46: The Man I Never Expected to Become

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Welcome to Getting Backup with Greek Meet Broad.
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Two men, two fathers, and one shared journey of rebuilding.
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We're talking about life after cancer, love, loss, and everything no one tells you.
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I'm David McLean and I'm Jamal Jones.
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And we welcome you to Getting Back Up Finding Life After Death podcast.
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This is gonna be a good one.
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Um I got a question for you.
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All right, shoot, go ahead.
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Um if Nalani met you today, yeah, what would be what would she be most surprised about?
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I think we should get into it today.
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Yeah.
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Yeah, I think we I think we should spend the time getting into today.
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We just want to really explore this a little bit further.
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So today we're talking about grief and how it has shaped us into the person and people we are today.
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Yeah, we're not talking about like what we lost, or we're talking about who we've become.
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Yeah.
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Right.
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And I think that's that's a whole different element of grief.
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Grief is so much about people think about it in the context of like, oh, it's this this backwards looking thing, but it forms you.
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Yeah, I mean, it's our are really our intention to help widowers recognize that growth after loss, it it's not betrayal.
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Yeah, and we've touched on this before.
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Yeah.
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Um, in in previous episodes.
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I know we've, you know, sometimes we we we these themes come back, but sometimes it is the greatest way, the best way that we have to actually honor the past, honor the previous people in our lives, but also honor the work that we're doing, right?
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And and and and how, you know, our ability to move through this process.
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Yeah, and do the best that we can to honor those people as well.
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Yeah.
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So let me get back to your question about what would surprise Nalani or what she would see or think is this moving forward as it looks for me.
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I think for sure, Jamal, it's what you and I are doing with the Get Back Up platform.
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So not only the podcast, but then also the widower reset that we have coming up September 25th to the 27th.
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Yeah.
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Bringing other men either in the start of this grief and loss journey, middle, or they are so far down the road that they've forgotten that they haven't really addressed what's going on because they had to work, they had to make sure the career was set up, their children are all set, maybe they have neglected or taken care of their health.
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But I think it's this challenge, I think Nalani would see, is we have moved forward and that I've embraced the community, the play aunties, the play uncles, the family as well.
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I think also trying to bring her family into the moving forward as much as they can.
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Now, each family has their challenges of especially after that glue.
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Right.
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And the money definitely was that the the connector, the the cartilage as well, the attendance, she was everything for the family to see how as best we can connect and interact.
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And I think at the center of it is really the legacy of the grandkids.
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Yeah.
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Is that making sure that I'm sending out the communications, they're able to see uh the grandkids.
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I think as I and we may talk a little bit about this going forward, but uh Nalani's mom just passed.
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Yeah.
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Yeah, we're gonna have to dig into that because we both experienced that in the last within the last two years.
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Yeah.
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So yeah.
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Yeah.
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And I think Nalani would appreciate that we featured her mother, uh uh Miss Martha Thomas, as much as we could in the family collective.
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And also that universe, because you know my friends are family, just like you know, you are my family, yeah, it into all that we've done, a certain vacation place that we go to a lot, making sure that she had that experience.
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Yes, and that she was featured there.
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Right.
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And so Nalani's girlfriends, my friends, yeah, yeah, we're all there to honor to a great extent Nalani's presence that brings us all together, and also to celebrate Miss Martha Thomas, who was able to come out.
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She was still able to get around and enjoy that celebration of that togetherness, having her there.
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She was ready to move to this place.
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She loved it so much.
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That that's so I think Nalani would be incredibly proud that in however way it was going to work, yeah, it did.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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And I think also just embracing this idea of being a single father.
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Oh yeah.
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Yeah.
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There's not a script for this.
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As we've talked about in previous episodes.
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There's not a script when you're not single.
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Right.
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That's true.
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You're not when you're when you're not a not when you're not a single father, there's not a script.
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Right.
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Yeah.
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Right.
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I I I think that and to take information in, 'cause you and I talk about this a lot.
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Sometimes you just have to make decisions, you gotta keep in mind.
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Oh yeah.
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Yeah.
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And to weigh what information is coming to me and not dismiss it out of hand because I don't have time for it or whatever.
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It's right.
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Wait, maybe that person has something they've been a friend for decades.
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Maybe they have something to offer.
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Yeah.
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Right, right.
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Something I'm missing.
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Yeah.
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And but then you gotta take all those ingredients and add your gut decision.
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That's right.
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Right, your gut and go with the right thing.
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But I think the listen, I think a lot of times, right, when you think about what they're looking at, what they would see in you today.
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Yeah.
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Right.
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I think it is that evolution, right?
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It is the the comfort.
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Sometimes it's the concern.
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You think about like what these women or what people are thinking about when they know they're gonna, their moment is coming, or as they may have thought about it even before if they didn't think their moment were their their time was coming.
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Yeah.
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Right.
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Like the worry that they have is sometimes is he gonna be able to do it by himself or is he gonna be okay?
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Or, you know, these these other things.
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So yeah, I think that plays a lot into it.
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So and I think the choreography or just the traffic too of including those women and men that Nalani on her deathbed said to them, Take care of my girls.
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Yeah.
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And to bring them in in a way that is meaningful, and you can see what result it has for the girls, that they say that they are happy.
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Yeah, that my oldest said that she was happy.
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That's that's big.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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So I think Nalani would be proud, more so than surprise.
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Because you know, I have good home training, some of it she is responsible for.
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Yeah.
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And so I think that that is it.
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I think also just the way this is evolving again to what all the people we hear from at getting back up, the our friends who call us, the comments that come into us, dudes come into professionals.
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Yeah.
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When I say dudes, I mean professionals come into our house, homes, and helping us with HVAC or all in house.
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Right.
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I think that that's a great one.
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And that you they come up here and they see what we do and because they ask and we're having conversations.
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You know, I talk about that's something too.
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Yeah.
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And and and then they ask us what we do.
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And then the other day, as I told you, young man said, Oh man, I just lost my mom last year, and I haven't figured out how to deal with that.
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And then we sat and talked about it.
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Yeah.
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And he was talking about, yeah, man, I was I was just turned to drinking and just sitting home watching documentaries by myself and didn't let people get caught up.
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And I think I think that's the important part too, when you think about like what they may see in us, yeah, is this new element of elf of empathy.
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Right.
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Right.
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It might not have been there before.
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Not to say you wouldn't have stopped and cared about this brother and given the space to talk, but would you have been able to tune in into it the way you can now?
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We didn't have the life experience.
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We'd have probably been like, oh man, that's messed up.
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Right.
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Yeah.
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And and we'd have listened, but it would have been a different conversation.
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It would have been a different dialogue.
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And for us, it'd be something, it wouldn't be the same contribution.
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Right.
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And I think to that point, I think for me, it's also like getting back up.
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I think that's an important one as I think about what Janice would look at and say, like, you know, I'm proud of or I'm happy that you're doing this.
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There's an element of closeness that we have in these dialogues.
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There's an element of closeness that we create in these dialogues.
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And I think a lot of times I always think about it and that, you know, like the things that, you know, I would hear you hear women talk about with their girls.
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Like brothers don't generally talk about that stuff.
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Right.
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We generally don't talk about the same type of things.
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It's not to say it's superficial conversations because I feel like we can't have these conversations about life and struggle and relationships, but there's a layer that we generally don't get past.
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That's right.
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That women do.
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And I think easily, easily, as easily.
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And I think now this has allowed us to.
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Yeah.
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Right?
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It's allowed us to kind of open up that can, right?
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A little bit more.
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And not can of beer, but yeah.
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But like it's allowed us to open up that that that can of information, yeah.
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Those cans of of emotions.
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And I think there's a certain vulnerability that I feel I know, you know, if I if if if she was, you know, watching and listening, she'd be like, you're talking about that now?
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Like you're you're willing to open that up.
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Right.
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I think there's there's the vulnerability piece that I think about for sure the the single parent dynamic.
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Yeah.
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She was a single parent for for a period of time after her her divorce.
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So there's an element of you don't get it that we used to talk about.
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She, I was a step parent and she was the the the primary parent.
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Right.
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So there was an element of for her of you don't get it.
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You don't get what I'm dealing with.
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You don't get what I'm dealing with.
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These are my children.
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My children.
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You don't have my children yet.
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Right.
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Or this is my stress, or this is my perspective.
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And I I saw it as the stepdad or right, the coming into a situation.
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Now I'm remarried, and I'm sure she's like, now you get it.
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Correct.
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Right.
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Like now you get what I was talking about.
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Now you understand how hard it is.
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Now you have how you like these these elements that um you any, I'm sure you're dealing with it too, is you're start you're dating, and you're like, oh, how much do I release or allow this person to to influence what's already here with the diamond amic with your girls?
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Like there's protectiveness, and we talked about that before too, but like those are things that you have in relationships that can create so much friction sometimes around how do you manage that?
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I think that for me is one thing that I think she would be, you know, proud of the work.
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Yeah.
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It's not perfect, it's always a progressive process.
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Right.
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But at least she'd be probably looking at like, well, okay, well, you're working at this, you understand now, you know, and and take these lessons.
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Do and then also, do you think because you are probably communicating more with your now wife and with Jordan?
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Yeah.
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Right.
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So that which would do you think she would remark upon that?
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I I think so.
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I mean, Jordan might say no.
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Well, I think I think Janice might be like, he's so much better than if he was.
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Right.
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That's just like Tale of Two Cities.
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Yeah.
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Right.
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But yeah, I I feel like I can say more and I can be more expressive, and I can kind of peel back the onion a little bit more.
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You know, whereas, you know, something used to take me, you know, a week to process, now takes me, you know, half the time or 24 hours, or I can feel it immediately.
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Now, oh yeah, this is what that is, and that doesn't feel comfortable, and let's talk about it.
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Whereas before, it'd be like, oh man, I don't know what that emotion was.
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I'm gonna sit on this for a week and you have you have no idea why I'm walking around pouting.
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Right.
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Right.
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Or when it came up, as you mentioned before, you just left.
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Yeah, exactly.
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Exactly.
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I don't know, I gotta go, right?
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So I think those are those are different things.
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Um, you know, patience.
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Um, I've always been a patient person, but I think it it you have thresholds, and I think that was something that we always talked about that I recall being able to tune into, like being patient and with our struggles, being patient with our experiences and individuals, being able to look at somebody and say, Wow, like I know this person has been through this in their life, and this is how it presents itself every day.
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This patience and even taking the time to say, I'm not going to react in this moment, or I'm going to comfort in this moment because this is what this person's need.
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Like, I think there's patience that I probably didn't have, you know, 10 years ago.
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And part of it could be age and me just becoming, you know, more seasoned and wiser and knowing which battles to pick versus which ones not to.
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Not that he'll do that.
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But I also do think it's some of it is like being able to tune into like this this loss has forced me and allowed me to step back and really think about what people are going through.
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Yeah.
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Right.
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And individually in my life and understanding, like, okay, be patient in this moment with them, with yourself, right?
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And and and processes and what's going on.
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So and your now wife, she brings her challenges.
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Right.
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And her we all have yeah, we all have experiences and baggage and lessons and and and and a life before that presents itself sometimes every day, sometimes periodically.
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And recognizing that, and then this more of the selflessness than selfishness that we have to kind of incorporate.
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Yeah, if if we're trying to stay together with folk, because sometimes that's what breaks people up.
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Yeah.
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Is that not being able to balance between the selfish and the self-fest, selfless.
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So I think I I think I I think you touched, I think that's a a good one.
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I think that piece, that ability to tune in more to others, to kind of pause and not react so quickly sometimes.
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I think those things, those are some of the things.
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And then I think, you know, you know, the ability to navigate the different dynamics with the kids, right?
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Like I've got, you know, the the two that we had to together, and then my stepson that, you know, her Janice's son, you know, so he's now in his 30s, and now he and I are navigating and continuing to manage and build and grow our relationship.
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So we have two other kids that are, you know, 21 and 16 that are evolving and they've got their own dynamics, and I've got to manage dynamics with each of them to help them the best way that I can.
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Yeah.
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To your point, so we can raise independent children, right?
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Who who and allow them to make mistakes.
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That's what's the point in their lives.
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Right.
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Right.
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Um, you know, they're no longer the five-year-old toddlers.
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I I have the five-year-old too, right, with Jordan.
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Which will do something differently now, too.
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But you know, that the the older kids are no longer, you know, when when she Simona, my my five-year-old, when she falls and trips and falls, you like casually walk over, like, are you okay?
00:16:08.559 --> 00:16:08.720
All right.
00:16:08.879 --> 00:16:09.919
Hey, blood, you're okay.
00:16:10.080 --> 00:16:11.600
You pick her up and help her dust off.
00:16:11.679 --> 00:16:15.919
And when you do that for a 16-year-old and a 21-year-old and a 30, you know, 33.
00:16:16.320 --> 00:16:16.799
It's different.
00:16:16.879 --> 00:16:17.200
Yeah.
00:16:17.360 --> 00:16:18.879
It's a different support.
00:16:19.039 --> 00:16:22.720
And I think that part, um, I think she'd be proud of that.
00:16:22.960 --> 00:16:23.120
Yeah.
00:16:23.200 --> 00:16:28.639
And what we're talking about is not becoming somebody different.
00:16:28.799 --> 00:16:30.480
This is not what this conversation is about.
00:16:30.879 --> 00:16:31.360
Not at all.
00:16:31.600 --> 00:16:33.360
It's about Yeah, it's it's about you.
00:16:33.519 --> 00:16:35.039
It's like becoming somebody deeper.
00:16:35.120 --> 00:16:35.279
Yeah.
00:16:35.519 --> 00:16:35.679
Right.
00:16:35.759 --> 00:16:41.039
It's it's you can like you're getting to a different level of of who you were before.
00:16:41.200 --> 00:16:41.440
Right.
00:16:41.600 --> 00:16:44.879
Not necessarily growing, um, you're more evolving.
00:16:44.960 --> 00:16:50.080
And you know you're evolving, you know, you talk about change, but this is more of an evolution of who you are.
00:16:50.240 --> 00:16:50.480
Yeah.
00:16:50.960 --> 00:16:56.000
And and it definitely shows up in the places that we've already mentioned just previously now.
00:16:56.240 --> 00:16:56.480
Yeah.
00:16:56.720 --> 00:16:59.840
But but then also prior conversations.
00:17:00.080 --> 00:17:14.400
Because what we talk about here and what you everyone, every one of us we're dealing with, it's always these little incremental steps to to this changing and and evolving.
00:17:14.480 --> 00:17:14.640
Right.
00:17:14.880 --> 00:17:23.279
Changing in a metamorphosis of being somebody who is more apt to deal with the challenges.
00:17:23.359 --> 00:17:26.000
Cause right, boy, have we belt dealt with some before.
00:17:26.160 --> 00:17:26.480
Oh, yeah.
00:17:26.720 --> 00:17:31.359
As it relates to death or even survival of uh an illness.
00:17:31.519 --> 00:17:31.680
Yeah.
00:17:31.839 --> 00:17:33.920
And those are the people that we also speak to.
00:17:34.079 --> 00:17:40.480
So it's gonna show up in that sense where we're gonna talk about this a lot.
00:17:40.640 --> 00:17:40.799
Yeah.
00:17:40.960 --> 00:17:48.880
We're gonna underscore so much of what we've already talked about because these are the tenets moving forward.
00:17:49.039 --> 00:17:49.440
Yeah.
00:17:49.680 --> 00:17:57.519
Yes, there's gonna be new information that's gonna be put through, but it's are you practicing, as we said, the routine brings this sense of familiarity.
00:17:57.599 --> 00:17:57.759
Yeah.
00:17:57.920 --> 00:18:02.319
And then also we can assess, okay, this is working or not, let me make these adjustments.
00:18:02.400 --> 00:18:02.799
Right.
00:18:03.119 --> 00:18:05.039
Adding a bunch of new is not gonna make it better.
00:18:05.119 --> 00:18:05.279
Yeah.
00:18:05.519 --> 00:18:08.799
So so that's I think also why we talk about where it shows up.
00:18:09.039 --> 00:18:19.119
Yeah, and I think, yeah, we we you know, we we touched on parenting, we touched on, you know, friendships, you know, you touched on the village and how you tap into that leadership, right?
00:18:19.200 --> 00:18:28.880
Where you take the lead and where you may have not, you may have defaulted to you know your late wife in the past or defaulted to other people, and now you're more willing to step.
00:18:29.359 --> 00:18:49.039
I know I'm more willing to to say things and voice my opinions and perspectives and and and make people and okay with you know, people being uncomfortable for the moment, but letting them know, like, hey, I'm doing this because it's gonna make you better, because I love you, or maybe I just don't want you to try to think that you can walk over me at this moment.
00:18:49.359 --> 00:18:53.599
Like being okay saying that, I think those are things, faith.
00:18:53.920 --> 00:18:59.920
Right, you know, I think some of us have have a different relationship with our faith.
00:19:00.160 --> 00:19:00.400
Yeah.
00:19:00.559 --> 00:19:02.559
You know, that's what I've really been challenged.
00:19:02.880 --> 00:19:09.039
And and when you go through something like this, it's hard to maintain that for yourself, for the kids, right?
00:19:09.200 --> 00:19:12.960
Like you I think those are pieces that you you that it shows up.
00:19:13.119 --> 00:19:14.240
Any others that you could think about?
00:19:14.720 --> 00:19:20.319
Yeah, I I think it's also redefining what your purpose is as well.
00:19:20.640 --> 00:19:26.319
And the core of it is yeah, we we we we move forward, we can't live in the grave.
00:19:26.640 --> 00:19:36.160
Right, as we said a bunch of times, and then particularly because we have people in our homes and outside to whom we're responsible, right?
00:19:36.319 --> 00:20:10.400
So the purpose of this moving forward, okay, then especially with some of what we're doing with this platform, that purpose of hey, we've learned so much just through going through it, talking about it, yeah, and people coming to us, that's our purpose, is to continue forward and help others kind of get through this and know A, it's gonna hurt, but you're gonna get through it ultimately for yourself and for the people in the involved in your life or your to whom you're responsible.
00:20:10.559 --> 00:20:10.720
Yeah.
00:20:10.880 --> 00:20:11.519
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:20:11.680 --> 00:20:17.839
No, I think passion, your purpose, um, you know, having compassion, right?
00:20:17.920 --> 00:20:37.599
Being what we talked about earlier, being able to tune into the the the gentleman you were talking to who whose mother, whose mother passed away, and like those things, like you know, that that that sometimes it comes natural for people, and sometimes you can be be distracted by a hundred different things, it'll just let you let that moment pass and be like, oh man, that's sad.
00:20:37.839 --> 00:20:38.960
Yeah, and you keep going.
00:20:39.039 --> 00:20:41.359
But now being able to you know lean on that.
00:20:41.519 --> 00:20:52.640
So um, you know, I think some of the things that surprise me in in particular is is in this process was how empathetic I became.
00:20:54.480 --> 00:21:06.160
Like, I think you touched on it with the the the story about the person, you know, the man who you met and his mother passed away and he's still struggling with it and he's dealing with it.
00:21:06.480 --> 00:21:12.319
I think there's times where I hear about people's experiences or somebody will tell me, Oh, I met this person and they're going through this.
00:21:12.400 --> 00:21:16.160
And I'm like, I want to talk to them, I want to see how they're okay, how they're doing.
00:21:16.319 --> 00:21:22.480
I don't, I may not even know them, but there's a part of me that I feel like I've become so much more empathetic.
00:21:22.720 --> 00:21:25.599
I will hear a story and somebody will tell me about this person, man.
00:21:25.759 --> 00:21:27.839
Like I'm holding back tears and I don't even know them.
00:21:27.920 --> 00:21:29.440
Yeah, but I'm like, I feel for them.
00:21:29.599 --> 00:21:31.279
I that wasn't me 10 years ago.
00:21:31.359 --> 00:21:31.599
Yeah.
00:21:31.839 --> 00:21:36.640
Ten years ago, if you know somebody was going through something like that, like I'm like, man, that's really sad.
00:21:36.799 --> 00:21:37.039
Yeah.
00:21:37.200 --> 00:21:38.319
That's uh are they okay?
00:21:38.480 --> 00:21:39.279
You had no reference.
00:21:39.519 --> 00:21:40.160
Had no reference.
00:21:40.240 --> 00:21:40.319
Yeah.
00:21:40.480 --> 00:21:42.160
And that's not to say that you didn't have loss.
00:21:42.799 --> 00:21:53.200
We we all had loss to our lives, but when it's this close and it's this deep, right, that pain, that that that pain of that moment presents itself and you're like, I know what that feels like.
00:21:53.359 --> 00:21:56.079
You you you listen more deeply.
00:21:56.319 --> 00:21:56.880
Yeah.
00:21:57.119 --> 00:21:57.519
Yeah.
00:21:57.839 --> 00:22:05.039
And out of concern Not just in that moment and and then that's it.
00:22:05.279 --> 00:22:08.240
It's hey, I think I might have something for you.
00:22:08.400 --> 00:22:09.599
Just something to consider.
00:22:09.759 --> 00:22:10.000
Yeah.
00:22:10.240 --> 00:22:11.839
This is what I've seen.
00:22:12.000 --> 00:22:13.200
Maybe it could work for you.
00:22:14.000 --> 00:22:17.359
I think you listen more deeply and with concern.
00:22:17.519 --> 00:22:17.759
Yeah.
00:22:17.839 --> 00:22:18.000
Yeah.
00:22:18.160 --> 00:22:26.960
Another one for me is, and I, you know, I I have a phrase that I tell my kids, it's you talk about like I I don't stress the small things.
00:22:27.039 --> 00:22:27.279
Yeah.
00:22:27.519 --> 00:22:30.400
I I and I I usually didn't before.
00:22:30.559 --> 00:22:34.319
Like, you know, I used to say to people, it ain't that serious.
00:22:34.559 --> 00:22:36.559
That would drive Janice crazy.
00:22:36.720 --> 00:22:39.839
Or she would complain to me about something, the voice, ah, it ain't that serious.
00:22:40.480 --> 00:22:42.720
And now it's not.
00:22:43.279 --> 00:22:49.440
But I also tell my kids, do not hold a grudge.
00:22:50.880 --> 00:22:54.799
And if you're gonna love the person tomorrow, forgive them today.
00:22:56.079 --> 00:23:00.640
Because one, you never know when somebody's gone, but why hold on to that?
00:23:00.799 --> 00:23:02.400
Why let that thing linger?
00:23:02.559 --> 00:23:02.799
Right.
00:23:02.880 --> 00:23:04.799
And it's easier said than done, right?
00:23:04.960 --> 00:23:14.559
But it's just like there's a part of it which is like, yeah, at some point, like move past it, move past the thing and get to the hug and the love and the conversation to move forward.
00:23:14.720 --> 00:23:19.839
Because the more you sit there, you hold on to it, and it just you know, it just builds up.
00:23:20.160 --> 00:23:25.359
Like healing doesn't take place when it's still.
00:23:25.519 --> 00:23:25.759
Right.
00:23:25.920 --> 00:23:27.359
It takes place in mu in movement.
00:23:27.599 --> 00:23:28.160
It's active.
00:23:28.319 --> 00:23:28.720
It's active.
00:23:29.119 --> 00:23:29.599
I love that.
00:23:29.680 --> 00:23:34.720
You said forgive the person if you're gonna love that person.
00:23:34.960 --> 00:23:37.039
If you're gonna love them tomorrow, forgive them today.
00:23:37.200 --> 00:23:37.680
I like that.
00:23:37.759 --> 00:23:38.319
Yeah, I like that.
00:23:38.559 --> 00:23:48.880
Yeah, and I think it's the thing that kind of surprised me about the the men we've become is just accepting and embracing those ordinary days, man.
00:23:49.039 --> 00:23:49.279
Yeah.
00:23:49.519 --> 00:23:55.519
Just because it a lot of it was okay, put out this fire.
00:23:55.759 --> 00:24:00.480
Uh all of these responsibilities are heaped upon us.
00:24:00.960 --> 00:24:06.319
Sometimes it's just regular old days, and that and they're okay.
00:24:06.640 --> 00:24:06.880
It's okay.
00:24:06.960 --> 00:24:08.079
That's what it was okay.
00:24:08.160 --> 00:24:13.200
Like, I I know, I mean, for me, I used to, and sometimes you I you we all deal with this.
00:24:13.359 --> 00:24:15.519
This little, I gotta be busy, I gotta be doing something.
00:24:15.599 --> 00:24:15.920
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:24:16.079 --> 00:24:17.279
I have to achieve something today.
00:24:17.440 --> 00:24:18.960
Sometimes it's just the day.
00:24:19.200 --> 00:24:21.680
Sometimes there's nothing but the day, right?
00:24:21.839 --> 00:24:27.519
You enjoy it, you take the moment, you live with it, and that's it.
00:24:27.680 --> 00:24:28.000
Yeah.
00:24:28.160 --> 00:24:28.319
Right.
00:24:28.480 --> 00:24:29.359
Because there's gonna be another one.
00:24:29.440 --> 00:24:30.880
It's gonna be another day tomorrow.
00:24:31.279 --> 00:24:32.079
And it's gonna be no different.
00:24:32.240 --> 00:24:33.440
And it might really or whatever.
00:24:33.519 --> 00:24:34.559
Or it might be harder.
00:24:34.640 --> 00:24:35.920
Yeah, it might be more stuff to do.
00:24:36.079 --> 00:24:36.480
That's right.
00:24:36.559 --> 00:24:39.440
Um, I think I I would say that's surprised me.
00:24:39.519 --> 00:24:43.440
I've become in some ways more patient, but in some ways less tolerant.
00:24:43.599 --> 00:24:43.920
Okay.
00:24:44.400 --> 00:24:44.720
Right.
00:24:44.880 --> 00:24:53.440
So I'm more patient with people, more patient with things, standing on the long line, it's not moving, sitting in traffic.
00:24:53.839 --> 00:25:01.440
I don't I'm not sitting here getting angry, honking, like the road rage doesn't kick in like it used to 10 years ago, 15 years ago.
00:25:01.759 --> 00:25:04.240
One, it's like the idea of like, what am I rushing to?
00:25:04.400 --> 00:25:05.440
What am I rushing for?
00:25:05.599 --> 00:25:08.240
But I'm less tolerant for like bullshit.
00:25:08.640 --> 00:25:14.799
Like, I'm less tolerant of the nonsense, things that truly like bother me.
00:25:14.880 --> 00:25:16.640
And I think that's actually surprising.
00:25:17.039 --> 00:25:19.759
Maybe it's like uh you know, the the things that spill over.
00:25:19.839 --> 00:25:29.759
It's just like I don't deal well now with like you know, just people selfishness.
00:25:30.319 --> 00:25:33.599
Like I I'm not tolerant of selfishness, yes, right.
00:25:33.839 --> 00:25:41.359
Um, and those are things that like I tell my kids if I talk to them, if I see something they're doing, I'm like, come on now, you're gonna leave that dish in the sink?
00:25:42.079 --> 00:25:44.880
Like, I have like almost no patience for it now.
00:25:45.119 --> 00:25:50.160
Whereas before I'd be like, I'll do it, I'll put it in the dishwasher, right?
00:25:50.240 --> 00:25:52.240
So it's just little things like that, but yeah.
00:25:52.480 --> 00:25:57.599
But also in that instance, it's more about raising this independent child.
00:25:57.839 --> 00:25:58.319
It's true, yeah.
00:25:58.480 --> 00:26:12.000
And and and it's that I I want to see that progression for you because I love you and I want you to get out there and under and be able to self-assess things like, oh shoot, this needs help, or I need to do that.
00:26:12.240 --> 00:26:16.000
I shouldn't, I should have a tidy place because I have a roommate now, right?
00:26:16.319 --> 00:26:18.640
Our daughters have roommates and get married.
00:26:18.880 --> 00:26:21.039
Because we don't want folks thinking they're dusty.
00:26:21.119 --> 00:26:27.920
Yeah, they exactly and and don't have good home training towards this independence that we've been working on so long.
00:26:28.160 --> 00:26:31.599
So I think that that's definitely what you're saying about the top the tolerance.
00:26:32.160 --> 00:26:34.079
Patience and tolerance, yeah, it's too they're different.
00:26:34.319 --> 00:26:34.880
Yeah, yeah.
00:26:35.279 --> 00:26:40.640
And and it we we had kind of already talked about this what's surprised about finding this new purpose, that you have time to go do it.
00:26:40.799 --> 00:26:41.039
Yes.
00:26:41.200 --> 00:26:42.480
Now, yes, yeah.
00:26:42.960 --> 00:26:44.720
And I I think that's what surprise is.
00:26:44.880 --> 00:26:46.720
Oh, wait, now I can, oh right.
00:26:46.880 --> 00:26:48.240
Let me work on whatever this is.
00:26:48.480 --> 00:26:48.720
Exactly.
00:26:49.200 --> 00:26:52.079
And I think that you know that that touches into like being more intentional.
00:26:52.319 --> 00:26:53.200
Yeah, right, I agree.
00:26:53.519 --> 00:27:00.240
Like finding the purpose, now I can go do it, and being intentional with you know what you're doing and how you do things.
00:27:00.480 --> 00:27:21.519
Yeah, where I struggled, I think, often could be it's an ongoing kind of process, and and learning, self-learning is just accepting change because the accepting change, which will always happen, maybe there's a bit of the past you forget or don't incorporate into your present life.
00:27:21.839 --> 00:27:24.880
So I think I think that was kind of a struggle.
00:27:25.200 --> 00:27:38.480
Well, you mean change is difficult, is difficult, and as a part of that change that is also accepting that she's becoming your your late wife is moving further from your normal day.
00:27:38.720 --> 00:27:39.359
Yeah.
00:27:39.680 --> 00:27:39.920
Right.
00:27:40.079 --> 00:27:50.079
So change, I think, is this element of the more you accept the change, the more you accept that she's no longer part of your life in in the same way.
00:27:50.240 --> 00:27:50.480
Right.
00:27:50.640 --> 00:28:06.400
And I think that's that's where the resistance comes from because you're trying to hold on in a way to the routines, to the trends, to the things that you did, to the ways you guys co-habited and and and co-parented.
00:28:06.480 --> 00:28:08.400
Yeah, like parenting has changed.
00:28:08.559 --> 00:28:08.880
Right.
00:28:09.039 --> 00:28:13.119
The underlying theme, the underlying goal is the same.
00:28:13.200 --> 00:28:13.440
Yeah.
00:28:13.599 --> 00:28:18.000
The underlying lessons that you wanted to share and teach, they're the same.
00:28:18.079 --> 00:28:18.240
Right.
00:28:18.559 --> 00:28:20.559
But you're a single dad.
00:28:20.880 --> 00:28:21.119
Right.
00:28:21.279 --> 00:28:24.000
And in my case, I'm parenting with a different person.
00:28:24.160 --> 00:28:24.480
Right.
00:28:24.640 --> 00:28:25.599
Things change.
00:28:25.759 --> 00:28:26.079
Right.
00:28:26.319 --> 00:28:31.440
And I think that's that's where And then also the language that we use as single parents.
00:28:31.519 --> 00:28:42.400
And then also with your now wife, it am I, is the intent and per and perceived message uh is anything getting lost here?
00:28:42.559 --> 00:28:46.400
I mean, this is what I'm trying to do with my daughters.
00:28:46.640 --> 00:28:46.960
Yeah.
00:28:47.200 --> 00:28:50.720
Would my late wife have been able to say it better than I?
00:28:51.039 --> 00:28:59.759
Or some way that she is is surrounding them in a way that I don't or have a certain emotional capacity to.
00:29:00.319 --> 00:29:03.680
And you start to think about that, and that's maybe where you struggle to.
00:29:03.920 --> 00:29:07.759
But then sometimes, especially now, you ain't got time for that.
00:29:07.920 --> 00:29:08.240
Yeah.
00:29:09.119 --> 00:29:17.519
You care and you you do the best you can and you check and see if and look for feedback and and and you you have to keep moving forward.
00:29:17.839 --> 00:29:18.079
Yeah.
00:29:18.240 --> 00:29:21.200
I think another one is like letting go of who you used to be.
00:29:21.440 --> 00:29:23.359
You and I talked about this a little bit earlier.
00:29:23.759 --> 00:29:32.880
Um, you know, in our, you know, before we started recording, we were talking about like the things you find joy in and the things you're able to be now, right?
00:29:33.200 --> 00:29:36.160
In how you act, how you interact with people.
00:29:36.400 --> 00:29:40.480
Like you're you're evolving, you're letting go of who you used to be.
00:29:40.640 --> 00:29:49.920
You know, you were talking a little bit about like, you know, because I think we both, you know, both Nalani and and Janice were shy in their own ways.
00:29:50.079 --> 00:29:50.400
Right.
00:29:50.559 --> 00:29:56.079
So in different settings, we had to adjust and adapt to accommodate them, right?
00:29:56.160 --> 00:30:07.920
To accommodate and support that that the and as a in a way it forced us to be, okay, I'm gonna be a little bit more reserved, or I'm gonna, you know, I wanna I wanna hang out longer, but I'm not, maybe, right?
00:30:08.000 --> 00:30:15.039
So I think these are things now we're like, well, wait, I don't I don't have to leave right away, or I I can have this kind of I can do this thing.
00:30:15.119 --> 00:30:30.960
I can screen crack like those are things that I think you when you think about letting go of who you used to be, but again, accepting the evolution of who you're becoming, yeah, accepting that, oh wow, there's some other things that I that are part of me that really didn't get to come out before.
00:30:31.200 --> 00:30:31.680
That's true.
00:30:31.839 --> 00:30:33.279
Yeah, and you can struggle with that.
00:30:33.359 --> 00:30:46.000
It's this allowing yourself to grow essentially, because it may lead to some other opportunities that where you in the relationship that you're in didn't allow you to bring that in.
00:30:46.079 --> 00:30:51.039
And oh, I wonder if that's gonna work for me or your my children or whatever it is.
00:30:51.200 --> 00:30:53.039
So and I I think you're absolutely right about that.
00:30:53.440 --> 00:30:54.559
There's two that I want to combine.
00:30:54.640 --> 00:30:58.880
I think the other one was like one is like we always talk about like this idea around being happy.
00:30:58.960 --> 00:31:06.240
Like there's there's this thing we struggle with around like, wait, I'm I felt happy today, or I didn't feel sad today, right?
00:31:06.400 --> 00:31:11.839
I think there's this there's this combination of like being happy and being stronger.
00:31:12.799 --> 00:31:15.279
And the I think they're one in the same.
00:31:15.359 --> 00:31:17.759
There's I think you have to feel and be okay.
00:31:18.160 --> 00:31:23.920
Stronger doesn't mean you're letting go of the past, and being happy doesn't mean you're you're you've you've moved beyond the past.
00:31:24.240 --> 00:31:31.119
It means that you're being a stronger person now to understand and accept the things that will bring bring joy to your life in the future.
00:31:31.440 --> 00:31:32.640
And I think there's strength in it.
00:31:32.720 --> 00:31:36.000
I think there's those those two things exist collectively.
00:31:36.240 --> 00:31:48.000
And I think that, you know, as I think about like the where where I struggled was in those moments, acknowledging and embracing joy, right?
00:31:48.240 --> 00:32:01.440
And acknowledging that me accepting this joy, accepting these things, these new experiences, these this this this time where I can laugh and actually feel free and not weighted by the loss, like it takes strength.
00:32:01.599 --> 00:32:06.319
And that was like hard to like acknowledge those two things at the same time for me a lot of times.
00:32:06.480 --> 00:32:06.799
Yeah.
00:32:06.960 --> 00:32:19.039
So I I I think the kind of the other thing that you and I have kind of talked about in different ways is the fact that good can come from tragedy.
00:32:19.200 --> 00:32:19.519
Yeah.
00:32:19.759 --> 00:32:21.599
I still really struggle with that.
00:32:21.759 --> 00:32:22.000
Yeah.
00:32:22.160 --> 00:32:24.079
Do you do you have any sense of that?
00:32:24.880 --> 00:32:25.279
Absolutely.
00:32:25.519 --> 00:32:41.279
I mean, I think, you know, I you know, people ask me, you know, there's times that I think about it, or I'll have a conversation with somebody like, you know, the best thing I got out of this situation, like this, it seems so like, you know, it seems like like a bizarre world to even say that.
00:32:41.359 --> 00:32:41.519
Yeah.
00:32:41.680 --> 00:32:43.839
The best thing I got out of losing my late wife.
00:32:44.079 --> 00:32:47.200
Like the best thing, like is the two shouldn't have been the same.
00:32:48.960 --> 00:32:49.359
It's somehow.
00:32:49.519 --> 00:32:52.240
Yeah, like well, but there is something that I got out of this.
00:32:52.400 --> 00:32:55.519
Yeah, and there is a lesson in all of this, and there is an experience.
00:32:55.759 --> 00:32:57.279
I am a stronger person.
00:32:57.440 --> 00:32:59.759
The kids are stronger and more resilient.
00:33:00.000 --> 00:33:10.079
Like, we have preferred not to lose correct my late wife, their mom, so for you, Nalan, your late wife, you're you're the mom of your children.
00:33:10.240 --> 00:33:10.880
Absolutely.
00:33:11.039 --> 00:33:11.359
Right.
00:33:11.599 --> 00:33:14.400
But we have we we are better people.
00:33:14.799 --> 00:33:18.559
We are we are and and part of it is because of the work we've done, right?
00:33:18.720 --> 00:33:26.559
There are people who are going through this and and and you're still trying to figure it out, like there's still work to do, but I know I'm a better person.
00:33:26.720 --> 00:33:38.880
I feel like I'm a better person because of how I am today, because of the evolution that I've made, because of the work that I've done, because how like so is there good, you know, like how can good come from tragedy?
00:33:38.960 --> 00:33:39.519
It it can.
00:33:39.839 --> 00:33:41.279
It's a great cost.
00:33:41.519 --> 00:33:42.799
Yeah, it's a great loss.
00:33:43.119 --> 00:33:43.519
Absolutely.
00:33:43.759 --> 00:33:44.160
Yeah.
00:33:44.559 --> 00:33:53.920
Yet this more significant purpose extractive from loss.
00:33:54.160 --> 00:33:54.400
Yeah.
00:33:54.640 --> 00:34:02.000
So that the there is good from the tragedy because you realize just how precious the time you have with people.
00:34:02.400 --> 00:34:12.000
And now in our circumstances, we have others that are starting their lives and giving them sense of how precious life is.
00:34:12.159 --> 00:34:12.480
Yeah.
00:34:12.639 --> 00:34:24.400
And so that's gonna come anyway from raising if our late wives were around whether we were co-parenting from afar or in the same house, depending on your situation.
00:34:24.800 --> 00:34:34.400
But to touch on that before we move to the next piece, it's if we all and some people have like a natural desire to help other people, right?
00:34:34.480 --> 00:34:37.599
Like some people will pull over the side of the road because they see somebody with a flat tire.
00:34:37.679 --> 00:34:39.199
Yeah, I don't think I'm that person.
00:34:39.519 --> 00:34:44.639
I worry about being, you know, shot on the side of the road, but somebody's trying to get over a media.
00:34:45.039 --> 00:34:46.079
Maybe it's the New Yorker me.
00:34:46.239 --> 00:34:46.800
I don't know.
00:34:47.119 --> 00:34:50.159
But if I see an old lady, I will.
00:34:50.639 --> 00:34:53.920
If it's this grown man with a flat tire, he's on his own.
00:34:55.280 --> 00:35:02.880
But I my my like I think there's a part of me that has always been like the desire to help other people, right?
00:35:02.960 --> 00:35:05.519
And and and interested to help other people.
00:35:06.159 --> 00:35:25.360
There's a part of this that allows me to achieve that with getting back up, but also people who have lost, and like I I'm on not to say I'm like the person on speed dial for people, but because my friends have known my they know my experience, there are times that oh, I know somebody who's gone through loss.
00:35:25.519 --> 00:35:25.840
Right.
00:35:26.159 --> 00:35:27.679
Can I give them your phone number?
00:35:27.840 --> 00:35:29.039
Yes, right.
00:35:29.199 --> 00:35:32.880
Now, does it mean that I'm the loss expert of my crew or my friends?
00:35:33.039 --> 00:35:41.039
No, it just means that they have somebody who's gone through an experience, and this is a person who can can empathize deeply with what you're talking about.
00:35:41.199 --> 00:35:44.320
Like to me, that's that's that's a good thing.
00:35:44.480 --> 00:35:45.199
Yeah, right.
00:35:45.360 --> 00:35:47.760
So, um gotcha.
00:35:48.800 --> 00:35:58.639
You know, the things that make it worse, I think that's the that's the the the chapter in this is like you know, comparing your new self to your old self.
00:35:59.920 --> 00:36:06.800
Like looking back and trying to compare, well, this is what I used to do, I don't do this anymore, or this is how I used to be.
00:36:06.960 --> 00:36:10.159
Like that that makes it worse because it actually drags you back to the past.
00:36:10.400 --> 00:36:10.800
That's right.
00:36:10.960 --> 00:36:16.480
Right, you know, and we've have discussed this before because we're bringing it forward again because it's so important.
00:36:16.639 --> 00:36:16.880
Yeah.
00:36:17.039 --> 00:36:27.679
Because you if you do that, you stay in the same place, or as you said, you devolve, you move back, you step back in the process of this, therefore you're resisting change too.
00:36:27.840 --> 00:36:28.000
Yeah.
00:36:28.159 --> 00:36:29.599
Because that's what's gonna make it worse.
00:36:29.760 --> 00:36:33.280
Because if you're not moving forward, then well, you certainly didn't want to change.
00:36:33.679 --> 00:36:38.079
You think it's gonna be the same, and then it pales in comparison to what you had.
00:36:38.239 --> 00:36:38.719
So yeah.
00:36:39.039 --> 00:36:47.440
The the you know, living in survival mode, like like you got to, you know, we we overemphathize, you gotta get up and fight this thing.
00:36:47.519 --> 00:36:50.960
Yeah, if you're in survival mode, you're just in the corner taking the punches.
00:36:51.440 --> 00:36:51.760
Right.
00:36:51.920 --> 00:36:56.960
Like and not all of us are uh as dope as you can't rope a rope.
00:36:59.199 --> 00:37:03.039
This is no, you you gotta you gotta move forward in this one, right?
00:37:03.119 --> 00:37:08.159
Like I that that to me is something that's that's really important in this process.
00:37:08.400 --> 00:37:11.360
It you can't just sit there and let it happen to you.
00:37:11.519 --> 00:37:11.920
Yeah.
00:37:12.159 --> 00:37:12.480
Right.
00:37:12.639 --> 00:37:12.880
Right.
00:37:12.960 --> 00:37:19.280
Um, internal damage, physical, mental, all of it.
00:37:19.519 --> 00:37:22.719
And then it's gonna h hurt everybody else that in your life.
00:37:23.039 --> 00:37:23.360
That's right.
00:37:23.440 --> 00:37:23.599
Yeah.
00:37:24.079 --> 00:37:24.239
Yeah.
00:37:24.400 --> 00:37:35.760
And and and as we talk about what makes it worse, and we've kind of addressed this uh just kind of in this conversation, too, is right, that fear of change that we mentioned, and then and then guilt.
00:37:35.920 --> 00:37:36.239
Yeah.
00:37:36.639 --> 00:37:38.880
Another byproduct of staying in place.
00:37:39.119 --> 00:37:47.760
The guilt part is is interesting because then I you know, I usually ask myself, this is something I used to ask myself when I felt guilt was what was I actually guilty for?
00:37:48.239 --> 00:37:49.679
Or what was I actually guilty of?
00:37:49.920 --> 00:37:50.880
Okay, right?
00:37:51.119 --> 00:37:53.679
Like, you know, did I fight hard enough?
00:37:53.760 --> 00:37:55.119
Did I hold her hand on long enough?
00:37:55.199 --> 00:37:55.760
Did I support?
00:37:55.840 --> 00:37:59.039
Did I take her enough to enough doctor's appointments?
00:37:59.360 --> 00:38:01.199
Did we call enough doctors?
00:38:01.360 --> 00:38:06.239
Did we do all of these things you can sit there and feel like you should feel guilty for?
00:38:06.320 --> 00:38:06.480
Yeah.
00:38:06.960 --> 00:38:08.400
That stuff just weighs you down.
00:38:08.639 --> 00:38:08.880
Right?
00:38:08.960 --> 00:38:11.199
It doesn't do anything for your process.
00:38:11.440 --> 00:38:20.719
And at the end of the day, I always thought to myself, the thing that I came had to come back to was I did not give her cancer.
00:38:23.119 --> 00:38:24.800
Cancer killed her, right?
00:38:25.599 --> 00:38:27.039
I didn't give her cancer.
00:38:27.519 --> 00:38:31.119
I fought the best way that we could, the best way that I could think of.
00:38:31.280 --> 00:38:37.599
And that was the thing that for me and for you, you've got to also think, like, what are you guilty of?
00:38:38.159 --> 00:38:38.320
Right?
00:38:38.480 --> 00:38:40.239
Yeah, we could all have done something better.
00:38:40.559 --> 00:38:41.199
All something.
00:38:41.440 --> 00:38:41.920
Guess what?
00:38:42.320 --> 00:38:44.320
But that's how that's your evolution.
00:38:45.199 --> 00:38:47.199
That's the evolution for the next challenge.
00:38:47.360 --> 00:38:47.920
Yeah, yeah.
00:38:48.079 --> 00:38:48.239
Right.
00:38:48.400 --> 00:38:49.280
No question about that.
00:38:49.599 --> 00:38:49.840
Yeah.
00:38:49.920 --> 00:38:51.039
Um what helps?
00:38:51.199 --> 00:38:52.159
What helps?
00:38:53.599 --> 00:38:58.559
Uh, I think you gotta be open to opportunities and open to new things, right?
00:38:58.719 --> 00:39:03.199
Like, you know, the things that may be uncomfortable, right?
00:39:03.280 --> 00:39:08.960
But just if you close yourself off to opportunities, I think you're gonna, you know, close yourself off to new joys.
00:39:09.280 --> 00:39:12.000
Especially with this new identity of who you have become.
00:39:12.159 --> 00:39:12.400
Yeah.
00:39:12.559 --> 00:39:13.840
This is who you have become.
00:39:14.000 --> 00:39:14.239
Yeah.
00:39:14.480 --> 00:39:17.760
So it is embracing those new changes.
00:39:17.920 --> 00:39:18.159
Yeah.
00:39:18.400 --> 00:39:22.000
And as we talk about serving others that you just had mentioned, yeah.
00:39:22.159 --> 00:39:23.280
What we do with this platform.
00:39:23.519 --> 00:39:23.920
Oh, yeah.
00:39:24.000 --> 00:39:24.079
Yeah.
00:39:24.239 --> 00:39:24.800
Not only the platform.
00:39:24.960 --> 00:39:51.280
I've heard of so many people, I know of so many people who found, I mean, we we decided our platform, but I know people who have started volunteering at at centers for you know children centers, you know, homes for people in needy, volunteer to uh it do something because they feel and found joy in helping other people, serving the community, serving the community.
00:39:51.840 --> 00:39:53.360
Um, therapy.
00:39:53.599 --> 00:39:54.159
Yeah.
00:39:54.559 --> 00:39:55.679
So get your therapists.
00:39:56.000 --> 00:39:57.519
We said it before, we're saying it again.
00:39:57.679 --> 00:39:58.639
Get somebody on speed doc.
00:39:58.880 --> 00:39:59.440
If it works for you.
00:39:59.599 --> 00:40:00.239
If it works for you.
00:40:00.320 --> 00:40:00.480
Yeah.
00:40:00.639 --> 00:40:00.800
Right.
00:40:00.880 --> 00:40:04.480
Like I think it's important to do if therapy talk.
00:40:04.639 --> 00:40:04.880
Yeah.
00:40:05.039 --> 00:40:06.559
I say therapy or talk.
00:40:06.719 --> 00:40:07.039
Yeah.
00:40:07.199 --> 00:40:08.159
Talk openly.
00:40:08.320 --> 00:40:11.119
Or talk to somebody who's gonna crack your ass open.
00:40:11.199 --> 00:40:12.079
Yeah, let you talk.
00:40:12.400 --> 00:40:12.480
Right?
00:40:12.960 --> 00:40:13.360
Exactly.
00:40:13.599 --> 00:40:19.039
You know, I always say, like a person who, you know, I have friends, you're one of them who if I'm having a bad day, I'll call you.
00:40:19.199 --> 00:40:21.119
And you don't just sit there and listen.
00:40:21.440 --> 00:40:24.639
You be like, so about what you said though.
00:40:24.880 --> 00:40:25.199
That's right.
00:40:25.360 --> 00:40:25.599
Right?
00:40:26.159 --> 00:40:27.360
I'm listening intently.
00:40:27.760 --> 00:40:27.920
Listen.
00:40:28.079 --> 00:40:29.440
So this is what I heard, man.
00:40:29.599 --> 00:40:30.079
Exactly.
00:40:30.880 --> 00:40:32.559
How are you feeling about that?
00:40:33.119 --> 00:40:36.960
Like, I know that feels awkward, but you know, you gotta, you need that.
00:40:37.119 --> 00:40:39.599
Um, you know, building something meaningful, yeah.
00:40:40.239 --> 00:40:43.119
Find a purpose, but building something meaningful.
00:40:43.599 --> 00:40:53.280
You know, I think one of the first things that I did was, you know, with the kids was like starting to build memories, right?
00:40:53.599 --> 00:40:59.760
Not so they can forget the past, but that they can know that there are more memories coming forward.
00:41:00.000 --> 00:41:08.400
And yes, how do you create a memory that you know lets your late mom live in this moment, but that's building something, right?
00:41:08.480 --> 00:41:13.920
Those were the first things that I thought very intently to myself around like I have to build memories for my kids.
00:41:14.079 --> 00:41:22.480
And I think what you and I have noticed is people notice that we've done that, and we're not fishing for compliments or anything like that, yeah.
00:41:22.719 --> 00:41:31.760
But they will not just say out of obligation, hey, you're doing a great job, but it's they see, especially our children are different.
00:41:31.840 --> 00:41:38.960
They see we as men in the situation we are, yeah, are there's growth.
00:41:39.199 --> 00:41:44.159
There is we're malleable in the sense of allowing things in, right.
00:41:44.320 --> 00:41:51.119
And the the embracing change and and and and we're adapting to that situation that we're now in.
00:41:51.199 --> 00:41:51.360
Yeah.
00:41:51.599 --> 00:41:59.360
So we're in becoming this new person, yeah, that that you are, yeah, that uh our our late wives would huh.
00:41:59.760 --> 00:42:00.239
Interesting.
00:42:00.639 --> 00:42:05.840
So this is I'm glad he has moved in this in this in the in this kind of direction.
00:42:06.000 --> 00:42:06.400
Yeah.
00:42:06.639 --> 00:42:13.119
Um, you know, we we I think so much of our we talked about what your identity is, but so much of our identity is around being a father first.
00:42:13.360 --> 00:42:13.840
Sure.
00:42:14.079 --> 00:42:16.960
I I this one is it's it's like a double-edged sword.
00:42:17.440 --> 00:42:21.360
You have to be a father first, but you have to find a way to find happiness.
00:42:22.320 --> 00:42:29.119
So it I think a lot of these things go into like finding purpose and like finding meaning and and and building something.
00:42:29.280 --> 00:42:36.880
Those are gonna be the things that help you to find these little flashes of happiness so that you can be a great father.
00:42:37.119 --> 00:42:37.360
Right.
00:42:37.440 --> 00:42:38.719
I think those are important.
00:42:38.880 --> 00:42:48.559
And as I have always thought about it, I remember like having a conversation with my mother, and you know, simultaneously I'm going to my therapist, and we're having conversations around being happy.
00:42:48.639 --> 00:42:54.639
And, you know, the the discussion around you gotta make your babies happy.
00:42:55.280 --> 00:42:56.800
No, I gotta make myself happy first.
00:42:56.960 --> 00:43:04.159
I gotta find a way to like find flashes of joy so that I can be a great father and project those flashes of joy for my kids.
00:43:04.320 --> 00:43:04.719
Yeah.
00:43:05.760 --> 00:43:12.000
It feels like a it feels like they're counter to each other, but they're not.
00:43:12.320 --> 00:43:12.639
Right?
00:43:12.880 --> 00:43:16.480
Your flashes of joy could actually be the moments that you build with your children.
00:43:17.199 --> 00:43:18.719
Like so they're they're not, right?
00:43:18.800 --> 00:43:20.800
And I think that's important to to to do.
00:43:21.039 --> 00:43:31.360
And and also the growth, I should say, in seeking happiness, you can't stay in the same place as the man that you are.
00:43:32.239 --> 00:43:36.400
Because sooner in our situation, our children will be gone.
00:43:36.559 --> 00:43:37.599
They'll have their lives.
00:43:37.760 --> 00:43:37.920
Right.
00:43:38.320 --> 00:43:45.519
What do we have then that we can hold on to or move forward with?
00:43:45.760 --> 00:43:53.599
So I think those two things can work in tandem but don't sacrifice one for the other.
00:43:53.840 --> 00:43:54.000
Right.
00:43:54.480 --> 00:43:57.039
That right I think is so critical about that.
00:43:57.280 --> 00:43:59.760
So yeah, you want to have a comparison.
00:44:00.800 --> 00:44:05.199
Again, you miss the conversation, you miss the dinner, the funny comments.
00:44:05.440 --> 00:44:07.679
And it doesn't have to be romantic.
00:44:07.840 --> 00:44:08.159
No.
00:44:08.400 --> 00:44:10.960
It could be just somebody like I said.
00:44:12.079 --> 00:44:15.360
People need masculine and feminine energy in their life.
00:44:15.440 --> 00:44:15.599
Yeah.
00:44:15.840 --> 00:44:17.039
It's a balance, right?
00:44:17.199 --> 00:44:29.039
So if it's just hey, you going out with a person who's a woman and they just bring this good feminine energy that you enjoy, yeah, absorb it.
00:44:29.199 --> 00:44:29.519
Right.
00:44:29.679 --> 00:44:34.800
And in my situation, I'm a lot of other women's new best girlfriend.
00:44:34.880 --> 00:44:35.119
Right.
00:44:35.360 --> 00:44:44.239
Because of just I I like to listen and and we can talk and I can counsel in these different situations.
00:44:44.320 --> 00:44:44.400
Right.
00:44:44.800 --> 00:44:54.000
But remember, I'm as you all know at this point in episode 46, 47, wherever we are, I love my mother very much.
00:44:54.159 --> 00:44:56.320
And so we have a very close relationship.
00:44:56.559 --> 00:45:10.079
And so I am a beneficiary of that relationship with women, meaning my mother, and then also certainly my late wife, raising me to the point where I am and my grandmother.
00:45:10.239 --> 00:45:10.400
Right.
00:45:11.039 --> 00:45:16.880
And you're a beneficiary of people who are okay talking and sharing their emotions and their feelings.
00:45:17.119 --> 00:45:17.360
That's right.
00:45:17.519 --> 00:45:22.960
Because, you know, yeah, we can we can label it and say that men find it difficult, but there are women who find it difficult.
00:45:23.119 --> 00:45:23.440
True.
00:45:23.599 --> 00:45:23.920
Right.
00:45:24.159 --> 00:45:25.920
To to talk about what they're really feeling.
00:45:26.000 --> 00:45:26.159
Right.
00:45:26.320 --> 00:45:26.480
Right.
00:45:26.639 --> 00:45:32.800
And I think, yeah, more generally, that's a stereotype that is probably more true in men.
00:45:33.039 --> 00:45:45.840
But the reality is if you have people who you are open sharing and talking to and communicating with, then you're gonna be wanting to have something with that, you know, with like that with somebody else.
00:45:46.000 --> 00:45:46.159
Yeah.
00:45:46.320 --> 00:45:49.519
And and and I think that helps me to help other widowers.
00:45:49.760 --> 00:45:50.320
And you too.
00:45:50.480 --> 00:45:50.800
Yeah.
00:45:51.039 --> 00:45:55.039
Because you said that you have more of that patience.
00:45:55.280 --> 00:45:55.599
Yeah.
00:45:55.920 --> 00:46:00.159
But it's also I like I think back to when I was going through my experience.
00:46:00.320 --> 00:46:00.719
Yeah.
00:46:00.960 --> 00:46:02.639
And I needed that so much.
00:46:02.800 --> 00:46:02.960
Yeah.
00:46:03.119 --> 00:46:04.880
And I didn't know exactly where to find it.
00:46:05.039 --> 00:46:05.199
Right.
00:46:05.280 --> 00:46:05.519
Right.
00:46:05.679 --> 00:46:07.840
Not to say, like, there's a lot of books out there.
00:46:07.920 --> 00:46:12.639
There's a lot of people talking about grief, a lot of people talking about how to deal with loss.
00:46:12.880 --> 00:46:16.159
There was something missing that I needed at that time.
00:46:16.239 --> 00:46:20.000
And part and and it was something like this, like what we're trying to create.
00:46:20.079 --> 00:46:20.239
Yeah.
00:46:20.400 --> 00:46:24.079
But it was also somebody who had gone through what I'd gone through.
00:46:24.239 --> 00:46:24.480
Right.
00:46:24.639 --> 00:46:24.800
Right.
00:46:24.880 --> 00:46:26.639
And it's not to say they didn't exist.
00:46:26.800 --> 00:46:30.639
I couldn't find them, or nobody was saying, Hey, Jamal, you need to go and talk to this person.
00:46:30.800 --> 00:46:32.000
He just went through this.
00:46:32.239 --> 00:46:40.800
So when I started going through it, and when I went through my experience, and the people would say, Hey, do you know that Joe is going through something?
00:46:41.039 --> 00:46:42.320
His wife is sick.
00:46:42.559 --> 00:46:43.599
Oh, yeah.
00:46:44.000 --> 00:46:45.920
Tell give Joe my number.
00:46:46.239 --> 00:46:46.880
Right.
00:46:47.360 --> 00:46:49.360
Oh, I'm going to reach out to him or whatever.
00:46:49.440 --> 00:46:53.840
And I think that was important to me because it was something that wasn't there, you know, when I needed it.
00:46:54.480 --> 00:47:02.079
Um, you know, and then I think the last thing, man, like just accepting growth as a part of the grief process.
00:47:02.960 --> 00:47:05.199
Like we, you know, we actually talked about that.
00:47:05.360 --> 00:47:09.599
That could that was almost the name, right, of the podcast from From Grief to Growth.
00:47:09.760 --> 00:47:10.079
Yeah.
00:47:10.239 --> 00:47:10.480
Right.
00:47:10.639 --> 00:47:12.239
But we, you know, we looked at it.
00:47:12.400 --> 00:47:13.599
Hey, what are we ultimately doing?
00:47:13.679 --> 00:47:15.039
We're we're getting back up here.
00:47:15.199 --> 00:47:15.679
Yeah.
00:47:16.159 --> 00:47:24.000
So, you know, I think those are the things that we we we we you know we we figure help us through this process.
00:47:24.159 --> 00:47:25.679
Oh yeah, I I think you're right.
00:47:25.840 --> 00:47:30.159
And all this adding to this new sense of who you're becoming.
00:47:30.320 --> 00:47:37.199
And if you don't recognize yourself anymore, maybe because the grief has been shaping you.
00:47:37.519 --> 00:47:40.480
Yeah, and and maybe that that's okay, right?
00:47:40.639 --> 00:47:47.280
But like it's an at I think what if grief is only taking something away?
00:47:48.000 --> 00:47:57.519
Uh what if it's so revealing what this what the transformation that's going on that that actually it's always been inside of you.
00:47:57.760 --> 00:47:58.000
Yeah.
00:47:58.320 --> 00:48:08.559
You know, I think some of the key things that we want to like take away from this, that you should take away from this, is you know, you've got to look at how you've changed.
00:48:08.639 --> 00:48:08.880
Yeah.
00:48:09.360 --> 00:48:17.760
And be like really honest with yourself around, hey, this is a process and this is what I've been through.
00:48:18.239 --> 00:48:18.480
Yeah.
00:48:18.639 --> 00:48:18.800
Right.
00:48:18.960 --> 00:48:22.320
And and and recognize those strengths that you now have.
00:48:23.039 --> 00:48:25.920
Again, it was inside of you and it's just brought to the surface.
00:48:26.079 --> 00:48:26.719
It's revealed.
00:48:27.119 --> 00:48:30.320
And don't apologize to anybody for your growth.
00:48:31.280 --> 00:48:34.400
So many of us, so many people are looking in at you.
00:48:34.559 --> 00:48:42.800
So many people who, you know, in many cases, you know, questioning your path and what they would have done or what they should everybody's different.
00:48:43.119 --> 00:48:52.159
And until everybody and somebody experiences this, you can only do what you believe is right for you and right for your family.
00:48:52.480 --> 00:48:55.599
And then what you said earlier about build something meaningful here.
00:48:55.760 --> 00:48:56.000
Yeah.
00:48:56.159 --> 00:49:02.079
This is the opportunity to have in shaping who you have become, is building something meaningful.
00:49:02.400 --> 00:49:08.639
And I think the last kind of takeaway, the story I told earlier about help another man here.
00:49:09.519 --> 00:49:16.159
I told about the gentleman who came to my house, was talking about he was looking for answers at the bottom of a bottle.
00:49:16.320 --> 00:49:16.559
Yeah.
00:49:16.719 --> 00:49:20.880
He realized, paused, yeah, I can't do that anymore.
00:49:21.119 --> 00:49:22.719
So help help another man.
00:49:22.960 --> 00:49:29.119
Yeah, and and if you take anything from this, don't just ask yourself, what have I lost?
00:49:29.360 --> 00:49:29.840
Yeah.
00:49:30.079 --> 00:49:32.639
Ask who am I becoming?
00:49:32.880 --> 00:49:36.320
Yeah, because you know, maybe that's what getting back up is about.
00:49:36.559 --> 00:49:39.199
Maybe that's what it's been about all along.
00:49:39.679 --> 00:49:40.639
So Yeah.
00:49:40.880 --> 00:49:45.519
Well, we appreciate you tuning into us yet again.
00:49:45.920 --> 00:49:52.400
And continue to send the comments and just subscribe everywhere you can.
00:49:53.039 --> 00:49:54.400
Like, thumbs up, all of that.
00:49:54.639 --> 00:49:55.199
Five stars.
00:49:55.360 --> 00:49:56.400
Yeah, yeah, all that.
00:49:56.639 --> 00:49:58.719
And it's just continuing to expand.
00:49:58.800 --> 00:50:02.719
We talked about the widow resets coming together.
00:50:02.960 --> 00:50:12.400
So we want to do more of that and get that out for everybody and just bring different people where for those who kind of need that focus time.
00:50:12.480 --> 00:50:14.079
So you hear more about that coming up.
00:50:14.239 --> 00:50:14.559
Yeah.
00:50:14.880 --> 00:50:17.360
Share us, like us, thumbs up.
00:50:17.679 --> 00:50:18.480
Thanks for joining.
00:50:18.880 --> 00:50:19.199
Thanks.
00:50:21.440 --> 00:50:23.599
Thank you for joining us on Getting Back Up.
00:50:23.760 --> 00:50:25.519
Finding life after death.
00:50:25.679 --> 00:50:30.320
If something in today's episode spoke to you, pass it on because somebody else needs to hear it.
00:50:30.719 --> 00:50:31.039
For sure.
00:50:31.199 --> 00:50:33.840
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00:50:34.719 --> 00:50:38.719
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00:50:38.880 --> 00:50:43.039
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00:50:43.519 --> 00:50:48.719
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00:50:48.960 --> 00:50:52.960
And remember, getting back up is part of life.
00:50:53.280 --> 00:50:55.920
But getting back up is how we live.
00:50:56.079 --> 00:50:57.440
We'll see y'all next time.