How a College Became 100% Pesticide Free and Grew a Food Forest | ChicoBag Podcast Ep8

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Music.
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Welcome to the Chico Bag Podcast, where we explore how to leave everything better
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than we found it, whether it's products we use, the systems we build, or the land we walk on.
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I'm your host, Andy Keller, and today we're joined by Stephan Klassen,
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Assistant Director of Sustainable Practices at Cascadia College of Washington.
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Cascadia's campus has earned national recognition as the number one sustainable
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college grounds in the country every year since 2018.
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It's home to a 58-acre restored wetland, and it's 100% pesticide-free and serves
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as a living example of what's possible when sustainability is built into a campus from the ground up.
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In this episode, we'll explore how educational institutions can lead the way
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in sustainability and how restored natural landscapes can double as classrooms
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and what lessons any organization or individual can take from Cascadia's model,
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no matter where you are. Let's dive in.
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Welcome, Stephanie. Great, thank you. Happy to be here.
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So tell me a little bit about the campus. It sounds amazing.
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Yeah. So we're a new community college. And the true point is that we're also
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tied to University of Washington Bothell.
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We're a joint campus with the two schools.
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And it was a push back in the late 90s to build this school from the ground up.
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And the state really wanted to do a land restoration project, too.
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So adding this, you know, we mentioned the 58 acre restored wetland.
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So that was the kind of main driving initiative force to kind of get the sustainability
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and land conservation and restoration on the idea.
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And then things started really growing from there. So now, since 2006,
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we went pesticide-free, and that takes a whole different management strategy.
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We'll cover that, I'm sure, quite a bit.
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And then from there, we realized that, you know, once you're pesticide-free,
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there's so much more you can do, right? You can bring the bees back and support
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pollinators. You can do food access areas for people and offer things that people
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can forage and kind of pick on their own.
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We've done much more like natural restorations and wildlife habitat spaces.
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We've done a few spaces that kind of made people shake their heads and wonder
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about things sometimes here and there too.
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So it's been interesting, like the pathway as we grow, but that pesticide-free
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was the first real start.
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And from there, we've been able to like showcase what can be done,
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how it can work with nature around buildings and use it as a classroom itself.
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And this is, you know, things people can do at home, too, which is exciting.
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I mean, I got it. It's 100 percent pesticide free. It's impressive.
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So what are the alternative practices that you're using there and how can we
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use that at home or, you know, at our own organization?
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The first one really is just realizing that when we say pesticide free,
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we really mean like synthetic pesticides or, you know, chemical pesticides.
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Insecticides and things, right? So stuff that's made by chemical companies to
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physically kill things, right?
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A lot of weeds, if you have problems with weeds, can be dealt with much more
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natural things like vinegar treatments or even just hand pulling and things.
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And so we have a full-time grounds keeping team that actually does manage differently,
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right? They do a lot more mowing and weeding.
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If something invasive comes in, there's specific spot treatment where they actually
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care and make sure they pull that and pull it and target that aggressively than overplant.
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The idea is that the whole strategy of how you actually manage your landscape
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is really different, where it's not only just, you know, handle a spot,
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it's supposed to be beautiful,
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and spray things that you don't like, and just grow exactly the things you want.
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I mean, things are a little bit more wild on our campus.
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We definitely have to grow specific native plants or other things that are adapted
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to the region to shade out things that would be weeds, right?
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We're in the Pacific Northwest, we have a ton of blackberry that comes in quickly
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and other things like knotweed that we've had to deal with here and there.
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And admittedly, right, there's been a few times emergency, like an orange invasive
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comes in, they've had to do a quick spot treatment, wipe out the thing,
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then ground cover the whole area.
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Keep it covered in like a plastic sheet for six months to
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a year and then make sure they pull any of the stragglers that
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come out but then the management is we have our grounds
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team always out there you know watching the land knowing what to grow allowing
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different things to kind of sprout naturally and not you know just pulling anything
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you don't recognize kind of idea so i mean what what can everyday people people
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are listening to this podcast do to adopt a more natural, you know, gardening.
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Right. Yeah. Like, like you guys have there. Like what are some of the lessons
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that you've learned? 100% pesticide free is hard. And we get that right.
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Especially if you're like managing a larger landscape and things,
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but less pesticides is the first step, right? You really don't need as much
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as people are probably spraying out in the world because it doesn't just kill weeds.
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It kills insects. It kills birds.
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It kills some of the plants you do want. And so that's actually the biggest
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thing. You can just take the step to stop using a lot of these chemicals.
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Roundup, you find in everyday grocery stores and those type of chemicals are
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usually the first ones that probably need to go.
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I mean, people don't know, but those are the chemicals used in multiple wars
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to actually kill people like 50 to 100 years ago.
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So that's not things we really want our kids playing on in lawns and things.
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Number two is lawns, right? If you have a lawn that you want to use for like
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kids playing or dogs running, sure, keep the space, but you don't need to keep
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the lawn if you're not using it really, or you can let it go a bit more wild, right?
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Plant some native plants, plant some berry bushes, plant things that are more functionally useful.
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A lawn was something that 17th century aristocrats wanted to show that they
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didn't need to grow food or something. It's like, we don't really need that anymore.
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That's interesting. The aristocrat, I never really thought about,
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you know, our landscape.
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Yeah. You imagine the giant palaces of like the French, right?
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And having hundreds of acres of lawn just because of that. But I mean,
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even in the 17th century, right?
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People would be growing food If they had the space, they'd be growing orchards
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or berry areas or mixed food forest type things or even like grapes for wine.
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Right. They wouldn't be having just lawn unless they really didn't need the space.
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I love the idea of going through the campus and finding food.
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In my own yard, I have fruit trees. And just the other day, I'm like,
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yeah, there's still oranges on my fruit tree. It's been there all year long.
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And anytime I want an orange, I go pick one. That's the best. Yeah.
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And it's nothing like having fruit right off the tree.
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So is anyone on campus just able to pick whatever they want?
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Pretty much. I mean, within reasonable limits, we ask. We have a food forest
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on campus that won an award back in 21, being like one of the first college campuses to have this.
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And the idea was, because, again, we're pesticide free, that anything is more
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or less safe to pick within reasons and limits and allergies and such, of course.
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But we grow everything from an apple orchard. We have this food forest that's
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mixed fruit and nuts to grow and berries.
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And it's open foraging. So if people need a snack between classes,
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right, because we're students and things, they can go and pick berries or fruit
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when the season comes in.
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The community members will walk their dogs across campus in the summer and then
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they'll pick a couple of mulberries or something.
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And the really fun part about it, especially we're lucky we're in the Pacific
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Northwest again, that we have this climate that allows for a huge variety of
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things to grow. So we have weird fruit people have never heard of.
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Things like medlars, goji berries, persimmons, Chinese hawthorn, cornelian cherries.
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I mean, stuff you will never find in a grocery store.
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But people love to experiment and try new things that way. I mean,
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I tried quince for the first time this year.
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So what is Chinese hawthorn? What's that taste like? It's a sour kind of red,
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kind of grape-sized fruit. It has seeds inside.
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You have to actually crack it open and scrape the seeds out.
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It's kind of like a chewy, kind of like a dry pear texture, but then much more sour like a cherry.
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Wow. Yeah, weird. Apparently Chinese people make it into a candy and they'll
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cover it in honey and candy it on sticks too, which is really more popular.
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That's neat. So, I mean, it sounds like.
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I mean, a great place to go to school. So, you know, how does higher education,
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you know, in this kind of, you know, you almost have like your own universe
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that you're able to operate in, you know, how can,
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you know, we learn from what you're doing?
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And what does this mean for like the largest sustainability movement across
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the world? That's not easy to answer, actually.
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I mean, the hardest part is that we are kind of a small or we're a very small
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school, but we're a small universe, too, in higher education trying to help people learn.
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And because we're also a college, we're trying to help people learn accessibly.
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So education that's affordable for people, that has more open access,
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that doesn't have harsh stricture requirements to get in, that's really one
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of our main missions to start.
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But then two, being able to use the campus itself as a learning space,
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as a living laboratory that people can come to and learn, just being on the
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campus makes a huge difference.
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Sustainability is a kind of a goal to you know
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make the world better people keep seeing all the problems in the world
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the news is scary we want to find ways to
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help people just think that you know there's hope in the world and society can
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be better we can do better than what we're currently doing and these are different
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pathways i mean grounds is where we shine but we have you know buildings and
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practices we have a sustainability bachelor's program that's several of my students
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still work their way through college and you can pay for it somehow like where we're there to kind of
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create opportunities and make a difference for me or at least
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train people to make a difference yeah i'm curious you know besides the
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grounds and your sustainability programs like what other things
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are you doing on campus but um we have i said buildings right so we have multiple
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lead certified buildings that's the leadership and energy and environmental
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design so several buildings that way so one building like captures rainwater
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to flush toilets all of them have south-facing windows to capture more lights.
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We reduce our power usage.
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A big one for like architects up here that are doing is external stairwells,
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where the stairwell is just externalized from the HVAC system,
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so it's never heated or cooled in the summer and winter.
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So they're freezing, admittedly, in the winter, but the building energy goes
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down because you don't have to actually keep that place warm that,
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you know, people use for 30 seconds to two minutes just going in the stairwell.
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For practices, we're big on zero waste as wherever we can, right?
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We have full composting across our whole campus, so we really push people to compost more.
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Even recycling is hard for people. I make mistakes recycling all the time myself.
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It's the best way to recycle or reduce waste is not to make it in the first place.
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Yes. So we train people on that, everything from orientation to students on
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different ways to sort waste.
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Common because we're in a higher education, right? Whiteboards are everywhere.
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Faculty are offered at times we haven't
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done in a little bit so we have to redo this soon but faculty are offered refillable
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whiteboard markers so that you know different practices again right choosing
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different pathways that doesn't create waste is kind of part of our culture
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that way you know i i'm seeing i'm hearing a theme you know as far as orienting
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the buildings you know having windows in the right location you know having the,
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the pollinators on campus, you know, it seems like everything is the idea of
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working with nature instead of working against nature.
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And it seems like a lot of humanity is just fighting nature instead of,
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you know, working with nature.
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So what kind of surprises have you learned, you know, through the process of working with nature?
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What's happened that has surprised you? First and foremost, how much nature
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wants to actually come back and kind of just produce.
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Our wetland of being 58 acres was, you know, it was a cattle ranch.
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Let's be honest. It was a full on cattle ranch.
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I mean, they had rodeos here before the early 2000s and it got restructured
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and redesigned to be a wetland and nature has come back.
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We have crows, we have beavers, animals came back to the site and use it,
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even though we're surrounded by the two different highways.
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There's interstates that surround our campus on two sides.
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The other part too with, I mean, the pesticide freeze that, you know,
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how much you can actually grow in different spaces, even, you know,
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no matter where you are in the US or across the world, right,
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there's ways you can grow your own food from gardens and things to small fruit trees, whatever you,
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you know, have locally, you can find your own local food.
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And then I guess the kind of negative side is how much people don't realize
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this is possible is the third kind of discovery.
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Students don't often know where their food comes from, they don't understand
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what happens to their waste.
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People don't realize about electricity or how we're, you know,
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producing pollution and things.
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And that's something we've had to educate over and over again.
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I mean, we have new students every year.
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That said, right, people really care about, you know, water and salmon and fish
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and where their food, how healthy their food is and, like, what they can actually do in nature.
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People love hiking and things, so the experience matters for everything from
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exercise to mental health.
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So that's been a wonderful discovery to learn how much, you know,
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if you build the space, If you kind of start working, as you said,
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right, with nature instead of against it, there's benefits that quickly come along that path.
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Yeah, you mentioned mental health. You know, I imagine having all these open
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spaces and time for students to go explore and pick fruit and connect with nature,
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see the butterflies and the bees, like,
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Do you think your campus is happier than the average campus?
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I've worked on a couple and I probably, right? I mean, people have the opportunity
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to just have the green space to walk.
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They can go out and find and people, students stop me and tell me they saw certain
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animals and things, right?
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We have black tip weasels are super cute and they're a popular one when people spot them on campus.
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So I think, yeah, a bit. But then just as long as students take advantage of that.
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I mean, we are in Seattle, so we get a lot of rain and gloom.
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And so there is the mental health challenge of that always.
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But with people in the spring and the fall, being able to actually use the green
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space and kind of just be in a sort of natural space really does make people
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happy. I mean, that's great.
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What advice do you have to people listening of, you know, what's some easy steps
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people can take to, I mean, realize some of the things that you've realized
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on campus, you know, maybe at their own house?
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At the house level, right? I'm just going to repeat myself, right?
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The low pesticides is always the start, right?
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You can't grow food on your site if you're going to be eating your own pesticides. It's no good.
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Two, actually, growing your own food is surprisingly both mentally healthy and
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exciting, right? You can watch. I mean, if you have kids, right?
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Kids love watching carrots or cucumbers or tomatoes pop up and grow.
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And then connecting in different ways to the other nature and landscape around you, right?
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Even if people who live in apartments, if they have bird feeders or small patio
00:14:57.705 --> 00:15:01.825
gardens and things, Those actually make a difference for both the natural landscape
00:15:01.825 --> 00:15:03.005
and the urban environment, but
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also helps you be happier having your own little plants in the area, too.
00:15:06.965 --> 00:15:09.825
I mean, not everyone loves plants, right? Everyone loves food.
00:15:10.965 --> 00:15:17.585
Yes. So whether you love plants, love food, love the planet, you want to feel better.
00:15:18.045 --> 00:15:23.305
I mean, Stephan, you're outlining, I think, a pretty solid argument that we
00:15:23.305 --> 00:15:25.425
all should be doing what you guys are doing at Cascadia.
00:15:26.165 --> 00:15:29.385
That's the hope, right? I mean, trying to showcase, at the very least,
00:15:29.505 --> 00:15:31.625
if nothing else, lower pesticides, but more.
00:15:31.745 --> 00:15:34.045
There's so many other things you can do to make yourself happier,
00:15:34.145 --> 00:15:37.865
your life a little bit more self-sufficient or community-oriented or better.
00:15:38.925 --> 00:15:42.405
Well, thank you so much for being on the podcast and sharing the great work
00:15:42.405 --> 00:15:45.105
you're doing. And I applaud you.
00:15:46.605 --> 00:15:49.585
And I'm inspired. Thank you. Yeah, happy to.
00:15:50.005 --> 00:15:54.765
I mean, if anyone is interested in our programs and things, happy to have people contact me.
00:15:54.885 --> 00:16:00.005
I mean, we're in the Seattle area. So, yeah, happy to talk to students or just even community groups.
00:16:00.765 --> 00:16:04.325
Great. You're open for tours? Oh, yeah. We give about at least one a month,
00:16:04.445 --> 00:16:07.545
sometimes more. Awesome. Well, great. Thank you so much.
00:16:07.760 --> 00:16:19.667
Music.