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Speaker 1: Hello, my friends, and welcome to a brand
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Speaker 1: new episode of Discourse in Magic with
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Speaker 1: Gaetan Bloom.
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Speaker 1: Gaetan Bloom is an incredible magician.
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Speaker 1: Not only is his magic fantastic, but he is
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Speaker 1: a creator of the likes that you have never
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Speaker 1: seen.
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Speaker 1: If you have ever seen his books, if you've
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Speaker 1: ever read his books, if you've ever bought
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Speaker 1: any of his magic, you'll realize that not
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Speaker 1: only is it strong, but also the methods are
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Speaker 1: brilliant.
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Speaker 1: He has come up with so much incredible
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Speaker 1: magic and he is such an incredible
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Speaker 1: performer.
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Speaker 1: And his story is even cooler, and in this
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Speaker 1: episode, we learn about how he is so gosh
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Speaker 1: darn creative and how you can be creative
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Speaker 1: too.
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Speaker 1: He talks about how he comes up with ideas,
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Speaker 1: where he gets his ideas, how he creates,
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Speaker 1: how he makes what his workshop looks like,
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Speaker 1: how he gets inspiration and his story as to
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Speaker 1: how he became the legend that he is today.
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Speaker 1: You are gonna learn so much from Gaetan
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Speaker 1: Bloom.
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Speaker 1: This was a man on my list for years, and I
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Speaker 1: am grateful that he not only showed up for
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Speaker 1: an amazing interview, but also delivered
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Speaker 1: something that I will never forget for the
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Speaker 1: rest of my life, and you won't either.
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Speaker 1: So please enjoy an incredible episode with
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Speaker 1: the one and only Gaetan Bloom.
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Speaker 1: Hello, my friends, and welcome to a brand
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Speaker 1: new episode of Discourse in Magic.
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Speaker 1: I am here with the one and only Gaetan
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Speaker 1: Bloom.
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Speaker 1: How are you?
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Speaker 1: I'm fine, jonah, I am fine.
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Speaker 1: I am so excited to chat with you about
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Speaker 1: magic and creativity and inventing and so
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Speaker 1: many parts of magic.
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Speaker 1: I've loved your stuff for the longest time
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Speaker 1: and really excited to get into it.
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Speaker 1: Let's start at the very, very beginning,
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Speaker 1: which is how did you get started in magic?
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Speaker 1: How did magic find you?
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Speaker 2: Well, you know, like many, many other
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Speaker 2: friends, you know, with the magic kit set,
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Speaker 2: and I was very disappointed.
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Speaker 2: First because, you know, I found, oh my God,
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Speaker 2: is that magic?
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Speaker 2: You know, it's just a flap, a black flap in
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Speaker 2: a cardboard box.
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Speaker 2: So I was really, oh, okay.
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Speaker 2: And then I saw, in fact, a magician in a
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Speaker 2: hotel.
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Speaker 2: I was very young, I was like eight years
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Speaker 2: old and on holiday, and I saw a small
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Speaker 2: poster, you know, saying tonight, the big
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Speaker 2: magician, blah blah, blah, in this hotel.
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Speaker 2: He was acting in the hotel.
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Speaker 2: So I went with my mother, you know, and wow,
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Speaker 2: and it was a full show, one hour and a half
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Speaker 2: show, you know.
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Speaker 2: And I was so happy to see that and I said I
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Speaker 2: want to do that, that's what I want to do,
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Speaker 2: that's it, that's it period.
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Speaker 2: And yeah, in fact the guy did three nights
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Speaker 2: because in the village was three different
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Speaker 2: hotels, you know, big one.
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Speaker 2: So he did the three of them and I went to
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Speaker 2: each of them.
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Speaker 2: I took my mother, you know, say I want to
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Speaker 2: see again, I want to see again.
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Speaker 2: And really I started when I saw this guy.
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Speaker 2: He was not great, he was okay, he was okay,
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Speaker 2: but he was doing a full night show, you
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Speaker 2: know.
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Speaker 2: And you know, at that time it was in the
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Speaker 2: 60s, something like that so he had just
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Speaker 2: like a threefold screen to to hide himself,
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Speaker 2: you know.
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Speaker 2: Yeah, and he had a small tapas.
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Speaker 2: You know like to put records, classical
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Speaker 2: music and all that, you know.
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Speaker 2: And and then he said, and in the second
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Speaker 2: part you will see the fakir, so-and-so.
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Speaker 2: I said, ah, so everybody was waiting for
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Speaker 2: the fakir, you know, to do very oriental
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Speaker 2: magic.
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Speaker 2: And then he went behind the screen and you
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Speaker 2: hear the music different, you know.
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Speaker 2: And then he came back with a outfit.
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Speaker 2: He had just something on his head, you know,
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Speaker 2: and he was doing the knife through the arm,
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Speaker 2: the needle swallowing, but he was just
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Speaker 2: again.
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Speaker 2: Of course it was him, but it was such a
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Speaker 2: funny thing to see this old man he was an
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Speaker 2: old man by the time, you know just changing
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Speaker 2: himself, removing the tuxedo and the thing
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Speaker 2: to put the indian turban so what?
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Speaker 1: where did it go for you from there?
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Speaker 1: So obviously you said, you were like eight
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Speaker 1: or nine and you saw magic.
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Speaker 2: And then, and then, what you know, did you
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Speaker 2: find magic stores, magicians from this show
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Speaker 2: I I received because there was was like a
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Speaker 2: small competition on the third day.
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Speaker 2: I knew all the questions, all the answers,
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Speaker 2: so I won a special deck of cards and this
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Speaker 2: deck of cards was from Mayette.
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Speaker 2: I didn't know Mayette, but it was from
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Speaker 2: Mayette.
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Speaker 2: And then my mother tried to find where was
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Speaker 2: this Mayette shop, you know, in Paris.
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Speaker 2: We knew it was and eventually we found it.
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Speaker 2: And then it was wow, my God, I just
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Speaker 2: discovered.
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Speaker 2: You know, mayette at the time was the only
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Speaker 2: magic shop in Paris.
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Speaker 2: Wow, and very old magic shop in Paris.
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Speaker 2: Wow, and very old magic shop.
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Speaker 2: Now it's owned by Dominique de Vivier, but
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Speaker 2: at the time it was Mr Mayette, still the
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Speaker 2: owner.
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Speaker 2: And for me to discover this shop was like
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Speaker 2: Harry Potter, you know, when he enters the
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Speaker 2: wall, you know, wow, was a shop made for us,
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Speaker 2: you know.
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Speaker 2: So it was the a start.
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Speaker 1: So you know, I know you said that when you
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Speaker 1: saw the show you were like this is the only.
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Speaker 1: This is what I want to do with my life.
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Speaker 1: Did you end up doing anything else?
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Speaker 1: Did you end up doing like, or did you go to
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Speaker 1: school?
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Speaker 1: Did you go, or you just this was it magic.
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Speaker 1: I went to school, I went to school.
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Speaker 2: I went to school.
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Speaker 2: The thing is that I wanted to do that, you
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Speaker 2: know, and my mother, my parents, were
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Speaker 2: working for the government nothing funny,
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Speaker 2: nothing fancy and my mother's hero was a
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Speaker 2: lawyer, a big lawyer, advocate, you know,
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Speaker 2: very well known, and I found in the
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Speaker 2: newspaper that his real passion was to do
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Speaker 2: magic.
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Speaker 2: So starting with that, you know, it was
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Speaker 2: easy because I told my mother you see, this
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Speaker 2: guy is your big hero, but he loves to do
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Speaker 2: magic.
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Speaker 2: Okay, so from that moment, magic was a
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Speaker 2: carrot.
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Speaker 2: So, if you know, if I had good notes at the
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Speaker 2: school, it was okay, I could have visit to
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Speaker 2: the shop, you know.
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Speaker 1: So a couple of questions about sort of
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Speaker 1: where it goes from here.
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Speaker 1: The first is I'm always very interested in
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Speaker 1: the business and the economics of magic,
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Speaker 1: especially when you don't know anything
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Speaker 1: else.
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Speaker 1: So maybe you're 16, 17, you do a show, a
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Speaker 1: gig or whatever.
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Speaker 1: How, how were you thinking about it?
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Speaker 1: Cause when you think of even now, you think
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Speaker 1: of magic as a career, like it's crazy, it's
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Speaker 1: a it's crazy to do.
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Speaker 1: What were you thinking at 16, 17, 18, or
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Speaker 1: whenever it happened for you?
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Speaker 1: Where are you thinking about making?
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Speaker 2: Oh, you know at that age I was already
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Speaker 2: doing not many shows, but I started really
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Speaker 2: to perform when I met Dominique Webb in the
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Speaker 2: second magic shop it was three years later,
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Speaker 2: you know, and because he was giving lessons
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Speaker 2: and there I met my real teacher, jean
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Speaker 2: Merlin, you know, who teach me everything
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Speaker 2: in magic.
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Speaker 2: But very early I started to.
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Speaker 2: I was so young, I was 12, 13.
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Speaker 2: I came behind the counter, you know, and
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Speaker 2: started to do some demos for Dominic Webb.
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Speaker 2: Really, it was just because I love to be
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Speaker 2: there, you know.
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Speaker 2: And so at one moment he just said why don't
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Speaker 2: you go in a big shop and sell tricks for me,
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Speaker 2: you know, during holidays?
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Speaker 2: Because of course I had not the age to have
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Speaker 2: a real contract.
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Speaker 2: But it started like that, you know, and
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Speaker 2: more and more, and I think it's the best
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Speaker 2: way to learn First.
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Speaker 2: So I had no money from that, but he gave me
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Speaker 2: books, he gave me tricks, et cetera, et
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Speaker 2: cetera.
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Speaker 2: So very early I had my foot, my finger in
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Speaker 2: the fact that I was dealing tricks and I
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Speaker 2: was already not creating tricks but
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Speaker 2: creating presentation, different
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Speaker 2: presentation for existing tricks.
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Speaker 1: That was a real big, and where did it go
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Speaker 1: from there for you with respect to shows,
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Speaker 1: like, did you start doing kids shows?
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Speaker 1: Did you start doing?
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Speaker 1: What was the next step for you?
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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, you know.
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Speaker 2: Then the next step was to, to, to
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Speaker 2: eventually enter the magic group, you know,
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Speaker 2: and the FFAP at the time, and what was?
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Speaker 2: Two different clubs and my mother again my
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Speaker 2: mother was always very helpful with this
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Speaker 2: thing in mind they say, okay, okay, he, we
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Speaker 2: apparently want to do that and he's pretty
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Speaker 2: good at that, so let's help him, you know.
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Speaker 2: And but I never had any other job, never.
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Speaker 2: So I'm not to choose, you know, I recognize
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Speaker 2: that now, or maybe it's even more difficult,
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Speaker 2: because if you have a steady job and you
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Speaker 2: know what you are going to make for the
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Speaker 2: rest of your life, or to jump in becoming a
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Speaker 2: magician, some people are very upset or
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Speaker 2: they don't know if they have to be
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Speaker 2: part-time or full-time.
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Speaker 2: But I never had really to take this
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Speaker 2: decision, it was from the beginning.
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Speaker 2: I want to do that, you know, and my parents
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Speaker 2: were okay with me.
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Speaker 2: I was living home, you know, and I left
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Speaker 2: them when I was 20, something, but that's
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Speaker 2: it.
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Speaker 1: Was there anything proactive that you did
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Speaker 1: at the time to get shows or TV appearances,
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Speaker 1: or was there anything you were doing like,
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Speaker 1: okay, I'm going to email all these people,
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Speaker 1: or I'm going to call all of these people,
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Speaker 1: or it just happened from you being popular.
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Speaker 2: No, I started to be like the new young guy
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Speaker 2: with funny ideas in the club, you know,
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Speaker 2: because I was 13, 14.
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Speaker 2: I already was thinking how to do an act for
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Speaker 2: the next convention or something you know.
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Speaker 2: So I was the new guy on the thing.
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Speaker 2: And then, very early I met during this
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Speaker 2: French convention.
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Speaker 2: I met very interesting people and I met
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Speaker 2: quite early Albert Gauchemart know people
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Speaker 2: like that.
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Speaker 2: And then and then I met Ken Brook in
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Speaker 2: England and this was the start really of
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Speaker 2: the of going, I mean, to be known as a, as
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Speaker 2: a kind of underground guy, you know,
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Speaker 2: because Ken Brook I knew Ken Brook because
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Speaker 2: when I was 16, I'd been across Abracadabra
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Speaker 2: it was an English magazine, weekly magazine,
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Speaker 2: incredible and Ken Brook was putting ads in
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Speaker 2: every, not every week, because it was very
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Speaker 2: costly and so I discovered his way, his to
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Speaker 2: sell things and and from.
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Speaker 2: He had not thousands of tricks but very few
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Speaker 2: tricks, but from fred caps, finn john I
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Speaker 2: mean the top of the top donna land, from
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Speaker 2: america, many, many top gun guys, you know.
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Speaker 2: And so eventually, when I was 18, I had the
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Speaker 2: chance to go to London for the first time,
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Speaker 2: you know, and to meet him and it was like
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Speaker 2: an instant friendship, you know.
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Speaker 2: And he took me literally under his arm, you
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Speaker 2: know.
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Speaker 2: And then I started to learn English,
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Speaker 2: because before I was not really speaking
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Speaker 2: properly English.
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Speaker 2: You know, wow, and then I found, you know,
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Speaker 2: one of my most famous trick is the standing
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Speaker 2: cart trick.
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Speaker 2: It was two carts and one stand.
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Speaker 2: And when I showed this to Ken as something
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Speaker 2: new, he said wow, my God, this afternoon
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Speaker 2: somebody is coming and I want you to show
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Speaker 2: him that and say, yes, of course.
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Speaker 2: Who is that?
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Speaker 2: A Dive Vernon.
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Speaker 2: I said, wow, oh, my God, dive Vernon, are
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Speaker 2: you kidding me?
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Speaker 2: No, no, no, no.
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Speaker 2: And so I did it to Dive Vernon and I fooled
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Speaker 2: him and he told me oh, you fooled me, you
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Speaker 2: fooled me, you fooled me.
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Speaker 2: And when I explained it, wow, he was so
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Speaker 2: happy.
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Speaker 2: And so, few, few years after that I went to
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Speaker 2: the magic castle and Dave Vernon took me
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Speaker 2: under his arm, you know, and the castle,
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Speaker 2: and say do your trick.
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Speaker 2: Right there, do do the trick to Larry
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Speaker 2: Jennings, do the trick.
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Speaker 2: Like a baby was, you know.
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Speaker 2: So I've always been very lucky in this
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Speaker 2: respect.
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Speaker 1: It sounds like.
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Speaker 1: It sounds like you've been very lucky to
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Speaker 1: have a lot of mentors that you know,
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Speaker 1: recognize your magic and take you to the
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Speaker 1: next level and the next step.
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Speaker 1: Who are some of the ones?
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Speaker 1: I know you mentioned a few already, but who
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Speaker 1: are some of the people in your journey that
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Speaker 1: really helped you the most, both with your
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Speaker 1: magic and with your Well, one is obviously
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Speaker 1: Jean Merlin.
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Speaker 2: I told you about him and he's still now.
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Speaker 2: He's a huge friend and still a mentor, and
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Speaker 2: whatever.
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Speaker 2: Another one is James Hodges.
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Speaker 2: James, you know, I had an affair with one
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Speaker 2: of his daughters One of my first fiance was
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Speaker 2: her, you know, and for three years we were
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Speaker 2: together and then we we split and really
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Speaker 2: it's my, my first idea, oh god, I won't see
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Speaker 2: james again.
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Speaker 2: So I was very sad with that.
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Speaker 2: But he said you know, kid, life is life,
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Speaker 2: but you, you always be like my, my son, so
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Speaker 2: it's okay.
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Speaker 2: So, and James did all my drawings for all
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Speaker 2: my tricks.
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Speaker 2: Oh, wow, if you have my books, of course
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Speaker 2: and he's not, really he deserves much more
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Speaker 2: because James knew how to do drawings, but
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Speaker 2: he was a ventriloquist, he was a magician,
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Speaker 2: he was a multi-talented man, really Wow.
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Speaker 2: And he left us a few years ago now and I
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Speaker 2: still miss him every day.
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Speaker 2: Yeah, wow.
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Speaker 2: And of course, another very influential man
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Speaker 2: for me was Finjon.
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Speaker 2: When I met Finjon, man for me was Finjon
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Speaker 2: when I met Finjon.
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Speaker 2: I met Finjon thanks to Ken Brook, because
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Speaker 2: Ken Brook was selling some tricks from Phil,
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Speaker 2: like the floating flute, and one trick
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Speaker 2: called Esoteric.
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Speaker 2: Esoteric was a wonderful haunted pack done
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Speaker 2: in a very special way because you could put
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Speaker 2: the the deck on the floor, you know, and
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Speaker 2: three people choose a card and the card
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Speaker 2: crawl out of the deck and blah, blah, blah.
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Speaker 2: But you are far away from the thing you
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Speaker 2: have.
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Speaker 2: You have not the deck in your hand and was
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Speaker 2: no electronic, of course, was a very, very
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Speaker 2: good use of thread, you know.
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Speaker 2: And when Ken Brook saw me he said oh, I
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Speaker 2: know, you are in Paris, you live in Paris.
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Speaker 2: I will make a few words and go to the Crazy
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Speaker 2: Horse and you will meet this guy.
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00:16:42,120 --> 00:16:44,048
Speaker 2: He's working at the Crazy Horse right now
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Speaker 2: and I did that and it was Finjan.
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Speaker 2: So I went for him at the exit, you know it
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Speaker 2: was two o'clock in the morning and he said
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Speaker 2: oh, kenbrook, oh yeah, okay, let's have a
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Speaker 2: drink.
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Speaker 2: And he took me for a drink on the
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Speaker 2: Champs-Élysées and you know I was 18 years
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Speaker 2: old at the time.
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Speaker 2: And then, after a few drinks, everything
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00:17:11,429 --> 00:17:13,634
Speaker 2: started to float on the table, you know the
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Speaker 2: bills, the things, the piece of bread,
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Speaker 2: whatever.
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00:17:16,786 --> 00:17:19,151
Speaker 2: I said, oh, my God, you know the guy was
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Speaker 2: not waiting for me, he was ready, he was
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Speaker 2: ready to make anything float, you know, and
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Speaker 2: of course this was way before ETR real,
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Speaker 2: anything like that.
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00:17:31,500 --> 00:17:33,388
Speaker 2: It was ever before.
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00:17:34,061 --> 00:17:37,309
Speaker 2: At the time he had not invented the elastic
379
00:17:37,489 --> 00:17:41,504
Speaker 2: invisible thread, you know, but he was
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00:17:41,605 --> 00:17:45,181
Speaker 2: already working a lot with threads and he
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00:17:45,822 --> 00:17:49,209
Speaker 2: really he opened my mind to a complete new
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Speaker 2: world, for me.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, I want to talk more about threads in
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Speaker 1: a minute.
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00:17:56,203 --> 00:17:57,969
Speaker 1: It's a whole section I want to talk about
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00:17:57,989 --> 00:18:01,748
Speaker 1: with you, but let's go back and talk a
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00:18:01,808 --> 00:18:03,673
Speaker 1: little bit about creativity.
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00:18:03,820 --> 00:18:06,186
Speaker 1: You know, I have found I've interviewed,
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Speaker 1: obviously, many magicians and I've found
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00:18:08,327 --> 00:18:10,643
Speaker 1: that often it's the magicians that don't
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00:18:10,764 --> 00:18:14,703
Speaker 1: have magic books or magic shops or anything
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00:18:14,743 --> 00:18:16,273
Speaker 1: where they grew up, that are the most
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00:18:16,334 --> 00:18:17,593
Speaker 1: creative because they don't have the
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00:18:17,654 --> 00:18:19,887
Speaker 1: resources and they start coming up with
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Speaker 1: their own things.
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00:18:20,882 --> 00:18:22,087
Speaker 1: But it sounds like you had both.
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00:18:22,501 --> 00:18:25,069
Speaker 1: You had a great actual magic education, but
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00:18:25,129 --> 00:18:28,446
Speaker 1: then you know, you started to come up with,
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00:18:29,207 --> 00:18:31,632
Speaker 1: you know, magic and presentations and
400
00:18:31,733 --> 00:18:34,364
Speaker 1: things that magicians haven't seen before.
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00:18:34,925 --> 00:18:37,390
Speaker 1: What, what did that look like for you?
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00:18:37,430 --> 00:18:40,322
Speaker 1: Was there a practice like, okay, I'm going
403
00:18:40,342 --> 00:18:42,307
Speaker 1: to spend this amount of time or I'm going
404
00:18:42,347 --> 00:18:44,212
Speaker 1: to spend some time every day working?
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00:18:44,581 --> 00:18:46,608
Speaker 1: Is it just you're jamming and you say, what
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00:18:46,648 --> 00:18:47,089
Speaker 1: about this?
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00:18:47,240 --> 00:18:47,903
Speaker 1: What about that?
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00:18:48,003 --> 00:18:50,444
Speaker 1: Like, how, why were you so creative at a
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Speaker 1: young age and maybe others were not?
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00:18:54,061 --> 00:18:54,422
Speaker 2: I think.
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00:18:54,583 --> 00:18:56,509
Speaker 2: I think it just because I was curious, I
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00:18:56,550 --> 00:18:56,710
Speaker 2: will.
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00:18:57,080 --> 00:18:59,921
Speaker 2: One of the real key to be creative, I think,
414
00:18:59,981 --> 00:19:02,809
Speaker 2: is to be curious about things and always
415
00:19:02,889 --> 00:19:04,092
Speaker 2: wanting to know more.
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00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:07,242
Speaker 2: You know, if something is how it works, you
417
00:19:07,282 --> 00:19:10,710
Speaker 2: know all my my toys I had to break them to
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00:19:10,790 --> 00:19:12,414
Speaker 2: see how it works inside.
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00:19:12,520 --> 00:19:12,701
Speaker 2: You know.
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00:19:12,761 --> 00:19:16,786
Speaker 2: If not, I was not happy and and so as soon
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00:19:16,867 --> 00:19:19,935
Speaker 2: as I knew that were some magic books with
422
00:19:20,276 --> 00:19:24,065
Speaker 2: secrets, you know I wanted to have some of
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00:19:24,126 --> 00:19:24,386
Speaker 2: them.
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00:19:24,446 --> 00:19:26,050
Speaker 2: You know, and and also I, I very early
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00:19:26,090 --> 00:19:27,955
Speaker 2: found that, you know I wanted to have some
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00:19:27,975 --> 00:19:28,115
Speaker 2: of them.
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00:19:28,135 --> 00:19:29,238
Speaker 2: You know, and and also I, I very early
428
00:19:29,338 --> 00:19:33,207
Speaker 2: found that I was a lot in love with old
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00:19:33,267 --> 00:19:33,568
Speaker 2: books.
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00:19:33,749 --> 00:19:36,936
Speaker 2: Already, as soon as I could put a hand on
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00:19:37,017 --> 00:19:39,663
Speaker 2: an old book, I'd say, oh, it smelled good.
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00:19:39,723 --> 00:19:42,288
Speaker 2: You know that's, that's something.
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00:19:42,368 --> 00:19:45,555
Speaker 2: Now it's gone because most of the thing are
434
00:19:45,595 --> 00:19:48,763
Speaker 2: done with pdf or whatever, and you have not
435
00:19:48,783 --> 00:19:50,447
Speaker 2: this, this feeling.
436
00:19:50,487 --> 00:19:52,714
Speaker 2: You know you don't have this anymore.
437
00:19:53,516 --> 00:19:55,380
Speaker 2: Like I remember again, when I was in
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00:19:55,460 --> 00:19:59,342
Speaker 2: england, I I after the first man was ken
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00:19:59,362 --> 00:20:02,724
Speaker 2: brooke, but also I went to Davenport, don
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00:20:02,764 --> 00:20:06,146
Speaker 2: and Alan, alan, alan, sorry, but in
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00:20:06,226 --> 00:20:09,988
Speaker 2: Davenport I found some very old books, you
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00:20:10,008 --> 00:20:13,070
Speaker 2: know, from the Goldstone Age and all that.
443
00:20:14,030 --> 00:20:17,172
Speaker 2: And I found some of the Al Baker books,
444
00:20:17,592 --> 00:20:20,074
Speaker 2: booklets, you know, for nothing.
445
00:20:20,294 --> 00:20:23,756
Speaker 2: It was very cheap and for instance, if you
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00:20:23,776 --> 00:20:26,457
Speaker 2: want to talk about thread, I mean we are
447
00:20:26,517 --> 00:20:28,458
Speaker 2: talking Finchon, but Al Baker.
448
00:20:32,640 --> 00:20:35,087
Speaker 2: Al Baker was a complete revelation and I
449
00:20:35,107 --> 00:20:36,811
Speaker 2: have all of the books from Al Baker.
450
00:20:39,620 --> 00:20:40,564
Speaker 2: Now you have the big, big compilation and
451
00:20:40,604 --> 00:20:43,156
Speaker 2: wonderful book from Todd Carr.
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00:20:43,981 --> 00:20:48,292
Speaker 2: But really Al Baker invented so many things.
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00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:52,109
Speaker 2: We only know now most of them, most of the
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Speaker 2: magicians.
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00:20:52,700 --> 00:20:56,070
Speaker 2: They know Al Baker for the mental side
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00:20:56,090 --> 00:21:00,468
Speaker 2: trick, but he had really a lot of what I
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00:21:00,548 --> 00:21:02,332
Speaker 2: call the indirect threat.
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00:21:02,373 --> 00:21:02,613
Speaker 2: You know.
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Speaker 1: So that's one of the things I want to talk
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00:21:05,350 --> 00:21:08,944
Speaker 1: to you about is, it's so funny when I read
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00:21:09,505 --> 00:21:12,561
Speaker 1: your book, because I read a trick I have no
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00:21:12,621 --> 00:21:15,810
Speaker 1: idea how that could work and it's always
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00:21:15,870 --> 00:21:16,692
Speaker 1: thread, you know?
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00:21:18,062 --> 00:21:19,448
Speaker 1: No, not really, but it's always.
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00:21:20,493 --> 00:21:22,421
Speaker 1: It feels like it's like a thread and it's a
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00:21:22,501 --> 00:21:23,403
Speaker 1: thread used in a way.
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00:21:23,564 --> 00:21:27,513
Speaker 1: I've never thought to use a thread ever.
468
00:21:27,901 --> 00:21:29,588
Speaker 1: It wouldn't have even crossed my mind.
469
00:21:29,740 --> 00:21:31,727
Speaker 1: For me, I think, thread it's levitation,
470
00:21:31,807 --> 00:21:32,730
Speaker 1: it's things moving.
471
00:21:33,342 --> 00:21:34,547
Speaker 1: So talk to me about that.
472
00:21:34,640 --> 00:21:36,787
Speaker 1: How do you you know, I don't even know
473
00:21:36,827 --> 00:21:37,730
Speaker 1: where to start on it.
474
00:21:38,001 --> 00:21:40,127
Speaker 1: When you're problem solving, how do you
475
00:21:40,167 --> 00:21:41,391
Speaker 1: even think of using thread?
476
00:21:42,922 --> 00:21:43,965
Speaker 1: How is that a tool?
477
00:21:45,108 --> 00:21:45,509
Speaker 2: I think.
478
00:21:45,629 --> 00:21:46,532
Speaker 2: I think it goes.
479
00:21:46,592 --> 00:21:49,987
Speaker 2: You know, in french we have what we call
480
00:21:50,128 --> 00:21:52,593
Speaker 2: friends, friends, friends.
481
00:21:53,615 --> 00:21:54,417
Speaker 2: What is a friend?
482
00:21:54,978 --> 00:21:57,805
Speaker 2: And in france it's a ami, ami, ami.
483
00:21:58,006 --> 00:22:04,105
Speaker 2: So it's a an ami for me, it's, for me, it's.
484
00:22:04,426 --> 00:22:06,903
Speaker 2: There is no way to translate that, but it's
485
00:22:07,164 --> 00:22:11,650
Speaker 2: what I call magical, invisible, magical
486
00:22:12,251 --> 00:22:12,652
Speaker 2: friends.
487
00:22:12,720 --> 00:22:14,186
Speaker 2: You know, to help us.
488
00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:15,704
Speaker 2: I can't translate it.
489
00:22:15,824 --> 00:22:17,028
Speaker 1: No, but that makes sense.
490
00:22:17,068 --> 00:22:17,630
Speaker 2: That makes sense.
491
00:22:18,660 --> 00:22:23,038
Speaker 2: So the first thing is to find a new trick
492
00:22:23,218 --> 00:22:23,620
Speaker 2: or whatever.
493
00:22:23,780 --> 00:22:27,389
Speaker 2: And this is from just watching everything
494
00:22:27,689 --> 00:22:31,964
Speaker 2: on a different angle, you know, or any
495
00:22:32,085 --> 00:22:34,972
Speaker 2: object you see, you know you can ask
496
00:22:35,032 --> 00:22:39,190
Speaker 2: yourself, okay, what is made for this?
497
00:22:39,380 --> 00:22:42,549
Speaker 2: I mean, a pencil is made to write, a hammer
498
00:22:42,609 --> 00:22:45,367
Speaker 2: is made to have to boom, boom, boom to nail
499
00:22:45,427 --> 00:22:50,009
Speaker 2: something, and then you can think what else
500
00:22:50,110 --> 00:22:54,109
Speaker 2: can we do, or what you can do with that.
501
00:22:54,170 --> 00:22:57,889
Speaker 2: You know, think the opposite, okay.
502
00:22:59,242 --> 00:23:03,756
Speaker 2: And then maybe you find I mean, you can
503
00:23:03,776 --> 00:23:07,264
Speaker 2: give me any object and we can start this
504
00:23:07,785 --> 00:23:08,766
Speaker 2: Give me an object here, lip balm.
505
00:23:09,006 --> 00:23:12,151
Speaker 2: I have lip balm, lip balm, okay.
506
00:23:13,814 --> 00:23:16,664
Speaker 1: Say okay, I saw it on my desk.
507
00:23:17,989 --> 00:23:20,706
Speaker 2: Okay, so what you do with that?
508
00:23:20,847 --> 00:23:23,246
Speaker 2: Normally you put it on your lips.
509
00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:26,604
Speaker 2: Okay, so what can be the?
510
00:23:29,223 --> 00:23:33,592
Speaker 2: You do this to make your lips not dry.
511
00:23:34,052 --> 00:23:35,996
Speaker 2: Exactly, exactly.
512
00:23:36,817 --> 00:23:38,019
Speaker 2: But imagine now.
513
00:23:38,079 --> 00:23:41,845
Speaker 2: You say now this if I put on your lips or
514
00:23:41,945 --> 00:23:45,010
Speaker 2: on my lips, maybe I have no more, no more
515
00:23:45,070 --> 00:23:47,439
Speaker 2: mouth, my lips are gone.
516
00:23:48,542 --> 00:23:49,404
Speaker 2: That's the opposite.
517
00:23:49,524 --> 00:23:54,539
Speaker 2: Right, and maybe now it looks stupid, but
518
00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:58,324
Speaker 2: if you go back to Jeff McBride when he
519
00:23:58,404 --> 00:24:00,988
Speaker 2: removed his face, that then it can be the
520
00:24:01,028 --> 00:24:02,009
Speaker 2: start of something.
521
00:24:02,049 --> 00:24:04,098
Speaker 2: You know, and you can do this to a
522
00:24:04,138 --> 00:24:07,435
Speaker 2: spectator as soon as I put balm on your
523
00:24:07,615 --> 00:24:10,023
Speaker 2: lips, you can't open your mouth.
524
00:24:10,424 --> 00:24:13,843
Speaker 2: It's like it's glue, you know.
525
00:24:14,525 --> 00:24:17,823
Speaker 2: And you can have another balm to unglue.
526
00:24:18,104 --> 00:24:21,037
Speaker 2: You know, you know it.
527
00:24:21,098 --> 00:24:24,527
Speaker 2: Just think, think anything, be free.
528
00:24:26,155 --> 00:24:29,022
Speaker 2: And then after, then, after you start to
529
00:24:29,082 --> 00:24:32,860
Speaker 2: say, okay, that's funny ideas, how can I do
530
00:24:32,941 --> 00:24:33,182
Speaker 2: that?
531
00:24:34,476 --> 00:24:35,298
Speaker 2: And may I use a?
532
00:24:35,318 --> 00:24:36,061
Speaker 2: I don't know instant glue studging.
533
00:24:36,081 --> 00:24:37,485
Speaker 2: May I use a?
534
00:24:37,566 --> 00:24:40,114
Speaker 2: I don't know instant glue stitching?
535
00:24:41,478 --> 00:24:44,886
Speaker 2: May I use, I don't know, a thread?
536
00:24:45,856 --> 00:24:48,983
Speaker 2: Maybe I can put an invisible thread so he
537
00:24:49,023 --> 00:24:50,987
Speaker 2: can't open his mouth, I don't know.
538
00:24:51,576 --> 00:24:53,162
Speaker 2: Or put a gimmick, a fake.
539
00:24:54,157 --> 00:24:57,706
Speaker 2: So you list all your different friends, you
540
00:24:57,766 --> 00:25:02,146
Speaker 2: know, and most of the time one is going to
541
00:25:02,206 --> 00:25:06,766
Speaker 2: click, but it's a very good list to have.
542
00:25:07,595 --> 00:25:11,585
Speaker 2: I mean, what's a list of your unknown
543
00:25:12,107 --> 00:25:12,628
Speaker 2: weapons?
544
00:25:14,315 --> 00:25:17,782
Speaker 2: And now we have magnets, we have daub, we
545
00:25:17,802 --> 00:25:18,964
Speaker 2: have thread, we have memory metal, we have
546
00:25:19,405 --> 00:25:20,868
Speaker 2: dope, we have thread, we have a memory
547
00:25:20,928 --> 00:25:24,094
Speaker 2: metal where I mean have reels.
548
00:25:24,455 --> 00:25:27,701
Speaker 2: You, you have many, we have many of them,
549
00:25:28,582 --> 00:25:28,983
Speaker 2: wow.
550
00:25:29,764 --> 00:25:31,568
Speaker 2: So that that's basically, you have some
551
00:25:31,608 --> 00:25:34,098
Speaker 2: tape, of course yeah, you have some tape.
552
00:25:34,479 --> 00:25:36,644
Speaker 1: So that's what, like, the creative process
553
00:25:36,704 --> 00:25:37,807
Speaker 1: really looks like for you.
554
00:25:37,907 --> 00:25:38,208
Speaker 1: Is you?
555
00:25:38,415 --> 00:25:41,645
Speaker 1: You, you pick maybe an object or something,
556
00:25:41,685 --> 00:25:43,580
Speaker 1: and then you start thinking of what could
557
00:25:43,620 --> 00:25:43,901
Speaker 1: it do?
558
00:25:43,941 --> 00:25:45,064
Speaker 1: That's different, what could it do?
559
00:25:45,104 --> 00:25:45,986
Speaker 1: That's the opposite.
560
00:25:46,127 --> 00:25:49,400
Speaker 1: And then you make a list of how you could
561
00:25:49,440 --> 00:25:52,706
Speaker 1: do that thing yeah, it's kind of.
562
00:25:53,567 --> 00:25:57,039
Speaker 2: Of course, that's the basic, but now I you
563
00:25:57,079 --> 00:25:59,363
Speaker 2: know, for instance, I see you.
564
00:25:59,423 --> 00:26:01,688
Speaker 2: You have the pipe from Magritte.
565
00:26:02,069 --> 00:26:02,269
Speaker 1: Yeah.
566
00:26:03,596 --> 00:26:06,281
Speaker 2: But Magritte is full of inspiration.
567
00:26:06,362 --> 00:26:11,901
Speaker 2: For a magician, I think, or any Dali or any
568
00:26:12,021 --> 00:26:15,517
Speaker 2: painter can be, but especially all the
569
00:26:15,557 --> 00:26:17,600
Speaker 2: surrealist painters.
570
00:26:17,881 --> 00:26:22,768
Speaker 2: It's a huge inspiration for us If you, for
571
00:26:22,828 --> 00:26:26,015
Speaker 2: instance, in Dali's work, you have the
572
00:26:26,096 --> 00:26:28,580
Speaker 2: clock, you know the soft clock.
573
00:26:29,462 --> 00:26:32,608
Speaker 2: The soft clock is something we have never
574
00:26:32,688 --> 00:26:35,458
Speaker 2: done this in magic, but it can be done
575
00:26:35,518 --> 00:26:39,485
Speaker 2: really To take a clock and it become like a
576
00:26:39,565 --> 00:26:41,789
Speaker 2: slinky thing or whatever, and back to
577
00:26:41,849 --> 00:26:46,200
Speaker 2: normal and and and stop to to the chosen
578
00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:46,680
Speaker 2: time.
579
00:26:47,141 --> 00:26:50,106
Speaker 1: I don't know so you must have notebooks
580
00:26:50,546 --> 00:26:54,326
Speaker 1: full of ideas that never oh yeah came to oh
581
00:26:54,504 --> 00:26:57,249
Speaker 1: yeah and, oh yeah, you, you keep everything.
582
00:26:57,426 --> 00:27:00,302
Speaker 2: You keep all the notebooks and you keep
583
00:27:00,363 --> 00:27:02,913
Speaker 2: everything, you keep all the notebooks.
584
00:27:02,933 --> 00:27:06,161
Speaker 2: You know, one of the problem is that before
585
00:27:06,181 --> 00:27:07,167
Speaker 2: I had notebooks and I went to the workshop
586
00:27:07,228 --> 00:27:08,275
Speaker 2: and I started to open one and say, okay,
587
00:27:08,315 --> 00:27:11,795
Speaker 2: now, because it's funny to take notes, but
588
00:27:11,896 --> 00:27:16,516
Speaker 2: then the problem is that now we have, we
589
00:27:16,536 --> 00:27:20,384
Speaker 2: have these, we have font, so you, you any
590
00:27:20,504 --> 00:27:22,649
Speaker 2: note, they go there, you know.
591
00:27:22,755 --> 00:27:26,043
Speaker 2: But I have hundreds of notes, but it's so
592
00:27:26,143 --> 00:27:29,739
Speaker 2: easy to stack them that now it's more
593
00:27:29,799 --> 00:27:32,486
Speaker 2: difficult to take one and go to the
594
00:27:32,566 --> 00:27:33,028
Speaker 2: workshop.
595
00:27:34,355 --> 00:27:38,441
Speaker 2: And that's why sometimes I like to take one
596
00:27:38,501 --> 00:27:44,389
Speaker 2: wing completely off and go to my workshop
597
00:27:44,790 --> 00:27:47,759
Speaker 2: and try things, because, on my way of
598
00:27:47,819 --> 00:27:52,277
Speaker 2: thinking, the more I can play and try, and
599
00:27:52,558 --> 00:27:55,066
Speaker 2: that's how it works, it goes.
600
00:27:55,455 --> 00:27:56,138
Speaker 1: Talk to me about.
601
00:27:56,238 --> 00:27:59,748
Speaker 1: When you say a workshop, are you using that
602
00:27:59,809 --> 00:28:01,880
Speaker 1: word like a metaphor or you physically have
603
00:28:01,920 --> 00:28:03,184
Speaker 1: a room with your magnets?
604
00:28:03,355 --> 00:28:05,504
Speaker 2: No, no, I have really a workshop.
605
00:28:05,675 --> 00:28:09,659
Speaker 2: It's a mess because I'm messy, but I know
606
00:28:09,720 --> 00:28:10,823
Speaker 2: where are my things.
607
00:28:10,943 --> 00:28:12,227
Speaker 2: And I try this.
608
00:28:12,735 --> 00:28:16,404
Speaker 2: Very often I have the idea I do it.
609
00:28:16,745 --> 00:28:19,160
Speaker 2: It doesn't work, oh shit why.
610
00:28:19,815 --> 00:28:22,944
Speaker 2: And then I have to compromise a little bit
611
00:28:23,025 --> 00:28:25,522
Speaker 2: pop, pop, pop, and then it works or not,
612
00:28:26,436 --> 00:28:28,724
Speaker 2: but quite often it works yeah.
613
00:28:29,115 --> 00:28:30,720
Speaker 1: Well, you know, obviously at this point
614
00:28:30,760 --> 00:28:33,515
Speaker 1: you've done it so much that you know you're
615
00:28:33,536 --> 00:28:35,482
Speaker 1: like, okay, oh, okay, I see it with red,
616
00:28:35,522 --> 00:28:36,385
Speaker 1: okay, it will work.
617
00:28:36,535 --> 00:28:37,580
Speaker 1: I get the idea of it.
618
00:28:38,636 --> 00:28:39,439
Speaker 1: No, that's for sure.
619
00:28:40,382 --> 00:28:43,917
Speaker 1: I want to talk about sort of an interesting
620
00:28:44,899 --> 00:28:47,224
Speaker 1: version of this topic, which is magic with
621
00:28:47,424 --> 00:28:48,006
Speaker 1: objects.
622
00:28:48,627 --> 00:28:53,061
Speaker 1: I think for me, in my journey, I did some
623
00:28:53,101 --> 00:28:55,065
Speaker 1: mentalism, I did some card magic and then
624
00:28:55,105 --> 00:28:57,056
Speaker 1: at some point I realized that you know, I
625
00:28:57,397 --> 00:29:00,405
Speaker 1: really need to do magic with stuff, you
626
00:29:00,445 --> 00:29:02,478
Speaker 1: know, with objects, with things like that's
627
00:29:02,538 --> 00:29:04,303
Speaker 1: what, what people want to see.
628
00:29:04,323 --> 00:29:04,664
Speaker 1: They don't.
629
00:29:04,704 --> 00:29:06,656
Speaker 1: Maybe not just card tricks, maybe not just
630
00:29:06,716 --> 00:29:07,277
Speaker 1: mentalism.
631
00:29:07,959 --> 00:29:12,146
Speaker 1: And all of a sudden I felt that I was
632
00:29:12,207 --> 00:29:14,719
Speaker 1: looking out in magic books and it's a very
633
00:29:14,820 --> 00:29:15,724
Speaker 1: small subject.
634
00:29:15,864 --> 00:29:17,351
Speaker 1: I mean it's cause there's people that talk
635
00:29:17,391 --> 00:29:18,315
Speaker 1: about it, but it's not.
636
00:29:18,395 --> 00:29:20,542
Speaker 1: The biggest subject is magic with objects
637
00:29:20,582 --> 00:29:22,556
Speaker 1: and magic with things, and that's what
638
00:29:22,757 --> 00:29:25,383
Speaker 1: really led me to your books, because it's
639
00:29:25,804 --> 00:29:30,215
Speaker 1: all things ropes and locks and crazy stuff.
640
00:29:30,435 --> 00:29:32,919
Speaker 1: Talk to me about how you think about magic
641
00:29:32,959 --> 00:29:35,162
Speaker 1: with objects, because sometimes you use
642
00:29:35,382 --> 00:29:38,707
Speaker 1: objects where maybe it's natural but it's a
643
00:29:38,768 --> 00:29:40,510
Speaker 1: clever, really clever jump, like, for
644
00:29:40,550 --> 00:29:42,358
Speaker 1: example, the mic cable.
645
00:29:42,839 --> 00:29:45,225
Speaker 1: But then sometimes you do, you do the card
646
00:29:45,245 --> 00:29:47,116
Speaker 1: manipulation with boxing gloves on a boxing
647
00:29:47,156 --> 00:29:47,316
Speaker 1: gloves.
648
00:29:47,397 --> 00:29:48,460
Speaker 1: It doesn't come from anywhere.
649
00:29:48,520 --> 00:29:48,901
Speaker 1: It's not.
650
00:29:49,342 --> 00:29:50,004
Speaker 1: Nobody thought.
651
00:29:50,064 --> 00:29:51,596
Speaker 1: There's no reason for boxing gloves.
652
00:29:51,637 --> 00:29:53,741
Speaker 1: So talk to me about how you think about
653
00:29:53,842 --> 00:29:56,167
Speaker 1: using objects, or it's just whatever
654
00:29:56,207 --> 00:29:56,755
Speaker 1: tickles you.
655
00:29:56,775 --> 00:29:59,260
Speaker 2: You know, again, it's being curious about
656
00:29:59,300 --> 00:29:59,521
Speaker 2: things.
657
00:30:00,383 --> 00:30:03,288
Speaker 2: Anything, you see, how can you bring it to
658
00:30:03,348 --> 00:30:03,709
Speaker 2: magic?
659
00:30:04,457 --> 00:30:05,943
Speaker 2: You mentioned the boxing gloves.
660
00:30:06,695 --> 00:30:10,446
Speaker 2: The boxing glove I saw in France.
661
00:30:10,615 --> 00:30:14,486
Speaker 2: We had a huge genius guy, comedy guy.
662
00:30:15,895 --> 00:30:17,021
Speaker 2: His name was Coluche.
663
00:30:18,255 --> 00:30:24,406
Speaker 2: He was the most well-known comedian in
664
00:30:24,546 --> 00:30:28,655
Speaker 2: France for a decade and more than a decade
665
00:30:28,856 --> 00:30:32,045
Speaker 2: and he killed himself in a trash car
666
00:30:32,085 --> 00:30:32,627
Speaker 2: accident.
667
00:30:33,297 --> 00:30:33,638
Speaker 2: It was.
668
00:30:35,076 --> 00:30:37,001
Speaker 2: The guy was so well-known he went for
669
00:30:37,081 --> 00:30:41,299
Speaker 2: president, the real president, just for fun,
670
00:30:42,061 --> 00:30:44,977
Speaker 2: but they started not to love the real
671
00:30:45,358 --> 00:30:48,903
Speaker 2: politic guys because he had too many votes
672
00:30:49,204 --> 00:30:50,265
Speaker 2: possible, you know.
673
00:30:50,846 --> 00:30:52,469
Speaker 2: So it was terrific.
674
00:30:53,150 --> 00:30:58,661
Speaker 2: But when he was very young, he did, he did
675
00:30:58,741 --> 00:31:00,985
Speaker 2: something with boxing gloves, nothing to do
676
00:31:01,025 --> 00:31:01,686
Speaker 2: with magic.
677
00:31:03,268 --> 00:31:07,277
Speaker 2: He was playing violin with boxing gloves.
678
00:31:08,340 --> 00:31:11,306
Speaker 2: So he had the violin and he and took and
679
00:31:11,326 --> 00:31:13,129
Speaker 2: the other and he was playing.
680
00:31:13,955 --> 00:31:17,281
Speaker 2: I, I'm, I quite, I'm quite sure he was not
681
00:31:17,441 --> 00:31:20,826
Speaker 2: using any tricks, really, he was just, you
682
00:31:20,866 --> 00:31:24,156
Speaker 2: know, but he was playing just for, and he
683
00:31:24,216 --> 00:31:26,925
Speaker 2: was dressed nearly as a clown, you know,
684
00:31:27,055 --> 00:31:28,721
Speaker 2: and he was playing the violin with the
685
00:31:28,761 --> 00:31:29,704
Speaker 2: boxing gloves, you know.
686
00:31:30,857 --> 00:31:33,688
Speaker 2: And then, in fact, in my mind I said, shit,
687
00:31:33,909 --> 00:31:38,725
Speaker 2: what can I do magically with boxing gloves,
688
00:31:38,745 --> 00:31:39,046
Speaker 2: you know?
689
00:31:39,075 --> 00:31:39,979
Speaker 2: And my first thing was to, because it's so
690
00:31:39,901 --> 00:31:40,539
Speaker 2: funny to have boxing gloves, you know, and
691
00:31:40,461 --> 00:31:42,901
Speaker 2: my first thing was to because it's so funny
692
00:31:43,002 --> 00:31:46,039
Speaker 2: to have boxing gloves to do something
693
00:31:47,142 --> 00:31:48,225
Speaker 2: beside boxing.
694
00:31:48,286 --> 00:31:50,201
Speaker 2: You know, that was my idea.
695
00:31:51,315 --> 00:31:53,816
Speaker 2: So the first thing I wanted to do was a
696
00:31:53,876 --> 00:31:55,701
Speaker 2: complete act with boxing gloves.
697
00:31:56,905 --> 00:32:00,184
Speaker 2: You know, maybe one of the first thing was
698
00:32:00,244 --> 00:32:03,334
Speaker 2: to have a floating ball to cover the
699
00:32:03,394 --> 00:32:04,156
Speaker 2: floating ball.
700
00:32:05,139 --> 00:32:07,746
Speaker 2: And when the ball goes on top of the silk,
701
00:32:07,826 --> 00:32:10,574
Speaker 2: you know, like a zombie ball, it's a, it's
702
00:32:10,634 --> 00:32:12,077
Speaker 2: a boxing glove, you know.
703
00:32:13,138 --> 00:32:15,562
Speaker 2: And and it starts to hit me, you know.
704
00:32:16,924 --> 00:32:18,285
Speaker 2: So I fight with this.
705
00:32:18,305 --> 00:32:20,869
Speaker 2: This it's not a ball anymore, it's a boxing
706
00:32:20,909 --> 00:32:21,150
Speaker 2: glove.
707
00:32:22,652 --> 00:32:25,857
Speaker 2: And then the second boxing glove appear in
708
00:32:25,897 --> 00:32:29,264
Speaker 2: my other hand, you know, and so I am the
709
00:32:29,324 --> 00:32:29,705
Speaker 2: winner.
710
00:32:29,805 --> 00:32:31,148
Speaker 2: That was the idea, you know.
711
00:32:31,930 --> 00:32:36,101
Speaker 2: And then I took a big sink, I cover, and I
712
00:32:36,201 --> 00:32:37,864
Speaker 2: started to light a cigarette.
713
00:32:38,885 --> 00:32:41,850
Speaker 2: And I was doing the cigarette in silk, you
714
00:32:41,890 --> 00:32:45,343
Speaker 2: know, with my thumb from the boxing glove,
715
00:32:45,643 --> 00:32:47,568
Speaker 2: you know, just getting.
716
00:32:49,619 --> 00:32:51,405
Speaker 2: And then I said, why not to do card
717
00:32:51,425 --> 00:32:52,207
Speaker 2: manipulation?
718
00:32:53,337 --> 00:32:57,759
Speaker 2: And I started, you know, and first I had
719
00:32:57,839 --> 00:33:01,304
Speaker 2: really, like the John Cornelius, vanishing
720
00:33:01,404 --> 00:33:04,027
Speaker 2: nickel, you know, I wanted, with a thread
721
00:33:04,748 --> 00:33:06,891
Speaker 2: to make the card vanish and reappear.
722
00:33:07,576 --> 00:33:10,283
Speaker 2: And then I say, but it's stupid, because I
723
00:33:10,323 --> 00:33:12,268
Speaker 2: can fake the gloves, of course, you know.
724
00:33:13,095 --> 00:33:15,043
Speaker 2: And that's how I started, you know.
725
00:33:15,215 --> 00:33:18,661
Speaker 2: And then I was showing this to my friend,
726
00:33:18,701 --> 00:33:20,564
Speaker 2: christian Feschner, and say you know,
727
00:33:20,784 --> 00:33:23,468
Speaker 2: that's great, but keep the manipulation
728
00:33:23,569 --> 00:33:27,102
Speaker 2: card, that's it, you don't need to complete
729
00:33:27,263 --> 00:33:27,765
Speaker 2: act with it.
730
00:33:29,177 --> 00:33:30,702
Speaker 2: So that's how it developed.
731
00:33:30,742 --> 00:33:32,960
Speaker 2: You know, just by watching this guy doing,
732
00:33:33,041 --> 00:33:34,725
Speaker 2: what can I do with this?
733
00:33:34,846 --> 00:33:39,843
Speaker 2: You know, not to copy him at all, but to
734
00:33:40,023 --> 00:33:41,948
Speaker 2: use this because the prop is funny, you
735
00:33:41,988 --> 00:33:42,088
Speaker 2: know.
736
00:33:45,259 --> 00:33:45,680
Speaker 1: Is that?
737
00:33:45,860 --> 00:33:50,088
Speaker 1: How many of the objects that end up in your
738
00:33:50,268 --> 00:33:50,830
Speaker 1: act are there?
739
00:33:50,975 --> 00:33:53,182
Speaker 1: Because you think you know it sounds like a
740
00:33:53,443 --> 00:33:55,565
Speaker 1: couple of the both this conversation and
741
00:33:55,585 --> 00:33:57,396
Speaker 1: the conversation about creativity sort of
742
00:33:57,436 --> 00:34:00,145
Speaker 1: sound like it starts with what do I do with
743
00:34:00,205 --> 00:34:00,526
Speaker 1: this?
744
00:34:00,975 --> 00:34:02,621
Speaker 1: You know what is the object?
745
00:34:03,123 --> 00:34:06,645
Speaker 2: Yeah, sometimes it just it's a command, you
746
00:34:06,705 --> 00:34:09,200
Speaker 2: know, because when I was doing a lot of
747
00:34:09,782 --> 00:34:11,978
Speaker 2: trade show or thing like that, I never did
748
00:34:12,038 --> 00:34:14,400
Speaker 2: a lot of trade shows, but when I was doing
749
00:34:14,440 --> 00:34:17,501
Speaker 2: that, people went with a new project and
750
00:34:17,541 --> 00:34:20,415
Speaker 2: said do something with that, you know, and
751
00:34:20,496 --> 00:34:23,341
Speaker 2: could be a new printer, could be a
752
00:34:23,421 --> 00:34:24,984
Speaker 2: caterpillar, could be.
753
00:34:25,465 --> 00:34:26,607
Speaker 2: You have no idea, you know.
754
00:34:26,727 --> 00:34:28,370
Speaker 2: And then you need to do things.
755
00:34:29,396 --> 00:34:33,046
Speaker 2: So because you need to do, you do it, you
756
00:34:33,146 --> 00:34:33,427
Speaker 2: know.
757
00:34:35,118 --> 00:34:38,127
Speaker 1: What about creativity in presentation,
758
00:34:38,756 --> 00:34:41,237
Speaker 1: about what it is that you talk about or how
759
00:34:41,298 --> 00:34:42,523
Speaker 1: it is that you present it?
760
00:34:42,635 --> 00:34:43,901
Speaker 1: How do you think about that?
761
00:34:44,175 --> 00:34:45,561
Speaker 2: You know this, I don't know.
762
00:34:45,695 --> 00:34:49,345
Speaker 2: I think I have, I think, a good sense of
763
00:34:49,426 --> 00:34:54,224
Speaker 2: humor and I think I'm pretty funny guy, so
764
00:34:54,385 --> 00:34:54,846
Speaker 2: it helps.
765
00:34:55,476 --> 00:34:59,199
Speaker 2: I've seen a lot of very good inventors or
766
00:34:59,824 --> 00:35:02,900
Speaker 2: so-called inventors, but they are not funny
767
00:35:02,980 --> 00:35:05,046
Speaker 2: or they don't know how to present really,
768
00:35:05,495 --> 00:35:07,222
Speaker 2: so it's much more difficult for them.
769
00:35:08,436 --> 00:35:12,344
Speaker 2: I think really again, even now I feel like
770
00:35:12,444 --> 00:35:17,160
Speaker 2: I'm a boy, a young boy, I mean, I'm a baby,
771
00:35:17,260 --> 00:35:20,346
Speaker 2: you know, I'm playing with my tools, with
772
00:35:20,407 --> 00:35:21,709
Speaker 2: my toys, you know.
773
00:35:22,415 --> 00:35:25,625
Speaker 2: Yeah, I just turned this year, I turned 70,
774
00:35:25,685 --> 00:35:29,042
Speaker 2: you know, but for me it's like I'm 15, you
775
00:35:29,082 --> 00:35:30,225
Speaker 2: know, in my mind you know.
776
00:35:30,245 --> 00:35:30,326
Speaker 1: Wow.
777
00:35:31,595 --> 00:35:33,638
Speaker 1: I want to talk more about the presentation,
778
00:35:33,718 --> 00:35:37,524
Speaker 1: because I think that it's interesting to be
779
00:35:37,604 --> 00:35:41,689
Speaker 1: able to get every part of this process from
780
00:35:41,729 --> 00:35:42,350
Speaker 1: how you do it.
781
00:35:42,390 --> 00:35:44,499
Speaker 1: So I think the the creativity part is very
782
00:35:44,559 --> 00:35:44,880
Speaker 1: clear.
783
00:35:45,280 --> 00:35:46,784
Speaker 1: You know, starting with an object that
784
00:35:46,884 --> 00:35:49,116
Speaker 1: excites your interest, you and just playing
785
00:35:49,156 --> 00:35:51,781
Speaker 1: and playing with it, then you say, okay, I
786
00:35:51,862 --> 00:35:55,589
Speaker 1: have, I have this object, I have this trick.
787
00:35:55,669 --> 00:35:56,877
Speaker 1: I think it's really interesting.
788
00:35:57,618 --> 00:35:59,742
Speaker 1: Do you do you write are?
789
00:35:59,842 --> 00:36:02,087
Speaker 1: Do you write in terms of what you're going
790
00:36:02,107 --> 00:36:03,569
Speaker 1: to say, like, do you write a script?
791
00:36:03,775 --> 00:36:06,865
Speaker 2: No, I never did that I never script, really,
792
00:36:07,555 --> 00:36:12,748
Speaker 2: but I was scripting in my mind very early.
793
00:36:12,915 --> 00:36:15,202
Speaker 2: I was thinking, oh, I will talk about this
794
00:36:15,262 --> 00:36:18,018
Speaker 2: topic or this or that, and I will.
795
00:36:18,559 --> 00:36:20,805
Speaker 2: I was taking the underground or the bus or
796
00:36:20,846 --> 00:36:24,924
Speaker 2: whatever, and I was repeating where I
797
00:36:24,964 --> 00:36:28,160
Speaker 2: wanted to go, you know, and imagining the
798
00:36:28,260 --> 00:36:30,146
Speaker 2: moment where I will be in front of the
799
00:36:30,226 --> 00:36:30,567
Speaker 2: audience.
800
00:36:30,675 --> 00:36:34,306
Speaker 2: But the first time it was just wow, you
801
00:36:34,346 --> 00:36:34,526
Speaker 2: know.
802
00:36:35,956 --> 00:36:38,780
Speaker 2: And then if you have the chance to walk,
803
00:36:38,860 --> 00:36:40,983
Speaker 2: and more and more and more, after two,
804
00:36:41,083 --> 00:36:44,248
Speaker 2: three, four times, you know you have seen
805
00:36:44,829 --> 00:36:49,157
Speaker 2: the clink or you forget that, and it
806
00:36:49,197 --> 00:36:51,762
Speaker 2: doesn't take long before.
807
00:36:51,882 --> 00:36:58,940
Speaker 2: For me it just kind of falls in place and
808
00:36:59,261 --> 00:37:00,806
Speaker 2: that's about the patter.
809
00:37:01,575 --> 00:37:05,145
Speaker 2: Also, there was an American magician I've
810
00:37:05,185 --> 00:37:05,667
Speaker 2: never met.
811
00:37:05,755 --> 00:37:07,993
Speaker 2: He was dead before I came to the Magic
812
00:37:08,033 --> 00:37:12,437
Speaker 2: Castle, but his name was Lou Derman and he
813
00:37:12,477 --> 00:37:16,527
Speaker 2: said at the time in the 60s, 70s, he said
814
00:37:18,058 --> 00:37:23,259
Speaker 2: when you walk, tape your pattern, tape your
815
00:37:23,279 --> 00:37:24,844
Speaker 2: show, tape it.
816
00:37:25,315 --> 00:37:28,237
Speaker 2: He was not talking about filming, it was
817
00:37:28,297 --> 00:37:31,177
Speaker 2: just about the sound, you know, and you
818
00:37:31,217 --> 00:37:35,326
Speaker 2: will know why they laugh right there, why
819
00:37:35,366 --> 00:37:36,088
Speaker 2: they don't laugh.
820
00:37:37,336 --> 00:37:41,044
Speaker 2: And every day, after every show he was just
821
00:37:41,144 --> 00:37:44,976
Speaker 2: listening to the last show, you know, and
822
00:37:45,016 --> 00:37:47,244
Speaker 2: I'm sure I know that people like
823
00:37:47,284 --> 00:37:47,986
Speaker 2: Copperfield.
824
00:37:48,006 --> 00:37:49,010
Speaker 2: They still do that.
825
00:37:49,070 --> 00:37:49,391
Speaker 2: You know.
826
00:37:49,411 --> 00:37:50,374
Speaker 2: They film every show.
827
00:37:50,655 --> 00:37:53,558
Speaker 2: They debrief after, and that's a way you
828
00:37:53,578 --> 00:37:54,940
Speaker 2: know how to improve very, very fastly.
829
00:37:54,980 --> 00:37:57,923
Speaker 2: You know how to improve very, very fastly.
830
00:37:58,344 --> 00:38:00,907
Speaker 2: You know, and now it's so easy.
831
00:38:01,287 --> 00:38:04,751
Speaker 2: It's so easy with your, you know, with your
832
00:38:04,811 --> 00:38:10,139
Speaker 2: phone you can film you and.
833
00:38:10,179 --> 00:38:11,021
Speaker 2: But that's so important because the best
834
00:38:11,041 --> 00:38:13,607
Speaker 2: ideas for me happen by chance.
835
00:38:13,887 --> 00:38:16,741
Speaker 2: One day, boom, especially if you work with
836
00:38:16,801 --> 00:38:19,762
Speaker 2: people, if you work with assisting
837
00:38:19,823 --> 00:38:20,525
Speaker 2: spectators.
838
00:38:23,258 --> 00:38:25,584
Speaker 2: One day they found something, they do
839
00:38:25,624 --> 00:38:27,956
Speaker 2: something by chance, wow.
840
00:38:28,197 --> 00:38:29,282
Speaker 2: And you have to keep this.
841
00:38:32,178 --> 00:38:36,307
Speaker 2: If you don't note it, maybe at the end of
842
00:38:36,347 --> 00:38:38,780
Speaker 2: the act you say, ah shit, he did something
843
00:38:38,840 --> 00:38:39,121
Speaker 2: funny.
844
00:38:39,161 --> 00:38:41,026
Speaker 2: I don't remember now.
845
00:38:42,044 --> 00:38:47,540
Speaker 2: So the more you can tape or record, the
846
00:38:47,600 --> 00:38:52,742
Speaker 2: best it is to keep this moment and try to
847
00:38:53,399 --> 00:38:58,409
Speaker 2: react it after you know it's helping me get
848
00:38:58,449 --> 00:39:01,243
Speaker 2: a full picture of what it looks like.
849
00:39:01,435 --> 00:39:03,743
Speaker 1: You know thinking about an object, putting
850
00:39:03,823 --> 00:39:06,673
Speaker 1: down the notes of what it could do working
851
00:39:06,713 --> 00:39:07,215
Speaker 1: in the workshop.
852
00:39:07,516 --> 00:39:09,600
Speaker 1: Once you have something that sort of looks
853
00:39:09,620 --> 00:39:12,666
Speaker 1: like it works, you mentally map out how
854
00:39:12,726 --> 00:39:15,119
Speaker 1: you're presenting and speaking and then you
855
00:39:15,179 --> 00:39:17,251
Speaker 1: put it on stage and record it two or three
856
00:39:17,291 --> 00:39:19,881
Speaker 1: or four times and now you know what needs
857
00:39:19,961 --> 00:39:20,302
Speaker 1: to be.
858
00:39:20,322 --> 00:39:22,437
Speaker 2: Oh, yeah and and yeah, I don't.
859
00:39:22,817 --> 00:39:25,964
Speaker 2: What I really don't like at all is when you
860
00:39:26,064 --> 00:39:29,036
Speaker 2: realize that the magician talking to you is
861
00:39:29,156 --> 00:39:30,238
Speaker 2: reciting something.
862
00:39:31,059 --> 00:39:33,043
Speaker 2: Hate that, it's not my.
863
00:39:33,423 --> 00:39:35,928
Speaker 2: Some people they do it well, you know, but
864
00:39:36,268 --> 00:39:39,420
Speaker 2: most of the time I don't like that, you
865
00:39:39,480 --> 00:39:42,425
Speaker 2: know I I much when it looks spontaneous,
866
00:39:42,806 --> 00:39:44,589
Speaker 2: like it's an event on the spot.
867
00:39:45,498 --> 00:39:48,026
Speaker 2: And I add that also as to be short.
868
00:39:50,918 --> 00:39:56,127
Speaker 2: If you remember Al Gauchman, it was a
869
00:39:56,187 --> 00:39:59,261
Speaker 2: school of being short, say go, gone too
870
00:39:59,301 --> 00:39:59,562
Speaker 2: late.
871
00:40:00,735 --> 00:40:02,279
Speaker 2: It was not complete big sentence, it was
872
00:40:02,233 --> 00:40:02,474
Speaker 2: boom.
873
00:40:02,429 --> 00:40:02,971
Speaker 2: School of being short, say go, gone too
874
00:40:02,925 --> 00:40:03,005
Speaker 2: late.
875
00:40:02,960 --> 00:40:03,361
Speaker 2: You know, it was not complete big sentence,
876
00:40:03,455 --> 00:40:04,299
Speaker 2: it was boom, boom.
877
00:40:04,995 --> 00:40:06,141
Speaker 2: It's right, the rhythm.
878
00:40:08,204 --> 00:40:10,133
Speaker 1: Are you talking about the trick needs to be
879
00:40:10,194 --> 00:40:12,363
Speaker 1: short or the presentation needs to be short?
880
00:40:13,316 --> 00:40:14,018
Speaker 2: The pattern.
881
00:40:14,219 --> 00:40:16,326
Speaker 2: If you have pattern, it has to be boom
882
00:40:17,735 --> 00:40:18,337
Speaker 2: Sentences.
883
00:40:18,457 --> 00:40:20,683
Speaker 2: No big blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
884
00:40:20,863 --> 00:40:22,487
Speaker 2: No big stories, I don't think so.
885
00:40:24,317 --> 00:40:25,803
Speaker 2: Also, I have some heroes.
886
00:40:26,376 --> 00:40:27,702
Speaker 2: You were talking about heroes.
887
00:40:28,436 --> 00:40:34,159
Speaker 2: One man I really love to watch and for me,
888
00:40:34,240 --> 00:40:37,841
Speaker 2: a master of rhythm is George Carle.
889
00:40:39,015 --> 00:40:41,643
Speaker 2: George Carle is a big clown.
890
00:40:42,004 --> 00:40:45,222
Speaker 2: He's not a magician, but he was doing the
891
00:40:45,315 --> 00:40:48,902
Speaker 2: crazy horse for many years and nobody could
892
00:40:49,336 --> 00:40:51,244
Speaker 2: go after this guy Nobody.
893
00:40:51,435 --> 00:40:52,578
Speaker 2: He had to finish the show.
894
00:40:52,758 --> 00:40:55,866
Speaker 2: George Carl, carl, yes, with a.
895
00:40:55,947 --> 00:40:55,967
Speaker 1: C.
896
00:40:56,496 --> 00:40:59,004
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, c-a-r-l.
897
00:41:01,056 --> 00:41:03,605
Speaker 2: Yeah, George Carl was a very unique clown.
898
00:41:04,076 --> 00:41:07,666
Speaker 2: If you go on YouTube you will find his act.
899
00:41:07,835 --> 00:41:11,085
Speaker 2: He had different acts but it ends.
900
00:41:11,175 --> 00:41:13,704
Speaker 2: That's where I get the microphone idea,
901
00:41:15,858 --> 00:41:19,205
Speaker 2: because his whole act is to get tangled
902
00:41:19,486 --> 00:41:20,788
Speaker 2: with the cable of the mic.
903
00:41:21,035 --> 00:41:26,763
Speaker 2: You know he's doing no magic, but it's very
904
00:41:26,803 --> 00:41:28,447
Speaker 2: difficult to describe the act.
905
00:41:28,575 --> 00:41:30,703
Speaker 2: But he has problems with everything.
906
00:41:31,655 --> 00:41:35,064
Speaker 2: He's clumsy as you can be clumsy, but in
907
00:41:35,184 --> 00:41:36,307
Speaker 2: such a funny way.
908
00:41:36,936 --> 00:41:40,342
Speaker 2: And when I saw him I said what can I do
909
00:41:41,024 --> 00:41:44,210
Speaker 2: with a microphone being magical, you know,
910
00:41:45,015 --> 00:41:49,284
Speaker 2: and not copying george karl, of course, um,
911
00:41:50,126 --> 00:41:55,997
Speaker 2: and about talking, one hero for me is a
912
00:41:56,058 --> 00:41:56,578
Speaker 2: pianist.
913
00:41:57,620 --> 00:42:02,266
Speaker 2: He was a huge, huge star in Denmark for
914
00:42:02,326 --> 00:42:03,047
Speaker 2: many years.
915
00:42:03,688 --> 00:42:09,100
Speaker 2: He died very, very late and but he was, I
916
00:42:09,200 --> 00:42:09,901
Speaker 2: knew after.
917
00:42:10,002 --> 00:42:13,887
Speaker 2: But if you know Fred Capps, of course,
918
00:42:13,927 --> 00:42:17,156
Speaker 2: great Fred Capps, but Fred Capps took a lot
919
00:42:17,217 --> 00:42:19,820
Speaker 2: from him about talking.
920
00:42:20,781 --> 00:42:23,365
Speaker 2: His delivery, the way he was talking was
921
00:42:23,525 --> 00:42:27,450
Speaker 2: really influenced by Victor Borger, another
922
00:42:27,530 --> 00:42:28,011
Speaker 2: big guy.
923
00:42:30,515 --> 00:42:32,542
Speaker 2: So if you take all the best, you know, all
924
00:42:32,562 --> 00:42:35,652
Speaker 2: these big guys are your heroes.
925
00:42:36,015 --> 00:42:36,979
Speaker 2: They inspire you.
926
00:42:37,160 --> 00:42:37,542
Speaker 2: You know.
927
00:42:38,476 --> 00:42:42,164
Speaker 1: I want to talk a little bit more about this
928
00:42:42,304 --> 00:42:45,638
Speaker 1: idea of creativity, but in a different lens,
929
00:42:45,718 --> 00:42:47,865
Speaker 1: which is, you know, a lot of times you see
930
00:42:47,925 --> 00:42:51,481
Speaker 1: magicians myself included, that will do.
931
00:42:52,383 --> 00:42:54,936
Speaker 1: Let's call it the classics, you know, but
932
00:42:54,976 --> 00:42:56,242
Speaker 1: they look like the classics.
933
00:42:56,315 --> 00:42:59,364
Speaker 1: You see cups and balls, maybe with cups and
934
00:42:59,404 --> 00:42:59,685
Speaker 1: balls.
935
00:42:59,805 --> 00:43:00,989
Speaker 1: You know, it's not with shoes and lemons.
936
00:43:00,912 --> 00:43:00,992
Speaker 1: It's.
937
00:43:00,914 --> 00:43:01,533
Speaker 1: See cups and balls, maybe with cups and
938
00:43:01,456 --> 00:43:01,597
Speaker 1: balls.
939
00:43:01,519 --> 00:43:02,835
Speaker 1: You know, it's not with shoes and and and
940
00:43:02,976 --> 00:43:04,480
Speaker 1: lemons, it's with cups and balls.
941
00:43:05,101 --> 00:43:06,926
Speaker 1: And you see a card trick and it's just a
942
00:43:06,966 --> 00:43:08,198
Speaker 1: card trick, maybe with a with a
943
00:43:08,238 --> 00:43:08,901
Speaker 1: presentation.
944
00:43:09,604 --> 00:43:11,370
Speaker 1: There's some magicians who I speak to that
945
00:43:11,531 --> 00:43:13,538
Speaker 1: they maybe, whether they're talking about
946
00:43:13,658 --> 00:43:14,862
Speaker 1: other people or they're talking about
947
00:43:14,882 --> 00:43:16,796
Speaker 1: themselves, they say they don't like this.
948
00:43:16,936 --> 00:43:19,641
Speaker 1: It needs to be original, it needs to be
949
00:43:19,822 --> 00:43:22,206
Speaker 1: unique, it needs to be special.
950
00:43:22,607 --> 00:43:27,498
Speaker 1: Do you feel that, like, do you feel that
951
00:43:27,518 --> 00:43:28,486
Speaker 1: you only do stuff on stage that you created
952
00:43:28,526 --> 00:43:30,618
Speaker 1: or you came up with, or do you think that's
953
00:43:30,638 --> 00:43:32,565
Speaker 1: the way it should be, or you don't care?
954
00:43:33,555 --> 00:43:37,986
Speaker 2: Since I was very young, I had the love to
955
00:43:38,086 --> 00:43:38,988
Speaker 2: fool magicians.
956
00:43:39,457 --> 00:43:42,362
Speaker 2: I love that, I love that, I love that idea.
957
00:43:42,382 --> 00:43:45,643
Speaker 2: You know, I mean to do maybe a standard
958
00:43:45,723 --> 00:43:50,419
Speaker 2: effect, but with a new method, just to fool
959
00:43:50,439 --> 00:43:52,878
Speaker 2: them like a sneaky boy, you know, like a
960
00:43:52,898 --> 00:43:53,360
Speaker 2: bad guy.
961
00:43:55,200 --> 00:43:57,261
Speaker 2: No, no, no, no, no, no, it's not that you
962
00:43:57,281 --> 00:43:57,381
Speaker 2: know.
963
00:43:57,756 --> 00:44:01,961
Speaker 2: And most of my magic, in fact, I go back to
964
00:44:02,062 --> 00:44:04,902
Speaker 2: a normal trick, except the method is
965
00:44:04,942 --> 00:44:05,263
Speaker 2: different.
966
00:44:05,595 --> 00:44:09,985
Speaker 2: And I started when I had the chance to have
967
00:44:10,065 --> 00:44:12,840
Speaker 2: access to the tar bell, the complete tar
968
00:44:12,860 --> 00:44:15,561
Speaker 2: bell, when I was 17,.
969
00:44:16,202 --> 00:44:18,387
Speaker 2: I bought a complete set of the tar bell.
970
00:44:18,467 --> 00:44:21,521
Speaker 2: At the time, the first thing I did was to
971
00:44:21,621 --> 00:44:26,497
Speaker 2: read the effect, not the explanation, and
972
00:44:26,597 --> 00:44:28,364
Speaker 2: it's still something you can do.
973
00:44:28,835 --> 00:44:31,616
Speaker 2: I mean, you read the effect and say, okay,
974
00:44:31,636 --> 00:44:33,523
Speaker 2: I have to find a solution for me.
975
00:44:34,595 --> 00:44:35,841
Speaker 2: How can I do that?
976
00:44:35,921 --> 00:44:40,539
Speaker 2: You know, because now you know that's one
977
00:44:40,579 --> 00:44:43,238
Speaker 2: of the problems we have now is that we see
978
00:44:43,298 --> 00:44:46,386
Speaker 2: something on the internet, wow, and you
979
00:44:46,947 --> 00:44:50,340
Speaker 2: click, you buy the explanation right now,
980
00:44:50,461 --> 00:44:53,047
Speaker 2: bing bing, and okay, what next?
981
00:44:53,856 --> 00:44:56,404
Speaker 2: So you have no time to think how it could
982
00:44:56,444 --> 00:44:56,725
Speaker 2: work.
983
00:44:56,845 --> 00:44:59,067
Speaker 2: You know, you just jump to the solution and
984
00:44:59,087 --> 00:45:01,160
Speaker 2: then to the next trick, and that's not the
985
00:45:01,200 --> 00:45:02,771
Speaker 2: way to go, I think.
986
00:45:03,415 --> 00:45:06,173
Speaker 2: But you know some of the tricks really are.
987
00:45:08,339 --> 00:45:14,092
Speaker 2: And also we forget that we have to try to
988
00:45:14,172 --> 00:45:15,195
Speaker 2: forget how it works.
989
00:45:17,642 --> 00:45:20,291
Speaker 2: For instance, one of the very first trick I
990
00:45:21,014 --> 00:45:24,395
Speaker 2: was happy with is to buy the China sticks.
991
00:45:26,681 --> 00:45:30,711
Speaker 2: I remember I was sick in bed and my mom
992
00:45:30,731 --> 00:45:35,330
Speaker 2: came back from Mayette with a set of
993
00:45:35,470 --> 00:45:39,603
Speaker 2: Chinese sticks the small version and had
994
00:45:39,803 --> 00:45:41,507
Speaker 2: ideas how it could work.
995
00:45:42,877 --> 00:45:48,807
Speaker 2: When I saw the real explanation, wow, maybe
996
00:45:48,847 --> 00:45:51,360
Speaker 2: for the first time, I said this is clever.
997
00:45:51,521 --> 00:45:53,408
Speaker 2: This is completely clever, because
998
00:45:53,870 --> 00:45:56,561
Speaker 2: everybody is thinking it must be a thread
999
00:45:56,621 --> 00:45:57,082
Speaker 2: or something.
1000
00:45:57,223 --> 00:46:00,041
Speaker 2: No, and so we all know how it works.
1001
00:46:00,503 --> 00:46:00,784
Speaker 2: You know.
1002
00:46:01,495 --> 00:46:05,922
Speaker 2: But I always say OK, now if we don't know
1003
00:46:06,964 --> 00:46:10,249
Speaker 2: how it could work in a new way.
1004
00:46:10,289 --> 00:46:13,482
Speaker 2: You know, and it's the same for the Chinese
1005
00:46:13,522 --> 00:46:15,702
Speaker 2: sticks, it's the same for the linking rings,
1006
00:46:16,716 --> 00:46:19,422
Speaker 2: can be the same for the cups and balls, you
1007
00:46:19,482 --> 00:46:21,888
Speaker 2: know, and et cetera, et cetera.
1008
00:46:22,215 --> 00:46:25,785
Speaker 2: Forget the normal trick and try to find
1009
00:46:25,885 --> 00:46:26,407
Speaker 2: something new.
1010
00:46:26,896 --> 00:46:29,818
Speaker 2: Sometimes it doesn't work, sometimes the
1011
00:46:29,959 --> 00:46:33,567
Speaker 2: old method is the best and still the best.
1012
00:46:33,607 --> 00:46:37,403
Speaker 2: You know, for instance, when I found my way
1013
00:46:37,443 --> 00:46:40,752
Speaker 2: to do the lasso rope, you know, the card, I
1014
00:46:40,792 --> 00:46:43,217
Speaker 2: was really thinking first to have a very
1015
00:46:43,318 --> 00:46:46,964
Speaker 2: complex machine inside the hat, like a rat
1016
00:46:47,025 --> 00:46:50,619
Speaker 2: trap, kind of making the knot, you know,
1017
00:46:50,719 --> 00:46:52,887
Speaker 2: and I told I was very good friend at the
1018
00:46:52,927 --> 00:46:55,627
Speaker 2: time with Jeff Busby from America and I was
1019
00:46:55,694 --> 00:46:58,150
Speaker 2: working since one month on the on the thing,
1020
00:46:58,190 --> 00:46:59,475
Speaker 2: and I was working since one month on the
1021
00:46:59,937 --> 00:47:03,583
Speaker 2: thing and it was not really working well,
1022
00:47:03,775 --> 00:47:04,278
Speaker 2: and it was.
1023
00:47:04,478 --> 00:47:06,840
Speaker 2: You know, I had the big machine in the hat
1024
00:47:06,921 --> 00:47:07,463
Speaker 2: and all that.
1025
00:47:08,499 --> 00:47:11,251
Speaker 2: And Jeff told me I hope, gaetan, it's not
1026
00:47:11,372 --> 00:47:13,854
Speaker 2: something very complex like a collector
1027
00:47:14,116 --> 00:47:17,055
Speaker 2: workshop prop or very expensive.
1028
00:47:17,978 --> 00:47:19,102
Speaker 2: No, no, of course not.
1029
00:47:19,222 --> 00:47:21,323
Speaker 2: And it was, it was completely.
1030
00:47:22,329 --> 00:47:24,800
Speaker 2: And so in the night I said shit must be a
1031
00:47:24,881 --> 00:47:27,041
Speaker 2: simple way, a simple way.
1032
00:47:28,139 --> 00:47:30,560
Speaker 2: And then I found that I could cut the hat
1033
00:47:30,680 --> 00:47:33,980
Speaker 2: and just put my finger inside and make the
1034
00:47:34,020 --> 00:47:34,542
Speaker 2: trick work.
1035
00:47:36,141 --> 00:47:38,682
Speaker 2: And that's it we go back to.
1036
00:47:39,698 --> 00:47:41,824
Speaker 2: It's very difficult to find something
1037
00:47:41,905 --> 00:47:42,286
Speaker 2: simple.
1038
00:47:43,255 --> 00:47:44,441
Speaker 2: That's the most difficult.
1039
00:47:47,158 --> 00:47:50,184
Speaker 2: It's quite easy to find something very
1040
00:47:50,244 --> 00:47:52,949
Speaker 2: electronic or very, very elaborate.
1041
00:47:53,555 --> 00:47:56,978
Speaker 2: But to cut down to the essence of the trick
1042
00:47:57,138 --> 00:48:00,122
Speaker 2: that Vernon was always saying If you need
1043
00:48:00,183 --> 00:48:02,281
Speaker 2: three moves to the trick, it's good, if you
1044
00:48:02,321 --> 00:48:04,943
Speaker 2: need only two, it's better, and if you get
1045
00:48:04,983 --> 00:48:06,870
Speaker 2: rid of the last one you have a miracle, you
1046
00:48:06,890 --> 00:48:06,990
Speaker 2: know.
1047
00:48:08,741 --> 00:48:11,169
Speaker 2: And so it's the same with any trick.
1048
00:48:12,701 --> 00:48:15,711
Speaker 2: Go to the simplification.
1049
00:48:16,221 --> 00:48:19,209
Speaker 1: The least that you can do it's not easy to
1050
00:48:19,249 --> 00:48:19,874
Speaker 1: be simple.
1051
00:48:20,080 --> 00:48:21,868
Speaker 2: It's not easy to be simple.
1052
00:48:23,863 --> 00:48:25,527
Speaker 1: What's the quote I would have?
1053
00:48:25,908 --> 00:48:28,162
Speaker 1: I, I, I wrote you a paragraph cause I
1054
00:48:28,182 --> 00:48:29,526
Speaker 1: didn't have the time to write you a
1055
00:48:29,586 --> 00:48:30,068
Speaker 1: sentence.
1056
00:48:30,368 --> 00:48:31,030
Speaker 1: I'm getting it.
1057
00:48:31,130 --> 00:48:32,544
Speaker 1: I'm saying the quote wrong, but it's
1058
00:48:32,564 --> 00:48:33,348
Speaker 1: something like that.
1059
00:48:33,428 --> 00:48:35,498
Speaker 1: You know, I wrote it in a paragraph, I
1060
00:48:35,538 --> 00:48:36,942
Speaker 1: didn't have the time to write it in one
1061
00:48:36,982 --> 00:48:37,422
Speaker 1: sentence.
1062
00:48:37,663 --> 00:48:38,964
Speaker 1: Okay, let's talk.
1063
00:48:39,005 --> 00:48:41,668
Speaker 1: We talked a bit about the inspiration for
1064
00:48:41,869 --> 00:48:44,072
Speaker 1: the boxing gloves and the inspiration for
1065
00:48:44,232 --> 00:48:47,081
Speaker 1: the microphone cord with the scissors.
1066
00:48:47,662 --> 00:48:50,007
Speaker 1: I want to hear about how the pamplemousse
1067
00:48:50,408 --> 00:48:51,510
Speaker 1: trick came to be.
1068
00:48:52,192 --> 00:48:53,320
Speaker 1: How did that come to be?
1069
00:48:54,281 --> 00:48:55,483
Speaker 2: oh, that's a funny one.
1070
00:48:55,623 --> 00:48:57,005
Speaker 2: That's a very funny one.
1071
00:48:57,785 --> 00:48:58,466
Speaker 2: In fact.
1072
00:48:58,767 --> 00:48:59,748
Speaker 2: I was working.
1073
00:49:00,068 --> 00:49:04,653
Speaker 2: I always loved the, the canary and the
1074
00:49:04,814 --> 00:49:09,324
Speaker 2: orange and the pomplamoose, because I saw
1075
00:49:09,545 --> 00:49:13,653
Speaker 2: Richard E Jr many years ago at the Olympia
1076
00:49:13,693 --> 00:49:14,294
Speaker 2: doing that.
1077
00:49:14,500 --> 00:49:17,810
Speaker 2: I said, wow, that's a beautiful trick.
1078
00:49:20,002 --> 00:49:24,991
Speaker 2: And my first idea was to use a blender, a
1079
00:49:25,031 --> 00:49:26,915
Speaker 2: grinder, you know.
1080
00:49:27,420 --> 00:49:31,289
Speaker 2: So one card chosen and I put the card with
1081
00:49:31,350 --> 00:49:35,629
Speaker 2: some water in the blender, minus one corner.
1082
00:49:36,200 --> 00:49:40,527
Speaker 2: Then I cut orange and the kiwi, and then
1083
00:49:40,584 --> 00:49:45,266
Speaker 2: the pamplemousse and the kiwi, and then the
1084
00:49:45,286 --> 00:49:49,891
Speaker 2: pamplemousse, and then my idea was to grab
1085
00:49:49,951 --> 00:49:54,216
Speaker 2: the bowl, you know, full of all that liquid
1086
00:49:54,696 --> 00:49:58,804
Speaker 2: and say now watch One, two, three, and I
1087
00:49:58,884 --> 00:50:01,663
Speaker 2: throw the thing in the air and the liquid
1088
00:50:02,186 --> 00:50:04,275
Speaker 2: when it falls back, it's back to the
1089
00:50:04,315 --> 00:50:04,978
Speaker 2: pamplemousse, mm.
1090
00:50:06,024 --> 00:50:09,926
Speaker 2: So 100% visual, you know, pshh.
1091
00:50:11,785 --> 00:50:11,926
Speaker 2: And.
1092
00:50:12,147 --> 00:50:14,336
Speaker 2: But I bought 10 blenders.
1093
00:50:14,356 --> 00:50:19,677
Speaker 2: It was leaking and I never went through,
1094
00:50:19,717 --> 00:50:19,938
Speaker 2: you know.
1095
00:50:19,958 --> 00:50:20,440
Speaker 2: And then I was working.
1096
00:50:21,910 --> 00:50:24,544
Speaker 2: I said I'm sure must be a solution, I have
1097
00:50:24,584 --> 00:50:26,170
Speaker 2: to find something.
1098
00:50:28,322 --> 00:50:30,502
Speaker 2: And I was working on the problem and then
1099
00:50:30,722 --> 00:50:34,841
Speaker 2: at the time I was in Las Vegas and Kevin
1100
00:50:34,861 --> 00:50:38,490
Speaker 2: James, my good friend, so good friend,
1101
00:50:38,550 --> 00:50:41,927
Speaker 2: kevin, told me oh, gaetan, I bought two
1102
00:50:41,987 --> 00:50:43,391
Speaker 2: tickets for you tonight.
1103
00:50:43,821 --> 00:50:48,964
Speaker 2: You have to go see this guy, his name is
1104
00:50:49,064 --> 00:50:49,627
Speaker 2: Gallagher.
1105
00:50:50,400 --> 00:50:51,686
Speaker 2: I said Gallagher, who is that?
1106
00:50:51,860 --> 00:50:53,988
Speaker 2: And I was with my girlfriend at the time,
1107
00:50:55,000 --> 00:50:59,428
Speaker 2: and so he said, oh, he's doing funny thing
1108
00:50:59,469 --> 00:51:01,653
Speaker 2: with watermelons and things like that.
1109
00:51:01,673 --> 00:51:04,683
Speaker 2: I said OK, ok, and so we arrived for the
1110
00:51:04,743 --> 00:51:08,873
Speaker 2: show and the room started to be dark, you
1111
00:51:08,913 --> 00:51:12,328
Speaker 2: know, and I asked have you I tip the maître
1112
00:51:12,368 --> 00:51:12,669
Speaker 2: d'?
1113
00:51:12,729 --> 00:51:13,572
Speaker 2: You know I tip him.
1114
00:51:13,720 --> 00:51:17,229
Speaker 2: I say you have a front row or something
1115
00:51:17,530 --> 00:51:17,810
Speaker 2: nice?
1116
00:51:18,051 --> 00:51:21,605
Speaker 2: Yeah, of course, and we're really nearly at
1117
00:51:21,645 --> 00:51:24,994
Speaker 2: the front first table, you know, and we're
1118
00:51:25,014 --> 00:51:27,360
Speaker 2: really nearly at the front first table, you
1119
00:51:27,380 --> 00:51:32,361
Speaker 2: know, and during this I see the people they
1120
00:51:32,381 --> 00:51:33,022
Speaker 2: are like wearing like raincoats.
1121
00:51:33,042 --> 00:51:33,883
Speaker 2: I said what is that?
1122
00:51:34,084 --> 00:51:35,025
Speaker 2: What's going on there?
1123
00:51:36,326 --> 00:51:37,208
Speaker 2: And it stopped.
1124
00:51:37,268 --> 00:51:39,270
Speaker 2: And the guy, the Gallagher hunter, he's
1125
00:51:39,290 --> 00:51:41,653
Speaker 2: like an old EP, you know, gallagher.
1126
00:51:41,894 --> 00:51:44,757
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah yeah, yeah.
1127
00:51:50,220 --> 00:51:52,144
Speaker 2: So he enter, he has like a big frisbee, you
1128
00:51:52,164 --> 00:51:52,645
Speaker 2: know, in a bucket.
1129
00:51:52,685 --> 00:51:54,008
Speaker 2: He said hello guys, how are you tonight?
1130
00:51:54,108 --> 00:51:56,052
Speaker 2: And he's for the first frisbee and the
1131
00:51:56,113 --> 00:51:59,024
Speaker 2: frisbee is filled with water, you know.
1132
00:51:59,064 --> 00:52:02,308
Speaker 2: So he just shoom putting water all over the
1133
00:52:02,389 --> 00:52:02,629
Speaker 2: room.
1134
00:52:02,849 --> 00:52:05,233
Speaker 2: He has not one Frisbee, he has 10 of them
1135
00:52:05,293 --> 00:52:07,055
Speaker 2: in the bucket with ice water.
1136
00:52:08,200 --> 00:52:10,566
Speaker 2: And every time I say, oh, my God.
1137
00:52:10,667 --> 00:52:12,652
Speaker 2: Well, what is this show, you know?
1138
00:52:13,701 --> 00:52:18,058
Speaker 2: And at the end of the show he has smashed,
1139
00:52:18,199 --> 00:52:21,668
Speaker 2: you know, he has a big hammer and he
1140
00:52:21,748 --> 00:52:25,647
Speaker 2: smashed pamplemousse, he smashed watermelon,
1141
00:52:25,840 --> 00:52:28,649
Speaker 2: he smashed burgers and mayonnaise and
1142
00:52:28,769 --> 00:52:29,331
Speaker 2: ketchup.
1143
00:52:30,280 --> 00:52:33,565
Speaker 2: You can't walk in the room, you sleep on
1144
00:52:33,645 --> 00:52:34,970
Speaker 2: mayonnaise and everything.
1145
00:52:35,440 --> 00:52:37,507
Speaker 2: And everybody is laughing, you know, is
1146
00:52:37,587 --> 00:52:38,590
Speaker 2: laughing so hard.
1147
00:52:39,601 --> 00:52:44,028
Speaker 2: And during that night I was experiencing
1148
00:52:44,128 --> 00:52:46,772
Speaker 2: the power of smashing food.
1149
00:52:48,721 --> 00:52:52,124
Speaker 2: It's very bad taste, it's whatever, but
1150
00:52:52,244 --> 00:52:55,865
Speaker 2: it's funny and it gives you energy.
1151
00:52:58,904 --> 00:53:02,952
Speaker 2: And at that time I say I want to find again
1152
00:53:03,580 --> 00:53:05,448
Speaker 2: this kind of energy, you know.
1153
00:53:06,301 --> 00:53:09,760
Speaker 2: So I have to shop, not to cut nicely, I
1154
00:53:09,780 --> 00:53:13,129
Speaker 2: have to shop the thing, you know, whatever,
1155
00:53:13,149 --> 00:53:14,552
Speaker 2: the kiwi, whatever the thing.
1156
00:53:15,401 --> 00:53:19,531
Speaker 2: And then I say, okay, let's forget the
1157
00:53:19,591 --> 00:53:20,113
Speaker 2: blender.
1158
00:53:22,001 --> 00:53:24,926
Speaker 2: What can I use, you know, to make it normal.
1159
00:53:25,166 --> 00:53:30,274
Speaker 2: And I saw it took me a while to find a
1160
00:53:30,354 --> 00:53:35,473
Speaker 2: cardboard box, but that's a normal thing.
1161
00:53:36,276 --> 00:53:40,091
Speaker 2: A cardboard box, wow, because I don't want
1162
00:53:40,171 --> 00:53:42,400
Speaker 2: to enter with a dustbin or something.
1163
00:53:44,345 --> 00:53:46,511
Speaker 2: A dustbin has nothing to do on the stage,
1164
00:53:46,941 --> 00:53:50,809
Speaker 2: but a cardboard box can be on any stage, on
1165
00:53:51,030 --> 00:53:52,694
Speaker 2: any street, anything.
1166
00:53:53,321 --> 00:53:56,284
Speaker 2: It's a bad, it's nothing, it's not a magic
1167
00:53:56,324 --> 00:53:56,586
Speaker 2: prop.
1168
00:53:57,802 --> 00:54:01,237
Speaker 1: It sounds like a lot of the inspiration for
1169
00:54:01,297 --> 00:54:03,946
Speaker 1: your magic comes from watching other
1170
00:54:04,046 --> 00:54:05,912
Speaker 1: performers that are not mature.
1171
00:54:06,880 --> 00:54:10,650
Speaker 2: Yeah, and and and and can be singer, can be
1172
00:54:11,351 --> 00:54:16,422
Speaker 2: dancer, can be anything artistic, is is an
1173
00:54:16,522 --> 00:54:17,206
Speaker 2: inspiration.
1174
00:54:18,321 --> 00:54:20,526
Speaker 2: And then, after you have to bring your own
1175
00:54:21,247 --> 00:54:25,988
Speaker 2: craziness or knowledge of magic and make it
1176
00:54:26,200 --> 00:54:26,983
Speaker 2: make it your own.
1177
00:54:27,203 --> 00:54:28,507
Speaker 2: Yes, of course, of course.
1178
00:54:29,329 --> 00:54:31,925
Speaker 2: But you know, if you, if you see a Charlie
1179
00:54:32,025 --> 00:54:35,401
Speaker 2: Chaplin, if you see Buster Keaton, all the
1180
00:54:35,481 --> 00:54:39,472
Speaker 2: big old timer, if you see Orson Welles, you
1181
00:54:39,512 --> 00:54:42,047
Speaker 2: know, you learn, you learn a lot.
1182
00:54:42,649 --> 00:54:44,006
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's unbelievable and I think it's a
1183
00:54:44,026 --> 00:54:44,288
Speaker 1: good practice.
1184
00:54:44,308 --> 00:54:45,012
Speaker 1: You know, you learn, you learn a lot.
1185
00:54:45,032 --> 00:54:45,878
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's unbelievable and I think it's a
1186
00:54:45,898 --> 00:54:46,160
Speaker 1: good practice.
1187
00:54:46,380 --> 00:54:49,231
Speaker 1: You know, magicians often are inspired from
1188
00:54:49,291 --> 00:54:51,480
Speaker 1: each other, which is great, but it's really
1189
00:54:51,600 --> 00:54:53,751
Speaker 1: great to be inspired from things that are
1190
00:54:53,851 --> 00:54:55,620
Speaker 1: outside of the world of magic.
1191
00:54:55,781 --> 00:54:58,546
Speaker 2: I think that's the key, that's the absolute
1192
00:54:58,606 --> 00:54:58,807
Speaker 2: key.
1193
00:55:00,220 --> 00:55:01,626
Speaker 1: To get it from outside of the world of
1194
00:55:01,686 --> 00:55:02,028
Speaker 1: magic.
1195
00:55:02,900 --> 00:55:04,742
Speaker 1: One more, one more question and then we
1196
00:55:04,762 --> 00:55:07,664
Speaker 1: have some final wrap-up questions, but the
1197
00:55:08,785 --> 00:55:11,948
Speaker 1: sort of last question is about an act.
1198
00:55:12,008 --> 00:55:16,692
Speaker 1: I think that for a very long time people
1199
00:55:16,752 --> 00:55:19,054
Speaker 1: would be in like it would be the vaudeville
1200
00:55:19,154 --> 00:55:19,814
Speaker 1: era or whatever.
1201
00:55:19,874 --> 00:55:21,816
Speaker 1: So, like Johnny Thompson, for example,
1202
00:55:21,836 --> 00:55:24,138
Speaker 1: would do the same 10 minutes, he would do
1203
00:55:24,158 --> 00:55:24,979
Speaker 1: the same 10-, he would do the same 10
1204
00:55:24,999 --> 00:55:26,021
Speaker 1: minute act for his whole career.
1205
00:55:26,742 --> 00:55:29,727
Speaker 1: And I think now it's like it's like the
1206
00:55:29,787 --> 00:55:32,191
Speaker 1: life of the internet, so people are doing a
1207
00:55:32,251 --> 00:55:34,094
Speaker 1: different trick every day because they're
1208
00:55:34,134 --> 00:55:36,405
Speaker 1: posting it on the internet and I think that
1209
00:55:36,626 --> 00:55:39,996
Speaker 1: slowly in between, you know, now maybe some
1210
00:55:40,036 --> 00:55:42,082
Speaker 1: magician will have two acts or three, one
1211
00:55:42,163 --> 00:55:43,788
Speaker 1: hour shows or something, or I don't know.
1212
00:55:44,550 --> 00:55:47,640
Speaker 1: For you, what was it mostly for your career?
1213
00:55:47,800 --> 00:55:51,028
Speaker 1: Was it the same 20 minute act with the
1214
00:55:51,108 --> 00:55:53,193
Speaker 1: flowers and this and the cutting of the
1215
00:55:53,280 --> 00:55:56,033
Speaker 1: cable and the, the boxing gloves, and or
1216
00:55:56,635 --> 00:55:57,640
Speaker 1: were you, was it always changing?
1217
00:55:58,300 --> 00:56:00,406
Speaker 1: Like, did you mostly do the same six or
1218
00:56:00,466 --> 00:56:02,732
Speaker 1: seven tricks on stage or did you do
1219
00:56:02,840 --> 00:56:03,342
Speaker 1: hundreds?
1220
00:56:03,482 --> 00:56:06,120
Speaker 2: And maybe I only know of a few of them that
1221
00:56:06,160 --> 00:56:08,925
Speaker 2: made it to videos well, the thing is that
1222
00:56:09,386 --> 00:56:12,251
Speaker 2: this act, you know, I started to, I
1223
00:56:12,332 --> 00:56:15,943
Speaker 2: invented this act with a microphone, and
1224
00:56:16,024 --> 00:56:22,495
Speaker 2: all that in 1981, okay, and I did it for
1225
00:56:22,535 --> 00:56:24,518
Speaker 2: the first time in Las Vegas, in the Desert
1226
00:56:24,558 --> 00:56:28,045
Speaker 2: Magic Seminar, and I remember always
1227
00:56:28,105 --> 00:56:31,891
Speaker 2: because in the show, in the room, you had
1228
00:56:31,931 --> 00:56:34,141
Speaker 2: Siegfried and Roy, you had Ken Brook, you
1229
00:56:34,161 --> 00:56:36,806
Speaker 2: had the Gauchman, you had Slidini, you had
1230
00:56:37,347 --> 00:56:40,493
Speaker 2: and they gave me a standing ovation and so
1231
00:56:40,513 --> 00:56:41,761
Speaker 2: I was the king of the world.
1232
00:56:42,141 --> 00:56:44,003
Speaker 2: You know, I was wow, my wow, my God, that's
1233
00:56:44,043 --> 00:56:44,083
Speaker 2: it.
1234
00:56:45,104 --> 00:56:47,266
Speaker 2: And during the same convention I did my
1235
00:56:47,406 --> 00:56:48,567
Speaker 2: first lecture.
1236
00:56:50,188 --> 00:56:52,750
Speaker 2: During the convention, another standing
1237
00:56:52,810 --> 00:56:54,972
Speaker 2: ovation, so it was really wow.
1238
00:56:55,653 --> 00:56:59,957
Speaker 2: So I came back and one year after, not even
1239
00:57:00,097 --> 00:57:04,505
Speaker 2: one year after, I always wanted to walk the
1240
00:57:04,525 --> 00:57:04,806
Speaker 2: crazy horse.
1241
00:57:04,826 --> 00:57:07,716
Speaker 2: So I went there, you know, and I did my act,
1242
00:57:07,820 --> 00:57:09,527
Speaker 2: but there was nobody in the room, only the
1243
00:57:09,607 --> 00:57:13,708
Speaker 2: boss, and it was like because, you know, no,
1244
00:57:13,808 --> 00:57:15,071
Speaker 2: no reaction, of course.
1245
00:57:16,121 --> 00:57:19,181
Speaker 2: And he told me yeah, okay, it's okay, but
1246
00:57:19,321 --> 00:57:21,187
Speaker 2: it needs to cook a little bit.
1247
00:57:21,207 --> 00:57:22,731
Speaker 2: So I will give you some direction.
1248
00:57:23,000 --> 00:57:25,041
Speaker 2: You go in Italy, you will walk and say okay,
1249
00:57:25,081 --> 00:57:26,226
Speaker 2: thank you, maestro.
1250
00:57:28,403 --> 00:57:29,146
Speaker 2: I make it short.
1251
00:57:31,761 --> 00:57:35,788
Speaker 2: In 93, meet again Kevin James and we become
1252
00:57:36,313 --> 00:57:38,847
Speaker 2: very good friends for completely different
1253
00:57:38,927 --> 00:57:41,667
Speaker 2: reasons, but he's working the crazy horse
1254
00:57:41,727 --> 00:57:45,043
Speaker 2: at the time, you know, and I've done
1255
00:57:45,925 --> 00:57:49,052
Speaker 2: already my career as a magician, lecturer
1256
00:57:49,132 --> 00:57:52,146
Speaker 2: and all that and doing this act, but doing
1257
00:57:52,226 --> 00:57:55,502
Speaker 2: mostly close-up or trade shows or things
1258
00:57:55,523 --> 00:57:55,884
Speaker 2: like that.
1259
00:57:57,501 --> 00:58:01,952
Speaker 2: But he said I need to go back to Vegas.
1260
00:58:02,180 --> 00:58:04,609
Speaker 2: Why don't you do the Crazy Horse, gaetan?
1261
00:58:05,463 --> 00:58:06,126
Speaker 2: You should do it.
1262
00:58:06,280 --> 00:58:08,408
Speaker 2: You say, you know, I did an audition 15
1263
00:58:08,448 --> 00:58:08,829
Speaker 2: years ago.
1264
00:58:10,642 --> 00:58:14,465
Speaker 2: He said well, okay, no, no, now show me
1265
00:58:14,526 --> 00:58:14,907
Speaker 2: something.
1266
00:58:15,301 --> 00:58:16,506
Speaker 2: You have nothing to show.
1267
00:58:16,747 --> 00:58:21,029
Speaker 2: Yes, I was just finishing Chan, tata Chan
1268
00:58:21,069 --> 00:58:22,913
Speaker 2: with Tamaris, 26 shows.
1269
00:58:23,964 --> 00:58:27,507
Speaker 2: So I cut everything I put together, I give
1270
00:58:27,748 --> 00:58:29,226
Speaker 2: to Kevin the tape.
1271
00:58:30,773 --> 00:58:32,991
Speaker 2: Two days after I have a phone call.
1272
00:58:33,414 --> 00:58:35,687
Speaker 2: I will always remember hello, mr Bernadette,
1273
00:58:36,383 --> 00:58:36,865
Speaker 2: can we meet?
1274
00:58:38,064 --> 00:58:41,215
Speaker 2: Wow, oh my god, yes, when next week, boom
1275
00:58:41,397 --> 00:58:41,640
Speaker 2: 12?
1276
00:58:42,483 --> 00:58:45,565
Speaker 2: Ok, and I go and I see the man he he
1277
00:58:45,605 --> 00:58:48,621
Speaker 2: doesn't remember me, of course and he said
1278
00:58:48,701 --> 00:58:51,248
Speaker 2: can you do the trick with the two Chinese
1279
00:58:51,268 --> 00:58:52,029
Speaker 2: sticks?
1280
00:58:52,089 --> 00:58:54,021
Speaker 2: Whatever, I've never seen this, it's very
1281
00:58:54,081 --> 00:58:54,362
Speaker 2: new.
1282
00:58:54,582 --> 00:58:57,389
Speaker 2: Okay, and the trick with the microphone and
1283
00:58:57,429 --> 00:58:57,890
Speaker 2: the shoe?
1284
00:58:57,930 --> 00:59:00,680
Speaker 2: At the end, yes, okay.
1285
00:59:01,301 --> 00:59:03,363
Speaker 2: And I said but you know, the problem is
1286
00:59:03,383 --> 00:59:05,325
Speaker 2: that I need to talk.
1287
00:59:05,405 --> 00:59:06,105
Speaker 2: I can't do it.
1288
00:59:06,165 --> 00:59:08,227
Speaker 2: Silent Crazy horse, you don't talk.
1289
00:59:09,028 --> 00:59:12,351
Speaker 2: And he said but what I saw was in Spanish.
1290
00:59:12,371 --> 00:59:14,933
Speaker 2: I said yes, because it was for Spanish TV.
1291
00:59:14,993 --> 00:59:17,516
Speaker 2: But he said I don't care, it's like your
1292
00:59:17,576 --> 00:59:19,337
Speaker 2: music, can you do it in Spanish?
1293
00:59:27,940 --> 00:59:28,942
Speaker 2: Yes, sir, and I did it and, believe it or
1294
00:59:28,982 --> 00:59:30,004
Speaker 2: not, but for 15 years I did the act in
1295
00:59:30,024 --> 00:59:31,206
Speaker 2: spanish, with two words of english and not
1296
00:59:31,266 --> 00:59:32,809
Speaker 2: one word in french, you know.
1297
00:59:34,031 --> 00:59:38,462
Speaker 2: And when I started, I mean kevin, get, get
1298
00:59:38,483 --> 00:59:39,103
Speaker 2: me the gig.
1299
00:59:39,164 --> 00:59:40,526
Speaker 2: There's the first thing, you know.
1300
00:59:40,606 --> 00:59:44,212
Speaker 2: But bardo said okay, I want to work with
1301
00:59:44,292 --> 00:59:47,622
Speaker 2: you, but I'm, you know, not before next
1302
00:59:47,662 --> 00:59:47,862
Speaker 2: year.
1303
00:59:48,704 --> 00:59:51,349
Speaker 2: And Kevin had to go back to Vegas for
1304
00:59:51,429 --> 00:59:55,723
Speaker 2: personal family problem and I had also
1305
00:59:55,903 --> 00:59:56,224
Speaker 2: problem.
1306
00:59:56,244 --> 00:59:58,269
Speaker 2: He said can you fill for me Because I have
1307
00:59:58,449 --> 00:59:59,352
Speaker 2: one year assignment?
1308
00:59:59,372 --> 01:00:01,504
Speaker 2: I said yes, of course, if he's okay.
1309
01:00:02,085 --> 01:00:04,351
Speaker 2: And I started right away, you know, Wow,
1310
01:00:10,800 --> 01:00:11,682
Speaker 2: and at first I was thinking I will do three
1311
01:00:11,702 --> 01:00:12,304
Speaker 2: months and I will be bored.
1312
01:00:12,324 --> 01:00:14,709
Speaker 2: I did 15 years there, you know, and not
1313
01:00:14,789 --> 01:00:16,453
Speaker 2: changing one thing.
1314
01:00:17,600 --> 01:00:21,509
Speaker 2: Because when you walk the crazy road, first,
1315
01:00:21,810 --> 01:00:24,227
Speaker 2: you don't do 20 minutes, you do nine
1316
01:00:24,287 --> 01:00:24,650
Speaker 2: minutes.
1317
01:00:24,670 --> 01:00:26,761
Speaker 2: You do nine minutes, wow, nine minutes,
1318
01:00:27,082 --> 01:00:31,012
Speaker 2: twice a night and three times on the
1319
01:00:31,052 --> 01:00:31,533
Speaker 2: weekends.
1320
01:00:32,940 --> 01:00:37,610
Speaker 2: And normally you do three months or four
1321
01:00:37,670 --> 01:00:39,822
Speaker 2: months, no more than four months, but it's
1322
01:00:40,143 --> 01:00:41,548
Speaker 2: every day boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.
1323
01:00:42,522 --> 01:00:45,217
Speaker 2: And then two months off and so on and so on,
1324
01:00:46,320 --> 01:00:49,532
Speaker 2: and you do like nine months first and a
1325
01:00:49,612 --> 01:00:52,842
Speaker 2: year, and then six months after we set
1326
01:00:52,863 --> 01:00:55,850
Speaker 2: around six months a year, you know, and
1327
01:00:55,951 --> 01:00:56,512
Speaker 2: that was it.
1328
01:00:56,600 --> 01:01:02,813
Speaker 2: But I never, I've never, been bored doing
1329
01:01:02,893 --> 01:01:03,194
Speaker 2: that.
1330
01:01:03,841 --> 01:01:04,946
Speaker 2: It was everything.
1331
01:01:06,140 --> 01:01:08,468
Speaker 2: It was like if you do it for the first time
1332
01:01:08,708 --> 01:01:12,887
Speaker 2: every night Now I have a lot of friends, or
1333
01:01:13,048 --> 01:01:15,864
Speaker 2: sometimes I think to my son or to my wife
1334
01:01:15,964 --> 01:01:18,945
Speaker 2: or to my whatever, and I say, okay, this
1335
01:01:19,025 --> 01:01:19,648
Speaker 2: one is for you.
1336
01:01:20,341 --> 01:01:22,929
Speaker 2: And as soon as I'm on stage, boom, boom.
1337
01:01:23,280 --> 01:01:27,049
Speaker 2: I think to the guy or to the audience and I
1338
01:01:27,089 --> 01:01:30,162
Speaker 2: do it, and I've never been bored.
1339
01:01:30,944 --> 01:01:34,730
Speaker 2: Wow, but you walk, you walk seconds instead
1340
01:01:34,770 --> 01:01:36,353
Speaker 2: to walk a new trick.
1341
01:01:36,573 --> 01:01:39,683
Speaker 2: You can't do a new trick, right, but you
1342
01:01:39,723 --> 01:01:40,344
Speaker 2: can walk.
1343
01:01:40,685 --> 01:01:43,089
Speaker 2: You know, it's like punishing whatever.
1344
01:01:43,129 --> 01:01:46,254
Speaker 1: Yeah wow, so that must have been.
1345
01:01:46,274 --> 01:01:48,323
Speaker 1: I don't think I even knew that you worked
1346
01:01:48,383 --> 01:01:51,068
Speaker 1: for 15 years at the crazy horse but you
1347
01:01:51,088 --> 01:01:54,381
Speaker 1: know it was not full 15 years I know, but
1348
01:01:54,461 --> 01:01:57,225
Speaker 1: nine months a year, a lot like, yeah, nine
1349
01:01:57,285 --> 01:01:58,947
Speaker 1: months and then six months, yeah.
1350
01:01:59,107 --> 01:02:04,174
Speaker 1: So that must have been not only amazing to
1351
01:02:04,294 --> 01:02:06,902
Speaker 1: perform and sharpen the act, but also
1352
01:02:07,523 --> 01:02:09,808
Speaker 1: really refreshing that you sort of have
1353
01:02:09,868 --> 01:02:12,694
Speaker 1: your daytime available to play.
1354
01:02:13,420 --> 01:02:15,503
Speaker 1: You know, you have your daytime available
1355
01:02:15,563 --> 01:02:18,608
Speaker 1: to work on magic and create and play and
1356
01:02:18,648 --> 01:02:19,108
Speaker 1: that's fantastic.
1357
01:02:19,128 --> 01:02:21,652
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, no, no, that was the thing?
1358
01:02:21,672 --> 01:02:22,533
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, but you know, I replaced in fact
1359
01:02:22,553 --> 01:02:22,794
Speaker 2: Tom Moulika.
1360
01:02:22,814 --> 01:02:23,174
Speaker 2: What an amazing.
1361
01:02:23,194 --> 01:02:24,596
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, no, that was the thing.
1362
01:02:24,616 --> 01:02:27,029
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, but you know, you know I replaced
1363
01:02:27,130 --> 01:02:28,260
Speaker 2: in fact Tom Mulica.
1364
01:02:30,195 --> 01:02:33,247
Speaker 2: Tom Mulica left the Crazy Horse but I saw
1365
01:02:33,308 --> 01:02:35,420
Speaker 2: Tom, he did the Crazy Horse.
1366
01:02:35,480 --> 01:02:38,866
Speaker 2: He did three years because he wanted to to
1367
01:02:38,967 --> 01:02:42,570
Speaker 2: raise money to open his, his pool bar in
1368
01:02:42,610 --> 01:02:43,236
Speaker 2: Las Vegas.
1369
01:02:43,458 --> 01:02:46,629
Speaker 2: Yeah, and he did, but he had not a really
1370
01:02:46,689 --> 01:02:47,131
Speaker 2: good time.
1371
01:02:47,280 --> 01:02:51,704
Speaker 2: But I saw the act when he started and I
1372
01:02:51,765 --> 01:02:56,046
Speaker 2: told Tom if you want to, I can have you
1373
01:02:56,086 --> 01:02:58,432
Speaker 2: visit Paris and we can manage.
1374
01:02:58,560 --> 01:03:02,652
Speaker 2: Yes, but you know, nearly it was treasures,
1375
01:03:03,060 --> 01:03:06,261
Speaker 2: small flat having cheese and dinner and
1376
01:03:06,281 --> 01:03:09,799
Speaker 2: that's it and back and forth, and every
1377
01:03:10,262 --> 01:03:14,148
Speaker 2: three months I was going to spend one night
1378
01:03:14,188 --> 01:03:18,883
Speaker 2: with them and in fact I saw the evolution
1379
01:03:19,083 --> 01:03:21,983
Speaker 2: in three years of crazy horse, you, your
1380
01:03:22,144 --> 01:03:23,168
Speaker 2: act rocket like.
1381
01:03:24,443 --> 01:03:27,571
Speaker 2: His act went from very good to wow.
1382
01:03:28,600 --> 01:03:32,607
Speaker 1: Yeah, unbelievable, what an amazing gig
1383
01:03:32,647 --> 01:03:33,128
Speaker 1: that you got.
1384
01:03:33,148 --> 01:03:36,954
Speaker 1: An amazing story and really helpful for us
1385
01:03:37,320 --> 01:03:40,205
Speaker 1: listening to better understand how to
1386
01:03:40,305 --> 01:03:43,050
Speaker 1: create and how to make and how to, you know,
1387
01:03:43,110 --> 01:03:44,793
Speaker 1: get inspired from other artists.
1388
01:03:44,833 --> 01:03:45,935
Speaker 1: I think it's fantastic.
1389
01:03:46,580 --> 01:03:48,689
Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, definitely, definitely.
1390
01:03:49,201 --> 01:03:51,368
Speaker 1: We are getting towards the end of the
1391
01:03:51,409 --> 01:03:51,970
Speaker 1: podcast.
1392
01:03:52,060 --> 01:03:53,785
Speaker 1: There's three final questions.
1393
01:03:53,985 --> 01:03:56,672
Speaker 1: The first is the endless chain.
1394
01:03:56,921 --> 01:03:59,970
Speaker 1: So in order to keep the podcast going on
1395
01:04:00,030 --> 01:04:02,970
Speaker 1: forever, each magician is asked to
1396
01:04:03,050 --> 01:04:04,878
Speaker 1: recommend another magician that would be
1397
01:04:04,979 --> 01:04:07,488
Speaker 1: really good for this type of conversation.
1398
01:04:08,029 --> 01:04:10,478
Speaker 1: So who is someone who you think would be
1399
01:04:10,618 --> 01:04:12,263
Speaker 1: really really good for this type of
1400
01:04:12,323 --> 01:04:15,310
Speaker 1: conversation that A I have not interviewed
1401
01:04:15,350 --> 01:04:17,762
Speaker 1: already, maybe you don't know and B that
1402
01:04:17,842 --> 01:04:19,546
Speaker 1: you can help put us in contact?
1403
01:04:20,107 --> 01:04:22,773
Speaker 2: Oh, I'm sure you have him on your list, but
1404
01:04:23,242 --> 01:04:25,348
Speaker 2: I wanted to mention his name many times,
1405
01:04:25,429 --> 01:04:28,275
Speaker 2: especially because of George Carl, but
1406
01:04:28,315 --> 01:04:31,187
Speaker 2: Charlie Fry oh, that's a great one, and
1407
01:04:31,227 --> 01:04:32,270
Speaker 2: I've never interviewed him.
1408
01:04:32,585 --> 01:04:35,732
Speaker 2: That's fantastic you know, charlie Fry was
1409
01:04:35,973 --> 01:04:38,683
Speaker 2: very, very friend with George Carl and in
1410
01:04:38,764 --> 01:04:41,790
Speaker 2: fact George Carl died in his arm, in fact
1411
01:04:41,931 --> 01:04:43,080
Speaker 2: in the hospital, oh my gosh.
1412
01:04:44,283 --> 01:04:48,255
Speaker 2: And Charlie has all the costume and really
1413
01:04:48,676 --> 01:04:49,860
Speaker 2: took a lot of inspiration.
1414
01:04:50,040 --> 01:04:51,925
Speaker 2: I mean, we are both.
1415
01:04:52,767 --> 01:04:55,862
Speaker 2: As soon as we talk about George, we are in
1416
01:04:55,922 --> 01:04:59,392
Speaker 2: tears and in happiness at the same time,
1417
01:04:59,460 --> 01:05:02,550
Speaker 2: because he knew him very, very well.
1418
01:05:02,780 --> 01:05:04,608
Speaker 2: I only saw him a few times.
1419
01:05:05,421 --> 01:05:06,286
Speaker 1: That's a great one.
1420
01:05:06,580 --> 01:05:09,770
Speaker 1: My next question is about modern magic.
1421
01:05:09,880 --> 01:05:11,707
Speaker 1: You know you've seen magic change in many
1422
01:05:11,767 --> 01:05:15,208
Speaker 1: ways, from smelling old books to now PDFs
1423
01:05:15,469 --> 01:05:16,632
Speaker 1: and everything in between.
1424
01:05:17,200 --> 01:05:19,709
Speaker 1: What's one thing you like about magic right
1425
01:05:19,789 --> 01:05:21,705
Speaker 1: now and what's one thing you don't like
1426
01:05:21,745 --> 01:05:22,809
Speaker 1: about magic right now?
1427
01:05:23,600 --> 01:05:27,364
Speaker 2: You know, I'm a little bit not afraid,
1428
01:05:27,444 --> 01:05:30,409
Speaker 2: because you you have not to be afraid of a
1429
01:05:30,529 --> 01:05:33,674
Speaker 2: new, new thing on the on the market.
1430
01:05:33,734 --> 01:05:37,143
Speaker 2: But of course there is new, new kind of
1431
01:05:37,303 --> 01:05:41,648
Speaker 2: magic, like the instagram magic or t magic,
1432
01:05:42,309 --> 01:05:44,851
Speaker 2: this, this sometimes.
1433
01:05:46,193 --> 01:05:48,295
Speaker 2: I watch a lot of this because sometimes you
1434
01:05:48,315 --> 01:05:53,667
Speaker 2: have beautiful ideas, most of them some
1435
01:05:54,108 --> 01:05:55,090
Speaker 2: very good ideas.
1436
01:05:55,231 --> 01:05:56,553
Speaker 2: They don't have to explain.
1437
01:05:56,700 --> 01:05:58,324
Speaker 2: I don't know why they want to explain
1438
01:05:58,384 --> 01:06:01,251
Speaker 2: everything, but it's true also that people
1439
01:06:01,491 --> 01:06:05,726
Speaker 2: forget that the only thing is that more and
1440
01:06:05,786 --> 01:06:08,032
Speaker 2: more you have people doing this kind of
1441
01:06:08,112 --> 01:06:10,767
Speaker 2: thing where they don't have an audience or
1442
01:06:10,787 --> 01:06:13,405
Speaker 2: a real audience, you know, and it changes
1443
01:06:13,425 --> 01:06:16,307
Speaker 2: the world, because for me, my greatest
1444
01:06:16,407 --> 01:06:19,323
Speaker 2: pleasure is to work for people, not for the
1445
01:06:19,343 --> 01:06:19,685
Speaker 2: screen.
1446
01:06:20,540 --> 01:06:25,403
Speaker 2: So this is a thing okay, maybe you can make
1447
01:06:25,443 --> 01:06:27,885
Speaker 2: a lot of money doing that and become a.
1448
01:06:27,905 --> 01:06:30,866
Speaker 2: These people one day will come to a real
1449
01:06:30,886 --> 01:06:31,167
Speaker 2: show.
1450
01:06:51,066 --> 01:06:52,703
Speaker 2: That's great, because there is nothing
1451
01:06:52,783 --> 01:06:55,770
Speaker 2: better than to do close-up for a few
1452
01:06:55,810 --> 01:06:59,105
Speaker 2: friends, but real close-up, whatever, and
1453
01:06:59,205 --> 01:07:01,852
Speaker 2: not just for the camera angle or whatever.
1454
01:07:02,561 --> 01:07:05,169
Speaker 1: And what's one thing you like about magic
1455
01:07:05,209 --> 01:07:05,611
Speaker 1: right now?
1456
01:07:06,962 --> 01:07:09,467
Speaker 2: always discovering new things, and
1457
01:07:09,487 --> 01:07:10,890
Speaker 2: especially in the old books.
1458
01:07:10,930 --> 01:07:13,081
Speaker 2: You know, when I found a new old book
1459
01:07:13,101 --> 01:07:17,168
Speaker 2: that's oh my god, or a new, crazy, crazy
1460
01:07:17,209 --> 01:07:18,010
Speaker 2: man of magic.
1461
01:07:18,050 --> 01:07:19,112
Speaker 2: You know many I'm.
1462
01:07:19,272 --> 01:07:21,906
Speaker 2: I'm thinking to write a book about the
1463
01:07:22,147 --> 01:07:26,063
Speaker 2: different crazy guys of magic because every
1464
01:07:26,103 --> 01:07:28,845
Speaker 2: country they have at least one or two or
1465
01:07:28,905 --> 01:07:29,889
Speaker 2: three, but not so many.
1466
01:07:31,521 --> 01:07:33,226
Speaker 2: Most of the people they don't know these
1467
01:07:33,286 --> 01:07:33,627
Speaker 2: guys.
1468
01:07:33,687 --> 01:07:39,449
Speaker 2: But I start to have a pretty good list of
1469
01:07:39,721 --> 01:07:40,986
Speaker 2: unknown, unknown.
1470
01:07:41,742 --> 01:07:42,226
Speaker 1: I like it.
1471
01:07:42,287 --> 01:07:43,720
Speaker 1: The crazy guys of magic.
1472
01:07:44,001 --> 01:07:45,690
Speaker 1: I really like it.
1473
01:07:45,810 --> 01:07:48,782
Speaker 1: The last question is plugs where can people
1474
01:07:48,902 --> 01:07:49,524
Speaker 1: find you?
1475
01:07:49,644 --> 01:07:51,468
Speaker 1: Where can people find your stuff, your
1476
01:07:51,568 --> 01:07:54,501
Speaker 1: books, your projects, maybe see you perform?
1477
01:07:54,641 --> 01:07:55,963
Speaker 1: Where can they see?
1478
01:07:56,944 --> 01:07:59,929
Speaker 2: the truth is, right now you don't find them
1479
01:08:00,029 --> 01:08:04,455
Speaker 2: very easily, but I'm revamping all that.
1480
01:08:04,820 --> 01:08:09,151
Speaker 2: So in the next six months I will tell you.
1481
01:08:09,231 --> 01:08:10,882
Speaker 2: At the time I will call you and say now
1482
01:08:10,942 --> 01:08:11,584
Speaker 2: it's ready.
1483
01:08:11,624 --> 01:08:16,514
Speaker 2: You know, but I have some new products on
1484
01:08:16,534 --> 01:08:19,568
Speaker 2: the way and I can tell you more now.
1485
01:08:19,748 --> 01:08:23,120
Speaker 2: But yes, yes, well, I'm very excited, Tax
1486
01:08:23,050 --> 01:08:23,840
Speaker 2: flat and play big Good good.
1487
01:08:23,770 --> 01:08:24,661
Speaker 1: Well, I'm very excited, tax flat and play
1488
01:08:24,590 --> 01:08:26,025
Speaker 1: big Good good.
1489
01:08:26,240 --> 01:08:28,302
Speaker 1: Well, I'm very excited, gaetan.
1490
01:08:28,522 --> 01:08:29,988
Speaker 1: Thank you so so much for doing this.
1491
01:08:30,100 --> 01:08:31,346
Speaker 1: This was an absolute pleasure.
1492
01:08:31,980 --> 01:08:34,862
Speaker 1: Amazing to hear about your history and how
1493
01:08:34,902 --> 01:08:37,270
Speaker 1: you think about this and better understand.
1494
01:08:37,340 --> 01:08:40,046
Speaker 2: I'm so sorry for my broken English, but you
1495
01:08:40,086 --> 01:08:42,471
Speaker 2: know it was perfect Okay.
1496
01:08:43,112 --> 01:08:43,874
Speaker 1: Totally perfect.
1497
01:08:43,940 --> 01:08:45,266
Speaker 1: So thank you so much for being here.
1498
01:08:45,701 --> 01:08:48,228
Speaker 1: Thank you to everybody for listening and
1499
01:08:48,289 --> 01:08:48,891
Speaker 1: being with us.
1500
01:08:49,000 --> 01:08:51,466
Speaker 1: This was a blast and we will see you all
1501
01:08:51,687 --> 01:08:52,549
Speaker 1: next Thursday.
1502
01:08:53,692 --> 01:08:54,012
Speaker 1: See you.
1503
01:09:03,782 --> 01:09:04,505
Speaker 1: Well, there you have it.
1504
01:09:04,641 --> 01:09:06,303
Speaker 1: I hope you liked the episode and I hope, of
1505
01:09:06,343 --> 01:09:07,829
Speaker 1: course, that you learned something.
1506
01:09:08,240 --> 01:09:10,527
Speaker 1: Now is your chance to tell a friend and
1507
01:09:10,587 --> 01:09:11,791
Speaker 1: spread the word.
1508
01:09:12,180 --> 01:09:13,506
Speaker 1: The podcast is back.
1509
01:09:13,860 --> 01:09:14,242
Speaker 1: That's right.
1510
01:09:14,322 --> 01:09:15,842
Speaker 1: Discourse in Magic, your favorite magic
1511
01:09:15,862 --> 01:09:17,588
Speaker 1: podcast, I hope I guess.
1512
01:09:17,688 --> 01:09:18,410
Speaker 1: I don't know, I don't care.
1513
01:09:18,621 --> 01:09:20,580
Speaker 1: It's back and I'm glad that you're here.
1514
01:09:20,700 --> 01:09:22,026
Speaker 1: So please tell a friend.
1515
01:09:22,200 --> 01:09:23,444
Speaker 1: It would mean the world.
1516
01:09:23,765 --> 01:09:25,029
Speaker 1: I don't care where you tell them, I don't
1517
01:09:25,049 --> 01:09:26,512
Speaker 1: care how you tell them, but if you tell at
1518
01:09:26,572 --> 01:09:28,654
Speaker 1: least one magician that you know that this
1519
01:09:28,714 --> 01:09:31,056
Speaker 1: podcast is back, I would appreciate it so
1520
01:09:31,096 --> 01:09:33,064
Speaker 1: so much and it would mean the world.
1521
01:09:33,425 --> 01:09:34,628
Speaker 1: Hope you're doing well, hope you're doing
1522
01:09:34,669 --> 01:09:35,030
Speaker 1: amazing.
1523
01:09:35,110 --> 01:09:36,584
Speaker 1: Thanks for being here and I will see you
1524
01:09:36,805 --> 01:09:38,454
Speaker 1: next Thursday, ciao.
00:00:00,541 --> 00:00:02,204
Speaker 1: Hello, my friends, and welcome to a brand
2
00:00:02,225 --> 00:00:04,109
Speaker 1: new episode of Discourse in Magic with
3
00:00:04,570 --> 00:00:05,893
Speaker 1: Gaetan Bloom.
4
00:00:06,180 --> 00:00:09,431
Speaker 1: Gaetan Bloom is an incredible magician.
5
00:00:09,600 --> 00:00:11,866
Speaker 1: Not only is his magic fantastic, but he is
6
00:00:11,926 --> 00:00:14,232
Speaker 1: a creator of the likes that you have never
7
00:00:14,332 --> 00:00:14,572
Speaker 1: seen.
8
00:00:14,700 --> 00:00:16,811
Speaker 1: If you have ever seen his books, if you've
9
00:00:16,852 --> 00:00:18,340
Speaker 1: ever read his books, if you've ever bought
10
00:00:18,520 --> 00:00:20,484
Speaker 1: any of his magic, you'll realize that not
11
00:00:20,585 --> 00:00:24,052
Speaker 1: only is it strong, but also the methods are
12
00:00:24,293 --> 00:00:24,854
Speaker 1: brilliant.
13
00:00:26,280 --> 00:00:27,182
Speaker 1: He has come up with so much incredible
14
00:00:27,202 --> 00:00:28,926
Speaker 1: magic and he is such an incredible
15
00:00:28,986 --> 00:00:29,427
Speaker 1: performer.
16
00:00:29,507 --> 00:00:32,140
Speaker 1: And his story is even cooler, and in this
17
00:00:32,200 --> 00:00:35,928
Speaker 1: episode, we learn about how he is so gosh
18
00:00:35,988 --> 00:00:38,954
Speaker 1: darn creative and how you can be creative
19
00:00:39,014 --> 00:00:39,174
Speaker 1: too.
20
00:00:39,300 --> 00:00:41,344
Speaker 1: He talks about how he comes up with ideas,
21
00:00:41,745 --> 00:00:44,189
Speaker 1: where he gets his ideas, how he creates,
22
00:00:44,289 --> 00:00:47,074
Speaker 1: how he makes what his workshop looks like,
23
00:00:47,200 --> 00:00:50,041
Speaker 1: how he gets inspiration and his story as to
24
00:00:50,121 --> 00:00:53,231
Speaker 1: how he became the legend that he is today.
25
00:00:53,680 --> 00:00:55,728
Speaker 1: You are gonna learn so much from Gaetan
26
00:00:55,768 --> 00:00:55,989
Speaker 1: Bloom.
27
00:00:56,200 --> 00:00:58,881
Speaker 1: This was a man on my list for years, and I
28
00:00:58,941 --> 00:01:02,001
Speaker 1: am grateful that he not only showed up for
29
00:01:02,021 --> 00:01:04,173
Speaker 1: an amazing interview, but also delivered
30
00:01:04,515 --> 00:01:06,082
Speaker 1: something that I will never forget for the
31
00:01:06,122 --> 00:01:08,610
Speaker 1: rest of my life, and you won't either.
32
00:01:08,960 --> 00:01:11,607
Speaker 1: So please enjoy an incredible episode with
33
00:01:11,647 --> 00:01:14,233
Speaker 1: the one and only Gaetan Bloom.
34
00:01:24,481 --> 00:01:26,266
Speaker 1: Hello, my friends, and welcome to a brand
35
00:01:26,286 --> 00:01:27,871
Speaker 1: new episode of Discourse in Magic.
36
00:01:28,020 --> 00:01:30,265
Speaker 1: I am here with the one and only Gaetan
37
00:01:30,426 --> 00:01:31,007
Speaker 1: Bloom.
38
00:01:31,127 --> 00:01:31,668
Speaker 1: How are you?
39
00:01:32,210 --> 00:01:33,693
Speaker 1: I'm fine, jonah, I am fine.
40
00:01:34,280 --> 00:01:36,966
Speaker 1: I am so excited to chat with you about
41
00:01:37,046 --> 00:01:39,892
Speaker 1: magic and creativity and inventing and so
42
00:01:39,952 --> 00:01:42,300
Speaker 1: many parts of magic.
43
00:01:42,641 --> 00:01:45,127
Speaker 1: I've loved your stuff for the longest time
44
00:01:45,367 --> 00:01:47,633
Speaker 1: and really excited to get into it.
45
00:01:48,240 --> 00:01:51,851
Speaker 1: Let's start at the very, very beginning,
46
00:01:51,912 --> 00:01:54,219
Speaker 1: which is how did you get started in magic?
47
00:01:54,259 --> 00:01:55,221
Speaker 1: How did magic find you?
48
00:01:56,562 --> 00:01:59,546
Speaker 2: Well, you know, like many, many other
49
00:01:59,646 --> 00:02:02,750
Speaker 2: friends, you know, with the magic kit set,
50
00:02:03,791 --> 00:02:05,814
Speaker 2: and I was very disappointed.
51
00:02:05,954 --> 00:02:08,843
Speaker 2: First because, you know, I found, oh my God,
52
00:02:08,983 --> 00:02:09,747
Speaker 2: is that magic?
53
00:02:09,900 --> 00:02:12,628
Speaker 2: You know, it's just a flap, a black flap in
54
00:02:12,708 --> 00:02:13,631
Speaker 2: a cardboard box.
55
00:02:15,263 --> 00:02:16,889
Speaker 2: So I was really, oh, okay.
56
00:02:18,202 --> 00:02:20,809
Speaker 2: And then I saw, in fact, a magician in a
57
00:02:20,869 --> 00:02:21,390
Speaker 2: hotel.
58
00:02:21,430 --> 00:02:23,704
Speaker 2: I was very young, I was like eight years
59
00:02:23,905 --> 00:02:29,928
Speaker 2: old and on holiday, and I saw a small
60
00:02:29,988 --> 00:02:32,881
Speaker 2: poster, you know, saying tonight, the big
61
00:02:32,922 --> 00:02:35,370
Speaker 2: magician, blah blah, blah, in this hotel.
62
00:02:36,241 --> 00:02:38,249
Speaker 2: He was acting in the hotel.
63
00:02:38,460 --> 00:02:43,133
Speaker 2: So I went with my mother, you know, and wow,
64
00:02:43,260 --> 00:02:45,366
Speaker 2: and it was a full show, one hour and a half
65
00:02:45,446 --> 00:02:46,188
Speaker 2: show, you know.
66
00:02:46,328 --> 00:02:48,963
Speaker 2: And I was so happy to see that and I said I
67
00:02:49,023 --> 00:02:50,828
Speaker 2: want to do that, that's what I want to do,
68
00:02:50,888 --> 00:02:52,252
Speaker 2: that's it, that's it period.
69
00:02:53,040 --> 00:02:56,266
Speaker 2: And yeah, in fact the guy did three nights
70
00:02:56,387 --> 00:02:59,532
Speaker 2: because in the village was three different
71
00:02:59,593 --> 00:03:01,182
Speaker 2: hotels, you know, big one.
72
00:03:01,623 --> 00:03:04,391
Speaker 2: So he did the three of them and I went to
73
00:03:04,572 --> 00:03:05,154
Speaker 2: each of them.
74
00:03:05,776 --> 00:03:07,962
Speaker 2: I took my mother, you know, say I want to
75
00:03:08,022 --> 00:03:09,625
Speaker 2: see again, I want to see again.
76
00:03:10,266 --> 00:03:13,713
Speaker 2: And really I started when I saw this guy.
77
00:03:13,913 --> 00:03:17,423
Speaker 2: He was not great, he was okay, he was okay,
78
00:03:17,523 --> 00:03:20,406
Speaker 2: but he was doing a full night show, you
79
00:03:20,446 --> 00:03:20,606
Speaker 2: know.
80
00:03:21,768 --> 00:03:25,411
Speaker 2: And you know, at that time it was in the
81
00:03:26,252 --> 00:03:30,156
Speaker 2: 60s, something like that so he had just
82
00:03:30,256 --> 00:03:34,106
Speaker 2: like a threefold screen to to hide himself,
83
00:03:34,166 --> 00:03:34,467
Speaker 2: you know.
84
00:03:34,868 --> 00:03:37,192
Speaker 2: Yeah, and he had a small tapas.
85
00:03:37,252 --> 00:03:41,586
Speaker 2: You know like to put records, classical
86
00:03:41,666 --> 00:03:43,589
Speaker 2: music and all that, you know.
87
00:03:44,571 --> 00:03:46,514
Speaker 2: And and then he said, and in the second
88
00:03:46,574 --> 00:03:50,189
Speaker 2: part you will see the fakir, so-and-so.
89
00:03:50,460 --> 00:03:52,247
Speaker 2: I said, ah, so everybody was waiting for
90
00:03:52,267 --> 00:03:55,027
Speaker 2: the fakir, you know, to do very oriental
91
00:03:55,088 --> 00:03:55,469
Speaker 2: magic.
92
00:03:56,381 --> 00:03:59,883
Speaker 2: And then he went behind the screen and you
93
00:03:59,903 --> 00:04:03,452
Speaker 2: hear the music different, you know.
94
00:04:03,560 --> 00:04:06,109
Speaker 2: And then he came back with a outfit.
95
00:04:06,180 --> 00:04:08,208
Speaker 2: He had just something on his head, you know,
96
00:04:08,360 --> 00:04:10,569
Speaker 2: and he was doing the knife through the arm,
97
00:04:10,720 --> 00:04:13,765
Speaker 2: the needle swallowing, but he was just
98
00:04:13,926 --> 00:04:14,287
Speaker 2: again.
99
00:04:14,367 --> 00:04:16,924
Speaker 2: Of course it was him, but it was such a
100
00:04:17,044 --> 00:04:20,202
Speaker 2: funny thing to see this old man he was an
101
00:04:20,342 --> 00:04:23,504
Speaker 2: old man by the time, you know just changing
102
00:04:23,684 --> 00:04:26,672
Speaker 2: himself, removing the tuxedo and the thing
103
00:04:26,712 --> 00:04:30,787
Speaker 2: to put the indian turban so what?
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Speaker 1: where did it go for you from there?
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Speaker 1: So obviously you said, you were like eight
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Speaker 1: or nine and you saw magic.
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Speaker 2: And then, and then, what you know, did you
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Speaker 2: find magic stores, magicians from this show
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Speaker 2: I I received because there was was like a
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Speaker 2: small competition on the third day.
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Speaker 2: I knew all the questions, all the answers,
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Speaker 2: so I won a special deck of cards and this
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Speaker 2: deck of cards was from Mayette.
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Speaker 2: I didn't know Mayette, but it was from
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Speaker 2: Mayette.
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Speaker 2: And then my mother tried to find where was
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Speaker 2: this Mayette shop, you know, in Paris.
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Speaker 2: We knew it was and eventually we found it.
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Speaker 2: And then it was wow, my God, I just
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Speaker 2: discovered.
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Speaker 2: You know, mayette at the time was the only
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Speaker 2: magic shop in Paris.
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Speaker 2: Wow, and very old magic shop in Paris.
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Speaker 2: Wow, and very old magic shop.
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Speaker 2: Now it's owned by Dominique de Vivier, but
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Speaker 2: at the time it was Mr Mayette, still the
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Speaker 2: owner.
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Speaker 2: And for me to discover this shop was like
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Speaker 2: Harry Potter, you know, when he enters the
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Speaker 2: wall, you know, wow, was a shop made for us,
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Speaker 2: you know.
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Speaker 2: So it was the a start.
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Speaker 1: So you know, I know you said that when you
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Speaker 1: saw the show you were like this is the only.
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Speaker 1: This is what I want to do with my life.
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Speaker 1: Did you end up doing anything else?
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Speaker 1: Did you end up doing like, or did you go to
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Speaker 1: school?
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Speaker 1: Did you go, or you just this was it magic.
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Speaker 1: I went to school, I went to school.
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Speaker 2: I went to school.
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Speaker 2: The thing is that I wanted to do that, you
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Speaker 2: know, and my mother, my parents, were
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Speaker 2: working for the government nothing funny,
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Speaker 2: nothing fancy and my mother's hero was a
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Speaker 2: lawyer, a big lawyer, advocate, you know,
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Speaker 2: very well known, and I found in the
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Speaker 2: newspaper that his real passion was to do
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Speaker 2: magic.
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Speaker 2: So starting with that, you know, it was
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Speaker 2: easy because I told my mother you see, this
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Speaker 2: guy is your big hero, but he loves to do
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Speaker 2: magic.
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Speaker 2: Okay, so from that moment, magic was a
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Speaker 2: carrot.
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Speaker 2: So, if you know, if I had good notes at the
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Speaker 2: school, it was okay, I could have visit to
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Speaker 2: the shop, you know.
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Speaker 1: So a couple of questions about sort of
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Speaker 1: where it goes from here.
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Speaker 1: The first is I'm always very interested in
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Speaker 1: the business and the economics of magic,
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Speaker 1: especially when you don't know anything
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Speaker 1: else.
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Speaker 1: So maybe you're 16, 17, you do a show, a
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Speaker 1: gig or whatever.
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Speaker 1: How, how were you thinking about it?
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Speaker 1: Cause when you think of even now, you think
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Speaker 1: of magic as a career, like it's crazy, it's
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Speaker 1: a it's crazy to do.
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Speaker 1: What were you thinking at 16, 17, 18, or
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Speaker 1: whenever it happened for you?
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Speaker 1: Where are you thinking about making?
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Speaker 2: Oh, you know at that age I was already
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Speaker 2: doing not many shows, but I started really
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Speaker 2: to perform when I met Dominique Webb in the
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Speaker 2: second magic shop it was three years later,
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Speaker 2: you know, and because he was giving lessons
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Speaker 2: and there I met my real teacher, jean
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Speaker 2: Merlin, you know, who teach me everything
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Speaker 2: in magic.
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Speaker 2: But very early I started to.
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Speaker 2: I was so young, I was 12, 13.
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Speaker 2: I came behind the counter, you know, and
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Speaker 2: started to do some demos for Dominic Webb.
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Speaker 2: Really, it was just because I love to be
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Speaker 2: there, you know.
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Speaker 2: And so at one moment he just said why don't
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Speaker 2: you go in a big shop and sell tricks for me,
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Speaker 2: you know, during holidays?
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Speaker 2: Because of course I had not the age to have
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Speaker 2: a real contract.
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Speaker 2: But it started like that, you know, and
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Speaker 2: more and more, and I think it's the best
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Speaker 2: way to learn First.
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Speaker 2: So I had no money from that, but he gave me
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Speaker 2: books, he gave me tricks, et cetera, et
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Speaker 2: cetera.
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Speaker 2: So very early I had my foot, my finger in
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Speaker 2: the fact that I was dealing tricks and I
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Speaker 2: was already not creating tricks but
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Speaker 2: creating presentation, different
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Speaker 2: presentation for existing tricks.
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Speaker 1: That was a real big, and where did it go
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Speaker 1: from there for you with respect to shows,
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Speaker 1: like, did you start doing kids shows?
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Speaker 1: Did you start doing?
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Speaker 1: What was the next step for you?
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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, you know.
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Speaker 2: Then the next step was to, to, to
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Speaker 2: eventually enter the magic group, you know,
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Speaker 2: and the FFAP at the time, and what was?
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Speaker 2: Two different clubs and my mother again my
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Speaker 2: mother was always very helpful with this
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Speaker 2: thing in mind they say, okay, okay, he, we
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Speaker 2: apparently want to do that and he's pretty
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Speaker 2: good at that, so let's help him, you know.
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Speaker 2: And but I never had any other job, never.
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Speaker 2: So I'm not to choose, you know, I recognize
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Speaker 2: that now, or maybe it's even more difficult,
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Speaker 2: because if you have a steady job and you
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Speaker 2: know what you are going to make for the
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Speaker 2: rest of your life, or to jump in becoming a
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Speaker 2: magician, some people are very upset or
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Speaker 2: they don't know if they have to be
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Speaker 2: part-time or full-time.
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Speaker 2: But I never had really to take this
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Speaker 2: decision, it was from the beginning.
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Speaker 2: I want to do that, you know, and my parents
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Speaker 2: were okay with me.
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Speaker 2: I was living home, you know, and I left
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Speaker 2: them when I was 20, something, but that's
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Speaker 2: it.
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Speaker 1: Was there anything proactive that you did
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Speaker 1: at the time to get shows or TV appearances,
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Speaker 1: or was there anything you were doing like,
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Speaker 1: okay, I'm going to email all these people,
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Speaker 1: or I'm going to call all of these people,
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Speaker 1: or it just happened from you being popular.
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Speaker 2: No, I started to be like the new young guy
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Speaker 2: with funny ideas in the club, you know,
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Speaker 2: because I was 13, 14.
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Speaker 2: I already was thinking how to do an act for
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Speaker 2: the next convention or something you know.
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Speaker 2: So I was the new guy on the thing.
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Speaker 2: And then, very early I met during this
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Speaker 2: French convention.
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Speaker 2: I met very interesting people and I met
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Speaker 2: quite early Albert Gauchemart know people
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Speaker 2: like that.
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Speaker 2: And then and then I met Ken Brook in
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Speaker 2: England and this was the start really of
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Speaker 2: the of going, I mean, to be known as a, as
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Speaker 2: a kind of underground guy, you know,
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Speaker 2: because Ken Brook I knew Ken Brook because
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Speaker 2: when I was 16, I'd been across Abracadabra
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Speaker 2: it was an English magazine, weekly magazine,
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Speaker 2: incredible and Ken Brook was putting ads in
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Speaker 2: every, not every week, because it was very
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Speaker 2: costly and so I discovered his way, his to
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Speaker 2: sell things and and from.
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Speaker 2: He had not thousands of tricks but very few
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Speaker 2: tricks, but from fred caps, finn john I
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Speaker 2: mean the top of the top donna land, from
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Speaker 2: america, many, many top gun guys, you know.
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Speaker 2: And so eventually, when I was 18, I had the
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Speaker 2: chance to go to London for the first time,
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Speaker 2: you know, and to meet him and it was like
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Speaker 2: an instant friendship, you know.
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Speaker 2: And he took me literally under his arm, you
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Speaker 2: know.
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Speaker 2: And then I started to learn English,
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Speaker 2: because before I was not really speaking
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Speaker 2: properly English.
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Speaker 2: You know, wow, and then I found, you know,
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Speaker 2: one of my most famous trick is the standing
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Speaker 2: cart trick.
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Speaker 2: It was two carts and one stand.
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Speaker 2: And when I showed this to Ken as something
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Speaker 2: new, he said wow, my God, this afternoon
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Speaker 2: somebody is coming and I want you to show
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Speaker 2: him that and say, yes, of course.
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Speaker 2: Who is that?
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Speaker 2: A Dive Vernon.
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Speaker 2: I said, wow, oh, my God, dive Vernon, are
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Speaker 2: you kidding me?
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Speaker 2: No, no, no, no.
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Speaker 2: And so I did it to Dive Vernon and I fooled
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Speaker 2: him and he told me oh, you fooled me, you
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Speaker 2: fooled me, you fooled me.
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Speaker 2: And when I explained it, wow, he was so
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Speaker 2: happy.
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Speaker 2: And so, few, few years after that I went to
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Speaker 2: the magic castle and Dave Vernon took me
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Speaker 2: under his arm, you know, and the castle,
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Speaker 2: and say do your trick.
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Speaker 2: Right there, do do the trick to Larry
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Speaker 2: Jennings, do the trick.
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Speaker 2: Like a baby was, you know.
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Speaker 2: So I've always been very lucky in this
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Speaker 2: respect.
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Speaker 1: It sounds like.
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Speaker 1: It sounds like you've been very lucky to
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Speaker 1: have a lot of mentors that you know,
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00:14:02,023 --> 00:14:06,031
Speaker 1: recognize your magic and take you to the
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Speaker 1: next level and the next step.
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Speaker 1: Who are some of the ones?
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Speaker 1: I know you mentioned a few already, but who
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00:14:11,063 --> 00:14:13,981
Speaker 1: are some of the people in your journey that
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Speaker 1: really helped you the most, both with your
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Speaker 1: magic and with your Well, one is obviously
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Speaker 1: Jean Merlin.
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Speaker 2: I told you about him and he's still now.
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00:14:26,482 --> 00:14:29,951
Speaker 2: He's a huge friend and still a mentor, and
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Speaker 2: whatever.
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Speaker 2: Another one is James Hodges.
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Speaker 2: James, you know, I had an affair with one
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Speaker 2: of his daughters One of my first fiance was
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Speaker 2: her, you know, and for three years we were
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Speaker 2: together and then we we split and really
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Speaker 2: it's my, my first idea, oh god, I won't see
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Speaker 2: james again.
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Speaker 2: So I was very sad with that.
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Speaker 2: But he said you know, kid, life is life,
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Speaker 2: but you, you always be like my, my son, so
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Speaker 2: it's okay.
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Speaker 2: So, and James did all my drawings for all
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Speaker 2: my tricks.
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Speaker 2: Oh, wow, if you have my books, of course
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00:15:14,323 --> 00:15:17,168
Speaker 2: and he's not, really he deserves much more
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Speaker 2: because James knew how to do drawings, but
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Speaker 2: he was a ventriloquist, he was a magician,
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00:15:24,080 --> 00:15:28,892
Speaker 2: he was a multi-talented man, really Wow.
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Speaker 2: And he left us a few years ago now and I
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00:15:33,469 --> 00:15:34,611
Speaker 2: still miss him every day.
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Speaker 2: Yeah, wow.
337
00:15:36,380 --> 00:15:41,311
Speaker 2: And of course, another very influential man
338
00:15:41,391 --> 00:15:42,734
Speaker 2: for me was Finjon.
339
00:15:42,880 --> 00:15:43,516
Speaker 2: When I met Finjon, man for me was Finjon
340
00:15:43,576 --> 00:15:43,980
Speaker 2: when I met Finjon.
341
00:15:44,442 --> 00:15:47,940
Speaker 2: I met Finjon thanks to Ken Brook, because
342
00:15:48,061 --> 00:15:51,486
Speaker 2: Ken Brook was selling some tricks from Phil,
343
00:15:52,427 --> 00:15:56,824
Speaker 2: like the floating flute, and one trick
344
00:15:56,864 --> 00:15:57,787
Speaker 2: called Esoteric.
345
00:15:58,280 --> 00:16:03,514
Speaker 2: Esoteric was a wonderful haunted pack done
346
00:16:03,534 --> 00:16:05,766
Speaker 2: in a very special way because you could put
347
00:16:05,806 --> 00:16:09,241
Speaker 2: the the deck on the floor, you know, and
348
00:16:09,301 --> 00:16:12,267
Speaker 2: three people choose a card and the card
349
00:16:12,628 --> 00:16:15,521
Speaker 2: crawl out of the deck and blah, blah, blah.
350
00:16:15,582 --> 00:16:18,150
Speaker 2: But you are far away from the thing you
351
00:16:18,170 --> 00:16:18,310
Speaker 2: have.
352
00:16:18,380 --> 00:16:21,456
Speaker 2: You have not the deck in your hand and was
353
00:16:21,537 --> 00:16:24,846
Speaker 2: no electronic, of course, was a very, very
354
00:16:25,127 --> 00:16:27,373
Speaker 2: good use of thread, you know.
355
00:16:28,702 --> 00:16:33,167
Speaker 2: And when Ken Brook saw me he said oh, I
356
00:16:33,187 --> 00:16:35,360
Speaker 2: know, you are in Paris, you live in Paris.
357
00:16:35,621 --> 00:16:39,179
Speaker 2: I will make a few words and go to the Crazy
358
00:16:39,299 --> 00:16:41,909
Speaker 2: Horse and you will meet this guy.
359
00:16:42,120 --> 00:16:44,048
Speaker 2: He's working at the Crazy Horse right now
360
00:16:45,521 --> 00:16:47,970
Speaker 2: and I did that and it was Finjan.
361
00:16:48,160 --> 00:16:52,042
Speaker 2: So I went for him at the exit, you know it
362
00:16:52,102 --> 00:16:55,643
Speaker 2: was two o'clock in the morning and he said
363
00:16:55,804 --> 00:16:58,124
Speaker 2: oh, kenbrook, oh yeah, okay, let's have a
364
00:16:58,164 --> 00:16:58,425
Speaker 2: drink.
365
00:16:59,441 --> 00:17:01,167
Speaker 2: And he took me for a drink on the
366
00:17:01,308 --> 00:17:05,688
Speaker 2: Champs-Élysées and you know I was 18 years
367
00:17:05,869 --> 00:17:06,671
Speaker 2: old at the time.
368
00:17:08,341 --> 00:17:11,388
Speaker 2: And then, after a few drinks, everything
369
00:17:11,429 --> 00:17:13,634
Speaker 2: started to float on the table, you know the
370
00:17:13,734 --> 00:17:16,325
Speaker 2: bills, the things, the piece of bread,
371
00:17:16,385 --> 00:17:16,726
Speaker 2: whatever.
372
00:17:16,786 --> 00:17:19,151
Speaker 2: I said, oh, my God, you know the guy was
373
00:17:19,231 --> 00:17:22,383
Speaker 2: not waiting for me, he was ready, he was
374
00:17:22,483 --> 00:17:25,267
Speaker 2: ready to make anything float, you know, and
375
00:17:25,488 --> 00:17:29,894
Speaker 2: of course this was way before ETR real,
376
00:17:30,414 --> 00:17:31,376
Speaker 2: anything like that.
377
00:17:31,500 --> 00:17:33,388
Speaker 2: It was ever before.
378
00:17:34,061 --> 00:17:37,309
Speaker 2: At the time he had not invented the elastic
379
00:17:37,489 --> 00:17:41,504
Speaker 2: invisible thread, you know, but he was
380
00:17:41,605 --> 00:17:45,181
Speaker 2: already working a lot with threads and he
381
00:17:45,822 --> 00:17:49,209
Speaker 2: really he opened my mind to a complete new
382
00:17:49,289 --> 00:17:51,093
Speaker 2: world, for me.
383
00:17:51,694 --> 00:17:54,689
Speaker 1: Yeah, I want to talk more about threads in
384
00:17:54,729 --> 00:17:55,150
Speaker 1: a minute.
385
00:17:56,203 --> 00:17:57,969
Speaker 1: It's a whole section I want to talk about
386
00:17:57,989 --> 00:18:01,748
Speaker 1: with you, but let's go back and talk a
387
00:18:01,808 --> 00:18:03,673
Speaker 1: little bit about creativity.
388
00:18:03,820 --> 00:18:06,186
Speaker 1: You know, I have found I've interviewed,
389
00:18:06,246 --> 00:18:08,267
Speaker 1: obviously, many magicians and I've found
390
00:18:08,327 --> 00:18:10,643
Speaker 1: that often it's the magicians that don't
391
00:18:10,764 --> 00:18:14,703
Speaker 1: have magic books or magic shops or anything
392
00:18:14,743 --> 00:18:16,273
Speaker 1: where they grew up, that are the most
393
00:18:16,334 --> 00:18:17,593
Speaker 1: creative because they don't have the
394
00:18:17,654 --> 00:18:19,887
Speaker 1: resources and they start coming up with
395
00:18:19,907 --> 00:18:20,469
Speaker 1: their own things.
396
00:18:20,882 --> 00:18:22,087
Speaker 1: But it sounds like you had both.
397
00:18:22,501 --> 00:18:25,069
Speaker 1: You had a great actual magic education, but
398
00:18:25,129 --> 00:18:28,446
Speaker 1: then you know, you started to come up with,
399
00:18:29,207 --> 00:18:31,632
Speaker 1: you know, magic and presentations and
400
00:18:31,733 --> 00:18:34,364
Speaker 1: things that magicians haven't seen before.
401
00:18:34,925 --> 00:18:37,390
Speaker 1: What, what did that look like for you?
402
00:18:37,430 --> 00:18:40,322
Speaker 1: Was there a practice like, okay, I'm going
403
00:18:40,342 --> 00:18:42,307
Speaker 1: to spend this amount of time or I'm going
404
00:18:42,347 --> 00:18:44,212
Speaker 1: to spend some time every day working?
405
00:18:44,581 --> 00:18:46,608
Speaker 1: Is it just you're jamming and you say, what
406
00:18:46,648 --> 00:18:47,089
Speaker 1: about this?
407
00:18:47,240 --> 00:18:47,903
Speaker 1: What about that?
408
00:18:48,003 --> 00:18:50,444
Speaker 1: Like, how, why were you so creative at a
409
00:18:50,484 --> 00:18:52,691
Speaker 1: young age and maybe others were not?
410
00:18:54,061 --> 00:18:54,422
Speaker 2: I think.
411
00:18:54,583 --> 00:18:56,509
Speaker 2: I think it just because I was curious, I
412
00:18:56,550 --> 00:18:56,710
Speaker 2: will.
413
00:18:57,080 --> 00:18:59,921
Speaker 2: One of the real key to be creative, I think,
414
00:18:59,981 --> 00:19:02,809
Speaker 2: is to be curious about things and always
415
00:19:02,889 --> 00:19:04,092
Speaker 2: wanting to know more.
416
00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:07,242
Speaker 2: You know, if something is how it works, you
417
00:19:07,282 --> 00:19:10,710
Speaker 2: know all my my toys I had to break them to
418
00:19:10,790 --> 00:19:12,414
Speaker 2: see how it works inside.
419
00:19:12,520 --> 00:19:12,701
Speaker 2: You know.
420
00:19:12,761 --> 00:19:16,786
Speaker 2: If not, I was not happy and and so as soon
421
00:19:16,867 --> 00:19:19,935
Speaker 2: as I knew that were some magic books with
422
00:19:20,276 --> 00:19:24,065
Speaker 2: secrets, you know I wanted to have some of
423
00:19:24,126 --> 00:19:24,386
Speaker 2: them.
424
00:19:24,446 --> 00:19:26,050
Speaker 2: You know, and and also I, I very early
425
00:19:26,090 --> 00:19:27,955
Speaker 2: found that, you know I wanted to have some
426
00:19:27,975 --> 00:19:28,115
Speaker 2: of them.
427
00:19:28,135 --> 00:19:29,238
Speaker 2: You know, and and also I, I very early
428
00:19:29,338 --> 00:19:33,207
Speaker 2: found that I was a lot in love with old
429
00:19:33,267 --> 00:19:33,568
Speaker 2: books.
430
00:19:33,749 --> 00:19:36,936
Speaker 2: Already, as soon as I could put a hand on
431
00:19:37,017 --> 00:19:39,663
Speaker 2: an old book, I'd say, oh, it smelled good.
432
00:19:39,723 --> 00:19:42,288
Speaker 2: You know that's, that's something.
433
00:19:42,368 --> 00:19:45,555
Speaker 2: Now it's gone because most of the thing are
434
00:19:45,595 --> 00:19:48,763
Speaker 2: done with pdf or whatever, and you have not
435
00:19:48,783 --> 00:19:50,447
Speaker 2: this, this feeling.
436
00:19:50,487 --> 00:19:52,714
Speaker 2: You know you don't have this anymore.
437
00:19:53,516 --> 00:19:55,380
Speaker 2: Like I remember again, when I was in
438
00:19:55,460 --> 00:19:59,342
Speaker 2: england, I I after the first man was ken
439
00:19:59,362 --> 00:20:02,724
Speaker 2: brooke, but also I went to Davenport, don
440
00:20:02,764 --> 00:20:06,146
Speaker 2: and Alan, alan, alan, sorry, but in
441
00:20:06,226 --> 00:20:09,988
Speaker 2: Davenport I found some very old books, you
442
00:20:10,008 --> 00:20:13,070
Speaker 2: know, from the Goldstone Age and all that.
443
00:20:14,030 --> 00:20:17,172
Speaker 2: And I found some of the Al Baker books,
444
00:20:17,592 --> 00:20:20,074
Speaker 2: booklets, you know, for nothing.
445
00:20:20,294 --> 00:20:23,756
Speaker 2: It was very cheap and for instance, if you
446
00:20:23,776 --> 00:20:26,457
Speaker 2: want to talk about thread, I mean we are
447
00:20:26,517 --> 00:20:28,458
Speaker 2: talking Finchon, but Al Baker.
448
00:20:32,640 --> 00:20:35,087
Speaker 2: Al Baker was a complete revelation and I
449
00:20:35,107 --> 00:20:36,811
Speaker 2: have all of the books from Al Baker.
450
00:20:39,620 --> 00:20:40,564
Speaker 2: Now you have the big, big compilation and
451
00:20:40,604 --> 00:20:43,156
Speaker 2: wonderful book from Todd Carr.
452
00:20:43,981 --> 00:20:48,292
Speaker 2: But really Al Baker invented so many things.
453
00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:52,109
Speaker 2: We only know now most of them, most of the
454
00:20:52,150 --> 00:20:52,651
Speaker 2: magicians.
455
00:20:52,700 --> 00:20:56,070
Speaker 2: They know Al Baker for the mental side
456
00:20:56,090 --> 00:21:00,468
Speaker 2: trick, but he had really a lot of what I
457
00:21:00,548 --> 00:21:02,332
Speaker 2: call the indirect threat.
458
00:21:02,373 --> 00:21:02,613
Speaker 2: You know.
459
00:21:03,643 --> 00:21:05,330
Speaker 1: So that's one of the things I want to talk
460
00:21:05,350 --> 00:21:08,944
Speaker 1: to you about is, it's so funny when I read
461
00:21:09,505 --> 00:21:12,561
Speaker 1: your book, because I read a trick I have no
462
00:21:12,621 --> 00:21:15,810
Speaker 1: idea how that could work and it's always
463
00:21:15,870 --> 00:21:16,692
Speaker 1: thread, you know?
464
00:21:18,062 --> 00:21:19,448
Speaker 1: No, not really, but it's always.
465
00:21:20,493 --> 00:21:22,421
Speaker 1: It feels like it's like a thread and it's a
466
00:21:22,501 --> 00:21:23,403
Speaker 1: thread used in a way.
467
00:21:23,564 --> 00:21:27,513
Speaker 1: I've never thought to use a thread ever.
468
00:21:27,901 --> 00:21:29,588
Speaker 1: It wouldn't have even crossed my mind.
469
00:21:29,740 --> 00:21:31,727
Speaker 1: For me, I think, thread it's levitation,
470
00:21:31,807 --> 00:21:32,730
Speaker 1: it's things moving.
471
00:21:33,342 --> 00:21:34,547
Speaker 1: So talk to me about that.
472
00:21:34,640 --> 00:21:36,787
Speaker 1: How do you you know, I don't even know
473
00:21:36,827 --> 00:21:37,730
Speaker 1: where to start on it.
474
00:21:38,001 --> 00:21:40,127
Speaker 1: When you're problem solving, how do you
475
00:21:40,167 --> 00:21:41,391
Speaker 1: even think of using thread?
476
00:21:42,922 --> 00:21:43,965
Speaker 1: How is that a tool?
477
00:21:45,108 --> 00:21:45,509
Speaker 2: I think.
478
00:21:45,629 --> 00:21:46,532
Speaker 2: I think it goes.
479
00:21:46,592 --> 00:21:49,987
Speaker 2: You know, in french we have what we call
480
00:21:50,128 --> 00:21:52,593
Speaker 2: friends, friends, friends.
481
00:21:53,615 --> 00:21:54,417
Speaker 2: What is a friend?
482
00:21:54,978 --> 00:21:57,805
Speaker 2: And in france it's a ami, ami, ami.
483
00:21:58,006 --> 00:22:04,105
Speaker 2: So it's a an ami for me, it's, for me, it's.
484
00:22:04,426 --> 00:22:06,903
Speaker 2: There is no way to translate that, but it's
485
00:22:07,164 --> 00:22:11,650
Speaker 2: what I call magical, invisible, magical
486
00:22:12,251 --> 00:22:12,652
Speaker 2: friends.
487
00:22:12,720 --> 00:22:14,186
Speaker 2: You know, to help us.
488
00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:15,704
Speaker 2: I can't translate it.
489
00:22:15,824 --> 00:22:17,028
Speaker 1: No, but that makes sense.
490
00:22:17,068 --> 00:22:17,630
Speaker 2: That makes sense.
491
00:22:18,660 --> 00:22:23,038
Speaker 2: So the first thing is to find a new trick
492
00:22:23,218 --> 00:22:23,620
Speaker 2: or whatever.
493
00:22:23,780 --> 00:22:27,389
Speaker 2: And this is from just watching everything
494
00:22:27,689 --> 00:22:31,964
Speaker 2: on a different angle, you know, or any
495
00:22:32,085 --> 00:22:34,972
Speaker 2: object you see, you know you can ask
496
00:22:35,032 --> 00:22:39,190
Speaker 2: yourself, okay, what is made for this?
497
00:22:39,380 --> 00:22:42,549
Speaker 2: I mean, a pencil is made to write, a hammer
498
00:22:42,609 --> 00:22:45,367
Speaker 2: is made to have to boom, boom, boom to nail
499
00:22:45,427 --> 00:22:50,009
Speaker 2: something, and then you can think what else
500
00:22:50,110 --> 00:22:54,109
Speaker 2: can we do, or what you can do with that.
501
00:22:54,170 --> 00:22:57,889
Speaker 2: You know, think the opposite, okay.
502
00:22:59,242 --> 00:23:03,756
Speaker 2: And then maybe you find I mean, you can
503
00:23:03,776 --> 00:23:07,264
Speaker 2: give me any object and we can start this
504
00:23:07,785 --> 00:23:08,766
Speaker 2: Give me an object here, lip balm.
505
00:23:09,006 --> 00:23:12,151
Speaker 2: I have lip balm, lip balm, okay.
506
00:23:13,814 --> 00:23:16,664
Speaker 1: Say okay, I saw it on my desk.
507
00:23:17,989 --> 00:23:20,706
Speaker 2: Okay, so what you do with that?
508
00:23:20,847 --> 00:23:23,246
Speaker 2: Normally you put it on your lips.
509
00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:26,604
Speaker 2: Okay, so what can be the?
510
00:23:29,223 --> 00:23:33,592
Speaker 2: You do this to make your lips not dry.
511
00:23:34,052 --> 00:23:35,996
Speaker 2: Exactly, exactly.
512
00:23:36,817 --> 00:23:38,019
Speaker 2: But imagine now.
513
00:23:38,079 --> 00:23:41,845
Speaker 2: You say now this if I put on your lips or
514
00:23:41,945 --> 00:23:45,010
Speaker 2: on my lips, maybe I have no more, no more
515
00:23:45,070 --> 00:23:47,439
Speaker 2: mouth, my lips are gone.
516
00:23:48,542 --> 00:23:49,404
Speaker 2: That's the opposite.
517
00:23:49,524 --> 00:23:54,539
Speaker 2: Right, and maybe now it looks stupid, but
518
00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:58,324
Speaker 2: if you go back to Jeff McBride when he
519
00:23:58,404 --> 00:24:00,988
Speaker 2: removed his face, that then it can be the
520
00:24:01,028 --> 00:24:02,009
Speaker 2: start of something.
521
00:24:02,049 --> 00:24:04,098
Speaker 2: You know, and you can do this to a
522
00:24:04,138 --> 00:24:07,435
Speaker 2: spectator as soon as I put balm on your
523
00:24:07,615 --> 00:24:10,023
Speaker 2: lips, you can't open your mouth.
524
00:24:10,424 --> 00:24:13,843
Speaker 2: It's like it's glue, you know.
525
00:24:14,525 --> 00:24:17,823
Speaker 2: And you can have another balm to unglue.
526
00:24:18,104 --> 00:24:21,037
Speaker 2: You know, you know it.
527
00:24:21,098 --> 00:24:24,527
Speaker 2: Just think, think anything, be free.
528
00:24:26,155 --> 00:24:29,022
Speaker 2: And then after, then, after you start to
529
00:24:29,082 --> 00:24:32,860
Speaker 2: say, okay, that's funny ideas, how can I do
530
00:24:32,941 --> 00:24:33,182
Speaker 2: that?
531
00:24:34,476 --> 00:24:35,298
Speaker 2: And may I use a?
532
00:24:35,318 --> 00:24:36,061
Speaker 2: I don't know instant glue studging.
533
00:24:36,081 --> 00:24:37,485
Speaker 2: May I use a?
534
00:24:37,566 --> 00:24:40,114
Speaker 2: I don't know instant glue stitching?
535
00:24:41,478 --> 00:24:44,886
Speaker 2: May I use, I don't know, a thread?
536
00:24:45,856 --> 00:24:48,983
Speaker 2: Maybe I can put an invisible thread so he
537
00:24:49,023 --> 00:24:50,987
Speaker 2: can't open his mouth, I don't know.
538
00:24:51,576 --> 00:24:53,162
Speaker 2: Or put a gimmick, a fake.
539
00:24:54,157 --> 00:24:57,706
Speaker 2: So you list all your different friends, you
540
00:24:57,766 --> 00:25:02,146
Speaker 2: know, and most of the time one is going to
541
00:25:02,206 --> 00:25:06,766
Speaker 2: click, but it's a very good list to have.
542
00:25:07,595 --> 00:25:11,585
Speaker 2: I mean, what's a list of your unknown
543
00:25:12,107 --> 00:25:12,628
Speaker 2: weapons?
544
00:25:14,315 --> 00:25:17,782
Speaker 2: And now we have magnets, we have daub, we
545
00:25:17,802 --> 00:25:18,964
Speaker 2: have thread, we have memory metal, we have
546
00:25:19,405 --> 00:25:20,868
Speaker 2: dope, we have thread, we have a memory
547
00:25:20,928 --> 00:25:24,094
Speaker 2: metal where I mean have reels.
548
00:25:24,455 --> 00:25:27,701
Speaker 2: You, you have many, we have many of them,
549
00:25:28,582 --> 00:25:28,983
Speaker 2: wow.
550
00:25:29,764 --> 00:25:31,568
Speaker 2: So that that's basically, you have some
551
00:25:31,608 --> 00:25:34,098
Speaker 2: tape, of course yeah, you have some tape.
552
00:25:34,479 --> 00:25:36,644
Speaker 1: So that's what, like, the creative process
553
00:25:36,704 --> 00:25:37,807
Speaker 1: really looks like for you.
554
00:25:37,907 --> 00:25:38,208
Speaker 1: Is you?
555
00:25:38,415 --> 00:25:41,645
Speaker 1: You, you pick maybe an object or something,
556
00:25:41,685 --> 00:25:43,580
Speaker 1: and then you start thinking of what could
557
00:25:43,620 --> 00:25:43,901
Speaker 1: it do?
558
00:25:43,941 --> 00:25:45,064
Speaker 1: That's different, what could it do?
559
00:25:45,104 --> 00:25:45,986
Speaker 1: That's the opposite.
560
00:25:46,127 --> 00:25:49,400
Speaker 1: And then you make a list of how you could
561
00:25:49,440 --> 00:25:52,706
Speaker 1: do that thing yeah, it's kind of.
562
00:25:53,567 --> 00:25:57,039
Speaker 2: Of course, that's the basic, but now I you
563
00:25:57,079 --> 00:25:59,363
Speaker 2: know, for instance, I see you.
564
00:25:59,423 --> 00:26:01,688
Speaker 2: You have the pipe from Magritte.
565
00:26:02,069 --> 00:26:02,269
Speaker 1: Yeah.
566
00:26:03,596 --> 00:26:06,281
Speaker 2: But Magritte is full of inspiration.
567
00:26:06,362 --> 00:26:11,901
Speaker 2: For a magician, I think, or any Dali or any
568
00:26:12,021 --> 00:26:15,517
Speaker 2: painter can be, but especially all the
569
00:26:15,557 --> 00:26:17,600
Speaker 2: surrealist painters.
570
00:26:17,881 --> 00:26:22,768
Speaker 2: It's a huge inspiration for us If you, for
571
00:26:22,828 --> 00:26:26,015
Speaker 2: instance, in Dali's work, you have the
572
00:26:26,096 --> 00:26:28,580
Speaker 2: clock, you know the soft clock.
573
00:26:29,462 --> 00:26:32,608
Speaker 2: The soft clock is something we have never
574
00:26:32,688 --> 00:26:35,458
Speaker 2: done this in magic, but it can be done
575
00:26:35,518 --> 00:26:39,485
Speaker 2: really To take a clock and it become like a
576
00:26:39,565 --> 00:26:41,789
Speaker 2: slinky thing or whatever, and back to
577
00:26:41,849 --> 00:26:46,200
Speaker 2: normal and and and stop to to the chosen
578
00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:46,680
Speaker 2: time.
579
00:26:47,141 --> 00:26:50,106
Speaker 1: I don't know so you must have notebooks
580
00:26:50,546 --> 00:26:54,326
Speaker 1: full of ideas that never oh yeah came to oh
581
00:26:54,504 --> 00:26:57,249
Speaker 1: yeah and, oh yeah, you, you keep everything.
582
00:26:57,426 --> 00:27:00,302
Speaker 2: You keep all the notebooks and you keep
583
00:27:00,363 --> 00:27:02,913
Speaker 2: everything, you keep all the notebooks.
584
00:27:02,933 --> 00:27:06,161
Speaker 2: You know, one of the problem is that before
585
00:27:06,181 --> 00:27:07,167
Speaker 2: I had notebooks and I went to the workshop
586
00:27:07,228 --> 00:27:08,275
Speaker 2: and I started to open one and say, okay,
587
00:27:08,315 --> 00:27:11,795
Speaker 2: now, because it's funny to take notes, but
588
00:27:11,896 --> 00:27:16,516
Speaker 2: then the problem is that now we have, we
589
00:27:16,536 --> 00:27:20,384
Speaker 2: have these, we have font, so you, you any
590
00:27:20,504 --> 00:27:22,649
Speaker 2: note, they go there, you know.
591
00:27:22,755 --> 00:27:26,043
Speaker 2: But I have hundreds of notes, but it's so
592
00:27:26,143 --> 00:27:29,739
Speaker 2: easy to stack them that now it's more
593
00:27:29,799 --> 00:27:32,486
Speaker 2: difficult to take one and go to the
594
00:27:32,566 --> 00:27:33,028
Speaker 2: workshop.
595
00:27:34,355 --> 00:27:38,441
Speaker 2: And that's why sometimes I like to take one
596
00:27:38,501 --> 00:27:44,389
Speaker 2: wing completely off and go to my workshop
597
00:27:44,790 --> 00:27:47,759
Speaker 2: and try things, because, on my way of
598
00:27:47,819 --> 00:27:52,277
Speaker 2: thinking, the more I can play and try, and
599
00:27:52,558 --> 00:27:55,066
Speaker 2: that's how it works, it goes.
600
00:27:55,455 --> 00:27:56,138
Speaker 1: Talk to me about.
601
00:27:56,238 --> 00:27:59,748
Speaker 1: When you say a workshop, are you using that
602
00:27:59,809 --> 00:28:01,880
Speaker 1: word like a metaphor or you physically have
603
00:28:01,920 --> 00:28:03,184
Speaker 1: a room with your magnets?
604
00:28:03,355 --> 00:28:05,504
Speaker 2: No, no, I have really a workshop.
605
00:28:05,675 --> 00:28:09,659
Speaker 2: It's a mess because I'm messy, but I know
606
00:28:09,720 --> 00:28:10,823
Speaker 2: where are my things.
607
00:28:10,943 --> 00:28:12,227
Speaker 2: And I try this.
608
00:28:12,735 --> 00:28:16,404
Speaker 2: Very often I have the idea I do it.
609
00:28:16,745 --> 00:28:19,160
Speaker 2: It doesn't work, oh shit why.
610
00:28:19,815 --> 00:28:22,944
Speaker 2: And then I have to compromise a little bit
611
00:28:23,025 --> 00:28:25,522
Speaker 2: pop, pop, pop, and then it works or not,
612
00:28:26,436 --> 00:28:28,724
Speaker 2: but quite often it works yeah.
613
00:28:29,115 --> 00:28:30,720
Speaker 1: Well, you know, obviously at this point
614
00:28:30,760 --> 00:28:33,515
Speaker 1: you've done it so much that you know you're
615
00:28:33,536 --> 00:28:35,482
Speaker 1: like, okay, oh, okay, I see it with red,
616
00:28:35,522 --> 00:28:36,385
Speaker 1: okay, it will work.
617
00:28:36,535 --> 00:28:37,580
Speaker 1: I get the idea of it.
618
00:28:38,636 --> 00:28:39,439
Speaker 1: No, that's for sure.
619
00:28:40,382 --> 00:28:43,917
Speaker 1: I want to talk about sort of an interesting
620
00:28:44,899 --> 00:28:47,224
Speaker 1: version of this topic, which is magic with
621
00:28:47,424 --> 00:28:48,006
Speaker 1: objects.
622
00:28:48,627 --> 00:28:53,061
Speaker 1: I think for me, in my journey, I did some
623
00:28:53,101 --> 00:28:55,065
Speaker 1: mentalism, I did some card magic and then
624
00:28:55,105 --> 00:28:57,056
Speaker 1: at some point I realized that you know, I
625
00:28:57,397 --> 00:29:00,405
Speaker 1: really need to do magic with stuff, you
626
00:29:00,445 --> 00:29:02,478
Speaker 1: know, with objects, with things like that's
627
00:29:02,538 --> 00:29:04,303
Speaker 1: what, what people want to see.
628
00:29:04,323 --> 00:29:04,664
Speaker 1: They don't.
629
00:29:04,704 --> 00:29:06,656
Speaker 1: Maybe not just card tricks, maybe not just
630
00:29:06,716 --> 00:29:07,277
Speaker 1: mentalism.
631
00:29:07,959 --> 00:29:12,146
Speaker 1: And all of a sudden I felt that I was
632
00:29:12,207 --> 00:29:14,719
Speaker 1: looking out in magic books and it's a very
633
00:29:14,820 --> 00:29:15,724
Speaker 1: small subject.
634
00:29:15,864 --> 00:29:17,351
Speaker 1: I mean it's cause there's people that talk
635
00:29:17,391 --> 00:29:18,315
Speaker 1: about it, but it's not.
636
00:29:18,395 --> 00:29:20,542
Speaker 1: The biggest subject is magic with objects
637
00:29:20,582 --> 00:29:22,556
Speaker 1: and magic with things, and that's what
638
00:29:22,757 --> 00:29:25,383
Speaker 1: really led me to your books, because it's
639
00:29:25,804 --> 00:29:30,215
Speaker 1: all things ropes and locks and crazy stuff.
640
00:29:30,435 --> 00:29:32,919
Speaker 1: Talk to me about how you think about magic
641
00:29:32,959 --> 00:29:35,162
Speaker 1: with objects, because sometimes you use
642
00:29:35,382 --> 00:29:38,707
Speaker 1: objects where maybe it's natural but it's a
643
00:29:38,768 --> 00:29:40,510
Speaker 1: clever, really clever jump, like, for
644
00:29:40,550 --> 00:29:42,358
Speaker 1: example, the mic cable.
645
00:29:42,839 --> 00:29:45,225
Speaker 1: But then sometimes you do, you do the card
646
00:29:45,245 --> 00:29:47,116
Speaker 1: manipulation with boxing gloves on a boxing
647
00:29:47,156 --> 00:29:47,316
Speaker 1: gloves.
648
00:29:47,397 --> 00:29:48,460
Speaker 1: It doesn't come from anywhere.
649
00:29:48,520 --> 00:29:48,901
Speaker 1: It's not.
650
00:29:49,342 --> 00:29:50,004
Speaker 1: Nobody thought.
651
00:29:50,064 --> 00:29:51,596
Speaker 1: There's no reason for boxing gloves.
652
00:29:51,637 --> 00:29:53,741
Speaker 1: So talk to me about how you think about
653
00:29:53,842 --> 00:29:56,167
Speaker 1: using objects, or it's just whatever
654
00:29:56,207 --> 00:29:56,755
Speaker 1: tickles you.
655
00:29:56,775 --> 00:29:59,260
Speaker 2: You know, again, it's being curious about
656
00:29:59,300 --> 00:29:59,521
Speaker 2: things.
657
00:30:00,383 --> 00:30:03,288
Speaker 2: Anything, you see, how can you bring it to
658
00:30:03,348 --> 00:30:03,709
Speaker 2: magic?
659
00:30:04,457 --> 00:30:05,943
Speaker 2: You mentioned the boxing gloves.
660
00:30:06,695 --> 00:30:10,446
Speaker 2: The boxing glove I saw in France.
661
00:30:10,615 --> 00:30:14,486
Speaker 2: We had a huge genius guy, comedy guy.
662
00:30:15,895 --> 00:30:17,021
Speaker 2: His name was Coluche.
663
00:30:18,255 --> 00:30:24,406
Speaker 2: He was the most well-known comedian in
664
00:30:24,546 --> 00:30:28,655
Speaker 2: France for a decade and more than a decade
665
00:30:28,856 --> 00:30:32,045
Speaker 2: and he killed himself in a trash car
666
00:30:32,085 --> 00:30:32,627
Speaker 2: accident.
667
00:30:33,297 --> 00:30:33,638
Speaker 2: It was.
668
00:30:35,076 --> 00:30:37,001
Speaker 2: The guy was so well-known he went for
669
00:30:37,081 --> 00:30:41,299
Speaker 2: president, the real president, just for fun,
670
00:30:42,061 --> 00:30:44,977
Speaker 2: but they started not to love the real
671
00:30:45,358 --> 00:30:48,903
Speaker 2: politic guys because he had too many votes
672
00:30:49,204 --> 00:30:50,265
Speaker 2: possible, you know.
673
00:30:50,846 --> 00:30:52,469
Speaker 2: So it was terrific.
674
00:30:53,150 --> 00:30:58,661
Speaker 2: But when he was very young, he did, he did
675
00:30:58,741 --> 00:31:00,985
Speaker 2: something with boxing gloves, nothing to do
676
00:31:01,025 --> 00:31:01,686
Speaker 2: with magic.
677
00:31:03,268 --> 00:31:07,277
Speaker 2: He was playing violin with boxing gloves.
678
00:31:08,340 --> 00:31:11,306
Speaker 2: So he had the violin and he and took and
679
00:31:11,326 --> 00:31:13,129
Speaker 2: the other and he was playing.
680
00:31:13,955 --> 00:31:17,281
Speaker 2: I, I'm, I quite, I'm quite sure he was not
681
00:31:17,441 --> 00:31:20,826
Speaker 2: using any tricks, really, he was just, you
682
00:31:20,866 --> 00:31:24,156
Speaker 2: know, but he was playing just for, and he
683
00:31:24,216 --> 00:31:26,925
Speaker 2: was dressed nearly as a clown, you know,
684
00:31:27,055 --> 00:31:28,721
Speaker 2: and he was playing the violin with the
685
00:31:28,761 --> 00:31:29,704
Speaker 2: boxing gloves, you know.
686
00:31:30,857 --> 00:31:33,688
Speaker 2: And then, in fact, in my mind I said, shit,
687
00:31:33,909 --> 00:31:38,725
Speaker 2: what can I do magically with boxing gloves,
688
00:31:38,745 --> 00:31:39,046
Speaker 2: you know?
689
00:31:39,075 --> 00:31:39,979
Speaker 2: And my first thing was to, because it's so
690
00:31:39,901 --> 00:31:40,539
Speaker 2: funny to have boxing gloves, you know, and
691
00:31:40,461 --> 00:31:42,901
Speaker 2: my first thing was to because it's so funny
692
00:31:43,002 --> 00:31:46,039
Speaker 2: to have boxing gloves to do something
693
00:31:47,142 --> 00:31:48,225
Speaker 2: beside boxing.
694
00:31:48,286 --> 00:31:50,201
Speaker 2: You know, that was my idea.
695
00:31:51,315 --> 00:31:53,816
Speaker 2: So the first thing I wanted to do was a
696
00:31:53,876 --> 00:31:55,701
Speaker 2: complete act with boxing gloves.
697
00:31:56,905 --> 00:32:00,184
Speaker 2: You know, maybe one of the first thing was
698
00:32:00,244 --> 00:32:03,334
Speaker 2: to have a floating ball to cover the
699
00:32:03,394 --> 00:32:04,156
Speaker 2: floating ball.
700
00:32:05,139 --> 00:32:07,746
Speaker 2: And when the ball goes on top of the silk,
701
00:32:07,826 --> 00:32:10,574
Speaker 2: you know, like a zombie ball, it's a, it's
702
00:32:10,634 --> 00:32:12,077
Speaker 2: a boxing glove, you know.
703
00:32:13,138 --> 00:32:15,562
Speaker 2: And and it starts to hit me, you know.
704
00:32:16,924 --> 00:32:18,285
Speaker 2: So I fight with this.
705
00:32:18,305 --> 00:32:20,869
Speaker 2: This it's not a ball anymore, it's a boxing
706
00:32:20,909 --> 00:32:21,150
Speaker 2: glove.
707
00:32:22,652 --> 00:32:25,857
Speaker 2: And then the second boxing glove appear in
708
00:32:25,897 --> 00:32:29,264
Speaker 2: my other hand, you know, and so I am the
709
00:32:29,324 --> 00:32:29,705
Speaker 2: winner.
710
00:32:29,805 --> 00:32:31,148
Speaker 2: That was the idea, you know.
711
00:32:31,930 --> 00:32:36,101
Speaker 2: And then I took a big sink, I cover, and I
712
00:32:36,201 --> 00:32:37,864
Speaker 2: started to light a cigarette.
713
00:32:38,885 --> 00:32:41,850
Speaker 2: And I was doing the cigarette in silk, you
714
00:32:41,890 --> 00:32:45,343
Speaker 2: know, with my thumb from the boxing glove,
715
00:32:45,643 --> 00:32:47,568
Speaker 2: you know, just getting.
716
00:32:49,619 --> 00:32:51,405
Speaker 2: And then I said, why not to do card
717
00:32:51,425 --> 00:32:52,207
Speaker 2: manipulation?
718
00:32:53,337 --> 00:32:57,759
Speaker 2: And I started, you know, and first I had
719
00:32:57,839 --> 00:33:01,304
Speaker 2: really, like the John Cornelius, vanishing
720
00:33:01,404 --> 00:33:04,027
Speaker 2: nickel, you know, I wanted, with a thread
721
00:33:04,748 --> 00:33:06,891
Speaker 2: to make the card vanish and reappear.
722
00:33:07,576 --> 00:33:10,283
Speaker 2: And then I say, but it's stupid, because I
723
00:33:10,323 --> 00:33:12,268
Speaker 2: can fake the gloves, of course, you know.
724
00:33:13,095 --> 00:33:15,043
Speaker 2: And that's how I started, you know.
725
00:33:15,215 --> 00:33:18,661
Speaker 2: And then I was showing this to my friend,
726
00:33:18,701 --> 00:33:20,564
Speaker 2: christian Feschner, and say you know,
727
00:33:20,784 --> 00:33:23,468
Speaker 2: that's great, but keep the manipulation
728
00:33:23,569 --> 00:33:27,102
Speaker 2: card, that's it, you don't need to complete
729
00:33:27,263 --> 00:33:27,765
Speaker 2: act with it.
730
00:33:29,177 --> 00:33:30,702
Speaker 2: So that's how it developed.
731
00:33:30,742 --> 00:33:32,960
Speaker 2: You know, just by watching this guy doing,
732
00:33:33,041 --> 00:33:34,725
Speaker 2: what can I do with this?
733
00:33:34,846 --> 00:33:39,843
Speaker 2: You know, not to copy him at all, but to
734
00:33:40,023 --> 00:33:41,948
Speaker 2: use this because the prop is funny, you
735
00:33:41,988 --> 00:33:42,088
Speaker 2: know.
736
00:33:45,259 --> 00:33:45,680
Speaker 1: Is that?
737
00:33:45,860 --> 00:33:50,088
Speaker 1: How many of the objects that end up in your
738
00:33:50,268 --> 00:33:50,830
Speaker 1: act are there?
739
00:33:50,975 --> 00:33:53,182
Speaker 1: Because you think you know it sounds like a
740
00:33:53,443 --> 00:33:55,565
Speaker 1: couple of the both this conversation and
741
00:33:55,585 --> 00:33:57,396
Speaker 1: the conversation about creativity sort of
742
00:33:57,436 --> 00:34:00,145
Speaker 1: sound like it starts with what do I do with
743
00:34:00,205 --> 00:34:00,526
Speaker 1: this?
744
00:34:00,975 --> 00:34:02,621
Speaker 1: You know what is the object?
745
00:34:03,123 --> 00:34:06,645
Speaker 2: Yeah, sometimes it just it's a command, you
746
00:34:06,705 --> 00:34:09,200
Speaker 2: know, because when I was doing a lot of
747
00:34:09,782 --> 00:34:11,978
Speaker 2: trade show or thing like that, I never did
748
00:34:12,038 --> 00:34:14,400
Speaker 2: a lot of trade shows, but when I was doing
749
00:34:14,440 --> 00:34:17,501
Speaker 2: that, people went with a new project and
750
00:34:17,541 --> 00:34:20,415
Speaker 2: said do something with that, you know, and
751
00:34:20,496 --> 00:34:23,341
Speaker 2: could be a new printer, could be a
752
00:34:23,421 --> 00:34:24,984
Speaker 2: caterpillar, could be.
753
00:34:25,465 --> 00:34:26,607
Speaker 2: You have no idea, you know.
754
00:34:26,727 --> 00:34:28,370
Speaker 2: And then you need to do things.
755
00:34:29,396 --> 00:34:33,046
Speaker 2: So because you need to do, you do it, you
756
00:34:33,146 --> 00:34:33,427
Speaker 2: know.
757
00:34:35,118 --> 00:34:38,127
Speaker 1: What about creativity in presentation,
758
00:34:38,756 --> 00:34:41,237
Speaker 1: about what it is that you talk about or how
759
00:34:41,298 --> 00:34:42,523
Speaker 1: it is that you present it?
760
00:34:42,635 --> 00:34:43,901
Speaker 1: How do you think about that?
761
00:34:44,175 --> 00:34:45,561
Speaker 2: You know this, I don't know.
762
00:34:45,695 --> 00:34:49,345
Speaker 2: I think I have, I think, a good sense of
763
00:34:49,426 --> 00:34:54,224
Speaker 2: humor and I think I'm pretty funny guy, so
764
00:34:54,385 --> 00:34:54,846
Speaker 2: it helps.
765
00:34:55,476 --> 00:34:59,199
Speaker 2: I've seen a lot of very good inventors or
766
00:34:59,824 --> 00:35:02,900
Speaker 2: so-called inventors, but they are not funny
767
00:35:02,980 --> 00:35:05,046
Speaker 2: or they don't know how to present really,
768
00:35:05,495 --> 00:35:07,222
Speaker 2: so it's much more difficult for them.
769
00:35:08,436 --> 00:35:12,344
Speaker 2: I think really again, even now I feel like
770
00:35:12,444 --> 00:35:17,160
Speaker 2: I'm a boy, a young boy, I mean, I'm a baby,
771
00:35:17,260 --> 00:35:20,346
Speaker 2: you know, I'm playing with my tools, with
772
00:35:20,407 --> 00:35:21,709
Speaker 2: my toys, you know.
773
00:35:22,415 --> 00:35:25,625
Speaker 2: Yeah, I just turned this year, I turned 70,
774
00:35:25,685 --> 00:35:29,042
Speaker 2: you know, but for me it's like I'm 15, you
775
00:35:29,082 --> 00:35:30,225
Speaker 2: know, in my mind you know.
776
00:35:30,245 --> 00:35:30,326
Speaker 1: Wow.
777
00:35:31,595 --> 00:35:33,638
Speaker 1: I want to talk more about the presentation,
778
00:35:33,718 --> 00:35:37,524
Speaker 1: because I think that it's interesting to be
779
00:35:37,604 --> 00:35:41,689
Speaker 1: able to get every part of this process from
780
00:35:41,729 --> 00:35:42,350
Speaker 1: how you do it.
781
00:35:42,390 --> 00:35:44,499
Speaker 1: So I think the the creativity part is very
782
00:35:44,559 --> 00:35:44,880
Speaker 1: clear.
783
00:35:45,280 --> 00:35:46,784
Speaker 1: You know, starting with an object that
784
00:35:46,884 --> 00:35:49,116
Speaker 1: excites your interest, you and just playing
785
00:35:49,156 --> 00:35:51,781
Speaker 1: and playing with it, then you say, okay, I
786
00:35:51,862 --> 00:35:55,589
Speaker 1: have, I have this object, I have this trick.
787
00:35:55,669 --> 00:35:56,877
Speaker 1: I think it's really interesting.
788
00:35:57,618 --> 00:35:59,742
Speaker 1: Do you do you write are?
789
00:35:59,842 --> 00:36:02,087
Speaker 1: Do you write in terms of what you're going
790
00:36:02,107 --> 00:36:03,569
Speaker 1: to say, like, do you write a script?
791
00:36:03,775 --> 00:36:06,865
Speaker 2: No, I never did that I never script, really,
792
00:36:07,555 --> 00:36:12,748
Speaker 2: but I was scripting in my mind very early.
793
00:36:12,915 --> 00:36:15,202
Speaker 2: I was thinking, oh, I will talk about this
794
00:36:15,262 --> 00:36:18,018
Speaker 2: topic or this or that, and I will.
795
00:36:18,559 --> 00:36:20,805
Speaker 2: I was taking the underground or the bus or
796
00:36:20,846 --> 00:36:24,924
Speaker 2: whatever, and I was repeating where I
797
00:36:24,964 --> 00:36:28,160
Speaker 2: wanted to go, you know, and imagining the
798
00:36:28,260 --> 00:36:30,146
Speaker 2: moment where I will be in front of the
799
00:36:30,226 --> 00:36:30,567
Speaker 2: audience.
800
00:36:30,675 --> 00:36:34,306
Speaker 2: But the first time it was just wow, you
801
00:36:34,346 --> 00:36:34,526
Speaker 2: know.
802
00:36:35,956 --> 00:36:38,780
Speaker 2: And then if you have the chance to walk,
803
00:36:38,860 --> 00:36:40,983
Speaker 2: and more and more and more, after two,
804
00:36:41,083 --> 00:36:44,248
Speaker 2: three, four times, you know you have seen
805
00:36:44,829 --> 00:36:49,157
Speaker 2: the clink or you forget that, and it
806
00:36:49,197 --> 00:36:51,762
Speaker 2: doesn't take long before.
807
00:36:51,882 --> 00:36:58,940
Speaker 2: For me it just kind of falls in place and
808
00:36:59,261 --> 00:37:00,806
Speaker 2: that's about the patter.
809
00:37:01,575 --> 00:37:05,145
Speaker 2: Also, there was an American magician I've
810
00:37:05,185 --> 00:37:05,667
Speaker 2: never met.
811
00:37:05,755 --> 00:37:07,993
Speaker 2: He was dead before I came to the Magic
812
00:37:08,033 --> 00:37:12,437
Speaker 2: Castle, but his name was Lou Derman and he
813
00:37:12,477 --> 00:37:16,527
Speaker 2: said at the time in the 60s, 70s, he said
814
00:37:18,058 --> 00:37:23,259
Speaker 2: when you walk, tape your pattern, tape your
815
00:37:23,279 --> 00:37:24,844
Speaker 2: show, tape it.
816
00:37:25,315 --> 00:37:28,237
Speaker 2: He was not talking about filming, it was
817
00:37:28,297 --> 00:37:31,177
Speaker 2: just about the sound, you know, and you
818
00:37:31,217 --> 00:37:35,326
Speaker 2: will know why they laugh right there, why
819
00:37:35,366 --> 00:37:36,088
Speaker 2: they don't laugh.
820
00:37:37,336 --> 00:37:41,044
Speaker 2: And every day, after every show he was just
821
00:37:41,144 --> 00:37:44,976
Speaker 2: listening to the last show, you know, and
822
00:37:45,016 --> 00:37:47,244
Speaker 2: I'm sure I know that people like
823
00:37:47,284 --> 00:37:47,986
Speaker 2: Copperfield.
824
00:37:48,006 --> 00:37:49,010
Speaker 2: They still do that.
825
00:37:49,070 --> 00:37:49,391
Speaker 2: You know.
826
00:37:49,411 --> 00:37:50,374
Speaker 2: They film every show.
827
00:37:50,655 --> 00:37:53,558
Speaker 2: They debrief after, and that's a way you
828
00:37:53,578 --> 00:37:54,940
Speaker 2: know how to improve very, very fastly.
829
00:37:54,980 --> 00:37:57,923
Speaker 2: You know how to improve very, very fastly.
830
00:37:58,344 --> 00:38:00,907
Speaker 2: You know, and now it's so easy.
831
00:38:01,287 --> 00:38:04,751
Speaker 2: It's so easy with your, you know, with your
832
00:38:04,811 --> 00:38:10,139
Speaker 2: phone you can film you and.
833
00:38:10,179 --> 00:38:11,021
Speaker 2: But that's so important because the best
834
00:38:11,041 --> 00:38:13,607
Speaker 2: ideas for me happen by chance.
835
00:38:13,887 --> 00:38:16,741
Speaker 2: One day, boom, especially if you work with
836
00:38:16,801 --> 00:38:19,762
Speaker 2: people, if you work with assisting
837
00:38:19,823 --> 00:38:20,525
Speaker 2: spectators.
838
00:38:23,258 --> 00:38:25,584
Speaker 2: One day they found something, they do
839
00:38:25,624 --> 00:38:27,956
Speaker 2: something by chance, wow.
840
00:38:28,197 --> 00:38:29,282
Speaker 2: And you have to keep this.
841
00:38:32,178 --> 00:38:36,307
Speaker 2: If you don't note it, maybe at the end of
842
00:38:36,347 --> 00:38:38,780
Speaker 2: the act you say, ah shit, he did something
843
00:38:38,840 --> 00:38:39,121
Speaker 2: funny.
844
00:38:39,161 --> 00:38:41,026
Speaker 2: I don't remember now.
845
00:38:42,044 --> 00:38:47,540
Speaker 2: So the more you can tape or record, the
846
00:38:47,600 --> 00:38:52,742
Speaker 2: best it is to keep this moment and try to
847
00:38:53,399 --> 00:38:58,409
Speaker 2: react it after you know it's helping me get
848
00:38:58,449 --> 00:39:01,243
Speaker 2: a full picture of what it looks like.
849
00:39:01,435 --> 00:39:03,743
Speaker 1: You know thinking about an object, putting
850
00:39:03,823 --> 00:39:06,673
Speaker 1: down the notes of what it could do working
851
00:39:06,713 --> 00:39:07,215
Speaker 1: in the workshop.
852
00:39:07,516 --> 00:39:09,600
Speaker 1: Once you have something that sort of looks
853
00:39:09,620 --> 00:39:12,666
Speaker 1: like it works, you mentally map out how
854
00:39:12,726 --> 00:39:15,119
Speaker 1: you're presenting and speaking and then you
855
00:39:15,179 --> 00:39:17,251
Speaker 1: put it on stage and record it two or three
856
00:39:17,291 --> 00:39:19,881
Speaker 1: or four times and now you know what needs
857
00:39:19,961 --> 00:39:20,302
Speaker 1: to be.
858
00:39:20,322 --> 00:39:22,437
Speaker 2: Oh, yeah and and yeah, I don't.
859
00:39:22,817 --> 00:39:25,964
Speaker 2: What I really don't like at all is when you
860
00:39:26,064 --> 00:39:29,036
Speaker 2: realize that the magician talking to you is
861
00:39:29,156 --> 00:39:30,238
Speaker 2: reciting something.
862
00:39:31,059 --> 00:39:33,043
Speaker 2: Hate that, it's not my.
863
00:39:33,423 --> 00:39:35,928
Speaker 2: Some people they do it well, you know, but
864
00:39:36,268 --> 00:39:39,420
Speaker 2: most of the time I don't like that, you
865
00:39:39,480 --> 00:39:42,425
Speaker 2: know I I much when it looks spontaneous,
866
00:39:42,806 --> 00:39:44,589
Speaker 2: like it's an event on the spot.
867
00:39:45,498 --> 00:39:48,026
Speaker 2: And I add that also as to be short.
868
00:39:50,918 --> 00:39:56,127
Speaker 2: If you remember Al Gauchman, it was a
869
00:39:56,187 --> 00:39:59,261
Speaker 2: school of being short, say go, gone too
870
00:39:59,301 --> 00:39:59,562
Speaker 2: late.
871
00:40:00,735 --> 00:40:02,279
Speaker 2: It was not complete big sentence, it was
872
00:40:02,233 --> 00:40:02,474
Speaker 2: boom.
873
00:40:02,429 --> 00:40:02,971
Speaker 2: School of being short, say go, gone too
874
00:40:02,925 --> 00:40:03,005
Speaker 2: late.
875
00:40:02,960 --> 00:40:03,361
Speaker 2: You know, it was not complete big sentence,
876
00:40:03,455 --> 00:40:04,299
Speaker 2: it was boom, boom.
877
00:40:04,995 --> 00:40:06,141
Speaker 2: It's right, the rhythm.
878
00:40:08,204 --> 00:40:10,133
Speaker 1: Are you talking about the trick needs to be
879
00:40:10,194 --> 00:40:12,363
Speaker 1: short or the presentation needs to be short?
880
00:40:13,316 --> 00:40:14,018
Speaker 2: The pattern.
881
00:40:14,219 --> 00:40:16,326
Speaker 2: If you have pattern, it has to be boom
882
00:40:17,735 --> 00:40:18,337
Speaker 2: Sentences.
883
00:40:18,457 --> 00:40:20,683
Speaker 2: No big blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
884
00:40:20,863 --> 00:40:22,487
Speaker 2: No big stories, I don't think so.
885
00:40:24,317 --> 00:40:25,803
Speaker 2: Also, I have some heroes.
886
00:40:26,376 --> 00:40:27,702
Speaker 2: You were talking about heroes.
887
00:40:28,436 --> 00:40:34,159
Speaker 2: One man I really love to watch and for me,
888
00:40:34,240 --> 00:40:37,841
Speaker 2: a master of rhythm is George Carle.
889
00:40:39,015 --> 00:40:41,643
Speaker 2: George Carle is a big clown.
890
00:40:42,004 --> 00:40:45,222
Speaker 2: He's not a magician, but he was doing the
891
00:40:45,315 --> 00:40:48,902
Speaker 2: crazy horse for many years and nobody could
892
00:40:49,336 --> 00:40:51,244
Speaker 2: go after this guy Nobody.
893
00:40:51,435 --> 00:40:52,578
Speaker 2: He had to finish the show.
894
00:40:52,758 --> 00:40:55,866
Speaker 2: George Carl, carl, yes, with a.
895
00:40:55,947 --> 00:40:55,967
Speaker 1: C.
896
00:40:56,496 --> 00:40:59,004
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, c-a-r-l.
897
00:41:01,056 --> 00:41:03,605
Speaker 2: Yeah, George Carl was a very unique clown.
898
00:41:04,076 --> 00:41:07,666
Speaker 2: If you go on YouTube you will find his act.
899
00:41:07,835 --> 00:41:11,085
Speaker 2: He had different acts but it ends.
900
00:41:11,175 --> 00:41:13,704
Speaker 2: That's where I get the microphone idea,
901
00:41:15,858 --> 00:41:19,205
Speaker 2: because his whole act is to get tangled
902
00:41:19,486 --> 00:41:20,788
Speaker 2: with the cable of the mic.
903
00:41:21,035 --> 00:41:26,763
Speaker 2: You know he's doing no magic, but it's very
904
00:41:26,803 --> 00:41:28,447
Speaker 2: difficult to describe the act.
905
00:41:28,575 --> 00:41:30,703
Speaker 2: But he has problems with everything.
906
00:41:31,655 --> 00:41:35,064
Speaker 2: He's clumsy as you can be clumsy, but in
907
00:41:35,184 --> 00:41:36,307
Speaker 2: such a funny way.
908
00:41:36,936 --> 00:41:40,342
Speaker 2: And when I saw him I said what can I do
909
00:41:41,024 --> 00:41:44,210
Speaker 2: with a microphone being magical, you know,
910
00:41:45,015 --> 00:41:49,284
Speaker 2: and not copying george karl, of course, um,
911
00:41:50,126 --> 00:41:55,997
Speaker 2: and about talking, one hero for me is a
912
00:41:56,058 --> 00:41:56,578
Speaker 2: pianist.
913
00:41:57,620 --> 00:42:02,266
Speaker 2: He was a huge, huge star in Denmark for
914
00:42:02,326 --> 00:42:03,047
Speaker 2: many years.
915
00:42:03,688 --> 00:42:09,100
Speaker 2: He died very, very late and but he was, I
916
00:42:09,200 --> 00:42:09,901
Speaker 2: knew after.
917
00:42:10,002 --> 00:42:13,887
Speaker 2: But if you know Fred Capps, of course,
918
00:42:13,927 --> 00:42:17,156
Speaker 2: great Fred Capps, but Fred Capps took a lot
919
00:42:17,217 --> 00:42:19,820
Speaker 2: from him about talking.
920
00:42:20,781 --> 00:42:23,365
Speaker 2: His delivery, the way he was talking was
921
00:42:23,525 --> 00:42:27,450
Speaker 2: really influenced by Victor Borger, another
922
00:42:27,530 --> 00:42:28,011
Speaker 2: big guy.
923
00:42:30,515 --> 00:42:32,542
Speaker 2: So if you take all the best, you know, all
924
00:42:32,562 --> 00:42:35,652
Speaker 2: these big guys are your heroes.
925
00:42:36,015 --> 00:42:36,979
Speaker 2: They inspire you.
926
00:42:37,160 --> 00:42:37,542
Speaker 2: You know.
927
00:42:38,476 --> 00:42:42,164
Speaker 1: I want to talk a little bit more about this
928
00:42:42,304 --> 00:42:45,638
Speaker 1: idea of creativity, but in a different lens,
929
00:42:45,718 --> 00:42:47,865
Speaker 1: which is, you know, a lot of times you see
930
00:42:47,925 --> 00:42:51,481
Speaker 1: magicians myself included, that will do.
931
00:42:52,383 --> 00:42:54,936
Speaker 1: Let's call it the classics, you know, but
932
00:42:54,976 --> 00:42:56,242
Speaker 1: they look like the classics.
933
00:42:56,315 --> 00:42:59,364
Speaker 1: You see cups and balls, maybe with cups and
934
00:42:59,404 --> 00:42:59,685
Speaker 1: balls.
935
00:42:59,805 --> 00:43:00,989
Speaker 1: You know, it's not with shoes and lemons.
936
00:43:00,912 --> 00:43:00,992
Speaker 1: It's.
937
00:43:00,914 --> 00:43:01,533
Speaker 1: See cups and balls, maybe with cups and
938
00:43:01,456 --> 00:43:01,597
Speaker 1: balls.
939
00:43:01,519 --> 00:43:02,835
Speaker 1: You know, it's not with shoes and and and
940
00:43:02,976 --> 00:43:04,480
Speaker 1: lemons, it's with cups and balls.
941
00:43:05,101 --> 00:43:06,926
Speaker 1: And you see a card trick and it's just a
942
00:43:06,966 --> 00:43:08,198
Speaker 1: card trick, maybe with a with a
943
00:43:08,238 --> 00:43:08,901
Speaker 1: presentation.
944
00:43:09,604 --> 00:43:11,370
Speaker 1: There's some magicians who I speak to that
945
00:43:11,531 --> 00:43:13,538
Speaker 1: they maybe, whether they're talking about
946
00:43:13,658 --> 00:43:14,862
Speaker 1: other people or they're talking about
947
00:43:14,882 --> 00:43:16,796
Speaker 1: themselves, they say they don't like this.
948
00:43:16,936 --> 00:43:19,641
Speaker 1: It needs to be original, it needs to be
949
00:43:19,822 --> 00:43:22,206
Speaker 1: unique, it needs to be special.
950
00:43:22,607 --> 00:43:27,498
Speaker 1: Do you feel that, like, do you feel that
951
00:43:27,518 --> 00:43:28,486
Speaker 1: you only do stuff on stage that you created
952
00:43:28,526 --> 00:43:30,618
Speaker 1: or you came up with, or do you think that's
953
00:43:30,638 --> 00:43:32,565
Speaker 1: the way it should be, or you don't care?
954
00:43:33,555 --> 00:43:37,986
Speaker 2: Since I was very young, I had the love to
955
00:43:38,086 --> 00:43:38,988
Speaker 2: fool magicians.
956
00:43:39,457 --> 00:43:42,362
Speaker 2: I love that, I love that, I love that idea.
957
00:43:42,382 --> 00:43:45,643
Speaker 2: You know, I mean to do maybe a standard
958
00:43:45,723 --> 00:43:50,419
Speaker 2: effect, but with a new method, just to fool
959
00:43:50,439 --> 00:43:52,878
Speaker 2: them like a sneaky boy, you know, like a
960
00:43:52,898 --> 00:43:53,360
Speaker 2: bad guy.
961
00:43:55,200 --> 00:43:57,261
Speaker 2: No, no, no, no, no, no, it's not that you
962
00:43:57,281 --> 00:43:57,381
Speaker 2: know.
963
00:43:57,756 --> 00:44:01,961
Speaker 2: And most of my magic, in fact, I go back to
964
00:44:02,062 --> 00:44:04,902
Speaker 2: a normal trick, except the method is
965
00:44:04,942 --> 00:44:05,263
Speaker 2: different.
966
00:44:05,595 --> 00:44:09,985
Speaker 2: And I started when I had the chance to have
967
00:44:10,065 --> 00:44:12,840
Speaker 2: access to the tar bell, the complete tar
968
00:44:12,860 --> 00:44:15,561
Speaker 2: bell, when I was 17,.
969
00:44:16,202 --> 00:44:18,387
Speaker 2: I bought a complete set of the tar bell.
970
00:44:18,467 --> 00:44:21,521
Speaker 2: At the time, the first thing I did was to
971
00:44:21,621 --> 00:44:26,497
Speaker 2: read the effect, not the explanation, and
972
00:44:26,597 --> 00:44:28,364
Speaker 2: it's still something you can do.
973
00:44:28,835 --> 00:44:31,616
Speaker 2: I mean, you read the effect and say, okay,
974
00:44:31,636 --> 00:44:33,523
Speaker 2: I have to find a solution for me.
975
00:44:34,595 --> 00:44:35,841
Speaker 2: How can I do that?
976
00:44:35,921 --> 00:44:40,539
Speaker 2: You know, because now you know that's one
977
00:44:40,579 --> 00:44:43,238
Speaker 2: of the problems we have now is that we see
978
00:44:43,298 --> 00:44:46,386
Speaker 2: something on the internet, wow, and you
979
00:44:46,947 --> 00:44:50,340
Speaker 2: click, you buy the explanation right now,
980
00:44:50,461 --> 00:44:53,047
Speaker 2: bing bing, and okay, what next?
981
00:44:53,856 --> 00:44:56,404
Speaker 2: So you have no time to think how it could
982
00:44:56,444 --> 00:44:56,725
Speaker 2: work.
983
00:44:56,845 --> 00:44:59,067
Speaker 2: You know, you just jump to the solution and
984
00:44:59,087 --> 00:45:01,160
Speaker 2: then to the next trick, and that's not the
985
00:45:01,200 --> 00:45:02,771
Speaker 2: way to go, I think.
986
00:45:03,415 --> 00:45:06,173
Speaker 2: But you know some of the tricks really are.
987
00:45:08,339 --> 00:45:14,092
Speaker 2: And also we forget that we have to try to
988
00:45:14,172 --> 00:45:15,195
Speaker 2: forget how it works.
989
00:45:17,642 --> 00:45:20,291
Speaker 2: For instance, one of the very first trick I
990
00:45:21,014 --> 00:45:24,395
Speaker 2: was happy with is to buy the China sticks.
991
00:45:26,681 --> 00:45:30,711
Speaker 2: I remember I was sick in bed and my mom
992
00:45:30,731 --> 00:45:35,330
Speaker 2: came back from Mayette with a set of
993
00:45:35,470 --> 00:45:39,603
Speaker 2: Chinese sticks the small version and had
994
00:45:39,803 --> 00:45:41,507
Speaker 2: ideas how it could work.
995
00:45:42,877 --> 00:45:48,807
Speaker 2: When I saw the real explanation, wow, maybe
996
00:45:48,847 --> 00:45:51,360
Speaker 2: for the first time, I said this is clever.
997
00:45:51,521 --> 00:45:53,408
Speaker 2: This is completely clever, because
998
00:45:53,870 --> 00:45:56,561
Speaker 2: everybody is thinking it must be a thread
999
00:45:56,621 --> 00:45:57,082
Speaker 2: or something.
1000
00:45:57,223 --> 00:46:00,041
Speaker 2: No, and so we all know how it works.
1001
00:46:00,503 --> 00:46:00,784
Speaker 2: You know.
1002
00:46:01,495 --> 00:46:05,922
Speaker 2: But I always say OK, now if we don't know
1003
00:46:06,964 --> 00:46:10,249
Speaker 2: how it could work in a new way.
1004
00:46:10,289 --> 00:46:13,482
Speaker 2: You know, and it's the same for the Chinese
1005
00:46:13,522 --> 00:46:15,702
Speaker 2: sticks, it's the same for the linking rings,
1006
00:46:16,716 --> 00:46:19,422
Speaker 2: can be the same for the cups and balls, you
1007
00:46:19,482 --> 00:46:21,888
Speaker 2: know, and et cetera, et cetera.
1008
00:46:22,215 --> 00:46:25,785
Speaker 2: Forget the normal trick and try to find
1009
00:46:25,885 --> 00:46:26,407
Speaker 2: something new.
1010
00:46:26,896 --> 00:46:29,818
Speaker 2: Sometimes it doesn't work, sometimes the
1011
00:46:29,959 --> 00:46:33,567
Speaker 2: old method is the best and still the best.
1012
00:46:33,607 --> 00:46:37,403
Speaker 2: You know, for instance, when I found my way
1013
00:46:37,443 --> 00:46:40,752
Speaker 2: to do the lasso rope, you know, the card, I
1014
00:46:40,792 --> 00:46:43,217
Speaker 2: was really thinking first to have a very
1015
00:46:43,318 --> 00:46:46,964
Speaker 2: complex machine inside the hat, like a rat
1016
00:46:47,025 --> 00:46:50,619
Speaker 2: trap, kind of making the knot, you know,
1017
00:46:50,719 --> 00:46:52,887
Speaker 2: and I told I was very good friend at the
1018
00:46:52,927 --> 00:46:55,627
Speaker 2: time with Jeff Busby from America and I was
1019
00:46:55,694 --> 00:46:58,150
Speaker 2: working since one month on the on the thing,
1020
00:46:58,190 --> 00:46:59,475
Speaker 2: and I was working since one month on the
1021
00:46:59,937 --> 00:47:03,583
Speaker 2: thing and it was not really working well,
1022
00:47:03,775 --> 00:47:04,278
Speaker 2: and it was.
1023
00:47:04,478 --> 00:47:06,840
Speaker 2: You know, I had the big machine in the hat
1024
00:47:06,921 --> 00:47:07,463
Speaker 2: and all that.
1025
00:47:08,499 --> 00:47:11,251
Speaker 2: And Jeff told me I hope, gaetan, it's not
1026
00:47:11,372 --> 00:47:13,854
Speaker 2: something very complex like a collector
1027
00:47:14,116 --> 00:47:17,055
Speaker 2: workshop prop or very expensive.
1028
00:47:17,978 --> 00:47:19,102
Speaker 2: No, no, of course not.
1029
00:47:19,222 --> 00:47:21,323
Speaker 2: And it was, it was completely.
1030
00:47:22,329 --> 00:47:24,800
Speaker 2: And so in the night I said shit must be a
1031
00:47:24,881 --> 00:47:27,041
Speaker 2: simple way, a simple way.
1032
00:47:28,139 --> 00:47:30,560
Speaker 2: And then I found that I could cut the hat
1033
00:47:30,680 --> 00:47:33,980
Speaker 2: and just put my finger inside and make the
1034
00:47:34,020 --> 00:47:34,542
Speaker 2: trick work.
1035
00:47:36,141 --> 00:47:38,682
Speaker 2: And that's it we go back to.
1036
00:47:39,698 --> 00:47:41,824
Speaker 2: It's very difficult to find something
1037
00:47:41,905 --> 00:47:42,286
Speaker 2: simple.
1038
00:47:43,255 --> 00:47:44,441
Speaker 2: That's the most difficult.
1039
00:47:47,158 --> 00:47:50,184
Speaker 2: It's quite easy to find something very
1040
00:47:50,244 --> 00:47:52,949
Speaker 2: electronic or very, very elaborate.
1041
00:47:53,555 --> 00:47:56,978
Speaker 2: But to cut down to the essence of the trick
1042
00:47:57,138 --> 00:48:00,122
Speaker 2: that Vernon was always saying If you need
1043
00:48:00,183 --> 00:48:02,281
Speaker 2: three moves to the trick, it's good, if you
1044
00:48:02,321 --> 00:48:04,943
Speaker 2: need only two, it's better, and if you get
1045
00:48:04,983 --> 00:48:06,870
Speaker 2: rid of the last one you have a miracle, you
1046
00:48:06,890 --> 00:48:06,990
Speaker 2: know.
1047
00:48:08,741 --> 00:48:11,169
Speaker 2: And so it's the same with any trick.
1048
00:48:12,701 --> 00:48:15,711
Speaker 2: Go to the simplification.
1049
00:48:16,221 --> 00:48:19,209
Speaker 1: The least that you can do it's not easy to
1050
00:48:19,249 --> 00:48:19,874
Speaker 1: be simple.
1051
00:48:20,080 --> 00:48:21,868
Speaker 2: It's not easy to be simple.
1052
00:48:23,863 --> 00:48:25,527
Speaker 1: What's the quote I would have?
1053
00:48:25,908 --> 00:48:28,162
Speaker 1: I, I, I wrote you a paragraph cause I
1054
00:48:28,182 --> 00:48:29,526
Speaker 1: didn't have the time to write you a
1055
00:48:29,586 --> 00:48:30,068
Speaker 1: sentence.
1056
00:48:30,368 --> 00:48:31,030
Speaker 1: I'm getting it.
1057
00:48:31,130 --> 00:48:32,544
Speaker 1: I'm saying the quote wrong, but it's
1058
00:48:32,564 --> 00:48:33,348
Speaker 1: something like that.
1059
00:48:33,428 --> 00:48:35,498
Speaker 1: You know, I wrote it in a paragraph, I
1060
00:48:35,538 --> 00:48:36,942
Speaker 1: didn't have the time to write it in one
1061
00:48:36,982 --> 00:48:37,422
Speaker 1: sentence.
1062
00:48:37,663 --> 00:48:38,964
Speaker 1: Okay, let's talk.
1063
00:48:39,005 --> 00:48:41,668
Speaker 1: We talked a bit about the inspiration for
1064
00:48:41,869 --> 00:48:44,072
Speaker 1: the boxing gloves and the inspiration for
1065
00:48:44,232 --> 00:48:47,081
Speaker 1: the microphone cord with the scissors.
1066
00:48:47,662 --> 00:48:50,007
Speaker 1: I want to hear about how the pamplemousse
1067
00:48:50,408 --> 00:48:51,510
Speaker 1: trick came to be.
1068
00:48:52,192 --> 00:48:53,320
Speaker 1: How did that come to be?
1069
00:48:54,281 --> 00:48:55,483
Speaker 2: oh, that's a funny one.
1070
00:48:55,623 --> 00:48:57,005
Speaker 2: That's a very funny one.
1071
00:48:57,785 --> 00:48:58,466
Speaker 2: In fact.
1072
00:48:58,767 --> 00:48:59,748
Speaker 2: I was working.
1073
00:49:00,068 --> 00:49:04,653
Speaker 2: I always loved the, the canary and the
1074
00:49:04,814 --> 00:49:09,324
Speaker 2: orange and the pomplamoose, because I saw
1075
00:49:09,545 --> 00:49:13,653
Speaker 2: Richard E Jr many years ago at the Olympia
1076
00:49:13,693 --> 00:49:14,294
Speaker 2: doing that.
1077
00:49:14,500 --> 00:49:17,810
Speaker 2: I said, wow, that's a beautiful trick.
1078
00:49:20,002 --> 00:49:24,991
Speaker 2: And my first idea was to use a blender, a
1079
00:49:25,031 --> 00:49:26,915
Speaker 2: grinder, you know.
1080
00:49:27,420 --> 00:49:31,289
Speaker 2: So one card chosen and I put the card with
1081
00:49:31,350 --> 00:49:35,629
Speaker 2: some water in the blender, minus one corner.
1082
00:49:36,200 --> 00:49:40,527
Speaker 2: Then I cut orange and the kiwi, and then
1083
00:49:40,584 --> 00:49:45,266
Speaker 2: the pamplemousse and the kiwi, and then the
1084
00:49:45,286 --> 00:49:49,891
Speaker 2: pamplemousse, and then my idea was to grab
1085
00:49:49,951 --> 00:49:54,216
Speaker 2: the bowl, you know, full of all that liquid
1086
00:49:54,696 --> 00:49:58,804
Speaker 2: and say now watch One, two, three, and I
1087
00:49:58,884 --> 00:50:01,663
Speaker 2: throw the thing in the air and the liquid
1088
00:50:02,186 --> 00:50:04,275
Speaker 2: when it falls back, it's back to the
1089
00:50:04,315 --> 00:50:04,978
Speaker 2: pamplemousse, mm.
1090
00:50:06,024 --> 00:50:09,926
Speaker 2: So 100% visual, you know, pshh.
1091
00:50:11,785 --> 00:50:11,926
Speaker 2: And.
1092
00:50:12,147 --> 00:50:14,336
Speaker 2: But I bought 10 blenders.
1093
00:50:14,356 --> 00:50:19,677
Speaker 2: It was leaking and I never went through,
1094
00:50:19,717 --> 00:50:19,938
Speaker 2: you know.
1095
00:50:19,958 --> 00:50:20,440
Speaker 2: And then I was working.
1096
00:50:21,910 --> 00:50:24,544
Speaker 2: I said I'm sure must be a solution, I have
1097
00:50:24,584 --> 00:50:26,170
Speaker 2: to find something.
1098
00:50:28,322 --> 00:50:30,502
Speaker 2: And I was working on the problem and then
1099
00:50:30,722 --> 00:50:34,841
Speaker 2: at the time I was in Las Vegas and Kevin
1100
00:50:34,861 --> 00:50:38,490
Speaker 2: James, my good friend, so good friend,
1101
00:50:38,550 --> 00:50:41,927
Speaker 2: kevin, told me oh, gaetan, I bought two
1102
00:50:41,987 --> 00:50:43,391
Speaker 2: tickets for you tonight.
1103
00:50:43,821 --> 00:50:48,964
Speaker 2: You have to go see this guy, his name is
1104
00:50:49,064 --> 00:50:49,627
Speaker 2: Gallagher.
1105
00:50:50,400 --> 00:50:51,686
Speaker 2: I said Gallagher, who is that?
1106
00:50:51,860 --> 00:50:53,988
Speaker 2: And I was with my girlfriend at the time,
1107
00:50:55,000 --> 00:50:59,428
Speaker 2: and so he said, oh, he's doing funny thing
1108
00:50:59,469 --> 00:51:01,653
Speaker 2: with watermelons and things like that.
1109
00:51:01,673 --> 00:51:04,683
Speaker 2: I said OK, ok, and so we arrived for the
1110
00:51:04,743 --> 00:51:08,873
Speaker 2: show and the room started to be dark, you
1111
00:51:08,913 --> 00:51:12,328
Speaker 2: know, and I asked have you I tip the maître
1112
00:51:12,368 --> 00:51:12,669
Speaker 2: d'?
1113
00:51:12,729 --> 00:51:13,572
Speaker 2: You know I tip him.
1114
00:51:13,720 --> 00:51:17,229
Speaker 2: I say you have a front row or something
1115
00:51:17,530 --> 00:51:17,810
Speaker 2: nice?
1116
00:51:18,051 --> 00:51:21,605
Speaker 2: Yeah, of course, and we're really nearly at
1117
00:51:21,645 --> 00:51:24,994
Speaker 2: the front first table, you know, and we're
1118
00:51:25,014 --> 00:51:27,360
Speaker 2: really nearly at the front first table, you
1119
00:51:27,380 --> 00:51:32,361
Speaker 2: know, and during this I see the people they
1120
00:51:32,381 --> 00:51:33,022
Speaker 2: are like wearing like raincoats.
1121
00:51:33,042 --> 00:51:33,883
Speaker 2: I said what is that?
1122
00:51:34,084 --> 00:51:35,025
Speaker 2: What's going on there?
1123
00:51:36,326 --> 00:51:37,208
Speaker 2: And it stopped.
1124
00:51:37,268 --> 00:51:39,270
Speaker 2: And the guy, the Gallagher hunter, he's
1125
00:51:39,290 --> 00:51:41,653
Speaker 2: like an old EP, you know, gallagher.
1126
00:51:41,894 --> 00:51:44,757
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah yeah, yeah.
1127
00:51:50,220 --> 00:51:52,144
Speaker 2: So he enter, he has like a big frisbee, you
1128
00:51:52,164 --> 00:51:52,645
Speaker 2: know, in a bucket.
1129
00:51:52,685 --> 00:51:54,008
Speaker 2: He said hello guys, how are you tonight?
1130
00:51:54,108 --> 00:51:56,052
Speaker 2: And he's for the first frisbee and the
1131
00:51:56,113 --> 00:51:59,024
Speaker 2: frisbee is filled with water, you know.
1132
00:51:59,064 --> 00:52:02,308
Speaker 2: So he just shoom putting water all over the
1133
00:52:02,389 --> 00:52:02,629
Speaker 2: room.
1134
00:52:02,849 --> 00:52:05,233
Speaker 2: He has not one Frisbee, he has 10 of them
1135
00:52:05,293 --> 00:52:07,055
Speaker 2: in the bucket with ice water.
1136
00:52:08,200 --> 00:52:10,566
Speaker 2: And every time I say, oh, my God.
1137
00:52:10,667 --> 00:52:12,652
Speaker 2: Well, what is this show, you know?
1138
00:52:13,701 --> 00:52:18,058
Speaker 2: And at the end of the show he has smashed,
1139
00:52:18,199 --> 00:52:21,668
Speaker 2: you know, he has a big hammer and he
1140
00:52:21,748 --> 00:52:25,647
Speaker 2: smashed pamplemousse, he smashed watermelon,
1141
00:52:25,840 --> 00:52:28,649
Speaker 2: he smashed burgers and mayonnaise and
1142
00:52:28,769 --> 00:52:29,331
Speaker 2: ketchup.
1143
00:52:30,280 --> 00:52:33,565
Speaker 2: You can't walk in the room, you sleep on
1144
00:52:33,645 --> 00:52:34,970
Speaker 2: mayonnaise and everything.
1145
00:52:35,440 --> 00:52:37,507
Speaker 2: And everybody is laughing, you know, is
1146
00:52:37,587 --> 00:52:38,590
Speaker 2: laughing so hard.
1147
00:52:39,601 --> 00:52:44,028
Speaker 2: And during that night I was experiencing
1148
00:52:44,128 --> 00:52:46,772
Speaker 2: the power of smashing food.
1149
00:52:48,721 --> 00:52:52,124
Speaker 2: It's very bad taste, it's whatever, but
1150
00:52:52,244 --> 00:52:55,865
Speaker 2: it's funny and it gives you energy.
1151
00:52:58,904 --> 00:53:02,952
Speaker 2: And at that time I say I want to find again
1152
00:53:03,580 --> 00:53:05,448
Speaker 2: this kind of energy, you know.
1153
00:53:06,301 --> 00:53:09,760
Speaker 2: So I have to shop, not to cut nicely, I
1154
00:53:09,780 --> 00:53:13,129
Speaker 2: have to shop the thing, you know, whatever,
1155
00:53:13,149 --> 00:53:14,552
Speaker 2: the kiwi, whatever the thing.
1156
00:53:15,401 --> 00:53:19,531
Speaker 2: And then I say, okay, let's forget the
1157
00:53:19,591 --> 00:53:20,113
Speaker 2: blender.
1158
00:53:22,001 --> 00:53:24,926
Speaker 2: What can I use, you know, to make it normal.
1159
00:53:25,166 --> 00:53:30,274
Speaker 2: And I saw it took me a while to find a
1160
00:53:30,354 --> 00:53:35,473
Speaker 2: cardboard box, but that's a normal thing.
1161
00:53:36,276 --> 00:53:40,091
Speaker 2: A cardboard box, wow, because I don't want
1162
00:53:40,171 --> 00:53:42,400
Speaker 2: to enter with a dustbin or something.
1163
00:53:44,345 --> 00:53:46,511
Speaker 2: A dustbin has nothing to do on the stage,
1164
00:53:46,941 --> 00:53:50,809
Speaker 2: but a cardboard box can be on any stage, on
1165
00:53:51,030 --> 00:53:52,694
Speaker 2: any street, anything.
1166
00:53:53,321 --> 00:53:56,284
Speaker 2: It's a bad, it's nothing, it's not a magic
1167
00:53:56,324 --> 00:53:56,586
Speaker 2: prop.
1168
00:53:57,802 --> 00:54:01,237
Speaker 1: It sounds like a lot of the inspiration for
1169
00:54:01,297 --> 00:54:03,946
Speaker 1: your magic comes from watching other
1170
00:54:04,046 --> 00:54:05,912
Speaker 1: performers that are not mature.
1171
00:54:06,880 --> 00:54:10,650
Speaker 2: Yeah, and and and and can be singer, can be
1172
00:54:11,351 --> 00:54:16,422
Speaker 2: dancer, can be anything artistic, is is an
1173
00:54:16,522 --> 00:54:17,206
Speaker 2: inspiration.
1174
00:54:18,321 --> 00:54:20,526
Speaker 2: And then, after you have to bring your own
1175
00:54:21,247 --> 00:54:25,988
Speaker 2: craziness or knowledge of magic and make it
1176
00:54:26,200 --> 00:54:26,983
Speaker 2: make it your own.
1177
00:54:27,203 --> 00:54:28,507
Speaker 2: Yes, of course, of course.
1178
00:54:29,329 --> 00:54:31,925
Speaker 2: But you know, if you, if you see a Charlie
1179
00:54:32,025 --> 00:54:35,401
Speaker 2: Chaplin, if you see Buster Keaton, all the
1180
00:54:35,481 --> 00:54:39,472
Speaker 2: big old timer, if you see Orson Welles, you
1181
00:54:39,512 --> 00:54:42,047
Speaker 2: know, you learn, you learn a lot.
1182
00:54:42,649 --> 00:54:44,006
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's unbelievable and I think it's a
1183
00:54:44,026 --> 00:54:44,288
Speaker 1: good practice.
1184
00:54:44,308 --> 00:54:45,012
Speaker 1: You know, you learn, you learn a lot.
1185
00:54:45,032 --> 00:54:45,878
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's unbelievable and I think it's a
1186
00:54:45,898 --> 00:54:46,160
Speaker 1: good practice.
1187
00:54:46,380 --> 00:54:49,231
Speaker 1: You know, magicians often are inspired from
1188
00:54:49,291 --> 00:54:51,480
Speaker 1: each other, which is great, but it's really
1189
00:54:51,600 --> 00:54:53,751
Speaker 1: great to be inspired from things that are
1190
00:54:53,851 --> 00:54:55,620
Speaker 1: outside of the world of magic.
1191
00:54:55,781 --> 00:54:58,546
Speaker 2: I think that's the key, that's the absolute
1192
00:54:58,606 --> 00:54:58,807
Speaker 2: key.
1193
00:55:00,220 --> 00:55:01,626
Speaker 1: To get it from outside of the world of
1194
00:55:01,686 --> 00:55:02,028
Speaker 1: magic.
1195
00:55:02,900 --> 00:55:04,742
Speaker 1: One more, one more question and then we
1196
00:55:04,762 --> 00:55:07,664
Speaker 1: have some final wrap-up questions, but the
1197
00:55:08,785 --> 00:55:11,948
Speaker 1: sort of last question is about an act.
1198
00:55:12,008 --> 00:55:16,692
Speaker 1: I think that for a very long time people
1199
00:55:16,752 --> 00:55:19,054
Speaker 1: would be in like it would be the vaudeville
1200
00:55:19,154 --> 00:55:19,814
Speaker 1: era or whatever.
1201
00:55:19,874 --> 00:55:21,816
Speaker 1: So, like Johnny Thompson, for example,
1202
00:55:21,836 --> 00:55:24,138
Speaker 1: would do the same 10 minutes, he would do
1203
00:55:24,158 --> 00:55:24,979
Speaker 1: the same 10-, he would do the same 10
1204
00:55:24,999 --> 00:55:26,021
Speaker 1: minute act for his whole career.
1205
00:55:26,742 --> 00:55:29,727
Speaker 1: And I think now it's like it's like the
1206
00:55:29,787 --> 00:55:32,191
Speaker 1: life of the internet, so people are doing a
1207
00:55:32,251 --> 00:55:34,094
Speaker 1: different trick every day because they're
1208
00:55:34,134 --> 00:55:36,405
Speaker 1: posting it on the internet and I think that
1209
00:55:36,626 --> 00:55:39,996
Speaker 1: slowly in between, you know, now maybe some
1210
00:55:40,036 --> 00:55:42,082
Speaker 1: magician will have two acts or three, one
1211
00:55:42,163 --> 00:55:43,788
Speaker 1: hour shows or something, or I don't know.
1212
00:55:44,550 --> 00:55:47,640
Speaker 1: For you, what was it mostly for your career?
1213
00:55:47,800 --> 00:55:51,028
Speaker 1: Was it the same 20 minute act with the
1214
00:55:51,108 --> 00:55:53,193
Speaker 1: flowers and this and the cutting of the
1215
00:55:53,280 --> 00:55:56,033
Speaker 1: cable and the, the boxing gloves, and or
1216
00:55:56,635 --> 00:55:57,640
Speaker 1: were you, was it always changing?
1217
00:55:58,300 --> 00:56:00,406
Speaker 1: Like, did you mostly do the same six or
1218
00:56:00,466 --> 00:56:02,732
Speaker 1: seven tricks on stage or did you do
1219
00:56:02,840 --> 00:56:03,342
Speaker 1: hundreds?
1220
00:56:03,482 --> 00:56:06,120
Speaker 2: And maybe I only know of a few of them that
1221
00:56:06,160 --> 00:56:08,925
Speaker 2: made it to videos well, the thing is that
1222
00:56:09,386 --> 00:56:12,251
Speaker 2: this act, you know, I started to, I
1223
00:56:12,332 --> 00:56:15,943
Speaker 2: invented this act with a microphone, and
1224
00:56:16,024 --> 00:56:22,495
Speaker 2: all that in 1981, okay, and I did it for
1225
00:56:22,535 --> 00:56:24,518
Speaker 2: the first time in Las Vegas, in the Desert
1226
00:56:24,558 --> 00:56:28,045
Speaker 2: Magic Seminar, and I remember always
1227
00:56:28,105 --> 00:56:31,891
Speaker 2: because in the show, in the room, you had
1228
00:56:31,931 --> 00:56:34,141
Speaker 2: Siegfried and Roy, you had Ken Brook, you
1229
00:56:34,161 --> 00:56:36,806
Speaker 2: had the Gauchman, you had Slidini, you had
1230
00:56:37,347 --> 00:56:40,493
Speaker 2: and they gave me a standing ovation and so
1231
00:56:40,513 --> 00:56:41,761
Speaker 2: I was the king of the world.
1232
00:56:42,141 --> 00:56:44,003
Speaker 2: You know, I was wow, my wow, my God, that's
1233
00:56:44,043 --> 00:56:44,083
Speaker 2: it.
1234
00:56:45,104 --> 00:56:47,266
Speaker 2: And during the same convention I did my
1235
00:56:47,406 --> 00:56:48,567
Speaker 2: first lecture.
1236
00:56:50,188 --> 00:56:52,750
Speaker 2: During the convention, another standing
1237
00:56:52,810 --> 00:56:54,972
Speaker 2: ovation, so it was really wow.
1238
00:56:55,653 --> 00:56:59,957
Speaker 2: So I came back and one year after, not even
1239
00:57:00,097 --> 00:57:04,505
Speaker 2: one year after, I always wanted to walk the
1240
00:57:04,525 --> 00:57:04,806
Speaker 2: crazy horse.
1241
00:57:04,826 --> 00:57:07,716
Speaker 2: So I went there, you know, and I did my act,
1242
00:57:07,820 --> 00:57:09,527
Speaker 2: but there was nobody in the room, only the
1243
00:57:09,607 --> 00:57:13,708
Speaker 2: boss, and it was like because, you know, no,
1244
00:57:13,808 --> 00:57:15,071
Speaker 2: no reaction, of course.
1245
00:57:16,121 --> 00:57:19,181
Speaker 2: And he told me yeah, okay, it's okay, but
1246
00:57:19,321 --> 00:57:21,187
Speaker 2: it needs to cook a little bit.
1247
00:57:21,207 --> 00:57:22,731
Speaker 2: So I will give you some direction.
1248
00:57:23,000 --> 00:57:25,041
Speaker 2: You go in Italy, you will walk and say okay,
1249
00:57:25,081 --> 00:57:26,226
Speaker 2: thank you, maestro.
1250
00:57:28,403 --> 00:57:29,146
Speaker 2: I make it short.
1251
00:57:31,761 --> 00:57:35,788
Speaker 2: In 93, meet again Kevin James and we become
1252
00:57:36,313 --> 00:57:38,847
Speaker 2: very good friends for completely different
1253
00:57:38,927 --> 00:57:41,667
Speaker 2: reasons, but he's working the crazy horse
1254
00:57:41,727 --> 00:57:45,043
Speaker 2: at the time, you know, and I've done
1255
00:57:45,925 --> 00:57:49,052
Speaker 2: already my career as a magician, lecturer
1256
00:57:49,132 --> 00:57:52,146
Speaker 2: and all that and doing this act, but doing
1257
00:57:52,226 --> 00:57:55,502
Speaker 2: mostly close-up or trade shows or things
1258
00:57:55,523 --> 00:57:55,884
Speaker 2: like that.
1259
00:57:57,501 --> 00:58:01,952
Speaker 2: But he said I need to go back to Vegas.
1260
00:58:02,180 --> 00:58:04,609
Speaker 2: Why don't you do the Crazy Horse, gaetan?
1261
00:58:05,463 --> 00:58:06,126
Speaker 2: You should do it.
1262
00:58:06,280 --> 00:58:08,408
Speaker 2: You say, you know, I did an audition 15
1263
00:58:08,448 --> 00:58:08,829
Speaker 2: years ago.
1264
00:58:10,642 --> 00:58:14,465
Speaker 2: He said well, okay, no, no, now show me
1265
00:58:14,526 --> 00:58:14,907
Speaker 2: something.
1266
00:58:15,301 --> 00:58:16,506
Speaker 2: You have nothing to show.
1267
00:58:16,747 --> 00:58:21,029
Speaker 2: Yes, I was just finishing Chan, tata Chan
1268
00:58:21,069 --> 00:58:22,913
Speaker 2: with Tamaris, 26 shows.
1269
00:58:23,964 --> 00:58:27,507
Speaker 2: So I cut everything I put together, I give
1270
00:58:27,748 --> 00:58:29,226
Speaker 2: to Kevin the tape.
1271
00:58:30,773 --> 00:58:32,991
Speaker 2: Two days after I have a phone call.
1272
00:58:33,414 --> 00:58:35,687
Speaker 2: I will always remember hello, mr Bernadette,
1273
00:58:36,383 --> 00:58:36,865
Speaker 2: can we meet?
1274
00:58:38,064 --> 00:58:41,215
Speaker 2: Wow, oh my god, yes, when next week, boom
1275
00:58:41,397 --> 00:58:41,640
Speaker 2: 12?
1276
00:58:42,483 --> 00:58:45,565
Speaker 2: Ok, and I go and I see the man he he
1277
00:58:45,605 --> 00:58:48,621
Speaker 2: doesn't remember me, of course and he said
1278
00:58:48,701 --> 00:58:51,248
Speaker 2: can you do the trick with the two Chinese
1279
00:58:51,268 --> 00:58:52,029
Speaker 2: sticks?
1280
00:58:52,089 --> 00:58:54,021
Speaker 2: Whatever, I've never seen this, it's very
1281
00:58:54,081 --> 00:58:54,362
Speaker 2: new.
1282
00:58:54,582 --> 00:58:57,389
Speaker 2: Okay, and the trick with the microphone and
1283
00:58:57,429 --> 00:58:57,890
Speaker 2: the shoe?
1284
00:58:57,930 --> 00:59:00,680
Speaker 2: At the end, yes, okay.
1285
00:59:01,301 --> 00:59:03,363
Speaker 2: And I said but you know, the problem is
1286
00:59:03,383 --> 00:59:05,325
Speaker 2: that I need to talk.
1287
00:59:05,405 --> 00:59:06,105
Speaker 2: I can't do it.
1288
00:59:06,165 --> 00:59:08,227
Speaker 2: Silent Crazy horse, you don't talk.
1289
00:59:09,028 --> 00:59:12,351
Speaker 2: And he said but what I saw was in Spanish.
1290
00:59:12,371 --> 00:59:14,933
Speaker 2: I said yes, because it was for Spanish TV.
1291
00:59:14,993 --> 00:59:17,516
Speaker 2: But he said I don't care, it's like your
1292
00:59:17,576 --> 00:59:19,337
Speaker 2: music, can you do it in Spanish?
1293
00:59:27,940 --> 00:59:28,942
Speaker 2: Yes, sir, and I did it and, believe it or
1294
00:59:28,982 --> 00:59:30,004
Speaker 2: not, but for 15 years I did the act in
1295
00:59:30,024 --> 00:59:31,206
Speaker 2: spanish, with two words of english and not
1296
00:59:31,266 --> 00:59:32,809
Speaker 2: one word in french, you know.
1297
00:59:34,031 --> 00:59:38,462
Speaker 2: And when I started, I mean kevin, get, get
1298
00:59:38,483 --> 00:59:39,103
Speaker 2: me the gig.
1299
00:59:39,164 --> 00:59:40,526
Speaker 2: There's the first thing, you know.
1300
00:59:40,606 --> 00:59:44,212
Speaker 2: But bardo said okay, I want to work with
1301
00:59:44,292 --> 00:59:47,622
Speaker 2: you, but I'm, you know, not before next
1302
00:59:47,662 --> 00:59:47,862
Speaker 2: year.
1303
00:59:48,704 --> 00:59:51,349
Speaker 2: And Kevin had to go back to Vegas for
1304
00:59:51,429 --> 00:59:55,723
Speaker 2: personal family problem and I had also
1305
00:59:55,903 --> 00:59:56,224
Speaker 2: problem.
1306
00:59:56,244 --> 00:59:58,269
Speaker 2: He said can you fill for me Because I have
1307
00:59:58,449 --> 00:59:59,352
Speaker 2: one year assignment?
1308
00:59:59,372 --> 01:00:01,504
Speaker 2: I said yes, of course, if he's okay.
1309
01:00:02,085 --> 01:00:04,351
Speaker 2: And I started right away, you know, Wow,
1310
01:00:10,800 --> 01:00:11,682
Speaker 2: and at first I was thinking I will do three
1311
01:00:11,702 --> 01:00:12,304
Speaker 2: months and I will be bored.
1312
01:00:12,324 --> 01:00:14,709
Speaker 2: I did 15 years there, you know, and not
1313
01:00:14,789 --> 01:00:16,453
Speaker 2: changing one thing.
1314
01:00:17,600 --> 01:00:21,509
Speaker 2: Because when you walk the crazy road, first,
1315
01:00:21,810 --> 01:00:24,227
Speaker 2: you don't do 20 minutes, you do nine
1316
01:00:24,287 --> 01:00:24,650
Speaker 2: minutes.
1317
01:00:24,670 --> 01:00:26,761
Speaker 2: You do nine minutes, wow, nine minutes,
1318
01:00:27,082 --> 01:00:31,012
Speaker 2: twice a night and three times on the
1319
01:00:31,052 --> 01:00:31,533
Speaker 2: weekends.
1320
01:00:32,940 --> 01:00:37,610
Speaker 2: And normally you do three months or four
1321
01:00:37,670 --> 01:00:39,822
Speaker 2: months, no more than four months, but it's
1322
01:00:40,143 --> 01:00:41,548
Speaker 2: every day boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.
1323
01:00:42,522 --> 01:00:45,217
Speaker 2: And then two months off and so on and so on,
1324
01:00:46,320 --> 01:00:49,532
Speaker 2: and you do like nine months first and a
1325
01:00:49,612 --> 01:00:52,842
Speaker 2: year, and then six months after we set
1326
01:00:52,863 --> 01:00:55,850
Speaker 2: around six months a year, you know, and
1327
01:00:55,951 --> 01:00:56,512
Speaker 2: that was it.
1328
01:00:56,600 --> 01:01:02,813
Speaker 2: But I never, I've never, been bored doing
1329
01:01:02,893 --> 01:01:03,194
Speaker 2: that.
1330
01:01:03,841 --> 01:01:04,946
Speaker 2: It was everything.
1331
01:01:06,140 --> 01:01:08,468
Speaker 2: It was like if you do it for the first time
1332
01:01:08,708 --> 01:01:12,887
Speaker 2: every night Now I have a lot of friends, or
1333
01:01:13,048 --> 01:01:15,864
Speaker 2: sometimes I think to my son or to my wife
1334
01:01:15,964 --> 01:01:18,945
Speaker 2: or to my whatever, and I say, okay, this
1335
01:01:19,025 --> 01:01:19,648
Speaker 2: one is for you.
1336
01:01:20,341 --> 01:01:22,929
Speaker 2: And as soon as I'm on stage, boom, boom.
1337
01:01:23,280 --> 01:01:27,049
Speaker 2: I think to the guy or to the audience and I
1338
01:01:27,089 --> 01:01:30,162
Speaker 2: do it, and I've never been bored.
1339
01:01:30,944 --> 01:01:34,730
Speaker 2: Wow, but you walk, you walk seconds instead
1340
01:01:34,770 --> 01:01:36,353
Speaker 2: to walk a new trick.
1341
01:01:36,573 --> 01:01:39,683
Speaker 2: You can't do a new trick, right, but you
1342
01:01:39,723 --> 01:01:40,344
Speaker 2: can walk.
1343
01:01:40,685 --> 01:01:43,089
Speaker 2: You know, it's like punishing whatever.
1344
01:01:43,129 --> 01:01:46,254
Speaker 1: Yeah wow, so that must have been.
1345
01:01:46,274 --> 01:01:48,323
Speaker 1: I don't think I even knew that you worked
1346
01:01:48,383 --> 01:01:51,068
Speaker 1: for 15 years at the crazy horse but you
1347
01:01:51,088 --> 01:01:54,381
Speaker 1: know it was not full 15 years I know, but
1348
01:01:54,461 --> 01:01:57,225
Speaker 1: nine months a year, a lot like, yeah, nine
1349
01:01:57,285 --> 01:01:58,947
Speaker 1: months and then six months, yeah.
1350
01:01:59,107 --> 01:02:04,174
Speaker 1: So that must have been not only amazing to
1351
01:02:04,294 --> 01:02:06,902
Speaker 1: perform and sharpen the act, but also
1352
01:02:07,523 --> 01:02:09,808
Speaker 1: really refreshing that you sort of have
1353
01:02:09,868 --> 01:02:12,694
Speaker 1: your daytime available to play.
1354
01:02:13,420 --> 01:02:15,503
Speaker 1: You know, you have your daytime available
1355
01:02:15,563 --> 01:02:18,608
Speaker 1: to work on magic and create and play and
1356
01:02:18,648 --> 01:02:19,108
Speaker 1: that's fantastic.
1357
01:02:19,128 --> 01:02:21,652
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, no, no, that was the thing?
1358
01:02:21,672 --> 01:02:22,533
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, but you know, I replaced in fact
1359
01:02:22,553 --> 01:02:22,794
Speaker 2: Tom Moulika.
1360
01:02:22,814 --> 01:02:23,174
Speaker 2: What an amazing.
1361
01:02:23,194 --> 01:02:24,596
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, no, that was the thing.
1362
01:02:24,616 --> 01:02:27,029
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, but you know, you know I replaced
1363
01:02:27,130 --> 01:02:28,260
Speaker 2: in fact Tom Mulica.
1364
01:02:30,195 --> 01:02:33,247
Speaker 2: Tom Mulica left the Crazy Horse but I saw
1365
01:02:33,308 --> 01:02:35,420
Speaker 2: Tom, he did the Crazy Horse.
1366
01:02:35,480 --> 01:02:38,866
Speaker 2: He did three years because he wanted to to
1367
01:02:38,967 --> 01:02:42,570
Speaker 2: raise money to open his, his pool bar in
1368
01:02:42,610 --> 01:02:43,236
Speaker 2: Las Vegas.
1369
01:02:43,458 --> 01:02:46,629
Speaker 2: Yeah, and he did, but he had not a really
1370
01:02:46,689 --> 01:02:47,131
Speaker 2: good time.
1371
01:02:47,280 --> 01:02:51,704
Speaker 2: But I saw the act when he started and I
1372
01:02:51,765 --> 01:02:56,046
Speaker 2: told Tom if you want to, I can have you
1373
01:02:56,086 --> 01:02:58,432
Speaker 2: visit Paris and we can manage.
1374
01:02:58,560 --> 01:03:02,652
Speaker 2: Yes, but you know, nearly it was treasures,
1375
01:03:03,060 --> 01:03:06,261
Speaker 2: small flat having cheese and dinner and
1376
01:03:06,281 --> 01:03:09,799
Speaker 2: that's it and back and forth, and every
1377
01:03:10,262 --> 01:03:14,148
Speaker 2: three months I was going to spend one night
1378
01:03:14,188 --> 01:03:18,883
Speaker 2: with them and in fact I saw the evolution
1379
01:03:19,083 --> 01:03:21,983
Speaker 2: in three years of crazy horse, you, your
1380
01:03:22,144 --> 01:03:23,168
Speaker 2: act rocket like.
1381
01:03:24,443 --> 01:03:27,571
Speaker 2: His act went from very good to wow.
1382
01:03:28,600 --> 01:03:32,607
Speaker 1: Yeah, unbelievable, what an amazing gig
1383
01:03:32,647 --> 01:03:33,128
Speaker 1: that you got.
1384
01:03:33,148 --> 01:03:36,954
Speaker 1: An amazing story and really helpful for us
1385
01:03:37,320 --> 01:03:40,205
Speaker 1: listening to better understand how to
1386
01:03:40,305 --> 01:03:43,050
Speaker 1: create and how to make and how to, you know,
1387
01:03:43,110 --> 01:03:44,793
Speaker 1: get inspired from other artists.
1388
01:03:44,833 --> 01:03:45,935
Speaker 1: I think it's fantastic.
1389
01:03:46,580 --> 01:03:48,689
Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, definitely, definitely.
1390
01:03:49,201 --> 01:03:51,368
Speaker 1: We are getting towards the end of the
1391
01:03:51,409 --> 01:03:51,970
Speaker 1: podcast.
1392
01:03:52,060 --> 01:03:53,785
Speaker 1: There's three final questions.
1393
01:03:53,985 --> 01:03:56,672
Speaker 1: The first is the endless chain.
1394
01:03:56,921 --> 01:03:59,970
Speaker 1: So in order to keep the podcast going on
1395
01:04:00,030 --> 01:04:02,970
Speaker 1: forever, each magician is asked to
1396
01:04:03,050 --> 01:04:04,878
Speaker 1: recommend another magician that would be
1397
01:04:04,979 --> 01:04:07,488
Speaker 1: really good for this type of conversation.
1398
01:04:08,029 --> 01:04:10,478
Speaker 1: So who is someone who you think would be
1399
01:04:10,618 --> 01:04:12,263
Speaker 1: really really good for this type of
1400
01:04:12,323 --> 01:04:15,310
Speaker 1: conversation that A I have not interviewed
1401
01:04:15,350 --> 01:04:17,762
Speaker 1: already, maybe you don't know and B that
1402
01:04:17,842 --> 01:04:19,546
Speaker 1: you can help put us in contact?
1403
01:04:20,107 --> 01:04:22,773
Speaker 2: Oh, I'm sure you have him on your list, but
1404
01:04:23,242 --> 01:04:25,348
Speaker 2: I wanted to mention his name many times,
1405
01:04:25,429 --> 01:04:28,275
Speaker 2: especially because of George Carl, but
1406
01:04:28,315 --> 01:04:31,187
Speaker 2: Charlie Fry oh, that's a great one, and
1407
01:04:31,227 --> 01:04:32,270
Speaker 2: I've never interviewed him.
1408
01:04:32,585 --> 01:04:35,732
Speaker 2: That's fantastic you know, charlie Fry was
1409
01:04:35,973 --> 01:04:38,683
Speaker 2: very, very friend with George Carl and in
1410
01:04:38,764 --> 01:04:41,790
Speaker 2: fact George Carl died in his arm, in fact
1411
01:04:41,931 --> 01:04:43,080
Speaker 2: in the hospital, oh my gosh.
1412
01:04:44,283 --> 01:04:48,255
Speaker 2: And Charlie has all the costume and really
1413
01:04:48,676 --> 01:04:49,860
Speaker 2: took a lot of inspiration.
1414
01:04:50,040 --> 01:04:51,925
Speaker 2: I mean, we are both.
1415
01:04:52,767 --> 01:04:55,862
Speaker 2: As soon as we talk about George, we are in
1416
01:04:55,922 --> 01:04:59,392
Speaker 2: tears and in happiness at the same time,
1417
01:04:59,460 --> 01:05:02,550
Speaker 2: because he knew him very, very well.
1418
01:05:02,780 --> 01:05:04,608
Speaker 2: I only saw him a few times.
1419
01:05:05,421 --> 01:05:06,286
Speaker 1: That's a great one.
1420
01:05:06,580 --> 01:05:09,770
Speaker 1: My next question is about modern magic.
1421
01:05:09,880 --> 01:05:11,707
Speaker 1: You know you've seen magic change in many
1422
01:05:11,767 --> 01:05:15,208
Speaker 1: ways, from smelling old books to now PDFs
1423
01:05:15,469 --> 01:05:16,632
Speaker 1: and everything in between.
1424
01:05:17,200 --> 01:05:19,709
Speaker 1: What's one thing you like about magic right
1425
01:05:19,789 --> 01:05:21,705
Speaker 1: now and what's one thing you don't like
1426
01:05:21,745 --> 01:05:22,809
Speaker 1: about magic right now?
1427
01:05:23,600 --> 01:05:27,364
Speaker 2: You know, I'm a little bit not afraid,
1428
01:05:27,444 --> 01:05:30,409
Speaker 2: because you you have not to be afraid of a
1429
01:05:30,529 --> 01:05:33,674
Speaker 2: new, new thing on the on the market.
1430
01:05:33,734 --> 01:05:37,143
Speaker 2: But of course there is new, new kind of
1431
01:05:37,303 --> 01:05:41,648
Speaker 2: magic, like the instagram magic or t magic,
1432
01:05:42,309 --> 01:05:44,851
Speaker 2: this, this sometimes.
1433
01:05:46,193 --> 01:05:48,295
Speaker 2: I watch a lot of this because sometimes you
1434
01:05:48,315 --> 01:05:53,667
Speaker 2: have beautiful ideas, most of them some
1435
01:05:54,108 --> 01:05:55,090
Speaker 2: very good ideas.
1436
01:05:55,231 --> 01:05:56,553
Speaker 2: They don't have to explain.
1437
01:05:56,700 --> 01:05:58,324
Speaker 2: I don't know why they want to explain
1438
01:05:58,384 --> 01:06:01,251
Speaker 2: everything, but it's true also that people
1439
01:06:01,491 --> 01:06:05,726
Speaker 2: forget that the only thing is that more and
1440
01:06:05,786 --> 01:06:08,032
Speaker 2: more you have people doing this kind of
1441
01:06:08,112 --> 01:06:10,767
Speaker 2: thing where they don't have an audience or
1442
01:06:10,787 --> 01:06:13,405
Speaker 2: a real audience, you know, and it changes
1443
01:06:13,425 --> 01:06:16,307
Speaker 2: the world, because for me, my greatest
1444
01:06:16,407 --> 01:06:19,323
Speaker 2: pleasure is to work for people, not for the
1445
01:06:19,343 --> 01:06:19,685
Speaker 2: screen.
1446
01:06:20,540 --> 01:06:25,403
Speaker 2: So this is a thing okay, maybe you can make
1447
01:06:25,443 --> 01:06:27,885
Speaker 2: a lot of money doing that and become a.
1448
01:06:27,905 --> 01:06:30,866
Speaker 2: These people one day will come to a real
1449
01:06:30,886 --> 01:06:31,167
Speaker 2: show.
1450
01:06:51,066 --> 01:06:52,703
Speaker 2: That's great, because there is nothing
1451
01:06:52,783 --> 01:06:55,770
Speaker 2: better than to do close-up for a few
1452
01:06:55,810 --> 01:06:59,105
Speaker 2: friends, but real close-up, whatever, and
1453
01:06:59,205 --> 01:07:01,852
Speaker 2: not just for the camera angle or whatever.
1454
01:07:02,561 --> 01:07:05,169
Speaker 1: And what's one thing you like about magic
1455
01:07:05,209 --> 01:07:05,611
Speaker 1: right now?
1456
01:07:06,962 --> 01:07:09,467
Speaker 2: always discovering new things, and
1457
01:07:09,487 --> 01:07:10,890
Speaker 2: especially in the old books.
1458
01:07:10,930 --> 01:07:13,081
Speaker 2: You know, when I found a new old book
1459
01:07:13,101 --> 01:07:17,168
Speaker 2: that's oh my god, or a new, crazy, crazy
1460
01:07:17,209 --> 01:07:18,010
Speaker 2: man of magic.
1461
01:07:18,050 --> 01:07:19,112
Speaker 2: You know many I'm.
1462
01:07:19,272 --> 01:07:21,906
Speaker 2: I'm thinking to write a book about the
1463
01:07:22,147 --> 01:07:26,063
Speaker 2: different crazy guys of magic because every
1464
01:07:26,103 --> 01:07:28,845
Speaker 2: country they have at least one or two or
1465
01:07:28,905 --> 01:07:29,889
Speaker 2: three, but not so many.
1466
01:07:31,521 --> 01:07:33,226
Speaker 2: Most of the people they don't know these
1467
01:07:33,286 --> 01:07:33,627
Speaker 2: guys.
1468
01:07:33,687 --> 01:07:39,449
Speaker 2: But I start to have a pretty good list of
1469
01:07:39,721 --> 01:07:40,986
Speaker 2: unknown, unknown.
1470
01:07:41,742 --> 01:07:42,226
Speaker 1: I like it.
1471
01:07:42,287 --> 01:07:43,720
Speaker 1: The crazy guys of magic.
1472
01:07:44,001 --> 01:07:45,690
Speaker 1: I really like it.
1473
01:07:45,810 --> 01:07:48,782
Speaker 1: The last question is plugs where can people
1474
01:07:48,902 --> 01:07:49,524
Speaker 1: find you?
1475
01:07:49,644 --> 01:07:51,468
Speaker 1: Where can people find your stuff, your
1476
01:07:51,568 --> 01:07:54,501
Speaker 1: books, your projects, maybe see you perform?
1477
01:07:54,641 --> 01:07:55,963
Speaker 1: Where can they see?
1478
01:07:56,944 --> 01:07:59,929
Speaker 2: the truth is, right now you don't find them
1479
01:08:00,029 --> 01:08:04,455
Speaker 2: very easily, but I'm revamping all that.
1480
01:08:04,820 --> 01:08:09,151
Speaker 2: So in the next six months I will tell you.
1481
01:08:09,231 --> 01:08:10,882
Speaker 2: At the time I will call you and say now
1482
01:08:10,942 --> 01:08:11,584
Speaker 2: it's ready.
1483
01:08:11,624 --> 01:08:16,514
Speaker 2: You know, but I have some new products on
1484
01:08:16,534 --> 01:08:19,568
Speaker 2: the way and I can tell you more now.
1485
01:08:19,748 --> 01:08:23,120
Speaker 2: But yes, yes, well, I'm very excited, Tax
1486
01:08:23,050 --> 01:08:23,840
Speaker 2: flat and play big Good good.
1487
01:08:23,770 --> 01:08:24,661
Speaker 1: Well, I'm very excited, tax flat and play
1488
01:08:24,590 --> 01:08:26,025
Speaker 1: big Good good.
1489
01:08:26,240 --> 01:08:28,302
Speaker 1: Well, I'm very excited, gaetan.
1490
01:08:28,522 --> 01:08:29,988
Speaker 1: Thank you so so much for doing this.
1491
01:08:30,100 --> 01:08:31,346
Speaker 1: This was an absolute pleasure.
1492
01:08:31,980 --> 01:08:34,862
Speaker 1: Amazing to hear about your history and how
1493
01:08:34,902 --> 01:08:37,270
Speaker 1: you think about this and better understand.
1494
01:08:37,340 --> 01:08:40,046
Speaker 2: I'm so sorry for my broken English, but you
1495
01:08:40,086 --> 01:08:42,471
Speaker 2: know it was perfect Okay.
1496
01:08:43,112 --> 01:08:43,874
Speaker 1: Totally perfect.
1497
01:08:43,940 --> 01:08:45,266
Speaker 1: So thank you so much for being here.
1498
01:08:45,701 --> 01:08:48,228
Speaker 1: Thank you to everybody for listening and
1499
01:08:48,289 --> 01:08:48,891
Speaker 1: being with us.
1500
01:08:49,000 --> 01:08:51,466
Speaker 1: This was a blast and we will see you all
1501
01:08:51,687 --> 01:08:52,549
Speaker 1: next Thursday.
1502
01:08:53,692 --> 01:08:54,012
Speaker 1: See you.
1503
01:09:03,782 --> 01:09:04,505
Speaker 1: Well, there you have it.
1504
01:09:04,641 --> 01:09:06,303
Speaker 1: I hope you liked the episode and I hope, of
1505
01:09:06,343 --> 01:09:07,829
Speaker 1: course, that you learned something.
1506
01:09:08,240 --> 01:09:10,527
Speaker 1: Now is your chance to tell a friend and
1507
01:09:10,587 --> 01:09:11,791
Speaker 1: spread the word.
1508
01:09:12,180 --> 01:09:13,506
Speaker 1: The podcast is back.
1509
01:09:13,860 --> 01:09:14,242
Speaker 1: That's right.
1510
01:09:14,322 --> 01:09:15,842
Speaker 1: Discourse in Magic, your favorite magic
1511
01:09:15,862 --> 01:09:17,588
Speaker 1: podcast, I hope I guess.
1512
01:09:17,688 --> 01:09:18,410
Speaker 1: I don't know, I don't care.
1513
01:09:18,621 --> 01:09:20,580
Speaker 1: It's back and I'm glad that you're here.
1514
01:09:20,700 --> 01:09:22,026
Speaker 1: So please tell a friend.
1515
01:09:22,200 --> 01:09:23,444
Speaker 1: It would mean the world.
1516
01:09:23,765 --> 01:09:25,029
Speaker 1: I don't care where you tell them, I don't
1517
01:09:25,049 --> 01:09:26,512
Speaker 1: care how you tell them, but if you tell at
1518
01:09:26,572 --> 01:09:28,654
Speaker 1: least one magician that you know that this
1519
01:09:28,714 --> 01:09:31,056
Speaker 1: podcast is back, I would appreciate it so
1520
01:09:31,096 --> 01:09:33,064
Speaker 1: so much and it would mean the world.
1521
01:09:33,425 --> 01:09:34,628
Speaker 1: Hope you're doing well, hope you're doing
1522
01:09:34,669 --> 01:09:35,030
Speaker 1: amazing.
1523
01:09:35,110 --> 01:09:36,584
Speaker 1: Thanks for being here and I will see you
1524
01:09:36,805 --> 01:09:38,454
Speaker 1: next Thursday, ciao.
