11.215
[SPEAKER_03]: No, she's not.
32:11.415 --> 32:17.117
[SPEAKER_03]: No, she's not because the compounded interest of what we have gone without will never be closed.
32:17.297 --> 32:25.000
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like a 1.4 trillion dollars that has to be given to help close the gap for HPC use in terms of financial resources.
32:25.180 --> 32:25.860
[SPEAKER_03]: And no one's given.
32:25.920 --> 32:27.140
[SPEAKER_03]: No one's cut those types of checks.
32:27.340 --> 32:33.922
[SPEAKER_03]: So if I were to ever be in a position where I could do that, it would immediately go into an endowment.
32:34.142 --> 32:36.323
[SPEAKER_03]: I would immediately use those endowment funds.
32:37.083 --> 32:44.486
[SPEAKER_03]: to be able to support research and development growth and institutions because that is how you're able to then cultivate more money, right?
32:44.526 --> 33:03.912
[SPEAKER_03]: Money makes money and so if I'm able to then get the best labs if I'm then able to actually support the best and brightest students who already had my schools but if I'm able to further support them so that they can invest their time and talents into the institutional activities and not have to go find a job, you know, while they're also being
33:04.332 --> 33:07.735
[SPEAKER_03]: an engineering major, or a chemistry major, or whatever they're doing, bio-tech major.
33:07.935 --> 33:11.799
[SPEAKER_03]: If I can reinvest in that, I think that would generate its own funding sources.
33:12.499 --> 33:15.702
[SPEAKER_03]: But I'm an academic so I'm biased, so of course I'll put it into academics.
33:16.049 --> 33:19.633
[SPEAKER_00]: So the money that McKenzie, McKenzie Scott, is giving is not closing the gap.
33:19.853 --> 33:20.213
[SPEAKER_00]: What's it doing?
33:20.233 --> 33:20.994
[SPEAKER_00]: Not, not in close.
33:21.094 --> 33:21.695
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, God, no.
33:21.875 --> 33:22.376
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, my God.
33:22.436 --> 33:22.656
[SPEAKER_00]: No.
33:22.956 --> 33:23.197
[SPEAKER_00]: No.
33:23.337 --> 33:24.278
[SPEAKER_00]: What is what is it doing?
33:24.538 --> 33:25.639
[SPEAKER_00]: What would value does it bring?
33:25.699 --> 33:27.041
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it still brings value, right?
33:27.081 --> 33:28.082
[SPEAKER_03]: Because it allows.
33:28.162 --> 33:28.883
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, it's thing about it.
33:28.943 --> 33:35.309
[SPEAKER_03]: It's like, if you woke up tomorrow, Drake, and you hit the lottery for $10 million, what would that do to change your life?
33:35.990 --> 33:36.611
[SPEAKER_01]: Not much.
33:37.690 --> 33:38.551
[SPEAKER_01]: Come on now.
33:38.851 --> 33:39.832
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a change now.
33:39.992 --> 33:41.433
[SPEAKER_01]: I give you $10.
33:41.453 --> 33:42.574
[SPEAKER_01]: $10 is a change now.
33:43.214 --> 33:44.696
[SPEAKER_01]: I got a business of taste.
33:44.776 --> 33:45.776
[SPEAKER_01]: I got a business of taste.
33:45.896 --> 33:47.958
[SPEAKER_01]: I have two kids that are going to college.
33:48.098 --> 33:48.418
[SPEAKER_01]: Great.
33:48.438 --> 33:48.979
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
33:48.999 --> 33:50.540
[SPEAKER_03]: You're more into the paid for the year.
33:50.600 --> 33:50.800
[SPEAKER_03]: Shoot.
33:50.820 --> 33:52.442
[SPEAKER_03]: Like you could probably pay off your house.
33:53.022 --> 34:14.907
[SPEAKER_03]: right pay off your house that means you're now saving that interest that you would have spent over the next 30 years to pay gone right you could probably go out and take care of anything around your house that need to be repaired that you've been shown off on right for fixed setup right you could put some money aside and have a grow for you know your family members to use down the line right so there's still a benefit
34:15.287 --> 34:18.029
[SPEAKER_03]: to any gift that you give to an HBCU period.
34:18.229 --> 34:29.337
[SPEAKER_03]: And the money that she has given because it was unrestricted money means they could use it however they saw fit to do what they needed to do for the well-being of their institution and their students.
34:29.877 --> 34:34.060
[SPEAKER_03]: And so you had a lot of those presidents who were taking care of, you know, paying for
34:34.600 --> 34:43.451
[SPEAKER_03]: Gallances of students, like I was at an institution where that was one of the, one of the priorities, was they were helping to pay for students so we could get them to the finish line.
34:43.691 --> 34:46.194
[SPEAKER_03]: Here are a number of institutions who are paying for facilities.
34:46.574 --> 34:52.141
[SPEAKER_03]: You are a number of institutions who use that money to go into their endowment so that they could further grow.
34:52.541 --> 35:01.344
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, HTC users' dominance are overwhelmingly small, but they could further grow their endowments so that they could then have a larger return the following year to reinvest into the institution.
35:01.504 --> 35:06.445
[SPEAKER_03]: So any dollar that's given to an HTC was a dollar well given period.
35:06.625 --> 35:11.367
[SPEAKER_03]: And if you're going to start giving two commas worth of checks, then that's definitely going to benefit the institution.
35:11.747 --> 35:12.928
[SPEAKER_03]: No matter which school you give it to.
35:12.988 --> 35:13.848
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like glad you said that.
35:13.908 --> 35:15.750
[SPEAKER_00]: So this is going to be kind of a wrap in here.
35:15.770 --> 35:17.411
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like glad you move much of the two commas.
35:17.491 --> 35:18.852
[SPEAKER_00]: Smiley, I'm on her page.
35:19.032 --> 35:22.414
[SPEAKER_00]: And she says, you know, she has a post where people are complaining.
35:22.434 --> 35:23.394
[SPEAKER_00]: I want to go to the president.
35:23.435 --> 35:24.435
[SPEAKER_00]: She creates a folk chart.
35:24.635 --> 35:26.516
[SPEAKER_00]: So I explained whether or not you love it.
35:26.536 --> 35:27.437
[SPEAKER_00]: She go to the president.
35:27.877 --> 35:28.598
[SPEAKER_01]: Is he so alert?
35:28.958 --> 35:29.879
[SPEAKER_01]: A lot of it was.
35:29.899 --> 35:30.479
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yes.
35:30.539 --> 35:31.300
[SPEAKER_01]: No, you get it.
35:31.520 --> 35:35.762
[SPEAKER_01]: At least two commas worth of donations to your alma mater.
35:37.143 --> 35:43.309
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't go no bother the president if you don't know the second line of the stands that you're all Well, water don't bother the president.
35:43.510 --> 35:48.855
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm glad you mentioned that check it that second thing is too Because we're watching the final four thoughts.
35:49.315 --> 35:52.098
[SPEAKER_00]: You have to go in deep deep on this to speak use dress code.
35:52.178 --> 35:55.702
[SPEAKER_00]: I support it I do too every college of University has a dress code
35:56.182 --> 35:57.343
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I do too.
35:57.383 --> 36:00.045
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, like I don't know why we're so mad.
36:00.085 --> 36:01.266
[SPEAKER_03]: Like what's the big deal?
36:01.366 --> 36:05.168
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not going up to glass in a sports brawl in some booty shorts.
36:05.488 --> 36:09.952
[SPEAKER_03]: Like I'm not shown up to class with, you know, what is their issue with the do rags, right?
36:09.972 --> 36:10.372
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm not sure.
36:10.392 --> 36:11.773
[SPEAKER_00]: You rags for janitors.
36:12.373 --> 36:25.717
[SPEAKER_03]: And pajamas, and I love, so I don't know if you also present a Rosalind Clarks post the other day on Facebook, I send it to you, but she did this long commentary as a university president, how she feels about this situation.
36:25.877 --> 36:30.298
[SPEAKER_03]: And she blames Silicon Valley for this now relaxed.
36:31.144 --> 36:33.385
[SPEAKER_03]: a corporate attire that has permeated.
36:33.485 --> 36:39.228
[SPEAKER_03]: But then she circles back and says, even though that is like the issue, right?
36:39.308 --> 36:43.830
[SPEAKER_03]: That the Silicon Valley has created a space where you can now show up to work in genes, right?
36:43.850 --> 36:46.571
[SPEAKER_03]: In a pollow or genes in a sweatshirt, and that's considered acceptable.
36:46.771 --> 36:49.912
[SPEAKER_03]: But there's still a level of professionalism that is expected.
36:50.093 --> 36:53.974
[SPEAKER_03]: And so she says this in the post-variant clearly issues like Sonal Manor, what you're perspective?
36:54.054 --> 36:57.576
[SPEAKER_03]: There is still a level of professionalism that is expected.
36:57.756 --> 37:04.018
[SPEAKER_03]: I had a colleague who's on social media goes by the name Asterstead, who's an astrophysicist.
37:04.257 --> 37:05.897
[SPEAKER_03]: brilliant, brilliant person.
37:06.097 --> 37:07.558
[SPEAKER_03]: But they are a fan of the duerex.
37:07.838 --> 37:09.978
[SPEAKER_03]: And they do a lot of posts with their duerex.
37:10.138 --> 37:16.860
[SPEAKER_03]: And then this one post they talked about how, you know, my duerex didn't keep me from, you know, working in a lab at Stanford.
37:16.940 --> 37:20.181
[SPEAKER_03]: My duerex didn't keep me from working in a national lab.
37:20.221 --> 37:24.221
[SPEAKER_03]: My duerex didn't keep me from, you know, being engaged in research at my institution.
37:24.402 --> 37:25.422
[SPEAKER_03]: And I agree with all of that.
37:25.522 --> 37:30.803
[SPEAKER_03]: It might not have kept you from those things, but I promise that you didn't show up to Stanford for your Stanford interview and your duerex.
37:30.983 --> 37:46.159
[SPEAKER_03]: So why is it okay to do that type of thing in our professional settings on campus which is a classroom is a professional setting no matter how you spin it it is a professional setting so why is that okay for our institutions to allow that in our professional settings.
37:46.498 --> 37:49.719
[SPEAKER_03]: that we wouldn't have that expectation outside of our campuses.
37:49.799 --> 37:51.139
[SPEAKER_03]: So I'm all in favor of it.
37:51.379 --> 37:53.079
[SPEAKER_03]: I love a child in a suit.
37:53.279 --> 37:59.040
[SPEAKER_03]: I love a child who shows up at a nice sheathed dress in the heel and a person like I love a professional look.
37:59.260 --> 37:59.540
[SPEAKER_03]: Right?
38:00.220 --> 38:05.621
[SPEAKER_03]: You know, the 40s and the 50s were some of my favorite dress times because everybody was suited out in the 40s, right?
38:05.761 --> 38:10.582
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, you will, you know, garbage man showing up in a suit on a typical day.
38:10.642 --> 38:13.743
[SPEAKER_03]: I just love, I just love that type of clean look, right?
38:14.443 --> 38:14.683
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
38:14.984 --> 38:15.244
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
38:16.205 --> 38:17.086
[SPEAKER_00]: I tease my son.
38:17.126 --> 38:18.787
[SPEAKER_00]: I keep teasing that.
38:18.907 --> 38:19.788
[SPEAKER_00]: I think I'm getting old.
38:20.148 --> 38:21.169
[SPEAKER_00]: And this is another example.
38:21.269 --> 38:21.990
[SPEAKER_00]: I think I'm getting old.
38:22.190 --> 38:25.893
[SPEAKER_00]: I believe that the way you dress, right, does a couple things.
38:26.293 --> 38:26.573
[SPEAKER_00]: Fun.
38:26.714 --> 38:29.896
[SPEAKER_00]: Someone's going to create an impression of you within seven seconds.
38:30.076 --> 38:32.799
[SPEAKER_00]: Based on how you address, how you present yourself.
38:32.999 --> 38:33.199
[SPEAKER_00]: Right?
38:33.499 --> 38:34.380
[SPEAKER_00]: That's the first thing they see.
38:34.440 --> 38:36.342
[SPEAKER_00]: Before you open your mouth, that's the first thing they see.
38:36.722 --> 38:37.363
[SPEAKER_00]: So the way you dress,
38:38.363 --> 38:38.943
[SPEAKER_00]: does everything.
38:39.464 --> 38:44.266
[SPEAKER_00]: Second thing is, it impacts what you feel about yourself, the way you care yourself, right?
38:44.666 --> 38:58.612
[SPEAKER_00]: And so if you're walking around and you know, pajama pans with a do rag on, you're going to care yourself much differently than you would if you were some khaki's a button up and some, you know, some nice, you know, casual dress shoes.
38:59.052 --> 39:01.133
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I see the idea
39:02.033 --> 39:08.717
[SPEAKER_00]: dressing in such a way when you go to class, you have this presence, you know, you're ready to learn people and it's contagious, right?
39:08.757 --> 39:14.960
[SPEAKER_00]: Everyone around you looks like we're all in this, you know, to to present ourselves with their best foot forward.
39:15.000 --> 39:16.521
[SPEAKER_00]: So again, I agree with you as well.
39:16.801 --> 39:18.582
[SPEAKER_00]: Last thing, then I'll give it a smile.
39:19.122 --> 39:20.323
[SPEAKER_00]: You mentioned that chapter in your book.
39:20.663 --> 39:21.443
[SPEAKER_00]: You have a book out?
39:21.483 --> 39:23.204
[SPEAKER_03]: So there's a textbook that was written.
39:23.384 --> 39:25.545
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so a textbook that was written a couple of years back.
39:26.466 --> 39:27.306
[SPEAKER_03]: I'll find it for you.
39:27.346 --> 39:30.148
[SPEAKER_03]: But yeah, so I do a chapter about commercialization for
39:30.608 --> 39:58.198
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm working on a book right now, really excited about that actually, it's a talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk talk
39:58.481 --> 40:01.342
[SPEAKER_03]: because what we do at our institutions is really, really important.
40:01.523 --> 40:03.183
[SPEAKER_03]: And nobody's reading anymore, right?
40:03.203 --> 40:09.587
[SPEAKER_03]: Like I do articles still, but like nobody's reading my article, but I can get 20,000, 30,000 views on a video, right?
40:09.627 --> 40:15.530
[SPEAKER_03]: So, so it's just a book about how to use digital social media to be able to disseminate science to the general public.
40:15.590 --> 40:15.810
[SPEAKER_00]: Love it.
40:15.830 --> 40:17.691
[SPEAKER_00]: And just for the record, I'll give it a smiley.
40:18.071 --> 40:20.012
[SPEAKER_00]: When you scolded us, you filed us.
40:20.032 --> 40:22.113
[SPEAKER_00]: Just for the record, you filed us, it's scolded us.
40:23.347 --> 40:47.404
[SPEAKER_02]: It's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just
40:48.224 --> 40:49.725
[SPEAKER_02]: Wednesday, what are you going to get the next two?
40:49.925 --> 40:50.266
[SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
40:50.426 --> 40:50.886
[SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely.
40:50.926 --> 40:51.947
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
40:52.267 --> 40:54.248
[SPEAKER_03]: So, so I will be presenting.
40:54.268 --> 40:57.210
[SPEAKER_03]: I will be presenting at Southern University in August.
40:58.071 --> 41:01.934
[SPEAKER_03]: I will be presenting at Lincoln, in Pennsylvania in November.
41:02.074 --> 41:05.496
[SPEAKER_03]: We will be giving a workshop at Harris Stowe in September.
41:05.897 --> 41:06.237
[SPEAKER_03]: So, yeah.
41:06.277 --> 41:12.401
[SPEAKER_03]: So, so technically my next three schools are Southern University, Harris Stowe, Lincoln, right?
41:12.421 --> 41:14.543
[SPEAKER_03]: So, those are the ones that I have on the calendar right now.
41:15.529 --> 41:16.090
[SPEAKER_01]: for sure.
41:16.690 --> 41:16.891
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.
41:17.591 --> 41:19.273
[SPEAKER_02]: This has been totally exciting.
41:19.293 --> 41:24.339
[SPEAKER_02]: So before we go into final four, are there any things we should ask you that we didn't ask you?
41:24.620 --> 41:27.743
[SPEAKER_03]: A son of a one final point about the dress code thing, right?
41:27.844 --> 41:29.946
[SPEAKER_03]: And and I saw somebody else make this commentary.
41:29.986 --> 41:34.111
[SPEAKER_03]: I believe it was on roll and Martin show, which I absolutely adore, because he can be fun.
41:36.093 --> 41:49.143
[SPEAKER_03]: But I love this comment that how you show up to class, particularly at an HBCU is not necessarily just a reflection about how you see yourself, but it's also a reflection as to how you see the person who's instructing you.
41:50.124 --> 41:56.629
[SPEAKER_03]: And our schools have some phenomenal world-class scholars and academics.
41:57.654 --> 42:08.581
[SPEAKER_03]: How dare I show up in my pajamas, it do ragged bonnet to someone who has traveled the world to present their research, right?
42:08.661 --> 42:12.784
[SPEAKER_03]: Someone who has worked on Nobel Prize eligible work.
42:13.264 --> 42:23.491
[SPEAKER_03]: And I'm gonna show up to your classroom dressed in this way and not give you the respect that your academics are now bringing to me as your expertise, right?
42:25.892 --> 42:28.733
[SPEAKER_03]: that this person present in, um, that I just wanted to point that out.
42:29.353 --> 42:29.733
[SPEAKER_02]: Pretty sure.
42:29.773 --> 42:32.114
[SPEAKER_02]: It just shows that it's dream lack of deference.
42:33.014 --> 42:33.754
[SPEAKER_02]: That's what it is.
42:34.135 --> 42:45.118
[SPEAKER_02]: When you show up in your pajamas or not iron or not prepared, you're not prepared to let this person disseminate that wealth of information and knowledge to you.
42:45.498 --> 42:46.538
[SPEAKER_02]: So, awesome.
42:47.959 --> 42:48.239
[SPEAKER_02]: Great.
42:54.398 --> 42:54.938
[SPEAKER_02]: I guess.
42:56.178 --> 43:01.460
[SPEAKER_02]: So the first vital for Dr. Aaron is a live or dead.
43:02.080 --> 43:04.460
[SPEAKER_02]: Who would you want to spend 24 hours with and why?
43:04.680 --> 43:12.682
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, but no, 24 hours with a live or dead, uh, 24 hours, Elon Musk.
43:13.142 --> 43:13.302
[SPEAKER_03]: Why?
43:13.983 --> 43:17.203
[SPEAKER_03]: Just to have access to that network for 24 hours.
43:17.283 --> 43:18.884
[SPEAKER_03]: Just to have access to that network for 24 hours.
43:24.410 --> 43:26.471
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I doubt it, but yes, cool.
43:26.511 --> 43:28.573
[SPEAKER_01]: Wait a minute, size fire again.
43:28.593 --> 43:31.695
[SPEAKER_01]: Give it, come on, I already told you we're sensitive.
43:32.115 --> 43:33.196
[SPEAKER_01]: What are you doubting?
43:36.018 --> 43:39.500
[SPEAKER_03]: I think our culture is his cup of tea.
43:39.560 --> 43:41.742
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, that's fair, that's fair, that's fair.
43:41.782 --> 43:43.323
[SPEAKER_03]: No, there's nothing against y'all.
43:43.343 --> 43:45.184
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah, that's fair, that's fair.
43:45.564 --> 43:48.066
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so here's one, I just came up with it just now.
43:48.466 --> 43:52.149
[SPEAKER_00]: You have a student that you taught in high school.
43:53.122 --> 43:57.926
[SPEAKER_00]: He is, has high capacity wants to study chemistry.
43:58.807 --> 44:00.669
[SPEAKER_00]: Which HBCU would you send them to?
44:00.689 --> 44:02.971
[SPEAKER_00]: Say, hey, go to the school.
44:03.251 --> 44:06.234
[SPEAKER_03]: And that's a good one, Xavier and Louisiana.
44:06.694 --> 44:07.455
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, why is that?
44:07.615 --> 44:09.717
[SPEAKER_03]: They have an amazing chemistry program.
44:10.618 --> 44:15.342
[SPEAKER_03]: They have a chemist who is actually working on redesigning batteries.
44:16.358 --> 44:21.623
[SPEAKER_03]: Um, and that type, yeah, it's because you don't, you don't realize like there's a fluid inside of batteries.
44:21.643 --> 44:23.865
[SPEAKER_03]: Like there's a chemical process that occurs better.
44:23.886 --> 44:30.151
[SPEAKER_03]: And so they are working on redesigning that which would be game changing, game changing.
44:30.712 --> 44:30.972
[SPEAKER_03]: Also.
44:32.754 --> 44:35.717
[SPEAKER_02]: What's the biggest risk you've ever taken and why?
44:37.270 --> 44:38.390
[SPEAKER_03]: coming on this podcast.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
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[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, good time.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Good time.
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[SPEAKER_03]: No, no, no.
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[SPEAKER_01]: I forgot the question.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, because risk.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Well, I think it's worse.
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[SPEAKER_00]: You're good.
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[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
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[SPEAKER_03]: I honestly don't think I can answer that because every risk I take is calculated.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So every, so I'm profoundly strategic.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So I don't.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I don't think I can name one, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: Cause every decision that I have made, whether it was a good one or bad one, has turned out to be able to put me in the place where I am now.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And I have never breathed about that.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So, yeah.
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[SPEAKER_02]: What about this when they were finding, when you decided that HPC used, he said that initially he thought they were beneath you, but then you found out that they were amazing.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Was that a risk or were you taking a abuse from your colleagues like, hey, I thought you didn't like this or that was in a risk because you had the data support at your decisions.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Is that it?
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[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And even with that, a risk is something that I think does harm, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: So you put yourself at risk because you're exposing yourself to harm.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And that has not harmed anyone.
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[SPEAKER_03]: If anything, it's benefited not only me personally and professionally, but it's benefited group of institutions that you deserve my admiration and love and support.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Nice.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
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[SPEAKER_00]: What's one thing most people don't know about you, that you wish they knew.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, if you don't know us, because I don't want you to, so, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,
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[SPEAKER_00]: like, no, I don't think so, man, I think she's pretty cool.
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[SPEAKER_00]: He was like, man, I don't know, dude.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know, I'm nervous.
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[SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, I don't know, I think we're right.
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[SPEAKER_00]: So you proved me right in terms of, you know, just, you know, being witty and scuttops.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, absolutely.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And I've come to be,
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[SPEAKER_03]: I've come to this like I'll be 46 this year, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: So some recent about that come to this agreement like you can't take yourself that serious like it's just not that serious, right?
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[SPEAKER_03]: And so like I laugh at myself just as quickly as I laugh at somebody else and I'm going to say to Terry, so if you don't take my jokes, well, that's all you, that's not my story.
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[SPEAKER_01]: That's your struggle, not bad.
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[SPEAKER_01]: That's my struggle.
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[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, I had someone tell me that once.
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[SPEAKER_03]: This guy had told me once that he was like, well, you're intimidating.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And I was like, okay, he's like, well, you should probably work on that.
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[SPEAKER_03]: I said,
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[SPEAKER_03]: But if I am intimidating others, it's not because I'm intentionally trying to intimidate.
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[SPEAKER_03]: It's because they feel intimidated.
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[SPEAKER_03]: As an end, there's nothing I can do about that to dampen how they feel when engaging with me, that I want to spend time doing.
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[SPEAKER_03]: There's so many more important things in the world that I can put my efforts behind, then trying to make you feel better about yourself because you feel intimidated and engaging with me.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I was that strong, you were coming across as a very confident and strong, which is a great thing.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Who doesn't want someone who's in their circle, who's strong and confident.
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[SPEAKER_03]: That's the use of therapy, I'm telling you.
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[SPEAKER_00]: He's like, you expect this practice.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Sorry, no.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, it's violent.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Well, Dr. Erin, I'm so excited that you commented on our post because I, like I said, I nerded out on some of your stuff and the findings with the 1.8 million and even your flow chart and the way you express things and share things.
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[SPEAKER_02]: I think what you're doing is amazing, and actually, she had the college guy on her podcast.
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[SPEAKER_02]: He was on our podcast, the White Guy, who's talking about the East Coast.
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[SPEAKER_01]: White George, White George, he was on the podcast.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And he was on her feet, so he was on our podcast.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So they called his white George.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So I was just nerding out on it, just stalking your Instagram posts.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So thank you for all that you do, all that you have done.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And all that you will do, because I think what you're doing is amazing.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So thanks for being here.
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[SPEAKER_00]: I look forward to the book too.
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[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, thanks.
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[SPEAKER_03]: I will make sure you all get copies.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And thank you all for doing the podcast.
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[SPEAKER_03]: And it will be able to bring conversations to the national attention.
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[SPEAKER_03]: It's critical, critical in this era.
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[SPEAKER_03]: So thank you all for this.
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[SPEAKER_00]: All right, for sure.
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[SPEAKER_00]: Awesome.