WEBVTT
00:00:00.050 --> 00:00:05.700
He said,"Oh my gosh, Amy, that's the thing that got us over the, the$250 million mark.
00:00:05.700 --> 00:00:13.919
What I didn't tell you when I had you join our company is we'd been stuck." and you came in, and between you and Traction," as he called it"it was, it was awesome.
00:00:13.919 --> 00:00:15.269
That's exactly what we needed,
00:00:15.269 --> 00:00:21.300
Welcome to The Scalability Code, the podcast that helps you get out of the sh*t show and start growing your business.
00:00:21.480 --> 00:00:24.089
And now for your host, Matt Haney.
00:00:24.332 --> 00:00:27.172
Here we are today, another episode of The Scalability Code.
00:00:27.192 --> 00:00:32.042
Today I'm joined by Amy Corder from the great state of Michigan up in Kalamazoo.
00:00:32.051 --> 00:00:35.091
Amy, thank you so much for joining us today on The Scalability Code.
00:00:35.890 --> 00:00:36.479
Thank you, Matt.
00:00:36.479 --> 00:00:37.259
I'm glad to be here
00:00:38.031 --> 00:00:40.112
We start by giving a little bit of background of yourself.
00:00:40.131 --> 00:00:49.481
I always say, like, when we're forced to have these introductions or when we walk into a room, it's almost like,"How quickly can we tell what we need to get and get a little look?" That's not the goal for the next few minutes.
00:00:49.481 --> 00:00:56.551
What I want to do is hear a little bit about your background and if you can keep it to some segments that gives the listeners a background of how you got to where you are.
00:00:56.902 --> 00:01:08.212
And then two, I want to know about how, you got started with entrepreneurship and more importantly, if there was anybody in your world or your life that impressioned you that said...
00:01:08.412 --> 00:01:10.682
that got you to say,"Shit, this is entrepreneurship.
00:01:10.781 --> 00:01:15.802
I'm kind of interested in that." So take those two topics, give us a little background, and then, we'll keep going
00:01:16.992 --> 00:01:18.141
So, a bit about me.
00:01:18.141 --> 00:01:30.361
When I'm asked, I often just start with I had a career scavenger hunt so far, not a career path, that I absolutely, have enjoyed learning, doing different work, different sized organizations, et cetera.
00:01:30.361 --> 00:01:35.581
So, I started out, my dad was an entrepreneur, so I got help with that right off the bat.
00:01:35.581 --> 00:01:37.072
My dad had his businesses.
00:01:37.072 --> 00:01:38.262
I loved his passion.
00:01:38.262 --> 00:01:56.956
he would stop, the vehicle on the way to church on Sunday and, hop out with his camera and take a picture at something, and my sister and I would be sitting in the car saying,"I don't know, Dad must have worked on that building or that, or that house or whatever." I also realized, though, that, being the fourth of five kids, that if I wasn't up at six in the morning and/or at midnight, I didn't get to see him.
00:01:56.965 --> 00:01:58.575
He was such a hard worker.
00:01:58.956 --> 00:02:07.135
And I always thought,"Oh my gosh, there's gotta be a, a better way to do that." And of course, now, fast-forward, I know that it's EOS really helps make a difference in that.
00:02:07.406 --> 00:02:10.045
I wish I'd found that in time while my dad was still around.
00:02:10.045 --> 00:02:14.036
So he ran his business through being eighty-five years old and kept on going.
00:02:14.036 --> 00:02:18.216
But, probably did a lot of it the hard way, and so it was inspirational.
00:02:18.225 --> 00:02:27.616
On the other hand, I looked at it and said,"Well, what else should I or could I know or experience, in my career?" And so, um, I'm a first generation at college, Pell eligible.
00:02:27.616 --> 00:02:32.475
We didn't have a lot of money, figured it out, and, went to a great institution, Kalamazoo College.
00:02:32.556 --> 00:02:34.915
Their colors are orange too, so, I never left it.
00:02:35.045 --> 00:02:37.586
I was just on a trip to France with them, last month actually.
00:02:37.586 --> 00:02:44.466
But, um, it had-- it really opened my eyes to the world and as well as just different ways of thinking, working, and doing.
00:02:44.466 --> 00:02:52.385
And so that, had me leap, to, well, I've seen my dad's, smaller businesses, but I grew up in Flint, Michigan, where GM is huge.
00:02:52.385 --> 00:03:03.105
And I said,"You know, maybe I wanna look at large organizations." So I started out in an organization that had over a hundred and twenty thousand people and, quickly found that, you get a little lost in there.
00:03:03.116 --> 00:03:05.036
It's hard to steer those ships.
00:03:05.036 --> 00:03:06.656
It's hard to move it, quickly.
00:03:06.656 --> 00:03:08.145
So wasn't as agile.
00:03:08.145 --> 00:03:09.195
I like things to move.
00:03:09.195 --> 00:03:14.256
I did have a great manager who gave me a lot of, assignments and opportunities.
00:03:14.306 --> 00:03:18.216
So one of those opportunities was with an entrepreneurial business.
00:03:18.506 --> 00:03:24.013
And at the time, I think maybe they'd grown to about a hundred, employees, just at that point, two locations.
00:03:24.233 --> 00:03:29.812
And I was sent there as a consultant, to help them in a couple of ways, and it just kept growing.
00:03:29.823 --> 00:03:37.447
And so after I was there, instead of, three weeks, I think it was, you know, thirteen months later, I'm still going back for, uh, you know, half a day a week or so.
00:03:37.893 --> 00:03:46.902
CEO and COO sat me down, very entrepreneurial, especially the COO, very much an entrepreneur, so kind of the second one in my life that, that really had a very different impact.
00:03:47.193 --> 00:03:52.342
And I realized that his focus was very much about how do we grow?
00:03:52.342 --> 00:03:59.591
How do we make, great lives for the people- in our organization while, oh, by the way, we're doing really great stuff for our clients.
00:03:59.820 --> 00:04:03.781
And so, what I loved about it was that he balanced that really well.
00:04:03.781 --> 00:04:09.631
My dad would do great things, but kind of, you know, on his own back and, and, in this organization it was different.
00:04:09.691 --> 00:04:12.050
I love that their core values were right on the wall.
00:04:12.050 --> 00:04:15.441
So for 13 months I'd walk by or been in the elevator where they were.
00:04:15.591 --> 00:04:19.110
I actually had memorized them, which probably scared them when they sat down.
00:04:19.110 --> 00:04:30.870
But you've gotta know, two former football players from the University of Michigan came into my cubicle after hours,'cause I worked in technology, so I was, there after hours to reboot computers and help with things like that.
00:04:30.901 --> 00:04:33.711
And, I had all the codes to the building and the computers.
00:04:33.711 --> 00:04:36.471
They trusted me implicitly as an outsider even.
00:04:36.721 --> 00:04:42.850
And they, came in my cube and brought me dinner and sat down and we were all eating while they were saying,"You know, you need to join our company.
00:04:42.850 --> 00:04:44.240
We've asked you four times, Amy.
00:04:44.511 --> 00:04:45.380
You know, what do you need?
00:04:45.380 --> 00:04:46.170
What do you need to know?
00:04:46.180 --> 00:04:46.810
We're growing.
00:04:46.810 --> 00:04:47.800
We're doing great things.
00:04:47.800 --> 00:04:55.165
Here's our vision." Like They shared the vision with me and I saw it and I was seeing it in action and I thought,"How can I say no?" Plus, they were football players.
00:04:55.175 --> 00:04:56.005
okay, I'll say no.
00:04:56.266 --> 00:04:56.985
no, I don't think so.
00:04:57.086 --> 00:05:04.471
So I, uh, I, so I said yes, joined that organization and, fast-forward while I led technology, we were in marketing services.
00:05:04.471 --> 00:05:10.711
I ended up being an intrapreneur, so inside of an organization, created in my service line-
00:05:10.757 --> 00:05:11.846
unit or yeah
00:05:11.963 --> 00:05:17.574
cr- yeah, I created a-- we helped secure, I should say it that way, the largest customer that that company had.
00:05:17.884 --> 00:05:18.785
It was crazy.
00:05:19.035 --> 00:05:20.535
so, epic fail on my part.
00:05:20.535 --> 00:05:22.475
I didn't ask for a commission, so silly me.
00:05:22.675 --> 00:05:26.545
But my team and I created this technology that really made a difference.
00:05:26.555 --> 00:05:29.564
So I really got to explore a lot of things in that organization.
00:05:29.564 --> 00:05:35.504
Wrote every job description I had and started out leading in my early 20s with everybody being older than I.
00:05:35.514 --> 00:05:52.375
So really learned leadership and management, which at the college level I had learned a lot also through NCAA sports So I think I've always had a lot of opportunity to kinda learn, grow, and, always been really observant and really tried to follow those great leaders, they were on a field or a court or sitting in an office.
00:05:52.574 --> 00:06:04.952
from there, I'll blend a little bit into my avocation as well because while it was, something that I had volunteered in since I was a teenager, I ended up taking one of top role, and this is the Civil Air Patrol.
00:06:04.973 --> 00:06:14.755
It's the official Air Force auxiliary, actually chartered by Congress to do three, main missions, emergency services, which includes disaster relief and homeland security's in there as well.
00:06:15.016 --> 00:06:16.045
that's one mission.
00:06:16.096 --> 00:06:17.485
Another, cadet programs.
00:06:17.485 --> 00:06:19.185
Another, aerospace education.
00:06:19.185 --> 00:06:28.105
So exactly the kind of thing that we would look at and say,"Are you, are you really focusing on three things at once?" But I'll tell you, I, I can speak to it.
00:06:28.146 --> 00:06:36.065
I, I, I actually had them create a pin that I wore on my, when I wore a civilian alternate uniform,'cause we don't change the Air Force uni-style uniform,
00:06:36.166 --> 00:06:37.697
No, you don't get to make edits there
00:06:37.829 --> 00:06:44.889
Yeah, that had a three bra- bladed propeller, and people would look at it and say,"What's that for?" And I said,"We have three missions, and we gotta keep'em balanced.
00:06:44.889 --> 00:07:00.713
The prop's not gonna fly well and pull us through the air." And so I really got people to recognize, they may have come in to help with one thing, like,"I wanna fly a plane." I had 552 aircraft in my command, which is the largest fleet of single eng- engine aircraft in the world, my senior Air Force advisor told me.
00:07:01.014 --> 00:07:05.543
I also had 61,000 people, and while I didn't meet'em all, I think they all emailed me.
00:07:05.673 --> 00:07:10.343
but that recognition and ability to take what I had done in different levels and just expand it.
00:07:10.343 --> 00:07:11.963
So talk about scale, right?
00:07:12.283 --> 00:07:19.303
that's what I love about, this is pre-EOS being around, but I've always led and managed, and it's really why I got to EOS.
00:07:19.624 --> 00:07:26.884
So as I was a national commander and two-star general, a major general, was in my command from 2007 to 2011.
00:07:27.264 --> 00:07:40.403
As I finished that, an entrepreneur that I had served on a board with in Detroit, a community board, had started, recognizing like,"Hey, she's doing some, you know, amazing stuff." They were just credited with saving, you know, 400 lives during her tenure.
00:07:40.454 --> 00:07:45.314
And, increasing the safety, and all these good things are happening, and he, reached out and said, I need to talk to you.
00:07:45.314 --> 00:07:46.603
You need to be on my team.
00:07:46.603 --> 00:08:06.244
I don't care what you do.""We need to figure this out." And he said,"Well, you could be the CIO, but this is like a tenth of what you've ever done in that." And so I started out just going in and helping him and, being on his leadership team, and then over time became his CFO, chief financial officer, and helped with that because I was recognizing the mid-level leaders needing, you know,
00:08:06.769 --> 00:08:07.959
and direction and accountability.
00:08:08.334 --> 00:08:09.134
and budgets.
00:08:09.134 --> 00:08:11.944
And just, you know, again, things that I ask questions about of my team.
00:08:12.093 --> 00:08:14.584
all of that said, I then moved to, the recognition.
00:08:14.584 --> 00:08:15.973
I was reading the book Traction.
00:08:15.983 --> 00:08:16.963
It just came out then.
00:08:17.163 --> 00:08:23.434
oddly, I'll tell you way back when, I was literally a mile away from Gino Wickman's office when Gino was there.
00:08:23.742 --> 00:08:28.163
I was on the Fortune stages talking about being a CIO and, he's where I wanted to be.
00:08:28.163 --> 00:08:29.463
You know, I wish I'd met him then.
00:08:29.702 --> 00:08:31.632
but, you know, not too late, not too late.
00:08:31.858 --> 00:08:38.418
so yeah, in 2011, as I was CIO, CFO, EI, EIO, I joked, I had the Traction book.
00:08:38.639 --> 00:08:47.433
My, uh, the owner, CEO, came in and said,"Amy, we need strategy." Like we just need a strategy and You know, I've, I read things.
00:08:47.433 --> 00:08:48.083
I was a reader.
00:08:48.114 --> 00:08:50.734
I'd read everything in the very cool office that I was in.
00:08:50.943 --> 00:08:53.053
and I said,"You know, David, we've got a strategy.
00:08:53.094 --> 00:08:55.183
You know, I, it's might be 48 pages long.
00:08:55.203 --> 00:08:58.384
I might be the only person who's read it, but We don't need more vision.
00:08:58.384 --> 00:08:59.423
We can get that out of you.
00:08:59.604 --> 00:09:05.644
What we need is, traction." And the book is out, I literally pushed the book across the table.
00:09:05.644 --> 00:09:08.203
That's what I was reading that day at lunch, just finishing.
00:09:08.214 --> 00:09:08.933
It was, timely.
00:09:09.293 --> 00:09:14.193
And so, he called me at midnight, not a good plan, but he called me at midnight and said,"I haven't put the book down.
00:09:14.193 --> 00:09:18.995
My family hates you." And, uh, and he said,"I, gotta tell you, you're right.
00:09:19.044 --> 00:09:26.149
We need to do this, so you do it." I was like,"Well, okay, so CFO..." Yeah, so now I am E, you know, E-I, E-I-O.
00:09:26.458 --> 00:09:28.408
And, so we self-implemented.
00:09:28.448 --> 00:09:30.428
I did look for some folks at the time.
00:09:30.619 --> 00:09:31.938
the owner was like,"I trust you.
00:09:31.938 --> 00:09:36.778
I want you to really jump in, you know, let's see where we go." So, 3,300 people.
00:09:36.778 --> 00:09:38.938
We were in both the United States and Mexico.
00:09:39.178 --> 00:09:40.028
I speak French.
00:09:40.028 --> 00:09:43.239
I went to France during college and in a university there, in fact.
00:09:43.239 --> 00:09:44.609
But, I needed a translator.
00:09:44.609 --> 00:09:51.708
But we did what we do best in EOS, which is, follow the process, trust the process, and I worked through the organization.
00:09:52.058 --> 00:09:53.538
I'll just say this, it, went well.
00:09:53.589 --> 00:10:00.698
I didn't know this until, I went to become an EOS implementer and I first called David.
00:10:00.698 --> 00:10:03.499
I hadn't talked to him for, eight years.
00:10:03.788 --> 00:10:10.839
we had exchanged some emails maybe, but I called him up and he answered the phone and stepped out of a meeting to answer the phone and he said,"What can I do for you?
00:10:10.839 --> 00:10:26.948
it's so good to hear from you." And I said,"Actually, I just wanted to see, would you support, you know, the work that I did?" We called it Traction, and then I did it in three other organizations since then, David, but you're the one that was the most complex, the, you know, really the, the largest at 3,300 people, right?
00:10:27.259 --> 00:10:28.288
And, I said,"What...
00:10:28.458 --> 00:10:31.499
You know, if I were gonna do this..." And he didn't let me finish the question.
00:10:31.759 --> 00:10:37.408
He said,"Oh my gosh, Amy, that's the thing that got us over the, the$250 million mark.
00:10:37.408 --> 00:10:42.528
What I didn't tell you when I had you join our company is we'd been stuck." And they're private, so I wasn't seeing it.
00:10:42.769 --> 00:10:49.068
He said,"We had been stuck, and you came in, and between you and Traction," as he called it"it was, it was awesome.
00:10:49.068 --> 00:10:58.808
That's exactly what we needed, and then we scaled from there." He went on to, go from Detroit to Chicago to Miami, and is now in Los Angeles doing, entrepreneurial, work.
00:10:59.099 --> 00:11:02.599
And he said,"I will talk to anybody who wants to talk to me about it.
00:11:02.649 --> 00:11:12.403
I can sing yours and the EOS' praises all day long." So, nobody's asked me to do that, by the way but that, um, that was a great way for me to look at it.
00:11:12.443 --> 00:11:27.371
I'm not as smart as I'd like you to believe, yeah, because what happened was three more times I was in my entrepreneurial, scavenger hunt, and so I wanted to have, different experiences and different seats around the leadership table And also in different industries.
00:11:27.371 --> 00:11:33.522
I've been, a CEO, CFO, COO, CIO, led sales and marketing, wasn't smart enough to get a C title.
00:11:33.701 --> 00:11:37.851
and then I always joked I wanted to be an EI, EIO, so I think EOSI is it.
00:11:37.861 --> 00:11:46.201
But, all that said, in the other organizations, there were three more after that that were all of size from, you know, 15 million to, 250.
00:11:46.522 --> 00:11:51.211
And in each of those, I would go in, work, and figure out whatever we need to do.
00:11:51.221 --> 00:11:54.221
Increase sales, got it done 37% in 10 months.
00:11:54.511 --> 00:11:55.392
How did I do that?
00:11:55.402 --> 00:11:56.422
It was the same people.
00:11:56.442 --> 00:11:59.471
It was using the concepts of getting right people, right seats.
00:11:59.471 --> 00:12:03.251
So all of that enabled me really to get to a point where I said...
00:12:03.292 --> 00:12:06.572
Actually, one of my friends said,"Amy, just go be an EOS implementer.
00:12:06.581 --> 00:12:07.272
You can help more
00:12:07.533 --> 00:12:09.433
how long-- when did you join EOS?
00:12:09.494 --> 00:12:10.413
How many sessions?
00:12:10.443 --> 00:12:12.474
Give us a little backstory of your journey
00:12:12.639 --> 00:12:15.899
five years ago roughly, during COVID, uh, not great timing.
00:12:16.168 --> 00:12:19.347
I've got, over 300 and I think 40 sessions in.
00:12:19.628 --> 00:12:23.048
I do, quite a few a year all across different industries and all.
00:12:23.138 --> 00:12:25.258
and yeah, just, love, love, love what I do.
00:12:25.268 --> 00:12:26.927
I know you can't tell, but I love
00:12:26.971 --> 00:12:32.682
no, I don't, I don't, get any passion or any, any body language or excitement from you at all.
00:12:32.692 --> 00:12:34.322
Well, hey, let's jump into some questions.
00:12:34.611 --> 00:12:36.511
I am the integrator, you are the visionary.
00:12:36.562 --> 00:12:38.871
It is my job to keep us moving forward.
00:12:39.231 --> 00:12:43.091
So I'm gonna ask you some questions because I think this is fun to get everyone's perspective about it.
00:12:43.091 --> 00:12:50.392
And then we'll talk, about your experience in managing people in your career and sort of how that translates over into the US practice you have today.
00:12:50.392 --> 00:12:57.221
So, big loaded question, but I don't know if you know this, as the integrator, me, in companies, I get to manage people for a living.
00:12:57.471 --> 00:13:01.652
I've been fortunate to do it for the last nine years across 15 or more engagements.
00:13:01.951 --> 00:13:03.851
Managing people is what I love doing.
00:13:04.111 --> 00:13:09.912
But, uh, you also are an incredible manager and have been managed thousands and thousands and thousands and tens of thousands of people.
00:13:10.371 --> 00:13:19.381
If you could give me the top three challenges you feel, when it comes to managing people, like where do you think the big gaping challenges come from?
00:13:20.220 --> 00:13:23.580
Yeah, I would first say a lot of them come from a place between our ears.
00:13:24.279 --> 00:13:30.870
You know, our challenge is often that we impose our thoughts and our experiences on people that we're working with.
00:13:30.870 --> 00:13:37.850
And so we, if we understand the vision and where we're going and it just all makes sense, we tend to think everybody else should, and that's just not the case,
00:13:38.056 --> 00:13:39.706
Because I get it, you should, Amy.
00:13:39.816 --> 00:13:41.755
If I understand it, why is it not clear?
00:13:42.440 --> 00:13:49.830
so that's really when, when I think about it, a lot of times people tend to be a leader or a manager, and for my whole career, I've been both.
00:13:50.049 --> 00:13:51.409
and so I'll share this with you.
00:13:51.659 --> 00:13:57.870
you know, y- I love it as you say,"You're the visionary, I'm the integrator." I, on the, rocket fuel assessment, I'm actually both.
00:13:57.889 --> 00:14:00.500
I'm both a visionary and an integrator, have done that.
00:14:00.820 --> 00:14:03.769
I love, love, love being in the visionary seat though, so Matt, you're awesome.
00:14:03.970 --> 00:14:13.419
And, uh, and the ability though to be able to lead, so have that vision, but really be, communicating it and sharing it, and, I always say at first it's shared on all.
00:14:13.710 --> 00:14:16.179
We need it to be shared by all, and that
00:14:16.224 --> 00:14:16.854
well said.
00:14:16.913 --> 00:14:21.264
I literally FBA followed by O is one of my favorite acronyms, but shared...
00:14:21.264 --> 00:14:22.024
Say that again
00:14:22.248 --> 00:14:36.028
we talk about having the vision shared by all, and what I'd say to teams that I work with, I say,"Remember, it's shared on all at first." We're telling them, but until they're experiencing it and they're seeing where it goes, and we help them.
00:14:36.028 --> 00:14:39.927
So we share the vision with them from a leadership perspective.
00:14:40.087 --> 00:14:44.798
We manage them to see what it really means week by week from a management perspective.
00:14:45.238 --> 00:14:53.950
So if you think about s- vision and, and the key component of vision for EOS, it's then looking at the scorecard, looking at the traction in terms of cadence.
00:14:53.960 --> 00:14:55.909
So that's how those all fit together.
00:14:55.909 --> 00:15:04.690
I think, you know, Gino just did a, a, an amazing genius job of putting the pieces together in a way that it's leading and managing, and from that, people want to get there.
00:15:04.919 --> 00:15:06.340
I led, volunteers.
00:15:06.340 --> 00:15:15.029
When you're leading volunteers at a point in my career, right, that you don't, ever get to meet, and you're certainly not giving them a paycheck, you have to though still have accountability.
00:15:15.370 --> 00:15:21.120
and it's things that I've absolutely watched how I've been able to do that by having a good team around me.
00:15:21.360 --> 00:15:24.559
We're sharing the vision, and then of course, you know, it's a team sport.
00:15:24.779 --> 00:15:31.289
I would say the lucky part of anything when I'm teaching clients, they're like,"Is there a quiz on this?" And somebody will go,"No, there's not a quiz,"'cause they...
00:15:31.529 --> 00:15:33.379
And I'll say,"Oh, well, actually there is.
00:15:33.389 --> 00:15:35.539
You know, the quiz, though, is real life.
00:15:35.639 --> 00:15:39.049
Thank goodness it's open book and it's a team sport." So
00:15:39.070 --> 00:15:39.700
What a win.
00:15:39.940 --> 00:15:41.072
We can all use it together
00:15:41.192 --> 00:15:43.523
yeah, get back to your leadership team manual and use it.
00:15:43.763 --> 00:15:46.373
So the one is really getting that vision shared.
00:15:46.582 --> 00:15:49.163
and another is, that open, honest communication, right?
00:15:49.283 --> 00:15:55.432
Making sure that, we're not, again, placing our thoughts of what they're thinking or should be thinking, that we're asking.
00:15:55.432 --> 00:15:58.842
We're really communicating, listening as well as speaking.
00:15:59.202 --> 00:16:02.633
and I would say that, a big part is getting, that team health.
00:16:02.633 --> 00:16:11.706
And obviously, if we share a vision and people are aligned to it, if we are communicating and managing well, and, and all of that, then what happens is team health.
00:16:11.706 --> 00:16:14.147
And as team health increases, so do the other two.
00:16:14.147 --> 00:16:16.157
So it's really moving everything up
00:16:16.178 --> 00:16:18.989
how that metric follows so many other ones, right?
00:16:19.013 --> 00:16:19.432
does.
00:16:19.482 --> 00:16:20.192
It sure does
00:16:20.308 --> 00:16:20.828
That's awesome.
00:16:21.219 --> 00:16:36.788
well, you talked about this, your scavenger hunt, and I love it because I've never heard, that term, and it's definitely gonna be the title of the episode, which is Career Scavenger Hunt, because I feel like that's such a telling term that is, you know, scavenger hunts end in good things, right?
00:16:36.818 --> 00:16:42.989
you don't always get there the right way, but the end goal is to get the end goal, and sometimes you go different ways to get there, and everyone has a journey.
00:16:43.528 --> 00:16:46.308
But, I'd love to talk about your experience with some of your clients.
00:16:46.308 --> 00:16:52.058
You know, you've said you've had, you know, north of 300, sessions and, you know, you're dealing with a lot of different clients.
00:16:52.369 --> 00:16:59.708
do you see any overlap in industries for yourself based from your geography, based on your interest, based off your experience?
00:16:59.739 --> 00:17:04.068
Do you find yourself overlapping with folks or industry types?
00:17:04.209 --> 00:17:05.459
If yes, tell us more.
00:17:05.679 --> 00:17:06.828
If no, tell me why.
00:17:07.557 --> 00:17:12.267
So, well, I would say for me it's a no, and it's mostly because I'm a scavenger, right?
00:17:12.267 --> 00:17:15.196
So, scavenger also means I'm intentional, right?
00:17:15.196 --> 00:17:17.156
There's intentionality of getting to the end goal.
00:17:17.156 --> 00:17:25.817
And so for me, I, love the fact that I love to put myself in places that are different from either even the multiple many industries I've worked in.
00:17:26.136 --> 00:17:33.176
And so, what I've recognized and while certainly EOS works, for, businesses, it also works for nonprofits.
00:17:33.186 --> 00:17:43.237
So I have a number of nonprofit, clients that have been thriving with EOS, and they're like, you know,"Well, I don't know if we're entrepreneurial." I'm like,"Well, if you're agile, you know, that's...
00:17:43.237 --> 00:17:48.096
You need agility." that's what we're talking about here is being able to really envision your next and move it forward.
00:17:48.346 --> 00:18:06.676
So I have a 330-member nonprofit, who just graduated, and during that time, of their four lines of service, 330 people across I think it's a dozen, counties, across those four lines of service, two of the lines of service had major funding challenges.
00:18:07.017 --> 00:18:08.836
kinda geopolitical things happened, right?
00:18:09.136 --> 00:18:29.567
So I remember hearing about it and thinking,"Oh my goodness, I've gotta call and place a call to the visionary there and see, you know, what can I do to help." and so I put a note to my assistant who called me before 8:00 in the morning and said,"You know, should I set up a meeting?" I said,"Well, if I don't hear from her, you know, the visionary soon, I w- let's do that." I'm on the phone with my assistant while the visionary calls in.
00:18:29.567 --> 00:18:32.126
It was barely eight o'clock, and I picked up the phone.
00:18:32.146 --> 00:18:34.237
Of course, I'm like,"Sorry, gotta, I gotta dump you.
00:18:34.237 --> 00:18:39.596
Let me pick her up." And I picked up the call, and she starts asking,"Oh, could you like teach our mid-levels?
00:18:39.596 --> 00:18:45.007
'Cause we've done it, but you know, you make it look so easy, and we've done well, but we're not gonna be as fast.
00:18:45.007 --> 00:18:50.737
Like we, we want to really have them get it." The shared on all needed to get to shared by all quickly, right?
00:18:50.737 --> 00:18:59.203
And so, she said,"Do you do that?" you can imagine I'm rarely speechless, but I was,'cause I'm thinking,"What is she asking?" I'm like,"Sure." And she said,"Is that a session?
00:18:59.203 --> 00:18:59.784
Is that like...
00:18:59.897 --> 00:19:05.228
What's the fee for that?" And so I'm like,"Well, you know, yes, there's usually a fee, You know, I've got workbooks.
00:19:05.248 --> 00:19:09.125
We can do that." And, but today, yeah, I'm like,"But you know, whatever you need.
00:19:09.125 --> 00:19:10.185
Well, let's get it on the schedule.
00:19:10.185 --> 00:19:11.145
We need it, next week.
00:19:11.185 --> 00:19:19.165
Can we do it next week?" So I'm like transacting this business with somebody that I'm thinking,"Oh my gosh, I just need to call and help them," you know?
00:19:19.516 --> 00:19:21.986
And so we get all done with that transact.
00:19:22.016 --> 00:19:25.266
"Now, you'll send an invoice?" I'm like,"Okay." You know?
00:19:25.528 --> 00:19:29.759
and then she's starting to conclude the call, and I'm like,"Well, wait." And she said,"Oh my gosh, wait, Amy.
00:19:29.959 --> 00:19:30.818
I'm so sorry.
00:19:31.068 --> 00:19:40.338
I just n- I need to back up." She said,"You probably aren't aware of this, but we had two of our main pillars of services get hit by a funding crisis, today.
00:19:40.558 --> 00:19:47.729
And so we had an emergency executive team, you know, leadership team meeting-" At 7:00 this morning, and we all determined a couple of things.
00:19:47.729 --> 00:19:50.090
One, that, you have led us well.
00:19:50.090 --> 00:19:50.980
You've taught us well.
00:19:51.191 --> 00:19:52.230
I don't lead, I teach, right?
00:19:52.381 --> 00:20:07.030
and she said,"Because we knew that we needed to delegate more, and you've, you know, helped us with that, and we recognized what we need to do is delegate everything." So she said,"While I and the marketing person have always done fundraising, we all needed to be ambassadors.
00:20:07.050 --> 00:20:12.540
And you know, the other thing was, and you really pressed us on this, that we needed to complete our marketing strategy.
00:20:12.711 --> 00:20:14.330
We all need to know our uniques.
00:20:14.340 --> 00:20:18.567
We all need to know our proven process." And so the board has it.
00:20:18.576 --> 00:20:21.676
We have board ambassadors that we identified.
00:20:21.866 --> 00:20:30.957
and so as a result of, the delegation and having the marketing strategy and knowing who we are and how we share that with the world, it's gonna change everything.
00:20:30.967 --> 00:20:40.727
So we literally, as of today, all eight of us are executive-level fundraisers, and we are armed with the marketing strategy, and we're gonna move forward.
00:20:40.946 --> 00:20:52.355
And that's why, Amy, that's why I called, because we need you to make sure that that next level down's moving because we're really delegating as well as we can, but you know, it's a bit of a scramble.
00:20:52.634 --> 00:20:55.865
so I did go do that, uh, session and they, received it well.
00:20:55.865 --> 00:20:59.615
And the net-net of it is that was some time ago.
00:20:59.664 --> 00:21:01.535
it wasn't quite a year, but it's been a while.
00:21:01.565 --> 00:21:06.765
and they just graduated, so they finished their EOS journey to mastery.
00:21:07.025 --> 00:21:08.005
They're awesome.
00:21:08.164 --> 00:21:18.144
I'm not saying everybody should have, like, such a pinch point that it creates that positive pressure to make sure they get everything done, but, it was terrific and, they did not lay off anyone.
00:21:18.886 --> 00:21:19.646
Wow
00:21:19.954 --> 00:21:20.924
it was incredible.
00:21:20.934 --> 00:21:26.444
So when I talk about different industries, I also talk about for-profit and not-for-profit as well.
00:21:26.444 --> 00:21:32.575
So, I know, because I've maybe led nonprofits and I'm on a lot of different boards and things, I'm able to do that.
00:21:32.575 --> 00:21:42.565
But across my, career, I've been in many places and, same thing then when, you know, no surprise, I have, And again, I have clients that are in the typical 10 to 250 people range.
00:21:42.785 --> 00:21:44.704
I have clients with thousands of people.
00:21:44.984 --> 00:21:46.647
You are listening to the Scalability Code.
00:21:46.647 --> 00:21:54.817
I'm your host, Matt Haney, founder of Sinclair Ventures, and we help visionary entrepreneurs like you get out of the shit show and focus on growing your business.
00:21:54.957 --> 00:22:01.356
We offer fractional COO and leadership coaching services that free up that brain of yours to focus on what's next.
00:22:01.846 --> 00:22:03.586
Learn more about us at SinclairVentures.
00:22:03.586 --> 00:22:03.936
com.
00:22:03.957 --> 00:22:04.576
Now back to it.
00:22:05.659 --> 00:22:11.199
I had a referral, to come in as a fractional integrator to a client, and they were really small, not running on EOS.
00:22:11.459 --> 00:22:12.929
they're retail salons.
00:22:13.028 --> 00:22:16.759
picture self-tanning or waxing or spray tans or whatnot.
00:22:17.338 --> 00:22:18.429
Three locations.
00:22:18.469 --> 00:22:21.128
Each location has three to five employees.
00:22:21.469 --> 00:22:26.219
And then at the ownership level, there's really the owner, the visionary, and an operations manager.
00:22:27.009 --> 00:22:28.689
so very limited team.
00:22:28.699 --> 00:22:29.358
So what is that?
00:22:29.368 --> 00:22:37.878
15, maybe 17 employees total, but really only two at that management layer, visionary, integrator, that's it.
00:22:38.888 --> 00:22:45.338
Really hard to come in, to an organization like that and I was fearful of joining because I thought I was going to fail.
00:22:45.509 --> 00:22:49.898
and h-how do you-- I mean, do you do implementations that small?
00:22:49.929 --> 00:22:53.598
Do you generally steer-- I mean, there's really two people to get the work done.
00:22:53.818 --> 00:22:56.148
So tell me about your experience.
00:22:56.148 --> 00:22:59.308
Have you gone anything that small and, give me a little backstory.
00:22:59.923 --> 00:23:01.522
No, that's, that's excellent, Matt.
00:23:01.752 --> 00:23:03.323
A great example to spring from.
00:23:03.363 --> 00:23:09.403
I would tell you as, as any great, uh, person who works with other organizations would say, it depends.
00:23:09.982 --> 00:23:14.403
So, I do have, a team that started out with just two on the leadership team.
00:23:14.553 --> 00:23:21.623
It was an entrepreneur through acquisition, so it was an entrepreneur who, became one by acquiring something in a field he didn't really...
00:23:21.673 --> 00:23:26.502
he knew some of, I believe, but was not, particularly skilled in it, experienced in it, I should say.
00:23:26.913 --> 00:23:34.982
and he, sought me out, found me and said,"I know you've, helped people self-implement early on and, you have a lot of self-implementers that come to you." So that's...
00:23:34.992 --> 00:23:39.873
If there's anything, maybe that's kind of a, an area where people reach out to me because I've done it.
00:23:39.962 --> 00:23:45.450
but then, I was asking him about his team and, and it was the sales, director and him.
00:23:45.759 --> 00:23:50.782
So it was visionary/integrator in one and sales in the other.
00:23:50.782 --> 00:24:02.500
And I'm like,"So who leads your operations?" And he said,"Well, we, you know, acquired this organization, and it had been around for 70 years and, uh, you know, we, we don't have anybody, but we aspire to that.
00:24:02.500 --> 00:24:08.720
We aspire to getting somebody there, but I just wanna see what we can learn." I'll tell you, I didn't expect them to go on the journey.
00:24:08.720 --> 00:24:16.130
I did an overview for them and gave them books and, shared with them, a good, overview and some thoughts and a lot of questions.
00:24:16.130 --> 00:24:17.220
I'm always about questions.
00:24:17.470 --> 00:24:26.477
and it was interesting because I get to the end of it, and I'm often so surprised, you know, because I don't think they're gonna want to go on the EOS implementation journey with me.
00:24:26.696 --> 00:24:29.676
and so I said,"So, you know, let me know how I can help you," blah, blah, blah.
00:24:29.676 --> 00:24:32.423
And he's like,"Wait-" aren't we good enough for you?
00:24:32.942 --> 00:24:34.633
And, uh, or something similar.
00:24:34.633 --> 00:24:38.613
I can't remember exactly, but I just remember being stunned by it, so that's why I don't remember probably.
00:24:39.039 --> 00:24:41.970
and I said,"Wait, are you interested?" and he said,"Yes.
00:24:42.250 --> 00:24:46.299
You know, when I acquired this, I wanted to move it forward and get it stabilized.
00:24:46.369 --> 00:25:01.730
My goal is to go off and do other things, you know, at a point or whatever." But he said, I can't imagine, you know, wanting to do it, you know, slowly." He said,"And I can't imagine doing this on our own as quickly as you could help us through it." So they're almost to graduation as well.
00:25:01.920 --> 00:25:03.460
And along the way, what happens?
00:25:03.460 --> 00:25:05.359
We build the accountability chart.
00:25:05.430 --> 00:25:12.359
we look at what, you know, right people, right seats can look like, and they now have an ops lead on the leadership team.
00:25:12.599 --> 00:25:25.623
So they've got the three people, and I do believe over time that that visionary/integrator, most of the time I have visionaries suffer from integrators, and if they don't start out that way, it happens pretty quickly.
00:25:25.853 --> 00:25:33.992
but in that example, it took a while, and I do think over time that you know, an integrator need will emerge, once, you know, the processes are all in place.
00:25:33.992 --> 00:25:37.643
So, so that's an example of really, you know, small side.
00:25:37.732 --> 00:25:41.843
I would say this, you know, we talk about, you know, EOS, it's, it's, you know, whether you...
00:25:41.903 --> 00:25:47.070
I can't remember if you said one size fits all or what it was, but, think it applies to different sizes, to different industries.
00:25:47.141 --> 00:25:54.790
I haven't run into an industry, for-profit or nonprofit, that it didn't make sense for, and I think because we all have to have a system, right?
00:25:54.790 --> 00:26:04.428
We all have to have a way that we do things or else we can't scale, Even, you know, when it's a family business, we don't all understand where we're going and, you know, have that cadence.
00:26:04.438 --> 00:26:08.538
So I mean, without it, you really need to have a communication, you know, mechanism.
00:26:08.538 --> 00:26:20.218
all of that said, I do think though that, the journey will, while the actual steps in the process, the agendas in the sessions may all look the same, we take it on a different course.
00:26:20.458 --> 00:26:33.597
If somebody has that need to, run operations while they're also trying to figure out the whole rest of the organization, we might jump early on to developing their process table of contents so they have someplace to hang their processes off from.
00:26:33.877 --> 00:26:42.627
Another that's having financial difficulty and comes because of profitability issues, we're gonna spend time earlier on talking about their cash flow drivers.
00:26:42.698 --> 00:26:46.938
So the EOS tools that are chosen, aren't always chosen in the same order.
00:26:47.147 --> 00:26:49.597
there's some foundational ones that need to be at the beginning.
00:26:49.768 --> 00:26:56.387
But after that, I'm gonna take a team where they need it to go, and I'm gonna be listening to them and having conversations about it.
00:26:56.617 --> 00:27:07.968
So that's, I think, of the beautiful parts of EOS is that ability to have a consistent set of tools, but we may have it scheduled inconsistently to, really what an organization best needs.
00:27:08.718 --> 00:27:09.397
That's awesome.
00:27:09.557 --> 00:27:11.077
That's such a great, piece.
00:27:11.107 --> 00:27:29.929
Okay, let's jump into tools, I do believe, and this is my opinion, having sat in many sessions as an integrator, not at the board as an implementer where you folks do your fine work, but us as implementers, I think there are certain implementers that teach tools really well, like specific tools.
00:27:30.548 --> 00:27:38.028
So, if there's a tool in your mind that you think,"Man, I'm really exceptional at it," or,"I just really like it," I'd love to know what that is.
00:27:38.398 --> 00:27:39.088
don't answer.
00:27:39.259 --> 00:27:40.138
I'm gonna go first.
00:27:40.138 --> 00:27:40.719
You think.
00:27:41.108 --> 00:27:51.929
I love the accountability chart as the integrator because it makes, my favorite part of it are, I'm looking at it through the lens of Ninety.io'cause that's my preferred online platform.
00:27:52.189 --> 00:27:59.838
The five bullet points below the person's name are some of the most impactful five bullet points in the entire company.
00:28:00.638 --> 00:28:10.989
Because I simply get to refer back to the accountability chart, flash it up on the screen, and everyone immediately zeroes in on their own name and sees those bullet points below.
00:28:11.138 --> 00:28:11.739
This is what I do.
00:28:11.739 --> 00:28:12.169
This is what I do.
00:28:12.169 --> 00:28:12.959
This is what I do.
00:28:13.608 --> 00:28:16.558
And it just brings what I call visual accountability.
00:28:16.749 --> 00:28:23.778
It's a term I use a lot, which is like we just visually see through the EOS platform, through Ninety.io visually what I'm accountable for.
00:28:24.169 --> 00:28:26.338
And if I'm not on it, then I'm not on it.
00:28:26.429 --> 00:28:29.538
So the accountability chart is near and dear to my heart as an integrator.
00:28:29.568 --> 00:28:32.979
I would love to know what you love in terms of EOS tools.
00:28:35.288 --> 00:28:38.219
Well, now that I shouldn't use accountability chart,'cause that was so cool.
00:28:38.269 --> 00:28:39.949
'Cause that's,'cause it's also my initials,
00:28:40.280 --> 00:28:40.750
Gotcha.
00:28:40.961 --> 00:28:41.691
I got it first
00:28:43.348 --> 00:28:45.259
it, it is im- it's so impactful.
00:28:45.298 --> 00:28:46.298
so I love what you said.
00:28:46.608 --> 00:28:50.709
I would talk about the Vision Traction Organizer all day long, and that would be so unfair.
00:28:50.909 --> 00:28:53.179
'cause it's awesome, and I think people see that.
00:28:53.229 --> 00:28:56.778
you know, if they're experiencing it, it allows them to get clarity and all of that.
00:28:57.019 --> 00:29:00.338
Let me talk about one that I think is kind of m- maybe magical.
00:29:00.538 --> 00:29:01.459
I won't say I'm...
00:29:01.469 --> 00:29:04.318
You know, I'm not perfect by any stretch at anything, right?
00:29:04.348 --> 00:29:04.828
We aren't.
00:29:04.909 --> 00:29:11.528
But I love the fact that maybe a place where you might be surprised that I have patience, I'm very patient.
00:29:11.528 --> 00:29:13.808
I ask a question, and I'll wait for a long time.
00:29:14.028 --> 00:29:16.628
I'll help them, with new questions to help them get there.
00:29:16.929 --> 00:29:25.798
I love the eight cashflow drivers, and the reason why is that it's so impactful as well, even if an organization's doing well.
00:29:25.808 --> 00:29:30.868
I mean, earlier in my implementations, I would tell you that that kind of would be...
00:29:30.878 --> 00:29:34.419
You know, people would kick that down to the later tools, and that was fine with me.
00:29:34.729 --> 00:29:43.048
And I tend to urge it earlier, especially if we have time for an extra tool, you know, in a session, or, you know, there's nothing that they need right that minute.
00:29:43.308 --> 00:29:46.778
and the reason why I do this is that, I think it helps so many ways.
00:29:46.818 --> 00:30:09.825
One, that the finance director or the, the, you know, the finance seat in the room, everything doesn't just fall to them that, that now we start thinking about, you know, everybody's thinking about cash flow, and, you know, how they can impact, you know, positive on the, on the, the, the top end, the top line of, of revenue or, or whatever it might be, donations, et cetera, ancillary revenue.
00:30:09.865 --> 00:30:15.924
and then also how they can impact the profitability by looking at things where we're leaking, you know, where we could do things differently.
00:30:16.214 --> 00:30:20.575
And, one of the things I didn't talk about, I'm a Lean Six Sigma Master Black Belt only because it's fun to
00:30:20.663 --> 00:30:21.333
didn't know that.
00:30:21.502 --> 00:30:22.363
That's pretty amazing
00:30:22.694 --> 00:30:24.674
I don't like that much data anymore, so...
00:30:24.845 --> 00:30:34.234
But I always kinda have an eye to waste, an eye to, you know, those things that we're waiting on or those things that we just really don't need to do if we're really focused on where we need to go.
00:30:34.515 --> 00:30:39.045
and it brings it into it without any, you know, I don't introduce any new words or terms or anything.
00:30:39.045 --> 00:30:39.755
We don't need to.
00:30:39.954 --> 00:30:44.404
The tool as it's developed and as we teach it, it really does the work.
00:30:44.595 --> 00:30:56.335
But what's amazing is that I'll have teams who are like,"Yeah, let's see how this one pans out, Amy." And, much like the, you know, doing the process table of contents where they're like,"Oh my gosh, it's so big." But what do we do?
00:30:56.335 --> 00:30:58.595
We help them simplify, right?
00:30:58.724 --> 00:31:07.234
And so eight cash flow drivers, we might start out with, 16 things on the board, but what we really dig into is which ones are most important for us?
00:31:07.285 --> 00:31:08.434
Who can impact it?
00:31:08.434 --> 00:31:12.454
Not, no, we're not looking at the finance director because he gets these data for us.
00:31:12.674 --> 00:31:19.154
We need to look at who in the room can make a difference to the end result and the numbers that we're receiving, right?
00:31:19.434 --> 00:31:21.654
And so it starts placing accountability.
00:31:21.654 --> 00:31:24.404
So I'll just tie into your accountability chart conversation.
00:31:24.585 --> 00:31:37.075
I literally this week just, pointed to that and said,"See how this eight cash flow or your, whatever your number's gonna be, your cash flow drivers really start talking about accountability." Now we should check and make sure in the accountability chart we haven't missed anything.
00:31:37.075 --> 00:31:49.924
If these are the most important, impactful things for us to do good work, because whether it's profitability needs to increase or whether we need a cash reserve to support the business, sustainability of the businesses, there's so many reasons.
00:31:49.924 --> 00:31:51.305
It's not just about profitability.
00:31:51.355 --> 00:31:56.174
it's about the long-term longevity of the organization and what we can learn.
00:31:56.505 --> 00:32:01.255
You know, 1% in one place, can be significant everywhere else.
00:32:01.285 --> 00:32:05.755
And so once we see that, then we go to, you know, so what are we gonna do about it?
00:32:05.755 --> 00:32:16.394
And I just find that I've never, taught the eight cash flow drivers working on that and had people not go,"Oh," when we got done, and also not take that and build rocks from it.
00:32:17.045 --> 00:32:26.730
And so again, Gino's genius and, you know, what we need to do first is, use tool and then get into building our rocks for the quarter, and that's another reason why.
00:32:26.740 --> 00:32:29.230
That the tool should help us inform what we need to do.
00:32:29.230 --> 00:32:31.640
We should be learning and seeing something from it.
00:32:31.650 --> 00:32:33.150
So there you go.
00:32:33.612 --> 00:32:34.172
I love it.
00:32:34.481 --> 00:32:35.991
what do you do to keep yourself busy?
00:32:36.132 --> 00:32:40.858
What hobbies, what interests, what things keep you, uh, firing on all cylinders?
00:32:41.903 --> 00:32:42.292
Yeah, terrific.
00:32:42.303 --> 00:32:50.813
Well, for decades it was, you know, I love search and rescue and helping, you know, youth leadership and all those fun things that the Civil Air Patrol gave me a, a place for.
00:32:50.813 --> 00:32:52.303
I've also served with the Red Cross.
00:32:52.323 --> 00:32:54.982
I've done a lot of things, but, I would tell you...
00:32:55.002 --> 00:33:02.742
And now I'm on the Civil Air Patrol Foundation board as a trustee nationally, so still helping there, but I'm not flying around in aircraft anymore.
00:33:02.962 --> 00:33:12.516
But what I, w-recognize is that I could serve, I have, you know, governance background and certification, so helping with, you know, some of the, local organizations that are needed it.
00:33:12.566 --> 00:33:20.578
My mom was really big in community education and really making sure that, journalism and news and everything was important.
00:33:20.578 --> 00:33:28.509
So when there was a local journalism foundation that was, springing up in my local town, I, just asked about it, and the next th- And you gotta be careful, right?
00:33:28.509 --> 00:33:30.229
'Cause the next thing I know, they're like,"Hey.
00:33:30.499 --> 00:33:36.618
Hey, you should be on our board." So I do spend some time doing things like that, that I really think are giving back to my community.
00:33:36.868 --> 00:33:47.419
The other thing I would tell you is I love, love, love to learn, so I'm always, you know, reading, probably m- not as much as I'd, I'd like to, or listening to, to books, although I do that a little bit less.
00:33:47.509 --> 00:33:48.378
I tend to read more.
00:33:48.588 --> 00:33:54.578
But the ability for me to continue moving forward, I'm, in strategic coach myself, so I get coached.
00:33:54.898 --> 00:34:10.063
So I just came back from a, a conference for a few days, and continuing to, sharpen my tools, and really make sure I'm doing, not only just good work in, EOS and the implementation of it, but also, you know, that I'm a good human and that I'm keeping myself balanced and that I'm focused.
00:34:10.063 --> 00:34:12.342
I know it's harder than it looks, but you know that.
00:34:12.563 --> 00:34:23.782
and so, I was a two-sport athlete in high school, played two different sports in college, and recognized a few years ago like,"Hey, I've never learned how to play tennis," when everybody else was playing pickleball, so I'm a little late probably.
00:34:23.782 --> 00:34:26.393
anyway, I learned how to play tennis, and I'm pretty ambidextrous.
00:34:26.402 --> 00:34:29.492
When I played softball, I'd hit Grand Slams left-handed and right-handed.
00:34:29.682 --> 00:34:41.273
Well, it turns out one day when I was getting a blister on my thumb'cause the ball machine kept, wasn't randomizing very well, I flipped the racket in my other hand and could hear my coach that I've had like maybe six hours of lessons from.
00:34:41.822 --> 00:34:49.373
S- You know, I'm like,"How did I do that, that top spin this h-hand?" And so I, I haven't figured out how to serve with both handed.
00:34:49.373 --> 00:34:50.702
I don't even know if I serve well with one.
00:34:50.932 --> 00:34:56.313
But I've gotta tell you, I've had so much fun, just learning something new like that as well.
00:34:56.492 --> 00:35:13.335
And I need to get back to coaching Special basketball because I found that when I played in, college, I, wasn't as good of a, um, rebounder as when I'm, I'm keeping the ball from hitting some, you know, kid's head, because they're not, you know, putting their own hands up to protect themselves.
00:35:13.335 --> 00:35:16.360
So It improves my rebound, ability, greatly.
00:35:16.360 --> 00:35:19.579
But, I love that across, some sports, helping the community.
00:35:19.789 --> 00:35:24.489
And then, we have a golden retriever, six-year-old, who is learning to be a therapy dog.
00:35:24.530 --> 00:35:28.599
and we got him during COVID knowing that he love, love, loves people.
00:35:28.610 --> 00:35:32.190
He's the ambassador at the bus stop in the morning and things like that.
00:35:32.190 --> 00:35:34.152
So, um, try to round all that out.
00:35:34.163 --> 00:35:35.052
Love to travel too.
00:35:35.052 --> 00:35:36.083
Just came back from France.
00:35:36.092 --> 00:35:36.402
So,
00:35:36.838 --> 00:35:37.639
That's very cool.
00:35:37.668 --> 00:35:38.349
Very cool.
00:35:38.688 --> 00:35:40.778
Well, I think we-- Any questions for me?
00:35:40.778 --> 00:35:45.929
Any thoughts, curiosities about what it was like for a fractional integrator or things that jump up?
00:35:45.929 --> 00:35:51.068
I don't know if you have any experience working with fractional integrators, but I'd love to answer any questions if any of them come to mind
00:35:51.650 --> 00:35:52.530
Yeah, I do.
00:35:52.550 --> 00:35:56.150
And, would just love to know, like, you know, if, if you have a sweet spot in that.
00:35:56.221 --> 00:35:58.690
and maybe, you know, whether it's industry or size.
00:35:58.760 --> 00:36:01.210
but then also, thinking about, Matt, the...
00:36:01.501 --> 00:36:09.431
You know, sometimes you know that you're going in to help somebody rise to be an integrator, and sometimes you're going in just to be a- Would you speak to that, please?
00:36:09.565 --> 00:36:10.445
Yeah, absolutely.
00:36:10.454 --> 00:36:13.215
So a little background, around specialties.
00:36:13.235 --> 00:36:17.954
You know, I, I look back through the engagements I've had, and there, there is overlap for me.
00:36:18.307 --> 00:36:21.534
but I love the scavenger hunt reference'cause they're all over the place.
00:36:21.934 --> 00:36:22.465
But there are.
00:36:22.465 --> 00:36:25.724
I've worked with several construction-related companies, service businesses.
00:36:25.744 --> 00:36:33.518
Everyone says,"What's your niche?" And I say,"Service-based businesses, business to business." Professional blue collar or white.
00:36:33.668 --> 00:36:38.829
So any business that's B2B that is in the blue collar or white collar industry.
00:36:38.898 --> 00:36:39.949
Ah, what does that mean?
00:36:40.239 --> 00:36:51.268
I tend to work with construction firms, whether it's a mechanical engineering company, which is aluminum manufacturing business, exterior renovations for high-rises, those would all be service-based businesses, B2B.
00:36:51.289 --> 00:36:56.739
So I did just finish an implementation, or an integration with a company that's was in the high-tech space.
00:36:56.739 --> 00:37:00.298
They were, building a tech platform that we actually ended up selling to Accenture.
00:37:00.809 --> 00:37:07.498
So, I'm currently an Accenture employee through transitioning that business over and building a business unit within Accenture.
00:37:07.509 --> 00:37:09.289
So that's been a ton of fun.
00:37:09.489 --> 00:37:14.369
and getting to see what seven hundred thousand people looks like in a business is truly fascinating.
00:37:14.748 --> 00:37:15.818
but that's been a lot of fun.
00:37:15.818 --> 00:37:19.139
I have a client currently that's in the, real estate investment space.
00:37:19.139 --> 00:37:22.248
They buy retail centers, improve them, lease them up, and resell them.
00:37:22.648 --> 00:37:23.989
it's really been all over the place.
00:37:24.018 --> 00:37:31.128
But the one common theme for me as a fractional integrator is working alongside a visionary that is, humble and curious.
00:37:31.668 --> 00:37:34.349
You'll hear me say those terms a lot or my clients get sick of it.
00:37:34.358 --> 00:37:50.929
It's like,"Let's stay humble and let's stay curious." one of my clients sent me over a little picture of Curious George, like an animated GIF being curious, and I'm like,"All right, you earn the nickname Curious George." I tend to align myself successfully with visionaries that are creative-- or sorry, curious and humble.
00:37:51.318 --> 00:37:52.878
So that's a little bit of that.
00:37:53.639 --> 00:38:01.018
one of the greatest joys that come to me as a fractional integrator is knowing when and how to transition out of a business.
00:38:01.309 --> 00:38:03.659
I'm coming in as the now, not forever.
00:38:03.918 --> 00:38:11.728
I say that very clearly up front because I don't want there to be a misconception that I'm coming in to take roles or I'm coming in to fire and hire.
00:38:11.759 --> 00:38:13.489
I am coming in to hire, hopefully not fire.
00:38:13.858 --> 00:38:17.199
But I am coming in to hold teams accountable, and that looks like a lot of things.
00:38:17.199 --> 00:38:20.289
Accountability gets a really negative rap these days.
00:38:20.289 --> 00:38:22.128
It's a four-letter word in the world.
00:38:22.648 --> 00:38:28.818
But, I try to make accountability as practical and, relatable as possible, not a micromanagement.
00:38:29.188 --> 00:38:39.719
And as I referenced earlier, EOS gives us the ability through the platforms that I use to manage EOS, but also through the VTOs and the tools for that visual accountability piece.
00:38:39.838 --> 00:38:45.768
It's really special to show something up on a screen and let people know that they're seeing it and holding themselves accountable.
00:38:46.119 --> 00:38:49.018
I just have the intuition to put it in front of them so that they go get it done.
00:38:49.588 --> 00:38:54.278
so that's a little bit about what it's like working with a fractional, but transitioning out is fun.
00:38:54.378 --> 00:38:58.329
I get to bring someone up from within, train them and onboard them, which is awesome.
00:38:58.358 --> 00:39:06.275
Or I get to bring someone from the outside, hire onboard, train, and I get a unique relationship with everyone now.
00:39:06.364 --> 00:39:09.454
I've got a relationship with the EOSi implementer who brings me in.
00:39:09.885 --> 00:39:12.905
I've got a relationship with the visionary who I've been working with for months.
00:39:13.235 --> 00:39:16.394
Now I have a relationship with the integrator.
00:39:17.135 --> 00:39:17.985
How cool is that?
00:39:18.014 --> 00:39:21.375
Because I've trained the integrator outside of the visionary.
00:39:21.625 --> 00:39:32.735
So the preexisting conditions that the visionary brings to every hire are no longer part of this onboarding because I'm the one responsible for hiring my replacement and ensuring their success.
00:39:33.005 --> 00:39:34.894
Okay, fast-forward 30, 60, 90.
00:39:34.894 --> 00:39:40.514
I get to go back to all three of those people, EOSi, integrator, and check in.
00:39:40.704 --> 00:39:41.375
How's it going?
00:39:41.585 --> 00:39:42.585
Are you having your one-on-one?
00:39:42.954 --> 00:39:44.335
Are you having your same page meeting?
00:39:44.664 --> 00:39:45.485
When's it quarterly?
00:39:45.824 --> 00:39:52.324
And I just get to be curious with those three people to figure out, how it's going to avoid a false start.
00:39:52.625 --> 00:39:56.494
So that's a really cool piece of what we get to do as fractional integrators
00:39:57.570 --> 00:39:58.590
that's fantastic.
00:39:58.721 --> 00:39:59.190
I love it.
00:39:59.240 --> 00:40:05.041
And, and you know, it r- it, r- reminds me I've graduated a number of clients, just early this year.
00:40:05.050 --> 00:40:06.311
I had a whole pack.
00:40:06.320 --> 00:40:07.291
It was, fun.
00:40:07.380 --> 00:40:10.541
and, you know, to be able to celebrate their mastery, right?
00:40:10.561 --> 00:40:15.951
And, and, and without me ever asking, they talk about, like, what's been so different, you know?
00:40:16.170 --> 00:40:21.791
Well, remember pre-EOS, and it's like it's a whole era now, pre-EOS, and then they talk about where they are.
00:40:21.990 --> 00:40:27.990
And what's fascinating about it is you know, as you talk about the, like, graduating or, you know, moving out, right?
00:40:28.260 --> 00:40:46.128
That, going back and checking back in with them, that's some of the, just wonderful work that we do, kind of unpaid, but oh my gosh, but you're paid by the, the energy and the success and/or being able to ask a question or help solve something if, you know, our curiosity leads us to you know, is that going okay?
00:40:46.358 --> 00:40:50.708
And so I love how that works, and, and it is, something that's just really special.
00:40:51.297 --> 00:40:52.148
That's fantastic.
00:40:52.387 --> 00:40:52.858
Yeah,'cause we
00:40:52.907 --> 00:40:54.038
I'd love to close this down.
00:40:54.038 --> 00:40:56.217
If you've got any final thoughts, I'd love to hear them.
00:40:56.237 --> 00:40:57.588
Otherwise, we'll wrap up
00:40:58.340 --> 00:40:58.639
Yeah.
00:40:58.639 --> 00:41:03.489
I loved how you talked about, staying curious and humble and having, visionaries that start there.
00:41:03.489 --> 00:41:07.699
And I will tell you, I probably am a tiny bit different in that and can afford to be.
00:41:07.860 --> 00:41:18.900
When I'm starting the journey, they may or may not have, the integrator in place yet, but I'm always looking for, do I think that they can get to curious and humble?
00:41:19.230 --> 00:41:32.429
because I can think of a couple of humbling moments when teams who had really, you know, styles are always different, but that, you know, someone who may be curious, but they're not willing to concede any room in the room at first.
00:41:32.730 --> 00:41:40.559
And when they hit that point where they realize if everything has to go through me, you know, because I'm controlling that then I can't grow.
00:41:40.800 --> 00:41:48.329
And those moments, whether it's, you know, tears or whether it's, you know, just, you know, wow, I need to share with all of you, and they just start sharing.
00:41:48.559 --> 00:41:53.289
That's such an amazing, moment that we get to, and that's when they can grow.
00:41:53.300 --> 00:41:56.739
So I love that you're looking for that'cause that's when you can really help them.
00:41:56.739 --> 00:42:00.960
So I look forward to having you work with, somebody that, I get to work too.
00:42:00.960 --> 00:42:01.679
I think it would be
00:42:01.766 --> 00:42:02.315
That would be awesome.
00:42:02.556 --> 00:42:07.925
I would love to, I would love to partner with you on any of your clients that have needs and, have really enjoyed our conversation today.
00:42:07.925 --> 00:42:12.036
So, thank you very much, Amy, for joining us today on The Scalability Code.
00:42:12.065 --> 00:42:20.175
I hope we can have another conversation in the future and really look forward to, getting to know you and, maybe I'll come up to Kalamazoo one day, but only in the summer.
00:42:20.306 --> 00:42:21.226
Only in the summer.
00:42:21.295 --> 00:42:22.235
I'm not coming in the winter
00:42:23.353 --> 00:42:26.724
that's fair, and that's when I liked, having a client in LA, so I get it.
00:42:26.934 --> 00:42:27.884
thanks so much, Matt.
00:42:27.884 --> 00:42:29.563
This has been, uh, just magical.
00:42:29.693 --> 00:42:31.762
Thank you for listening to The Scalability Code.
00:42:31.793 --> 00:42:37.282
If you made it this far, please follow the show on Apple, Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:42:37.373 --> 00:42:39.833
We'll see you next time on The Scalability Code.
00:00:00.050 --> 00:00:05.700
He said,"Oh my gosh, Amy, that's the thing that got us over the, the$250 million mark.
00:00:05.700 --> 00:00:13.919
What I didn't tell you when I had you join our company is we'd been stuck." and you came in, and between you and Traction," as he called it"it was, it was awesome.
00:00:13.919 --> 00:00:15.269
That's exactly what we needed,
00:00:15.269 --> 00:00:21.300
Welcome to The Scalability Code, the podcast that helps you get out of the sh*t show and start growing your business.
00:00:21.480 --> 00:00:24.089
And now for your host, Matt Haney.
00:00:24.332 --> 00:00:27.172
Here we are today, another episode of The Scalability Code.
00:00:27.192 --> 00:00:32.042
Today I'm joined by Amy Corder from the great state of Michigan up in Kalamazoo.
00:00:32.051 --> 00:00:35.091
Amy, thank you so much for joining us today on The Scalability Code.
00:00:35.890 --> 00:00:36.479
Thank you, Matt.
00:00:36.479 --> 00:00:37.259
I'm glad to be here
00:00:38.031 --> 00:00:40.112
We start by giving a little bit of background of yourself.
00:00:40.131 --> 00:00:49.481
I always say, like, when we're forced to have these introductions or when we walk into a room, it's almost like,"How quickly can we tell what we need to get and get a little look?" That's not the goal for the next few minutes.
00:00:49.481 --> 00:00:56.551
What I want to do is hear a little bit about your background and if you can keep it to some segments that gives the listeners a background of how you got to where you are.
00:00:56.902 --> 00:01:08.212
And then two, I want to know about how, you got started with entrepreneurship and more importantly, if there was anybody in your world or your life that impressioned you that said...
00:01:08.412 --> 00:01:10.682
that got you to say,"Shit, this is entrepreneurship.
00:01:10.781 --> 00:01:15.802
I'm kind of interested in that." So take those two topics, give us a little background, and then, we'll keep going
00:01:16.992 --> 00:01:18.141
So, a bit about me.
00:01:18.141 --> 00:01:30.361
When I'm asked, I often just start with I had a career scavenger hunt so far, not a career path, that I absolutely, have enjoyed learning, doing different work, different sized organizations, et cetera.
00:01:30.361 --> 00:01:35.581
So, I started out, my dad was an entrepreneur, so I got help with that right off the bat.
00:01:35.581 --> 00:01:37.072
My dad had his businesses.
00:01:37.072 --> 00:01:38.262
I loved his passion.
00:01:38.262 --> 00:01:56.956
he would stop, the vehicle on the way to church on Sunday and, hop out with his camera and take a picture at something, and my sister and I would be sitting in the car saying,"I don't know, Dad must have worked on that building or that, or that house or whatever." I also realized, though, that, being the fourth of five kids, that if I wasn't up at six in the morning and/or at midnight, I didn't get to see him.
00:01:56.965 --> 00:01:58.575
He was such a hard worker.
00:01:58.956 --> 00:02:07.135
And I always thought,"Oh my gosh, there's gotta be a, a better way to do that." And of course, now, fast-forward, I know that it's EOS really helps make a difference in that.
00:02:07.406 --> 00:02:10.045
I wish I'd found that in time while my dad was still around.
00:02:10.045 --> 00:02:14.036
So he ran his business through being eighty-five years old and kept on going.
00:02:14.036 --> 00:02:18.216
But, probably did a lot of it the hard way, and so it was inspirational.
00:02:18.225 --> 00:02:27.616
On the other hand, I looked at it and said,"Well, what else should I or could I know or experience, in my career?" And so, um, I'm a first generation at college, Pell eligible.
00:02:27.616 --> 00:02:32.475
We didn't have a lot of money, figured it out, and, went to a great institution, Kalamazoo College.
00:02:32.556 --> 00:02:34.915
Their colors are orange too, so, I never left it.
00:02:35.045 --> 00:02:37.586
I was just on a trip to France with them, last month actually.
00:02:37.586 --> 00:02:44.466
But, um, it had-- it really opened my eyes to the world and as well as just different ways of thinking, working, and doing.
00:02:44.466 --> 00:02:52.385
And so that, had me leap, to, well, I've seen my dad's, smaller businesses, but I grew up in Flint, Michigan, where GM is huge.
00:02:52.385 --> 00:03:03.105
And I said,"You know, maybe I wanna look at large organizations." So I started out in an organization that had over a hundred and twenty thousand people and, quickly found that, you get a little lost in there.
00:03:03.116 --> 00:03:05.036
It's hard to steer those ships.
00:03:05.036 --> 00:03:06.656
It's hard to move it, quickly.
00:03:06.656 --> 00:03:08.145
So wasn't as agile.
00:03:08.145 --> 00:03:09.195
I like things to move.
00:03:09.195 --> 00:03:14.256
I did have a great manager who gave me a lot of, assignments and opportunities.
00:03:14.306 --> 00:03:18.216
So one of those opportunities was with an entrepreneurial business.
00:03:18.506 --> 00:03:24.013
And at the time, I think maybe they'd grown to about a hundred, employees, just at that point, two locations.
00:03:24.233 --> 00:03:29.812
And I was sent there as a consultant, to help them in a couple of ways, and it just kept growing.
00:03:29.823 --> 00:03:37.447
And so after I was there, instead of, three weeks, I think it was, you know, thirteen months later, I'm still going back for, uh, you know, half a day a week or so.
00:03:37.893 --> 00:03:46.902
CEO and COO sat me down, very entrepreneurial, especially the COO, very much an entrepreneur, so kind of the second one in my life that, that really had a very different impact.
00:03:47.193 --> 00:03:52.342
And I realized that his focus was very much about how do we grow?
00:03:52.342 --> 00:03:59.591
How do we make, great lives for the people- in our organization while, oh, by the way, we're doing really great stuff for our clients.
00:03:59.820 --> 00:04:03.781
And so, what I loved about it was that he balanced that really well.
00:04:03.781 --> 00:04:09.631
My dad would do great things, but kind of, you know, on his own back and, and, in this organization it was different.
00:04:09.691 --> 00:04:12.050
I love that their core values were right on the wall.
00:04:12.050 --> 00:04:15.441
So for 13 months I'd walk by or been in the elevator where they were.
00:04:15.591 --> 00:04:19.110
I actually had memorized them, which probably scared them when they sat down.
00:04:19.110 --> 00:04:30.870
But you've gotta know, two former football players from the University of Michigan came into my cubicle after hours,'cause I worked in technology, so I was, there after hours to reboot computers and help with things like that.
00:04:30.901 --> 00:04:33.711
And, I had all the codes to the building and the computers.
00:04:33.711 --> 00:04:36.471
They trusted me implicitly as an outsider even.
00:04:36.721 --> 00:04:42.850
And they, came in my cube and brought me dinner and sat down and we were all eating while they were saying,"You know, you need to join our company.
00:04:42.850 --> 00:04:44.240
We've asked you four times, Amy.
00:04:44.511 --> 00:04:45.380
You know, what do you need?
00:04:45.380 --> 00:04:46.170
What do you need to know?
00:04:46.180 --> 00:04:46.810
We're growing.
00:04:46.810 --> 00:04:47.800
We're doing great things.
00:04:47.800 --> 00:04:55.165
Here's our vision." Like They shared the vision with me and I saw it and I was seeing it in action and I thought,"How can I say no?" Plus, they were football players.
00:04:55.175 --> 00:04:56.005
okay, I'll say no.
00:04:56.266 --> 00:04:56.985
no, I don't think so.
00:04:57.086 --> 00:05:04.471
So I, uh, I, so I said yes, joined that organization and, fast-forward while I led technology, we were in marketing services.
00:05:04.471 --> 00:05:10.711
I ended up being an intrapreneur, so inside of an organization, created in my service line-
00:05:10.757 --> 00:05:11.846
unit or yeah
00:05:11.963 --> 00:05:17.574
cr- yeah, I created a-- we helped secure, I should say it that way, the largest customer that that company had.
00:05:17.884 --> 00:05:18.785
It was crazy.
00:05:19.035 --> 00:05:20.535
so, epic fail on my part.
00:05:20.535 --> 00:05:22.475
I didn't ask for a commission, so silly me.
00:05:22.675 --> 00:05:26.545
But my team and I created this technology that really made a difference.
00:05:26.555 --> 00:05:29.564
So I really got to explore a lot of things in that organization.
00:05:29.564 --> 00:05:35.504
Wrote every job description I had and started out leading in my early 20s with everybody being older than I.
00:05:35.514 --> 00:05:52.375
So really learned leadership and management, which at the college level I had learned a lot also through NCAA sports So I think I've always had a lot of opportunity to kinda learn, grow, and, always been really observant and really tried to follow those great leaders, they were on a field or a court or sitting in an office.
00:05:52.574 --> 00:06:04.952
from there, I'll blend a little bit into my avocation as well because while it was, something that I had volunteered in since I was a teenager, I ended up taking one of top role, and this is the Civil Air Patrol.
00:06:04.973 --> 00:06:14.755
It's the official Air Force auxiliary, actually chartered by Congress to do three, main missions, emergency services, which includes disaster relief and homeland security's in there as well.
00:06:15.016 --> 00:06:16.045
that's one mission.
00:06:16.096 --> 00:06:17.485
Another, cadet programs.
00:06:17.485 --> 00:06:19.185
Another, aerospace education.
00:06:19.185 --> 00:06:28.105
So exactly the kind of thing that we would look at and say,"Are you, are you really focusing on three things at once?" But I'll tell you, I, I can speak to it.
00:06:28.146 --> 00:06:36.065
I, I, I actually had them create a pin that I wore on my, when I wore a civilian alternate uniform,'cause we don't change the Air Force uni-style uniform,
00:06:36.166 --> 00:06:37.697
No, you don't get to make edits there
00:06:37.829 --> 00:06:44.889
Yeah, that had a three bra- bladed propeller, and people would look at it and say,"What's that for?" And I said,"We have three missions, and we gotta keep'em balanced.
00:06:44.889 --> 00:07:00.713
The prop's not gonna fly well and pull us through the air." And so I really got people to recognize, they may have come in to help with one thing, like,"I wanna fly a plane." I had 552 aircraft in my command, which is the largest fleet of single eng- engine aircraft in the world, my senior Air Force advisor told me.
00:07:01.014 --> 00:07:05.543
I also had 61,000 people, and while I didn't meet'em all, I think they all emailed me.
00:07:05.673 --> 00:07:10.343
but that recognition and ability to take what I had done in different levels and just expand it.
00:07:10.343 --> 00:07:11.963
So talk about scale, right?
00:07:12.283 --> 00:07:19.303
that's what I love about, this is pre-EOS being around, but I've always led and managed, and it's really why I got to EOS.
00:07:19.624 --> 00:07:26.884
So as I was a national commander and two-star general, a major general, was in my command from 2007 to 2011.
00:07:27.264 --> 00:07:40.403
As I finished that, an entrepreneur that I had served on a board with in Detroit, a community board, had started, recognizing like,"Hey, she's doing some, you know, amazing stuff." They were just credited with saving, you know, 400 lives during her tenure.
00:07:40.454 --> 00:07:45.314
And, increasing the safety, and all these good things are happening, and he, reached out and said, I need to talk to you.
00:07:45.314 --> 00:07:46.603
You need to be on my team.
00:07:46.603 --> 00:08:06.244
I don't care what you do.""We need to figure this out." And he said,"Well, you could be the CIO, but this is like a tenth of what you've ever done in that." And so I started out just going in and helping him and, being on his leadership team, and then over time became his CFO, chief financial officer, and helped with that because I was recognizing the mid-level leaders needing, you know,
00:08:06.769 --> 00:08:07.959
and direction and accountability.
00:08:08.334 --> 00:08:09.134
and budgets.
00:08:09.134 --> 00:08:11.944
And just, you know, again, things that I ask questions about of my team.
00:08:12.093 --> 00:08:14.584
all of that said, I then moved to, the recognition.
00:08:14.584 --> 00:08:15.973
I was reading the book Traction.
00:08:15.983 --> 00:08:16.963
It just came out then.
00:08:17.163 --> 00:08:23.434
oddly, I'll tell you way back when, I was literally a mile away from Gino Wickman's office when Gino was there.
00:08:23.742 --> 00:08:28.163
I was on the Fortune stages talking about being a CIO and, he's where I wanted to be.
00:08:28.163 --> 00:08:29.463
You know, I wish I'd met him then.
00:08:29.702 --> 00:08:31.632
but, you know, not too late, not too late.
00:08:31.858 --> 00:08:38.418
so yeah, in 2011, as I was CIO, CFO, EI, EIO, I joked, I had the Traction book.
00:08:38.639 --> 00:08:47.433
My, uh, the owner, CEO, came in and said,"Amy, we need strategy." Like we just need a strategy and You know, I've, I read things.
00:08:47.433 --> 00:08:48.083
I was a reader.
00:08:48.114 --> 00:08:50.734
I'd read everything in the very cool office that I was in.
00:08:50.943 --> 00:08:53.053
and I said,"You know, David, we've got a strategy.
00:08:53.094 --> 00:08:55.183
You know, I, it's might be 48 pages long.
00:08:55.203 --> 00:08:58.384
I might be the only person who's read it, but We don't need more vision.
00:08:58.384 --> 00:08:59.423
We can get that out of you.
00:08:59.604 --> 00:09:05.644
What we need is, traction." And the book is out, I literally pushed the book across the table.
00:09:05.644 --> 00:09:08.203
That's what I was reading that day at lunch, just finishing.
00:09:08.214 --> 00:09:08.933
It was, timely.
00:09:09.293 --> 00:09:14.193
And so, he called me at midnight, not a good plan, but he called me at midnight and said,"I haven't put the book down.
00:09:14.193 --> 00:09:18.995
My family hates you." And, uh, and he said,"I, gotta tell you, you're right.
00:09:19.044 --> 00:09:26.149
We need to do this, so you do it." I was like,"Well, okay, so CFO..." Yeah, so now I am E, you know, E-I, E-I-O.
00:09:26.458 --> 00:09:28.408
And, so we self-implemented.
00:09:28.448 --> 00:09:30.428
I did look for some folks at the time.
00:09:30.619 --> 00:09:31.938
the owner was like,"I trust you.
00:09:31.938 --> 00:09:36.778
I want you to really jump in, you know, let's see where we go." So, 3,300 people.
00:09:36.778 --> 00:09:38.938
We were in both the United States and Mexico.
00:09:39.178 --> 00:09:40.028
I speak French.
00:09:40.028 --> 00:09:43.239
I went to France during college and in a university there, in fact.
00:09:43.239 --> 00:09:44.609
But, I needed a translator.
00:09:44.609 --> 00:09:51.708
But we did what we do best in EOS, which is, follow the process, trust the process, and I worked through the organization.
00:09:52.058 --> 00:09:53.538
I'll just say this, it, went well.
00:09:53.589 --> 00:10:00.698
I didn't know this until, I went to become an EOS implementer and I first called David.
00:10:00.698 --> 00:10:03.499
I hadn't talked to him for, eight years.
00:10:03.788 --> 00:10:10.839
we had exchanged some emails maybe, but I called him up and he answered the phone and stepped out of a meeting to answer the phone and he said,"What can I do for you?
00:10:10.839 --> 00:10:26.948
it's so good to hear from you." And I said,"Actually, I just wanted to see, would you support, you know, the work that I did?" We called it Traction, and then I did it in three other organizations since then, David, but you're the one that was the most complex, the, you know, really the, the largest at 3,300 people, right?
00:10:27.259 --> 00:10:28.288
And, I said,"What...
00:10:28.458 --> 00:10:31.499
You know, if I were gonna do this..." And he didn't let me finish the question.
00:10:31.759 --> 00:10:37.408
He said,"Oh my gosh, Amy, that's the thing that got us over the, the$250 million mark.
00:10:37.408 --> 00:10:42.528
What I didn't tell you when I had you join our company is we'd been stuck." And they're private, so I wasn't seeing it.
00:10:42.769 --> 00:10:49.068
He said,"We had been stuck, and you came in, and between you and Traction," as he called it"it was, it was awesome.
00:10:49.068 --> 00:10:58.808
That's exactly what we needed, and then we scaled from there." He went on to, go from Detroit to Chicago to Miami, and is now in Los Angeles doing, entrepreneurial, work.
00:10:59.099 --> 00:11:02.599
And he said,"I will talk to anybody who wants to talk to me about it.
00:11:02.649 --> 00:11:12.403
I can sing yours and the EOS' praises all day long." So, nobody's asked me to do that, by the way but that, um, that was a great way for me to look at it.
00:11:12.443 --> 00:11:27.371
I'm not as smart as I'd like you to believe, yeah, because what happened was three more times I was in my entrepreneurial, scavenger hunt, and so I wanted to have, different experiences and different seats around the leadership table And also in different industries.
00:11:27.371 --> 00:11:33.522
I've been, a CEO, CFO, COO, CIO, led sales and marketing, wasn't smart enough to get a C title.
00:11:33.701 --> 00:11:37.851
and then I always joked I wanted to be an EI, EIO, so I think EOSI is it.
00:11:37.861 --> 00:11:46.201
But, all that said, in the other organizations, there were three more after that that were all of size from, you know, 15 million to, 250.
00:11:46.522 --> 00:11:51.211
And in each of those, I would go in, work, and figure out whatever we need to do.
00:11:51.221 --> 00:11:54.221
Increase sales, got it done 37% in 10 months.
00:11:54.511 --> 00:11:55.392
How did I do that?
00:11:55.402 --> 00:11:56.422
It was the same people.
00:11:56.442 --> 00:11:59.471
It was using the concepts of getting right people, right seats.
00:11:59.471 --> 00:12:03.251
So all of that enabled me really to get to a point where I said...
00:12:03.292 --> 00:12:06.572
Actually, one of my friends said,"Amy, just go be an EOS implementer.
00:12:06.581 --> 00:12:07.272
You can help more
00:12:07.533 --> 00:12:09.433
how long-- when did you join EOS?
00:12:09.494 --> 00:12:10.413
How many sessions?
00:12:10.443 --> 00:12:12.474
Give us a little backstory of your journey
00:12:12.639 --> 00:12:15.899
five years ago roughly, during COVID, uh, not great timing.
00:12:16.168 --> 00:12:19.347
I've got, over 300 and I think 40 sessions in.
00:12:19.628 --> 00:12:23.048
I do, quite a few a year all across different industries and all.
00:12:23.138 --> 00:12:25.258
and yeah, just, love, love, love what I do.
00:12:25.268 --> 00:12:26.927
I know you can't tell, but I love
00:12:26.971 --> 00:12:32.682
no, I don't, I don't, get any passion or any, any body language or excitement from you at all.
00:12:32.692 --> 00:12:34.322
Well, hey, let's jump into some questions.
00:12:34.611 --> 00:12:36.511
I am the integrator, you are the visionary.
00:12:36.562 --> 00:12:38.871
It is my job to keep us moving forward.
00:12:39.231 --> 00:12:43.091
So I'm gonna ask you some questions because I think this is fun to get everyone's perspective about it.
00:12:43.091 --> 00:12:50.392
And then we'll talk, about your experience in managing people in your career and sort of how that translates over into the US practice you have today.
00:12:50.392 --> 00:12:57.221
So, big loaded question, but I don't know if you know this, as the integrator, me, in companies, I get to manage people for a living.
00:12:57.471 --> 00:13:01.652
I've been fortunate to do it for the last nine years across 15 or more engagements.
00:13:01.951 --> 00:13:03.851
Managing people is what I love doing.
00:13:04.111 --> 00:13:09.912
But, uh, you also are an incredible manager and have been managed thousands and thousands and thousands and tens of thousands of people.
00:13:10.371 --> 00:13:19.381
If you could give me the top three challenges you feel, when it comes to managing people, like where do you think the big gaping challenges come from?
00:13:20.220 --> 00:13:23.580
Yeah, I would first say a lot of them come from a place between our ears.
00:13:24.279 --> 00:13:30.870
You know, our challenge is often that we impose our thoughts and our experiences on people that we're working with.
00:13:30.870 --> 00:13:37.850
And so we, if we understand the vision and where we're going and it just all makes sense, we tend to think everybody else should, and that's just not the case,
00:13:38.056 --> 00:13:39.706
Because I get it, you should, Amy.
00:13:39.816 --> 00:13:41.755
If I understand it, why is it not clear?
00:13:42.440 --> 00:13:49.830
so that's really when, when I think about it, a lot of times people tend to be a leader or a manager, and for my whole career, I've been both.
00:13:50.049 --> 00:13:51.409
and so I'll share this with you.
00:13:51.659 --> 00:13:57.870
you know, y- I love it as you say,"You're the visionary, I'm the integrator." I, on the, rocket fuel assessment, I'm actually both.
00:13:57.889 --> 00:14:00.500
I'm both a visionary and an integrator, have done that.
00:14:00.820 --> 00:14:03.769
I love, love, love being in the visionary seat though, so Matt, you're awesome.
00:14:03.970 --> 00:14:13.419
And, uh, and the ability though to be able to lead, so have that vision, but really be, communicating it and sharing it, and, I always say at first it's shared on all.
00:14:13.710 --> 00:14:16.179
We need it to be shared by all, and that
00:14:16.224 --> 00:14:16.854
well said.
00:14:16.913 --> 00:14:21.264
I literally FBA followed by O is one of my favorite acronyms, but shared...
00:14:21.264 --> 00:14:22.024
Say that again
00:14:22.248 --> 00:14:36.028
we talk about having the vision shared by all, and what I'd say to teams that I work with, I say,"Remember, it's shared on all at first." We're telling them, but until they're experiencing it and they're seeing where it goes, and we help them.
00:14:36.028 --> 00:14:39.927
So we share the vision with them from a leadership perspective.
00:14:40.087 --> 00:14:44.798
We manage them to see what it really means week by week from a management perspective.
00:14:45.238 --> 00:14:53.950
So if you think about s- vision and, and the key component of vision for EOS, it's then looking at the scorecard, looking at the traction in terms of cadence.
00:14:53.960 --> 00:14:55.909
So that's how those all fit together.
00:14:55.909 --> 00:15:04.690
I think, you know, Gino just did a, a, an amazing genius job of putting the pieces together in a way that it's leading and managing, and from that, people want to get there.
00:15:04.919 --> 00:15:06.340
I led, volunteers.
00:15:06.340 --> 00:15:15.029
When you're leading volunteers at a point in my career, right, that you don't, ever get to meet, and you're certainly not giving them a paycheck, you have to though still have accountability.
00:15:15.370 --> 00:15:21.120
and it's things that I've absolutely watched how I've been able to do that by having a good team around me.
00:15:21.360 --> 00:15:24.559
We're sharing the vision, and then of course, you know, it's a team sport.
00:15:24.779 --> 00:15:31.289
I would say the lucky part of anything when I'm teaching clients, they're like,"Is there a quiz on this?" And somebody will go,"No, there's not a quiz,"'cause they...
00:15:31.529 --> 00:15:33.379
And I'll say,"Oh, well, actually there is.
00:15:33.389 --> 00:15:35.539
You know, the quiz, though, is real life.
00:15:35.639 --> 00:15:39.049
Thank goodness it's open book and it's a team sport." So
00:15:39.070 --> 00:15:39.700
What a win.
00:15:39.940 --> 00:15:41.072
We can all use it together
00:15:41.192 --> 00:15:43.523
yeah, get back to your leadership team manual and use it.
00:15:43.763 --> 00:15:46.373
So the one is really getting that vision shared.
00:15:46.582 --> 00:15:49.163
and another is, that open, honest communication, right?
00:15:49.283 --> 00:15:55.432
Making sure that, we're not, again, placing our thoughts of what they're thinking or should be thinking, that we're asking.
00:15:55.432 --> 00:15:58.842
We're really communicating, listening as well as speaking.
00:15:59.202 --> 00:16:02.633
and I would say that, a big part is getting, that team health.
00:16:02.633 --> 00:16:11.706
And obviously, if we share a vision and people are aligned to it, if we are communicating and managing well, and, and all of that, then what happens is team health.
00:16:11.706 --> 00:16:14.147
And as team health increases, so do the other two.
00:16:14.147 --> 00:16:16.157
So it's really moving everything up
00:16:16.178 --> 00:16:18.989
how that metric follows so many other ones, right?
00:16:19.013 --> 00:16:19.432
does.
00:16:19.482 --> 00:16:20.192
It sure does
00:16:20.308 --> 00:16:20.828
That's awesome.
00:16:21.219 --> 00:16:36.788
well, you talked about this, your scavenger hunt, and I love it because I've never heard, that term, and it's definitely gonna be the title of the episode, which is Career Scavenger Hunt, because I feel like that's such a telling term that is, you know, scavenger hunts end in good things, right?
00:16:36.818 --> 00:16:42.989
you don't always get there the right way, but the end goal is to get the end goal, and sometimes you go different ways to get there, and everyone has a journey.
00:16:43.528 --> 00:16:46.308
But, I'd love to talk about your experience with some of your clients.
00:16:46.308 --> 00:16:52.058
You know, you've said you've had, you know, north of 300, sessions and, you know, you're dealing with a lot of different clients.
00:16:52.369 --> 00:16:59.708
do you see any overlap in industries for yourself based from your geography, based on your interest, based off your experience?
00:16:59.739 --> 00:17:04.068
Do you find yourself overlapping with folks or industry types?
00:17:04.209 --> 00:17:05.459
If yes, tell us more.
00:17:05.679 --> 00:17:06.828
If no, tell me why.
00:17:07.557 --> 00:17:12.267
So, well, I would say for me it's a no, and it's mostly because I'm a scavenger, right?
00:17:12.267 --> 00:17:15.196
So, scavenger also means I'm intentional, right?
00:17:15.196 --> 00:17:17.156
There's intentionality of getting to the end goal.
00:17:17.156 --> 00:17:25.817
And so for me, I, love the fact that I love to put myself in places that are different from either even the multiple many industries I've worked in.
00:17:26.136 --> 00:17:33.176
And so, what I've recognized and while certainly EOS works, for, businesses, it also works for nonprofits.
00:17:33.186 --> 00:17:43.237
So I have a number of nonprofit, clients that have been thriving with EOS, and they're like, you know,"Well, I don't know if we're entrepreneurial." I'm like,"Well, if you're agile, you know, that's...
00:17:43.237 --> 00:17:48.096
You need agility." that's what we're talking about here is being able to really envision your next and move it forward.
00:17:48.346 --> 00:18:06.676
So I have a 330-member nonprofit, who just graduated, and during that time, of their four lines of service, 330 people across I think it's a dozen, counties, across those four lines of service, two of the lines of service had major funding challenges.
00:18:07.017 --> 00:18:08.836
kinda geopolitical things happened, right?
00:18:09.136 --> 00:18:29.567
So I remember hearing about it and thinking,"Oh my goodness, I've gotta call and place a call to the visionary there and see, you know, what can I do to help." and so I put a note to my assistant who called me before 8:00 in the morning and said,"You know, should I set up a meeting?" I said,"Well, if I don't hear from her, you know, the visionary soon, I w- let's do that." I'm on the phone with my assistant while the visionary calls in.
00:18:29.567 --> 00:18:32.126
It was barely eight o'clock, and I picked up the phone.
00:18:32.146 --> 00:18:34.237
Of course, I'm like,"Sorry, gotta, I gotta dump you.
00:18:34.237 --> 00:18:39.596
Let me pick her up." And I picked up the call, and she starts asking,"Oh, could you like teach our mid-levels?
00:18:39.596 --> 00:18:45.007
'Cause we've done it, but you know, you make it look so easy, and we've done well, but we're not gonna be as fast.
00:18:45.007 --> 00:18:50.737
Like we, we want to really have them get it." The shared on all needed to get to shared by all quickly, right?
00:18:50.737 --> 00:18:59.203
And so, she said,"Do you do that?" you can imagine I'm rarely speechless, but I was,'cause I'm thinking,"What is she asking?" I'm like,"Sure." And she said,"Is that a session?
00:18:59.203 --> 00:18:59.784
Is that like...
00:18:59.897 --> 00:19:05.228
What's the fee for that?" And so I'm like,"Well, you know, yes, there's usually a fee, You know, I've got workbooks.
00:19:05.248 --> 00:19:09.125
We can do that." And, but today, yeah, I'm like,"But you know, whatever you need.
00:19:09.125 --> 00:19:10.185
Well, let's get it on the schedule.
00:19:10.185 --> 00:19:11.145
We need it, next week.
00:19:11.185 --> 00:19:19.165
Can we do it next week?" So I'm like transacting this business with somebody that I'm thinking,"Oh my gosh, I just need to call and help them," you know?
00:19:19.516 --> 00:19:21.986
And so we get all done with that transact.
00:19:22.016 --> 00:19:25.266
"Now, you'll send an invoice?" I'm like,"Okay." You know?
00:19:25.528 --> 00:19:29.759
and then she's starting to conclude the call, and I'm like,"Well, wait." And she said,"Oh my gosh, wait, Amy.
00:19:29.959 --> 00:19:30.818
I'm so sorry.
00:19:31.068 --> 00:19:40.338
I just n- I need to back up." She said,"You probably aren't aware of this, but we had two of our main pillars of services get hit by a funding crisis, today.
00:19:40.558 --> 00:19:47.729
And so we had an emergency executive team, you know, leadership team meeting-" At 7:00 this morning, and we all determined a couple of things.
00:19:47.729 --> 00:19:50.090
One, that, you have led us well.
00:19:50.090 --> 00:19:50.980
You've taught us well.
00:19:51.191 --> 00:19:52.230
I don't lead, I teach, right?
00:19:52.381 --> 00:20:07.030
and she said,"Because we knew that we needed to delegate more, and you've, you know, helped us with that, and we recognized what we need to do is delegate everything." So she said,"While I and the marketing person have always done fundraising, we all needed to be ambassadors.
00:20:07.050 --> 00:20:12.540
And you know, the other thing was, and you really pressed us on this, that we needed to complete our marketing strategy.
00:20:12.711 --> 00:20:14.330
We all need to know our uniques.
00:20:14.340 --> 00:20:18.567
We all need to know our proven process." And so the board has it.
00:20:18.576 --> 00:20:21.676
We have board ambassadors that we identified.
00:20:21.866 --> 00:20:30.957
and so as a result of, the delegation and having the marketing strategy and knowing who we are and how we share that with the world, it's gonna change everything.
00:20:30.967 --> 00:20:40.727
So we literally, as of today, all eight of us are executive-level fundraisers, and we are armed with the marketing strategy, and we're gonna move forward.
00:20:40.946 --> 00:20:52.355
And that's why, Amy, that's why I called, because we need you to make sure that that next level down's moving because we're really delegating as well as we can, but you know, it's a bit of a scramble.
00:20:52.634 --> 00:20:55.865
so I did go do that, uh, session and they, received it well.
00:20:55.865 --> 00:20:59.615
And the net-net of it is that was some time ago.
00:20:59.664 --> 00:21:01.535
it wasn't quite a year, but it's been a while.
00:21:01.565 --> 00:21:06.765
and they just graduated, so they finished their EOS journey to mastery.
00:21:07.025 --> 00:21:08.005
They're awesome.
00:21:08.164 --> 00:21:18.144
I'm not saying everybody should have, like, such a pinch point that it creates that positive pressure to make sure they get everything done, but, it was terrific and, they did not lay off anyone.
00:21:18.886 --> 00:21:19.646
Wow
00:21:19.954 --> 00:21:20.924
it was incredible.
00:21:20.934 --> 00:21:26.444
So when I talk about different industries, I also talk about for-profit and not-for-profit as well.
00:21:26.444 --> 00:21:32.575
So, I know, because I've maybe led nonprofits and I'm on a lot of different boards and things, I'm able to do that.
00:21:32.575 --> 00:21:42.565
But across my, career, I've been in many places and, same thing then when, you know, no surprise, I have, And again, I have clients that are in the typical 10 to 250 people range.
00:21:42.785 --> 00:21:44.704
I have clients with thousands of people.
00:21:44.984 --> 00:21:46.647
You are listening to the Scalability Code.
00:21:46.647 --> 00:21:54.817
I'm your host, Matt Haney, founder of Sinclair Ventures, and we help visionary entrepreneurs like you get out of the shit show and focus on growing your business.
00:21:54.957 --> 00:22:01.356
We offer fractional COO and leadership coaching services that free up that brain of yours to focus on what's next.
00:22:01.846 --> 00:22:03.586
Learn more about us at SinclairVentures.
00:22:03.586 --> 00:22:03.936
com.
00:22:03.957 --> 00:22:04.576
Now back to it.
00:22:05.659 --> 00:22:11.199
I had a referral, to come in as a fractional integrator to a client, and they were really small, not running on EOS.
00:22:11.459 --> 00:22:12.929
they're retail salons.
00:22:13.028 --> 00:22:16.759
picture self-tanning or waxing or spray tans or whatnot.
00:22:17.338 --> 00:22:18.429
Three locations.
00:22:18.469 --> 00:22:21.128
Each location has three to five employees.
00:22:21.469 --> 00:22:26.219
And then at the ownership level, there's really the owner, the visionary, and an operations manager.
00:22:27.009 --> 00:22:28.689
so very limited team.
00:22:28.699 --> 00:22:29.358
So what is that?
00:22:29.368 --> 00:22:37.878
15, maybe 17 employees total, but really only two at that management layer, visionary, integrator, that's it.
00:22:38.888 --> 00:22:45.338
Really hard to come in, to an organization like that and I was fearful of joining because I thought I was going to fail.
00:22:45.509 --> 00:22:49.898
and h-how do you-- I mean, do you do implementations that small?
00:22:49.929 --> 00:22:53.598
Do you generally steer-- I mean, there's really two people to get the work done.
00:22:53.818 --> 00:22:56.148
So tell me about your experience.
00:22:56.148 --> 00:22:59.308
Have you gone anything that small and, give me a little backstory.
00:22:59.923 --> 00:23:01.522
No, that's, that's excellent, Matt.
00:23:01.752 --> 00:23:03.323
A great example to spring from.
00:23:03.363 --> 00:23:09.403
I would tell you as, as any great, uh, person who works with other organizations would say, it depends.
00:23:09.982 --> 00:23:14.403
So, I do have, a team that started out with just two on the leadership team.
00:23:14.553 --> 00:23:21.623
It was an entrepreneur through acquisition, so it was an entrepreneur who, became one by acquiring something in a field he didn't really...
00:23:21.673 --> 00:23:26.502
he knew some of, I believe, but was not, particularly skilled in it, experienced in it, I should say.
00:23:26.913 --> 00:23:34.982
and he, sought me out, found me and said,"I know you've, helped people self-implement early on and, you have a lot of self-implementers that come to you." So that's...
00:23:34.992 --> 00:23:39.873
If there's anything, maybe that's kind of a, an area where people reach out to me because I've done it.
00:23:39.962 --> 00:23:45.450
but then, I was asking him about his team and, and it was the sales, director and him.
00:23:45.759 --> 00:23:50.782
So it was visionary/integrator in one and sales in the other.
00:23:50.782 --> 00:24:02.500
And I'm like,"So who leads your operations?" And he said,"Well, we, you know, acquired this organization, and it had been around for 70 years and, uh, you know, we, we don't have anybody, but we aspire to that.
00:24:02.500 --> 00:24:08.720
We aspire to getting somebody there, but I just wanna see what we can learn." I'll tell you, I didn't expect them to go on the journey.
00:24:08.720 --> 00:24:16.130
I did an overview for them and gave them books and, shared with them, a good, overview and some thoughts and a lot of questions.
00:24:16.130 --> 00:24:17.220
I'm always about questions.
00:24:17.470 --> 00:24:26.477
and it was interesting because I get to the end of it, and I'm often so surprised, you know, because I don't think they're gonna want to go on the EOS implementation journey with me.
00:24:26.696 --> 00:24:29.676
and so I said,"So, you know, let me know how I can help you," blah, blah, blah.
00:24:29.676 --> 00:24:32.423
And he's like,"Wait-" aren't we good enough for you?
00:24:32.942 --> 00:24:34.633
And, uh, or something similar.
00:24:34.633 --> 00:24:38.613
I can't remember exactly, but I just remember being stunned by it, so that's why I don't remember probably.
00:24:39.039 --> 00:24:41.970
and I said,"Wait, are you interested?" and he said,"Yes.
00:24:42.250 --> 00:24:46.299
You know, when I acquired this, I wanted to move it forward and get it stabilized.
00:24:46.369 --> 00:25:01.730
My goal is to go off and do other things, you know, at a point or whatever." But he said, I can't imagine, you know, wanting to do it, you know, slowly." He said,"And I can't imagine doing this on our own as quickly as you could help us through it." So they're almost to graduation as well.
00:25:01.920 --> 00:25:03.460
And along the way, what happens?
00:25:03.460 --> 00:25:05.359
We build the accountability chart.
00:25:05.430 --> 00:25:12.359
we look at what, you know, right people, right seats can look like, and they now have an ops lead on the leadership team.
00:25:12.599 --> 00:25:25.623
So they've got the three people, and I do believe over time that that visionary/integrator, most of the time I have visionaries suffer from integrators, and if they don't start out that way, it happens pretty quickly.
00:25:25.853 --> 00:25:33.992
but in that example, it took a while, and I do think over time that you know, an integrator need will emerge, once, you know, the processes are all in place.
00:25:33.992 --> 00:25:37.643
So, so that's an example of really, you know, small side.
00:25:37.732 --> 00:25:41.843
I would say this, you know, we talk about, you know, EOS, it's, it's, you know, whether you...
00:25:41.903 --> 00:25:47.070
I can't remember if you said one size fits all or what it was, but, think it applies to different sizes, to different industries.
00:25:47.141 --> 00:25:54.790
I haven't run into an industry, for-profit or nonprofit, that it didn't make sense for, and I think because we all have to have a system, right?
00:25:54.790 --> 00:26:04.428
We all have to have a way that we do things or else we can't scale, Even, you know, when it's a family business, we don't all understand where we're going and, you know, have that cadence.
00:26:04.438 --> 00:26:08.538
So I mean, without it, you really need to have a communication, you know, mechanism.
00:26:08.538 --> 00:26:20.218
all of that said, I do think though that, the journey will, while the actual steps in the process, the agendas in the sessions may all look the same, we take it on a different course.
00:26:20.458 --> 00:26:33.597
If somebody has that need to, run operations while they're also trying to figure out the whole rest of the organization, we might jump early on to developing their process table of contents so they have someplace to hang their processes off from.
00:26:33.877 --> 00:26:42.627
Another that's having financial difficulty and comes because of profitability issues, we're gonna spend time earlier on talking about their cash flow drivers.
00:26:42.698 --> 00:26:46.938
So the EOS tools that are chosen, aren't always chosen in the same order.
00:26:47.147 --> 00:26:49.597
there's some foundational ones that need to be at the beginning.
00:26:49.768 --> 00:26:56.387
But after that, I'm gonna take a team where they need it to go, and I'm gonna be listening to them and having conversations about it.
00:26:56.617 --> 00:27:07.968
So that's, I think, of the beautiful parts of EOS is that ability to have a consistent set of tools, but we may have it scheduled inconsistently to, really what an organization best needs.
00:27:08.718 --> 00:27:09.397
That's awesome.
00:27:09.557 --> 00:27:11.077
That's such a great, piece.
00:27:11.107 --> 00:27:29.929
Okay, let's jump into tools, I do believe, and this is my opinion, having sat in many sessions as an integrator, not at the board as an implementer where you folks do your fine work, but us as implementers, I think there are certain implementers that teach tools really well, like specific tools.
00:27:30.548 --> 00:27:38.028
So, if there's a tool in your mind that you think,"Man, I'm really exceptional at it," or,"I just really like it," I'd love to know what that is.
00:27:38.398 --> 00:27:39.088
don't answer.
00:27:39.259 --> 00:27:40.138
I'm gonna go first.
00:27:40.138 --> 00:27:40.719
You think.
00:27:41.108 --> 00:27:51.929
I love the accountability chart as the integrator because it makes, my favorite part of it are, I'm looking at it through the lens of Ninety.io'cause that's my preferred online platform.
00:27:52.189 --> 00:27:59.838
The five bullet points below the person's name are some of the most impactful five bullet points in the entire company.
00:28:00.638 --> 00:28:10.989
Because I simply get to refer back to the accountability chart, flash it up on the screen, and everyone immediately zeroes in on their own name and sees those bullet points below.
00:28:11.138 --> 00:28:11.739
This is what I do.
00:28:11.739 --> 00:28:12.169
This is what I do.
00:28:12.169 --> 00:28:12.959
This is what I do.
00:28:13.608 --> 00:28:16.558
And it just brings what I call visual accountability.
00:28:16.749 --> 00:28:23.778
It's a term I use a lot, which is like we just visually see through the EOS platform, through Ninety.io visually what I'm accountable for.
00:28:24.169 --> 00:28:26.338
And if I'm not on it, then I'm not on it.
00:28:26.429 --> 00:28:29.538
So the accountability chart is near and dear to my heart as an integrator.
00:28:29.568 --> 00:28:32.979
I would love to know what you love in terms of EOS tools.
00:28:35.288 --> 00:28:38.219
Well, now that I shouldn't use accountability chart,'cause that was so cool.
00:28:38.269 --> 00:28:39.949
'Cause that's,'cause it's also my initials,
00:28:40.280 --> 00:28:40.750
Gotcha.
00:28:40.961 --> 00:28:41.691
I got it first
00:28:43.348 --> 00:28:45.259
it, it is im- it's so impactful.
00:28:45.298 --> 00:28:46.298
so I love what you said.
00:28:46.608 --> 00:28:50.709
I would talk about the Vision Traction Organizer all day long, and that would be so unfair.
00:28:50.909 --> 00:28:53.179
'cause it's awesome, and I think people see that.
00:28:53.229 --> 00:28:56.778
you know, if they're experiencing it, it allows them to get clarity and all of that.
00:28:57.019 --> 00:29:00.338
Let me talk about one that I think is kind of m- maybe magical.
00:29:00.538 --> 00:29:01.459
I won't say I'm...
00:29:01.469 --> 00:29:04.318
You know, I'm not perfect by any stretch at anything, right?
00:29:04.348 --> 00:29:04.828
We aren't.
00:29:04.909 --> 00:29:11.528
But I love the fact that maybe a place where you might be surprised that I have patience, I'm very patient.
00:29:11.528 --> 00:29:13.808
I ask a question, and I'll wait for a long time.
00:29:14.028 --> 00:29:16.628
I'll help them, with new questions to help them get there.
00:29:16.929 --> 00:29:25.798
I love the eight cashflow drivers, and the reason why is that it's so impactful as well, even if an organization's doing well.
00:29:25.808 --> 00:29:30.868
I mean, earlier in my implementations, I would tell you that that kind of would be...
00:29:30.878 --> 00:29:34.419
You know, people would kick that down to the later tools, and that was fine with me.
00:29:34.729 --> 00:29:43.048
And I tend to urge it earlier, especially if we have time for an extra tool, you know, in a session, or, you know, there's nothing that they need right that minute.
00:29:43.308 --> 00:29:46.778
and the reason why I do this is that, I think it helps so many ways.
00:29:46.818 --> 00:30:09.825
One, that the finance director or the, the, you know, the finance seat in the room, everything doesn't just fall to them that, that now we start thinking about, you know, everybody's thinking about cash flow, and, you know, how they can impact, you know, positive on the, on the, the, the top end, the top line of, of revenue or, or whatever it might be, donations, et cetera, ancillary revenue.
00:30:09.865 --> 00:30:15.924
and then also how they can impact the profitability by looking at things where we're leaking, you know, where we could do things differently.
00:30:16.214 --> 00:30:20.575
And, one of the things I didn't talk about, I'm a Lean Six Sigma Master Black Belt only because it's fun to
00:30:20.663 --> 00:30:21.333
didn't know that.
00:30:21.502 --> 00:30:22.363
That's pretty amazing
00:30:22.694 --> 00:30:24.674
I don't like that much data anymore, so...
00:30:24.845 --> 00:30:34.234
But I always kinda have an eye to waste, an eye to, you know, those things that we're waiting on or those things that we just really don't need to do if we're really focused on where we need to go.
00:30:34.515 --> 00:30:39.045
and it brings it into it without any, you know, I don't introduce any new words or terms or anything.
00:30:39.045 --> 00:30:39.755
We don't need to.
00:30:39.954 --> 00:30:44.404
The tool as it's developed and as we teach it, it really does the work.
00:30:44.595 --> 00:30:56.335
But what's amazing is that I'll have teams who are like,"Yeah, let's see how this one pans out, Amy." And, much like the, you know, doing the process table of contents where they're like,"Oh my gosh, it's so big." But what do we do?
00:30:56.335 --> 00:30:58.595
We help them simplify, right?
00:30:58.724 --> 00:31:07.234
And so eight cash flow drivers, we might start out with, 16 things on the board, but what we really dig into is which ones are most important for us?
00:31:07.285 --> 00:31:08.434
Who can impact it?
00:31:08.434 --> 00:31:12.454
Not, no, we're not looking at the finance director because he gets these data for us.
00:31:12.674 --> 00:31:19.154
We need to look at who in the room can make a difference to the end result and the numbers that we're receiving, right?
00:31:19.434 --> 00:31:21.654
And so it starts placing accountability.
00:31:21.654 --> 00:31:24.404
So I'll just tie into your accountability chart conversation.
00:31:24.585 --> 00:31:37.075
I literally this week just, pointed to that and said,"See how this eight cash flow or your, whatever your number's gonna be, your cash flow drivers really start talking about accountability." Now we should check and make sure in the accountability chart we haven't missed anything.
00:31:37.075 --> 00:31:49.924
If these are the most important, impactful things for us to do good work, because whether it's profitability needs to increase or whether we need a cash reserve to support the business, sustainability of the businesses, there's so many reasons.
00:31:49.924 --> 00:31:51.305
It's not just about profitability.
00:31:51.355 --> 00:31:56.174
it's about the long-term longevity of the organization and what we can learn.
00:31:56.505 --> 00:32:01.255
You know, 1% in one place, can be significant everywhere else.
00:32:01.285 --> 00:32:05.755
And so once we see that, then we go to, you know, so what are we gonna do about it?
00:32:05.755 --> 00:32:16.394
And I just find that I've never, taught the eight cash flow drivers working on that and had people not go,"Oh," when we got done, and also not take that and build rocks from it.
00:32:17.045 --> 00:32:26.730
And so again, Gino's genius and, you know, what we need to do first is, use tool and then get into building our rocks for the quarter, and that's another reason why.
00:32:26.740 --> 00:32:29.230
That the tool should help us inform what we need to do.
00:32:29.230 --> 00:32:31.640
We should be learning and seeing something from it.
00:32:31.650 --> 00:32:33.150
So there you go.
00:32:33.612 --> 00:32:34.172
I love it.
00:32:34.481 --> 00:32:35.991
what do you do to keep yourself busy?
00:32:36.132 --> 00:32:40.858
What hobbies, what interests, what things keep you, uh, firing on all cylinders?
00:32:41.903 --> 00:32:42.292
Yeah, terrific.
00:32:42.303 --> 00:32:50.813
Well, for decades it was, you know, I love search and rescue and helping, you know, youth leadership and all those fun things that the Civil Air Patrol gave me a, a place for.
00:32:50.813 --> 00:32:52.303
I've also served with the Red Cross.
00:32:52.323 --> 00:32:54.982
I've done a lot of things, but, I would tell you...
00:32:55.002 --> 00:33:02.742
And now I'm on the Civil Air Patrol Foundation board as a trustee nationally, so still helping there, but I'm not flying around in aircraft anymore.
00:33:02.962 --> 00:33:12.516
But what I, w-recognize is that I could serve, I have, you know, governance background and certification, so helping with, you know, some of the, local organizations that are needed it.
00:33:12.566 --> 00:33:20.578
My mom was really big in community education and really making sure that, journalism and news and everything was important.
00:33:20.578 --> 00:33:28.509
So when there was a local journalism foundation that was, springing up in my local town, I, just asked about it, and the next th- And you gotta be careful, right?
00:33:28.509 --> 00:33:30.229
'Cause the next thing I know, they're like,"Hey.
00:33:30.499 --> 00:33:36.618
Hey, you should be on our board." So I do spend some time doing things like that, that I really think are giving back to my community.
00:33:36.868 --> 00:33:47.419
The other thing I would tell you is I love, love, love to learn, so I'm always, you know, reading, probably m- not as much as I'd, I'd like to, or listening to, to books, although I do that a little bit less.
00:33:47.509 --> 00:33:48.378
I tend to read more.
00:33:48.588 --> 00:33:54.578
But the ability for me to continue moving forward, I'm, in strategic coach myself, so I get coached.
00:33:54.898 --> 00:34:10.063
So I just came back from a, a conference for a few days, and continuing to, sharpen my tools, and really make sure I'm doing, not only just good work in, EOS and the implementation of it, but also, you know, that I'm a good human and that I'm keeping myself balanced and that I'm focused.
00:34:10.063 --> 00:34:12.342
I know it's harder than it looks, but you know that.
00:34:12.563 --> 00:34:23.782
and so, I was a two-sport athlete in high school, played two different sports in college, and recognized a few years ago like,"Hey, I've never learned how to play tennis," when everybody else was playing pickleball, so I'm a little late probably.
00:34:23.782 --> 00:34:26.393
anyway, I learned how to play tennis, and I'm pretty ambidextrous.
00:34:26.402 --> 00:34:29.492
When I played softball, I'd hit Grand Slams left-handed and right-handed.
00:34:29.682 --> 00:34:41.273
Well, it turns out one day when I was getting a blister on my thumb'cause the ball machine kept, wasn't randomizing very well, I flipped the racket in my other hand and could hear my coach that I've had like maybe six hours of lessons from.
00:34:41.822 --> 00:34:49.373
S- You know, I'm like,"How did I do that, that top spin this h-hand?" And so I, I haven't figured out how to serve with both handed.
00:34:49.373 --> 00:34:50.702
I don't even know if I serve well with one.
00:34:50.932 --> 00:34:56.313
But I've gotta tell you, I've had so much fun, just learning something new like that as well.
00:34:56.492 --> 00:35:13.335
And I need to get back to coaching Special basketball because I found that when I played in, college, I, wasn't as good of a, um, rebounder as when I'm, I'm keeping the ball from hitting some, you know, kid's head, because they're not, you know, putting their own hands up to protect themselves.
00:35:13.335 --> 00:35:16.360
So It improves my rebound, ability, greatly.
00:35:16.360 --> 00:35:19.579
But, I love that across, some sports, helping the community.
00:35:19.789 --> 00:35:24.489
And then, we have a golden retriever, six-year-old, who is learning to be a therapy dog.
00:35:24.530 --> 00:35:28.599
and we got him during COVID knowing that he love, love, loves people.
00:35:28.610 --> 00:35:32.190
He's the ambassador at the bus stop in the morning and things like that.
00:35:32.190 --> 00:35:34.152
So, um, try to round all that out.
00:35:34.163 --> 00:35:35.052
Love to travel too.
00:35:35.052 --> 00:35:36.083
Just came back from France.
00:35:36.092 --> 00:35:36.402
So,
00:35:36.838 --> 00:35:37.639
That's very cool.
00:35:37.668 --> 00:35:38.349
Very cool.
00:35:38.688 --> 00:35:40.778
Well, I think we-- Any questions for me?
00:35:40.778 --> 00:35:45.929
Any thoughts, curiosities about what it was like for a fractional integrator or things that jump up?
00:35:45.929 --> 00:35:51.068
I don't know if you have any experience working with fractional integrators, but I'd love to answer any questions if any of them come to mind
00:35:51.650 --> 00:35:52.530
Yeah, I do.
00:35:52.550 --> 00:35:56.150
And, would just love to know, like, you know, if, if you have a sweet spot in that.
00:35:56.221 --> 00:35:58.690
and maybe, you know, whether it's industry or size.
00:35:58.760 --> 00:36:01.210
but then also, thinking about, Matt, the...
00:36:01.501 --> 00:36:09.431
You know, sometimes you know that you're going in to help somebody rise to be an integrator, and sometimes you're going in just to be a- Would you speak to that, please?
00:36:09.565 --> 00:36:10.445
Yeah, absolutely.
00:36:10.454 --> 00:36:13.215
So a little background, around specialties.
00:36:13.235 --> 00:36:17.954
You know, I, I look back through the engagements I've had, and there, there is overlap for me.
00:36:18.307 --> 00:36:21.534
but I love the scavenger hunt reference'cause they're all over the place.
00:36:21.934 --> 00:36:22.465
But there are.
00:36:22.465 --> 00:36:25.724
I've worked with several construction-related companies, service businesses.
00:36:25.744 --> 00:36:33.518
Everyone says,"What's your niche?" And I say,"Service-based businesses, business to business." Professional blue collar or white.
00:36:33.668 --> 00:36:38.829
So any business that's B2B that is in the blue collar or white collar industry.
00:36:38.898 --> 00:36:39.949
Ah, what does that mean?
00:36:40.239 --> 00:36:51.268
I tend to work with construction firms, whether it's a mechanical engineering company, which is aluminum manufacturing business, exterior renovations for high-rises, those would all be service-based businesses, B2B.
00:36:51.289 --> 00:36:56.739
So I did just finish an implementation, or an integration with a company that's was in the high-tech space.
00:36:56.739 --> 00:37:00.298
They were, building a tech platform that we actually ended up selling to Accenture.
00:37:00.809 --> 00:37:07.498
So, I'm currently an Accenture employee through transitioning that business over and building a business unit within Accenture.
00:37:07.509 --> 00:37:09.289
So that's been a ton of fun.
00:37:09.489 --> 00:37:14.369
and getting to see what seven hundred thousand people looks like in a business is truly fascinating.
00:37:14.748 --> 00:37:15.818
but that's been a lot of fun.
00:37:15.818 --> 00:37:19.139
I have a client currently that's in the, real estate investment space.
00:37:19.139 --> 00:37:22.248
They buy retail centers, improve them, lease them up, and resell them.
00:37:22.648 --> 00:37:23.989
it's really been all over the place.
00:37:24.018 --> 00:37:31.128
But the one common theme for me as a fractional integrator is working alongside a visionary that is, humble and curious.
00:37:31.668 --> 00:37:34.349
You'll hear me say those terms a lot or my clients get sick of it.
00:37:34.358 --> 00:37:50.929
It's like,"Let's stay humble and let's stay curious." one of my clients sent me over a little picture of Curious George, like an animated GIF being curious, and I'm like,"All right, you earn the nickname Curious George." I tend to align myself successfully with visionaries that are creative-- or sorry, curious and humble.
00:37:51.318 --> 00:37:52.878
So that's a little bit of that.
00:37:53.639 --> 00:38:01.018
one of the greatest joys that come to me as a fractional integrator is knowing when and how to transition out of a business.
00:38:01.309 --> 00:38:03.659
I'm coming in as the now, not forever.
00:38:03.918 --> 00:38:11.728
I say that very clearly up front because I don't want there to be a misconception that I'm coming in to take roles or I'm coming in to fire and hire.
00:38:11.759 --> 00:38:13.489
I am coming in to hire, hopefully not fire.
00:38:13.858 --> 00:38:17.199
But I am coming in to hold teams accountable, and that looks like a lot of things.
00:38:17.199 --> 00:38:20.289
Accountability gets a really negative rap these days.
00:38:20.289 --> 00:38:22.128
It's a four-letter word in the world.
00:38:22.648 --> 00:38:28.818
But, I try to make accountability as practical and, relatable as possible, not a micromanagement.
00:38:29.188 --> 00:38:39.719
And as I referenced earlier, EOS gives us the ability through the platforms that I use to manage EOS, but also through the VTOs and the tools for that visual accountability piece.
00:38:39.838 --> 00:38:45.768
It's really special to show something up on a screen and let people know that they're seeing it and holding themselves accountable.
00:38:46.119 --> 00:38:49.018
I just have the intuition to put it in front of them so that they go get it done.
00:38:49.588 --> 00:38:54.278
so that's a little bit about what it's like working with a fractional, but transitioning out is fun.
00:38:54.378 --> 00:38:58.329
I get to bring someone up from within, train them and onboard them, which is awesome.
00:38:58.358 --> 00:39:06.275
Or I get to bring someone from the outside, hire onboard, train, and I get a unique relationship with everyone now.
00:39:06.364 --> 00:39:09.454
I've got a relationship with the EOSi implementer who brings me in.
00:39:09.885 --> 00:39:12.905
I've got a relationship with the visionary who I've been working with for months.
00:39:13.235 --> 00:39:16.394
Now I have a relationship with the integrator.
00:39:17.135 --> 00:39:17.985
How cool is that?
00:39:18.014 --> 00:39:21.375
Because I've trained the integrator outside of the visionary.
00:39:21.625 --> 00:39:32.735
So the preexisting conditions that the visionary brings to every hire are no longer part of this onboarding because I'm the one responsible for hiring my replacement and ensuring their success.
00:39:33.005 --> 00:39:34.894
Okay, fast-forward 30, 60, 90.
00:39:34.894 --> 00:39:40.514
I get to go back to all three of those people, EOSi, integrator, and check in.
00:39:40.704 --> 00:39:41.375
How's it going?
00:39:41.585 --> 00:39:42.585
Are you having your one-on-one?
00:39:42.954 --> 00:39:44.335
Are you having your same page meeting?
00:39:44.664 --> 00:39:45.485
When's it quarterly?
00:39:45.824 --> 00:39:52.324
And I just get to be curious with those three people to figure out, how it's going to avoid a false start.
00:39:52.625 --> 00:39:56.494
So that's a really cool piece of what we get to do as fractional integrators
00:39:57.570 --> 00:39:58.590
that's fantastic.
00:39:58.721 --> 00:39:59.190
I love it.
00:39:59.240 --> 00:40:05.041
And, and you know, it r- it, r- reminds me I've graduated a number of clients, just early this year.
00:40:05.050 --> 00:40:06.311
I had a whole pack.
00:40:06.320 --> 00:40:07.291
It was, fun.
00:40:07.380 --> 00:40:10.541
and, you know, to be able to celebrate their mastery, right?
00:40:10.561 --> 00:40:15.951
And, and, and without me ever asking, they talk about, like, what's been so different, you know?
00:40:16.170 --> 00:40:21.791
Well, remember pre-EOS, and it's like it's a whole era now, pre-EOS, and then they talk about where they are.
00:40:21.990 --> 00:40:27.990
And what's fascinating about it is you know, as you talk about the, like, graduating or, you know, moving out, right?
00:40:28.260 --> 00:40:46.128
That, going back and checking back in with them, that's some of the, just wonderful work that we do, kind of unpaid, but oh my gosh, but you're paid by the, the energy and the success and/or being able to ask a question or help solve something if, you know, our curiosity leads us to you know, is that going okay?
00:40:46.358 --> 00:40:50.708
And so I love how that works, and, and it is, something that's just really special.
00:40:51.297 --> 00:40:52.148
That's fantastic.
00:40:52.387 --> 00:40:52.858
Yeah,'cause we
00:40:52.907 --> 00:40:54.038
I'd love to close this down.
00:40:54.038 --> 00:40:56.217
If you've got any final thoughts, I'd love to hear them.
00:40:56.237 --> 00:40:57.588
Otherwise, we'll wrap up
00:40:58.340 --> 00:40:58.639
Yeah.
00:40:58.639 --> 00:41:03.489
I loved how you talked about, staying curious and humble and having, visionaries that start there.
00:41:03.489 --> 00:41:07.699
And I will tell you, I probably am a tiny bit different in that and can afford to be.
00:41:07.860 --> 00:41:18.900
When I'm starting the journey, they may or may not have, the integrator in place yet, but I'm always looking for, do I think that they can get to curious and humble?
00:41:19.230 --> 00:41:32.429
because I can think of a couple of humbling moments when teams who had really, you know, styles are always different, but that, you know, someone who may be curious, but they're not willing to concede any room in the room at first.
00:41:32.730 --> 00:41:40.559
And when they hit that point where they realize if everything has to go through me, you know, because I'm controlling that then I can't grow.
00:41:40.800 --> 00:41:48.329
And those moments, whether it's, you know, tears or whether it's, you know, just, you know, wow, I need to share with all of you, and they just start sharing.
00:41:48.559 --> 00:41:53.289
That's such an amazing, moment that we get to, and that's when they can grow.
00:41:53.300 --> 00:41:56.739
So I love that you're looking for that'cause that's when you can really help them.
00:41:56.739 --> 00:42:00.960
So I look forward to having you work with, somebody that, I get to work too.
00:42:00.960 --> 00:42:01.679
I think it would be
00:42:01.766 --> 00:42:02.315
That would be awesome.
00:42:02.556 --> 00:42:07.925
I would love to, I would love to partner with you on any of your clients that have needs and, have really enjoyed our conversation today.
00:42:07.925 --> 00:42:12.036
So, thank you very much, Amy, for joining us today on The Scalability Code.
00:42:12.065 --> 00:42:20.175
I hope we can have another conversation in the future and really look forward to, getting to know you and, maybe I'll come up to Kalamazoo one day, but only in the summer.
00:42:20.306 --> 00:42:21.226
Only in the summer.
00:42:21.295 --> 00:42:22.235
I'm not coming in the winter
00:42:23.353 --> 00:42:26.724
that's fair, and that's when I liked, having a client in LA, so I get it.
00:42:26.934 --> 00:42:27.884
thanks so much, Matt.
00:42:27.884 --> 00:42:29.563
This has been, uh, just magical.
00:42:29.693 --> 00:42:31.762
Thank you for listening to The Scalability Code.
00:42:31.793 --> 00:42:37.282
If you made it this far, please follow the show on Apple, Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:42:37.373 --> 00:42:39.833
We'll see you next time on The Scalability Code.
