Finding Joy When Your Prayers Go Unanswered | Lara Silverman | Ep. 158

WEBVTT
00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:03.240
Three years I went through so much anger so much
00:00:03.240 --> 00:00:05.099
questioning. So I mean just in my heart because
00:00:05.099 --> 00:00:08.259
you have to remember i'm on a bed Okay, and there
00:00:08.259 --> 00:00:10.779
came a point I will tell you and the lord was
00:00:10.779 --> 00:00:12.859
encouraging me keep waiting keep trusting, you
00:00:12.859 --> 00:00:15.039
know, I mean all sorts of messages from the lord
00:00:15.039 --> 00:00:18.000
But there came a point three years in where I
00:00:18.000 --> 00:00:21.699
felt The Holy Spirit say to me in his still soft
00:00:21.699 --> 00:00:24.420
voice the word acceptance and then he followed
00:00:24.420 --> 00:00:26.559
up the following few weeks Everywhere I turned
00:00:26.559 --> 00:00:30.280
it was always second Corinthians 12 9. My grace
00:00:30.280 --> 00:00:32.960
is sufficient for you I'm gonna hold you through
00:00:32.960 --> 00:00:35.259
this but I am calling you to acceptance of this
00:00:35.259 --> 00:00:39.719
and you can imagine I mean how painful that was
00:00:39.719 --> 00:00:42.299
to hear frankly just in the emotions of wait
00:00:42.299 --> 00:00:45.090
Lord I've been begging you for deliverance of
00:00:45.090 --> 00:00:47.969
my family. I mean, what do you mean? Like, it
00:00:47.969 --> 00:00:53.570
was just a very difficult word. Hey there. Welcome
00:00:53.570 --> 00:00:56.250
to the God's Goodness podcast. We are your hosts,
00:00:56.509 --> 00:00:58.590
Josh and Shelly Hankins, and we're here to share
00:00:58.590 --> 00:01:01.649
real stories of God's power, stories of hope,
00:01:01.990 --> 00:01:04.170
healing, and miracles that will strengthen your
00:01:04.170 --> 00:01:06.510
faith. No matter what you're walking through,
00:01:06.569 --> 00:01:09.109
we want to remind you that God is good and He's
00:01:09.109 --> 00:01:17.689
still moving today. Let's dive in. What do you
00:01:17.689 --> 00:01:19.750
do when you've prayed for things to change and
00:01:19.750 --> 00:01:22.290
they haven't? You want to believe God is good,
00:01:22.549 --> 00:01:24.829
but if you're being truthful, you thought His
00:01:24.829 --> 00:01:27.549
goodness would look different than this. So how
00:01:27.549 --> 00:01:30.090
do you keep trusting Him when what you desperately
00:01:30.090 --> 00:01:33.909
wanted Him to change hasn't changed? Laura Silverman,
00:01:34.250 --> 00:01:36.689
author and host of Singing Through Fire, has
00:01:36.689 --> 00:01:39.310
had to decide what she believes about God's goodness
00:01:39.310 --> 00:01:41.849
when her circumstances seem to say otherwise.
00:01:42.140 --> 00:01:44.780
And her story challenges a question we may not
00:01:44.780 --> 00:01:47.500
realize we're asking. Do I believe God is good
00:01:47.500 --> 00:01:50.040
because of what he gives me or because of who
00:01:50.040 --> 00:01:52.659
he is? Thank you so much for joining us today.
00:01:52.780 --> 00:01:54.439
We really appreciate having you on the show.
00:01:54.659 --> 00:01:56.760
Could you open us up in an opening prayer to
00:01:56.760 --> 00:01:59.840
get our momentum going? Absolutely. Thank you
00:01:59.840 --> 00:02:02.480
so much for having me on, Shelly and Josh. The
00:02:02.480 --> 00:02:05.280
pleasure is all mine. I would love to open us
00:02:05.280 --> 00:02:08.819
up in prayer. Thanks. Dear Lord, thank you so
00:02:08.819 --> 00:02:11.280
much for this opportunity to just speak over
00:02:11.280 --> 00:02:14.860
the airwaves about your glory, Lord, and the
00:02:14.860 --> 00:02:17.819
purposes you have even in our darkest places
00:02:17.819 --> 00:02:21.400
and our sufferings, Lord. So please, please give
00:02:21.400 --> 00:02:24.180
me the right words and give Shelly and Josh the
00:02:24.180 --> 00:02:26.539
right words to steward this conversation in a
00:02:26.539 --> 00:02:30.009
way that will encourage all the listeners out
00:02:30.009 --> 00:02:32.409
there, and I pray for all of their hearts, Lord,
00:02:32.469 --> 00:02:35.289
to take something away that will honor and glorify
00:02:35.289 --> 00:02:39.550
you and edify them. Amen. Amen. All right. Take
00:02:39.550 --> 00:02:42.110
us back to before your health began to change.
00:02:42.729 --> 00:02:45.210
What did your life look like then, and what happened
00:02:45.210 --> 00:02:48.430
that started changing everything? Absolutely.
00:02:48.710 --> 00:02:51.650
Well, so my journey through the fire, if you
00:02:51.650 --> 00:02:55.310
will, started eight years ago. I had just turned
00:02:55.310 --> 00:02:59.080
30. And this was in 2018 and I was at the top
00:02:59.080 --> 00:03:01.780
of my game. I mean, I had graduated from Stanford
00:03:01.780 --> 00:03:05.180
law school. I was very type A. I had worked for
00:03:05.180 --> 00:03:07.879
a big law firm for five years, really loving
00:03:07.879 --> 00:03:09.740
every second of it. I had worked for a couple
00:03:09.740 --> 00:03:12.500
of federal judges. I mean, we're talking, I was
00:03:12.500 --> 00:03:15.180
really, you know, a workaholic, if you will,
00:03:15.219 --> 00:03:17.639
which was bad, obviously, but we can get into
00:03:17.639 --> 00:03:20.860
the idols issue later. But the point is that
00:03:20.860 --> 00:03:23.879
the Lord had just opened. the door to my dream
00:03:23.879 --> 00:03:26.740
job as a federal criminal prosecutor. It was
00:03:26.740 --> 00:03:29.259
the job I had always wanted to do to work in
00:03:29.259 --> 00:03:32.379
criminal justice. I love public speaking and
00:03:32.379 --> 00:03:36.199
justice. And so here I was. And on the second
00:03:36.199 --> 00:03:40.080
week of the job, I fell mysteriously ill with
00:03:40.080 --> 00:03:43.699
a very rare neurological illness. And it's been
00:03:43.699 --> 00:03:46.120
eight years now, and frankly, we still don't
00:03:46.120 --> 00:03:48.539
have a proper diagnosis. I mean, doctors have
00:03:48.539 --> 00:03:51.479
given me, you know, a million diagnoses, but
00:03:51.479 --> 00:03:54.460
I don't believe we have the right one because
00:03:54.460 --> 00:03:57.680
after trying 150 treatments, nothing has worked.
00:03:58.360 --> 00:04:01.460
And, but the long and short of it is that first
00:04:01.460 --> 00:04:03.900
10 months, I took a leave from the U S attorney's
00:04:03.900 --> 00:04:05.860
office. They said, oh, you know, go heal from
00:04:05.860 --> 00:04:08.699
this thing, come back. And after trying about
00:04:08.699 --> 00:04:11.800
10 treatments, nothing worked. And so there came
00:04:11.800 --> 00:04:14.360
a point where I, my family was praying. We were
00:04:14.360 --> 00:04:17.560
like, okay, should Laura resign? I mean, I couldn't
00:04:17.560 --> 00:04:20.019
go back. I mean, and just to explain for the
00:04:20.019 --> 00:04:24.519
audience. Right now, I am bedridden about 70
00:04:24.519 --> 00:04:27.319
% of the day, so I'm in bed right now as we're
00:04:27.319 --> 00:04:30.480
recording this. Now, luckily, the last four years,
00:04:30.519 --> 00:04:33.399
I can sit up and walk, you know, a couple hours
00:04:33.399 --> 00:04:35.779
a day, then I lay back down, then sit back up.
00:04:36.120 --> 00:04:38.860
But basically, the illness stems from a faulty
00:04:38.860 --> 00:04:41.459
connection between my ears and my brain, such
00:04:41.459 --> 00:04:44.579
that my brain cannot tell where I am in space
00:04:44.579 --> 00:04:46.899
at any given point in time. So it's essentially
00:04:46.899 --> 00:04:49.939
vertigo, and it's, you know, exceedingly uncomfortable
00:04:49.939 --> 00:04:52.220
as you can imagine. Imagine and none of the drugs
00:04:52.220 --> 00:04:54.740
helped none of the treatments helped I mean But
00:04:54.740 --> 00:04:57.920
the point is after those first ten months the
00:04:57.920 --> 00:05:00.259
week that I was either supposed to resign or
00:05:00.259 --> 00:05:02.720
go back I felt so much pressure. I was thinking
00:05:02.720 --> 00:05:04.920
Lord. Are you really gonna make me resign from
00:05:04.920 --> 00:05:08.600
this dream job? I mean and my daily devotional
00:05:08.600 --> 00:05:11.879
that week my sister called me and She said have
00:05:11.879 --> 00:05:14.399
you read the devotional today? And I said no
00:05:14.800 --> 00:05:17.360
And I opened it and the message of the day was
00:05:17.360 --> 00:05:20.040
something like, you know, did God open a door
00:05:20.040 --> 00:05:23.100
only to close it? You know, is it really confusing
00:05:23.100 --> 00:05:26.740
right now? Trust God because he's doing something
00:05:26.740 --> 00:05:30.879
you can't see. And it was just like, it was waterworks
00:05:30.879 --> 00:05:33.000
because I kept thinking, why did you open the
00:05:33.000 --> 00:05:34.839
door to this job? Lord, if you're going to ask
00:05:34.839 --> 00:05:37.319
me to resign, essentially, I mean, I never had
00:05:37.319 --> 00:05:39.600
the chance to stand up in that courtroom and
00:05:39.600 --> 00:05:41.519
say, you know, good morning, your honor. My name
00:05:41.519 --> 00:05:43.639
is Laura Silverman and I represent the United
00:05:43.639 --> 00:05:46.569
States. So it really was heartbreaking, but I
00:05:46.569 --> 00:05:49.509
chose to give up the career and from there things
00:05:49.509 --> 00:05:51.850
went from bad to worse So, I don't know if I
00:05:51.850 --> 00:05:53.670
should keep going with the story or you want
00:05:53.670 --> 00:05:57.069
to ask any question. No, no, no keep going Okay,
00:05:57.569 --> 00:05:59.949
basically I was bedridden from there for three
00:05:59.949 --> 00:06:02.730
years straight and I'm talking literally disabled
00:06:02.730 --> 00:06:05.470
I mean on a bedpan with my mother nursing me
00:06:05.470 --> 00:06:08.470
in one bedroom and my father, you know bringing
00:06:08.470 --> 00:06:11.089
food every day They were feeding me. I mean it
00:06:11.089 --> 00:06:15.120
was we brought Doctors, doctor after doctor to
00:06:15.120 --> 00:06:17.920
our home, I was hospitalized a million times.
00:06:18.379 --> 00:06:21.060
Stanford, UCSF, none of them were able to help
00:06:21.060 --> 00:06:23.660
me. My whole church community praying for me.
00:06:23.959 --> 00:06:27.160
And you can imagine this job type experience
00:06:27.160 --> 00:06:30.019
of, okay, I was this high powered lawyer and
00:06:30.019 --> 00:06:33.399
now I'm on a bed. I'm completely disabled, relying
00:06:33.399 --> 00:06:37.160
on others, depending on the Lord exclusively.
00:06:37.300 --> 00:06:40.300
And I will tell you that the Lord was with me
00:06:40.300 --> 00:06:43.720
that entire time. I don't say that lightly. In
00:06:43.720 --> 00:06:46.519
other words, obviously he speaks to everyone
00:06:46.519 --> 00:06:49.180
in different ways. But for me, you know, usually
00:06:49.180 --> 00:06:51.519
it's like through coincidences, like my devotional
00:06:51.519 --> 00:06:53.560
will say one thing and then a friend will text
00:06:53.560 --> 00:06:55.860
the same verse a few hours later and you just
00:06:55.860 --> 00:06:57.839
know it's from the Lord. Yeah, you know what
00:06:57.839 --> 00:07:00.990
I'm talking about. Like Godwinks. Yeah, God winks.
00:07:01.129 --> 00:07:03.410
Exactly. And you've got to read my memoir because,
00:07:03.490 --> 00:07:06.170
I mean, I'm a lawyer, so I keep evidence receipts.
00:07:06.329 --> 00:07:09.230
I mean, I had my mom write down every time the
00:07:09.230 --> 00:07:11.790
Lord spoke to me and I would just keep this journal.
00:07:12.230 --> 00:07:14.769
And I've got like 10 journals now over, you know,
00:07:14.829 --> 00:07:17.689
eight years. But the point is that three years,
00:07:17.850 --> 00:07:20.750
I went through so much anger, so much questioning.
00:07:20.930 --> 00:07:22.529
I mean, just in my heart, because you have to
00:07:22.529 --> 00:07:25.800
remember I'm on a bed, okay? And there came a
00:07:25.800 --> 00:07:28.199
point, I will tell you, and the Lord was encouraging
00:07:28.199 --> 00:07:30.420
me, keep waiting, keep trusting. I mean, all
00:07:30.420 --> 00:07:33.420
sorts of messages from the Lord. But there came
00:07:33.420 --> 00:07:36.860
a point three years in where I felt. The Holy
00:07:36.860 --> 00:07:39.259
Spirit say to me in his still soft voice the
00:07:39.259 --> 00:07:42.160
word acceptance and then he followed up the following
00:07:42.160 --> 00:07:45.139
few weeks Everywhere I turned it was always second
00:07:45.139 --> 00:07:48.240
Corinthians 12 9. My grace is sufficient for
00:07:48.240 --> 00:07:50.759
you I'm gonna hold you through this but I am
00:07:50.759 --> 00:07:53.420
calling you to acceptance of this and you can
00:07:53.420 --> 00:07:57.600
imagine I mean how painful that was to hear frankly
00:07:57.600 --> 00:08:01.110
just in the emotions of wait Lord I've been begging
00:08:01.110 --> 00:08:03.790
you for deliverance my family. I mean, what do
00:08:03.790 --> 00:08:06.769
you mean? Like it was just a very difficult word
00:08:06.769 --> 00:08:09.449
because I wasn't raised in a prosperity gospel
00:08:09.449 --> 00:08:12.649
church. Thank God, but I did have this sense
00:08:12.649 --> 00:08:15.319
that well You know, if God loves you, he will
00:08:15.319 --> 00:08:18.000
heal you eventually. Like I didn't realize that,
00:08:18.060 --> 00:08:20.279
you know, I wasn't born with a disability. I,
00:08:20.300 --> 00:08:22.120
you know, I had never been sick my whole life.
00:08:22.120 --> 00:08:25.220
So I didn't realize God calls some of us to lifelong
00:08:25.220 --> 00:08:27.420
crosses. And yet it's right there in the Bible.
00:08:27.519 --> 00:08:30.120
I mean, you know, with Paul being one example,
00:08:30.480 --> 00:08:33.600
but anyway, so at that point, it was a wrestle
00:08:33.600 --> 00:08:36.139
to get to surrender as far as the health went.
00:08:36.220 --> 00:08:38.639
I mean, cause I had already sort of given up
00:08:38.639 --> 00:08:41.039
the career emotionally in my heart. I mean, it
00:08:41.039 --> 00:08:43.169
was You know, who cares about being a lawyer
00:08:43.169 --> 00:08:45.929
anymore? I want it to get off that bed. Now I
00:08:45.929 --> 00:08:50.620
will say that at the same time, the Lord You
00:08:50.620 --> 00:08:52.519
know, there came a point where he kind of called
00:08:52.519 --> 00:08:55.080
me to start trying to sit up. It wasn't that
00:08:55.080 --> 00:08:56.659
clear. I mean, I don't have to get into the details.
00:08:56.659 --> 00:08:59.279
You can read my memoir, but it was clear to me
00:08:59.279 --> 00:09:02.139
that I need to try walking again, but it would
00:09:02.139 --> 00:09:04.379
not be a healing. So in other words, to this
00:09:04.379 --> 00:09:07.600
day, whenever I sit up, the world starts spinning
00:09:07.600 --> 00:09:10.519
harder around me. And it's just, again, it's
00:09:10.519 --> 00:09:12.299
something to do with my ears. We have no idea
00:09:12.299 --> 00:09:14.639
why, but I've stopped all the treatments because
00:09:14.639 --> 00:09:17.940
really they were making my body worse. There's
00:09:17.940 --> 00:09:20.480
a miraculous part of my story. Should I finish
00:09:20.480 --> 00:09:22.860
that before we launch in or another how to do
00:09:22.860 --> 00:09:26.399
it quickly bit? Okay Yeah, yeah, so hand us everything
00:09:26.399 --> 00:09:29.720
and then we'll pick it apart All right All right.
00:09:29.720 --> 00:09:31.779
I like this. It's like legal style. Give us your
00:09:31.779 --> 00:09:35.399
argument then we'll okay So basically at that
00:09:35.399 --> 00:09:37.740
time when the Lord called me to acceptance, you
00:09:37.740 --> 00:09:40.539
know until eternity essentially which anyway,
00:09:40.559 --> 00:09:42.899
we can get into the theology of that later, but
00:09:43.200 --> 00:09:45.799
The Lord brought this man into my life out of
00:09:45.799 --> 00:09:48.080
nowhere. Okay. You can't write this story up
00:09:48.080 --> 00:09:50.759
because I was very angry. I mean, I was like,
00:09:50.759 --> 00:09:52.960
I don't have perseverance anymore. I don't want
00:09:52.960 --> 00:09:55.519
to read a single devotional anymore. I was just,
00:09:55.679 --> 00:09:58.480
are you serious Lord? Like what, you know, after
00:09:58.480 --> 00:10:01.279
all these years, I mean, as a young 30 year old,
00:10:01.480 --> 00:10:03.500
anyway, the point is, and I don't want to go
00:10:03.500 --> 00:10:05.539
into a self pity party. I'm trying to give you
00:10:05.539 --> 00:10:08.200
a vision of the emotions because I think it's
00:10:08.200 --> 00:10:10.500
relatable and I think it can show people that
00:10:10.500 --> 00:10:13.769
they're not the only one. The point is, this
00:10:13.769 --> 00:10:15.950
guy from my church, he was four years older than
00:10:15.950 --> 00:10:18.509
me, he was a biochemical engineering PhD, the
00:10:18.509 --> 00:10:21.029
most brilliant man I'd ever met, and simultaneously
00:10:21.029 --> 00:10:23.470
the most Christ -like man I had ever met. We
00:10:23.470 --> 00:10:25.769
were just acquaintances from church from years
00:10:25.769 --> 00:10:29.110
before. And he was also our lay youth pastor,
00:10:29.129 --> 00:10:31.909
so he would make these devotionals for kids on
00:10:31.909 --> 00:10:34.090
YouTube with Batman, Lord of the Rings. He would
00:10:34.090 --> 00:10:36.750
make the Bible so relatable, these five minute
00:10:36.750 --> 00:10:39.289
snippets for kids. And he was also a missionary
00:10:39.289 --> 00:10:42.070
to Haiti. So this guy was like, I mean, haven't
00:10:42.070 --> 00:10:44.090
met and he was also a cancer researcher. I mean,
00:10:44.129 --> 00:10:46.649
he was just brilliant. He calls my mom. He says,
00:10:46.850 --> 00:10:48.470
can I visit your daughter? Because honestly,
00:10:48.509 --> 00:10:50.769
she's been isolated in there. The church is praying
00:10:50.769 --> 00:10:53.370
for her. What is happening? She needs a visitor.
00:10:53.710 --> 00:10:55.610
And you got to remember, this was during COVID.
00:10:55.750 --> 00:10:57.730
One of the years that I was strictly bedridden,
00:10:57.850 --> 00:11:02.220
it was COVID. So he comes in and he starts. visiting
00:11:02.220 --> 00:11:04.179
me because I was, you know, we were desperate
00:11:04.179 --> 00:11:06.019
at this, but I mean, I was talking to my pastors,
00:11:06.080 --> 00:11:08.639
but I, anyway, it's, I won't get into all the
00:11:08.639 --> 00:11:10.820
details, but the point is he starts visiting
00:11:10.820 --> 00:11:12.879
me and giving me a theology of suffering and
00:11:12.879 --> 00:11:15.700
we quickly became, you know, good friends. He
00:11:15.700 --> 00:11:18.539
would visit me once a week. I was on my bed and
00:11:18.539 --> 00:11:21.320
the plot twist is he had just been diagnosed
00:11:21.320 --> 00:11:24.559
with stage four terminal cancer himself and his
00:11:24.559 --> 00:11:27.860
entire ministry was one of encouraging other
00:11:27.860 --> 00:11:30.779
sufferers because as a kid he had already gone
00:11:30.799 --> 00:11:32.740
through a different kind of cancer, which the
00:11:32.740 --> 00:11:35.299
Lord delivered him from, but that led him to
00:11:35.299 --> 00:11:38.379
accept Christ. So now 25 years later, he was
00:11:38.379 --> 00:11:40.580
just diagnosed again, and he's sitting next to
00:11:40.580 --> 00:11:43.340
me with a chemo pump, and I'm bedridden in my
00:11:43.340 --> 00:11:45.679
koala pajamas, and he's telling me, no, Laura,
00:11:45.679 --> 00:11:47.840
you've got to persevere. Here are the different
00:11:47.840 --> 00:11:50.600
reasons why the Lord allows suffering. Like this
00:11:50.600 --> 00:11:52.799
is biblical. It's all over the New Testament,
00:11:52.820 --> 00:11:56.120
just really kind of mentoring me. And I can't
00:11:56.120 --> 00:11:57.899
explain it to you guys, but over the course of
00:11:57.899 --> 00:12:00.649
like the first eight visits, we literally realized
00:12:00.649 --> 00:12:03.230
we were falling in love. And you've got to understand
00:12:03.230 --> 00:12:05.450
the context. I mean, I had been single my whole
00:12:05.450 --> 00:12:07.870
life. Matt had never had a girlfriend. He was
00:12:07.870 --> 00:12:11.909
age, you know, 37. I was 34. I mean, you can't
00:12:11.909 --> 00:12:14.009
write this stuff up. We prayed about it. We're
00:12:14.009 --> 00:12:16.850
like, okay, are we really supposed to move forward
00:12:16.850 --> 00:12:21.159
with this? And I will tell you the Lord wasn't
00:12:21.159 --> 00:12:23.659
exactly crystal clear and I think he was testing
00:12:23.659 --> 00:12:26.179
our hearts like will you trust me? You know sort
00:12:26.179 --> 00:12:28.440
of like he kept giving me the word surrender
00:12:28.440 --> 00:12:32.059
But then there came a point where he said I want
00:12:32.059 --> 00:12:35.080
you to to take this gift of joy in your mutual
00:12:35.080 --> 00:12:38.200
grief It was like a green light and we just knew
00:12:38.200 --> 00:12:41.059
it was like, okay. All right. God is saying take
00:12:41.059 --> 00:12:44.179
this joy in your grief And it was a miracle.
00:12:44.240 --> 00:12:47.559
Somehow a year later, I got in a car, which by
00:12:47.559 --> 00:12:49.759
the way, to this day, I can only do two car rides
00:12:49.759 --> 00:12:52.360
a month because car rides cause me extreme pain.
00:12:52.700 --> 00:12:54.840
But the point is I walked down that aisle at
00:12:54.840 --> 00:12:57.580
a hotel, Matt's mom booked the hotel. I was the
00:12:57.580 --> 00:13:00.340
bedridden bride, you know, and we got married
00:13:00.340 --> 00:13:03.179
and it was the most amazing wedding with our
00:13:03.179 --> 00:13:06.019
whole church community there. And our verse was
00:13:06.019 --> 00:13:09.379
Isaiah 43 20, which says the Lord gives us streams
00:13:09.379 --> 00:13:12.549
of refreshing water in our times of desert. suffering
00:13:12.549 --> 00:13:15.070
because you could see how he just plopped you
00:13:15.070 --> 00:13:17.350
know he gave us to one another in the midst of
00:13:17.350 --> 00:13:20.250
all these trials and long and short of it is
00:13:20.250 --> 00:13:23.149
Matt entered glory a year and three months after
00:13:23.149 --> 00:13:27.610
the wedding so you can imagine me feeling like
00:13:27.610 --> 00:13:30.870
Job after Matt's death just all the same bitterness
00:13:30.870 --> 00:13:33.210
came up again and I was discouraged because I
00:13:33.210 --> 00:13:35.269
had felt like I had had a measure of spiritual
00:13:35.269 --> 00:13:37.870
growth as we were married it was the most beautiful
00:13:37.870 --> 00:13:41.990
year we can get into it but the Lord Called me
00:13:41.990 --> 00:13:45.009
to have joy in my grief after Matt died. He said
00:13:45.009 --> 00:13:47.409
are you gonna forget everything? I taught you
00:13:47.409 --> 00:13:50.470
through Matt. No, I want you to rejoice in this
00:13:50.470 --> 00:13:52.529
I mean he was tender with me don't get me wrong
00:13:52.529 --> 00:13:54.450
with walking me through the some of the grief
00:13:54.450 --> 00:13:58.710
But he was also like no you have to choose to
00:13:58.710 --> 00:14:02.330
bless my name and praise me even in this and
00:14:02.330 --> 00:14:05.190
man Let me tell you it was given the type -a
00:14:05.190 --> 00:14:07.769
personality and sort of you get a sense of who
00:14:07.769 --> 00:14:11.279
I was years ago It was difficult and yet, and
00:14:11.279 --> 00:14:13.059
I'm still, you know, on a journey, obviously,
00:14:13.179 --> 00:14:16.240
no one's perfected before eternity, but I do
00:14:16.240 --> 00:14:18.620
feel like I am more surrendered these last few
00:14:18.620 --> 00:14:20.940
months. And the last thing I'll say, and then
00:14:20.940 --> 00:14:22.799
I'll hand the mic to you guys, because I've talked
00:14:22.799 --> 00:14:26.200
too long, is... The Lord called me to write a
00:14:26.200 --> 00:14:29.360
book after Matt died. And I chose to write. And
00:14:29.360 --> 00:14:31.879
so I wrote it literally on this bed with my laptop
00:14:31.879 --> 00:14:34.879
on my knees, my mom bringing me snacks and my
00:14:34.879 --> 00:14:37.200
head turning because my head spins even when
00:14:37.200 --> 00:14:40.220
I'm bedridden. And I wrote this memoir and it's
00:14:40.220 --> 00:14:42.000
called Singing Through Fire because I'm also
00:14:42.000 --> 00:14:44.419
a jazz singer. And it's really a metaphorical,
00:14:44.740 --> 00:14:47.320
it's metaphorical about, you know, can we have
00:14:47.320 --> 00:14:51.090
joy in the fire? And it was basically my love
00:14:51.090 --> 00:14:54.149
story and my testimony of how God never left
00:14:54.149 --> 00:14:56.529
me this entire journey of suffering. It's been
00:14:56.529 --> 00:14:59.309
eight years and I would not be a Christian today
00:14:59.309 --> 00:15:02.309
if he had not been like that, you know, this
00:15:02.309 --> 00:15:04.350
close to me intimately. I mean, Psalm 34 says
00:15:04.350 --> 00:15:07.409
he is near to the brokenhearted and I am a class
00:15:07.409 --> 00:15:09.710
A witness of this. This is why I wrote the book
00:15:09.710 --> 00:15:11.809
and I pray that it would bless someone out there
00:15:11.809 --> 00:15:15.570
today. That's an incredible story, and I'm very
00:15:15.570 --> 00:15:18.769
sorry to hear about your affliction. I am sorry
00:15:18.769 --> 00:15:21.590
to hear about the loss of your love of your life.
00:15:22.389 --> 00:15:24.409
Thank you. I can't imagine having to go through
00:15:24.409 --> 00:15:27.470
all of it. My wife and I do differ on the suffering
00:15:27.470 --> 00:15:30.009
thoughts. You know, she believes that everyone
00:15:30.009 --> 00:15:32.210
should be healed. Everyone should have. She's
00:15:32.210 --> 00:15:34.149
the optimistic, faith -filled lover. I have the
00:15:34.149 --> 00:15:36.710
gift of faith, and it drives them banana sandwich.
00:15:37.090 --> 00:15:39.929
I believe for all the things. I have faith, but
00:15:39.929 --> 00:15:42.970
it's not a calling. And so I have a gift of healing.
00:15:43.230 --> 00:15:46.889
which mirrors her gift very well. However, I
00:15:46.889 --> 00:15:49.149
also have had a word from the Lord that told
00:15:49.149 --> 00:15:52.070
me that I was created to suffer for others, and
00:15:52.070 --> 00:15:54.370
I have not suffered to the level that you guys
00:15:54.370 --> 00:15:58.450
have. I count it as joy every time I'm hurt while
00:15:58.450 --> 00:16:01.049
helping someone else, just because of that message.
00:16:01.210 --> 00:16:05.779
I work in EMS, I'm an EMT. I count it as joy
00:16:05.779 --> 00:16:09.100
when my back hurts or when my knees hurt and
00:16:09.100 --> 00:16:11.879
I think about how I'm supposed to suffer so that
00:16:11.879 --> 00:16:14.220
other people don't and I just and my wife does
00:16:14.220 --> 00:16:17.519
not Agree with me. I'm sorry. What did you say
00:16:17.519 --> 00:16:21.179
you have EMS? No. No, I am in EMS emergency medical
00:16:21.179 --> 00:16:24.580
services I'm in EMT. I work on an ambulance.
00:16:25.080 --> 00:16:28.399
Oh, that's so wonderful. Yeah. Yeah, and I'm
00:16:28.399 --> 00:16:31.580
50 and so I'm I I don't want to brag, but I'm
00:16:31.580 --> 00:16:33.820
going to. I run circles around a lot of the people
00:16:33.820 --> 00:16:36.899
half my age. They don't make them like they used
00:16:36.899 --> 00:16:39.460
to. They don't, no. Us Gen Xers are a tough read.
00:16:40.200 --> 00:16:43.840
And I have bad knees. I'm coming down from being
00:16:43.840 --> 00:16:47.039
overweight and I've lost 36 pounds. I'm doing
00:16:47.039 --> 00:16:49.200
great. But my knees still hurt when I get out
00:16:49.200 --> 00:16:50.860
of the back of a truck by the end of a 24 -hour
00:16:50.860 --> 00:16:54.779
shift. And I look at it as nothing but joy because
00:16:54.779 --> 00:16:57.019
I know that I'm supposed to suffer. And my wife,
00:16:57.019 --> 00:16:59.559
it drives her banana sandwich. When I tell her
00:16:59.559 --> 00:17:00.919
that she's like, well, let's pray for healing
00:17:00.919 --> 00:17:02.940
I say go like I I mean if we heals it heals if
00:17:02.940 --> 00:17:04.900
not, then I'll have a painful reminder that I
00:17:04.900 --> 00:17:07.619
helped somebody And yeah her and I are different
00:17:07.619 --> 00:17:11.680
on that aspect. So your story speaks to me Yeah,
00:17:11.680 --> 00:17:14.740
but it screams against her spirit and I think
00:17:14.740 --> 00:17:19.180
it helps demonstrate that god is not Singularly
00:17:19.180 --> 00:17:22.279
focused on each and every one of us Being the
00:17:22.279 --> 00:17:24.799
same that he is treating us all as the individuals
00:17:24.799 --> 00:17:28.140
He created us as and some of us are created to
00:17:28.140 --> 00:17:30.180
suffer We'd look at the the beggar outside of
00:17:30.180 --> 00:17:32.640
the temple that Peter healed and he said, you
00:17:32.640 --> 00:17:34.240
know gold and silver I don't have but what I
00:17:34.240 --> 00:17:37.160
do have I freely give this man Jesus would have
00:17:37.160 --> 00:17:39.980
walked past every single day on his way to the
00:17:39.980 --> 00:17:43.980
temple But never healed him Right, right this
00:17:43.980 --> 00:17:45.619
man Jesus would have seen because they said that
00:17:45.619 --> 00:17:47.859
he was there every day everybody knew this man
00:17:47.859 --> 00:17:51.099
and So in Jesus didn't heal him and why not?
00:17:51.289 --> 00:17:54.069
Because it was for Peter to do it. It was for
00:17:54.069 --> 00:17:57.069
someone else to do it. And so Some people never
00:17:57.069 --> 00:17:59.569
receive a healing some people and I believe everyone
00:17:59.569 --> 00:18:02.569
gets healed. It's just maybe not this side of
00:18:02.569 --> 00:18:04.990
heaven Exactly. I know that you will have a new
00:18:04.990 --> 00:18:06.569
body and know that you will be restored I know
00:18:06.569 --> 00:18:08.750
that you will be running in poppy fields or whatever
00:18:08.750 --> 00:18:13.029
it is Pale pink peonies or whatever, whatever
00:18:13.029 --> 00:18:14.809
flower you like the most. I know that you'll
00:18:14.809 --> 00:18:16.670
be there and I know that you'll feel the grass
00:18:16.670 --> 00:18:18.990
between your toes and that you'll love it. I
00:18:18.990 --> 00:18:20.950
just know that it's not for everybody on this
00:18:20.950 --> 00:18:23.849
side. And I know it discourages people when they
00:18:23.849 --> 00:18:25.349
think, well, we prayed for grandma and then she
00:18:25.349 --> 00:18:27.190
passed away. So God doesn't care. I was like,
00:18:27.230 --> 00:18:29.609
well, maybe he does. Cause now grandma's running
00:18:29.609 --> 00:18:32.890
for the first time in 50 years. You know, and
00:18:32.890 --> 00:18:35.029
so her and I, my wife and I, our perspectives
00:18:35.029 --> 00:18:38.019
are a little different, but The ultimate end
00:18:38.019 --> 00:18:40.720
of it is that the glory of Jesus, the glory of
00:18:40.720 --> 00:18:43.660
God, the love of the kingdom, the grace, the
00:18:43.660 --> 00:18:46.599
mercy, all of that, none of that changes. God
00:18:46.599 --> 00:18:50.000
created us, created you, created my wife, myself,
00:18:50.380 --> 00:18:52.700
to have a relationship with him. We're created
00:18:52.700 --> 00:18:55.319
in his image, the spiritual image, not his physical
00:18:55.319 --> 00:18:57.640
image, because he doesn't have one. He had to
00:18:57.640 --> 00:18:59.440
make Jesus, so we had a physical image to look
00:18:59.440 --> 00:19:01.759
at, so that we could be in a relationship with
00:19:01.759 --> 00:19:04.119
him. He created us knowing that he wanted to
00:19:04.119 --> 00:19:08.130
spend eternity with us. And I think our perspectives
00:19:08.130 --> 00:19:10.890
on Earth are what helps shape what we're going
00:19:10.890 --> 00:19:14.789
to be like in heaven. And he doesn't mean he
00:19:14.789 --> 00:19:18.430
loves my wife more because she can walk. It doesn't
00:19:18.430 --> 00:19:20.410
mean he loves you more because you can't walk.
00:19:22.269 --> 00:19:31.890
None of that is a factor to him. At first, I
00:19:31.890 --> 00:19:34.009
was just interested in the idea of saving money
00:19:34.009 --> 00:19:36.170
on everyday wellness products I was already buying
00:19:36.170 --> 00:19:39.609
anyway. But then I started noticing people I
00:19:39.609 --> 00:19:42.230
personally know getting paid weekly from a membership
00:19:42.230 --> 00:19:44.730
they were simply sharing with others. That's
00:19:44.730 --> 00:19:47.069
what made me really pay attention. Because it's
00:19:47.069 --> 00:19:49.750
not about stocking inventory, pressuring friends,
00:19:49.910 --> 00:19:52.589
or chasing customers around. It's a membership
00:19:52.589 --> 00:19:54.950
that gives people access to high quality products
00:19:54.950 --> 00:19:57.569
at lower prices. And if you decide to share it,
00:19:57.829 --> 00:20:00.150
there's a compensation side attached to it too.
00:20:00.480 --> 00:20:02.839
After seeing real people get results from it
00:20:02.839 --> 00:20:05.400
consistently, I realized this could genuinely
00:20:05.400 --> 00:20:07.619
become a long -term income vehicle for the right
00:20:07.619 --> 00:20:09.960
person. If you've been looking for something
00:20:09.960 --> 00:20:12.420
simple that actually makes sense in today's economy,
00:20:12.980 --> 00:20:14.539
you should at least take a look at why so many
00:20:14.539 --> 00:20:16.740
people are paying attention to this right now.
00:20:17.160 --> 00:20:20.700
The infos in our about section. I remember when
00:20:20.700 --> 00:20:22.440
my son was younger, I've told this story many
00:20:22.440 --> 00:20:24.519
times, and I carried him to bed one night. He
00:20:24.519 --> 00:20:26.509
was like two and a half, three years old. And
00:20:26.509 --> 00:20:28.309
I let him stay up. He had a strict bedtime, eight
00:20:28.309 --> 00:20:30.069
o 'clock. It was like 10 .30. We let him stay
00:20:30.069 --> 00:20:31.410
up watching a movie. And so I'm carrying him
00:20:31.410 --> 00:20:33.650
up to bed. And I remember as I was rounding around
00:20:33.650 --> 00:20:36.670
the hallway to the banister of the stairs, I
00:20:36.670 --> 00:20:38.589
didn't remember if he was a good boy that day
00:20:38.589 --> 00:20:40.390
or a bad boy. I don't remember if we had a good
00:20:40.390 --> 00:20:43.589
day or a bad day. And none of that mattered because
00:20:43.589 --> 00:20:46.890
I loved him so much that it was my joy and my
00:20:46.890 --> 00:20:49.329
pleasure to carry him upstairs to bed, that it
00:20:49.329 --> 00:20:52.380
didn't matter. It wasn't dependent on him. He
00:20:52.380 --> 00:20:55.420
was dependent on my love for him. And this is
00:20:55.420 --> 00:20:57.440
what God had showed me. And by the time I got
00:20:57.440 --> 00:21:00.460
to the top of the steps, he reversed that thought
00:21:00.460 --> 00:21:02.380
process on me and said, this is how I want you
00:21:02.380 --> 00:21:04.839
to come to me. I don't want you to come to me
00:21:04.839 --> 00:21:06.599
because I answered your prayer. I don't want
00:21:06.599 --> 00:21:09.180
you to come to me because I healed you or I didn't
00:21:09.180 --> 00:21:11.380
heal you. I want you to come to me because you
00:21:11.380 --> 00:21:16.380
want me as your father. Oh, Intra, right. Exactly.
00:21:16.660 --> 00:21:18.680
Yeah. Yeah. No, he speaks to me a lot in very
00:21:18.680 --> 00:21:20.660
profound ways. And that was one of them. And
00:21:20.660 --> 00:21:23.000
I love to share that. And I look at you, not
00:21:23.000 --> 00:21:25.059
physically because I'm behind a microphone, but
00:21:25.059 --> 00:21:27.339
I look at your story and I think of you and I
00:21:27.339 --> 00:21:30.559
think how profoundly you must love him despite
00:21:30.559 --> 00:21:34.359
what he hasn't done for you. And, you know, my
00:21:34.359 --> 00:21:36.500
wife is different on cessationists. We're people
00:21:36.500 --> 00:21:38.240
that don't believe in miracles anymore. And she's
00:21:38.240 --> 00:21:40.039
like, these guys are banana sandwich. And I'm
00:21:40.039 --> 00:21:42.839
like, I love them the most. They're like didn't
00:21:42.839 --> 00:21:44.579
well, they're like doubting promise, you know
00:21:44.579 --> 00:21:47.299
blessed it is the one who believes without saying
00:21:47.299 --> 00:21:50.579
you believe because you have seen You know, it's
00:21:50.579 --> 00:21:52.799
and so the people that haven't seen the miracles
00:21:52.799 --> 00:21:55.039
but still live Jesus. I'm like you guys are amazing
00:21:55.039 --> 00:21:57.619
I love you guys and she's a little different.
00:21:57.619 --> 00:21:59.480
She thinks they're crazy because we've seen miracles
00:21:59.480 --> 00:22:02.359
I'm like God doesn't run out of miracles. Right
00:22:02.359 --> 00:22:05.299
and so it's just a perspective change, but God
00:22:05.299 --> 00:22:07.359
hasn't changed in either one of those perspectives
00:22:07.359 --> 00:22:11.599
Just how we view him Yeah, I mean you guys are
00:22:11.599 --> 00:22:14.500
gonna find this fascinating So I cut I split
00:22:14.500 --> 00:22:16.880
the baby like I actually land in the middle So
00:22:16.880 --> 00:22:19.140
I very much believe and I don't mean this in
00:22:19.140 --> 00:22:20.920
an insulting way to Shelley at all I mean, I
00:22:20.920 --> 00:22:23.759
think I've expressed my views I absolutely believe
00:22:23.759 --> 00:22:26.559
it is not God's will to heal everyone just by
00:22:26.559 --> 00:22:28.799
virtue of all the things He's spoken to me through
00:22:28.799 --> 00:22:31.240
the Holy Spirit and otherwise in my own suffering
00:22:31.240 --> 00:22:34.119
I mean we're talking years of prayers and Matt
00:22:34.119 --> 00:22:36.619
was the most faithful person I've ever met we
00:22:36.619 --> 00:22:39.279
were we laid hands on him in hospice. He died.
00:22:39.279 --> 00:22:41.500
I mean was waiting for miracles till the end
00:22:41.500 --> 00:22:44.160
I mean the point is but I split the baby because
00:22:44.160 --> 00:22:48.339
I actually I am a continuationist so I do believe
00:22:48.339 --> 00:22:50.599
that the gifts are operating today I've heard
00:22:50.599 --> 00:22:53.940
too many testimonies of miraculous healings but
00:22:53.940 --> 00:22:57.220
unfortunately it hasn't happened for me because
00:22:57.220 --> 00:23:00.940
my backstop is always whatever God's will is
00:23:00.940 --> 00:23:03.299
and he's revealed that to me he doesn't reveal
00:23:03.299 --> 00:23:05.500
it to everyone who has chronic pain many people
00:23:05.500 --> 00:23:07.960
with chronic pain God ultimately does heal them
00:23:07.960 --> 00:23:10.839
but the point is for I do believe some people
00:23:10.839 --> 00:23:13.039
have the gift of healing sounds like Josh has
00:23:13.039 --> 00:23:16.180
it But the point is I think it always God's will
00:23:16.180 --> 00:23:19.460
is always the backstop because even Paul he could
00:23:19.460 --> 00:23:21.839
have laid hands on Timothy Did he know he told
00:23:21.839 --> 00:23:24.180
him to take wine for his frequent ailments, you
00:23:24.180 --> 00:23:26.000
know, Paul clearly had the gift of healing He
00:23:26.000 --> 00:23:28.960
was laying hands on people. So my point is I'm
00:23:28.960 --> 00:23:31.119
kind of in the middle So I'm kind of like a unicorn
00:23:31.119 --> 00:23:34.400
because you know, even though I'm like a Calvinist
00:23:34.400 --> 00:23:38.380
for whom God's sovereignty is ultimate I do I'm
00:23:38.380 --> 00:23:41.099
I depart from most reformed positions where I
00:23:41.099 --> 00:23:42.940
do believe the gifts are operating You know,
00:23:42.940 --> 00:23:45.440
I am seeking the gift of tongues. I mean I Paul
00:23:45.440 --> 00:23:48.940
says desire the gifts So theologically, I think
00:23:48.940 --> 00:23:51.079
we need balance and I kind of land somewhere
00:23:51.079 --> 00:23:53.099
in the middle But I mean, I don't want to digress
00:23:53.099 --> 00:23:55.599
but yeah, no, no, that's perfect. I don't think
00:23:55.599 --> 00:23:57.200
that's really splitting the baby I think it's
00:23:57.200 --> 00:24:00.059
just a unique perspective. I think yeah, that's
00:24:00.059 --> 00:24:04.359
just you do believe but your belief also is that
00:24:04.359 --> 00:24:07.660
it's not for everybody And the evidence is that
00:24:07.660 --> 00:24:09.980
just because in my small circle, I've seen healings.
00:24:09.980 --> 00:24:12.920
I've also seen people not healed in my small
00:24:12.920 --> 00:24:16.140
circle. I've seen cancer take people. I've seen
00:24:16.140 --> 00:24:18.539
I've seen ailments last and last and last. And
00:24:18.539 --> 00:24:20.400
I've seen somebody walk away without hip pain
00:24:20.400 --> 00:24:22.690
when I prayed for him one time. You know, I've
00:24:22.690 --> 00:24:25.410
seen both of them. And if I took the perspective
00:24:25.410 --> 00:24:27.890
that God heals everybody and then he doesn't,
00:24:27.950 --> 00:24:30.309
then I'm thinking I did something wrong. I displeased
00:24:30.309 --> 00:24:32.809
God. I didn't say the magic words the right way.
00:24:32.890 --> 00:24:34.710
And I want to say to all our listeners that there
00:24:34.710 --> 00:24:37.009
is no right way. There is no traditional, there
00:24:37.009 --> 00:24:39.670
is no magic word. There is no proper way of saying,
00:24:39.730 --> 00:24:42.250
oh, Father, I see you seated at the glory throne.
00:24:42.710 --> 00:24:45.210
There is no way to, he's your father. We're knocking
00:24:45.210 --> 00:24:47.849
on this door, like knock and he shall open it
00:24:47.849 --> 00:24:49.630
for you, but we're already inside the house.
00:24:50.340 --> 00:24:52.400
We don't need to bang on the door to get his
00:24:52.400 --> 00:24:53.980
attention. We just need to walk up to him and
00:24:53.980 --> 00:24:56.240
say, hey, Pop, this is what's going on. Talk
00:24:56.240 --> 00:24:59.099
to him like he's your actual father. We don't
00:24:59.099 --> 00:25:02.339
need magical ceremonial words. There is nothing
00:25:02.339 --> 00:25:04.140
that's going to pull his heart string more. He's
00:25:04.140 --> 00:25:05.980
not going to say, well, this Christian over here,
00:25:06.019 --> 00:25:07.680
he talks to me a lot better than this Christian
00:25:07.680 --> 00:25:10.160
over there. He doesn't do that. That's something
00:25:10.160 --> 00:25:12.539
we do in our own minds. That's not the heart
00:25:12.539 --> 00:25:14.960
of the father. And I also know that the heart
00:25:14.960 --> 00:25:17.339
of the father says that I have a child. And I
00:25:17.339 --> 00:25:19.660
know a plan for this child and this plan does
00:25:19.660 --> 00:25:22.920
not include this for them in this moment, right?
00:25:23.039 --> 00:25:26.539
Yeah, there's every single prayer. It's just
00:25:26.539 --> 00:25:30.079
sometimes the answer is no Exactly, and that
00:25:30.079 --> 00:25:33.119
blows people's minds because they think I asked
00:25:33.119 --> 00:25:34.839
I asked and he's gonna give it to me. He's like,
00:25:35.180 --> 00:25:40.019
well, no not always Yeah, no, I mean I couldn't
00:25:40.019 --> 00:25:41.799
agree. I mean you're basically preaching to the
00:25:41.799 --> 00:25:44.539
choir and I want to be very sensitive because
00:25:45.029 --> 00:25:47.109
I don't want to, you know, and I know Shelley,
00:25:47.250 --> 00:25:49.150
I hope you don't feel insulted or something.
00:25:49.230 --> 00:25:50.910
This isn't like, cause I'm trying to be very
00:25:50.910 --> 00:25:52.890
sensitive. She's lifted me for 16 years. She
00:25:52.890 --> 00:25:56.710
knows. I mean, I just I genuinely don't believe
00:25:56.710 --> 00:25:59.190
and I I'm saying this out of humility not to
00:25:59.190 --> 00:26:02.650
insult your position I genuinely don't believe
00:26:02.650 --> 00:26:05.849
that the opposing Viewpoint is biblical and i'm
00:26:05.849 --> 00:26:08.109
not trying to insult you Shelly i'm saying it
00:26:08.109 --> 00:26:11.369
from a place of pain because I have seen people
00:26:11.369 --> 00:26:14.009
where you know, they are preached at that, you
00:26:14.009 --> 00:26:16.289
know If you don't heal it's because of your lack
00:26:16.289 --> 00:26:19.609
of faith and it leads them to just I mean i've
00:26:19.609 --> 00:26:21.890
heard so many testimonies where people you know,
00:26:21.890 --> 00:26:24.839
it leads them to leave the faith and it's frankly
00:26:24.839 --> 00:26:28.279
just not biblical i don't understand this idea
00:26:28.279 --> 00:26:31.799
i mean if anything the new testament says the
00:26:31.799 --> 00:26:34.240
opposite i mean god told paul i will show him
00:26:34.240 --> 00:26:37.240
how much he must suffer for my name jesus said
00:26:37.240 --> 00:26:39.339
in this world you will have trouble but take
00:26:39.339 --> 00:26:41.660
heart i have overcome the world paul said in
00:26:41.660 --> 00:26:44.019
acts we must go through many hardships to enter
00:26:44.019 --> 00:26:46.220
the kingdom of heaven jesus said take up your
00:26:46.220 --> 00:26:48.940
cross and deny yourself lose your life to find
00:26:48.940 --> 00:26:51.359
it i mean i'm not making this up these are all
00:26:51.359 --> 00:26:54.720
jesus's words not mine. So when the people on
00:26:54.720 --> 00:26:56.400
the other, and I'm not trying to create like,
00:26:56.400 --> 00:26:58.299
you know, camps, you know, we're fighting each
00:26:58.299 --> 00:27:00.660
other. We're all brothers and sisters. I just
00:27:00.660 --> 00:27:03.059
don't understand how the theology holds weight,
00:27:03.059 --> 00:27:06.180
you know, under scrutiny to what the Bible is
00:27:06.180 --> 00:27:09.339
actually saying. Look, I was, you know, the first
00:27:09.339 --> 00:27:11.799
person to tell you eight years ago, Oh, God is
00:27:11.799 --> 00:27:14.720
good. Like, why wouldn't he heal everyone? But
00:27:14.720 --> 00:27:17.420
when you're looking at the facts, you can't tell
00:27:17.420 --> 00:27:20.000
me that Matt died of cancer because he didn't
00:27:20.000 --> 00:27:21.960
have enough faith. Okay. I'm not going to sit
00:27:21.960 --> 00:27:24.140
here bragging about my faith. I do believe I
00:27:24.140 --> 00:27:26.240
have a lot of faith, and I know that's not the
00:27:26.240 --> 00:27:28.680
reason I've been bedridden, because the Lord
00:27:28.680 --> 00:27:31.859
has told me explicitly that my thorn in the flesh
00:27:31.859 --> 00:27:34.680
is for His glory. Is He pruning me through all
00:27:34.680 --> 00:27:37.619
this? Yes. Has He given me verses that suggest
00:27:37.619 --> 00:27:40.140
that He is using this to test the genuineness
00:27:40.140 --> 00:27:42.799
of my faith? Yes. It's all over the New Testament
00:27:42.799 --> 00:27:45.920
as to why God allows trials. Read 1 Peter. I
00:27:45.920 --> 00:27:48.279
mean, do not be surprised, my children, when
00:27:48.279 --> 00:27:50.400
you suffer many trials, for this is to prove
00:27:50.400 --> 00:27:52.930
the genuineness of your faith. It doesn't say
00:27:52.930 --> 00:27:55.269
so that I can heal the others who have faith,
00:27:55.269 --> 00:27:57.049
but you're the one who doesn't have faith. I
00:27:57.049 --> 00:28:00.170
mean, I'm not trying to, you know, be on a soapbox
00:28:00.170 --> 00:28:02.809
here. I'm trying to give a biblical case for
00:28:02.809 --> 00:28:06.009
why I believe that it just cannot be the case
00:28:06.009 --> 00:28:08.269
that those of us who are not healed, it's because
00:28:08.269 --> 00:28:10.630
we don't have enough faith. And I believe that's
00:28:10.630 --> 00:28:12.950
what the opposing position essentially argues.
00:28:12.990 --> 00:28:15.049
Unless I'm wrong, Shelly, it would be great if
00:28:15.049 --> 00:28:17.509
you could maybe give your position because I
00:28:17.509 --> 00:28:20.289
think these issues are so important. I think
00:28:20.289 --> 00:28:23.250
my faith plays a lot into it because like I can
00:28:23.250 --> 00:28:25.690
accept that not everyone will be healed on this
00:28:25.690 --> 00:28:28.109
side of heaven, but it's like really come on
00:28:28.109 --> 00:28:32.769
God, you know, but I do see that there is purpose
00:28:32.769 --> 00:28:35.529
in that because then you're able to encourage
00:28:35.529 --> 00:28:38.950
others in the same position. And so that is powerful
00:28:38.950 --> 00:28:43.309
in your ministry because you have that authenticity.
00:28:43.869 --> 00:28:47.450
And so speaking from experience, it's just the
00:28:47.450 --> 00:28:49.960
encouragement that you can give to others. in
00:28:49.960 --> 00:28:53.539
that same situation is amazing. I was just going
00:28:53.539 --> 00:28:57.720
to suggest and add that hearing your testimony,
00:28:58.660 --> 00:29:01.259
however many people are going to be tuning in
00:29:01.259 --> 00:29:03.779
across however many different countries, someone
00:29:03.779 --> 00:29:06.259
is going to hear this that is suffering and think
00:29:06.259 --> 00:29:09.000
that God has abandoned them and might have new
00:29:09.000 --> 00:29:11.220
hope knowing that maybe that's just not what's
00:29:11.220 --> 00:29:14.240
going on. that God has a different plan for them
00:29:14.240 --> 00:29:16.920
that involves them to be where they are as they
00:29:16.920 --> 00:29:19.640
are and not in a healed form that they desire.
00:29:19.980 --> 00:29:22.799
There's a deep work going on, too, in that process,
00:29:23.079 --> 00:29:26.319
too. Yeah. We were at a Pentecostal church once,
00:29:26.319 --> 00:29:28.980
and they're very much into speaking in tongues.
00:29:29.160 --> 00:29:30.539
Like, everybody has a gift of speaking in tongues.
00:29:30.599 --> 00:29:33.039
And I'm like, well, that's not biblical. It says
00:29:33.039 --> 00:29:34.640
they'll give one gift to one person, another
00:29:34.640 --> 00:29:36.539
gift to another, and two others will get riskier.
00:29:36.680 --> 00:29:38.420
But not everybody gets the gift of tongues. It
00:29:38.420 --> 00:29:41.259
doesn't say everybody gets it. And so I started
00:29:41.259 --> 00:29:42.940
looking around thinking, if you don't have the
00:29:42.940 --> 00:29:44.640
gift of tongues, are you thinking that Jesus
00:29:44.640 --> 00:29:47.319
doesn't love you? Are you looking around everybody
00:29:47.319 --> 00:29:48.740
and thinking like, I can't speak in tongues,
00:29:48.900 --> 00:29:51.519
so clearly I don't have the Holy Spirit. And
00:29:51.519 --> 00:29:53.359
I love Pentecostals, don't get me wrong. I love
00:29:53.359 --> 00:29:57.099
everybody. I just don't like that you could possibly
00:29:57.099 --> 00:30:01.960
be ostracizing somebody without knowing it. Oh,
00:30:02.160 --> 00:30:04.859
absolutely. And so I say the same for the suffering.
00:30:05.119 --> 00:30:06.900
You know, when we say that God wants to heal
00:30:06.900 --> 00:30:08.339
everybody and you're like, well, he's not healing
00:30:08.339 --> 00:30:11.029
me, so he must not love me. You know, I don't
00:30:11.029 --> 00:30:13.369
want to ostracize somebody and think that, no,
00:30:13.390 --> 00:30:15.789
no, God loves you. If you were the only person
00:30:15.789 --> 00:30:18.349
on the earth, he would have died for you. And
00:30:18.349 --> 00:30:19.910
that means that you would have had to been the
00:30:19.910 --> 00:30:21.309
one to kill him and he still would have done
00:30:21.309 --> 00:30:24.650
it for you. Exactly. Yeah. And you suffering
00:30:24.650 --> 00:30:26.730
isn't because you made him angry. This isn't
00:30:26.730 --> 00:30:28.970
punishment. God doesn't do that. So if you're
00:30:28.970 --> 00:30:30.630
out there and you think that you are suffering
00:30:30.630 --> 00:30:33.569
because God is mad at you, that you did something
00:30:33.569 --> 00:30:36.269
wrong, you said the F word in traffic. This is
00:30:36.269 --> 00:30:39.109
not true. This was 100 not true. That is a lie
00:30:39.109 --> 00:30:41.650
from the enemy Yeah, you are not suffering for
00:30:41.650 --> 00:30:44.930
anything that you did to dishonor god Because
00:30:44.930 --> 00:30:47.589
you were born dishonoring him and he made a way
00:30:47.589 --> 00:30:49.589
to salvage you and as soon as you took jesus
00:30:49.589 --> 00:30:52.589
as your savior All of those things are never
00:30:52.589 --> 00:30:55.690
counted against you never Yeah, I mean, absolutely.
00:30:55.769 --> 00:30:58.470
I mean, look at John 9 .3. The disciples asked
00:30:58.470 --> 00:31:01.250
Jesus, is this man born blind because of his
00:31:01.250 --> 00:31:03.529
sin or his parents' sin? And Jesus said, no,
00:31:03.630 --> 00:31:06.130
this man was born blind in order to show the
00:31:06.130 --> 00:31:09.500
works of God, aka the glory of God. And so there
00:31:09.500 --> 00:31:12.920
is something Paul said, we glory in our sufferings.
00:31:13.000 --> 00:31:15.740
I mean, is it Romans five, three? I mean, literally
00:31:15.740 --> 00:31:17.680
suffering creates perseverance, perseverance,
00:31:17.900 --> 00:31:20.259
character and character hope. And so I don't
00:31:20.259 --> 00:31:22.440
think faith really has any, you know, with all
00:31:22.440 --> 00:31:24.259
due respect, because I know Shelley's on the
00:31:24.259 --> 00:31:26.779
opposite side, but I just, you know, I'm glad
00:31:26.779 --> 00:31:28.900
we can laugh about it. And this is important
00:31:28.900 --> 00:31:31.140
because I've had people who just. point blank
00:31:31.140 --> 00:31:34.180
refused to debate with me online. And I think
00:31:34.180 --> 00:31:36.539
as brothers and sisters in Christ, we have to
00:31:36.539 --> 00:31:38.220
understand each other's viewpoint, or at least
00:31:38.220 --> 00:31:40.720
be willing to have conversations. And you can
00:31:40.720 --> 00:31:43.240
tell I'm very passionate about this because I'm
00:31:43.240 --> 00:31:45.160
literally in the middle of the fire. I mean,
00:31:45.460 --> 00:31:47.680
if I didn't have, and I'm not trying to defend
00:31:47.680 --> 00:31:49.859
my faith. I know Shelly's not saying, you know,
00:31:50.079 --> 00:31:52.440
I'm saying if I didn't have faith, I would have
00:31:52.440 --> 00:31:54.759
left Christianity a long time ago. And if you
00:31:54.759 --> 00:31:57.420
look at Joni Erikson Tata's testimony, she, everyone
00:31:57.420 --> 00:32:00.130
knows Joni. She's, she's been a paraplegia. for
00:32:00.130 --> 00:32:03.609
50 years and she one time you know a man walked
00:32:03.609 --> 00:32:05.430
up to her and said if you had more faith you
00:32:05.430 --> 00:32:07.710
would get out of that wheelchair and and she
00:32:07.710 --> 00:32:11.240
said to him It takes more faith, and I'm sorry,
00:32:11.240 --> 00:32:13.359
I shouldn't laugh, but it's just kind of comical
00:32:13.359 --> 00:32:16.380
to me. She said that it takes more faith to believe
00:32:16.380 --> 00:32:19.259
that God is good and sustaining me by his power
00:32:19.259 --> 00:32:21.819
in this wheelchair than it does to believe that
00:32:21.819 --> 00:32:24.059
he could snap his fingers. And trust me, she
00:32:24.059 --> 00:32:26.480
is someone who does believe God could snap his
00:32:26.480 --> 00:32:28.420
fingers, that there comes a point where if the
00:32:28.420 --> 00:32:30.960
Lord reveals his will for your life, you know,
00:32:30.960 --> 00:32:33.420
what are you going to do? We have to surrender.
00:32:33.539 --> 00:32:36.079
I mean, Jesus lived a life of pure surrender.
00:32:36.319 --> 00:32:38.789
I mean, it's not my will, but thine. be done.
00:32:39.130 --> 00:32:41.589
And so I think the reason the people really,
00:32:41.589 --> 00:32:43.789
you know, kind of rift against this idea of,
00:32:44.069 --> 00:32:46.390
no, God wants to heal everyone. Of course he
00:32:46.390 --> 00:32:49.269
does because he's loving, but we have to look
00:32:49.269 --> 00:32:51.630
at what the Bible actually says. I mean, even
00:32:51.630 --> 00:32:54.569
look at Job. Job was the most righteous man and
00:32:54.569 --> 00:32:57.329
he suffered with boils. And we see behind the
00:32:57.329 --> 00:32:59.150
scenes at the beginning of the book of Job where
00:32:59.150 --> 00:33:01.589
it's clear that he's not suffering because of
00:33:01.589 --> 00:33:03.910
his sin. He's suffering because, you know, God
00:33:03.910 --> 00:33:06.609
is doing things, you know, Satan wanted to tempt
00:33:06.609 --> 00:33:09.130
him and whatever. into the details, but there's
00:33:09.130 --> 00:33:11.730
just too many biblical examples. Look at the
00:33:11.730 --> 00:33:14.109
martyrs. I mean, they all were persecuted and
00:33:14.109 --> 00:33:16.690
killed for their faith. So Christianity is not
00:33:16.690 --> 00:33:19.589
a faith where, oh, you know, it's all about our
00:33:19.589 --> 00:33:21.990
good works. Do you have enough faith? Do you
00:33:21.990 --> 00:33:24.910
measure up? Do you this? Do you that? I think
00:33:24.910 --> 00:33:27.150
it's so important that people understand that
00:33:27.150 --> 00:33:29.710
God loves them and has a plan and a purpose for
00:33:29.710 --> 00:33:32.069
their lives. Regardless, you understand what
00:33:32.069 --> 00:33:34.859
I'm saying. Yeah, faith in God isn't what creates
00:33:34.859 --> 00:33:37.539
the miracles. God is what creates them. Yes,
00:33:37.700 --> 00:33:41.460
exactly. There's a Scottish pastor named Alistair
00:33:41.460 --> 00:33:45.720
Begg, and he tells a story about the man on the
00:33:45.720 --> 00:33:49.099
middle cross and the thieves. What are you doing
00:33:49.099 --> 00:33:50.819
here? Do you know the doctrine of faith? Do you
00:33:50.819 --> 00:33:52.299
know the doctrine of this, the doctrine of that?
00:33:52.400 --> 00:33:54.480
He's like, I don't know any of that. This is
00:33:54.480 --> 00:33:55.880
by what right do you have to be here? He says,
00:33:56.019 --> 00:33:57.299
well, the man on the middle cross said I could
00:33:57.299 --> 00:34:00.529
come. Right not because of anything he did but
00:34:00.529 --> 00:34:02.650
because you know the thief did but everything
00:34:02.650 --> 00:34:06.029
because yeah Jesus did because he said so not
00:34:06.029 --> 00:34:10.389
because I did anything but because he said so
00:34:10.389 --> 00:34:12.710
And I think that's very important to think of
00:34:12.710 --> 00:34:14.769
including faith like I could have the gift of
00:34:14.769 --> 00:34:16.849
faith like my wife And it's not gonna change
00:34:16.849 --> 00:34:19.210
how Jesus loves her or I can have the gift of
00:34:19.210 --> 00:34:21.309
healing it and and I have faith it's just not
00:34:21.309 --> 00:34:23.889
a gift of faith and It's not gonna say he's not
00:34:23.889 --> 00:34:27.239
gonna look at me like he'd do better You know,
00:34:27.340 --> 00:34:30.579
he's not looking at me disdainfully as if somehow
00:34:30.579 --> 00:34:32.539
I'm messing up. He's looking at me and he says,
00:34:32.679 --> 00:34:35.019
man, there's my son. I love him. He's broken.
00:34:35.760 --> 00:34:39.940
He has neurological disorders with ADHD because
00:34:39.940 --> 00:34:43.059
I made him that way. And he has an inability
00:34:43.059 --> 00:34:45.539
to do things that other of my children can do.
00:34:46.099 --> 00:34:48.099
But it doesn't mean I love him any less. It doesn't
00:34:48.099 --> 00:34:51.260
mean I'm judging him based off of his inadequacies.
00:34:51.980 --> 00:34:55.059
Right. I'm judging him correctly. He has chosen
00:34:55.059 --> 00:34:58.099
to accept me as his savior. All the other stuff
00:34:58.099 --> 00:35:00.860
is fluffing nonsense. I don't care about all
00:35:00.860 --> 00:35:03.340
that stuff. Yeah. I just want his heart and I
00:35:03.340 --> 00:35:05.760
have it. And yeah, I think that's what's important.
00:35:05.800 --> 00:35:09.320
It doesn't matter what other people their faith
00:35:09.320 --> 00:35:12.820
is. Their faith is important to believe in Jesus,
00:35:12.880 --> 00:35:15.719
but their faith isn't what powers their salvation.
00:35:15.719 --> 00:35:18.860
Exactly. Yeah, it's all because of what Jesus
00:35:18.860 --> 00:35:24.849
did for us. Yeah. I had a headache for four straight
00:35:24.849 --> 00:35:28.210
days. It got so bad, I was basically bedridden.
00:35:28.989 --> 00:35:31.329
That's when I tried the X39 patch for the first
00:35:31.329 --> 00:35:34.389
time. And within a short time, I noticed a difference
00:35:34.389 --> 00:35:37.789
in how I felt overall. Now we keep using X39
00:35:37.789 --> 00:35:41.170
for energy, recovery, and soreness. What caught
00:35:41.170 --> 00:35:43.789
my attention is that it's not a supplement or
00:35:43.789 --> 00:35:46.730
stimulant. It's a patented, light -based wellness
00:35:46.730 --> 00:35:49.110
patch designed to support your body's natural
00:35:49.110 --> 00:35:51.920
repair processes. If you've been putting off
00:35:51.920 --> 00:35:54.900
trying X39, check out our link in the about section
00:35:54.900 --> 00:35:57.860
and finally look into it for yourself. And honestly
00:35:57.860 --> 00:36:00.380
like even on you know where I don't know what
00:36:00.380 --> 00:36:02.500
churches say this but the whole idea that oh
00:36:02.500 --> 00:36:04.260
you don't have enough faith so you're not being
00:36:04.260 --> 00:36:07.039
healed it's like a I wouldn't be praying if I
00:36:07.039 --> 00:36:10.019
didn't have faith but B it's like Jesus said
00:36:10.019 --> 00:36:12.320
that even a mustard seed of faith is enough to
00:36:12.320 --> 00:36:14.320
move mountains or whatever I hope I'm quoting
00:36:14.320 --> 00:36:15.659
the verse right I can't remember what the end
00:36:15.659 --> 00:36:17.639
of the verse is but like even a mustard seed
00:36:17.639 --> 00:36:21.420
is enough so again just logically that path of
00:36:21.420 --> 00:36:23.300
reasoning doesn't you can tell my legal mind
00:36:23.300 --> 00:36:25.820
that's always like analyzing just based on but
00:36:25.820 --> 00:36:28.869
anyway I Yeah, I completely agree. And I do want
00:36:28.869 --> 00:36:31.750
to say one more thing. Like, when Matt was first
00:36:31.750 --> 00:36:35.010
diagnosed, okay, with cancer, the sermon series
00:36:35.010 --> 00:36:38.750
at our church was on Genesis 50. And, you know,
00:36:38.750 --> 00:36:40.750
remember, Matt was the lay youth pastor, but
00:36:40.750 --> 00:36:44.349
our main pastor was preaching on Genesis 50 -20.
00:36:44.409 --> 00:36:46.570
And what's that verse? How Joseph's suffering
00:36:46.570 --> 00:36:49.889
led to the salvation of many. It says what Satan
00:36:49.889 --> 00:36:52.610
intended for evil, God intended for good. So
00:36:52.610 --> 00:36:54.869
God was sovereign over the suffering. He had
00:36:54.869 --> 00:36:57.289
planned the suffering. He had ordained the suffering.
00:36:57.289 --> 00:37:00.309
Why? To lead to many people's salvation. And
00:37:00.309 --> 00:37:02.969
so Matt wrote this Facebook post saying, oh man,
00:37:03.130 --> 00:37:05.610
it seems like God or this is great. God ordained
00:37:05.610 --> 00:37:08.409
this for our church to study the week of my diagnosis
00:37:08.409 --> 00:37:10.610
because you know, God is showing us he's gonna
00:37:10.610 --> 00:37:12.849
pull good out of the evil of my cancer. He has
00:37:12.849 --> 00:37:15.400
a plan for this, a purpose for this. And the
00:37:15.400 --> 00:37:17.559
healing, you know, the people who claim that,
00:37:17.559 --> 00:37:19.480
you know, God always heals everyone. I don't
00:37:19.480 --> 00:37:22.260
think they allow for that in terms of, no, God
00:37:22.260 --> 00:37:25.760
has a purpose for this. And so the day that Matt
00:37:25.760 --> 00:37:29.260
died, my, you know, I'm bawling in bed, whatever.
00:37:29.579 --> 00:37:31.739
I opened my daily devotional and guess what the
00:37:31.739 --> 00:37:34.780
daily verse is Genesis 50 20. And it told me
00:37:34.780 --> 00:37:37.400
it's the message of the day was, you know, what
00:37:37.400 --> 00:37:39.699
Satan intends for evil, God intends for good.
00:37:39.820 --> 00:37:43.239
And you got to remember we were praying up through
00:37:43.239 --> 00:37:45.659
hospice. I mean, We were singing worship songs.
00:37:45.840 --> 00:37:48.579
The pastors laid hands on him. I mean, we were
00:37:48.579 --> 00:37:50.980
praying for miracles. And yet God told me the
00:37:50.980 --> 00:37:53.159
day he died that this was my will. My child,
00:37:53.260 --> 00:37:56.039
I am comforting you take courage in this. I mean,
00:37:56.320 --> 00:37:59.119
so no one can tell me that, you know, Matt didn't
00:37:59.119 --> 00:38:01.860
have enough faith. This is why, I mean, it was
00:38:01.860 --> 00:38:04.500
just the Lord's will. And I say that with all
00:38:04.500 --> 00:38:07.340
due respect, but I'm just giving you my testimony
00:38:07.340 --> 00:38:09.719
of how God has spoken to me through all these
00:38:09.719 --> 00:38:13.969
trials. I was thinking of Romans 828 before you
00:38:13.969 --> 00:38:16.389
mentioned that. So God is working all things
00:38:16.389 --> 00:38:18.650
for good. Even if you're in a situation, look
00:38:18.650 --> 00:38:20.769
for the good in it because then you'll get to
00:38:20.769 --> 00:38:24.750
see more good and more good. And it's that, the
00:38:24.750 --> 00:38:28.530
RES, the Recticular Activating System, that neuroscience
00:38:28.530 --> 00:38:31.409
is catching up to Jesus. And so what you focus
00:38:31.409 --> 00:38:35.170
on grows. And so just, you know, it may be discouraged,
00:38:35.269 --> 00:38:39.949
but look at the good for it. So that's my short.
00:38:40.159 --> 00:38:45.380
Well, blurb. So what would you say is your anchor
00:38:45.380 --> 00:38:48.719
verse that gets you through your everyday life
00:38:48.719 --> 00:38:51.980
after eight years of debilitating neurological
00:38:51.980 --> 00:38:55.909
disorder? That's a beautiful question after God
00:38:55.909 --> 00:38:58.389
called me to acceptance of this illness four
00:38:58.389 --> 00:39:00.929
years ago He gave me a very specific verse which
00:39:00.929 --> 00:39:04.030
is now my life verse and it is second Corinthians
00:39:04.030 --> 00:39:08.650
417 Which says our light and momentary afflictions
00:39:08.650 --> 00:39:12.750
are achieving for us an eternal weight of glory
00:39:12.750 --> 00:39:16.469
that far outweighs them all So you can see how
00:39:16.469 --> 00:39:18.570
the Lord ministered to me because I was saying
00:39:18.570 --> 00:39:22.090
why why won't you heal me Lord? And he basically
00:39:22.090 --> 00:39:24.769
spoke into my heart and he said my daughter This
00:39:24.769 --> 00:39:27.869
is my will because I am using these trials for
00:39:27.869 --> 00:39:30.369
your eternal glory You know, we don't really
00:39:30.369 --> 00:39:32.510
understand it Remember the next verse says that
00:39:32.510 --> 00:39:35.570
we look to things unseen like we don't know what
00:39:35.570 --> 00:39:38.369
it is But we know that in the gospel pattern
00:39:38.369 --> 00:39:41.030
just like Jesus's cross led to his glory the
00:39:41.030 --> 00:39:44.840
same is true for us So I mean this verse is just
00:39:44.840 --> 00:39:47.699
Jesus's kingdom is upside down in every single
00:39:47.699 --> 00:39:51.000
respect. So, I mean, why would suffering be any
00:39:51.000 --> 00:39:53.880
different? Our suffering creates our eternal
00:39:53.880 --> 00:39:56.960
glory. It's all over the New Testament. God gets
00:39:56.960 --> 00:39:59.519
glory through our sufferings. Look at Paul where
00:39:59.519 --> 00:40:02.380
he said, God told him in 2 Corinthians 12, 9,
00:40:02.739 --> 00:40:05.460
my grace is sufficient for you for my power is
00:40:05.460 --> 00:40:08.449
made perfect in your weakness. I mean, so this
00:40:08.449 --> 00:40:10.690
is really a word I would give to someone out
00:40:10.690 --> 00:40:13.650
there today who's just struggling, doesn't understand
00:40:13.650 --> 00:40:17.210
why. Why, Lord, why do you allow this? I just
00:40:17.210 --> 00:40:19.429
want to give you this verse as an encouragement
00:40:19.429 --> 00:40:23.690
today. Beautiful. I hope everyone can feel the
00:40:23.690 --> 00:40:25.829
Holy Spirit listening to this because I'm in
00:40:25.829 --> 00:40:29.190
tears. Yeah, no, she does that when the Holy
00:40:29.190 --> 00:40:31.690
Spirit's hitting her. I felt it earlier, but
00:40:31.690 --> 00:40:33.769
I didn't have the tears earlier. I just love
00:40:33.769 --> 00:40:37.039
it. I don't do it because men don't cry. Except,
00:40:37.099 --> 00:40:39.239
except Jesus, he wept. That was in the Bible.
00:40:40.840 --> 00:40:42.780
It's actually what I encourage other men to cry
00:40:42.780 --> 00:40:44.579
with, is like, don't be, don't be afraid to.
00:40:44.659 --> 00:40:46.579
Like Jesus wept and he was the man's man, you
00:40:46.579 --> 00:40:49.659
know. Oh man, we needed comedy there. That was
00:40:49.659 --> 00:40:51.619
like a welcome relief. I feel like I've been
00:40:51.619 --> 00:40:55.400
fired up as you can tell. And so that joke was
00:40:55.400 --> 00:40:57.900
very welcome. You're welcome. It's, it's pretty
00:40:57.900 --> 00:41:00.179
much the way I roll. It's how God created me.
00:41:00.599 --> 00:41:02.920
I apologize for nothing. I'll be crying. He'll
00:41:02.920 --> 00:41:07.309
make me laugh. Like, thanks. I have my moments.
00:41:07.809 --> 00:41:10.869
I really appreciate your strength in all of this.
00:41:11.110 --> 00:41:14.489
I appreciate that your stance mirrors my own.
00:41:15.190 --> 00:41:18.429
I appreciate how respectful you are and delicate
00:41:18.429 --> 00:41:21.909
despite my wife not sharing the same views. And
00:41:21.909 --> 00:41:23.949
I also appreciate the conversation we've had
00:41:23.949 --> 00:41:26.909
that illustrates that there are different views,
00:41:26.929 --> 00:41:30.070
but it's still one God. And it doesn't matter
00:41:30.070 --> 00:41:32.250
what your view is, my view is, my wife's view
00:41:32.250 --> 00:41:35.519
is because... God still saved each and every
00:41:35.519 --> 00:41:38.639
one of us through his son, Jesus Christ. And
00:41:38.639 --> 00:41:42.059
I believe that that is the most important part
00:41:42.059 --> 00:41:45.280
of the message, not whether I suffer for others,
00:41:45.360 --> 00:41:48.260
whether you suffer alone, whether my wife believes
00:41:48.260 --> 00:41:51.239
that people suffering should never suffer because
00:41:51.239 --> 00:41:53.739
God will heal everybody is irrelevant compared
00:41:53.739 --> 00:41:56.219
to how much God loves each and every one of us.
00:41:57.099 --> 00:41:59.949
Yeah, absolutely. It's something I had heard
00:41:59.949 --> 00:42:02.269
before. I forget the name of the pastor that
00:42:02.269 --> 00:42:04.869
said it, but he said if Jesus was back today,
00:42:05.190 --> 00:42:07.010
there would still be two churches and it'd be
00:42:07.010 --> 00:42:09.369
the muddites and the anti muddites. You know,
00:42:09.409 --> 00:42:10.989
the people that believe he heals by putting mud
00:42:10.989 --> 00:42:13.190
in people's eyes and believe he doesn't because
00:42:13.190 --> 00:42:16.269
he did both. And so, you know, even if he was
00:42:16.269 --> 00:42:18.510
around right now and we could witness him with
00:42:18.510 --> 00:42:21.030
all the technology, all the YouTube videos, everything,
00:42:21.190 --> 00:42:24.090
we would still be split on how we love him and
00:42:24.090 --> 00:42:27.559
believe in him with him right in our midst. I
00:42:27.559 --> 00:42:29.960
agree with you. We all have blind spots. I mean,
00:42:29.960 --> 00:42:33.019
God is beyond understanding. From my point of
00:42:33.019 --> 00:42:35.280
view, all we can do is we've got the Word of
00:42:35.280 --> 00:42:38.260
God and we have to go from there. But yeah, I
00:42:38.260 --> 00:42:40.059
agree with you that we're all going to get to
00:42:40.059 --> 00:42:41.719
eternity and there's going to be probably so
00:42:41.719 --> 00:42:43.800
many things where God is going to reveal like,
00:42:44.019 --> 00:42:46.320
all right, your theology was wrong on that, Laura,
00:42:46.619 --> 00:42:49.239
your theology was wrong on that, Shelley. I mean,
00:42:49.380 --> 00:42:51.320
in other words, like, we're not God. I mean,
00:42:51.320 --> 00:42:52.780
he's going to tell me I was perfect. He's going
00:42:52.780 --> 00:42:55.480
to be like, man, you were the best listener there
00:42:55.480 --> 00:42:57.949
ever was. I wish you would have paid attention
00:42:57.949 --> 00:43:02.050
to your own advice. Oftentimes, I am saying,
00:43:02.230 --> 00:43:05.530
yeah, you were right to Josh. I hate him. Always
00:43:05.530 --> 00:43:08.469
after the fact. Incredible. I'll tell you an
00:43:08.469 --> 00:43:14.230
example offline. Thank you so much for just being
00:43:14.230 --> 00:43:16.349
open and vulnerable with us. It can't be easy
00:43:16.349 --> 00:43:19.769
to share about your loss, personal loss, your
00:43:19.769 --> 00:43:21.989
professional loss, your personal loss, your love
00:43:21.989 --> 00:43:25.329
loss. It cannot be easy to share that. And I
00:43:25.329 --> 00:43:28.070
thank you so much for your faith that you are
00:43:28.070 --> 00:43:30.909
Dedicated and that you love Jesus as much as
00:43:30.909 --> 00:43:33.869
you do despite what people like my wife would
00:43:33.869 --> 00:43:38.269
say I Really? I do appreciate hearing I appreciate
00:43:38.269 --> 00:43:40.550
that our listeners get to have a perspective
00:43:40.550 --> 00:43:43.969
that Sometimes God has a different plan for them
00:43:43.969 --> 00:43:46.849
that sometimes it isn't about healing Sometimes
00:43:46.849 --> 00:43:49.110
it's a different kind of journey and I also want
00:43:49.110 --> 00:43:50.949
to encourage you that doesn't mean that he's
00:43:50.949 --> 00:43:54.400
not gonna heal you specifically listener It's
00:43:54.400 --> 00:43:58.199
just maybe right maybe not right now Right, maybe
00:43:58.199 --> 00:44:00.480
it's not right now. Maybe eight years from now.
00:44:00.480 --> 00:44:02.980
Maybe two weeks from now Maybe when you enter
00:44:02.980 --> 00:44:05.260
into the kingdom of heaven, I can't answer those
00:44:05.260 --> 00:44:08.079
questions. I don't know I had to wait 17 years
00:44:08.079 --> 00:44:10.820
So for my chronic neck and shoulder pain to be
00:44:10.820 --> 00:44:13.460
gone I was in tears the last day and I told Josh
00:44:13.460 --> 00:44:15.539
you got to pray and that was the first miracle
00:44:15.539 --> 00:44:18.519
we saw So I was healed of that but it took 17
00:44:18.519 --> 00:44:20.599
years, but I wasn't expecting it, but I was still
00:44:20.599 --> 00:44:23.480
praying for it So like it also took four tries
00:44:23.719 --> 00:44:26.260
It didn't immediately healed, it moved. Well,
00:44:26.320 --> 00:44:28.219
I got a headache in the back of my head, and
00:44:28.219 --> 00:44:29.559
I was like, oh, that's weird, because I didn't
00:44:29.559 --> 00:44:31.500
usually get headaches. And then he's like, all
00:44:31.500 --> 00:44:33.219
right, we're going to pray again. And it was
00:44:33.219 --> 00:44:36.739
as simple as, shall we be healed? And he's like,
00:44:36.780 --> 00:44:39.019
how do you feel? And the headache moved again,
00:44:39.280 --> 00:44:41.829
closer to my forehead, and then. couple more
00:44:41.829 --> 00:44:44.050
times, and then the headache was gone after it
00:44:44.050 --> 00:44:46.090
moved. It was a thing, but we were persistent,
00:44:46.329 --> 00:44:48.809
and it was the first miracle we saw, so it was...
00:44:48.809 --> 00:44:50.829
Yeah, and there was nothing fancy. There was
00:44:50.829 --> 00:44:53.469
no oil, there was no holy water, there was no
00:44:53.469 --> 00:44:56.050
magical words, there was no... But I was surrendered.
00:44:56.349 --> 00:44:59.349
I got nothing left, because the pills and pot
00:44:59.349 --> 00:45:03.530
weren't helping at all. Nothing was... I don't
00:45:03.530 --> 00:45:06.550
do any of that anymore, but yeah. But you never
00:45:06.550 --> 00:45:09.820
know, so... It's like me just be hopeful and
00:45:09.820 --> 00:45:12.340
you could be like me where you are called to
00:45:12.340 --> 00:45:15.219
glorious suffering for others And so it's your
00:45:15.219 --> 00:45:17.900
journey let your light shine and take joy in
00:45:17.900 --> 00:45:20.039
it Take joy in everything the Lord does for you
00:45:20.039 --> 00:45:23.460
because if I suffer for somebody else, then he
00:45:23.460 --> 00:45:26.159
must really want somebody else And he already
00:45:26.159 --> 00:45:29.599
has me. He knows i'm not going anywhere He go
00:45:29.599 --> 00:45:32.260
him and I've had that talk many a time And so
00:45:32.260 --> 00:45:35.079
if he needs to break me, so somebody else can
00:45:35.079 --> 00:45:37.920
see me broken and serving him in order for them
00:45:37.920 --> 00:45:41.699
to serve him, then break me. I'm tough. I'm tough.
00:45:41.840 --> 00:45:43.579
I can take it until I can't. And then I have
00:45:43.579 --> 00:45:47.320
my wife to lean on. Yeah. Oh, thank you so much,
00:45:47.400 --> 00:45:49.960
Laura, for being here with us. And I love that.
00:45:49.960 --> 00:45:52.099
Thank you. Now, part of your ministry, before
00:45:52.099 --> 00:45:54.519
we wrap this up, is you have the podcast. So
00:45:54.519 --> 00:45:57.599
share about that. I would love to share so people
00:45:57.599 --> 00:46:00.119
can find my book if you're interested on, you
00:46:00.119 --> 00:46:02.079
know, not, this isn't honestly, you can tell
00:46:02.079 --> 00:46:03.920
I didn't write the book for money. I mean, I'm
00:46:03.920 --> 00:46:06.360
literally bedridden. It's really just my testimony
00:46:06.360 --> 00:46:09.139
and it's a really sweet romantic love story.
00:46:09.139 --> 00:46:11.679
I heard it's a little comedy too. It's yeah,
00:46:11.840 --> 00:46:13.820
it's pretty funny because I'm actually a comedian.
00:46:14.159 --> 00:46:16.739
I mean, I grew up doing musical theater and I,
00:46:16.860 --> 00:46:19.239
after Matt died, I started doing Armenian comedy
00:46:19.239 --> 00:46:21.820
reels on Instagram because the Lord told me to,
00:46:21.820 --> 00:46:24.059
you know, get back on the joy train. And it was
00:46:24.059 --> 00:46:26.360
like, I just processed my grief through doing
00:46:26.360 --> 00:46:29.199
comedy and - Armenian comedy. Yeah, exactly.
00:46:29.360 --> 00:46:31.260
Like, you know, because I'm Armenian, so I did
00:46:31.260 --> 00:46:33.239
cultural comedy, you know, teasing grandmas,
00:46:33.460 --> 00:46:35.260
teasing young kids, you know, it's like food
00:46:35.260 --> 00:46:38.659
culture, whatever. Perfect. But yeah, how specific
00:46:38.659 --> 00:46:43.139
it is. Yeah, and so you can see like God, I mean,
00:46:43.139 --> 00:46:44.639
it's not that he doesn't tolerate our grief.
00:46:44.679 --> 00:46:46.920
He walks us through our grief, but he really
00:46:46.920 --> 00:46:49.480
with me, he was tough with me to say, nope, we're
00:46:49.480 --> 00:46:51.219
not going to stay in the bitterness. We're going
00:46:51.219 --> 00:46:53.280
to turn, turn. We're going to rejoice always
00:46:53.280 --> 00:46:55.639
as Paul says, sorrowful, but rejoicing. But anyway,
00:46:56.099 --> 00:46:58.460
you can, so I wrote my book in quite a comical
00:46:58.460 --> 00:47:01.059
fashion and it helps people get through the suffering
00:47:01.059 --> 00:47:03.380
because you know, I'm portraying a lot of suffering,
00:47:03.659 --> 00:47:06.519
but It's really a romantic love story and how,
00:47:06.699 --> 00:47:08.420
I mean, anyway, you heard my testimony. So you
00:47:08.420 --> 00:47:11.059
can find my book on Amazon and also my website,
00:47:11.340 --> 00:47:14.559
which is larasilverman .com, L -A -R -A, silverman
00:47:14.559 --> 00:47:17.949
.com. And I also host the Singing Through Fire
00:47:17.949 --> 00:47:20.849
podcast, literally from my bedroom. My parents
00:47:20.849 --> 00:47:23.090
helped me create a little studio here where I
00:47:23.090 --> 00:47:25.550
sit up as much as I can and I interview my own
00:47:25.550 --> 00:47:28.530
guests. And every single person I interview is
00:47:28.530 --> 00:47:32.030
someone who has walked through severe suffering.
00:47:32.230 --> 00:47:34.570
And I give a lot of my own devotional lectures
00:47:34.570 --> 00:47:36.789
on, you know, everything that God has told me.
00:47:36.789 --> 00:47:39.469
You can find that podcast on, you know, all podcast
00:47:39.469 --> 00:47:42.010
platforms. And I have a YouTube channel called
00:47:42.010 --> 00:47:44.869
The Silverman Show where I host the podcast.
00:47:44.840 --> 00:47:47.059
It's called the singing through fire podcast.
00:47:47.340 --> 00:47:50.000
So thank you so much for giving me the opportunity
00:47:50.000 --> 00:47:52.880
to share my story today And thank you Josh for
00:47:52.880 --> 00:47:55.559
encouraging me about my faith. It's all the Lord's
00:47:55.559 --> 00:47:57.940
sustaining me I would not be a Christian today
00:47:57.940 --> 00:48:00.400
if he had not upheld my faith. I believe that
00:48:00.400 --> 00:48:03.480
firmly It's him doing it not me. So thank you
00:48:03.480 --> 00:48:07.469
so much awesome I hope this has been a blessing
00:48:07.469 --> 00:48:10.849
to our listeners as much as me. I love this conversation.
00:48:11.369 --> 00:48:13.710
And if you would love to partner with us, we
00:48:13.710 --> 00:48:15.550
would love that. We have some links that you
00:48:15.550 --> 00:48:17.329
can click on if you want to help support the
00:48:17.329 --> 00:48:20.030
show and help us get these messages out to more
00:48:20.030 --> 00:48:22.769
people and win more souls for the kingdom and
00:48:22.769 --> 00:48:27.869
just keep encouraging others. Before you go,
00:48:27.949 --> 00:48:30.250
if this episode encouraged you or made you think
00:48:30.250 --> 00:48:32.489
of someone in your life, share it with them.
00:48:32.699 --> 00:48:35.039
You never know how God might use one story at
00:48:35.039 --> 00:48:37.460
the right moment. Thanks for spending this time
00:48:37.460 --> 00:48:40.380
with us today. And don't forget, God is always
00:48:40.380 --> 00:48:42.900
working, miracles still happen, and your story
00:48:42.900 --> 00:48:45.000
matters too. We'll talk to you next week.