TC Elders (Audio); Connection and Memory: Inside the Therapeutic Community Elders Network

Therapeutic Community Elders & the PETT Archive (Planned Environment Therapy Trust)

Episode summary: In this conversation, David Jones and Naomi Murphy are joined by Tom Harrison, Sarah Paget, Vicky Gavin, and David Kennard.. Together they explore what the Therapeutic Community (TC) Elders are, why their monthly open forums matter, and what it means for the field that the PETT archive at Toddington is closing. The group reflects on sustaining therapeutic community ideas, making knowledge accessible through a “living archive” (including Vicky’s A–Z artwork concept), and how people can get involved.

• Tom Harrison – Psychiatrist (worked in a therapeutic community in the 1970s); historian of therapeutic communities.
• Sarah Paget – Director at the Mulberry Bush; supports and coordinates the TC Elders and related activity.
• Vicky (Victoria) – Formerly worked at The Retreat (Acorn programme) and managed the therapeutic community at HMP Send; also an artist developing an A–Z “living archive” concept.
• David Kennard – Clinical psychologist; long-standing contributor to the therapeutic community field (including writing/editing roles) and TC Elders participant.

• Where the idea of the TC Elders came from and what the group is for.
• Why the monthly Zoom Open Forums have become a key way of staying connected across countries and services.
• How the Elders aim to hold a space for thinking, including “negative capability” (the capacity to sit with not knowing).
• Who the Open Forums are for (not only people in formal therapeutic communities), and what people get from attending.
• The story and purpose of the PETT archive—and what is being lost (and potentially preserved) as it closes.
• A “living archive” approach: Vicky’s A–Z artwork as a way to invite memories, reflections, and contributions from the wider community.

• 01:03 – Welcome and what the conversation will cover (TC Elders and the PETT archive).
• 01:29 – Introductions: Tom Harrison, Sarah Paget, Vicky (Victoria), David Kennard, Dr Naomi Murphy.
• 03:51 – What are the Therapeutic Community Elders and why were they formed?
• 05:51 – The monthly Open Forums: connection, learning, and support across settings and countries.
• 10:03 – How to access the Open Forums; typical attendance and the “no fee” ethos.
• 15:26 – Who can be an Elder? How invitations work and why in-person meetings matter.
• 21:51 – Vicky’s A–Z “living archive” artwork idea and how it could become open and collaborative.
• 28:38 – What is the PETT archive and what has it contained?
• 32:39 – Why the archive is closing (May 31) and the practical realities of maintaining it.
• 33:59 – Preserving therapeutic community ideas in a climate that often undervalues long-term, relational work.
• 40:04 – Closing reflections: why therapeutic community ideas are “common sense” and broader than TCs.

• The TC Elders are less about “giving answers” and more about holding a reflective space for practitioners and communities.
• The Open Forums function as a predictable monthly “anchor” that supports people doing relational work in challenging contexts.
• The PETT archive represents a major collective memory of therapeutic community practice; its closure highlights the real costs of preserving history.
• “Living archive” approaches (like the A–Z concept) may help capture stories, artefacts, and learning that don’t always make it into formal publications.

• TC Elders contact : Sarah Paget – spaget@mulberrybush.org.uk
• Host organisation: The Mulberry Bush (hosts the TC Elders).
• Archive discussed: PETT archive (Planned Environment Therapy Trust archive) at Toddington (noted as closing May 31).