WEBVTT
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00:00:08.480Welcome to What Makes Us.
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00:00:18.960This is a podcast exploring and how we develop as people through our experiences and connections between individuals, with groups, and amongst society.
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00:00:23.839We'll be bringing on guests to discuss how they've come to be who they are.
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00:00:28.559And along the way, we may end up learning something about ourselves.
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00:00:34.159So please sit back and enjoy your listening to What Makes Us.
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00:00:39.600Welcome to What Makes Us.
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00:00:44.320I'm your host, Brian Hooks, and today I have an amazing guest with me.
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00:00:46.640I'm really excited for this conversation.
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00:00:52.399Today's topic is What Makes Us Start Again at 50?
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00:00:53.840I'm really excited for this.
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00:00:59.039Not because I'm close to 50, I have to say that, even though I am somewhat close to 50.
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00:01:02.320But I think this is such a great conversation.
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00:01:06.640And today with me, I have a really good friend of mine, fellow coach, Gitika.
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00:01:13.840She's going to introduce herself and we are going to uh uh have a really great conversation.
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00:01:16.400So, Giteka, can you please talk to us?
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00:01:23.359Say hello to everyone, and and tell us a little bit about yourself and what made you interested in this topic.
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00:01:25.200Absolutely, Brian.
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00:01:27.200Thank you so much for having me over.
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00:01:29.040And hello, everyone.
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00:01:34.799Uh, super excited to be a part of this conversation on what makes us.
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00:01:42.640So, uh, talking about me, I'm a coach for women in transition.
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00:02:01.040When I say so, what I mean is that uh at different stages of life, women go through various types of transitions, starting from transition and then their careers, then the motherhood, and then kids walking away, and then retirement.
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00:02:08.800And at each phase of life, they they would want to reinvent themselves.
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00:02:15.759They would want to understand what next, what is the renewed purpose of my life?
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00:02:20.560So that is where this thought of starting again came up.
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00:02:26.879You know, so um sometimes we feel that okay, maybe this is it.
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00:02:28.560Now what next?
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00:02:30.400So that what next?
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00:02:51.199So when we say starting again, it's not like we are ending some something and starting something new, it's more of like continuing what you are and picking up something interesting that gives you a renewed thought, a renewed purpose to live further.
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00:02:57.439So that is where this this whole idea of uh starting again came up.
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00:02:58.560Yeah.
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00:03:07.360I I I love this because I mean we're talking about women today, but and this also significantly impacts all of us, even men, right?
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00:03:12.240Like um as we go through these transitions, but you work specifically for women, right?
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00:03:15.520So that so the balance is that to a certain degree.
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00:03:24.319Um but you know, I I think it's so true that there's so many different stages in our life, right?
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00:03:32.159And and for women, uh, especially women, and I've been around women of color for most of my life, particularly in the US.
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00:03:34.400And it is a very, it's difficult.
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00:03:46.319It's tough being a black one, I'll just say that it is very difficult to be a black woman in the US because it is one of the identities that gets just dumped on, uh, truthfully.
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00:03:52.479And just for women and then you go to the bigger, broader context, women in society in general.
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00:03:59.360So I I one of the reasons why I love this conversation is because it's such a such an important piece.
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00:04:02.960And and I am a believer, you know, women rule the world.
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00:04:07.919Uh, and so I'm like, I uh why not get on the good side?
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00:04:11.759I love for you to say that.
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00:04:16.480Starting 50, right?
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00:04:22.800So what uh so what makes it you know the age such an important space in this in this starting again?
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00:04:24.319And how about we start there?
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00:04:27.360Interesting question, Brian.
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00:04:31.360So um I would come from my experience.
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00:04:38.399Yeah, so when I turned 50, I really felt that some something changed within.
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00:04:51.040So by 50, most of us, I'm not saying all, but most of us are uh kind of done with the uh with the responsibility of bringing up children.
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00:04:59.680Because most of us have their children either in high school or they are already in college by the time we are 50, right?
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00:05:05.519So suddenly there is a lot of void in our lives.
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00:05:14.399Because as mothers, as women, our whole world revolves around family, around kids.
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00:05:24.079Whether we are professionally involved in our work or not, whether we are a housemaker or a professional, this is the this is a truth, right?
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00:05:37.040So when uh the kids walk away, and when we have so much more time to ourselves, that is when this question once again arrives in our minds that what now?
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00:05:45.279What should I begin now to keep myself productively occupied and happy and content, you know?
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00:05:50.480So that is where this number 50 becomes very important.
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00:05:52.319That makes sense.
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00:05:58.399I and I'm wondering if that's in a you know, if you put this in the Indy in the Indian context, right?
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00:06:05.920Because I guess I know a lot of 50 or women over 50 that specifically dealt with career.
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00:06:11.920Like their main focus was career, and family was there, but not necessarily kids, right?
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00:06:20.160They were more focused on the career and then with their significant other, but there was a decision made for not to have kids.
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00:06:22.560But that 50 is still there, right?
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00:06:24.480You still hit that model, Mark.
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00:06:36.079Um and think thinking about India specifically, you know, because it's such a cultural, you know, family is such a huge part of that collective understanding, right?
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00:06:42.480Like it's pretty strong of you get married, there should be a kid one or two years after that.
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00:06:57.199Um in my old relationship, you know, me and my wife, we got married, and we decided to to focus on career, and we decided to travel and we did stuff together before we had our kid.
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00:07:00.639So it was like nine years later, then we had our kid.
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00:07:04.959Um and I think that was not, there weren't a lot of happy people in our family.
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00:07:09.360We were getting harassed pretty, pretty strongly about having a kid.
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00:07:12.160But that was just a decision that we were making.
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00:07:24.160So, you know, my daughter now was six, and so when I hit 58, oh, when she starts going to college, I'm gonna be like, okay, what's what's I need to already be thinking about that third or fourth stage of my life.
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00:07:35.600Um But yeah, there is that, I I do understand that sense of like starting over and and trying to figure out what your identity is changing to, right?
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00:07:55.920Because now if the if the parent, if the kid's gone and you've been, you know, your number one, number two priority has always been your kid, and now they are gone and living their lives, um trying to figure out what you want to do is gonna be really huge.
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00:07:59.439So so what does that pro you know, what does that process look like?
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00:08:03.120Have you seen for yourself and and for other folks, for other women?
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00:08:05.120What does that process look like?
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00:08:22.800So, Brent, before that, let me also touch upon the fact that um women who are touching 50 and uh who are not empty nesters uh specifically or who are still having the kids who are small or not having kids also.
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00:08:45.519So uh, you know, there is a phase in women's life which is when the hormonal changes are happening in the body, and that is when you know, uh, most of us when we are around 45 to 55, is when that huge hormonal changes happen in our body.
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00:08:55.440And I feel I I very deeply feel that these hormonal changes bring a similar energy back to us.
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00:09:10.480Um, if we look at our lives maybe 30, 40 years back when we were teenagers, you know, that time also when we were hitting teenage, that time also a lot of hormonal changes were happening, you know.
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00:09:10.799Right.
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00:09:26.720So I I very uh you know strongly feel that the life comes at a full circle kind of a thing in terms of our bodily changes, our thought-related changes when we are hitting 50 around that line.
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00:09:36.080And um you remember when we were teenagers, the kind of energy we had, the kind of friendships we had, the kind of fun we used to have.
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00:09:46.159At 50, again, the the mind and body uh get aligned to that kind of need to have in life.
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00:09:54.639I'm not sure what exactly medically happens there, why this this kind of a feeling comes up, but it actually comes up.
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00:10:02.399I I so coming to the next question that you asked and linking it there, um, my observation about other women.
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00:10:12.879So a lot of women that I meet who are in this age bracket, I see a similar energy in that in them also.
00:10:13.120 -->
00:10:21.600Like the few of us who are very, very conscious about speaking out, about doing something, about taking a decision.
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00:10:25.919Suddenly, around 50, we are like, let it be, you know.
00:10:26.080 -->
00:10:28.399I mean, we'll see what happens.
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00:10:33.519We are better risk takers once again when we are around 50.
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00:10:39.600This is this is what I have observed in my friends, in myself, and in my clients whom I coach.
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00:10:50.879There is uh another urge to be what you are rather than playing lots of roles that you have been playing all these years.
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00:10:54.000That's interesting.
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00:11:03.759Is that like because the roles are more associated with others versus being associated with yourself, right?
00:11:03.840 -->
00:11:06.799Like it's it's in uh how do I say this?
00:11:07.039 -->
00:11:08.559I don't know if I said this right, right?
00:11:08.639 -->
00:11:15.759Like your your role as a mother is is being there for somebody else, right?
00:11:16.000 -->
00:11:23.200Absolutely what they need, but now it's now I I can focus on myself, right?
00:11:23.519 -->
00:11:25.120Absolutely, I spend the time.
00:11:25.279 -->
00:11:29.200So that energy actually shifts around around 50.
00:11:29.279 -->
00:11:31.039And I I think that totally makes sense.
00:11:31.279 -->
00:11:32.399Yeah, it totally makes sense.
00:11:32.879 -->
00:11:35.600Um and and very important, right?
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00:11:48.080I you know, identity, and as we are trying to figure out ourselves, I think sometimes we get into this space of like, I this is who I am, and there's no change that's gonna happen.
00:11:48.240 -->
00:11:50.720But then all of a sudden, right?
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00:12:00.879This huge change, and you're not just talking like mentally, but emotionally and and you know, physically, like your hormone shifting.
00:12:01.039 -->
00:12:12.720That's a huge change, and it can it changes not only your your physical chemistry, but also that mental chemistry and moves things around.
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00:12:17.279Uh and uh I I you know I've seen it with my mother.
00:12:17.519 -->
00:12:23.759Um, I didn't see it with my grandma, or probably didn't recognize it with my grandma when she went through it.
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00:12:27.440I probably didn't recognize it, but I definitely saw it with my mom.
00:12:28.000 -->
00:12:32.879And and I was uh as a bystander, right?
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00:12:36.159That was a harrowing time of my life.
00:12:36.399 -->
00:12:42.080Um I could I didn't know what to say to not get killed.
00:12:44.000 -->
00:12:54.240There were many moments that I died, uh, because I did something or said something that usually would would kind of almost get just like whatever.
00:12:54.559 -->
00:12:59.039But in that time and place, that was not the time and place.
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00:13:10.559It's uh yeah, so you know, as you're like seeing this happen, uh it wasn't yeah, as I saw it, and I experienced it from the outside.
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00:13:14.639Um, it can be very challenging.
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00:13:16.159Very challenging.
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00:13:29.679Um yeah, on the reverse side of that, uh my father, uh for interesting women we call it menopause, men we call it midlife crisis.
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00:13:34.240Maybe they are interlinked somewhere.
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00:13:36.559I I I totally believe they're interlinked.
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00:13:43.840I am right, I don't know the science of it, but you know, for women, it's like they're very scientific.
00:13:43.919 -->
00:13:47.440They're your hormones have changed, their body is changing.
00:13:47.600 -->
00:13:50.799For men, it almost feels like they it's just a mental aspect.
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00:14:02.000Their egos are gone haywire, they're you know, they're making decisions that you'd be like, you you made that decision when you're like a teenager, like you said, right?
00:14:02.080 -->
00:14:03.679Like that's a teenager decision.
00:14:03.919 -->
00:14:06.000Like, why would you make that choice?
00:14:06.320 -->
00:14:17.919Um, as I watched both my parents go through that that time aspect of their lives, um I feel like my mom handled it with a lot more grace than my dad did.
00:14:18.080 -->
00:14:21.840I think my dad was ready for it, uh, truthfully.
00:14:22.000 -->
00:14:28.559Um and I think that's a that's a really I I'm wondering, like, how do you how do you prepare for something like that?
00:14:28.720 -->
00:14:33.759You know, as people are in that 40, 45, and they know, right?
00:14:33.840 -->
00:14:38.960You can see your kids growing, you you're you're accelerating that they're gonna be out of your house soon.
00:14:39.200 -->
00:14:45.120Um yeah, but then then it happens and you're kind of at a loss, right?
00:14:45.279 -->
00:14:47.759It's like so like how do we prepare for please?
00:14:48.080 -->
00:14:50.799I'm I'm actually asking for myself as well here, right?
00:14:50.879 -->
00:14:52.960Like I'm about to be I'm gonna be 50 in five years.
00:14:53.120 -->
00:14:57.840I'm like, how do I prepare myself for these changes that are coming on, potentially?
00:15:49.139 -->
00:15:50.899So very important, Brian.
00:15:51.060 -->
00:15:59.700Um, we cannot suddenly make a shift in our life uh on the day when we leave the the kid in college.
00:15:59.940 -->
00:16:20.899It will be too late for us to really think of anything specific at that moment because we are going through a lot of emotional changes at that time, not only because uh the kid is leaving, but also like we just discussed that our bodies are also changing at that time.
00:16:21.060 -->
00:16:25.860So there's a lot happening together at that age bracket.
00:16:26.180 -->
00:16:35.460So it's a good idea to start looking at it as a long-term vision at least seven, eight years in advance.
00:16:36.740 -->
00:16:54.100This is what I always uh uh tell my clients also when we are having this kind of discussion, that when your child is in teenage, the moment you feel that the child is needing his or her her own space now.
00:16:54.980 -->
00:17:07.859You know, which which starts happening a little earlier now as compared to when we were teenagers, uh, probably around 11, 12 years, old kids also start needing their own spaces now.
00:17:08.980 -->
00:17:18.740So that is a that is the first signal for us to realize that the kid is now going to need us less and less by the passing year.
00:17:20.180 -->
00:17:24.899And you know, don't we raise our kids to be independent?
00:17:25.619 -->
00:17:31.460We raise them to be like that, but the hardest part is to accept that they don't need us anymore.
00:17:32.740 -->
00:17:47.220So we have to prepare ourselves for that, that we are making them uh individuals who are going to be taking care of their lives on their own at one point in time, and this is the first step they are taking now.
00:17:47.379 -->
00:18:04.980So better we also start spending time for ourselves, be with ourselves, so that we are prepared to be individual again, to be back to ourselves again, to be back to Gitika and Brian again when the kid is in college.
00:18:05.299 -->
00:18:13.059And what that is going to be is again depending on how do you see yourself 10 years from here?
00:18:13.460 -->
00:18:16.259What do you see yourself doing 10 years from now?
00:18:17.380 -->
00:18:25.059So that vision, one needs to really sit down, think about it, and create and start taking those steps towards that.
00:18:26.339 -->
00:18:27.860I hope this helps.
00:18:28.420 -->
00:18:29.779No, no, no, I think it does.
00:18:29.940 -->
00:18:30.500I think it does.
00:18:30.579 -->
00:18:38.259It's like a you have to reimagine and and and and reconnect, right?
00:18:38.339 -->
00:18:38.740You said it.
00:18:38.819 -->
00:18:41.860You have to reconnect with yourself, yes, right?
00:18:42.099 -->
00:18:45.620And and also, you know, your body is different from when you were young.
00:18:45.779 -->
00:18:50.099There's things that you did younger that you you can't do anymore.
00:18:50.339 -->
00:18:53.140Um it makes sense to in that reconnect.
00:18:53.220 -->
00:19:03.220There is also that space of like rediscovery or like discovery of what's that new thing that you love to do, or like you want to to do on your own.
00:19:03.460 -->
00:19:05.700Uh yes, yes, yeah, yeah.
00:19:06.019 -->
00:19:36.339And you know, uh, you are you are going to do that in the middle of all the chaos when the kids it's is still with you, when the kid is still wanting your attention, and you need to uh kind of uh uh uh uh have all the duties of being a parent or vice versa, whatever, you know, if you are talking about your work responsibilities, all that is still happening, but still you have to take out time to actually start reconnecting with yourself.
00:19:36.660 -->
00:19:44.420No, no, that you know, I was as you're talking about it, uh what came to my mind was uh managing these transitions, right?
00:19:44.579 -->
00:19:49.940They because it's you have time to prepare, the event happens, right?
00:19:50.099 -->
00:19:51.140The thing happens.
00:19:51.380 -->
00:19:54.420How do you respond to that thing?
00:19:54.579 -->
00:20:15.140If you're not prepared, you know, that emotion, that emotion and and fluctuations may be a lot stronger than you are expecting, which will then happen or you know, your response is gonna be, you know, maybe not what you intended it to be, maybe a little bit more stronger, um, which kind of throws everything off, right?
00:20:15.299 -->
00:20:17.620Like that's what that's what was coming to my mind.
00:20:17.860 -->
00:20:21.140I think it was a really good transition that my mom and dad did.
00:20:21.620 -->
00:20:38.259As I was leaving, I and not just leaving college, but just like our relationship transition from being like the high school kid to then, you know, being able to make decisions, you know, relatively make decisions on my own.
00:20:38.579 -->
00:20:47.299And it went from my parents telling me what to do to kind of advising me on what they think I should do.
00:20:47.539 -->
00:20:57.299And that was a huge transition because I had other friends that their parents were like still like expecting them to do exactly what they're saying.
00:20:57.460 -->
00:20:59.620Um, just on kind of like trivial things.
00:20:59.700 -->
00:21:01.059It wasn't even big stuff.
00:21:01.220 -->
00:21:08.259Um but for my mom and dad, they really let me just like make the choice.
00:21:08.500 -->
00:21:12.980And then if I had questions, they'd be like, Yeah, come talk to me about it.
00:21:13.620 -->
00:21:24.339And it it shifted my relationship with him to a more I don't know, I would I would say we're like, we're friends.
00:21:24.579 -->
00:21:36.019Like we're really you know, like that's like we're that's my parents, but I I go to them because I have confidence in what they're gonna tell me, but it's not necessarily saying that I have to do what they tell me.
00:21:36.259 -->
00:21:47.299I know they're gonna let me make the decision, but they're giving me information or perspective that I hadn't that I didn't necessarily know or hadn't, you know, don't have the experience with.
00:21:47.460 -->
00:21:49.620And then they're sharing that experience.
00:21:49.860 -->
00:21:55.620And so I feel like that was a really nice transition that I hope I get to have with my kids.
00:21:55.860 -->
00:21:58.339That's one of my things that I hope to have with my own kid.
00:21:58.579 -->
00:22:06.579Because I I it was it's very worthwhile for me to be like, I can go to them and not feel like I'm gonna get you know scolded for doing something.
00:22:06.660 -->
00:22:17.620I mean, and I get scolded, but it still is that space of respect in uh for me as an adult and then for them as my as my parent.
00:22:18.500 -->
00:22:19.140True, true.
00:22:19.380 -->
00:22:31.940So if you if you look at it from their perspective now, that is when you will be able to realize that it was a transition for them and how they made a change in their way of conversation with their kid.
00:22:32.259 -->
00:22:32.900Right.
00:22:33.220 -->
00:22:33.539Right?
00:22:33.779 -->
00:22:40.660So that now today you feel that what they did was the perfect thing for you at that age.
00:22:41.220 -->
00:22:48.740So that that's the transition that we are talking about, that which happens around that age when we are touching 15, you're in 50, 55, 45.
00:22:49.299 -->
00:22:49.779You know?
00:22:50.019 -->
00:22:58.259So these are emotional transitions, also a lot of emotional transition for people who are touching that age in various ways.
00:22:58.339 -->
00:23:00.339Like one example you only gave, just now.
00:23:01.059 -->
00:23:01.860Yeah, yeah.
00:23:02.099 -->
00:23:06.180It's kind of like let the truly let the let the bird fly, right?
00:23:06.259 -->
00:23:08.660Like they're out of the nest, let them fly.
00:23:08.900 -->
00:23:12.180Like, why kind of hold them onto a leaf?
00:23:12.339 -->
00:23:13.299Like, let it go.
00:23:13.460 -->
00:23:14.579Uh yes.
00:23:14.900 -->
00:23:20.819And then you can feel that sense of like they they have now space for something else, right?
00:23:20.900 -->
00:23:22.980Like, I don't need to worry about my kid.
00:23:23.220 -->
00:23:25.620They that my kid is seems to be doing well.
00:23:25.940 -->
00:23:27.940So I have space for something.
00:23:28.019 -->
00:23:29.620I can fill that with something I want.
00:23:30.339 -->
00:23:30.579Yes.
00:23:31.059 -->
00:23:33.059And I did see that happen several times.
00:23:33.299 -->
00:23:34.500I'm like, oh, okay.
00:23:34.579 -->
00:23:38.180So this is she doesn't have to worry about me anymore.
00:23:38.579 -->
00:23:38.980So yeah.
00:23:40.180 -->
00:23:45.779But with the assurance that your house is there, you can come back.
00:23:45.940 -->
00:23:51.460The bird can come back to the nest whenever and in whatever situation they want.
00:23:51.940 -->
00:23:52.259Yeah.
00:23:52.420 -->
00:23:52.579Yeah.
00:23:52.740 -->
00:23:55.380I think I think that's yeah, the nesting part, right?
00:23:55.460 -->
00:23:56.740Like that's the nesting part.
00:23:57.299 -->
00:24:00.900So there was something you brought up earlier that I kind of wanted to talk about.
00:24:01.059 -->
00:24:04.099Um the relationships with friends.
00:24:04.420 -->
00:24:09.860Like as people are transitioning, because it can be really isolating.
00:24:10.099 -->
00:24:18.099Um as especially for women, as they are going through something that is very personal, um, it can be very isolating.
00:24:18.420 -->
00:24:23.220And so, you know, relationship with the people around you, with your friends and stuff like that.
00:24:23.380 -->
00:24:24.579And you said that it changes.
00:24:24.660 -->
00:24:30.900So I'm kind of intrigued, like, what is this change that happens around with friends around 50 as well?
00:24:32.500 -->
00:24:33.940I feel a lot.
00:24:34.420 -->
00:24:42.420Again, depending on how open you are to change, you know, I would not say that everyone has the same kind of thought process.
00:24:42.579 -->
00:24:44.339Everyone let let that be.
00:24:44.579 -->
00:24:49.539Let you have to let yourself be to be able to experience that.
00:24:49.860 -->
00:25:04.339But if if I'm talking about friends, I'm talking about friends who are in my similar age bracket, who are going through similar kinds of transitions, similar kind of changes in their bodies, emotionally, mentally, everything.
00:25:04.660 -->
00:25:09.700So I feel there is again a very, very beautiful connect between us.
00:25:09.860 -->
00:25:18.180Once again, which was missing for last say last 20, 25 years when we were busy doing lots of other things.
00:25:18.420 -->
00:25:20.740So, not that we are not playing our roles.
00:25:20.980 -->
00:25:29.860We are still playing the roles that we were playing, but probably there is a shift in the way we put ourselves in that role.
00:25:31.460 -->
00:25:35.220And the priorities have shifted again.
00:25:35.380 -->
00:25:42.259Like, you know, maybe if I put my family first, then my career, then my finances, and then friends.
00:25:42.500 -->
00:25:48.579Probably the friends have climbed the ladder a little higher.
00:25:49.299 -->
00:26:02.500You know, family still remains at the topmost priority, but friends also become much more important than they were in the last 20-25 years when we were struggling to do so much in our life.
00:26:02.819 -->
00:26:12.579And everyone is again wanting to meet, wanting to celebrate, go for coffee dates, go for drinks, you know, uh, have sleepovers, you know.
00:26:12.819 -->
00:26:21.059We we had uh, I tell you, as a kid, um for slumber parties was not a very big thing for us.
00:26:21.220 -->
00:26:23.380I mean, we hardly must have done that.
00:26:23.700 -->
00:26:26.579We did it for our kids, but not for us.
00:26:26.819 -->
00:26:31.860But now at 4550, we are doing slumber parties, you know.
00:26:35.380 -->
00:26:37.059We stay awake the whole night.
00:26:37.220 -->
00:26:39.940We do the same things that our teenagers used to do.
00:26:40.019 -->
00:26:42.420And we used to ask in the morning, did you sleep?
00:26:42.579 -->
00:26:43.620Did you get some sleep?
00:26:43.779 -->
00:26:45.539Did you uh did you eat something?
00:26:45.620 -->
00:26:48.180You know, what were you doing the whole night?
00:26:48.259 -->
00:26:53.380And now we are doing the same things, so it's super fun, I tell you.
00:26:53.860 -->
00:26:58.500You know, we have the same kind of enthusiasm all over again.
00:27:00.980 -->
00:27:10.180So it's not necessarily reliving the past, but it's enjoying where you are at in that moment with the people around you, right?
00:27:10.420 -->
00:27:12.740Because it's there's so much richness with that.
00:27:13.940 -->
00:27:14.740Yes, yes.
00:27:14.900 -->
00:27:17.140The friends are also not the same, you know.
00:27:17.380 -->
00:27:18.660Friends have changed.
00:27:18.900 -->
00:27:25.700This is a new set of friends, but um we we have the same kind of fun we used to have in our college days.
00:27:26.019 -->
00:27:27.860Yeah, no, totally, totally.
00:27:28.740 -->
00:27:31.620I'm just thinking about adult slumber parties.
00:27:33.299 -->
00:27:42.819I mean, like, we I don't know if we call them slumber parties, but I definitely remember all night staying up, chatting away, and just thinking about like, what are we gonna do tomorrow?
00:27:44.420 -->
00:27:54.579That well, you know what that you know it makes sense that you see so many of the groups of women coming together and doing trips, right?
00:27:54.900 -->
00:27:57.299Going, going, doing the trips together.
00:27:57.460 -->
00:27:58.819Um girl time.
00:27:58.900 -->
00:27:59.940I call that girl time.
00:28:00.099 -->
00:28:00.819That's girl time.
00:28:00.900 -->
00:28:01.860You gonna do girl time?
00:28:02.019 -->
00:28:02.740Okay, fantastic.
00:28:02.819 -->
00:28:03.940Do your girl time, right?
00:28:04.099 -->
00:28:06.900Yes, um, because that's needed, right?
00:28:07.299 -->
00:28:11.299When you know, I have to say, as a man, I'm gonna drive my wife crazy.
00:28:11.700 -->
00:28:16.579I know I'm a component of craziness for my wife.
00:28:16.900 -->
00:28:21.220Um, and you and I know my daughter is a component of craziness.
00:28:21.299 -->
00:28:22.900It's like you gotta get away.
00:28:23.059 -->
00:28:25.860Uh, you gotta get some time away from us.
00:28:26.099 -->
00:28:34.180Uh and and how that is, is sometimes that's with others, and sometimes that's by yourself, and trying to find that that that peace.
00:28:34.339 -->
00:28:42.019So it makes sense that your relationships also grow and evolve and transform as you as you go through that too.
00:28:42.339 -->
00:28:43.220Yeah, yeah.
00:28:43.380 -->
00:28:43.860Yeah.
00:28:44.420 -->
00:29:00.420So if I may add another thing there, when you since you talked about the travel and the trips, so you know, at this age, I feel you also start reconnecting with yourself in a in a very uh deep manner, not only with friends.
00:29:00.579 -->
00:29:13.539So trips like not necessarily girls' trips, but even solo trips, which is a uh which is uh something which is you know uh getting very very popular these days, you going away.
00:29:13.700 -->
00:29:20.019So in Indian context, especially solo trips were never that popular up till now.
00:29:20.660 -->
00:29:29.940But now my daughter went on a solo trip last year at uh at the age of 24, and we were like, wow, I mean, you know, good that you are doing that.
00:29:30.339 -->
00:29:31.059Way to go, yeah.
00:29:31.380 -->
00:29:38.259But but uh this year uh uh in 2025, I mean last year, I went on my first solo trip.
00:29:39.059 -->
00:29:41.299Nice, so I I I could do that.
00:29:41.380 -->
00:29:50.579I I feel happy that I could do that, and I'm happy that my family saw that kind of put that kind of trust in me that I was able to do that.
00:29:50.900 -->
00:29:53.539Because so it it again came from me.
00:29:53.620 -->
00:30:00.740I mean, they wouldn't uh come up and tell that uh you are confident enough to go on a solo trip, you know.
00:30:00.900 -->
00:30:12.819They would never be able to just that, but it is me who has to actually come forward and say what I like, what I don't like, what I want to do, what I don't want to do.
00:30:13.059 -->
00:30:22.099So now what I what the point that I'm trying to bring up is that it is important for us as women to speak up.
00:30:22.500 -->
00:30:32.420And this this this energy, this confidence and this this freedom of speaking our voices again also enhances at this age.
00:30:32.500 -->
00:30:33.860This is what I have felt.
00:30:34.980 -->
00:30:48.819Again, like you you gave your mom's example that you know she probably we become more vocal, we feel we feel more confident about speaking our hearts out all over again.
00:30:49.059 -->
00:30:56.099Like as a teenager, maybe I would have told my mom or my dad that no, this is how I want it, and I want to do this.
00:30:56.420 -->
00:31:00.740And then whatever the consequences were, that was another part of the story.
00:31:01.059 -->
00:31:05.140But now again, we are wanting to do that, and we are able to do that.
00:31:05.299 -->
00:31:07.460That's the beautiful part of it.
00:31:07.779 -->
00:31:08.259Yeah.
00:31:08.579 -->
00:31:17.140No, I I love that full circle piece of, you know, I think as a as a teenager, you're doing it because it's you want to experience.
00:31:17.380 -->
00:31:24.500As a as an adult, as an older, as you're 50 or 50 young, you have the experience and you know what you want, right?
00:31:24.579 -->
00:31:31.779Like that you come into it with a different, like I I know exactly what I want because I've experienced it.
00:31:31.860 -->
00:31:33.700And so I want these key things.
00:31:34.019 -->
00:31:36.660And then a little bit of new mixed in there, right?
00:31:37.460 -->
00:31:38.740Yeah, that's awesome.
00:31:39.460 -->
00:31:43.460So something, and this is kind of like a big picture deal here.
00:31:43.940 -->
00:31:52.819When we think about career for women at 50, I think it gets like there's a lot of murkiness with that, right?
00:31:53.059 -->
00:31:56.019Because you have the glass ceiling, right?
00:31:56.180 -->
00:31:59.059Like, you're you know, where are you in your career?
00:31:59.140 -->
00:32:00.339What are you doing in your career?
00:32:00.500 -->
00:32:03.940Have you reached the space that you want to in your career?
00:32:04.099 -->
00:32:05.940Um, have you made those goals?
00:32:06.019 -->
00:32:08.099You know, have you have you made it?
00:32:08.339 -->
00:32:12.900Uh, but then there's also that limit because of society and stuff.
00:32:13.140 -->
00:32:15.860How do you how is that negotiated?
00:32:16.019 -->
00:32:32.660I feel like it's not, it's it's like more like a negotiation because, you know, unfortunately our society as a patriarchal society has put a limitation on how women, where women can be and how they can grow and and what they can do.
00:32:32.819 -->
00:32:34.420I think that's breaking down totally.
00:32:34.579 -->
00:32:41.860I think you know, there's more opportunities, and I and I and I say that in the in truly in the guys of like leadership, right?
00:32:41.940 -->
00:32:51.539Like if you look at as that as an example where your global leadership is, you know, there's not enough women that are on that stage of global leadership.
00:32:51.700 -->
00:32:53.700But it's significantly growing.
00:32:53.860 -->
00:32:59.220There's more women that are prime ministers that are running, you know, running huge businesses.
00:32:59.460 -->
00:33:07.779Think about the uh the EU, European Union, a woman is is leading that organization, there's women leading countries.
00:33:07.940 -->
00:33:13.700So it's not like it's not possible, but there's still that resistance.
00:33:14.099 -->
00:33:18.660And I would say a higher level of resistance still uh for women.
00:33:18.900 -->
00:33:22.259And so as you hit 50 years, you're thinking about your career.
00:33:22.500 -->
00:33:26.900Um, you know, what is that, what can that pro what is that process like, I guess?
00:33:26.980 -->
00:33:30.740And and I'm just, you know, I don't know.
00:33:30.900 -->
00:33:34.019I could be coming up with something, but I feel like there's something that's really there.
00:33:34.180 -->
00:33:39.460The ageism, the gender issues, all those different things kind of coming into play.
00:33:39.700 -->
00:33:44.019And then we get into this corporate or career, career mindset.
00:33:44.500 -->
00:33:50.019Um and I know that changes, you know, you're physiologically, you're mentally changing as well.
00:33:50.500 -->
00:33:52.660So I think I feel like there's there's something there.
00:33:52.819 -->
00:33:54.259I'll just leave it at that.
00:33:54.660 -->
00:33:55.860There's something there.
00:33:56.740 -->
00:34:14.179Yeah, so um see, uh, I I feel that that that glass ceiling or that feeling of um restriction or limitations, that is also about the mindset.
00:34:15.779 -->
00:34:20.179Uh not only of society, but your own mindset.
00:34:20.500 -->
00:34:22.579How do you really perceive yourself?
00:34:22.819 -->
00:34:31.539How do you really, how much prepared are you to go out and break that glass ceiling and go beyond that?
00:34:32.019 -->
00:34:45.860So if if I accept that, okay, this is the limit, and I whether if I'm doubtful whether to break it or not, then probably I will always be below that.
00:34:46.339 -->
00:34:56.259But I see a lot of change in the women, like you also said these days, that they are all there to do whatever they want to do in their lives.
00:34:56.500 -->
00:35:05.380In fact, um, see, if I talk about myself, fortunately, I have never been into a corporate lifestyle.
00:35:05.619 -->
00:35:13.460I was always a freelancer, and then I was working at my pace with my kind of flexibility.
00:35:14.500 -->
00:35:33.460Uh, you know, maybe um I would have made a plan for my life 20 years back, and I might have written down somewhere that at 50 I would start taking it very slow, or maybe start preparing for retirement and stuff like that.
00:35:33.780 -->
00:35:36.659But now I see the energy is renewed.
00:35:36.820 -->
00:35:40.579I don't see that happening uh very soon.
00:35:40.900 -->
00:35:45.699I am looking into new ventures, I want to do more with my life.
00:35:46.019 -->
00:35:55.460And in fact, my husband, who is going to retire in the next two and a half years, he uh he jokes and he says that I'm going to stop burning now.
00:35:55.539 -->
00:35:57.619It's your turn to start, you know.
00:35:58.099 -->
00:36:01.059Filling up for what I'm doing right now.
00:36:01.219 -->
00:36:09.219So, you know, jokes, jokes of what I'm trying to tell is that um I think the limitation is in our head.
00:36:10.820 -->
00:36:14.500We we have to break it and we have to go beyond that.
00:36:14.659 -->
00:36:18.099And I don't think anything is going to stop us.
00:36:18.420 -->
00:36:21.940As women, the most important part is security, you know.
00:36:22.260 -->
00:36:28.500Um, you the family wants you to be secure, which is uh a prime focus.
00:36:28.740 -->
00:36:32.820So it is for every human being, but for women, it is little more, right?
00:36:33.059 -->
00:36:39.139Yeah, so as long as that is taken care of, I don't think that there should be any limitation.
00:36:39.460 -->
00:36:43.860It's your will, it's your uh you know, vision.
00:36:44.420 -->
00:36:48.820Speak it out like I always say, speak it out, talk about it, let the other person know.
00:36:48.900 -->
00:36:58.260Sometimes what happens, Ryan, we we uh take our especially our partners uh for granted in a way that he he should understand.
00:36:58.420 -->
00:37:07.699No, he he will understand, and even if I have not said with my body language, the other person should understand what I am feeling, but it's not always true.
00:37:07.940 -->
00:37:17.380Yeah, we have to be vocal, we have to tell about it, and then expect the results that we are feeling they should be talking about.
00:37:18.340 -->
00:37:19.300So, yeah.
00:37:19.940 -->
00:37:20.900Yeah, more limitations.
00:37:21.619 -->
00:37:22.340You gotta talk.
00:37:22.420 -->
00:37:25.780It's it's uh and and the fact of the mindset, right?
00:37:25.860 -->
00:37:36.740Uh uh it's in your mind that you set those limitations, uh, regardless of what's out in the community, regardless of how society impacts, it's really and truly your mindset.
00:37:36.820 -->
00:37:40.260If you limit yourself, then that's as far as you're gonna make it.
00:37:40.420 -->
00:37:42.820Which it totally, totally makes sense.
00:37:43.059 -->
00:37:45.059Um, I I just really like that.
00:37:45.219 -->
00:37:48.340That you know those limitations are on us.
00:37:48.659 -->
00:37:52.900And if we want to break those, as you do any any aspect of our life, right?
00:37:52.980 -->
00:37:59.539Like if you wanna break those limitations, you have to speak up and you have to keep moving forward.
00:37:59.780 -->
00:38:00.260Yes.
00:38:01.139 -->
00:38:02.179Yeah, yeah.
00:38:03.219 -->
00:38:03.780It's awesome.
00:38:03.940 -->
00:38:09.300More energy at 50 to be able to really, you know, take hold of life in a different way.
00:38:09.940 -->
00:38:10.260Yeah.
00:38:10.659 -->
00:38:12.099With experience, you know?
00:38:12.579 -->
00:38:12.820Yeah.
00:38:13.059 -->
00:38:16.500It's it comes from the experience, not not by chance.
00:38:16.740 -->
00:38:18.099It's by choice.
00:38:18.579 -->
00:38:19.139Yeah.
00:38:19.860 -->
00:38:35.300You know, I was uh I'm a I'm a huge uh society kind of uh perspective person in um in social in social justice stuff, they talk about this the part where you hold the most power.
00:38:35.539 -->
00:38:44.099So the part where you hold the most power in society is uh 40 to like 60, but 50 is like the sweet spot.
00:38:44.260 -->
00:38:58.099They say that because you know, you're cons you're not like an elderly statesman or ill, you know, but you are more looked towards as a leader in mentor because you've had this previous experience.
00:38:58.420 -->
00:39:00.019That's true, that's true, actually.
00:39:00.099 -->
00:39:11.940Yeah, because um you have seen 50 years of your life, and um, you know, as they say, been there, done that, lots of things.
00:39:12.260 -->
00:39:24.500So um people put more trust and confidence in you, and probably you also do that much more as compared to what you had when you were younger.
00:39:25.539 -->
00:39:32.420Yeah, putting more trust into that's interesting that because of your age, you're more trustworthy.
00:39:33.059 -->
00:39:43.860Yeah, and I I I wouldn't say that this is this is a written rule or something, that if you are elder, you are most trustworthy.
00:39:44.019 -->
00:39:46.260It it I don't think should be taken that way.
00:39:46.420 -->
00:40:00.019But yes, looking at your own life or the the way you have portrayed yourself in all these years and how people have perceived you, that is the main key of how people put in trust in you.
00:40:00.340 -->
00:40:01.699Not just the age.
00:40:02.099 -->
00:40:03.380Not just the age.
00:40:03.619 -->
00:40:18.340But it is interesting though, that the psychology of it that we find uh if you've experienced life longer, that kind of gives a realm of trust that people can easily pick up on.
00:40:19.059 -->
00:40:29.059Um, well, as we kind of get closer to this, is there anything that you would want to share with listeners on uh on what makes us start again?
00:40:29.380 -->
00:40:34.500So all I want to say is that one age is just a number.
00:40:34.740 -->
00:40:38.740It it may sound very cliche, but it is a fact.
00:40:39.059 -->
00:40:42.260Um, as you grow, you evolve.
00:40:42.500 -->
00:40:44.900As you evolve, you want to do more.
00:40:46.019 -->
00:40:49.380So there is always a new beginning waiting for you.
00:40:49.460 -->
00:40:54.420There is always a renewed renewed purpose of life that you can look into.
00:40:55.539 -->
00:41:05.059So just just listen to your heart, see what it is saying, and speak it out.
00:41:05.780 -->
00:41:11.219Make the conversation, making the conversation is very important.
00:41:11.380 -->
00:41:26.099This is one thing that I have learned in the last five years of my life that I cannot just keep expecting the other person to understand what is in my mind unless I actually say it.
00:41:28.500 -->
00:41:36.820So go ahead, tell the world and tell yourself what you want to do and start.
00:41:37.780 -->
00:41:38.659That's it.
00:41:39.300 -->
00:41:40.579That's beautiful.
00:41:41.139 -->
00:41:42.179That's beautiful.
00:41:42.500 -->
00:41:43.059I love that.
00:41:43.139 -->
00:41:47.380I don't I I think that's for all especially for women, but for everyone, right?
00:41:47.619 -->
00:41:56.340Speak out yes, communicate what you need and what you and what you want for yourself and for the people around you.
00:41:56.500 -->
00:41:58.900I think that's beautiful.
00:41:59.460 -->
00:42:00.740Thank you so much.
00:42:00.980 -->
00:42:03.539Uh, I love this conversation, and I'm excited.
00:42:03.619 -->
00:42:08.019Hopefully, you know, we'll have another one and uh and and talk through.
00:42:08.099 -->
00:42:16.500I don't know, I feel like talking through what is midlife crisis for men might be what makes us have a midlife crisis.
00:42:16.820 -->
00:42:20.179Um, I think that might be a fun conversation at some point.
00:42:21.300 -->
00:42:23.380All right, thank you so much.
00:42:24.099 -->
00:42:26.900Thank you, thank you, Brian, for having me over.
00:42:27.139 -->
00:42:30.579And I really, really love talking my heart out.
00:42:30.659 -->
00:42:32.900Like I always say, talk it out, talk it out.
00:42:32.980 -->
00:42:37.460You gave me the opportunity to talk it out, and just gratitude for that.
00:42:37.619 -->
00:42:38.340Thank you.
00:42:40.900 -->
00:42:43.460Thank you for listening to What Makes Us.
00:42:43.619 -->
00:42:52.659Make sure to rate or review this podcast on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, or send it to a friend who you think will enjoy this podcast.
00:42:52.900 -->
00:42:56.019Thank you for sharing your time and see you soon.
