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A lot of companies are trying to govern AI with a policy document and a prayer.
Ashley Casovan calls out that misguided approach in this episode of Trust Issues.
Jeremy Patterson and Bruno Lecoq speak with Ashley, Managing Director at the IAPP’s AI Governance Center, about what it really takes to govern AI when the technology keeps moving faster than the rules. The conversation gets into why AI governance needs policies, processes, and people, why technical teams and policy teams often talk past each other, and why the “innovation vs. regulation” debate is the wrong fight.
What You’ll Learn:
- Why AI governance depends on people, not only policies
- How Ashley helped build Canada’s first national responsible AI policy
- Why ISO 42001 pushes organizations to look at the whole AI management system
- How BEMO thinks about AI agents as digital workers
- Why powerful AI agents need experienced human owners
- Why technical, policy, legal, and security teams need a shared language
- Why AI harms are real, even if panic is not useful
- Why “innovation vs. regulation” is the wrong way to frame the AI debate
Episode chapters:
00:34 Welcome to Trust Issues
00:52 Meeting Ashley Casovan
01:46 Ashley’s path from Alberta politics to AI governance
04:12 How do you govern a moving target?
06:28 Ashley’s path to IAPP
08:33 ISO 42001 and governing AI agents
10:35 What AI governance really means
11:46 How BEMO manages digital workers
13:31 Building Canada’s first responsible AI policy
21:17 Why data and AI governance are connected
23:51 Can policy keep up with AI?
25:07 Why AI governance needs many roles
27:06 Why AI guardrails need real-world consequences
32:31 Why standards and community matter
34:07 Why technical and policy teams talk past each other
36:46 Managing uneven AI adoption inside a company
41:43 Individual choice vs. systemic AI risk
43:18 Why innovation vs. regulation is the wrong debate
45:27 Where to find Ashley
46:06 Closing thoughts
Quotes:
- “AI governance is all of the different types of policies, processes and people considerations needed to effectively manage your AI system in a safe and trusted manner.”
- “The same concepts that have applied in other types of safety or trust environments where we’re working with tools and technology are still relevant.”
- “We need to have people with multiple perspectives in the room to tackle any governance attempt.”
- “We need to stop having these conversations about innovation versus regulation.”
Connect with the team:
👉 Ashley Casovan on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ashley-casovan-b3247211/
👉 Bruno Lecoq on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brunolecoq/
👉 Jeremy Patterson on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeremypatterson2026/
👉 BEMO Website: https://www.bemopro.com/
👉 Bruno Lecoq on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brunolecoq/
👉 Jeremy Patterson on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeremypatterson2026/
👉 BEMO Website: https://www.bemopro.com/
Trust Issues is handcrafted by our friends over at: fame.so
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