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Music.
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Welcome to the mind school, the classroom for your mind and soul, where we design our lives from the inside out.
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Here you will find a human first approach to life, business and relationships, to create freedom, growth and constant evolution through mindset, emotional intelligence, leadership and connection to self. I'm your host, Breanna may educator, CEO mindset and business mentor, and my mission is to teach the things we were never taught at school so that no dream is left on the pillow and no purpose left unfulfilled.
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Here, you can expect a lot of laughs and thought provoking conversations as we squeeze every drop of juice from this beautiful, precious, crazy thing called life.
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Welcome back to another episode.
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I just wanted to give another introduction to this incredible guest who is back on the show after our last episode was so well received. And this is a beautiful friend of mine and someone who I have done some training with, who I have coached. We make a bit of a joke about how we just, you know, throw money around between one another, but that is because I truly stand behind this incredible leader who shows up with so much honesty, so much integrity. She has built a very incredible, very successful coaching business. And yet today, on this episode, we really talk about some of the realities, and, I guess, truths and behind the scenes, things that you might not see with the coaches that you could follow online, or the business owners that you see online. So I guess we talk about all the shit that coaches shouldn't say. We talked about how to navigate business when you're not actually getting results that you're used to or that you want, and you've done all the things and you don't know what else to do. We talked about the idea of surrender and the practical application of surrender. We talked about shadow work, of course, because we both froth it, and we talked about shadows that we've witnessed show up in our businesses, and how it continues to and what we do. We talk about our views on the common question of, how do I get rid of my shadows? We talked about that.
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We talked about authenticity. We talked about trends within the industry. We talked about holding on to faith and what that actually looks like. We talked about so many things. And like always, this was just a really honest conversation. It always is with Caitlin. I just, like, I said, love her. And so I think you're going to get a get a lot from this conversation before I hit play. I just wanted to let you know that the mind school method, which is my certification where I teach mindset, NLP, Shadow Work, emotional embodiment and the most perfect blend of tools for you to put in your coaching toolkit, to be one of the most highly skilled coaches and to get the most insane transformations and breakthroughs from your clients and for yourself, I've had lots of people join who are not coaches, but are getting insane transformations in their personal, professional life. And yeah, that is sold out for 2024 but we are going to open the doors for enrollment for 2025 very soon. So if you're interested in that, if you're interested in shadow work, or any of these things that we talk about, the link is in the show notes, just to pop your name on the wait list. But for now, enjoy this conversation with Caitlin Hosking. Okay, we are back with Caitlin, who needs no introduction, because I've done it before on another episode, Caitlin Hosking is back on the podcast, which was such a well received, such a la pop, such a popular episode last time. So we're back after we finally actually met in real life, like as as humans and so welcome back to the podcast. Caitlin is my friend. Is a shadow work coach.
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Has been my mentor. I have mentored. We tend to just throw money around between each other's bank accounts.
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It's not a, what do you call those things? MLM? Is that it?
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Yeah, it's not like that. It's not a Ponzi scheme, no. But welcome. How are you, yeah, yeah, yeah, good, good.
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Kind of, sort of, half depends.
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Depends what area of my life you're asking me, I'm good in.
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Oh, let's go there.
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Let's go business. Because I think a lot of people listening would be intrigued. We've been having chats in WhatsApp and off the mic about just some of the realities of personal development, of having a business, of being so fucking aware of your shadows and your mindset and your limitations.
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And we've been having some really cool chats. So let's go there. What's what's not feeling so good. Let's be real. What's not.
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It, oh, man, I actually just messaged my friend because we're going to do a session tomorrow.
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Because, like, what's not feeling hot feels ginormous in my nervous system. And I feel like the last seven years, I have worked my ass off to create everything that I have, which is beautiful, I have so much like house, relationship, car, business, you know, made hundreds and 1000s of dollars, all of that stuff. And then in the last eight weeks, it literally feels like in business, everything's just come to a screeching halt and and I'm trying to fix it, like I'm not someone who just sits there and is like, Oh, well, too bad. I'm like, Okay, I'll do a masterclass. I will do this. I will make an offering, like, I will send emails, and I keep doing all of these things, and this, like, annoys me to the nth degree, because I am someone who loves to see that when you take action, you get a result.
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And when that doesn't make sense to me, of like, why that's not working, it brings up all of my shit, all of my shit. So it just has felt really, really slow. It feels very quiet right now, and I can usually turn things around pretty fast, like two to three weeks done, but this is going on like two months throughout that two months I've had I was sick for six weeks. I had a pregnancy loss. I've had I was away, but I was sick while I was away. So it's like I've had a lot of other things I've been balancing, and then it just feels like everything that I want is sort of being like torn away from me, and I'm left sitting here feeling like deep grief, actually, which I have been sitting with it, you know, because you have to. And I my friend, was like, Do you think maybe, like, the money's being ripped away from you, because that's your avoidance pattern? I was like, shut the fuck up, which is true, because when the money is hot, I'm like, I'm good. I don't have any shadows. I don't have anything playing out, like all of my things are healed, and that's what I'm really starting to notice, is like these old patterns, and how associated my worth is not necessarily like my self worth, because I'm like, nine relationships and all of that, I feel like really good about those. Yeah. How much am I worth as a coach is actually still related to financial success and to navigate that and to just slowly start to unpick and let go of the like, the mind's kind of stories are, like, no one cares about you, it's all going to fall apart.
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What else was there? I wrote it in my phone because, literally, I was like, sitting in the morning, just like, what patterns are actually kind of coming up for me or current themes. So there's tension. I feel like I'm holding a lot of tension. There's control.
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There's the not enoughness.
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There's manipulation. Because I'm like, I can feel myself going to scarcity. Therefore I'm going into the manipulator of like, how do I get people to buy like, what is it I need to do for you? And what do I need to say in order for you to buy from me, discounting past success? So I'm making it mean that, because I'm not in the exact same position. I'm shit, yeah, essentially, yeah. I have shame, like deep shame, around not doing as well, and then hierarchy of money, so like, your work is only worthy if someone pays for it. Wow, oh my god, so that's how you're going. Nice intro, hey guys, actually, I actually there's so much in this, and I just want to, like, reflect and say to you, this is why I 1,000% always back you as a coach, because you're real and you're honest, and the way that you just shared, how you're processing it in the mud, in the shit, and still showing up on a fucking podcast anyway, that's what I want people to see, like being a coach and having, you Know, created multi, six figures, or whatever it is, doesn't mean that you get to escape being a fucking human and that all your stories are just dissolved. And that's something that I think it's in the industry where it's like, there is some people, and it's not to say that they're wrong or they're bad, but there is a lot of marketing that would suggest I'm perfect.
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Are, and the metric for that is often money, which is wild. And I've definitely felt some of those things that you've mentioned in you've mentioned too. I resonate so hard with what you were just saying around I'm someone who can usually just do the work to get the result, yeah, and then when the result doesn't come, you're like, Well, fuck I need to go find more information. I need to educate myself more. I need to do more.
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I need to find the root cause, how that's relating to me at the moment is with fertility, like I'm feeling everything that you've just felt, but in the fertility sense, because I'm like, I'm I'm doing the acupuncture, I've done the herbs, I've taken out this, the part of the cervix that what I've done all the things, and there is no answer, and all that's left is faith and surrender. Yeah, that's literally all that's left. Have you lent into that yet? Or we're just not there yet. So as my mind grapples to figure it all out, as it does, like I've it's funny because it it kicked off when I noticed, like the money was starting to go down, like sales just weren't as high. And then I kept trying to, um, sorry, someone just walked in and, like, my intentions, like, maybe we need to talk about recent diagnosis too.
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Okay, it's funny what we're talking about. Oh, yeah. So your dog bark, both of us trying to have a comment.
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Oh my god, guys. So you probably can't see unless you're watching on YouTube. Caitlin's whole face just fucking lit up. So Jonathan, it's Jonathan, isn't it? I always Jonathan just walked into the back of Caitlin's office holding this fucking halo of a burrito from zambies. And we've been saying all day like because today, zombies is giving away 90,000 burritos. We bond over our love for burritos from zombies so you can eat it. Now if you want to the listeners, don't mind.
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I was like, yeah, oh, wait, it's good, yeah. So like 668, weeks ago, so I, like, pivoted my business into business coaching. So this is mortifying, easier if I was in the healing space, yes, right? Because I was like, well, in the healing space, no one cares, really. But then I pivoted into business because, like, I was doing very well, and I had navigated a lot in business and all of that. And when I first did it with your mentoring me that stage, and I went through that period of like, oh my god, like holding the vision for the pivot. And then it just went, like, and, you know, all the money started rolling in, and I was having like, 40k months, and, like, all of this shit. So I was like, I'm good. I've got my whole life sorted out. Yeah, I've made that.
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And then I created this whole program, self paced calls on relationship with money, because, like, mine was feeling great at that point, and the shadows around money and all of this stuff, and then, yeah, money just started, like, dipping, like, I sold, you know, copies of that course, and some one on one, stuff. Like, there was things, and then it's just like my monthly recurring just started to drop, and it was in that where my imposter started to flare up and was going, you can't talk about money because you're not making enough. And which is like, the irony is that whole program is about your relationship with money, not manifesting more. So that's been a big part of this is like humbling myself to my teachings of, okay, like what, what's happening, and the avoidance around money, especially when I feel like it's not as much, I'm like, we'll just not look at that and pretend it's fine.
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Everything's fine, because what comes up is like, this deep anxiety and this shadow around failure.
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Like, if you look at that and that's reality, and you know that means you failed. Question, yeah, on your highest cash months, were you you're happier?
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Like, do you think they made you happy? Were you happier? Then, what's been your happiest moments in business this year?
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Yes, I have, but that's because I've also had other high cash funds where I was like, I am so anxious, right? I'm really anxious that I'm going to lose it all and blah. So it's like, I would be making all this money, but I had this really anxious attachment, and I've worked really, really hard on that, yeah. And so this year, like, I have been really kind of balancing this act of like, okay, when money's high, I look after myself, I do all those things, and then when money's low, I still allow myself to have fun and go to the beach and look.
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After myself, because my pattern would be high months, do nothing low months, hustle, yeah, feast and famine, yeah. So like this feast and famine. So I'm like, Okay, I've got to, like, manage. But as it's kind of not turning around, then I can see those patterns starting to, like, come back in of the avoidance and just being like, I'm just gonna work. That's what I feel like doing. It's really interesting because I'm not actually doing that, like I have done the things that need to be done, but I'm not sitting at my computer all day, every day, and waking up at 4am with anxiety about it.
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I'm like, is this great? No, it's not my favorite moment, yeah, but it's not going to get better if I treat myself like shit. So there were some things I noticed, like in my business, around like becoming a business coach, and I kind of try to put myself into this box of what other business coaches look like. And I started pushing this narrative of everything's wonderful and perfect all of the time in my life, which is the complete opposite to my entire business and what I preach. Yeah, so I made a decision that I'm going to drop the facade and just be really transparent. So I did a live and I talked about that money's dipping and what's coming up for me, and have just been sort of navigating my authentic expression since then. But it's so interesting because as I'm showing up authentically, normally, that's worked.
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Normally, I show up authentically, and everyone's like, I love you, and now I want to work with you so I get the validation, yeah, but now I'm not getting the validation. I'm like, oh my god, does everyone fucking hate me? Am I just a fucking loser?
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Wow, crisis, wow. That's a lot. It's a lot. Yeah, like, it is a lot.
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And the fact I still smile and laugh, yeah, is, like, my gift, I think it fully is, and your honesty, yeah, because I'm like, I can't, you know, and I know the good thing about like, the amount of shadow work I've done is like, I am viewing those thoughts. I know that they are not me, right? I can see them sort of like on a screen, and it's like, this is where my mind wants to go. And I'm like, Thank you, but I also know that that's not truth, right? And thank you for highlighting my still deep need for external validation over who I am. There's so much in this, because I think there's, there's been trends both ways. It's like and shadows to everything, as you know, which is why we spoke on your podcast this week about how everything has a flip side, and therefore it's so fucking hard to know what meaning to make. But it's like I've seen in the space, there's business coaches as an example, who do definitely their main thing is money. Yeah, their main thing is money. But then I've had conversations with business coaches who say the problem with that is people come in and they expect money to be made, because now their goals are centered around money. Their worth is centered around money. And so it become, it can become this, like money is the driver of everything. So it's like the the thing that you promote on your socials, you also need to be happy with what that can mean inside your containers, and with how you show up when that one thing isn't going as well as you'd like. It's where the imposter, it's it's fucking it's rough money. Stuff is huge in the industry, totally. And I feel like there is such a narrative around this, actually, this is another thing that's been highlighted for me. So the narrative is like, once you do this shadow work, then you will make money, and the only reason you're not making money is because of these shadows playing out. And I have like, like, I love shadow work, not because of that. I love it because it has bought me such a deep sense of wholeness and fulfillment and deep understanding for myself and deep empathy and compassion for other human beings through that lens. So I love that, and I've it's also been revealed that I was associating that in my body and my nervous system, my brain of Yeah, but if you do all this work, then you will get this tangible, external outcome for sure, and it will be perfect all of the time. And so not seeing that is then creating this probably back to the failure thing, actually, of like, I didn't do good enough, and that's one of my core words, is like, I didn't do good enough, it's not enough, and I should have done better, and I'm just like, What is the point? Like, what was the point of this work? And it's this journey for me is actually like remembering what I did this work for, because it wasn't for the it never was for the external things that was always it was.
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Is the fact that I felt so broken and lost, and no one understood me, and I didn't understand myself, and like I had such deep loathing who I was, and I did this work to heal myself, and then everything else became a bonus. And it does contribute to those things, but it contributes in a way of, instead of trying to, like, it's spiritual work, yeah, right, it's spiritual work. And to be doing this work just to get an external manifestation is not spiritual. It is ego driven, and it's a deep remembrance of, ultimately, this work is about faith. It's about surrender and trust into life and noticing where our ego gets into the attachment of I'm only good enough when I'm only worthy when I'm only this when, and going, well, how can I remember like I've been put on this path and this I feel like everything that's happened in my life and in my business has been about me detaching from that external validation, which doesn't mean I don't love it. And for anyone, you can totally love it, external validation, if someone's like, when you're like, I love you know, I always back you as a coach, and I love how it is. I'm like, Yeah, we love that shit, yeah. But if that determined how I felt about myself as a coach, completely.
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That's unhealthy. That's an unhealthy attachment to the external. So I think it's this, this deep surrendering back into myself and I this is what it feels like, right? That's a it feels like it's being torn away from me as the deepest reminder of who I am without the external. And so how, if anyone's listening that's like, Fuck, I'm not getting the results. I want all my stories and shit is coming up. How have you in the last eight weeks? How do you surrender?
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Like still doing it? I think the most important thing when it comes to surrender is knowing it's not one decision. It's a decision every single moment when something comes up of, Am I going to go into this and freak out and do all those things, or am I going to notice and choose a different path? Yeah, and so like, even this morning, I could feel this anxiety building in my body while I was drinking coffee. It was like, everything's going to fucking fall apart and it's all fucked and it's never going to turn around. And I was just like, I'm noticing, I'm noticing my need for control right now, and that's not going to serve me. So I went to the beach, and then I went to the gym, and then I sat with my friend in ceremony. And now I'm here, and I have not done any work except for this time now, and it's just like, I don't want to be continuously feeding into my patterns, and so the surrender is noticing the pattern and making a new choice that serves you, and that doesn't mean not working at all, yeah, but I choose, very intentionally, not to work when I'm in an anxious state, because then my perfectionist comes up, my hyper vigilance, so I'll be like, on my phone checking, you know, emails, this, that, this, that, and like, doing all of that, of like trying to, trying to feel a sense of control by seeing the external thing, um, I usually jump between 4000 things. So I'm so dysregulated that I can't focus anyway, yeah, yeah. And nothing's ever good enough. So it's like that's that drives that perfectionism, but like the overachiever and all of those sorts of patterns that I can fall into, so I I just intentionally go. I'm surrendering to how I feel right now, and I will not fix it through that. But once I'm regulated, of course, I'm going to circle back, because there's also a surrender there of reality and doing nothing for me currently, like in my experience, that also is not helpful, because then you're sitting there and you feel completely out of control because you literally haven't done anything. And they can be shadows around that as well. So it's, it's just marrying these, these two you want to go masculine feminine energies, yeah, or yin and yang of what is most needed right now for me to regulate myself and surrender to that. I love the way you framed that, quickly interrupting this episode to let you know that the mind school method is sold out for 2024 and we are very close to opening enrolment for 2025 this is the one stop shop certification for coaches who want to upskill so that you can create more impact, more money and more freedom. If you or your clients are getting stuck, looping on old patterns, holding yourself back, or just simply want to catapult to your next level. The mind school method is the place to learn how to powerfully lead yourself so that you can get the best out of your clients and all the people you love. It is six days. It is immersive, it is transformative, and it is where you will learn the best of the best coaching tools from NLP mind.
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Set Shadow Work and emotional embodiment so that you can be the best coach you can be, and have an overflowing heart and bank account to match your overflowing toolkit. The link for the waitlist is in the show notes. Now back to the episode.
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It happens all the time. I'm sure you get this question too, like when you start teaching shadow, most people will go, but how do I get rid of it? That's always the first question. How do I get rid of and it's like, I'm hoping that it's becoming very clear that like you don't necessarily get rid of like you said before, I notice scarcity come up, and when scarcity comes up, I want to go into the manipulator. And I fucking resonate with that. One of my biggest shadows was around manipulation like and I remember, I think I might have said it to you in shadow alchemy. I have so many pieces of evidence from being really, like, really young. My mom and dad would just be like, Oh, you're such a schema. Like, you're such a little schema. I'd like, wrap one around my finger and then put, you know, mum said I could, but not say to dad, like, all these little things, such a little schema. And I built this thing, and then held a lot of shame around it, but then, yeah, it was something that was playing out in business, because the same thing I would manipulate, but now it's actually just seeing, Oh, right now I feel like I could want to go into that like you said, How do I make people buy? And I'm choosing differently. I'm not necessarily getting rid of but I'm choosing differently and getting way better at doing it, not in hindsight, doing it in the moment. And so we're not getting rid of anything, guys like we're not getting rid of shit. We're not fixing you, because you're not broken. And the more you try to get rid of parts of yourself, the more you cast it back into the shadows.
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So what you can see Caitlin doing right now is actually, this is how you, and I don't even like the terms like dissolve the shadows, because, like I'm you don't dissolving it, but this is how you essentially detach you d maybe you dissolve shame and the the energy of shame around it.
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This is the work. It's actually what you're doing. It's not the getting rid of it's the observing and choosing differently totally. And it's like, and if this makes anyone feel better, like, I've done this for seven years, and I've I studied psychology 12 years ago, so I've known about this for a long fucking time, and this shit still comes up. So yeah, please don't feel like you're like, oh my god, it's coming up. I'm terrible. No, you're magnificently human. And I know like the part of us are so, so deeply wants to escape that because we want because it's painful, because it is painful, the human experience is deeply painful, and that's the contrast. Because if we didn't have the deep pain, if I don't go through this, like, if, you know, if I jump back on three months and I'm at 100k cash months, it wouldn't mean the same thing, right? That doesn't mean I'm choosing it. God, thank you. Yeah, still open, Julie, my Yeah, it's this the way that I have always looked at shadows.
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Because I got into shadow work because I held such deep shame about myself, and I never read a book on Shadow Work. I read a book on shame, which was about shadows, and it was the first time for me. So I really got introduced into it as this.
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There's nothing wrong with you.
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You are whole, and you have light things that you see and dark things that you feel shame and try not to see. And so it's always about integration of seeing the seeing the whole picture. So I'm really grateful.
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Like the earliest teachers I had in this were not Instagram, like people were not talking about this back then these are, like, very well studied people.
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And I was like, it's sort of like, you have your wardrobe, right? And you look in your wardrobe, you're like, Okay, what do I want to wear today?
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You don't fucking put on every piece of clothing. And you also don't wear things that aren't like, if you're going to yoga class. You're not fucking wearing skinny, tight jeans and a shirt that your titties are going to fall out when you're in Downward Facing Dog, yeah? Like, I'm going to yoga class, so I'm going to wear fucking yoga pants and a prop that hold my titties in place, right? Yeah. So it's we're doing the same thing with our shadows, of going, Okay, well, what? Not even shadows like our entire personality trait closet of, well, what's most helpful to me as the human in this moment, and if it's not the jings, the whatever tight shirt, then how do I put on the yoga pants? And then sometimes, like, if we go back to my example of like, choosing to go the beach is like I choose to put on relaxation and regulation and calm. And then there's times where I am working and I'm I'm probably a lot more fiery when I tend to work. And so that's just a different trait of mine, and I just bring that out when I'm working, when I'm speaking, because I love that part of me as well, but it.
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Not the only part, and I don't have to wear it all the time.
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And what I love about that analogy and the way that you frame that is it takes away. The more I studied shadow and and all of these pieces, it almost took away like, you know that when it feels very high school, like that person's so fake.
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She's this person, around that person, but around this person, she's totally different. And, like all of these little pieces, and it's like, can't you just be all of it? Like I, I remember, actually, this is so interesting. I have always had very diverse groups of friends.
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Like, if you lined up my besties, it would be like, what the actual like Bush bogans that are like, happy on the farm and have never worn high heels in their life, and my other bestie, who is literally like, blonde, diva bombshell, like all of that. And I always felt like, what is Am I a like, am I a chameleon? I think someone said that was like, Are you just you could Are you a chameleon? I was like, No, all of these people represent parts of me, and those parts come out around certain people. But then I used to think, Oh, my God, am I fake? Do I not know who I am? Am I just a shape shifter? But the truth is that all of them exist. Some people just bring out different parts of us. And I think, like you said, if we give ourselves permission to have a huge wardrobe, and know that a big wardrobe exists, you don't have to just although, if I think of my wardrobe, I literally do wear the same four things all the time and everything else you don't wear. But it's a great analogy where all of it, where the whole wardrobe, and that doesn't mean that you're fake or inauthentic when different pieces come out, just like you can be a fucking powerhouse. I see you as a powerhouse, and you've just told me how you're feeling like a fucking sack of shit, and it's like you're still a powerhouse. You're still both.
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You can have the summer dress and the winter clothes, and one doesn't cancel out the other totally, totally. And that I believe, especially in in business, knowing that is one of the most helpful things. Because what used to happen before I got into shadow work was I would have one bad day and be like, everything else is canceled, right? Like I can't teach on this and I can't do personal development. Like I'm not this perfect shiny object anymore.
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And so the shame around that was, was the thing. And then when I was like, oh, right, like I can be both. I can be literally falling apart, and I can still hold a relationship and friendships and go to the gym and go to the beach and hold my business and do what needs to be done, but I can still feel like it's really fucking hard right now. But that doesn't cancel out like, and this is what I've been like. I'm picking even more during this time. Is like, the the worthiness around being a coach, and it's like, just because in this fucking moment, my business is not this shiny thing that you think it needs to be in order for me to be a good coach. That's actually your shadow work and not mine.
00:33:54.859 --> 00:34:20.559
Because how many times do people buy the marketing and the shiny object and they get the shittest coaching experience behind the scenes? Oh, mate, that's a whole another conversation. I reckon there's so many incredible coaches. Oh no, incredible marketers out there. And I've seen this. I've experienced this myself, incredible marketers.
00:34:16.780 --> 00:34:24.699
And I take full responsibility, like, I fall for the marketing.
00:34:20.559 --> 00:34:52.760
I'm so like, I'm a human. It pushes on all of my things. I see it, and I'm like, I know what this person's doing, but I want to buy like, I want to know this secret sauce that you fucking speak about so dumb. I'm so gullible. But like, I've seen it, I've fallen for it. I've spent literally 50, $60,000 on containers where I've gotten in and gone, oh, that was some great marketing. I don't know if this person's ever done any coaching training, yeah, yeah.
00:34:52.820 --> 00:35:12.039
And vice versa, humans who I know are, what terrible marketers, and I think what a shame, because they're the best coaches. And so even I think, like there's so much to that, but even knowing where your skill set needs some you know, up leveling can make you a lot.
00:35:08.440 --> 00:35:46.019
Yeah, yeah. There's so much of that. And I was actually saying this the other day that I find that a lot of the like, the best, safest, most beautiful coaches suffer the most in marketing because they don't. They're so afraid of, like, I don't want to shame someone or manipulate them like they care so deeply. And look, they've got shadows around that, and this is something I've had to work along, including myself. Yeah, but it's like, it is a shame, because you're like, you have so so much potential to change.
00:35:46.099 --> 00:35:57.380
The world, and it's the same. I mean, we do see that in society, like the people who tend to make the most money are generally not the greatest. That's not all cases, just to be clear, it's not all cases, and it has nothing to do with the money.
00:35:57.380 --> 00:36:20.799
They just weren't great to start with, yeah, but you they get there, because I don't give a fuck. They're just like, I will step on toes and I will manipulate and I will scheme and I will do shady shit, because that's my thing. But then when you see these people who deeply care and feel and empathize with people, they're like, I don't like that being done to me, so I don't want to do that to you.
00:36:18.279 --> 00:36:54.739
And then they get caught up in this whole story around manipulation and shame, and then they do absolutely nothing. And it's like, you, the people that can need to have the money, and I don't hate it. I just like this about the culture that we live in is, is that piece of we it's getting caught up in the story, right in the narrative, and we're not willing to look at it with like, a clear lens of this person marketing to me, like, how can I look at that closer, more closely? Are they?
00:36:50.659 --> 00:37:51.380
Are they actually who they say they are? When have I seen the other side? And I always say, like, the light of the light, the darker the shadow. If I see someone who is constantly light and shiny and like, never has anything and never talks about what they're moving through. For me, that's just a red flag, yeah, and that doesn't mean that it they have to do that by any means, but for me, it's a red flag. And so I, and I probably do this the hard way, is like, such a deep part of my mission, in the business space, in the coaching space, is to be human, is to show the humanity, even if it means that maybe I don't scale like out of this world, because I'm like, I would rather people see me and I see them, and when we're working together, it's just beautiful, like my clients that I get to work with, it is the fucking best thing ever.
00:37:48.860 --> 00:38:01.880
Like, I don't have to wear a mask. I don't have to pretend things are perfect. Like, yeah, I feel you're on that navigating and so it's for me, that's sustainability.
00:38:02.420 --> 00:38:29.759
That is sustainability, because you will waste so much energy trying to hold those shadows of yours down right? And it will, you'll get burnt out. You end up not liking your business and all of those things. And so maybe it feels like the harder way for me right now, but I've also had a lot of success from it, yeah, and I've had like the success is not just the financial success.
00:38:29.759 --> 00:39:22.960
The success is when a client says, Thank you so much for saying that I feel similar or I didn't know anyone else felt like this, so I don't feel so alone. Isn't that the point of development work? Isn't that the point of coaching is to be a better fucking human, compassionate, yeah, yeah, it's so wild. And I actually something I was thinking about too, there was like, you know, there's two sides to this, because people think like being a human is showing your vulnerability, showing your struggles, showing what you're working through, your obstacles, your hardships, your adversities. And I agree with that, and I I think that that's so important, but something that we've always we spoke about once in WhatsApp, and I love the post that you created for me, vulnerability is the flip side of that I'm okay. I'm okay to share what I'm struggling with.
00:39:19.539 --> 00:39:29.819
I'm okay to share what's going on behind the scenes. I'm pretty much an open book, but for me to stand in my power, for me to stand and say, hey, guess what?
00:39:29.819 --> 00:39:37.500
My business has made seven figures. Hey, guess what? I just did a whatever like to own my power that is vulnerable to me.
00:39:37.920 --> 00:40:02.779
And I think that there's both sides to the equation, because we also live in a society where it's like, be good, but not too good, because you'll get cut down and be good, but still be relatable. You don't want to not be relatable anymore. So don't be too powerful. And my work to do is almost the flip side of that. Share your quote humanity.
00:39:57.019 --> 00:40:02.779
Humanity is also powerful.
00:40:02.779 --> 00:40:46.019
Humanity is also strong, and I've had to be okay with sharing power, but that's where my shadow work was to do, because I was so afraid of being anything other than little country bumpkin Breanna, like relatable Bogan, yeah. And that's, you know, this is golden shadow work, right? And that's I when I teach on shadow work. And it's always like, I kind of when I even when I'm with someone and I'm listening to them speak, if they're coming on as a client, I'm in my mind. I'm like, okay, cool. Like they're associating themselves with what we would typically look at as the dark shadow, so they think that they're not good enough and they're a loser and like, that's, that's something that I really came from. And then I can also gage if someone is associating themselves with the.
00:40:46.099 --> 00:41:07.239
Golden shadow more, which is like they think that they are larger than life and the most amazing, and they're terrified of anyone seeing anything other than that. And so it's this duality like, and that humanity is the duality, right, of like you can be both that sometimes, and you can have that you could be making seven figures and still feel like a bag of dicks.
00:41:08.440 --> 00:41:33.779
Neither is wrong, but what are we choosing to show? And as you said, like, what feels most vulnerable? And I, as you said, like, I did that post because it was a lot, the trend was kind of like, here's what I don't show on social media. And it was all these people always presented really, like, perfectly showing their hard things. And I was like, well, here's what I don't show on social media. And they were like, all of my wins, yeah.
00:41:33.839 --> 00:41:40.619
I even had clients being like, I had no idea about how much money you had made, or, you know, this or this, or this, or whatever.
00:41:40.679 --> 00:43:01.159
I'm like, Yeah, that's true. And I think that actually kicked off the flip of going, like, trying to push a new narrative, and then I lost myself in that. And happen is like this pendulum swinging, but you have to overstep your own boundaries to find where your line is, yeah, and that's the middle ground which is so it's so, yeah, you'll probably lose it, and then you'll find it, then you'll lose it, then you'll find it, and you'll just be on this fucking washing machine and have an Eggsy. Yeah, just another Eggsy. But guys, if you're having an existential crisis, you can always hit Caitlin and I up because we have them regularly. Like, what is the point of humaning is? Yeah, go listen to Caitlin's podcast. And if people want to follow you, look at your 50 shades of Caitlyn. We need to do another episode about ADHD, because there's a lot that we could talk about with that. There's so many more topics, and we've both discovered we don't love podcasting alone in our rooms at home. So we might do more of these. But if you'd like to talk to Caitlin and message either of us about some new topics, we can bring where can people find you, to connect with you. There you can find me at complete on the score by Caitlin. And if you want to learn more specifically about, like, human nervous system, Shadow Work, that sort of stuff. Then go to shadow alchemy Coaching Academy, share more the education content there. And then on my on my personal page, I just show whatever is alive.
00:43:02.900 --> 00:43:13.420
That's my little playground. So you're gonna see a bit of unhinged shit. And then I have a podcast called Shadow Work. What the fuck? So you can always listen to that.
00:43:10.119 --> 00:43:21.400
Thank you so much. We'll be back for round three. Thank you for having me. Thank you for tuning in to the mind school podcast.
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It is a massive intention of mine to continue to grow this show, because the more the show grows, the better the guests get, and I know that is going to be so powerful for you listening. So if I could ask this massive favor, it would mean the world if you could please leave a review, hit the Follow button, or leave a rating on Spotify, so that we can continue to grow this show and bring you the juiciest, most thought provoking and expansive conversations through incredible guests. Thank you so much for tuning in. I'll see you next week. You.
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Music.
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Welcome to the mind school, the classroom for your mind and soul, where we design our lives from the inside out.
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Here you will find a human first approach to life, business and relationships, to create freedom, growth and constant evolution through mindset, emotional intelligence, leadership and connection to self. I'm your host, Breanna may educator, CEO mindset and business mentor, and my mission is to teach the things we were never taught at school so that no dream is left on the pillow and no purpose left unfulfilled.
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Here, you can expect a lot of laughs and thought provoking conversations as we squeeze every drop of juice from this beautiful, precious, crazy thing called life.
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Welcome back to another episode.
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I just wanted to give another introduction to this incredible guest who is back on the show after our last episode was so well received. And this is a beautiful friend of mine and someone who I have done some training with, who I have coached. We make a bit of a joke about how we just, you know, throw money around between one another, but that is because I truly stand behind this incredible leader who shows up with so much honesty, so much integrity. She has built a very incredible, very successful coaching business. And yet today, on this episode, we really talk about some of the realities, and, I guess, truths and behind the scenes, things that you might not see with the coaches that you could follow online, or the business owners that you see online. So I guess we talk about all the shit that coaches shouldn't say. We talked about how to navigate business when you're not actually getting results that you're used to or that you want, and you've done all the things and you don't know what else to do. We talked about the idea of surrender and the practical application of surrender. We talked about shadow work, of course, because we both froth it, and we talked about shadows that we've witnessed show up in our businesses, and how it continues to and what we do. We talk about our views on the common question of, how do I get rid of my shadows? We talked about that.
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We talked about authenticity. We talked about trends within the industry. We talked about holding on to faith and what that actually looks like. We talked about so many things. And like always, this was just a really honest conversation. It always is with Caitlin. I just, like, I said, love her. And so I think you're going to get a get a lot from this conversation before I hit play. I just wanted to let you know that the mind school method, which is my certification where I teach mindset, NLP, Shadow Work, emotional embodiment and the most perfect blend of tools for you to put in your coaching toolkit, to be one of the most highly skilled coaches and to get the most insane transformations and breakthroughs from your clients and for yourself, I've had lots of people join who are not coaches, but are getting insane transformations in their personal, professional life. And yeah, that is sold out for 2024 but we are going to open the doors for enrollment for 2025 very soon. So if you're interested in that, if you're interested in shadow work, or any of these things that we talk about, the link is in the show notes, just to pop your name on the wait list. But for now, enjoy this conversation with Caitlin Hosking. Okay, we are back with Caitlin, who needs no introduction, because I've done it before on another episode, Caitlin Hosking is back on the podcast, which was such a well received, such a la pop, such a popular episode last time. So we're back after we finally actually met in real life, like as as humans and so welcome back to the podcast. Caitlin is my friend. Is a shadow work coach.
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Has been my mentor. I have mentored. We tend to just throw money around between each other's bank accounts.
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It's not a, what do you call those things? MLM? Is that it?
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Yeah, it's not like that. It's not a Ponzi scheme, no. But welcome. How are you, yeah, yeah, yeah, good, good.
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Kind of, sort of, half depends.
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Depends what area of my life you're asking me, I'm good in.
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Oh, let's go there.
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Let's go business. Because I think a lot of people listening would be intrigued. We've been having chats in WhatsApp and off the mic about just some of the realities of personal development, of having a business, of being so fucking aware of your shadows and your mindset and your limitations.
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And we've been having some really cool chats. So let's go there. What's what's not feeling so good. Let's be real. What's not.
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It, oh, man, I actually just messaged my friend because we're going to do a session tomorrow.
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Because, like, what's not feeling hot feels ginormous in my nervous system. And I feel like the last seven years, I have worked my ass off to create everything that I have, which is beautiful, I have so much like house, relationship, car, business, you know, made hundreds and 1000s of dollars, all of that stuff. And then in the last eight weeks, it literally feels like in business, everything's just come to a screeching halt and and I'm trying to fix it, like I'm not someone who just sits there and is like, Oh, well, too bad. I'm like, Okay, I'll do a masterclass. I will do this. I will make an offering, like, I will send emails, and I keep doing all of these things, and this, like, annoys me to the nth degree, because I am someone who loves to see that when you take action, you get a result.
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And when that doesn't make sense to me, of like, why that's not working, it brings up all of my shit, all of my shit. So it just has felt really, really slow. It feels very quiet right now, and I can usually turn things around pretty fast, like two to three weeks done, but this is going on like two months throughout that two months I've had I was sick for six weeks. I had a pregnancy loss. I've had I was away, but I was sick while I was away. So it's like I've had a lot of other things I've been balancing, and then it just feels like everything that I want is sort of being like torn away from me, and I'm left sitting here feeling like deep grief, actually, which I have been sitting with it, you know, because you have to. And I my friend, was like, Do you think maybe, like, the money's being ripped away from you, because that's your avoidance pattern? I was like, shut the fuck up, which is true, because when the money is hot, I'm like, I'm good. I don't have any shadows. I don't have anything playing out, like all of my things are healed, and that's what I'm really starting to notice, is like these old patterns, and how associated my worth is not necessarily like my self worth, because I'm like, nine relationships and all of that, I feel like really good about those. Yeah. How much am I worth as a coach is actually still related to financial success and to navigate that and to just slowly start to unpick and let go of the like, the mind's kind of stories are, like, no one cares about you, it's all going to fall apart.
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What else was there? I wrote it in my phone because, literally, I was like, sitting in the morning, just like, what patterns are actually kind of coming up for me or current themes. So there's tension. I feel like I'm holding a lot of tension. There's control.
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There's the not enoughness.
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There's manipulation. Because I'm like, I can feel myself going to scarcity. Therefore I'm going into the manipulator of like, how do I get people to buy like, what is it I need to do for you? And what do I need to say in order for you to buy from me, discounting past success? So I'm making it mean that, because I'm not in the exact same position. I'm shit, yeah, essentially, yeah. I have shame, like deep shame, around not doing as well, and then hierarchy of money, so like, your work is only worthy if someone pays for it. Wow, oh my god, so that's how you're going. Nice intro, hey guys, actually, I actually there's so much in this, and I just want to, like, reflect and say to you, this is why I 1,000% always back you as a coach, because you're real and you're honest, and the way that you just shared, how you're processing it in the mud, in the shit, and still showing up on a fucking podcast anyway, that's what I want people to see, like being a coach and having, you Know, created multi, six figures, or whatever it is, doesn't mean that you get to escape being a fucking human and that all your stories are just dissolved. And that's something that I think it's in the industry where it's like, there is some people, and it's not to say that they're wrong or they're bad, but there is a lot of marketing that would suggest I'm perfect.
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Are, and the metric for that is often money, which is wild. And I've definitely felt some of those things that you've mentioned in you've mentioned too. I resonate so hard with what you were just saying around I'm someone who can usually just do the work to get the result, yeah, and then when the result doesn't come, you're like, Well, fuck I need to go find more information. I need to educate myself more. I need to do more.
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I need to find the root cause, how that's relating to me at the moment is with fertility, like I'm feeling everything that you've just felt, but in the fertility sense, because I'm like, I'm I'm doing the acupuncture, I've done the herbs, I've taken out this, the part of the cervix that what I've done all the things, and there is no answer, and all that's left is faith and surrender. Yeah, that's literally all that's left. Have you lent into that yet? Or we're just not there yet. So as my mind grapples to figure it all out, as it does, like I've it's funny because it it kicked off when I noticed, like the money was starting to go down, like sales just weren't as high. And then I kept trying to, um, sorry, someone just walked in and, like, my intentions, like, maybe we need to talk about recent diagnosis too.
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Okay, it's funny what we're talking about. Oh, yeah. So your dog bark, both of us trying to have a comment.
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Oh my god, guys. So you probably can't see unless you're watching on YouTube. Caitlin's whole face just fucking lit up. So Jonathan, it's Jonathan, isn't it? I always Jonathan just walked into the back of Caitlin's office holding this fucking halo of a burrito from zambies. And we've been saying all day like because today, zombies is giving away 90,000 burritos. We bond over our love for burritos from zombies so you can eat it. Now if you want to the listeners, don't mind.
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I was like, yeah, oh, wait, it's good, yeah. So like 668, weeks ago, so I, like, pivoted my business into business coaching. So this is mortifying, easier if I was in the healing space, yes, right? Because I was like, well, in the healing space, no one cares, really. But then I pivoted into business because, like, I was doing very well, and I had navigated a lot in business and all of that. And when I first did it with your mentoring me that stage, and I went through that period of like, oh my god, like holding the vision for the pivot. And then it just went, like, and, you know, all the money started rolling in, and I was having like, 40k months, and, like, all of this shit. So I was like, I'm good. I've got my whole life sorted out. Yeah, I've made that.
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And then I created this whole program, self paced calls on relationship with money, because, like, mine was feeling great at that point, and the shadows around money and all of this stuff, and then, yeah, money just started, like, dipping, like, I sold, you know, copies of that course, and some one on one, stuff. Like, there was things, and then it's just like my monthly recurring just started to drop, and it was in that where my imposter started to flare up and was going, you can't talk about money because you're not making enough. And which is like, the irony is that whole program is about your relationship with money, not manifesting more. So that's been a big part of this is like humbling myself to my teachings of, okay, like what, what's happening, and the avoidance around money, especially when I feel like it's not as much, I'm like, we'll just not look at that and pretend it's fine.
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Everything's fine, because what comes up is like, this deep anxiety and this shadow around failure.
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Like, if you look at that and that's reality, and you know that means you failed. Question, yeah, on your highest cash months, were you you're happier?
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Like, do you think they made you happy? Were you happier? Then, what's been your happiest moments in business this year?
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Yes, I have, but that's because I've also had other high cash funds where I was like, I am so anxious, right? I'm really anxious that I'm going to lose it all and blah. So it's like, I would be making all this money, but I had this really anxious attachment, and I've worked really, really hard on that, yeah. And so this year, like, I have been really kind of balancing this act of like, okay, when money's high, I look after myself, I do all those things, and then when money's low, I still allow myself to have fun and go to the beach and look.
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After myself, because my pattern would be high months, do nothing low months, hustle, yeah, feast and famine, yeah. So like this feast and famine. So I'm like, Okay, I've got to, like, manage. But as it's kind of not turning around, then I can see those patterns starting to, like, come back in of the avoidance and just being like, I'm just gonna work. That's what I feel like doing. It's really interesting because I'm not actually doing that, like I have done the things that need to be done, but I'm not sitting at my computer all day, every day, and waking up at 4am with anxiety about it.
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I'm like, is this great? No, it's not my favorite moment, yeah, but it's not going to get better if I treat myself like shit. So there were some things I noticed, like in my business, around like becoming a business coach, and I kind of try to put myself into this box of what other business coaches look like. And I started pushing this narrative of everything's wonderful and perfect all of the time in my life, which is the complete opposite to my entire business and what I preach. Yeah, so I made a decision that I'm going to drop the facade and just be really transparent. So I did a live and I talked about that money's dipping and what's coming up for me, and have just been sort of navigating my authentic expression since then. But it's so interesting because as I'm showing up authentically, normally, that's worked.
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Normally, I show up authentically, and everyone's like, I love you, and now I want to work with you so I get the validation, yeah, but now I'm not getting the validation. I'm like, oh my god, does everyone fucking hate me? Am I just a fucking loser?
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Wow, crisis, wow. That's a lot. It's a lot. Yeah, like, it is a lot.
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And the fact I still smile and laugh, yeah, is, like, my gift, I think it fully is, and your honesty, yeah, because I'm like, I can't, you know, and I know the good thing about like, the amount of shadow work I've done is like, I am viewing those thoughts. I know that they are not me, right? I can see them sort of like on a screen, and it's like, this is where my mind wants to go. And I'm like, Thank you, but I also know that that's not truth, right? And thank you for highlighting my still deep need for external validation over who I am. There's so much in this, because I think there's, there's been trends both ways. It's like and shadows to everything, as you know, which is why we spoke on your podcast this week about how everything has a flip side, and therefore it's so fucking hard to know what meaning to make. But it's like I've seen in the space, there's business coaches as an example, who do definitely their main thing is money. Yeah, their main thing is money. But then I've had conversations with business coaches who say the problem with that is people come in and they expect money to be made, because now their goals are centered around money. Their worth is centered around money. And so it become, it can become this, like money is the driver of everything. So it's like the the thing that you promote on your socials, you also need to be happy with what that can mean inside your containers, and with how you show up when that one thing isn't going as well as you'd like. It's where the imposter, it's it's fucking it's rough money. Stuff is huge in the industry, totally. And I feel like there is such a narrative around this, actually, this is another thing that's been highlighted for me. So the narrative is like, once you do this shadow work, then you will make money, and the only reason you're not making money is because of these shadows playing out. And I have like, like, I love shadow work, not because of that. I love it because it has bought me such a deep sense of wholeness and fulfillment and deep understanding for myself and deep empathy and compassion for other human beings through that lens. So I love that, and I've it's also been revealed that I was associating that in my body and my nervous system, my brain of Yeah, but if you do all this work, then you will get this tangible, external outcome for sure, and it will be perfect all of the time. And so not seeing that is then creating this probably back to the failure thing, actually, of like, I didn't do good enough, and that's one of my core words, is like, I didn't do good enough, it's not enough, and I should have done better, and I'm just like, What is the point? Like, what was the point of this work? And it's this journey for me is actually like remembering what I did this work for, because it wasn't for the it never was for the external things that was always it was.
00:20:46.099 --> 00:22:09.879
Is the fact that I felt so broken and lost, and no one understood me, and I didn't understand myself, and like I had such deep loathing who I was, and I did this work to heal myself, and then everything else became a bonus. And it does contribute to those things, but it contributes in a way of, instead of trying to, like, it's spiritual work, yeah, right, it's spiritual work. And to be doing this work just to get an external manifestation is not spiritual. It is ego driven, and it's a deep remembrance of, ultimately, this work is about faith. It's about surrender and trust into life and noticing where our ego gets into the attachment of I'm only good enough when I'm only worthy when I'm only this when, and going, well, how can I remember like I've been put on this path and this I feel like everything that's happened in my life and in my business has been about me detaching from that external validation, which doesn't mean I don't love it. And for anyone, you can totally love it, external validation, if someone's like, when you're like, I love you know, I always back you as a coach, and I love how it is. I'm like, Yeah, we love that shit, yeah. But if that determined how I felt about myself as a coach, completely.
00:22:05.599 --> 00:22:37.079
That's unhealthy. That's an unhealthy attachment to the external. So I think it's this, this deep surrendering back into myself and I this is what it feels like, right? That's a it feels like it's being torn away from me as the deepest reminder of who I am without the external. And so how, if anyone's listening that's like, Fuck, I'm not getting the results. I want all my stories and shit is coming up. How have you in the last eight weeks? How do you surrender?
00:22:39.779 --> 00:25:46.019
Like still doing it? I think the most important thing when it comes to surrender is knowing it's not one decision. It's a decision every single moment when something comes up of, Am I going to go into this and freak out and do all those things, or am I going to notice and choose a different path? Yeah, and so like, even this morning, I could feel this anxiety building in my body while I was drinking coffee. It was like, everything's going to fucking fall apart and it's all fucked and it's never going to turn around. And I was just like, I'm noticing, I'm noticing my need for control right now, and that's not going to serve me. So I went to the beach, and then I went to the gym, and then I sat with my friend in ceremony. And now I'm here, and I have not done any work except for this time now, and it's just like, I don't want to be continuously feeding into my patterns, and so the surrender is noticing the pattern and making a new choice that serves you, and that doesn't mean not working at all, yeah, but I choose, very intentionally, not to work when I'm in an anxious state, because then my perfectionist comes up, my hyper vigilance, so I'll be like, on my phone checking, you know, emails, this, that, this, that, and like, doing all of that, of like trying to, trying to feel a sense of control by seeing the external thing, um, I usually jump between 4000 things. So I'm so dysregulated that I can't focus anyway, yeah, yeah. And nothing's ever good enough. So it's like that's that drives that perfectionism, but like the overachiever and all of those sorts of patterns that I can fall into, so I I just intentionally go. I'm surrendering to how I feel right now, and I will not fix it through that. But once I'm regulated, of course, I'm going to circle back, because there's also a surrender there of reality and doing nothing for me currently, like in my experience, that also is not helpful, because then you're sitting there and you feel completely out of control because you literally haven't done anything. And they can be shadows around that as well. So it's, it's just marrying these, these two you want to go masculine feminine energies, yeah, or yin and yang of what is most needed right now for me to regulate myself and surrender to that. I love the way you framed that, quickly interrupting this episode to let you know that the mind school method is sold out for 2024 and we are very close to opening enrolment for 2025 this is the one stop shop certification for coaches who want to upskill so that you can create more impact, more money and more freedom. If you or your clients are getting stuck, looping on old patterns, holding yourself back, or just simply want to catapult to your next level. The mind school method is the place to learn how to powerfully lead yourself so that you can get the best out of your clients and all the people you love. It is six days. It is immersive, it is transformative, and it is where you will learn the best of the best coaching tools from NLP mind.
00:25:46.099 --> 00:25:59.480
Set Shadow Work and emotional embodiment so that you can be the best coach you can be, and have an overflowing heart and bank account to match your overflowing toolkit. The link for the waitlist is in the show notes. Now back to the episode.
00:26:00.679 --> 00:27:27.959
It happens all the time. I'm sure you get this question too, like when you start teaching shadow, most people will go, but how do I get rid of it? That's always the first question. How do I get rid of and it's like, I'm hoping that it's becoming very clear that like you don't necessarily get rid of like you said before, I notice scarcity come up, and when scarcity comes up, I want to go into the manipulator. And I fucking resonate with that. One of my biggest shadows was around manipulation like and I remember, I think I might have said it to you in shadow alchemy. I have so many pieces of evidence from being really, like, really young. My mom and dad would just be like, Oh, you're such a schema. Like, you're such a little schema. I'd like, wrap one around my finger and then put, you know, mum said I could, but not say to dad, like, all these little things, such a little schema. And I built this thing, and then held a lot of shame around it, but then, yeah, it was something that was playing out in business, because the same thing I would manipulate, but now it's actually just seeing, Oh, right now I feel like I could want to go into that like you said, How do I make people buy? And I'm choosing differently. I'm not necessarily getting rid of but I'm choosing differently and getting way better at doing it, not in hindsight, doing it in the moment. And so we're not getting rid of anything, guys like we're not getting rid of shit. We're not fixing you, because you're not broken. And the more you try to get rid of parts of yourself, the more you cast it back into the shadows.
00:27:24.219 --> 00:27:45.599
So what you can see Caitlin doing right now is actually, this is how you, and I don't even like the terms like dissolve the shadows, because, like I'm you don't dissolving it, but this is how you essentially detach you d maybe you dissolve shame and the the energy of shame around it.
00:27:45.839 --> 00:28:51.199
This is the work. It's actually what you're doing. It's not the getting rid of it's the observing and choosing differently totally. And it's like, and if this makes anyone feel better, like, I've done this for seven years, and I've I studied psychology 12 years ago, so I've known about this for a long fucking time, and this shit still comes up. So yeah, please don't feel like you're like, oh my god, it's coming up. I'm terrible. No, you're magnificently human. And I know like the part of us are so, so deeply wants to escape that because we want because it's painful, because it is painful, the human experience is deeply painful, and that's the contrast. Because if we didn't have the deep pain, if I don't go through this, like, if, you know, if I jump back on three months and I'm at 100k cash months, it wouldn't mean the same thing, right? That doesn't mean I'm choosing it. God, thank you. Yeah, still open, Julie, my Yeah, it's this the way that I have always looked at shadows.
00:28:51.199 --> 00:29:06.679
Because I got into shadow work because I held such deep shame about myself, and I never read a book on Shadow Work. I read a book on shame, which was about shadows, and it was the first time for me. So I really got introduced into it as this.
00:29:06.799 --> 00:29:09.279
There's nothing wrong with you.
00:29:06.799 --> 00:29:19.359
You are whole, and you have light things that you see and dark things that you feel shame and try not to see. And so it's always about integration of seeing the seeing the whole picture. So I'm really grateful.
00:29:19.359 --> 00:29:33.000
Like the earliest teachers I had in this were not Instagram, like people were not talking about this back then these are, like, very well studied people.
00:29:27.059 --> 00:29:38.159
And I was like, it's sort of like, you have your wardrobe, right? And you look in your wardrobe, you're like, Okay, what do I want to wear today?
00:29:38.459 --> 00:30:46.019
You don't fucking put on every piece of clothing. And you also don't wear things that aren't like, if you're going to yoga class. You're not fucking wearing skinny, tight jeans and a shirt that your titties are going to fall out when you're in Downward Facing Dog, yeah? Like, I'm going to yoga class, so I'm going to wear fucking yoga pants and a prop that hold my titties in place, right? Yeah. So it's we're doing the same thing with our shadows, of going, Okay, well, what? Not even shadows like our entire personality trait closet of, well, what's most helpful to me as the human in this moment, and if it's not the jings, the whatever tight shirt, then how do I put on the yoga pants? And then sometimes, like, if we go back to my example of like, choosing to go the beach is like I choose to put on relaxation and regulation and calm. And then there's times where I am working and I'm I'm probably a lot more fiery when I tend to work. And so that's just a different trait of mine, and I just bring that out when I'm working, when I'm speaking, because I love that part of me as well, but it.
00:30:46.099 --> 00:30:49.579
Not the only part, and I don't have to wear it all the time.
00:30:51.019 --> 00:31:06.819
And what I love about that analogy and the way that you frame that is it takes away. The more I studied shadow and and all of these pieces, it almost took away like, you know that when it feels very high school, like that person's so fake.
00:31:06.819 --> 00:31:26.699
She's this person, around that person, but around this person, she's totally different. And, like all of these little pieces, and it's like, can't you just be all of it? Like I, I remember, actually, this is so interesting. I have always had very diverse groups of friends.
00:31:22.059 --> 00:32:39.059
Like, if you lined up my besties, it would be like, what the actual like Bush bogans that are like, happy on the farm and have never worn high heels in their life, and my other bestie, who is literally like, blonde, diva bombshell, like all of that. And I always felt like, what is Am I a like, am I a chameleon? I think someone said that was like, Are you just you could Are you a chameleon? I was like, No, all of these people represent parts of me, and those parts come out around certain people. But then I used to think, Oh, my God, am I fake? Do I not know who I am? Am I just a shape shifter? But the truth is that all of them exist. Some people just bring out different parts of us. And I think, like you said, if we give ourselves permission to have a huge wardrobe, and know that a big wardrobe exists, you don't have to just although, if I think of my wardrobe, I literally do wear the same four things all the time and everything else you don't wear. But it's a great analogy where all of it, where the whole wardrobe, and that doesn't mean that you're fake or inauthentic when different pieces come out, just like you can be a fucking powerhouse. I see you as a powerhouse, and you've just told me how you're feeling like a fucking sack of shit, and it's like you're still a powerhouse. You're still both.
00:32:39.119 --> 00:33:11.379
You can have the summer dress and the winter clothes, and one doesn't cancel out the other totally, totally. And that I believe, especially in in business, knowing that is one of the most helpful things. Because what used to happen before I got into shadow work was I would have one bad day and be like, everything else is canceled, right? Like I can't teach on this and I can't do personal development. Like I'm not this perfect shiny object anymore.
00:33:07.539 --> 00:33:54.559
And so the shame around that was, was the thing. And then when I was like, oh, right, like I can be both. I can be literally falling apart, and I can still hold a relationship and friendships and go to the gym and go to the beach and hold my business and do what needs to be done, but I can still feel like it's really fucking hard right now. But that doesn't cancel out like, and this is what I've been like. I'm picking even more during this time. Is like, the the worthiness around being a coach, and it's like, just because in this fucking moment, my business is not this shiny thing that you think it needs to be in order for me to be a good coach. That's actually your shadow work and not mine.
00:33:54.859 --> 00:34:20.559
Because how many times do people buy the marketing and the shiny object and they get the shittest coaching experience behind the scenes? Oh, mate, that's a whole another conversation. I reckon there's so many incredible coaches. Oh no, incredible marketers out there. And I've seen this. I've experienced this myself, incredible marketers.
00:34:16.780 --> 00:34:24.699
And I take full responsibility, like, I fall for the marketing.
00:34:20.559 --> 00:34:52.760
I'm so like, I'm a human. It pushes on all of my things. I see it, and I'm like, I know what this person's doing, but I want to buy like, I want to know this secret sauce that you fucking speak about so dumb. I'm so gullible. But like, I've seen it, I've fallen for it. I've spent literally 50, $60,000 on containers where I've gotten in and gone, oh, that was some great marketing. I don't know if this person's ever done any coaching training, yeah, yeah.
00:34:52.820 --> 00:35:12.039
And vice versa, humans who I know are, what terrible marketers, and I think what a shame, because they're the best coaches. And so even I think, like there's so much to that, but even knowing where your skill set needs some you know, up leveling can make you a lot.
00:35:08.440 --> 00:35:46.019
Yeah, yeah. There's so much of that. And I was actually saying this the other day that I find that a lot of the like, the best, safest, most beautiful coaches suffer the most in marketing because they don't. They're so afraid of, like, I don't want to shame someone or manipulate them like they care so deeply. And look, they've got shadows around that, and this is something I've had to work along, including myself. Yeah, but it's like, it is a shame, because you're like, you have so so much potential to change.
00:35:46.099 --> 00:35:57.380
The world, and it's the same. I mean, we do see that in society, like the people who tend to make the most money are generally not the greatest. That's not all cases, just to be clear, it's not all cases, and it has nothing to do with the money.
00:35:57.380 --> 00:36:20.799
They just weren't great to start with, yeah, but you they get there, because I don't give a fuck. They're just like, I will step on toes and I will manipulate and I will scheme and I will do shady shit, because that's my thing. But then when you see these people who deeply care and feel and empathize with people, they're like, I don't like that being done to me, so I don't want to do that to you.
00:36:18.279 --> 00:36:54.739
And then they get caught up in this whole story around manipulation and shame, and then they do absolutely nothing. And it's like, you, the people that can need to have the money, and I don't hate it. I just like this about the culture that we live in is, is that piece of we it's getting caught up in the story, right in the narrative, and we're not willing to look at it with like, a clear lens of this person marketing to me, like, how can I look at that closer, more closely? Are they?
00:36:50.659 --> 00:37:51.380
Are they actually who they say they are? When have I seen the other side? And I always say, like, the light of the light, the darker the shadow. If I see someone who is constantly light and shiny and like, never has anything and never talks about what they're moving through. For me, that's just a red flag, yeah, and that doesn't mean that it they have to do that by any means, but for me, it's a red flag. And so I, and I probably do this the hard way, is like, such a deep part of my mission, in the business space, in the coaching space, is to be human, is to show the humanity, even if it means that maybe I don't scale like out of this world, because I'm like, I would rather people see me and I see them, and when we're working together, it's just beautiful, like my clients that I get to work with, it is the fucking best thing ever.
00:37:48.860 --> 00:38:01.880
Like, I don't have to wear a mask. I don't have to pretend things are perfect. Like, yeah, I feel you're on that navigating and so it's for me, that's sustainability.
00:38:02.420 --> 00:38:29.759
That is sustainability, because you will waste so much energy trying to hold those shadows of yours down right? And it will, you'll get burnt out. You end up not liking your business and all of those things. And so maybe it feels like the harder way for me right now, but I've also had a lot of success from it, yeah, and I've had like the success is not just the financial success.
00:38:29.759 --> 00:39:22.960
The success is when a client says, Thank you so much for saying that I feel similar or I didn't know anyone else felt like this, so I don't feel so alone. Isn't that the point of development work? Isn't that the point of coaching is to be a better fucking human, compassionate, yeah, yeah, it's so wild. And I actually something I was thinking about too, there was like, you know, there's two sides to this, because people think like being a human is showing your vulnerability, showing your struggles, showing what you're working through, your obstacles, your hardships, your adversities. And I agree with that, and I I think that that's so important, but something that we've always we spoke about once in WhatsApp, and I love the post that you created for me, vulnerability is the flip side of that I'm okay. I'm okay to share what I'm struggling with.
00:39:19.539 --> 00:39:29.819
I'm okay to share what's going on behind the scenes. I'm pretty much an open book, but for me to stand in my power, for me to stand and say, hey, guess what?
00:39:29.819 --> 00:39:37.500
My business has made seven figures. Hey, guess what? I just did a whatever like to own my power that is vulnerable to me.
00:39:37.920 --> 00:40:02.779
And I think that there's both sides to the equation, because we also live in a society where it's like, be good, but not too good, because you'll get cut down and be good, but still be relatable. You don't want to not be relatable anymore. So don't be too powerful. And my work to do is almost the flip side of that. Share your quote humanity.
00:39:57.019 --> 00:40:02.779
Humanity is also powerful.
00:40:02.779 --> 00:40:46.019
Humanity is also strong, and I've had to be okay with sharing power, but that's where my shadow work was to do, because I was so afraid of being anything other than little country bumpkin Breanna, like relatable Bogan, yeah. And that's, you know, this is golden shadow work, right? And that's I when I teach on shadow work. And it's always like, I kind of when I even when I'm with someone and I'm listening to them speak, if they're coming on as a client, I'm in my mind. I'm like, okay, cool. Like they're associating themselves with what we would typically look at as the dark shadow, so they think that they're not good enough and they're a loser and like, that's, that's something that I really came from. And then I can also gage if someone is associating themselves with the.
00:40:46.099 --> 00:41:07.239
Golden shadow more, which is like they think that they are larger than life and the most amazing, and they're terrified of anyone seeing anything other than that. And so it's this duality like, and that humanity is the duality, right, of like you can be both that sometimes, and you can have that you could be making seven figures and still feel like a bag of dicks.
00:41:08.440 --> 00:41:33.779
Neither is wrong, but what are we choosing to show? And as you said, like, what feels most vulnerable? And I, as you said, like, I did that post because it was a lot, the trend was kind of like, here's what I don't show on social media. And it was all these people always presented really, like, perfectly showing their hard things. And I was like, well, here's what I don't show on social media. And they were like, all of my wins, yeah.
00:41:33.839 --> 00:41:40.619
I even had clients being like, I had no idea about how much money you had made, or, you know, this or this, or this, or whatever.
00:41:40.679 --> 00:43:01.159
I'm like, Yeah, that's true. And I think that actually kicked off the flip of going, like, trying to push a new narrative, and then I lost myself in that. And happen is like this pendulum swinging, but you have to overstep your own boundaries to find where your line is, yeah, and that's the middle ground which is so it's so, yeah, you'll probably lose it, and then you'll find it, then you'll lose it, then you'll find it, and you'll just be on this fucking washing machine and have an Eggsy. Yeah, just another Eggsy. But guys, if you're having an existential crisis, you can always hit Caitlin and I up because we have them regularly. Like, what is the point of humaning is? Yeah, go listen to Caitlin's podcast. And if people want to follow you, look at your 50 shades of Caitlyn. We need to do another episode about ADHD, because there's a lot that we could talk about with that. There's so many more topics, and we've both discovered we don't love podcasting alone in our rooms at home. So we might do more of these. But if you'd like to talk to Caitlin and message either of us about some new topics, we can bring where can people find you, to connect with you. There you can find me at complete on the score by Caitlin. And if you want to learn more specifically about, like, human nervous system, Shadow Work, that sort of stuff. Then go to shadow alchemy Coaching Academy, share more the education content there. And then on my on my personal page, I just show whatever is alive.
00:43:02.900 --> 00:43:13.420
That's my little playground. So you're gonna see a bit of unhinged shit. And then I have a podcast called Shadow Work. What the fuck? So you can always listen to that.
00:43:10.119 --> 00:43:21.400
Thank you so much. We'll be back for round three. Thank you for having me. Thank you for tuning in to the mind school podcast.
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It is a massive intention of mine to continue to grow this show, because the more the show grows, the better the guests get, and I know that is going to be so powerful for you listening. So if I could ask this massive favor, it would mean the world if you could please leave a review, hit the Follow button, or leave a rating on Spotify, so that we can continue to grow this show and bring you the juiciest, most thought provoking and expansive conversations through incredible guests. Thank you so much for tuning in. I'll see you next week. You.
