Trust the Process: From Frustration to the Dog He Can Trust Anywhere | Chris Copeland

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Have you ever felt like your retriever might not turn out like you hoped for it to?
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We get it.
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The truth is, training a retriever isn't simple, but it doesn't have to be hard.
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On the Bill From Here podcast, you're going to hear real stories from real people who used to be stuck with the retrievers, but are now confident they're on the right path to training their dog successfully.
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Welcome to the Bill From Here podcast.
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On this episode, it's my great honor to be introducing you to CGM member Chris Copeland.
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Chris has been with us for quite some time now, seven or eight years or so.
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So he's been with us pretty much since the beginning.
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Corn's been around coming up on nine years as of recording this episode.
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And it's uh so it's just been a great honor to have him here for this long.
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And that's one of the things I love about our members is that, you know, when you become a member, you're not in or out.
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You know, you're you're a member for life.
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And that's one of the beautiful things about it.
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But Chris has got some amazing stories to share.
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You know, we share a lot of uh common interests as well.
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And just I love his approach on dogs in general.
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It's not just about this amazing duck dog, but it's also about this amazing family dog that he can take on all of his adventures, an adventure dog, so to speak.
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So um, you're gonna really enjoy this story.
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So without further ado, welcome aboard, Chris.
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Glad you're here.
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Thanks, Josh.
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Appreciate you having me.
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Uh I was really excited whenever I got the uh note to fill out the questionnaire, felt to tell the story, and uh just honored to be here and happy to be a member of CGA.
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Man, it's our honor.
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And when I saw your story come through, you just fired me up.
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And you know, since we've talked and kind of gone back all that, I you start to remember the conversations we've had early on, and you start to remember all those interactions.
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And I just think I can't even believe it's been eight years.
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It doesn't really feel like it.
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I mean, it's just gone by so fast.
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It certainly has.
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Uh from the from the time I got my you know first puff to start the CGA program, uh, yeah, how much just changes is amazing.
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And our my my surroundings personally, you're getting you guys as a business, the content of CGA, the the member environment, uh wow.
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Can't say enough about it.
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I have to admit, I'm I'm not a social media person.
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Um I have enough busy stuff to do in life, but I I really do.
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I am fascinated every day by seeing the members, asking open questions.
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And that's the thing I've always appreciated about y'all's forum is people can go on there to get help.
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You know, there because you you guys have helped me so many times, even before we had the the member forum, where I would send you an email with something I was experiencing and always helpful.
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And it's just fun to watch the members be able to do that and help other members.
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It's it's a really cool experience.
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Yeah, it blows me away.
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I mean, we're really blessed, the people.
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I mean, people like you, and it's really just the people that are just they're kind.
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And you know, nobody's there trying to I think it's just because our people are comfortable in themselves too.
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They're they're not here to prove anything.
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They have nothing to prove because they're here to learn.
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And that approach, that here to learn is the really the right approach to have.
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Um, well, Chris, let's go back on your story.
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I want people to know who you are.
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Uh, you know, you've been with us a while, we know you, but I know the people, the listeners, it'd be cool to get to know you.
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Where did you grow up?
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What's your background?
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And you know, I'm always curious, how did you get it?
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How did we get into dogs?
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Like, you know, we all found this common interest.
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Where where did it all begin for you?
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Yeah, so uh I I grew up in uh grew up in Georgia, um, multiple places in Georgia.
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Um when my father graduated from um Auburn University, we moved back to my family's, both my families are from Valdasta, Georgia.
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And my mother's side of the family had a farm on the outside of town, and my dad's parents lived in town, and we lived there for the first seven years.
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Uh, then my dad up and decided he wanted to go to medical school.
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So we moved to Augusta, Georgia when I was seven years old.
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And yeah, I thought that was an out-of-body experience, but it turned out great.
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Um but my brother and I continued to go back to the family farm.
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I mean, we were living our lives in Augusta, but then the way my brother and I always like to tell it, we were shipped off in the summertime to go live with my grandparents, and my brother and I both cropped tobacco on my grandparents' farm.
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Wow.
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And, you know, we were rambunctious kids, fishing, hunting, turtles.
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What what we were just outside all the time.
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My brother nor I, he's three years older than I am, neither of us ever played video games.
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Uh, we didn't like to be inside at all.
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We wanted to go outside and tear things up.
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Um yeah.
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But on one particular trip uh at Thanksgiving, uh we went back to my grandparents' farm and I was at my grandparents' house and my uncle came in uh for the four o'clock afternoon coffee that they always did, and he decided that he and wanted to invite me to go duck hunting, and I had no idea what uh what to expect or what to even think, but I knew I was excited that my uncle wanted to take me along.
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Uh so clearly didn't sleep the night before, and he came and got me early, and we sneak through the woods with a flashlight, and we end up on this creek on the backside of my grandparents' farm.
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And he sat me down on the sandbar along the edge of the creek and handed me a shotgun, which they had taught me how to shoot and handle.
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And he just said, Do you want me to sit with you?
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And I said, No, I think I'll be fine.
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And I just remember sitting there kind of watching, you know, that's that one thing that I think is still common for all waterfowlers is that, you know, that 10, 15 minutes, 20 minutes in the blind before it's legal shooting time.
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Uh so not only is it just a beautiful time of day, but i the bird activity, you know, before you can actually do anything, it's just it's so incredible to watch.
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And that was really my first experience with it.
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And it was so quiet, and I hear the wing whistles come over my head and had no idea what it was.
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I look up and finally I make that association.
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You know, within 20 minutes, I I got a shot off and was lucky enough to hit one and picked it up out of the water, and it was a male wood duck, and all of those colors.
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I I was just I was in awe of what what I had in my hand.
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And ultimately that led not only to me being a I'll be a lifelong waterfowler, supporter of uh ducks unlimited, any any conservation group that is preserving habitat for waterfowl or songbirds.
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But I ended up studying birds in school.
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Um really?
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Yeah.
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I mean, I have a general biology degree, but all of my upper level electives were birds and marine fish.
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Uh that's kind of where I like to spend my time.
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I figured if I had to spend my money for going to college, I was gonna enjoy I was gonna enjoy what I studied.
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That's cool.
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So that's kind of that's kind of where you know what got me into it.
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Um but as a kid question on the college thing.
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Yeah.
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The uh did you go in knowing that that's what you wanted to study, or what's the what's the story there?
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Well, I mean, I knew I was gonna pursue uh I knew I was gonna pursue a degree in bio biological science of some sort.
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Uh aspiration was to go to medical school like my father.
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Uh I was not that good of a student.
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But I I was a decent student.
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Uh, but you know, as my dad got into it, you know, once a physician gets into practice, you finish with residency.
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I mean, I think he ended up doing like 12 years of school uh just you know, post uh post-graduate stuff.
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And really being a physician is it's not easy.
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There there's a lot to it, and you have to have a really special temperament um to deal with patients, to deal with insurance companies, to deal with regulations.
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Um you know, and over time I just kind of lost interest in that, but I did love uh wildlife sciences.
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Um but I loved most specifically is uh the ecology of birds and fish and how those things relate to us, and that's really where I concentrated my efforts.
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Um But then as these things go, I mean, people ask me, they're like, Well, what'd you study in school?
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I said, study biology, uh, birds and fish.
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And they're like, Well, how did you end up in the plant business?
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And I was like, Well, I mean, I've worked on a farm my whole life when I after I graduated from college, my wife and I were dating.
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Uh we got married right after uh before I graduated, and we had our uh and within a year we had our first child on the way, and Carver was born in 2001.
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And I was working on a golf course at that time, but that particular golf course was only open eight months out of the year.
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So I had to find something to do uh in between because you can't support a family if you're not working.
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Amen.
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Yeah, and only certain segments of the golf business pay enough to support the family anyway.
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Um and so I met a guy that my my wife knew, she was managing a restaurant, and one of their regular customers owned a nursery.
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And he invited me out for an interview.
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And when I say nursery, I was thinking about a garden center, and this nursery was 400 acres at the time uh of potted plants.
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Yeah, it was it was impressive.
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And once I got started with him, you know, I've been in the nursery business ever since.
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I I just recently left the plant production side to join a different company, but working on working in the nursery business outside just it was everything I wanted.
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And that's what gave me an opportunity to really start with dogs is because I had a chance I could take the dogs to work with me.
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That is awesome.
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I mean, goodness, I mean, there's a lot this isn't the podcast where I have a lot of questions about all the uh the nursery stuff.
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My wife and I like to garden together, so I I love seeing stuff grow.
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Yeah.
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Uh but there's honestly a lot of parallels between the dog's growth and and then seeing plants grow and all that the development cycles and everything.
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That's a good point.
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So I'm I'm fascinated by all that stuff, honestly.
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That's that's a great point.
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Um So it's really my wife's uncle's fault.
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He got me my first, he got us our first dog.
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Um She came from a kennel, she came from a kennel in Greenville, South Carolina.
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Uh he was a college professor and he had a couple of dogs of his own.
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And duck dogs are just He he had a he had a black labrador, her name was Anna, um, and he he didn't have any children uh and he had a lot of time on his hands, so he trained her to be an adventure dog, hunting dog.
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He she did all kinds of things.
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She was a she was a fantastic dog.
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And so he worked with that breeder uh at that kennel and hooked us up with a litter and he picked a pop for us.
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But unfortunately, within a week of me getting her home, uh she got really, really sick.
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And oh man.
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Yeah.
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It turns out the the litter uh the immunizations didn't work or something, and the whole litter got parvoted.
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Um no, yeah, that's really bad right there.
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Yeah.
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But we had a really good we had a really good vet in uh Edgefield, South Carolina at the time.
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Uh have to give a shout out to Clarence Bagshaw.
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He he took her in and kept her for four days and saved her.
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And she she was a fantastic dog.
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Uh I I tried training her.
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That you know, if I I can't count the number of times I had to swim for a bumper for myself.
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Um she would not do it.
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She did not like retrieving bumpers, but uh I can't count the number of w waterfowls she picked up, uh the hours we spent in the dove field.
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She she understood uh you know the exercises that we were trying to do, but she really was just a great hunting companion.
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Um Wow.
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And so that's kind of where it started.
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And boy, Nellie Nellie lived she lived f we put her down just shy of 15 years.
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She lived a long time.
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Wow.
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That's amazing.
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And yeah, the it the kids, you know, the I I recommend for everybody.
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You know, my son is wanting to start that journey here pretty soon after he finishes law school, and I promised him that I'd get him a dog uh when he was done.
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But there's always this question about do I have enough time?
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Do do I have enough time if I have a young family, do I have enough time for a dog?
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Much less do I have enough time to train my own dog.
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Um and I can honestly say that it never felt like a burden to us.
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Yeah, we we can't see our lives without one.
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That's amazing.
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And I think it's the right mentality too.
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I mean, some people may genuinely not have enough time, but if you if you don't have enough time for a dog, you know, maybe some other priorities should be reconsidered, right?
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I mean, it doesn't take a lot of time to train a dog, you know, 20 minutes a day, uh four days a week.
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And if you don't have that amount of margin in your life, that's something to think about.
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I'll just say that.
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Yeah, but that was the thing that really struck me with uh, you know, that starting back when I joined CGA when 52 Plus was not available at that time, and now it's even more refined.
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You know, that that training, just like with work, you know, just like raising children, that training is every moment.
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Every moment there's a decision to be made, there's a conversation to have.
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And it's and I remember you telling me this one time.
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It don't allow the dog to start habits that you're gonna have to unwind later.
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And, you know, though those were the things that I didn't know with the first two dogs.
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I trained them to sit.
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I trained them to come back when called.
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Um, I trained them to retrieve a little bit.
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But never never did I create what I feel like I have today, that bond that I have with my dog uh in the Wow.
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It's just it's just being, I'm just always very conscious of my demeanor around the dogs now.
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So I don't So going from uh let's dive into that a little bit because that's important.
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You you said something I think it's really profound, and I hope a lot of people caught that.
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And it wasn't, you know, you taught your dog these things.
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It's not what you know that's the problem, it's what you don't know that can be the problem.
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Yes.
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I think there's a lot of things that a lot of people don't know.
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I was on a call with someone today that had run into some problems.
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This they're not a cornerstone member yet, they're thinking about becoming one.
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They've got this dog and now it's not retrieving.
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And we kind of diagnosed some of the challenges they're facing, and one of those was they were retrieving until the dog wanted to quit.
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And that was one of those small things, and then from there they would stop.
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Yeah.
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That's one of those small details.
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If you stopped even earlier than that, that's the better time to stop because if if you don't let the dog quit, the dog doesn't know it can quit.
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Yes.
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Like that's just one small detail.
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But I want to kind of dive into that coming from your perspective because you well, actually, let's go, let's go back even further.
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How did you learn to train these dogs before corners come back in the day?
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What were you buying books?
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What what's your journey there?
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How did you go from getting a dog to I'm gonna train this dog?
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Well, let's go to that part.
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Yeah, so uh initially it was all about it was all about um any book that I could get my hands on, uh gun dog, water dog, uh compare contrast.
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I mean, I I collected uh I've got I've probably got 20 books downstairs that that I've been that I've picked up along the way.
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I and and it started when I was young, long before I ever had a dog, just reading about it.
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Um But then before before my wife's uncle got us the first dog Nelly, he gave me a a a book that was kind of off off topic, but it was it was focused on the psychology of dogs.
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How do dogs think?
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And you guys talk a lot about this as well, which was another way, it was another place where I really made a quick connection between CGA and everything that I'd learned to that point, is how the dog learns.
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If you understand how the dog learns, uh, because my second dog, I she was doing everything I asked of her in training.
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She had a lot of prey drive for a bumper.
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And I took her out to a quail field one time and just wanted to get her introduced to the scent and let her be around other dogs.
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She had no interest in picking up those birds.
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Took her to a dove field, same thing, no interest.
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Took her on a duck hunt, same thing, no interest.
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I I'd almost have to walk her to the downed bird and put her on top of it.
00:17:58.160 --> 00:17:58.720
Wow.
00:17:58.960 --> 00:18:13.359
And I was so frustrated that I called uh a friend of my uncle's uh trained upland dogs, and I had a quick conversation with him, told him what was going on, and I was I was frustrated to the point where I was considering selling a dog.
00:18:15.519 --> 00:18:21.039
Um yeah, I wouldn't, I would never think something like that right now.
00:18:21.279 --> 00:18:23.359
Um, but he gave me a quick tip.
00:18:23.440 --> 00:18:24.960
He said, Here, here's what you do.
00:18:25.200 --> 00:18:32.799
And so my son and I took her out to uh a place near our house where they had a tower and got some fresh quail.
00:18:33.200 --> 00:18:43.119
She was in her crate in the back of my truck, and I put the crate of quail right down in front of her kennel, and we drove out into the back of his property.
00:18:43.759 --> 00:18:48.559
So by the time we got there, she was pretty amped up with that smell of those pen raised birds.
00:18:48.640 --> 00:18:55.599
And we ran a couple of birds up in the box, let them out, gunshot, and she was sitting right there.
00:18:55.839 --> 00:19:14.000
And that association of those smells, that gunshot, bird flying, and the bird fell right in front of her, but it was winged and still went and still moving, that thing ran up under the truck and she went after it.
00:19:14.640 --> 00:19:27.759
And she came out, she had oil streaks on the back of her back, but she she had the bird, and from then on, she was really, she was probably one of the most highly amped dogs I've worked with.
00:19:27.920 --> 00:19:40.880
Um but we eventually tempered that, and that's where we really had to focus mostly on not breaking it at the gunshot, uh, because that was our initially her worst habit.
00:19:41.119 --> 00:19:42.720
And that was a challenge for me.
00:19:42.960 --> 00:19:58.720
Um but as I got to know CGA, I just realized that I had not placed those steps in the right area of development, because otherwise I would have it would have that would have never happened.
00:19:58.960 --> 00:20:05.279
Um because the last two dogs that I've had were just incredibly steady uh at the gunshot.
00:20:06.400 --> 00:20:07.039
Wow.
00:20:07.359 --> 00:20:09.039
Yeah, that I'm I'm glad you said that.
00:20:09.119 --> 00:20:15.920
That's a place that I really feel for people that go down those paths because you just don't know it until you know it.
00:20:16.319 --> 00:20:19.279
And like we know and we've seen people go down that path.
00:20:19.440 --> 00:20:23.599
There's just some things that if you don't know it ahead of time, you're gonna find out.
00:20:23.759 --> 00:20:31.359
And when you find out, it's not a fun thing to find out because you realize, uh-oh, we're gonna go way back, fix some things and work through it.
00:20:31.599 --> 00:20:31.839
Right.
00:20:32.000 --> 00:20:34.640
And but that's something that sometimes you people have to go on that journey.
00:20:34.720 --> 00:20:36.240
And if you go on that journey, that's okay.
00:20:36.400 --> 00:20:38.160
The big thing is that you just learn it.
00:20:38.319 --> 00:20:44.160
And that if you find yourself there, I will say, like you said, it's it's a you wish you kind of knew that to begin with.
00:20:44.319 --> 00:20:46.160
It is a little easier to learn it on the front end.
00:20:46.240 --> 00:20:49.599
It's you don't need to experience it yourself if you don't have to.
00:20:49.839 --> 00:20:51.200
And I'll say that for anybody listening.
00:20:51.359 --> 00:21:03.200
Hopefully, if if you're on the fence there thinking about some things, like just really think about what you're doing before you get started, because you can do it right and you can you can do it halfway right, but doing it the full right way is definitely the way to go.
00:21:03.680 --> 00:21:32.880
Yeah, and I think that i that's one of the things, especially the dog being steady, whether they're steady in the house, steady around other people, um in the car when traveling, just having a dog that is is very calm and attentive to directions being directions being offered, i it's it really struck me on my first big waterfowling trip that I took a few years ago.
00:21:33.039 --> 00:21:50.000
Uh and seeing dogs breaking on a gunshot when there's eight guns in an A-frame blind, seeing dogs uh bringing back birds that were wounded and not delivering to hand, and then that wounded bird is flying through the A-frame with floated weapons.
00:21:50.160 --> 00:21:57.039
I I just and and again everyone's conscious of that.
00:21:57.119 --> 00:21:59.680
And and the the young guy who was our guide at that moment.
00:22:00.160 --> 00:22:06.079
This this pup was young and he he knew that's where he had to focus.
00:22:06.240 --> 00:22:09.759
And by the second year, he poured all of his energy into that.
00:22:10.000 --> 00:22:18.720
And by the the next year, when he guided us, the the dog was just sharp as a razor and has been wonderful ever since.
00:22:18.960 --> 00:22:25.200
Um so it it really is interesting how, as you guys talk about so much, every dog is different.
00:22:25.519 --> 00:22:37.519
And it's have a clear understanding of what you want from the dog when it's finished, and create your path there based on what the dog's willing to give you.
00:22:37.680 --> 00:22:41.359
Um and just be patient.
00:22:41.920 --> 00:22:44.160
Be methodical, but be patient.
00:22:45.839 --> 00:22:46.400
100%.
00:22:46.880 --> 00:22:51.680
Kind of building off of that, you know, where um let's let's dive into your corner story a little bit.
00:22:51.839 --> 00:22:54.400
Where did, you know, why did you choose to train a different way?
00:22:54.559 --> 00:22:56.000
Like what made you seek out corner?
00:22:56.480 --> 00:23:01.519
And then kind of pre preceding that, let's talk about the dog that you got starting there.
00:23:01.920 --> 00:23:03.519
Where did where did all that begin?
00:23:03.599 --> 00:23:04.720
Why'd you get another dog?
00:23:04.799 --> 00:23:07.279
And what was your goals and hopes for this dog?
00:23:07.519 --> 00:23:07.920
Yeah.
00:23:08.880 --> 00:23:09.920
That's a great question.
00:23:10.079 --> 00:23:17.920
Um so as I said, when Nelly, as Nellie got older, uh, we had to put her down when she was 14, uh, just shy of 15 years old.
00:23:18.079 --> 00:23:26.720
Um, and at that time, my second dog, Izzy, she would have been, I think, eight at that time.
00:23:26.799 --> 00:23:32.880
So she was starting to get you know up there a little bit, still very athletic and still highly driven.
00:23:33.039 --> 00:23:35.759
Uh, but I I thought that was the right time to start.
00:23:36.000 --> 00:23:42.960
Um and I had always dreamed of buying, you know, a dog from a very reputable breeder.
00:23:43.279 --> 00:23:49.119
And, you know, because I'd followed Docs Unlimited and been a member for many years, I knew about Wild Rose Kennels.
00:23:49.279 --> 00:23:53.759
And so I started the conversation with them, got on the wait list.
00:23:54.160 --> 00:23:58.160
Um, and that's really what sparked my interest.
00:23:58.319 --> 00:24:10.720
I mean, I was if I was going to invest that much and have my first real, what I felt was my dream dog, uh, I knew I wanted to go about training in a different way.
00:24:10.880 --> 00:24:12.720
I wanted to be a better trainer.
00:24:13.039 --> 00:24:20.319
Um because I my family members were not going to let me get a puppy and send it off for six months for training.
00:24:20.559 --> 00:24:24.319
But training was something I had a passion for.
00:24:24.480 --> 00:24:25.680
I wanted to be better.
00:24:25.920 --> 00:24:47.039
And when I found um Cornerstone, I was it it took the me, I think at that time you guys had like a preview and I started walking through the content, and that's my learning style, is I like that step by step, you know, like building a model airplane or something.
00:24:47.119 --> 00:24:51.680
It's just follow, follow the steps and be be methodical.
00:24:52.960 --> 00:24:58.079
So when I when Tilly came home, I mean we started from day one.
00:24:58.240 --> 00:25:05.200
I mean, sit for your food, built my own placeboard, um, clicker and treat.
00:25:05.359 --> 00:25:13.039
I mean, just every bit of that process, it felt like in retrospect, it was like a blur.
00:25:13.119 --> 00:25:16.079
You know, those first few months went by so fast.
00:25:16.559 --> 00:25:26.240
Heel training all over the neighborhood and stores, and she was just one of the best dogs we had ever had in our home.
00:25:26.400 --> 00:25:27.839
She was very well behaved.
00:25:27.920 --> 00:25:30.079
Uh, she didn't chew things up.
00:25:30.559 --> 00:25:32.079
Um Wow.
00:25:33.119 --> 00:25:42.160
You know, but the the interesting thing was that Izzy, the older dog, you know, just didn't really have much interest in her.
00:25:42.319 --> 00:25:47.680
You know, Tilly would want to go and play, and Izzy just kind of brush her off.
00:25:47.839 --> 00:26:03.039
And, you know, there were times where they would interchange with each other uh in in a positive way, chasing each other around the yard, but she just never really had attention for her like she did for Nelly when they were stuck together all the time.
00:26:04.160 --> 00:26:08.880
But over over the course of a year, I, you know, it took her on her first duck hunt.
00:26:08.960 --> 00:26:20.880
Uh, she made her first retrieve, and I I have videos saved somewhere of us doing training retrieves with the bird after the hunt, and you know, she was just a a fantastic dog.
00:26:21.200 --> 00:26:24.079
Um and there were bumps along the way.
00:26:24.480 --> 00:26:32.799
Um I think I was telling you earlier there was a particular time where she just didn't seem interested in training.
00:26:32.880 --> 00:26:39.440
I'd get home from work and I'd take her out and she'd make it about 10 minutes and it just kind of gave up.
00:26:39.599 --> 00:26:46.000
She she wanted to go chew grass or sniff weeds, or she just wanted to do anything other than what I was asking her to do.
00:26:46.319 --> 00:26:50.720
And that went on for a few, a few days, and I finally got frustrated.
00:26:50.799 --> 00:26:55.599
And uh, I think I emailed you and Barton and and you guys both replied.
00:26:55.680 --> 00:27:11.119
And I think the summary uh suggestion was you know, try to break up the routine, you know, look put her in a kennel, make sure that that training time is her best time of the day.
00:27:11.440 --> 00:27:16.640
So my wife and I came up with a plan where she was working at home at that time.
00:27:16.720 --> 00:27:26.160
She'd take her for a long walk in the afternoon and then put her in the kennel for about an hour to an hour and a half for her nap, you know, before I got home.
00:27:26.880 --> 00:27:32.240
And so when I got home, she was ready to bust out, eat her dinner, and go.
00:27:32.559 --> 00:27:53.200
And that was really incredible how that simple change in her schedule, her level of attention, you know, over a week or so, it went from she was only giving me 10 minutes to we could go, we could go 20 minutes in just in a matter of a couple of weeks.
00:27:53.359 --> 00:27:56.640
I mean, that process really worked well for her.
00:27:56.880 --> 00:28:01.200
Um that's encouraging, I think, for a lot of people to hear.
00:28:01.359 --> 00:28:04.160
Um, because you're not the only person ever faced that.
00:28:04.400 --> 00:28:16.799
The dog not you just quitting and for whatever reason, depending on the dog, depending on the stage of life and training that it's at, like that's you know, probably was worse on you than it was a dog.
00:28:16.880 --> 00:28:21.279
I mean, that's a frustrating place to be able to have a dog that just says, nope, I'm done.
00:28:21.519 --> 00:28:21.759
Right.
00:28:21.920 --> 00:28:26.319
But so it was as simple as just changing the environment on the dog is what it sounds like.
00:28:26.480 --> 00:28:29.519
Just a small little tweak that made maybe all the difference for you guys.
00:28:29.759 --> 00:28:30.000
Yeah.
00:28:30.079 --> 00:28:33.519
And I mean, just like raising children, I mean, they're so schedule-oriented.
00:28:33.599 --> 00:28:45.759
Um, and if you make some subtle adjustments, uh, sometimes dogs don't like changes to their schedules, but the the way it was coupled, the long walk outside, you know, kind of doing her thing.
00:28:46.000 --> 00:28:54.559
And then her nap time, it's like she would wake up from her nap fresh, and now dad's home and now it's time to go play.
00:28:54.640 --> 00:28:56.240
Let's go, let's go have some fun.
00:28:56.480 --> 00:28:58.799
So I I think that really worked out well.
00:28:59.039 --> 00:29:09.200
But it by the time I got to the next dog, I I really knew to look for signs of her mental acuity kind of dropping off.
00:29:09.440 --> 00:29:13.119
And so I just kind of take a step back and I'd give her her playtime.
00:29:13.279 --> 00:29:14.720
We would be in the middle of the training session.
00:29:14.799 --> 00:29:19.039
I'd just say, look, if you want to go sniff weeds and chase a deer, go ahead, go do that.
00:29:19.599 --> 00:29:24.400
But then she would quickly come back, and that's kind of how we we go through that routine.
00:29:24.480 --> 00:29:30.000
But with Tilly, that really did that really did make a huge difference.
00:29:30.160 --> 00:29:34.319
Um and we we had other problems that we had to work through.
00:29:34.480 --> 00:29:41.039
She was a she was a much softer dog compared to my previous ones.
00:29:41.599 --> 00:29:48.240
Um I never really corrected her much, but we were working on whistle stops.
00:29:48.640 --> 00:29:55.119
And I would send her on a retrieve, stop her with the whistle, and then cast another retrieve.
00:29:56.000 --> 00:29:58.720
She did not like to be stopped on a retrieve.
00:29:59.279 --> 00:30:02.319
She just she thought that she was doing something wrong.
00:30:02.480 --> 00:30:04.480
And it that was kind of the second problem.
00:30:04.640 --> 00:30:13.200
It took us, it took us quite a few weeks to kind of work through that for her to realize that I'm not stopping you because you're doing something wrong.
00:30:13.519 --> 00:30:15.359
I just need you to change directions.
00:30:15.519 --> 00:30:18.640
That that's all Wow.
00:30:19.759 --> 00:30:22.000
It's amazing that y'all were able to navigate through that.
00:30:22.079 --> 00:30:24.799
So you you felt like you navigated that challenge pretty well?
00:30:25.279 --> 00:30:26.000
We we did.
00:30:26.160 --> 00:30:35.359
You know, we just had to, you know, we just had to close the distance down a little bit, go back, reinforce whistles as a positive thing, not as a negative thing.
00:30:35.599 --> 00:30:53.359
Um, and then as she continued to understand that, hey, this is about us getting out here to pick things up, she realized that at every step I was rewarding her for just being attentive and patient.
00:30:53.759 --> 00:31:01.839
You know, I was never, I was never, I was not correcting for bad behavior, I was reinforcing positive behaviors.
00:31:02.079 --> 00:31:04.400
Even no matter how small they were.
00:31:04.799 --> 00:31:09.440
That statement you just said is very profound and it's easy for people to miss.
00:31:09.519 --> 00:31:10.799
I've just got to point it out.
00:31:11.039 --> 00:31:20.160
You're rewarding behaviors, even if no matter how small they were in the right direction, not focusing on correcting, whatever we focus on is gonna grow.
00:31:20.319 --> 00:31:27.279
So if you focus on the negative and you're just trying to correct the negative, the more important thing is focus on the good, reward the good.
00:31:27.519 --> 00:31:29.440
The negative is gonna normally fade off.
00:31:29.599 --> 00:31:37.279
Um, not to say you shouldn't correct your dog, but that different that's a slightly different approach than a lot of people take, and it produces some of the best results I've ever seen.
00:31:37.440 --> 00:31:38.640
I mean, it truly is incredible.
00:31:38.880 --> 00:32:04.319
Well, and I'll tell you, I I mean, this is just the way I think, but I've grown more as a person through this process because it's helped me personally realize that if you're gonna make conversations, this is true at home, it's true in the workplace, the list of things you should not do is much larger than the list of things you should do.
00:32:04.880 --> 00:32:21.200
And and I really found that helpful when uh work working with and training employees on new tasks is to be very focused on what goal we want to achieve and the steps that we need to achieve to get there.
00:32:21.440 --> 00:32:25.279
I'm not explaining all the noise or the things that could go wrong.
00:32:25.440 --> 00:32:27.599
Let's just walk through the steps.
00:32:27.759 --> 00:32:33.039
And we're gonna do it very slow at first, but we're gonna get better with repetition.
00:32:33.200 --> 00:32:36.319
We're gonna get faster and more efficient with repetition.
00:32:36.559 --> 00:32:39.920
And it's the the very same process with the dogs.
00:32:40.079 --> 00:32:54.480
And when I learned to relax and let it happen and enjoy every single training session we did, uh, I tell people all the time, it's it never feels like work for me.
00:32:54.640 --> 00:32:59.359
Uh, it is just something I truly enjoy doing every day.
00:33:00.799 --> 00:33:04.559
What would you say was the big thing that helped you learn to like relax?
00:33:04.880 --> 00:33:06.000
What was the shift?
00:33:06.240 --> 00:33:15.920
Because I know a lot of people want their dogs to be really good and maybe are concerned that the dog isn't gonna work out for whatever reason.
00:33:16.000 --> 00:33:19.359
I think that's a reasonable question, especially if you've never trained a dog before.
00:33:19.519 --> 00:33:22.720
It's genuinely a reasonable question to wonder if it's not gonna turn out.
00:33:22.880 --> 00:33:25.519
What was kind of the big the big thing there?
00:33:26.000 --> 00:33:27.599
Yeah, that's a that's a great question.
00:33:27.680 --> 00:33:32.079
I I think it was a it was really a combination of things.
00:33:34.079 --> 00:33:42.079
First, uh, it was the realization that I was learning more than the dog was.
00:33:43.839 --> 00:33:57.279
That you know, generations of breeding has instilled those dogs with the ability to be calm, you know, depending on which breeder you're working with, and everybody wants a different style of dog.
00:33:57.599 --> 00:34:03.519
But I wanted a dog that was very calm by nature, uh very quiet uh by nature.
00:34:03.920 --> 00:34:18.639
So the dog had all of those ingredients from the beginning, and I didn't have to do I really didn't have to do anything other than make the association to the commands and sit, heal here.
00:34:18.800 --> 00:34:19.760
That's it.
00:34:20.400 --> 00:34:40.079
And with those three things, if those things are really solid, then being able to branch out into the next individual steps, I had to slow myself down because my career dealing with live plants, I mean, the decisions had to be very sharp.
00:34:40.320 --> 00:34:48.320
Uh, while it wasn't heart surgery or anything else, I mean, it's a lot of inventory value there and it's a living organism and it's outside.
00:34:48.559 --> 00:34:54.159
So I would come home and I would feel myself kind of amped up.
00:34:54.800 --> 00:35:01.039
And I started to see that in the dog's reaction to me when I came home.
00:35:01.679 --> 00:35:09.760
And I had been reading about how dogs can really sense your mood by your body language.
00:35:09.920 --> 00:35:14.000
And we are not nearly as conscious of our body language as we should be, I think.
00:35:15.119 --> 00:35:24.159
And so I really started paying attention to that and and really forced myself to start letting go of that on my ride home from work.
00:35:25.440 --> 00:35:31.840
And I would judge my success by how the dog responded to me when I came in.
00:35:33.039 --> 00:35:39.679
And over time, it was it was more practice for me than it was for the dog.
00:35:40.960 --> 00:35:46.800
So that was that was really point number two uh that created the turning point.
00:35:46.880 --> 00:35:52.159
But point number three was seeing the dog in action.
00:35:52.800 --> 00:35:54.639
Was it was it ever perfect?
00:35:54.800 --> 00:35:56.880
Was it ever going to be my image of perfect?
00:35:57.199 --> 00:35:57.519
No.
00:35:58.400 --> 00:36:09.119
But I wanted to see the dog happy and I wanted to see the dog enjoy doing what it was born to do and and do it with a pretty significant level of skill.
00:36:09.360 --> 00:36:11.519
Um kudos to the dog.
00:36:11.599 --> 00:36:26.239
I mean, because I'm only so good of a trainer, but just didn't I didn't want to go into a hunting situation, whether you're out of state or you're just with your bodies in the swamp, you know, on the back of the farm.
00:36:26.880 --> 00:36:30.320
I didn't want my dog to be a disruption to a hunt.
00:36:30.559 --> 00:36:34.079
And I wanted her to be safe, and I wanted her to be safe around other people.
00:36:34.159 --> 00:36:37.039
And it those were the three things that really did it for me.
00:36:37.360 --> 00:36:38.159
That's huge.
00:36:38.320 --> 00:36:38.880
That's huge.
00:36:39.039 --> 00:36:44.719
I mean, that's pretty sharp to realize that and I like where you're going with that line of thinking.
00:36:45.119 --> 00:36:53.360
It's about perceived, it's not necessarily about in the moment, but you're taking steps before the moment that's allowing everything to unfold as it should.
00:36:53.440 --> 00:36:54.880
So that's incredible.
00:36:55.280 --> 00:36:58.400
My my next question is let's let's dive into this dog.
00:36:58.559 --> 00:37:05.280
Let's dive into your your latest dog that you're working through the course, which again, I love that people have trained more than one dog for the program.
00:37:05.440 --> 00:37:06.320
It's amazing.
00:37:06.559 --> 00:37:10.000
But let's dive into your new dog and your journey thus far.
00:37:10.639 --> 00:37:15.599
Transitioning from Tilly to uh the current dog.
00:37:15.679 --> 00:37:20.239
Uh the current dog has probably 10 different names depending on who's in the house at any moment.
00:37:20.639 --> 00:37:23.199
Um I just call I just call her Peabody.
00:37:23.920 --> 00:37:25.920
Um long story behind that name.
00:37:26.000 --> 00:37:26.880
We won't get into that.
00:37:26.960 --> 00:37:30.719
It's it's a bird association that none of my family understands.
00:37:31.199 --> 00:37:35.920
But Peabody, uh, we got Peabody from Wild Rose as well.
00:37:36.000 --> 00:37:39.280
Uh, unfortunately, Tilly did not live very long.
00:37:39.360 --> 00:37:44.159
Um she had some she had renal dysplasia.
00:37:44.239 --> 00:37:51.599
Uh she was born with it, and we didn't know it uh until you know we went through the process of getting her fixed and they picked it up in the blood work.
00:37:51.760 --> 00:38:03.360
But anyway, Wild Rose was exceptional to us, uh, took very good care of us, um, gave us pick of the litter from uh a new breeding that they had.
00:38:04.079 --> 00:38:10.079
And along the way, you know, they were very supportive as I was doing the training.
00:38:10.159 --> 00:38:12.880
They knew I was working with CGA on the training program.
00:38:13.199 --> 00:38:35.920
And um the team in in North Carolina at their Hillsborough facility, they were they were exceptional in asking questions about, okay, so we know that this didn't go the way we wanted, but tell us about how the training went and what would be your ideal dog next.
00:38:36.960 --> 00:38:52.480
And as I mentioned, Tilly was a little bit on the soft side uh as it related to, you know, course corrections and training of any type, uh, whereas my previous dog had been should run through a brick wall and be ready for the next adventure.
00:38:53.280 --> 00:38:55.119
I wanted something in the middle.
00:38:55.440 --> 00:39:02.079
Um, and I have to say, you know, five years removed, uh, they absolutely nailed it.
00:39:02.320 --> 00:39:15.920
Um so Peabody is um her father was Gus, which was Deeke's one of Deeke's pups, and then the mother was Claire.
00:39:16.480 --> 00:39:21.440
And Claire was when I met her, the mother when we went to pick them up, Claire was like 46 pounds.
00:39:21.599 --> 00:39:23.920
I mean, she's very small-frame dog.
00:39:24.079 --> 00:39:31.119
Peabody now's 49 pounds, so that perfect size, very slender and exceptionally agile.
00:39:31.519 --> 00:39:34.639
Uh, she can jump fences, she can jump anything.
00:39:34.960 --> 00:39:40.320
And we she has been the most energetic about the training program.
00:39:40.719 --> 00:39:45.199
And very early on, we were all after it the first year and a half.
00:39:45.360 --> 00:39:50.639
I mean, we we worked together, I would say probably four to five days a week.
00:39:50.800 --> 00:39:55.199
Um, but in short burst, we kept the sessions less than 20 minutes.
00:39:55.599 --> 00:40:09.199
Um but we have not been able to hunt as much as we would like to, but still every day now we we take long walks together, we do heel training together, we do bumper training probably two days a week still.
00:40:09.440 --> 00:40:12.960
Um and we have a lake nearby, so she gets to swim as much as she likes.
00:40:13.039 --> 00:40:15.760
But she's she's really been a fabulous dog.
00:40:15.840 --> 00:40:22.719
And even though we don't hunt much on the opportunities that we do get to go, um, she she performs very, very well.
00:40:23.119 --> 00:40:26.400
So with your new pop, this I mean, it sounds like things have gone really well.
00:40:26.639 --> 00:40:33.760
Sounds like I mean, it sounds like, you know, even more maturity as a trainer, you've grown, you're able to take the previous experience you've had and lead into it.
00:40:33.840 --> 00:40:42.320
You know, one of the things that we talked about, you know, on the film we were first discussing, I'd love to talk about is you know, this isn't just a hunting dog, this is an adventure dog too.
00:40:42.400 --> 00:40:44.239
Uh let's get into the adventure dog side of things.
00:40:44.559 --> 00:40:47.360
What do you guys do other than hunt and prepare for hunting?
00:40:47.519 --> 00:40:50.800
Let's get into the the just general life that you and your dog have together.
00:40:51.119 --> 00:40:51.280
Yeah.
00:40:51.360 --> 00:40:57.760
I mean, she, you know, over the over the five years, I mean, you know, both my kids have circulated through school.
00:40:57.840 --> 00:41:06.480
Uh, Carter is uh my son is in his first year of law school, and my daughter is a sophomore in in in school.
00:41:06.800 --> 00:41:18.639
So they've been they've she's seen the whole transition, uh, but every step of the way, that dog is always ready to go, whether it's for a ride, go on a walk.
00:41:18.960 --> 00:41:29.119
Um, and she's even if the kids have been gone for four to six months, the second they come through the door, she just goes straight to them.
00:41:29.280 --> 00:41:31.519
Um and I I joke with my wife all the time.
00:41:31.920 --> 00:41:41.360
It's a much she's a mom's dog now because when it's evening time, she's curled up on the couch right next to right next to my wife.
00:41:41.599 --> 00:41:43.280
You know, she sleeps with us every night.
00:41:43.360 --> 00:41:49.440
I mean, she's just she it there's nothing that we don't do with her.
00:41:49.679 --> 00:41:52.960
Um I've gotten her accustomed to boats.
00:41:53.039 --> 00:41:54.880
Uh she loves going fishing with me.
00:41:54.960 --> 00:41:59.199
She'll get in the boat and ride around the lake or go out in the marsh.
00:41:59.360 --> 00:42:00.719
You know, we'll do short stents.
00:42:00.960 --> 00:42:03.519
And her favorite thing is watching dolphins.
00:42:03.679 --> 00:42:15.360
If you're just driving around in the salt marsh and the dolphins are breaking the water, she's on the side of the boat trying to get at them, but she really is.
00:42:15.760 --> 00:42:18.400
People just she loves being around people.
00:42:18.559 --> 00:42:22.719
Um, and she never makes people uncomfortable.
00:42:22.800 --> 00:42:28.400
Uh people can come in and sit down and she goes and greets them and then back to her spot.
00:42:28.480 --> 00:42:29.840
You know, like they're not even there.
00:42:30.159 --> 00:42:38.000
She's she's really a special animal, and you know, I I hope I hope all the rest of them are like her.
00:42:40.000 --> 00:42:40.880
That's amazing.
00:42:41.039 --> 00:42:44.639
Do you did you did you ever think you could have a dog like this?
00:42:44.719 --> 00:42:49.760
I know some of the ones from the past, they were kind of hard charging what's I really didn't.
00:42:50.000 --> 00:43:02.320
You know, uh I could have never I could have never imagined to any level of detail the the characteristics that my dog displays today.
00:43:02.480 --> 00:43:06.800
I I didn't know I needed a dog like that.
00:43:07.039 --> 00:43:09.920
Um and I really do.
00:43:10.000 --> 00:43:12.079
I I've I would feel comfortable.
00:43:12.320 --> 00:43:17.119
I feel comfortable taking her anywhere and everywhere off lead.
00:43:17.519 --> 00:43:22.079
I mean, she she's actually more attentive when she's off lead.
00:43:22.719 --> 00:43:26.559
And the whole COVID thing, it changed people.
00:43:28.480 --> 00:43:29.119
Yeah.
00:43:29.760 --> 00:43:30.960
I never will forget this.
00:43:31.039 --> 00:43:41.199
Just walking down the sidewalks, you know, during when COVID first started, you know, you would see people coming down the sidewalk towards you and they would deliberately go to the other side.
00:43:41.519 --> 00:43:43.679
Like, whoa, wait a minute.
00:43:44.159 --> 00:43:48.000
And that that trend continues, especially when people are walking dogs.
00:43:48.079 --> 00:43:50.800
They never want their dogs to be near other people.
00:43:50.880 --> 00:43:53.039
They don't want their dogs to be near other dogs.
00:43:53.199 --> 00:44:02.159
And, you know, my dog is just, I'm like, okay, well, so if that's the way it's going to be, I just walk off the sidewalk and Peabody sit.
00:44:02.800 --> 00:44:07.599
She sits and she watches them go by like they're carrying a pizza that she's not going to touch.
00:44:08.559 --> 00:44:14.400
And, you know, I just I think I wish everybody, I wish everyone could have that.
00:44:14.480 --> 00:44:25.280
Because I know some people I know there's a lot of people out there that that got a dog and maybe they didn't research it enough, the type of dog that they needed to get for the life that they live.
00:44:25.519 --> 00:44:27.599
Um and it's just not a good match.
00:44:27.679 --> 00:44:30.079
And then some of the dogs can be pretty unruly.
00:44:30.159 --> 00:44:34.320
And I feel bad for the owners and I feel worse for the dogs.
00:44:36.719 --> 00:44:39.920
Yeah, that's not fun having one that's unruly.
00:44:40.079 --> 00:44:56.159
Would you say, I mean, I know the breeding obviously is going to play an important role as far as how your training experience goes, whether you have to work harder versus where I mean, because it is important to start with the right product because you have to work less to pull it out.
00:44:56.880 --> 00:45:04.239
Would you say, you know, how would you say your training, like the foundation was conducive for that, right, versus the way you used to train?
00:45:04.480 --> 00:45:11.039
Was there anything that stood out to you that was important, things you worked on early on that you feel like helped contribute to give you this dog?
00:45:11.679 --> 00:45:16.880
Yeah, I I I think what's the best way to describe this?
00:45:17.039 --> 00:45:28.639
I I think just having a connection with a dog where it wants more than anything to be with you.
00:45:29.679 --> 00:45:34.000
May not it may not be completely conscious of, hey, I'm doing this to please you.
00:45:34.079 --> 00:45:48.800
Uh I'm doing this because you feed me, but I I'd I think that there's just a genuine interest on this dog's part to be a part of everything about her family.
00:45:49.039 --> 00:45:54.079
You know, her that's that's her group of people, and she wants to be in the middle of the fray.
00:45:54.880 --> 00:46:14.400
Um and truly, I mean that by itself kind of fosters among other people, that okay, I'm willing to show a level of patience with this dog that that maybe I didn't have with previous dogs.
00:46:14.880 --> 00:46:18.400
Um I hope that answers your question.
00:46:18.559 --> 00:46:22.239
That's just uh it it just never really thought about it from that perspective.
00:46:22.400 --> 00:46:33.440
But I I definitely believe that the breeding went a long way in making the work w m way easier than it ever had been in the past.
00:46:34.880 --> 00:46:35.599
100%.
00:46:36.400 --> 00:46:38.079
There's a lot that goes into a great dog.
00:46:38.239 --> 00:46:41.519
You got breeding, and it's always best to start with breeding.
00:46:41.760 --> 00:46:50.880
Start with a great breeder, find one that you can trust, find one that you like, you know, find one that does things, their practices or something that you like.
00:46:51.039 --> 00:46:57.760
But also then once you got that part of the equation down, the whole training part of the equation is a big part of it too, the development process.
00:46:57.840 --> 00:46:58.719
Like you said, the bond.
00:46:58.880 --> 00:47:01.440
I think the biggest thing that you said there was that connection.
00:47:01.599 --> 00:47:02.000
Yeah.
00:47:02.159 --> 00:47:10.400
Yeah, having a dog that wants to be with you, not wants to be away from you, or associates you with, you know, this isn't fun.
00:47:11.039 --> 00:47:19.840
What's one of the uh biggest things that you found that was there any tips or tricks you've got for people that you learned along the way that made training sessions more fun?
00:47:20.159 --> 00:47:27.119
Or was it just the style of training you feel that can was conducive to, hey, dog enjoys this?
00:47:28.000 --> 00:47:41.039
Yeah, I I mean I think changing the environment constantly, keeping the dog on their toes, you know, don't take them to the same place all the time.
00:47:41.199 --> 00:47:43.119
You know, branch out.
00:47:43.519 --> 00:47:48.639
Find as many friends as you can who've got a big lawn or parks.
00:47:48.880 --> 00:47:55.679
Uh fortunately, where we live now, there are dozens of urban or rural and urban parks.
00:47:56.079 --> 00:48:01.920
So I can take her to a lot of different places and expose her to a lot of different things.
00:48:02.159 --> 00:48:08.960
I don't I don't have access to you know places where I can shoot with her, but that's not as important to me anymore as it used to be.
00:48:09.360 --> 00:48:11.119
She's kind of past that stage.
00:48:11.679 --> 00:48:14.960
But but she loves exploring new places.
00:48:15.039 --> 00:48:28.239
And every time we go, um, and I think you told me this, is like when you go, start out by giving them a few minutes to orient themselves to the location.
00:48:28.400 --> 00:48:32.320
Let them get all of that out of their system and then get to work.
00:48:32.639 --> 00:48:37.679
And especially with uh Peabody and Tilly, that really worked very, very well.
00:48:40.159 --> 00:48:41.519
That's great.
00:48:44.559 --> 00:48:46.079
It seems like you've got an amazing dog.
00:48:46.320 --> 00:48:48.480
Seems like things have gone extremely well.
00:48:48.719 --> 00:48:53.760
You know, maybe you've definitely learned a lot along the way and you've grown a lot, which is incredible.
00:48:53.920 --> 00:48:56.320
So um let me let me ask this.
00:48:56.559 --> 00:49:10.000
You know, coming from the previous ways you trained to to where the way you train now, what would you say the biggest like just transformation for you was like your mindset, the mentality?
00:49:10.320 --> 00:49:21.039
You know, was there is there more clarity in the way you train now that gives you that confidence or were you confident before?
00:49:21.119 --> 00:49:26.719
Or you know, I know we talked about earlier there was just some a lot of times you were just running into things you just didn't know.
00:49:26.800 --> 00:49:27.119
Yeah.
00:49:27.519 --> 00:49:34.639
That and then all of a sudden, oh no, now then you were aware of like, okay, I see where I went wrong here.
00:49:34.960 --> 00:49:42.079
So kind of fast forward to now, is there kind of a defining line in that for you on how you used to be versus where you're at now?
00:49:42.480 --> 00:49:44.239
I want to make sure I explain this the right way.
00:49:44.320 --> 00:49:45.119
That's a great question.
00:49:45.199 --> 00:49:49.199
I want to make sure I explain this the right way so that someone doesn't take it out of context.
00:49:49.360 --> 00:49:51.760
I I would not say that I'm confident.
00:49:52.639 --> 00:49:54.880
I would say that I'm comfortable.
00:49:55.360 --> 00:50:02.559
Um and I think maybe that's been my purpose all along, and maybe I just didn't know it.
00:50:03.760 --> 00:50:05.519
I wanted to be comfortable.
00:50:05.679 --> 00:50:12.559
I wanted to be comfortable in what the dog gave me, whether it was good or bad.
00:50:12.880 --> 00:50:19.920
Control my own emotions so that we can be focused on the business of learning.
00:50:20.159 --> 00:50:22.960
And if it's just an off day, it's just going to be an off day.
00:50:23.119 --> 00:50:30.239
But that doesn't that one day is not going to determine the long-term success of that dog.
00:50:30.639 --> 00:50:39.840
Uh, but if handled poorly and handled poorly uh time after time, it could ultimately be the demise of that success, I think is what I found.
00:50:40.000 --> 00:50:43.760
Uh, because I think back on it now to the things I did with my first two dogs.
00:50:44.000 --> 00:50:49.440
And there were there were things that I just did completely wrong.
00:50:49.679 --> 00:50:50.239
You know?
00:50:50.880 --> 00:50:53.119
You know, don't fuss it, don't fuss at that dog.
00:50:53.199 --> 00:50:55.840
You know, don't don't hit that dog with the e-collar.
00:50:55.920 --> 00:51:00.079
I mean, that's uh it's just it's just ex little things like that.
00:51:00.719 --> 00:51:08.320
I just feel like each day I go out now, I I don't set high expectations.
00:51:09.760 --> 00:51:12.639
I just this is what we want to accomplish.
00:51:12.880 --> 00:51:15.280
And if this is all she's gonna give me today, that's fine.
00:51:15.519 --> 00:51:19.199
But if she's successful, let's just keep building on it.
00:51:20.000 --> 00:51:31.679
You know, after playing golf my whole life, you know, yeah you hear about I see you see people who have a bad day on the golf course, and the first thing they do is they go to the driving range.
00:51:32.000 --> 00:51:50.960
And I've been a follower of the game for my entire life, and I've been associated with some very, very high-level players, and they practice harder when they're playing well than they do when they're playing bad.
00:51:51.280 --> 00:51:58.159
Sometimes you just have to take a break and do a reset, leave it alone for a couple of days, and then come back to it.
00:51:58.559 --> 00:52:00.960
And that's that's kind of the approach we take.
00:52:01.119 --> 00:52:09.360
And we've had periods where just for weeks, it just feels like I I'm not into this this week, or I'm not into this thing you're trying to teach me.
00:52:09.599 --> 00:52:14.559
And so sometimes we just take a step back and then come back to it later on.
00:52:16.400 --> 00:52:17.119
I like that.
00:52:17.360 --> 00:52:19.920
I think you know, you're hitting on something too.
00:52:20.320 --> 00:52:24.239
There's days where you said this earlier, the dog, it's just not the dog's day.
00:52:24.400 --> 00:52:25.760
And there's days where it's not your day.
00:52:26.000 --> 00:52:26.719
That's right.
00:52:27.599 --> 00:52:32.960
And that can line up to where the dog's feeling good, and then one day and you're not, and then vice versa.
00:52:33.119 --> 00:52:34.559
That can that can stack up over time.
00:52:34.639 --> 00:52:36.800
But I like what you said there about being comfortable.
00:52:36.960 --> 00:52:44.000
Because that that is, I mean, that comfort, that confidence is you know, I that's a good way to say confidence is comfortable.
00:52:44.320 --> 00:52:46.800
You're you you know that this is going to work out.
00:52:46.960 --> 00:52:48.559
Like you know that you're on the right path.
00:52:48.639 --> 00:52:48.880
Yeah.
00:52:49.039 --> 00:52:50.400
And that's a good place to be.
00:52:50.639 --> 00:52:53.199
Yeah, there's just it's there's so much.
00:52:53.760 --> 00:53:17.360
I mean, the level of detail that you guys have invested into the 52-week program, uh, not only is it remarkable, because it truly does, it can create a dog who's pretty well prepared for nearly every single situation they're gonna see, whether in in a duck in a duck blind.
00:53:18.480 --> 00:53:21.920
Because the vast majority of them, I mean, you you you guys hunt a lot too.
00:53:22.079 --> 00:53:24.400
I mean, a lot of them are pretty straightforward.
00:53:24.559 --> 00:53:32.079
A lot of those retreats are pretty straightforward, but there's four or five of them every day that are gonna be, whoa, how did the dog pull that off?
00:53:34.719 --> 00:53:35.840
That's what it's about.
00:53:36.000 --> 00:53:40.559
I mean, you got to be prepared for it all, but you've you've got to be ready for the easy retrieves, dude.
00:53:40.719 --> 00:53:40.960
Oh, yeah.
00:53:41.199 --> 00:53:42.000
And they're gonna happen.
00:53:42.639 --> 00:53:55.840
Um, I know we're getting close to time, but I want to just keep going a little bit further because there was something that we haven't really tapped into yet that I know we've kind of hit on, but I know you're passionate about this, and this is just mindset as a whole.
00:53:56.559 --> 00:54:03.920
Because you know, getting it right here is a vast majority of the battle because we are the person making the decisions.
00:54:04.000 --> 00:54:08.480
You said something early on in your work life with the with the trees, right?
00:54:08.719 --> 00:54:17.440
You're managing acres upon acres of a lot of living organisms and one wrong decision, and that that's a serious consequence.
00:54:17.599 --> 00:54:17.760
Right.
00:54:17.920 --> 00:54:19.760
And so that's a lot of pressure.
00:54:20.159 --> 00:54:23.360
So, and then the same thing we understand this when we're training our dogs.
00:54:23.519 --> 00:54:31.039
You're going through this journey, and in a sense, there's a lot of pressure because you know you're personally responsible whether this dog turns out or not.
00:54:31.360 --> 00:54:35.360
Are the decisions that I'm making going to turn this dog out or not?
00:54:35.519 --> 00:54:37.519
That's a that's a huge weight to carry.
00:54:37.760 --> 00:54:47.199
And so if you're not careful, that if you're depending on your mindset, that can either send you off in the wrong direction and have you going down a path of right thinking or wrong thinking.
00:54:47.440 --> 00:54:51.519
And so I know that you're you're kind of passionate about some of that topic.
00:54:51.679 --> 00:55:00.800
I would love to know just some of the, I don't know, top two or three nuggets of you know, how have you been, because you've already shared some of it and it's been amazing.
00:55:00.880 --> 00:55:19.760
But what's some of the top three, two to three that just comes to the mind as I'm speaking of this, just mental spaces to get yourself in to be successful at training this dog, to be in that place where you just described as comfortable, you know, whether you know however this goes, like this isn't about forcing my agenda.
00:55:19.920 --> 00:55:25.679
This is about we're gonna just take it as it comes and we're gonna work together to achieve this goal.
00:55:26.079 --> 00:55:39.199
Is there is there two to three, or even if it's just one golden nugget of information that that has worked for you personally, that you're like, this is what I think about when I'm going out and training, this is how I shift my mindset to make sure that I'm on par.
00:55:43.280 --> 00:55:52.559
I think for me, I I approach this like I've approached certain projects at work.
00:55:53.280 --> 00:56:00.800
And every one of us, we have pieces of our work that we do every day that I really don't like doing that.
00:56:01.280 --> 00:56:05.679
And so in which case, that's how much of your energy it gets.
00:56:05.760 --> 00:56:14.239
Um you put it on the back burner, you procrastinate, and you procrastinate long enough, then you're stressed because now I'm up against a deadline.
00:56:14.639 --> 00:56:23.920
And I think for me, the most successful projects I've ever done at work were things that that I was really interested in.
00:56:24.639 --> 00:56:38.079
And and I would just encourage everybody if you're really interested in training a gun dog and a good gun dog, maybe even a great gun dog for some people out there.
00:56:39.360 --> 00:56:41.360
That's where CGA is helpful.
00:56:41.519 --> 00:56:46.800
If you've already got the passion for it and the energy, then you're gonna dedicate yourself.
00:56:46.960 --> 00:56:59.280
It's it's like people who who successfully create good exercise routines where that is their time of the day, and there is nothing that is gonna get in the way of their time of the day.
00:56:59.599 --> 00:57:03.840
When they've got to hit the gym or they've got to go run five miles.
00:57:04.400 --> 00:57:11.840
That was what that was my mindset about this is I was committed to being a better handler.
00:57:12.719 --> 00:57:21.920
And even when I started, I didn't realize then that truly this is about training a good gun dog is about learning to be a better handler.
00:57:22.159 --> 00:57:30.639
How you prepare for each session, how you guide each session, and how you recap each session and be honest with yourself about how it went.
00:57:30.800 --> 00:57:34.480
Um, and oftentimes I found, that's the second piece.
00:57:34.719 --> 00:57:46.159
Oftentimes I found that if the dog will fell short, it was because I hadn't prepared well enough or I hadn't thought well enough about what she may do in this situation.
00:57:46.400 --> 00:57:49.360
So those are the two big takeaways for me.
00:57:50.880 --> 00:57:51.920
That's good.
00:57:52.559 --> 00:57:54.880
That's that's golden information right there, man.
00:57:55.039 --> 00:57:57.760
I hope uh I hope everybody writes that down.
00:57:57.920 --> 00:58:01.519
It's a big uh simple, but it's it's powerful.
00:58:01.679 --> 00:58:02.400
I'll say that.
00:58:02.880 --> 00:58:04.880
Well, I hope it's I hope I hope it's helpful.
00:58:06.400 --> 00:58:13.280
I really want to see people successful in this program, and I hope they enjoy as much as I have over the last eight years.
00:58:14.559 --> 00:58:16.880
Well, you've been with us eight years, so that's saying something.
00:58:17.119 --> 00:58:18.719
You've enjoyed it along the way.
00:58:18.800 --> 00:58:23.920
And um, Chris, I gotta say it's been an honor to have you on this podcast and and to hear your story.
00:58:24.159 --> 00:58:27.199
It's uh I I love all the just nuances of it.
00:58:27.280 --> 00:58:41.280
And from growing up there in the in South Georgia, that first duck hunt when uh near Thanksgiving, and here you are now just continuing on in this new stage of life that you're in as the kids are in college and you know, business and everything.
00:58:41.440 --> 00:58:42.800
So it's been it's been incredible.
00:58:42.960 --> 00:58:47.840
Let me I'll I'll ask this question I always like to ask as we kind of close this out because I know we're bumping up on time.
00:58:48.079 --> 00:59:06.880
But um what you know, if you could if you could tell yourself yourself something or if you could tell someone that was thinking about getting into this, what would be your like one your one little piece of advice, your one little final tip, like, hey, just keep this in your mind and you're gonna be okay as you go through the process of training a dog?
00:59:07.199 --> 00:59:17.440
I I think it lines up to what you communicate all the time, is be patient, be persistent.
00:59:18.559 --> 00:59:26.559
Be as and be as clear as you can be in your own mind about how the outcome should look.
00:59:26.880 --> 00:59:31.440
How do I want the dog to behave when I get to where I want to be?
00:59:31.679 --> 00:59:33.440
What is the definition of a great gun dog?
00:59:33.599 --> 00:59:35.840
What is a great what is the definition of a good gun dog?
00:59:36.000 --> 00:59:36.880
What can they do?
00:59:37.119 --> 00:59:47.519
I think the more clear people are in their minds about their own expectations, and then divide by four or ten and say, This is where I gotta start.
00:59:48.079 --> 00:59:54.639
You know, this is a building process and it's a living being.
00:59:55.199 --> 01:00:00.079
And if there's not trust between two living beings, it's just not gonna work.
01:00:01.039 --> 01:00:04.000
Not not to get to the level of great.
01:00:04.320 --> 01:00:08.960
So be patient, be persistent, and trust the process.
01:00:12.079 --> 01:00:13.039
That's good, Chris.
01:00:13.199 --> 01:00:25.440
Well, I appreciate you for being on, and I know the members do, and we're excited for you to continue this journey and continue building those unforgettable moments with your dog, as especially out there on the salt flats getting after some red fish or some dolphins.
01:00:25.920 --> 01:00:26.719
Exactly.
01:00:27.039 --> 01:00:28.480
Thank you, Josh, for having me.
01:00:28.559 --> 01:00:35.599
I appreciate all of you guys, appreciate the relationship we've had over the years, and uh my son will be joining here over the next year as well.
01:00:35.679 --> 01:00:37.920
So we'll get him on the path as well.