1. Exploring Artistic Intention: The Beauty of Unintentional Art and Creativity's Staying Power

WEBVTT
00:00:00.100 --> 00:00:01.185
So we had the new camera.
00:00:01.360 --> 00:00:09.891
We covered that influence, micro, contemporary We like touched on that but I don't think we, we, uh, we're going to have to revisit that.
00:00:09.919 --> 00:00:11.025
We're going to have to come back to that.
00:00:11.025 --> 00:00:17.440
The creative act, the Rick Rubin book no did not, we didn't even alluded to it several times, but I didn't get into it.
00:00:17.539 --> 00:00:18.986
You tied it in nicely at the end, though.
00:00:19.920 --> 00:00:20.984
Project timelines.
00:00:20.984 --> 00:00:25.469
No creativity as a muscle starting losing motivation?
00:00:25.469 --> 00:00:26.663
Yeah, didn't?
00:00:26.702 --> 00:00:32.039
I don't even think, we even thought about that, and you could argue that even some of these could be entire episodes.
00:00:32.039 --> 00:00:34.067
This is going to be the next episode.
00:00:35.740 --> 00:00:38.810
Um, naming the podcast right Pretention.
00:00:38.810 --> 00:00:40.109
We didn't really talk about that.
00:00:40.109 --> 00:00:44.628
No we did, though I had I call myself an artist in parentheses or.
00:00:44.628 --> 00:00:49.545
I can't call myself an artist in parentheses and that that kind of kicked things off And we did talk about that.
00:00:49.545 --> 00:00:52.487
Let us attempting a thesis, and why?
00:00:52.487 --> 00:00:54.685
for the podcast Definitely didn't even touch that.
00:00:54.685 --> 00:00:57.808
No, so we talked about the new camera.
00:00:58.262 --> 00:01:02.200
We talked about the new camera and and the prompt about the artist.
00:01:02.200 --> 00:01:05.751
The artist led us into a discussion about.
00:01:06.260 --> 00:01:06.701
So what?
00:01:06.701 --> 00:01:12.894
I'd give us 1.3 out of six agreed.
00:01:14.001 --> 00:01:20.760
And it'd been a golden afternoon And I remember having the familiar conviction that life was beginning over again with the summer.
00:01:20.780 --> 00:01:31.688
Somebody's I would rather take something that works really well and doesn't look beautiful than something that's beautiful and doesn't work.
00:01:31.688 --> 00:01:41.801
I'm going to take function over form personally, but I personally gravitate towards the thing that does both, that has both function and and.
00:01:41.801 --> 00:01:50.451
and maybe another aspect of function is not only that it that it does what it's supposed to do well, but that it's also built to last.
00:01:50.451 --> 00:01:59.492
Yeah, it's made out of durable, high quality materials, and the design is informed by just as much as the function is.
00:02:00.340 --> 00:02:24.991
And those those products are difficult to find And, and I think finding community with other people that know of them And that's one thing I love about content creation is if you can get someone that is just kind of tells it like it is, you can get those shortcuts to the product, services, software, whatever it is that That melds function and form, and when you find people who are like minded in that.
00:02:24.991 --> 00:02:35.120
In that, this is one thing I struggle with with my in-laws and my wife is they're very much based on function and cost, cost, cost is the worst factor.
00:02:35.159 --> 00:02:36.667
How do I have something that functions?
00:02:37.350 --> 00:02:39.319
and is as inexpensive as possible.
00:02:39.319 --> 00:02:54.039
And my whole philosophy is, you know, my buddy, doc Rock, always says buy it nice or buy it twice, and I would rather spend more money on something that is functional, has beautiful form or good form and is also made to last.
00:02:54.039 --> 00:03:00.719
That's why people say they don't build them like they used to all that stuff and why we're drawn to that's older, analog things.
00:03:01.944 --> 00:03:07.816
You put it at the top of my list of you know you talk about the life advice or the principles.
00:03:07.816 --> 00:03:14.259
Yeah, and that's one of my major principles And I learned that really young because I, my dad, would always do the opposite.
00:03:14.259 --> 00:03:16.878
Yeah, he doesn't have anything And there's been a golden afternoon.
00:03:18.526 --> 00:03:22.360
And I remember having the familiar conviction of life was beginning over again with the sunlight.
00:03:23.081 --> 00:03:26.733
I buy more than I'd like to, but I don't think most of it.
00:03:26.733 --> 00:03:38.288
The issue is, you start to build this Well, there's the best version of this and I just need to work my way to that, and you have to get the best version of everything in your life, and that's not.
00:03:38.288 --> 00:03:39.939
It's not a good way to approach it.
00:03:39.939 --> 00:03:48.455
But you, you, you buy stuff with the mindset that you're going to have this forever.
00:03:48.675 --> 00:03:48.816
Yeah.
00:03:49.902 --> 00:03:58.360
And what's eventually going to happen is I'm going to have all of this, you know shit, and then I'm going to die and my kids aren't going to want it.
00:03:58.360 --> 00:03:59.960
My grandkids aren't going to want it.
00:03:59.960 --> 00:04:07.280
No, they'll want a piece of it And hopefully I can show that the value of some of these things, oh, man.
00:04:08.223 --> 00:04:13.308
You know, hopefully I read something great with that typewriter and I'm like this was the typewriter that this was written on.
00:04:13.308 --> 00:04:18.612
I want you to have this and then it helps to at least identify the value a little.
00:04:18.612 --> 00:04:25.012
It's a more effective way of taping the value onto it in their minds.
00:04:25.012 --> 00:04:29.214
Maybe the like it's all these great photos we're taking on this camera.
00:04:29.214 --> 00:04:30.338
This is yours now, Right?
00:04:30.338 --> 00:04:36.026
But yeah, you spend all your life collecting stuff that you're going to Nobody's going to care about at some point.
00:04:36.026 --> 00:04:39.970
We were in an antique store the other day and there were a bunch of bowling trophies.
00:04:40.391 --> 00:04:45.471
Oh yeah, and I was I told you has a few actual bowling trophies of our own.
00:04:45.512 --> 00:04:51.654
Yeah, i mean, there were hundreds of, probably a hundred bowling trophies, yeah, first place, da, da, da, da, da.
00:04:51.654 --> 00:04:57.904
And I pointed to him and I told Audrey, you know what this is probably this was somebody's entire life.
00:04:58.125 --> 00:04:58.266
Yeah.
00:04:58.920 --> 00:05:06.048
This was what they cared about more than anything in the world Life's work, their life's work and they were so proud of this.
00:05:06.269 --> 00:05:32.220
And now it's just an inanimate object that nobody will buy Nope, and sitting in an antique store waiting to be trashed because it doesn't really have any function, yeah, other than, you know, a reminder, a memory, a marker of achievement for the individual who achieved what that trophy stands for, yeah, so, other than that which doesn't have to anybody else, Right, It doesn't.
00:05:32.279 --> 00:05:36.769
It's like family photos right, i mean, you and I have had discussions about the family photos before.
00:05:36.769 --> 00:05:43.214
Right, there's some of the best photography you'll ever see is just in bins of old family photos.
00:05:43.214 --> 00:05:44.959
Absolutely, it's unbelievable.
00:05:44.959 --> 00:05:46.704
I mean, it's unachievable by anybody.
00:05:46.704 --> 00:06:08.185
And it was somebody's trash, yeah, but why do we, why do we accept photos of strangers and photos of strange things when they're presented to us in the form of art by some significant photographer, mm-hmm, but family photos have?
00:06:08.185 --> 00:06:14.572
no, we don't even put the effort in to give them a context or to give them a significance.
00:06:14.572 --> 00:06:15.740
Why is that?
00:06:15.740 --> 00:06:16.422
That's?
00:06:16.422 --> 00:06:20.932
there's no difference between a William Maggleson photo and some of these.
00:06:20.932 --> 00:06:32.810
I mean, obviously being a William Maggleson photo, but some of these family photos are just as intriguing, just as fascinating, just as beautiful.
00:06:33.783 --> 00:06:36.338
I wonder if it's in the intention behind the photo.
00:06:36.338 --> 00:07:00.163
Yeah, and William Eggleston going out and connecting with something It's weird, you know and trying to capture it on film intentionally versus you know someone who has a kid's birthday party or they're at a car race that they're, you know their uncle is in and they're grabbing.
00:07:00.163 --> 00:07:04.512
You know they're just taking photos as a as a memento, accidental masterpieces Of it.
00:07:05.180 --> 00:07:14.947
There's no doubt that some of them, if you look through, you know shoeboxes full of these things that there's going to be two, three, four that just kind of grab you in a certain way, and others that might not.
00:07:15.420 --> 00:07:28.894
Would you say we over index as a, as a society, we over index on intention, or do you think, on even a more mystical level, that intention, intention, shines through in the final work?
00:07:28.894 --> 00:07:30.966
Cause I think that could be true.
00:07:30.966 --> 00:07:47.285
It sounds really mystical, i know, i just think I have no way to describe it with any kind of but you see something with a grand amount of intention behind it and it does feel a little bit more significant for some reason, and maybe that's all in our mind.
00:07:48.483 --> 00:07:48.925
I think it is.
00:07:48.925 --> 00:07:49.601
I mean for me.
00:07:49.601 --> 00:07:52.449
you know, we were talking about this when we met earlier.
00:07:52.449 --> 00:08:00.314
I was talking about Fred Herzog and the photos that I saw of his through T hoppers video on YouTube.
00:08:00.314 --> 00:08:08.134
And I look at these photos as she shows them on her video and I am just like blown away by how beautiful.
00:08:08.134 --> 00:08:24.468
or there's one photo where it's a storefront and there's a window and there's curtains Yeah, and there's a space in the curtain and a woman's arm is visible resting on a couch in the space And I go the framing, the color.
00:08:24.809 --> 00:08:30.730
You know it's slide film, you know the way everything about it just seems like a rock rock.
00:08:30.730 --> 00:08:31.512
Well painting.
00:08:31.531 --> 00:08:33.166
Yeah, it just seems impossible.
00:08:34.565 --> 00:08:46.340
And this person saw it and captured it beautifully And the magic of that to me is so moving that I almost feel like I'm there.
00:08:47.102 --> 00:08:48.788
I understood what you know.
00:08:48.788 --> 00:09:22.759
You know, if I saw that I would be grabbed by it as well, But he was the one that captured the photo, Yeah, Whereas if I look through family photos even though I might find a photo that is intriguing like, there's one photo of my mom from when we were kids And actually I think it's actually super eight I'm conflating the two because I've seen them so many times, but I think it's super eight footage And there's just in a lot of these shots there's just sort of this distant feeling from my mom, who is all of like 22, with two kids and married to her former high school English teacher.
00:09:22.759 --> 00:09:37.820
Yeah, And there's this distance in her eyes and in the way she looks and the person filming it my dad is not filming her with the intention of capturing a woman that is in an emotional state that is intriguing to him.
00:09:37.820 --> 00:09:41.033
He's just documenting someone decorating a Christmas tree.
00:09:41.033 --> 00:09:42.340
Grab my wife here, Yeah, Grab her.
00:09:42.561 --> 00:09:44.006
But I look at it and I go.
00:09:44.006 --> 00:09:53.994
You know now part of that, though if it was just a stranger like we talked about a shoebox full of some strangers family photos I don't know that I would see that Because it's your mom, because I know Building.
00:09:53.994 --> 00:10:01.822
Yeah, and how I would feel if I was 22 years old and all of a sudden had two kids and a little girl And all of a sudden had two kids and a stepdaughter, and all this?
00:10:02.465 --> 00:10:03.548
craziness going on in my life.
00:10:03.548 --> 00:10:11.885
Let's pretend it's not your mom And I'm not trying to step on that, just for the sake of thought experiment, and it was just a random 22 year old woman.
00:10:11.885 --> 00:10:16.508
Yeah, you know, would you eventually probably work to that same place?
00:10:16.508 --> 00:10:21.970
Maybe you don't know the backstory, but then suddenly there's this endless possibility for backstory.
00:10:22.860 --> 00:10:32.014
But there's something about my mom's energy and demeanor in the footage that communicates something other than someone just happily decorating Christmas tree.
00:10:32.014 --> 00:10:34.019
So, yes, i do.
00:10:34.019 --> 00:11:03.195
I do think so, and I think that that someone finding something like that that is really profound to them, in a pile of footage or a shoebox of photos where the person capturing it did not intend to capture that beauty Or magic or whatever you want to call it, i think it could be just as profound as flipping through a Fred Herzog photography book and seeing photo after photo.
00:11:03.195 --> 00:11:15.414
That is, that is significantly impactful, and maybe the rarity of that makes it even more special than someone who intentionally shot it.
00:11:16.240 --> 00:11:19.450
So it's almost, it is true, documentary Right.
00:11:21.923 --> 00:11:23.904
But the, yeah, you know.
00:11:23.904 --> 00:11:35.860
so I, you know, i gravitate again because I am someone who was trying to take photographs like these masters, in my own way hopefully, but of course influenced by them.
00:11:35.860 --> 00:11:46.956
But But you know, there is something equally special about someone who captures something unintentionally, possibly even more special.
00:11:46.956 --> 00:11:58.912
But, yeah, i mean, i was at an antique store here in Omaha and they had boxes of family photos or pages torn out from photo albums, And it's just.
00:11:59.092 --> 00:12:02.995
you know, I probably spent five minutes going through them and I don't know that.
00:12:02.995 --> 00:12:04.885
I was like, are any of these special?
00:12:04.885 --> 00:12:07.355
Yeah, But they weren't.
00:12:07.355 --> 00:12:12.159
they were not remarkable to me, But it also could be because of the context.
00:12:12.159 --> 00:12:14.195
Yeah, They've been discarded, they've been given.
00:12:14.195 --> 00:12:19.937
like, how could any of these be special if they've basically been one step above the trash bin?
00:12:19.996 --> 00:12:22.282
by being at this random antique store in Omaha.
00:12:22.282 --> 00:12:29.482
Yeah, If I look through them again going, are there any that say something else or have some other element to them.
00:12:29.482 --> 00:12:37.739
Or maybe this person did have some talent or compositional instincts, even if they weren't aware of it when they were taking the photo.
00:12:37.739 --> 00:12:41.119
Did they subconsciously take quality photos or something interesting?
00:12:42.610 --> 00:12:44.437
You know, curious to go back and look.
00:12:44.437 --> 00:12:52.850
Well, thanks all of these questions like what is interesting, what is compositionally a good photo, what is The lack of intentionality, you could argue, is what makes it interesting.
00:12:52.850 --> 00:13:04.933
Well, because, absolutely because it's just it's somebody setting out to capture their perspective, their reality, which is Well, and the lack of artistic intention.
00:13:05.134 --> 00:13:08.581
There is intention, but it's just different than what we're used to.
00:13:08.701 --> 00:13:17.697
Yeah, it's So suddenly that raises the question and we're not going to try to answer this, or Sure, there's much smarter people than us that have done better jobs.
00:13:17.697 --> 00:13:27.429
But the lack of artistic intention, like we talked about on the last episode, kind of removed some of that intellectual exercise from it.
00:13:27.429 --> 00:13:38.500
It removes some of that pretension or self-importance and it becomes more about the subject Right, which is kind of the entire goal of you know, you want to be a master of your craft.
00:13:38.500 --> 00:13:46.441
If that craft is photography, the goal is to Gary Winogren would always talk about he wanted to not exist.
00:13:46.740 --> 00:13:55.174
Yes, it was just the camera floating through this reality, and he always wanted to find out.
00:13:55.174 --> 00:14:05.720
He was constantly seeking to find out what reality looked like outside of his head, because you can never see reality outside of your own reality.
00:14:05.759 --> 00:14:05.940
Yes.
00:14:06.529 --> 00:14:20.658
And as photographers, when you get to a certain point, i feel like you are searching for that meta-reality or that final, finite reality.
00:14:20.658 --> 00:14:22.943
Maybe it's infinite, you know, maybe it's not finite.
00:14:22.943 --> 00:14:27.951
You're looking for that just reality as it is Not.
00:14:27.951 --> 00:14:37.639
There's no projection happening from the artist And you could argue that when you remove all of those intentions, those artistic intentions.
00:14:37.639 --> 00:14:39.971
That's the purest form of that And that's the word.
00:14:40.072 --> 00:14:44.741
I use when I think of that concept, i think of the word pure and I think of the word truth.
00:14:44.741 --> 00:14:45.630
Yeah, truth.
00:14:45.630 --> 00:15:03.705
The absence of bias, the absence of me trying, you know, i talked about and the last time we talked I talked about me creating to serve my ego, of wanting to be perceived of as an artist or a screenwriter or whatever, and all that comes with that.
00:15:03.705 --> 00:15:14.283
But, and part of why maybe I'm gravitating towards the form of photography, and especially people like Gary Winogrand and Fred Herzog and these other photographers, is going.
00:15:14.283 --> 00:15:25.325
they're not doing it to serve their ego because they want to be a famous art photographer or they want a show at MoMA or all that.
00:15:25.325 --> 00:15:28.038
Maybe some do and maybe some of them did have that?
00:15:28.097 --> 00:15:40.386
I don't know, But my feeling is that they are compelled to go out there and snap photos because I don't know ties in with Rick's book, but they are.
00:15:40.386 --> 00:15:47.121
they can't help themselves And it feels like it's more in service to the truth and purity than it is in service to themselves.
00:15:47.350 --> 00:15:56.764
Well, and Gary would always talk about or people that knew Gary would always talk about him photographing at the most ridiculous times.
00:15:57.184 --> 00:15:57.365
Yeah.
00:15:57.750 --> 00:15:58.172
Why are you?
00:15:58.172 --> 00:15:59.195
why are you taking photos?
00:15:59.195 --> 00:16:01.441
Well, nobody else is going to take photos of this, right.
00:16:01.441 --> 00:16:06.720
It was something to him beyond I'm going out to express my intention.
00:16:06.720 --> 00:16:13.832
It was so much more And that's why the work is so staggering to this day is because it was more.
00:16:13.832 --> 00:16:17.418
it wasn't just this artist who was.
00:16:17.418 --> 00:16:19.903
I have this image that I want to get out.
00:16:19.903 --> 00:16:21.284
Right An agenda.
00:16:21.570 --> 00:16:25.780
Yeah, an agenda, And there have been some great projects that have explored the idea of these photos.
00:16:25.780 --> 00:16:46.428
I know Alex Soth had a project last year the year before called The Pound of Pictures And one of the creative kind of threads that he began pulling at to develop that project was he found on eBay or somewhere online that he could order pictures by the pound.
00:16:46.769 --> 00:16:46.909
Yeah.
00:16:47.230 --> 00:16:48.135
You pay by the pound.
00:16:48.672 --> 00:16:49.716
It's just random pictures.
00:16:49.755 --> 00:17:00.605
Random pictures, yeah, and some store somewhere in the world and they just okay you, that's six pounds of pictures, that's, you know, 490, 4 a pound.
00:17:00.644 --> 00:17:00.784
Yeah.
00:17:01.672 --> 00:17:05.328
All right, you pay the 20 something dollars and there you go.
00:17:05.328 --> 00:17:20.470
Yeah, there's your six pounds of photos, and he would just go through these photos and find all of this staggering work, because suddenly you are projecting these artistic intentions onto it And you're like, wow, this is unbelievable And that was never the original intention.
00:17:20.470 --> 00:17:27.913
So it raises a lot of questions And I don't think this is its own episode In a lot of ways.
00:17:27.913 --> 00:17:35.490
I don't want to continue to talk about this for like the next 30 minutes, but I it's a fascinating topic.
00:17:36.211 --> 00:17:43.304
Well and just something I'd love to, even if we just maintain the dialogue throughout the rest of this year and see where it gets us by.
00:17:43.750 --> 00:17:55.309
Well, and it's just, i mean, this is, you know, to me one of the centerpiece conversations about what you know we're trying to talk about in this podcast is, you know, making great art and what does that mean?
00:17:55.309 --> 00:18:05.292
Yeah, and I think the beauty of it is, it's not up to us to define it because it's really Well I had that later in the notes is.
00:18:06.054 --> 00:18:15.925
I heard this thing the other day and it put into words something that I've always felt or I've always wanted to express.
00:18:15.925 --> 00:18:27.503
I've never been comfortable or tried to perpetuate the idea of me being an artist whatever that means.
00:18:30.191 --> 00:18:35.323
And I think one of the reasons is, first of all, what does that word mean?
00:18:35.323 --> 00:18:47.170
Yeah, it's just a terrible word to, from the big, anybody that calls themselves an artist, And I don't mean this in an offensive way or I'm trying to tear other people down.
00:18:47.170 --> 00:18:50.016
I just I don't.
00:18:50.016 --> 00:18:56.769
If you call yourself an artist, haven't you kind of defeated the purpose of being a true artist in the first place?
00:18:56.769 --> 00:19:14.369
If you feel comfortable calling yourself that And I wanted to get your thoughts on it because I know that's something we talked about in the last podcast of kind of developing past the state and figuring out that you can be the one that has that connection Have you ever felt comfortable?
00:19:14.369 --> 00:19:15.368
Has that changed?
00:19:15.368 --> 00:19:17.589
What do you call yourself?
00:19:17.589 --> 00:19:19.167
I always err on the side.
00:19:19.167 --> 00:19:24.813
If if Audrey has a hard time explaining to people what I do I'm doing something right, Yeah, Yeah.
00:19:25.738 --> 00:19:36.323
Yeah, yeah, yeah, and I you know, part of me, part of me likes that there's confusion about what I do Like wait, so wait you.
00:19:36.323 --> 00:19:41.136
Just you make videos for the internet and your basement It sounds so bad.
00:19:41.176 --> 00:19:44.934
Yeah, yeah, that's exactly what I do.
00:19:45.151 --> 00:19:47.750
There's, you know, there's so much that goes into it.
00:19:47.750 --> 00:19:55.748
You know I, you know we've had conversations where I I don't feel comfortable calling myself an artist because I think of other people as artists.
00:19:55.748 --> 00:20:25.406
I think of my brother, i think of you know, i think of maybe it's a cliche like the sort of struggling, tormented person who you know isn't necessarily filled with intention, but they're filled with compulsion, obsession, and they can't not create these things that are hard to describe or explain.
00:20:25.406 --> 00:20:31.001
Yeah, they find whatever form it is and it just comes out of them.
00:20:31.001 --> 00:21:09.829
And then you have people that say they're a painter or they're a sculptor, and and and I'm not trying to judge or whatever But sometimes I wonder if we label ourselves as that more in service to our ego and the idea that we want to have our self image and how we want to project ourselves out on the world, because it sounds intriguing or interesting, or it makes us look cool, or it makes us feel a sense of accomplishment in a life where maybe we've struggled to find what our calling is, or to find success or whatever, because there's so many things that go into it, from cultural pressure to what people expect of you.
00:21:10.029 --> 00:21:34.064
And that's where, like even with my family and not as much my side of the family but my wife's side of the family where I think they they are so disconnected from artistic pursuits or creative pursuits No, not to say that they're not creative or they don't have the capacity to be creative, but you know they are very much on that function side of things.
00:21:34.064 --> 00:21:38.978
Go to work, punch the clock, earn your revenue, go on, you know, a family trip.
00:21:38.978 --> 00:21:41.863
Have, you know, spaghetti and meatballs for dinner?
00:21:41.863 --> 00:21:42.384
you know like.
00:21:43.109 --> 00:21:44.256
And that's not to say that they don't have any depth.
00:21:44.256 --> 00:21:46.101
It's like letting a muscle atrophy, right.
00:21:46.470 --> 00:22:06.990
But they look, i think they look at me and because I don't fit into that context of, you know, working for the hospital as the IT person or, you know, the marketing director for the convention visitors bureau, i'm more nebulous and sort of amorphous and they don't know what I do.
00:22:06.990 --> 00:22:13.147
Yeah, like, i think, even to the point where they would be, they're surprised I make money doing it.
00:22:13.147 --> 00:22:27.726
Yeah, yeah, and even though I consider myself someone who does creative things for a living, there's still a lot of, like you know, craft and technical crap, like learning and organizing files and maintaining hard drives and all this stuff.
00:22:27.726 --> 00:22:30.434
So, so it's difficult.
00:22:30.434 --> 00:22:37.849
But then at the same time, i go out and make photography videos and have moved into photography because of that compulsion aspect.
00:22:38.150 --> 00:22:46.565
Like, I am drawn to capturing moments through video, photo, writing.
00:22:46.565 --> 00:22:51.128
you know these artistic forms, Expressions or whatever.
00:22:51.148 --> 00:22:53.214
Yeah, um, it was.
00:22:53.214 --> 00:22:57.846
The thing that brought it to top of mind for me was I was listening.
00:22:57.846 --> 00:22:59.269
It was an Anthony Bourdain interview.
00:22:59.269 --> 00:23:01.829
I just watched an Anthony Bourdain clip this morning.
00:23:01.829 --> 00:23:08.470
We've been watching, we watched the entirety of Cook's tour and no reservation, we've just been going crazy on it.
00:23:08.470 --> 00:23:27.525
But the somebody asked him about chefs and art Yeah, and if you're an amazing chef, you're just as much an artist as an amazing painter or an amazing.
00:23:27.525 --> 00:23:28.465
You're creating something.
00:23:28.465 --> 00:23:31.390
You have raw materials and you're creating something that you're creating.
00:23:31.390 --> 00:23:33.693
You have transcends and you're playing with memory.
00:23:33.693 --> 00:23:38.262
You're playing with scents, smell, sight, sound.
00:23:38.262 --> 00:23:43.781
Some could say it's a more function and forms craft.
00:23:44.061 --> 00:23:44.242
Yeah.
00:23:44.509 --> 00:23:47.420
Some could say it's a more immersive form of art than cinema.
00:23:47.509 --> 00:23:48.433
You could make that argument.
00:23:48.433 --> 00:23:50.492
They'd be wrong.
00:23:50.492 --> 00:23:53.556
I've had some pretty great meals.
00:23:53.910 --> 00:24:12.596
I've had some no, and it really transcends, and you're, I just think it's an interesting thing that people not enough people see But the question was opposed to Bourdain Who are chefs that you see as artists?
00:24:12.596 --> 00:24:28.757
And he thought about it for a couple of moments and then said I think there's only a couple that truly, and in his mind he's just I forget what he calls himself, It's a wandering professional or something.
00:24:28.757 --> 00:24:30.113
That's what he called himself.
00:24:30.113 --> 00:24:42.854
And he said there's a couple that They look at things so differently, They approach the form from such a crazy unique There's nothing else to call them but artists.
00:24:42.854 --> 00:25:00.611
Yeah, Then there's people that are so highly skilled at their craft I mean, we're talking 10,000 hours times four right, They're just absolute Technical masters, Technical masters, And he put a distinction between that And he said that's different from being an artist.
00:25:01.031 --> 00:25:01.755
A true artist.
00:25:01.755 --> 00:25:06.271
He's and he made the joke Everybody is an artist these days.
00:25:06.271 --> 00:25:06.968
Everybody's.
00:25:06.968 --> 00:25:10.869
This person's an artist, this person's a podcast artist, this person's this artist.
00:25:10.869 --> 00:25:15.155
And we like to be inclusive in our world.
00:25:15.155 --> 00:25:24.695
We, like you, don't want to limit somebody's potential by saying, oh, you have to do this to be this, but I think that's a good way to look at it from any perspective.
00:25:24.695 --> 00:25:43.317
There's unbelievable filmmakers who have achieved the highest level of technical proficiency ever achieved, and then there's somebody like a Martin Scorsese, who can come in and shift what a film looks and feels like.
00:25:43.317 --> 00:25:49.116
There's somebody like a you know who's a great painter.
00:25:49.116 --> 00:25:52.555
The reference he used was we're talking Picasso here.
00:25:52.555 --> 00:25:56.073
Yes, we can't just lump anybody into that.
00:25:56.073 --> 00:26:05.115
And I think that's really interesting because you and I both like to highly index the technical side, the craft side of things.
00:26:05.115 --> 00:26:06.298
It's very important.
00:26:06.298 --> 00:26:08.634
It's a very important, it's a must.
00:26:08.724 --> 00:26:27.289
I don't think if you're going to be, if you are an artist, the technical proficiency is going to come with that even if it's not intended and the discipline is going to most like, or you can kind of just The discipline of the craft Flounder right, not your personal discipline, i think that's part of it.
00:26:27.289 --> 00:26:40.932
I think of some of these amazing artists who are artists, true artists, and they reach the technical proficiency, but then you see late career, slums or something or another, because the discipline wasn't there.
00:26:40.932 --> 00:26:45.496
But then you have somebody like a Picasso, who was a great artist.
00:26:45.744 --> 00:26:50.176
He was abstracted to every contemporary, not every, I mean.
00:26:50.176 --> 00:26:54.250
I know there's other, We're not going to have that discussion, but there's.
00:26:54.250 --> 00:26:57.069
His discipline was there.
00:26:57.069 --> 00:26:58.296
He was every day.
00:26:58.296 --> 00:26:59.606
he was working Every day Like it was.
00:27:00.450 --> 00:27:04.009
This was his job And so his output was with.
00:27:04.009 --> 00:27:13.894
The technical proficiency was huge and the abstracted thought, the true artistry was there, and that's how you get somebody who gets to a level like that.
00:27:13.894 --> 00:27:21.253
Then you have somebody like a Hunter Thompson maybe, who kind of puts out fear and loathing.
00:27:21.253 --> 00:27:29.614
Or you have F Scott Fitzgerald, who puts out Gatsby and then goes and drinks his sorrows away in Hollywood and barely gets out another work.
00:27:29.614 --> 00:27:31.952
Kurt Cobain, the 27, all of these.
00:27:32.625 --> 00:27:34.551
Yeah, you have people who have this.
00:27:34.551 --> 00:27:37.050
They clearly have this artistic vision.
00:27:37.050 --> 00:27:45.851
The technical side is there And it's just like but whether it's the discipline, whatever is, not there or it's the societal con.
00:27:46.172 --> 00:27:56.881
The societal con, Or is it the societal constructs that interfere with those artists in the restaurant world?
00:27:56.881 --> 00:28:15.073
I think of Charlie Trotter and everything that happened to him as his restaurant kind of flatlined a little bit What things in our culture put pressures and stifle that artistic obsession, compulsion.
00:28:15.845 --> 00:28:16.970
Michelin stars or.
00:28:17.625 --> 00:28:28.251
Well, yeah, the Michelin stars, the reviews in the magazines, just normal stuff, like him having to deal with some health issues and not going to a doctor.
00:28:28.251 --> 00:28:37.789
Competitiveness with other people, like your own psychological constructs that interfere with the purity and truth of artistic expression.
00:28:38.545 --> 00:28:40.551
How do those things analytics on your work?
00:28:41.105 --> 00:28:44.034
Yeah, the gamification revenue.
00:28:44.034 --> 00:29:12.191
It's so interesting that that influence what you create and how you create it, When maybe you started from a really pure place, like, let's say, a Kurt Cobain, and then, oh, you got to be on SML next week and then you got to be on The Today Show and you got to do this, And then this whole financial commercial construct builds around it And some people maybe Picasso is an example where he just was able to manage that stuff embrace it and work embrace it or reject certain things.
00:29:13.505 --> 00:29:15.573
He didn't have other people that were depending on him.
00:29:15.573 --> 00:29:21.965
Not to say that that's truly the case I don't know for sure but you see, people, that You have a.
00:29:21.965 --> 00:29:33.611
Scorsese, who's still putting out crazy output and has managed to And then using his position also to preserve the work of other artists that if he wasn't preserving, their work.
00:29:33.724 --> 00:29:36.439
I sound like a total Scorsese nerd on this pod so far.
00:29:36.479 --> 00:29:38.777
I'm pretty sure Can't wait for flowers, flowers of the killer.
00:29:38.857 --> 00:29:45.508
Killers of the flower, Killers of the flower mode sorry If I sound like I'm completely obsessed with Scorsese, because I am.
00:29:45.508 --> 00:29:56.571
He's one of those people that, yeah, as I get older, i find myself looking to people who have done it, and Dylan is a great example.
00:29:56.571 --> 00:30:03.731
You know, dylan had more commercial expectations on than anybody, and I just listened to the live project that he recorded a year ago.
00:30:03.731 --> 00:30:12.809
Yeah, and it's a lot of those songs from the 60s and 70s reimagined with his current sound and it's smoky and it's so good.
00:30:12.809 --> 00:30:24.316
As you start to pass those ages in life, you start to look and say, ok, but who's doing this at 80?
00:30:24.505 --> 00:30:25.710
Who's doing this at 85?
00:30:26.010 --> 00:30:27.689
Yep, Who's doing this at?
00:30:27.689 --> 00:30:30.471
We talked about Joel Meyerowitz last week.
00:30:30.471 --> 00:30:32.471
You know he's still out there.
00:30:32.471 --> 00:30:34.209
Is it in gray art still doing?
00:30:34.690 --> 00:30:35.573
Yeah, yeah.
00:30:36.214 --> 00:30:38.470
Yep, and it's so.
00:30:38.470 --> 00:30:43.413
who's internalized these practices to a point where the discipline's there?
00:30:43.413 --> 00:30:47.531
It's been there And it hasn't waned.
00:30:47.531 --> 00:30:53.332
David Bowie was creating great stuff right up until the week that he died.
00:30:53.953 --> 00:31:19.209
Yeah, and there's maybe some arguments too that they blend in a little bit more than when they first made their appearance, because what they did when they first came out was so mind bending, or culture shifting, or a voice that we hadn't seen or heard before, literally like a singing voice, but then also the voice of the artist.
00:31:19.209 --> 00:31:37.695
And as culture and other artists materialize around the form or the voice that they created and blend in with it, they're not necessarily lost, but maybe they don't stand out as prominently.
00:31:37.695 --> 00:31:41.606
Or, again, we're fixated on the new thing, like great.
00:31:41.606 --> 00:31:47.273
You know, grayart and his photography is amazing, but look at what this person over here is doing.
00:31:47.445 --> 00:31:47.829
And they've got a.
00:31:47.849 --> 00:31:49.710
YouTube channel And they have an Instagram account.
00:31:50.345 --> 00:31:54.816
And it's new and novel and whatever that is.
00:31:54.816 --> 00:32:15.346
And then you always see, too, when a great artist passes away, or they have fallen, blended in a little bit more or maybe not created as prolifically, or what they're doing and creating is still reminiscent of the stuff that really put them on the map.
00:32:15.346 --> 00:32:19.413
We rediscover them, you know.
00:32:19.413 --> 00:32:21.288
I think of the Beach Boys and Brian Wilson.
00:32:21.288 --> 00:32:25.369
You know, he's still putting out new music as recently as just a few years ago.
00:32:27.188 --> 00:32:33.212
And the thing about it, though, is that'll never they're not making music to fit in with the contemporary.
00:32:33.212 --> 00:32:43.894
Our kids and our grandkids are going to discover Brian Wilson because they listen to pet sounds and whatever, and hopefully that encourages them to dig deeper.
00:32:44.484 --> 00:32:47.053
And then they do discover some of the new Brian Wilson.
00:32:47.053 --> 00:32:56.192
They discover they listen to Highway 61 or Blonde on Blonde And then they're like, oh, let's keep going.
00:32:56.192 --> 00:32:57.450
And they do discover.
00:32:57.450 --> 00:33:04.666
And I think it's always interesting when an artist manages to the cultural zeitgeist, the cultural.
00:33:04.666 --> 00:33:19.608
that's never been a good watermark, i feel like, for anything, although you could argue that these people that we're talking about wouldn't have been we wouldn't be talking about them if they weren't the water market one point in time.
00:33:19.608 --> 00:33:26.845
But the work that they're creating is going to be there forever.
00:33:26.845 --> 00:33:30.854
But I always find it interesting when an artist leaves the zeitgeist and then manages to come back.
00:33:30.854 --> 00:33:37.627
So you think Dylan, you know the Highway 61 and the folk.
00:33:37.627 --> 00:33:39.491
Dylan was early 60s.
00:33:39.491 --> 00:33:43.108
Mid 60s was kind of the foray into rock.
00:33:43.108 --> 00:33:51.634
Then he came back in the 70s with some of these country sounds And he had Blood on the Tracks, which is an all time great album.
00:33:51.634 --> 00:33:53.109
That's 15 years later.
00:33:53.109 --> 00:33:54.394
Think about that.
00:33:54.394 --> 00:33:56.876
15 years ago it was 2008?
00:33:56.876 --> 00:33:57.775
2000.
00:33:58.484 --> 00:34:07.508
2008, right yeah, yeah and that's think of how different things are from 2008 now, and that was the period of time and then That was what?
00:34:07.508 --> 00:34:10.396
70 was that 73, 73 ish.
00:34:10.396 --> 00:34:25.516
Fast forward 25 more years and Another great album it wins, wins a Grammy, and right you, it Reconnects with the cultural zeitgeist somehow.
00:34:25.516 --> 00:34:29.947
And oh, that's, that's 40 years.
00:34:29.947 --> 00:34:32.431
40 years, yeah, and so I'm remarkable.
00:34:32.431 --> 00:34:34.396
Things like that You know we talk about.
00:34:34.396 --> 00:34:47.525
Oh man, drake has just been dominant for 13 years 40 years Stain power staying and there's something to that work and you know the same, the same way we watch.
00:34:49.090 --> 00:34:51.840
You can go back and watch raging bowl or listen to.
00:34:51.900 --> 00:34:53.264
Mozart, listen Shakespeare.
00:34:53.264 --> 00:34:56.074
I mean talk about staying re-chakes absolutely.
00:34:56.405 --> 00:34:59.012
Truly read Shakespeare and it's unbelievable.
00:34:59.012 --> 00:35:00.096
You go back and watch.
00:35:00.096 --> 00:35:17.615
You know, in the last couple of years I feel like the godfather has gotten re-invigorated because of the, the marketing pushes, and you go back and watch that movie and it's Just as just as good as it was It'd be, it's better because now you have all this expectation, but sure it's crazy, you know, creating something with staying power.
00:35:17.896 --> 00:35:18.478
How does that?
00:35:18.478 --> 00:35:20.210
What are some of the factors of that?
00:35:20.210 --> 00:35:26.099
and you don't necessarily want to break it down, to try to recreate it, because I don't know, that's not how it's done.
00:35:26.139 --> 00:35:27.264
There's no playbook.
00:35:27.445 --> 00:35:31.867
There's no playbook, you just got right, you just got to make what you feel and That, but it's great, it is.
00:35:31.867 --> 00:35:36.557
That that's always astonishing for me is that 40 year Dylan, yeah, come back.
00:35:36.557 --> 00:35:39.927
That's just Yeah.
00:35:39.927 --> 00:35:41.269
That's unbelievable.
00:35:41.811 --> 00:35:47.990
Yeah, and I, you know you think about Him creating something like that after 40 years.
00:35:47.990 --> 00:36:05.012
And what role does our collective Knowledge and understanding of who he is, the legend, living legend that he is, you know, what role does that play and you know, and in lifting up that perception of what he's created, not to sit, not to take away from what he's created?
00:36:05.012 --> 00:36:11.945
but you know, i'm always curious about what our own Bias is, our collective recognition of someone just to clarify.
00:36:12.485 --> 00:36:17.657
Are you saying like, like, suddenly that earlier work is even more significant because he was able to?
00:36:19.067 --> 00:36:45.684
I'm saying, i wonder sometimes with artists or creators that we have revered and, you know, been astonished by what they've made over the years, that does that Make us perceive of what they've created 40 years later, with all this additional Bias and and weight that we want to give to it, and that not not that it's not as good as what they made earlier?
00:36:45.806 --> 00:36:47.784
I don't know but you go in with expectation.
00:36:48.346 --> 00:37:07.012
Well expectation, and there's just so much gravity and mass around who some of these people are, that if Picasso were around today and made a new painting, yeah, would we love it, because Picasso did it, even though It's it's not as good as his earlier works.
00:37:07.291 --> 00:37:08.375
Yeah, i don't know it.
00:37:08.375 --> 00:37:28.590
I feel like that's a constant Thing that people get get hit with, though, is it's not as good as your early stuff, and that's why it is so impressive, because, speaking of Dylan or Martin Scorsese, you could say he reinvigorated his career when he made Maybe Wolf, wolf, wolf of Wall.
00:37:28.630 --> 00:37:33.119
Street probably was was the film that did it, yeah, and it suddenly took him from.
00:37:33.119 --> 00:37:39.067
I Mean he was making, he was constantly making good films, there's a lot of good films.
00:37:39.067 --> 00:37:47.353
But you know, he had the 70s where it was just yeah, taxi driver, raging bull, incredible, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.
00:37:47.353 --> 00:37:49.762
Then he had good fellas in the 90s.
00:37:49.762 --> 00:38:10.574
You know, um, raging Bull was 80s too, yeah, and Then he has a lull period, sure, and then he comes out and he puts Wolf of Wall Street comes out and suddenly he's back in these Absolute center of the cultural zeitgeist and cinema.
00:38:10.574 --> 00:38:13.230
He's 70 something at that point.
00:38:13.230 --> 00:38:17.987
But then you go back and you revisit Oh, casino actually wasn't as bad as I remember it So good Yeah.
00:38:18.206 --> 00:38:25.648
Oh man, this last temptation of Christ actually pretty, pretty interesting film and One of my favorites has always been Cape Fear.
00:38:25.849 --> 00:38:38.842
Cape is where you make a Cape Fear, oh great Yeah, really good, just deniro shredded and That movie is so uncomfortable to watch in a good way.
00:38:39.023 --> 00:38:41.130
In a good way I mean well in.
00:38:41.311 --> 00:38:47.378
In Tarantino says you know like a good director has about 10 films in him and then they nonsense, you know right.
00:38:47.378 --> 00:38:50.471
But I think that's kind of that.
00:38:50.471 --> 00:38:50.791
That.
00:38:50.791 --> 00:38:53.177
You know, that's part of that conversation as well.
00:38:53.177 --> 00:39:00.592
The other, the other thing too, in that you know, if Picasso painted something today, would we revere it because it's Picasso?
00:39:00.592 --> 00:39:04.224
would revere it because on its own it's an amazing piece of artwork.
00:39:04.224 --> 00:39:11.125
You know, what role does the artist Status, reputation, play in our assessment of that art?
00:39:11.766 --> 00:39:12.429
Well, this is.
00:39:12.429 --> 00:39:15.235
This is more important than ever because of AI sure?
00:39:15.416 --> 00:39:38.322
Yeah, well, and you have new artists that come out and is part of why we love their work because we're able to assess it more purely, because they don't have a reputation and You know they're this new flashy thing that created this beautiful painting or an amazing photograph, and That's what leads our assessment.
00:39:38.322 --> 00:39:49.110
It is What the work looks like or how it impacts us, not how our understanding of who they are as an artist Impacts us, and then we process their art.
00:39:49.110 --> 00:39:51.414
You know just how we consume.
00:39:51.414 --> 00:39:52.336
It, too, is interesting.
00:39:52.336 --> 00:40:06.467
And going back to Scorsese, what an amazing interpreter and Thinker about, sent, the cinema, cinematic arts, and just to listen to him talk about a movie and break it down, it's incredible.
00:40:06.507 --> 00:40:20.644
It's like I mean, i have gone from sort of having a Ho-hum reaction to a movie to then watching the special features where he talks about this movie and My entire perception of that movie is elevated tenfold.
00:40:20.644 --> 00:40:25.998
Yeah because he pointed things out that I didn't understand because of a lack of historical context.
00:40:25.998 --> 00:40:35.672
Yeah, the challenge like like how some this type of thing was never depicted on film before And all of a sudden you have this different appreciation for what was accomplished.
00:40:35.731 --> 00:40:41.711
I think you almost just answered our original question to of Does intention, right, shine through?
00:40:41.711 --> 00:40:49.074
and it might not shine through through in the mystical way that I Was thinking about it earlier, but it might shine through.
00:40:49.074 --> 00:41:00.817
And You watch a Scorsese film and you know everything is intentional, right, everything is there for a reason and there's still room, like we said last week, there's still room to explore.
00:41:00.817 --> 00:41:07.465
But That's part of the calculation is, how do I present room to explore?
00:41:07.465 --> 00:41:09.269
How do I put this out?
00:41:09.269 --> 00:41:33.768
and then you watch something, whether it's a TV show or a television show, or Whether it's a television show or a streaming show or something, even a lesser quality movie, it's maybe something that's more commercially driven, something with different Intentions or goals behind it, and you feel, oh, this isn't quite, i Just don't care as much.
00:41:34.190 --> 00:41:39.425
Yeah, because they, you have this close-up in a Scorsese film and you're like what is this?
00:41:39.425 --> 00:41:40.489
What's he showing here?
00:41:40.489 --> 00:41:52.775
You have a close-up in there and it's probably just somebody was like okay, we covered it with two or three cameras and we need to cut to the close-up because It's time for a close-up, right, and that's.
00:41:52.775 --> 00:42:00.059
You know, that's where the intention shines through and that probably over the course of a longer piece of work.
00:42:00.059 --> 00:42:03.052
But yeah, and not to get tied up.
00:42:03.052 --> 00:42:06.851
We went down this road So difficult because you have so, so few.
00:42:07.032 --> 00:42:16.804
I mean film first falls collaborative art form, so you have multiple people contributing to right, you know, serve a single vision usually, but then in some cases, especially more commercial properties.
00:42:16.804 --> 00:42:22.414
You are going to have, you know, other interests and other voices in there.
00:42:22.414 --> 00:42:37.152
You're gonna have studio executives, you're gonna have the studio head, you're gonna have corporate interests, like I was just, you know, rewatching at my in-laws the beginning of Back to the Future because it was on a marathon on TMC or AMC, and There's three.
00:42:38.346 --> 00:42:46.190
Yeah there's three product placements for Burger King and the first, you know 15 minutes, there's a Mountain Dew product placement.
00:42:46.190 --> 00:42:50.565
You know these, there's all these things where you know they're trying to create something.
00:42:50.565 --> 00:43:00.878
I would argue that's art from Bob's a mechison, bob Gale and Steven Spielberg, yeah, but they have these other things that they have to contend with these.
00:43:01.565 --> 00:43:04.717
So the point where they recast Michael J or recast Eric Stoltz.
00:43:04.717 --> 00:43:09.081
Is Eric Stoltz is the original Marty McFly, yeah, and put in Michael J Fox.
00:43:09.081 --> 00:43:15.958
So You know that you can even think like a photographer or a sculptor or a painter who's commissioned to create something.
00:43:15.958 --> 00:43:19.244
Yeah, and You know what does that look like?
00:43:19.244 --> 00:43:34.085
I think about the crown in the scene where the painter that was commissioned to do Woodson Churchill's portrait, winston Churchill, is expecting him to have a grand, classical, timeless portrait of him and he had one that Churchill felt was grotesque.
00:43:34.306 --> 00:43:36.757
But that artist was trying to ask what he was.
00:43:36.757 --> 00:43:45.128
Trying to merge it together like they're paying me to do this, yeah, but I'm gonna do it from a place of my Artistic intention and vision.
00:43:45.128 --> 00:43:52.509
I'm gonna get to know who this person really is and I'm gonna try to convey the truth of who he is, even if Churchill doesn't like it.
00:43:52.688 --> 00:44:15.576
Well, and I feel like, as people who consume a lot of this stuff and try to make ourselves familiar with what's come before, sometimes there are situations, specifically more commercial situations, where we like to Approach it with the thought of everybody's gonna love this because this is the true.
00:44:15.576 --> 00:44:32.784
Yeah, this is the truth, or this is trying to get at the truth, and then the reality is Is people don't care, but there might be some commercial tactic or something that's more effective, sure, and Well, you know, you did this weird thing and it didn't work.
00:44:32.784 --> 00:44:42.338
Well, maybe the the whole concept was failed to not work in the first place, but then you went out on a limb, so you gave a scapegoat for well, it's because you got all arty with it, right?
00:44:44.007 --> 00:44:58.675
I don't, i don't quite have the full point there, but it's something that I think about often, especially writing copy or doing something for a commercial purpose, where I'm just Essentially making up nonsense or whatever.
00:44:58.675 --> 00:45:05.152
Yeah, but I want to get his back on track, because I know you have the camera story and I want to hear about that.
00:45:05.152 --> 00:45:13.356
I want to see the camera and then maybe we can Find at least one or two quotes pretty much at our time already.
00:45:14.286 --> 00:45:17.092
But that's the beauty of this, you know we cut, you know you.
00:45:17.092 --> 00:45:19.538
This again is kind of ties into the whole thing.
00:45:19.538 --> 00:45:28.610
You, you know, we can sit down ahead of time and kind of plot out what we think we should cover to Provide value to the audience that might watch this.
00:45:28.610 --> 00:45:38.068
And as we sit down and talk it takes us in a direction, maybe, that we didn't anticipate and I think it gets hope is that it still provides value Absolutely.
00:45:38.327 --> 00:45:39.471
And I think we're.
00:45:39.471 --> 00:45:47.010
You know, we're talking about all of these things and we're trying to create something that is along the same lines.
00:45:47.010 --> 00:45:57.748
We can kind of direct where it's going to go, yeah, but if we're here discovering stuff and that's interesting, let's then hopefully the audience is as well, and that's the same.
00:45:57.748 --> 00:46:02.568
The same goes for film, the same goes for photography, the same goes for painting, the same goes for writing.
00:46:02.568 --> 00:46:08.474
Right, if you think it's interesting when you're putting it together, there's a good chance it's going to be interesting.
00:46:09.257 --> 00:46:23.050
Well, I think that's why podcasts as a form for the most part not necessarily all podcasts, but a lot of podcasts are consumed so voraciously, even if it's in small numbers, like ratings, but you have these kind of specific communities that are consuming this content.
00:46:23.050 --> 00:46:30.702
When you think about the other side of it, like a talk show that's on rails, right, Yeah, certain segments we have time we have got to hit that question.
00:46:30.722 --> 00:46:32.231
We talked with the guest beforehand.
00:46:32.231 --> 00:46:43.650
They have a funny anecdote or a little quirky story or whatever kind of like my canon story Like when you watch that you're captivated by the star or the host is really funny, whatever.
00:46:43.650 --> 00:46:49.233
Sometimes there's moments of improvisation or surprises, but for the most part it just feels like it's on rails.
00:46:49.233 --> 00:46:51.221
The same thing happens every time.
00:46:51.221 --> 00:46:53.067
Whereas something like this.
00:46:53.148 --> 00:47:06.804
The hope would be that, even if we set out to do four topics, that we're going to try to cover, if we go off track a little bit into this conversation about intention and artist work.
00:47:06.804 --> 00:47:13.550
After 40 years, all the stuff that we just talked about is the audience watching that going, but that's what's really happening in the moment.
00:47:13.590 --> 00:47:15.096
That's where they're really going.
00:47:15.666 --> 00:47:21.905
And that's more interesting to us than Alex and Matt's itinerary and them going okay.
00:47:22.126 --> 00:47:33.686
Now is the part where we segue into this or that or whatever, and I think we've both gotten semi-comfortable sitting in front of the camera or talking to a camera.
00:47:33.686 --> 00:47:37.914
So we at least have the guide rails in our subconscious to keep us.
00:47:38.916 --> 00:47:43.293
I think the intent is to hopefully a form emerges.
00:47:43.293 --> 00:47:47.786
We do 20 episodes, 10 episodes, and hopefully the form emerges from that.
00:47:47.786 --> 00:48:00.519
And we're definitely we're always going to be looking and critiquing and trying to figure out ways to improve, But hopefully a form emerges and you don't go in with this predetermined idea.
00:48:00.519 --> 00:48:15.539
It really is a really stupid metaphor for this entire topic that we've had Just hopefully you go out and you explore and the form emerges from that.
00:48:15.539 --> 00:48:16.844
So I think that's kind of your point.
00:48:17.005 --> 00:48:26.672
I think the key is, too, that all of our conversations that have made us decide to make a podcast are about this exploration of what makes great art.
00:48:26.672 --> 00:48:27.554
Who are we?
00:48:27.554 --> 00:48:28.456
Are we an art?
00:48:28.456 --> 00:48:32.706
Are you, are I an artist, am I an artist?
00:48:32.706 --> 00:48:40.507
And trying to have conversations about that exploration because we don't have the answers.
00:48:40.507 --> 00:48:42.391
We have things that have worked for us.
00:48:42.391 --> 00:48:51.606
We certainly could give each other advice, whatever and that might connect with our audience, but the idea is that we're all exploring this together.
00:48:51.606 --> 00:48:59.248
We're talking about what has worked and what hasn't worked, and our careers, our artistic pursuits, all of that stuff.
00:48:59.248 --> 00:49:17.416
And that that's the more interesting thing, not that weird like and not that all podcasts are like this, but that we're not two gurus that have had all this success And we're going to tell you what to do to get to where we are, whether we're selling some course or a system, or our book, or whatever it is.
00:49:17.436 --> 00:49:18.682
I mean, you're exactly where.
00:49:18.682 --> 00:49:21.193
it looks like we are in the process, yeah, and that's all.
00:49:21.193 --> 00:49:23.101
that's all there really is to it.
00:49:23.101 --> 00:49:25.067
I think we both have ambitions to.
00:49:25.067 --> 00:49:32.442
it's not like we have ambitions of grandiose luxury, or we just sure.
00:49:32.442 --> 00:50:01.018
I think both of us would be happy at this stage just creating the work that is fulfilling and makes us proud, continuing to further these skill sets that we've become, yeah, we've fallen in love with, and I financially be able to sustain at least a mild level of, i don't know whatever that looks like, yeah, and it doesn't look like we're making $25 million and we need to.
00:50:01.018 --> 00:50:05.731
I'm famous and we need to optimize these clicks.
00:50:05.972 --> 00:50:09.643
And I mean, i think everybody is has gone through something.
00:50:09.643 --> 00:50:17.726
Most people have gone through a period of life where they've over indexed on being a celebrity or something like that.
00:50:17.726 --> 00:50:23.764
But at least personally speaking, i have no interest in being a celebrity.
00:50:23.764 --> 00:50:35.813
I like the idea of having influence because I know how important my influences have been on me And I would love to be that to somebody else.
00:50:35.813 --> 00:50:38.463
But that's not coming from a I want to be.
00:50:38.463 --> 00:50:47.735
That's right And I promise you I've done a lot of self reflection on this and it's not coming from a place of of ego at least I don't believe it is.
00:50:47.735 --> 00:50:49.057
I think it's coming from a place of.
00:50:49.057 --> 00:50:50.570
It's the same reason I wanted.
00:50:50.570 --> 00:50:51.574
I want to make movies.
00:50:51.996 --> 00:50:52.557
It's the same reason.
00:50:52.557 --> 00:51:01.626
I movies were the thing that were most profoundly effective on who I became Same here, and so I gravitate towards that.
00:51:01.766 --> 00:51:21.329
Yeah, and I've, you know, moved more towards videos, for lack of a better term, just thinking about something that's released online, through YouTube, you know, versus a cinema or streaming platform or whatever that is, you know, a narrative story that a big crew makes or a small crew makes telling a story, etc.
00:51:21.329 --> 00:51:21.731
Etc.
00:51:21.731 --> 00:51:35.353
I've gravitated towards videos, moved away from the big influence that was on me with cinema and film, partially because making a movie is expensive.
00:51:35.353 --> 00:51:38.639
Even a low budget one like you said it requires a lot of people.
00:51:38.826 --> 00:51:41.034
Yeah, the democratization of these tools.
00:51:41.034 --> 00:51:48.239
Like we can make a podcast, video podcast or audio podcast very relatively easily with a low, low input It's.
00:51:48.239 --> 00:51:53.661
It's sometimes hard enough just to get the two of us on the same page, absolutely So, hey, are we going to record today?
00:51:54.081 --> 00:51:54.724
Let's do it tomorrow.
00:51:54.724 --> 00:51:56.668
Oh no good, yeah, for sure.
00:51:57.230 --> 00:52:11.447
So you know I've gravitated towards videos because the the ability to go from vision to completed product requires so much less input and help and money and all that stuff.
00:52:11.447 --> 00:52:22.664
And you know, on the flip side too, i may not just have the compulsion at a deep enough level like a Scorsese or a Spielberg or other filmmakers that go.
00:52:23.748 --> 00:52:37.329
I'm doing this, and literally every fiber of my being and every resource I have is going to go towards making, making these things, because it is the only thing for me, whereas I have found, you know, real fulfillment in videos, photos.
00:52:37.670 --> 00:52:41.358
I think it's you gave the Tarantino quote earlier.
00:52:41.425 --> 00:52:41.746
Yeah.
00:52:42.548 --> 00:52:44.534
What a position of arrogance to be like.
00:52:44.534 --> 00:52:45.597
Only 10.
00:52:45.597 --> 00:52:47.824
Imagine making 10 films.
00:52:49.010 --> 00:52:56.945
Why I think what's going to be really interesting is because I think his next one will be his ninth or tenth, i can't remember if he's you know if he's going to keep making it.
00:52:57.065 --> 00:52:59.070
It's so funny, like, imagine what's.
00:52:59.070 --> 00:53:00.534
There's a quote out there.
00:53:00.534 --> 00:53:06.914
Somebody said it The fact that any film ever gets made is an absolute miracle, 100%.
00:53:06.934 --> 00:53:08.036
And here it is.
00:53:08.644 --> 00:53:09.788
There's only 10 great ones.
00:53:09.788 --> 00:53:12.494
Yeah, it's like oh, out of the 25.
00:53:12.494 --> 00:53:15.391
Yeah, yeah, okay.
00:53:15.693 --> 00:53:19.387
Well, speaking of them being very difficult to make and we won't go down too much of a rabbit hole.
00:53:19.387 --> 00:53:23.416
my buddy, micah, who I visited when my family went out to Colorado.
00:53:23.416 --> 00:53:29.577
we stayed with him and his family for part of the time and went to Estes Park and stayed on our own there.
00:53:29.577 --> 00:53:32.190
He's a WGA screenwriter.
00:53:32.190 --> 00:53:37.646
I went to film school with him And he's on hold right now for all of his projects.
00:53:37.646 --> 00:53:53.440
One screenplay he wrote just got re-optioned and he got a one step deal to do a rewrite with the team that's getting involved, but he can't do anything because of the writer strike, and so we've always talked, of course, about making the film together.
00:53:53.440 --> 00:53:56.353
whether it was something he wrote, i wrote, we wrote together.
00:53:56.353 --> 00:53:59.806
however, it came to be, and so we talked about that quite a bit.
00:54:00.288 --> 00:54:00.527
Well.
00:54:00.608 --> 00:54:00.849
I was.
00:54:00.849 --> 00:54:04.155
You know the kind of our fireplace chats in Colorado.
00:54:04.155 --> 00:54:17.503
And you know, the first thing I think of, with even a small sort of contained drama that he wrote, I think of the massive undertaking that it is to get crew a 15 day shoot budget.
00:54:17.503 --> 00:54:25.905
I mean, you just throw out some, even some rudimentary numbers and you're talking $250,000 to pay crew.
00:54:26.166 --> 00:54:27.027
Yeah, All that stuff.
00:54:27.027 --> 00:54:29.072
I mean that's on the extreme low end.
00:54:30.195 --> 00:54:31.157
So anyway it's.
00:54:31.157 --> 00:54:43.231
yeah, it takes a really special person to see that whatever their vision is film wise gets completed to the finished product And I don't know that.
00:54:43.231 --> 00:54:52.726
I am that person And I have somewhat sort of jaded, frustrated viewpoint of the whole Hollywood system after my own experiences writing specs.
00:54:52.766 --> 00:54:54.490
You might even want to do that person.
00:54:54.490 --> 00:54:56.797
You know, you don't, there's plenty of.
00:54:56.797 --> 00:55:00.998
I think everybody thought Casey Neistat would go on to make.
00:55:00.998 --> 00:55:02.987
Oh, he made all this money with the blog.
00:55:02.987 --> 00:55:04.335
He's going to make real films now.
00:55:04.335 --> 00:55:05.139
Well, again, i think.
00:55:05.139 --> 00:55:07.027
And then he's like these are my real films.
00:55:07.467 --> 00:55:45.791
I think part of it comes back to what motivated me to pursue it And as I have become more, you know, develop self-awareness and really asked myself I wonder if a big motivator for me to do it was more ego driven It was the status, to be able to call myself a screenwriter, to see my name on the screen, to have the kind of directed by the money that you might have if you're a successful screenwriter and what that would allow you to be able to do, what people would think of you if you said I mean, i'll be honest when I tell people, because I went full time with YouTube last August.
00:55:45.891 --> 00:55:54.396
When I tell people that in their reaction which I didn't expect initially, you know I'm a YouTuber you're almost apologetic about it because it's whatever.
00:55:54.396 --> 00:56:05.465
And then some people are like really Like they react in such a profound way and it sucks, but sometimes, and the next time somebody asks what you do, you're like excited that they're gonna react positively.
00:56:05.485 --> 00:56:07.632
You're like an astronaut in an elementary school.
00:56:07.713 --> 00:56:08.434
Yeah, yeah.
00:56:08.474 --> 00:56:11.190
You know it's yeah, So that is possible.
00:56:11.331 --> 00:56:12.757
Right, so you can do that Yeah.
00:56:12.777 --> 00:56:15.065
And that's not gonna be the case in a few years.
00:56:15.065 --> 00:56:22.199
But just getting circling back you, i don't think we're gonna get to the creative act.
00:56:22.199 --> 00:56:26.405
Yeah, now, we'll do that next, yeah, we won't.
00:56:28.590 --> 00:56:32.297
But whatever we're doing, right episode 35 and we'll tell the truth.
00:56:34.664 --> 00:56:35.347
We're lying.
00:56:35.347 --> 00:56:41.438
I think the you mentioned you're in Colorado, yeah, and I want to see this camera.
00:56:41.438 --> 00:56:46.396
So oh yes, just go ahead and give the backstory to the mic.
00:56:46.599 --> 00:56:50.530
This will relate if you're someone that's going to listen to these episodes.
00:56:50.530 --> 00:57:12.068
I think the through line not necessarily the foundation of this being Brick Rubin's book, but this book helping me cement my understanding of the creative act, what it means to be creative, artistic pursuits, all that stuff This, this book, for me sort of put into words a lot of the different philosophies I have, the points of view I have, etc.
00:57:12.068 --> 00:57:29.244
And especially it opened it up to include not just when I make a video or take a photo, but to include creativity when it comes to time with my family or going out to dinner with my wife or these other things that you wouldn't think are creative but they actually are.
00:57:29.244 --> 00:57:31.753
And that's a whole separate conversation that we'll put a pin in.
00:57:31.753 --> 00:57:47.764
Anyway, so my wife and two kids, we go to Colorado and we're in Estes Park And I can be a little bit as part of my creativity, i can create a vision for how I want the day to unfold or sort of how I want things to be.
00:57:47.764 --> 00:57:52.965
And I have to be very careful because there are other collaborators in that my wife and my kids.
00:57:52.965 --> 00:58:05.994
I have to be careful that I am not ignoring the truth of how they feel or what they want, and just going on rails with what I want to do and making them join me because I have this again, this vision for how the day is going to go.
00:58:06.519 --> 00:58:09.605
So this happened to me in Rocky Mountain National Park.
00:58:09.605 --> 00:58:19.583
We are at the alluvial fan and the kids are climbing on the rocks and on it, but it starts raining, which is fine because we were getting close to wrapping up our time there.
00:58:19.583 --> 00:58:31.800
Well, my grand vision of sort of saying goodbye to the park and having like a wonderful drive through it was to leave from the exit that was opposite of the one that we entered, the entrance that we came in.
00:58:31.800 --> 00:58:34.824
So a longer drive through the park to exit.
00:58:34.824 --> 00:58:44.860
Well, in me communicating that to my wife, she thought I was talking about exiting through the entrance that we came into, so this going out the same place we came in.
00:58:46.342 --> 00:58:54.396
And so, as we're heading that way and I'm not the best inside Rocky Mountain to kind of have my bearings is we're heading that way I'm like, babe, is this the, isn't this where we entered?
00:58:54.396 --> 00:58:55.860
And she's like, yeah, isn't that where you wanted to go out?
00:58:55.860 --> 00:59:00.150
I said no, i wanted to go out the other exit because I wanted.
00:59:00.150 --> 00:59:04.460
I had this vision for this grand drive and seeing the mountains and stopping and taking a photo, whatever.
00:59:04.460 --> 00:59:08.992
So I was a little frustrated that I might.
00:59:08.992 --> 00:59:12.039
What I thought I had effectively communicated was not effectively communicated.
00:59:13.842 --> 00:59:15.806
Your vision was not going to be correct.
00:59:16.067 --> 00:59:18.331
My vision was not going to be realized.
00:59:18.331 --> 00:59:21.277
So I'm pretty good at going, OK, that's not.
00:59:21.277 --> 00:59:22.840
You know, that's, that's not going to happen anymore.
00:59:22.840 --> 00:59:26.440
So I'm just going to let go and we're going to go this new route.
00:59:26.440 --> 00:59:37.318
So as we're driving out of the park, you know there's different hotels and resorts and all this stuff, And I'm kind of taking it in and we come across like a strip mall and it has a donut place called Squatchy Donuts.
00:59:37.318 --> 00:59:49.639
The owners are firm believers in the existence of Squatch Sasquatch, And so they've made a donut stop that's reminiscent of that And they have all these fun flavors.
00:59:50.322 --> 00:59:51.047
Did they have a giant?
00:59:51.088 --> 00:59:51.733
donut on.
00:59:51.733 --> 00:59:52.659
Their thing is mini donuts.
00:59:52.659 --> 00:59:55.820
No, they do like a, like a plate.
00:59:56.684 --> 01:00:01.460
The most overused tiny donut piece of advertising, the giant donut Right Right.
01:00:02.324 --> 01:00:03.876
But it's all Sasquatch stuff.
01:00:03.896 --> 01:00:05.021
Bigfoot, Bigfoot.
01:00:05.021 --> 01:00:08.710
So I'm like, OK, so I start casting a new vision.
01:00:08.710 --> 01:00:11.268
Right, This is me being creative, the creative act.
01:00:11.268 --> 01:00:13.385
I start going.
01:00:13.385 --> 01:00:15.190
I get a vision really quick.
01:00:15.190 --> 01:00:18.646
I'm like, well, let's stop for donuts, Us and the kids will have a fun snack.
01:00:18.646 --> 01:00:22.327
They're pretty regimented with their sugar And so like, let's just go have some fun.
01:00:22.327 --> 01:00:27.652
And then there's a thrift store next door and I go aha, I can check the thrift store to see if they have any cameras there.
01:00:27.652 --> 01:00:34.505
So all of a sudden, the frustration of the old vision not happening is replaced with the excitement of this new vision unfolding.
01:00:34.547 --> 01:00:34.706
Yeah.
01:00:34.967 --> 01:00:45.590
OK, so we have our donuts and all that stuff and I go into the thrift store and my wife likes to look through the kids clothing because she sometimes finds some items that we can get at a low cost that the kids can wear.
01:00:45.590 --> 01:00:46.492
And so she's doing that.
01:00:46.492 --> 01:00:55.409
The kids are kind of here and there and I ask the clerk or the owner do you have any cameras, old digital cameras or whatever?
01:00:55.409 --> 01:00:56.706
And he's like well, we've got a drawer over here.
01:00:56.706 --> 01:00:58.965
He takes me over, looks in the drawer It's all these accessories.
01:00:58.965 --> 01:01:00.601
There's no cameras in there, he's like.
01:01:00.601 --> 01:01:05.152
But we did just get a Canon film camera in, if you want to take a look at that.
01:01:05.152 --> 01:01:12.847
And I had seen what looked like a black camera case behind the front desk And I was like I wonder what that is.
01:01:12.847 --> 01:01:18.211
Yeah, so as we go over, i'm thinking it's going to be like an A1, an SLR, which is cool.
01:01:18.211 --> 01:01:18.693
But I'm not.
01:01:19.121 --> 01:01:26.251
I'm more interested in like finders and ditchy cams and stuff So well can you just just to even go even further.
01:01:26.251 --> 01:01:29.027
Yeah, we've talked about you.
01:01:29.027 --> 01:01:32.204
Getting a rangefinder right Has been like the ultimate goal.
01:01:32.204 --> 01:01:36.911
And I talked about it on several occasions for probably five months now.
01:01:37.440 --> 01:01:52.628
And I'm not ready to pull the trigger on a like a film camera quite yet, because I want to have that experience with maybe a more accessible one As far as price point goes and all that, and get used to shooting on film without it being an automatic point and shoot film camera.
01:01:52.628 --> 01:02:05.623
So you know, i have a list of some cameras that I really want that are on my like DigiCam 35 millimeter film camera list that if I see them in a thrift store I'm going to be like really excited to see it Right.
01:02:05.623 --> 01:02:12.273
So he brings the camera case over and I open it up and I gasp.
01:02:12.273 --> 01:02:24.150
I'm like like this is one of the film cameras that's on my list And I had never seen it in person before Yeah, only on YouTube videos or photographs.
01:02:24.150 --> 01:02:32.688
And this thing looked, other than being dusty and a little, you know, kind of grimy, it looked pristine.
01:02:32.688 --> 01:02:45.074
So the camera is a rangefinder that Ken made through the 60s and 70s called the Canon QL17 G3.
01:02:45.320 --> 01:02:47.306
Gosh that is an incredible shape.
01:02:48.429 --> 01:02:49.190
And it's cleaned up.
01:02:49.190 --> 01:02:50.806
I did a full detailing of it.
01:02:51.159 --> 01:02:55.751
OK, so this is only for the people that are watching off, if you want to.
01:02:55.751 --> 01:03:00.001
The, the X, is it extruding, yeah?
01:03:00.101 --> 01:03:02.289
the extruding lens protruding, protruding.
01:03:02.599 --> 01:03:04.085
Thank you, yep.
01:03:04.085 --> 01:03:09.746
The protruding lens cap Absolutely essential because then you can do this.
01:03:09.746 --> 01:03:10.228
Yep.
01:03:10.228 --> 01:03:16.226
So to anybody out there who's not in on this this is the best way.
01:03:16.226 --> 01:03:17.891
Best way to stow a camera.
01:03:17.891 --> 01:03:20.088
Your lens is protected, nothing can hit it.
01:03:20.088 --> 01:03:23.907
Yep, this is actually amazing, though.
01:03:23.907 --> 01:03:25.865
It's like a hundred and thirty dollar camera.
01:03:26.561 --> 01:03:28.148
I've seen that and I've seen some of them.
01:03:28.148 --> 01:03:29.686
Well, you know, it's not the black one.
01:03:29.686 --> 01:03:31.806
The black one goes for quite, you know, quite high.
01:03:31.867 --> 01:03:32.789
But you don't film in here.
01:03:33.260 --> 01:03:48.226
No, i took out the light seals, i scraped them all out, which was a pain in the butt, and I'm getting a kit like a kit that's, they're all precut and they're coming, so I haven't been able to test it.
01:03:48.226 --> 01:03:52.846
To make sure that you know film goes through it, that you know the everything works.
01:03:52.846 --> 01:03:54.490
The shutter opens.
01:03:54.960 --> 01:03:59.346
This is that you were telling me on the phone, so this is the first time I've seen this camera.
01:03:59.346 --> 01:04:08.182
Yeah, and I apologize for anybody that's watching or that's listening, because there's some camera.
01:04:08.182 --> 01:04:13.199
Asmr for you, beautiful, because, yeah, we're just playing with the camera.
01:04:13.199 --> 01:04:16.385
It's probably not very entertaining audio, but this is.
01:04:16.385 --> 01:04:20.293
He was telling me on the phone that the viewfinder is a little foggy.
01:04:20.434 --> 01:04:22.327
Yeah, it seems like it might be a little easy.
01:04:22.400 --> 01:04:22.581
This.
01:04:22.581 --> 01:04:24.005
This is like perfect conditions.
01:04:24.045 --> 01:04:24.487
It is correct.
01:04:24.527 --> 01:04:25.601
Yeah, it's they.
01:04:25.601 --> 01:04:29.829
just I'm not sure if they use plastic or one.
01:04:29.891 --> 01:04:30.793
They're just kind of blue.
01:04:31.260 --> 01:04:34.329
That's just kind of how, at least in my experience what I've, what I've played with.
01:04:35.219 --> 01:04:44.831
So you know, I've gone to numerous thrift stores throughout the Omaha area and have been, for the most part, disappointed that there really aren't a lot of cameras.
01:04:44.831 --> 01:04:45.882
Goodwill first of all.
01:04:45.882 --> 01:04:48.449
It doesn't matter what goodwill you go to anymore.
01:04:48.449 --> 01:04:52.911
They send it off to shopgoodwillcom and and it gets auctioned off.
01:04:52.911 --> 01:04:58.326
That makes sense because they're going to get more profit from that than if somebody buys it at the actual store.
01:04:58.326 --> 01:05:01.327
And then you know different antique stores here.
01:05:01.327 --> 01:05:03.806
I mean, it has been slim pickings.
01:05:03.806 --> 01:05:15.411
There may be other photographers that are out really scouring the different antique shops and thrift stores and whatever here in the Omaha area, but I'm I'm telling you this this was the last thing I expected to find at that thrift store.
01:05:15.659 --> 01:05:16.724
This is this is sweet.
01:05:16.724 --> 01:05:26.940
I think it's what a good metaphor for just letting things unfold Exactly And something's not necessarily going as expected Sometimes.
01:05:26.940 --> 01:05:31.512
That I feel like usually that's the best case scenario.
01:05:32.300 --> 01:05:34.168
And I think that's where agenda comes in.
01:05:34.168 --> 01:05:35.342
You know, like you can.
01:05:35.342 --> 01:05:45.887
You can build a vision, or a vision comes to you for what you want to do, and sometimes the source, the universe, the whatever you want to call it takes you in a different direction.
01:05:45.887 --> 01:06:18.530
And I think if you live in your frustration or something negative because what you originally thought was going to happen didn't happen and don't keep yourself open to creating something new And this all sounds very corny, but that's just sort of like if I had a system of faith or spirituality or whatever it is that it is if you're going to be frustrated that what you thought was going to happen didn't happen, the creative act that you set out to, to have or to make.
01:06:20.641 --> 01:06:21.445
Just let go of it.
01:06:21.445 --> 01:06:24.509
You know, you don't know what, what it means or what's going to come of it.
01:06:24.509 --> 01:06:26.503
It looks brand new It does I mean it is?
01:06:26.503 --> 01:06:29.170
it is in next the flawless condition.
01:06:29.170 --> 01:06:30.927
So I'm really excited.
01:06:31.019 --> 01:06:32.706
But that was the Japanese camera.
01:06:32.706 --> 01:06:37.244
It'd be the mint, mint, plus, plus, plus plus, plus, plus, plus, plus, plus.
01:06:37.244 --> 01:06:40.088
Well, cool I think that's a good, a good note to end it on.
01:06:41.199 --> 01:06:48.244
And it's been a golden afternoon And I remember having the familiar conviction that life was beginning over again with the summer.