130. Microdosing Functional Mushrooms: The Wellness “Trend” Humans Have Used for Thousands of Years with Alli Schaper

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Welcome to Rooted in Wellness with me, wellness advocate and holistic nutritionist, Mona Sharma.
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Together, we will take a journey to discover natural healing practices from imbalance to balance guided by ancient wisdom and modern scientific insights.
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I was raised living summers on an ashram, so I learned early on that food is medicine and your kitchen is your greatest source of healthcare and prevention.
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After facing two heart surgeries, anxiety, and weight challenges, I discovered that just because your symptoms are common doesn't mean that they are normal.
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Together with some incredible guests, we will explore the power of our mind, body, and soul connection, returning to our roots to rediscover our greatest well-being.
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Hey everyone, welcome back to Rooted in Wellness, and today I'm sitting down with my sweet friend, Ali Shaper.
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And gosh, this is such a fascinating conversation.
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So mushrooms are having a huge moment in the wellness industry right now, and we're seeing them in coffee, powders, gummies, supplements, and humans have actually been working with fungi for thousands of years.
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So what did ancient cultures understand that we're only now beginning to remember?
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Okay.
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Allie takes us into the incredible world of mushrooms and explains the difference between culinary, functional, and psychedelic varieties.
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We talk about lion's mane, reishi, fruiting bodies, mycelium, extract ratios, and what you really need to look for before spending money on that next mushroom product.
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But this conversation goes so much deeper than supplements.
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Allie shares how chronic digestive issues, losing her period, and being prescribed somewhere between 8 and 10 medications led her to stop outsourcing her health.
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We also talk about microdosing, the patterns that keep us stuck, the emotions that we keep trying to fix, and how mushrooms helped her family move through grief after losing her father.
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One of Allie's teachers calls mushrooms instruments of joy.
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And I love that.
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And I think that you're going to understand exactly what that means by the end of this conversation.
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Allie is the CEO and co-founder of Supermush, a brand that I'm proud to recommend.
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She's the host of Into the Multiverse and co-founder and board member of the Microdosing Collective, the first U.S. nonprofit dedicated to legal microdosing advocacy.
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This episode will completely change the way that you look at mushrooms.
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and the intelligence of nature.
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Let's get into it.
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My sweet friend, Allie, welcome to Rooted in Wellness.
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I'm so happy to be here.
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It's just an excuse to hang out with you for an hour, which is so exciting to me.
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You were literally in my top five when I started the podcast, so this is long overdue.
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But I think it's also in perfect timing, the way that we've rolled out the topics for the episode until now.
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So I just want to start off by saying how proud I am of you and everything that you've built.
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Gosh, I've just been your biggest, biggest cheerleader.
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And we're going to dive into all of that today.
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So to kick things off, this podcast is really all about becoming more rooted.
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That's rooted in your health and your happiness and your life and who you are.
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And what I know is a philosophy you and I both believe is the inner knowing that we all have to heal ourselves.
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So let's just start off by two or three things that make you feel more rooted every day.
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Well, I'm so happy to be here with you and thank you for that compliment.
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And, you know, I guess it evolves over time, but in this current season of my life, for the last year, I've been praying to myself out loud.
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And there's something about the verbal action of talking to, you know, whatever larger,
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the new, you know, spirit, God, universe that you believe in that has kept me really grounded.
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And I feel like there is a level of honesty that I'm able to have with myself.
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And so I try to do that every morning.
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So that's one thing.
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And then...
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I love drinking a warm beverage in the morning.
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It's very simple, but my life involves a lot of travel and a lot of speaking.
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You can hear my voice is almost gone right now because I've been speaking so much.
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And so it's a lot of output.
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And so I love just having a moment with myself in the morning, whether it's matcha or lemon water and just sitting down and setting intention for my day.
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And I used to have a way more elaborate morning routine.
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It is condensed over the years.
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And so pretty simple.
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And I do a meditation that me and my fiance learned in India when we were over there.
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And it kind of returns me to the energy of being over there.
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So I've done that every day for the last few years, and it's been a beautiful part of my routine.
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So beautiful.
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No one's ever said that before the first practice of speaking out loud.
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Is this something new for you to dive more into spirituality?
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Did that happen after India?
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Do you have that before anchored within you?
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Well, so I love journaling, right?
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So for a long time, I loved journaling in the morning and, you know, after...
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If you watch any sort of make you a better person podcast, self-help podcast, journaling, your gratitudes in the morning was always the thing that I did.
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And then I shifted that around like a year ago after I went to a Pachnakarma retreat.
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And something that someone had said to me on that retreat was,
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shifted my practice to be speaking out loud to myself.
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And I found that it just influenced a different level of honesty.
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And, you know, there's also just something about when you say out loud, these are the challenges that I'm going to anticipate today.
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These are the things that I'm grateful for.
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These are the people that I'm praying for that just set up your psyche, I think, to handle it.
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And it's different from, you know, when you're writing something that
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It kind of feels like this far off story.
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So it's just a little distinction.
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And it's been really powerful for me.
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And now I also am inspired to return to handwriting more because I'm watching all of the Chachubiti videos that are talking about how, or I guess rather Instagram videos talking about AI, about how our brains are being decayed by the constant use of AI.
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And one of the biggest things that you can combat the brain decay with is writing by hand.
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So I'm inspired to kind of reintroduce that.
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But speaking out loud has been a beautiful part of my routine.
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So good.
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I'm smiling so much because I'm super inspired.
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As a hardcore introvert, I can hear my voice a lot in my head.
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But to say things out loud.
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And I remember meeting or there's somebody else who came on the podcast to simply asking the question, spirit or God or consciousness, what would you have me do today?
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Instead of constantly, you know, hoping for what we think that we want, which most of the time isn't what holds the wisdom or the greatest possibility, right?
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Because our mind is so finite.
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So beautiful practice.
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Super inspired by that.
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On the flip side, we're going to get to your healing story.
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It's such a powerful one.
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Do you notice when you become uprooted?
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You mentioned you travel quite a bit.
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What are two or three things that you know now make you feel uprooted?
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Moving too fast in the morning.
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I love the idea that you're always a few moments away from a completely better state and mood.
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But if I move,
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If I, you know, if I don't meditate, if I do these things, I also don't want to be such a slave to these practices because I think the idea of any of them is that you're able to actually live, live those practices.
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But if I skip those intention settings and I kind of just funnel into my day, I find that my phone tells me what to do and the world is kind of telling me what to do and I'm not able to be as in flow with life because it's more reactive.
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And also just eating any processed food.
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I know this is like part of your entire world, but the way that my gut functions and the way that I work optimally is when I eat real food that is from the earth, as close to the earth as possible.
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So the quality of the food I eat is so important.
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And I'm really sensitive to sugar.
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I'm not...
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as rigid as I used to be.
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And I think that there is a real freedom that's opened up in my life because of that.
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However, because I'm so consistent with the quality of food that I eat and the time that I eat and all these things, right, with traveling as much as I do, if I start to eat more processed food, my gut stops working as well.
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And then my brain stops working as well.
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So it's kind of just this cycle.
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So I try to be really specific about that because it just makes me a
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you know, all the things.
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It's everything, right?
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How we show up every day.
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And thank you.
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Those are beautiful answers.
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I always ask those two questions.
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One, in a world where we've really overcomplicated health and wellness, every single person, I think with the exception of Dave Asprey, has mentioned things that are free, right?
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To feel better in our bodies every single day.
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And then going back to the importance of just prioritizing our
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ourself, how we're fueling every day.
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So it's quite simple, but we've overcomplicated it.
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To get the most out of you today, we're going to start with some rapid fire questions.
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Okay.
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Let's do it.
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Whatever comes to mind.
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So finish this sentence.
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Most people think of mushrooms as a food, but they're actually nature's greatest teacher in death, spiritual wisdom, and they have so much potential to heal our bodies.
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Yeah.
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Goosebumps.
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The most criminally underused mushroom in wellness right now is?
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Lion's mane.
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I just bought some this morning.
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Great.
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What's the fastest way to guarantee functional mushrooms won't work for you?
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Processed food.
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Processed food, eating a ton of stimulants.
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I think if you were over, you know, my quick elaboration on this is if you are constantly stimulated, whether it's by pharmaceuticals or cortisol that you create, you know, anything that is keeping your body in a fight or flight state, you're going to be less sensitive to something like an adaptogen.
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So when you're drinking three cups of coffee a day and you don't feel the reishi or the lion's mane, it's,
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it's because your body is is on overdrive over here you're not going to notice this like subtle beautiful tuning fork that is available for your nervous system yeah that mushrooms can offer i think a big part of that is people don't notice the addiction to overdrive because it's become them right that's a big part of the work that i do with my clients is like hey hey remember the way remember what it feels like to be on this side next microdosing in one sentence what is it actually doing
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Microdosing is giving you the ability to be subtly neuroplastic while you're in your day-to-day life.
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And it creates live pattern interruption or habits that you might want to change.
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What's the one thing about mushrooms that once you learn it, you can never see the world the same again?
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Mushrooms, both functional and psychedelic, I think can give us more access to the heaven that is all around us.
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Yeah, you can see it.
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Hot take.
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What's the wellness industry getting dangerously wrong about mental health?
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I think just in general that we're, you know, that we're, that we're broken.
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I think that there's, there's just so much beauty in emotions and being human.
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And I think we overcorrect a lot, right?
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You see this in the longevity space where now we're so scared to die.
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And, you
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I think wanting to live more fully is such a beautiful thing, but there's just this, you know, this balance with all of it.
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And I've been thinking about that a lot as it comes to, you know, the more intense things like looking at death as a failure, looking at where we're at as something, you know, being wronged versus just, you know, full acceptance of the now.
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So I think that the internal messaging is getting influenced by a lot of the external.
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So true.
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You've mentioned death twice now.
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Let's start with that.
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I know the passing of your father had obviously a very profound impact on you.
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You've shared a lot about it.
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You wrote a book about it also.
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Can you share a little bit more about the connection between that and maybe how mushrooms was part of the evolution to processing that?
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Yeah, and it was, you know, I would like to write a book about it.
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It was more like a story.
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It was like, you know, a story that I wrote about it.
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Yeah, my dad has been such an important teacher in my life.
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He passed away a little over three years ago.
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And I would say, you know, the first...
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The first thing that I thought about when I found out my dad passed away was I'm so grateful I was able to give and introduce my parents to mushrooms before he passed.
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And I think the reason that I thought that is because psychedelic mushrooms, when used intentionally in the right settings, can give just this incredible widening of perspective on where we're going.
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And the reason why they're so...
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beautiful and impactful for end-of-life care is because there's this acceptance that sets in.
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And I've experienced that a lot recently with different friends, but the fear of death is often kind of killing us quicker.
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And so with my dad, I was so grateful that he was able to have that experience before he passed.
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And my mother was able to use psychedelic therapy for,
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After I passed away for, you know, to help process her grief.
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And she's done so, and you know, it's still a journey.
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It's not linear.
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But she's done so in a way that I find to be really healthy when I look around at the other ways we tend to process grief.
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And this is very, you know, this is very limited to the Western ways, right?
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Like Eastern cultures have such beautiful death rituals and the ways that they...
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You know, they take care of the family and really integrate death into life in a beautiful way.
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But it's very cold and harsh in Western cultures.
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And I think mushrooms are such an impactful part of helping us remember how to die well.
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So I guess, you know, to kind of tie that in a bow, my dad is still very present with me.
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So, so much.
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And it's really deepened my connection to my work and to mushrooms because I was able to see what a profound impact psychedelics had on my family around the experience of him dying.
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I'm so excited for my audience to get to know you better.
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Just in the way that you are able to story tell around those types of things, they're really hard conversations to have.
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Even in the world of wellness and the impact that you're making through into the multiverse as well.
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Because I think you said it best, the word that comes to mind for most of the people that I work with and myself included is remembering like, hey, there's an opportunity to remember that there's beauty every day.
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That we get this one body as a vessel to make the most out of it.
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And while we're so over-consumed with living to 120 or 130, and the fear that comes with that, and the fear around popping pills, and the fear around peptides, and the fear around everything else, has nothing to do with living and remembering the beauty of every day.
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And that's where we got to get things right, right?
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Yeah.
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And it's like, I'm 32.
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So when I'm in my 70s, I might be a little more nervous.
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So I think that, you know, it's, I, I'm, I'm aware of my immaturity in my experience of, you know, I don't, I, in theory, if I live a long, healthy life, I think I have 70 years left, right?
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Or maybe, maybe more than that.
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But the reality is we don't know.
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And, you know, I, I had, I had this one kind of frame I thought about the other day, because if let's say someone's really rude to you at the grocery store, right?
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And you say something like completely just like inappropriate, rude, and you want to snap back at them.
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And then you find out they have a terminal illness.
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You just want to go give them a hug, right?
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Yeah.
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And so the distinction, I guess, is that the compassion that we have around proximity to death is...
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is significant, right?
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If you know someone is on the way out to transition, we have this compassion that opens up in our heart.
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But the irony is we're all dying.
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We're all actually sharing this terminal illness.
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And I just, that's one example of many where if you can keep, you know, death, that's part of what I share with myself and my, you know, and with God, when I talk to myself in the morning is that this is a very limited, you know,
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experience of this of this human incarnation and the remembrance of that it opens up so much freedom and so much compassion it's so true and so the the context i feel like that we're all missing you know because when i go through my day and people piss me off and i get upset and you know just go through the cycles of of being human that one grocery store example reminds me that everyone is you know as everyone's going through something much and it
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And if you can open up that compassion, you're actually, you know, talk about joy being the killer of all disease.
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The resentment we hold on to these, you know, stories about what people should do in our life.
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Like, that's a lot of where when I'm suffering, it's because I think that people should be meeting an expectation that I have of them.
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Exactly.
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And so that's really one of the biggest things where I'm just, I'm like, if I can release those expectations and try to have that level of compassion, realizing that we all have this shared, you know, terminal illness, even though it seems far off.
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Yeah.
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It just brings me so much more peace and joy in my day to day life.
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It's so true.
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The impact of going out into the world, if we were to imagine, whether it's the guy at the grocery store, the person in traffic, or even a dear friend, like if we could just hold up a mirror to ourselves and in those moments where we want to lose it, what is it telling us about who we are, what we haven't processed, why is it triggering to begin with, and how could we act differently?
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And to your point, this is happening when we think about
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death and the fear that comes there.
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But something else that I've preached for so many years, and I even need to remind myself, is remembering that nothing matters when you don't have your health.
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Right?
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And I pray to God that for everyone listening or watching, you never have to experience that, right?
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Just your health suffering or being in a situation.
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But the unfortunate truth is that most of us are touched by somebody who is sick or a parent or a sibling or God forbid your children,
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And we're so aware of it.
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And yet we still get trapped into this loophole of the grind of day-to-day life and the hardship and the stress.
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And we're not remembering just, you know, how limited and unlimited time actually is and what we can do with it.
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So your story is a really big part of this.
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You were prescribed, you know, what was it, between 8 and 10?
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prescription medications when you were at your sickest.
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Did doctors ask you about what was happening in your life?
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Do you want to go back to that moment and share a little bit more about that?
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Yeah.
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I mean, I started out, you know, I guess I'll just kind of like lay the landscape of my journey because it really was what led me into mushrooms.
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All of this is, and I'm very grateful for it now because if I wasn't, you know, as sick as I was or as, sigh,
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You know, the journey that I've been on would not have been, you know, I don't know if I would have landed here if I wasn't so sucked into, you know, kind of a hole by the by the swirl I was in with prescription medications.
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I have basically been chronically constipated since I was a child at this point.
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For the first 15, 20 years of my life, I didn't even know how bad my gut was functioning.
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And so I was in and out of all these doctors.
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just like in pretty consistent pain.
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And it kind of went in waves, you know, it wasn't super consistent.
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And that was kind of like the core symptom.
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But then what ended up happening is, you know, I would go to a doctor and they would prescribe me a medication that ended up creating more symptoms, you know, as the tale as old as time.
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And so by the time I was around age 21, I had been prescribed, it was like eight or 10 different pharmaceutical interventions.
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And none of them had actually, you know,
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cured the root of what was going on in my gut function.
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And I know a lot of women struggle with this.
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Like I talk to women all the time and constipation is obviously like such a stigmatized topic.
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And, you know, we're very, you know, I guess in the way, especially in like Western world, we're very like ashamed to talk about.
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I grew up not being comfortable talking about what's going on in my gut.
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And that was also probably a part of it, right?
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Like I didn't know, I wasn't educated about how my body was supposed to work.
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And so, you know, by the time I was 24, I hadn't gotten a period in like five or six years.
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I had also gotten prescribed birth, you know, I was taking birth control.
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I had taken, you know, different birth controls over the years.
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And I got to a point where I was so sick of outsourcing my wisdom.
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I remember, you know, going in and sitting in the doctor's office, like on the plastic chairs and just having this experience of sitting there, I'm like feeling this like plastic beneath me and just filled out the clipboards with all the papers and just like waiting for someone to come in and tell me what was wrong with me and waiting for someone else to come in and cure my problem and looking for also the one thing.
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Yeah.
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The psychology around that, I think, is just setting us up for failure no matter what.
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But basically what happened was I decided to become my own citizen doctor and really start to take control of my health.
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And so that's when I discovered functional medicine and I discovered functional mushrooms through a part of that process.
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And I was able to get off all of my own, on my own, just through movement and exercise and all of the basic things that you're such a believer in, able to get off of these pills that were really creating so many other symptoms.
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And I felt amazing, right?
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Like I was able to get to a point where my gut was working better and I was still having some issues, but it wasn't as consistent.
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And so like the physical changes were working, right?
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And then there's like the psychosomatic.
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And when I entered the world of psychedelics, I realized how much of the mental stories or the holding on too tightly to life was actually creating a lot of my gut dysfunction.
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And so I think that it was all of these things kind of together that were able to work in synergy to help my body function normally.
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I got my period back.
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And there's different layers, right?
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But you had all the basics like food, movement, eating things from the earth.
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Yeah.
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Psychedelics were a huge part of my journey just from like the psychosomatic, really looking at my, where my traumas came from and where my, you know, where these habits came from.
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I also, you know, I had an eating disorder in college or sorry, and it was like high school leading into college that was a huge factor.
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Right.
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And there was just so many different things that I was able to like really look at and unpack and figure out where the source of it was coming from.
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Microdosing was super impactful for me.
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And so that was kind of like where my journey started.
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And because mushrooms were so impactful in my physical well-being, my spiritual well-being, my mental well-being, I wanted to go all in on sharing them.
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And so all my work, you know, it revolves around mushrooms through our products, through all the work I do in psychedelics, you know, the media stuff and the policy stuff.
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But I just think that the mushrooms are amazing.
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And I'm excited that for more people to be, you know, be able to have access to them.
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Oh, yeah, it's happening.
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It's funny.
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There's something I think that so many people sitting in that chair have shared that something happened around the age of 24.
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My last heart surgery was when I was 24 before I decided to have that self-advocacy that you're talking about.
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And I wonder how many of our listeners, too, you know, different story, but how many of us suffered when we were younger?
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Doctors said it was normal or they gave us a prescription and they said, well, let's see how this goes.
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I'll see you in two or three months.
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Right.
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I'll see how this goes and see you in two or three months.
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And like the laundry list of prescriptions that we tried and attempt to try to feel better.
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Right.
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Right.
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So here we are, flash forward, when we think about now, there is an epidemic of people suffering with their mental health, not only their physical health, but their mental health.
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And when we think about everything that people are trying through medication, through sleep, through trying different diets, they're doing all of these things, and yet they still feel like they're running on empty.
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Mm-hmm.
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they're not broken.
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There's some sort of dysfunction within the body.
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A lot of doctors at this point, I think because of stress and overwhelm in our modern world, it's hard to get to the root cause because there's so much going on.
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But when we think about it, where do you think, or from the stories that you hear from people, where's conventional medicine still falling short?
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And where do you think that mushrooms are really becoming the answer?
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Yeah.
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And I guess the caveat to this answer is that, you know, I don't think necessarily everyone should take psychedelic mushrooms.
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I think functional mushrooms, if you're not, if you don't have an allergy to them or anything, you know, these are ancient wisdom.
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You know, Chinese medicine has been using functional mushrooms for a very long time.
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And, you know, the real ancient wisdom of mushrooms is kind of irrefutable from a superfood perspective.
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But I guess, you know, your question is...
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where is where is functional you know conventional medicine falling short and where can mushrooms be you know different solution i guess i'll just speak to you know my story personally you know you talk about this a lot but the looking at the whole human was never was never done and so people know this by now right if they're into functional medicine in any way where if someone's not asking you what you're eating if where you're you know
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what you're moving, what your movement rituals are, what your relationships are like.
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Like all of that is so important and what it takes to, you know, create a healthy, happy human being.
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And so what functional mushrooms have the ability to do is rebalance the body because they, you know, they work for immune modulators.
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They work to bring to the body into homeostasis.
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And so why they're so magnificent, in my personal opinion, is they work different on every person.
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more anxiety reishi mushrooms, which is a non-psychedelic, you know, functional superfood mushroom, it'll calm the system down.
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If you give someone reishi mushrooms who has a little bit low energy to actually bring you up to homeostasis.
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So I, you know, I said it earlier, but it's kind of like this, this tuning fork for the whole body.
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So they're, you know, intelligent in the way that they work within, within our system.
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Mushrooms have
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an incredible fungi, right?
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Fungi has an incredible intelligence within it that works with our body because we share 50% of our DNA with fungi.
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So they're so synergistic with our system.
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And on the psychedelic front, there's like properties within psilocybin, you know, which is one psilocybin converts to psilocin in the liver and then goes into the, you know,
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you know goes into the bloodstream and does its hallucinogenic thing and there's actual amazing properties of what psilocybin can do for your physical body but what it illuminates and like creates an opening for people to look at their lives in a different way where we're often so stuck in these you know these habit loops these patterns and these limiting beliefs and often even you know a comfortability with being
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sick.
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Like it's uncomfortable to change in general.
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But when you look at a lot of symptoms people have, like they're actually creating this mental story, right?
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And I was for a very long time, so I know it very well, where it's very comfortable to be, you know, someone with
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that subscribes to having these things wrong with you, right?
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Because the brain is always looking for problems.
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So I think that the beautiful part about psychedelics is they open this window for you to look at your life in a different way and revisit those stories but make a new narrative around what those mean.
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The brain's always looking for problems and it's also looking for identity.
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And to your point in your story, I know I certainly identified as somebody who was sick, somebody who was on a prescription medication.
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I thought that that was it, that I identified with being sick for so long until I was able to break free.
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And I think that...
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What you're alluding to is the beauty of that, kind of like shattering what you think you know and saying, hey, there's actually possibility for so much more.
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And when no one else around you is likely giving you permission, it's time for you to give yourself that permission.
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So we live in L.A.
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I know that a lot of what we're speaking about today is just...
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you know, coffee talk.
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But for people who aren't listening, who this might be like a completely new spectrum, let's maybe break down.
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So we've got culinary mushrooms, we've got functional mushrooms, and then we've got psychedelic mushrooms.
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And while I think everybody should be working with culinary mushrooms and buying your shiitake and your blinds made and stuff like that, let's break down the three.
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Okay.
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So yeah, those are the three categories, right?
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A fungi, which is the organism.
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And as I said before, we share 50% of our DNA with fungi.
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And just to kind of pull back for a second, I love people know the history of mushrooms because they've been around forever.
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You can find a 5,000-year-old caveman that has been perfectly fossilized in the way that he was preserved.
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His name's Otzi the caveman.
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Otzi.
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Right.
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And on his person, he had a little pouch of
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Functional mushrooms with a little chaga, which is a functional mushroom, necklace around his neck.
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So mushrooms are ancient wisdom.
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They have been around forever.
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And in the West, we really lost track of them in our diet and our supplement routine.
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So in Eastern cultures, Chinese medicine, I grew up over in Taiwan, and mushrooms were everywhere.
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So this is really Western that we're having an aversion to mushroom, but they're kind of making their way back into the mainstream.
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So the three categories you alluded to, it's culinary mushrooms.
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Those are what you get at the grocery store.
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You know, there's a mushroom section.
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There's oyster mushrooms and shiitake and portobello mushrooms and all of the culinary mushrooms, right?
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You never want to eat mushrooms raw because the titan on the cell wall of the mushroom, your body actually can't break down.
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So if you see a salad bar that has raw mushrooms on it,
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not good, right?
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And you'll know this from Ayurveda or anything that you look at where warmed cooked foods, great, but especially with mushrooms, you never want to eat raw mushrooms.
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So that's culinary mushrooms.
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Still great for you, like have an amazing nutritional benefit, but the category of functional mushrooms is this like specific category of superfood mushrooms that have a functional benefit beyond just nutrition.
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And so these are the popular ones you'll hear about.
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Lion's mane, cordyceps,
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Reishi, turkey tail, chaga.
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You know, there's about like 13 main ones that people talk about.
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And these are most commonly consumed in extracts.
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And so what you want to be looking for is fruiting body extracts.
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So we're in the fruiting body.
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And what that means is basically the top of, you know, what you see popping up out of a grassy field, the top of a mushroom that most people would recognize.
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That's the fruiting body of the fungal organism.
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And that's where you find most of the polysaccharides, beta-glucans, etc.
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So most of the good stuff is in that part of the mushroom.
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And those are usually extracted through hot water, alcohol, usually double extracted, and then put into things like we make gummies, gummies.
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Capsules, powders, tinctures, etc.
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And those are so great to consume on a supplemental basis.
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So we can go into more of the individual ones.
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And then there is psychedelic mushrooms, which are the psychoactive mushroom psilocybin is the most common one people talk about.
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There's a lot of different forms and strains of psilocybin mushrooms.
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And those have a psychoactive effect, which creates a hallucinogenic experience when consumed in high doses and actually is a psychoactive molecule.
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So different from functional mushrooms in the sense that like lion's mane is not going to get you high.
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That's still a little bit of a confusion point, but those are kind of the three main categories.
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Are you seeing the conversation shift?
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at events that you're at when they're talking about psychedelic mushrooms and the availability to masses for healing or with doctors?
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So I started a nonprofit a few years ago called Microdosing Collective.
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And the goal of that nonprofit was to help increase safe access to low-dose psychedelics.
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And so I've been involved in the policy work over the last four years.
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And it's been really amazing to see and kind of track where things are going and where it stands.
396
00:32:18.999 --> 00:32:24.161
And so high level right now in the U.S., there's three states that have legal psilocybin therapy.
397
00:32:25.061 --> 00:32:27.002
Oregon, Colorado, and New Mexico.
398
00:32:27.022 --> 00:32:37.345
There's a really exciting bill that's being proposed in New York, so to be decided if New York will have access to psilocybin, you know, in a therapeutic way soon.
399
00:32:37.846 --> 00:32:40.927
But that's, you know, therapeutic access at a service center, right?
400
00:32:41.307 --> 00:32:47.389
And then there's, you know, a more progressive decriminalization model in Colorado, which allows you to grow, gather, and gift.
401
00:32:47.989 --> 00:32:52.753
psychedelic mushrooms so you can grow your own and actually, you know, gift them to a friend legally.
402
00:32:53.374 --> 00:32:54.915
But there's no commercial exchange.
403
00:32:55.495 --> 00:32:57.317
So that's kind of like the legal landscape.
404
00:32:57.337 --> 00:32:59.399
And there's all these states that are proposing new policies.
405
00:32:59.779 --> 00:33:05.464
I think over the next few years, there's going to be even more where people are going to have, you know, even wider access to,
406
00:33:06.104 --> 00:33:09.365
Right now, psilocybin is still federally, you know, scheduled.
407
00:33:09.425 --> 00:33:16.108
It's still illegal schedule one, meaning that, you know, the FDA finds it to have no medicinal benefit.
408
00:33:16.829 --> 00:33:17.949
And so that's changing.
409
00:33:17.969 --> 00:33:22.631
And obviously we know this from the incredible results from all of the clinical trials.
410
00:33:23.091 --> 00:33:25.852
that are going on around the country using psychedelics.
411
00:33:25.872 --> 00:33:27.693
So I'm really excited about where it's going.
412
00:33:28.133 --> 00:33:45.520
Obviously, psychedelics have an incredible medicinal benefit when used intentionally, and there's a lot more attention going to policy efforts, which is really exciting because the argument against psilocybin therapy doesn't really have a stand anymore because the results are so powerful.
413
00:33:46.123 --> 00:33:49.286
Something that ultimately comes from the earth, right?
414
00:33:49.346 --> 00:33:57.014
And I think what you said best, the clinical therapeutic aspect of it, if that's how it rolls out, then incredible that we're doing it right.
415
00:33:57.594 --> 00:34:01.699
I think that what's happening right now, and you and I just saw each other at Expo West,
416
00:34:02.279 --> 00:34:03.860
It is the Wild West.
417
00:34:04.180 --> 00:34:10.985
Like even the supplement industry in many ways is feeling so much like the pharmaceutical industry and not knowing who to trust.
418
00:34:11.266 --> 00:34:14.808
And mushrooms is one of the biggest categories that's popped up.
419
00:34:14.868 --> 00:34:20.933
We're seeing mushroom, gum, tea, you know, gummies, foods, cacao, everything.
420
00:34:21.493 --> 00:34:24.594
Let's hover for a second on the fruiting body or the mycelium.
421
00:34:25.094 --> 00:34:28.795
Is there a distinction that people should look at when they're buying a mushroom-based product?
422
00:34:28.855 --> 00:34:29.075
Yes.
423
00:34:29.135 --> 00:34:32.497
I mean, this is a hot debate in the mycologist community.
424
00:34:32.557 --> 00:34:35.297
So it's important for people to do their research.
425
00:34:35.618 --> 00:34:45.961
The group of mycologists that we kind of study under and follow and take wisdom and advice from believe that the fruiting body is superior for nutritional benefits.
426
00:34:46.381 --> 00:35:00.690
There's also amazing companies that are using mycelium and extracting it, extracting the mycelium from the grain on which it's grown in the proper way, which there's more studies looking at mycelium and the benefits that you can find in mycelium.
427
00:35:00.710 --> 00:35:03.031
So there's a lot more research that needs to be done.
428
00:35:03.511 --> 00:35:09.435
If the company is extracting mycelium or fruiting body in the correct way, that's like thing number one to look at.
429
00:35:09.895 --> 00:35:13.958
What you'll see if you look on the back of packaging, so always look at the back of your packaging,
430
00:35:14.558 --> 00:35:22.668
it should say, whether it's mycelium, full spectrum, fruiting body, if it doesn't say any of that, that's kind of a red flag.
431
00:35:22.968 --> 00:35:25.011
And then there should also be an extract ratio.
432
00:35:25.391 --> 00:35:28.936
So on the back of ours, we use different extract ratios.
433
00:35:28.956 --> 00:35:30.257
So you'll get either like a 20 to 1 extract.
434
00:35:31.198 --> 00:35:34.499
extract, which is more powerful, right, than a four to one or a two to one.
435
00:35:34.879 --> 00:35:42.062
So the more powerful the extract ratio, the more powerful the nutrient density that you're getting within that extract.
436
00:35:42.102 --> 00:35:45.764
And so we take the liquefied extracts and turn them into gummies.
437
00:35:46.724 --> 00:35:49.345
So fruiting body extract, you want to see an extract ratio.
438
00:35:49.865 --> 00:35:55.468
And then you also, it really matters what milligrams, right, are in the blend.
439
00:35:55.908 --> 00:36:02.052
And so, you know, we'll have our blend and we'll have, you know, how many milligrams are total in the functional mushroom blend.
440
00:36:02.072 --> 00:36:10.717
If you see something that has five milligrams of, you know, of mycelium in there, it's like putting a grain of salt on something and calling it salted.
441
00:36:11.117 --> 00:36:21.027
So you really want to look for, you know, minimum 100 milligrams for individual functional mushroom, you know, functional mushroom blends.
442
00:36:21.688 --> 00:36:23.270
Like lion's mane, 100 milligrams.
443
00:36:23.310 --> 00:36:27.794
And it also depends, like, if you have an 8 to 1 extract, that's more powerful than having...
444
00:36:28.475 --> 00:36:31.778
you know, 200 milligrams of a two-to-one extract.
445
00:36:31.798 --> 00:36:33.019
So those are like kind of the factors.
446
00:36:33.059 --> 00:36:36.942
It's a little bit confusing, but the main takeaways are look for fruiting bodies.
447
00:36:36.982 --> 00:36:37.943
That's our perspective.
448
00:36:38.243 --> 00:36:39.444
There's other perspectives out there.
449
00:36:39.464 --> 00:36:43.627
So do your research, you know, look for extracts, extract ratios on there.
450
00:36:43.647 --> 00:36:44.948
So you want to see an extract ratio.
451
00:36:45.308 --> 00:36:50.793
And also just look at the company's website and do a little bit of common sense digging is like who's behind this thing.
452
00:36:51.273 --> 00:36:52.494
Do they seem like they're in integrity?
453
00:36:52.514 --> 00:36:54.496
Are they sharing where they're sourcing the mushrooms from?
454
00:36:54.576 --> 00:36:55.196
All those things.
455
00:36:55.857 --> 00:36:57.158
Such good education.
456
00:36:57.178 --> 00:37:00.360
I can think of like supplement brands that are throwing mushrooms into you.
457
00:37:00.380 --> 00:37:02.682
And I know that that distinction is not being made.
458
00:37:02.702 --> 00:37:05.004
So I just learned something new as well.
459
00:37:05.384 --> 00:37:07.946
And when we think about dosing, something I've never looked at.
460
00:37:08.246 --> 00:37:09.928
So these are the daily energy gummies.
461
00:37:10.108 --> 00:37:10.808
They taste amazing.
462
00:37:11.088 --> 00:37:11.489
They're really good.
463
00:37:11.509 --> 00:37:12.630
They're like a staple in our house.
464
00:37:12.750 --> 00:37:12.930
Yep.
465
00:37:13.390 --> 00:37:14.130
When is too much?
466
00:37:14.150 --> 00:37:21.492
I know that you, you know, kind of advocate for a dose back here, but is, will someone have a symptom if they take too many?
467
00:37:21.992 --> 00:37:23.452
Do you recommend cutting yourself off?
468
00:37:23.833 --> 00:37:25.933
So not from the mushroom itself.
469
00:37:25.953 --> 00:37:30.974
Like you can take, you know, these are relatively like moderate, like daily dose, right?
470
00:37:30.994 --> 00:37:36.336
So the more thing that you want to be concerned about is like, you shouldn't be eating more than five or six gummies a day.
471
00:37:36.796 --> 00:37:38.376
I'm super sensitive to sugar alcohol.
472
00:37:38.396 --> 00:37:41.837
So we have, these are sugar-free, but they have a little bit of maltitol and monk fruit, very low
473
00:37:42.657 --> 00:37:48.103
But for us, it was more important to make them sugar-free than to have six grams of cane sugar per gummy.
474
00:37:48.343 --> 00:37:48.523
Yeah.
475
00:37:48.844 --> 00:37:51.527
Because most Americans don't need more sugar in their diet.
476
00:37:51.547 --> 00:37:55.671
So we wanted to make something that was sugar-free and more accessible to people in that sense.
477
00:37:56.092 --> 00:38:03.500
So that being said, I'm very sensitive to not – if I eat a few sticks – if I'm chewing a few sticks of gum, my stomach will get upset.
478
00:38:03.980 --> 00:38:06.021
So that is something that you really want to note.
479
00:38:06.061 --> 00:38:13.066
Like my kind of threshold is like, I don't want to eat more than like five or six gummies a day, which sometimes I do because I love them and I have them around all the time.
480
00:38:13.706 --> 00:38:15.207
But that's the major thing.
481
00:38:15.567 --> 00:38:18.749
On the functional mushroom part, you could take a lot more.
482
00:38:19.329 --> 00:38:22.613
you know, with lion's mane and a powder and be completely fine.
483
00:38:22.873 --> 00:38:23.273
Exactly.
484
00:38:23.393 --> 00:38:23.534
Yeah.
485
00:38:23.574 --> 00:38:23.794
Yeah.
486
00:38:23.854 --> 00:38:24.795
I wanted you to hover on that.
487
00:38:25.095 --> 00:38:26.276
The serving sizes too.
488
00:38:26.437 --> 00:38:28.459
I'm the same with sugar alcohols.
489
00:38:28.839 --> 00:38:29.680
Notice how you feel.
490
00:38:29.700 --> 00:38:34.244
And often like we've got to remember, I know a lot of people who, oh, I heard this was good for me.
491
00:38:34.284 --> 00:38:35.986
So I decided to like eat half the bag.
492
00:38:36.026 --> 00:38:37.387
Eat as much as I could.
493
00:38:37.407 --> 00:38:37.588
Yeah.
494
00:38:37.608 --> 00:38:38.529
Doesn't always work that way.
495
00:38:38.549 --> 00:38:38.709
Yep.
496
00:38:39.029 --> 00:38:42.431
So what was the documentary about mushrooms that was so big?
497
00:38:42.471 --> 00:38:43.172
Fantastic fungi.
498
00:38:43.392 --> 00:38:44.312
Fantastic fungi.
499
00:38:44.352 --> 00:38:45.033
It's incredible.
500
00:38:45.113 --> 00:38:45.853
It's incredible.
501
00:38:45.873 --> 00:38:46.193
It's so good.
502
00:38:46.233 --> 00:38:46.494
Yeah.
503
00:38:46.854 --> 00:38:59.622
So whenever we'll talk a little bit more about journeys and stuff like that, whenever I, even at the ashram, whenever I go back to the ashram, let's put it that way, I'm always just so impressed by the power of nature to heal.
504
00:39:00.322 --> 00:39:04.785
Whether it's the soil, the sun, how our food is grown, the ocean, the water, everything.
505
00:39:04.805 --> 00:39:05.225
Yeah.
506
00:39:05.405 --> 00:39:08.146
how connected we are and how much better we feel in those scenarios.
507
00:39:08.426 --> 00:39:20.068
When I watched Fantastic Fungi, watching how mycelium grow and kind of the network beneath the soil and communication that happens, I think about that within the body.
508
00:39:20.648 --> 00:39:27.429
Often we take supplements and we think that, oh, I'm going to take this heart supplement and it'll just go to the heart or this for my eyes or for my brain.
509
00:39:27.449 --> 00:39:29.230
It's like, no, the body is connected.
510
00:39:29.250 --> 00:39:33.371
How do you see mushrooms connecting throughout the body?
511
00:39:33.711 --> 00:39:34.371
Is it possible?
512
00:39:34.951 --> 00:39:36.392
for mushrooms to work systemically.
513
00:39:36.412 --> 00:39:38.753
Yeah, I love that analogy.
514
00:39:38.793 --> 00:39:44.915
So mycelium, for people that don't know what mycelium is, it's worth looking up these visuals because it's just extraordinary.
515
00:39:45.496 --> 00:39:56.961
I never grew up having any idea that under every single step that you take across planet Earth, there is a vast connected web of mycelium network that connects all living things.
516
00:39:58.101 --> 00:40:00.883
And that was just left out of my education system.
517
00:40:01.483 --> 00:40:01.703
Same.
518
00:40:01.884 --> 00:40:08.568
And what is so miraculous is that mycelium network functions very similar to, you know, it's like the Earth's Internet.
519
00:40:09.268 --> 00:40:16.853
And every single tree, every single plant, anything that grows out of the Earth is underground connected by this mycelium network.
520
00:40:17.173 --> 00:40:22.396
that transmits nutrients in the most optimal way to everything, right?
521
00:40:22.416 --> 00:40:32.963
So if a tree is suffering, you know, and struggling to grow, mycelium will transmit new, you know, new nutrients over to that tree through little hyphae, which is part of the mycelium network.
522
00:40:33.523 --> 00:40:35.924
And that's pretty extraordinary, right?
523
00:40:36.064 --> 00:40:36.845
And so every...
524
00:40:37.225 --> 00:40:40.188
everything in the human body is also mirrored to nature.
525
00:40:40.548 --> 00:40:45.352
And so I love that example because if you look at veins, they look very similar to mycelium, right?
526
00:40:45.372 --> 00:41:00.345
Like it's a similar way where if you look at our thumbprint to a tree or the way that the amount of water that's distributed through the human body is the perfect ratio of the amount of water that's on the earth, which I also didn't find out until like very recent years.
527
00:41:00.606 --> 00:41:03.188
So everything in nature is perfectly mapped to the human body
528
00:41:03.608 --> 00:41:05.890
We're often out of balance within our human body.
529
00:41:05.910 --> 00:41:15.977
So it's not as in balance, perhaps, as the nature around us, which is why I think being in nature kind of osmosis us back into being in balance with our circadian rhythm, etc.
530
00:41:16.437 --> 00:41:22.581
My experience taking functional mushrooms for the first time when I was going through my healing journey was exactly that.
531
00:41:22.601 --> 00:41:28.926
I felt like my health was at like eight and I felt good and I was off my pharmaceuticals and I felt good.
532
00:41:28.946 --> 00:41:29.046
Yeah.
533
00:41:29.686 --> 00:41:33.688
And then I started consuming high doses of functional mushrooms every single day for months.
534
00:41:34.268 --> 00:41:36.769
And I felt my brain come online in a different way.
535
00:41:37.209 --> 00:41:41.071
So I felt this systemic whole body waking up experience.
536
00:41:41.651 --> 00:41:44.112
And it was through lion's mane and reishi and cordyceps.
537
00:41:44.252 --> 00:41:45.973
No psychedelic mushrooms at that point, right?
538
00:41:45.993 --> 00:41:46.814
Yeah.
539
00:41:47.894 --> 00:41:49.975
I was just like, wow, how cool is it to wake up in your life?
540
00:41:50.035 --> 00:41:55.918
So there's no way that it wasn't working on a whole system level for me because my inflammation went down.
541
00:41:56.019 --> 00:41:57.739
My brain felt like it was more connected.
542
00:41:58.160 --> 00:41:59.480
My gut function was working better.
543
00:41:59.520 --> 00:42:00.301
My skin looked better.
544
00:42:00.341 --> 00:42:01.101
My hair looked better.
545
00:42:01.141 --> 00:42:02.262
Like all of these things, right?
546
00:42:02.282 --> 00:42:05.164
And I was also doing all of the other things as well.
547
00:42:05.184 --> 00:42:06.064
I was eating well.
548
00:42:06.584 --> 00:42:07.345
I was moving.
549
00:42:07.865 --> 00:42:12.508
And so when you introduce functional mushrooms to a system that is
550
00:42:13.328 --> 00:42:17.511
already operating well, I think it's so much more obvious, right?
551
00:42:17.551 --> 00:42:27.817
If you are, you know, super sick and you're only taking functional mushrooms and not doing something else, like, it might be less, you might be less sensitive to that example we talked about at the beginning of the show.
552
00:42:28.137 --> 00:42:28.357
Yeah.
553
00:42:28.557 --> 00:42:32.319
So yes, I think mushrooms have the ability to heal whole bodies.
554
00:42:32.339 --> 00:42:33.460
And there's something else.
555
00:42:33.860 --> 00:42:48.188
I shared a video about this recently, but the beta-glucan found in mushrooms, I don't know if you saw this, but the beta-glucan has actually been shown to, basically on a cellular level, prevent our lung cells from getting sick.
556
00:42:48.208 --> 00:42:51.310
So it's like this preventative coat that I'm picturing.
557
00:42:52.030 --> 00:42:55.212
And we know that's like the environment you're introducing, any...
558
00:42:55.512 --> 00:42:57.853
sort of pathogen to is what creates the reaction.
559
00:42:57.873 --> 00:43:02.476
So, you know, the last thing I'll say about this is, you know, I used to be allergic to eggs.
560
00:43:02.996 --> 00:43:04.177
I'm not allergic to eggs anymore.
561
00:43:04.217 --> 00:43:10.480
It's because I fixed my gut microbiome so much that when I introduced the egg to the system that I'm totally fine now, right?
562
00:43:10.800 --> 00:43:23.847
And so mushrooms feel and they're being increasingly proven to create this, you know, protective layer on our whole system that when something outside virus pathogen is introduced, that it protects us against illness.
563
00:43:23.867 --> 00:43:24.107
Yeah.
564
00:43:24.267 --> 00:43:26.108
This is my most favorite thing to talk about.
565
00:43:26.529 --> 00:43:28.550
So yeah, I love that analogy.
566
00:43:28.810 --> 00:43:32.573
And you know, when you look at your blood vessels, even when you look at bok choy, right?
567
00:43:32.593 --> 00:43:45.642
Like you just see the resemblance of the fact that we come from nature and we're made from nature and even everything that's coming out around our lymphatic system as well and how that mimics the quality of nature and a communication system, right?
568
00:43:45.822 --> 00:43:46.023
Yeah.
569
00:43:46.683 --> 00:43:48.645
how on, it's just mind boggling.
570
00:43:48.665 --> 00:43:51.707
Like when you think about walking on the soil, I love that story that you told.
571
00:43:52.047 --> 00:43:56.690
You would never know that you were walking across an entire network of mycelium, right?
572
00:43:57.431 --> 00:43:58.732
And no idea what's under there.
573
00:43:58.752 --> 00:44:01.034
You have no clue what the earth is made out of.
574
00:44:01.454 --> 00:44:02.875
And this disconnection that we have.
575
00:44:03.175 --> 00:44:10.581
And when I think about building resilience back into the body, even beta glucans and the studies that they're finding now have to do with oxidative stress.
576
00:44:10.621 --> 00:44:11.882
And a lot of the things that,
577
00:44:12.662 --> 00:44:18.549
kind of, you know, make the stress happen faster within the body is the result of living in our modern day world.
578
00:44:19.290 --> 00:44:28.982
So here I am thinking that if you need the reminder, you are not only your greatest healer, I think that our bodies are probably the most intelligent things on the planet.
579
00:44:29.503 --> 00:44:31.805
And they function better when we're connected to nature.
580
00:44:32.125 --> 00:44:34.167
I really hope that that's going to come online.
581
00:44:34.727 --> 00:44:48.359
And I think that mushrooms also, and maybe this is part of the next question, if ancient wisdom is known about mushrooms forever, when we look at pharmaceuticals, they're already getting most of our pharmaceuticals from nature through extracts and stuff like that.
582
00:44:48.959 --> 00:44:52.522
Why do you think we're being forced to take that world seriously now?
583
00:44:52.983 --> 00:44:57.747
You know, I say on the show all the time, we've talked about integrative healthcare for so long, but no one's actually practicing it.
584
00:44:57.767 --> 00:44:58.067
Mm-hmm.
585
00:44:58.367 --> 00:44:58.587
Right.
586
00:44:58.947 --> 00:45:03.970
It's for our own healing journey that we uncover, OK, the sleep pillar, the meditation pillar, the movement pillar.
587
00:45:04.270 --> 00:45:14.737
We have to make it all work together, but we're doing that on our own effort as opposed to going to the doctor where we move into the meditation studio afterwards, followed by the traditional Chinese medicine doctor and then the Ayurvedic specialist.
588
00:45:14.757 --> 00:45:16.358
It's just it's not set up that way.
589
00:45:16.578 --> 00:45:16.798
Right.
590
00:45:17.238 --> 00:45:18.600
Yeah, it's exciting, right?
591
00:45:18.620 --> 00:45:21.382
Because it's, I think it's a triaging of a lot of different things.
592
00:45:21.423 --> 00:45:23.505
It's social media, it's access to information.
593
00:45:23.525 --> 00:45:34.156
You know, when I was going through my healing journey, a video, you know, really that changed my perspective was watching a video of Mark Hyman talk about the impact of acid blockers.
594
00:45:34.596 --> 00:45:35.657
on our health.
595
00:45:35.717 --> 00:45:40.081
And I was like, no one ever told me this, that it had X, Y, and Z side effects.
596
00:45:40.481 --> 00:45:45.105
And I called my doctor, you know, 10 years after I was taking that pill.
597
00:45:45.505 --> 00:45:53.932
And I was like, hey, like, I just learned that there might be some, you know, these side effects to this drug and it actually could lead to cancer and things later in life.
598
00:45:54.312 --> 00:45:55.273
And I was like, is this true?
599
00:45:55.293 --> 00:45:56.974
And he's like, oh yeah, you don't actually need to be taking that.
600
00:45:56.994 --> 00:45:58.516
It was more of a preventative thing.
601
00:45:58.536 --> 00:45:59.056
You can stop.
602
00:45:59.236 --> 00:46:03.360
And I'm like, oh my God, how much have I been blindly outsourcing this?
603
00:46:04.100 --> 00:46:10.821
I went really deep into the process where I looked up the cost and the profit margin of each of my pills.
604
00:46:10.841 --> 00:46:23.704
And I was like, oh my God, this is, I went very deep into understanding that a lot of the things that are prescribed, whether it's knee surgery or individual pharmaceuticals, the profit margins are very correlated with the rate of prescriptions, right?
605
00:46:23.724 --> 00:46:28.024
The most profitable ones, not always, but often are prescribed.
606
00:46:28.224 --> 00:46:30.585
I was told I needed emergency knee surgery and then I didn't
607
00:46:31.265 --> 00:46:35.694
Or I would never be able to fully, you know, walk around again and then end up getting stem cells.
608
00:46:35.734 --> 00:46:37.096
I was blessed to be able to do that.
609
00:46:37.397 --> 00:46:40.323
But I didn't need to get the knee surgery, you know, upon reflection.
610
00:46:40.363 --> 00:46:41.445
So, yeah.
611
00:46:41.867 --> 00:46:44.728
Remind me your original question because I went on a whole tangent.
612
00:46:44.748 --> 00:46:51.611
No, I think you kind of answered perfectly the fact that we were at a point in time where we must go back to ancient wisdom.
613
00:46:51.631 --> 00:46:51.992
Oh, yeah.
614
00:46:52.232 --> 00:46:52.492
Okay.
615
00:46:52.952 --> 00:46:53.212
Yeah.
616
00:46:53.252 --> 00:46:58.094
So I think it's exciting because I think more and more because we're, you know, we're the sickest we've ever been.
617
00:46:58.254 --> 00:47:02.576
And you see this a lot with what's happening, you know, with everything RFK is pushing forward.
618
00:47:02.596 --> 00:47:06.238
People are responding and paying attention.
619
00:47:06.678 --> 00:47:10.459
to the fact that we need to change our food system because we're the sickest we've ever been.
620
00:47:10.999 --> 00:47:13.960
And the solutions that are available are failing us.
621
00:47:14.020 --> 00:47:28.164
Even with mental health, when we talk about the world of psychedelics, the way that if you're advocating for policy around psychedelics, the way that you would onboard someone who might be more resistant to that understanding is to get them to understand what you can already agree with, right?
622
00:47:28.524 --> 00:47:29.924
What we have available isn't working.
623
00:47:30.204 --> 00:47:32.065
We're in the worst mental health crisis we've ever been in.
624
00:47:32.465 --> 00:47:32.685
Yeah.
625
00:47:33.045 --> 00:47:40.288
And there might be some promise in these, you know, at least they can admit there might be some promise in these other molecules that have had these extraordinary, extraordinary results.
626
00:47:40.368 --> 00:47:54.995
So I think access to information, I think as more scandals come out where you realize the profit incentive behind a lot of these systems is more and more obvious now because you have all these, you know, exposing documentaries, you have all of this information that people are aware of.
627
00:47:55.675 --> 00:47:59.976
And we feel it more than we've ever felt it.
628
00:48:00.177 --> 00:48:05.518
So I would say people are paying attention now more than ever because we're waking up more than ever.
629
00:48:05.598 --> 00:48:12.180
You know, if you have just statistically, there's 11 million people in the United States that are using microdosing psilocybin.
630
00:48:12.661 --> 00:48:17.462
They did a RAND report and that is how many people are using low dose psychedelics.
631
00:48:17.542 --> 00:48:20.523
That's 69% of the total percentage of people that are using psilocybin.
632
00:48:20.903 --> 00:48:24.568
A few years ago, two years ago, it was 4 million people.
633
00:48:24.948 --> 00:48:27.431
So it's growing like crazy.
634
00:48:27.471 --> 00:48:39.845
And if you have that many people that are at minimum what you can derive from that data interested in changing their consciousness to become a happier, healthier human, which is most of the reason why people are engaging in these practices, then it's going to be a better person.
635
00:48:39.965 --> 00:48:40.966
especially microdosing.
636
00:48:41.006 --> 00:48:45.310
You know, you microdose with the intention to microdose, not because you want to take five grams of mushrooms.
637
00:48:45.330 --> 00:48:49.093
You're really looking at the impact of those, you know, those smaller doses.
638
00:48:49.653 --> 00:48:56.059
So I just think more and more people are waking up and I'm really excited to see how that unfolds over the next few years.
639
00:48:56.579 --> 00:48:57.219
I think so too.
640
00:48:57.259 --> 00:49:13.404
Honestly, even since starting this podcast, the amount of messaging that I'm seeing around ancient wisdom rise is because people are starting to see through or they've gone through a journey like you and I where they're like, okay, you know, I don't feel a whole lot better and I'm continuing to get sick.
641
00:49:13.424 --> 00:49:14.184
This isn't working.
642
00:49:14.204 --> 00:49:16.125
It might be a band-aid, but it certainly is not working.
643
00:49:16.705 --> 00:49:20.046
And let's just call out like there is a time and a place for pharmaceuticals.
644
00:49:20.546 --> 00:49:22.707
They can be life-saving, life-changing.
645
00:49:23.247 --> 00:49:35.534
However, if you have a parent who's alive, who's in their 70s, 80s, and 90s, just imagine a lifetime of being given prescription meds, followed by an additional prescription, followed by an additional.
646
00:49:35.835 --> 00:49:41.438
Like my mom right now is just on so many and doctors can't even think about how to reverse the impact of that.
647
00:49:41.638 --> 00:49:44.699
And she's got an entire history of autoimmune disease.
648
00:49:44.759 --> 00:49:53.882
But I'd wonder going back if there was more focus on the resiliency of things or more focus on, well, how do I bring my body back online?
649
00:49:54.502 --> 00:49:56.183
How she could have healed like so many others.
650
00:49:57.504 --> 00:50:14.681
I think just, you know, an interesting kind of question that I like to pose to myself when I can remember to do so as often as I can is with everything you consume, whether it's, you know, you have like your chlorophyll water here, we have super mush and we have, you know, tea here, pharmaceuticals, substances, anything.
651
00:50:14.701 --> 00:50:16.223
It's like, what direction is it taking you?
652
00:50:16.243 --> 00:50:17.664
Is it taking you into your head or your heart?
653
00:50:18.045 --> 00:50:18.245
Yeah.
654
00:50:18.345 --> 00:50:19.126
And a lot of...
655
00:50:19.706 --> 00:50:22.389
A lot of pharmaceutical medications, not all, right?
656
00:50:22.489 --> 00:50:26.814
Like if you were to look at MDMA, it's an amphetamine, right?
657
00:50:26.954 --> 00:50:30.477
It's in the psychedelic family, but it's a heart medicine.
658
00:50:30.558 --> 00:50:32.520
So there's like nuance to this statement.
659
00:50:32.780 --> 00:50:37.064
But in general, like high amounts of caffeine takes you straight into your head, right?
660
00:50:37.184 --> 00:50:37.925
Or Adderall-
661
00:50:38.806 --> 00:50:41.548
you know, which is a super commonly prescribed ADHD medication.
662
00:50:41.568 --> 00:50:43.569
It takes you into your head because it's performance.
663
00:50:44.070 --> 00:50:50.554
And so we're constantly being pitched performance over, you know, over heart-centered action.
664
00:50:51.095 --> 00:51:02.763
And I think with everything we consume, food, sugar, you know, to ask yourself that question, is this taking me into my heart or is it taking me into my head is a simple way to look at things.
665
00:51:03.343 --> 00:51:05.725
You just nailed the foundation of how I work with my clients.
666
00:51:06.065 --> 00:51:11.170
How can we shut down all the noise in the mind and put the wisdom back into the body, which I think is always guiding us.
667
00:51:11.871 --> 00:51:13.373
But we've become experts.
668
00:51:13.393 --> 00:51:15.254
We've mastered ignoring symptoms.
669
00:51:15.475 --> 00:51:17.397
And we're so addicted to feeling great.
670
00:51:17.757 --> 00:51:22.582
Like you and I, we probably said yes to the prescription right away because whatever it takes to feel better, I'll take it.
671
00:51:22.742 --> 00:51:23.022
Right.
672
00:51:23.603 --> 00:51:25.283
Because sometimes it feels like a lot of work.
673
00:51:25.623 --> 00:51:26.404
Yeah.
674
00:51:26.424 --> 00:51:35.666
And let's piggyback on that with the fact that you and I work in an industry where we're so interested in what the next best thing is.
675
00:51:36.226 --> 00:51:38.627
The red pill, the next trend, whatever it is.
676
00:51:39.247 --> 00:51:44.968
Mushrooms is a category that, you know, for lack of a better word, has in some ways been bulletproof.
677
00:51:45.708 --> 00:51:50.289
When I think about, you know, the CBD phase that happened, right?
678
00:51:50.349 --> 00:51:53.150
Or the hemp-infused everything that happened.
679
00:51:53.790 --> 00:51:55.272
Why do you think that mushrooms are different?
680
00:51:56.193 --> 00:51:57.994
I think it goes back to the ancient wisdom.
681
00:51:58.235 --> 00:52:09.445
To go back to Otzi the caveman, we have been working with mushrooms in psychedelic forms and in functional forms as humans for thousands of years.
682
00:52:10.006 --> 00:52:12.969
And so in a lot of ways, they're the only medicine that has stood the test of time.
683
00:52:13.729 --> 00:52:15.311
And that's significant.
684
00:52:15.351 --> 00:52:22.937
And so when solutions are failing us, we look to our elders, we look to ancient wisdom, not as often as we should in the Western world, right?
685
00:52:23.117 --> 00:52:25.499
And I keep referencing that because there is a distinction.
686
00:52:25.579 --> 00:52:33.105
Like if you look at Eastern cultures, Chinese medicine, where I grew up, over in Taiwan, I was there for the first eight years of my life—
687
00:52:33.765 --> 00:52:37.388
They think it's kind of funny that the West is having this massive moment with mushrooms.
688
00:52:37.408 --> 00:52:42.953
They're like, we have been in this game for a very long time, both with functional specifically, right?
689
00:52:43.414 --> 00:52:50.340
And again, indigenous tribes using psilocybin mushrooms for ceremonial purposes for thousands of years as well.
690
00:52:50.840 --> 00:52:55.404
So I think the ancient wisdom is really the flag here.
691
00:52:55.685 --> 00:53:03.672
And what's happening is we have now all this modern science that's catching up and being able to pinpoint what is actually happening in the body.
692
00:53:04.112 --> 00:53:11.199
Because, you know, if you think about, you know, a shaman who's serving you a psilocybin mushroom in ancient times, right?
693
00:53:11.619 --> 00:53:18.124
They probably don't know the mechanism of action of how it's working in the liver and then going into the bloodstream and all of these different things.
694
00:53:18.144 --> 00:53:29.191
Like modern science is catching up and being able to explain to a conservative and maybe more discerning adult in the modern world of what's actually happening in our system.
695
00:53:29.511 --> 00:53:39.318
So these two worlds are merging together, which I think is really important because we know now more about these molecules, functional mushrooms, psilocybin mushrooms, other psychedelics than we ever have.
696
00:53:39.878 --> 00:53:45.500
But the legitimacy behind them is really the marriage of the modern science and the ancient wisdom.
697
00:53:45.840 --> 00:53:46.700
Beautifully said.
698
00:53:47.281 --> 00:53:51.122
Yeah, you and I are both a big fan of studies and data and stuff like that.
699
00:53:51.142 --> 00:53:54.783
But I think there's also an inner knowing of when something feels good.
700
00:53:54.803 --> 00:53:58.825
And a lot of people are popping pills without feeling any different.
701
00:53:59.125 --> 00:53:59.305
Right.
702
00:53:59.685 --> 00:54:06.428
I think it's important to mention, so, you know, who knows, people are going to be inspired after this and not really know where to start their mushroom journey.
703
00:54:06.848 --> 00:54:12.370
There was a study in 2022, 30% of mushroom supplements reviewed didn't meet their label claims for active compounds.
704
00:54:12.830 --> 00:54:17.172
So if this is going to continue to be a trend that's rising, as it should...
705
00:54:18.072 --> 00:54:20.153
You mentioned how to look for things on a label.
706
00:54:20.553 --> 00:54:27.077
Do you know around, are there going to be, you know, any specifics with labeling that people should look out for?
707
00:54:27.577 --> 00:54:38.484
You know, we don't want people going to CVS and buying something off the shelf thinking that it's going to support them necessarily because it could just be fairy dust mushrooms that are sprinkled into it combined with filler and stuff like that.
708
00:54:39.264 --> 00:54:39.484
Yeah.
709
00:54:39.504 --> 00:54:41.825
So for functional mushrooms, it's really those main things.
710
00:54:42.065 --> 00:54:44.726
Fruiting body mushrooms, looking for the extract ratio.
711
00:54:45.126 --> 00:54:48.068
There's a lot of innovation that's happening with functional mushrooms as well.
712
00:54:48.488 --> 00:54:51.009
People are extracting them, you know, making more potent extracts.
713
00:54:51.029 --> 00:54:52.189
Like all of that's fantastic.
714
00:54:52.269 --> 00:54:53.470
I'm really excited about that.
715
00:54:53.510 --> 00:54:56.271
So I know the industry will evolve that statistic.
716
00:54:56.291 --> 00:55:00.212
I mean, I'm even sure that it's much more than that that don't meet their claims.
717
00:55:00.252 --> 00:55:04.214
It might be on the low end, but it's a $40 billion industry, the functional mushroom industry.
718
00:55:04.394 --> 00:55:04.794
industry.
719
00:55:05.055 --> 00:55:05.976
So this is massive.
720
00:55:06.656 --> 00:55:10.400
And the amount of products that are coming out are remarkable.
721
00:55:10.440 --> 00:55:12.381
So it's exciting because the whole market is growing.
722
00:55:12.782 --> 00:55:16.345
But as you see with any industry, we saw this with CBD, right?
723
00:55:16.745 --> 00:55:23.291
I think there's a difference here because CBD doesn't have the ancient wisdom flag in the same way that fungi does.
724
00:55:23.732 --> 00:55:26.634
But the most important thing is to really look at the
725
00:55:28.656 --> 00:55:29.797
Look at their transparency.
726
00:55:29.837 --> 00:55:31.438
Look where they're sourcing the mushrooms from.
727
00:55:31.678 --> 00:55:41.663
Look if they have a founder that's forward-facing and talking about, you know, we're trying to be even more public and, you know, more involved in education around where we make our products, all of those things.
728
00:55:41.963 --> 00:55:43.064
Those are really important flags.
729
00:55:43.124 --> 00:55:46.106
And I would say, you know, start very simple.
730
00:55:46.126 --> 00:55:49.708
You know, look at, you know, where our product line is going.
731
00:55:49.748 --> 00:55:50.928
It's a little sneak preview.
732
00:55:50.968 --> 00:55:55.411
It's like, we're going to make, you know, either single or double ingredient blends.
733
00:55:55.551 --> 00:55:56.171
Great.
734
00:55:56.231 --> 00:55:56.932
Very simple.
735
00:55:56.952 --> 00:55:57.072
Great.
736
00:55:57.552 --> 00:56:05.736
You know, the world in which we need to fit 100 ingredients into a very small product is giving people like a small amount of each of each ingredient.
737
00:56:05.756 --> 00:56:10.658
So what we want to do is, you know, higher doses, fewer ingredients, like just very simple.
738
00:56:11.058 --> 00:56:13.579
You can't read the label and you don't understand what's on it.
739
00:56:13.979 --> 00:56:17.060
You probably shouldn't consume it like basic, basic knowledge there.
740
00:56:17.080 --> 00:56:22.843
And I would say, you know, for people that are looking to start with functional mushrooms,
741
00:56:23.363 --> 00:56:28.065
pick a powder, pick a gummy, pick a capsule and stick with it consistently.
742
00:56:28.525 --> 00:56:32.427
These are not, you know, you'll get a boost if you take a high dose of lion's mane.
743
00:56:32.587 --> 00:56:34.928
Like I love, you know, I love drinking it with matcha in the morning.
744
00:56:34.948 --> 00:56:36.929
I feel this cognitive boost.
745
00:56:37.089 --> 00:56:39.049
It's a combination of a little bit of caffeine, right?
746
00:56:39.090 --> 00:56:39.970
And the lion's mane.
747
00:56:40.370 --> 00:56:42.452
But they work best when they build in your system over time.
748
00:56:42.952 --> 00:56:48.918
Any work that I've done on myself that's actually healed me has been not an overnight success.
749
00:56:49.018 --> 00:56:50.159
It's been work.
750
00:56:50.439 --> 00:56:51.840
It's work to get into your system.
751
00:56:51.921 --> 00:56:56.284
It's not like drinking a cup of coffee, that feeling.
752
00:56:56.745 --> 00:57:01.009
But it's a more subtle attunement to nature, to the rest of your life.
753
00:57:01.069 --> 00:57:05.092
And so it's really worth it because you're calm and you're peace of mind.
754
00:57:05.833 --> 00:57:09.816
over the course of a few months of taking these will really be rewarded.
755
00:57:10.296 --> 00:57:14.839
People that take functional mushrooms consistently are usually with them for life.
756
00:57:15.339 --> 00:57:19.022
They're not like a thing that people rotate in and off of very often.
757
00:57:19.462 --> 00:57:24.486
People that really notice that, they're like, wow, this is such a supportive thing for me to have in my routine.
758
00:57:24.866 --> 00:57:26.227
That's super powerful.
759
00:57:26.647 --> 00:57:28.349
I love the word attunement.
760
00:57:28.609 --> 00:57:35.355
In many ways, you know, if you're going through a really stressful season in your life, obviously these can be therapeutic.
761
00:57:35.796 --> 00:57:44.124
But if you are experiencing consistent stress and you feel like you've been that way for a long time, to your point, you've got to look at all of the pillars, right?
762
00:57:44.224 --> 00:57:47.186
We can't expect mushrooms to come in and be the superhero of everything.
763
00:57:47.227 --> 00:57:48.388
They can be highly supportive.
764
00:57:49.048 --> 00:57:59.059
And do the work to look at where the biggest kind of inflammation is coming at so that you really reap the rewards and understand how they can attune your body to feeling better every day.
765
00:57:59.720 --> 00:58:01.542
You've mentioned brain fog a few times.
766
00:58:01.562 --> 00:58:03.224
You mentioned Lion's Mane just now.
767
00:58:03.244 --> 00:58:07.729
What's one of your favorite go-tos in the morning for all the people experiencing brain fog right now?
768
00:58:08.329 --> 00:58:17.894
I mean, lion's mane, you know, its nature is Adderall is, you know, my unofficial terminology for it because most people will know that reference.
769
00:58:17.914 --> 00:58:25.697
But if you don't, Adderall is a stimulant and, you know, it's an ADHD medication drug that will make people feel super productive.
770
00:58:26.838 --> 00:58:29.179
Unfortunately, it has like some side effects that are not effective.
771
00:58:29.619 --> 00:58:33.121
preferable if you're taking it over, you know, long period of time.
772
00:58:33.581 --> 00:58:43.005
Lion's mane is this beautiful neuroplasticity inducing supplement mushroom that doesn't have those side effects and it creates more neuroplasticity in the brain.
773
00:58:43.045 --> 00:58:55.451
So if you've actually looked at, you know, a really great study on lion's mane that I love is consistent use of lion's mane in adults shows neuroprotective benefits against diseases like Alzheimer or any sort of degenerative disease, brain disease.
774
00:58:56.111 --> 00:58:59.453
And so when you think about, you know, Alzheimer's runs in my family.
775
00:58:59.493 --> 00:59:08.878
So I'm constantly thinking about, not in a fearful way, but in a preventative way, like what am I more likely to get because of my family history and my DNA?
776
00:59:09.338 --> 00:59:14.981
And Alzheimer's is something that runs in my family, but it's completely preventable if you take care of your brain chemistry.
777
00:59:15.021 --> 00:59:18.443
And so lion's mane is a really incredible way that we can take care of Alzheimer's.
778
00:59:18.683 --> 00:59:19.424
our brain chemistry.
779
00:59:19.444 --> 00:59:21.425
And these studies show pretty remarkable results.
780
00:59:21.905 --> 00:59:27.289
And if you look at someone's brain on lion's mane, it actually has this level of neuroplasticity.
781
00:59:28.089 --> 00:59:38.056
So, you know, psilocybin mushrooms kind of get all the sexy airtime around regrowing your brain pathways and neuroplasticity and connecting, you know, and connecting new dots.
782
00:59:38.616 --> 00:59:42.959
Lion's mane is also, you know, really, really powerful for doing that.
783
00:59:43.534 --> 00:59:44.535
Oh, cool.
784
00:59:44.916 --> 00:59:52.204
I remember when I first started using mushrooms, whether it was a powder or a tincture, I thought it would just kill the flavor of everything.
785
00:59:52.264 --> 00:59:53.425
And it's not the case.
786
00:59:53.746 --> 00:59:54.426
Some of them do.
787
00:59:54.767 --> 00:59:57.090
Okay, so like reishi mushrooms, super bitter.
788
00:59:57.290 --> 00:59:58.311
Reishi mushrooms, yeah.
789
00:59:58.411 --> 01:00:01.675
If I mix that into like a cacao or something at night, it would just kind of kill the flavor.
790
01:00:01.955 --> 01:00:02.595
Yeah, yeah.
791
01:00:02.635 --> 01:00:03.275
No, kind of it.
792
01:00:03.295 --> 01:00:04.716
So reishi can be super intense.
793
01:00:04.736 --> 01:00:11.698
There's companies now that are working on creating flavorless extracts, which would be a really cool kind of innovative step.
794
01:00:11.958 --> 01:00:12.878
And functional mushrooms.
795
01:00:13.218 --> 01:00:14.779
Lion's mane doesn't really have a flavor.
796
01:00:14.839 --> 01:00:16.499
Adding it to coffee, completely fine.
797
01:00:16.519 --> 01:00:19.720
Like we're going to make a lion's mane matcha coming up soon.
798
01:00:19.780 --> 01:00:21.801
So I'm really excited about that.
799
01:00:21.821 --> 01:00:22.881
Super high dose lion's mane.
800
01:00:22.901 --> 01:00:23.561
That's perfect for you.
801
01:00:23.581 --> 01:00:24.962
No, because I'm obsessed with matcha.
802
01:00:25.022 --> 01:00:25.422
I love it.
803
01:00:25.802 --> 01:00:27.904
So the flavor of them can be really intense.
804
01:00:27.944 --> 01:00:29.985
But if you, you know, we masked them in gummies.
805
01:00:30.005 --> 01:00:33.108
The reason why we made a gummy is because we wanted mushrooms to taste good.
806
01:00:33.468 --> 01:00:39.752
Because on their own, these extracts can be better, especially if you're taking the right product.
807
01:00:39.792 --> 01:00:49.099
If you take a, you know, powder that doesn't have any bitterness to it, it might not actually be, you know, the dosing and the extract ratio and all of that that we just talked about with mushroom.
808
01:00:49.340 --> 01:00:49.560
Yeah.
809
01:00:49.820 --> 01:00:50.360
So cool.
810
01:00:51.461 --> 01:00:52.102
I can't wait for that.
811
01:00:52.782 --> 01:01:02.845
A lot of people this year, this is the first year in many years where I refuse to do any type of like a new year protocol to step into something hardcore or doing a cleanse.
812
01:01:02.885 --> 01:01:08.646
Because I found after last year, so many people were just trying to make it to the end of the year.
813
01:01:08.926 --> 01:01:10.807
Like it wasn't even about burnout anymore.
814
01:01:11.287 --> 01:01:15.908
People were just like numb to the world and life and expectations.
815
01:01:16.108 --> 01:01:19.429
And, you know, even through the winds, it was just like a disconnection.
816
01:01:20.409 --> 01:01:22.371
A lot of people are experiencing that this year.
817
01:01:22.391 --> 01:01:37.882
Can you talk to us a little bit about the intelligence of mushrooms to support somebody and feeling again and maybe breaking out of what we talked about earlier is just the cycle of kind of identifying with this is it right now and remembering that?
818
01:01:38.649 --> 01:01:46.075
Yeah, it's such a beautiful question because, I mean, I know so many people, right, including myself at times that are like doing all the things.
819
01:01:46.135 --> 01:01:47.036
Yeah.
820
01:01:47.276 --> 01:01:54.202
And there's still not this cultivation and this consistency of peace of mind, which I think is the ultimate success that we can achieve.
821
01:01:54.222 --> 01:01:56.404
Do I feel good and happy in my body?
822
01:01:56.424 --> 01:01:58.386
And do I feel like I'm exactly where I'm supposed to be?
823
01:01:59.007 --> 01:02:01.689
And often that shift can be subtle, right?
824
01:02:01.729 --> 01:02:05.752
The low level anxiety that just like slowly pulsates through our system.
825
01:02:06.753 --> 01:02:18.102
It can be frog in a boiling pot where you don't know that you're living with a low-level anxiety or even very low-grade depression where you're just, I don't feel the sense of joy.
826
01:02:18.122 --> 01:02:21.864
One of my teachers always says to me, mushrooms are instruments of joy.
827
01:02:22.545 --> 01:02:28.269
And so I have this analogy where I like to picture everything that we're consuming as...
828
01:02:29.770 --> 01:02:46.402
you know, like, well, I guess start with the body, like for the body picturing it as this, this empty opera house, like this vacant vessel, everything that we feed ourselves, whether it's thoughts or social media or food or supplements or psychedelics, whatever it is, everything that we feed ourselves has a different note and a different tone.
829
01:02:46.862 --> 01:02:55.949
And then over time, these notes become melodies and harmonies and they, they form together and it becomes the symphony of your life and the song that you play out to the world.
830
01:02:56.629 --> 01:02:56.829
And I
831
01:02:57.650 --> 01:03:08.673
we can feel when someone in our presence is playing a really sad song or a really joyous song or, you know, a melancholy tune, whatever it might, whatever it might be.
832
01:03:09.193 --> 01:03:11.193
But I like to think about it in audio, right?
833
01:03:11.213 --> 01:03:12.874
Like what is that frequency that we're playing out?
834
01:03:12.934 --> 01:03:16.695
And someone who's in burnout is playing a burnout, is playing a burnout song.
835
01:03:17.475 --> 01:03:26.457
And the beautiful thing about whether it's functional mushrooms or, you know, I love, I love microdosing for exactly this whole comment on it in a second, but yeah.
836
01:03:26.837 --> 01:03:39.420
They can be this tuning fork to the nervous system to put you back in a state of balance and calm and centeredness and are just really great tools to be able to access along with a lot of other things.
837
01:03:40.000 --> 01:03:44.801
Microdosing is the practice of taking a small amount of psychedelic mushroom.
838
01:03:45.501 --> 01:03:51.302
You can microdose other things as well, but psilocybin specifically is a small amount that's below the hallucinogenic threshold.
839
01:03:51.342 --> 01:03:54.963
So it's sub-hallucinogenic, meaning you're not having any visual effects.
840
01:03:55.663 --> 01:03:56.063
effects.
841
01:03:56.744 --> 01:04:02.429
It's usually between 0.1 and 0.2 grams of psilocybin mushrooms.
842
01:04:02.449 --> 01:04:10.535
And the ability to move through life and let things pass through you is really profound with microdosing.
843
01:04:10.556 --> 01:04:11.957
So with all of
844
01:04:13.838 --> 01:04:16.379
worked with to help bring them kind of through that process.
845
01:04:16.960 --> 01:04:25.224
The number one thing I would say that people benefit from is being able to interact with your life in a way that something will occur.
846
01:04:25.664 --> 01:04:31.707
But instead of like a sticky note that's sticking to your body that's covered in molasses, it'll just slide off of you.
847
01:04:32.467 --> 01:04:42.013
And I think the accumulation of all of these moments and, you know, expectations for people and stories like creates this weighing down of the system.
848
01:04:42.634 --> 01:04:50.779
And so I love, you know, I love that you're not doing some radical kind of new year, new you thing, because this is your life.
849
01:04:50.979 --> 01:04:53.281
You know, this is the moment that we're in now.
850
01:04:53.381 --> 01:04:57.063
And I'm trying to remind myself that.
851
01:04:58.664 --> 01:05:03.128
That my actual measure of success is, you know, how joyous am I in my day?
852
01:05:03.148 --> 01:05:07.733
And I love having these tools when I feel like I'm out of balance.
853
01:05:08.413 --> 01:05:15.260
Imagine moving through life and when the stuff happens, not having it hold you, right?
854
01:05:15.880 --> 01:05:23.062
I don't think a lot of us were really taught how to ever process properly, not to mention grief, because we don't even talk about that in our society.
855
01:05:23.082 --> 01:05:37.425
And yet most of us grew up with like this blueprint of hypervigilance or, you know, addiction to stress, living in burnout, but not even recognizing that we're there because it's just, it's so common.
856
01:05:37.465 --> 01:05:38.805
It's such a common place to live.
857
01:05:39.305 --> 01:05:42.866
How does one figure out a microdosing protocol then?
858
01:05:43.798 --> 01:05:45.219
Yeah, of course.
859
01:05:45.540 --> 01:05:45.640
No.
860
01:05:45.660 --> 01:05:49.403
So our nonprofit microdosing collective has a lot of good information about this.
861
01:05:49.424 --> 01:06:01.515
We have a microdosing guide and I'm very passionate about people sharing their experiences with with psychedelics because I think that the destigmatization of them will help inform culture and culture helps inform policy.
862
01:06:01.575 --> 01:06:05.879
So that's kind of the the way that I actually think will increase access is more people sharing their stories.
863
01:06:06.660 --> 01:06:10.863
So microdosing protocols are usually having it in your system four to five days a week.
864
01:06:11.163 --> 01:06:14.165
There's several different kind of main protocols that people follow.
865
01:06:14.906 --> 01:06:20.109
One is, you know, two days on, one day off, three weeks of that protocol, and then one week break.
866
01:06:20.169 --> 01:06:22.211
That's like a common protocol that people will follow.
867
01:06:22.931 --> 01:06:29.195
And there's a few others that are popular and created by, you know, a few different, you know, psychedelic educators that are awesome.
868
01:06:29.755 --> 01:06:40.041
So our guide, which you can find at microdosingcollective.org, has like a great overview of education, you know, what microdosing does to your system, what protocols to follow, etc.
869
01:06:40.501 --> 01:06:44.023
The biggest thing is it's currently illegal to access these substances.
870
01:06:44.463 --> 01:06:52.092
That being said, there's policies that are coming to allow people to access them and, you know, and save for legal ways.
871
01:06:52.512 --> 01:06:54.474
So I'm excited about where we're going with it.
872
01:06:54.995 --> 01:06:59.040
And there's a lot of really good resources that you can find online that's
873
01:06:59.480 --> 01:07:04.242
The biggest thing is don't take sketchy substances from someone that you do not know.
874
01:07:05.083 --> 01:07:19.090
The unfortunate reality is if, you know, if you live in New York State, for example, you can walk into any street corner store, deli, and find someone that's selling psilocybin mushrooms in the, you know, underground market and just kind of going for it.
875
01:07:19.150 --> 01:07:22.552
So as this movement is growing, there's more and more unsafe substances.
876
01:07:22.572 --> 01:07:25.953
So don't buy any of those would be my flag.
877
01:07:25.973 --> 01:07:28.915
And make sure you have like a safe, you know, vetted, trusted source.
878
01:07:30.470 --> 01:07:31.150
That is insane.
879
01:07:31.170 --> 01:07:31.570
Yeah.
880
01:07:32.090 --> 01:07:32.631
I'll share.
881
01:07:32.691 --> 01:07:35.271
So after I miscarried, I miscarried twins.
882
01:07:35.952 --> 01:07:40.433
Craig had a friend who experienced loss who talked about the benefits of microdosing.
883
01:07:41.173 --> 01:07:42.834
And Craig brought them for me to try.
884
01:07:42.854 --> 01:07:43.934
And it was a game changer.
885
01:07:43.954 --> 01:07:48.195
I kind of felt really stuck in this sadness for a long time and self-blame.
886
01:07:48.936 --> 01:07:55.637
And even after my healing journey, I kind of just forgot like, oh, you know, trusting that my body had to do what it had to do in order to move forward.
887
01:07:56.098 --> 01:07:56.858
It was a game changer.
888
01:07:56.878 --> 01:07:56.978
Yeah.
889
01:07:57.838 --> 01:07:59.038
Oh, that's, it's so beautiful.
890
01:07:59.118 --> 01:08:08.801
And I think specifically for grief in whatever form that might, that might be, this subtle adjustment while you're in your day-to-day life is so important.
891
01:08:08.881 --> 01:08:10.521
And you can access that through other ways, right?
892
01:08:10.541 --> 01:08:13.922
Microdosing is one, is one way to look at your life differently.
893
01:08:14.443 --> 01:08:23.465
But what I've seen even with my, with my mother and her experience of, you know, she got on a microdosing protocol after, after my dad passed away.
894
01:08:23.985 --> 01:08:26.486
And it was like a year and a half or so after.
895
01:08:26.526 --> 01:08:28.027
It wasn't immediate.
896
01:08:28.527 --> 01:08:31.429
And she's done kind of one-off days here and there before.
897
01:08:32.329 --> 01:08:35.651
But, I mean, she wrote a whole—I'll share it with you.
898
01:08:35.671 --> 01:08:41.213
She wrote a whole kind of essay to me about how this has changed her perspective and relationship with grief.
899
01:08:41.494 --> 01:08:45.856
And she described it so beautifully because she's like the tethers that I have to him—
900
01:08:46.636 --> 01:08:48.097
you know, in heaven.
901
01:08:48.517 --> 01:08:51.419
And she has very specific belief on that in a beautiful way.
902
01:08:52.059 --> 01:08:57.082
She's like, I feel like I'm able to cut some of those cords and allow him to move on.
903
01:08:57.583 --> 01:09:01.605
And I still feel connected, but I don't feel like I'm holding on so tightly.
904
01:09:02.206 --> 01:09:04.147
And she's this beautiful way she described it.
905
01:09:04.827 --> 01:09:07.349
And to witness her be able to use...
906
01:09:07.949 --> 01:09:18.673
You know, what is most commonly in culture a tool for creativity and optimization because of the popularization of, you know, Silicon Valley founders using microdosing.
907
01:09:19.093 --> 01:09:28.556
But I've seen for women, for mothers, for people that feel stuck in their lives to be able to gift people the opportunity to be 1% more neuroplastic.
908
01:09:29.036 --> 01:09:29.216
Yeah.
909
01:09:29.476 --> 01:09:31.657
While they're in their day-to-day life is such a blessing.
910
01:09:32.177 --> 01:09:38.799
And, you know, the movie scene example I like to think about is The Matrix where all the bullets are flying at you.
911
01:09:39.920 --> 01:09:49.063
And so I like to describe microdosing with this visual because it's like, if you think about your life, there's all this stuff that's coming at you, messages, emails, you know.
912
01:09:49.623 --> 01:09:53.346
conflicts with your partner, kids, family, all the things, right, work.
913
01:09:53.967 --> 01:10:07.418
And when something is coming at you that might be intrusive to the system, Neo in the matrix, he stops the bullets, he picks one up, he looks at it, and he moves it to the side and he's able to make a completely different decision.
914
01:10:07.858 --> 01:10:15.605
And so microdosing while you're in your life is able to slow down the thought patterns enough where instead of just automatically reacting, right,
915
01:10:16.085 --> 01:10:26.432
like returning to your 16-year-old self when your mother says something to you that triggers you to slow down and be a little bit more conscious as that thought is, you know, in the mind and coming out of the mouth is the way I like to think about it.
916
01:10:26.873 --> 01:10:27.693
So powerful.
917
01:10:28.374 --> 01:10:32.357
And I think something else that we need to move past is the stigma behind it.
918
01:10:32.757 --> 01:10:32.897
Right?
919
01:10:32.917 --> 01:10:36.079
I remember when I tried it, I was like, you know, what am I doing?
920
01:10:36.319 --> 01:10:38.161
You know, what are people going to think?
921
01:10:38.201 --> 01:10:38.321
Right.
922
01:10:38.961 --> 01:10:45.427
And yet now, kind of in the practitioner space, the science that's coming out behind it, that stigma needs to go away.
923
01:10:46.028 --> 01:10:57.558
And I was so excited to have this conversation with you, thinking last night that there's so many of us, I think a lot of people too in my community were in this sandwich generation of caring for our children, but also caring for our parents.
924
01:10:58.339 --> 01:11:01.942
And, you know, with our parents getting to the nearer
925
01:11:03.123 --> 01:11:08.410
end of their life, the benefit of microdosing maybe with your mother or your father.
926
01:11:08.931 --> 01:11:18.403
And what that impact would be like together to have that as a shared experience to process and maybe pre-grieve so that the final moment wasn't so intense.
927
01:11:19.166 --> 01:11:28.449
Yeah, I mean, mushrooms for end of life care and for post, you know, post grief, I think are so remarkable.
928
01:11:28.509 --> 01:11:30.549
And, you know, I was so I was working in this space.
929
01:11:30.629 --> 01:11:34.370
It's my full, you know, my full time mission before my my dad passed away.
930
01:11:34.410 --> 01:11:40.952
But afterwards, it gave me, like I said, such a deepening of seeing how valuable that this tool can be for families because the solutions are.
931
01:11:41.532 --> 01:11:46.015
with how we process grief or trauma, especially with the process of death.
932
01:11:46.415 --> 01:11:50.177
We don't do that well over in America specifically.
933
01:11:50.818 --> 01:11:55.941
But my dad, before he passed away, he was microdosing.
934
01:11:56.681 --> 01:12:03.605
And the significance of that is really special because he was finding this relaxation in his life.
935
01:12:06.227 --> 01:12:09.309
and he ended up passing away five days before he retired.
936
01:12:09.329 --> 01:12:18.735
And so much of my experience of his life was about, you know, talking to him about him getting to retirement and getting to this date in the future.
937
01:12:18.755 --> 01:12:18.875
And I,
938
01:12:21.136 --> 01:12:22.577
It wasn't all the way.
939
01:12:22.658 --> 01:12:28.923
Like he wasn't fully relaxed into, you know, not subscribing to that he needed to get somewhere.
940
01:12:28.983 --> 01:12:30.064
But it was softening.
941
01:12:30.665 --> 01:12:33.127
And that was a factor.
942
01:12:33.147 --> 01:12:35.650
And that was him using microdosing.
943
01:12:36.250 --> 01:12:37.611
My mom called them his happy pills.
944
01:12:37.651 --> 01:12:40.212
And it was like this kind of funny joke in our family.
945
01:12:40.252 --> 01:12:44.313
And it was like this subtle softening of not needing to get anywhere.
946
01:12:44.713 --> 01:12:48.795
And so to see him taste that was super impactful.
947
01:12:49.375 --> 01:12:59.059
And I think so much of, you know, especially when we get down to, you know, close to retirement, which is still a thing that we, I think retirement is kind of a funny concept.
948
01:12:59.079 --> 01:12:59.499
Yeah.
949
01:12:59.979 --> 01:13:03.600
But there's a lot of anxiety of releasing your purpose.
950
01:13:04.360 --> 01:13:15.044
And if you can be in your day-to-day experience and be more joyful and feel more relaxed and feel more peace of mind, like what a gift that is to your family, what a gift that is to those around you.
951
01:13:15.124 --> 01:13:18.165
And I'm excited to see what comes with that.
952
01:13:18.845 --> 01:13:32.619
end-of-life care and psilocybin with studies and things that are coming out because my personal experience has been that it is incredibly profound and I don't know what my family's grieving journey would have looked like if there was other tools that we had to turn to.
953
01:13:32.879 --> 01:13:34.841
My mom didn't get on an SSRI.
954
01:13:34.881 --> 01:13:35.242
She didn't.
955
01:13:35.502 --> 01:13:36.703
She said no to all of that.
956
01:13:37.024 --> 01:13:42.809
And she was able to use these other tools that are non-addictive and bring you into your heart, enable you to process grief.
957
01:13:43.450 --> 01:13:45.992
And we were actually looking at it and she's feeling her emotions.
958
01:13:46.373 --> 01:13:48.054
So I'm just I'm so impressed with her.
959
01:13:48.074 --> 01:13:53.479
And I know that's not everyone's journey is to be open to that at 65 years old.
960
01:13:54.500 --> 01:13:55.842
But it's been really special to witness.
961
01:13:56.755 --> 01:13:57.715
It's kind of frightening right now.
962
01:13:57.755 --> 01:13:58.376
My mom's older.
963
01:13:58.396 --> 01:13:59.476
She's 81.
964
01:14:00.036 --> 01:14:06.459
And the forecast right now for old age is frightening, like the amount of falls that are happening.
965
01:14:06.999 --> 01:14:12.662
And there's multiple doctors who said to me, I said, you know, how is every room in this hospital floor full?
966
01:14:13.362 --> 01:14:17.444
And three specific doctors looked at me and they said, we never expected people to live this long.
967
01:14:17.464 --> 01:14:17.864
Yeah.
968
01:14:18.784 --> 01:14:20.965
And so a lot of these people are suffering.
969
01:14:21.365 --> 01:14:23.345
They don't necessarily have the care that they need.
970
01:14:23.405 --> 01:14:33.648
We already know, like for our generation, we're living at this generational mismatch for the stressors on the human body and we're just trying to cope, which is why I think microdosing could be so powerful.
971
01:14:34.168 --> 01:14:35.049
So yeah, I love you.
972
01:14:35.089 --> 01:14:40.090
Thank you for hovering on that for a second because I just think it could paint a completely different picture for people.
973
01:14:40.410 --> 01:14:59.304
This last phase of our life, which could be such a decline, is now something where there is a bit of a lessened grip or enjoyment or peace or happiness that can come with it, especially if you're, you know, given a diagnosis or like my mom on different prescription medications or if the body actually is shutting down, but you're just not ready to go.
974
01:14:59.885 --> 01:15:01.067
Yeah, and there's an acceptance.
975
01:15:01.087 --> 01:15:06.294
You know, mushrooms at the end of the day, it's the first question you asked one of them, is their teachers and death.
976
01:15:06.534 --> 01:15:12.582
You know, I wrote this story after my dad died, is the one you're referencing, and it was called Mushrooms Eat Death for Breakfast.
977
01:15:13.003 --> 01:15:16.227
And the analogy there is that mushrooms, you know, fungi literally through enzymes—
978
01:15:16.688 --> 01:15:30.054
that they produce, when something dies on the forest floor, they will come out and the fungi will come out, eat the decaying body or whatever it is and decompose it and return its nutrients to the soil.
979
01:15:30.574 --> 01:15:36.177
So mushrooms just integrate, you know, fungi just integrates death into the process of, you know, of life.
980
01:15:36.977 --> 01:15:38.558
And we don't do that.
981
01:15:38.718 --> 01:15:47.020
We literally put bodies in coffins and freeze them and interrupt the natural cycle so that fungi can't eat them.
982
01:15:47.560 --> 01:15:50.801
And there's something really fascinating about that.
983
01:15:50.821 --> 01:15:51.461
Absolutely.
984
01:15:51.501 --> 01:15:54.942
And so from a spiritual perspective, I think that, you know, there's so much.
985
01:15:54.962 --> 01:15:58.143
Like we've talked about so many beautiful things that lion's mane can do for the brain.
986
01:15:58.183 --> 01:16:03.804
And, you know, there's this just incredible category of functional mushrooms for healing the body.
987
01:16:06.165 --> 01:16:12.767
It gets deeper for me because I look at how the mycelium operates and I'm like, well, we should be more like that.
988
01:16:12.887 --> 01:16:14.287
Humans should be more like mushrooms.
989
01:16:14.307 --> 01:16:17.008
They distribute nutrients to the tree when it's suffering.
990
01:16:17.028 --> 01:16:25.550
They're not worried about protecting their own little clan, you know, of they are, they are plant agnostic with how they, with how they share resources.
991
01:16:26.250 --> 01:16:32.032
And specifically when it comes to death, I think mushrooms are incredible teachers and
992
01:16:32.712 --> 01:16:38.354
of helping us die well, if we can open ourselves to listen to what that wisdom is.
993
01:16:38.374 --> 01:16:51.180
You know, most people that experience a psilocybin journey in a therapeutic setting will come out of that experience and share that they're not afraid to die because they've experienced, you know, a flavor of what that looks like.
994
01:16:51.200 --> 01:16:58.763
That's why they're so impactful for end-of-life care because people are able to experience with that other side, whatever that is for you.
995
01:16:59.243 --> 01:17:23.995
will look like and it makes it less scary and that's often the first time that a lot of people have opened their consciousness in that way true so i think specifically for end-of-life care which there's more and more policies that are allowing people to have access to that but what a gift it is to be able to give someone you know this beautiful experience before they transition and for their family to witness that i think there's just so much medicine in that
996
01:17:24.895 --> 01:17:25.355
Thank you.
997
01:17:25.595 --> 01:17:28.236
I think I needed to hear that for my mom.
998
01:17:29.196 --> 01:17:29.476
All right.
999
01:17:29.516 --> 01:17:31.636
You mentioned that 5G dose.
1000
01:17:32.217 --> 01:17:33.837
Let's just give a picture of this.
1001
01:17:34.437 --> 01:17:38.578
Working with a lot of people who've gone through psychedelic journeys, which have been really, really powerful.
1002
01:17:39.118 --> 01:17:45.539
I think that mushrooms holds a unique space because people aren't constantly diving back in for answers.
1003
01:17:45.579 --> 01:17:52.381
There's no addiction to go back in to see the way or to do the work or to have an ego death experience or anything like that.
1004
01:17:53.041 --> 01:18:01.404
It actually, from my own experience and obviously with working with people who've gone through their own, it's much more profound and there's much more ease that comes with it after.
1005
01:18:02.004 --> 01:18:11.148
Like you mentioned, the deeper connection that comes, the connection with consciousness, the ability to remember and see life in a little bit more of a less gripful way.
1006
01:18:11.888 --> 01:18:13.609
How does someone kind of enter this world?
1007
01:18:13.649 --> 01:18:16.130
We talked about doing your research and your education.
1008
01:18:16.750 --> 01:18:24.946
Maybe after doing that, when you truly feel ready seeking a practitioner who can support you, what would be the first steps for someone to kind of lean in that direction?
1009
01:18:25.408 --> 01:18:27.869
I think education always is the first thing.
1010
01:18:27.889 --> 01:18:28.629
Yeah.
1011
01:18:28.649 --> 01:18:34.230
People love to hear about my parents and how I introduced them to psychedelics because it's kind of a stigmatized thing, right?
1012
01:18:34.250 --> 01:18:34.450
For sure.
1013
01:18:34.850 --> 01:18:39.391
And it was multiple years of education before they were, they're not hippies.
1014
01:18:39.431 --> 01:18:43.832
They're not, you know, neither of them had ever tried a psychedelic before their 60s.
1015
01:18:44.813 --> 01:18:52.034
And that's important because education was the thing that pulled them in to want to have that experience.
1016
01:18:52.094 --> 01:18:55.315
And really more so my mom, my dad was kind of like, whatever she does, I'm good with.
1017
01:18:56.016 --> 01:19:05.050
But I'm using them as a case study here because education is super important, whether it's watching Fantastic Fungi, amazing documentary.
1018
01:19:05.090 --> 01:19:10.357
Michael Pollan wrote an incredible book that really changed the psychedelic culture called How to Change Your Mind.
1019
01:19:10.738 --> 01:19:12.780
That's an amazing kind of starter kit book to read.
1020
01:19:12.800 --> 01:19:19.285
I have other like starter kit resources that I have on my Instagram with just like great knowledge that people should look at.
1021
01:19:19.645 --> 01:19:28.692
I think everyone should see the brain scans of what happens to your brain under the influence of psilocybin before you ever consume it because it's incredible.
1022
01:19:29.152 --> 01:19:31.114
And then when this, you know, this molecule...
1023
01:19:31.554 --> 01:19:41.677
and this compound is pulsing through your system, you're actually able to like piece together what's happening and have a visual reference that your brain is connecting to neural pathways that it hasn't used before, which is pretty incredible.
1024
01:19:42.197 --> 01:19:46.178
So education first, always the legality of... Of course.
1025
01:19:46.398 --> 01:19:48.459
Is, you know, is a major key here.
1026
01:19:48.879 --> 01:19:54.400
There's other places out of the country where you can fully legally do, you know, psilocybin retreats.
1027
01:19:54.460 --> 01:19:55.781
Beckley is a great place to look.
1028
01:19:56.641 --> 01:19:59.802
I haven't gone there personally, but I know people that have and love it.
1029
01:20:00.262 --> 01:20:03.303
So there's a lot of great legal psilocybin retreats.
1030
01:20:03.804 --> 01:20:12.988
If you are in Oregon and Colorado, you can legally, in New Mexico now, you can legally do psilocybin therapy, which is amazing.
1031
01:20:13.088 --> 01:20:13.868
Yeah.
1032
01:20:14.008 --> 01:20:16.730
It's expensive, but there's really good models there.
1033
01:20:16.810 --> 01:20:18.430
So those are like three states that you can look into.
1034
01:20:18.471 --> 01:20:19.351
And other states that are...
1035
01:20:19.611 --> 01:20:20.231
that are coming.
1036
01:20:20.311 --> 01:20:24.392
So education first, check the legality of where you're, of where you're going.
1037
01:20:24.432 --> 01:20:30.033
And people are also, you know, they're going, we can't recommend that, but like people are going to the underground, to the underground.
1038
01:20:30.053 --> 01:20:37.555
And there's a lot of incredible facilitators that are facilitating underground and have been for, you know, a very long time with anyone.
1039
01:20:37.575 --> 01:20:44.457
I would just say really have your references and trust where you're, you're getting your information from people that have sat with them.
1040
01:20:44.977 --> 01:20:47.398
But my preference and excitement is that there's
1041
01:20:49.798 --> 01:20:54.319
to, you know, to these incredible experiences that can be so life-changing for people.
1042
01:20:54.919 --> 01:20:57.780
So that's, that's coming over, you know, over the coming years for sure.
1043
01:20:58.180 --> 01:20:58.720
Incredible.
1044
01:20:59.300 --> 01:21:05.301
It was really important to me that we took the conversation from functional to psychedelic for that reason.
1045
01:21:05.821 --> 01:21:12.062
You and I have been on many retreats and we've traveled to beautiful places where psychedelics aren't necessary.
1046
01:21:12.122 --> 01:21:15.923
Like we've put ourselves into environments and ceremonies and stuff like that, where
1047
01:21:16.423 --> 01:21:18.305
It's almost like the same wisdom that comes.
1048
01:21:18.866 --> 01:21:35.502
And something that I've noticed in the past decade, 15 years of doing this work, is that the people who make the longest, most tangible shifts, where wellness doesn't have this intense grip anymore, but it actually becomes them, are the ones who've taken wellness from something that they had to do into more of a spiritual journey.
1049
01:21:35.622 --> 01:21:35.983
Mm-hmm.
1050
01:21:36.503 --> 01:21:39.064
So wellness becomes the spiritual approach to their body.
1051
01:21:39.604 --> 01:21:49.666
And mushrooms are such a complimentary way to kind of get in touch with that in a world that is fast-paced, overcomplicated, very busy, stressful.
1052
01:21:49.786 --> 01:21:53.626
At the tips of our fingers, we're experiencing more stress than ever before in history.
1053
01:21:54.146 --> 01:21:57.427
So yeah, I really do hope that I'm such a big fan of your mission for the future.
1054
01:21:57.447 --> 01:22:00.548
And it's so important for me to have you on to share that.
1055
01:22:00.668 --> 01:22:01.648
So thank you.
1056
01:22:02.328 --> 01:22:05.971
Tell us about your nonprofit, what you could use, what you're looking for right now.
1057
01:22:06.552 --> 01:22:08.153
Yeah, no, I mean, I adore you.
1058
01:22:08.173 --> 01:22:12.317
And so this is such a fun opportunity to get to hang out with you and to see you.
1059
01:22:12.377 --> 01:22:14.359
And what you're doing is so important.
1060
01:22:14.379 --> 01:22:17.001
And I'm excited for more people to hear your message.
1061
01:22:17.021 --> 01:22:19.844
You know, you've obviously been shouting it from the rooftops for a very long time.
1062
01:22:19.884 --> 01:22:25.449
But like you alluded to, the world is waking up and catching up in a way that's really exciting.
1063
01:22:25.489 --> 01:22:26.330
So things that were
1064
01:22:27.030 --> 01:22:29.672
stigmatized are now being more accepted.
1065
01:22:29.692 --> 01:22:30.913
And I'm excited about that.
1066
01:22:30.933 --> 01:22:32.914
And you're really a pioneer of that of that world.
1067
01:22:32.954 --> 01:22:34.015
So thank you.
1068
01:22:34.515 --> 01:22:35.096
So thank you.
1069
01:22:35.196 --> 01:22:38.078
And yeah, I mean, like a few a few things that are kind of exciting.
1070
01:22:38.298 --> 01:22:40.820
Microdosing Collective, you mentioned that's our nonprofit.
1071
01:22:41.120 --> 01:22:45.063
We're doing really great work there educating people about low dose psychedelics.
1072
01:22:45.623 --> 01:22:47.264
And we're working on some really cool policy stuff.
1073
01:22:47.704 --> 01:22:52.346
So there's, you know, a lot of it's like still kind of under wraps, but coming kind of coming soon.
1074
01:22:52.366 --> 01:22:57.849
So hopefully there'll be some good headlines that we're involved in with moving some policy stuff forward in the near future.
1075
01:22:58.409 --> 01:23:05.432
But there's really great educational guides on on microdosingcollective.org or our Instagram that you can find, you know, and just follow along.
1076
01:23:05.753 --> 01:23:07.994
We're always like posting latest news and things like that.
1077
01:23:08.414 --> 01:23:10.875
And then Supermush is like a whole amazing adventure.
1078
01:23:11.035 --> 01:23:14.897
And you can find our products and Target and our website and Amazon and all the things.
1079
01:23:15.337 --> 01:23:15.897
They're the best.
1080
01:23:16.418 --> 01:23:17.298
We love them in our house.
1081
01:23:17.358 --> 01:23:18.259
My kids love them too.
1082
01:23:18.279 --> 01:23:19.000
They're great for kids.
1083
01:23:19.220 --> 01:23:19.460
Yeah.
1084
01:23:19.680 --> 01:23:20.040
Right?
1085
01:23:20.160 --> 01:23:20.821
They're great for kids.
1086
01:23:21.081 --> 01:23:21.581
Exactly.
1087
01:23:21.641 --> 01:23:22.562
Lower sugar too.
1088
01:23:22.742 --> 01:23:24.743
And just get them in touch with mushrooms.
1089
01:23:24.803 --> 01:23:27.605
They will be fascinated by the fact that they taste good.
1090
01:23:27.665 --> 01:23:32.048
And we wanted to make them a middle ground and meet people where they're at.
1091
01:23:32.709 --> 01:23:38.733
We didn't start with gummies, but then, you know, if you look at the number one and number two nutraceutical products in our space, it's gummies and powders.
1092
01:23:38.813 --> 01:23:40.674
And we're like, let's go to where people are.
1093
01:23:40.894 --> 01:23:43.296
And you don't have to remind people to take a gummy every day.
1094
01:23:43.716 --> 01:23:44.717
You look forward to it, you know?
1095
01:23:44.977 --> 01:23:47.099
I think I'm on my third bag of the creatine gummies.
1096
01:23:47.379 --> 01:23:48.080
I love the creatine.
1097
01:23:48.100 --> 01:23:49.261
Those are my fave.
1098
01:23:49.481 --> 01:23:50.242
So yeah, those are great.
1099
01:23:50.622 --> 01:23:50.822
All right.
1100
01:23:50.842 --> 01:23:53.124
We're going to link out everything below for people to follow you.
1101
01:23:53.145 --> 01:23:56.287
I also want to point out, Allie, you're such an incredible educator.
1102
01:23:56.307 --> 01:23:59.550
You've been really upping your educational content, I've noticed.
1103
01:23:59.951 --> 01:24:00.711
And I thought you had a book.
1104
01:24:00.992 --> 01:24:02.373
That just needs to be turned into books.
1105
01:24:03.033 --> 01:24:04.594
I really would love to write a book.
1106
01:24:04.955 --> 01:24:10.278
Maybe that's a, I'm inspired by, I want to write more.
1107
01:24:10.298 --> 01:24:13.861
I think that would help unlock more creativity in me.
1108
01:24:13.881 --> 01:24:17.103
So hopefully that will be a part of the future.
1109
01:24:17.143 --> 01:24:21.026
And I think it will be something about death because it's such a topic I'm so passionate about.
1110
01:24:21.226 --> 01:24:21.866
We need to hear it.
1111
01:24:22.467 --> 01:24:27.230
Grief happens in so many stages throughout our life before we even get to death and we're dying every day, right?
1112
01:24:27.911 --> 01:24:30.993
Tell us something that you're most excited about for the future outside of your wedding.
1113
01:24:31.013 --> 01:24:31.333
Yeah.
1114
01:24:32.175 --> 01:24:33.835
Yeah, I'm in love.
1115
01:24:33.895 --> 01:24:34.896
I guess that's the highlight.
1116
01:24:34.976 --> 01:24:36.116
That's kind of the highlight of my life.
1117
01:24:36.136 --> 01:24:38.376
I've been so in love with my partner and he's amazing.
1118
01:24:39.916 --> 01:24:49.278
And for me, it's been such a, you know, the journey of falling in love and being with your, you know, your human is just the foundation of everything else.
1119
01:24:50.078 --> 01:24:57.220
And the perspective that love gives us on the rest of our lives is, you know, it's everything.
1120
01:24:57.240 --> 01:24:59.300
Like at the end of the day, we talked about death, right?
1121
01:24:59.360 --> 01:24:59.640
It's like,
1122
01:25:00.100 --> 01:25:01.000
we're all going there.
1123
01:25:01.080 --> 01:25:08.462
And at the end of your life, when you're on your deathbed, people just want to be, you know, surrounded with their most favorite, cherished relationships.
1124
01:25:08.502 --> 01:25:20.164
And so I think when I look at the wisdom that I hopefully will have when I'm, you know, at that stage in life, I think what I would, what I would tell myself is just to be so grateful for the love that I have in my life, both with my partner and my friends.
1125
01:25:20.624 --> 01:25:26.945
But yeah, I'm really, I'm, I'm excited about the people that I'm around because I have so much psychological safety, you know,
1126
01:25:27.265 --> 01:25:29.367
with my partner and my community.
1127
01:25:29.987 --> 01:25:35.091
And I mean, that feels like the core foundation, which with everything else can thrive.
1128
01:25:35.111 --> 01:25:43.017
When that is not solidified, I find that life can get a little leaky, but that feels like the thing I'm the most grateful for.
1129
01:25:43.818 --> 01:25:46.100
Marriage is the greatest ride, honestly.
1130
01:25:46.140 --> 01:25:48.702
Like just even, just get ready for the greatest adventure.
1131
01:25:48.722 --> 01:25:49.182
Yeah.
1132
01:25:49.522 --> 01:25:50.723
All right, last question.
1133
01:25:51.364 --> 01:25:56.948
If you were to paint a picture of functional mushrooms and psilocybin in 10 years from now, what do you see?
1134
01:25:57.620 --> 01:26:06.222
Oh, man, I think that you are going to see functional mushrooms at every major retailer in the world.
1135
01:26:06.622 --> 01:26:14.783
I mean, there's already brands that are going into the big retail stores like Costco and kind of where mainstream, you know, mainstream culture is.
1136
01:26:14.824 --> 01:26:21.705
I think that functional mushroom supplements will be a, you know, zero stigmatized everyday staple in people's diets.
1137
01:26:22.345 --> 01:26:26.267
I think there's going to be really incredible new form factors and innovation in that space.
1138
01:26:26.327 --> 01:26:27.968
So I think they're going to be mainstream.
1139
01:26:28.128 --> 01:26:30.269
I think functional mushrooms will be mainstream.
1140
01:26:30.750 --> 01:26:46.138
And on the psilocybin side, I just hope that anyone that wishes to have an experience with psilocybin mushrooms, whether it's in a microdose way or in a larger dose journey way, will have legal safe access to do so.
1141
01:26:46.898 --> 01:26:47.658
With no stigma.
1142
01:26:48.119 --> 01:26:48.899
With no stigma, yeah.
1143
01:26:49.139 --> 01:26:49.599
You got it.
1144
01:26:50.280 --> 01:26:50.540
All right.
1145
01:26:50.580 --> 01:26:50.960
I love you.
1146
01:26:51.120 --> 01:26:51.580
I adore you.
1147
01:26:51.600 --> 01:26:52.301
Thank you for coming.
1148
01:26:52.321 --> 01:26:53.461
Love you too.
1149
01:26:54.021 --> 01:26:55.602
I hope today's episode inspired you.
1150
01:26:56.122 --> 01:26:57.283
This is a really big topic.
1151
01:26:57.323 --> 01:26:59.364
It is a pillar that I address with a lot of my clients.
1152
01:26:59.404 --> 01:27:10.589
And the intention is from all of these episodes is that you might hear something that inspires you to break free of what you think you should be doing into remembering that you are your greatest healer and your protocol should be different than everyone else.
1153
01:27:10.909 --> 01:27:14.691
And there's so many modalities that come from nature out there that are designed to help you remember.