Interview with Author Elizabeth Redmond

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A sexy day with Daddy. I'm going read this team book,
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Mama's book. So grab your cheap buzzy and listen.
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Hey, guys, welcome to another episode a Bad Book Bash.
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Today we're doing something a little different. Instead of my
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typical kind of let's be honest, negative bitching about writing,
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this is gonna be a more positive episode. One of
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my dear friends and returning podcast guest stars named Elizabeth Redmond.
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She has released a book. She is an author. I
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read this book and it was fucking amazing. And I'm
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not just saying that because she's my friend. Like I've
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had I've read a lot of books for friends and stuff,
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and this book was We'll get into it, but it was.
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It was amazing and I genuinely really enjoyed it. It
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hit me emotionally in such a deep level. And also
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the imagery behind the scenes, I actually felt like I
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was there, like with all the senses. Anyways, I'm getting
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a little too into specifics. Well, we'll introduce Well, I'll
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introduce Elizabeth right now. She's a comedian. She's also the
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host of El Paso Comedy Club here in Dublin. She's
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a public speaker and the book that she has just
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released is titled The Final Resting Place of a Butterfly. Elizabeth,
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you want to introduce yourself.
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Now, Oh hi, thank you so much for this. That's
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a warm welcome, thank you that what you're saying means
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so much to me. I was for a minute, I
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was going, who is this person? What is this book
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she's talking about? I was like, ooh, thank you so much.
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What a lovely introduction. What's that accent you got? Oh?
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So that's the whole thing. It's the whole thing. It's weird.
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It's always been weird because I grew up in the
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States with two foreigners for parents and the acting thing.
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And I've been here in Ireland for about fourteen years
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and I was raised in Texas. I speak Spanish. I
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can do accents, and that can be problematic because sometimes
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you can put them on a little bit without even trying,
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and then people just presume your mental But yes, it's
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a bit. I don't know people. People often comment on
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my accent. Irish people are like, are you Canadian?
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What is that?
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And then one of the girls at my day job
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was like, you don't have a Texas accent until you
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say she says, you start to call everybody Darlin when
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I go, hey Darlin, and then she's like, there it is,
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Hey Darlin, there it is. So it's a bit of
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a mix. So like my background and yeah, it's.
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Weird, Like you do have some colloquialisms that you say,
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but I'm like, that's very Southern. But then you yeah,
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like as as an American who's lived in Ireland, I
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can tell you've been here a lot longer than me.
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And so's then that there's some words that you say
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that I'm like, oh, that's that's very Irish. Was like
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in the middle of the sentence, and then you go
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back to being American.
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But yeah, and even pronunciations of certain words. And sometimes
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if I'm not watching it, it also depends on like
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my audience, who I'm around, because if you're around of
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a bunch of Americans, you're going to just naturally fall
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into that old pattern of speaking. And if you're around
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nothing but Irish people, you're gonna find that you fall
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into that melodic, you know, way of speaking. So I
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do notice certain things. Even my partner, who's Irish, my fiance,
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he's like, yeah, you've gone kind of full Irish having
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your baby a little bit, certain words that I say,
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or certain anything that might end with sound, you know,
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or even just that sound sound, you know sound. I
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was like, that's totally a little or sometimes I even
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confuse myself a little bit because I'm like, oh, yeah,
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you know, I took my car to the garage, and
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then the next sentence, Oh, I got a call from
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the gar from the garage, and I'm going, wait, what
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am I doing? What am I saying? I forget when
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work is? You know? Yeah, I'm going, wait where am
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I boot trunk? Like what? Yeah?
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So I was just like, yeah, garage.
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I was like, oh, that's right, we say garage. Doesn't
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that sound bizarre now to you because you've been here
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a while as well?
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Well, yeah, I've been here since twenty sixteen, and I know.
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But then sometimes I hear people say a certain word
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and then I'm thinking, is is it like a because
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I'm it's like Midwest English that I say. You know,
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I'm from the Midwest, So I'm like, is dary is
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what they say in Texas where.
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You're yeah, originally from No, we say garage, we say garage,
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you know, garage, those French words that everybody kind of
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plays with like over here, you know they call it
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a filet.
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Oh that actually you know, and it's a philelet that
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actually really ticked me off when I first came over here. Yeah,
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so I'm like, that's one of the ones that sticks. Yeah,
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you can mill it roll. I'm like, you guys are
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physically geographically closer to France than we are in the States,
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and we're the ones saying it correctly. I literally had
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this conversation like last night with somebody. I was like
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the filet, and they were acting like they didn't really
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understand what I say. I said, the pillot, you know,
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the phillot. But it just sounds wrong to call like
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a piece of steak Philip Mignon. Yeah, you know, you don't.
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I don't know. It's weird. Language is so fun, isn't it.
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I guess that, you know, little tangent with the Philip
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philet thing, just because you know, when I first moved
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over here, it was autumn twenty sixteen. We all know
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what was going on back then, mister mister orange man.
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And you know, so people some people, like in my
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master's course, they would you know, they would like tease
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me for being American and they would make the kind
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of typical American jokes of like Americans are stupid and
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culturally ignorant. Yah da yah, And then I hear them
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pull out chicken fill it and like you're sick. Yeah,
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dare you, sir? Yeah yeah, late yeah, but small, small tangent.
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We all of our tangents. I like that.
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But oh that we're here to talk about your lovely,
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lovely book. This is more of a book boasting and
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the book basting the bulllashing. Yeah, so please will you
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tell us about your book, The Final Resting Place of
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a Butterfly? And just like quick summary.
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Well a quick summary. It is actually based on the
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true story of my great grandmother, maternal great grandmother, and
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how she ended up going from like the life of
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a New York socialite down to Mexico City in the
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middle of the Mexican Revolution one hundred years ago over
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well over one hundred now, and how she and her husband,
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she was pregnant, had two small children, didn't speak a
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word of Spanish, had no connections to Mexico, and ended up,
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you know, immigrating to a whole new country as a
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young wife and mother kind of led blindly into a
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situation by her husband, who she was meant to be
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able to trust, and things were not exactly what they seemed,
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and she found that out when she went down there.
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So when I got the idea of the book, you know,
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I've written all my life different things, and when you
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do stand up comedy, you write, of course, and I
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have always wanted to write books. Didn't go to UNI
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for it, didn't know exactly if that was the right
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path for me. Took some writing courses in UNI, you know,
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but didn't in it. So I think sometimes, especially in
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Martin study, you can kind of feel like almost a
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bit of a fraud or an impostor if you don't
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have the backup credentials, you go, who am I to
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think that I could be, you know, the next author
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of Twilight for example. To be fair, I don't think
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I could do better.
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In the bar very low.
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I'm putting the bar a tiny bit load. Do you
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know why? Because if you put the bar nice and low,
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people expect less from you, and then they go, oh,
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that was actually quite good.
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You know, you know what I like to live by.
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There was a quote by it goes, if you reach
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for the reach for the stars, so if you fall,
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you land on the clouds. That was the very famous philosopher, Uh,
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Kanye West, I.
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Believe so I love that. I love that. I think
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he might have stolen that from Oscar Wild and kind
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of missed next.
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Tour round today. Now just me five minutes ago being like,
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why do people think Americans are still culturally ignorant? And
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then here I'm going being like, yeah, Kanye West said that.
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Originally he was the first one.
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No, I'm trying to think no, but he probably did
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get influenced. I'm trying to think what the quote is
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by Oscar Wild, something about like, no, some of us
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are We're all in the gutter, but some of us
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are looking at the stars or something. Yeah, it's you know,
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but yes, I can see where like or if people
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are quoting you know, Abraham Lincoln said this on the
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internet and you're going, no, I don't think you did.
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Yeah, yes, so I'm just trying to google it go
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yeah it's yeah.
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Well sorry, well back back to back to the synopsis
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of the book. It's just it it's a fictionalized telling
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of what I think happened. Obviously, I I'll never really
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get the whole story because what I heard from my
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maternal grandmother. My maternal grandmother was from New York and
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she was one of the children in the book. She
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was four when the family relocated to Mexico City, and
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my great aunt, her little sister, was the baby that
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was born there. And so when I would go, my
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mother was there, born and raised in Mexico City. Which
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growing up in the United States and in Texas in
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the eighties and nineties, people just always thought that was bizarre.
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When people go on about like you're saying, the United
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States can be viewed as very culturally ignorant when we
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have so much diversity and so many different cultures, it's
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hard to wrap your head around that. But I think
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the United States is so geographically large and there's so
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many people that we often do tend to be a
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bit myopic, focusing on just what we see going on
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in the United States and Mexico being you know, Mexico
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and Canada are our nearest neighbors, and I would say,
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as an American myself, we probably don't know enough about
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our closest neighbors. So because the indigenous population of the
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United States was wiped out essentially and replaced with immigrants
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from all over the world, but most especially in the
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beginning European whites. You know, so was Canada, so was
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now their indigenous population was not wiped out, neither was
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the Mexican or any Latin American countries, but a lot
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of immigrants started coming from Europe and other places into
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these countries. So, you know, white Europeans have been going
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into Mexico since the fifteen hundreds, the Conquistadors, the Spaniards,
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the French, the Germans, like loads of people from Europe.
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People in the United States don't really see that though,
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because when we have the kin to almost reverse immigration
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in a sense, you've got migrant workers, people in poverty
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who are flooding and have been flooding for a long
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time into the United States. But also, i say flooding
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into the United States. A lot of the United States
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used to belong to Mexico, so those people were also
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a lot of them were already there. That was their land,
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there was their home, and it got annexed and secede
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and went into you know, we've got taken over and
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became part of the United States. But there's huge swaths
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of Mexican indigenous generations of family in California, Arizona, New Mexico, Texas.
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Those people have been there for hundreds of years. They're
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American now, you know, but racially they might be considered indigenous,
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whether North American indigenous, which Mexico is part of North America.
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So whenever I would tell people, and my mother would
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tell people, oh, you know, I'm from Mexico City, you know,
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people in the United States just would give us a
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weird look because they weren't used to sing white Mexicans.
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It's just not a demographic that's thought about in the
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United States, like we don't exist.
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That is very true because you you were raised were
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you raised in Mexico.
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No, I was raised in Houston. But I was very,
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very fortunate in that I was able to go almost
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every summer every year to either Mexico City or Dublin
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because my parents were from those countries. You know. My
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dad was from Dublin, my mom was from Mexico City.
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So it wasn't even like a oh, they're going on
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holiday again. It was my mom had to find something
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to do with me for the whole summer while she
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was working my dad was working. So it's either you're
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going to Ireland for the summer or to stay with family,
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or you're going to Mexico City to stay with family.
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So it was actually quite economical in that way, probably
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cheaper than camp, you know, and a way to see
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the family and away for me to practice my Spanish.
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So I was but I'm clearly Spanish. But I look
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back in hindsight and I go, oh my god, probably
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people think what a privileged brat, what a privileged existed.
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It was entirely privileged in the sense that I got
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such cultural enrichment, right that not many people get.
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But monetarily it's.
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Not like monetarily, no, it was monetarily it was cheaper,
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you know, so I just send me to cousins and
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aunts and you know, so I grew up spending almost
248
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every summer in Mexico City and or Ireland, and that
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was it was incredible.
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So that is something that's really interesting about you that
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I see in this book is this mix of the
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this triad of Yeah. Sure, I mean I feel like
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we see a lot in media about like, you know,
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American and Irish mixing, or American Mexican mixan, but then
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you bring all three.
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Yeah, America, a lot of people of the commented, They're like,
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that is so cool, And it really is. Like I
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always say, I'm so so fortunate because I grew up
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at a really great time in the United States, but
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I also grew up exposed to really other great countries
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as well, and all three countries and cultures had their
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pros and cons had their problems, but also had their
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wonderful things, and so being able to and I do
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feel it's hard for me, like when I do explain
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to people, yes, I'm American, but I I you know,
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I was born and raised there. I was born in Galveston, Texas.
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But because my parents were from other countries and their
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families were so you know, we had no roots in Texas,
269
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we had no history in Texas. It was hard for
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me to feel like I belonged. Whereas I stepped off
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the plane in Mexico City or in Dublin, and I
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was like, oh, this is home. And I felt that
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on an almost cellular level in the time I was
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a child, and I felt that about the two places.
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So I often tell people I was actually I was
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rared in the three countries. Yeah, you know, I was.
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I went to that school, I went to school during
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the school year in the United States, but every single summer,
279
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every single holiday was spent in one of the other countries.
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I kind of, yeah, I definitely get that. I mean,
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not nearly on the same level, but thouse okay, Like,
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you know, I'm from Chicago and my parents are from
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the southern part of the States, and I know it's
284
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very different comparing like this regional part of the States
285
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to like a whole different.
286
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Right.
287
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It's I don't want to.
288
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Say, no, is it, but is it? I mean I
289
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can see where you're going. Cultures are so different.
290
00:14:07.200 --> 00:14:09.759
Yeah, Like you know, like this, the food that my
291
00:14:10.080 --> 00:14:13.120
mom would cook in the house was you know, more
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Southern style. Yeah, and so my you know, some of
293
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my friends had never had it before. And I think
294
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even just some of the beliefs that was taught in
295
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my house, most of them I did not agree with.
296
00:14:24.600 --> 00:14:26.759
Yeah, yeah, but they stuck out.
297
00:14:27.080 --> 00:14:30.080
They stuck out a bit. And what was even weirder
298
00:14:30.240 --> 00:14:32.600
is that, like some of my friends like this actually
299
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ticked me off a bit. But like I had this
300
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one friend that I've known since I was seven, right,
301
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and again, I was born and raised in Chicago, and
302
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he would constantly refer to me as a Southern bell
303
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and I'm like a bitch, he grew up togathered at
304
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I don't have a Southern accent at all. Yeah, like
305
00:14:48.639 --> 00:14:50.320
you're from the South, you can tell I don't have
306
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a sun accent. But still it was weird, like people
307
00:14:52.559 --> 00:14:55.320
around like that was not the first time i'd heard that. Yeah,
308
00:14:55.320 --> 00:14:57.279
where people would try to be like, oh, because you're Southern,
309
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I'm like, no.
310
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Just not.
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Yeah. Well, that's the thing I think is that we
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have to kind of decide for ourselves what we feel like.
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It's not always about where we're born and where we're rared,
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and it's not always about our background. And there are
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some people that they have very rich cultural backgrounds that
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they kind of go they shun it, so like that's
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just that's not how I feel. So I can see
318
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where your friend's calling you that would annoy you. But
319
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I think you make a very good point. Don't discount
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it just because it's the same country, Chicago to the
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south of the United States, huge fast difference. I don't
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think you need that. I don't think you need that.
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You know, imaginary line on a map, you don't need
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that divide say it's a different country. You know, it's
325
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it's sometimes in many ways, parts of the United States
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are like different countries.
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00:15:37.000 --> 00:15:40.240
So you know, Texas was a technically yes, it was
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for like five years and a year ten years ago.
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They had their own money. That's why I guess all
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she didn't.
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All have brought this up, because every time this subject
332
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comes up with a Texan, you guys get so weirdly defensed.
333
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We were our own countet.
334
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Yeah, and you know what I am, We're the only
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ones that are allowed to fly our flag above.
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The americad life. Okay.
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I explained to people like, I'm so sorry, sorry that
338
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we're like this and this is where I am very Texan.
339
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And here's the kicker, I feel more Texan than American.
340
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I know. Weird really heard that. Yeah, yeah, well a
341
00:16:10.480 --> 00:16:12.600
look at the whole thing. I think when you do
342
00:16:12.759 --> 00:16:15.360
have a place that was its own country, that gets
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into the psyche of the people, and then it gets
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passed down through the generations, everything from you know, civil
345
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and law and education and through the communities, and people
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are like, oh, we were our own country one hundred
347
00:16:26.519 --> 00:16:28.480
and fifty years ago, you know, so we're two hundred
348
00:16:28.559 --> 00:16:31.279
years ago now and nearly and I yeah, I think
349
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that's a hard thing to kind of get over. Maybe
350
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you know what I mean.
351
00:16:34.679 --> 00:16:38.159
Any Texas listeners sigh, school I would I would go
352
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to Texas every summer, like how you would go to Mexico, yeah, Ireland,
353
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And then my Texan friends would be like, you're not
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one of us. Yeah, you know, obviously I sounded. And
355
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then I'd go back to Chicago. Yeah, like, oh you
356
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you went to your homeland or something, right, Anyways, I
357
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don't want to.
358
00:16:53.799 --> 00:16:55.879
Well, look when I was growing up and coming here
359
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to Ireland and my Irish cousins were so disappointed. They're like, oh,
360
00:16:59.000 --> 00:17:00.639
you don't sound like a text, you know, you're not
361
00:17:01.000 --> 00:17:03.080
way with how they exactly, they made fun of me.
362
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They're like, well, you can't ride a horse what And
363
00:17:04.960 --> 00:17:06.680
then I'd go to Mexico City and all my cousins
364
00:17:06.720 --> 00:17:09.000
would be like, oh ya, you know, the little little
365
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American girl, you know, and they but at the same
366
00:17:11.640 --> 00:17:14.359
time there were always still kind of both like yeah,
367
00:17:14.359 --> 00:17:16.559
but you are one of us, you know. So yeah,
368
00:17:16.680 --> 00:17:20.799
it's very so Basically, the book is based on a
369
00:17:20.880 --> 00:17:24.240
real series of events that happened in my maternal family
370
00:17:24.319 --> 00:17:27.480
and how my mother's family got to Mexico City, because
371
00:17:27.519 --> 00:17:32.440
you go, how did these white American Europeans end up
372
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in Mexico City And it's twenty three percent of the
373
00:17:36.200 --> 00:17:39.400
population of Mexico is Caucasian, is white, you know. But
374
00:17:39.960 --> 00:17:42.359
they all have their different, you know, origin stories how
375
00:17:42.359 --> 00:17:45.440
they got there, and I think that mine is quite fascinating.
376
00:17:45.640 --> 00:17:47.920
It would be a lot more boring, or maybe it
377
00:17:47.920 --> 00:17:50.079
wouldn't be, but I don't think certainly would be as
378
00:17:50.119 --> 00:17:53.880
fascinating if my mother had been Mexican and just been Mexican,
379
00:17:53.880 --> 00:17:55.119
do you know what I mean, people be like, oh,
380
00:17:55.160 --> 00:17:57.440
that's really cool, you're Mexican Irish and I'd probably have
381
00:17:57.519 --> 00:18:00.160
better hair and a nice tan. But you know, like
382
00:18:00.200 --> 00:18:03.519
my mom being white and the last name Clancy and
383
00:18:03.839 --> 00:18:06.720
stuff like that, and you kind of go, what that's odd,
384
00:18:06.759 --> 00:18:09.680
why are you? You know? And she's so staunchly Mexican
385
00:18:09.720 --> 00:18:11.279
and she you know, and we are very proud of
386
00:18:11.319 --> 00:18:13.400
our Mexican culture and we do feel that it's ours,
387
00:18:13.480 --> 00:18:16.720
you know, because parts of my family there have been
388
00:18:16.759 --> 00:18:19.880
there for on her father's line, who is Mexican born
389
00:18:19.960 --> 00:18:22.680
but again European descent, but I can still trace his
390
00:18:22.839 --> 00:18:25.960
line on ancestry dot Com. Of all things. I found
391
00:18:26.000 --> 00:18:29.079
an ancestor that went back into Mexico into the seventeen hundreds,
392
00:18:29.640 --> 00:18:32.160
you know, And so it's like, I really do have
393
00:18:32.200 --> 00:18:35.480
a right to claim my American heritage because it goes
394
00:18:35.480 --> 00:18:37.920
back hundreds and hundreds of years on my mother's line.
395
00:18:38.319 --> 00:18:42.799
My mother's my Mexican born mother. One of her ancestors
396
00:18:42.880 --> 00:18:45.000
on that maternal line from the northeast of the United
397
00:18:45.039 --> 00:18:49.160
States was a general in the American Revolution, you know.
398
00:18:49.240 --> 00:18:51.960
And then on her father's line, again European, but have
399
00:18:52.240 --> 00:18:54.839
been back in Mexico for hundreds of years. So it's
400
00:18:54.880 --> 00:18:57.079
like when I sit there and say, you know, I'm
401
00:18:57.559 --> 00:18:59.480
whatever I am, I have a right to say that
402
00:18:59.480 --> 00:19:01.759
I'm Mexican. I have a right to you know. But
403
00:19:01.799 --> 00:19:03.960
that's been questioned over the years, whereas nobody has ever
404
00:19:04.119 --> 00:19:05.960
questioned in the United States my right to say that
405
00:19:05.960 --> 00:19:08.000
I'm Irish because my father's from Dublin.
406
00:19:08.039 --> 00:19:08.200
You know.
407
00:19:08.519 --> 00:19:11.440
So it's a funny old thing. People are very strange.
408
00:19:11.480 --> 00:19:14.839
But the reason I don't know, I got the idea
409
00:19:14.880 --> 00:19:17.279
I've always written, and I've always wanted to write a book.
410
00:19:17.319 --> 00:19:19.359
But certainly if you had asked me five years ago
411
00:19:19.599 --> 00:19:21.680
when I started the book, when I first had the
412
00:19:21.720 --> 00:19:24.160
seeds start to grow in my head and I was like, oh,
413
00:19:24.160 --> 00:19:25.640
I have this idea. Maybe I should put it down
414
00:19:25.680 --> 00:19:27.720
on paper. If you'd asked me five years ago, I'd
415
00:19:27.720 --> 00:19:29.440
have been like, oh, I'd write a book about this.
416
00:19:29.480 --> 00:19:31.000
I'd write a book about this. I've got to write
417
00:19:31.039 --> 00:19:33.119
a book with my dad. He was so cool, you know,
418
00:19:33.200 --> 00:19:35.480
he was the Irish guy that went to work for NASA,
419
00:19:35.559 --> 00:19:37.920
and you know, like, and I'm working on that story.
420
00:19:38.200 --> 00:19:40.279
But I or I would have wanted to write something
421
00:19:40.279 --> 00:19:43.079
a little bit happier, maybe more comedic. And this is
422
00:19:43.119 --> 00:19:47.720
a quite darker tone to the novel. And I'm actually
423
00:19:47.799 --> 00:19:50.200
quite surprised how it all came about. So it was
424
00:19:50.200 --> 00:19:52.960
about September of nineteen. I remember I'd gotten a new
425
00:19:53.039 --> 00:19:55.119
laptop and I was just, you know, as you do,
426
00:19:55.200 --> 00:19:57.880
messing around, and I had an idea. And for some reason,
427
00:19:57.920 --> 00:20:00.960
I was thinking a lot about my grandmother, my mother's mother,
428
00:20:01.559 --> 00:20:03.680
who had been dead you know, already since I think
429
00:20:03.759 --> 00:20:05.720
nineteen ninety five, and she and I were never close.
430
00:20:05.799 --> 00:20:07.880
We did not have what you would call a good relationship.
431
00:20:08.400 --> 00:20:11.440
My mother's mother was a very cruel woman. She was abusive,
432
00:20:13.119 --> 00:20:16.559
She was abusive, towards myself. You know, a lot of
433
00:20:16.559 --> 00:20:19.960
those generations were yeah, you know, and she was a
434
00:20:20.160 --> 00:20:25.599
very bitter, angry woman. And my own mother would say,
435
00:20:26.400 --> 00:20:28.799
you know, if the things that happened to her had
436
00:20:28.839 --> 00:20:30.440
happened to you or to me, And you know, we
437
00:20:30.480 --> 00:20:32.960
did always try to give that grace of she had
438
00:20:32.960 --> 00:20:36.000
a very hard life. She had a very hard childhood,
439
00:20:36.000 --> 00:20:37.960
which I can't really give any more detailed by back.
440
00:20:38.000 --> 00:20:39.359
So I don't want to spoil it because it's in
441
00:20:39.400 --> 00:20:39.880
the book.
442
00:20:39.759 --> 00:20:43.799
Right well, because your grandmother is again based one of
443
00:20:43.799 --> 00:20:45.480
the characters is basically her.
444
00:20:45.720 --> 00:20:49.279
Yeah, the main care character in the book, Amanda Tappan,
445
00:20:49.480 --> 00:20:52.519
is based on my great grandmother, who was named Anna
446
00:20:52.559 --> 00:20:57.599
Clancy Tappan from Philadelphia, and the whole family originated, you know,
447
00:20:57.640 --> 00:21:00.279
New York, Philly, Boston, going back hundreds a year. Like
448
00:21:00.319 --> 00:21:03.759
my mom used to joke with her Mexican accents, I
449
00:21:03.880 --> 00:21:06.119
had the ancest there's that we're on the Mayflower and
450
00:21:06.240 --> 00:21:09.359
you know, and and sabaskay, we are related to the
451
00:21:09.440 --> 00:21:12.720
Benjamin Franklin And I'm like, okay, well, I'm sure we are. Yeah.
452
00:21:12.759 --> 00:21:16.119
Everybody says that that's not insane, but one of my
453
00:21:16.119 --> 00:21:18.680
mother's ancestors was a doctor at Harvard and that's a
454
00:21:18.920 --> 00:21:21.400
he was an obg y n And that's how one
455
00:21:21.400 --> 00:21:23.440
of the one of the characters in the book ends
456
00:21:23.480 --> 00:21:26.720
up in Mexico. So there's this weird kind of crossover
457
00:21:26.799 --> 00:21:29.480
between the states in Mexico, and it is alluded to
458
00:21:29.599 --> 00:21:34.599
in the book. And it's a fascinating story and I
459
00:21:34.640 --> 00:21:38.680
took quite a bit of artistic license with it. I
460
00:21:39.279 --> 00:21:44.839
for some reason, got this desire to forgive my grandmother
461
00:21:46.000 --> 00:21:48.680
for how she had abused my mother and what that
462
00:21:48.720 --> 00:21:50.200
had done to my mother and to me.
463
00:21:50.480 --> 00:21:51.440
The generational tray.
464
00:21:51.480 --> 00:21:55.119
Absolutely, yeah, I suppose there was a real And also
465
00:21:55.200 --> 00:21:57.319
I was thirty nine at the time. Oh here we go,
466
00:21:57.400 --> 00:22:00.000
given out my age. But it's okay. It was September
467
00:22:00.000 --> 00:22:03.480
twenty nineteen. It was a transformational time. I was getting
468
00:22:03.519 --> 00:22:05.759
back into stand up comedy. I just had to put
469
00:22:05.799 --> 00:22:08.559
my father in a nursing home. I was divorced, raising
470
00:22:08.559 --> 00:22:12.559
two kids on my own. I was having a career shift,
471
00:22:12.799 --> 00:22:15.680
lots of sea changes, lots of big upheaval. And I
472
00:22:15.680 --> 00:22:17.920
guess with my fortieth birthday living which I was really
473
00:22:17.920 --> 00:22:19.960
looking forward to it because I was like, I'm forty,
474
00:22:20.200 --> 00:22:23.079
I ye look at me both my knees work. I
475
00:22:23.160 --> 00:22:25.680
was I was like, I felt like a kid, yeah,
476
00:22:25.720 --> 00:22:27.559
you know, And I was like, I'm not fussed about
477
00:22:27.599 --> 00:22:29.720
forty And I couldn't get what the fuss was. Yeah,
478
00:22:29.960 --> 00:22:31.720
but I do think I was going through like a
479
00:22:31.759 --> 00:22:35.079
pre mid life not a crisis. But look at transformation
480
00:22:35.160 --> 00:22:37.559
and I started questioning things in my own familiar background
481
00:22:37.680 --> 00:22:39.799
and why things were the way they were and why
482
00:22:39.839 --> 00:22:42.319
they turned out the way they did. And I've always
483
00:22:42.359 --> 00:22:45.319
had a fascination with human beings in psychology, and I
484
00:22:45.359 --> 00:22:47.519
think a lot of us in the arts do so.
485
00:22:47.640 --> 00:22:50.720
I have an acting background, stand up writing. I'm fascinated
486
00:22:50.759 --> 00:22:53.720
by humans. You know, why do we act the way
487
00:22:53.720 --> 00:22:55.200
that we do? Why do we do the things that
488
00:22:55.240 --> 00:22:57.839
we do? Why do we treat others the way we do?
489
00:22:57.920 --> 00:23:01.200
Sometimes, especially if we've been hurt and we know how
490
00:23:01.279 --> 00:23:04.319
that feels, and then they go and hurt other people.
491
00:23:05.000 --> 00:23:08.599
See, there's different hurt people. I look, I get that
492
00:23:08.720 --> 00:23:12.160
the hurt people hurt people, but there's I don't know
493
00:23:12.200 --> 00:23:15.839
too many people who haven't been through a lot and
494
00:23:15.960 --> 00:23:20.279
haven't been very true, very very hurt and suffered abuses.
495
00:23:21.000 --> 00:23:24.119
E has their way, everybody has their story. Everybody has
496
00:23:24.160 --> 00:23:27.559
their cross to bear. Literally, some people quote unquote worse
497
00:23:27.559 --> 00:23:31.599
than others. But human beings are pretty resilient and we've
498
00:23:31.640 --> 00:23:37.519
been through a lot of horrific things as global society, cultures, religions,
499
00:23:37.680 --> 00:23:45.039
races people. It's not an excuse to go out and
500
00:23:45.119 --> 00:23:49.000
just do whatever you want. You can't abuse people because
501
00:23:49.640 --> 00:23:52.480
you were abused. There are people who lived through the Holocaust.
502
00:23:52.519 --> 00:23:55.640
There are people who watch their entire families slaughtered in
503
00:23:55.640 --> 00:23:57.920
front of them in a war. There are people who
504
00:23:57.960 --> 00:24:02.440
have been through all of it, pestilence, rape, murder, all
505
00:24:02.480 --> 00:24:05.599
of it, and they've gone on to be wonderful people,
506
00:24:07.039 --> 00:24:11.559
you know what I mean, loving people, People who worked
507
00:24:11.599 --> 00:24:16.000
on themselves, sought answers, and they didn't go down the
508
00:24:16.039 --> 00:24:18.799
path of I'm going to be bitter and abusive and
509
00:24:18.920 --> 00:24:20.200
dark and cruel.
510
00:24:20.480 --> 00:24:21.039
Yeah, you know.
511
00:24:21.119 --> 00:24:23.960
So it's basically like I have to make a superhero reference, like,
512
00:24:24.000 --> 00:24:26.039
are you going to let this turn you into Batman?
513
00:24:26.160 --> 00:24:27.519
Or is you going to let this turn you into
514
00:24:27.519 --> 00:24:30.240
the Joker? Are you going to choose to use your
515
00:24:30.279 --> 00:24:33.119
trauma as an excuse to go down a path of
516
00:24:33.799 --> 00:24:36.960
sociopathy and and cruelty, or are you going to try
517
00:24:37.039 --> 00:24:38.559
and go, you know what, I'm not going to let
518
00:24:38.599 --> 00:24:41.839
them get me. I'm not going to let them change me.
519
00:24:41.920 --> 00:24:43.559
I'm not going to let them steal my joy and
520
00:24:43.599 --> 00:24:45.599
who I am as a person. We all have that
521
00:24:45.680 --> 00:24:49.240
choice to make. So in the case of my grandmother,
522
00:24:49.720 --> 00:24:52.240
you know, her little sister, the one that was born
523
00:24:52.279 --> 00:24:54.079
in Mexico City, Both in real life and the book,
524
00:24:54.160 --> 00:24:57.039
she turned out to be a wonderful human being, you
525
00:24:57.079 --> 00:24:58.240
know what I mean. So you sit there and you go,
526
00:24:58.279 --> 00:25:00.759
why did we get the bad one? Yes, So I
527
00:25:02.160 --> 00:25:05.079
wanted to forgive my grandmother, who had been dead twenty
528
00:25:05.079 --> 00:25:07.480
five years at that point, nearly I wanted to forgive her.
529
00:25:08.400 --> 00:25:11.200
I wanted to think about you know, because I thought
530
00:25:11.200 --> 00:25:14.799
about this many times over the years after I became
531
00:25:14.839 --> 00:25:17.160
a mother myself, like, how can you look at your
532
00:25:17.200 --> 00:25:21.880
babies and do the things that my great grandmother did,
533
00:25:22.759 --> 00:25:25.359
the things that my grandmother did, How can you do that?
534
00:25:25.359 --> 00:25:27.559
That was your innocent, sweet baby? And so I pictured
535
00:25:27.599 --> 00:25:30.240
my grandmother as an inn a sweet, innocent, sweet baby,
536
00:25:31.160 --> 00:25:35.200
and you're kind of going, oh my god. She was traumatized.
537
00:25:36.160 --> 00:25:39.200
And back then there was no mental health. There was
538
00:25:39.240 --> 00:25:42.920
nothing for women specifically. You know, if we had postpartum depression.
539
00:25:42.960 --> 00:25:45.920
We were treated like we were hysterical. They used to
540
00:25:46.000 --> 00:25:49.400
throw women in institutions, they used to bottomize women. That
541
00:25:49.559 --> 00:25:53.119
was common practice. So I started thinking about these two women,
542
00:25:53.119 --> 00:25:57.599
in particular, my great grandmother, Anna Clancy Tappan and my grandmother,
543
00:25:57.680 --> 00:26:02.519
her daughter, Marie Beatrice. And I had so hated that
544
00:26:02.559 --> 00:26:05.000
woman growing up. My grandmother, she was so she frightened
545
00:26:05.000 --> 00:26:07.119
the life out of me with good reason. You know,
546
00:26:07.200 --> 00:26:10.079
I was petrified of her. And when she died, I
547
00:26:10.119 --> 00:26:12.440
was fifteen, and I was relieved, so the.
548
00:26:12.440 --> 00:26:13.079
Terror was over.
549
00:26:13.640 --> 00:26:16.640
But then I remember my mother, who they had never
550
00:26:16.720 --> 00:26:19.599
had a good relationship and had always been fighting and
551
00:26:20.000 --> 00:26:24.680
hideousness and trauma. She wept when her mother died.
552
00:26:26.200 --> 00:26:30.000
I understand that. Yeah, I understand that because well, sorry
553
00:26:30.039 --> 00:26:32.240
not to no making note at all, but I used to.
554
00:26:32.440 --> 00:26:36.200
As you know, my father passed away like two and
555
00:26:36.200 --> 00:26:37.000
a half months ago.
556
00:26:37.359 --> 00:26:38.799
Oh that's so fresh in July.
557
00:26:39.000 --> 00:26:42.440
Yeah. Yeah, And he was not a nice human being
558
00:26:42.680 --> 00:26:47.599
at all. He was literally clinically diagnosed as a narcissist.
559
00:26:47.640 --> 00:26:50.000
This is not me being an armchair sechnologist. You had
560
00:26:50.000 --> 00:26:53.680
a fucking doctor's to pay. Yeah, and yeah, there was
561
00:26:53.720 --> 00:26:55.519
a lot of complicated. He did a lot of He
562
00:26:55.559 --> 00:26:57.359
did way more harm than good in my life. But
563
00:26:57.400 --> 00:26:59.160
of course I was still sad when he died. It's
564
00:26:59.160 --> 00:27:02.119
more like your mourning the relationship you never had. Yeah,
565
00:27:02.720 --> 00:27:05.279
you realize like, oh, it's over, and there's there's no
566
00:27:05.400 --> 00:27:06.119
way to change it.
567
00:27:06.279 --> 00:27:09.279
There's no chance of reconciliation, there's no chance that they're
568
00:27:09.279 --> 00:27:09.960
going to change.
569
00:27:10.039 --> 00:27:10.200
Well.
570
00:27:10.279 --> 00:27:12.279
But seeing that is the thing that haunts me as
571
00:27:12.319 --> 00:27:14.519
I know, when my mother passes away, I don't know
572
00:27:14.559 --> 00:27:16.000
how I'm going to react or how I'm going to
573
00:27:16.079 --> 00:27:18.200
take it. Thinking about when my father passed away.
574
00:27:19.000 --> 00:27:19.920
I thought it was a good man.
575
00:27:20.400 --> 00:27:24.200
I mean he was. We were best friends, we were soulmates. Yeah,
576
00:27:24.480 --> 00:27:27.519
he was great crack. Everybody loved him. Everybody loved him.
577
00:27:27.559 --> 00:27:29.319
I'm telling you. Dogs used to follow him down the
578
00:27:29.319 --> 00:27:32.599
street like the pied Piper. Children, children would throw, babies
579
00:27:32.599 --> 00:27:35.000
would throw their arms open to him. He couldn't. I
580
00:27:35.000 --> 00:27:37.119
didn't know. Too many people didn't like my father, you
581
00:27:37.160 --> 00:27:39.519
know what I mean. And he And it was also
582
00:27:39.559 --> 00:27:41.880
because I think there was that he adored people too.
583
00:27:43.000 --> 00:27:45.960
You know, when you put that out, you get it back.
584
00:27:46.039 --> 00:27:49.599
And he was a light when he died, and that
585
00:27:49.720 --> 00:27:51.640
was three and a half years ago, and I still
586
00:27:52.599 --> 00:27:54.559
and of course I was real. Of course, three and
587
00:27:54.559 --> 00:27:56.160
a half years is not a long time. Of course
588
00:27:56.160 --> 00:27:58.279
I'm gonna be greeving a long time. And I'm telling you,
589
00:27:58.480 --> 00:28:00.839
forty years from now, I'm to be that lady in
590
00:28:00.880 --> 00:28:03.359
the nursing home born all the nurses telling them about
591
00:28:03.359 --> 00:28:07.559
my daddy because he was he was fantastic. And you
592
00:28:07.559 --> 00:28:09.119
sit there and you go, of course you're gonna find
593
00:28:09.119 --> 00:28:12.359
yourself sobbing in the middle of traffic. Of course you're
594
00:28:12.400 --> 00:28:14.680
gonna be cheering up at the weirdest times, going, what's
595
00:28:14.759 --> 00:28:17.359
you know? Oh yeah, Sometimes you message your friend you.
596
00:28:17.400 --> 00:28:19.640
Go, I guess I've crying about my daddy.
597
00:28:19.400 --> 00:28:21.680
You know, Like that's normal to grieve the people that
598
00:28:21.720 --> 00:28:24.000
we love and we're wonderful, But how do you grieve
599
00:28:24.039 --> 00:28:26.880
a person it was your biggest tormentor.
600
00:28:27.039 --> 00:28:29.759
Well another point I want to say that you might
601
00:28:29.839 --> 00:28:32.799
experience that I felt, and actually my brother felt this
602
00:28:32.839 --> 00:28:36.079
as well, because my dad was the worst to my brother.
603
00:28:36.279 --> 00:28:37.519
I don't know, all three of us. It was like
604
00:28:37.559 --> 00:28:39.519
he treated my sister the best, my brother the worst,
605
00:28:39.519 --> 00:28:43.920
and I was in the middle, I guess, But my
606
00:28:44.000 --> 00:28:47.279
brother was more devastated I think by my dad's death
607
00:28:47.359 --> 00:28:50.279
than me. Yeah, but it was more because like, oh,
608
00:28:50.359 --> 00:28:54.599
he was so he was such a nasty man that
609
00:28:54.640 --> 00:28:57.400
you could tell he was living in darkness, Like he
610
00:28:57.599 --> 00:29:02.400
was tormented. He was a tormented soul. And you think
611
00:29:02.440 --> 00:29:04.680
about that, You just think about someone like that like
612
00:29:05.119 --> 00:29:07.599
the it's like, yeah, they're shitty, but they're also a
613
00:29:07.680 --> 00:29:09.720
human who experiences pain at the end of the day.
614
00:29:09.839 --> 00:29:12.240
To see that's exactly. That just shows that your brother
615
00:29:12.400 --> 00:29:16.519
and you and if you are a good sympathetic person
616
00:29:16.839 --> 00:29:21.720
with a compassionate soul, yeah, their pain screams out at you.
617
00:29:22.319 --> 00:29:27.079
Yeah, he was very clearly like living in such yakness.
618
00:29:26.759 --> 00:29:28.480
You have to get to a point where you remove
619
00:29:28.519 --> 00:29:32.480
yourself from the horrible things that they've done to you. Yeah,
620
00:29:32.799 --> 00:29:35.039
and you do have to feel, if not a pity,
621
00:29:35.200 --> 00:29:38.279
but at least an understanding of this is a human
622
00:29:38.319 --> 00:29:40.599
being who had something done to them, or some thing's
623
00:29:40.680 --> 00:29:42.839
done to them that I'll never know about, I'll never
624
00:29:42.880 --> 00:29:44.799
fully understand. And even if they were to tell me,
625
00:29:44.920 --> 00:29:48.160
I could still not comprehend it. And they are in
626
00:29:48.319 --> 00:29:52.599
so much pain, they can't love anyone else, they can't
627
00:29:52.640 --> 00:29:55.599
love their own children, and they certainly don't love themselves.
628
00:29:55.640 --> 00:30:00.599
People who are filled with self hatred. I can't imagine
629
00:30:01.359 --> 00:30:02.559
what that must be like.
630
00:30:03.599 --> 00:30:07.799
Well, and then they also he loved us, but only
631
00:30:07.839 --> 00:30:10.640
because we were He saw us as an extension of him.
632
00:30:10.759 --> 00:30:12.039
So it in our relate it's this move.
633
00:30:12.119 --> 00:30:14.400
Yeah, yeah, so it is like you do. He's like, okay,
634
00:30:14.440 --> 00:30:16.799
I know he experiences love, but it's not the same
635
00:30:16.880 --> 00:30:19.519
kind of love now that we have so does and
636
00:30:19.559 --> 00:30:23.279
it's it's not as pure of a love as you know,
637
00:30:23.319 --> 00:30:25.240
it's a very selfish kind of love. But is it
638
00:30:25.400 --> 00:30:28.119
still valid because it's love at the end of the day, out.
639
00:30:28.680 --> 00:30:30.880
Look, and it's and it always falls on us, the
640
00:30:30.920 --> 00:30:33.200
people who are doing the work and going to therapy
641
00:30:33.240 --> 00:30:36.359
and forgiving and you know, and trying to lead healthy
642
00:30:36.519 --> 00:30:39.279
lifestyles and all that. It always falls on us to
643
00:30:39.319 --> 00:30:41.000
be the ones to forgive and to turn the other
644
00:30:41.079 --> 00:30:42.759
cheek and to be the bigger person. And you're like,
645
00:30:42.759 --> 00:30:44.599
you can only do that for so long before you go, no,
646
00:30:44.720 --> 00:30:48.720
this person is just poison and they can't be in
647
00:30:48.759 --> 00:30:50.839
my life or whatever. You know. The ending is. And
648
00:30:50.880 --> 00:30:55.119
when someone loses a parent that they had a great
649
00:30:55.160 --> 00:30:57.359
relationship with, of course they're going to be devastated. That's
650
00:30:57.400 --> 00:30:59.440
your parent. That you've got two people that brought you
651
00:30:59.440 --> 00:31:01.640
into the world and they're supposed to be your main protectors.
652
00:31:02.160 --> 00:31:05.839
If you've got a parent that you have had turmoil
653
00:31:06.000 --> 00:31:11.039
and nothing but upset with maybe even smidges of good times,
654
00:31:11.240 --> 00:31:13.319
which all that does is get your hopes up that
655
00:31:13.319 --> 00:31:14.839
they're going to come around and love you.
656
00:31:15.359 --> 00:31:16.079
What almost worse.
657
00:31:16.279 --> 00:31:19.200
It is worse. It's absolutely worse. And which is you know,
658
00:31:19.240 --> 00:31:22.039
my dynamic with my mother when you're sitting there bending
659
00:31:22.039 --> 00:31:25.400
over backwards for years, you know, jumping through flaming hoops,
660
00:31:26.279 --> 00:31:29.119
trying to get them to love you, you know, literally
661
00:31:29.200 --> 00:31:31.880
jumping through hoops on fire, and they're they're looking at you,
662
00:31:31.920 --> 00:31:35.039
going the flames aren't big enough. Nothing you do is
663
00:31:35.039 --> 00:31:39.000
good enough. You'll never get their unconditional love. And it's
664
00:31:39.079 --> 00:31:43.640
so it's so vital to human beings to have that
665
00:31:43.799 --> 00:31:47.519
unconditional love from the two people that brought us into
666
00:31:47.559 --> 00:31:50.079
this world that if we don't get it from two
667
00:31:50.519 --> 00:31:52.359
the two of them, who we've got a lot of
668
00:31:52.400 --> 00:31:54.519
work to do. But even if we get like I
669
00:31:54.559 --> 00:31:57.880
got the unconditional love from my father, but it was
670
00:31:57.920 --> 00:32:02.880
my maternal role, you know, it was her gender role.
671
00:32:02.920 --> 00:32:06.079
It was the same sex parent that fucked me up
672
00:32:06.119 --> 00:32:09.480
more if you you know, if it's the truth, and
673
00:32:09.640 --> 00:32:10.799
I don't want to be one of these people that
674
00:32:10.880 --> 00:32:13.160
sits there, Oh everything is mommy's fault. No no, no,
675
00:32:13.160 --> 00:32:15.599
no no. We can't blame our parents for everything. We
676
00:32:15.680 --> 00:32:18.160
have to take accountability again. You can't use that as
677
00:32:18.160 --> 00:32:20.640
an excuse. My ex husband used to like to do that.
678
00:32:21.160 --> 00:32:23.119
So oh, mommy and daddy did X, Y and Z
679
00:32:23.279 --> 00:32:26.759
to me, So now I get to be treat people completely,
680
00:32:27.319 --> 00:32:30.079
you know however I want, and then fall back on
681
00:32:30.160 --> 00:32:32.200
that as an excuse, and I'm like, that's not how
682
00:32:32.279 --> 00:32:35.279
human beings are supposed to work. You know, it's not
683
00:32:35.400 --> 00:32:39.640
our responsibility to live your life for you. We can't
684
00:32:39.640 --> 00:32:41.759
be you know, your happiness And a lot of these
685
00:32:41.880 --> 00:32:46.880
very damaged, emotionally damaged people, they look outward for their happiness.
686
00:32:46.920 --> 00:32:49.880
They can't certainly look inward because woo self reflection, it's
687
00:32:50.000 --> 00:32:51.599
dark in there. They don't want to look at that,
688
00:32:52.039 --> 00:32:53.759
so they put it on their spouse, they put it
689
00:32:53.759 --> 00:32:55.720
on their children, they put it on their you know
690
00:32:55.759 --> 00:32:58.880
what I mean. And that's why we have those narcissistic
691
00:32:58.960 --> 00:33:01.119
types and go you are here to make me feel
692
00:33:01.119 --> 00:33:05.200
better about myself because I'm so damaged I can't do it. Yeah,
693
00:33:05.240 --> 00:33:09.519
So we're dealing with people who are just not uh,
694
00:33:09.599 --> 00:33:16.359
they're almost disabled in the sense of being totally human.
695
00:33:18.599 --> 00:33:20.880
And I certainly hope that doesn't cause any offense. I
696
00:33:20.920 --> 00:33:24.839
don't mean that in a derogatory manner when I say disabled.
697
00:33:24.400 --> 00:33:26.279
Well, no, yeah it is. I mean it's like they're
698
00:33:26.279 --> 00:33:30.039
definitely emotionally disabled. Well a narcissist, yes, definitely emotionally they.
699
00:33:30.000 --> 00:33:32.480
Are missing something. There's a connection in the brain that's
700
00:33:32.559 --> 00:33:35.680
not you know either either because of things that they've
701
00:33:35.759 --> 00:33:38.559
endured that have you know, with the question has always
702
00:33:38.599 --> 00:33:41.640
been nature versus nurture, And I always like it back
703
00:33:41.680 --> 00:33:44.079
to my grandmother and her little sister. They both had
704
00:33:44.119 --> 00:33:46.119
the same things happened to them that happen in the book,
705
00:33:47.920 --> 00:33:50.680
and one turned out to be a monster and one
706
00:33:50.720 --> 00:33:53.519
turned out to be a wonderful, upstanding, loving woman. So
707
00:33:53.759 --> 00:33:56.680
how how And if you read the book and you
708
00:33:56.720 --> 00:34:00.319
see the characters, you would almost think that the little
709
00:34:00.359 --> 00:34:02.799
baby would be the one to be the angriest out
710
00:34:02.839 --> 00:34:05.480
of everyone and who, you know, So it's so strange
711
00:34:05.519 --> 00:34:08.320
how these things happened but I I started writing the
712
00:34:08.320 --> 00:34:11.119
books in September of nineteen. I just started just literally
713
00:34:11.199 --> 00:34:13.000
throwing words down on the computer. I was like, I
714
00:34:13.039 --> 00:34:14.280
don't know what this is in my head, but I'm
715
00:34:14.280 --> 00:34:17.119
going to get it down. Thinking a lot about this stuff.
716
00:34:17.159 --> 00:34:18.840
And then it kind of grew a little bit, and
717
00:34:18.840 --> 00:34:21.840
then we went, you know, into twenty twenty, and I
718
00:34:21.880 --> 00:34:25.480
was like, woohoo, you know, new career. I'm writing a
719
00:34:25.519 --> 00:34:29.440
book forty how twenty twenty, it's gonna be my year.
720
00:34:29.760 --> 00:34:31.239
And then it was. But you know, I think a
721
00:34:31.239 --> 00:34:32.599
lot of people, I think we jinxed it. These A
722
00:34:32.639 --> 00:34:35.000
lot of people are like, oh, the twenties, the Roaring twenties. Yeah,
723
00:34:35.119 --> 00:34:37.599
Like no, it was more like the twenties are on fire?
724
00:34:37.719 --> 00:34:40.559
What is happening? Obviously we got locked up and you know,
725
00:34:40.760 --> 00:34:43.159
trying to find a silver lining. When we were stuck
726
00:34:43.159 --> 00:34:45.199
in the house, like the one of the first or
727
00:34:45.239 --> 00:34:47.280
second lockdowns, I was like, well, this is great, because
728
00:34:47.320 --> 00:34:48.840
this is gonna be all the time to work on
729
00:34:48.880 --> 00:34:50.880
my book. Did I work on the book?
730
00:34:50.880 --> 00:34:51.239
I did not.
731
00:34:51.599 --> 00:34:53.800
June and July and all we had a beautiful summer,
732
00:34:53.840 --> 00:34:55.440
so we were all getting out. I was getting the
733
00:34:55.480 --> 00:34:59.599
kids out. But then around the end of the summer
734
00:34:59.639 --> 00:35:04.480
of twenty I started just something happened and it was like,
735
00:35:04.960 --> 00:35:07.840
if you do a lot of automatic writing, you know,
736
00:35:08.519 --> 00:35:10.239
this is what kind of happened. I just started doing
737
00:35:10.280 --> 00:35:12.559
a lot of automatic writing, and I just started writing
738
00:35:12.599 --> 00:35:15.599
things out of order, and then this character was born.
739
00:35:15.679 --> 00:35:19.039
And then this happened, and it was starting to take
740
00:35:19.079 --> 00:35:23.360
shape the clay, you know, it was starting to resemble something,
741
00:35:23.400 --> 00:35:25.360
and I was like, there's a little bit of cohesion here,
742
00:35:25.400 --> 00:35:30.119
and okay, and I wrote the prologue, which everybody seems
743
00:35:30.119 --> 00:35:32.079
to love. That's actually one of the first things I
744
00:35:32.119 --> 00:35:34.320
wrote was the prologue, the very beginning.
745
00:35:35.719 --> 00:35:37.000
How much you want to go into it, but we
746
00:35:37.320 --> 00:35:39.880
have explained the prologuecause I will say that your prologue
747
00:35:39.920 --> 00:35:44.000
was quite gripping, and it, you know, definitely like foreshadowed
748
00:35:44.159 --> 00:35:47.039
the more sinister parts of the book that were to come. Yeah.
749
00:35:47.119 --> 00:35:50.639
Well, the prologue essentially puts you right in the middle
750
00:35:50.679 --> 00:35:53.760
of the action. It tells you exactly what's going on,
751
00:35:53.960 --> 00:35:55.639
even though you don't know it yet. And I hope
752
00:35:55.639 --> 00:35:58.960
that sentence makes sense, right, It is foreshadowing, yeah, right
753
00:35:58.960 --> 00:36:01.320
in the middle of the main time, Like yeah, yeah,
754
00:36:01.360 --> 00:36:04.400
it is the juicy bit of oh man, stuff is happening,
755
00:36:05.159 --> 00:36:08.480
but we don't know why it. I think it. I
756
00:36:08.480 --> 00:36:13.920
think it grabs people because there's immediately an emotional pull. Yeah,
757
00:36:14.079 --> 00:36:17.000
you know things are not good and that this woman
758
00:36:17.079 --> 00:36:21.760
is posed with a decision and then bam, the next
759
00:36:22.400 --> 00:36:25.360
is you know, back in Manhattan and pre you know,
760
00:36:25.360 --> 00:36:26.199
we've gone back in time.
761
00:36:26.559 --> 00:36:27.760
So major whiplash.
762
00:36:27.840 --> 00:36:30.239
Yeah, a little bit, a little bit. And I'm actually
763
00:36:30.239 --> 00:36:32.440
delighted that it did that to you because everyone has
764
00:36:32.440 --> 00:36:35.280
said that the prologue is really grat Let.
765
00:36:35.199 --> 00:36:36.480
Me know, if I'm like going into doing what I
766
00:36:36.519 --> 00:36:39.559
know you ailed the prologue. You see the main character,
767
00:36:39.760 --> 00:36:46.719
Amanda with her children in a very unsafe situation. Yeah,
768
00:36:46.760 --> 00:36:51.679
and again, like you, you are extremely talented with your
769
00:36:51.760 --> 00:36:55.280
use of imagery and I know, keep I keep saying that,
770
00:36:55.360 --> 00:36:58.239
but like you come up with just like with certain
771
00:36:59.199 --> 00:37:02.639
phrases and ways of describing things that I'm like, oh,
772
00:37:02.679 --> 00:37:04.960
I've never thought of it that way before, but it
773
00:37:05.079 --> 00:37:08.760
just clicks. It just like tickles my brain. And so
774
00:37:08.800 --> 00:37:10.719
you do such a good job of painting that scene
775
00:37:10.719 --> 00:37:11.519
of that danger.
776
00:37:11.760 --> 00:37:11.960
Yeah.
777
00:37:12.000 --> 00:37:15.840
And then I think also, you know, you can feel
778
00:37:16.159 --> 00:37:19.719
Amanda's fear as a mother, as you know that this
779
00:37:19.880 --> 00:37:24.679
like maternal instinct and this primal feeling that all of
780
00:37:24.760 --> 00:37:28.480
us have towards family members and loved ones or should
781
00:37:28.480 --> 00:37:31.760
have or should have Yeah, should have, should have? And
782
00:37:31.800 --> 00:37:34.199
then and then suddenly it cuts to Yeah, then it
783
00:37:34.239 --> 00:37:37.400
cuts to her being in New York, uh what like
784
00:37:37.480 --> 00:37:39.960
several months prior, and you're just kind of like, oh, yeah,
785
00:37:39.960 --> 00:37:40.280
how did this?
786
00:37:40.559 --> 00:37:41.519
Yeah? What not going on?
787
00:37:41.559 --> 00:37:44.159
But how did she go from this cushy New York
788
00:37:44.440 --> 00:37:48.280
life to this incredibly dangerous situation in a different country.
789
00:37:48.400 --> 00:37:53.159
Yeah, And I think the prologue highlights not only her
790
00:37:53.239 --> 00:37:57.519
children's vulnerability, but hers. And I had to think about,
791
00:37:57.599 --> 00:38:00.039
you know, in real life, when my great crist my
792
00:38:00.119 --> 00:38:02.960
mother made the decisions that she did things, you know
793
00:38:03.679 --> 00:38:04.719
hit crescendo.
794
00:38:04.960 --> 00:38:05.880
What was it?
795
00:38:05.920 --> 00:38:08.599
What could it have been like that night or day
796
00:38:08.679 --> 00:38:11.480
or whenever? She you know, based on a true story,
797
00:38:11.559 --> 00:38:13.360
totally true story, which was.
798
00:38:13.360 --> 00:38:15.760
Even more I remember, I think you told me after
799
00:38:15.880 --> 00:38:17.159
after I read it, you'really, this is based on my
800
00:38:17.159 --> 00:38:19.119
grandma's Oh this is this is some real shit that
801
00:38:19.159 --> 00:38:19.880
actually happened.
802
00:38:19.960 --> 00:38:22.719
Yeah, yeah, yeah, And then of course, you know, my
803
00:38:22.760 --> 00:38:25.519
mother always made excuses for my grandmother that oh, you know,
804
00:38:25.639 --> 00:38:27.880
of course she is the way she is and blah
805
00:38:27.920 --> 00:38:31.800
blah blah, and I'm going, yeah, but uh, you know so,
806
00:38:32.079 --> 00:38:34.159
But I wanted to delve into that and then the
807
00:38:34.199 --> 00:38:38.239
familial trauma and how it gets passed down from generation
808
00:38:38.280 --> 00:38:41.599
to generation. Like I literally have cousins both in Mexico
809
00:38:41.679 --> 00:38:45.079
City and here are not here but in Texas who
810
00:38:45.840 --> 00:38:49.679
they dubbed it the Tappin Curse because my great grandmother's
811
00:38:50.039 --> 00:38:52.880
the names were Clancy Tapping And it's so funny because
812
00:38:52.920 --> 00:38:55.119
my mom was always banging on about her Irish ancestry,
813
00:38:55.119 --> 00:38:58.559
which yes she is and Clancy, but Tapping tapp A
814
00:38:58.800 --> 00:39:02.760
n is English. And I saw her ancestry results from
815
00:39:02.800 --> 00:39:04.639
my aunt, I was like, oh, y'all are a little
816
00:39:04.639 --> 00:39:07.039
bit more English than you care to admit. Is that
817
00:39:08.800 --> 00:39:11.000
It's cute how you're just picking and choose on there.
818
00:39:11.320 --> 00:39:13.840
And I had that so I had that same conversation
819
00:39:13.920 --> 00:39:16.840
with my mom. Yeah, my mom's a natural redhead. Yeah,
820
00:39:16.960 --> 00:39:21.119
and I know my Irish listeners are gonna cringe so hard,
821
00:39:21.199 --> 00:39:23.320
and I'm so sorry. I told her to not do this,
822
00:39:23.440 --> 00:39:26.039
but she still did it. Whenever she comes here, she
823
00:39:26.159 --> 00:39:27.920
tells everyone how she's so Irish.
824
00:39:28.679 --> 00:39:30.119
That's where she gets her red hair, is it?
825
00:39:30.159 --> 00:39:31.880
That's why he's shack glest. I get my red hair
826
00:39:32.039 --> 00:39:33.920
my temper. And she tells everyone this, and I'm like,
827
00:39:33.960 --> 00:39:35.760
you gotta stumach I in the emper. But she doesn't
828
00:39:35.760 --> 00:39:37.480
listen to me. I swear, I'm telling you people, she
829
00:39:37.519 --> 00:39:40.800
doesn't listen to me. But anyways, I did a DNA
830
00:39:40.920 --> 00:39:43.320
test and my dad had also done a DNA test,
831
00:39:43.440 --> 00:39:45.280
so I was able to see his results in my results,
832
00:39:45.320 --> 00:39:47.400
and from that I was able to conclude because I'm
833
00:39:47.480 --> 00:39:51.880
mostly English. Yeah, and it came from her side. Yeah,
834
00:39:51.920 --> 00:39:54.920
I'm like, you're hella English dude, Yeah, yeah, yeah, But
835
00:39:55.039 --> 00:39:57.559
she still she ignored me. She still tells people. I'm like, oh,
836
00:39:57.559 --> 00:39:59.079
I'm Irish, but no, you're fucking English.
837
00:39:59.239 --> 00:40:01.719
Well we could get again into that conversation all day
838
00:40:01.760 --> 00:40:04.440
long about Americans who are like, Nope, I'm Irish, but
839
00:40:05.199 --> 00:40:08.039
you know you and A doesn't lie, DNA doesn't lie, sister,
840
00:40:08.239 --> 00:40:11.039
but no, but I you know, family members called it,
841
00:40:11.559 --> 00:40:14.199
call it that's happened, curse, And I suppose I did
842
00:40:14.320 --> 00:40:17.239
kind of wonder, like how much is there anything to that?
843
00:40:17.400 --> 00:40:20.719
Can you really be cursed generationally? Can the actions of
844
00:40:20.800 --> 00:40:25.320
your ancestors pass on such bad blood. Can it fundamentally
845
00:40:25.559 --> 00:40:29.840
change our DNA? It can change our psyche? You know, trauma,
846
00:40:29.920 --> 00:40:31.920
They're they're finding links. There are studies that have come
847
00:40:31.920 --> 00:40:34.519
out in the last few years that find links between
848
00:40:34.920 --> 00:40:39.119
like generational trauma and cellular changes, Like how could it
849
00:40:39.239 --> 00:40:42.760
not How could it not change us on an evolutionary level?
850
00:40:42.840 --> 00:40:45.679
How could it not affect our biology? If you you know,
851
00:40:45.840 --> 00:40:48.880
if you do something enough over time, you're going to
852
00:40:49.440 --> 00:40:51.760
have an effect on it, you know, maybe on how
853
00:40:51.800 --> 00:40:54.960
a gene even expresses itself. Because if you know, if
854
00:40:55.199 --> 00:40:58.320
a woman is pregnant, she's under huge stress, her a
855
00:40:58.360 --> 00:41:02.119
drenals are produced, seeing adrenaline, her cortisol is going through
856
00:41:02.119 --> 00:41:03.440
the roof. You think that doesn't have an effect on
857
00:41:03.440 --> 00:41:06.280
the fetus. You think that doesn't have this Elizabeth.
858
00:41:06.639 --> 00:41:11.199
I'm sitting here fucking eight months pregnant. Thanks, thanks bitch.
859
00:41:11.920 --> 00:41:13.800
Well I'm not stressing you out, am, I.
860
00:41:14.840 --> 00:41:16.880
Act I've actually had a pretty chill pregnancy.
861
00:41:17.079 --> 00:41:19.639
Well there you go. Well, if you have a pretty
862
00:41:19.719 --> 00:41:22.360
chill pregnancy, that's great. But like there's this theory, and
863
00:41:22.400 --> 00:41:23.599
I don't know if I've talked about it with you,
864
00:41:23.679 --> 00:41:31.039
before about how we all existed in our grandmother's bodies. Yeah, yeah,
865
00:41:31.400 --> 00:41:34.000
I remember talking like, you know, when my mother was
866
00:41:34.159 --> 00:41:41.000
pregnant with me in nineteen seventy nine and nineteen eighty like, sorry,
867
00:41:41.079 --> 00:41:42.679
not when she was pregnant with me, when her mother
868
00:41:42.840 --> 00:41:46.400
was pregnant with her. Okay, and the female fetus is formed.
869
00:41:46.599 --> 00:41:51.440
Are ovaries are automatically the eggs that you know that
870
00:41:51.559 --> 00:41:53.760
we're all the eggs that we have throughout our life
871
00:41:53.840 --> 00:41:56.320
are are the ones that are already there were formed
872
00:41:56.360 --> 00:42:00.719
in utero. So technically, well, my grandmother was with my mother,
873
00:42:01.360 --> 00:42:03.599
I was there in some form if you get you know,
874
00:42:03.639 --> 00:42:09.039
a little trible well now like that's also you kind
875
00:42:09.039 --> 00:42:11.760
of go, okay, well, biologically I was, and where people's
876
00:42:11.840 --> 00:42:15.760
beliefs about where life starts and where my soul was
877
00:42:15.960 --> 00:42:17.880
if it didn't exists, all that be out yet. I'm
878
00:42:17.880 --> 00:42:20.199
not trying to get metaphysical on you. Just the biology.
879
00:42:20.320 --> 00:42:23.679
Are half of your DNA come well? Yeah in your grandmother?
880
00:42:23.920 --> 00:42:26.960
Yeah yeah, was that egg? That egg was there when
881
00:42:27.000 --> 00:42:29.679
she was pregnant with my mother. My mother had her
882
00:42:29.719 --> 00:42:32.440
eggs in her ovaries already in development, so I could
883
00:42:32.519 --> 00:42:36.119
potentially the egg that became mea was already there, Like.
884
00:42:36.159 --> 00:42:39.840
If your grandma had a hell of stressful pregnancy and
885
00:42:40.000 --> 00:42:42.760
she's releasing you know, who knows what out of hormones,
886
00:42:42.800 --> 00:42:45.119
but then your mom had having a cry my mother yet,
887
00:42:45.159 --> 00:42:47.199
but it's still like a fa Yeah, And I get
888
00:42:47.199 --> 00:42:49.239
I'm not a biologist or any thing. So if i'm
889
00:42:49.920 --> 00:42:52.960
some people might be listening, like I actually have biology degrees,
890
00:42:53.000 --> 00:42:54.480
and I like, that's he's talking out of her asset.
891
00:42:54.519 --> 00:42:56.800
I'm sorry, but no, but I mean, I think I
892
00:42:56.840 --> 00:42:58.280
think there's been studies that have come out in the
893
00:42:58.320 --> 00:43:00.840
last few years as well, like among the African American
894
00:43:00.880 --> 00:43:03.159
community in the United States and among the Jewish community
895
00:43:03.760 --> 00:43:08.239
that they have found like actual changes to their DNA.
896
00:43:08.360 --> 00:43:10.760
They have found cellular you know, things that have happened
897
00:43:10.800 --> 00:43:15.159
because of the generational trauma, the horrific things that they've
898
00:43:15.199 --> 00:43:18.440
been through that kept on going for years and years
899
00:43:18.480 --> 00:43:21.320
and years and were passed on from one generation to
900
00:43:21.440 --> 00:43:24.000
the next. And how those things become ingrained in you.
901
00:43:24.119 --> 00:43:26.800
And then the nature versus nurture debate, even if you're
902
00:43:26.840 --> 00:43:29.800
out of danger, if you were raised by people who
903
00:43:29.880 --> 00:43:33.559
were constantly in danger and constantly had high cortisol levels
904
00:43:33.599 --> 00:43:36.119
and were constantly in fight or flight. That's going to
905
00:43:36.280 --> 00:43:38.360
have an effect. Even if you had a wonderful childhood
906
00:43:38.400 --> 00:43:40.480
where you weren't in the Holocaust and you weren't a slave,
907
00:43:40.519 --> 00:43:42.840
and you weren't in war torn countries, if you were
908
00:43:42.920 --> 00:43:45.920
raised by people had that after effect, or even your grandparents,
909
00:43:46.000 --> 00:43:47.559
you know, that's all going to have an effect on you.
910
00:43:47.719 --> 00:43:50.519
So the book for me was about trying to heal
911
00:43:50.679 --> 00:43:53.360
my own generational trauma. And then when I saw that
912
00:43:53.480 --> 00:43:57.360
I was actually writing the book and making progress, I
913
00:43:57.440 --> 00:44:00.320
was like, oh wow, what if this could actually help
914
00:44:00.400 --> 00:44:03.119
other people? Yeah, and then I finished the first draft
915
00:44:03.159 --> 00:44:07.119
in January of twenty one, and then I was starting
916
00:44:07.199 --> 00:44:08.920
to edit it and get it. You know, I was
917
00:44:08.960 --> 00:44:12.400
starting to send out query letters to literary agents, because
918
00:44:12.440 --> 00:44:14.280
you know that you need a literary agent before a
919
00:44:14.320 --> 00:44:17.280
publisher will look at you. In most cases, had no
920
00:44:17.400 --> 00:44:19.760
idea what I was doing. The world of publishing, even
921
00:44:19.800 --> 00:44:22.440
when you read about it, even talking to people looking
922
00:44:22.519 --> 00:44:24.679
up stuff on the internet, the world of publishing that
923
00:44:24.840 --> 00:44:29.199
we know it seems quite an undertaking. It seems very
924
00:44:29.320 --> 00:44:32.719
much shrouded in mystery, very daunting. It's very daunting. Yes,
925
00:44:32.800 --> 00:44:34.719
it's very daunting, and I'm kind of going, it's daunting
926
00:44:34.800 --> 00:44:37.440
enough to write a book. I was so pleased that
927
00:44:37.559 --> 00:44:42.760
I had actually finished a book that I was like, wow, okay,
928
00:44:42.800 --> 00:44:44.320
and then I started looking into all that. And then
929
00:44:44.360 --> 00:44:46.320
my father got sick and went into a comment passed
930
00:44:46.320 --> 00:44:48.280
away and I had to put that down. I had
931
00:44:48.320 --> 00:44:50.400
gotten a couple of rejections already. I was like, whoa,
932
00:44:50.760 --> 00:44:53.320
you know, but I just the more I thought about it,
933
00:44:53.360 --> 00:44:55.159
I thought, okay, I have to put this down. I
934
00:44:55.199 --> 00:44:56.599
don't have the bandwidth right now.
935
00:44:57.119 --> 00:44:58.320
Everyone gets rejections.
936
00:44:58.559 --> 00:45:01.159
Oh sure, it wasn't the reject it was my dad's death.
937
00:45:01.199 --> 00:45:02.639
I thought, I'm just not going to look at this
938
00:45:02.760 --> 00:45:04.760
right now, at this book, you know. And then and
939
00:45:04.840 --> 00:45:07.679
then you go through periods where you're so sick of
940
00:45:07.760 --> 00:45:09.719
looking at your own writing. They're like, oh, I cannot
941
00:45:09.719 --> 00:45:12.480
read that again. You know, you're going over chapters, you're
942
00:45:12.480 --> 00:45:14.719
going over things, you're trying to fix things, and you're like,
943
00:45:14.880 --> 00:45:16.880
if I have to read that passage one more time.
944
00:45:17.639 --> 00:45:19.360
And I did go through a period where I think
945
00:45:19.400 --> 00:45:20.159
I hated the book.
946
00:45:20.280 --> 00:45:22.039
I was like, oh, you know, you think you've become
947
00:45:22.119 --> 00:45:25.400
like you become you get like tunnel vision yeah, I've
948
00:45:25.480 --> 00:45:28.239
never written a book or anything, but I guess maybe
949
00:45:28.320 --> 00:45:29.960
like when I look at my own jokes or my
950
00:45:30.039 --> 00:45:30.920
own set whatever.
951
00:45:31.039 --> 00:45:33.199
But yeah, you can't see outside of it. And you go, yeah,
952
00:45:33.440 --> 00:45:37.320
you can't. You're like, I'm so, I'm so overlooking at
953
00:45:37.360 --> 00:45:40.159
this that I can't tell if it works or not anymore. Yeah,
954
00:45:40.239 --> 00:45:42.559
So you can't. You can't have an objective viewpoint on it.
955
00:45:42.639 --> 00:45:43.800
So you have to kind of walk away. And I
956
00:45:43.880 --> 00:45:45.559
think a lot of authors have said over the years,
957
00:45:45.880 --> 00:45:47.880
one of the best things you can do is finish
958
00:45:47.880 --> 00:45:50.519
the manuscript, put it away, come back to it in
959
00:45:50.559 --> 00:45:52.559
six months, and then look at it with fresh eyes.
960
00:45:52.679 --> 00:45:55.199
You've had a break, and you can then oh, okay.
961
00:45:55.719 --> 00:45:59.000
And then I don't know at what point during twenty
962
00:45:59.039 --> 00:46:02.320
two and twenty three, you know, I had like my
963
00:46:02.440 --> 00:46:04.840
fiance read it, but he's biased. And then you know,
964
00:46:04.960 --> 00:46:08.119
and I had one a friend of mine read it
965
00:46:08.239 --> 00:46:11.519
and he loved it and had some suggestions. I'm starting
966
00:46:11.599 --> 00:46:15.239
to edit and starting to to do things, and you
967
00:46:15.360 --> 00:46:17.800
kind of go, sometimes it's okay to let things simmer,
968
00:46:18.760 --> 00:46:22.920
you know, Yeah, And and then you have to start
969
00:46:24.199 --> 00:46:26.400
tearing things down. And so I've I've edited the book
970
00:46:26.519 --> 00:46:30.880
I'd say good solid two times, maybe three, and I'm
971
00:46:30.960 --> 00:46:32.960
happy with where it is now. I don't want to
972
00:46:33.000 --> 00:46:35.280
make any more changes. I do feel it's ready to
973
00:46:35.360 --> 00:46:36.960
go out into the world. That's why i asked you
974
00:46:37.079 --> 00:46:39.519
to read it, you know. And I'm so delighted with
975
00:46:41.679 --> 00:46:42.800
the emotion that it is.
976
00:46:45.079 --> 00:46:48.559
Yeah, it's it definitely struck something to me, and I'm
977
00:46:48.599 --> 00:46:51.559
not I'm not going to spoil the ending. I will
978
00:46:51.599 --> 00:46:56.360
say like the ending left a very strong emotional impact
979
00:46:56.440 --> 00:46:56.639
on me.
980
00:46:56.760 --> 00:46:58.760
Yeah, Like I left after.
981
00:46:58.599 --> 00:47:02.400
I finished reading it was in a certain kind of
982
00:47:02.480 --> 00:47:06.360
mood for a few hours. Oh wow, that's why you
983
00:47:06.400 --> 00:47:08.400
know you have a good book though. Yeah, that's when
984
00:47:08.440 --> 00:47:10.320
it resonates with you strongly.
985
00:47:10.800 --> 00:47:11.679
Well, that's the thing.
986
00:47:11.760 --> 00:47:11.960
I mean.
987
00:47:12.039 --> 00:47:16.800
Look, humans are storytellers and I am definitely a storyteller.
988
00:47:19.440 --> 00:47:26.239
I like eliciting laughter and maybe tears emotions from people.
989
00:47:26.840 --> 00:47:29.440
And if it can help someone to deal with their
990
00:47:29.559 --> 00:47:31.960
own stuff or to look at things in a different light,
991
00:47:33.039 --> 00:47:35.679
then I've done my job. If people have been entertained
992
00:47:35.760 --> 00:47:39.360
by it, great, If people enjoyed it, that's all I
993
00:47:39.440 --> 00:47:42.679
can ask for. That's enough for me. That's fantastic.
994
00:47:43.440 --> 00:47:46.480
Well, something that really struck me with this book that
995
00:47:46.719 --> 00:47:50.559
I've told you about is so again the main character
996
00:47:50.639 --> 00:47:58.199
Amanda and her husband Eddie, and Eddie is like, is
997
00:47:58.519 --> 00:48:02.360
a narcissist total right, He's a narcissist. But the other
998
00:48:02.519 --> 00:48:04.480
character and the other characters in the book, they kind
999
00:48:04.559 --> 00:48:06.840
of they kind of know, well, like other people, they
1000
00:48:06.880 --> 00:48:08.159
look at him and they're like, oh, we can tell
1001
00:48:08.199 --> 00:48:12.079
he's kind of cruel. But because he is an outstanding
1002
00:48:12.159 --> 00:48:16.599
member of society and he's good husband on paper, right,
1003
00:48:16.800 --> 00:48:20.280
especially for the time period. Yeah, this is written in right.
1004
00:48:20.360 --> 00:48:21.320
He wasn't beaten her.
1005
00:48:23.000 --> 00:48:25.599
You know, so it's just kind of like, oh, whatever,
1006
00:48:25.639 --> 00:48:26.239
wish you washing.
1007
00:48:26.320 --> 00:48:27.280
He's a good man. Yeah.
1008
00:48:27.320 --> 00:48:30.840
Yeah. And as someone who has been a victim of
1009
00:48:31.400 --> 00:48:37.360
narcissistic abuse for the vast majority of my childhood, that
1010
00:48:37.639 --> 00:48:42.239
really struck me, Like it was you you describe it
1011
00:48:42.360 --> 00:48:47.280
in such a good way, And just like the the
1012
00:48:47.480 --> 00:48:50.360
it was the subtle things. It was the small things
1013
00:48:50.400 --> 00:48:53.360
that had the biggest impact, Like just the little comments
1014
00:48:53.440 --> 00:48:56.239
that Eddie would make here and there, the little things
1015
00:48:56.400 --> 00:49:01.000
he would do, which an observer might not think is
1016
00:49:01.039 --> 00:49:03.320
that big of a deal, But as someone who suffered
1017
00:49:03.320 --> 00:49:05.400
from arcissistic abuse, you're like, oh, this is this match
1018
00:49:05.519 --> 00:49:08.559
or right. Yeah, yeah, this is such a fucking red flag.
1019
00:49:08.840 --> 00:49:12.320
But I like how you made it so subtle and
1020
00:49:12.400 --> 00:49:15.039
it wasn't like all in your face.
1021
00:49:15.280 --> 00:49:17.320
Yeah, well I don't. I don't think it's a good
1022
00:49:17.360 --> 00:49:19.960
idea ever to really hit your reader or your viewer
1023
00:49:20.119 --> 00:49:22.079
if you're making something for TV and film. I don't
1024
00:49:22.079 --> 00:49:23.320
think it's a good idea to hit people over the
1025
00:49:23.400 --> 00:49:25.599
head with stuff you need to ask. Your audience is
1026
00:49:25.639 --> 00:49:27.320
smart enough to get it. You know, the same thing
1027
00:49:27.360 --> 00:49:30.000
with stand up. You know, it's better not to be obvious.
1028
00:49:30.079 --> 00:49:32.239
It's better to be a little ambiguous and let them
1029
00:49:32.280 --> 00:49:35.320
come to their own conclusions. But I think the reason
1030
00:49:35.360 --> 00:49:38.320
I was able to paint it so well with the
1031
00:49:38.400 --> 00:49:41.519
subtlety is because, you know, and this is not to
1032
00:49:41.599 --> 00:49:45.079
be mean in any way. This is just where I've
1033
00:49:45.079 --> 00:49:48.039
gotten to in my life. The reality is that I
1034
00:49:48.119 --> 00:49:51.039
was raised by a woman with you know, again not
1035
00:49:51.119 --> 00:49:53.519
trying to play armchair psychologists, but if you sit there
1036
00:49:53.559 --> 00:49:56.079
and you read anything about borderline personality disorder and you
1037
00:49:56.159 --> 00:49:59.559
go tick tick tick, narcissum, et cetera, if you've been
1038
00:49:59.559 --> 00:50:05.159
a victim of narcissistic abuse. My mother, and she has
1039
00:50:05.199 --> 00:50:07.360
two daughters from a previous marriage to I have two
1040
00:50:07.519 --> 00:50:10.559
much older half sisters who are as much you know,
1041
00:50:10.719 --> 00:50:15.280
victims of her abuse, but also quite from the same
1042
00:50:15.800 --> 00:50:17.239
Uh you know.
1043
00:50:17.480 --> 00:50:19.599
They joined They were like in, if you can't beat them,
1044
00:50:20.000 --> 00:50:20.679
join them clubs.
1045
00:50:20.719 --> 00:50:23.239
Yeah, my older leaders like that, you know, if the
1046
00:50:23.320 --> 00:50:26.800
older if you can't, if you can't beat them, yeah, exactly,
1047
00:50:26.880 --> 00:50:30.760
I'm just gonna And I was a popular scapegoat whipping
1048
00:50:30.840 --> 00:50:32.920
boy because I was the odd one because my dad
1049
00:50:33.119 --> 00:50:36.159
was who he was and not their father, and so
1050
00:50:36.280 --> 00:50:40.199
there were all kinds of elements dynamics. There have problems, No,
1051
00:50:40.440 --> 00:50:43.599
not at all, You're okay, there were there were problems there.
1052
00:50:44.960 --> 00:50:47.400
My mother and my half sisters were very, very very
1053
00:50:47.480 --> 00:50:51.159
toxic narcissistic people, as was my ex husband. Because I
1054
00:50:51.280 --> 00:50:54.079
married my mother so sad, I had a wonderful example
1055
00:50:54.199 --> 00:50:56.800
in my father, and I still ended up falling for
1056
00:50:56.920 --> 00:51:01.079
someone who manipulated me as a young woman. And that
1057
00:51:01.480 --> 00:51:05.920
narcissistic abuse is quite subtle. They want you to revere
1058
00:51:06.039 --> 00:51:10.480
them and to be there. They want to be your everything.
1059
00:51:11.119 --> 00:51:13.199
They want you to trust them. They bring you in close,
1060
00:51:13.280 --> 00:51:15.079
and that's when the knife you in the back. And
1061
00:51:15.840 --> 00:51:18.880
it's a sad thing to say, I'm not sitting here
1062
00:51:19.000 --> 00:51:22.320
wanting to run down my biological family. I talk about
1063
00:51:22.360 --> 00:51:24.280
all of these people in the past tense because I've
1064
00:51:24.320 --> 00:51:26.840
gone no contact with all of them. Having said that,
1065
00:51:27.000 --> 00:51:30.119
on my maternal family, both in Texas and in Mexico City,
1066
00:51:30.239 --> 00:51:34.760
I have loving, healthy relationships with cousins, aunts, my mom's sister.
1067
00:51:35.119 --> 00:51:39.000
We've never had a problem my father and all his family. Fantastic,
1068
00:51:39.199 --> 00:51:46.079
no issue there. But unfortunately, you can find yourself surrounded
1069
00:51:46.079 --> 00:51:48.679
by and almost stuck in a situation, surrounded by very,
1070
00:51:48.840 --> 00:51:51.159
very toxic people. And if you want to live your
1071
00:51:51.199 --> 00:51:53.639
life in an unhealthy manner, you want to be bitter
1072
00:51:53.800 --> 00:51:56.400
and angry and vengeful and spiteful and cruel and all
1073
00:51:56.440 --> 00:51:58.239
this thing knock yourself out, But you're not going to
1074
00:51:58.280 --> 00:52:01.960
do it around me or my children. It's it's a
1075
00:52:02.039 --> 00:52:05.559
tough one. You can sit there as a sympathetic person,
1076
00:52:05.639 --> 00:52:07.519
make all the excuses in the world for these people,
1077
00:52:08.559 --> 00:52:10.039
but at the end of the day, like I said,
1078
00:52:10.119 --> 00:52:13.760
you myself, people who have been through traumatic events and
1079
00:52:13.880 --> 00:52:17.880
they don't go down this path. Yeah, we always have
1080
00:52:18.800 --> 00:52:22.400
a choice and how we treat others. Yeah, and if
1081
00:52:22.440 --> 00:52:24.800
you do have mental health issues, that are you know,
1082
00:52:25.000 --> 00:52:27.159
affecting your behavior and you're lashing out at people and
1083
00:52:27.199 --> 00:52:30.639
you're not well, you're it's your responsibility to go and
1084
00:52:31.920 --> 00:52:38.880
seek help, whether it's counseling, medicine, workshops, you know, whatever
1085
00:52:39.400 --> 00:52:42.159
you need to do to feel better about and to
1086
00:52:42.280 --> 00:52:44.960
try and heal your trauma. That's your responsibility. You're not
1087
00:52:45.039 --> 00:52:48.079
the one that caused it, but it is your responsibility
1088
00:52:48.119 --> 00:52:48.519
to heal it.
1089
00:52:49.199 --> 00:52:52.280
The way I so it was best described to me
1090
00:52:53.039 --> 00:52:57.199
would be like, imagine if a baby was dropped on
1091
00:52:57.280 --> 00:53:01.760
your doorstep, right, and it's like this baby, Sorry for
1092
00:53:01.840 --> 00:53:04.159
the permials of this analogy, this baby is like the
1093
00:53:04.320 --> 00:53:06.880
generational trauma. Like here you go and you open the
1094
00:53:06.920 --> 00:53:09.239
door and you're like shit, like I didn't do anything
1095
00:53:09.400 --> 00:53:11.840
to get this baby. It's not my I didn't abandon
1096
00:53:11.920 --> 00:53:14.679
this baby, right, but it's still your responsibility to make
1097
00:53:14.719 --> 00:53:16.840
sure that baby's taken to a staff place. You can't
1098
00:53:16.880 --> 00:53:19.159
just fucking be like, oh I didn't, yeah exactly. Not
1099
00:53:19.280 --> 00:53:21.760
the deadbeat mom who drops this baby off. I'm closing
1100
00:53:21.800 --> 00:53:24.280
my door letting the baby die in the rain. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
1101
00:53:24.760 --> 00:53:25.119
you have to.
1102
00:53:25.280 --> 00:53:29.039
Well, I mean, look, it is our responsibility to heal ourselves,
1103
00:53:29.719 --> 00:53:32.159
and we have to in some cases it's very sad,
1104
00:53:32.199 --> 00:53:34.159
but some of us have to reparent ourselves.
1105
00:53:34.320 --> 00:53:35.280
Oh yeah, one hundred percent.
1106
00:53:35.880 --> 00:53:40.159
And so Eddie being the narcissist. And the subtlety of
1107
00:53:40.239 --> 00:53:43.840
it is because most of the time these types they're
1108
00:53:43.880 --> 00:53:46.599
not really super in your face, you know, because they
1109
00:53:46.639 --> 00:53:48.599
don't want to be found out. What is the expression
1110
00:53:50.280 --> 00:53:53.320
street angel, house devil, that kind of They don't want
1111
00:53:53.400 --> 00:53:57.079
the general populace to see them, you know, mistreating you,
1112
00:53:57.239 --> 00:53:59.719
because then others will point it out. They have to
1113
00:53:59.760 --> 00:54:00.639
be lie about it.
1114
00:54:01.599 --> 00:54:05.719
There was and I'm not sure if I'm revealing too much.
1115
00:54:05.760 --> 00:54:08.119
I can I can cut this nose. There was a
1116
00:54:08.239 --> 00:54:14.639
part that really struck me when he called the police.
1117
00:54:15.480 --> 00:54:19.119
There was like some danger going on, called the police
1118
00:54:19.639 --> 00:54:22.719
and Amanda thought at first like, oh, the police are
1119
00:54:22.760 --> 00:54:25.519
here to check on my safety, and then she realized later, no,
1120
00:54:25.760 --> 00:54:28.679
he did this as a power move against me to
1121
00:54:28.920 --> 00:54:29.480
threaten me.
1122
00:54:29.880 --> 00:54:32.280
They were there threatening her, okay, And it wasn't.
1123
00:54:33.920 --> 00:54:36.280
As well as a teenager I experience. I did nothing.
1124
00:54:36.320 --> 00:54:39.199
I was I was a goodie two shoes, little Christian
1125
00:54:39.280 --> 00:54:42.199
girl who went to math team every week. Yeah, and
1126
00:54:42.440 --> 00:54:45.800
they fucking called the cops on me because I was
1127
00:54:45.920 --> 00:54:50.519
talking back because they were I was being verbally abused
1128
00:54:50.559 --> 00:54:52.119
and I wasn't gonna stand for it.
1129
00:54:52.320 --> 00:54:54.199
Right, well, oh that's you know what I mean.
1130
00:54:54.320 --> 00:54:56.599
So I'm like, what are the The cops actually came
1131
00:54:56.719 --> 00:54:59.320
and then just like okay, and nothing happened. But it
1132
00:54:59.440 --> 00:55:00.320
was a power They.
1133
00:55:00.239 --> 00:55:04.000
Were trying to scare you. It was an intimidation. Intimidation absolutely. Well.
1134
00:55:04.119 --> 00:55:07.159
It's interesting how these narcissistic types, these abusive people that
1135
00:55:07.239 --> 00:55:09.800
go out into the world, they mistreat you. They mistreat you,
1136
00:55:09.880 --> 00:55:13.159
they mistreat you. They you know, they whip the dog
1137
00:55:14.519 --> 00:55:17.840
until it finally turns and bites or or shows its teeth.
1138
00:55:18.000 --> 00:55:22.960
When we react because we've had enough, we're suddenly the problem.
1139
00:55:23.079 --> 00:55:25.199
We're the abusive ones. And you're going, wow, that is
1140
00:55:25.280 --> 00:55:28.199
a what an example of gas lighting? But also wow,
1141
00:55:28.400 --> 00:55:30.599
didn't see that coming. What am I meant to do?
1142
00:55:31.199 --> 00:55:32.760
You know, you either take it and take it and
1143
00:55:32.800 --> 00:55:34.679
take it and it never stops, or you stand up
1144
00:55:34.719 --> 00:55:36.920
to the bullies. But you know what, bullies don't like that.
1145
00:55:37.000 --> 00:55:39.440
They don't like being stood up too. So sometimes you're
1146
00:55:39.440 --> 00:55:41.199
not gonna get a bullied back down. They're gonna dig
1147
00:55:41.239 --> 00:55:44.599
their heels in deeper. So you know if you if
1148
00:55:44.679 --> 00:55:49.440
you then stand up for yourself, it's how dare you? What?
1149
00:55:49.599 --> 00:55:51.679
They don't stop to think about how they've treated you.
1150
00:55:52.320 --> 00:55:54.679
And this is you know, anybody. This could be a coworker,
1151
00:55:55.119 --> 00:55:59.239
a boss, a spouse, a parent, your own children, you know,
1152
00:55:59.480 --> 00:56:04.159
your siblings. It can it can filter into any kind
1153
00:56:04.239 --> 00:56:09.440
of human relationship, this dynamic. And when we fight back
1154
00:56:10.679 --> 00:56:11.800
where the problem.
1155
00:56:12.400 --> 00:56:15.039
I feel like not not to I don't like on
1156
00:56:15.159 --> 00:56:18.440
the bigger picture, I think we can something that I've
1157
00:56:18.480 --> 00:56:22.480
been struggling with, just like hearing about in the news
1158
00:56:22.599 --> 00:56:25.760
and whatever. It just really seems like humanity as a whole.
1159
00:56:26.159 --> 00:56:31.360
We punish the people who speak out period, Like you know,
1160
00:56:31.480 --> 00:56:37.599
you get like sexual assault cases or something, and a
1161
00:56:37.679 --> 00:56:39.639
woman will speak out and be like, hey this you
1162
00:56:39.719 --> 00:56:41.159
know this would happen. And then there's always going to
1163
00:56:41.199 --> 00:56:43.079
be people who are like, why are you roting this
1164
00:56:43.159 --> 00:56:47.079
guy's life? Yeah, like you, oh, you bringing attention to
1165
00:56:47.239 --> 00:56:50.119
it is actually the bigger problem than what he did.
1166
00:56:50.159 --> 00:56:52.639
You should just brush this night through the rug. We
1167
00:56:52.760 --> 00:56:55.079
see that so so often.
1168
00:56:55.880 --> 00:56:58.400
Well that's how society worked forever.
1169
00:56:58.679 --> 00:57:00.880
So why are you trying to victimize yourself?
1170
00:57:01.079 --> 00:57:01.239
You know?
1171
00:57:01.320 --> 00:57:04.199
Oh, you just want to be a little victim as well,
1172
00:57:04.320 --> 00:57:05.119
Like that's what they say.
1173
00:57:05.320 --> 00:57:07.760
Well, like you talked about how like Eddie is, you
1174
00:57:07.880 --> 00:57:10.960
know on paper, everybody's telling her, Oh, he's so great,
1175
00:57:11.079 --> 00:57:13.719
such a great husband, because back then that's the bar
1176
00:57:13.960 --> 00:57:19.199
was pretty low. Oh yeah, everybody everybody in in in
1177
00:57:19.360 --> 00:57:24.239
Latin American culture, in American culture, back then, in European culture,
1178
00:57:24.320 --> 00:57:30.079
Irish culture, every Asian, everywhere. One hundred years ago, everybody
1179
00:57:30.480 --> 00:57:33.719
looked the other way. Nothing was done about trauma and abuse.
1180
00:57:34.000 --> 00:57:37.559
Everybody looked the other way. Woman, especially if you were
1181
00:57:37.599 --> 00:57:40.119
a woman, especially if you were a child, especially if
1182
00:57:40.159 --> 00:57:43.719
you were a person of color. Everybody looked the other way.
1183
00:57:44.880 --> 00:57:47.679
And just because my great grandparents would have come from
1184
00:57:47.719 --> 00:57:50.719
a bit of money in a different class in society
1185
00:57:50.760 --> 00:57:55.440
at that time, they were almost allowed more. They were
1186
00:57:55.440 --> 00:57:56.920
allowed to get away with it more. To get me.
1187
00:57:58.599 --> 00:58:01.800
Well, like, actually, because something I want to bring up,
1188
00:58:02.199 --> 00:58:04.639
that's like a good contrast between your book and the
1189
00:58:04.800 --> 00:58:08.960
shit romances I reveal on this. By the time this
1190
00:58:09.039 --> 00:58:11.559
comes out, I believe I would have already released The
1191
00:58:12.400 --> 00:58:16.480
Italian's Christmas Passion. That is a that's the book I
1192
00:58:16.760 --> 00:58:20.519
am going to. I don't know, sexy, I'm gonna roast
1193
00:58:20.559 --> 00:58:24.480
it in December. Currently we're recording. It's October, and I
1194
00:58:24.559 --> 00:58:29.960
think this is Yeah. So anyways, the book for the
1195
00:58:30.280 --> 00:58:35.840
Italian Christmas the Italian's Christmas Passion, which the sub book
1196
00:58:35.880 --> 00:58:41.559
I'm reading in December is The Italian's Unexpected Baby. It's like,
1197
00:58:41.639 --> 00:58:46.679
you have this rich Italian man, okay, and he, you know,
1198
00:58:46.920 --> 00:58:51.119
has this like love affair with his secretary. Of course
1199
00:58:51.159 --> 00:58:55.199
he does and swoops her off her feet, and he's extremely,
1200
00:58:55.679 --> 00:59:00.519
extremely controlling, and she grew up with like abuse of
1201
00:59:00.639 --> 00:59:02.760
dad and she tries to like push away from that.
1202
00:59:03.480 --> 00:59:09.199
And the sexy Italian guy like doesn't really relent that much,
1203
00:59:09.800 --> 00:59:11.639
and he does all this stuff that is just like
1204
00:59:11.840 --> 00:59:15.639
huge red flags, like pressures her to marry him, like
1205
00:59:16.599 --> 00:59:19.000
you know, after only three weeks of dating, and she
1206
00:59:19.079 --> 00:59:21.559
doesn't really have a choice. It's like, you know, he
1207
00:59:21.679 --> 00:59:23.360
tries to make it seem like she has a choice,
1208
00:59:23.360 --> 00:59:25.400
but she really doesn't. But this is all painted in
1209
00:59:25.559 --> 00:59:26.599
like a sexy way.
1210
00:59:27.039 --> 00:59:27.239
Yeah.
1211
00:59:27.280 --> 00:59:29.280
And the reason and that's why I wrote these books
1212
00:59:29.400 --> 00:59:32.440
is because you see, this is such a common trope
1213
00:59:33.400 --> 00:59:37.000
for so many romantic fantasy books, where you have these
1214
00:59:37.079 --> 00:59:40.440
dudes that are walking red flags that are controlling that.
1215
00:59:41.000 --> 00:59:43.280
Even how oh, like I married that, that was my
1216
00:59:43.400 --> 00:59:45.079
first husband then, And like.
1217
00:59:45.239 --> 00:59:47.519
Even in these books, like the dudes will say something
1218
00:59:47.599 --> 00:59:52.239
manipulative and the female character will be like, hey, that's manipulative,
1219
00:59:52.280 --> 00:59:54.440
and then the dude is like, no, it's not, and
1220
00:59:54.519 --> 00:59:56.920
then in his inner monologue he's like, yeah, I knew
1221
00:59:56.920 --> 00:59:59.000
I was being manipulative, but she just needs to understand,
1222
00:59:59.320 --> 01:00:02.559
you know, but ain't it as sexy? And and then
1223
01:00:02.880 --> 01:00:07.920
your book Amanda and Eddie, it's kind of similar, like
1224
01:00:08.000 --> 01:00:10.679
he could be a character in these romantic fantasy books
1225
01:00:10.679 --> 01:00:14.440
where he walks in. He's this rich, powerful guy, and
1226
01:00:14.559 --> 01:00:17.360
he kind of like rushes their romance right, it makes
1227
01:00:17.400 --> 01:00:19.159
her he's relentless with her.
1228
01:00:19.400 --> 01:00:19.639
Yep.
1229
01:00:20.000 --> 01:00:23.719
And it's it kind of reminds me of It's like
1230
01:00:23.880 --> 01:00:25.800
the show Kevin Can Fuck Himself.
1231
01:00:26.079 --> 01:00:26.960
I've never seen that.
1232
01:00:27.119 --> 01:00:29.039
Have you heard of it? No, it's really good.
1233
01:00:29.079 --> 01:00:29.320
I saw.
1234
01:00:29.360 --> 01:00:34.239
It's basically it switches between a comedy and a drama.
1235
01:00:34.880 --> 01:00:36.719
It's like you have the setup of like a typical
1236
01:00:36.840 --> 01:00:40.519
sitcom family where you have like the goofy stupid dad
1237
01:00:41.119 --> 01:00:44.239
and then like the up husband because I don't have kids,
1238
01:00:44.440 --> 01:00:46.840
and then you have like the uptight wife who's like
1239
01:00:46.880 --> 01:00:49.760
always kind of cleaning up after him, and whenever it's
1240
01:00:49.800 --> 01:00:52.719
like showing it from Kevin the husband's perspective, it's a
1241
01:00:52.800 --> 01:00:54.880
comedy and there's a life track, and then you see
1242
01:00:54.960 --> 01:00:57.559
from her perspective and it turns into this like really sad.
1243
01:00:57.480 --> 01:01:01.079
Drama, you know, and she brilliant like ringing in her ears.
1244
01:01:00.800 --> 01:01:03.159
And it's and that's kind of like how I felt
1245
01:01:03.159 --> 01:01:07.440
a little bit with like comparing your book to these
1246
01:01:07.519 --> 01:01:11.360
shitty books. Wow, is like yeah, it's like, oh, the
1247
01:01:11.440 --> 01:01:15.760
Italian's Christmas Passion. Oh, this this dapper rich man, he
1248
01:01:15.960 --> 01:01:18.039
just he just knows what he wants and he sweeps
1249
01:01:18.079 --> 01:01:20.599
her off her feet and maybe he lies to her
1250
01:01:20.639 --> 01:01:22.639
and tricks her, but it's for her own good. And
1251
01:01:22.719 --> 01:01:25.880
then you cut to the real the realness of the situations, like, no,
1252
01:01:26.000 --> 01:01:29.440
he's a fucking narcissist. Yeah, he's killing something inside of her.
1253
01:01:29.599 --> 01:01:34.000
Yeah yeah, yeah. Well I always I really liked and
1254
01:01:34.119 --> 01:01:36.880
appreciated some of your feedback that you had said that
1255
01:01:37.159 --> 01:01:38.519
you just he infuriated you.
1256
01:01:38.679 --> 01:01:40.559
Oh my got it busy now so much. Yeah, he
1257
01:01:40.679 --> 01:01:42.440
was so realistic. That's great.
1258
01:01:42.639 --> 01:01:47.119
That makes me happy that I wrote a horrible human being.
1259
01:01:47.000 --> 01:01:49.199
Into existence, so not thing that that as anyone who's
1260
01:01:49.239 --> 01:01:53.559
like listened, no, sorry, anyone who's like experienced narcissistic abuse.
1261
01:01:53.599 --> 01:01:56.840
I think they would really really res this book would
1262
01:01:56.840 --> 01:02:01.400
really resonate with them. Actually, would you mind explaining the title?
1263
01:02:01.760 --> 01:02:04.079
The title, uh, the Final Resting Place of a Butterfly.
1264
01:02:04.519 --> 01:02:06.840
Yeah, it was so weird because you know, you have
1265
01:02:06.960 --> 01:02:10.440
your working titles and you're like, I don't know how
1266
01:02:10.480 --> 01:02:14.400
I feel about that, you know, I actually tell you
1267
01:02:14.559 --> 01:02:17.400
the title I had was and nothing wrong with it,
1268
01:02:17.519 --> 01:02:19.760
But it was just I had called it, for lack
1269
01:02:19.840 --> 01:02:22.159
of anything else at the time, I had called it
1270
01:02:22.400 --> 01:02:26.320
the fairy Tale of Mexico City, which nothing wrong with it.
1271
01:02:26.519 --> 01:02:29.119
I'm not even saying I might not use it that
1272
01:02:29.280 --> 01:02:32.679
one day in the future on something else, because I
1273
01:02:32.880 --> 01:02:35.159
was trying to paint the picture of this was sold
1274
01:02:35.159 --> 01:02:37.639
to her as a fairy tale, you know, going down
1275
01:02:37.719 --> 01:02:40.239
to Mexico City at a time when you know, they
1276
01:02:40.280 --> 01:02:42.639
had money, they had white privilege, like it was in
1277
01:02:43.119 --> 01:02:46.199
You're going from one set of luxury to another. Like
1278
01:02:47.440 --> 01:02:48.639
you know, it's not like she was going down to
1279
01:02:48.679 --> 01:02:51.079
Mexico to work on a hacienda. She wasn't going into
1280
01:02:51.079 --> 01:02:53.639
the fields she was, you know, it was the same
1281
01:02:53.679 --> 01:02:55.719
thing as if he was taking her to Paris. It
1282
01:02:55.840 --> 01:02:57.599
was oh, but he just failed to mention there was
1283
01:02:57.639 --> 01:03:00.480
a revolution going on time, you know, Oopsie's you know,
1284
01:03:00.719 --> 01:03:04.639
So the Fairytale in Mexico City, I wanted to immediately
1285
01:03:04.719 --> 01:03:06.440
have Mexico in the title, and I was like, ooh,
1286
01:03:06.519 --> 01:03:08.880
you know, but I always kind of felt like, for
1287
01:03:09.000 --> 01:03:12.360
some reason it wasn't working, and I was like, oh,
1288
01:03:12.519 --> 01:03:15.039
it's okay, I'll find something. And then one day, when
1289
01:03:15.079 --> 01:03:17.920
we were stuck in the house for COVID, I was
1290
01:03:18.840 --> 01:03:21.920
outside in the garden doing something, you know, pottering around,
1291
01:03:22.400 --> 01:03:25.679
and I came across a big giant clay pot where
1292
01:03:25.679 --> 01:03:29.039
I had planted something and in it and it would
1293
01:03:29.079 --> 01:03:33.440
have been i'd say maybe late summer to early autumn, September, maybe,
1294
01:03:33.519 --> 01:03:38.880
I don't know. And I saw in the dirt lying
1295
01:03:38.960 --> 01:03:43.280
there a little tiny orange and black butterfly and I
1296
01:03:43.440 --> 01:03:45.000
looked and I saw it, and I went, oh, and
1297
01:03:45.079 --> 01:03:47.599
I even morbid as I am. I grabbed my phone
1298
01:03:47.599 --> 01:03:49.280
and I took a little picture of it because I said, oh,
1299
01:03:49.599 --> 01:03:52.559
what are the odds, you know, because butterflies feature so
1300
01:03:52.679 --> 01:03:56.440
heavily in the book, and in Mexican culture and even
1301
01:03:56.480 --> 01:03:57.840
the time of year and everything with the Day of
1302
01:03:58.079 --> 01:04:00.400
the Dead coming up, and I thought, oh my god,
1303
01:04:00.440 --> 01:04:02.239
what are the odds, you know, And I thought about it,
1304
01:04:02.440 --> 01:04:06.599
and it literally just I thought to myself, Oh, the
1305
01:04:06.679 --> 01:04:09.079
final resting place of a butterfly. Look at that, you know,
1306
01:04:09.800 --> 01:04:12.760
just slide down in the dirt of this pot. And
1307
01:04:13.199 --> 01:04:15.039
she did look like a monarch, but you know, we
1308
01:04:15.079 --> 01:04:18.079
don't generally see those here too much. It's just entirely
1309
01:04:18.159 --> 01:04:20.079
too cold, and monarchs are much bigger. But she had
1310
01:04:20.119 --> 01:04:23.719
the coloring, and so I pottered off, you know, I
1311
01:04:23.760 --> 01:04:25.960
went back into the house and then I went, hang on,
1312
01:04:26.079 --> 01:04:27.119
what what did I just say?
1313
01:04:29.039 --> 01:04:29.320
Struck?
1314
01:04:29.559 --> 01:04:31.960
Yeah, And I was like, the final resting place of
1315
01:04:32.000 --> 01:04:34.199
a butterfly. I was like, what is that? And I
1316
01:04:34.280 --> 01:04:36.920
had no one to ask it is my letter, very profound,
1317
01:04:37.079 --> 01:04:40.159
and I was like, holy cow. I immediately went in
1318
01:04:40.239 --> 01:04:41.920
and changed it, and now I have a questioned the
1319
01:04:41.960 --> 01:04:43.800
title over the years and going oh, that's a mouthful.
1320
01:04:43.920 --> 01:04:47.480
You know, I was very melodramatic. You know, everybody's like, Nope,
1321
01:04:47.559 --> 01:04:50.519
don't change that. Don't change Everybody's like, don't change that.
1322
01:04:50.599 --> 01:04:53.480
That's funda finle itself. Is like a line from a poem.
1323
01:04:53.800 --> 01:04:57.000
Oh oh, and it makes a lot of well, it
1324
01:04:57.039 --> 01:04:58.400
does make a lot of sense to the books.
1325
01:04:58.440 --> 01:05:02.840
Actually, yeah, because Amanda herself is like a monarch butter.
1326
01:05:02.880 --> 01:05:05.360
Totally well, and this is a really cool thing that
1327
01:05:05.480 --> 01:05:08.079
my fiancee Jean had actually pointed out to me, and
1328
01:05:08.119 --> 01:05:10.599
I was like, yes, I knew that. I knew that
1329
01:05:10.679 --> 01:05:14.199
the whole time. We were talking about the migration of
1330
01:05:14.239 --> 01:05:17.199
the monarchs, which has talked about quite in depth in
1331
01:05:17.239 --> 01:05:20.719
the book at a couple of different places. And you know,
1332
01:05:20.800 --> 01:05:24.840
the monarch butterfly is so known as a as a
1333
01:05:24.920 --> 01:05:29.639
symbol of Mexico. Their breeding grounds are in the northeast
1334
01:05:29.679 --> 01:05:31.519
of the United States and a little bit into Canada
1335
01:05:31.559 --> 01:05:36.599
and stuff, but mostly the northeast United States. They those
1336
01:05:36.599 --> 01:05:40.320
are their breeding grounds. And it's New York, it's Philly,
1337
01:05:40.360 --> 01:05:44.199
it's Boston. And then if the news exactly where Amanda
1338
01:05:44.239 --> 01:05:47.679
is from. It's a new generation of butterflies. It's not
1339
01:05:47.840 --> 01:05:50.960
the old guys that went up there for winter or sorry,
1340
01:05:51.000 --> 01:05:54.199
that went up there for spring and breeding. It's the
1341
01:05:54.880 --> 01:05:59.599
new butterflies. They're the ones that fly down to Mexico
1342
01:06:01.039 --> 01:06:05.400
and it's almost like they have this internal compass, Like
1343
01:06:05.519 --> 01:06:08.639
how if they've never made that journey before, do they know?
1344
01:06:09.960 --> 01:06:11.480
And I'd read up on it, I'd done lots of
1345
01:06:11.519 --> 01:06:13.760
research and it has something to do with like magnetic
1346
01:06:13.840 --> 01:06:18.199
fields and stuff, and like it's amazing science. But this
1347
01:06:18.360 --> 01:06:23.920
new generation of young, hopeful new butterflies goes down to Mexico,
1348
01:06:25.719 --> 01:06:28.639
and I just Sean had pointed out to me, He's like,
1349
01:06:28.760 --> 01:06:32.079
but isn't the family isn't like your great grandmother and
1350
01:06:32.119 --> 01:06:34.400
all that from that exact area where the butterflies start
1351
01:06:34.440 --> 01:06:38.079
out and then they ended up in Mexico. And I went, uh, huh,
1352
01:06:39.559 --> 01:06:43.239
that's right, Love, sure, yeah, you know, and I just
1353
01:06:43.360 --> 01:06:45.159
kind of I don't know, that must have been a
1354
01:06:45.239 --> 01:06:48.599
subconscious but I mean, look the monarch again, we're in Mexico.
1355
01:06:48.800 --> 01:06:50.920
It's one of the symbols. But I did find it
1356
01:06:51.000 --> 01:06:53.239
to be a very kind of extraordinary coincident. If my
1357
01:06:53.320 --> 01:06:57.079
mother's family had been from Seattle, you know, we wouldn't
1358
01:06:57.119 --> 01:07:01.840
have that really cool kind of link. But very GOP's
1359
01:07:02.079 --> 01:07:07.039
exactly perfect. Another huge connection and metaphor, and so a
1360
01:07:07.119 --> 01:07:09.000
lot of happy accidents when I was writing this book,
1361
01:07:09.039 --> 01:07:10.880
a lot of kind of aha moments and you go,
1362
01:07:11.000 --> 01:07:12.719
oh wow, that works. Okay, cool.
1363
01:07:13.599 --> 01:07:16.039
I guess I would like to say, like, during during
1364
01:07:16.079 --> 01:07:20.559
the writing process, what were some of the major hurdles
1365
01:07:21.039 --> 01:07:24.880
and stumbles that you had and how did you overcome them?
1366
01:07:25.360 --> 01:07:29.119
Especially for people listening who are I know, I've spoken
1367
01:07:29.159 --> 01:07:31.199
to some listeners who are writing their own books and
1368
01:07:31.280 --> 01:07:34.639
they've yeah, they get like writer's block. I suppose, how
1369
01:07:34.639 --> 01:07:35.360
would you deal with that?
1370
01:07:35.840 --> 01:07:38.199
Well? It was interesting. I actually never felt like i'd
1371
01:07:38.199 --> 01:07:42.000
gotten writers logged during this process. I'd felt it previously,
1372
01:07:42.280 --> 01:07:43.559
you know, when I was younger, when I was writing
1373
01:07:43.559 --> 01:07:45.320
other things and you just stop writing something. You're like,
1374
01:07:45.360 --> 01:07:48.440
I'm done with this, you know, when I would leave
1375
01:07:48.440 --> 01:07:51.079
it and go back to it and change things. It
1376
01:07:51.440 --> 01:07:55.039
was I suppose the biggest struggling, or a biggest struggle
1377
01:07:55.280 --> 01:08:00.320
for me, was the editing process. It's not fun. You know,
1378
01:08:01.119 --> 01:08:03.679
you have to go in and fix that and you go, oh, whoops.
1379
01:08:03.800 --> 01:08:05.440
You know I said this in this paragraph, and then
1380
01:08:05.480 --> 01:08:08.760
the next paragraph I contradict myself, you know, like, oh
1381
01:08:08.840 --> 01:08:10.480
I have to fix that. Oh you can't. Oh that's
1382
01:08:10.519 --> 01:08:14.840
not true. So the editing process and I often laugh,
1383
01:08:15.920 --> 01:08:18.479
you know, they say write what you know, and I'm like, okay,
1384
01:08:20.119 --> 01:08:23.680
I'll Pick nineteen twelve, Mexico City, the ninth Fabrabulation. You know,
1385
01:08:24.840 --> 01:08:26.840
you know, you're sitting there going over things, going, wait,
1386
01:08:26.920 --> 01:08:29.279
I speak fluent Spanish, but I can't remember how to
1387
01:08:29.359 --> 01:08:31.560
spell that word, you know, like you would do in
1388
01:08:31.600 --> 01:08:33.199
English too, And you're going back and you're having to
1389
01:08:33.279 --> 01:08:36.359
check in two languages, because there's a good smattering of Spanish,
1390
01:08:36.760 --> 01:08:40.159
you know, through the conversation of the book, and and
1391
01:08:41.000 --> 01:08:43.840
so you're checking that. Then you're checking the historical accuracy,
1392
01:08:44.239 --> 01:08:47.319
accuracy of oh yes, I'm saying this happened at this time,
1393
01:08:47.399 --> 01:08:49.279
and then done, I'm making And I do have like
1394
01:08:49.359 --> 01:08:51.840
lots of little easter eggs in the book, references to
1395
01:08:51.960 --> 01:08:53.920
things that were happening, like I'll just flat out say
1396
01:08:53.960 --> 01:08:56.199
like maybe the Titanic one. You know, there's little that
1397
01:08:56.279 --> 01:08:58.439
the reader's going, oh hey, you know, because I again
1398
01:08:58.560 --> 01:09:01.239
I want to put you in that talk. Yes, you know.
1399
01:09:02.760 --> 01:09:07.279
As far as stumbling blocks, it was more the editing process.
1400
01:09:07.399 --> 01:09:09.600
It's very difficult. And I think most writers would say
1401
01:09:09.640 --> 01:09:12.840
that to sit down and just write and you're like, okay,
1402
01:09:12.920 --> 01:09:14.760
this is nonsense, but let's just see where it goes.
1403
01:09:14.880 --> 01:09:16.600
You have to allow yourself a certain amount of freedom
1404
01:09:17.039 --> 01:09:21.520
with editing. Oh, there's work involved. You have to be
1405
01:09:21.680 --> 01:09:23.840
rigid with your time. You have to be rigid with Okay,
1406
01:09:23.880 --> 01:09:25.520
this is my goal for the day, or my goal
1407
01:09:25.560 --> 01:09:27.680
for the week, or I have to fix that glaring
1408
01:09:27.800 --> 01:09:29.399
plot hole in chapter five, you know.
1409
01:09:29.399 --> 01:09:29.760
What I mean.
1410
01:09:30.960 --> 01:09:35.159
It's tackling those things that nobody tells you, especially if
1411
01:09:35.159 --> 01:09:37.600
you've never written a book before. You know, you don't
1412
01:09:37.680 --> 01:09:39.439
know that that's going to be a problem. You don't
1413
01:09:39.479 --> 01:09:41.039
know that. Sometimes you're like, man, I don't know how
1414
01:09:41.079 --> 01:09:44.000
to resolve this, or I really don't like that. So
1415
01:09:44.199 --> 01:09:47.159
it's just kind of almost allowing yourself to make mistakes,
1416
01:09:47.399 --> 01:09:50.159
showing yourself a bit of grace and empathy and going
1417
01:09:50.560 --> 01:09:52.960
you've never written a book before, you don't actually know
1418
01:09:53.000 --> 01:09:56.760
what you're doing, so just don't be so judgmental. That
1419
01:09:56.960 --> 01:09:59.640
was my biggest hurtling was getting out of my own way.
1420
01:10:00.439 --> 01:10:04.920
Imposter syndrome totally. I think so many people have imposter syndrome.
1421
01:10:05.039 --> 01:10:08.000
Oh, so many people, And look to a certain degree,
1422
01:10:08.039 --> 01:10:11.239
it makes sense unless you're a glaring narcissist, you know
1423
01:10:11.399 --> 01:10:13.359
who think ooh I can do anything and I'm wonderful
1424
01:10:13.359 --> 01:10:16.479
and blah blah blah, you know, people don't want to fail.
1425
01:10:17.199 --> 01:10:20.520
We don't want to embarrass ourselves and make mistakes. Even
1426
01:10:20.600 --> 01:10:23.600
if we know that we can't be perfect, it's still
1427
01:10:23.680 --> 01:10:25.399
something in the back of our head that goes, oh,
1428
01:10:25.479 --> 01:10:27.840
that's not good enough, you know. Yeah, especially if you've
1429
01:10:27.840 --> 01:10:30.279
got any kind of real trauma childhood trauma ooh, that
1430
01:10:30.479 --> 01:10:32.600
carries with you into adulthood and then you're going into
1431
01:10:32.640 --> 01:10:36.159
something that's a little bit out there, you know, in
1432
01:10:36.239 --> 01:10:39.640
the creative world in art and literature, you're writing a book,
1433
01:10:39.720 --> 01:10:42.359
and you know people are going to be quite judgmental,
1434
01:10:42.479 --> 01:10:47.560
and so getting basically getting over myself was the biggest thing.
1435
01:10:48.239 --> 01:10:50.920
It was the biggest hurdle for me in writing this.
1436
01:10:51.680 --> 01:10:55.279
There's there's a quote there's like it's called perfection is the.
1437
01:10:56.800 --> 01:10:59.000
Is like the enemy of progress or something.
1438
01:10:59.079 --> 01:10:59.239
Yeah.
1439
01:10:59.279 --> 01:11:01.039
Yeah, perfection is the enemy of progress.
1440
01:11:01.359 --> 01:11:04.920
Yeah yeah, and it totally is. You'll never be perfect.
1441
01:11:05.119 --> 01:11:07.039
You have to. And that's why I got to this
1442
01:11:07.199 --> 01:11:09.039
point where I was like, you know what, I'm ready.
1443
01:11:10.600 --> 01:11:12.520
I've gotten it as far as I can take it,
1444
01:11:12.760 --> 01:11:16.199
this story, this book, you know, it's with an editor
1445
01:11:16.279 --> 01:11:17.960
now I'm trying to I want to get it out
1446
01:11:18.000 --> 01:11:20.880
in November. All of these things. These are goals that
1447
01:11:20.960 --> 01:11:23.560
I had to force myself to do, even when I
1448
01:11:23.680 --> 01:11:25.359
turned to you a couple months ago and I said, hey,
1449
01:11:25.399 --> 01:11:26.720
I have this idea. Would you like to be a
1450
01:11:26.760 --> 01:11:28.920
beta reader because you love books and you love to read,
1451
01:11:28.960 --> 01:11:31.000
and certainly I think it'll be better than some of
1452
01:11:31.079 --> 01:11:33.720
the CRAPY read on the for this podcast.
1453
01:11:33.800 --> 01:11:35.920
It was in your book was a was a palate
1454
01:11:36.000 --> 01:11:36.680
cleanser for me.
1455
01:11:36.920 --> 01:11:39.039
Oh, I'm so not. I'm happy. I who doesn't love
1456
01:11:39.079 --> 01:11:39.880
a lemon survet.
1457
01:11:40.159 --> 01:11:40.720
That's thereat.
1458
01:11:40.920 --> 01:11:43.560
Thank you so much. And it's but it's it's still
1459
01:11:43.640 --> 01:11:46.119
it's not like a happy, happy, fun read, but it
1460
01:11:46.359 --> 01:11:49.199
is in its own way. You know. I've read it
1461
01:11:49.319 --> 01:11:53.800
back in chunks and all together, and I think actually
1462
01:11:53.920 --> 01:11:56.760
after you started reading it, I got a wild hair
1463
01:11:56.840 --> 01:11:59.800
one day and I sat down and I read the
1464
01:11:59.840 --> 01:12:06.079
whole thing about three days, and I remember going, wow,
1465
01:12:06.720 --> 01:12:08.560
you know, like, it's not the best book in the world.
1466
01:12:08.760 --> 01:12:10.159
There are gonna be some people who hate it. There's
1467
01:12:10.159 --> 01:12:12.640
gonna be some people who love it. That's fine. But
1468
01:12:12.960 --> 01:12:15.880
I am very satisfied you should be with the work
1469
01:12:15.920 --> 01:12:16.600
that I've done.
1470
01:12:18.720 --> 01:12:22.960
Because it feels very real, but not in a boring way. Yeah,
1471
01:12:23.039 --> 01:12:26.600
Like there are some parts of it that are I
1472
01:12:26.640 --> 01:12:28.439
don't know, for lack of a better word, like that
1473
01:12:28.560 --> 01:12:32.960
the plot itself sometimes feels fantastical but realistic.
1474
01:12:33.199 --> 01:12:36.319
Thumb makes any sense, Well, I kind of felt like
1475
01:12:36.520 --> 01:12:40.159
I needed the characters to be so strong and believable
1476
01:12:40.600 --> 01:12:43.279
because the whole situation, Like, even if I hadn't written
1477
01:12:43.279 --> 01:12:45.039
a book, if I just told people, well, see my
1478
01:12:45.119 --> 01:12:46.439
family and this is what they did and this is
1479
01:12:46.439 --> 01:12:49.159
what happened, people go, oh my god. It is kind
1480
01:12:49.159 --> 01:12:50.840
of out there. It is. It's not your run of
1481
01:12:50.840 --> 01:12:54.800
the mill story. So in order to kind of ground
1482
01:12:54.960 --> 01:12:57.960
what was already a fantastic true story, but it's it's
1483
01:12:58.039 --> 01:13:01.079
out there. It's wild as a lot of drama and
1484
01:13:01.159 --> 01:13:02.760
a lot of trauma, and if you're going to give
1485
01:13:02.800 --> 01:13:05.640
that to people, you have to make it worth it. Yes,
1486
01:13:06.439 --> 01:13:10.359
you know, so I wanted to create characters that people
1487
01:13:10.960 --> 01:13:13.880
could sympathize with and grow to love.
1488
01:13:15.159 --> 01:13:17.760
I think also, something I kind of wanted to say
1489
01:13:17.840 --> 01:13:24.439
earlier is because this happens during the Mexican Revolution and
1490
01:13:25.479 --> 01:13:29.720
Amanda and her family, they're these rich white people that
1491
01:13:29.840 --> 01:13:31.920
are in the middle of this Mexican Revolution, and you
1492
01:13:32.039 --> 01:13:35.479
do such a great job of like portraying that fear
1493
01:13:35.680 --> 01:13:38.720
and that danger that they experience. And I think you know,
1494
01:13:38.800 --> 01:13:41.560
in the in the modern in modern day right now,
1495
01:13:41.680 --> 01:13:44.479
we see a lot of that with you know, with
1496
01:13:44.760 --> 01:13:48.399
with Gaza, with the stuff going on in Ukraine, and
1497
01:13:48.520 --> 01:13:50.800
of course we hear about it and it pulls on
1498
01:13:50.880 --> 01:13:54.039
our heart strings, but there's still this element of that's
1499
01:13:54.680 --> 01:13:56.960
over there, that's over there, that's not over here, that's
1500
01:13:56.960 --> 01:13:59.479
not something that could ever happen to me. I don't
1501
01:14:00.039 --> 01:14:03.640
look like the apple that this is happening too. It's
1502
01:14:03.640 --> 01:14:09.600
a bit of distance and reading. Like their fear which
1503
01:14:09.680 --> 01:14:11.479
was like so you did such a good job again,
1504
01:14:11.640 --> 01:14:16.239
like it was like so tangible and palpable, and there
1505
01:14:16.239 --> 01:14:21.720
are these like white Americans and they're experiencing that. It
1506
01:14:22.239 --> 01:14:25.239
makes you reflect more on like that shit is still
1507
01:14:25.279 --> 01:14:28.000
happening today in other parts of the world. Yeah, and
1508
01:14:28.319 --> 01:14:30.359
it makes you helps you sympathize more.
1509
01:14:31.279 --> 01:14:33.680
Thank you well. I mean, like like I said, they say,
1510
01:14:33.760 --> 01:14:35.399
write what you know, and I bid off a little
1511
01:14:35.399 --> 01:14:37.319
bit more than I could too. There were times that
1512
01:14:37.399 --> 01:14:39.359
was going, what are you doing? Because I was hitting
1513
01:14:39.399 --> 01:14:44.680
on topics of white privilege and you know, indigenous cultures,
1514
01:14:45.720 --> 01:14:56.640
war governments, factions, you know, medicine, maternal and postpartum depression,
1515
01:14:56.920 --> 01:15:01.359
mental health issues, misogyny, feminism, like all of it. And
1516
01:15:01.439 --> 01:15:06.039
I'm going, well, you just chose. It's like, really, you
1517
01:15:06.079 --> 01:15:08.399
couldn't have just you had to go there, didn't you?
1518
01:15:08.520 --> 01:15:09.399
You know, I did.
1519
01:15:09.560 --> 01:15:11.760
There were times I was like, whoa this is? But
1520
01:15:12.279 --> 01:15:15.840
I know that I I kind of touch on a
1521
01:15:15.920 --> 01:15:19.760
lot of those topics, but without again bombarding you with them,
1522
01:15:19.800 --> 01:15:22.640
I don't think. And yeah, I know, definitely I had
1523
01:15:22.680 --> 01:15:25.800
to portray the time period accurately, and you did, like.
1524
01:15:25.840 --> 01:15:27.560
There'd be there were some parts where I thought would
1525
01:15:27.560 --> 01:15:31.680
be funny, where like Amanda's pregnant casually drinking some wine.
1526
01:15:31.840 --> 01:15:37.079
Yeah, yeah, because even up until very recently, women were
1527
01:15:37.119 --> 01:15:39.319
drinking pregnant, so you have to think a hundred years ago.
1528
01:15:39.520 --> 01:15:41.079
Or her husband a little doctor saw her.
1529
01:15:41.159 --> 01:15:44.239
Yeah, and I was like drinking and smoking and probably
1530
01:15:44.279 --> 01:15:46.399
taking a little bit of cocaine for their headaches, you know,
1531
01:15:46.560 --> 01:15:49.359
And it was just that's what was done at the time.
1532
01:15:49.560 --> 01:15:54.800
And the blatant, you know, misogyny and the mistreatment of
1533
01:15:54.880 --> 01:15:59.479
people and the racist attitudes that were just that permeated
1534
01:15:59.760 --> 01:16:02.319
not just the Mexican culture but the American culture and
1535
01:16:03.079 --> 01:16:06.359
all of it, and the class warfare between you know,
1536
01:16:06.439 --> 01:16:09.840
the haves and the have nots, and and I have
1537
01:16:10.000 --> 01:16:12.640
to describe some characters in terms that I would never
1538
01:16:13.840 --> 01:16:17.000
use in real life or to depict people. You know,
1539
01:16:17.199 --> 01:16:19.680
there are some parts where I'm talking about Amparo, who
1540
01:16:19.760 --> 01:16:22.880
actually turned out to be Yeah, you know, one of
1541
01:16:22.920 --> 01:16:24.600
my favorite characters. I love her madly.
1542
01:16:26.880 --> 01:16:27.079
You know.
1543
01:16:27.199 --> 01:16:29.239
I described her as how the people would have described
1544
01:16:29.239 --> 01:16:29.720
her back then.
1545
01:16:30.119 --> 01:16:33.640
Yeah, you know, just judging her based off her physical description.
1546
01:16:34.000 --> 01:16:37.479
Yeah, yeah, and who she is in society, and doesn't
1547
01:16:37.520 --> 01:16:38.760
she turn out to be wonderful?
1548
01:16:39.079 --> 01:16:40.800
Yeah? We like the best characters.
1549
01:16:40.880 --> 01:16:42.600
Yeah, like seriously, Like I fell in love with her
1550
01:16:42.640 --> 01:16:44.920
and I was like, oh my god, how did that happen?
1551
01:16:44.960 --> 01:16:47.720
And it was really cool. It was really cool. The
1552
01:16:47.800 --> 01:16:52.319
writing process was very I was surprised by how automatic
1553
01:16:53.279 --> 01:16:56.760
it became. There were times when, you know, you know,
1554
01:16:56.880 --> 01:17:00.640
sometimes they talk about like a muse or the magical
1555
01:17:00.760 --> 01:17:03.399
kind of like almost like a golden thread between you
1556
01:17:03.600 --> 01:17:06.520
and the divine. Let's saying, I'm getting kind of trippy
1557
01:17:06.560 --> 01:17:09.039
and out there, but almost like an altered state. Like
1558
01:17:09.119 --> 01:17:11.800
I There's lots of things I can do when meditation
1559
01:17:12.000 --> 01:17:13.880
is not one of them. I'm not good at turning
1560
01:17:13.920 --> 01:17:17.920
off my brain. I've been trying for years. Yoga, deep breaths,
1561
01:17:17.960 --> 01:17:18.159
all that.
1562
01:17:18.359 --> 01:17:20.479
Oh sorry, a little yeah, tangent.
1563
01:17:20.600 --> 01:17:21.880
No, you're great people.
1564
01:17:22.199 --> 01:17:25.640
I want to go see a psychiatrist recently, just talk
1565
01:17:25.640 --> 01:17:30.239
about like, uh, PTSD and stuff. And she straight up
1566
01:17:30.279 --> 01:17:35.000
told me, like, people with PTSD and CPTSD have a
1567
01:17:35.079 --> 01:17:37.760
harder time with meditation, and I would not recommend it,
1568
01:17:38.600 --> 01:17:41.399
she said. She said that, so like if if I know,
1569
01:17:41.479 --> 01:17:43.520
based on your upbringing, some of the stuff you told me,
1570
01:17:44.279 --> 01:17:46.560
just saying don't beat yourself up there, Like, look, I
1571
01:17:46.840 --> 01:17:49.239
meditate and I've been told that's how to chill the
1572
01:17:49.279 --> 01:17:50.399
fuck out, and it's not working.
1573
01:17:50.960 --> 01:17:55.239
It's it's not it's do I Look, it's not for everybody.
1574
01:17:55.239 --> 01:17:57.640
I do my own thing. I do yoga, I work
1575
01:17:57.680 --> 01:18:00.000
out a lot, I do a lot of creative stuff.
1576
01:18:00.279 --> 01:18:02.199
So I'm trying to heal myself the best way I
1577
01:18:02.279 --> 01:18:04.560
know how and treat my own issues the best way
1578
01:18:04.600 --> 01:18:07.600
I know how. And most the most rewarding ones for
1579
01:18:07.680 --> 01:18:10.199
me are the ones that lease indorphins, and usually it's
1580
01:18:10.199 --> 01:18:14.159
been creative and stuff, meditation. I just have too much
1581
01:18:14.199 --> 01:18:15.840
going on in my brain most of the time it
1582
01:18:15.920 --> 01:18:19.640
won't quiet down. And so that's why my psychiatrist was like,
1583
01:18:19.720 --> 01:18:22.000
don't don't you try and try it. Don't stress it
1584
01:18:22.000 --> 01:18:24.479
because it might just make it worse and worse. But yes, yes, yes,
1585
01:18:24.520 --> 01:18:27.279
and then you got outer, absolutely, and then you've got
1586
01:18:27.600 --> 01:18:30.000
anxiety about and there's another thing I can't do right,
1587
01:18:30.039 --> 01:18:32.319
and then another voice in your head beating you up.
1588
01:18:32.920 --> 01:18:37.279
But the thing about meditation, like I can't meditate, but
1589
01:18:38.479 --> 01:18:42.119
I do feel that there were times that I'd go
1590
01:18:42.439 --> 01:18:45.680
into Now I can disassociate like a son of a gun, which.
1591
01:18:45.560 --> 01:18:47.479
Is the damn't fair. So we got that.
1592
01:18:47.800 --> 01:18:49.479
I can just with fulthe eight, I can have a
1593
01:18:49.520 --> 01:18:51.560
whole I can have a whole conversation with a person
1594
01:18:51.600 --> 01:18:53.520
while I'm having a whole other conversation in my head.
1595
01:18:53.560 --> 01:18:56.079
I like his voice at me.
1596
01:18:56.319 --> 01:18:59.880
He just I'm an easily never owned the room. Yeah, exactly. Hey,
1597
01:19:00.199 --> 01:19:02.680
when I go whenever I have, like if I have
1598
01:19:02.800 --> 01:19:04.520
to go to the dentist or if I have to
1599
01:19:04.560 --> 01:19:07.000
have like a gynecological procedure, you know where I am.
1600
01:19:07.199 --> 01:19:09.640
I'm in the Maldives. In my head, I'm lying on
1601
01:19:09.720 --> 01:19:14.359
a beach. I'm not don't feel anything. I'm not recognizing anything.
1602
01:19:14.640 --> 01:19:17.000
La la la la la. Gone can't meditate what I
1603
01:19:17.000 --> 01:19:19.119
can disassociate. I don't know what test says for my
1604
01:19:19.199 --> 01:19:21.399
mental health, but there you have it, Twincy's. I don't
1605
01:19:21.399 --> 01:19:24.239
know how healthy that is, but it works for me well.
1606
01:19:24.319 --> 01:19:26.439
But when I was writing, there were times when I
1607
01:19:26.640 --> 01:19:30.760
was just madness coming through my fingertips, typing on the
1608
01:19:30.880 --> 01:19:34.359
laptop and I'd write for hours and I'd write for days,
1609
01:19:34.880 --> 01:19:37.359
and I didn't know what I was going to write next.
1610
01:19:37.439 --> 01:19:39.560
And it was almost like, and I've said this to people,
1611
01:19:40.319 --> 01:19:42.720
and unless you've gone through it yourself, you're gonna think
1612
01:19:42.720 --> 01:19:46.600
I'm nuts. It was like something was working through me.
1613
01:19:46.920 --> 01:19:49.479
It was like it was writing itself. It was like
1614
01:19:49.640 --> 01:19:52.960
a muse or my granny's ghost or somebody. I could
1615
01:19:52.960 --> 01:19:56.199
see it was working through me, and it kind of
1616
01:19:56.279 --> 01:19:58.079
almost scared the shit out of me a little bit.
1617
01:19:58.119 --> 01:19:59.720
And then I was like, oh, this is so cool,
1618
01:20:00.039 --> 01:20:02.079
Like you were like, it's like you're something aligned.
1619
01:20:02.199 --> 01:20:06.359
Yeah, yeah, totally. My subconscious took over and just delivered.
1620
01:20:07.319 --> 01:20:09.840
And I think that's why it's so important that people
1621
01:20:09.840 --> 01:20:13.039
get out of their own way and askew impositor syndrome
1622
01:20:13.079 --> 01:20:15.359
as much as they can, and automatic writing, and just
1623
01:20:15.520 --> 01:20:17.359
go for it to start writing. And when you're stuck
1624
01:20:17.439 --> 01:20:20.760
with writer's block, just write something else. Pick up a
1625
01:20:20.840 --> 01:20:23.600
pen and paper, start on the laptop, distract yourself, but
1626
01:20:23.720 --> 01:20:25.319
get back to the writing and just write. And it
1627
01:20:25.359 --> 01:20:28.359
could be nonsense, but just start letting it come out
1628
01:20:28.399 --> 01:20:30.000
of you. Because the more you do it, the more.
1629
01:20:30.119 --> 01:20:32.239
It's like any exercise, the more you do something, the
1630
01:20:32.279 --> 01:20:34.039
better you're going to get at it, and the more
1631
01:20:34.560 --> 01:20:37.479
instinctive it's going to become. And what was really cool
1632
01:20:37.880 --> 01:20:40.479
was that then later I would go back to read
1633
01:20:40.960 --> 01:20:44.720
passages of the book six months later and I'd go,
1634
01:20:46.039 --> 01:20:48.800
oh my god, that's really good. Yeah, but normally that
1635
01:20:49.000 --> 01:20:51.159
there were times I would read things and go, I
1636
01:20:51.199 --> 01:20:54.920
don't remember writing that. That's a little bit scary. I
1637
01:20:55.079 --> 01:20:57.720
was like, I don't remember writing that. I don't remember.
1638
01:20:58.039 --> 01:20:59.920
Oh my god, you know, so I don't.
1639
01:20:59.720 --> 01:21:00.439
Know what that is.
1640
01:21:02.000 --> 01:21:05.800
But it was cool. It was cool. And there were
1641
01:21:06.000 --> 01:21:09.520
portions of the book where I've I'd actually moved myself
1642
01:21:09.600 --> 01:21:10.359
to tears.
1643
01:21:10.680 --> 01:21:12.479
Getting into a deep flow state.
1644
01:21:12.920 --> 01:21:15.680
No, that's I know, reading it back, reading sting passages
1645
01:21:15.720 --> 01:21:17.880
back and being moved to tears, and I'm going. I
1646
01:21:17.960 --> 01:21:20.600
think that's a good sign. That is, did you make
1647
01:21:20.680 --> 01:21:22.039
yourself cry at your own book?
1648
01:21:22.399 --> 01:21:25.039
And if a happy read, well, I think I told
1649
01:21:25.079 --> 01:21:27.239
you again and I don't want to spoil too much.
1650
01:21:27.479 --> 01:21:29.800
The end of the book for me was a deep wow,
1651
01:21:30.159 --> 01:21:30.920
profound impact.
1652
01:21:31.079 --> 01:21:34.520
Wow, I hope did it feel this can be a
1653
01:21:34.600 --> 01:21:39.199
weird word. Did this story in any way feel cleansing
1654
01:21:39.319 --> 01:21:41.479
to you? I know that's a strange word to use.
1655
01:21:41.560 --> 01:21:42.800
I don't know if that's the right word.
1656
01:21:43.079 --> 01:21:44.600
I would say, yeah, I would definitely say it was
1657
01:21:44.640 --> 01:21:46.159
cleansing in someone.
1658
01:21:45.920 --> 01:21:48.920
Maybe I mean cathartic more so, but like a definite
1659
01:21:49.079 --> 01:21:50.039
release of something.
1660
01:21:50.439 --> 01:21:50.680
Yeah.
1661
01:21:50.920 --> 01:21:55.520
I think there were some of the ways in which
1662
01:21:55.840 --> 01:21:59.079
Amanda dealt with Eddie, some of the ways in which
1663
01:22:00.479 --> 01:22:04.159
Eddie had to kind of face some of his own
1664
01:22:04.840 --> 01:22:07.279
face zone consequences, not all you know he didn't yea
1665
01:22:07.319 --> 01:22:10.680
yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, I was like, okay, long time coming, dude.
1666
01:22:10.760 --> 01:22:10.960
Yeah.
1667
01:22:11.720 --> 01:22:13.399
But it was also done in a realistic way, because
1668
01:22:13.399 --> 01:22:15.960
I mean an ideal world, yeah, people that are narcissist
1669
01:22:16.000 --> 01:22:19.880
and bullies would be you know, fully punished and totally yeah,
1670
01:22:20.279 --> 01:22:22.359
change and stop with it. But this did it in like,
1671
01:22:22.640 --> 01:22:23.960
in a realistic way.
1672
01:22:24.239 --> 01:22:26.520
So right, it just is what it is.
1673
01:22:26.800 --> 01:22:27.760
Yeah, it is what it is.
1674
01:22:27.840 --> 01:22:30.840
Well, like, I know you didn't exactly get the ending
1675
01:22:30.920 --> 01:22:32.520
that you were hoping for as a reader.
1676
01:22:32.680 --> 01:22:33.279
Yeah, that's true.
1677
01:22:33.319 --> 01:22:33.520
I was.
1678
01:22:33.600 --> 01:22:35.159
I was kind of hoping for a different ending, and
1679
01:22:35.239 --> 01:22:36.920
the ending did uh surprise me.
1680
01:22:37.479 --> 01:22:39.920
I'm delighted. I'm delighted and no, I mean I'm delighted
1681
01:22:39.960 --> 01:22:42.199
because it's not predictable. I'm delighted that you didn't see
1682
01:22:42.239 --> 01:22:44.720
it coming. Yeah, that it took you by surprise, even
1683
01:22:44.800 --> 01:22:48.159
towards the end, that's great. That's that's God. That's what
1684
01:22:48.239 --> 01:22:49.840
every writer wants to hear. I think, you know.
1685
01:22:49.960 --> 01:22:53.479
Yeah, and again it was like a realistic kind of ending. Yeah,
1686
01:22:53.520 --> 01:22:55.800
it was like it was surprising but realistic, if that
1687
01:22:55.880 --> 01:22:56.239
makes sense.
1688
01:22:56.279 --> 01:22:58.800
Well, and I hate to tell people, but when if
1689
01:22:58.840 --> 01:23:00.439
they do read it and they get to the end,
1690
01:23:00.800 --> 01:23:03.000
it's that ending, is what happened.
1691
01:23:03.560 --> 01:23:06.119
Yeah, I remember, because yeah, you told me I was uns.
1692
01:23:06.359 --> 01:23:10.199
And then my family had to pick up the pieces
1693
01:23:10.199 --> 01:23:13.840
of that and that's where you got your generational totally totally.
1694
01:23:14.680 --> 01:23:18.199
Now I have started, I actually did started quite a
1695
01:23:18.239 --> 01:23:22.119
while ago. I follow up a second book, Oh okay,
1696
01:23:22.239 --> 01:23:25.479
nice following the Next Generation and then I have an idea,
1697
01:23:25.560 --> 01:23:27.760
an outline for the third if I get that far,
1698
01:23:27.800 --> 01:23:30.800
which I think I will eventually, and that would kind
1699
01:23:30.840 --> 01:23:35.159
of follow my mother into modern day, like the nineteen
1700
01:23:35.199 --> 01:23:39.640
sixties Mexico City and growing up, and she was she
1701
01:23:39.920 --> 01:23:42.039
was told she was going to be a film star,
1702
01:23:42.279 --> 01:23:44.159
you know, and she was, oh, is she actually?
1703
01:23:44.239 --> 01:23:44.359
Oh?
1704
01:23:44.479 --> 01:23:44.960
My mom was?
1705
01:23:45.239 --> 01:23:48.239
She was? She acted, She was in beauty pageants and
1706
01:23:48.319 --> 01:23:50.640
she was. I talked about it, I'd make jokes about
1707
01:23:50.680 --> 01:23:53.359
it on stage. She was the double of Elizabeth Taylor.
1708
01:23:53.439 --> 01:23:56.760
She was stunning. And so especially you know in Mexico City,
1709
01:23:56.840 --> 01:24:00.079
you stand out already because you're white and then of
1710
01:24:00.119 --> 01:24:02.520
a certain class, and then you know, her father was
1711
01:24:02.600 --> 01:24:05.159
kind of a big wig in kind of radio and
1712
01:24:05.279 --> 01:24:07.880
journalism and stuff, and so she really thought that she
1713
01:24:08.079 --> 01:24:11.960
was gonna end up whatever. And so like, there's a
1714
01:24:12.079 --> 01:24:14.560
lot still that I could unpack with this family and
1715
01:24:14.680 --> 01:24:17.800
with this story. And maybe there's a little part of
1716
01:24:17.880 --> 01:24:19.920
me that's like, maybe if I just write it all out,
1717
01:24:20.600 --> 01:24:23.119
I can break the curse, you know, and who knows,
1718
01:24:23.199 --> 01:24:25.279
who knows, who knows? But I you know, these things
1719
01:24:25.439 --> 01:24:27.359
kind of happen organically, and you're like, well, I can't
1720
01:24:27.359 --> 01:24:29.319
ignore it, So I'm going to work towards it.
1721
01:24:30.279 --> 01:24:32.239
You know, do you feel though that like it was
1722
01:24:32.319 --> 01:24:34.000
a cathartic for you to just.
1723
01:24:35.760 --> 01:24:39.960
Purge all this out, Yeah, totally.
1724
01:24:40.319 --> 01:24:42.119
And like maybe that with your mom, who's you have?
1725
01:24:42.279 --> 01:24:44.920
You know, you had some feelings about your grandma. Yeah,
1726
01:24:45.000 --> 01:24:47.399
and this is I mean, she's not the main character
1727
01:24:47.520 --> 01:24:50.000
in this story, but she is a character in the
1728
01:24:50.039 --> 01:24:53.279
final resting place of a butterfly. I guess I'm just
1729
01:24:53.439 --> 01:24:55.319
thinking because like, how do I says? I had a
1730
01:24:55.439 --> 01:25:01.199
friend who really tragically passed away like three years ago,
1731
01:25:01.880 --> 01:25:04.920
and he was quite young, right, and that really like
1732
01:25:05.239 --> 01:25:07.079
shook me, and it would be the point where anytime
1733
01:25:07.119 --> 01:25:09.279
I thought about it, I would I would just start crying.
1734
01:25:10.000 --> 01:25:13.079
And Alex Byrne, you know Alex and Alex Byrne has
1735
01:25:13.079 --> 01:25:14.960
been a guest in the podcast that actually he was
1736
01:25:15.199 --> 01:25:20.760
in roasting the Italian He's Christmas Passion. Sorry. He wrote
1737
01:25:21.800 --> 01:25:25.760
a short drama and I played a character in this
1738
01:25:25.880 --> 01:25:29.960
short film that he that he produced and directed, and
1739
01:25:30.239 --> 01:25:32.039
the character I did, I had to I had to
1740
01:25:32.159 --> 01:25:34.600
cry on spot and so I just thought about my
1741
01:25:34.640 --> 01:25:37.239
buddy and we had to do several takes of this.
1742
01:25:37.439 --> 01:25:38.800
So I had to just kind of sit there and
1743
01:25:38.920 --> 01:25:41.159
just cry and cry and cry and like force myself
1744
01:25:41.199 --> 01:25:43.199
to think about it and just cry. And then after
1745
01:25:43.319 --> 01:25:47.279
that I realized then like I wasn't able to cry
1746
01:25:47.479 --> 01:25:49.720
anymore where I thought about it. I'm still sad. Yeah,
1747
01:25:49.720 --> 01:25:51.680
I kind of got all my tears out, so I
1748
01:25:51.720 --> 01:25:54.720
guess what I'm trying to say, sorry and no hi jacket.
1749
01:25:55.239 --> 01:25:59.039
But like the you know, when you're you take this
1750
01:25:59.319 --> 01:26:03.159
pain and you put it through this creative tunnel, Yeah,
1751
01:26:03.720 --> 01:26:05.600
do you find that that healed.
1752
01:26:05.319 --> 01:26:09.960
You in a way? Or you know, I could I
1753
01:26:10.039 --> 01:26:14.319
could tell stories about my grandmother that, you know, things
1754
01:26:14.399 --> 01:26:17.239
she did to my mother, things she did to myself
1755
01:26:17.600 --> 01:26:21.000
and my half sisters, and not horrific beating like well,
1756
01:26:21.039 --> 01:26:25.239
I mean where I'm concerned, not horrific beatings. But you know,
1757
01:26:25.439 --> 01:26:28.720
I can talk about it now and I can realize,
1758
01:26:28.760 --> 01:26:30.960
like it took me years, probably into my thirties to
1759
01:26:31.039 --> 01:26:34.600
realize that something that my grandmother, you know, and I'm
1760
01:26:34.640 --> 01:26:36.640
actually just gonna talk about it. And just to give
1761
01:26:36.680 --> 01:26:41.439
an example of how ill this woman was, it was
1762
01:26:41.439 --> 01:26:44.680
about nineteen eighty five. My grandmother had come from Mexico
1763
01:26:44.760 --> 01:26:47.359
City to visit to stay with us, in Friendswood, Texas,
1764
01:26:47.840 --> 01:26:51.279
my mom had hurt her back, and here in we
1765
01:26:51.319 --> 01:26:53.680
would call it like vultural or tigerbalm or you know
1766
01:26:53.760 --> 01:26:55.600
those kinds of things. In the States we had like
1767
01:26:55.840 --> 01:26:58.159
icy hot and ben gay. Do you remember those right? Yes?
1768
01:26:58.399 --> 01:27:00.319
I never understood why ben gay was called ben gay,
1769
01:27:00.399 --> 01:27:02.319
but you know, well I just remember from the eighties,
1770
01:27:03.000 --> 01:27:08.039
and you know, my mother had asked her mother to
1771
01:27:08.199 --> 01:27:09.880
apply some of this ointment to her back where she
1772
01:27:09.880 --> 01:27:12.920
couldn't reach. And me, being a five year old little girl,
1773
01:27:13.560 --> 01:27:16.640
you know, love in love with her mommy, I was
1774
01:27:16.680 --> 01:27:17.399
bouncing up and down.
1775
01:27:17.399 --> 01:27:18.079
I was like, I want to help.
1776
01:27:18.119 --> 01:27:20.159
I would help, I would help you let me, can
1777
01:27:20.199 --> 01:27:23.239
I direct it? Please? And I don't know why to
1778
01:27:23.319 --> 01:27:26.399
this day, but I can still see the look on
1779
01:27:26.479 --> 01:27:30.239
her face, on your mom's face. No, my grandmother lying prone. Yeah,
1780
01:27:30.439 --> 01:27:32.520
I can still see the look on my grandmother's face
1781
01:27:33.279 --> 01:27:36.680
as she put a little bit of the bengate on
1782
01:27:36.800 --> 01:27:37.359
her finger.
1783
01:27:38.039 --> 01:27:38.880
Huh A.
1784
01:27:39.039 --> 01:27:44.079
Never breaking eye contact with me, she reached over and
1785
01:27:44.239 --> 01:27:45.439
she smeared it in my eye.
1786
01:27:45.760 --> 01:27:49.680
What a bitch? What the fuck is that is malicious?
1787
01:27:49.760 --> 01:27:55.640
Isn't that that is so? Isn't that horrible? My mother?
1788
01:27:55.760 --> 01:27:59.800
I scream. My mother jumps up. She screams at her mother.
1789
01:28:00.119 --> 01:28:02.840
She's screaming at her in Spanish. You could have blinded her.
1790
01:28:02.920 --> 01:28:05.760
Oh my god. She grabs me, rushes me to the sink,
1791
01:28:06.399 --> 01:28:10.119
flushes my eyes with water, and I'm hysterical as you
1792
01:28:10.159 --> 01:28:13.520
would be. My mother is hysterical as you would be.
1793
01:28:14.119 --> 01:28:19.600
And psychopathic Granny is sitting there kind of smiling to herself. Okay,
1794
01:28:19.720 --> 01:28:23.159
that's a level of evil. That's a level of evil
1795
01:28:23.359 --> 01:28:26.760
hurting a church child for no reason, not that there's
1796
01:28:26.760 --> 01:28:29.039
ever a reason, but you know what I mean. Like
1797
01:28:29.640 --> 01:28:32.119
back in the day, abuser is always, oh, well they
1798
01:28:32.239 --> 01:28:34.119
did X, Y and Z, so I took a switch
1799
01:28:34.159 --> 01:28:35.600
off the tree and I'll beat them stupid, you know,
1800
01:28:35.720 --> 01:28:37.520
yeah I did something bad or they got a bad
1801
01:28:37.600 --> 01:28:39.880
grade or whatever. You know, I'm gonna teach you a lesson.
1802
01:28:39.920 --> 01:28:41.680
And they beat the shit out of them. I was
1803
01:28:41.840 --> 01:28:44.319
just sitting there, minding my own business. But because I
1804
01:28:44.439 --> 01:28:47.840
annoyed her, she decided to try and put a chemicra
1805
01:28:48.079 --> 01:28:50.439
Like I know, she's put a chemical in my eye,
1806
01:28:51.199 --> 01:28:54.119
and well, I look back at my mos reaction, which
1807
01:28:54.159 --> 01:28:58.079
was completely normal. They got into a huge fight, screaming
1808
01:28:58.159 --> 01:29:00.960
her Now I remember a few days later my grandmother
1809
01:29:01.079 --> 01:29:04.800
left obviously went back to Mexico City. Don't know if
1810
01:29:04.840 --> 01:29:06.079
my mother really kicked her out or what.
1811
01:29:06.680 --> 01:29:08.760
But see, I'm glad your granny's dead.
1812
01:29:08.960 --> 01:29:11.359
Oh man, me too. That's why when she died in
1813
01:29:11.439 --> 01:29:13.479
ninety five, I was like, whoa party?
1814
01:29:14.199 --> 01:29:14.359
You know?
1815
01:29:14.640 --> 01:29:18.840
And but my mother as messed up an individual as
1816
01:29:18.880 --> 01:29:23.119
she is and was, if someone had done that to
1817
01:29:23.239 --> 01:29:31.119
my child, I would have never ever allowed them around
1818
01:29:31.199 --> 01:29:34.880
me or my child again. Whereas my mother continued to
1819
01:29:35.039 --> 01:29:38.199
take me my sisters and would go visit Mexico City
1820
01:29:38.239 --> 01:29:41.680
and continue to subject me to the whims of that
1821
01:29:41.760 --> 01:29:45.079
crazy woman. Yeah, and all they would do when we
1822
01:29:45.119 --> 01:29:47.680
would go it was called alfcol which means the building,
1823
01:29:47.720 --> 01:29:49.960
the apartment building in Mexico City. My grandmother owned a
1824
01:29:49.960 --> 01:29:52.800
lot of property, real estate, and there was a building
1825
01:29:52.880 --> 01:29:55.039
from like the nineteen twenties, and I was convinced it
1826
01:29:55.119 --> 01:29:57.479
was haunted. I loved going there though, because it was
1827
01:29:57.520 --> 01:29:59.880
super cool. It was all like Art decoee and old.
1828
01:30:00.039 --> 01:30:02.760
It was like time has stood still. So that's where
1829
01:30:02.800 --> 01:30:04.840
we would go and stay when we were in Mexico City.
1830
01:30:04.920 --> 01:30:07.159
We didn't go spend many on hotels, which was, you
1831
01:30:07.239 --> 01:30:09.439
know what allowed us to go every year. I had
1832
01:30:09.439 --> 01:30:12.560
a free place to crash, and my mom had her
1833
01:30:12.600 --> 01:30:15.560
apartment and it was down the hall from her mother's apartment,
1834
01:30:15.720 --> 01:30:19.920
and I would just spend nights reading my Archie comics
1835
01:30:20.000 --> 01:30:23.239
in bed or reading my books because down the hall
1836
01:30:23.479 --> 01:30:26.079
all Akare was screaming. That's all they did all night,
1837
01:30:26.680 --> 01:30:28.920
you know. And you're going, what a way to spend
1838
01:30:29.079 --> 01:30:30.960
my summer vacation, you know.
1839
01:30:31.119 --> 01:30:33.319
But why would you subject yourself exactly?
1840
01:30:33.479 --> 01:30:35.840
Why was my mother going for what? Because there's a
1841
01:30:35.880 --> 01:30:37.800
part of her that loves it. She loves to fight,
1842
01:30:37.920 --> 01:30:39.720
she loves it. They love that drama. I think they're
1843
01:30:39.720 --> 01:30:40.680
almost addicted to it.
1844
01:30:40.920 --> 01:30:43.199
Yeah, it's that you get so comfortable with it.
1845
01:30:43.359 --> 01:30:47.119
Oh, totally, they're so comfortable in conflict. But also maybe
1846
01:30:47.279 --> 01:30:49.520
she thought if she got some kind of reaction from
1847
01:30:49.560 --> 01:30:51.239
her mother that that was better than nothing.
1848
01:30:52.039 --> 01:30:53.880
No, you know what now it reminds me of you know,
1849
01:30:53.960 --> 01:30:56.439
that fucking experiment they did with like the baby and
1850
01:30:56.560 --> 01:30:59.439
the mom and when they okay, like if they have
1851
01:30:59.560 --> 01:31:02.439
a baby, and I'm sorry this sounds so vague. I
1852
01:31:02.479 --> 01:31:06.640
don't know where is this experiment where that they took
1853
01:31:06.640 --> 01:31:08.479
a baby and a mom in a room, and they
1854
01:31:08.520 --> 01:31:13.319
told the mother to not show any emotive expressions whatsoever
1855
01:31:13.680 --> 01:31:15.920
to her baby. And so sure enough, you see the
1856
01:31:15.960 --> 01:31:18.159
baby there, just playing, trying to get the mom's attention.
1857
01:31:18.600 --> 01:31:20.800
Mom just stares stone cold face at the baby.
1858
01:31:21.079 --> 01:31:21.279
Yeah.
1859
01:31:21.479 --> 01:31:24.319
Baby continues to try, and then baby starts crying. Yeah,
1860
01:31:24.439 --> 01:31:27.720
Mom is still cold cold face. Baby crying harder. And
1861
01:31:27.840 --> 01:31:29.760
that itself is a form of abuse.
1862
01:31:30.239 --> 01:31:31.000
Absolutely.
1863
01:31:31.479 --> 01:31:33.199
That's why I got chills when you said that your
1864
01:31:33.199 --> 01:31:36.920
grandma just kind of spared, Yeah, because as she did it. Yeah,
1865
01:31:37.520 --> 01:31:40.760
that's the that's the most psychopathic thing. Yeah, of that.
1866
01:31:41.000 --> 01:31:46.680
Well, and look the the silent treatment. It's okay if
1867
01:31:46.680 --> 01:31:48.079
you get into an argument with somebody and you're like,
1868
01:31:48.119 --> 01:31:49.520
I need to take a minute or a day, I
1869
01:31:49.560 --> 01:31:51.760
can't talk to you right now, that's fine. But when
1870
01:31:51.800 --> 01:31:54.159
you freeze out a loved one and you are especially
1871
01:31:54.199 --> 01:31:56.319
if you are their main caretaker like a mother or
1872
01:31:56.359 --> 01:31:59.199
a father, if you go silent treatment on your child,
1873
01:31:59.279 --> 01:32:02.319
it is imolutely a form of abuse. It is emotional abuse.
1874
01:32:02.920 --> 01:32:07.039
And I do reckon that My mother probably kind of
1875
01:32:07.079 --> 01:32:10.279
took the bad reactions from her mother as some sort
1876
01:32:10.319 --> 01:32:12.840
of at least she was giving her something good.
1877
01:32:12.880 --> 01:32:15.199
Attention. You know about it egg exactly, But I didn't
1878
01:32:15.199 --> 01:32:16.000
know Ad and Jackie.
1879
01:32:16.079 --> 01:32:19.199
So that's my mother acting like a toddler basically. But
1880
01:32:19.479 --> 01:32:22.279
but if somebody had had done that to my child,
1881
01:32:22.399 --> 01:32:26.119
even my own mother, I would have thrown up those boundaries.
1882
01:32:26.159 --> 01:32:27.600
And you're never going to be around me or my
1883
01:32:27.680 --> 01:32:31.239
children again, you lunatic. She assaulted me, She assaulted me
1884
01:32:31.319 --> 01:32:33.600
with a chemical could have could have blownd it made
1885
01:32:33.880 --> 01:32:37.399
absolutely and that is just the tip of the iceberg.
1886
01:32:37.479 --> 01:32:39.359
Maybe some of the things she did to my mother.
1887
01:32:40.439 --> 01:32:42.159
Can't imagine what your mom had.
1888
01:32:42.039 --> 01:32:45.399
To There's a comic, actually, we have a comic and
1889
01:32:45.560 --> 01:32:47.119
I won't call him by name because I don't want
1890
01:32:47.119 --> 01:32:48.720
to call him out, but he does. He's brilliant, and
1891
01:32:48.800 --> 01:32:50.720
he does a set and he does a joke about
1892
01:32:50.880 --> 01:32:53.600
his family being from a different country than Ireland, something
1893
01:32:53.640 --> 01:32:56.880
about a family pet chicken being eaten for dinner. Oh
1894
01:32:57.199 --> 01:33:00.199
you know who I'm talking about. But yeah, wait, does
1895
01:33:00.239 --> 01:33:03.600
a sound familiar. Yeah, I'll tell you have to, okay,
1896
01:33:03.640 --> 01:33:05.159
because I don't want to be throwing his stuff out
1897
01:33:05.159 --> 01:33:08.439
there without his permission. But right he references you know,
1898
01:33:08.680 --> 01:33:11.279
this being done and everybody laughs, and that exactly that
1899
01:33:11.640 --> 01:33:15.319
my mother's pet chicken was served to her. And here's
1900
01:33:15.399 --> 01:33:18.239
the thing that was a conscious choice that my grandmother made.
1901
01:33:18.640 --> 01:33:20.760
There was no need for that. They had money, they
1902
01:33:20.800 --> 01:33:22.640
weren't poor, they weren't farmers. They weren't like, oh, we
1903
01:33:22.720 --> 01:33:26.079
have nothing left to eat, but you're darling, Henrietta. She
1904
01:33:26.119 --> 01:33:27.840
could have sent the maid because they all have made
1905
01:33:27.920 --> 01:33:29.439
in Mexico City, and you know they all have a
1906
01:33:29.479 --> 01:33:32.640
house full of servants because the economics are so different there, right,
1907
01:33:33.359 --> 01:33:35.279
she put a senator to get whatever. She made the
1908
01:33:35.319 --> 01:33:40.239
conscious effort to kill my mother's beloved pet chicken and
1909
01:33:40.840 --> 01:33:43.479
make her eat it just the tip of the ie.
1910
01:33:43.520 --> 01:33:45.960
Mean this these this is a very sick woman, isn't
1911
01:33:46.039 --> 01:33:46.439
what they do?
1912
01:33:46.640 --> 01:33:50.239
Is that they again, and this is like abusers and
1913
01:33:50.960 --> 01:33:53.640
narcissists trying to manipulate the situation. They're like, oh, whoever
1914
01:33:53.800 --> 01:33:56.399
is the most emotional one is the one that's in
1915
01:33:56.479 --> 01:33:59.520
the wrong is the one that loses. So like again
1916
01:33:59.640 --> 01:34:03.039
with the the eye thing, your grandma's sitting there not reacting.
1917
01:34:03.640 --> 01:34:05.760
That was herd of being like, ha I made you react.
1918
01:34:05.840 --> 01:34:06.239
I won.
1919
01:34:06.720 --> 01:34:11.359
Yeah, No, we're human, we're allowed to be anybody a grewid. Yeah,
1920
01:34:11.560 --> 01:34:14.479
totally felt about as something like that. So the whole
1921
01:34:14.520 --> 01:34:17.239
point is to give that like when I talk about trauma,
1922
01:34:17.279 --> 01:34:20.640
I'm talking about real trauma, like you know, And I
1923
01:34:20.680 --> 01:34:25.319
suppose was I trying to forgive my grandmother? Was it cathartic?
1924
01:34:25.600 --> 01:34:26.680
I don't forgive your grandma.
1925
01:34:26.840 --> 01:34:29.720
Well, I don't forgive her for that specifically, because I
1926
01:34:29.720 --> 01:34:32.680
don't think there's any any way that you could. But
1927
01:34:32.800 --> 01:34:34.279
you kind of take a step back and you go
1928
01:34:34.479 --> 01:34:36.520
and but again, you know, why did she turn out
1929
01:34:36.600 --> 01:34:39.600
the way same set of circumstances with the revolution and
1930
01:34:39.680 --> 01:34:42.399
the same parents and the same things that happened. Why
1931
01:34:42.479 --> 01:34:45.640
did my grandmother turn out to be so evil? And
1932
01:34:45.840 --> 01:34:49.479
why did my great aunt Muriel, her younger sister, turn
1933
01:34:49.520 --> 01:34:51.760
out to be an absolute doll? And she was. She
1934
01:34:51.880 --> 01:34:54.039
had like eight children. She went on she had wonderful
1935
01:34:54.039 --> 01:34:56.960
relationships with all of them. She went on to become
1936
01:34:58.399 --> 01:35:01.720
very wealthy, very successful. Her children were diplomats, and she
1937
01:35:01.800 --> 01:35:03.920
married a wonderful man. They had. I had been in
1938
01:35:04.000 --> 01:35:06.920
her home many many times as a child. She was warm,
1939
01:35:07.119 --> 01:35:09.600
she was loving, and I used to sit there and go,
1940
01:35:09.720 --> 01:35:12.600
why couldn't Miuriell have been my grandmother instead of my
1941
01:35:12.680 --> 01:35:15.720
grade and I loved this woman, and she was elegant
1942
01:35:15.800 --> 01:35:18.159
and she was yeah, and until she was like ninety five,
1943
01:35:18.319 --> 01:35:20.159
she was still with her makeup and her hair and
1944
01:35:20.279 --> 01:35:22.479
driving her I mean, she was a badass. She was
1945
01:35:22.520 --> 01:35:24.720
someone to look up to. And then I got the
1946
01:35:24.840 --> 01:35:28.439
troll from my grandmother. You know. It's just like so yeah, yeah,
1947
01:35:28.560 --> 01:35:30.119
but look, I mean we all have our stuff, and
1948
01:35:30.279 --> 01:35:34.319
it's it's heartbreaking and it's very sad. And it's when
1949
01:35:34.359 --> 01:35:37.000
we talk about like how fantastical some of the circumstances
1950
01:35:37.039 --> 01:35:40.199
are in the book, you kind of go, how crazy
1951
01:35:40.279 --> 01:35:41.760
were the people? Well, you know know what?
1952
01:35:42.199 --> 01:35:44.600
That is so true. I don't know if you've probably
1953
01:35:44.680 --> 01:35:46.960
experienced this. I mean, well, like just right, how where
1954
01:35:46.960 --> 01:35:50.680
you tell people your own personal experience of being raised
1955
01:35:51.479 --> 01:35:54.960
by a narcissist, raised in an abusive household, and sometimes
1956
01:35:54.960 --> 01:35:56.600
people are like what really they have a hard time
1957
01:35:56.640 --> 01:35:59.239
believing you. Yeah, I've had that, you know, where I
1958
01:35:59.359 --> 01:36:03.079
tell people some shit and they're like, oh, so I
1959
01:36:03.119 --> 01:36:04.520
could tell sometimes they don't believe.
1960
01:36:04.359 --> 01:36:06.199
Me, yeah, And then they has actual always I think
1961
01:36:06.239 --> 01:36:07.600
we can't possibly be that bad.
1962
01:36:07.680 --> 01:36:09.960
I can't possibly be that bad. And then then they've
1963
01:36:10.000 --> 01:36:11.520
actually met the people before and then.
1964
01:36:11.479 --> 01:36:13.880
They're like, yeah, I see you. Oh well, for example,
1965
01:36:14.000 --> 01:36:16.079
I mean, my ex husband used to mock and the
1966
01:36:16.199 --> 01:36:19.600
little my trauma that oh, your mommy just wasn't nice
1967
01:36:19.640 --> 01:36:22.039
to you, didn't say nice things to you. Go dude,
1968
01:36:22.119 --> 01:36:23.640
it wasn't you know what I mean? But like he
1969
01:36:23.800 --> 01:36:25.720
and my mother had a very they hated each other.
1970
01:36:25.880 --> 01:36:28.319
And it's a funny thing too, is that most of
1971
01:36:28.399 --> 01:36:30.760
us go around, we can't sniff out the narcissists. We
1972
01:36:30.840 --> 01:36:35.239
don't really cop the toxic people. Another narcissist can spot
1973
01:36:35.279 --> 01:36:37.640
another one a mile away, and they get kind of
1974
01:36:37.680 --> 01:36:40.880
threatened because they don't want you being taken away from them.
1975
01:36:41.000 --> 01:36:43.920
They don't want anyone in on their territory. I've seen
1976
01:36:43.960 --> 01:36:47.680
it with girlfriends, like when you get those jealous types
1977
01:36:47.760 --> 01:36:50.800
that they don't want you to have other friends. They
1978
01:36:50.840 --> 01:36:52.319
don't want you to have boyfriends. They don't want you
1979
01:36:52.319 --> 01:36:53.960
to spend time with this sister. They don't want you
1980
01:36:54.079 --> 01:36:57.279
to referential treatment to this parent. They don't want you
1981
01:36:57.680 --> 01:37:02.680
that the other narcissist is threat to their control over you. Yep.
1982
01:37:02.760 --> 01:37:05.560
And if you're a nice, easy going person with a
1983
01:37:05.720 --> 01:37:10.359
good soul and good light, people the narks flock to that.
1984
01:37:10.640 --> 01:37:11.720
Oh yeah, it's advantage.
1985
01:37:11.800 --> 01:37:14.680
I love it. They feed off of it. Narcissistic supply.
1986
01:37:14.760 --> 01:37:15.479
It's a real thing.
1987
01:37:15.880 --> 01:37:19.600
I think that's why we all of us have. I
1988
01:37:19.680 --> 01:37:22.560
think we all have like that one friend who's a
1989
01:37:22.640 --> 01:37:26.279
fucking angel, a fucking sweetheart, just like and they're dating
1990
01:37:26.399 --> 01:37:29.640
the worst then and you're just like, these are two
1991
01:37:29.760 --> 01:37:34.600
complete opposites. But it's like the horrible person can only
1992
01:37:34.680 --> 01:37:37.640
ever date someone that sweet and that kind Yeah, because
1993
01:37:37.680 --> 01:37:41.159
it's everyone else is like no, my my, my bullshit,
1994
01:37:41.640 --> 01:37:46.319
uh radar, radar spots immediately, and then the kind of
1995
01:37:46.319 --> 01:37:48.319
person exactly.
1996
01:37:48.000 --> 01:37:50.640
It that is a huge Yeah, you've hit the nail
1997
01:37:50.640 --> 01:37:54.960
on the head. That is absolutely a thing because they
1998
01:37:55.039 --> 01:37:59.159
can't date the same type of person because they have
1999
01:37:59.279 --> 01:38:01.319
to get that supply. They have to feed off somebody.
2000
01:38:01.359 --> 01:38:02.880
They're like energy vampires and.
2001
01:38:02.960 --> 01:38:07.319
Then they and they all swarm these angelic people totally.
2002
01:38:07.560 --> 01:38:10.319
Yeah. Well, like, two narcissists in a relationship aren't gonna
2003
01:38:10.359 --> 01:38:13.079
last for very long at all because they're not going
2004
01:38:13.159 --> 01:38:14.960
to get their needs met. They're not going to get
2005
01:38:15.000 --> 01:38:17.000
what they want out of the other one, which is controlled,
2006
01:38:17.000 --> 01:38:20.239
because they're both gonna be angling for control. So the
2007
01:38:20.359 --> 01:38:23.960
relationship is probably gonna end spectacularly and quite soon, because
2008
01:38:24.119 --> 01:38:26.199
one is going to go, one is gonna bounce because
2009
01:38:26.600 --> 01:38:28.880
I can't control this person. I can't manipulate this person.
2010
01:38:29.520 --> 01:38:31.359
Is a Sorry. Is there anything else you'd like to
2011
01:38:31.520 --> 01:38:33.079
chat about before? I don't know.
2012
01:38:33.880 --> 01:38:36.520
I don't think so. I think we've covered I'm trying
2013
01:38:36.560 --> 01:38:42.680
to think. I think we've covered good. It's interesting we've
2014
01:38:42.720 --> 01:38:44.880
talked so much about the book without really giving away
2015
01:38:45.279 --> 01:38:48.680
much of the plot because I don't want to, like, yeah,
2016
01:38:48.840 --> 01:38:50.840
we don't want spoilers, like I want to call what you.
2017
01:38:50.880 --> 01:38:51.439
Want to reveal?
2018
01:38:51.640 --> 01:38:54.800
Yeah, yeah, no, I want people to discover and and
2019
01:38:55.239 --> 01:38:57.319
so I think there's a lot of discovery in the book,
2020
01:38:57.399 --> 01:39:02.920
and that's what keeps it entertaining, you know, so hopefully anyway.
2021
01:39:02.880 --> 01:39:04.199
Yeah, no, i'd die. I agree.
2022
01:39:04.359 --> 01:39:06.319
Look, I'm having a great time. It is what it is.
2023
01:39:06.840 --> 01:39:09.880
You know, it's been a long time coming. The seeds
2024
01:39:09.920 --> 01:39:13.199
for this idea started five years ago. They've grown slowly.
2025
01:39:13.319 --> 01:39:15.760
It's evolved over time. If you had told me it
2026
01:39:15.800 --> 01:39:17.079
was going to take me five years to get a
2027
01:39:17.119 --> 01:39:19.479
book out, I'd have been like, what, that's awful, you know,
2028
01:39:19.560 --> 01:39:22.079
that's terrible, too slow. But you know, what life happens,
2029
01:39:22.239 --> 01:39:25.600
and things sometimes unfold as they should. And I'm you know,
2030
01:39:25.680 --> 01:39:29.479
this is completely grassroots movement. I could have put all
2031
01:39:29.520 --> 01:39:32.359
my energy into trying to find a literary agent and
2032
01:39:32.479 --> 01:39:35.479
a traditional publishing house, and I'm not ruling that out,
2033
01:39:35.640 --> 01:39:38.960
but I've decided I'm going to just self publish it
2034
01:39:39.039 --> 01:39:41.520
because this isn't a technology or an option that we
2035
01:39:41.640 --> 01:39:43.960
really had twenty or thirty years ago, and I'm going
2036
01:39:44.039 --> 01:39:46.279
to take full advantage of it. And absolutely, you know,
2037
01:39:46.560 --> 01:39:50.079
I often say to people because again, your imposter syndrome goes,
2038
01:39:50.159 --> 01:39:51.760
oh my god, it's self published.
2039
01:39:52.640 --> 01:39:54.479
You know, it doesn't hurt it try at all. Look
2040
01:39:54.560 --> 01:39:57.479
what's because if you try and you fail, and then
2041
01:39:57.560 --> 01:39:59.800
you don't try both options, at the end of the day,
2042
01:40:00.000 --> 01:40:01.600
do not have a Yeah, yeah, you won't have a
2043
01:40:01.600 --> 01:40:02.800
book house right as well?
2044
01:40:03.039 --> 01:40:05.119
Well, also too, you have to get out of your
2045
01:40:05.159 --> 01:40:08.159
own head. Look, lots of people publish stuff themselves all
2046
01:40:08.199 --> 01:40:11.520
the time, and why not. Why not. It's a thing
2047
01:40:11.600 --> 01:40:14.720
that exists for a reason. If people want to discount
2048
01:40:14.760 --> 01:40:17.279
the quality of the work because this is the method
2049
01:40:17.359 --> 01:40:20.279
I chose, or the you know, the path I chose
2050
01:40:20.359 --> 01:40:23.199
to go down, that's fine. I'm not bothered at all.
2051
01:40:23.479 --> 01:40:26.279
You know, not everybody, Not everything is for everybody, and
2052
01:40:26.399 --> 01:40:30.439
that's okay, but I want to retain a certain amount
2053
01:40:30.479 --> 01:40:34.159
of artistic control right over my work and how it's
2054
01:40:34.239 --> 01:40:38.000
distributed and how it's received and how it's marketed and everything.
2055
01:40:38.039 --> 01:40:40.159
I mean, it's all grassroots. My soon to be husband
2056
01:40:40.279 --> 01:40:44.560
is doing the book cover. He's an amazing lots of things,
2057
01:40:44.640 --> 01:40:48.319
but he's an amazing digital artist as well an artists
2058
01:40:48.399 --> 01:40:51.600
and you know, and so I'm kind of we're now
2059
01:40:51.720 --> 01:40:55.119
doing this collab as the kids would say, we're you know,
2060
01:40:55.319 --> 01:40:57.760
husband and wife team doing this collaboration where we're working
2061
01:40:57.800 --> 01:40:59.560
on this together. So that means so much to me
2062
01:41:00.079 --> 01:41:02.520
that he's doing the artwork for it. And he's been
2063
01:41:02.600 --> 01:41:06.920
my biggest champion and supporter and cheerleader through the entire thing.
2064
01:41:07.640 --> 01:41:11.359
And he's always been so patient. He's just like, yeah,
2065
01:41:11.600 --> 01:41:14.079
I know, whenever you're ready, you know, and kind of
2066
01:41:14.239 --> 01:41:16.159
never put any pressure on me, and just like you'll
2067
01:41:16.199 --> 01:41:17.600
do it when you're ready, and you do it on
2068
01:41:17.640 --> 01:41:20.720
your own time the way you want. And then was like, yep,
2069
01:41:20.840 --> 01:41:24.520
it's time, you know, and just very steadfast and strong,
2070
01:41:24.640 --> 01:41:27.399
and it's great to have that kind of support. It's
2071
01:41:27.439 --> 01:41:29.720
great to have that kind of support, and I'm seeing
2072
01:41:29.720 --> 01:41:32.159
a lot of it from people, and it's meant a
2073
01:41:32.199 --> 01:41:35.760
lot to me. So I mean, I'm doing it not
2074
01:41:35.920 --> 01:41:39.199
the old fashioned way, you know, getting the book out,
2075
01:41:39.359 --> 01:41:41.800
but I think it's going to be good. And like,
2076
01:41:41.920 --> 01:41:42.720
you don't know unless you.
2077
01:41:42.720 --> 01:41:44.880
Try, exactly you are your harshest critic.
2078
01:41:45.079 --> 01:41:48.239
Oh, totally, totally, totally yeah, but you don't know if
2079
01:41:48.239 --> 01:41:48.720
you don't try.
2080
01:41:48.800 --> 01:41:50.760
So that's exact one hundred percent. And I think just
2081
01:41:50.880 --> 01:41:53.960
people listening who are writing their own books and everything
2082
01:41:54.960 --> 01:41:58.239
can definitely take that away with them as well. Like
2083
01:41:58.319 --> 01:42:00.720
even if it takes five years, but like, if you
2084
01:42:00.760 --> 01:42:03.880
don't try now than five years from now, you still
2085
01:42:03.920 --> 01:42:06.000
won't have a book, right.
2086
01:42:06.079 --> 01:42:08.000
The time is going to pass anyway. And if you
2087
01:42:08.279 --> 01:42:09.000
enjoy it, it is.
2088
01:42:09.159 --> 01:42:09.359
Yeah.
2089
01:42:09.399 --> 01:42:11.079
If you enjoy it makes you feel better, then go
2090
01:42:11.239 --> 01:42:12.800
for it and then get out of your own way
2091
01:42:12.880 --> 01:42:14.760
and just put it out into the world. And who
2092
01:42:14.840 --> 01:42:16.560
was it. I think it was Andy Warhol who said,
2093
01:42:16.640 --> 01:42:19.840
you know, make your art, put it out there, and
2094
01:42:20.119 --> 01:42:22.479
while people are busy deciding if it's good or not,
2095
01:42:22.720 --> 01:42:25.279
you make more art. I know, just just make just
2096
01:42:25.399 --> 01:42:26.239
do what makes you happy.
2097
01:42:28.560 --> 01:42:33.159
So, Elizabeth, where can people find you? And where can
2098
01:42:33.199 --> 01:42:35.680
they find your book? How can people stalk you?
2099
01:42:36.479 --> 01:42:40.560
People can stock me on? E Redmond author on Instagram. Also,
2100
01:42:40.680 --> 01:42:43.600
my comedy page is Elizabeth Redmond Comedy. There's also l
2101
01:42:43.680 --> 01:42:46.079
Passo Comedy. But if we're just talking about the book itself.
2102
01:42:46.319 --> 01:42:50.319
E Redmond Comedy or excuse me. E Redmond author on Instagram.
2103
01:42:51.279 --> 01:42:52.920
Haven't started a website.
2104
01:42:52.560 --> 01:42:52.960
For it yet.
2105
01:42:53.039 --> 01:42:55.640
I'm happy to use the free socials for now. Okay,
2106
01:42:55.880 --> 01:42:57.359
just see how we go, and if I get to
2107
01:42:57.399 --> 01:42:58.920
a point where I have to pivot, you know, I'll
2108
01:42:58.960 --> 01:43:00.680
let you know if change anything.
2109
01:43:00.840 --> 01:43:02.359
I'll put the links in the description.
2110
01:43:02.760 --> 01:43:06.640
Thank you, And it's going to be here very soon,
2111
01:43:07.720 --> 01:43:10.439
within in November. I don't have an actual date, but
2112
01:43:10.520 --> 01:43:12.479
it doesn't matter because this won't come out until January.
2113
01:43:12.560 --> 01:43:15.920
So I suppose, I yeah, I don't really have any
2114
01:43:16.119 --> 01:43:18.840
any further questions, I suppose on the stills, anything else
2115
01:43:18.880 --> 01:43:19.960
you want to talk about.
2116
01:43:20.399 --> 01:43:23.520
I don't. I don't know. I don't think so. I
2117
01:43:23.640 --> 01:43:26.840
think I'm trying to think here we covered it. Do
2118
01:43:26.920 --> 01:43:28.960
you have any questions about the Mexican culture or the
2119
01:43:29.000 --> 01:43:30.680
tie into the butterfly or did I did I do
2120
01:43:30.800 --> 01:43:34.159
that pretty Oh oh, just just real quick. The monarch
2121
01:43:34.199 --> 01:43:36.840
butterfly big symbol in Mexico. But reason that it ties
2122
01:43:36.880 --> 01:43:38.479
into the Day of the Dead and Halloween and all
2123
01:43:38.479 --> 01:43:44.479
these things is the Aztecs believed that hummingbirds and monarch
2124
01:43:44.520 --> 01:43:49.520
butterflies specifically those two species are our loved ones coming
2125
01:43:49.560 --> 01:43:53.039
back to visit us from beyond. And then you know,
2126
01:43:53.319 --> 01:43:55.680
we have Halloween and Latin American culture, but it's really
2127
01:43:55.760 --> 01:43:58.279
the November first and November two that is the Day
2128
01:43:58.319 --> 01:44:01.239
of the Dead when our answers when the you know,
2129
01:44:02.560 --> 01:44:04.760
i'd say those three days really, but the when, the when,
2130
01:44:04.840 --> 01:44:06.960
the what do they call it? The veil is lifted,
2131
01:44:07.079 --> 01:44:11.359
the world, the between worlds is more permeable, perhaps, and
2132
01:44:11.600 --> 01:44:15.600
people do like like a friend us, which are these
2133
01:44:15.680 --> 01:44:18.159
altars where they put pictures of their loved ones and
2134
01:44:18.279 --> 01:44:20.640
the things that they loved, the foods that they loved,
2135
01:44:20.680 --> 01:44:23.199
and make Now I've never actually done one, and I've
2136
01:44:23.239 --> 01:44:25.319
always kind of wanted to. My mother didn't do when
2137
01:44:25.520 --> 01:44:27.479
when I was growing up. It was interesting because my
2138
01:44:27.520 --> 01:44:30.560
mother was such an Americanized Mexican. There were things of
2139
01:44:30.720 --> 01:44:33.359
the Mexican culture that I never copped and never twigged
2140
01:44:33.399 --> 01:44:35.840
until later, and I'd go, hey, hey, why don't we
2141
01:44:35.920 --> 01:44:38.479
eat caxus, you know, stuff like that, and for what
2142
01:44:38.920 --> 01:44:43.960
we're so Anglo, you know, and she's like, because we don't,
2143
01:44:44.199 --> 01:44:46.479
you know, like I did. I didn't grow up eating
2144
01:44:46.479 --> 01:44:49.359
a lot of weird stuff, like you know, the Mexican food.
2145
01:44:49.439 --> 01:44:51.399
I grew up eating that was delicious, but it was
2146
01:44:51.479 --> 01:44:53.319
kind of kind of normal, you know. I didn't grow
2147
01:44:53.399 --> 01:44:56.439
up eating too much tripe or manudo or cow stumpy.
2148
01:44:56.520 --> 01:45:00.000
You know. I didn't have like a king san yete
2149
01:45:00.159 --> 01:45:02.039
and my mother didn't. And I asked her why. I
2150
01:45:02.119 --> 01:45:04.239
was like, that's like a Mexican sweet sixteen. Why didn't
2151
01:45:04.279 --> 01:45:06.680
we And she was like, no, no, no, no, that
2152
01:45:06.880 --> 01:45:09.239
wasn't done. And she said that it was something that
2153
01:45:09.399 --> 01:45:11.680
back in the day society women used to do, and
2154
01:45:11.760 --> 01:45:14.960
then their maids started copying them, so then the rich
2155
01:45:15.000 --> 01:45:19.079
women of Mexico discarded the tradition. Isn't that horrible? But
2156
01:45:19.319 --> 01:45:22.359
this is what I'm saying, that that's the world that
2157
01:45:22.479 --> 01:45:28.319
my mother came from, racist, classist. I'm not even saying, like,
2158
01:45:28.960 --> 01:45:30.520
you know, as a dig towards her. I'm saying that's
2159
01:45:30.560 --> 01:45:34.359
the world that she was raised in. Right, So there
2160
01:45:34.520 --> 01:45:37.199
was so much kind of going against her in a
2161
01:45:37.239 --> 01:45:41.000
way too, you know, when you don't have that opposite
2162
01:45:41.079 --> 01:45:45.600
viewpoint or that safe place, you know, whereas growing up
2163
01:45:45.640 --> 01:45:47.600
with my mother, as difficult as it was, I had
2164
01:45:47.720 --> 01:45:49.159
the safe place that was my father.
2165
01:45:49.640 --> 01:45:49.840
Yeah.
2166
01:45:50.159 --> 01:45:52.439
And there are so many people who get two shit parents,
2167
01:45:52.520 --> 01:45:54.960
you know, and they don't they don't stand a chance,
2168
01:45:55.640 --> 01:45:58.600
and they still turn out to be wonderful human beings.
2169
01:45:58.880 --> 01:46:01.680
So I do, well, there you go, there, Well, there
2170
01:46:01.720 --> 01:46:03.079
you go. God you got an extra one. Hey, you
2171
01:46:03.159 --> 01:46:05.920
had a spare, You had a spare. But that's my point,
2172
01:46:06.000 --> 01:46:07.680
and I think that's a big theme in the book
2173
01:46:07.800 --> 01:46:10.159
is that we all have choices. Yeah, and we have
2174
01:46:10.199 --> 01:46:11.439
to take accountability for them.
2175
01:46:12.760 --> 01:46:16.920
That's very true. I actually yeah, Like I guess before
2176
01:46:16.960 --> 01:46:20.520
we go, would would you? I? Should we talk about
2177
01:46:20.840 --> 01:46:23.920
more about like a we we did talk about Mexican,
2178
01:46:24.079 --> 01:46:24.920
Irish American?
2179
01:46:25.119 --> 01:46:26.680
Yeah, well, look, ask me anything and if you don't
2180
01:46:26.680 --> 01:46:27.840
want to use the lady you can cut it out,
2181
01:46:27.880 --> 01:46:30.119
ask me whatever you want. Wyami here like it's it's oh,
2182
01:46:30.119 --> 01:46:30.359
I guess.
2183
01:46:30.399 --> 01:46:33.079
Yeah. One more question I had was when you were
2184
01:46:33.199 --> 01:46:38.159
writing these characters, were there any characters in particular that
2185
01:46:38.560 --> 01:46:41.520
went a different direction as you were writing them, or
2186
01:46:41.600 --> 01:46:47.039
even some characters that like elicited a strong emotional response
2187
01:46:47.119 --> 01:46:49.159
in you as you were writing them, like maybe you're
2188
01:46:49.159 --> 01:46:50.920
writing this one character and like, yeah, I really fucking
2189
01:46:51.000 --> 01:46:53.880
hate this guy and I hate writing him, or something
2190
01:46:53.960 --> 01:46:54.119
like that.
2191
01:46:55.520 --> 01:47:00.800
Yeah, Edward was hard. It was difficult to approach writing
2192
01:47:00.960 --> 01:47:03.800
him and without writing him out, you know, with this
2193
01:47:04.199 --> 01:47:06.479
stereotypical he's a bastard kind of you know.
2194
01:47:07.159 --> 01:47:08.159
I tried the husband.
2195
01:47:08.640 --> 01:47:14.439
I tried to find scraps of his humanity. They're there.
2196
01:47:14.560 --> 01:47:16.920
They're very few and far between, but they're there because look,
2197
01:47:16.960 --> 01:47:19.399
I mean, the reality is you have to figure out,
2198
01:47:19.439 --> 01:47:21.079
like why did she end up with him? There had
2199
01:47:21.119 --> 01:47:23.600
to have been something there, you know. And again this
2200
01:47:23.720 --> 01:47:26.039
mirror is my relationship with my ex husband. You sit
2201
01:47:26.119 --> 01:47:28.000
there and you go, but how in the hell hindsight?
2202
01:47:28.159 --> 01:47:28.319
You know?
2203
01:47:28.840 --> 01:47:30.720
And I've asked myself for years, and I've been upset
2204
01:47:30.760 --> 01:47:32.319
for years and had to process and heal all this.
2205
01:47:32.399 --> 01:47:35.159
You're going out. They have two beautiful children, They're phenomenal.
2206
01:47:35.319 --> 01:47:36.880
I wouldn't have had them had I not met this
2207
01:47:37.000 --> 01:47:40.239
particular person. But you do ask yourself, how in the
2208
01:47:40.319 --> 01:47:41.840
name of God? When I was a young woman, and
2209
01:47:41.880 --> 01:47:43.039
I was very young when I met him. I was
2210
01:47:43.079 --> 01:47:46.359
only twenty again, mirrors the character in the book, very
2211
01:47:46.399 --> 01:47:50.319
young and innocent, naive, you kind of go but how
2212
01:47:50.760 --> 01:47:53.920
did you not see it? How did you stay for
2213
01:47:54.079 --> 01:47:57.239
so long? How did you put up with? And so
2214
01:47:57.359 --> 01:47:59.560
many women across time have done these same things. I'm
2215
01:47:59.600 --> 01:48:01.439
not the first, first, I won't be the last, sadly,
2216
01:48:03.239 --> 01:48:06.560
so writing Ed was really difficult for me because it
2217
01:48:06.640 --> 01:48:09.159
was grappling a lot of things with my own divorce
2218
01:48:09.359 --> 01:48:13.079
and my ex husband, and you feel that you wasted
2219
01:48:13.119 --> 01:48:15.359
a lot of your youth, and we have such limited
2220
01:48:15.399 --> 01:48:18.039
time on this planet. Anyway, it's it was, I suppose
2221
01:48:18.079 --> 01:48:19.600
Also I wrote it in a way to kind of
2222
01:48:19.640 --> 01:48:23.479
heal that a little bit, you know. So coming to
2223
01:48:23.640 --> 01:48:26.760
terms with writing Ed as a whole person who maybe
2224
01:48:26.920 --> 01:48:30.680
had some charm somewhere was quite a challenge. And I
2225
01:48:30.760 --> 01:48:33.000
did actually feel at times when I was writing him,
2226
01:48:33.039 --> 01:48:36.039
I was like, you know, growling that You're like, you're
2227
01:48:36.119 --> 01:48:38.159
too Why is my jaw hurt because I'm clenching my
2228
01:48:38.199 --> 01:48:40.680
teeth because I'm so mad. But as far as characters
2229
01:48:40.720 --> 01:48:44.600
who went a different way Orla, I didn't think when
2230
01:48:44.640 --> 01:48:46.760
I introduced her kind of early on in the book,
2231
01:48:46.880 --> 01:48:48.439
I didn't know she was going to show up again.
2232
01:48:49.239 --> 01:48:51.479
Can you describe Orla for the for the listening.
2233
01:48:52.079 --> 01:48:54.359
She makes a brief appearance in the beginning of the
2234
01:48:54.399 --> 01:48:58.199
book because she is just the Irish immigrant nanny to
2235
01:48:58.319 --> 01:49:01.039
Amanda and Ed and helped, you know in New York.
2236
01:49:01.199 --> 01:49:03.800
That's it. And I wrote her, and I did it
2237
01:49:03.920 --> 01:49:07.880
to specifically highlight and show something about both Ed and
2238
01:49:07.880 --> 01:49:11.159
an Amanda's characters and to bring in a different view
2239
01:49:11.640 --> 01:49:14.199
of a different description of what's going on by from
2240
01:49:14.279 --> 01:49:14.920
this outsider.
2241
01:49:15.319 --> 01:49:15.840
And then.
2242
01:49:17.239 --> 01:49:19.840
She shows up later and I'm not going to expound
2243
01:49:19.920 --> 01:49:21.319
on that because I don't want to give anything way,
2244
01:49:21.319 --> 01:49:23.760
but you do kind of go huh right, yeah, like
2245
01:49:23.920 --> 01:49:24.720
that's surprising.
2246
01:49:25.199 --> 01:49:25.640
Yeah it was.
2247
01:49:25.760 --> 01:49:27.920
Yeah, it took me and I even when I wrote it,
2248
01:49:27.960 --> 01:49:30.000
I went, how but how did this happen? And I
2249
01:49:30.159 --> 01:49:33.199
was so genuinely pleased and surprised. I was like, oh,
2250
01:49:33.279 --> 01:49:35.680
this makes perfect sense. Of course, Well I wouldn't you know.
2251
01:49:36.560 --> 01:49:41.239
And and missus Heatherington, I think turns out differently to
2252
01:49:41.399 --> 01:49:43.119
how everybody, and that is very.
2253
01:49:44.079 --> 01:49:46.359
She was kind of a neighbor in the beginning.
2254
01:49:46.359 --> 01:49:49.119
She's really like our comedy she's like our comic relief freely.
2255
01:49:48.960 --> 01:49:49.479
Yeah she is.
2256
01:49:49.520 --> 01:49:53.479
And then she has a more serious role and and touching.
2257
01:49:53.800 --> 01:49:56.079
Really you kind of oh, kind of that.
2258
01:49:56.359 --> 01:50:00.960
That moment in the book. Actually, Yeah, it struck a
2259
01:50:01.039 --> 01:50:02.960
chord of me because it kind of reminded me of
2260
01:50:03.079 --> 01:50:05.960
some other times in my life or maybe there was
2261
01:50:06.000 --> 01:50:12.039
someone in my life that I ended up misunderstanding or
2262
01:50:12.159 --> 01:50:14.960
not not what's the word I'm looking for.
2263
01:50:16.159 --> 01:50:19.960
Misjudging, perhaps a little bit judging, Yeah, maybe, and then
2264
01:50:20.720 --> 01:50:23.159
you later on very pleasantly surprised and then feeling kind
2265
01:50:23.159 --> 01:50:25.960
of bad like I should have I shouldn't have seen
2266
01:50:26.000 --> 01:50:26.840
that person the way I did.
2267
01:50:27.199 --> 01:50:27.399
Yeah.
2268
01:50:28.239 --> 01:50:31.520
Well, the three characters that really kind of and again
2269
01:50:31.640 --> 01:50:35.399
writing them was like a joy. I think they were
2270
01:50:35.479 --> 01:50:41.960
my favorites were on Paro, Marta and Guadalupe. And Marta
2271
01:50:42.039 --> 01:50:45.000
is a badass, you know, and Paro is a badass.
2272
01:50:45.600 --> 01:50:48.920
These are women who have been discounted.
2273
01:50:50.079 --> 01:50:51.359
They're like the bottom of society.
2274
01:50:51.399 --> 01:50:56.560
Yeah, because absolutely women. They're poor, they're indigenous or indigenous mixed,
2275
01:50:56.680 --> 01:50:59.279
they're from a certain you know, they're the the they're
2276
01:50:59.359 --> 01:51:05.000
the housemaid, the house the servants, you know. And I
2277
01:51:05.560 --> 01:51:08.960
loved I just loved I loved how their personalities grew
2278
01:51:09.199 --> 01:51:11.600
out of nothing. I'm like, I don't know how I
2279
01:51:11.680 --> 01:51:14.439
made these people. Now, I will say, having an acting background,
2280
01:51:14.760 --> 01:51:17.000
you have to take script, you have to read character
2281
01:51:17.119 --> 01:51:18.800
somebody else's words, and you have to come up with
2282
01:51:18.840 --> 01:51:21.000
their backstory. You have to come up with their imagery,
2283
01:51:21.399 --> 01:51:23.399
their life that they've been through to make them real.
2284
01:51:23.479 --> 01:51:26.079
Whether you're in a play or TV or whatever, you
2285
01:51:26.239 --> 01:51:30.079
have to make the character real. And so I suppose
2286
01:51:30.359 --> 01:51:35.640
maybe I have a lot of experience making real characters, right,
2287
01:51:36.159 --> 01:51:38.560
But the attachment that I have to some of them,
2288
01:51:39.520 --> 01:51:43.159
I'm actually dumbfounded by because I feel like they're real people.
2289
01:51:43.520 --> 01:51:46.800
Yeah, yeah, that's really fascinating how that happens.
2290
01:51:47.600 --> 01:51:50.880
Well, it's it's if anybody had told me about like
2291
01:51:51.159 --> 01:51:53.560
you do kind of hear about writers talking about how
2292
01:51:53.640 --> 01:51:57.520
they felt about their characters. But but I like, I
2293
01:51:57.640 --> 01:52:00.399
am such a huge fan of Marta. I you know,
2294
01:52:00.680 --> 01:52:04.880
like she got a different attitude to everybody in the book,
2295
01:52:05.119 --> 01:52:07.760
you know what I mean. She's really kind of ahead
2296
01:52:07.760 --> 01:52:09.920
of her time, a little bit more modern, a little
2297
01:52:09.960 --> 01:52:12.479
bit more feminist when that didn't even exist, and just
2298
01:52:12.640 --> 01:52:16.279
and she's quiet about it, but she's just got like
2299
01:52:16.399 --> 01:52:20.359
this little inner fire. Yeah, and she's kind of surly
2300
01:52:20.479 --> 01:52:22.319
and a little bit and I'm just like, I love
2301
01:52:22.399 --> 01:52:23.520
her so much.
2302
01:52:23.920 --> 01:52:25.640
I really do, I really do.
2303
01:52:26.119 --> 01:52:29.760
And then I'd already started, like the second book and hopefully,
2304
01:52:29.880 --> 01:52:33.000
you know, I'll finish that and you know it, Oh
2305
01:52:33.079 --> 01:52:36.439
my god. Well, i'll tell you when the podcast is over.
2306
01:52:36.479 --> 01:52:38.119
I'll tell you the title because I've had the title
2307
01:52:38.159 --> 01:52:41.479
for years. Okay, okay, okay. And it starts. It starts
2308
01:52:41.520 --> 01:52:45.279
with the three girls with it starts with Loupe and Paroto.
2309
01:52:45.439 --> 01:52:46.399
It's okay, it's about them.
2310
01:52:46.720 --> 01:52:49.279
Yeah, well, it starts with them, and it's a very
2311
01:52:49.399 --> 01:52:52.199
dramatic moment, so like it's kind of continuing on from
2312
01:52:52.239 --> 01:52:54.359
a very dramatic moment in the first book that we
2313
01:52:54.439 --> 01:52:57.399
don't see a resolution to or an outcome on their side, if.
2314
01:52:57.319 --> 01:52:57.640
You get me.
2315
01:52:58.279 --> 01:53:01.279
So yeah, like, look, you have to do things just
2316
01:53:01.399 --> 01:53:04.319
to do them, and then once you've done it, you go,
2317
01:53:04.520 --> 01:53:07.279
I did that, And if it's poorly received or warmly
2318
01:53:07.319 --> 01:53:09.199
received or whatever, but like it makes it that much
2319
01:53:09.239 --> 01:53:12.119
easier to then continue onto something else, and then to
2320
01:53:12.159 --> 01:53:15.239
write something else, and to write something else, and I still,
2321
01:53:15.359 --> 01:53:18.119
you know, I have plans for this whole kind of
2322
01:53:19.159 --> 01:53:22.920
genre of maternal trauma stuff. And then I have my
2323
01:53:23.239 --> 01:53:25.760
dad's story that I want to transcribe into a book.
2324
01:53:26.000 --> 01:53:28.960
I last year I wrote, I taught myself how to
2325
01:53:29.000 --> 01:53:33.479
write a TV pilot. I entered it into the BBC's
2326
01:53:34.279 --> 01:53:36.439
they have this thing they do every year called Writer's Room.
2327
01:53:36.840 --> 01:53:39.279
They look for They're really looking for writers more so
2328
01:53:39.399 --> 01:53:44.199
than scripts. And I had. I did a sixty page
2329
01:53:45.840 --> 01:53:49.279
TV pilot of my dad's story of an Irish immigrant
2330
01:53:49.319 --> 01:53:52.800
who left Ireland to go do Broadway, got drafted into
2331
01:53:52.800 --> 01:53:55.439
the United States Air Force, ended up staying in Texas,
2332
01:53:55.640 --> 01:53:58.239
getting a job with NASA. He worked with all the astronauts.
2333
01:53:58.279 --> 01:54:01.199
Like my dad's story is incredible. His is a lot
2334
01:54:01.319 --> 01:54:05.279
more heartwarming and uplifting than what I've started with. Yeah,
2335
01:54:05.399 --> 01:54:07.319
which I do kind of go why did you have
2336
01:54:07.520 --> 01:54:09.760
to go to the saddest place first?
2337
01:54:10.239 --> 01:54:10.600
Like why?
2338
01:54:10.720 --> 01:54:12.800
But you know what, I feel really good about it.
2339
01:54:12.920 --> 01:54:13.119
I do.
2340
01:54:13.800 --> 01:54:16.119
I do. I feel it was cathartic. It was actually
2341
01:54:16.199 --> 01:54:19.760
a lot of fun. Hopefully things will get easier as
2342
01:54:19.800 --> 01:54:21.840
I continue to write, like, hopefully it won't be as
2343
01:54:21.920 --> 01:54:25.359
much work. But I have a sneaking suspicion, but there's
2344
01:54:25.399 --> 01:54:28.319
no getting out of that part, you know, but putting
2345
01:54:28.399 --> 01:54:31.199
myself out there and being vulnerable and putting stuff on
2346
01:54:31.279 --> 01:54:33.680
social media and telling my friends and family and going
2347
01:54:33.720 --> 01:54:35.560
hay to the newspaper, Hay, I'm doing this, and I'm
2348
01:54:35.600 --> 01:54:38.800
self publishing, and hey, putting stuff out there. Once you do,
2349
01:54:38.920 --> 01:54:40.119
it becomes a lot easier.
2350
01:54:41.000 --> 01:54:45.439
I definitely, like, I think we've all seen last with comics.
2351
01:54:45.520 --> 01:54:48.000
I've seen this where there might be a new comic
2352
01:54:48.079 --> 01:54:50.920
on the scene, yeah, and who doesn't really have much
2353
01:54:50.960 --> 01:54:54.560
of a name, whose stuff is kind of, you know,
2354
01:54:54.880 --> 01:54:58.960
new and not very polished. Yeah, but they end up
2355
01:54:59.000 --> 01:55:02.159
being there our own number one fans. And I'll hear
2356
01:55:02.199 --> 01:55:04.199
other comics be like, oh, this person thinks that they're
2357
01:55:04.239 --> 01:55:05.119
so full of themselves.
2358
01:55:05.199 --> 01:55:05.399
Yeah.
2359
01:55:05.439 --> 01:55:09.239
Yeah, but then that fucking attitude and confidence gets them far,
2360
01:55:09.439 --> 01:55:11.560
and then they end up you know, I'm not gonna
2361
01:55:11.560 --> 01:55:13.880
say names, but I know there's like a handful that
2362
01:55:13.960 --> 01:55:16.479
I'm thinking of of. Yes, and I'm not one of
2363
01:55:16.560 --> 01:55:17.199
the homes no.
2364
01:55:17.279 --> 01:55:20.479
No, Look, and it's in every comedy scene. Yes, it's Yeah.
2365
01:55:20.760 --> 01:55:22.600
I saw it for Houston and I saw it. I've
2366
01:55:22.640 --> 01:55:25.000
seen it here in Dublin two. You go, wow, look,
2367
01:55:25.119 --> 01:55:27.279
a lot of a lot of times. Confidence in bravado,
2368
01:55:27.439 --> 01:55:30.000
even if there's not much substance, it like, it can
2369
01:55:30.079 --> 01:55:30.800
get you in the door.
2370
01:55:31.159 --> 01:55:32.960
I mean because someone and again I say names some
2371
01:55:33.039 --> 01:55:37.000
of these comics, I'm like, they actually were as talented
2372
01:55:37.039 --> 01:55:39.239
as they claim to be. Some of them were not.
2373
01:55:39.560 --> 01:55:43.439
Yeah, but they ended up still on the same like
2374
01:55:43.800 --> 01:55:46.119
level or yeah, like that's.
2375
01:55:46.119 --> 01:55:48.600
Outstanding levels because they believed in themselves.
2376
01:55:49.199 --> 01:55:51.640
There's I gotta tell you, there's a lot to it. Yeah,
2377
01:55:51.760 --> 01:55:55.239
and I wish more of us believed in ourselves. Yeah,
2378
01:55:55.479 --> 01:55:59.920
especially women, especially especially women especially, but also if you've
2379
01:56:00.279 --> 01:56:03.640
dealt with childhood trauma, if you have CPTSD, if you
2380
01:56:03.680 --> 01:56:06.479
have PTSD, if you have mental health issues, you have whatever,
2381
01:56:06.560 --> 01:56:07.439
imposter syndrome.
2382
01:56:08.079 --> 01:56:08.279
Yeah.
2383
01:56:08.359 --> 01:56:09.920
You know what, at the end of the day, some
2384
01:56:10.000 --> 01:56:13.000
people aren't gonna like your stuff. Yeah, no matter what
2385
01:56:13.119 --> 01:56:14.479
it is, don't do it for them.
2386
01:56:16.479 --> 01:56:21.680
That's it, absolutely Well, Elizabeth, is there anything.
2387
01:56:22.239 --> 01:56:24.439
You just look if you want to give me a
2388
01:56:24.479 --> 01:56:27.720
follow on Instagram on E. Redmond author, if you know
2389
01:56:27.880 --> 01:56:30.479
all the updates and information about the book, the books
2390
01:56:30.520 --> 01:56:34.279
release and little blurbs and little little blurbs that I've
2391
01:56:34.399 --> 01:56:37.039
created on like Canva and stuff about the book, and
2392
01:56:37.640 --> 01:56:40.079
you know, and because people tell me it's quite quotable,
2393
01:56:40.159 --> 01:56:43.039
and there's things passages that they love and very much
2394
01:56:43.199 --> 01:56:46.159
everybody has the people the few people that have reat
2395
01:56:46.199 --> 01:56:48.760
it have been like specifically this and that, and I'm going, okay,
2396
01:56:48.880 --> 01:56:50.920
So if you're looking for information, if you're interested in
2397
01:56:51.039 --> 01:56:54.000
reading it, I would love it. Follow me on E
2398
01:56:54.159 --> 01:56:59.279
Redmond Author the link to the Amazon you know, it'll
2399
01:56:59.319 --> 01:57:02.359
be available in the Kindle store. It's an ebook right now.
2400
01:57:02.760 --> 01:57:05.600
In the description, I will be in the new year
2401
01:57:06.560 --> 01:57:12.039
audio recording the entire book. Well, there's no point I mean,
2402
01:57:12.079 --> 01:57:14.159
if I'm an actor and a voiceover actor and I've
2403
01:57:14.199 --> 01:57:16.159
done podcasts and stuff in public speed, there's no point
2404
01:57:16.279 --> 01:57:20.319
hiring someone to do it, you know, thank you very much.
2405
01:57:20.479 --> 01:57:23.199
And well also I need it is a weird it
2406
01:57:23.359 --> 01:57:25.600
is a weird ass accent, to be fair, but people
2407
01:57:25.840 --> 01:57:29.239
seem to like my speaking voice. And I'm cheap. I
2408
01:57:29.279 --> 01:57:31.039
don't want to I don't want to pay anybody to
2409
01:57:31.119 --> 01:57:33.880
do it, and I think it's again it'll be cathartic
2410
01:57:33.960 --> 01:57:35.800
and emotional and lovely for me to do it. And
2411
01:57:35.880 --> 01:57:37.520
also I have to make sure that they you know,
2412
01:57:37.600 --> 01:57:39.800
I have to pronounce the Spanish correctly, I'm not hiring
2413
01:57:39.880 --> 01:57:42.159
it out, and you know there are That's part of
2414
01:57:42.199 --> 01:57:44.239
the trick as well, is that it's got the the
2415
01:57:44.359 --> 01:57:47.039
a little bit of the bilingual aspect in it. Whoops,
2416
01:57:48.399 --> 01:57:50.840
a little bit of the bilingual aspect in it as well.
2417
01:57:51.439 --> 01:57:54.720
So yeah, sometimes, you know, if you want something done,
2418
01:57:54.760 --> 01:57:57.119
you have to do it yourself. So that's what I'm
2419
01:57:57.159 --> 01:57:58.960
going to be doing. So thank you so much for
2420
01:57:59.079 --> 01:58:00.399
having me. I really appreciate it.
2421
01:58:00.800 --> 01:58:02.680
Thank you for coming on, thank you for being a guest,
2422
01:58:02.760 --> 01:58:05.159
thank you for letting me read your book. And uh
2423
01:58:05.239 --> 01:58:08.479
yeah everyone, that is a final resting place of a
2424
01:58:08.560 --> 01:58:12.840
Butterfly by Elizabeth Redmond. And this has been bad book bash.
2425
01:58:13.359 --> 01:58:16.000
Oh and also shout out to my Patreon subscribers and
2426
01:58:16.079 --> 01:58:21.520
and emer love you guys. You're my you're my butterflies. Okay,
2427
01:58:21.720 --> 01:58:25.319
got it, he just had he had just left that
2428
01:58:25.399 --> 01:58:27.079
in there, all right, Thanks everyone,