Everyday Obstacles: Perfectionism | Season 4, Ep. 6

Dane:
00:00
do you wanna look perfect or be perfect?



Steve:
00:01
My whole life, I'm looking for that like ability to renegotiate with and bend a rule and justify it. That was exactly what happened Wednesday. 'cause didn't get a workout in and because I didn't get a workout in, I didn't wanna up and feel the discomfort of fessing up to that in the moment.



Steve:
00:18
And so I avoided that discomfort and was the snowballing, right?

Dane:
00:22
I think that perfectionism is a way to hide. I don't want anyone to see the seams or the cracks or the reality.



Steve:
00:30
I could have easily showed up, said what I was able to do own what I didn't.



Dane:
00:35
Skip perfectionism, be wholehearted present forward, and then in retrospect, look back and say, how'd I do? Did it work? Am I getting better? What if I could go better still?



Steve:
00:46
So what I learned from is non perfection does not mean. Failure. And for some reason I always relate those to if I'm not perfect, then I fail. So I actually loved, in a weird way, the experience of failing, making that connection fessing up to it here, and then of course, the shared contribution for the community of how to do that differently next time.



Dane:
01:09
it's not about perfect. It's about wholehearted. It's about bringing your whole self body, mind and spirit to whatever you're in the midst of, and giving your all to it in the full awareness that it might not work, that it might break, that you might fail, you might look like a fool.



Dane:
01:30
All those things are possibilities, and you do it anyways. This is an opportunity. This is not an obligation.



Dane:
01:38
Eat your own humble pie and tell a better story, a more true story. A story that's as true or more true than the first one you told. And see if you don't find yourself moving closer in the direction of wholehearted



Dane:
01:50
As humans we prefer the path of least resistance. We crave convenience, the payoff without the price. But when our lives revolve around comfort, it doesn't deliver. Living in perpetual comfort leaves us weak and asleep. This podcast is an invitation to flip that script, to choose the unlikely path, to get the life you really want through voluntary discomfort.



Dane:
02:14
This is Strong & Awake. I'm Dane Sanders.



Mitch:
02:18
So one of the things that strikes me about perfectionism and specifically about how Steve, who's a member of our community and shared that clip that you guys just heard is that perfectionism is a thief. It steals growth from us, not just on the front end when we're aiming for perfection. So we, don't even attempt that thing because we know we're not gonna be perfect at it. Or if we do it, but we don't do it perfectly and we stumble, we don't actually learn from the action either. It's stealing the, the benefit that comes from the actual action, whether we do it or not.



Mitch:
02:56
Perfectionism can be this thing that is celebrated in our culture, yet oftentimes it's the very thing that's actually stealing a lot of the growth or preventing the growth that that lays in front of us as opportunity.



Mitch:
03:10
So I, I'd love to explore this in this episode. 'Cause I think perfectionism is, is one of those things that a lot of us have. Navigated and had to think about whether that's related to work, whether that's related to how we show up in relationships or how we're relating with ourself. So, with enough preamble, Dane, I wanna get to the meat of it.



Dane:
03:30
Well, lemme, lemme just say up front, like, so if the topic today is perfectionism, I get why there's a lot of confusion here. It, it really makes sense to me. So any struggling perfectionist, my invitation for you is to not to your point, Mitch, not. Subtly, in your heart of hearts, say to yourself, this is awesome, that I'm a perfectionist and I'm just struggling.



Dane:
03:53
Whatever the hell that means. Let's open up your perfectionism bag and let's really start pulling the contents out and try to make sure we're clear on what it means and why we think it's not resourceful. That there's something that's a better resource, a different way of relating that could be helpful.



Dane:
04:12
But again, a nod to why it's confusing. We see examples in popular culture that are as close to perfect as we can imagine. So you know, it doesn't take long on Instagram to see like perfect bodies doing perfect things that are imper, like Im impossible. Like how are they doing these things?



Dane:
04:33
I was with an old time, man of discomfort friend of ours Gregory just a day or so ago as I speaking at a conference and we were did an early morning workout. It was a great time. And Gregory Benedict, if you haven't seen this TEDx, go, go see it. But Gregory and I were chatting and, I was saying, yeah. Have you seen that, that Instagram of the guy who does the Turkish getup with a barbell with, I think it's like 245 or 265 pounds, so he has like if you don't know what a Turkish getup is, normally it's done with a kettlebell, so you have total control over the entire weight the entire time.



Dane:
05:08
But this guy does it with a barbell and most people who are crazy strong. Can bench press with two arms, maybe that much weight, but that's like, that's, that's really uncommon. Most people can't get above 2 25 if they really commit to lifting. And he's at 2 65. He's doing it with one arm from the ground, pushing the bar up above his chest, getting up onto one knee, getting up onto the on onto both feet, standing up and then going down on one knee.



Dane:
05:41
Going down to his, his booty and then bringing it down, controlled to his chest and putting the bar down. It's a world record. Anyway, so Gregory was actually helping the guy set the world record. He happened to be, I think, in the room getting him all sorted. And it's real. It's not like some. Deep, fake, whatever.



Dane:
06:01
And you look at that and you're like, that isn't just perfect. That's like super human. That's just outrageous. Or again, I talk about Steph Curry all the time. I'm such a fan of his. Like when Steph Curry takes a shot, he's the greatest of all time. Of a shooting, of course we go, that's perfect. Like, how could anyone say that's not awesome?



Dane:
06:22
It is awesome. And if you asked that weightlifter or that basketball player, if they're perfect, what they'll tell you is they're not. What they'll tell you is all the shots, they miss what they'll tell. But what what gets celebrated is the one perfect execution. And in that regard, we do want to be perfect.



Dane:
06:44
But there's a difference between being perfect, like actually having a thing that happened that you did that was as close to faultless as you could imagine, but that's something that you are assessing after the fact perfect happened or didn't happen. It's binary and it's come and gone.



Dane:
07:02
Perfectionism is an expectation that this present and moving forward, it's not worth doing unless I. I can do it. Perfect. That's the problem. And when people get that mixed up, it's like it's, they've gotten their timeline screwed up. What they end up doing is they have this, they set this ridiculous expectation and even worse, they become their own worst enemy. They become that thief you're describing where they become complicit in not even trying to be excellent. And instead they just, they discount and go, well, if I can't be excellent, why bother if I can't be that guy on the internet or that woman on the internet or that whatever.



Dane:
07:43
Why bother? Mm-hmm. And what we wanna say is, because your life depends on, that's why you should bother your physical life, your emotional life, your spiritual life, and perfectionism is what you wanna reject being awesome. If you wanna call that being perfect, have at it, but like, being awesome, try to be awesome, awesome.



Dane:
08:04
Is awesome. It's worth trying to become. And the road to get there though is a different word. It's not about perfect. It's about wholehearted. It's about bringing your whole self body, mind and spirit to whatever you're in the midst of, and giving your all to it in the full awareness that it might not work, that it might break, that you might fail, you might look like a fool.



Dane:
08:32
All those things are possibilities, and you do it anyways. You do it with a smile on your face, knowing that if my whole heart's in it, I, this is an opportunity. This is not an obligation. And the reason we know this factually is because if that got taken away, if you're a basketball player and all of a sudden you lost both your hands, you don't get to shoot anymore, or you're a weightlifter and you get become a paraplegic, guess what's gonna happen?



Dane:
08:59
You gonna spend the rest of your life. Wishing you could have had a chance to do one more imperfect weightlift or one more imperfect shot that you missed because that would be the greatest of, because you'd give your whole self to it. In fact, people say, I'd give my left limb to have another chance to do X, Y, or Z.



Dane:
09:16
When I tore my Achilles many years ago, I. That was, that was my lament. And it led to a whole different way of living. And I, I wanna suggest that wholeheartedness, you don't have to wait for these things to be taken from us. For us to become wholehearted, we can be proactively wholehearted. And that's what present forward is all about.



Dane:
09:34
Skip perfectionism, be wholehearted present forward, and then in retrospect, look back and say, how'd I do? Did it work? Am I getting better? What if I could go better still?



Mitch:
09:49
It is not a, it's not a strong and awake episode unless we. Talk about Steph Curry or pickleball.



Mitch:
09:57
It's true. No, but that's, it's so true. It's, we, we see, and I think in a, even like a less, 'cause I think part of that is obvious to people. Like, of course I can't be Steph Curry, but I'll still shoot the basketball around. Or I can't be a Tiger Woods, but I'll still play golf, like, you know, scratch golf or something.



Mitch:
10:11
Right. And I think the, the pervasive things that you're getting at too, I think that's more common, at least in my life, is this, I'm not even gonna attempt this. I'm not, it's, it's like what Carol Dweck talks about in like, growth in mindset. Like I can't do this well, or I can't do it perfectly, or I can't, I can't feel confident when doing this, so I'm gonna not just not do it, but I'm gonna feel justified in not doing it.



Mitch:
10:33
That's, that's the cancer, it's, that's the worst part. Oh, it's so pervasive and, and I think. The reason I wanna dwell on this is because it's. Kind of hard to, to clock it because we we're so accustomed to using this to let ourselves off the hook. And it feels a very like, authentic, very genuine. Like, well I just feel like I can't really authentically, fully presently show up.



Mitch:
10:56
So like I'm just not gonna commit to that in this sense. Yeah.



Dane:
10:59
there're misallocate words 'cause they're saying perfectionism. I can't do this with a perfectionist attitude, so therefore I don't wanna do it. We, the, the classic example, you and I were chatting about this before the, the well-intentioned people who are finding their life to be difficult.



Dane:
11:12
And they come to us in MWOD and they say, my life is really difficult. I can't do this wholeheartedly, therefore, I need to quit. And to which we say, great, you're gonna quit. It's probably not for you. I get it. What, what are you gonna do instead to fortify your life? So that you can actually do all these hard things.



Dane:
11:31
'cause the hard things aren't going in a way, like they're, they're stick, they're sticking around, they're here. And if your life is complicated, you actually need community more. You need structure more. You should probably add it to your practice right now. Not take away and, and what you're calling wholehearted isn't wholehearted.



Dane:
11:51
In that regard, we would rather have you bring it as much as you can bear to the table, as imperfect as that is, as you wanna call it, halfhearted, call it halfhearted, but here's what we know. That result will get you more in retrospect, when you look back at the result, you're gonna, you're gonna be more satisfied with that than having not done the thing.



Dane:
12:14
And what you're really craving is when you say that, it's the same complaint I have about when people talk about balance. Like I just need more balance in my life, which is really, I just need more relief in my life, so I'm gonna justify breaking my commitments That we wanna say, well, there's other options besides breaking your commitments.



Dane:
12:31
And you can bring more of yourself to the, to the equation, but let's not create more confusion by mixing up our words, by calling our perfectionism wholehearted or, or somehow justifying that I'm, that I, that it's okay for me. I feel good about breaking a commitment to myself when, who made the commitment to your, to the, to who?



Dane:
12:54
It's you. To you. So you're betraying you, you're robbing you when you break commitment and it's, it's so unnecessary. 'cause there's ways to actually. Modify a commitment to yourself, honor a commitment to yourself, or even just do it the hard thing. Put your head down, get the thing done, and see if you don't grow because you did that thing in that moment, particularly when it was hard



Mitch:
13:25
There's a number of things that we have kind of as a part of our community that, that we practice regularly. We have a very like request culture. Like if you've put yourself on the hook to do something and you, you find yourself in a situation where you can't follow through on that.



Mitch:
13:40
It's like make a request. We have fess up Fridays where we kind of get to articulate with honesty, like where we missed the mark, but not just leave it at that or let ourselves off the hook for that, but actually move from an intention or a plan, but like to actually course correct and say, this is what I'm gonna be doing.



Mitch:
13:57
Differently. And, and honoring that and, and moving forward and not dwelling in shame. And I think o obviously the reasons we do these things isn't just because we're like, we want power and we want to have people make requests of us or confess to us. It's like such a resourceful practice to exercise these things.



Mitch:
14:14
Yeah. To change how we're relating with missing the mark or making requests. And I think that's one of the, been one of the biggest reveals for me. Is like change, realizing how uncomfortable I have historically been with those practices. Mm. So again, without speaking specifically to like, I'm not prescribing that people practice these things I mean, I think it's super resourceful and we'd love to have you in the community, but like, what can people be doing in their day to day as these things start to come up?



Mitch:
14:45
Like what are, what are some of the first steps to, to begin to identify when they are living in this perfectionism or, or maybe guised perfectionism. And how do they kind of course correct and, and start to move forward outta that.



Dane:
15:01
Yeah. So, so let's make one more comment about what perfectionism often is.



Dane:
15:07
And that is, it's a means by which I can look a certain kind of way. It's almost like a virtue signaling like, I want people to see me as a hard worker, see me as, gosh, I'm burning the can at both ends. And I, you know, I, I'm really locked in and committed. And, but what's revealed in a moment like that is like, and you're also incredibly undisciplined about setting boundaries and overcommitted.



Dane:
15:36
And why are you doing that? Well, it probably feeds a narrative about you that you like. And and you wanna have it all right? And, and the irony is you're disqualifying yourself from having it all because you didn't measure and assess your capacity and, you know, ratchet up according to your growth and your ability.



Dane:
15:59
So this, this again, thinly veiled effort to be perceived a kind, a certain kind of way is, is a way to hide. And I think that perfectionism is a way to hide, actually. 'cause what you're, you're, you're, you're like, I, I don't want anyone to see the seams or the cracks or the, the, the reality. And you get in our culture, like why that's so reinforced, right?



Dane:
16:25
Every, this is a long noticed phenomenon where if, if what is communicated. Has been edited to the degree of we've hidden all of the fractures. The goal is to make it be look as perfect as possible. But making it look perfect and being perfect are very different things. That's the first thing I wanna say.



Dane:
16:44
The second thing I wanna say is and then I wanna get to your question 'cause I, I, I don't think I'm addressing it, but Go ahead. Well



Mitch:
16:48
hold that because I think. What you were just saying is super important, but I also think it's not just for the outside world, it's for ourselves too. I don't like seeing myself as fragile or imperfect.



Dane:
16:58
No, I actually think it's primarily about me. Totally. Like it's not the brand. The outside world doesn't brand you, the outside world doesn't even care. A



Mitch:
17:05
hundred percent.



Dane:
17:07
Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's, it's like me trying to get my hair just right when nobody. Noticed my hair when they're just listening to the podcast and can't see you anyway.



Dane:
17:15
Well, I know, and the amount of time and product that I've put into this effort, you know like the amount of, I, I, I get so mad at myself when I think about like, what am I gonna wear? Like, why do I, no one, no one cares about what I'm gonna wear, but me, no human being.



Dane:
17:31
And, and yet, you know, you can have that sense of like, people acknowledge it when you walk into a room, there's a sense of like status or am I wearing a certain kind of thing or, you know, whatever. And status is real. I get, I, I get that. And maybe these, these efforts, a vanity can help, but, but perfectionism is a kind of vanity that I want, I just want to call it for what it is.



Dane:
17:54
And, and the irony is nobody likes vain people. Like we, we just don't like it. I'm not liked when I'm vain. I know that factually what I am appreciated for is when people see me try, like really give my all to it, even, especially in total utter failure. But I, I also wanna add too, we're talking about like we're request culture and we have fess up Fridays and how important those things are.



Dane:
18:22
They're great mechanisms for when we are not hitting the mark, but there is another alternative that we don't talk enough about, which is hitting the mark. Like, do the thing. Keep your word. Mm-hmm. And it's not a question of whether you'll do that a hundred percent of the time. We already know that's not gonna happen, but it's really okay if you do some of the time actually do what you say you're gonna do.



Dane:
18:52
Mm-hmm. And I would argue when you do it is. Really helpful to you and to those you're around. In a way that is, is I think we, we, we give so much attention to how do we get out of our commitments. I think sometimes we forget that the easiest way to get out of a commitment is to keep your commitments.



Dane:
19:13
'Cause then it'll be historic and you don't have to worry about it anymore. And be, be, be really clear about what you're, what you're committed, who you're committed to be, and have your actions and projects that you're, you can put yourself on the hook for, reflect those things.



Mitch:
19:29
Mm-hmm.



Mitch:
19:30
That's so important because I think there is an emphasis.



Mitch:
19:34
That I, I make, I know, but I'm sure a lot of us make that, you know, you learn from your failures. You, and then we kind of steer the whole conversation to growth. Only happens in failure or like, flourishing only happens in failure. It's like, okay, that's part of the equation. But if I like, it's really impactful when I apologize to my kids.



Mitch:
19:53
Like if I like, you know, raise my voice or do something, you know, inappropriate, that hurt their feelings or something, it's really impactful for me to apologize. But if like. That is only the, the only indication of me being a good parent and not like all of the times when I do the right thing, when I control my temper or whatever, like, then that, that's like an incomplete story.



Mitch:
20:17
So I think that is really important to, to point out. So thank you for doing that.



Dane:
20:20
Well, and to even, to even say like, it may not be flashy. But in those moments where you didn't flow blow up or you didn't, whatever, you know, fill in the blank. Whatever listeners are, have their particular triggers and responses that they regret later.



Dane:
20:36
Over time, all those times when you do show up in a measured way, when you do keep your word, when you, when you are the kind of person that you believe you can be consistently. It's not gonna be celebrated every time, but it's what you become. It's your character. It's what you become famous for.



Dane:
20:54
It's the stuff that people depend on and that, that is a worthy investment like that, that pays exponentially more than asking for forgiveness. It's just, it's, you don't, you're not gonna get kind of insta status for it. Right. And, and it's amazing 'cause when you, when you start. Making those deposits day in, day out and become a certain kind of person that might be taken for granted.



Dane:
21:21
But even being taken for granted often is a sign that you are the kind of person who keeps granting things like that. You keep giving things. And who doesn't wanna be that person? Well everyone wants to be that person, but very few want to be, want to do the work to become that person, which is I. Is, is doing all of the efforts, the, the, the wholeheartedness as we move increasingly, hopefully toward who we, who we think we are.



Mitch:
21:52
So I originally was during this conversation towards like, how do I identify, like when this dynamic is at play, when perfectionism is cropping up? And I'm totally down to keep talking about that, but I have a hunch like a lot of people know when that's going on. Maybe, maybe not.



Dane:
22:07
Well, it's a good, it's a good question.



Dane:
22:09
Like it's funny when I think about. You know, friends I cited earlier, like in our community who are like, Hey, I can't be a part of this 'cause I can't be wholehearted. And they, they're, they're misunderstanding kind of who we are and what we're about.



Mitch:
22:19
Yeah. Guilty



Dane:
22:20
most people when, when we reveal it we're like, oh no, you don't.



Dane:
22:23
I think you're missing, you're, you're, you're forgetting maybe the first second and then we remind you and, and people get sorted and it's great. And by the way, most of those people don't actually end up leaving. That's what's so cool is when they kind of court like, kind of right, calibrate they go, oh, oh, yeah.



Dane:
22:40
I do see that. Oh yeah, I, I do need, I do need community. I, I do need to be on the hook for a foundation that I can do this complicated life from and so on. So I, I, I think there is probably some value in like, the stuff that you want to look for to make sure you're not deceiving yourself. I, I would say would, would be things like are you seeing yourself as a victim to circumstances in your life?



Dane:
23:07
That would be a tell because if you have a perfectionist perspective that that's the standard. Then when everything is kind of, feels like a truck is on top of you and she's getting loaded, loaded, loaded and you have this vision in your head of like, this shouldn't be so, uh. I think that, and, you know, why, why, why am I being so oppressed kind of thing.



Dane:
23:27
And I, I need to take action, but the taking of action is actually removing my responsibilities as opposed to either keeping them or making a request, or if I miss the mark making amends. Those are, they're all at your disposal. And shifting your perspective from one of it's all happening to me to, I actually have agency in this moment would be shrewd.



Dane:
23:52
So if you, if you just find yourself complaining, if you find yourself it's always happening to me. I think those are good tells and it's, it's weird to talk about victim relative to perfectionism, but I think there really is I. There, there's some kind of a relationship in there that's worth paying attention to.



Mitch:
24:09
Yeah.



Mitch:
24:09
Well, oftentimes it's a justification. Yeah. For like, and this is why I can't be perfect.



Dane:
24:15
Well, and I think, and that's right. That's the second piece I would argue is just notice if you're telling your, telling a really grand story as to why you're missing the mark on things. The stories reveal what we're avoiding and what if there was a simpler story to the situation at hand? You just don't wanna do it. It's hard. You're tired, you're grumpy. You didn't eat, you didn't sleep, you didn't have enough water yesterday. You happen to have a really challenging job and you haven't been a good steward of your energy.



Dane:
24:50
And now the job is even more challenging. You know, that kind of. The common denominator in all of these noticings is, is, is, is humility. It's a willingness to kind of go, oh, okay, I'm gonna wake up and eat humble pie before I get handed. Humble, humble pie. Mm. I, I'd rather be humble than be humiliated.



Dane:
25:12
That is an exercise, that's a discipline, that's a practice. In a world where maybe people are flexing more often than not and trying to to present like they are perfect. You can see why that would be. We, we may not be interested in that. We, it might not feel aligned with, we wanna look perfect.



Dane:
25:32
So therefore, like even the question, do you wanna look perfect or be perfect? If you find yourself you wanna look perfect. Because being perfect, perfect would make you look imperfect. 'Cause being perfect is messy, man. Like hitting every shot messy. You gotta fight for that and, and I think that's, it's a good tell for me.



Dane:
25:55
If I'm not willing to get my, you know, sorted, like I'm not, I'm



Mitch:
25:59
you just messed up his hair for, for your audio. Listen.



Dane:
26:01
Yeah. See, yeah. If you didn't see it was, and, and it still looked good. That's what's so crazy. But you guys get my point and we can, we can move on. 'cause I think we, I think it's critical that we, we start thinking through okay, if, if, once you've noticed, what do you do about it?



Dane:
26:16
And, and I. It's number one, I think very helpful to be in community with people who can. Can help you discern or help you kind of see the reality a little bit more clearly? I think.



Mitch:
26:30
Well, and even just holding account, like the very active holding account, you start to hear yourself like, I can't tell you how many volleys or videos that I've recorded in our community where I'm talking about something and I'm hear myself saying all of these justifications and excuses, and my family's been sick and this, which like, I know, I'm like, oh my goodness, I am just.



Mitch:
26:53
Justifying hiding, preserve some kind of Yes. Or to feel that much more celebrated. 'cause I still did this thing, you know?



Dane:
26:59
That's right. That's right. Yeah.



Mitch:
27:00
I don't need to hear any responses, but just hearing myself record this thing, I'm like, Ooh, what am I doing?



Dane:
27:06
For those who don't know this, in our community, we don't hold anyone accountable. We invite people to account. So what Mitch is describing is like, because we, the reason we ask everyone to check in every single day is to do exactly what Mitch is describing you. You get to indict yourself, and if you didn't hear yourself very well, we have a community of people who will help you hear exactly what you just said.



Dane:
27:29
Yes. And it's, it's amazing. And, but it is humble pie, man. Can I have some more



Dane:
27:35
please? Yummy. Yummy.



Mitch:
27:36
Totally. Okay, so we've got community, you said that's really resourceful. What else?



Dane:
27:43
I think that every three months or so about every. You know, it's every 90 days or so, it's just, or maybe leading up to like a, a quarterly change or whatever. Just like we would do in business when, and come up with like quarterly goals or KPIs or whatever. It's probably worth pausing and just assessing your life.



Dane:
28:04
Like put it in the calendar. Ask yourself the question, am I trying to present an image or be the real thing, be the real McCoy. And and then the, the follow up question would be, what would the next 90 days look like? What would I want to, how would I want to engineer or design my next 90 days to move further from trying to appear perfect and closer to being?



Dane:
28:31
The real deal. And what what'll happen for a lot of folks is they start assessing their projects if they're smart. Now we, in our community, the temptation is to assess your practice and start like, oh, I need to stop doing cold showers and holding my breath and working out, and what do I need to drink water or stretch or why, you know, and so on.



Dane:
28:52
And or eat clean, you know? And. You need. That's just foundation stuff. Like, don't mess with that stuff. That's, that's how you actually stand up in life. Period. But you might start assessing the projects in your life and going, are these actually as important as they used to be? Are these critical in the season that I'm in relative to the bigger ambitions I have for who I wanna become this year or next year or next decade?



Dane:
29:16
And, and as that happens, I think that's where the boundary setting begins to happen. And you start clarifying what, what really is important in this season? So I can be not only wholehearted with my practice, the foundation, but I can be wholehearted in the. The people, the projects and, and the season of life that I'm in,



Mitch:
29:35
obviously I have found our community to be very resourceful and helping me, like just be honest with myself, eat that humble pie and also like learn from doing the thing. So besides. Going into the, you know, description, applying to MWOD, like what are, what are a couple things that like today, because yes, quarterly it's great, but like, what are some practical takeaways to kind of close out this episode that people can begin to do like in this moment?



Dane:
30:07
I love that question. So bring it down to it. The last 24 hours, in the last 24 hours, where did you make up a story that got you out of a commitment?



Dane:
30:17
Just name that thing and who did you tell that story to, and what would it look like for you to go back to that same person and tell them a new story.



Dane:
30:27
Say, Hey, remember that story I told you about why I broke the commitment here? I didn't do the thing there. I didn't do whatever. Eat your own humble pie and tell a better story, a more true story. A story that's as true or more true than the first one you told. And see if you don't find yourself moving closer in the direction of wholehearted in that conversation, in that one space.



Dane:
30:47
At the end of the day, it's still a matter of taking atomic level parts of real conversations, real projects, real tasks, real doing and. Align those with our commitments. Who do you know doing things when we don't wanna do them? Hugging the cactus. Putting yourselves in the hook in the first place.



Dane:
31:09
And because we live in a world where it's really easy to do the, we talk about credo all the time, but committing to things really quickly, that's great. Commit to all the things you you'd like. But in these. In, in the last 24 hours. Where did you notice like, oh, because I wasn't very judicious in those choices, in those 90 day window kind of quarterly decisions, and now I'm on the hook for all these things, man, when it comes to my projects, it might be time for me to do some renegotiating because I'm spending so much energy trying to maintain it all and keep all the plates spinning and all the, you know, balls in the metaphorical air.



Dane:
31:42
What's happening is. I'm, I'm robbing myself, betraying myself, and not showing up wholehearted in any place because I wanna maintain appearances of perfect in all these places. And I, it, it is powerful. It, it often isn't solved in one moment, but it usually begins in one moment. And in those beginnings, it usually comes from a story.



Dane:
32:03
Where did you tell yourself a story that per kind of propped up this perfectionist mindset, and how might you trade that in for one that's closer to wholehearted?



Mitch:
32:15
Hmm. You know, we have strong and awake for love's sake. And this is where that love for love's sake comes in in a really powerful way.



Mitch:
32:23
Because I see you model this all the time. It's an you doing that with me even before this call, processing raw. What are you navigating how am I relating with you? Like all these things, like is an invitation for others to step into that too was an invitation for me to also be honest. So I appreciate you for that, Dane.



Mitch:
32:41
Mm. Your, your, a good friend and a good mentor, and hopefully our listeners are also experiencing us in that way.



Dane:
32:48
Yeah. You're encouraging Mitch. I, I'm really glad that you brought up the for love's sake part 'cause that that's the whole point. That's the whole point. It's the impact and, and just like when you're describing with your kids how powerful it is, when you're willing to.



Dane:
33:02
Apologize when you're willing to, like when we are, when we do course correct or when we do the thing, all these things are, are building blocks that aren't just about me. Me is just boring after a while, but but me for the sake of others, for the other, especially for those who are without or not included or counted out, that's the magic man.



Dane:
33:26
And it's just rare to become the kinds of people who can. Actually make an impact in those spaces without, without some of this kind of work. So that's really what's at stake here. It's less about optimization and more about for love's sake. And if you wanna be the kind of person who can do that kind of work, do this kind of work and see if you don't find yourself a lot more satisfied with the result.



Mitch:
33:48
Thanks, Dane.



Dane:
33:49
Thanks, Mitch.



Dane:
33:50
Men and women of discomfort is our membership community, and we are open to everyone. But keep in mind, our tagline is it's probably not for you. If we're wrong about that, or if you want to find out for yourself, you can find us at MWOD.io