Selling Is Everything: On Entrepreneurship and EOS, with Adam Kaplan

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Welcome to The Scalability Code, the podcast that helps you get out of the sh*t show and start growing your business.
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A few times each month, you'll hear stories and commentary from visionary entrepreneurs, EOS implementers, and fractional COOs about how they've taken businesses to Level 10.
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And now for your host, Matt Haney.
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All right, here we are again today.
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Another episode of The Scalability Code.
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Thanks for joining us today.
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I'm joined by Adam Kaplan.
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Adam comes to us from outside of Detroit Motor City, and um, Adam's gonna give us some of his background.
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Yeah, there it is.
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Give us some of his background on how he got to EOS.
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What he does, how it happens, what he loves, maybe what he hates, and some of the other things about working, um, with small business owners.
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So Adam, thank you so much for joining us today on the Scalability Code.
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Thanks for having me, Matt.
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Appreciate it.
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Awesome.
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So as we do, I think, an introduction goes a long way.
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I think we as business owners and, and facilitators and executives are trained to give a, a really quick 30 to 45 second introduction.
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But I'm gonna challenge logic today because I want you, Adam, to take some time and go back to a couple different things.
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One, think about, your first exposure to entrepreneurship.
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and give us some backstory there.
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And generally for entrepreneurs that's at an early age.
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Then I want you to fill some gaps in between now and then.
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So tell us how it started and take your time, give us some steps and let us know how you ended up as an entrepreneur.
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anyone on listening to this ever collect baseball cards?
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Oh, don't tell my kid.
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He's so into it right now.
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So into it.
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So I never had a Mickey Mantle.
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Let's just put that out there.
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Or a Thai Cobb.
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Okay.
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But, uh, that was my jam at 8, 9, 10 years old, you know?
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No,
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so great.
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And you know, it took a big lapse and now there's a huge resurgence.
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Again.
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Yeah, that's what I heard.
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You know, I'm not one of those weird old guys hanging out at car shows with 10-year-old boys.
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That's a good thing to know.
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That's a.
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It's a good thing to know, but, you know, when I was that 8-year-old boy, like I couldn't get enough of that.
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And, uh, we had a lot of fun.
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My, uh, my buddy and I uh, mostly successfully buying, not so much successfully selling.
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So you ask what the lessons are.
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Um, selling is everything.
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The selling function, if you can't sell, can't have your business.
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That's right and and most collectors don't, I don't say most collectors.
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Dumb statement, A lot of collectors don't wanna sell.
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They just wanna sit on'em and the market goes full circle, et cetera.
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So more importantly, who did you grow up following?
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Were you a Tigers fan?
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So I grew up in New York, so, um, I'm actually a long, I'm a long suffering Mets fan
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Okay, fine.
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We we're good.
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We're good.
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We're good.
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As long as you weren't gonna tell me you were, uh, a long suffering Yankees fan.
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'cause I do happen to represent these guys rather.
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Well.
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I couldn't have made that up.
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It was sitting here.
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But as long as you're a Mets fan, we're good.
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cause there's no harm
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love, I love you guys'cause you made 1986 possible.
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no.
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Sorry man.
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you're not wrong.
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Sorry man.
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deal.
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That was a bad deal.
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So, wait, so you, uh, you got into baseball cards.
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Did you get a good collection?
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I mean, do you have some stuff?
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had a good collection.
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I have a, maybe I have a good collection.
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Like it's not something I look at all the time.
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Um, I've got some good cards, you know, but nothing to retire off of.
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Wait, is there any, I, I'm so many questions.
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I'm sorry.
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And then I'll let it go.
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Do you have.
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A plan for the cards.
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Do you have family?
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Do you have kids?
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Do you have friends?
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Anybody that would want your collection?
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I need a succession plan for my
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need to go.
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There's a new program.
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Shout out to my friend Ed Kane, who co-star, a company called Card Vault.
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You need to look up Card Vault.
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They partnered with, Tom Brady.
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You've heard of him.
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And they started a series of retail stores around the country called Card Vault because they like you.
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Uh, saw the way that cards were back in the day and the retail stores of the past, which have then faded away.
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And now Adam, there's this whole resurgence around, going to stores, going to retail, ripping packs, as they say.
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So, cards are back.
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You ought to dig back in and you ought to just say, let's be a little curious and see what my cards are worth and where they are.
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I would say just one other thing, and I know we're really belaboring this, but you know, you say ripping packs, like, we used to count cards like we used to say, all right, if this card is here, what comes before it?
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And maybe we should buy this pack.
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And sometimes we were right and sometimes we were wrong.
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Like, that's like counting cards in
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Counting cards.
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Well, listen, I love that I won't spend too much more time on it, but I do think that, uh.
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You know, it's cool to hear.
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I had a collection too.
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I wasn't the diligent and I certainly didn't keep up with'em, but I love living it through the eyes of my kids and his friends now, so, okay.
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So that was our first exposure to entrepreneurship.
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Great.
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Life lessons.
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Tell me, how'd you get, like give me, gimme some more about how you got to where you are.
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Um, first job was entrepreneurial.
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It wasn't my company, but I partnered with an entrepreneur.
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And, uh, you know, like you, that kind of gravitates towards integrator.
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I had some, you know, he threw me to the wolves with some integrator type opportunities, uh, including building, a website for him that, uh, was in the late nineties.
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Wow.
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Way before
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in the day.
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Back in the day, you know, and uh, and I remember the day when people said, Hey, the internet's gonna be big one day, right?
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Sure it will.
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Sure it will.
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so that was fun.
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And then, um, I was building a company, 2001, internet bubble burst.
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Poof.
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Gone.
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'cause those were my clients.
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so that was maybe my entrepreneurial low point, but depending on how you look at that, I learned a ton from that, right?
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You could be riding high and then riding low, literally in an instant.
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I think people experienced that during COVID.
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Maybe some people, who've been bitten by the tariffs this year.
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Some people listening.
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Um, and, uh, you know, I hit the high 10 years later when the company I was running, we sold it to Big PE Firm, Morgan Stanley, 10 times ebitda.
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That felt good, but honestly at that time I realized that, I was kind of making up like my system.
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I didn't really have one.
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Um, I
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What space was that company in?
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dental.
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Ah, okay.
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Like products or actual services Delivering cleaning.
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There you
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Services, yeah.
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Unique service
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build that up new?
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A multi-office unit kind of thing?
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Or what
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Yeah.
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It wasn't office, it was, um, it was, a different service delivery.
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model.
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We went to the patient instead of them coming to us.
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Very cool.
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So, um, we were pretty ahead of, ahead of our time with that.
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you were the operator.
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Was it your company or were you the one making the operator or making the visionary successful.
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was the integrator of that company.
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makes sense.
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That makes sense.
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Awesome.
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And how long were you there?
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Like what was that story like?
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That was a couple of years.
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doubling the offices, scaling up and, um, a lot of growing pains.
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And, uh, ultimately, you know, a nice exit for everybody
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Were you able to get in early enough where you were working with the founders, or were you already sort of one layer down based on when you joined?
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with the founders.
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They, they had taken already some VC money, but that was like a smaller round and then, you know, that was a bigger round.
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but then, you know, I want to do something myself.
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So I started a recruiting company and in 2014, Klein introduced me to EOS Kle, that's in the traction book.
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and, you know, he said there's a system to run your business better.
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And I was pretty skeptical.
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and I kind of sat with it for a while and then Ultimately I ended up implementing it, doubling my business in three years.
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I saw it work for me, it worked for my client, so it wasn't a one trick pony.
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And uh, then I picked up some client, other clients.
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Just self implement then, or were
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I self-implemented at that point.
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Okay, good.
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That's great.
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And then, um, picked up some other clients in my recruiting company.
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They were running on EOS, and I saw their success.
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So.
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bought in and then, in 2021, I became an EOS implementer after taking EOS to another company where we doubled our customers in a year during COVID.
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So, uh, I lived it, I experienced it.
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Um.
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I, saw what it can do and uh, now I'm coaching others, making them better using EOS.
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That's awesome.
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That's very cool.
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So think back between baseball cards.
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And between the dental business, any other influential visionaries or entrepreneurs that you met in your, you know, your developing years as a kid or before college or in high school or, you know, my dad's buddy or so-and-so's someone that, that you thought, man, they, they were a visionary or they got a really, how did they come up with that?
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I love that question.
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That's a great question.
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I'm gonna have to reflect on that a little bit.
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cause my dad was kind of the man who went to work nine to five and wasn't an entrepreneur.
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Um, he was an engineer, so, you know, I had growing up, uh, a number of friends whose parents whose primarily fathers were entrepreneurs.
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Same
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So there was a guy who, uh, started with one shoe store and then he added two more shoe stores and he was in New York.
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Um, so he made some money there And any diversifying into real estate.
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and then you know, pre Uber, he bought a, taxi medallion.
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Because those were like bitcoin today.
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Absolutely.
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I
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like went nuts.
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so he held that and sold it and, you know, I, I used to talk to him about business and he used to say, you know, everything sounds good.
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We live in a nice house.
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You know, I've definitely made money, but I've also lost money, he's the one who, I think he was the one who mentioned to me like, you make money on the buy.
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Right.
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And that's always been my mantra for any real estate investments I've gotten into, or stocks, right?
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That's obviously, um, it's a cautionary tale right now with
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Yeah, no kidding.
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you know, multi-year highs, right?
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What are, are we buying?
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Where are we buying?
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but I think a lot of visionary entrepreneurs have, have, some of these instincts.
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But sometimes I think, you know, they can get carried away And now we can like maybe transition a little bit into EOS tools, if I may.
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Right.
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You know, on, on your vision, what's your core focus?
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Right?
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What's your main business?
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I know that visionaries can help themselves and they like to invest in other things.
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And but let's try and really dig in, like where's the value that we wanna create?
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Yeah.
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That's awesome.
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That's, that's interesting.
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So I too, like you was exposed to entrepreneurship at an early age, um, via my friends' families and fathers and others that I was watching.
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My dad was a banker, my mom was a school teacher.
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I always had the, but I always had the bug and I always got, I got, you know, I had the lawn mowing business and had the stuff and.
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I too, as an integrator, align myself with visionary business owners.
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And there's one common theme throughout the last 20, 25 years of my career is that I was always working next to somebody who had a struggle or a challenge to translate their vision.
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And I didn't know it at the time, but I was the guy that translated, I was the translator that helped.
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Get this guy or gal in a room, talk through what the details were and then help take that back to the people so that we had a true plan and the plan could change, but we had to give someone something in writing that said, this is the direction we're going and this is where we're going and this is why.
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And here's so, so to your point earlier on, on distilling vision down and making sure that we're being in.
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Incredibly clear.
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If you ask the average employee at any company in the in the country, run by a single entrepreneur, I would bet all the baseball cards that I own, that half of those people or less would say, I know the vision of this business.
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I bet even 10% of the people that work for single visionary entrepreneurs could say with conviction what the vision of the business is.
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And I don't know if you see that at all as you're entering in or talking to people about EOS.
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Uh, yeah, I, it's a small percentage.
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Um, don't know what the number is and that's, um, I think because.
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Primarily, a lot of us are so caught in the weeds, stuck in the weeds of the day-to-day business
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Yep.
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Working in the business and not on it at
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Right.
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Right.
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And we, we, might not even be clear.
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I think visionaries.
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have some general sense, right, of where they're going.
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That's what makes them visionaries.
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But I'm not sure that they see all the dots, as you said.
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That's why they need integrators to help them with that.
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and furthermore, I don't know that a lot of visionaries see that as something they should be doing,
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Right.
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Why is this important?
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Just go do the job, work, work, work.
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Why do you need to know what the long-term vision is?
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and you and I obviously know that, but I think the, the main reason, not the main reason, but one of the reasons that I think sharing that vision is just to get alignment so that people know.
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What they're showing up for.
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and that could be a myriad of things.
00:13:50.522 --> 00:14:01.892
Some of them have bigger purpose, some of them have, you know, give backs and community, and some of it's just capitalism, capitalistic nature, and, you know, um, but that's for the employee to decide.
00:14:01.892 --> 00:14:07.172
It's our job as integrators and visionaries and coaches to make the vision clear.
00:14:07.172 --> 00:14:10.412
That way people know what they're joining and what they're signing up for.
00:14:10.929 --> 00:14:11.139
okay.
00:14:11.139 --> 00:14:12.009
Let me ask you a question.
00:14:12.009 --> 00:14:14.649
This is always one of my favorite questions to ask implementers.
00:14:15.437 --> 00:14:23.812
is there any, any common themes, common businesses, common trends, common industries that you find yourself working in?
00:14:23.932 --> 00:14:29.932
Because as we know, EOS and Traction, the framework does apply to every single business.
00:14:30.352 --> 00:14:33.677
But do you find yourself gravitating towards a certain type of business?
00:14:35.279 --> 00:14:49.440
Well, it's not by design, uh, necessarily, but my professional career has been primarily with service companies and it just so happens that I end up, um, mostly with service businesses,
00:14:50.633 --> 00:14:52.462
Professional services B2B.
00:14:52.880 --> 00:14:54.380
B2B, some B2C.
00:14:54.380 --> 00:14:58.640
So distribution, logistics, medical services.
00:14:58.640 --> 00:15:02.583
um, I've got, education services,
00:15:03.929 --> 00:15:05.787
Well, it's no surprise that.
00:15:06.152 --> 00:15:15.062
The, all of those companies, uh, as I look back through our roster for the last eight years of doing this, we tend to fall in that space as well.
00:15:15.121 --> 00:15:17.731
B2B services, both professional and blue collar.
00:15:17.994 --> 00:15:19.787
and I find myself that.
00:15:20.522 --> 00:15:28.909
The visionaries and entrepreneurs that are starting those businesses tend to be those that win by what I call blunt force trauma.
00:15:29.389 --> 00:15:33.289
They are out there just banging that business every day, bang, bang, bang.
00:15:33.289 --> 00:15:34.429
'cause that's what they know, right?
00:15:34.669 --> 00:15:37.159
And that's what they've done and that's what made them successful.
00:15:37.519 --> 00:15:41.346
But adding, a little bit of accountability and a little bit of structure tends to see.
00:15:41.836 --> 00:15:49.722
That pendulum, I see it swing really hard, really quick when they add a little bit of structure, to their, you know, their services business.
00:15:52.129 --> 00:16:02.418
I would add that a lot of these visionary entrepreneurs are chief cook and bottle washers in a lot of instances, so rainmakers.
00:16:02.869 --> 00:16:11.100
But also many of them really involved in the day-to-day and the processes and, not loving that part of their work.
00:16:11.216 --> 00:16:12.917
wanting to elevate, just not knowing how.
00:16:13.644 --> 00:16:15.307
You are listening to the Scalability Code.
00:16:15.307 --> 00:16:23.477
I'm your host, Matt Haney, founder of Sinclair Ventures, and we help visionary entrepreneurs like you get out of the shit show and focus on growing your business.
00:16:23.616 --> 00:16:30.017
We offer fractional COO and leadership coaching services that free up that brain of yours to focus on what's next.
00:16:30.506 --> 00:16:32.246
Learn more about us at SinclairVentures.
00:16:32.246 --> 00:16:32.596
com.
00:16:32.616 --> 00:16:33.236
Now back to it.
00:16:34.318 --> 00:16:35.578
Yeah, no, absolutely.
00:16:35.578 --> 00:16:39.269
I think, uh, yeah, no, that's, that's very, very well said.
00:16:39.328 --> 00:16:41.999
Um, let's see, what else?
00:16:43.528 --> 00:16:48.089
most of your clients, I think we talked about this, well, let me ask this question.
00:16:48.089 --> 00:16:50.458
Do most of your visionaries.
00:16:51.193 --> 00:16:53.744
Also sit in the integrator seat?
00:16:54.403 --> 00:17:00.703
Or do they have, do most of your clients have both the visionary and integrator and their different people?
00:17:01.465 --> 00:17:03.684
Uh, most of my clients, it's different people, but they're definitely a.
00:17:03.950 --> 00:17:05.839
some that sit in both seats.
00:17:06.374 --> 00:17:06.854
Yep.
00:17:06.943 --> 00:17:16.038
And in your experience, you know, is there a, is there a more impactful result with an integrator in the seat versus just the visionary sitting in both?
00:17:17.150 --> 00:17:17.630
Yes.
00:17:17.983 --> 00:17:19.784
Yes, I led you to that question.
00:17:19.844 --> 00:17:22.124
You're giving me great one word answers.
00:17:22.500 --> 00:17:26.272
how do you approach it with a visionary where they've got the wrong integrator in that seat?
00:17:26.843 --> 00:17:29.153
Integrator by default is what I say.
00:17:29.579 --> 00:17:30.059
Okay.
00:17:30.750 --> 00:17:31.470
Um.
00:17:32.519 --> 00:17:37.380
You know, at the end of the day, um, it's their business, right?
00:17:38.298 --> 00:17:53.505
so you know, typically, first of all, it's more common that they're gonna be sitting in both seats than they're gonna be carrying a bad integrator Or, an, or what I should say is an integrator that isn't the right puzzle piece, that isn't the right fit for them.
00:17:53.535 --> 00:17:56.085
'cause bad is a relative term, right?
00:17:56.085 --> 00:17:58.545
Bad for them, but not necessarily bad in the world.
00:17:58.605 --> 00:18:01.095
Could be, could be a great integrator for someone else.
00:18:02.567 --> 00:18:06.886
that sounds like a right, right, you know, RPRS issue, right?
00:18:06.886 --> 00:18:11.086
Where you've got the right person for someone else.
00:18:11.116 --> 00:18:12.767
Not the right person for our seat.
00:18:13.371 --> 00:18:22.082
And that's an evolving, situation because as the business changes, the needs for the seat, might very well change.
00:18:22.516 --> 00:18:23.385
Absolutely.
00:18:23.685 --> 00:18:35.367
I absolutely, I, I, I use this term a lot, which is, you know, promoted by default or, or by tenure we put them in that seat because they were the office manager and they naturally moved up'cause they were organized, right?
00:18:35.367 --> 00:18:39.778
They were very good at managing the office or, or doing smaller kind of management things.
00:18:39.778 --> 00:18:44.698
But as the business has grown and the revenues have grown, and the org and accountability chart has grown.
00:18:45.238 --> 00:18:54.208
We have this person who has been there a while, but is probably most times not the right person to be running the true operations of the business.
00:18:55.000 --> 00:18:55.869
Well, and here's what I see.
00:18:55.869 --> 00:19:08.259
I see that there's a trusted relationship between a visionary and an integrator, but a visionary I had, I had this with a client, dental company, five offices, pretty sizable practice.
00:19:09.029 --> 00:19:10.799
Integrator is very much trusted.
00:19:11.739 --> 00:19:29.458
but didn't really have the strategic CHUs to gravitas to, and, and really was towards the tail end of their career and didn't really want to, change, I mean, put, put into place some of the changes that the business needed, so.
00:19:30.146 --> 00:19:35.508
the, uh, visionary really struggled with that for a period of time.
00:19:36.131 --> 00:19:36.480
Right.
00:19:36.993 --> 00:19:38.732
you know, we try and shine a light on that.
00:19:38.732 --> 00:19:45.573
Ultimately, it's, you know, it's always a visionaries company and, um, you know, they're gonna make the call.
00:19:45.698 --> 00:19:51.637
again, the integrator makes the day-to-day decisions, but, you know, the integrator works on the privilege of the visionary
00:19:51.902 --> 00:20:04.507
I, I agree with that, and I think that if there's one or a couple things I have issue with around EOS, one of them is that the visionary that the integrator gets this ability to make all these decisions and break all these ties, and as you said earlier.
00:20:05.231 --> 00:20:06.342
I'm a service provider.
00:20:06.372 --> 00:20:07.481
You're a service provider.
00:20:07.481 --> 00:20:18.102
At the end of the day, we're providing a service just like employees do for any employer, and we can do our absolute best to bring the proverbial horse to water and hope that they drink.
00:20:18.402 --> 00:20:29.334
Um, and the best visionaries that I've worked with or that I've been associated with do genuinely care what their employees feel and how they, perceive them.
00:20:29.334 --> 00:20:32.094
But at the end of the day, it is their business and their decisions.
00:20:33.681 --> 00:20:34.181
Hundred percent.
00:20:34.528 --> 00:20:34.919
right.
00:20:35.999 --> 00:20:37.679
okay, a couple other things.
00:20:37.828 --> 00:20:51.586
Um, what do you think the one hardest thing that, or the hardest thing in your mind, um, when it comes to managing people, what do you think is the, is the hardest element towards managing a human in a business sense?
00:20:52.578 --> 00:20:54.933
Yeah, I mean, you mentioned RPRS, right?
00:20:54.933 --> 00:20:55.834
People, right seat.
00:20:55.834 --> 00:20:58.203
So it's really managing to that.
00:20:58.678 --> 00:21:01.077
Yeah, so accountability.
00:21:01.759 --> 00:21:02.118
right.
00:21:02.118 --> 00:21:04.459
Accountability is really what it boils down to.
00:21:04.519 --> 00:21:10.165
And, you know, many people on this call probably know aspects of this, or maybe they'll know it well.
00:21:10.730 --> 00:21:11.059
Right.
00:21:11.059 --> 00:21:17.928
Verse in managing of the core values, making sure someone truly is a core values fit and that the core values are right.
00:21:19.204 --> 00:21:27.288
it's kind of the, the assumption and that they're a fit and then, that they gw see the role and I think,
00:21:27.910 --> 00:21:28.752
Break that apart.
00:21:28.782 --> 00:21:31.782
I know what GWC is, but I always like to hear everyone's term.
00:21:32.088 --> 00:21:32.749
Yeah.
00:21:32.977 --> 00:21:35.047
so get it as a God-given talent.
00:21:35.886 --> 00:21:37.446
You're either good at it or you're not.
00:21:37.763 --> 00:21:39.054
I'll go to the C now.
00:21:39.054 --> 00:21:46.775
That's the education and experience, but then the w in the middle, the bullseye That's waking up every day with a fire in your belly to do it.
00:21:46.835 --> 00:22:01.074
I think we as leaders have a good sense about the w and I think we underestimate how important that is and we should lean more into that
00:22:01.787 --> 00:22:03.287
Into the wanted piece.
00:22:03.317 --> 00:22:03.497
The
00:22:03.578 --> 00:22:04.298
the wanted piece.
00:22:04.358 --> 00:22:04.598
Yeah.
00:22:04.598 --> 00:22:06.219
If we have someone who doesn't want it.
00:22:06.836 --> 00:22:11.192
I, I've never seen a w change from a No to a S ever.
00:22:11.500 --> 00:22:11.560
Yeah.
00:22:11.560 --> 00:22:12.010
I agree.
00:22:12.101 --> 00:22:12.671
I agree.
00:22:12.851 --> 00:22:17.141
I, I struggle a lot with the capacity piece, and I think you summed it up by saying.
00:22:17.740 --> 00:22:33.641
Education and experience is the C because what's really interesting in my scenario earlier where you have an office manager moved into the integrator role, they may get it, they may sure as hell want it, but they don't have the experience, um, and the education to do the role.
00:22:33.851 --> 00:22:38.500
And that's a really hard thing to look at when you've got someone who wants it.
00:22:38.965 --> 00:22:40.105
Really want it.
00:22:40.105 --> 00:22:40.346
Right?
00:22:40.346 --> 00:22:43.826
They really do, and they just don't have the capacity.
00:22:43.885 --> 00:22:47.859
And I, I find that is the, right person for the organization.
00:22:47.859 --> 00:22:49.029
They're just in the wrong seat.
00:22:49.359 --> 00:22:55.630
And most visionaries I come across will find a seat for that person because they want it and they get it.
00:22:56.192 --> 00:22:56.582
Yeah.
00:22:57.192 --> 00:22:59.442
It's a race at that point, right?
00:22:59.442 --> 00:23:01.811
It's like how quickly can this person learn it?
00:23:02.382 --> 00:23:04.991
to meet the visionary's needs.
00:23:04.991 --> 00:23:13.461
And it can happen and people can elevate themselves, but it just depends on the visionary, what he or she needs.
00:23:13.461 --> 00:23:17.238
And it's, it's definitely not a slam dunk, but it can happen.
00:23:17.238 --> 00:23:18.167
I've seen it happen.
00:23:19.061 --> 00:23:19.352
Sure.
00:23:19.856 --> 00:23:26.835
As well as, as well as I have too, So what, let, let me, let's go into tools for a couple minutes.
00:23:26.894 --> 00:23:32.984
Tell me your, uh, and you might be thinking about your, your last session or your up next upcoming session, right?
00:23:32.984 --> 00:23:34.664
You probably finished one at some point.
00:23:34.664 --> 00:23:36.045
I know you have one coming up.
00:23:36.795 --> 00:23:40.964
You're having conversations with that leadership team as preparing for this session.
00:23:41.461 --> 00:23:51.009
what are the, the, the next tool you're going to talk about, or the last one you talked about that, you know, give you the reason why you're gonna bring that tool up during the session?
00:23:53.104 --> 00:23:55.320
after every session I take notes.
00:23:56.099 --> 00:24:01.559
anticipating what they mo might need in the next session based on the results from the prior one.
00:24:01.617 --> 00:24:02.038
Mm-hmm.
00:24:02.707 --> 00:24:13.711
I did an annual last week, a two day annual, and, like I always do, we talk about, five dysfunctions of a team and Patrick Lencioni and Team Health.
00:24:15.241 --> 00:24:17.311
So that was super strong.
00:24:17.311 --> 00:24:19.922
they're pretty strong on scorecard and cash.
00:24:19.922 --> 00:24:26.682
The next tool, that's, um, slated to teach them as and, and, and the schedule is cash.
00:24:26.682 --> 00:24:34.771
So I'll be ready to, uh, teach them the five, know, the, the, the, the, eight cashflow drivers, I guess however many there are, right?
00:24:36.342 --> 00:24:45.071
but We may show up that day and they may need something different from me and from EOS, so we'll, we'll give them, give them what they need,
00:24:45.381 --> 00:24:46.070
That's awesome.
00:24:46.101 --> 00:24:58.820
Yeah, no, there's many times I've gone into a session and thought, um, this, Hey, talking to the implementer, Hey, we really need, to focus on this and this, and then someone drops a, a bombshell during the, during something and they're like, err, time out.
00:24:58.820 --> 00:25:00.381
We actually need to pivot to something else.
00:25:00.381 --> 00:25:06.290
We actually just did the eight cash drivers at cashflow drivers in one of the last session, last quarterlies I had.
00:25:06.605 --> 00:25:10.326
With a, another implementer down here in Texas, and it was fascinating.
00:25:10.326 --> 00:25:23.615
I hadn't been through it in a while or maybe didn't remember it with the last time, but it was really, really impactful to go through the cash flow drivers because, um, it's very easy, I think, for me to just see that as not an issue.
00:25:23.895 --> 00:25:28.477
if you're not having cash flow issues, it's not an issue, but it's only till it's an issue that you're like.
00:25:29.017 --> 00:25:29.797
Oh shit.
00:25:29.797 --> 00:25:33.547
If I would've just done this six months ago, we wouldn't be here.
00:25:33.547 --> 00:25:35.136
But now you're forced to scramble.
00:25:35.136 --> 00:25:37.686
So I think that's a really interesting one that you brought up.
00:25:37.747 --> 00:25:44.174
Um, and do you find it harder to bring those, sometimes bring those, those correlations to each different industry?
00:25:44.234 --> 00:25:52.095
I mean, are each different team, I mean, mapping the cash flow drivers for each unique business must be a little bit of a challenge at times.
00:25:52.767 --> 00:25:54.172
Yeah, they're, they're different.
00:25:54.172 --> 00:26:00.291
I mean, we try not to be consultants and try to have our teams come up with that.
00:26:00.353 --> 00:26:12.083
you know, the level of financial acumen varies among my teams, so, uh, sometimes we need to work harder than others, but most of the time they can, uh, they can pull some, some, some good ones out.
00:26:12.083 --> 00:26:12.143
Yeah.
00:26:12.815 --> 00:26:18.227
How hard is it for you to, uh, to sit through sessions and not give answers?
00:26:19.338 --> 00:26:20.446
it can be hard.
00:26:20.866 --> 00:26:22.277
It can, it can be hard.
00:26:23.045 --> 00:26:27.452
now I will say that I share expertise if I've had it.
00:26:27.452 --> 00:26:33.482
Like, if I have a team that's done something with E OS that I think could benefit this team, I will share it.
00:26:34.262 --> 00:26:36.663
But I'm never gonna tell them, you need to do this.
00:26:36.692 --> 00:26:38.103
I just kind of add.
00:26:38.998 --> 00:26:42.268
To what I like to call, uh, the pool of shared meaning, Right.
00:26:42.268 --> 00:26:44.008
You're your id, you're discussing an issue.
00:26:44.008 --> 00:26:46.798
You're on the D of IDS, you're discussing it.
00:26:47.248 --> 00:26:51.087
If I have something I could put into that pool of information, I will do that.
00:26:51.701 --> 00:26:52.152
Yeah.
00:26:52.211 --> 00:26:52.961
No, that's great.
00:26:52.962 --> 00:27:07.982
and that of all things, I think in the sessions that I've been in as a fractional integrator, sitting next to the visionary being led through a session with a an EOS, implementer, I've been relieved at times when the answer's not given.
00:27:08.042 --> 00:27:19.502
I've also been frustrated when I look in the eyes of that implementer and I go, first of all, I know you outside of this session room and I know you know the answer, and we're kind of like swimming through the muck.
00:27:19.593 --> 00:27:22.353
You sometimes just want the answer, but your point is valid.
00:27:22.353 --> 00:27:30.063
The teams need to come to the table with the, with the acumen or interest to, to solve, and sometimes when they're not there, you gotta nudge'em a little bit.
00:27:30.794 --> 00:27:31.013
Yeah.
00:27:31.463 --> 00:27:32.753
And I know Jim, and I'm not there.
00:27:32.814 --> 00:27:34.253
It's not a torture chamber, right?
00:27:34.314 --> 00:27:42.503
Like, like we we're there to help'em along and, uh, ultimately get to what they need or, uh, give'em some to-dos to go out and find it.
00:27:43.262 --> 00:27:43.742
Yep.
00:27:44.222 --> 00:27:51.752
uh, anything unique in your sessions that you bring or that you like to think you do differently or bring that secret sauce?
00:27:51.752 --> 00:27:59.192
The Adam Kaplan Magic that people always say, Hey, it was really great that you did X, Y, or Z, or, I really like the way you do
00:28:00.615 --> 00:28:02.086
I love leading IDFs.
00:28:02.086 --> 00:28:11.603
I mean, um, I love pushing my teams to get to the solve faster and better, and, to figure out what's holding them back.
00:28:12.353 --> 00:28:16.641
write some of those issues up on the board, if they're stuck.
00:28:17.451 --> 00:28:24.371
what are a couple of options and just really try and help them and, uh, push them through compartmentalize.
00:28:24.371 --> 00:28:28.000
Well push it down to the ops team.
00:28:28.000 --> 00:28:30.191
Like, is this something we really need to spend our time on?
00:28:30.191 --> 00:28:33.851
Do we have the most knowledge in this room, or is the most knowledge in ops?
00:28:33.851 --> 00:28:34.931
Then why are we doing it?
00:28:35.433 --> 00:28:35.854
That's right.
00:28:35.861 --> 00:28:36.580
Let them do it.
00:28:37.084 --> 00:28:37.624
That's right.
00:28:37.894 --> 00:28:44.074
Well, let me ask you a question'cause you used the term IDS and I think it's for those of us who are not, those of you who are not familiar.
00:28:44.450 --> 00:28:48.440
IDS is a, is a identified define and solve problems.
00:28:48.920 --> 00:28:53.299
So I ask, I wanna ask you a question, Adam, because I think, discuss, define however you wanna look at it.
00:28:53.989 --> 00:29:07.363
how do you suggest companies running on e os list out what the issue is that we're trying to solve is there, do you have a format, do you have a specific way that you say, every time we do this or.
00:29:08.440 --> 00:29:30.662
Yeah, I don't have an every time, I mean, we say like three to five words, so I try to model it literally, you know, if it's uh, if it's an issue with, Hey, we need to hire more salespeople, I'll just write hire sales, you know, or, You know, if, ops isn't getting the product out the door, I just put on product shipping, right?
00:29:30.662 --> 00:29:33.662
We don't have to have all the description and all the details.
00:29:33.811 --> 00:29:39.257
If it's truly an issue, the person whose issue, it is is gonna be able to tee it up.
00:29:39.257 --> 00:29:42.467
And if they can't, then let's dig in.
00:29:42.467 --> 00:29:44.521
I mean, that's not the real issue.
00:29:44.521 --> 00:29:45.662
That's not the root.
00:29:46.432 --> 00:29:49.103
maybe it's a symptom.
00:29:50.012 --> 00:29:56.461
uh, the main thing is put it up there in a couple of words, know who owns it, and then go from there.
00:29:56.550 --> 00:29:57.421
Keep practicing.
00:29:58.104 --> 00:30:12.624
And then a question I get asked all the time as a fractional integrator is'cause they look at me as the the local EOS resident in the room, which I tend to be when we don't completely solve an issue because we've assigned to-dos that need to be done.
00:30:13.209 --> 00:30:14.828
To then solve the issue.
00:30:15.669 --> 00:30:23.709
Does that issue get removed from the IDS or does it get left in the IDS section for to-dos to come back so that we can solve?
00:30:24.280 --> 00:30:26.260
I mean, technically it should go away.
00:30:26.590 --> 00:30:32.347
And then the to-do, um, once we finish the, to-do, if.
00:30:33.153 --> 00:30:37.502
That issue comes back or, or whenever it comes back, we just put it back up there.
00:30:37.502 --> 00:30:54.078
Otherwise, you know, we're just kind of carrying, all these issues and it becomes just kind of a laundry list of just stuff that we've talked about and stuff that we've done instead of the most important problems, obstacles, opportunities that we have in the business.
00:30:54.807 --> 00:30:58.317
Yeah, I think it's a good, a good rule of thumb to do that.
00:30:58.346 --> 00:31:06.171
I've found that, and I have a little, you know, maybe it's not pure, but I have a rule that's, you know, we're not gonna have the same issue, three weeks in a row.
00:31:06.260 --> 00:31:07.131
We're just not gonna do it.
00:31:07.221 --> 00:31:15.201
Now if, if it's a big hairy one, then maybe we need to take it back or move it to long-term issues and come up with a dark quarterly, but we're not gonna see the same issue for every week.
00:31:15.371 --> 00:31:19.601
And if it needs, Adam needs to go solve something, then let's go solve something.
00:31:19.871 --> 00:31:26.980
And I think that's the beauty of having a fractional integrator in the room, is that they can say to you, Hey Adam, I saw that that was there last week.
00:31:27.010 --> 00:31:28.691
You needed three things to get done.
00:31:29.141 --> 00:31:30.580
Did you get those three things done?
00:31:30.580 --> 00:31:37.421
Because we're gonna have an L 10 coming up in four business days, and I don't want to, I don't want you to have egg on your face.
00:31:37.510 --> 00:31:37.750
You know?
00:31:37.750 --> 00:31:41.111
I want you to get this moving forward and I don't wanna see this issue again.
00:31:41.381 --> 00:31:42.431
So I use it.
00:31:42.861 --> 00:31:43.760
Maybe it's not pure.
00:31:43.760 --> 00:31:49.371
I use it as another form of accountability that says we do have to-dos associated, we gotta get those done.
00:31:49.671 --> 00:31:52.611
And it's still an issue on the issues list with your name next to it.
00:31:54.720 --> 00:31:57.964
if it works for you and works for your teams, keep doing it.
00:31:58.623 --> 00:31:59.823
I love your flexibility.
00:31:59.823 --> 00:32:02.853
I do get some people that are like, no, no, that's not what the book says.
00:32:02.883 --> 00:32:07.623
It's like, I know the book says that, but we need to do what's best for, for everyone involved.
00:32:07.623 --> 00:32:10.914
And sometimes, uh, you know, scratching an issue off.
00:32:11.410 --> 00:32:18.460
And, and I guess technically maybe you come back and do a headline or do something that says, you know, Hey, this is, we got resolution on it.
00:32:18.460 --> 00:32:19.180
Just FYI.
00:32:19.180 --> 00:32:21.910
But I do find that people want that closure.
00:32:22.029 --> 00:32:26.440
They want that closure in the leadership team meeting to know that that issue was removed and resolved.
00:32:26.710 --> 00:32:29.121
So, well one more question.
00:32:29.361 --> 00:32:35.181
Tell me what you do outside of, of, uh, outside of work other than collect baseball cards, which you're gonna get back into.
00:32:36.522 --> 00:32:42.103
Yeah, so, um, I'm a big family guy, so like, love spending time with my family, man of faith.
00:32:42.133 --> 00:32:42.883
Um,
00:32:42.891 --> 00:32:43.280
it.
00:32:43.961 --> 00:32:44.830
proud Jew.
00:32:44.830 --> 00:32:44.891
Um,
00:32:45.319 --> 00:32:46.130
There you go.
00:32:46.190 --> 00:32:46.400
Love
00:32:46.480 --> 00:32:47.951
I'm very involved in the community.
00:32:47.951 --> 00:32:50.980
I'm actually, uh, currently the president of my synagogue.
00:32:51.340 --> 00:32:54.101
Probably the craziest job I ever took.
00:32:54.656 --> 00:32:56.381
hardest job I ever took.
00:32:56.569 --> 00:32:57.559
A hundred percent.
00:32:57.619 --> 00:32:59.329
You can't fire any of those people.
00:32:59.390 --> 00:33:03.005
Well, maybe you could fire some of'em, but you can't find the people that fire, the people that put you there.
00:33:03.851 --> 00:33:04.840
No, I can't.
00:33:04.901 --> 00:33:05.681
No, I can't.
00:33:05.740 --> 00:33:08.621
Um, so that's, that's, that's an awesome learning experience.
00:33:08.621 --> 00:33:11.171
Now I like to work out, travel, read,
00:33:12.083 --> 00:33:16.913
Alright, last place you, I'll let you go after this last place you've traveled and the next place you're going.
00:33:17.788 --> 00:33:25.558
Okay, so my last big trip, well, well, I mean last, technically last place I traveled was, was Montana, which was great.
00:33:25.558 --> 00:33:28.949
First time in Montana, Wyoming, very beautiful.
00:33:28.949 --> 00:33:31.798
Highly recommend, um, you'll never see a blue or sky.
00:33:32.563 --> 00:33:35.118
it's, there's fun in the sun for everybody.
00:33:35.118 --> 00:33:38.028
All season, all season long, every season.
00:33:38.719 --> 00:33:41.269
Um, but biggest, biggest trip was Japan.
00:33:41.413 --> 00:33:44.777
once in a lifetime, uh, or at least, a bucket list item.
00:33:44.777 --> 00:33:45.646
Hope to go back.
00:33:46.396 --> 00:33:47.788
Uh, real wonderful place.
00:33:49.544 --> 00:33:56.354
Um, a next big family trip, uh, is Israel actually for my dad's, uh, 90th birthday, please.
00:33:56.354 --> 00:33:56.713
God.
00:33:56.713 --> 00:33:59.114
He should be, uh, should be well.
00:33:59.114 --> 00:34:00.584
And then, uh, we're gonna give him his
00:34:00.701 --> 00:34:01.511
amazing.
00:34:01.574 --> 00:34:01.903
Yeah.
00:34:02.021 --> 00:34:02.501
going?
00:34:03.134 --> 00:34:03.884
in December,
00:34:04.271 --> 00:34:05.082
Okay, wonderful.
00:34:05.082 --> 00:34:06.102
And where are you going?
00:34:07.364 --> 00:34:08.983
Uh, we're gonna be all over.
00:34:09.914 --> 00:34:10.483
Really?
00:34:10.514 --> 00:34:11.653
Mostly in the central.
00:34:11.713 --> 00:34:13.423
Yeah, mostly in the central area.
00:34:13.454 --> 00:34:16.273
Tel Aviv, probably not the negative.
00:34:16.572 --> 00:34:17.291
The Negev?
00:34:17.291 --> 00:34:20.291
We, we did a star watching night at the Negev.
00:34:20.472 --> 00:34:23.257
You talk about the bluest skies in the Montana and Wyoming.
00:34:23.981 --> 00:34:43.032
The darkest, most gorgeous place was in the crater, in the bottom of the Negev with my family laid out on these cushions and we're staring up at this jet black sky, and we had a stargazing guy come in with a green light and he was telling us all about the constellations and we're in the beautiful, like there wasn't a noise.
00:34:43.032 --> 00:34:43.931
There wasn't a light.
00:34:44.291 --> 00:34:45.581
It was very magical.
00:34:45.581 --> 00:34:46.512
I'll never forget it.
00:34:47.898 --> 00:34:48.079
That
00:34:48.297 --> 00:34:56.336
Um, well enjoy Tel Aviv and, uh, the, the, the Caramel market at Food Tour and Tel Aviv is what I recommend.
00:34:56.786 --> 00:34:58.556
Go, go tour the market.
00:34:58.586 --> 00:35:03.324
Your dad can take a place and you guys can bring him different food and it, it's so special.
00:35:03.414 --> 00:35:07.644
So anyway, Adam, thank you so much for joining me today on the Scalability Code.
00:35:07.644 --> 00:35:09.054
I really enjoyed our conversation.
00:35:09.355 --> 00:35:10.974
Thanks for sharing your wisdom.
00:35:11.244 --> 00:35:14.875
Um, and we look forward to potentially having you back in the future.
00:35:15.347 --> 00:35:16.126
Thanks Matt.
00:35:16.126 --> 00:35:16.666
It was fun.
00:35:16.666 --> 00:35:17.686
Appreciate you having me.
00:35:18.204 --> 00:35:18.655
Awesome.
00:35:18.655 --> 00:35:19.824
Well, take care sir.
00:35:20.146 --> 00:35:21.047
You too.
00:35:21.302 --> 00:35:23.373
Thank you for listening to The Scalability Code.
00:35:23.402 --> 00:35:28.893
If you made it this far, please follow the show on Apple, Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:35:28.996 --> 00:35:30.737
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00:35:30.766 --> 00:35:33.226
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