Hyperindependence and The "Strong Woman" Act is Burning You Out | Episode 35

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Welcome to the Communal Nervous System Podcast.
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I'm your host, Jenny Adams, semantic ADHD business coach, and this is a space for you if you're a sensitive, neurodivergent, hot led business owner, who won't fix that without money out.
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Here we planned nervous system regulation, which form and form business structure.
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So you can increase your impact in a way that actually is safe, sustainable, and loving.
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You have practical tools, honest behind-the-scenes conversations, mindset shifts, and a good sprinkle of spiritual wounds, all designed to help you put your body first, trust yourself again, and create more ease, energy, and abundance in your life and business.
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I'm so glad you're here.
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Let's go calm your nervous system.
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Hello and welcome back to the Calm Your Nervous System podcast.
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And in this episode, I am going to be talking to you.
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If you are one of those hyper-independent women who is fantastic in a crisis, you are an amazing problem solver, you are so good at fixing stuff when shit has hit the fan, but you are probably somebody that struggles to maybe send a message to your friend and say, I'm really struggling right now, or I could do with some help.
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You're always the one that's the helper.
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And I'm going to break down in detail what's actually going on in your nervous system, how this has developed, and why there's nothing actually wrong with you, as in you're not crazy, you're not doing anything wrong.
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Your nervous system has just developed in a certain way that has meant that it's not necessarily safe to ask for help.
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So if this sounds familiar, let's dive in because this is very common if you are neurodivergent, if you are a hyper-independent woman.
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And I'm speaking from experience here, as the woman that thought I had it all together, and I really fucking didn't.
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And I've also got about 40 minutes before my ADHD drug dealer is gonna call me.
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That's what I call my prescriber, by the way, and not an actual drug dealer.
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So let's see if we can actually uh get to the point in the next 45 minutes.
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So let's get stuck in with what's actually going on from a developmental perspective.
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So we all know if you are female and neurodivergent, I would imagine you probably didn't have your neurodiversity recognized early enough in life as a child.
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So many, pretty much all of my clients have been diagnosed later on in life.
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And it's not just the diagnosis, it's the recognition as well.
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So I got my diagnosis in 2024, which is crazy because it's 2026 now.
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It was only less than two years ago.
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But I had recognized I'd had ADHD for a good few years before then.
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I think the world kept telling me for a long time, but in a nasty way.
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I I've shared this before on the podcast, but I would hear over and over again, what's wrong with you?
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Why can't you sit still?
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What why are you going from one thing to the next?
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Have you got ADHD or something?
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And it was it was used in that nasty tone.
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And I was like, no, no, no, no, I don't have ADHD because you know I left school with 13 GCSEs, and you know, I can sit still, but if you looked inside my brain, that's where all the all of the um hyperactivity is going on.
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But on the outside, I've got it all together because I look like I have everything presentable, and that's what I see over and over in my clients with these beliefs that you are crazy, that there is something seriously wrong with you, that's not just a diagnosis, that when when it's been years and years and decades and decades of not being seen, not being given the support that you need, not being recognized for who you are, that any time you have shown any of those neurodivergent traits, it's been really nastily used against you and not supported.
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I've believed it, I still do believe this to some degree sometimes.
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I hear it in my clients, but it's it's this thought that actually maybe maybe I am just trying to get something out of the doctors, or maybe there is that I don't fit into this diagnostic criteria.
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There's I'm just broken.
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And I can say this as someone who has experienced this, and I hear this all the time.
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This is part of the late diagnosis of ADHD, autism, neurospiciness.
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It's decades of having to be a certain way.
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So no, you are not crazy.
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What's actually happened?
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Let's go into the details of how this has come about from a developmental perspective, because that voice is also that hyper-independence of no one can help me because there's something fundamentally wrong with me.
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I have to fix this.
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Because probably for most, or if not all of your life, you have had to fix the shit yourself.
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You've probably not had somebody there that has your back that you know when things get really tough, they're there for you.
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And not just maybe financially.
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It's are they there emotionally?
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You might be someone that goes, Well, I know I'm never gonna be out on the streets.
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I know I've got family, friends, they'd always put me up.
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But what about when you're having those days when you're really tough on yourself?
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Maybe you're someone who's also got PMDD, maybe it's that luteal phase, maybe you're perimenopause, going through the menopause.
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It's those days where you're just like, I just can't, I can't deal with this anymore.
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I can see these crazy thoughts, it's too much.
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On those days, who's got your back?
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Who can you actually go to without them going, okay, well, have you done this and have you done that?
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And have you know, have that?
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Someone that throws a load of advice at you.
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Have you got those people in your life where you can just say, I'm a mess?
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And they're the ones that come to you and say, We've got this.
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And I've been going through some stuff recently, and I reached out to one of my friends, which was really bloody tough, by the way, especially as someone doing the work I do, to actually be vulnerable.
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And so I'm I'm actually really struggling with some stuff at the moment, which I will go into in a later podcast, but I'm kind of in it at the moment.
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And to hear, we will get through this, we've got this.
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She was talking in that we language, and even now I can feel myself getting emotional talking about it because to have somebody like that that's actually that's so on your side that's so whatever's happened, we'll sort this, we'll figure it out, instead of how did you get here and what are you gonna do about it, and putting it all the onus back on you.
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So, who are those people in your life?
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And if you don't have them, let's go into why that might be because reaching out, being vulnerable is bloody difficult if you are somebody, somebody who has historically felt like you need to be hyper-independent.
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So I don't need to go into detail about how shit it is that women, women's health is not studied, recognized enough, that neurodivergent health isn't looked into enough.
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Put the two two and two together, it's not great.
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We know this.
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We know that we are probably expert maskers, that we are very good at fitting into what's expected of us and dimming down who we actually are and what we actually need.
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And be especially for women and girls, it's the internalizing of a lot of the symptoms that we would otherwise see externally in boys and men, especially when it comes to ADHD and autism as well.
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Actually, it tends to be a little bit more um extremes, not the word, but you know what I mean.
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It's it's more obvious in men.
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Women, we're very good at putting the right face on and the right behaviour.
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So, what's actually going on from a developmental perspective?
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So, when we are in utero, and when we are born, all we have, I mean, humans we're we're pretty um, we are very, very vulnerable when we are firstborn.
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We're we're pretty useless.
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We can't really do anything for ourselves at all.
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We can cry and puke and shit, but you know, that's about it, really.
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So when we are firstborn, all we have to go on is what our parents can do, how they can support us.
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We are completely dependent generally on our mother, on being fed, being bathed, being cleaned, going to the toilet, you know, all of those things are very, very basic human needs.
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We are completely dependent on our primary caregiver.
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And when we are born, we have no capacity to self-regulate.
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You know, we're in this nice little cozy womb space, everything's all warm, we're being fed, you know, all of our needs are met, and then we're torn out and thrust into the real world, and it's a big scary place.
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So suddenly we have to start to learn to survive in the real world.
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And who's there for us, who should be there for us, our parents.
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So we have this really important phase called co-regulation that generally it goes on throughout life, but the the key ages of it are really from around birth to about between sort of three and seven-ish.
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And this is where a child needs a child, a baby, they need that primary caregiver, they need their nervous system to soothe them, to mirror their facial expressions.
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And they've actually shown videos to babies in attachment um studies where their mum is there in front of them, but there's a slight delay on the video.
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And because the baby isn't getting the reaction quickly enough, so let's say the baby smiles and the mum doesn't smile back soon enough, the baby will start to cry.
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Whereas if that baby looks at the mum and smiles, and then the mum smiles back, and they've got this mirroring going back and forth, that is that safe co-regulation.
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When they're not getting that, and this can look like you know, a mum rocking the baby and the baby's looking at them and they're looking at their phone, or you know, they're distracted, they're trying to do things.
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And I will also say, if you are a mum listening to this, you're doing your best.
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Pretty much every single parent wants the best for their kids.
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I don't think there's many parents that don't, that genuinely don't care.
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However, every parent is human.
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Humans make mistakes, we are not perfect.
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And if we look generationally as well, how we have been raised, how our parents were raised by their parents, the era that they might have been raised in, what was okay then, what wasn't okay, the societal expectations.
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I mean, there's so much we could unpack with this.
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So compassion in here.
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We're all doing our best.
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So co-regulation, it's the soothing, it's the mirroring, it's obviously the holding.
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So if a baby's crying, it's picking them up, it's the responsiveness, it's it's showing that baby's nervous system that your needs matter.
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And if you call out, if you need something, your needs will be met.
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And that nervous system then starts to learn I'm safe because my needs will be met.
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I'm important because I ask and it is I'm receiving something.
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And the world is a safe place, that it's actually okay to be themselves, that they don't have to moderate and change their behavior in any way.
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And this is where when co-regulation happens in a safe way, that child believes, okay, well, when I'm overwhelmed, I can reach out for somebody and they make it better.
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And it's not just emotional, it's the physiological effects as well.
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So it's it's it's the releasing of oxytocin between the mother and the baby, and it decreases the cortisol, the stress levels.
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So if you can imagine a baby's crying, it's stressful for both the parent and the baby when that baby is picked up.
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It's not just the mum going, oh thank God they've shut up.
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There's that loving moment of ah, I'm here with my child.
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So the the mum gets the release of oxytocin as well as the baby.
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And I will also say here, safe, correct care regulation is predominantly focused on what the baby needs.
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And in order to do that, the parents, the caregivers, need to be as regulated as possible.
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So if the parents are extremely stressed out, the baby's nervous system will start to pick up on that.
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So we have what's known as mirror neurons.
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So again, if you are highly sensitive and neurodivergent, you probably know what it's like to walk into a room and know what's just happened.
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You can feel people's emotions.
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That is those mirror neurons working.
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It's knowing how someone else feels.
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And we can use this for good or bad.
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You know, you can walk into a room and know someone's just had an argument, and then you feel a bit riled up or angry afterwards.
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Equally, if you walk into a room and everyone's just been having a really good laugh, you walk in and go, ha, I feel better now.
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My energy's just shifted.
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So we can use this for good and bad.
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So if every time a stressed-out parent picks up their child and the child stops crying, it's also not necessarily that healthy when the parents are trying to co-regulate from their child.
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Ideally, they are co-regulating with their child.
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So they are the safe adult, the safe nervous system, and the baby is the one that is not understanding, they don't get it, they're they're too young.
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Their nervous system is not developed enough to know what soothing looks like, but the adult can self-soothe.
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So it's the baby needs to learn from the parent what safety actually feels like.
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And if often our if we are neurodivergent, our nervous systems t tend to be a lot more sensitive and intense.
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So we will feel things from that much bigger sensory perspective with a lot more sensory sensitivity.
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So, you know, even like clothing not feeling right, and if you've, you know, the baby that just can't stop crying, they might be neurodivergent and something's a little bit too tight or you know, a bit too damp, or a little bit cold, or something like that.
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And you know, it is that slightly bigger sensory experience, which then we'll need more co-regulation with, but it can look like a really fussy pain in the ass baby that just won't stop crying.
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And if the caregivers, if the parents can't recognize what's going on, and sometimes that's because we don't know that we're neurodivergent, we don't know that we're highly sensitive when we're just born, because there's no genetic test.
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There are theories on whether it's purely inherited or if it's environmental.
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And but if parents aren't noticing I've got a sensitive baby here, if those signals aren't being read, if the self-soothing isn't happening, sorry, not the self-soothing, if the soothing of the baby isn't happening, this is where we learn that it's not safe to express our needs.
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So I know for myself, I was brought up as a cry it out baby, and thank God there has been a lot of studies done now to debunk the cry-out method, although unfortunately it still is used in a lot of child rearing places.
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But unfortunately, it is still used in a lot of with a lot of parents, and actually, what happens when babies are left to cry out, and it's the the sleep training.
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Okay, we'll give them 10 minutes of crying and then we'll go and pick them up.
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It releases a lot of cortisol and it leads to insecure attachment styles.
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So avoidant attachment avoidant attachment and insecure.
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So avoidant attachment and anxious attachment.
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I can go into a little bit more detail on what these are, but essentially it's a child, a baby, learning that their needs don't matter.
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Sometimes there's love, sometimes my needs are met, and sometimes not.
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That tends to be an anxious attachment style.
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I'm never gonna get picked up.
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What's the point in crying?
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I'll just flop.
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And they might be the babies.
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Oh, they were really good, they were really quiet.
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Yeah, they cried a lot at the beginning, then they just then they just stopped.
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No, they they didn't learn to behave, they learnt to give up, which is really sad.
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And that is where that emotional detachment happens at quite a young age.
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That that defensive independence, no one's there for me.
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If I ask for help, no one comes.
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So why bother?
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I need to figure this out myself, and there are links between that cry it out method and ADHD later on in life as well.
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And I've I was looking into this because I've I've heard a lot about the cryout method.
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I was doing a little bit of research before this podcast, and just from Googling it, I mean it's it's it's still widely used, which is crazy.
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And it says you're advised not to do it until five to six months when babies are able to self-soothe.
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I'm sorry.
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What babies are able to self-soothe at that age?
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They they can flop, they can freeze, they can fall.
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Their nervous systems are not in a place where they can consciously be like, okay, I've got this.
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They're six months old.
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They cannot self-soothe.
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And we all know about the the troublesome twos of toddlers.
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That is them trying to figure out where are my boundaries, what is okay, what is not okay, and the intense emotional outbursts that anyone that's ever been around a two-year-old must know they are not self-soothing, they're trying to figure shit out because they're they're growing up.
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So that co-regulation really needs to carry on as children are starting to learn to become more independent.
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And there isn't a line in the sand where, okay, before the age of seven, co-regulation is the most important.
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After the age of seven, they can be independent.
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We all must know a seven-year-old cannot be fully independent.
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And I honestly believe, you know, into into adulthood, we all need co-regulation.
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We we're tribal beings, we live in community.
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This is why shame feels so difficult.
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Anytime we are ostracized and pushed away from our people, it feels like we're gonna die.
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We need that co-regulation, whatever age we are, but it is extremely important in the first few years of life.
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And although you might not have any conscious memories of those years, the nervous system starts to wire and develop based on those early, early experiences.
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And one of the great things that I do in the somatic work I do, and one of the wonderful techniques that we use in the somatic work that I do is to do with re-imprinting and reprogramming some of those earlier memories that your subconscious has stored that you might not know consciously, they will come up, and we can go into those memories and not necessarily change them, but we can change the nervous system response.
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So beliefs get changed, and I've actually done this.
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Obviously, I teach this, I I run clients through this, I've done a lot myself as a client, and I've actually re-reprogrammed my birth from going from a forceps delivery and then being left on my own for the first half an hour of my life, and somewhere at those beliefs of I'm on my own now, I have to manage everything by myself, there's no one there for me, and also I've been pulled out of this comfortable space, not in my own time.
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We re-pattern that into coming out when I was ready and being held and being supported in the way that I needed.
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And it's not necessarily changing what happens, but it's repatterning okay, maybe my needs could have been met.
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So instead of holding this belief from literally birth, I don't need to hold on to that anymore.
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And it's incredible when I see my one to one clients go through a similar process and What we change and where it came from, and most of the time it's those memories of I didn't even know that was in there, I didn't know that was significant in any way.
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And we we've repatterned somatically what's going on in that experience, and it's changed how you're showing up in the present, which is incredible.
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So co-regulation continues throughout life.
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The next phase of development is that independence, it's figuring out okay, who am I on my own?
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And often it's that teenage phase of I feel like an adult now and I can do everything, I don't need any help.
00:24:29.259 --> 00:24:33.740
And we know that teenagers are not fully developed yet.
00:24:33.980 --> 00:24:35.420
We we've all been there.
00:24:35.500 --> 00:24:43.660
We know what it's like to feel like we can do everything, but also emotions feel really intense.
00:24:43.819 --> 00:24:55.180
There's a lot of social stuff, there's a lot of change going on, there's a lot of um impulsivity and you know, chasing rewards, and you know, throw some throw some ADHD in there as well.
00:24:55.420 --> 00:25:02.779
Um, there's a lot, a lot going on as we start to figure out who are we as an individual?
00:25:03.339 --> 00:25:06.779
Who am I as an independent person?
00:25:07.420 --> 00:25:19.420
And it's also around this time and maybe going into early 20s, where if we haven't had that safe co-regulation, we will continually seek to find it.
00:25:19.579 --> 00:25:45.099
We will continue to do this until we find safe co-regulation, but it can turn up like codependency, so it can be molding into those friendship groups where you feel like you can only fit in if you behave in a certain way, or you need to be overly generous, or um, you know, the one that always has the friends around your house, you have to be giving something instead of just I'm enough as I am.
00:25:45.500 --> 00:25:49.259
And a great, horrible example of this.
00:25:49.420 --> 00:26:09.579
When I was 13, I remember going to a sleepover and overhearing my friends at the time talking about how they only kept me in their friendship group because I was generous and I gave them nice presents and I had a nice house, and they actually found me quite annoying.
00:26:09.660 --> 00:26:13.099
And I think they said that I was I was a little bit desperate or something.
00:26:13.339 --> 00:26:31.900
And I remember at the time I was so unsure of who I was and so desperate to fit in and be liked that I would just shape myself into what people wanted me to be, and hearing that was so heartbreaking, so so upsetting at the age of 13.
00:26:31.980 --> 00:26:34.700
And I remember then having to go into hospital.
00:26:34.940 --> 00:26:53.019
This was about a month before my dad died, and to have told him, and he cried, and my dad did not cry, and you know, that is one of those really nasty memories, but I'm sharing this because if you've been through something similar, it's not something you've done wrong.
00:26:53.259 --> 00:26:59.980
You weren't pathetic, and I've looked back at myself and thought, why did I try so hard?
00:27:00.139 --> 00:27:01.579
I wouldn't do that now.
00:27:01.819 --> 00:27:15.900
But I've learned a lot from that experience, and what I was seeking was was safety, it was co-regulation, it was being part of something, being included, being seen.
00:27:16.220 --> 00:27:21.019
And clearly at the time that was something that I felt like I didn't have.
00:27:22.220 --> 00:27:52.779
And that's one example in a teenage go away, but it can also turn into codependent, toxic, dangerous, abusive relationships where you're looking, you're seeking for that comfort from somebody, but maybe you need to be needed all the time, and they are very needy, so it can look like somebody that you need to fix, always having those problem relationships with you know, tumultuous people.
00:27:52.940 --> 00:28:10.059
And again, I have definitely been there with all of well, not all, most of my exes had so many issues, and I genuinely thought, okay, well, I can go in here and I can fix them, which sounds crazy to even say now.
00:28:10.379 --> 00:28:14.619
And sometimes they were super dependent on me, they needed me.
00:28:14.700 --> 00:28:16.139
I felt really seen.
00:28:16.460 --> 00:28:45.980
Being in a of my first relationship was horrendously abusive in all senses of the word, but I would get told over and over again, you're the only reason I'm alive, you're the reason I live, you're so important, you're everything to me, and to have grown up feeling not important, not seen, not valued, and then to have someone at the age of 15 who was five years older, who, you know, was very wise at the age of 20, dating a 15-year-old, but anyway, lots of issues there.
00:28:46.379 --> 00:29:05.420
Um, to be so obsessed with me, and also the excitement in my ADHD brain and nervous system of having somebody so obsessed, the the dopamine hits from that, some oxytocin in there, but in a pretty screwed up way.
00:29:05.900 --> 00:29:14.299
That's how we get into those codependent relationships, and then we get so deep in them, we're like, shit, how do I get out?
00:29:14.379 --> 00:29:15.259
How did I get here?
00:29:15.420 --> 00:29:23.980
How did this turn from exciting and I'm the center of their world to being a shell of a person?
00:29:24.059 --> 00:29:25.980
And that's what codependency does.
00:29:26.299 --> 00:30:00.220
And often those people they know they've got their own shit going on, they know how to find people like me, maybe people like you, they play on the RSD, the rejection-sensitive dysphoria, they know exactly what to say, and it's just another piece of evidence in your nervous system that the world is dangerous, that you aren't allowed to be loved and accepted just as you are.
00:30:00.460 --> 00:30:13.980
You need to be doing something for somebody, and this is where that codependency is also turning into that hyper-independency, and you don't need to have been in a codependent relationship to see this.
00:30:14.059 --> 00:30:21.740
It could be with friendships, it could be with parents, siblings, partners, friends, um, any kind of relationship, even money.
00:30:21.900 --> 00:30:31.500
Because when you are in the depths of that codependency, you've learned, you have evidence over the years, you cannot ask for help.
00:30:31.819 --> 00:30:36.299
And that hyper-independency is a trauma response.
00:30:36.619 --> 00:30:41.180
It is your nervous system saying, I cannot be vulnerable because that is dangerous.
00:30:41.339 --> 00:30:43.980
Because when I have asked before, no one's been there for me.
00:30:44.059 --> 00:30:49.180
And maybe not even no one's been there, but you've then had it thrown back in your face.
00:30:49.339 --> 00:30:51.259
You've had it used against you.
00:30:51.579 --> 00:30:56.619
That real vulnerability, I'm struggling right now, I need some help.
00:30:56.940 --> 00:30:59.900
And you get the fuck you, why have you not dealt with this?
00:31:00.059 --> 00:31:01.259
This is your responsibility.
00:31:01.420 --> 00:31:02.059
You're stupid.
00:31:02.139 --> 00:31:03.740
How have you got yourself into the situation?
00:31:03.900 --> 00:31:05.819
You got into it, you get out of it.
00:31:06.139 --> 00:31:09.500
Oh, even saying that, it feels horrible.
00:31:09.900 --> 00:31:15.740
That that is where that hyper-independency just gets that armor gets even stronger.
00:31:16.139 --> 00:31:17.579
Nope, I don't need anyone.
00:31:17.900 --> 00:31:19.579
I'm gonna do this by myself.
00:31:19.900 --> 00:31:31.099
And we've got that vulnerability equals danger, asking often equals rejection, and we don't like to ask as well.
00:31:31.180 --> 00:31:33.660
We don't like to need because then we feel like a burden.
00:31:34.460 --> 00:31:35.500
So we don't.
00:31:36.460 --> 00:31:44.619
So we have learnt that we get dismissed, we get invalidated, we get told we're too sensitive, we're too difficult.
00:31:44.779 --> 00:31:45.980
So what do we do?
00:31:46.220 --> 00:31:47.980
We say, I'll deal with it.
00:31:48.139 --> 00:31:49.740
It's all on me, I'm fine.
00:31:49.980 --> 00:31:51.019
We mask it.
00:31:51.180 --> 00:32:03.420
We will overcompensate, so we might be working longer hours, we might be giving more in those relationships, being super organized, people pleasing, and just burying the struggles.
00:32:03.660 --> 00:32:18.379
And I see this in most of my clients that they come to me and they might say, Okay, I've got a really successful studio that I'm running, or I'm really high up in the business I've I've built, or the work I do.
00:32:18.700 --> 00:32:34.220
A lot of them specialize in nervous system, trauma, medical work, and yet they have got to a point where they are reaching out, which is amazing, because they've not been able to for so long.
00:32:34.539 --> 00:32:54.940
Because of the positions that they are in, they've hidden the struggles that they're in because somewhere in their heads, and I do the same, we've said, but I know the information, I know about the nervous system, I know about trauma, I work with ADHDers, I understand this stuff, and yet we're still in it.
00:32:55.180 --> 00:32:57.099
And I'm holding my hand up here.
00:32:57.259 --> 00:33:07.019
You know, I'm a nervous system expert, I've worked with ADHD for years, I've coached clients, I've worked with embodiment and the body and what's going on physically.
00:33:07.180 --> 00:33:14.700
I still see a personal trainer who is constantly blowing my mind about what's going on in my body physically, even though I've studied anatomy.
00:33:14.940 --> 00:33:19.740
Um, I talk to my clients about regulation all the time.
00:33:20.139 --> 00:33:22.859
I practice somatic tools all the time.
00:33:23.019 --> 00:33:24.059
I know this stuff.
00:33:24.220 --> 00:33:26.059
I still get fucking dysregulated.
00:33:26.139 --> 00:33:40.139
I still have those thoughts that I can't do this, or there's something wrong with me, or someone's gonna find me out, or you know, all of these things that you know I can laugh about now, but when I'm in them, they feel really fucking serious and scary.
00:33:40.379 --> 00:33:46.379
And it's that old hyper-independent trait wanting to come up and go, no, no, don't speak to anyone.
00:33:46.539 --> 00:33:47.660
This is your mess.
00:33:47.900 --> 00:33:49.660
You get yourself out of it.
00:33:49.980 --> 00:34:16.860
And one thing I have been doing more recently is actually reaching out to my friends, family, and saying, I'm struggling with certain things and being open and changing the dynamic instead of pretending that everything's okay, actually saying, you know what, I I do need some help, I I do need some support right now, or can you just be there for me?
00:34:17.500 --> 00:34:28.380
And at the precipice of asking that, everything feels like it's about to collapse, and then you do it and go, Oh, oh, that wasn't too bad.
00:34:28.700 --> 00:34:30.460
Why was I so worried?
00:34:31.260 --> 00:34:37.340
So we'll go into a few tips in a minute of what you can do that can help.
00:34:37.900 --> 00:34:45.260
But what that hyper-independency can look like if you haven't already recognized it's refusing to ask for help.
00:34:45.500 --> 00:35:00.940
So even if you're absolutely drowning in stress, whether that's in work or life, relationships, parenting, managing house, food, whatever, everything being completely chaotic, but you cannot ask for help.
00:35:01.019 --> 00:35:02.380
No, no, I'm fine, I'm fine, I'm fine.
00:35:02.539 --> 00:35:07.820
You know, you're there with like 300 plates spinning all at once, and you're like, no, I got this, I'm fine, I've I can do this, I can do this.
00:35:07.980 --> 00:35:12.700
Knowing full well that everything's about to collapse any minute, but I'm fine.
00:35:13.019 --> 00:35:15.099
Fine, that's that's the key word there.
00:35:15.260 --> 00:35:24.619
And I love this acronym for fine, I'm fine, is uh F is fucked up, insecure, neurotic, and emotional.
00:35:24.860 --> 00:35:25.740
So there you go.
00:35:25.900 --> 00:35:31.420
Next time you say you're fine, you're really fucked up, insecure, neurotic, and emotional.
00:35:31.740 --> 00:35:34.300
So are you really fine or do you need some help?
00:35:34.539 --> 00:35:37.099
Because asking for help and support is good.
00:35:37.260 --> 00:35:38.460
It's okay.
00:35:38.860 --> 00:35:49.900
It's hyperindependence, it's managing the crisis, it's managing the chaos, and not telling anyone until it's all fixed, it's all done and dusted with.
00:35:50.059 --> 00:35:57.659
Whilst you're in it, you just pretend everything's fine until after, and then you're well, I was going through this really tough time recently.
00:35:57.980 --> 00:36:00.219
Why did you go through it on your own?
00:36:00.619 --> 00:36:17.579
It's that really uncomfortable physical feeling, or like panic if someone offers to help, the feeling of, well, I must be failing, or like a drop in your stomach, or everything tightening up when someone actually says, I can see you're struggling.
00:36:17.659 --> 00:36:18.699
Do you need some help?
00:36:18.940 --> 00:36:22.380
It's only having surface level friendships.
00:36:22.699 --> 00:36:31.659
So if you're not willing to go that deeper, more vulnerable place, you might just surround yourself with people that are quite shallow, that they don't want to go there either.
00:36:31.739 --> 00:36:33.179
And it's just, yeah, how's work?
00:36:33.340 --> 00:36:34.139
Yeah, good.
00:36:34.300 --> 00:36:36.940
How's you know, have you booked a holiday anytime soon?
00:36:37.019 --> 00:36:38.219
Yeah, yeah, how's it going?
00:36:38.460 --> 00:36:44.940
And if you're staying on that surface level, that's a big red flag to say, you don't want to go.
00:36:45.259 --> 00:36:46.940
You don't want to go deeper.
00:36:47.340 --> 00:36:51.019
Because if you need the help, there's no one there for you.
00:36:51.179 --> 00:36:57.420
So again, you are unconsciously reinforcing that belief that there's no one there for you.
00:36:57.579 --> 00:37:02.219
Instead of the people that actually go, you're not okay, are you?
00:37:02.380 --> 00:37:06.780
I'm not leaving until we talk through this because I can see something's wrong.
00:37:06.940 --> 00:37:09.500
And I'm here for you, I've got your back.
00:37:09.980 --> 00:37:13.099
I'm not taking that I'm fine, it's bullshit.
00:37:13.340 --> 00:37:22.699
If you can get those people in your life or coaches, they are fantastic people to have in your life because they will crack through the shit quickly.
00:37:23.099 --> 00:37:31.980
And when you're on the other side of that, it's a huge relief to not have to carry the weight of your of the world alone anymore.
00:37:32.219 --> 00:37:48.139
It also looks like overgiving, and maybe you're the one that always always has to cook, that does everything in the household, that you're you organise all the finances, you do everything because you don't want to be a burden, you don't want to have to ask for help with any of those things.
00:37:48.300 --> 00:37:50.139
So you over-deliver.
00:37:50.380 --> 00:37:53.659
And the flip side of that as well is struggling to delegate.
00:37:53.820 --> 00:37:57.259
If you do ask for some for help, you're on someone's back.
00:37:57.420 --> 00:37:59.500
No, oh no, you're doing it wrong.
00:37:59.739 --> 00:38:01.340
I wouldn't do it that way.
00:38:01.739 --> 00:38:05.900
And this can be as simple as how you load the dishwasher.
00:38:06.059 --> 00:38:10.780
I will cram every single last thing in the dishwasher and have it stacked in a specific perfect order.
00:38:10.940 --> 00:38:16.699
My husband puts half as much stuff in there and puts it all in weird places, still gets clean.
00:38:16.940 --> 00:38:18.619
He's put things in the dishwasher.
00:38:18.780 --> 00:38:20.460
I've learned to let that go.
00:38:21.019 --> 00:38:24.219
There's also a part of me sometimes that goes, why, why are you putting that there?
00:38:24.300 --> 00:38:26.380
No, that's not going to get clean if you put it there.
00:38:26.699 --> 00:38:28.539
No, do it that way.
00:38:29.579 --> 00:38:34.059
It's struggling to delegate and just go, oh, it's just easier if I do it.
00:38:34.139 --> 00:38:35.179
But then what happens?
00:38:35.340 --> 00:38:37.259
Everything is on you.
00:38:37.980 --> 00:38:43.500
And there's also an intense sense of pride from being the one who has it all together.
00:38:43.659 --> 00:39:06.940
You know, the strong woman who has it all together, that she's she's bought her own property, that she doesn't need a man, that she has a good job, she runs her own business, everything's going well, it all looks good, but actually, under the surface of that, is an intense loneliness and the inability to actually lean on somebody because you're the one that everybody leans on.
00:39:07.179 --> 00:39:10.380
So where do you go when you need that help?
00:39:10.860 --> 00:39:20.780
Okay, so we've covered the first step with co-regulation, and that's being with others from a young age and our nervous system speaking to each other.
00:39:21.019 --> 00:39:34.699
It is that more dependent place to be in as a child, but it's being around safe people and our nervous systems learning that it's safe to be around people, safe for our needs to be met.
00:39:35.179 --> 00:39:41.739
Then we go into the next phase, which is independence, healthy independence, not hyper-independence.
00:39:41.980 --> 00:40:01.019
And that is learning that okay, you can go out there in the world as an independent person, you can soothe yourself, you can tolerate frustration and feelings and emotions, and know that you can reach out and you can manage those feelings without suppressing them.
00:40:01.259 --> 00:40:09.340
And it's that secure confidence that you can grow into to function as a healthy, independent person.
00:40:09.900 --> 00:40:14.460
And then the final stage of development is interdependence.
00:40:14.860 --> 00:40:36.380
And if you think of that word inter, it's it's collectional, it's that's even a word, it's the interaction between you and others, and that interdependence is a healthy and secure way of knowing that you can lean on and be leaned on, right?
00:40:36.619 --> 00:40:43.900
So you can ask for help, and it's that give and take, and it doesn't mean you give and they take, right?
00:40:44.139 --> 00:40:56.699
It's the reciprocity, and it's the trust that if you ask for support, if you receive support, you don't need to give anything back.
00:40:56.940 --> 00:41:04.219
So it's not that you become a needy person and you take, take, take, take, take, because if you're listening to this, you aren't one of those people.
00:41:04.940 --> 00:41:16.539
But it's safely knowing you can ask for help and receive help and support without it making you weak, without it meaning you need to give something back in return.
00:41:16.699 --> 00:41:25.659
It's something deep in you that knows you are worthy as you are to receive support, to receive help.
00:41:25.820 --> 00:41:27.420
You don't need to give anything back.
00:41:27.500 --> 00:41:35.820
You aren't taking from anyone, you're not being a burden, the same love, support, compassion that you give to others.
00:41:36.139 --> 00:41:37.980
Why can't you receive that?
00:41:38.300 --> 00:41:41.019
Why will you bend over backwards for other people?
00:41:41.259 --> 00:41:50.139
Yeah, if someone shows you the tiniest bit of generosity or support, something in you pushes it away.
00:41:50.539 --> 00:41:55.980
It's being able to find that interdependency where you can receive.
00:41:56.300 --> 00:42:10.460
And that can look as simple as someone holding a door open for you, or you know, letting you go ahead, or you know, it's the the lack of sorry, oh no, no, I'm sorry, no, no, no, I'm sorry.
00:42:10.619 --> 00:42:13.659
It's the yeah, you're in my way, or you bumped into me.
00:42:14.139 --> 00:42:14.460
Okay.
00:42:15.019 --> 00:42:22.300
I'll I will receive your apology instead of having to be an overgive because you're not worthy enough as you are.
00:42:22.460 --> 00:42:26.940
So if you're recognizing any of these traits, they aren't permanent.
00:42:27.179 --> 00:42:32.699
You don't need to go back to birth and relive your whole your whole life again.
00:42:32.860 --> 00:42:35.500
I mean, we can do some of that in the one-to-one work I do.
00:42:35.659 --> 00:42:38.460
So, you know, drop me a message if you are interested.
00:42:38.780 --> 00:42:44.139
But you can start to change this hyper-independent pattern.
00:42:44.860 --> 00:42:47.420
So just recognizing it, first of all.
00:42:47.579 --> 00:42:58.300
So let me know if you're resonating with anything that you've heard in this podcast and saying, Oh shit, yeah, I see myself here.
00:42:58.539 --> 00:43:01.500
I can I can tell I'm doing X, Y, and Z.
00:43:02.860 --> 00:43:07.420
It's not just being independent, it's protecting yourself from something.
00:43:07.659 --> 00:43:18.059
And if you're running your life on the defense from fear, one, it's exhausting, and it will burn you out if you haven't already burnt out or got a chronic illness.
00:43:18.300 --> 00:43:24.219
And you don't need to live like that, you don't need to be overgiving and not enough, and it's fucking exhausting.
00:43:24.380 --> 00:43:28.780
You know, women are we are so we have so much power and capability.
00:43:29.179 --> 00:43:33.980
Why are we all being too nice about everything and sacrificing ourselves?
00:43:34.139 --> 00:43:36.539
Like, no one's gonna come and give you a fucking medal.
00:43:36.860 --> 00:43:39.500
You're not gonna be a martyr.
00:43:40.300 --> 00:43:41.579
We need to stop.
00:43:42.300 --> 00:43:45.500
And yes, it can sound easy for me to say, we need to stop.
00:43:45.659 --> 00:43:46.860
I'm still in it.
00:43:47.259 --> 00:43:48.460
Start small.
00:43:49.659 --> 00:43:56.059
It's asking for the little things, accept the lift, let someone open the door for you.
00:43:56.300 --> 00:44:07.340
It's asking for a little bit of advice from somebody with something that you're struggling with instead of having to do it all yourself or just speaking to AI about it because they're a faceless, non-human entity.
00:44:07.659 --> 00:44:18.380
Reach out, show your nervous system that it is safe to be supported, start small, build up that evidence and you know, celebrate yourself.
00:44:18.619 --> 00:44:25.500
When you have said, actually, yeah, that would be great if if you don't mind helping out when we're doing X, Y, and Z.
00:44:25.980 --> 00:44:27.259
Could I have the lift?
00:44:27.500 --> 00:44:28.619
Yeah, thank you.
00:44:28.860 --> 00:44:29.259
Thank you.
00:44:29.420 --> 00:44:30.619
I would like to come around for dinner.
00:44:30.780 --> 00:44:37.500
And changing your language as well, because often we can talk about reaching out for help or or support when we're struggling.
00:44:37.659 --> 00:44:43.179
We don't need to literally text someone and say, I need your help, I'm struggling, because that can feel like a lot.
00:44:43.420 --> 00:44:47.900
It can be texting someone and just saying, have you got 20 minutes to have a chat?
00:44:48.139 --> 00:44:51.340
Or I'm having a bit of a bad day, can you make me smile?
00:44:51.500 --> 00:44:53.659
Or you know, start small.
00:44:53.900 --> 00:44:56.300
I can I could do with some help with something.
00:44:56.380 --> 00:44:57.579
Can you help me figure this out?
00:44:57.739 --> 00:45:02.460
It doesn't need to be the my world's about to fall apart and I'm such a failure as I am.
00:45:02.699 --> 00:45:03.019
No.
00:45:03.659 --> 00:45:05.099
Doesn't need to be that.
00:45:05.500 --> 00:45:18.219
And recognizing the RSD in here as well, that if someone, if you have reached out and someone maybe hasn't got back to you, or they're not seeing what you need, sometimes we need to be clear.
00:45:18.539 --> 00:45:27.900
And 99.9% of the time, it's generally us taking things the wrong way instead of whatever stories we've made up about.
00:45:28.059 --> 00:45:37.420
Oh, well, actually, maybe they haven't replied because I'm actually I'm asking for too much and I shouldn't be, they're going through something and I I can't put on them.
00:45:37.579 --> 00:45:40.460
That's why they've not replied because I'm just such a pain in the ass.
00:45:40.860 --> 00:45:42.059
They're putting me off.
00:45:42.380 --> 00:45:46.460
99.9% of the time, that is not true.
00:45:47.179 --> 00:45:48.539
They are probably busy.
00:45:48.860 --> 00:45:54.059
And I remember doing this back when I broke up with that abusive ex-boyfriend.
00:45:54.300 --> 00:46:02.460
I remember texting my mum, and this was 2009, you know, flip phone era, and said, I've just broken up with him.
00:46:02.539 --> 00:46:04.860
And that was the final sort of nail in the coffin.
00:46:05.019 --> 00:46:06.219
I'm out, I'm done.
00:46:06.539 --> 00:46:08.219
She didn't talk to me about it for two days.
00:46:08.619 --> 00:46:09.420
Two days.
00:46:09.980 --> 00:46:12.940
I was like, is she just blaming me for this?
00:46:13.099 --> 00:46:14.300
Is she not gonna help me?
00:46:14.539 --> 00:46:16.139
Am I just alone to deal with this?
00:46:16.219 --> 00:46:17.259
And I don't want to say anything.
00:46:17.340 --> 00:46:19.179
But you know, I was grieving all of this stuff.
00:46:19.259 --> 00:46:20.940
I was 18 at the time.
00:46:21.579 --> 00:46:27.659
And then she this is before we obviously are all addicted to our smartphones as much as we are now.
00:46:28.059 --> 00:46:35.420
She opened her phone and came rushing straight into my bedroom and was like, oh my god, Jen, I've not looked at my phone in two days, it's been in my handbag.
00:46:35.659 --> 00:46:37.099
Why didn't you tell me?
00:46:37.340 --> 00:46:40.860
And I'd gone through all of these stories, oh, she doesn't care, and all of this shit.
00:46:41.019 --> 00:46:43.340
When actually her phone was in her handbag.
00:46:43.500 --> 00:46:44.539
She just hadn't looked.
00:46:44.619 --> 00:46:48.780
And I didn't feel safe enough at the time to go and tell her all of this.
00:46:48.860 --> 00:46:52.059
So I'd text her instead because that was my my way of getting around.
00:46:52.139 --> 00:46:53.900
I need some help, but I can't say it to you.
00:46:54.059 --> 00:46:54.780
Come to me.
00:46:54.940 --> 00:46:55.900
So there you go.
00:46:56.139 --> 00:47:03.980
99.9% of the time, it's not because they don't care, it's because they're busy or they've their phones left in their handbag.
00:47:04.139 --> 00:47:06.780
They haven't seen these things, they've got their own lives going on.
00:47:06.940 --> 00:47:08.699
It's not about you.
00:47:09.019 --> 00:47:10.539
Well done for asking, though.
00:47:10.699 --> 00:47:12.780
And finding those safe people.
00:47:13.099 --> 00:47:25.900
So getting around other neurodivergent people communities, where you can openly talk about the RSD and the hyper-independence and some of some of these struggles and be like, oh, it's not just me.
00:47:26.059 --> 00:47:28.860
I'm not just I'm not crazy, because you're not.
00:47:29.179 --> 00:47:36.940
And this is where those those beautiful community spaces are so incredible that we can we can just be ourselves in.
00:47:37.099 --> 00:47:47.820
And of course, if this is a continual pattern over and over, find some somatic therapy, coaching, some support, because entangled in all of this is trauma.
00:47:47.980 --> 00:47:51.579
And it might be small tea trauma, not big T trauma.
00:47:51.659 --> 00:47:53.259
There might be a bit of both.
00:47:53.579 --> 00:48:00.219
Working with someone who's trauma-informed, who can work with the nervous system, who understands neurodiversity.
00:48:00.619 --> 00:48:04.699
It's not just tell me about your childhood and talking about stuff.
00:48:04.940 --> 00:48:15.019
Because often with us ADHD is we are either too smart and we figure out where someone's trying to get to us, we give them the right information, or it just doesn't work.
00:48:15.179 --> 00:48:21.659
The neurotypical therapies generally, well not generally, sometimes don't work as well for us.
00:48:21.980 --> 00:48:25.019
So if you are looking for some support, I am here.
00:48:25.179 --> 00:48:40.940
Send me a message on Instagram as well, or pop me an email from through my website, you know, get in touch, research some people, but you are not weak by any means for reaching out and asking for help and support.
00:48:41.179 --> 00:48:45.179
And everyone I've worked with has said, why did I not do this sooner?
00:48:45.420 --> 00:48:50.380
You don't have to wait until things get really, really bad in order to get some help.
00:48:50.460 --> 00:49:02.780
You don't need to say I'm in absolute crisis and now I do something about it, especially if you're in the UK and you wait to go to the NHS, because if you're at that point, things are a bit, there's there's not that much help out there.
00:49:03.019 --> 00:49:05.340
So there are lots of free resources.
00:49:05.420 --> 00:49:07.739
You know, this is what I do my podcast for.
00:49:08.139 --> 00:49:11.659
Um send me a message if you're interested in working together.
00:49:11.820 --> 00:49:14.539
Give yourself the space to grieve as well.
00:49:14.860 --> 00:49:21.340
Because if this it is all new information to you, there can be some anger that comes up towards maybe your parents.
00:49:21.500 --> 00:49:26.219
And this is why I caveated this at the beginning, because we're all doing our best.
00:49:26.460 --> 00:49:29.579
Your parents were doing their best with the information they had at the time.
00:49:29.820 --> 00:49:38.059
Science at the time was saying, let them cry out, but really, you've just taught yourself, your kids, that help isn't there.
00:49:38.300 --> 00:49:45.019
It can be frustrating when your neurodiversity hasn't been recognized until you're an adult.
00:49:45.340 --> 00:49:51.019
And maybe it's your kids that are being diagnosed and given the support that you wish you had.
00:49:51.179 --> 00:49:56.539
It's okay to be sad, frustrated, angry, upset about this.
00:49:56.699 --> 00:49:58.139
Let yourself grieve.
00:49:58.380 --> 00:50:01.820
Let yourself say it isn't fair because it isn't fair.
00:50:01.900 --> 00:50:05.259
But generally, we've all been doing our best with the information that we have.
00:50:05.500 --> 00:50:18.940
Things are changing now, and you can be part of that change by not showing the next generation that they have to mask, that they have to be hyper-independent, that they have to get into those codependent relationships, all of that shit.
00:50:19.179 --> 00:50:20.300
We can do better.
00:50:20.460 --> 00:50:24.059
We can actually say, you know what, I'm struggling a little bit at the moment.
00:50:24.139 --> 00:50:25.179
I'm feeling vulnerable.
00:50:25.259 --> 00:50:26.940
I'm gonna get some help and support.
00:50:27.179 --> 00:50:37.259
And that interdependence is not weakness, it is the most advanced developmental stage that there is.
00:50:37.980 --> 00:50:46.059
So being able to ask for help, leaning on your friends, your family, your support group shows how developed, how advanced that you actually are.
00:50:46.300 --> 00:50:54.940
And the fact that you've got this far without a reliable support system isn't a testament to how little you need people.
00:50:55.259 --> 00:51:00.059
It's a testament to how hard you've been working to hold it all together.
00:51:00.219 --> 00:51:01.820
You don't need to do this alone.
00:51:02.139 --> 00:51:08.860
We are not created, we have not evolved to be alone as humans.
00:51:09.259 --> 00:51:15.900
We need people, and it's not too late to go and find your people to break these patterns.
00:51:16.619 --> 00:51:19.739
So I hope today has been helpful.
00:51:19.980 --> 00:51:27.099
Take some time to go for a walk in nature if this is feeling heavy today, if this has blown your brains a little bit.
00:51:27.500 --> 00:51:29.820
Remember, you were doing your best.
00:51:30.300 --> 00:51:31.500
We all are.
00:51:31.820 --> 00:51:37.820
Help support is out there, and I hope this helps you understand yourself a little bit better.
00:51:38.059 --> 00:51:43.420
Because if I had this information years ago, things would have been a lot different.
00:51:43.579 --> 00:51:53.420
But then you wouldn't be here listening to all the mistakes I made in my life, and hopefully learning from them because I didn't have this information.
00:51:53.900 --> 00:51:56.219
I will speak to you in the next episode.
00:51:56.460 --> 00:51:59.099
Take care of yourself and I will see you then.
00:52:00.300 --> 00:52:03.420
Thank you so much for being here and listening to this episode.
00:52:03.579 --> 00:52:10.940
If something landed for you, I'd massively appreciate you leaving a five-star review or share this episode with someone who would really benefit from it.
00:52:11.179 --> 00:52:22.860
Your support helps this podcast reach more sensitive neurodivergent business owners who are ready to do things differently and increase your impact with more regulation, more ease, and less burnout.
00:52:23.099 --> 00:52:26.460
I appreciate you being here and I'll see you in the next episode.