Mark & Chris interview

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Hey, y'all, this is Mark Vatson and this is Chris
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Hannabut and you're listening to a grand slam of music, sports,
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and entertainment. It's the award nominated Backstage Past Podcast with
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Brandon Morell on KYBN ninety eight point one, your Bay
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Area Broadcasting Network.
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Stream the show anytime at the Sports.
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Guys podcast dot com and on iHeartRadio podcast. You can
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also stream at THHWN dot org and.
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Welcome inside the Backstage Pass a busy day full of
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shows and Turkey Day coming up around the corner if
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you guys are having that great Turkey Day too. Happy
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Thanksgiving to everybody out there too, all across our affiliates,
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our stations, and everybody in podcast land on iHeartRadio podcast
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and of course thch WN dot orgon powered by the
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Sports Guys podcast dot com, and of course our affiliates
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out there KYBN ninety eight point one, your Bay Area
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Broadcasting Network. Brandon Morele here, and of course we do
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a lot of different recording artists out there too. But
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it's always good to give back to the songwriters, the
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composer and everybody who does a little bit of everything
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in the music business and to do that today here
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on the backstage Pass powered by the Sports guyspodcast dot com,
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please to welcome in big time composers out there too.
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They've done it all in the feature film days too,
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and of course a lot of different music cuts, worked
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on a lot of records out there and album sold.
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Mark Bats and Chris Hannah. But to the show guys,
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what's going on?
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Hey, Hey, good, good to be here. Thanks for having.
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Us, Thanks for having us spreading you got it well, Mark,
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let's kind of start right there too. I love the
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fact is, you know, we can talk about the track
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records all day too, but I want to get to
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know how you guys have met on this. I mean, Mark,
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you've done six Grammy Award winning albums too, and I
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know you grew up kind of a classic of the
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trained pianist and producer. I mean one hundred and thirty
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two million albums sold. Your track record speaks for itself.
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Chris has been a composer, of producer and a mixer
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and who's done a lot of things. Talk about just
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how you guys met to collaborate on these projects we're
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gonna be talking about today.
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We have a mutual friend who's a singer and songwriter
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named So, and she connected me and Chris. We kind
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of hung out for years and worked on a bunch
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of different projects, and maybe a couple of years back,
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Chris came to me and said that if I wanted
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to join him to work on Power Force. So we
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decided to collaborate on that. It's been an awesome experience
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with three years in and so making an awesome soundtrack,
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which is going to be the first score soundtrack released
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from the Power franchise because a lot of people think
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the score is really exceptional. We continued on. We've also
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been scoring movies. We scored two documentaries over the last
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two years. One of them is The Alabama Solution, which
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was an expose on Alabama prisons and some very corrupt
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things that go on behind these stores. And the other
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one was called One Person, One Vote, and it was
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a documentary about explaining the electoral College and how the
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electoral college came about and and and why maybe it
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possibly is an outdated bottle for politics.
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And uh.
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That kind of encompasses our how we meet, how we met,
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and we just work on a bunch of different things together.
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Chris is a very compliments what I do in a
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in a great way. He's a genius of what he
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does as a fantastic guitarist, fantastic songwriter and also fantastic engineer,
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and that compliments what I do as a pianist.
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No, Chris, you talked about that too, is read somewhere.
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We first moved to Los Angeles there a while back
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in Joseph Sokora is a big time actor there too,
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has done a lot of things out there for films
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and things like that. Talk about that relationship too, and
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getting into this to kind of build on power book
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for this this four series.
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I'm into it. It's fantastic.
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Thank you.
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Yeah, you did some you did research.
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Yeah, So, Joseph.
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The funny thing is when I first moved to Los Angeles,
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like twenty just so over twenty years ago, I went
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and helped a guy, this guy Justin Rhodes, who's like
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a really fantastic screenwriter and at the time he was
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in school working on his like final project, and the
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actor that was in his final school project that was
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helping out was Joseph Secora. So Joseph was like one
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of the first people that I met when I moved
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to Los Angeles and we watched the Academy Awards together
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that year, and you know, I mean he was just
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like a young actor in a same way that I
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was just moving to Los Angeles as like a young musician,
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and I mean I knew nobody, and so it was
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very full circle because I watched his career over those years,
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him just you know, getting bigger and bigger parts. And
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then it was really awesome for us to you know,
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be able to the first show that at least that
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I you know, I'd had a lot of cuts and
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shows and cuts and movies, but I'd never had a
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show that you know, it was fully ours, like where
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it was like, Okay, this is our scoring project.
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And for it to be Joseph's first where you know,
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it's like his show.
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You know, he's executive producer on it, he's like the
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main star on it, it's very you know, there's a
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big full circle moment for me.
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Yeah.
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You've both done a lot in your career, you know,
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Mark I mentioned there too, just huge statistics out there
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too looking back at it. I mean one hundred and
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thirty two million albums sold as pianist, producer, things like that,
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and you know, collaborating with such these great icons marks
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such as Eminem and Beyonce and jay Z Alicia Keys.
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What are you most proud of? Mark?
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Just in your career and the fact that to be
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able to share this talent with other people that you
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have and also collaborate with some of the biggest artists
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you know nationwide.
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I think what I'm most proud of is being able
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to work with these really super creative, genius artists and
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be able to help them with their visions. When I
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first started out, I had a rap group with with
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my brothers called Get Said VP, who was signed to
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PolyGram to Polydor Records, and the record didn't do well.
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It was a It was a really tough experience. And
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then from that point on I moved more behind developing
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and helping other artists so that they would not make
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the same mistakes that I did. So that early in
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my career that was working with Nda I Read was
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signed to Motown on her first album, crafting the South
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of Anthony Hamilton for his first album. These were artists
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that did not necessarily fit into the machinery or the
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music business machinery comfortable.
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They had their own unique and.
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Distinct thing, and so I'm most proud of helping artists
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like that be heard, you know, artists that don't really
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fit in the box, artists that do different things. And
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then also to be in the same room with talents
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on the level of you know, eminem or Challenge on
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the level we love Alisha Keys. We're talking to some
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of the most prolific artists and most talented artists on
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the planet Earth. So to be in the room with
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them is a lot of pride, a lot of honor,
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and I'm very thankful and grateful about it.
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Mark, I didn't know that about you and your brother.
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That's how I've never I never knew that. One thing
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about you, Mark that I've just watched and that I
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really admire about your work with the artists that you
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work with, is.
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All of them are your friends. Like you, you make
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these artists.
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That you know there's busy and bouncing from thing to thing,
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but like you build relationships with these artists in a
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way that sets you apart. Like you're, for lack of
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a better term, your bedside manner. You know, you really
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that on top of how awesome of a musician you are,
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it's like that, right, that is what really separates you
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in my opinion, is that right there, like you're the
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love that you have for them and the love that
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they have for you. That then you have these like
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lifetime friendships with you know, with Dave and Dave Matthews
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and all the I mean every other all the other
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artists like they they like they love you and like, yeah,
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I mean that is that is just from an outsider's perspective,
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is the I think the most impressive thing to me
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is the relationships that you that you build with the
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people that you work with. I mean with ours, you know,
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with yours and my relationship too, but just that you're
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at at the heart of all of it.
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You are a relationship guy. For like, without a doubt.
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That's pretty awesome. Chuse thank you so much.
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Again, it goes back to me wanting to nurture artists
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and and get the best out of them, and that
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make the same mistakes per se that that I made
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early on when I got into the record business.
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So I just kind of see.
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You know, people that need a hand at what they do,
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and it could be somebody who's highly skilled and they
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still need that support system. So I think part of
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being a producer is not just being about being a
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great musician or hearing the right notes. It's also kind
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of being a therapist as well, and uh, and being
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in position to supply supply emotional and spiritual support to
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the artists that you're working with.
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Yeah, I can voucher that support.
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Yeah, there's Power Book Floor Force.
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You know, part of that Power franchise got more than
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over one point six billion hours viewed globally. I mean,
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you think back about this project. I'm getting into it,
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you know right now with episodes and things like that,
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and if people check out, they're streaming services out there too,
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Chris talk about just you know, the the hours you
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know viewed on something very interesting too. And of course
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the composition is fantastic with it too. But I love
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these because any of these documentaries that people get into,
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just like for anything, could be an artist, could be
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a series, anything like that. It's got to have the
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information and you know, kind of like a good song,
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it's got to have those hooks in it. And you
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guys definitely have I think, really planted you know, the
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hooks and people that keep them tuned into a series
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like this.
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Chris.
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Yeah, we're very fortunate to be able to work on
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a brand like Power. I mean, it's just like there's
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like the same we always say Power never dies. It's
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like it's like it's gonna you know, there's never a
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time somebody's not watching it in the world. It's just
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it's it's like the gift that keeps on giving. So
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you know, to be able to put a sonic fingerprint
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on something like that, and especially with Force because it's
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the biggest it's just you know, action, there's so much
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action in it.
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So it's really great practice.
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For us too, because it's kind of like just a
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lot of different blockbusters thrown together. Right, It's like every
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single every episode has the full its gunfights and explosions.
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It's like, you know, and then and then the chill scene.
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So we get to really stretch a lot, and and
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it's great for us for as we continue to move
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into doing bigger films, the more blockbuster vibe. So it's
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it's it's been really a lot of fun and a
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great learning experience too. This again, it was you know,
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it was my first full show, so I've learned a
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lot through the process.
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Yeah, I love the other one too, Like I said,
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looking back the HBO documentary, you talked about this a
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little bit.
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Mark.
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We started there the Alabama Solution, which is now HB
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HBO Max Critical Acclaim the Sundance Film Festival earlier this
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year and now is nominated for five.
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Critics Choice Awards.
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It won.
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Awesome.
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Yeah, it won and it won.
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Uh that's political political dot thementity.
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Yeah, I've not seen that one yet. I've got to
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dive into this one, Mark, how did this one come about?
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Here?
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And also for you guys, I mean to get the
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word back in this you know, ever changing tough industry
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when it comes down to it, for composing to being
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a recording artist working on any type of you know,
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digital media projects. Getting back those Critics Choice Awards and
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winning one had to be exciting.
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Yeah, it was pretty awesome.
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I worked closely with a music supervisor named Sue Jacobs.
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We've worked on a bunch of films together, like I Tanya, Whijuana, Oscar,
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and also American Hustle, which was Best Picture at the
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Golden Globes. So we've been collaborating on different projects and
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she called me about this Alabama Solution, and so I
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met with Andrew Jareki and Charlotte Kaufman who spent six
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years working on this film, and the idea of the
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film was that there were people who were incarcerated, many
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were incarcerated, who had got cell phones inside and were
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filming atrocities that take place that were on a Guantina
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Mobey level of atrocities. And it also affirmed that slavery
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still exists in America and that they were people who
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were enslaved basically, who were working under those conditions, who
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would be violent, who could be violently punished or killed
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if they didn't follow these orders to a ti. So
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they worked on it for six years, six difficult years
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of gathering footage and interviews and experiencing some outrageous situations,
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including or following the story of one particular correction officer
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murdering one of the men in the facility. So they
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kind of follow and tell that story. But also on
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their site, the Alabama Solution, you see that the story
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of these atrocious stories that they told in the movie
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are just a type of iceberg of the thousands of
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other cases that you can investigate on their page. So
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I called Chris, you know, to come in and to
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work with me on this. We make a great team
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at scoring and there's a lot of beautiful, fantastic guitars
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that helped to tell the story of that region.
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And that vibe, and we did a lot of music
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for a lot of great music for it. It was
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a very painful process so to have to meet in
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the experience of real life experiences. But for myself, it's
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one of up in the long run, I feel to
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be the most important project.
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That I've coming together. Chris go ahead talk about that too.
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Just really another special project too, and also trying like
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you mentioned there too for this one available out a
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stream on HBO Max for the Alabama Solution, your favorit
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parts of really uh, you know, kind of exposing something
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that really needed to be kind of brought to attention.
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Yeah, I mean, I totally agree with Mark.
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I mean, it's the most important project that I've ever
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been a part of. I mean, as musicians, it's like
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it's very it's I feel like sometimes it's kind of rare,
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or it's just an artist at all at anything to
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you know, be a part of something that is so
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much bigger than what you're than than just the work.
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It's a legacy project, like I I feel like like
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I was I mean, yeah, I mean, if if I
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never worked on another project again, and I would and
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and I got to say, at least I worked on
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this project right here, I'd be good with that. Like
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I I that it means that.
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Much to me.
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Because it's rare to be able to be a part
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of something that's meaning that meaningful.
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Yeah, I mean, the movies very heavy.
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I mean to see what the men indoor and to
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see what they're families endure. And it's also incredibly inspiring
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because there's a lot of heroes in this film, really brave,
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really brave men and women that are just taking it
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one day at a time and using nonviolence is as
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their method to get the word out there. And the
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only thing that they're asking for is a little bit
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of transparency. I mean, you know, you can't there's you
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could have journalists can go into a war zone and
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film what's going on, but you know they can't go
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in and there's no there's no transparency in our in
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our criminal justice system in the United States, And I mean,
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you know, there's a lot of people, there are lots
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of people are getting murdered and disappeared and odean and
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it's just it's really horrific that and we're paying for it,
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so you know, it was and creatively it was a
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really fun experience because it was challenging that the directors
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had a very particular thing that they wanted and it's
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because it's so emotional, you know, this is their baby.
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We you know, it was it was difficult, and we
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we really worked very hard hand in hand with them
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to deliver exactly what they wanted without over selling the
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emotion and staying understated. But then us still figuring out
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our sonic textures and.
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You know, used lots of lots of guitars, piano, live streams, metal, percussion.
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You know, we wanted it was very important for it
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to kind of sound like a machine because like Andrew called,
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he said, you know, it says the way that he
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describes the Alabama Department of Corrections is that it's a
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murder machine. And and it was very that was a
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theme that we kept discussing. You know, it's like it
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needs to sound like if we can make it sound
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like a machine, like it's.
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Constantly moving, that that that was you know, the goal
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at the end of the day, and.
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I think we did that.
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I'm really happy with it and we'll be releasing that soundtrack.
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We're working on it now.
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The also have a soundtrack album for for Alabama Solution.
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Yeah, definitely a call for that accountability and reform to
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you can't wait to check that out too as well. Uh,
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you guys can check out the Alabama Solution there too,
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Mark Bats and Chris Hanna but joining us here on
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the backstage pass. So you know, Mark, I want to
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ask you about this one too, because it's just kind
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of a question to throw out there too about how
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the industry has has changed so much. You mentioned, you know,
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you're working on six of those Grammy Award winning albums
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too and and doing things being a producer. I love
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the fact is and that there's pros and cons to
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both of it. But h kind of a two parter here,
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and we'll start with us and Mark the collaboration in
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music today to see a lot of the artists, no
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matter what genre of music kind of cross over. And
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I do interview a lot more country artists here on
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the program because there in the show is you know,
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well known and Nashville, Tennessee, and we go there for
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a couple of major events from you know, throughout the
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years and things like that. But it's kind of cool
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that to see that, you know, some of the artists
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like Akon, you know crosses over now working with Gary
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Lavax of Rascal Flats, and you see just different things
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that are going. I want to ask you about the
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crossover there in the collaboration that you're seeing with different
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genres of music, Mark and kind of get your opinion
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on that.
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I absolutely love it.
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I think that that that's only for me personally, one
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music I see there's one big continuum of ideas that
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continue us the share off of each other and borrow
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from each other. I think it's always good when people
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culturally come together to share their ideas. I think it's
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part of unifying. It has a very unifying quality. Music
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brings people together in general, and these things can break boundaries.
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There's a lot of boundaries that are Social media reach
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a lot of unders. People get into their own worlds,
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and then they have their echo chambers inside of their
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world and and sometimes those worlds start to separate and
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become smaller and smaller and more more more divisive, and
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so there's a lot of separation that the social media stokes,
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and it puts people on opposite size, and then they
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argue and then the the abs itself. Whatever outrage is
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out there, they use that outrage to keep people engaged.
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So with that being out you know, in the world
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so much right now, the idea that they could be
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some you know, music, the spiritual force that could cross
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those boundaries and bring people together. I think it's more
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needed now uh than ever before. We need more country
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wrap projects, we need more uh reggaep.
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Projects, we need more.
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Different styles, more jazz meets jazz and classical artists coming together,
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putting people on different cultures inside of venues together to
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bring them into real life and a little bit off
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of the phone, because if you live in the world
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of your phone, you can think that you know that
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everybody's angry at each other, that everybody hates each other,
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and as soon as you go outside, you go wow,
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you know, you go to a festival or something, they
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go like, no, that's that's not real. And if the
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music is a great force uh to bring people together
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like that, and to also uh found the rat a
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lot of the negativity that has been born in the
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social media game.
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Yeah, Chris, would you agree absolutely?
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Yeah?
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Yeah, I.
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Don't even really have much to add to that.
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Yeah, I was actually watching the Cmawards of the Night too,
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and I thought it was kind of cool because you see,
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like you know, Big Extra Plug and Luke Holmbs you know,
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collaborating with a song there too. I mean Big Extra
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Plug is is now taken over and done. His thing
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is producer, compon just songwriter, composer. He's done at all
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in the industry too, and he's still keeping his name
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you know, out there too. And I think the crossover
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to gives it because I love that variety is kind
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of like the spice of life. You know, we're all
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on our phones and this digital age now, and that
422
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leads me to my next question. And I'll start with
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this one, Chris, like, how much AI has impacted you
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know this now from the music industry and they keep saying, well,
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it's going to take away from you know, the songwriter,
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it's going to take away from the recording of the song.
427
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I mean AI is around to stay whether we like
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it or not. You know, we're coming up as we're
429
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all using different pieces and and parts of it. I
430
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mean chat GPT now, how technology has changed what you
431
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guys do? And I guess kind of when you weigh
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the pros and cons. Chris, what are kind of those
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those pros and cons in the music industry for AI?
434
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Because it's here to stay.
435
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Definitely, I'm glad that you brought this up. I have
436
00:22:45.519 --> 00:22:47.839
a few things to talk about.
437
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Bluntly, there's not a whole lot more that can be
438
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taken from songwriters in today's industry. I mean, it's it's
439
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a very very very tough way to make a living.
440
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I mean, you have to have the number one and smash,
441
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you know, on a record. It's like getting a cut
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on an album. Now you don't make anything off of
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it as a songwriter. So it's already it's already very
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very difficult. This last the article that came out a
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couple of weeks ago, what was it last week or
446
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week before where they were talking about the country band
447
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that you know had a number one song on the
448
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Billboard Digital download chart. I feel like Mark and I
449
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were talking about this, and like, my thing about that
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is it's not even a story about AI.
451
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It's actually to me a story of.
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How corrupt the the the the uh the list is
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because I mean it's a downloadable like who downloads digital? Like,
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you know, really who downloads digital anyways, everybody's streams, so
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it's so manipulated that it's just a self feed.
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It's just for press, right like all the like.
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It's just a way of saying, okay, we'll buy I
458
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think they said, I read that it could have been
459
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as few as it's like six thousand downloads in a week,
460
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so you know, they spend ten thousand dollars, they buy
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the downloads, and now they got a number one Billboard
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with an AI band, right, and then they just put
463
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it in all the all the industry uh press and
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then then it gets people to go to Spotify to
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listen to it. And so it's really kind of an
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indictment on how that part of the system works. More
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than that is an you know, sad or exciting depending
468
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on how you look at it, that an AI band
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is number one on Billboard. I mean it's kind of
470
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a farce. As for how we use AI personally, I
471
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use it as a sounding board. I would say, like
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I'll write a song, play the piano park, come up
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with the demo with the melodies, come up with half
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the lyrics, work out some of the production, upload it,
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and then see what direction I'd like to take it
476
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because you know it takes a long time to demo
477
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out and that you know, if you go to try
478
00:25:07.920 --> 00:25:11.440
different styles, it takes some time. So it's nice to
479
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have it as that and back and forth and maybe
480
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if you like some of what it does, you import that.
481
00:25:16.759 --> 00:25:20.440
But I always I replace everything. I replay it.
482
00:25:21.440 --> 00:25:23.880
Yeah, I prefer I like to replay everything or hire
483
00:25:23.960 --> 00:25:26.720
musicians to replay stuff. And because it just it doesn't
484
00:25:26.759 --> 00:25:30.960
do that, it's it's a great source of additional inspiration.
485
00:25:31.319 --> 00:25:34.559
I think it's and it's fun. It's it definitely is
486
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fun to play with. And I've had and I just
487
00:25:38.039 --> 00:25:42.039
I've had too, Like I'm working on a commercial.
488
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Spot right now, and it was in aishole.
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Like they I mean, they brought something that was demoed
490
00:25:53.680 --> 00:25:55.680
out with AI and they were like, this needs to
491
00:25:55.720 --> 00:25:57.160
be redone by humans.
492
00:25:57.519 --> 00:26:00.759
So it's it's a it's a weird world.
493
00:26:01.839 --> 00:26:03.440
It is too and people have to realize too. And
494
00:26:03.519 --> 00:26:05.559
I'm all about, you know, the songwriters mark when I
495
00:26:05.599 --> 00:26:07.079
look back at it too, because you're right, it's like
496
00:26:07.119 --> 00:26:09.079
pennies on the dollar if that based on the number
497
00:26:09.079 --> 00:26:11.119
of streams and things like that. But I'm all about
498
00:26:11.640 --> 00:26:14.000
like the songwriters getting paid like you guys, you know,
499
00:26:14.039 --> 00:26:16.200
coming up with the music. Because when I watch something,
500
00:26:16.559 --> 00:26:18.880
whether it be these docuseries or things like that, or
501
00:26:18.920 --> 00:26:21.240
something like a force out there to or you know,
502
00:26:21.319 --> 00:26:23.680
one Person, one vote or in the Alabama solution, like
503
00:26:23.720 --> 00:26:28.119
the music to me draws me into a composition, a composition,
504
00:26:28.319 --> 00:26:31.599
or a docuseries or documentary or just a movie. Because
505
00:26:31.640 --> 00:26:33.799
I mean I went and saw you know, the Wicked
506
00:26:33.799 --> 00:26:35.480
one yesterday. My wife was like, let's go see it.
507
00:26:35.559 --> 00:26:36.839
Let's go see, let's go. Well, I was like, man,
508
00:26:36.839 --> 00:26:39.559
I'm just much into the music because I am the
509
00:26:39.599 --> 00:26:41.240
dialogue in the movie. And I kind of feel like,
510
00:26:41.559 --> 00:26:44.079
you know, the songwriters are just as important mark as
511
00:26:44.119 --> 00:26:46.160
the person is the recording the song for the movie.
512
00:26:47.799 --> 00:26:52.599
Definitely, the songwriters are very important. You know, this this
513
00:26:52.680 --> 00:26:56.720
is a revolution, you know, a digital revolution taking place overall,
514
00:26:57.359 --> 00:27:00.000
and so we, you know, as musicians, we can say,
515
00:27:00.200 --> 00:27:02.640
you know, take a look and see how it's happening
516
00:27:02.680 --> 00:27:05.799
to music. And the thing about it with with with
517
00:27:05.920 --> 00:27:11.799
the music is that using digital computers to create what
518
00:27:12.000 --> 00:27:15.440
humans do has been going on for quite some time.
519
00:27:15.960 --> 00:27:21.200
This programs like fruity Loops or even the Ableton where
520
00:27:21.359 --> 00:27:25.200
the computer, will you know, kick you unlimited drum loops
521
00:27:26.039 --> 00:27:28.640
until you find things that you like, or in the
522
00:27:28.720 --> 00:27:32.640
sense of fruity loops, you're just dragging computer made information
523
00:27:32.839 --> 00:27:36.200
into files and making records. So people have been producing
524
00:27:36.240 --> 00:27:38.960
records like that for quite some time now. The AI
525
00:27:39.079 --> 00:27:43.000
is taking another giant step forward to you know, create
526
00:27:43.039 --> 00:27:46.920
the entire song for people. For myself, the way I
527
00:27:47.039 --> 00:27:51.039
use it is to expand on my demos. So there's
528
00:27:51.039 --> 00:27:53.799
something you know, if I'm writing a song but I
529
00:27:53.839 --> 00:27:57.480
want a female singer to sing it, I can write
530
00:27:57.519 --> 00:27:59.480
my partner and I can upload it and just have
531
00:27:59.759 --> 00:28:04.279
just just changed the vocal to a female singer, or
532
00:28:04.359 --> 00:28:06.200
or any ideas that I may have.
533
00:28:06.240 --> 00:28:07.519
It helps to implement them.
534
00:28:07.920 --> 00:28:10.880
And so, you know, for my students, I teach at
535
00:28:11.000 --> 00:28:13.839
USC one day a week and I tell them, you know,
536
00:28:14.119 --> 00:28:15.839
some of them go like, you know, I'm not really
537
00:28:15.880 --> 00:28:17.359
into A. I don't want to use A I just
538
00:28:17.400 --> 00:28:20.920
want to just do my music. And I say, you know,
539
00:28:21.160 --> 00:28:25.559
just be aware of it because fourteen or thirteen or
540
00:28:25.640 --> 00:28:28.480
fourteen year old who's just starting to make music today,
541
00:28:29.160 --> 00:28:31.960
they're going to be using it to make their music.
542
00:28:32.640 --> 00:28:35.200
And so, you know, five to six years from now.
543
00:28:36.160 --> 00:28:40.240
Those when those people who started at thirteen become eighteen.
544
00:28:40.400 --> 00:28:42.559
They're the ones that people are going to be competing with.
545
00:28:42.599 --> 00:28:46.680
So you don't want to fall behind technically at any point.
546
00:28:46.799 --> 00:28:50.960
You know, this started for me with Napster because when
547
00:28:51.039 --> 00:28:55.960
Napster first came out, I was furious because this is
548
00:28:56.000 --> 00:28:59.079
a time period where we're making you know, an album
549
00:28:59.119 --> 00:29:01.680
has thirteen, twelve thirteen songs on it, and it costs
550
00:29:01.720 --> 00:29:05.920
twelve or thirteen dollars, So it's costing one dollar to
551
00:29:06.039 --> 00:29:10.000
listen to to have access to a person song, and
552
00:29:10.079 --> 00:29:12.359
so everybody had to pay that dollar. So if a
553
00:29:12.400 --> 00:29:15.839
million people wanted to listen to that song or have
554
00:29:15.960 --> 00:29:18.200
that song in their possession, then that would be a
555
00:29:18.279 --> 00:29:22.079
million dollars for people to split. And this is the
556
00:29:22.160 --> 00:29:24.680
interesting that I came into. So here we got Napster,
557
00:29:24.759 --> 00:29:27.079
They're like, okay, now it's free. You know, you can
558
00:29:27.119 --> 00:29:30.519
get your music files, just download whatever album. So I
559
00:29:30.559 --> 00:29:33.519
went to organize artists and talked to artists and producers
560
00:29:33.519 --> 00:29:36.920
about protesting this thing. It started out it was a
561
00:29:36.960 --> 00:29:39.720
little bit of heat, but that heat fizzled out pretty
562
00:29:39.759 --> 00:29:42.559
quickly and it was left down to myself and a
563
00:29:42.640 --> 00:29:45.519
lawyer who was a friend of mine who told me
564
00:29:45.599 --> 00:29:48.119
at that point said, you know, Mark, I'm gonna tell
565
00:29:48.119 --> 00:29:51.960
you about technology. You know, technology is like a steamroller.
566
00:29:52.599 --> 00:29:56.000
Either you're driving it or it's running over you. And
567
00:29:56.319 --> 00:30:00.119
from that point on I said, okay, you know, gave
568
00:30:00.279 --> 00:30:02.559
up and I would you know, left the fight against
569
00:30:02.640 --> 00:30:07.640
napster and just joined into the to the modern age.
570
00:30:07.960 --> 00:30:10.880
And so for me, whenever whenever something comes out new
571
00:30:11.000 --> 00:30:13.519
or I just see, okay, how can it be used,
572
00:30:13.920 --> 00:30:16.640
how can it be utilized? How can it be utilized ethically?
573
00:30:17.559 --> 00:30:20.440
I think in the case of the streaming services, it's
574
00:30:20.480 --> 00:30:23.720
a dangerous mechanism because they have the access to the
575
00:30:23.759 --> 00:30:27.839
most powerful playlist. So Spotify, I could first say, have
576
00:30:27.920 --> 00:30:30.680
a playlist, put Beyonce a song on there, put a
577
00:30:30.759 --> 00:30:33.200
Drake song on there, put a tail Swift song on
578
00:30:33.240 --> 00:30:36.119
their playlist, and then add two of their own AI
579
00:30:36.279 --> 00:30:39.599
songs onto that playlist, and then people are just going
580
00:30:39.640 --> 00:30:42.319
to be listening and streaming no songs. But then once
581
00:30:42.359 --> 00:30:47.599
that happens, if Spotify owns the AI artists, then they
582
00:30:47.599 --> 00:30:50.240
don't have to pay anybody, you know, for for that,
583
00:30:50.519 --> 00:30:53.240
and then that could grow. So what happens when it's
584
00:30:53.279 --> 00:30:56.400
five AI artists on the playlist and five real artists,
585
00:30:56.440 --> 00:30:59.680
and and then Spotify is just generating half of the
586
00:30:59.680 --> 00:31:02.920
fun to go right back into their pockets and not
587
00:31:03.000 --> 00:31:06.519
into the hands of working bard as a human beings.
588
00:31:06.519 --> 00:31:10.279
So there has to be some ethical questions answered. I
589
00:31:10.279 --> 00:31:12.640
think what I'm seeing in the future is there's going
590
00:31:12.680 --> 00:31:15.319
to be places that says there's no AI allowed in
591
00:31:15.480 --> 00:31:18.480
this place. So there'll be music places you can go to.
592
00:31:18.480 --> 00:31:22.559
What they'll say, you can't upload the AI song here,
593
00:31:22.839 --> 00:31:23.279
you can.
594
00:31:23.200 --> 00:31:25.319
Only have it here. But that day hasn't come yet.
595
00:31:25.359 --> 00:31:28.240
So now we're in the wild wild West power of AI.
596
00:31:28.920 --> 00:31:33.559
And so again I appreciate that now people who never
597
00:31:33.640 --> 00:31:36.279
got a chance to create in the past now have
598
00:31:36.359 --> 00:31:40.720
the opportunity to create. I can appreciate that, but I
599
00:31:40.920 --> 00:31:45.640
also see the dangers more artists and more songwriters be
600
00:31:45.799 --> 00:31:47.079
squeezed out of the preference.
601
00:31:47.960 --> 00:31:49.799
Yeah, they really summed it up there too, and like
602
00:31:49.799 --> 00:31:51.559
I said, it's definitely it's here to stay, and like
603
00:31:51.640 --> 00:31:53.480
so we use it for some aspects of being my
604
00:31:53.559 --> 00:31:55.720
show too at the same time, but I kind of
605
00:31:55.759 --> 00:31:57.240
draw the line with some things that you want to
606
00:31:57.279 --> 00:31:59.400
do yourself in the original creativity of it, and then
607
00:31:59.440 --> 00:32:01.920
of course the can back at it too. That can
608
00:32:01.960 --> 00:32:05.400
help you kind of you know, write some things out there,
609
00:32:05.480 --> 00:32:08.160
compose some things that you know, make sure it has
610
00:32:08.160 --> 00:32:10.160
a good frame of body work too. But as far
611
00:32:10.160 --> 00:32:12.039
as like machines and robots trying to sit there and
612
00:32:12.039 --> 00:32:13.880
do the work for me, I'd rather just put my hands,
613
00:32:14.279 --> 00:32:15.920
get it dirty, and like you said, you guys have
614
00:32:15.960 --> 00:32:18.640
done throughout your career, be able to do as much
615
00:32:18.640 --> 00:32:20.240
as you can yourself, and just kind of use it
616
00:32:20.359 --> 00:32:23.279
as as basically kind of as a scaffold there too.
617
00:32:23.279 --> 00:32:25.880
At the same time, so I think it's definitely here
618
00:32:25.880 --> 00:32:28.119
to stay. I want to ask you, Chris about you know,
619
00:32:28.160 --> 00:32:30.400
like I said, with the holidays coming up. I know Mark,
620
00:32:30.400 --> 00:32:32.279
we were talking about this a little bit off the earlier,
621
00:32:32.400 --> 00:32:34.880
just kind of looking forward to like the downtime, and
622
00:32:34.920 --> 00:32:36.960
you guys are so busy with all these great projects
623
00:32:37.000 --> 00:32:38.319
that are going on right now too. What are you
624
00:32:38.359 --> 00:32:41.000
most looking forward to, Chris, for the for the holidays
625
00:32:41.039 --> 00:32:42.279
as it spending time with family.
626
00:32:42.880 --> 00:32:43.599
Definitely. Yeah.
627
00:32:43.880 --> 00:32:45.359
Before I get to that, I just have one more
628
00:32:45.400 --> 00:32:48.720
thing about the AI stuff. The one really great thing
629
00:32:49.039 --> 00:32:52.039
that I'm noticing that AI does do though as I
630
00:32:52.079 --> 00:32:54.480
work with other artists and work with other musicians as
631
00:32:54.519 --> 00:32:59.400
this happen is it allows musicianship to shine, like like
632
00:33:00.960 --> 00:33:03.759
a music being able to pick up an instrument and
633
00:33:04.400 --> 00:33:07.720
play and practice your instrument and be great at it
634
00:33:07.759 --> 00:33:09.279
and be able to do it in a room with
635
00:33:09.359 --> 00:33:13.279
other people. Now it's like, oh, it's even better, you
636
00:33:13.519 --> 00:33:16.640
like even more, you know, super unicorn now right because
637
00:33:17.839 --> 00:33:20.599
people are just like, it's a crutch.
638
00:33:20.640 --> 00:33:23.200
If you use it as a crutch, you know, it's
639
00:33:23.200 --> 00:33:23.920
a problem.
640
00:33:24.240 --> 00:33:27.319
And so that part of it is really great because
641
00:33:28.240 --> 00:33:30.400
like it just allows.
642
00:33:29.960 --> 00:33:32.400
The crean, you know, the crean to rise, like if you.
643
00:33:32.400 --> 00:33:36.799
Can play, you're I feel like it's a It's still
644
00:33:36.960 --> 00:33:39.920
it's a huge asset to have, and AI only makes
645
00:33:39.960 --> 00:33:42.480
it more glaring to be able to.
646
00:33:43.160 --> 00:33:44.960
I mean, I just I've already seen it.
647
00:33:45.039 --> 00:33:48.119
I see I the sound of it, even the sound
648
00:33:48.160 --> 00:33:51.240
of what the AI pumps out. It's like, oh, it's already,
649
00:33:51.279 --> 00:33:52.920
I can hear it, you know what I mean. It's
650
00:33:52.960 --> 00:33:57.759
like it I know it's just getting started in a
651
00:33:57.759 --> 00:34:00.440
lot of but it already. To me when I hear
652
00:34:00.480 --> 00:34:03.720
it feels dated and I don't I don't understand. That's
653
00:34:03.759 --> 00:34:05.960
the best way that I can put it. Even when
654
00:34:06.000 --> 00:34:07.799
it pumps out and I love what it pumps out,
655
00:34:07.880 --> 00:34:11.239
I still feel like it's dated. I don't I don't
656
00:34:11.280 --> 00:34:14.480
know why that is. I'm in the minority on that probably,
657
00:34:14.559 --> 00:34:20.320
but anyways, Okay, So when I'm looking most forward to
658
00:34:20.840 --> 00:34:25.159
down time, I'm looking forward to relaxing. My wife and
659
00:34:25.199 --> 00:34:27.360
I kind of already started some of that relaxing over
660
00:34:27.400 --> 00:34:27.880
the weekend.
661
00:34:28.840 --> 00:34:30.519
We started our.
662
00:34:30.400 --> 00:34:35.760
Holidays early, and I'm just I'm looking forward to relaxing.
663
00:34:36.400 --> 00:34:38.559
I'm going to be playing a lot just for fun,
664
00:34:38.679 --> 00:34:43.400
Like I'm going to be practicing a lot, and and
665
00:34:43.400 --> 00:34:47.000
and just and while we in the studio every day
666
00:34:47.360 --> 00:34:49.960
during the holidays, but just for me, I just have
667
00:34:50.079 --> 00:34:52.360
some songs that I'm working on and and some other
668
00:34:52.440 --> 00:34:55.280
non music music related projects that like, I really I
669
00:34:55.320 --> 00:34:57.800
want to sit down and focus on and and have
670
00:34:57.920 --> 00:35:01.840
fun with. And I'm not we're not traveling this year.
671
00:35:01.880 --> 00:35:04.079
A lot of times we travel, but we're staying home
672
00:35:04.280 --> 00:35:10.000
and I'm going to just eat and relax and enjoy
673
00:35:10.000 --> 00:35:12.119
each other's company, no doubt.
674
00:35:12.159 --> 00:35:14.000
I think that's always a fun time mark for you.
675
00:35:14.039 --> 00:35:15.400
And we were telling before the show a little bit
676
00:35:15.440 --> 00:35:17.159
of that R and R because we work so much
677
00:35:17.280 --> 00:35:18.960
we get carried away. It's hard to find that balance
678
00:35:19.000 --> 00:35:21.079
between work life and family life.
679
00:35:20.920 --> 00:35:23.760
Right, Yes, indeed, yes, indeed, that's why I have of
680
00:35:23.840 --> 00:35:26.800
It's always good, a good opportunity to catch up with
681
00:35:26.880 --> 00:35:30.519
family and and just put you know, get in touch
682
00:35:30.519 --> 00:35:33.079
with two roots and the things that are the most
683
00:35:33.079 --> 00:35:36.880
important in life. And I'm always look forward to that time.
684
00:35:38.119 --> 00:35:40.960
I'll tell you what these are fantastic projects. One that
685
00:35:40.960 --> 00:35:42.480
I'm already into a couple of more I got to
686
00:35:42.480 --> 00:35:45.039
get into. It's Power Book four Force, part of the
687
00:35:45.079 --> 00:35:48.880
Power franchise, got over one point six billion hours viewed
688
00:35:48.880 --> 00:35:51.679
globally there on Stars of course, the LA Law reboot pilot,
689
00:35:51.719 --> 00:35:55.159
the political documentary One Person, One Vote in hbos the
690
00:35:55.199 --> 00:35:58.960
Alabama Solution out there too, which premiered to critical acclaim
691
00:35:58.960 --> 00:36:01.320
there too at that Sundawn Film Festival. You guys can
692
00:36:01.360 --> 00:36:03.880
check out all these great projects out there too, across
693
00:36:03.960 --> 00:36:07.119
your streaming platforms. Always great to catch up with two
694
00:36:07.119 --> 00:36:09.159
of the best, Mark Bats and Chris Handleb out there.
695
00:36:09.159 --> 00:36:09.320
Guys.
696
00:36:09.360 --> 00:36:11.719
Appreciate you being with us, and happy holidays to you
697
00:36:12.159 --> 00:36:14.800
and your family, and looking forward to many more great
698
00:36:14.800 --> 00:36:17.239
things happening in the careers that you guys, already have
699
00:36:17.280 --> 00:36:19.360
out there Hall of Fame careers and mean more great
700
00:36:19.360 --> 00:36:19.800
things coming.
701
00:36:19.840 --> 00:36:20.880
We appreciate you so much.
702
00:36:21.320 --> 00:36:23.880
Thanks Brandon A, thank you so much, Brandon.
703
00:36:23.920 --> 00:36:25.000
It was great to be on that.
704
00:36:25.559 --> 00:36:27.440
Yeah, so you got it, Chris Hannah, but Mark Batson
705
00:36:27.480 --> 00:36:29.239
out there too, and of course more great artists coming
706
00:36:29.320 --> 00:36:31.400
up over the next few weeks here too. Happy holidays
707
00:36:31.440 --> 00:36:34.440
to everybody out there too. From the Backstage Past KYB
708
00:36:34.559 --> 00:36:37.519
in ninety eight point one, your Bay Area broadcasting network
709
00:36:37.599 --> 00:36:41.679
TCHWN dot orgonpowered by the Sports Guys Podcast dot com,
710
00:36:41.679 --> 00:36:44.000
now top search on iHeartRadio podcast.
711
00:36:44.079 --> 00:36:45.760
We'll see you soon, God blessed, take care.
712
00:36:46.199 --> 00:36:48.360
Hey all, this is Chanler Marie and you're listening to
713
00:36:48.400 --> 00:36:52.599
the award nominated Backstage Pass on KYBN ninety eight point one,
714
00:36:52.840 --> 00:36:55.559
your Bay Area broadcasting network. You can listen to on
715
00:36:55.639 --> 00:37:00.000
THCHWN dot org and on iHeartRadio podcasts in any time.
716
00:37:00.000 --> 00:37:02.519
I'm at the Sports Guys Podcast dot com.