Building AI-Fluent Organizations: Where AI Becomes a Superpower, with Candice Faktor

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Candice Faktor: AI can be your friend in this,
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Candice Faktor: or it is, as you say, going to be your foe,
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Candice Faktor: because AI can replace people who aren't interested in building continuous learning.
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GIles Gherson: Hello,
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GIles Gherson: I'm Giles Gerson,
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GIles Gherson: and this is Toronto Talks, the voice of Toronto's business community.
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GIles Gherson: What are we talking about?
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GIles Gherson: Each episode is a conversation with top business leaders about how they're shaping growth, driving competitiveness,
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GIles Gherson: and building up our economy.
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GIles Gherson: It's about what they believe it will take to make sure the Toronto region remains one of the world's great global cities.
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GIles Gherson: Here's today's conversation.
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Jon Worren: I'm John Warren.
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Jon Worren: I'm the Vice President of the Toronto Region Board of Trade, running the World Trade Centre Toronto.
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Jon Worren: And I'm the host of this week's Toronto Talks,
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Jon Worren: which takes place during Toronto Tech Week, which is a very exciting moment for this city.
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Jon Worren: And very appropriately,
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Jon Worren: we're sat here with Candice Factor,
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Jon Worren: founder of Disco,
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Jon Worren: and an executive in the tech space,
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Jon Worren: an investor in our tech space.
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Jon Worren: So we're very much looking forward to having this conversation.
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Jon Worren: It will predominantly be about AI, but also some of the things that surround artificial intelligence.
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Jon Worren: So,
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Jon Worren: Candice,
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Jon Worren: you scaled and, you know, a very successful period at Wattpad, a company that had really figured out how to grow,
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Jon Worren: how to build a massive online community.
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Jon Worren: And then to start over from zero during the pandemic.
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Jon Worren: Most people in your position wouldn't have.
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Jon Worren: So what were you actually running towards?
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Jon Worren: Or were you running away from something?
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Candice Faktor: I love that question.
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Candice Faktor: And I think COVID was an existential time for all of us,
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Candice Faktor: right?
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Candice Faktor: We were faced with a tremendous amount of uncertainty.
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Candice Faktor: And I think different people have different responses to uncertainty.
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Candice Faktor: Fair enough.
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Candice Faktor: I joke that I definitely have a very similar response to uncertainty,
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Candice Faktor: which is like I'm called to create.
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Candice Faktor: And,
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Candice Faktor: you know, I think what I was running towards was,
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Candice Faktor: wow, this is a really, really interesting moment in society.
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Candice Faktor: You know, never before has the entire world been,
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Candice Faktor: you know,
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Candice Faktor: put in their homes and forced to adjust or change their behavior.
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Candice Faktor: And I thought about sort of the zoomification of work.
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Candice Faktor: And instead of being afraid of it or upset about it, I was like, how can we take these lemons and create lemonade?
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Candice Faktor: And what really what came to me was I've never taken an online course in my life before.
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Candice Faktor: And I started thinking a lot of like, why is that?
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Candice Faktor: Like what I love learning.
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Candice Faktor: I'm like this super curious person who's like a lifelong learner.
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Candice Faktor: I've I've never sat through an online course where you just click through.
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Candice Faktor: And what became very apparent to me, it's because that's not how I believe the best learning happens.
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Candice Faktor: And so,
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Candice Faktor: you know, it was really interesting.
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Candice Faktor: The fact that we were on Zoom was an opportunity to say,
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Candice Faktor: like,
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Candice Faktor: maybe it's because there's no like live or experiential learning in any of these programs.
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Candice Faktor: Maybe it's because there's no community.
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Candice Faktor: Maybe it's because I believe that people need to learn with and from each other or from projects.
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Candice Faktor: And that was really the impetus of the start of disco is like,
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Candice Faktor: wait a second,
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Candice Faktor: how can how can this moment actually create opportunity for doing something that can be more transformative versus,
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Candice Faktor: wow, this really sucks.
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Candice Faktor: There were parts that were really hard,
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Candice Faktor: right? Like I sat in my tiny bedroom.
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Candice Faktor: Like it was laughable, like the amount of space that I occupied for like a year.
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Candice Faktor: You know, I was like,
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Candice Faktor: I guess humans are really adaptable.
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Candice Faktor: Like my office was in my bedroom at the edge of my bed with the door closed and my kids were home and the dog was home.
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Candice Faktor: And,
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Candice Faktor: you know, it's like really hard.
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Candice Faktor: In terms of,
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Candice Faktor: you know,
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Candice Faktor: fundraising,
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Candice Faktor: it was actually incredible because I was wearing pajama pants and nice jackets like this and was able to raise like a lot of money from my,
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Candice Faktor: you know,
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Candice Faktor: bedroom basically or like from my coffee table.
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Candice Faktor: So there was both like wonderful and hard things at the same time.
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Jon Worren: Fair enough.
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Jon Worren: Fair enough.
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Jon Worren: So let's just get into a little bit this.
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Jon Worren: Like you're sort of in the space of corporate training or facility.
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Candice Faktor: Yeah, we definitely moved into that space significantly.
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Jon Worren: So where do you feel that the failure was before?
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Jon Worren: And in launching this,
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Jon Worren: attempting to correct that,
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Jon Worren: and how is AI coming to sort of play a role in that?
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Candice Faktor: Yeah.
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Candice Faktor: So it's such a great question.
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Candice Faktor: And I think, you know, going back to like,
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Candice Faktor: why is it that I've never done an online course before?
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Candice Faktor: I've worked in many companies,
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Candice Faktor: different sizes,
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Candice Faktor: different scales,
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Candice Faktor: it's because it doesn't work.
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Candice Faktor: Right.
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Candice Faktor: Like for the most part, a lot of the course content is compliance.
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Candice Faktor: Right.
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Candice Faktor: It's like I have to check the box and say I've watched these things,
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Candice Faktor: but they're not really the modes of transformation.
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Candice Faktor: So I think about learning as
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Candice Faktor: transformation.
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Candice Faktor: It's like you didn't know something before.
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Candice Faktor: And the only way to like
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Candice Faktor: actually know that thing is to go through a learning experience but learning is really hard
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Candice Faktor: it shouldn't be easy there should be friction that's the whole point of it and so learning is
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Candice Faktor: really capability building and for the most part like online courses or compliance courses or
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Candice Faktor: video courses which you know corporate learning was just it was abundant like really the the core
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Candice Faktor: learning for corporate training was consuming video content.
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Candice Faktor: And,
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Candice Faktor: you know,
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Candice Faktor: I just,
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Candice Faktor: I think
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Candice Faktor: people,
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Candice Faktor: if you look at it,
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Candice Faktor: I went really, really deep into the science of learning,
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Candice Faktor: like how do you
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Candice Faktor: create transformation?
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Candice Faktor: And that's something I've been interested in my whole life is just like
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Candice Faktor: transformation of all kinds.
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Candice Faktor: There's, there's conditions that you need, right? And those
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Candice Faktor: conditions are, it needs to be experiential.
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Candice Faktor: It needs to be active learning.
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Candice Faktor: You need to have
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Candice Faktor: projects you need to have the ability to do things you need peers that can give you the
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Candice Faktor: lived experience can give you the psychological safety can actually give you the gamification
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Candice Faktor: of like proving that you're better than your peers sometimes um you need uh you need
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Candice Faktor: personalization like we can't all learn the same generic content it needs to be applied to my
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Candice Faktor: context.
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Candice Faktor: So,
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Candice Faktor: you know, I think it's like really broken in a lot of places and we're starting to
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Candice Faktor: see that.
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Candice Faktor: And also AI has fundamentally changed the game,
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Candice Faktor: like things that were valuable before,
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Candice Faktor: which was just intelligence or knowledge are now abundant and free.
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Candice Faktor: So,
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Candice Faktor: you know,
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Candice Faktor: businesses that
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Candice Faktor: were built on just content libraries,
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Candice Faktor: I think that's a really,
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Candice Faktor: really difficult business to be
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Candice Faktor: today.
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Candice Faktor: Businesses that are in the learning space or transformation space that actually use
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Candice Faktor: proprietary IP to design experiences that can get capabilities built for people,
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Candice Faktor: I think,
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Candice Faktor: you know, obviously I'm biased, are much more effective at this AI moment because this isn't,
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Candice Faktor: you know, for fun AI.
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Candice Faktor: Like it's not a compliance thing. It's like,
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Candice Faktor: do you have the capability or
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Candice Faktor: don't you have the capability to use AI to change your workflow,
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Candice Faktor: your role,
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Candice Faktor: you know,
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Candice Faktor: the organization.
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Candice Faktor: And so these are like things that you actually have to have versus some of the other learning topics may have been more check the box.
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Jon Worren: Sure,
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Jon Worren: sure.
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Jon Worren: I mean,
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Jon Worren: and it's not like these things that you talk about that makes for great learning or makes for transformation,
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Jon Worren: really.
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Jon Worren: You can imagine that it's much easier to create that in an in-person setting, in a live setting compared to online.
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Jon Worren: So you may have to think a little bit deeper on what actually constitutes a good learning experience in a setting where you don't control a lot of the physical surroundings or the context in the same way,
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Jon Worren: right?
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Candice Faktor: Well, I love that you bring this up because I think that is the big unlock,
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Candice Faktor: right?
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Candice Faktor: It's like what COVID did and then what AI has done.
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Candice Faktor: So there's like two paradigm shifts.
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Candice Faktor: So it's not that this learning didn't happen in companies.
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Candice Faktor: It's just that it was incredibly expensive to do transformative learning or capability building or experiential learning.
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Candice Faktor: It's like for,
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Candice Faktor: you know,
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Candice Faktor: high potential leaders,
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Candice Faktor: this learning was happening.
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Candice Faktor: Right.
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Candice Faktor: But if you look at an organization,
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Candice Faktor: it was for like a tiny percentage of the org that you could afford to structure for projects and peers and in person.
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Candice Faktor: And so what I think the first disruption was,
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Candice Faktor: was,
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Candice Faktor: wait a second,
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Candice Faktor: let's rethink our assumptions on whether this has to be in person.
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Candice Faktor: How can virtual live peer based project based learning scale and how can we democratize that to more people in an organization?
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Candice Faktor: And that actually did happen.
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Candice Faktor: Right.
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Candice Faktor: Is like we were forced to do that.
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Candice Faktor: And then I think companies who saw the economic ROI that like actually you can have really meaningful experiential learning virtually at a fraction of the cost of bringing people together.
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Candice Faktor: And time,
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Candice Faktor: time is a big one too,
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Candice Faktor: was the first wave.
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Candice Faktor: Yeah.
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Candice Faktor: But it still cost a lot of money and it was still hard to do because learning,
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Candice Faktor: like great learning experiences are,
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Candice Faktor: they're thoughtful,
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Candice Faktor: they're intentional.
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Candice Faktor: I think the next wave, which is what we're really excited about at Disco, is how can AI actually take a lot of the burden of creating really effective,
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Candice Faktor: experiential,
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Candice Faktor: personalized,
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Candice Faktor: project-based, peer-based learning?
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Candice Faktor: How can we use AI to actually unlock even more capability building?
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Candice Faktor: So imagine a scenario where you can take your proprietary IP,
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Candice Faktor: whether it's product enablement or leadership development or like the list goes on and or change management around AI upskilling.
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Candice Faktor: how do I take your proprietary IP and then actually generate amazing effective learning programs for
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Candice Faktor: different roles in your organization,
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Candice Faktor: for different people that have the combination of
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Candice Faktor: human first experiences. So some live experiences with agents or agentic coaches that help you
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Candice Faktor: continue that learning and personalize it and have generative conversations.
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Candice Faktor: So
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Candice Faktor: you know,
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Candice Faktor: use this technology for good,
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Candice Faktor: for actually helping humans upskill. And I think
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Candice Faktor: that's,
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Candice Faktor: you know, that's what I get really excited about is like, there's a lot of
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Candice Faktor: negativity around AI in organizations,
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Candice Faktor: but I think it's the wrong way to look at it. I think it's,
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Candice Faktor: yes, it will replace certain types of work that we've done before,
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Candice Faktor: but it can also enhance,
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Candice Faktor: you know,
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Candice Faktor: so many types of work that we're just about to discover.
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Jon Worren: Sure.
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Jon Worren: I mean, it is very interesting,
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Jon Worren: right?
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Jon Worren: Because in some ways,
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Jon Worren: AI can be also a competitor to what you do.
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Jon Worren: It can be an amazing coach in some ways if you train it right.
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Jon Worren: And it can do a lot of things for you in that way.
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Jon Worren: But it's a double-edged soldier because AI can also produce a lot of very cheap
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Jon Worren: and maybe thoughtless content.
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Jon Worren: So the AI, you really need to know what you're doing with AI for it to make sense.
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Candice Faktor: A thousand percent. And I think this is where there's a lot of nuance to how organizations build AI fluency and become,
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Candice Faktor: you know, AI native organizations.
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Candice Faktor: So to double click on that, I would say you have to assume that work that can be done by AI will be done by AI.
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Jon Worren: Yes.
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Candice Faktor: And for a lot of people, it's very existential.
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Candice Faktor: And I think where organizations go wrong is they think this is a tooling problem.
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Candice Faktor: if we just put anthropic or claude co-work into everybody's hands we'll have figured out
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Candice Faktor: how to be ai native or um you know we're just going to use cursor you know and and it's just
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Candice Faktor: it's going to work and it's like you are completely underestimating you know what it
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Candice Faktor: actually takes to build capability in an organization and what for me what it is
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Candice Faktor: it is the human element,
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Candice Faktor: right?
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Candice Faktor: Like we have humans,
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Candice Faktor: if they are fearful,
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Candice Faktor: they are going to
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Candice Faktor: like really resist any and all,
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Candice Faktor: you know, transformation.
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Candice Faktor: They're going to be fixed
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Candice Faktor: in their roles versus fluid,
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Candice Faktor: right? And they're not going to look at this as superpowers.
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Candice Faktor: They're
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Candice Faktor: going to look at this as,
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Candice Faktor: you know, my job's at risk.
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Candice Faktor: And so the job of leadership is to
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Candice Faktor: radically change the nature of,
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Candice Faktor: you know,
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Candice Faktor: AI upskilling in the org to be one of,
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Candice Faktor: you know,
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Candice Faktor: how do we learn to use these tools in a way that can actually create more value for this company?
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Candice Faktor: And how then do we need to change the workflows and the roles and the learning that needs to happen?
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Jon Worren: Yeah,
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Jon Worren: a lot of great points there.
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Jon Worren: But it's so interesting what you're saying there about,
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Jon Worren: Well, first of all,
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Jon Worren: we've witnessed it firsthand in the program that we're running to help small businesses adopt AI.
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Jon Worren: That when they arrive to us,
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Jon Worren: they really are looking for help to pick a tool.
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Jon Worren: Which one should we choose?
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Jon Worren: And I think that's what this is about.
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Jon Worren: But then as the time goes and they learn a little bit more, they understand that, okay,
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Jon Worren: the human element actually is the most important.
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Jon Worren: So we've seen that in the core that just graduated for us a few weeks ago.
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Jon Worren: This shift took place gradually.
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Jon Worren: And at the end of it, all they wanted to know about was change management,
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Jon Worren: trying to understand the risk,
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Jon Worren: trying to understand how to engage their staff in doing the work.
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Jon Worren: The tool thing had completely gone away as a question for them.
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Jon Worren: So that's very, very interesting.
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Jon Worren: How do you stop people from worrying about losing their jobs then?
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Jon Worren: Because it is a real thing in certain cases.
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Candice Faktor: It is 100% a real thing.
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Candice Faktor: And I don't think you can be Pollyanna about it,
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Candice Faktor: right?
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Candice Faktor: I think their reality is that there are three kinds of people in an organization.
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Candice Faktor: This is oversimplifying, but just for simplicity's sake.
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Candice Faktor: And this was Brian Balfour's framework.
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Candice Faktor: And it just really resonated with me, which is they're catalysts.
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Candice Faktor: There are people who are so excited about what is going to be possible now that they have superpowers.
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Candice Faktor: Right.
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Candice Faktor: And it really,
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Candice Faktor: really is superpowers.
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Candice Faktor: You know,
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Candice Faktor: if you use it appropriately.
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Candice Faktor: So you have this group of people called the catalysts.
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Candice Faktor: They are your leaders.
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Candice Faktor: Like what your job is in an organization is to unlock,
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Candice Faktor: you know, and remove all friction for allowing these people to show you what's possible in your organization as an AI native organization.
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Candice Faktor: I think when people see their peers actually using these tools and you have a learning platform that actually encourages,
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Candice Faktor: you know, live peer based,
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Candice Faktor: you know,
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Candice Faktor: sharing,
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Candice Faktor: which you have and you're a Disco customer, too,
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Candice Faktor: which is great.
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Candice Faktor: Um,
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Candice Faktor: but, but cohorts of people who are actually showcasing whether it's like demos every week
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Candice Faktor: or a project,
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Candice Faktor: you know,
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Candice Faktor: space where people can see other people's projects.
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Candice Faktor: That's really powerful for people to see, Oh,
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Candice Faktor: actually like my job isn't what I thought
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Candice Faktor: it was.
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Candice Faktor: My job is to use these tools in effective ways.
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Candice Faktor: That's going to be a small percentage of your people,
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Candice Faktor: but it's a really, really important
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Candice Faktor: segment.
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Candice Faktor: The second segment,
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Candice Faktor: in my opinion,
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Candice Faktor: are converts.
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Candice Faktor: Like these are good people.
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Candice Faktor: They're good workers.
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Candice Faktor: they don't want to go out of the rules right they want to know what's allowed they want to have a
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Candice Faktor: sandbox they want to understand like what's the rubric like what's unacceptable in this new ai
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Candice Faktor: world what's like acceptable what's exceptional and i bet you if you actually articulate what is
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Candice Faktor: exceptional most people will actually tend towards that they'll they'll recognize like
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Candice Faktor: the world has changed this is what exceptional use looks like if i want to be in my role like i
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Candice Faktor: moving towards here but it's clear it's like more defined and i think we have to that's the job of
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Candice Faktor: leadership right is to actually create ai fluency programs that articulate this at the role and
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Candice Faktor: workflow level and then i think you have you know um i don't your anchors right these are people
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Candice Faktor: like they're stuck in an old paradigm i wouldn't even say it's bad it's just like they're they're
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Candice Faktor: They're risk averse.
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Candice Faktor: And actually, I think there's a lot to learn there.
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Candice Faktor: You know,
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Candice Faktor: I think there's a lot to learn around like where risk may lie.
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Candice Faktor: Right.
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Candice Faktor: Or what I need to think about when it comes to compliance or actually like privacy,
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Candice Faktor: trust,
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Candice Faktor: discernment,
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Candice Faktor: judgment.
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Candice Faktor: Like these are all really important skills in AI.
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Candice Faktor: So I wouldn't be dismissive,
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Candice Faktor: but I would be like discerning.
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Candice Faktor: Right.
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Candice Faktor: Around what do you want to take from what these people are saying and also setting the bar differently.
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Candice Faktor: Right.
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Candice Faktor: Like we can't be in our old way.
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Candice Faktor: And the people who aren't willing to cross the chasm,
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Candice Faktor: right?
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Candice Faktor: I do think there is a real existential risk because an organization,
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Candice Faktor: like the very nature of the human experience is impermanence and change.
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Candice Faktor: You know,
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Candice Faktor: the very nature of human experience is adaptation and survival,
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Candice Faktor: right?
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Candice Faktor: And so to assume that things will always stay the same is the wrong first principle
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Candice Faktor: for any organization or for any human being.
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Candice Faktor: And I think we've been taught,
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Candice Faktor: right,
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Candice Faktor: that like if you just stick in your little box
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Candice Faktor: in a specialized way and do your thing,
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Candice Faktor: you're safe.
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Candice Faktor: But like my,
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Candice Faktor: you know,
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Candice Faktor: my mantra is like,
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Candice Faktor: actually, if you're not taking risks
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Candice Faktor: or experimenting or trying new things,
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Candice Faktor: like you're not safe
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Candice Faktor: because that's the nature of,
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Candice Faktor: you know, the universe.
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Jon Worren: But that is a hard culture to build.
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Jon Worren: And,
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Jon Worren: you know,
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Jon Worren: looking across the corporate landscape in Canada,
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Jon Worren: but not necessarily one that we're very good at in Canada.
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Candice Faktor: I think it depends where you're looking.
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Candice Faktor: Maybe.
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Candice Faktor: So I think it's like we have an incredible ecosystem of really innovative,
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Candice Faktor: change,
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Candice Faktor: you know,
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Candice Faktor: change loving organizations.
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Candice Faktor: and people,
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Candice Faktor: right?
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Candice Faktor: I think Canadians,
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Candice Faktor: they're misunderstood.
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Candice Faktor: Like there's a tremendous amount
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Candice Faktor: of successful Canadians
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Candice Faktor: who are very,
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Candice Faktor: very open
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Candice Faktor: to an embracing of change and disruption.
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Candice Faktor: And,
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Candice Faktor: you know,
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Candice Faktor: the challenge for us now
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Candice Faktor: is many of them have actually left the country,
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Candice Faktor: even though they're Canadian.
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Candice Faktor: And the reason for that
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Candice Faktor: is because our landscape has not,
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Candice Faktor: our culture may not be rewarding
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Candice Faktor: and or recognizing how important embracing change really is.
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Jon Worren: Yeah,
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Jon Worren: fair enough.
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Jon Worren: I think that's really well said.
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Jon Worren: And then also to make sure that maybe that we cultivate an environment
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Jon Worren: where those people are valued in a different way.
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Jon Worren: We started out the conversation talking a little bit about mentioning that it's Tech Week.
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Jon Worren: And you're a prominent member of the tech community in Toronto.
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Jon Worren: How would you describe the state of the tech community in Toronto today?
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Candice Faktor: Yeah, it's interesting.
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Candice Faktor: I mean,
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Candice Faktor: I remember 2017,
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Candice Faktor: and I actually think I was in Toronto Life talking about Toronto as the next big tech ecosystem.
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Candice Faktor: And it was a very exciting time.
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Candice Faktor: This is like nearly a decade ago, which is crazy how fast time flies.
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Candice Faktor: But what was exciting then was the recognition that we have some of the world's most important and smartest talents,
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Candice Faktor: specifically in AI,
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Candice Faktor: that had its roots and connectivity to this ecosystem.
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Candice Faktor: and we were,
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Candice Faktor: you know,
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Candice Faktor: world class.
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Candice Faktor: There were some world class companies that were being built
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Candice Faktor: and there was a recognition that on the global stage,
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Candice Faktor: you know,
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Candice Faktor: lots of global capital and talent
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Candice Faktor: were looking to invest in Canada.
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GIles Gherson: And,
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Candice Faktor: you know, I fundamentally believe we need to build bridges
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Candice Faktor: if we are going to be successful as an ecosystem.
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Candice Faktor: Like you don't do this in isolation.
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Candice Faktor: And I would say it's really unfortunate what has happened since then.
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Candice Faktor: And I think instead of actually moving up and to the right,
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Candice Faktor: we've tapered in terms of relevance on the global scale.
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Candice Faktor: And I think there's...
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Jon Worren: What's missing?
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Candice Faktor: I think there's a few things, right?
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Candice Faktor: I think it's a hard place to be an entrepreneur today.
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Candice Faktor: I don't think the city is friendly towards,
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Candice Faktor: you know, the entrepreneurial ecosystem.
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Candice Faktor: I think,
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Candice Faktor: you know, the recognition that we need to build companies to actually increase prosperity in Canada.
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Candice Faktor: And to your point, the risk aversion is not,
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Candice Faktor: you know, is not helping us. Right.
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Candice Faktor: So so we need to make this a really,
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Candice Faktor: really attractive place for talent,
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Candice Faktor: for capital and for founders.
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Candice Faktor: And I think if we do that,
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Candice Faktor: like the world's our oyster.
440
00:23:27,600 --> 00:23:32,700
Candice Faktor: Like we live in one of the most resource rich and wonderful places.
441
00:23:33,040 --> 00:23:36,040
Candice Faktor: Like our multiculturalism is that is a gift.
442
00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:38,520
Candice Faktor: It's like the diversity is phenomenal.
443
00:23:39,120 --> 00:23:41,200
Candice Faktor: The talent is exceptional.
444
00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:45,300
Candice Faktor: We live in a relatively safe part of the world.
445
00:23:46,370 --> 00:23:47,280
Candice Faktor: You know, the list goes on.
446
00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:48,320
Candice Faktor: Like Canada is like,
447
00:23:48,680 --> 00:23:49,260
Candice Faktor: I'm an immigrant.
448
00:23:49,430 --> 00:23:51,220
Candice Faktor: Like I like deeply,
449
00:23:51,460 --> 00:23:56,660
Candice Faktor: deeply am so appreciative of this country and everything that it's given me and my family.
450
00:23:57,740 --> 00:24:07,460
Candice Faktor: But the culture in the city and in the country has not progressed around entrepreneurship and risk taking.
451
00:24:08,100 --> 00:24:08,420
Candice Faktor: And,
452
00:24:08,830 --> 00:24:10,180
Candice Faktor: you know, even in the school systems,
453
00:24:10,480 --> 00:24:10,600
Candice Faktor: right?
454
00:24:10,740 --> 00:24:10,840
Candice Faktor: Like,
455
00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:16,880
Candice Faktor: I think we have under invested in the skills that you need to thrive in an uncertain world,
456
00:24:17,600 --> 00:24:18,940
Candice Faktor: whether that's entrepreneurship,
457
00:24:19,340 --> 00:24:19,700
Candice Faktor: agency,
458
00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:20,540
Candice Faktor: resilience.
459
00:24:22,200 --> 00:24:22,880
Candice Faktor: You know,
460
00:24:23,100 --> 00:24:30,460
Candice Faktor: there's just there's a there's a lack of understanding how to create prosperity.
461
00:24:31,500 --> 00:24:33,480
Candice Faktor: And if we do that, I think we have,
462
00:24:34,100 --> 00:24:39,520
Candice Faktor: you know, we have a really, really great chance of being like one of the world's top cities.
463
00:24:40,340 --> 00:24:40,860
Jon Worren: Amazing.
464
00:24:41,380 --> 00:24:41,820
Jon Worren: Yeah,
465
00:24:41,980 --> 00:24:43,120
Jon Worren: I fully agree with you.
466
00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:44,920
Jon Worren: The ingredients are there,
467
00:24:45,650 --> 00:24:46,680
Jon Worren: but some of the dynamic
468
00:24:46,940 --> 00:24:48,420
Jon Worren: is not right at the moment.
469
00:24:50,900 --> 00:24:54,000
Jon Worren: All right, a couple of questions just to wrap this up.
470
00:24:54,670 --> 00:24:55,200
Jon Worren: First of all,
471
00:24:56,000 --> 00:24:56,680
Jon Worren: how do you learn?
472
00:24:57,200 --> 00:25:00,300
Jon Worren: We started off talking about learning and corporate learning.
473
00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:02,040
Candice Faktor: I love it. I mean,
474
00:25:02,420 --> 00:25:02,640
Candice Faktor: so,
475
00:25:03,260 --> 00:25:07,320
Candice Faktor: you know, I guess this is why I'm so passionate about what we're building
476
00:25:07,340 --> 00:25:07,980
Candice Faktor: at Disco,
477
00:25:08,820 --> 00:25:11,160
Candice Faktor: I learn through experience,
478
00:25:11,880 --> 00:25:12,000
Candice Faktor: right?
479
00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:14,540
Candice Faktor: And really rich active experiences.
480
00:25:15,040 --> 00:25:16,460
Candice Faktor: So it's a real
481
00:25:16,800 --> 00:25:17,500
Candice Faktor: combo because,
482
00:25:18,520 --> 00:25:18,720
Candice Faktor: you know,
483
00:25:19,560 --> 00:25:21,900
Candice Faktor: I love learning through project-based learning,
484
00:25:22,360 --> 00:25:23,640
Candice Faktor: right? And we're a remote
485
00:25:23,730 --> 00:25:25,540
Candice Faktor: company. So everything we do is like,
486
00:25:25,980 --> 00:25:29,140
Candice Faktor: you know, using a tool like Disco, which is,
487
00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:29,840
Candice Faktor: you know,
488
00:25:29,850 --> 00:25:30,680
Candice Faktor: we have projects,
489
00:25:30,950 --> 00:25:32,200
Candice Faktor: we have peer groups.
490
00:25:32,980 --> 00:25:35,840
Candice Faktor: I like learning when it's personalized to my context.
491
00:25:36,140 --> 00:25:39,180
Candice Faktor: So agendified learning and agents to help you learn.
492
00:25:39,430 --> 00:25:39,580
Candice Faktor: Right.
493
00:25:39,820 --> 00:25:41,180
Candice Faktor: I think that's incredible.
494
00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:48,000
Candice Faktor: Like I think this new paradigm where I can actually converse with an agent and it can give me feedback.
495
00:25:48,370 --> 00:25:49,600
Candice Faktor: Right. Or I can role play.
496
00:25:49,870 --> 00:25:57,280
Candice Faktor: You know, it's actually something we just launched and launching in Disco right now, which is like these tools don't just replace work.
497
00:25:57,340 --> 00:26:02,760
Candice Faktor: It's the intentionality behind them and the products that you can build to actually help people learn.
498
00:26:03,580 --> 00:26:06,760
Candice Faktor: But the idea of generative feedback oriented learning,
499
00:26:07,140 --> 00:26:07,740
Candice Faktor: active learning,
500
00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:08,720
Candice Faktor: project learning,
501
00:26:09,460 --> 00:26:10,400
Candice Faktor: peer based learning,
502
00:26:11,760 --> 00:26:14,180
Candice Faktor: I think is 100 percent how you build capability.
503
00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:18,960
Candice Faktor: And you learn by experimenting and often you learn best through failing.
504
00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:19,860
Candice Faktor: Like,
505
00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:28,480
Candice Faktor: you know, that's the that is the biggest thing. I think like if I could give one piece of advice to Torontonians,
506
00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:28,980
Candice Faktor: right,
507
00:26:29,820 --> 00:26:35,620
Candice Faktor: it's be OK that you can try something and it not work out and then learn from that and do it again.
508
00:26:36,620 --> 00:26:38,880
Candice Faktor: and the asymmetry of risk.
509
00:26:39,030 --> 00:26:41,300
Candice Faktor: You don't need to put your entire company at risk
510
00:26:41,390 --> 00:26:43,220
Candice Faktor: or your entire career at risk.
511
00:26:43,980 --> 00:26:46,980
Candice Faktor: You just need to start taking action,
512
00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:48,220
Candice Faktor: trying things,
513
00:26:48,420 --> 00:26:49,440
Candice Faktor: seeing if it worked,
514
00:26:49,900 --> 00:26:50,960
Candice Faktor: understanding why it didn't,
515
00:26:51,400 --> 00:26:52,160
Candice Faktor: and do it again.
516
00:26:52,820 --> 00:26:55,500
Candice Faktor: And I think that is really,
517
00:26:55,680 --> 00:26:56,300
Candice Faktor: really important.
518
00:26:56,660 --> 00:26:59,560
Candice Faktor: And AI can be your friend in this,
519
00:26:59,860 --> 00:27:02,400
Candice Faktor: or it is, as you say, going to be your foe
520
00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:05,940
Candice Faktor: because AI can replace people who aren't interested
521
00:27:05,960 --> 00:27:07,640
Candice Faktor: in building continuous learning.
522
00:27:08,150 --> 00:27:11,140
Jon Worren: And just from a leadership perspective,
523
00:27:11,210 --> 00:27:13,860
Jon Worren: when you talk about that sort of an environment
524
00:27:14,260 --> 00:27:14,860
Jon Worren: where learning,
525
00:27:15,300 --> 00:27:15,720
Jon Worren: risk-taking,
526
00:27:16,040 --> 00:27:17,700
Jon Worren: failure is,
527
00:27:17,960 --> 00:27:19,000
Jon Worren: you know,
528
00:27:19,300 --> 00:27:20,920
Jon Worren: it's conducive to that kind of behavior.
529
00:27:21,720 --> 00:27:23,840
Jon Worren: Like, what does it mean to be a leader in that kind of,
530
00:27:24,340 --> 00:27:24,460
Jon Worren: like,
531
00:27:24,690 --> 00:27:27,660
Jon Worren: what is it that you have to be encouraging
532
00:27:27,750 --> 00:27:29,440
Jon Worren: and what is it you have to be careful about?
533
00:27:29,620 --> 00:27:33,720
Candice Faktor: Yeah, I think being a leader today
534
00:27:33,740 --> 00:27:34,780
Candice Faktor: is really,
535
00:27:35,220 --> 00:27:37,460
Candice Faktor: really different than it was before.
536
00:27:39,180 --> 00:27:42,940
Candice Faktor: I think there's a couple of key skills.
537
00:27:43,190 --> 00:27:45,380
Candice Faktor: I think you need to be an effective leader today.
538
00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:50,140
Candice Faktor: So one, you need to be like exceptionally curious.
539
00:27:51,040 --> 00:27:54,100
Candice Faktor: Like the earth is literally moving beneath you,
540
00:27:54,480 --> 00:27:54,620
Candice Faktor: right?
541
00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:56,520
Candice Faktor: And it's like every two weeks,
542
00:27:57,520 --> 00:27:57,960
Candice Faktor: it's new,
543
00:27:58,560 --> 00:27:58,680
Candice Faktor: right?
544
00:27:58,920 --> 00:28:02,020
Candice Faktor: And so you can't put your head in the sand.
545
00:28:02,540 --> 00:28:09,700
Candice Faktor: you can't outsource it like you have to understand what is changing like you're orienting an entire
546
00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:17,640
Candice Faktor: organization so like your orientation really matters um i think you have to have deep empathy
547
00:28:18,260 --> 00:28:27,120
Candice Faktor: like like empathy is you know i think just like an underrated skill of leadership right like
548
00:28:27,100 --> 00:28:32,500
Candice Faktor: controlling command is not how you get people to do things that are risky.
549
00:28:33,670 --> 00:28:33,920
Candice Faktor: You know,
550
00:28:34,500 --> 00:28:35,480
Candice Faktor: you really
551
00:28:35,490 --> 00:28:41,540
Candice Faktor: have to have empathy and you have to share your openness and your experiences around your own
552
00:28:41,680 --> 00:28:41,840
Candice Faktor: learning.
553
00:28:42,370 --> 00:28:44,960
Candice Faktor: And you've got to be really humble in that, like,
554
00:28:45,760 --> 00:28:47,260
Candice Faktor: the answers aren't known. So we got
555
00:28:47,260 --> 00:28:48,160
Candice Faktor: to figure it out.
556
00:28:49,110 --> 00:28:50,300
Candice Faktor: And just understanding,
557
00:28:50,560 --> 00:28:52,960
Candice Faktor: like, even that nuance of like, there's different kinds
558
00:28:52,980 --> 00:28:58,120
Candice Faktor: of people in your org and like why are they behaving in the ways that they are like I think
559
00:28:58,280 --> 00:29:06,300
Candice Faktor: that's really really important in leadership today and then the third thing is you have to be really
560
00:29:06,620 --> 00:29:13,720
Candice Faktor: innovative around where in your organization are you going to onboard this new worker which is like
561
00:29:13,720 --> 00:29:21,760
Candice Faktor: an agent and what does that mean then for the human work that is around it and what does that mean for
562
00:29:22,340 --> 00:29:24,380
Candice Faktor: your company's competitive position.
563
00:29:25,400 --> 00:29:27,600
Candice Faktor: And like, I think there's both efficiency gains,
564
00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:28,300
Candice Faktor: which are
565
00:29:29,020 --> 00:29:31,960
Candice Faktor: going to be kind of table stakes, in my opinion.
566
00:29:32,140 --> 00:29:33,420
Candice Faktor: It's not that you shouldn't go for them.
567
00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:38,480
Candice Faktor: It's that you should understand that in competitive dynamics,
568
00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:40,160
Candice Faktor: like those are going to be the first
569
00:29:40,320 --> 00:29:42,080
Candice Faktor: ones to become table stakes.
570
00:29:42,580 --> 00:29:44,280
Candice Faktor: So then it becomes like,
571
00:29:44,840 --> 00:29:47,540
Candice Faktor: how might I use these technologies to create
572
00:29:48,440 --> 00:29:49,280
Candice Faktor: new opportunities,
573
00:29:49,740 --> 00:29:50,640
Candice Faktor: growth opportunities,
574
00:29:51,820 --> 00:29:53,800
Candice Faktor: and growth opportunities for the company,
575
00:29:53,890 --> 00:29:55,740
Candice Faktor: but also for people's roles.
576
00:29:56,740 --> 00:29:58,380
Candice Faktor: And, you know, if you're not growing, you're dying.
577
00:29:59,140 --> 00:29:59,880
Candice Faktor: That's it,
578
00:30:00,150 --> 00:30:00,520
Candice Faktor: you know?
579
00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:03,840
Candice Faktor: And so you can harvest something for a period of time,
580
00:30:04,510 --> 00:30:05,940
Candice Faktor: but unless you're finding like
581
00:30:06,400 --> 00:30:08,260
Candice Faktor: new opportunities,
582
00:30:08,740 --> 00:30:11,720
Candice Faktor: new growth areas, I would say this to the city,
583
00:30:11,970 --> 00:30:12,680
Candice Faktor: to the country,
584
00:30:13,120 --> 00:30:14,300
Candice Faktor: to companies,
585
00:30:14,620 --> 00:30:15,160
Candice Faktor: and to people,
586
00:30:15,620 --> 00:30:15,700
Candice Faktor: right?
587
00:30:16,070 --> 00:30:17,160
Candice Faktor: Unless you are growing,
588
00:30:17,620 --> 00:30:19,480
Candice Faktor: you are dying.
589
00:30:20,450 --> 00:30:20,620
Candice Faktor: So,
590
00:30:20,960 --> 00:30:22,760
Candice Faktor: you know, like finding as a leader,
591
00:30:22,970 --> 00:30:25,320
Candice Faktor: like finding new growth opportunities
592
00:30:25,490 --> 00:30:26,320
Candice Faktor: for your organization
593
00:30:27,370 --> 00:30:29,400
Candice Faktor: and then like looking at like,
594
00:30:29,580 --> 00:30:31,520
Candice Faktor: therefore, what do humans need to do?
595
00:30:31,660 --> 00:30:34,940
Candice Faktor: What does AI need to do to achieve that
596
00:30:35,160 --> 00:30:38,020
Candice Faktor: is what I think really exceptional leadership is.
597
00:30:38,200 --> 00:30:39,900
Jon Worren: So we're in Tech Week,
598
00:30:40,140 --> 00:30:42,140
Jon Worren: 600 events,
599
00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:43,020
Jon Worren: apparently.
600
00:30:43,260 --> 00:30:43,520
Candice Faktor: Amazing.
601
00:30:43,710 --> 00:30:44,220
Candice Faktor: It's amazing.
602
00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:44,600
Candice Faktor: So great.
603
00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:48,280
Jon Worren: What is one of two things that you're most looking forward to this week?
604
00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:49,500
Candice Faktor: Oh,
605
00:30:49,660 --> 00:30:52,040
Candice Faktor: there's so much going on. I think,
606
00:30:53,090 --> 00:30:55,140
Candice Faktor: I think just the very fact that,
607
00:30:56,250 --> 00:30:56,500
Candice Faktor: you know,
608
00:30:56,660 --> 00:30:57,300
Candice Faktor: I was at an
609
00:30:57,440 --> 00:31:02,160
Candice Faktor: event last night and everybody was saying like, you have to be in Toronto this week.
610
00:31:02,870 --> 00:31:03,020
Candice Faktor: Right.
611
00:31:03,280 --> 00:31:03,360
Candice Faktor: And
612
00:31:03,360 --> 00:31:06,480
Candice Faktor: so it's not even like just for the local community.
613
00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:09,059
Candice Faktor: It's like the world is actually paying attention
614
00:31:09,080 --> 00:31:11,400
Candice Faktor: to Toronto this week and what's happening here.
615
00:31:12,100 --> 00:31:14,140
Candice Faktor: And so it's just like a great opportunity
616
00:31:14,540 --> 00:31:16,820
Candice Faktor: for anybody to go out
617
00:31:17,180 --> 00:31:19,360
Candice Faktor: and kind of see what the future looks like,
618
00:31:19,420 --> 00:31:20,740
Candice Faktor: see what is being built,
619
00:31:21,260 --> 00:31:22,840
Candice Faktor: learn from great entrepreneurs
620
00:31:23,170 --> 00:31:26,360
Candice Faktor: who are really embracing these technologies,
621
00:31:26,700 --> 00:31:28,800
Candice Faktor: learn from some of the incredible talent
622
00:31:29,020 --> 00:31:31,540
Candice Faktor: that's here speaking from around the world.
623
00:31:31,960 --> 00:31:35,360
Candice Faktor: I think that's the reality is like,
624
00:31:35,980 --> 00:31:40,260
Candice Faktor: There are no barriers to your growth.
625
00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:42,820
Candice Faktor: You just need to be looking in the right places
626
00:31:43,220 --> 00:31:45,000
Candice Faktor: and surrounding yourself by the right people.
627
00:31:46,100 --> 00:31:47,740
Jon Worren: Sounds like a great place to end it.
628
00:31:47,920 --> 00:31:48,620
GIles Gherson: Thank you so much.
629
00:31:49,300 --> 00:31:50,000
Candice Faktor: No problem.
630
00:31:51,160 --> 00:31:53,080
GIles Gherson: Thanks for listening to Toronto Talks,
631
00:31:53,280 --> 00:31:56,360
GIles Gherson: conversations with the leaders shaping the region's economy.
632
00:31:56,960 --> 00:31:59,040
GIles Gherson: Follow us wherever you get your podcasts.