Ep. 03: Remote Work, Connection & The Culture We're Losing

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Tell me what was your favorite part of today's episode?
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When Will, off camera, taught us about a new version of extrovert introvert in the middle area.
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Yeah, what about you?
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I always hold a talk about Hannah Montana.
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Oh!
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I liked Adrienne's wings.
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Oh! Adrienne?
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I like to say I'm gonna say whatever was on my mind and not get judged for it.
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Oh yeah!
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Um, I think mine was, sorry mom, I told you to get off your ass, but I really meant it.
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Have you ever been in a store and you're like talking to people, this is the thing I
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wrote in my family where it's like, we strike up conversation with strangers.
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And then I felt like, well now I've got to buy something, like I'm too invested with
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this store person.
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They're going out of business, they're losing their jobs, I don't know.
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You feel like you're supporting him at that point?
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Yeah, it was a charity case.
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All right, you want to start?
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I'm going to try out a new intro, let's see how this goes.
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Let's go crazy.
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Ready?
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This is age.
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The podcast where we talk for a long time about something we randomly pull out of a trash
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hand.
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But what is it really?
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We're all in a culture where we're aging much slower than the culture around us is aging.
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And some of us feel like we're just arriving?
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No, sorry.
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Let's do it again.
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You're just arriving.
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Ready?
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I think we can pull that in.
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No, this is age.
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The podcast where we have an incredibly long conversation about something we randomly
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pull out of a trash can.
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But what is it really?
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We're in a culture where we're aging much slower than everything around us.
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Some of us feel like we're ahead of our time.
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Some of us feel like we're aging out.
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Others of us feel, how do you feel, Adrian?
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How do I'm swimming in a sea of multi-age people and I'm like, what land am I in?
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Right.
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The fast lane.
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The floating.
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Yes.
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And then others of us feel like we're just arriving.
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I'm just here.
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I just got here.
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So age is a weekly experiment we do to discuss the meaning of it all.
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Through randomness, through casual improv and through just live conversation.
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So we invite you into this experience that you definitely don't have time for.
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Welcome to age.
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Let's pull the topic out of the beach.
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I'm so glad you finally figured out what this podcast is about.
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I love that it was going to work.
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I'm excited to go.
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But I told you.
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Can I tell you an improv moment?
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Since you said improv.
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Yeah.
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We were at the zoo yesterday, day before.
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You're welcome.
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We're watching some chimpanzees and we've been at the zoo for a while.
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It's raining so the animals are really active and it's best to do experience in my life.
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And we're watching the chimps and Alex goes, wow, and then we're with this other friend
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Rebecca and she goes, wow, and they just keep going, wow, like on accident.
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And this little like six-year-old girl walks up to them and goes, stop saying wow.
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And they're like, Alex is like really comfortable with kids.
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He's like, you're not saying wow right now?
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This is so wow.
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She's like, it's like, stop saying wow.
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I have a gun.
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Whoa.
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She don't really have a gun.
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Wow.
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She holds her hands up like this.
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I don't forget what they said next.
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You said, I'm the police.
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If I wasn't a commentary on you culture, I was like scared at the same time, but also that
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she like went on this whole thing.
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She's like, you're a gorilla.
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Oh my.
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It's amazing.
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So anyway, you said it.
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I love that.
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I was like, get her off stage yesterday.
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I mean, it's terrifying.
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This topic is oddly applicable being that our fourth is remote.
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Oh.
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Remote is the topic.
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Oh god.
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It's already hard to go through a moment with remote.
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Oh man.
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That's true.
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That's true.
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So like, that's the first thing that just pops in your mind when you hear the topic.
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I have trauma from high school when COVID shut down.
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Oh.
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They were like.
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It's about about that one too.
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We're going remote.
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Oh.
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And I, me and one of my friends, when we found out spring break, we were like, what are
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those spring break for like three weeks?
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Yeah.
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My family had a place down in St. Augustine, so we're like, we're going to go remote.
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We're watching like the NC, like, education guy and he's like, yeah, no, we're going back
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to school.
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We're making plans for like next year for you guys to be remote.
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And I was like, this is going to suck.
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Oh god.
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It did suck.
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I didn't learn anything my senior year by the way.
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So it sucked.
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But that is my first.
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It's funny.
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It's been made as big of an impression on me, obviously, because I wasn't in school.
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But it just wrecked.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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Who were the generation that I was thinking of when it happened?
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I was like, cock.
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That's right.
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That's right.
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That's right.
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That's right.
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Yeah.
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That's right.
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Yeah.
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And they would do it remotely and I was like, this suck.
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Yeah.
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Not the same.
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No.
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Not the same.
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I was still burned out in the zoom.
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I remember.
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Yeah.
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So I had to go through this.
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Oh, it's okay.
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I'm learning.
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I'm learning.
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Did you, um, we want to dwell on it?
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I could follow you.
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But did you like have all the tech and stuff that you needed?
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No.
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Our school was thankfully enough to be like sponsored by Apple at the time.
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So we all got our iPads to go home.
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So that was interesting.
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I live in the middle of nowhere and we just got Wi-Fi at my parents house two years ago.
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That was a thing.
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The Dow County was like, most of the kids didn't have, it's like cell phones were the way
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that they used to be.
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Is that how they could remotely?
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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It was really like nobody, nobody knew what they were doing.
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It would have been easier transition like if we lived in somewhere like a metro city area
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or living in the middle of nowhere.
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So I remember a former colleague of ours and I were talking about, um, yeah, let's switch
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to our note.
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And the idea of like Wi-Fi deserts, it's like a food desert, you know, like you can live
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with people but you might not have the resources that you need.
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You might not be able to afford internet for whatever reason or they haven't run the line
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out to your house.
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And like that was a foreign concept to this person who had been raised in, not America.
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I'm sorry, I'm just like dropping into the Adrian.
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And yeah, I had then lived in New York City for the rest of their lives.
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Yeah.
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Like, oh yeah, there's definitely places that aren't there yet.
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My, I guess.
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Speaking of Adrian, I wanted to teach you real quick.
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Sure.
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Oh, please.
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I did, I did point at her.
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It's a victory person.
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Right.
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So Reggie's out on vacation with his family.
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Hope you have fun Reggie.
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Yeah.
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We brought in a really good friend and colleague, Adrian.
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Well, this is actually perfect segue from remote because I am here in Asheville because of
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remote working.
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That's what brought me here.
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But I'm Adrian, you can, I run a little brandy agency called East 12 Studio.
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We specialize in CPG food and beverage for pets and people, consumer package, consumer
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package.
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You put that over there to pitch you down.
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Oh, she knows.
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I've been trying for a while.
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To people.
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She's got it.
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Yeah, it's incredible.
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But yeah, I met, well, can I give this?
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Oh, okay.
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Adrian, I worked together previously in a different location and I met these lovely folks here
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because my job went remote and I got to move from New York City, which I never thought
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I'd be able to do.
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I always thought, like, oh, if I'm going to have a job, I have to be in some metro area.
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Right.
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And then remote work happened and I was like, it took me like a few years.
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But then I was like, wait a minute.
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Everyone else is working remotely.
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I could do it.
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So you were staying, you just stayed there for a while and then?
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Yeah, I stayed there for like almost all of the pandemic and then I was like.
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The worst place to be during the pandemic.
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Yeah, it was pretty awful.
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It was like locked down for three years.
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But after I got through the trauma of that, my brain would be able to open up and I was
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like, hey, I could live anywhere.
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And you came to Nashville, North Carolina.
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Yeah.
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Long story short.
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You had some family ties here.
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I had family here.
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So I'd been here before.
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But then the pandemic, like, my partner, we started traveling down here, staying a little
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bit longer than our last trip.
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We were like, let's not go back.
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Let's see if we can stay.
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And then Adrienne and I, we had worked together remotely and we would like see each other
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on Zoom all the time.
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And every so often, you would be in town and maybe we would be able to cross paths and
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maybe we wouldn't.
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But then one day, I'm working in the center for craft.
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And like, they've got this center.
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Like, if you have a desk month to month, you, I call it the fish bowl area.
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And I look over and I'm like, who is that working in the back corner?
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And I think I like pop my head on the other side.
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My hair was very different.
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I think the last time you would see me, oh, thank you.
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We've been on that journey.
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She can't tell herself.
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Can you?
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I can't tell you things like that too.
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Maybe.
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I want a secret.
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People need to know.
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It looks great.
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It's a thank you very much.
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I'm particularly glad, Adrian, is here.
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And I think that when Reggie was going to go on vacation, we debated, should we just cancel
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this week?
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And I was like, oh, we just figured out how to do this thing.
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The third one.
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We're going to forget how to ride this bike if we get off of it right now.
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And also, I was like, we just got so many incredible people in our orbit.
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And I think you're the first.
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So all right, we were like the first person to touch the mic.
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I'm sorry.
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I'm sorry.
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I'm a chair.
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But yeah, I just can't say, I will not be too effusive, I'll try, but like Adrian, I've
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done, I've written a couple of peer reviews for Adrian at a previous life.
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That does were anonymous.
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Now you know.
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Now you're going to take credit.
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But I think the thing that always popped out to me about Adrian and the thing that I
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still, I bring you up more than I'm proud to say in the office.
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But like Adrian.
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But it's so sweet.
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Stop.
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00:09:51.320 --> 00:09:52.320
Don't stop.
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Keep going.
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She is an incredible creative, I mean, obviously like a guru in the packaging world, which
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is such like a dense design assignment, I think.
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But the thing that really struck me and made Adrian special in my mind was she is probably
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the most impressive person I've ever met in terms of like crossing mid-brain and being
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like, I can use my creative, la, la, la, brain and also you could like, keep the ship
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a explode and like, steering in the right direction.
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Not to find all the money.
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And like, let's ask a few clarifying questions before I like throw some shit at the wall
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and hope that it, you know, looks fine and it made you like an incredible advocate for
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or I think creatives who came to work underneath you and she develops talent in a really
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beautiful way.
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So I'm very, you're a really good get for this episode.
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We're so happy to have you on.
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Yeah.
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You guys, thank you.
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I'm trying to like not touch my mic and also be emoted and I'm also very like a person
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with my hands.
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Now I probably like very awkward.
283
00:11:00.080 --> 00:11:01.080
I'm like, thank you.
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You want to put your heart, but I think I can't do that.
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Thank you.
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00:11:06.080 --> 00:11:07.400
We won't do any more of that.
287
00:11:07.400 --> 00:11:08.400
And now it's over.
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00:11:08.400 --> 00:11:10.000
And now it's over back to the topic.
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00:11:10.000 --> 00:11:11.000
Yes.
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00:11:11.000 --> 00:11:12.000
So remote.
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00:11:12.000 --> 00:11:13.320
So remote brought us here today.
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What a gift.
293
00:11:14.320 --> 00:11:16.320
But I didn't think about the same.
294
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I guess it's my age.
295
00:11:17.320 --> 00:11:18.320
Yeah.
296
00:11:18.320 --> 00:11:19.320
I have.
297
00:11:19.320 --> 00:11:20.320
Yeah.
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00:11:20.320 --> 00:11:23.960
I have this, this sound system that Reggie gave me to set up and it comes with its own
299
00:11:23.960 --> 00:11:24.960
old remote.
300
00:11:24.960 --> 00:11:25.960
Oh.
301
00:11:25.960 --> 00:11:26.960
And now, yeah, it's old.
302
00:11:26.960 --> 00:11:30.440
Like it looks like an old, I mean, it may not be that old, but it looks ancient compared
303
00:11:30.440 --> 00:11:32.640
to the little Apple remote that sits next to it.
304
00:11:32.640 --> 00:11:34.560
And then it also have my Sony Abrovia remote.
305
00:11:34.560 --> 00:11:36.160
So they're all sitting there.
306
00:11:36.160 --> 00:11:39.080
And it's annoying because I have to get up from the couch and I have to grab the remote
307
00:11:39.080 --> 00:11:40.080
and go through it.
308
00:11:40.080 --> 00:11:41.080
Which one is it?
309
00:11:41.080 --> 00:11:42.080
Yeah.
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00:11:42.080 --> 00:11:44.360
Turn this one up and that one on and push the right button.
311
00:11:44.360 --> 00:11:46.360
So that's what I thought of.
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00:11:46.360 --> 00:11:50.240
I, you know, I figured out a beat later that that's what it was.
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00:11:50.240 --> 00:11:55.560
I also the first thing in my mind is this little remote control remote remote.
314
00:11:55.560 --> 00:11:59.640
So I don't know what that means about us living in this like analog world.
315
00:11:59.640 --> 00:12:00.640
What does that mean?
316
00:12:00.640 --> 00:12:02.560
You know that there's like an age gap.
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00:12:02.560 --> 00:12:06.600
You're experiencing, you know, like school being all remote and I'm experiencing like watching
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00:12:06.600 --> 00:12:07.600
TV.
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00:12:07.600 --> 00:12:13.920
I wonder what that word, you know, like when words exist over time, they change and they
320
00:12:13.920 --> 00:12:14.920
mean something different.
321
00:12:14.920 --> 00:12:18.400
And my son's always telling me random words that I didn't know the words and they may
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00:12:18.400 --> 00:12:19.400
not be yet.
323
00:12:19.400 --> 00:12:20.400
They may just be.
324
00:12:20.400 --> 00:12:22.600
You know what I want to share an example?
325
00:12:22.600 --> 00:12:27.480
You know, like, well, I think all of them are letters actually like, we're shortening.
326
00:12:27.480 --> 00:12:28.480
Shortening.
327
00:12:28.480 --> 00:12:29.480
Yeah.
328
00:12:29.480 --> 00:12:30.480
Yeah.
329
00:12:30.480 --> 00:12:31.480
Right.
330
00:12:31.480 --> 00:12:38.480
It's, it's like reddit or not reddit, um, discord, um, yeah, yeah, yeah, so it's all
331
00:12:38.480 --> 00:12:39.480
acronyms and stuff.
332
00:12:39.480 --> 00:12:40.480
Right acronyms.
333
00:12:40.480 --> 00:12:46.960
And these other words, and my mind blank, I wish I, you're going to have to educate and
334
00:12:46.960 --> 00:12:47.960
better.
335
00:12:47.960 --> 00:12:51.360
Maybe I can ask him and then I'll put him in the description because they're, they're
336
00:12:51.360 --> 00:12:52.360
good.
337
00:12:52.360 --> 00:12:55.200
Oh, if we need to bleep your son's name, we can do that.
338
00:12:55.200 --> 00:12:57.200
So that was probably not kosher.
339
00:12:57.200 --> 00:13:01.800
I asked when they came into the office the other day, I was like, I'm like, your generation,
340
00:13:01.800 --> 00:13:02.800
are you going to watch the podcast?
341
00:13:02.800 --> 00:13:03.800
And he's like, no.
342
00:13:03.800 --> 00:13:04.800
Absolutely.
343
00:13:04.800 --> 00:13:05.800
He said no.
344
00:13:05.800 --> 00:13:06.800
So he was like, no.
345
00:13:06.800 --> 00:13:07.800
Not for you, not for my dad.
346
00:13:07.800 --> 00:13:08.800
Hard though.
347
00:13:08.800 --> 00:13:09.800
Yeah.
348
00:13:09.800 --> 00:13:10.800
Hard though.
349
00:13:10.800 --> 00:13:11.800
Who really will watch?
350
00:13:11.800 --> 00:13:12.800
I mean, there's so many buyers.
351
00:13:12.800 --> 00:13:14.800
You know, like, these are the questions.
352
00:13:14.800 --> 00:13:15.800
My son is so honest.
353
00:13:15.800 --> 00:13:17.800
I was trying to pitch it to Adrian.
354
00:13:17.800 --> 00:13:18.800
I was trying to.
355
00:13:18.800 --> 00:13:19.800
It's a little bit.
356
00:13:19.800 --> 00:13:20.800
Yeah.
357
00:13:21.400 --> 00:13:22.400
Yeah.
358
00:13:22.400 --> 00:13:28.600
But just before we go on, will, would you mind to grab a glass of water because we didn't
359
00:13:28.600 --> 00:13:30.400
offer one to Adrian earlier?
360
00:13:30.400 --> 00:13:33.000
There's clubs in the kitchen.
361
00:13:33.000 --> 00:13:36.000
You can just pick one out of the cabinet in the kitchen.
362
00:13:36.000 --> 00:13:37.800
I just realized, Tim's over here drinking.
363
00:13:37.800 --> 00:13:38.600
I'm over here drinking.
364
00:13:38.600 --> 00:13:40.600
You know you can drink whenever you want and we never offer them.
365
00:13:40.600 --> 00:13:41.600
Oh, I'm like a dog.
366
00:13:41.600 --> 00:13:43.600
We're saying you can watch the water bowl.
367
00:13:43.600 --> 00:13:45.600
You can drink whatever you want.
368
00:13:45.600 --> 00:13:47.400
We'll bring the water bowl to you.
369
00:13:47.400 --> 00:13:48.400
Yes, studio.
370
00:13:49.400 --> 00:13:54.000
I thought, well, it wasn't the first thing I thought of when you said, but when I think
371
00:13:54.000 --> 00:13:57.800
of remote, yeah, there's like a lot of sadness in some ways about it.
372
00:13:57.800 --> 00:14:02.000
But the first job I had that let me work remote was at this really big agency.
373
00:14:02.000 --> 00:14:04.000
And my boss was based out of Boston.
374
00:14:04.000 --> 00:14:10.800
But they had a New York location that I like had the option to go into dream world
375
00:14:10.800 --> 00:14:13.400
where you can go in, but you don't have to go in.
376
00:14:13.400 --> 00:14:16.800
It's like a sexy office that's like really stocked and that kind of thing.
377
00:14:16.800 --> 00:14:21.600
But the whole time I was like, wow, there's something dreamy about this to me because
378
00:14:21.600 --> 00:14:22.600
like I could go.
379
00:14:22.600 --> 00:14:23.600
I talk about this all the time.
380
00:14:23.600 --> 00:14:27.200
I could go to Italy for a week and like technically if I'm willing to keep those hours,
381
00:14:27.200 --> 00:14:30.200
like it's not locationally based.
382
00:14:30.200 --> 00:14:31.200
Yeah.
383
00:14:31.200 --> 00:14:33.400
I think that's something that's always bothered me.
384
00:14:33.400 --> 00:14:34.400
Thank you.
385
00:14:34.400 --> 00:14:35.400
Sorry.
386
00:14:35.400 --> 00:14:36.400
Thank you.
387
00:14:36.400 --> 00:14:37.400
There you have it.
388
00:14:37.400 --> 00:14:39.400
We just kept knocking on to our chair.
389
00:14:39.400 --> 00:14:40.400
Okay.
390
00:14:40.400 --> 00:14:41.400
And you probably hit the chair on the way down.
391
00:14:41.400 --> 00:14:42.400
Yeah.
392
00:14:42.400 --> 00:14:43.400
And don't worry.
393
00:14:43.400 --> 00:14:44.400
We'll put it in the edit.
394
00:14:44.400 --> 00:14:45.400
Like everybody will love it.
395
00:14:45.400 --> 00:14:47.800
But I'm on the topic of remote.
396
00:14:47.800 --> 00:14:48.800
Real remote.
397
00:14:48.800 --> 00:14:49.800
Yeah.
398
00:14:49.800 --> 00:14:50.800
Now that we've got another we're here.
399
00:14:50.800 --> 00:14:51.800
Another current century.
400
00:14:51.800 --> 00:14:54.800
I'm going through a little bit of a remote renaissance.
401
00:14:54.800 --> 00:14:55.800
Wow.
402
00:14:55.800 --> 00:14:56.800
And it's due to you, Mary.
403
00:14:56.800 --> 00:15:00.640
I think that I've experienced and pushed against hard couriers remote.
404
00:15:00.640 --> 00:15:04.400
I hated my kids being remote because I feel like they got a whole jaded experience
405
00:15:04.400 --> 00:15:05.400
from that.
406
00:15:05.400 --> 00:15:06.400
Yeah.
407
00:15:06.400 --> 00:15:09.000
And I didn't want to go remote as a designer.
408
00:15:09.000 --> 00:15:11.720
I love working with people in real space and time.
409
00:15:11.720 --> 00:15:15.920
I don't like the tools largely until I'm at Mary.
410
00:15:15.920 --> 00:15:19.800
At 40 hearts, we're trying to create a virtual office, which I originally felt a little
411
00:15:19.800 --> 00:15:24.120
bit of a traumatic maybe tinged against.
412
00:15:24.120 --> 00:15:29.400
But now I'm seeing this potential, the ability to travel and move.
413
00:15:29.400 --> 00:15:33.680
When you set the tools up right, they're starting to feel better to me than they have
414
00:15:33.680 --> 00:15:34.680
in the past.
415
00:15:34.680 --> 00:15:39.360
But I think it's like the different paths of communication that to me feel heavy about
416
00:15:39.360 --> 00:15:40.360
being remote.
417
00:15:40.360 --> 00:15:46.240
And when I was watching my kids, there's like power school and there's this other app
418
00:15:46.240 --> 00:15:50.640
they're supposed to get on and do this and then there's the tech stack, that they didn't
419
00:15:50.640 --> 00:15:53.600
actually hold in their mind.
420
00:15:53.600 --> 00:15:56.320
So it's not like they're learning school stuff.
421
00:15:56.320 --> 00:16:01.200
They're actually learning how to use technology is really the learning and the happy technology
422
00:16:01.200 --> 00:16:04.240
because the government and schools get to it last.
423
00:16:04.240 --> 00:16:08.640
And it wasn't ever optimized for remote school when that happened.
424
00:16:08.640 --> 00:16:13.160
They optimize it along the way on the kids, on the fly.
425
00:16:13.160 --> 00:16:17.920
So teachers are just flying off the cuff, trying to do whatever they can to survive and
426
00:16:17.920 --> 00:16:19.680
keep things moving.
427
00:16:19.680 --> 00:16:25.240
And then kids are like playing Minecraft on the side, and it's just this circus happening.
428
00:16:25.240 --> 00:16:29.800
And so remote, and even before, I think remote was a thing before COVID hit, you know, people
429
00:16:29.800 --> 00:16:35.840
like talking about going remote and then whether or not corporate should inhibit that, whether
430
00:16:35.840 --> 00:16:37.440
they should require people to be in.
431
00:16:37.440 --> 00:16:40.800
Well, then there was like this expansion contraction thing that happened.
432
00:16:40.800 --> 00:16:42.000
It's going back, right?
433
00:16:42.000 --> 00:16:43.000
It's going back hard.
434
00:16:43.000 --> 00:16:44.000
Yeah.
435
00:16:44.000 --> 00:16:47.400
So I was talking to someone locally and they were talking about how they were remote from
436
00:16:47.400 --> 00:16:54.480
New York City, but the work started to dry up because he even got offered a really great
437
00:16:54.480 --> 00:16:59.720
job in the firm or the agency that wanted him to come back, so you have to be here at
438
00:16:59.720 --> 00:17:00.720
three days a week.
439
00:17:00.720 --> 00:17:01.720
Yeah.
440
00:17:01.720 --> 00:17:02.720
Yeah.
441
00:17:02.720 --> 00:17:03.720
He can travel as a kid.
442
00:17:04.520 --> 00:17:07.520
I wonder what it's starting to mean now.
443
00:17:07.520 --> 00:17:11.960
And why it's shifting, like we're a small agency and we're creating a virtual office so
444
00:17:11.960 --> 00:17:16.520
we can do it more, but other agencies, I think, I don't know if it's a productivity thing.
445
00:17:16.520 --> 00:17:17.520
That's so many ideas.
446
00:17:17.520 --> 00:17:18.520
I've so many thoughts.
447
00:17:18.520 --> 00:17:19.520
Say it.
448
00:17:19.520 --> 00:17:21.760
I thought about this a lot.
449
00:17:21.760 --> 00:17:23.760
And maybe there are a little teeth.
450
00:17:23.760 --> 00:17:24.760
No, this is the talk.
451
00:17:24.760 --> 00:17:27.760
This is the part of the conversation we talk about what drives us crazy about it.
452
00:17:27.760 --> 00:17:33.120
I feel like in the more, I think it's agencies, but corporations, I hate to say this.
453
00:17:33.120 --> 00:17:37.920
I think the thing that rides a lot of it is real estate, and only because I've heard
454
00:17:37.920 --> 00:17:43.200
this from some business owners that have very expensive real estate that are locked into
455
00:17:43.200 --> 00:17:45.960
leafes and are like, we have to leave that.
456
00:17:45.960 --> 00:17:50.640
Well, I just did a $5 million renovation on this space and I'm locked into this lease
457
00:17:50.640 --> 00:17:52.640
for 10 years.
458
00:17:52.640 --> 00:17:53.640
It's kind of practical.
459
00:17:53.640 --> 00:17:55.880
I got to, I have to use it.
460
00:17:55.880 --> 00:17:56.880
Yeah.
461
00:17:56.880 --> 00:18:01.120
I think, but that's like very like business reason for it.
462
00:18:01.120 --> 00:18:08.800
I think the corporate folks, I've heard is that there's like this fear of, I think it's
463
00:18:08.800 --> 00:18:13.440
a real estate too, because they all usually own very expensive pieces of real estate are
464
00:18:13.440 --> 00:18:15.560
invested and bought property.
465
00:18:15.560 --> 00:18:20.160
But also, I think it's like, there's this fear that if I can't see the people working,
466
00:18:20.160 --> 00:18:21.160
they're not doing the work.
467
00:18:21.160 --> 00:18:22.160
Totally.
468
00:18:22.160 --> 00:18:23.160
This is like an old thing.
469
00:18:23.160 --> 00:18:25.800
I think this people have always felt this and I'm like, well, we just went through this
470
00:18:25.800 --> 00:18:28.680
whole period where no one was hearing all the businesses kept going.
471
00:18:28.680 --> 00:18:34.640
It's like this old philosophy of, if I can't see you doing, like, you know, what is
472
00:18:34.640 --> 00:18:37.520
nothing like a tree falls in the wood here?
473
00:18:37.520 --> 00:18:38.520
I hear it.
474
00:18:38.520 --> 00:18:41.800
Yeah, it's like if someone's, if someone's, I can't see them working, are they really
475
00:18:41.800 --> 00:18:42.800
working?
476
00:18:42.800 --> 00:18:43.800
Yeah.
477
00:18:43.800 --> 00:18:48.080
And I think it's like a control thing for a lot of these companies that don't trust their
478
00:18:48.080 --> 00:18:49.080
employees.
479
00:18:49.080 --> 00:18:52.360
I was actually just listening to a podcast on the way here this morning and they were
480
00:18:52.360 --> 00:18:54.720
talking about intrinsic versus extrinsic value.
481
00:18:55.440 --> 00:19:00.960
And I think this is an underlying issue is that in the research, when you pay someone
482
00:19:00.960 --> 00:19:04.800
to do something, they lose intrinsic value for that thing.
483
00:19:04.800 --> 00:19:09.360
No matter if it started as a really core thing to them, you pay them for it and it devalues
484
00:19:09.360 --> 00:19:10.720
it from their intrinsic point of view.
485
00:19:10.720 --> 00:19:14.640
It pulls it into an extrinsic value, which is something you get a reward for.
486
00:19:14.640 --> 00:19:19.920
So I wonder if, in this may relate to what Forty Hearts mission is in creating inner
487
00:19:19.920 --> 00:19:25.720
brand, inside an organization, so that the values and the meaning for being there is
488
00:19:25.720 --> 00:19:26.720
lived.
489
00:19:26.720 --> 00:19:27.720
Yeah.
490
00:19:27.720 --> 00:19:30.720
And so I wonder if these employees don't even really want to be there.
491
00:19:30.720 --> 00:19:32.720
I think that you're wondering.
492
00:19:32.720 --> 00:19:36.440
And so the impression, like, it worked because they don't want to work.
493
00:19:36.440 --> 00:19:38.040
They're avoiding it or they dread it.
494
00:19:38.040 --> 00:19:42.800
And I wonder, like, this is, I'm always this guy and I kind of hate being this guy, but
495
00:19:42.800 --> 00:19:46.160
if there was another one of these guys in the room, I wouldn't be.
496
00:19:46.160 --> 00:19:49.280
But I think that there is, you know, both sides can be true.
497
00:19:49.280 --> 00:19:54.000
In one way, I think it's obnoxious that people, managers feel like they need to be right
498
00:19:54.000 --> 00:19:55.520
there every second.
499
00:19:55.520 --> 00:19:59.600
That's clearly not, like, a dignified way to work, kind of starts to sound like a different
500
00:19:59.600 --> 00:20:02.400
way of working that we said we move past.
501
00:20:02.400 --> 00:20:09.080
But the other side of the coin is, like, I might not be motivated as an employee to work.
502
00:20:09.080 --> 00:20:13.640
And if I'm at my home or somewhere else, I might have other great reasons not to be
503
00:20:13.640 --> 00:20:14.640
working.
504
00:20:14.640 --> 00:20:16.320
I think it's about, am I working or am I not?
505
00:20:16.320 --> 00:20:19.280
I think it's about, like, you talked about this yesterday.
506
00:20:19.280 --> 00:20:24.520
How much value is there to me in taking, like, the rest and care that my body needs, whether
507
00:20:24.520 --> 00:20:30.080
that's doing my laundry or taking an app or playing Minecraft or going and getting in
508
00:20:30.080 --> 00:20:32.360
the pool for a couple of hours?
509
00:20:32.360 --> 00:20:35.360
Like, I do think it's also a function of burnout.
510
00:20:35.360 --> 00:20:38.160
And it's like, well, let me take back what I can.
511
00:20:38.160 --> 00:20:43.040
I also feel like there's this great book called Quiet and it's about, like, Introverse.
512
00:20:43.040 --> 00:20:45.400
And then, but it talks about, I don't know if you guys have read it.
513
00:20:45.400 --> 00:20:51.680
It talks about, like, the evolution of the workforce in the US based off of, like, introverted
514
00:20:51.680 --> 00:20:53.200
versus extroverted.
515
00:20:53.200 --> 00:20:57.880
And the US culture is based, I'll just speak for US, another rest of the world, is based
516
00:20:57.880 --> 00:21:01.280
off of an extrovert paradise.
517
00:21:01.280 --> 00:21:05.880
And I think this also gets back to, like, not understanding how some people work best.
518
00:21:05.880 --> 00:21:11.160
There is, like, half of the population that's forced to be out there with the extroverts
519
00:21:11.200 --> 00:21:16.040
that actually don't perform really well in office environments because it's, like, draining
520
00:21:16.040 --> 00:21:17.040
for them.
521
00:21:17.040 --> 00:21:20.800
But I feel like we don't acknowledge that because we're, like, fit into the box, be this
522
00:21:20.800 --> 00:21:25.560
perfect worker, this is the type of work, and that's culture, but it's inhibiting their
523
00:21:25.560 --> 00:21:26.560
entire creative flow.
524
00:21:26.560 --> 00:21:27.560
Yeah, exactly.
525
00:21:27.560 --> 00:21:31.080
Well, there's even, I think that even exists within a job.
526
00:21:31.080 --> 00:21:35.280
Like, there are things that will be better if I'm in a room talking to people and I'm
527
00:21:35.280 --> 00:21:38.640
a verbal processor, surprising no one.
528
00:21:38.640 --> 00:21:43.480
But I think that there are also things that if you don't give me a second of loan, it's
529
00:21:43.480 --> 00:21:44.480
not going to get done.
530
00:21:44.480 --> 00:21:45.480
Or it'll get done.
531
00:21:45.480 --> 00:21:49.840
It's like, I'll feed it to AI, and I'll give it to me, and then it'll be done.
532
00:21:49.840 --> 00:21:54.640
Well, what I'm wondering is if it's an age thing, too, because, how do you add this?
533
00:21:54.640 --> 00:21:55.640
Yeah.
534
00:21:55.640 --> 00:21:59.040
And guarantee you feel different about what remote means than what I didn't have remote
535
00:21:59.040 --> 00:22:00.040
when I was 22.
536
00:22:00.040 --> 00:22:05.160
I was traveling around doing furniture repair, and I couldn't do that remotely, obviously.
537
00:22:05.160 --> 00:22:06.160
But there wasn't an option.
538
00:22:06.160 --> 00:22:10.200
It's in there when there's not an option, you really don't know what's different, you're
539
00:22:10.200 --> 00:22:11.200
not comparing them.
540
00:22:11.200 --> 00:22:12.200
How does it feel?
541
00:22:12.200 --> 00:22:15.400
I mean, I am the extrovert.
542
00:22:15.400 --> 00:22:19.120
So I do really like being in the office and that kind of thing.
543
00:22:19.120 --> 00:22:23.200
I feel like I'm more comfortable being in the office than I am being remote right now,
544
00:22:23.200 --> 00:22:27.400
just because I don't know how to properly get everything I want out of a Slack message.
545
00:22:27.400 --> 00:22:31.280
I'm thinking in my brain and I'm like, okay, this is what I need.
546
00:22:31.280 --> 00:22:33.480
And then three minutes later, I'm like, damn it.
547
00:22:33.560 --> 00:22:36.280
I need something else.
548
00:22:36.280 --> 00:22:41.840
And so I think being able to mature and that I think remote will become a lot more efficient.
549
00:22:41.840 --> 00:22:46.760
Do you feel like when you're typing in Slack, it's like getting the clarity of what you're
550
00:22:46.760 --> 00:22:50.200
trying to type out the thought is hard?
551
00:22:50.200 --> 00:22:53.160
Yeah, so I struggle with that, too, and I get drained of me.
552
00:22:53.160 --> 00:22:57.640
Yeah, me writing a Slack message, if you put a gun to my head, you wouldn't know the
553
00:22:57.640 --> 00:22:58.640
difference.
554
00:22:58.640 --> 00:22:59.640
They are the same.
555
00:22:59.640 --> 00:23:00.640
No, no, no, no, no.
556
00:23:00.640 --> 00:23:01.640
Slack intense.
557
00:23:01.640 --> 00:23:05.640
So they are the same, especially like when we have a deadline and I'm like, oh shit, like
558
00:23:05.640 --> 00:23:06.640
what am I just saying?
559
00:23:06.640 --> 00:23:07.640
Yeah, you remember that project we were doing?
560
00:23:07.640 --> 00:23:08.640
Literally living on Slack for like 18 hours straight?
561
00:23:08.640 --> 00:23:09.640
I was at the very beginning of your 45th experience.
562
00:23:09.640 --> 00:23:10.640
Yeah, you were just, oh man, that was intense.
563
00:23:10.640 --> 00:23:11.640
I'm traumatized by that.
564
00:23:11.640 --> 00:23:12.640
Are you sending things back and forth?
565
00:23:12.640 --> 00:23:13.640
Like images, too?
566
00:23:13.640 --> 00:23:14.640
Or like, images file?
567
00:23:14.640 --> 00:23:15.640
Yeah, yeah.
568
00:23:15.640 --> 00:23:16.640
Like it was everything.
569
00:23:16.640 --> 00:23:17.640
And it was pretty intense.
570
00:23:17.640 --> 00:23:18.640
I was like, I don't know what to do.
571
00:23:18.640 --> 00:23:19.640
Wouldn't you also like the only one in the office at that time?
572
00:23:19.640 --> 00:23:20.640
No, I was sitting by you that this one I'm talking about.
573
00:23:20.640 --> 00:23:21.640
But yeah, you were pretty much.
574
00:23:21.640 --> 00:23:45.920
Yeah, Reggie and Tim were both gone somewhere and I was sitting in the office and the clients
575
00:23:45.920 --> 00:23:46.920
were just like calling me.
576
00:23:46.920 --> 00:23:47.920
Oh my gosh.
577
00:23:47.920 --> 00:23:48.920
Oh my gosh.
578
00:23:48.920 --> 00:23:49.920
I'm calling me.
579
00:23:49.920 --> 00:23:50.920
Trial by fire.
580
00:23:50.920 --> 00:23:51.920
This was like my...
581
00:23:51.920 --> 00:23:52.920
You passed.
582
00:23:52.920 --> 00:23:53.920
Yeah, passed.
583
00:23:53.920 --> 00:23:54.920
Yeah, for sure.
584
00:23:54.920 --> 00:23:55.920
This was my third week on the 40th.
585
00:23:55.920 --> 00:23:59.920
It's like actually signed on from college and I was like, these people are slacking me.
586
00:23:59.920 --> 00:24:00.920
I don't know how to even respond.
587
00:24:00.920 --> 00:24:01.920
I'm just like, well...
588
00:24:01.920 --> 00:24:02.920
It even sounds violent.
589
00:24:02.920 --> 00:24:03.920
Yeah.
590
00:24:03.920 --> 00:24:04.920
You were slacking me.
591
00:24:04.920 --> 00:24:05.920
Yeah.
592
00:24:05.920 --> 00:24:08.920
That little ping, that little ping.
593
00:24:08.920 --> 00:24:09.920
Oh my gosh.
594
00:24:09.920 --> 00:24:10.920
I turned that off.
595
00:24:10.920 --> 00:24:11.920
Yeah.
596
00:24:11.920 --> 00:24:12.920
I turned it off.
597
00:24:12.920 --> 00:24:13.920
Yeah.
598
00:24:13.920 --> 00:24:14.920
You wanted to ask me.
599
00:24:14.920 --> 00:24:15.920
Do you want to commit suicide..?
600
00:24:15.920 --> 00:24:16.920
No, no.
601
00:24:16.920 --> 00:24:17.920
No!
602
00:24:17.920 --> 00:24:18.920
Never wanted to.
603
00:24:18.920 --> 00:24:19.920
So I wanted to ask anyone to end your story.
604
00:24:19.920 --> 00:24:20.920
Definitely.
605
00:24:20.920 --> 00:24:25.840
But we do keep up with A client uns Vict token, and thankfully our point of contact is lovely
606
00:24:25.840 --> 00:24:29.200
but I do think it's kind of hard to take agentship line.
607
00:24:29.200 --> 00:24:33.280
And the fact that you can't be so important back in 4th was about my intervention.
608
00:24:33.280 --> 00:24:40.280
Right, so this is my problem is humans may have been made for less channels of communication.
609
00:24:40.280 --> 00:24:45.280
I'm not going to say this for sure because I've done a research, but for me personally and maybe for you,
610
00:24:45.280 --> 00:24:49.280
when there are too many conversations happening, like I have to propose email, I have these Slack messages,
611
00:24:49.280 --> 00:24:55.280
I have these voice mails, I have, I get so overwhelmed and all of that because I don't,
612
00:24:55.280 --> 00:24:59.280
I can't keep track of where all these channels are for some reason.
613
00:24:59.280 --> 00:25:03.280
I will say it's gotten better since she did that, married to this virtual office for us,
614
00:25:03.280 --> 00:25:05.280
so she's training these old guys, how do you organize this?
615
00:25:05.280 --> 00:25:11.280
They might also hear more about Adrian, you and I have been through the ringer on virtual office.
616
00:25:11.280 --> 00:25:13.280
Oh, yes we have.
617
00:25:13.280 --> 00:25:18.280
And but imagine like having not done any of that ever before in your life and then some crazy lady comes in
618
00:25:18.280 --> 00:25:21.280
and is like, I need a virtual first office, so this is what we're doing.
619
00:25:21.280 --> 00:25:25.280
And I'm not kidding, like three weeks in, they went from zero to a hundred.
620
00:25:25.280 --> 00:25:26.280
It's amazing.
621
00:25:26.280 --> 00:25:27.280
That's awesome.
622
00:25:27.280 --> 00:25:30.280
Slack is all organized and my wife even said, can I have that video?
623
00:25:30.280 --> 00:25:32.280
So I was like, she recorded this.
624
00:25:32.280 --> 00:25:33.280
Oh my gosh.
625
00:25:33.280 --> 00:25:34.280
It's good.
626
00:25:34.280 --> 00:25:39.280
I will say this and I keep saying it to them internally, but I feel like I need to put it in the public forum.
627
00:25:39.280 --> 00:25:43.280
I kept every morning, I would wake up and be like, today's going to be the day.
628
00:25:43.280 --> 00:25:44.280
Somebody's going to break.
629
00:25:44.280 --> 00:25:47.280
Somebody's going to, I'm going to be in the middle of trying to share something.
630
00:25:47.280 --> 00:25:48.280
We're going to break down.
631
00:25:48.280 --> 00:25:52.280
I can't handle it anymore and I'm going to respect that and we're going to back off of it.
632
00:25:52.280 --> 00:25:55.280
But I kept pushing because that, I'm a pusher.
633
00:25:55.280 --> 00:25:58.280
So we like it very much.
634
00:25:58.280 --> 00:25:59.280
Yeah.
635
00:25:59.280 --> 00:26:01.280
That was a mean girl's reference to somebody knows.
636
00:26:01.280 --> 00:26:03.280
But I think, yeah.
637
00:26:03.280 --> 00:26:11.280
But I, the like level of open-mindedness and I'll say resilience because it can be a lot
638
00:26:11.280 --> 00:26:15.280
with the virtual stuff and like willingness to learn and try new things
639
00:26:15.280 --> 00:26:20.280
and like pull together, I think is the most important thing to be like, hey, I have a problem
640
00:26:20.280 --> 00:26:23.280
and then everybody rushes to the problem to try to help.
641
00:26:23.280 --> 00:26:27.280
It has been very inspiring.
642
00:26:27.280 --> 00:26:28.280
It's, yeah.
643
00:26:28.280 --> 00:26:32.280
It's like you start one of these processes and you're like, well, my expectations are kind of low.
644
00:26:32.280 --> 00:26:33.280
Yeah.
645
00:26:33.280 --> 00:26:36.280
Have a lot of grace for any of the, whatever is, but like it's been incredible.
646
00:26:36.280 --> 00:26:40.280
And when everyone uses it in the way it's intense and two, it works really well.
647
00:26:40.280 --> 00:26:41.280
Right, exactly.
648
00:26:41.280 --> 00:26:42.280
You're like, oh, this is helping my life.
649
00:26:42.280 --> 00:26:45.280
And it's not about the humans and it is about the tech.
650
00:26:45.280 --> 00:26:47.280
Sorry, sorry, listeners.
651
00:26:48.280 --> 00:26:50.280
The live raw, untruthy conversation.
652
00:26:50.280 --> 00:26:51.280
It's okay.
653
00:26:51.280 --> 00:26:52.280
It's going to be fine.
654
00:26:52.280 --> 00:26:56.280
But I do think it's more about like behavior than it is about the tech itself.
655
00:26:56.280 --> 00:27:01.280
Because there's also this research about whether or not these technologies were intended to help us
656
00:27:01.280 --> 00:27:03.280
or where they were intended to distract us.
657
00:27:03.280 --> 00:27:04.280
Oh, my God.
658
00:27:04.280 --> 00:27:05.280
I'm always skeptical.
659
00:27:05.280 --> 00:27:06.280
Right.
660
00:27:06.280 --> 00:27:10.280
Because especially social media, but also I think for Slack is like an inter-social media.
661
00:27:10.280 --> 00:27:11.280
Yes.
662
00:27:11.280 --> 00:27:16.280
For a company especially if you're at scale and they will commonly say, not they, Slack,
663
00:27:16.280 --> 00:27:21.280
but the researchers around this will say, is there a guide that teaches you how to
664
00:27:21.280 --> 00:27:24.280
most efficiently use this app?
665
00:27:24.280 --> 00:27:27.280
No, because the more you're on the app actually benefits the business.
666
00:27:27.280 --> 00:27:29.280
So be in there trying to figure it out.
667
00:27:29.280 --> 00:27:30.280
It's very in your head against the wall.
668
00:27:30.280 --> 00:27:32.280
They care about how to move things around.
669
00:27:32.280 --> 00:27:33.280
Right.
670
00:27:33.280 --> 00:27:37.280
Because the more you're in the app, the more it benefits them as an organization.
671
00:27:37.280 --> 00:27:38.280
And the business model.
672
00:27:38.280 --> 00:27:39.280
I totally believe that.
673
00:27:39.280 --> 00:27:40.280
Yeah.
674
00:27:40.280 --> 00:27:43.280
And you know what keeps happening to Reggie and Reggie.
675
00:27:43.280 --> 00:27:44.280
Right.
676
00:27:44.280 --> 00:27:46.280
I'm going to talk to you about this IRL before you see this.
677
00:27:46.280 --> 00:27:47.280
This is a podcast for the first time.
678
00:27:47.280 --> 00:27:52.280
No, I do think there is like, I'm going to notice an age gap, but it's not at all like,
679
00:27:52.280 --> 00:27:53.280
okay, Boomer.
680
00:27:53.280 --> 00:27:54.280
He's not a Boomer by the way.
681
00:27:54.280 --> 00:27:55.280
He's not.
682
00:27:55.280 --> 00:27:56.280
I'm so sorry.
683
00:27:56.280 --> 00:27:57.280
I'm like, wait a minute.
684
00:27:57.280 --> 00:27:58.280
I am not sitting in for a Boomer.
685
00:27:58.280 --> 00:27:59.280
No.
686
00:27:59.280 --> 00:28:00.280
No, you're not.
687
00:28:00.280 --> 00:28:01.280
I was like, wait a minute.
688
00:28:01.280 --> 00:28:02.280
I don't think people would do that.
689
00:28:02.280 --> 00:28:03.280
Unsuspecting Boomer.
690
00:28:03.280 --> 00:28:04.280
Yeah.
691
00:28:04.280 --> 00:28:06.280
Age is an illusion these days.
692
00:28:06.280 --> 00:28:08.280
I don't know how old anybody is.
693
00:28:08.280 --> 00:28:13.280
But I've noticed that Reggie is really, I've said before, like, we need to complain more.
694
00:28:13.280 --> 00:28:16.280
Like, I think if people don't know you're hurting, how can they help you?
695
00:28:16.280 --> 00:28:18.280
And I think most people do want to help you.
696
00:28:18.280 --> 00:28:21.280
But we got to figure out a way to complain that's not whatever punitive.
697
00:28:21.280 --> 00:28:23.280
But Reggie's great at complaining.
698
00:28:23.280 --> 00:28:24.280
And I've told him this many, many times.
699
00:28:24.280 --> 00:28:27.280
And my life has been made better because Reggie complains.
700
00:28:27.280 --> 00:28:28.280
Like, our windows get fixed.
701
00:28:28.280 --> 00:28:29.280
And our doors get rusted.
702
00:28:29.280 --> 00:28:30.280
And.
703
00:28:30.280 --> 00:28:32.280
But he, yeah, he's not only a complainer.
704
00:28:32.280 --> 00:28:33.280
Yeah.
705
00:28:33.280 --> 00:28:34.280
He's like a fixer.
706
00:28:34.280 --> 00:28:35.280
He gets the thing now.
707
00:28:35.280 --> 00:28:36.280
That's a good combo.
708
00:28:36.280 --> 00:28:37.280
Yeah.
709
00:28:37.280 --> 00:28:39.280
The motivation of like, I see how great this could be.
710
00:28:39.280 --> 00:28:40.280
How do I get this fix?
711
00:28:40.280 --> 00:28:46.280
But he also expects things from software that I wonder if it's from like a bygone time.
712
00:28:46.280 --> 00:28:51.280
The idea that you could reach out to the customer service portal and that they might actually help you navigate these things.
713
00:28:51.280 --> 00:28:55.280
Which is where, yeah, he grew up getting in touch with the maker of the software.
714
00:28:55.280 --> 00:28:56.280
Yeah.
715
00:28:56.280 --> 00:28:58.280
And like, he was a flash pioneer, you know.
716
00:28:58.280 --> 00:29:01.280
So like, he understands how these things evolve.
717
00:29:01.280 --> 00:29:07.280
And I think he's probably accustomed in some way to being like the super user who can push the software forward.
718
00:29:07.280 --> 00:29:08.280
Right.
719
00:29:08.280 --> 00:29:09.280
But these, they're not working like that.
720
00:29:09.280 --> 00:29:11.280
We are not a priority.
721
00:29:11.280 --> 00:29:18.280
Maybe their biggest enterprise client is able to like sway that in like a head of account kind of way.
722
00:29:18.280 --> 00:29:21.280
But like, I never feel heard or seen.
723
00:29:21.280 --> 00:29:28.280
But the funny thing is that Slack actually made their impression on the market as an app because of how they heard their customers.
724
00:29:28.280 --> 00:29:29.280
Yeah.
725
00:29:29.280 --> 00:29:33.280
So in the beginning, they would change their software daily, hourly.
726
00:29:33.280 --> 00:29:34.280
Yeah.
727
00:29:34.280 --> 00:29:37.280
Because of how aggressive they were in listening to the users.
728
00:29:37.280 --> 00:29:38.280
Yeah.
729
00:29:38.280 --> 00:29:45.280
But when it gets to a certain point, it's more important that it's just their priorities change.
730
00:29:45.280 --> 00:29:46.280
Yeah.
731
00:29:46.280 --> 00:29:47.280
And then we're not a priority, which is kind of sad.
732
00:29:47.280 --> 00:29:49.280
And like, where are you listening is my other question.
733
00:29:49.280 --> 00:29:53.280
Like, before the product existed, you had to go listen to like issues in the market.
734
00:29:53.280 --> 00:29:56.280
And then after the product exists, are you listening broadly?
735
00:29:56.280 --> 00:29:58.280
Or are you just listening to people on the app?
736
00:29:58.280 --> 00:30:00.280
Are you being surveilled and everything that you say?
737
00:30:00.280 --> 00:30:02.280
And they're pulling whatever?
738
00:30:02.280 --> 00:30:03.280
I don't know.
739
00:30:03.280 --> 00:30:04.280
On your screen?
740
00:30:04.280 --> 00:30:05.280
Yeah.
741
00:30:05.280 --> 00:30:08.280
Well, I think this gets into a conversation of scale again.
742
00:30:08.280 --> 00:30:16.280
And capitalism like always growing mentality is that when you get to a point at which you see apps and development happen
743
00:30:16.280 --> 00:30:21.280
where this real specific app was working for this real specific problem.
744
00:30:21.280 --> 00:30:23.280
And then they got to the max.
745
00:30:24.280 --> 00:30:25.280
Miro.
746
00:30:25.280 --> 00:30:26.280
Yeah.
747
00:30:26.280 --> 00:30:27.280
And then they moved.
748
00:30:27.280 --> 00:30:28.280
Right.
749
00:30:28.280 --> 00:30:29.280
Miro.
750
00:30:29.280 --> 00:30:30.280
But you'll watch them all do it.
751
00:30:30.280 --> 00:30:31.280
They try to eat all the other apps.
752
00:30:31.280 --> 00:30:32.280
Yes.
753
00:30:32.280 --> 00:30:33.280
Like, we're the all in one app.
754
00:30:33.280 --> 00:30:34.280
Every app's the all in one app.
755
00:30:34.280 --> 00:30:36.280
I don't know what I'm going to do with 15 all in one apps.
756
00:30:36.280 --> 00:30:40.280
And it's frustrating because that is the way they have to move with our culture.
757
00:30:40.280 --> 00:30:41.280
Yeah.
758
00:30:41.280 --> 00:30:42.280
It's so true.
759
00:30:42.280 --> 00:30:43.280
Right.
760
00:30:43.280 --> 00:30:44.280
They have to eat more market share.
761
00:30:44.280 --> 00:30:45.280
Yeah.
762
00:30:45.280 --> 00:30:46.280
It's so true.
763
00:30:46.280 --> 00:30:47.280
I mean, they do it with every CPG.
764
00:30:47.280 --> 00:30:50.280
We've been in all kinds of meetings like this where they're like, we make cereal for the morning.
765
00:30:50.280 --> 00:30:52.280
But what about nighttime cereal?
766
00:30:52.280 --> 00:30:53.280
I've never thought about it.
767
00:30:53.280 --> 00:30:58.280
And then they start to open up these different parts of your life that they can colonize for lack of a better word.
768
00:30:58.280 --> 00:30:59.280
Yeah.
769
00:30:59.280 --> 00:31:01.280
Like, let me go plant my flag on this part of Tim's brain.
770
00:31:01.280 --> 00:31:02.280
And bring up a good point.
771
00:31:02.280 --> 00:31:11.280
What about colonization was like remote when you send your worker into another region.
772
00:31:11.280 --> 00:31:12.280
Interesting.
773
00:31:12.280 --> 00:31:13.280
We're remotely.
774
00:31:13.280 --> 00:31:14.280
Interesting.
775
00:31:14.280 --> 00:31:15.280
Feed back.
776
00:31:15.280 --> 00:31:16.280
Feed back the intel.
777
00:31:16.280 --> 00:31:17.280
And the king.
778
00:31:17.280 --> 00:31:18.280
You know, there's this good thing.
779
00:31:18.280 --> 00:31:19.280
Okay.
780
00:31:19.280 --> 00:31:20.280
Interesting.
781
00:31:20.280 --> 00:31:21.280
Yeah.
782
00:31:21.280 --> 00:31:22.280
Yeah.
783
00:31:22.280 --> 00:31:23.280
Yeah.
784
00:31:23.280 --> 00:31:24.280
Yeah.
785
00:31:24.280 --> 00:31:25.280
I don't know how to name it.
786
00:31:25.280 --> 00:31:26.280
Come on.
787
00:31:26.280 --> 00:31:27.280
I can do this.
788
00:31:27.280 --> 00:31:29.280
But Venenia, the Pinta and the San Diego VR.
789
00:31:29.280 --> 00:31:31.280
There's a group here in town.
790
00:31:31.280 --> 00:31:32.280
Sorry.
791
00:31:32.280 --> 00:31:34.280
Called Digital Nomads.
792
00:31:34.280 --> 00:31:38.280
And I have managed my digital nomads for coming through.
793
00:31:38.280 --> 00:31:40.280
I've never attended a single event.
794
00:31:40.280 --> 00:31:41.280
Any other thing that I've attended.
795
00:31:41.280 --> 00:31:43.280
I'm like, oh, how do you two know each other?
796
00:31:43.280 --> 00:31:44.280
It's like everybody I meet.
797
00:31:44.280 --> 00:31:45.280
They're like, oh, we met in digital nomads.
798
00:31:45.280 --> 00:31:49.280
And it's because I think why they're so strong is because they're people who individually have their own.
799
00:31:50.280 --> 00:31:51.280
The feeling work.
800
00:31:51.280 --> 00:31:52.280
Yeah.
801
00:31:52.280 --> 00:31:54.280
That's like kept them in this job, whatever it is.
802
00:31:54.280 --> 00:31:56.280
And then they go and have fun times.
803
00:31:56.280 --> 00:31:58.280
Like they're just a group of people who need to have fun time.
804
00:31:58.280 --> 00:31:59.280
They're like, you work remote.
805
00:31:59.280 --> 00:32:00.280
I work remote.
806
00:32:00.280 --> 00:32:02.280
That's what gives us something in common.
807
00:32:02.280 --> 00:32:03.280
Yeah.
808
00:32:03.280 --> 00:32:04.280
So let's go bowl.
809
00:32:04.280 --> 00:32:05.280
Yeah.
810
00:32:05.280 --> 00:32:06.280
Like whatever.
811
00:32:06.280 --> 00:32:08.280
Have you heard this concept of third space?
812
00:32:08.280 --> 00:32:09.280
Yeah.
813
00:32:09.280 --> 00:32:10.280
The third space.
814
00:32:10.280 --> 00:32:11.280
Yeah.
815
00:32:11.280 --> 00:32:15.280
But most people try and capture the third space, but they just make it into another working space.
816
00:32:15.280 --> 00:32:16.280
Yeah.
817
00:32:16.280 --> 00:32:18.280
But I think if someone knows how to have fun.
818
00:32:18.280 --> 00:32:20.280
This came up when you were talking about play.
819
00:32:20.280 --> 00:32:21.280
Here's an insight.
820
00:32:21.280 --> 00:32:22.280
Are you listening?
821
00:32:22.280 --> 00:32:23.280
Big business.
822
00:32:23.280 --> 00:32:25.280
I mean, like we have a space in town.
823
00:32:25.280 --> 00:32:26.280
Oh, switch yards.
824
00:32:26.280 --> 00:32:27.280
Switch yards.
825
00:32:27.280 --> 00:32:28.280
Oh, yeah.
826
00:32:28.280 --> 00:32:31.280
It's a different kind of co-working where I think they're trying to capture a third space.
827
00:32:31.280 --> 00:32:36.280
But the truth, third space, is where it's totally relationship driven.
828
00:32:36.280 --> 00:32:37.280
Yes, and natural work.
829
00:32:37.280 --> 00:32:38.280
And natural work.
830
00:32:38.280 --> 00:32:39.280
Yes.
831
00:32:39.280 --> 00:32:42.280
So there is that level of play that I think actually connects people.
832
00:32:42.280 --> 00:32:43.280
Yeah.
833
00:32:43.280 --> 00:32:48.280
And the work relationships are driven by a goal.
834
00:32:48.280 --> 00:32:50.280
So you all want to get to somewhere.
835
00:32:50.280 --> 00:32:52.280
So you make it nice so that you can get to this place.
836
00:32:52.280 --> 00:32:53.280
Yeah.
837
00:32:53.280 --> 00:32:56.280
But friends are things you really have to cultivate.
838
00:32:56.280 --> 00:32:57.280
Sure.
839
00:32:57.280 --> 00:32:58.280
And they take work and time.
840
00:32:58.280 --> 00:32:59.280
Yeah.
841
00:32:59.280 --> 00:33:03.280
Most work friends, when you get out of work, it falls apart and in a really short amount of time.
842
00:33:03.280 --> 00:33:04.280
But friend friends.
843
00:33:04.280 --> 00:33:05.280
That's true.
844
00:33:05.280 --> 00:33:11.280
That you make in these third space as a concept in relationship and play and whatever it is hanging out.
845
00:33:11.280 --> 00:33:14.280
I wonder if that's why digital nomads is what it is.
846
00:33:14.280 --> 00:33:15.280
They're like...
847
00:33:15.280 --> 00:33:16.280
Because they're hanging out.
848
00:33:16.280 --> 00:33:17.280
And they don't have anyone else.
849
00:33:17.280 --> 00:33:18.280
Imagine.
850
00:33:18.280 --> 00:33:19.280
Yeah, true.
851
00:33:19.280 --> 00:33:21.280
If you digitally remote their own system.
852
00:33:21.280 --> 00:33:22.280
We know.
853
00:33:22.280 --> 00:33:23.280
Like moving to this town.
854
00:33:23.280 --> 00:33:28.280
We were both remote at the time that we moved to Asheville and very isolating, I would say.
855
00:33:28.280 --> 00:33:31.280
And like never mind, it's COVID for a time.
856
00:33:31.280 --> 00:33:34.280
So it's like, I can't go to a bar and meet people.
857
00:33:34.280 --> 00:33:35.280
I'm going to contract a life.
858
00:33:35.280 --> 00:33:36.280
That's very true.
859
00:33:36.280 --> 00:33:37.280
And you both are extroverts, right?
860
00:33:37.280 --> 00:33:39.280
No, I'm actually an introvert.
861
00:33:39.280 --> 00:33:41.280
You're a high-performance extrovert.
862
00:33:41.280 --> 00:33:42.280
I think.
863
00:33:42.280 --> 00:33:44.280
In theater, probably.
864
00:33:44.280 --> 00:33:45.280
I...
865
00:33:45.280 --> 00:33:46.280
Okay.
866
00:33:46.280 --> 00:33:47.280
No, no, no.
867
00:33:47.280 --> 00:33:48.280
We're just both French horn players.
868
00:33:48.280 --> 00:33:49.280
That's what you're picking.
869
00:33:49.280 --> 00:33:50.280
I didn't play French horn.
870
00:33:50.280 --> 00:33:51.280
I didn't play French.
871
00:33:51.280 --> 00:33:52.280
I didn't play French.
872
00:33:52.280 --> 00:33:53.280
People I know in town.
873
00:33:53.280 --> 00:33:54.280
They play French horn.
874
00:33:54.280 --> 00:33:57.280
I like to walk in because I'm collecting this group.
875
00:33:57.280 --> 00:33:59.280
But I'm like, I think we should start at quartet.
876
00:33:59.280 --> 00:34:00.280
What is it about French horn players?
877
00:34:00.280 --> 00:34:01.280
Yeah.
878
00:34:01.280 --> 00:34:02.280
There's something to say qua.
879
00:34:02.280 --> 00:34:03.280
Yeah, there's something all about it.
880
00:34:03.280 --> 00:34:04.280
I'm like, why choose a...
881
00:34:04.280 --> 00:34:05.280
Like, I'm in seventh grade.
882
00:34:05.280 --> 00:34:06.280
Why?
883
00:34:06.280 --> 00:34:07.280
I care about French horn players.
884
00:34:07.280 --> 00:34:09.280
There looks like a toilet around there.
885
00:34:09.280 --> 00:34:12.280
No one cares about you.
886
00:34:12.280 --> 00:34:13.280
They're like, pipe down French horns.
887
00:34:13.280 --> 00:34:15.280
It's a wonderful instrument, though.
888
00:34:15.280 --> 00:34:17.280
And now you hear it every time you watch a movie.
889
00:34:17.280 --> 00:34:18.280
Don't you?
890
00:34:18.280 --> 00:34:19.280
Like, they're singing out.
891
00:34:19.280 --> 00:34:20.280
All right.
892
00:34:20.280 --> 00:34:22.280
We'll speak for all the fake extroverts.
893
00:34:22.280 --> 00:34:23.280
We made a real laugh.
894
00:34:23.280 --> 00:34:24.280
Not fake.
895
00:34:24.280 --> 00:34:26.280
Let's see, skilled extroverts, but truly introvert.
896
00:34:26.280 --> 00:34:29.280
Because I view it after reading this book, a quiet,
897
00:34:29.280 --> 00:34:31.280
which I suggest all you read.
898
00:34:31.280 --> 00:34:33.280
We saw a book on every episode.
899
00:34:33.280 --> 00:34:34.280
I think it's good.
900
00:34:34.280 --> 00:34:35.280
It's good to read.
901
00:34:35.280 --> 00:34:36.280
Yeah.
902
00:34:36.280 --> 00:34:37.280
That's another topic.
903
00:34:37.280 --> 00:34:38.280
You can read it.
904
00:34:38.280 --> 00:34:39.280
You can read it.
905
00:34:39.280 --> 00:34:43.280
How you judge on the, like, a very loose way is, like,
906
00:34:43.280 --> 00:34:44.280
how to get your energy.
907
00:34:44.280 --> 00:34:46.280
And I get my energy by being by myself.
908
00:34:46.280 --> 00:34:47.280
Like, being...
909
00:34:47.280 --> 00:34:48.280
I can be out with people.
910
00:34:48.280 --> 00:34:51.280
I actually really enjoy it, but it's draining for me.
911
00:34:51.280 --> 00:34:54.280
Like, after I'm out being extroverted,
912
00:34:54.280 --> 00:34:56.280
I have to, like, retreat back into my little hole
913
00:34:56.280 --> 00:34:59.280
and, like, recharge by myself for a little bit.
914
00:34:59.280 --> 00:35:02.280
Where extroverted people are, like, I'm alive!
915
00:35:02.280 --> 00:35:04.280
I love being around people.
916
00:35:04.280 --> 00:35:05.280
They're like, I'm draining.
917
00:35:05.280 --> 00:35:06.280
Yes!
918
00:35:06.280 --> 00:35:07.280
I'm draining.
919
00:35:07.280 --> 00:35:09.280
No, I feel like I'm just high intensity.
920
00:35:09.280 --> 00:35:12.280
Like, no matter which of those I'm doing, I'm doing it all.
921
00:35:12.280 --> 00:35:13.280
You don't identify either side.
922
00:35:13.280 --> 00:35:14.280
I'm not too, you're high intensity.
923
00:35:14.280 --> 00:35:15.280
Thank you.
924
00:35:15.280 --> 00:35:16.280
But is that it?
925
00:35:16.280 --> 00:35:17.280
Yeah.
926
00:35:17.280 --> 00:35:18.280
Yeah.
927
00:35:18.280 --> 00:35:19.280
I'm going to turn on.
928
00:35:19.280 --> 00:35:20.280
Yeah.
929
00:35:20.280 --> 00:35:21.280
It's rugged.
930
00:35:21.280 --> 00:35:22.280
No matter which version I'm doing.
931
00:35:22.280 --> 00:35:25.280
Introvertedness, dependent on intensity.
932
00:35:25.280 --> 00:35:28.280
I'm saying, I think, when I'm alone, I'm alone.
933
00:35:28.280 --> 00:35:30.280
And God, do I love it.
934
00:35:30.280 --> 00:35:34.280
Like, if I've lived for many years without a bathtub,
935
00:35:34.280 --> 00:35:37.280
and I moved into my house in 2021, and we have a bathtub now,
936
00:35:37.280 --> 00:35:39.280
and I'm, like, hmmm.
937
00:35:39.280 --> 00:35:41.280
And now I'm a different person.
938
00:35:41.280 --> 00:35:44.280
Like, you didn't know me in the non-bath tub years,
939
00:35:44.280 --> 00:35:46.280
but you would not, Adrian knows.
940
00:35:46.280 --> 00:35:47.280
It was so much fun.
941
00:35:47.280 --> 00:35:48.280
The age of the bathtub.
942
00:35:48.280 --> 00:35:52.280
The whole time of New York, like, sitting on the shower,
943
00:35:52.280 --> 00:35:54.280
but you're, like, hoping to do this thing.
944
00:35:54.280 --> 00:35:56.280
You'll just drain.
945
00:35:56.280 --> 00:35:57.280
Yeah.
946
00:35:57.280 --> 00:35:58.280
Sorry about my worries.
947
00:35:59.280 --> 00:36:02.280
It's funny because my, I'm just finding out that I think my dad is an introvert,
948
00:36:02.280 --> 00:36:04.280
and he's been, like, a pastor's whole life.
949
00:36:04.280 --> 00:36:07.280
Literally extroverted hundreds of times that I ever saw him.
950
00:36:07.280 --> 00:36:08.280
I'm so personable.
951
00:36:08.280 --> 00:36:09.280
Yeah.
952
00:36:09.280 --> 00:36:10.280
Yeah.
953
00:36:10.280 --> 00:36:14.280
And now he kind of has the freedom to be introvert,
954
00:36:14.280 --> 00:36:15.280
and that's his natural place.
955
00:36:15.280 --> 00:36:16.280
Yeah.
956
00:36:16.280 --> 00:36:18.280
And I'm wondering if that's my natural place, too.
957
00:36:18.280 --> 00:36:19.280
Yeah.
958
00:36:19.280 --> 00:36:20.280
Interesting.
959
00:36:20.280 --> 00:36:21.280
I'm just discovering this about myself.
960
00:36:21.280 --> 00:36:23.280
That's what I think I was trained to be an extrovert.
961
00:36:23.280 --> 00:36:25.280
Because the world is designed for extrovert.
962
00:36:25.280 --> 00:36:27.280
And that's the American standard.
963
00:36:27.280 --> 00:36:29.280
But when you were saying it's like, if you're going to be successful,
964
00:36:29.280 --> 00:36:30.280
you need to be...
965
00:36:30.280 --> 00:36:31.280
There's something wrong with you if you're not that way.
966
00:36:31.280 --> 00:36:32.280
Yeah.
967
00:36:32.280 --> 00:36:35.280
And I think that I'm sort of, like, just recovering from it a little bit.
968
00:36:35.280 --> 00:36:39.280
And you talked about overwhelm with too many channels of communication,
969
00:36:39.280 --> 00:36:41.280
which I, I went to therapy because of that.
970
00:36:41.280 --> 00:36:44.280
I was like, why can't I function like a normal human?
971
00:36:44.280 --> 00:36:48.280
Why am I, like, shut down when I have 10 emails and 30 texts?
972
00:36:48.280 --> 00:36:49.280
Right.
973
00:36:49.280 --> 00:36:52.280
Like, just answer the text and be like, sorry, bye.
974
00:36:52.280 --> 00:36:53.280
Yeah.
975
00:36:53.280 --> 00:36:54.280
But it's...
976
00:36:54.280 --> 00:36:55.280
That's, like, ruthless authenticity.
977
00:36:55.280 --> 00:36:56.280
Yeah.
978
00:36:56.280 --> 00:37:00.280
Well, like, I was realizing I see every, like, bid for, like, connection,
979
00:37:00.280 --> 00:37:02.280
which is a compliment in my view.
980
00:37:02.280 --> 00:37:04.280
Like, people want to be connected to me as a good thing.
981
00:37:04.280 --> 00:37:05.280
Yeah.
982
00:37:05.280 --> 00:37:06.280
I was seeing it as, like, obligation.
983
00:37:06.280 --> 00:37:07.280
Like, everybody wants something.
984
00:37:07.280 --> 00:37:08.280
Oh, thanks, Emily.
985
00:37:08.280 --> 00:37:11.280
So, like, I've had to flip that switch in my brain and be like,
986
00:37:11.280 --> 00:37:14.280
I don't have to give people anything if I don't want to.
987
00:37:14.280 --> 00:37:17.280
And I can say, that's awesome.
988
00:37:17.280 --> 00:37:18.280
And be done.
989
00:37:18.280 --> 00:37:22.280
Like, I don't have to take any action because I received this communicate.
990
00:37:22.280 --> 00:37:25.280
But I think room at work puts you in kind of a weird spot with that.
991
00:37:25.280 --> 00:37:28.280
Because every communication does sort of imply that you're going to do something.
992
00:37:28.280 --> 00:37:30.280
And you kind of have to respond, too.
993
00:37:30.280 --> 00:37:31.280
Yeah.
994
00:37:31.280 --> 00:37:34.280
Because you feel like this is, again, it's like you're getting towards a goal
995
00:37:34.280 --> 00:37:36.280
or committing, like, you need to do it fast.
996
00:37:36.280 --> 00:37:37.280
Yeah.
997
00:37:37.280 --> 00:37:38.280
So you need to tell people what you're doing.
998
00:37:38.280 --> 00:37:39.280
But it also can't ignore it.
999
00:37:39.280 --> 00:37:40.280
Yeah.
1000
00:37:40.280 --> 00:37:41.280
It becomes really easy, though.
1001
00:37:41.280 --> 00:37:42.280
I'm looking at you because I'm like, this has happened to you.
1002
00:37:42.280 --> 00:37:43.280
I watched it happen.
1003
00:37:43.280 --> 00:37:44.280
Yeah.
1004
00:37:44.280 --> 00:37:48.280
Where, like, people will just sort of, like, punt or, like, they'll, like, kick the can down the road.
1005
00:37:48.280 --> 00:37:49.280
That's true.
1006
00:37:49.280 --> 00:37:52.280
Because you're the one who will actually pick it up and be like, guys, we need to do something about this.
1007
00:37:52.280 --> 00:37:53.280
That's true.
1008
00:37:54.280 --> 00:37:57.280
And you're like, okay, I'm not going to put this baby down.
1009
00:37:57.280 --> 00:38:00.280
So you wonder, like, you know, when they started having all these different types of school
1010
00:38:00.280 --> 00:38:05.280
that you can send your kids to, I'm experiencing this now because I'm sending my youngest
1011
00:38:05.280 --> 00:38:07.280
into kindergarten.
1012
00:38:07.280 --> 00:38:11.280
And there's, like, a buffet of options.
1013
00:38:11.280 --> 00:38:15.280
A really charter public, this wall door.
1014
00:38:15.280 --> 00:38:18.280
And you didn't go through this with your other two kids.
1015
00:38:18.280 --> 00:38:25.280
Well, kind of, but it was just beginning because, as you're 16, in last 12, but there was,
1016
00:38:25.280 --> 00:38:29.280
so there's this thing where people discover that not everyone learns the same.
1017
00:38:29.280 --> 00:38:33.280
It's sort of amazing, like, not everyone's meant to sit in the desk to take a test
1018
00:38:33.280 --> 00:38:34.280
the way that we've done it.
1019
00:38:34.280 --> 00:38:37.280
Who would argue who is designed?
1020
00:38:37.280 --> 00:38:38.280
Maybe not one.
1021
00:38:38.280 --> 00:38:41.280
Maybe, like, some rare nerd who I love nerds.
1022
00:38:41.280 --> 00:38:45.280
I think nerding out on anything like design, like we do, or nerding out on science,
1023
00:38:45.280 --> 00:38:49.280
it's amazing, but I think that there's a very small percentage of people that work like that.
1024
00:38:49.280 --> 00:38:50.280
Yeah.
1025
00:38:50.280 --> 00:38:55.280
So I think also we're finding maybe in the realm or in the age of being remote where it's possible
1026
00:38:55.280 --> 00:39:01.280
that it's good to allow certain types of us to work differently.
1027
00:39:01.280 --> 00:39:02.280
Yeah.
1028
00:39:02.280 --> 00:39:05.280
You know, and there's this, and what corporate's going to miss on this is that they're wanting to
1029
00:39:05.280 --> 00:39:07.280
force it back into the extroverted lane.
1030
00:39:07.280 --> 00:39:12.280
When these introverts are going to create something so magnificent in their isolation.
1031
00:39:12.280 --> 00:39:13.280
That's true.
1032
00:39:13.280 --> 00:39:15.280
I don't want to call it isolation because you're still connected.
1033
00:39:15.280 --> 00:39:16.280
Yeah.
1034
00:39:16.280 --> 00:39:17.280
Like, you need to be supportive.
1035
00:39:17.280 --> 00:39:18.280
I think every human needs that.
1036
00:39:18.280 --> 00:39:19.280
It's a safe wall.
1037
00:39:19.280 --> 00:39:20.280
Yeah, there's a safe wall.
1038
00:39:20.280 --> 00:39:21.280
Yeah.
1039
00:39:21.280 --> 00:39:22.280
Where you can retreat.
1040
00:39:22.280 --> 00:39:23.280
Yeah.
1041
00:39:23.280 --> 00:39:26.280
Because I remember working, and Mary does it sometimes.
1042
00:39:26.280 --> 00:39:27.280
She doesn't know this about me.
1043
00:39:27.280 --> 00:39:31.280
But sometimes when I'm in the moment, my brain slows down to, like, a tortoise pace.
1044
00:39:31.280 --> 00:39:33.280
Well, actually, tortoise is the fastest.
1045
00:39:33.280 --> 00:39:36.280
My brain slows down to, like, very slow.
1046
00:39:36.280 --> 00:39:38.280
What's slow, like, syrup or collapse?
1047
00:39:38.280 --> 00:39:39.280
Like slow.
1048
00:39:39.280 --> 00:39:40.280
Okay.
1049
00:39:40.280 --> 00:39:41.280
Yep.
1050
00:39:41.280 --> 00:39:44.280
It's like I've become passive, and I'm taking in all this information.
1051
00:39:44.280 --> 00:39:46.280
And then when I go off by myself, I grind it.
1052
00:39:46.280 --> 00:39:47.280
Right.
1053
00:39:47.280 --> 00:39:48.280
Right.
1054
00:39:48.280 --> 00:39:49.280
And I know how to get through the information.
1055
00:39:49.280 --> 00:39:51.280
And I know how to make creativity comes.
1056
00:39:51.280 --> 00:39:52.280
All this inspiration.
1057
00:39:52.280 --> 00:39:55.280
And I think you process actually on the board.
1058
00:39:55.280 --> 00:39:56.280
In real time.
1059
00:39:56.280 --> 00:39:57.280
Drawing sketches.
1060
00:39:57.280 --> 00:39:58.280
Yeah.
1061
00:39:58.280 --> 00:39:59.280
Taking pictures and moving it forward.
1062
00:39:59.280 --> 00:40:00.280
It's amazing.
1063
00:40:00.280 --> 00:40:01.280
And I see it.
1064
00:40:01.280 --> 00:40:02.280
I'm, like, so jealous.
1065
00:40:02.280 --> 00:40:04.280
For me, I'm blank.
1066
00:40:04.280 --> 00:40:05.280
I see everything happening.
1067
00:40:05.280 --> 00:40:07.280
And I'm taking it in.
1068
00:40:07.280 --> 00:40:09.280
It's like I love computers taking all these inputs.
1069
00:40:09.280 --> 00:40:12.280
And then I need to go off by myself or nothing happens.
1070
00:40:12.280 --> 00:40:15.280
If I don't have time to go out by myself and process it,
1071
00:40:15.280 --> 00:40:16.280
it's almost like digestion.
1072
00:40:16.280 --> 00:40:17.280
It's like I'm eating a lot of food.
1073
00:40:17.280 --> 00:40:18.280
Yep.
1074
00:40:18.280 --> 00:40:19.280
Data and information.
1075
00:40:19.280 --> 00:40:20.280
Yep.
1076
00:40:20.280 --> 00:40:23.280
And then I need time to, like, digest this and do something with it.
1077
00:40:23.280 --> 00:40:25.280
And so that's the way I work.
1078
00:40:25.280 --> 00:40:29.280
And it didn't go well for me until I created my own agency.
1079
00:40:29.280 --> 00:40:31.280
Because I created my question.
1080
00:40:31.280 --> 00:40:32.280
Yeah.
1081
00:40:32.280 --> 00:40:34.280
And some, you know, like, some people say you're wasting time
1082
00:40:34.280 --> 00:40:35.280
by inserting the internet.
1083
00:40:35.280 --> 00:40:36.280
Yeah.
1084
00:40:36.280 --> 00:40:38.280
And then suddenly someone told me that,
1085
00:40:38.280 --> 00:40:39.280
oh, I may have told myself.
1086
00:40:39.280 --> 00:40:41.280
I can best advice.
1087
00:40:41.280 --> 00:40:44.280
No, I gave, I did a talk for some.
1088
00:40:44.280 --> 00:40:45.280
Oh, I did.
1089
00:40:45.280 --> 00:40:46.280
I did.
1090
00:40:46.280 --> 00:40:47.280
That's a really good advice.
1091
00:40:47.280 --> 00:40:48.280
I should say that more often.
1092
00:40:48.280 --> 00:40:49.280
I did a talk for college.
1093
00:40:49.280 --> 00:40:50.280
I sat myself down.
1094
00:40:50.280 --> 00:40:52.280
And I had a little talk to myself.
1095
00:40:52.280 --> 00:40:53.280
I said.
1096
00:40:53.280 --> 00:40:55.280
I did a college conversation.
1097
00:40:55.280 --> 00:40:57.280
Or I did a talk for college students.
1098
00:40:57.280 --> 00:40:59.280
And I told them to notice your process.
1099
00:40:59.280 --> 00:41:02.280
Everyone wants to tell you what your process should be.
1100
00:41:02.280 --> 00:41:03.280
Yeah, very smart.
1101
00:41:03.280 --> 00:41:04.280
But you figured out your own process.
1102
00:41:04.280 --> 00:41:05.280
Who working?
1103
00:41:05.280 --> 00:41:06.280
Yeah.
1104
00:41:06.280 --> 00:41:08.280
And so one of my processes was wasting time surfing.
1105
00:41:08.280 --> 00:41:09.280
That's how I researched.
1106
00:41:09.280 --> 00:41:10.280
Yeah.
1107
00:41:10.280 --> 00:41:11.280
I didn't call it research.
1108
00:41:11.280 --> 00:41:12.280
Yeah.
1109
00:41:12.280 --> 00:41:14.280
But I would be overwhelmed or I wouldn't know what to do.
1110
00:41:14.280 --> 00:41:15.280
Yeah.
1111
00:41:15.280 --> 00:41:16.280
And I would find myself surfing.
1112
00:41:16.280 --> 00:41:19.280
And then the internet, if not surfing out in the ocean,
1113
00:41:19.280 --> 00:41:20.280
surfing the internet.
1114
00:41:20.280 --> 00:41:21.280
Thanks for clarifying.
1115
00:41:21.280 --> 00:41:23.280
And I would find things that like sparked me.
1116
00:41:23.280 --> 00:41:24.280
Yeah.
1117
00:41:24.280 --> 00:41:25.280
And I would collect them.
1118
00:41:25.280 --> 00:41:26.280
Yeah.
1119
00:41:26.280 --> 00:41:29.280
And so I started wasting time as a part of my process.
1120
00:41:29.280 --> 00:41:30.280
Yeah.
1121
00:41:30.280 --> 00:41:31.280
I would just go in my office.
1122
00:41:31.280 --> 00:41:32.280
I love that.
1123
00:41:32.280 --> 00:41:33.280
And I would surf.
1124
00:41:33.280 --> 00:41:34.280
And I would collect.
1125
00:41:34.280 --> 00:41:36.280
And then I would be driven to do the thing.
1126
00:41:36.280 --> 00:41:37.280
And I would find the solution.
1127
00:41:37.280 --> 00:41:39.280
And that was invisible to me.
1128
00:41:39.280 --> 00:41:42.280
And I think it's invisible to a lot of people who don't identify
1129
00:41:42.280 --> 00:41:44.280
first and foremost as creators or designers.
1130
00:41:44.280 --> 00:41:45.280
Until Adrian stepped up.
1131
00:41:45.280 --> 00:41:47.280
It was like, this is a step.
1132
00:41:47.280 --> 00:41:50.280
We need to do this step before we do these other steps.
1133
00:41:50.280 --> 00:41:51.280
At least it was.
1134
00:41:51.280 --> 00:41:53.280
Well, I like to talk about it.
1135
00:41:53.280 --> 00:41:55.280
I think maybe this is the same thing you do.
1136
00:41:55.280 --> 00:41:58.280
I like to be like, I want the images to talk to me.
1137
00:41:58.280 --> 00:42:02.280
I go to the same process where I have to do like a big pool.
1138
00:42:02.280 --> 00:42:03.280
Yes.
1139
00:42:03.280 --> 00:42:06.280
I got to like get all the stuff, make it kind of messy.
1140
00:42:06.280 --> 00:42:07.280
Yeah.
1141
00:42:07.280 --> 00:42:10.280
And then once I have it out there, like there's something about
1142
00:42:10.280 --> 00:42:12.280
looking at all of that where it like tells you a story.
1143
00:42:12.280 --> 00:42:13.280
Yeah.
1144
00:42:13.280 --> 00:42:15.280
But I can't do it without doing what you're talking about.
1145
00:42:15.280 --> 00:42:16.280
Right.
1146
00:42:16.280 --> 00:42:17.280
Which is like wasting time.
1147
00:42:17.280 --> 00:42:18.280
Yeah.
1148
00:42:18.280 --> 00:42:19.280
I think I can.
1149
00:42:19.280 --> 00:42:20.280
Finding the stuff.
1150
00:42:20.280 --> 00:42:21.280
And then I compare it to like when you do pottery.
1151
00:42:21.280 --> 00:42:22.280
And you take all that clay.
1152
00:42:22.280 --> 00:42:23.280
Yes.
1153
00:42:23.280 --> 00:42:24.280
And you throw it on the wheel.
1154
00:42:24.280 --> 00:42:25.280
Yeah.
1155
00:42:25.280 --> 00:42:27.280
But it doesn't work unless you center it.
1156
00:42:27.280 --> 00:42:28.280
Yeah.
1157
00:42:28.280 --> 00:42:29.280
Yeah.
1158
00:42:29.280 --> 00:42:31.280
And that's what I do in my own space.
1159
00:42:31.280 --> 00:42:33.280
And so I wonder if there is this freedom now.
1160
00:42:33.280 --> 00:42:36.280
If we correctly learn how to create the culture and the community.
1161
00:42:36.280 --> 00:42:37.280
Yeah.
1162
00:42:37.280 --> 00:42:39.280
And not the pressures and the intensity of it.
1163
00:42:39.280 --> 00:42:40.280
Yeah.
1164
00:42:40.280 --> 00:42:42.280
And it's not always going to be easy life isn't that way.
1165
00:42:42.280 --> 00:42:46.280
But if there's a way to center your process, however you work,
1166
00:42:46.280 --> 00:42:49.280
the introverts, extroverts, something that ride the 50% line,
1167
00:42:49.280 --> 00:42:52.280
you know, like in the middle, like my wife does.
1168
00:42:52.280 --> 00:42:53.280
What do you call them?
1169
00:42:53.280 --> 00:42:54.280
Amberverts.
1170
00:42:54.280 --> 00:42:55.280
Amberverts.
1171
00:42:55.280 --> 00:42:58.280
And Jake, my best friend too, I think also identified as an Ambervert
1172
00:42:58.280 --> 00:42:59.280
for a long time.
1173
00:42:59.280 --> 00:43:00.280
There's a new one.
1174
00:43:00.280 --> 00:43:01.280
Oh, really?
1175
00:43:01.280 --> 00:43:02.280
And I've just, I need a little bird.
1176
00:43:02.280 --> 00:43:03.280
I need a little bird.
1177
00:43:03.280 --> 00:43:05.280
I need to learn not to try to do any specific reverts.
1178
00:43:05.280 --> 00:43:06.280
Probably.
1179
00:43:06.280 --> 00:43:07.280
I don't know.
1180
00:43:07.280 --> 00:43:08.280
I, on the last.
1181
00:43:08.280 --> 00:43:09.280
Would you call it?
1182
00:43:09.280 --> 00:43:10.280
Amberverts.
1183
00:43:10.280 --> 00:43:12.280
But no, there's another one that just came out.
1184
00:43:12.280 --> 00:43:14.280
But what we put it on is story like three days ago.
1185
00:43:14.280 --> 00:43:15.280
Do you need to check it?
1186
00:43:15.280 --> 00:43:16.280
Um, what is this?
1187
00:43:16.280 --> 00:43:17.280
We're in French.
1188
00:43:17.280 --> 00:43:18.280
I'm going to start using the word perfect.
1189
00:43:18.280 --> 00:43:19.280
It's a clever thing.
1190
00:43:19.280 --> 00:43:20.280
Yeah.
1191
00:43:20.280 --> 00:43:22.280
I watched about that theater episode where I was like,
1192
00:43:22.280 --> 00:43:24.280
let me teach you about theater.
1193
00:43:24.280 --> 00:43:26.280
I got so many things wrong.
1194
00:43:26.280 --> 00:43:28.280
It was very important.
1195
00:43:28.280 --> 00:43:29.280
What is it?
1196
00:43:29.280 --> 00:43:30.280
Oh, trove.
1197
00:43:30.280 --> 00:43:31.280
Oh trove.
1198
00:43:31.280 --> 00:43:33.280
What does that mean?
1199
00:43:33.280 --> 00:43:36.280
Well, as well as doing some research off camera.
1200
00:43:36.280 --> 00:43:37.280
Thanks God somebody else.
1201
00:43:37.280 --> 00:43:44.280
I think that's me.
1202
00:43:44.280 --> 00:43:45.280
Oh, that's me.
1203
00:43:45.280 --> 00:43:46.280
Really?
1204
00:43:46.280 --> 00:43:47.280
I think that's me.
1205
00:43:47.280 --> 00:43:48.280
Oh, try.
1206
00:43:48.280 --> 00:43:49.280
Wait a minute.
1207
00:43:49.280 --> 00:43:50.280
I got a hint.
1208
00:43:50.280 --> 00:43:52.280
The doge heard a long last year.
1209
00:43:52.280 --> 00:43:54.280
It's one last year.
1210
00:43:54.280 --> 00:44:01.060
An individual who's socially capable yet emotionally independent of group identity
1211
00:44:01.060 --> 00:44:05.160
That's me. I think that's me too. Oh, okay. We're all
1212
00:44:05.160 --> 00:44:09.260
Keep up opening up your group now that we've identified. And do we have to stop?
1213
00:44:10.020 --> 00:44:15.800
Don't talk. No, no, no, no, no. Sorry. I got the new call for us. Do you have like I?
1214
00:44:16.700 --> 00:44:21.320
Don't know if it's anxiety or maybe it's just like my maybe now I'm learning this is
1215
00:44:22.200 --> 00:44:25.000
Just built into my way of being I don't like
1216
00:44:25.900 --> 00:44:28.140
How can I say this I don't like
1217
00:44:28.840 --> 00:44:34.040
Joining up into groups. Yeah, and I don't know. I've been that way my entire life
1218
00:44:34.040 --> 00:44:38.780
Yeah, and I don't know why yeah me too and it's not that like I
1219
00:44:39.160 --> 00:44:43.940
Don't like people that are in groups like I just don't want to be a part of it
1220
00:44:43.940 --> 00:44:48.640
Like I'd much rather be off doing my own thing. I can enjoy what you're doing from afar, but I don't want to be
1221
00:44:49.280 --> 00:44:51.280
Part of it. It's maybe just
1222
00:44:52.960 --> 00:44:56.880
It feels to me like I like being in a group
1223
00:44:56.880 --> 00:45:01.000
I'm discovering that I like being in like we have a friend group that I keep
1224
00:45:01.360 --> 00:45:07.440
Will in it and I'm like guys we got to keep this thing rolling. What are we doing next like are we going to the beach or what?
1225
00:45:07.440 --> 00:45:14.400
But I think I've never been that person before, but I think it it bothers me to join a group that already has like a
1226
00:45:14.760 --> 00:45:16.760
pre-existing culture sometimes
1227
00:45:16.760 --> 00:45:20.940
And I'll notice thing. Yeah, it sounds really judgy when I get home and I'm like
1228
00:45:21.440 --> 00:45:23.320
Decomposing and processing it. I'm like well
1229
00:45:23.320 --> 00:45:30.120
It was fun for these reasons and I liked this person, but as a group they kind of bring out this weird thing in each other that I don't really want to
1230
00:45:30.120 --> 00:45:35.440
Fake for them and so I kind of well, I would attribute that to having options
1231
00:45:35.440 --> 00:45:38.720
I don't know what don't speak on this because you grew up in the small town
1232
00:45:38.720 --> 00:45:45.040
Yeah, but it's fair and when and speak your experience in what it means to be connected in a small town with our
1233
00:45:45.040 --> 00:45:49.200
Unoption you can't go to 15 in your schools or choose from you travel multiple different friends
1234
00:45:49.200 --> 00:45:55.080
Well, and by the way, whatever the story is you've come out on the other side like an incredible community builder
1235
00:45:55.080 --> 00:46:00.040
Everywhere you go teach us your way. Yeah, I think in high school it was like I
1236
00:46:01.120 --> 00:46:03.120
ran in so many different crowds
1237
00:46:03.960 --> 00:46:06.120
Probably literally no literally like
1238
00:46:08.360 --> 00:46:12.600
I ran with so many different people I never had like this like one
1239
00:46:13.000 --> 00:46:18.600
I'm gonna say click because it was high school. I never had this one click that I was like associated with I was like always like
1240
00:46:18.600 --> 00:46:26.760
Morefeen and I was like hanging out and yeah, like I was like I was a friend and I'm like I'm not saying that cuz I was probably a total
1241
00:46:26.760 --> 00:46:30.480
Brat in high school, but like I was like at least like friendly enough to be like
1242
00:46:30.480 --> 00:46:32.480
Yeah, how are you doing?
1243
00:46:32.480 --> 00:46:34.480
I will be totally honest
1244
00:46:35.040 --> 00:46:41.720
Me and Connor went back for Eastern Franklin and I do not speak to anyone from high school not even a single soul and
1245
00:46:42.600 --> 00:46:48.120
It's not on purpose. There is an intentional. It's really not unintentional. It's like I think
1246
00:46:49.080 --> 00:46:52.320
High school like frames what you want for your friends like in the real world
1247
00:46:52.320 --> 00:46:53.120
Mm-hmm
1248
00:46:53.120 --> 00:46:57.400
And so like I was always constantly like man like this is so small town drama
1249
00:46:57.400 --> 00:47:00.120
I want friends who like see this bigger picture that I do
1250
00:47:00.320 --> 00:47:05.720
So when I went to college and like got my real friends and then like when I got into Asheville and I've got like people
1251
00:47:05.720 --> 00:47:10.560
Who are all these different circles? I'm like? Oh, this is like mature. This is fun
1252
00:47:10.920 --> 00:47:12.920
It can also be child like
1253
00:47:13.640 --> 00:47:17.320
So yeah, I just run with a lot of different circles. So you used your
1254
00:47:18.840 --> 00:47:26.080
You experienced high school as a like a training. Yeah, and maybe this was what it is for all of us like we take it so seriously and I tell my kids like
1255
00:47:30.320 --> 00:47:36.480
I was like one of those people in high school like I did everything like I literally did everything and I
1256
00:47:36.480 --> 00:47:41.440
Sport and I'm ashamed. Yeah, I'm ashamed to miss admitted. I'm Mrs. FHS
1257
00:47:42.000 --> 00:47:45.400
For high school and like FHS like the high school Franklin
1258
00:47:46.280 --> 00:47:48.760
So I like I see that the queen
1259
00:47:48.760 --> 00:47:51.280
The problem we yes you were and I
1260
00:47:54.840 --> 00:47:59.040
Because I was like I hate to admit it because it's like
1261
00:47:59.280 --> 00:48:01.280
I'm the shit
1262
00:48:01.280 --> 00:48:07.360
That's true. It was like so for me. It was like so stereotypical like I thought when I got the college my friends
1263
00:48:07.360 --> 00:48:13.320
We're gonna make like so much fun of me because they were like oh you were that girl, but but isn't it beautiful like you didn't want it
1264
00:48:13.320 --> 00:48:15.320
And you got it. Yeah, yeah
1265
00:48:15.320 --> 00:48:21.000
For code to life that the things you don't want like the things you're like I could take it or leave it and then I was like you give it to
1266
00:48:21.720 --> 00:48:23.720
Tell me
1267
00:48:23.720 --> 00:48:31.440
It's just meered irony. I remember being a prom and I was just like shit talking on like the whole thing and I was like tell my friends
1268
00:48:31.440 --> 00:48:36.920
I was like guys like don't you think this is my trip when they are like like he shit talking the whole thing probably I know
1269
00:48:36.920 --> 00:48:41.160
I was just I think it's because like the non-chalant of not wanting something
1270
00:48:41.160 --> 00:48:46.680
But maybe secretly down. I don't know. Okay. Shalant is a word. Thank you for my name. Not non-chalant
1271
00:48:47.680 --> 00:48:53.000
Shalant yes like are you shalant? Are you non-chalant? I don't know to me. We should bring shalant into the
1272
00:48:53.720 --> 00:48:59.040
Vocabulary because they have non-chalant. Yeah, why can't I mean I'm shalant about it? I was not shalant about it
1273
00:48:59.040 --> 00:49:02.280
I also just wanted to get like I was so head focused
1274
00:49:02.280 --> 00:49:07.440
I was like I want to get out of my small town. I moved to Asheville. Okay, so you were pushing against it like you felt like you wanted to
1275
00:49:08.080 --> 00:49:12.360
Expand your yeah, I felt like my parents were like giving me this framework
1276
00:49:13.240 --> 00:49:19.440
To like see the world and then I was like coming back and I'm like guys look at this thing and a price like what the hell is this?
1277
00:49:19.720 --> 00:49:24.920
You need your people. Yeah, I need my people and I think that's what high school is for is because you get a taste of it
1278
00:49:24.920 --> 00:49:29.840
You've got these people in this proximity, but it's not like I don't mean there's high school best friends
1279
00:49:29.840 --> 00:49:36.600
But for me it wasn't like life-giving. It was more of a draining factor those four years than it was like a life-giving moment for me
1280
00:49:36.600 --> 00:49:40.800
I think that's good though because I think people that dwell in their high school is like the best years
1281
00:49:41.080 --> 00:49:47.280
They miss out on everything else that comes after because they're like always looking back and they still look exactly the same as they did in high school
1282
00:49:47.280 --> 00:49:51.440
Yeah, I don't want to crack it anyway, but there are people that are fine with that. Yeah
1283
00:49:51.840 --> 00:49:56.000
They're comfortable with right you think back and there's not an evolution that happened the growth
1284
00:49:56.000 --> 00:50:01.120
You miss out on the growth. I get really scared about stuff like that when it's like you're living in the past
1285
00:50:01.120 --> 00:50:03.680
I get really freaked out about stuff like that
1286
00:50:03.960 --> 00:50:05.960
Well, I do too because I live I
1287
00:50:05.960 --> 00:50:11.880
Well, I was here so early that I feel like this is my hometown right and I'm the only person that hasn't moved on to a town
1288
00:50:11.880 --> 00:50:16.520
That's not their hometown, but just so happens that my hometown became cool
1289
00:50:20.360 --> 00:50:25.040
Yeah, I'm like I'm not in the old town that's like no one wants to be at my town just got cool
1290
00:50:25.360 --> 00:50:27.360
Yeah, and I just from here you got lucky
1291
00:50:30.360 --> 00:50:33.800
I mean I don't think it's quite as isolated as Franklin
1292
00:50:33.880 --> 00:50:37.800
But like similar vibes a lot of people stay close home that kind of thing
1293
00:50:38.040 --> 00:50:44.520
Marion to Chapel Hill like Brawley Durham area to New York back to Asheville and I was like oh
1294
00:50:44.520 --> 00:50:48.840
Asheville is on the rise where it's like some places do you feel like oh it's
1295
00:50:48.840 --> 00:50:53.400
Inclining and I don't know Helena it and we kind of had a weird rough moment
1296
00:50:53.400 --> 00:50:55.640
But it definitely feels like something's brewing
1297
00:50:55.640 --> 00:50:59.480
And I feel like you'll always find your way back home. There you go
1298
00:51:00.360 --> 00:51:03.240
Did you see your Hannah Montana 30th? I love 20th?
1299
00:51:03.400 --> 00:51:05.400
Yes, I
1300
00:51:07.400 --> 00:51:09.400
I grew up on Hannah Montana
1301
00:51:09.960 --> 00:51:11.960
Did it give you a personality disorder you think
1302
00:51:14.680 --> 00:51:21.480
Maybe I've got all these all you know the closet the closet though like with the rotating theme
1303
00:51:22.440 --> 00:51:24.440
I have never watched me neither
1304
00:51:24.440 --> 00:51:27.240
I just found out that she was like a a singer
1305
00:51:27.480 --> 00:51:30.440
Miley yeah, you don't know I know Miley
1306
00:51:30.840 --> 00:51:36.600
No, that the actual show is about a singer. Yeah, not a singer in your life very meta
1307
00:51:37.160 --> 00:51:40.200
I didn't even know that no, I just found this out because I turned it on
1308
00:51:40.200 --> 00:51:43.000
Yeah, I was like what do you like about Hannah Montana? I just don't get it and
1309
00:51:43.800 --> 00:51:48.440
It was funny actually she created the 20th just by telling people it was gonna happen. Yeah
1310
00:51:48.920 --> 00:51:54.360
Yeah, yeah, she's just starting to tell people she just spread the word and then it forced the big guys to make this happen
1311
00:51:54.440 --> 00:51:58.920
But anyways when she said that they she in the show she was explaining this
1312
00:51:59.880 --> 00:52:02.680
I didn't even know that about it. I just I knew the show
1313
00:52:02.680 --> 00:52:06.360
I didn't know what the premise was and I saw on like tiktok or Instagram
1314
00:52:06.680 --> 00:52:10.760
They did like a cut screen of like she recreated the final scene. I guess and I saw that
1315
00:52:11.080 --> 00:52:14.920
But it was like a social experiment that they did on Miley Cyrus
1316
00:52:14.920 --> 00:52:19.720
Right, it was yeah, but here's the thing is that she's talking about like I was trying out
1317
00:52:19.720 --> 00:52:22.040
I didn't know how to get the part she was not so long. Mm-hmm
1318
00:52:22.760 --> 00:52:26.360
She's Billy race Cyrus's daughter. Yeah, she's dolly parton's god daughter
1319
00:52:26.440 --> 00:52:35.160
That's what she is like I hate that bullshit about people saying yes, I just worked so hard and I tried out and I could I didn't take her leave it
1320
00:52:35.240 --> 00:52:43.160
And they're not only were like this feels to me like my parents just assuming that I was gonna go to college on merit-based scholarship
1321
00:52:43.160 --> 00:52:46.520
Yeah, they're like our child the genius look at her at these scores
1322
00:52:46.680 --> 00:52:48.680
She's gonna we don't need to save for it
1323
00:52:49.800 --> 00:52:54.280
And that was not the case because by the time I went to college everybody else's parents were also like
1324
00:52:54.360 --> 00:52:58.360
Gunning for that stuff. And so yeah, you're competing with a lot of people. Yeah, we never mind
1325
00:52:58.600 --> 00:53:00.120
And this is like kind of
1326
00:53:00.360 --> 00:53:05.560
In Cindy area say like that guy was like let me just waste the conservative view in like a microwave
1327
00:53:05.800 --> 00:53:07.000
but like
1328
00:53:07.000 --> 00:53:11.800
There's also this push for diversity which is right and good and it should be happening
1329
00:53:12.120 --> 00:53:18.600
But it means that for the first time in American history anyway true like white people are having to like wake up and
1330
00:53:18.920 --> 00:53:22.440
But come excellent. We don't get it just for like rolling out of bed that morning
1331
00:53:22.680 --> 00:53:27.800
So I feel like from Miley Cyrus's perspective. She probably was up against a bunch of other girls
1332
00:53:28.040 --> 00:53:32.600
Well, she said she only did it so that she could get the guy back in her hometown a kid in high school
1333
00:53:32.600 --> 00:53:34.600
Don't you think she's peeing?
1334
00:53:34.600 --> 00:53:40.120
I don't like the bullshit story about like I'm waiting. I was gonna get it. I'm like you were
1335
00:53:41.080 --> 00:53:46.120
primed yeah, and you have every connection possibly make it happen for you
1336
00:53:46.920 --> 00:53:49.800
What if you take the word primed and instead you said groomed
1337
00:53:50.440 --> 00:53:53.240
Okay, what if you were like destined your whole life people
1338
00:53:53.240 --> 00:53:55.560
This was your function and you need to go perform it
1339
00:53:56.040 --> 00:54:00.840
And by the way you don't get to go home where your boss isn't watching you anymore because your boss is watching all the time
1340
00:54:00.840 --> 00:54:05.560
Trust me that the Michael Jackson. Yeah, by the way, there's a new movie coming. I know Michael
1341
00:54:06.280 --> 00:54:09.000
Okay, so tell me here. What is happening with Michael Jackson?
1342
00:54:09.000 --> 00:54:12.040
Because the first one not supposed to listen to him because I thought he was canceled
1343
00:54:13.000 --> 00:54:18.840
But I wonder if it's the Epstein vials have revealed something about his real role in trying to protect these kids
1344
00:54:19.160 --> 00:54:21.160
I've asked my kids if they know about this
1345
00:54:21.640 --> 00:54:23.640
But I think there's a lot of Instagram
1346
00:54:23.640 --> 00:54:30.920
Reels or like a viral thing happening where he was literally trying to protect them from Epstein and Epstein like people
1347
00:54:31.880 --> 00:54:35.880
Now that's not fry your brain because I grew up learning he was a pedophile
1348
00:54:35.960 --> 00:54:40.920
Yes, and then you know remember they had the documentary came out and then we were all supposed to like stop listening to his music
1349
00:54:42.040 --> 00:54:48.120
Yeah, well, it's like the artist from the art
1350
00:54:48.920 --> 00:54:50.920
It's the same with like Woody Allen
1351
00:54:50.920 --> 00:54:53.880
And these are like creepy dudes where you're like why do you make good things?
1352
00:54:54.440 --> 00:54:56.440
Are you horrible and make great things incredible
1353
00:54:57.560 --> 00:55:00.200
I do the Michael Jackson thing where he gets on his toes
1354
00:55:00.840 --> 00:55:04.520
Not on these shoes. I can't crease on it. Let's hold film a moon walk
1355
00:55:07.720 --> 00:55:09.720
But that was one of that's my connection to Michael Jackson
1356
00:55:12.040 --> 00:55:14.920
Actually, what's your perspective on Michael Jackson like not
1357
00:55:15.480 --> 00:55:18.760
Thank you. That's all yeah growing up in the 80s and like being a pop star
1358
00:55:19.400 --> 00:55:20.440
I just
1359
00:55:20.440 --> 00:55:22.600
Music I was like oh, this is really good
1360
00:55:22.760 --> 00:55:26.840
And I was like oh my you know like and I was telling my parents and they were like yes
1361
00:55:26.840 --> 00:55:29.000
So by the way apparently he's a pedophile and I was like
1362
00:55:29.720 --> 00:55:34.360
noted and then I would still go put it on in Spotify. So I don't know if that says something about my moral character
1363
00:55:34.840 --> 00:55:39.400
But that was my connection and none of us like I'm never really talking my friends
1364
00:55:39.880 --> 00:55:46.040
I will say this when I talk about Michael Jackson in my age a lot of older people are like you still listen to Michael Jackson really
1365
00:55:46.840 --> 00:55:50.120
Yeah, so that's like the only thing the rest of us were like oh
1366
00:55:50.360 --> 00:55:55.400
There's like really cool like high freels on tiktok to Michael Jackson song. So they're hype
1367
00:55:56.200 --> 00:56:00.920
You just reminded me something. Oh actually brought an idea into my mind. What about
1368
00:56:01.560 --> 00:56:05.640
Ideas coming to us remotely through these devices. I think
1369
00:56:05.800 --> 00:56:12.840
Remote ideas we talk about gravity and about like attracting things and I I can get really down about the world
1370
00:56:13.320 --> 00:56:18.280
Like if we start talking politics. I like don't know how to dig myself out of that hole at the time
1371
00:56:18.680 --> 00:56:25.640
Skill them building, but I am so jazzed to be alive during this time like I can get really down to mouth about it
1372
00:56:25.640 --> 00:56:28.280
But if I zoom out far enough, I'm like this is a crazy time
1373
00:56:28.360 --> 00:56:29.480
I'm so thankful
1374
00:56:29.480 --> 00:56:35.320
I got to experience the internet and like the connecting of the globe and the free flow of ideas
1375
00:56:35.320 --> 00:56:40.280
Which might be about to close down, you know, it was the Wild West when the internet started and we're slowly
1376
00:56:40.280 --> 00:56:44.040
I think it'll close down just as a consequence of it being
1377
00:56:44.440 --> 00:56:49.880
Inundated with AI. Yeah, I think it'll close down. I know I care about like server space and story
1378
00:56:49.880 --> 00:56:53.640
Yeah, trying to reckon with but the idea that I grew up when you could just like pirate music
1379
00:56:53.960 --> 00:56:57.000
You know, oh my god. Thanks for my music career. Thank you very much. Sorry
1380
00:56:57.480 --> 00:57:03.080
But as someone who really expanded my palette and I'm really thankful, but what about the first thing?
1381
00:57:03.080 --> 00:57:07.880
Go stream enemy lovers. The thing is that once that started happening music
1382
00:57:09.240 --> 00:57:11.640
ceased to get have it's it's
1383
00:57:12.600 --> 00:57:18.040
Regional taste. It's flavor now. We've got a global right every type of music started to be
1384
00:57:18.600 --> 00:57:27.080
Influence by all these different pieces and started being a melting pot of sounds versus like a Seattle sound or a national sound or a Memphis sound
1385
00:57:28.040 --> 00:57:33.480
South Florida Miami sound like they're used to being pockets of movements that would happen
1386
00:57:33.800 --> 00:57:38.440
But now our sounds and our ideas are drawn in remotely and then influence
1387
00:57:38.920 --> 00:57:42.280
What could have been real about that culture? What could have been authentic in that culture?
1388
00:57:42.680 --> 00:57:46.200
I think I'm going on the path that you maybe you're going on and I'm feeling
1389
00:57:46.440 --> 00:57:50.280
opposite of you really feel like it's blending out yeah because I
1390
00:57:51.000 --> 00:57:57.000
Was Justin Madrid, which is a city that I love and it was the first time I've been there a few times
1391
00:57:57.240 --> 00:57:59.080
It was the first time where I was like
1392
00:58:00.600 --> 00:58:03.880
There's too much American culture here like it was trying to be New York
1393
00:58:04.120 --> 00:58:12.280
They're like brunch spot and I'm like no there should not be brunch in Madrid like this goes against everything that's part of that culture
1394
00:58:12.680 --> 00:58:19.080
Yes, which is what I want to travel for eight hours on a plane to visit because I want something different
1395
00:58:19.640 --> 00:58:24.680
And I feel like all this ease of connectivity is really
1396
00:58:25.320 --> 00:58:32.840
Deluting new ideas exactly because we just want to like recycle and pass through the ideas that are out there already that are popular
1397
00:58:32.920 --> 00:58:36.440
And I don't think there's space for a lot of new ideas to come to the
1398
00:58:37.080 --> 00:58:42.120
Surface it's kind of like what you see in movies where you don't really see I mean the one you were talking about this morning
1399
00:58:42.120 --> 00:58:44.920
Maybe the project film area. I think that's one of the first
1400
00:58:46.040 --> 00:58:50.440
Um, like a fresh idea on the screen. Yeah, but all of them are like remakes. Yes
1401
00:58:51.080 --> 00:58:56.040
Remix is of the same thing and I think the internet is a remix and I'm not against the remix
1402
00:58:56.040 --> 00:58:58.920
This hip hop is killer and it all about the remix
1403
00:58:59.640 --> 00:59:02.920
But I wonder if when you don't have some sort of
1404
00:59:03.480 --> 00:59:09.480
Container or restriction. It's if it starts to be diluted. Yeah, because there's too many things being added
1405
00:59:10.120 --> 00:59:15.240
To give it its flavor like a richness. I don't know. Oh, sorry. There's no digital isolation
1406
00:59:15.720 --> 00:59:19.160
Like you can't it's so it's all like you know like you hear about like
1407
00:59:19.800 --> 00:59:22.840
Our great artists of time would go off and create their own art
1408
00:59:22.840 --> 00:59:27.160
But they had to do it away because they they wanted to have like their own mind
1409
00:59:27.320 --> 00:59:33.080
Influenza and I feel like there's that doesn't happen in the digital space exactly the mystery of our own ingenuity. Yeah
1410
00:59:33.800 --> 00:59:35.400
I wonder though
1411
00:59:35.400 --> 00:59:42.360
So like I live my partner Alex wonderful wonderful qualities. He has he does not get out of the house much
1412
00:59:42.600 --> 00:59:44.600
And we're working on that
1413
00:59:45.160 --> 00:59:47.160
He's
1414
00:59:49.160 --> 00:59:53.160
To balance my energy out. So I'm also called by yeah, he's well
1415
00:59:53.160 --> 00:59:59.160
He loves being around people who just like isn't gonna without the prompt go out and see things. So that's what I do
1416
00:59:59.480 --> 01:00:01.160
but he
1417
01:00:01.160 --> 01:00:04.920
He really does open my mind. He's this is the video games guy. You were talking the Reggie about you
1418
01:00:05.000 --> 01:00:07.000
We don't like video games, but he's working on me
1419
01:00:07.480 --> 01:00:14.760
He you know spin so much time online almost as if he's a generation younger. I think like he says he was raised by a TV
1420
01:00:14.760 --> 01:00:19.320
He's raised by Nintendo and he laughs about that. Sorry, Breton Lisa. We don't take it too seriously, but
1421
01:00:19.960 --> 01:00:20.920
He um
1422
01:00:21.000 --> 01:00:28.760
He is a big redditor. He doesn't pose but he works. Yeah, and he because he invests his time in energy in the space
1423
01:00:28.920 --> 01:00:30.920
He finds little mocks and crannies
1424
01:00:31.320 --> 01:00:39.240
He finds these little niche communities where people are there. So it's like a different form of it's a more sort of maybe intellectual
1425
01:00:39.400 --> 01:00:46.040
Or psychological grouping of people versus a regional grouping of people and from somewhere. I think it starts to
1426
01:00:46.760 --> 01:00:51.720
I do think there's gonna be a resurgence. I think it's already happening where people are like I'm tired of
1427
01:00:52.520 --> 01:00:58.280
The Americanized white lens being shown on my culture and like it getting mellowed out
1428
01:00:58.760 --> 01:01:03.720
I think people are starting to ask the question like where am I from and what does it mean to be from that place?
1429
01:01:04.200 --> 01:01:09.000
I'm right. Yeah, I think being from I'm just moving back to Asheville has really
1430
01:01:09.560 --> 01:01:13.400
Put this in perspective for me. There's a lot of stuff about I'm looking at you because I'm like Appalachian
1431
01:01:14.040 --> 01:01:21.240
Well, there's a lot of stuff about Appalachian culture that I think hurt me as a kid like that change to I was in ways that
1432
01:01:21.880 --> 01:01:23.880
Yeah, I'm not really always proud of
1433
01:01:24.200 --> 01:01:27.320
But there's also like we are a flavor of white person
1434
01:01:27.880 --> 01:01:32.600
Like we're one of the segments of white people that I'm like, oh, we've got something
1435
01:01:33.320 --> 01:01:36.360
I'm not sure. It's not like purely good. We have dolly part
1436
01:01:36.680 --> 01:01:44.920
We've got dolly for dolly part. Yeah, but it's made me and my brother moved home and we've got all these things happening
1437
01:01:44.920 --> 01:01:49.480
But it makes me a lot prouder to be like, oh, yeah, I'm gonna take this piece of Appalachian culture
1438
01:01:49.640 --> 01:01:53.480
This belongs to me and like let's not let this part die off like playing a bandro
1439
01:01:54.040 --> 01:01:56.600
Did you imagine us having this conversation while I'm just like
1440
01:01:56.600 --> 01:01:58.600
I
1441
01:02:01.800 --> 01:02:06.680
Okay, so back to the Alex niche thing as I think it's a rebellion against what we're talking about
1442
01:02:06.680 --> 01:02:08.680
I don't think it's because of what we're talking about
1443
01:02:08.680 --> 01:02:12.520
I think it's gotten so people are so fed up like my son's fed up with culture
1444
01:02:13.000 --> 01:02:17.160
He was wanting real life culture. It's just like the culture that mainstream culture
1445
01:02:17.400 --> 01:02:22.280
And he wants to niche into his gamers guys. Yeah, he will speak his language
1446
01:02:22.280 --> 01:02:26.920
So I wonder if it's not a result of it. Well, it's the consequence of it or the it is a result of it
1447
01:02:26.920 --> 01:02:30.440
But I don't think it's fed it. I think it's caused a reversion
1448
01:02:31.240 --> 01:02:36.760
To me shing to creating these things where people actually care about each other. It's not just advertising and marketing
1449
01:02:37.480 --> 01:02:42.600
I know rather people did that in person. It's not that. I think it's cool. I love a repeal rebel against the man
1450
01:02:44.440 --> 01:02:48.680
There you Alex you're an insurgent the man I
1451
01:02:49.640 --> 01:02:55.720
Yeah, I just I think it is neither better nor worse. It's just different. But I
1452
01:02:57.000 --> 01:02:59.880
I agree that we should not let all these
1453
01:03:00.680 --> 01:03:02.600
valuable rich
1454
01:03:02.600 --> 01:03:08.680
Interesting cultures just completely get assimilated or annihilated by whatever it is we're putting out there
1455
01:03:09.000 --> 01:03:12.920
I remember when I was setting when guistics in school they were talking about how quickly
1456
01:03:13.400 --> 01:03:18.600
Different languages are dying off yeah, and sometimes I think about culture through that lens is like culture is music
1457
01:03:18.760 --> 01:03:22.680
So much. Yeah, and there already has been and I think that's
1458
01:03:23.400 --> 01:03:26.840
I'm gonna blame colonialism. I'm gonna blame on some level patriarchy
1459
01:03:26.920 --> 01:03:32.520
But um, I think that we're waking up to it. So yeah, let's call it immature patriarchy. Sure agree
1460
01:03:32.600 --> 01:03:39.000
immature boy men trying to yeah dominate everything. Yeah, I yeah, I feel I'm more of a egalitarian, but um, yeah
1461
01:03:39.080 --> 01:03:42.920
I do think the idea that something has been lost that is true to me
1462
01:03:43.480 --> 01:03:48.440
But I also think there's not that's not to say that it can't be like found rediscovered
1463
01:03:48.520 --> 01:03:53.880
I think this is one of the reasons I love older people like they just remember a different version of the world
1464
01:03:53.960 --> 01:03:58.360
And I'm fascinated by that. I love old people too. Yeah, I just wish we could like
1465
01:03:59.240 --> 01:04:01.000
bring old people back
1466
01:04:01.000 --> 01:04:04.840
Our culture doesn't really admire or they couldn't do anything like go away
1467
01:04:04.840 --> 01:04:11.320
We don't want to see you like I dream of a time when you could sit around a fire and hear from the old people
1468
01:04:11.640 --> 01:04:15.400
Like why learn from them? Yeah, should we schedule something?
1469
01:04:15.400 --> 01:04:17.400
Thank you
1470
01:04:17.400 --> 01:04:19.800
All person fire gathering we'll put it on the calendar
1471
01:04:19.960 --> 01:04:26.840
Also, here's the thing is I also think old people have also lost the practice. Yeah, yes, because if you sit with an old person
1472
01:04:27.320 --> 01:04:29.640
It's like the culture has trained us to kind of
1473
01:04:30.520 --> 01:04:36.440
I don't know if it's trained them that they don't matter. Yeah, I think that's it's hard to get something out of them
1474
01:04:36.440 --> 01:04:39.400
I think like they're yeah, they're like they're not relevant. Yeah
1475
01:04:40.040 --> 01:04:45.240
They've been just they've watched other elders be disrespected and they're expecting that right
1476
01:04:45.640 --> 01:04:47.640
And society like my
1477
01:04:47.640 --> 01:04:51.000
Guys are asking like what do we do in Easter my neighbor turned 80
1478
01:04:51.560 --> 01:04:55.080
She's a twin and she still looks yeah, she still is by herself
1479
01:04:55.720 --> 01:05:01.800
Wow, she's fabulous. She's like a no she was an artist her whole life, and so she threw a big like potluck party
1480
01:05:02.520 --> 01:05:04.520
And oh my god, I just lost my turn
1481
01:05:04.520 --> 01:05:06.520
Sorry, welcome to
1482
01:05:07.000 --> 01:05:10.200
I know the story tell it. I've ever been to in my life
1483
01:05:10.840 --> 01:05:12.840
So good with the point of the whole idea
1484
01:05:13.560 --> 01:05:17.560
Kotluck, we do this all the time. I feel like that words got to be in this
1485
01:05:18.840 --> 01:05:20.840
We need to put potluck in it
1486
01:05:25.000 --> 01:05:28.040
What I was going to say is we're talking about like is it society?
1487
01:05:28.920 --> 01:05:33.720
And I think our society is evolving without thinking about elders at all
1488
01:05:34.760 --> 01:05:40.760
She has this little sleep this little sleep app actually really impressed like she researched it online
1489
01:05:41.160 --> 01:05:46.600
Yes, the full device she puts on our finger. Is it an or ring? It's not an aura, but it's it's like that
1490
01:05:47.000 --> 01:05:52.040
Where but it's just for measuring like her sleep potential sleep app yet. Wow
1491
01:05:52.920 --> 01:05:55.640
So she went she she bought it online, which is a big thing
1492
01:05:56.440 --> 01:06:00.760
Yeah, but she couldn't get it to work and she was like I try and call in customer service
1493
01:06:00.760 --> 01:06:06.360
Which we know how that goes and then she was like they said the Bluetooth and this and that and I was like you know what?
1494
01:06:06.680 --> 01:06:13.240
Our whole society has evolved leaving behind like a whole generation of people just expecting that they're going to like
1495
01:06:14.040 --> 01:06:18.440
Somehow or not participate in it like it's just it was really rude
1496
01:06:18.520 --> 01:06:20.760
I felt like offended for her that I
1497
01:06:21.320 --> 01:06:24.920
And if you go to any place where the people yeah, it's super depressing
1498
01:06:24.920 --> 01:06:28.920
Yes, I have a friend that went he was he suffered um
1499
01:06:30.760 --> 01:06:32.760
West Nile virus
1500
01:06:33.080 --> 01:06:36.600
From a mosquito bite around the region, which is kind of scary anyway
1501
01:06:36.600 --> 01:06:41.160
He was paralyzed in his leg and he was staying at this place. It's supposed to be a rehab
1502
01:06:41.960 --> 01:06:43.960
physical rehab, but
1503
01:06:45.000 --> 01:06:50.600
Almost like they're just sitting watching TV waiting to die. Yeah, so walking down this
1504
01:06:51.480 --> 01:06:53.880
There's so many stories. There's so many like
1505
01:06:54.600 --> 01:06:58.760
Wiz pieces of wisdom that are lying around in this place
1506
01:06:59.400 --> 01:07:05.240
Absolutely just kind of imprisoned. Yeah, so true. We my mom has thought for many years
1507
01:07:05.320 --> 01:07:09.000
I wish she'd do this Allison. This is your sign get off your ass and do this project
1508
01:07:09.320 --> 01:07:11.320
She's talked about
1509
01:07:14.600 --> 01:07:21.240
She's talked about doing an oral history project and just going and sitting with older people and like collecting the stories of the region
1510
01:07:21.560 --> 01:07:26.200
My grandpa died. I asked my grandma if she could write what she remembered of him in a story
1511
01:07:26.600 --> 01:07:30.280
Because you realize when you lose someone that that was the person holding it
1512
01:07:30.600 --> 01:07:36.280
Yeah, they were holding the memories of their life and that their family and it wasn't a device holding it
1513
01:07:39.320 --> 01:07:43.480
And so what when she wrote it down and I got to read it is like how I should have asked her before
1514
01:07:44.360 --> 01:07:47.080
My grandpa died. Yeah, because then I would have known his story
1515
01:07:47.640 --> 01:07:50.200
And you think you know some of the story especially people close to you
1516
01:07:50.600 --> 01:07:52.600
But there's so many things that we don't know about each other
1517
01:07:53.400 --> 01:07:59.080
Experiencing these little universes in our cell we're never sitting around a fire with nothing else to do like so we're to come from bud
1518
01:07:59.320 --> 01:08:03.320
Yeah, we're like I have five minutes for coffee on Thursday and it's true
1519
01:08:03.320 --> 01:08:06.360
What are you trying to use it and the little thing your pocket buzzing the whole thing?
1520
01:08:06.360 --> 01:08:13.320
I guess why yeah because the intrinsic value of spending time with each other has been stolen by the reward of time is money
1521
01:08:13.560 --> 01:08:18.520
Yes, once you start paying people for their time you start to lose the intrinsic value of time
1522
01:08:19.000 --> 01:08:23.320
It's a waste of time and some people don't even have enough time to let someone get a full sentence out
1523
01:08:23.320 --> 01:08:26.600
That's what we started using letters. Yeah, that's true. Come to ideas
1524
01:08:27.320 --> 01:08:35.160
So I wonder in this remote world because a lot I think a lot of these things are because everything is so remote
1525
01:08:36.040 --> 01:08:42.920
Whether it's ideas. Yeah, we're distancing ourselves slowly the lack of culture like being dismembered from culture like I grew up in church
1526
01:08:43.000 --> 01:08:47.960
Because my dad was a pastor and we moved kind of like a military family or an army family where you move
1527
01:08:48.680 --> 01:08:52.520
As a child I moved five six times. I never knew where I was from
1528
01:08:53.240 --> 01:08:56.280
I went to every elementary school everyone knew me, but I didn't know where I was from
1529
01:08:57.080 --> 01:09:02.040
So when you have this remote movement happening especially in our in in our businesses
1530
01:09:02.840 --> 01:09:09.800
Where do we find that authenticity that culture like how do you craft that or not craft it even because I think that comes off as like
1531
01:09:10.200 --> 01:09:15.960
Premeditated and manufactured. How do you reveal the culture of the uniqueness that we possess?
1532
01:09:16.600 --> 01:09:20.200
Because we all bring something unique to this world. I know that as a fact and I call it fate
1533
01:09:20.520 --> 01:09:21.880
Yeah, you have a fate
1534
01:09:21.880 --> 01:09:24.840
It's the destiny is shared, but the fate you have is unique
1535
01:09:25.400 --> 01:09:28.920
How do you find that if you're inundated and held up by all this stuff? Good question
1536
01:09:29.080 --> 01:09:32.040
So like if we were gonna have an agency that has a virtual office
1537
01:09:32.760 --> 01:09:36.920
Maybe there's a place where that remote that freedom that comes in being remote
1538
01:09:37.720 --> 01:09:42.280
Is where we allow the culture to happen and bring it back
1539
01:09:43.240 --> 01:09:48.840
Well, I love that and I've also been thinking a lot about you know someone who like
1540
01:09:49.400 --> 01:09:53.800
grew up I went to college in New York. I stayed there my entire adult life
1541
01:09:54.200 --> 01:09:59.880
And always having a little of an egocentric point of view of New York being the center of culture. I mean they are just better
1542
01:10:00.120 --> 01:10:05.800
You know, I love New York, but and I will always be my home. Sorry. I keep doing that. It's always being my home
1543
01:10:07.480 --> 01:10:09.480
I'll be my home
1544
01:10:12.680 --> 01:10:14.680
It's good to be a posture I feel like
1545
01:10:15.320 --> 01:10:17.320
And tell this back
1546
01:10:20.200 --> 01:10:22.200
So she's a New Yorker we get it
1547
01:10:22.920 --> 01:10:23.720
Okay
1548
01:10:24.360 --> 01:10:27.640
And I think Asheville has really taught me this is that
1549
01:10:28.920 --> 01:10:34.360
Actually, I think the interesting culture is happening in these little micro pockets of places that aren't
1550
01:10:35.000 --> 01:10:42.280
The big city that have a big machine behind them that needs especially nowadays needs to keep running and
1551
01:10:42.680 --> 01:10:47.320
To keep being fed and manufactured. Yeah, and I feel like it's in all these
1552
01:10:48.040 --> 01:10:52.600
Small places where people are I know we're talking about people not feeling connected here
1553
01:10:52.600 --> 01:10:57.560
But I do feel like people in Asheville are more connected to each other than I have experienced
1554
01:10:58.360 --> 01:11:02.360
Living in New York. Colleen was a great example of that. Yeah, I was so impressed
1555
01:11:02.520 --> 01:11:06.120
Yeah, but I think like the the interesting little cultural
1556
01:11:06.600 --> 01:11:08.760
Sizzle is happening in these smaller places
1557
01:11:09.560 --> 01:11:11.560
I think it happening behind
1558
01:11:11.560 --> 01:11:16.520
The curtain. I think it is. He knows yet. They're not getting credit for it. I'm sure he's not onto it yet
1559
01:11:17.560 --> 01:11:19.560
But I just don't know
1560
01:11:19.560 --> 01:11:24.040
You know like when everything someone wants to like bring something like this is a good idea. This is a good trend
1561
01:11:24.360 --> 01:11:29.640
We'd like destroyed. You know, we go like hardcore like we take it 150% like Asheville
1562
01:11:29.720 --> 01:11:33.400
I'll use up my own account when someone found out about craft brewing
1563
01:11:34.840 --> 01:11:36.840
I can see that
1564
01:11:36.840 --> 01:11:42.280
It become a craft brewer. Yeah, and we need a hundred craft brewery. We have like a guild like a brewer's gill
1565
01:11:44.440 --> 01:11:49.400
And then you have craft beer tours and you it's like everyone got on the same thing
1566
01:11:50.120 --> 01:11:57.080
And like ultra to optimize or or like capitalize on the idea versus it being this thing that just is happy like you craft beer
1567
01:11:57.080 --> 01:12:01.160
It's cool. Yeah, let's make craft beer marketing. But I agree. I agree
1568
01:12:01.800 --> 01:12:04.680
Mostly men. I'm sure there's some female brewers out there. I
1569
01:12:05.400 --> 01:12:11.400
Carlyle who we are gonna have in the studio hopefully in a week or two her husband is a brewer his next Tyler
1570
01:12:11.720 --> 01:12:17.320
Really awesome couple and they move from Florida where he was also a brewer and I think they moved to Asheville in part
1571
01:12:17.640 --> 01:12:21.640
I think he got a job, but I want to say Hillman or somewhere like that
1572
01:12:22.120 --> 01:12:27.800
And I went to there's a conference that we hold in Asheville at the Civic Center put on by the guild
1573
01:12:27.880 --> 01:12:32.360
I went with her to that because she loves in particular designing packaging and
1574
01:12:32.680 --> 01:12:36.200
Dice for like breweries because they're in the culture. They're such a culture
1575
01:12:36.680 --> 01:12:38.920
Not just like the money making culture, but like
1576
01:12:39.480 --> 01:12:46.120
Understanding the science of brewing and experimenting almost like artistry. Yeah, so I think you're right
1577
01:12:46.200 --> 01:12:48.680
It's probably driven by like oh, we can make a mint in it
1578
01:12:48.840 --> 01:12:50.120
I think there's this
1579
01:12:50.120 --> 01:12:54.360
Exciting like creative juice. It's like there were the arts district. That's the good part of it
1580
01:12:54.360 --> 01:12:56.200
That's the identity or the heart of it
1581
01:12:56.360 --> 01:13:02.120
But then branding and marketing comes around and says let's make this into money. Yeah, and it just joins it
1582
01:13:02.120 --> 01:13:09.160
It like that's right. I mean even the even musical movements like rung or pop it will not pop pop probably is the problem
1583
01:13:09.160 --> 01:13:13.320
But grunge and hardcore and like all these underground movements
1584
01:13:13.800 --> 01:13:19.480
Get popularized and then get destroyed like it totally removes the movement
1585
01:13:20.760 --> 01:13:22.760
I think we're talking about capitalism
1586
01:13:22.760 --> 01:13:26.760
Yeah, I don't like it or not
1587
01:13:27.400 --> 01:13:29.720
How do I even know if I like it because I grew up in capitalism
1588
01:13:29.720 --> 01:13:32.920
So what is this feast that we're living in and especially owning your own business?
1589
01:13:32.920 --> 01:13:34.920
You're like well, I need to
1590
01:13:37.080 --> 01:13:40.920
I need it so people can have jobs and you have to be part of the system
1591
01:13:40.920 --> 01:13:48.120
But then I also find myself being like the system has been engineered in a way that no longer works for
1592
01:13:48.920 --> 01:13:52.440
Like regular people. Well, if you're trying it doesn't work
1593
01:13:52.440 --> 01:13:57.240
But maybe if we just let go and we're like I don't want to be prom queen. Okay, get this. This is gonna be good
1594
01:13:57.800 --> 01:13:59.800
The nonscience the nonscience
1595
01:14:00.760 --> 01:14:02.760
Just gonna be a shawant statement
1596
01:14:03.880 --> 01:14:09.320
Tim doesn't know that there is really he can't lie to you and nor do I and I think that's one of the things that I wanted
1597
01:14:09.960 --> 01:14:12.120
And I wonder if that's why my son learned the word he's like this
1598
01:14:13.800 --> 01:14:17.000
But there is a study right now about the growth economy
1599
01:14:17.960 --> 01:14:22.680
Because growth has defined innovation for many many years
1600
01:14:23.400 --> 01:14:29.640
But the statistics around what it has provided in medicine and food and progress is off the charts
1601
01:14:30.200 --> 01:14:33.000
But guess what it is just started to fall
1602
01:14:34.040 --> 01:14:37.080
So all that has been learned through growth
1603
01:14:37.880 --> 01:14:42.680
Like we believe growth is like in capitalism growth is a necessity everything must grow or it dies
1604
01:14:43.800 --> 01:14:45.800
And that's why companies grow into the point of
1605
01:14:45.880 --> 01:14:51.800
Consuming everything else because they just have to yep, but what we're what the research is finding is that growth
1606
01:14:52.600 --> 01:14:55.560
All the benefits it brought are now. It's a detraction
1607
01:14:56.120 --> 01:14:57.960
This obsession with growth
1608
01:14:57.960 --> 01:15:02.280
But we're still using the scarcity mind to keep growing
1609
01:15:02.760 --> 01:15:05.560
Like you don't have enough and this is the whole thing with branding that I have
1610
01:15:05.960 --> 01:15:10.040
The crisis internally about is that branding we're selling something a product
1611
01:15:11.160 --> 01:15:14.280
Is built on telling someone they need the product. Yeah
1612
01:15:15.240 --> 01:15:19.560
Yeah, you have to actually talk to them talk them into believing they're not enough and that they need this thing
1613
01:15:19.560 --> 01:15:25.160
Yeah, that's how you're going to get happiness and feel fulfillment. Yep. All these things that should be intrinsic and not human
1614
01:15:25.960 --> 01:15:27.560
So there is this
1615
01:15:28.520 --> 01:15:33.960
Our minds in its scarcity has grown to this level that we're at now where
1616
01:15:34.440 --> 01:15:41.480
And this is a part of the research which blew my mind. There is I think one and a half times enough food in the world to feed everyone
1617
01:15:42.120 --> 01:15:48.840
The production. Yes, this is real a real study. Huh? What in a half times we could feed literally everyone right now
1618
01:15:48.840 --> 01:15:52.200
So is it all going to waste? It's not productive. Yes, it's a distribution thing
1619
01:15:52.840 --> 01:15:58.600
It's a control thing. It's there is you have to be dissatisfied in this culture for capitalism to work
1620
01:15:58.760 --> 01:15:59.640
That is true
1621
01:15:59.640 --> 01:16:04.360
So if you're not dissatisfied I never would think care of and then people will say well, are we going to be motivated if we're not in this growth
1622
01:16:04.840 --> 01:16:09.720
Yeah, time and the thing about it is that motivation existed before capitalism was ever invented
1623
01:16:09.720 --> 01:16:11.720
It's been driven by creativity exactly
1624
01:16:12.040 --> 01:16:14.040
And that has always been a part of human humanity
1625
01:16:14.120 --> 01:16:17.480
Yeah, and so we're going to start experiencing
1626
01:16:17.960 --> 01:16:22.600
Whether or not the test of whether or not growth at all costs is benefiting anyone
1627
01:16:22.840 --> 01:16:26.440
Yeah, or we all drive in ourselves off the cliff. Yeah, because we're intrinsic we're
1628
01:16:27.000 --> 01:16:28.520
extrinsically
1629
01:16:28.520 --> 01:16:32.280
Value driven money money as Justin Bieber said
1630
01:16:33.000 --> 01:16:35.800
I know this because my daughter's a fever fever
1631
01:16:36.600 --> 01:16:40.200
Money money money. Oh, he said that money money money. See I went abba
1632
01:16:42.760 --> 01:16:45.880
I think you're right and I feel like
1633
01:16:46.680 --> 01:16:50.120
The distribution problem is a solvent one and I think definitely solvable
1634
01:16:50.120 --> 01:16:54.760
I'm sort of back to like am I bummed or am I excited to be living this time
1635
01:16:55.160 --> 01:16:58.920
I really believe I'm going to see the solution. I'm not going to see the
1636
01:16:59.480 --> 01:17:03.320
The ultimate solution. You are I hope I'm not going to see the openness
1637
01:17:03.480 --> 01:17:07.560
I don't think I'm it's never going to end right, but some of these things that we're bringing up
1638
01:17:07.720 --> 01:17:13.560
I'm like, ah, I live on the tipping point. Yeah, I'm hoping I'm hoping that I get to see it before
1639
01:17:13.720 --> 01:17:19.640
I'm older and so that I can talk I get to see the renaissance and I get to see the rebuild instead of just the falling down
1640
01:17:19.640 --> 01:17:21.720
But that's the part I'm not sure about our work
1641
01:17:22.120 --> 01:17:26.360
Yeah, make this is to make me start it like we're the push because we are in brand
1642
01:17:26.760 --> 01:17:28.920
I mean, we're not going to say anymore because we kind of have an issue
1643
01:17:28.920 --> 01:17:31.640
I'm telling people not to use brand anymore. We're a creative studio
1644
01:17:31.960 --> 01:17:36.200
And I'm like a desire and I love it. It's about identity. Yeah, we aren't we identify with things
1645
01:17:36.200 --> 01:17:42.040
But use it to change the system. Yeah, don't use it to just add more nonsense to the system
1646
01:17:42.040 --> 01:17:47.800
I brought that would be at the goal. You should look at this book. Yeah, I did and the brandy or the I need to fest
1647
01:17:48.520 --> 01:17:51.640
I did buy it on Amazon. So think about that for a minute
1648
01:17:51.880 --> 01:17:57.480
But an Amazon's in the book. They sold me propaganda against them. Have you seen the good place?
1649
01:17:58.200 --> 01:18:00.200
Yeah
1650
01:18:01.000 --> 01:18:03.000
Oh, yeah, but
1651
01:18:06.520 --> 01:18:11.480
But there it wasn't being sold anywhere that I could find it locally. So talk about distribution of ideas
1652
01:18:12.600 --> 01:18:14.600
But we do live in such a clinical time
1653
01:18:14.600 --> 01:18:18.040
We do which one could say that AI could help with all of this
1654
01:18:18.600 --> 01:18:19.800
Imagine
1655
01:18:19.800 --> 01:18:28.520
Because AI is supposed to and it's most utopian state be able to stop us needing to have to grow because it's gonna
1656
01:18:28.600 --> 01:18:33.160
It's gonna provide these things for us that we spent our time trying to acquire and grow. So
1657
01:18:33.960 --> 01:18:36.760
I as much as every this may be controversial
1658
01:18:37.080 --> 01:18:42.760
Oh, yeah, we were talking about I just feel like in the creative field everyone is so anti-AI
1659
01:18:43.000 --> 01:18:47.560
How we're so fearful and there I do I understand the slop issue
1660
01:18:47.800 --> 01:18:50.280
I got that but I also see how
1661
01:18:50.760 --> 01:18:58.760
It could be super beneficial if we could put some good parameters around it and use it in the ways that
1662
01:18:59.880 --> 01:19:05.240
I think it actually help us as humans. Yeah, and maybe part of that is in this branding design field
1663
01:19:05.960 --> 01:19:11.240
It can take away some of our tasks that were really labor intensive and let us be human together again
1664
01:19:11.720 --> 01:19:16.280
Yeah, and free up the extra time to be human to then be creative to make things
1665
01:19:16.680 --> 01:19:18.680
So I don't hate AI. Sorry
1666
01:19:19.320 --> 01:19:21.320
Everyone all my peers are gonna slay me
1667
01:19:22.200 --> 01:19:25.320
Well, it'll come back around and people will be like she was so wise even
1668
01:19:27.320 --> 01:19:29.320
Archive this podcast
1669
01:19:29.560 --> 01:19:31.560
It's gonna
1670
01:19:31.560 --> 01:19:36.680
I'm really um, I realized last night. I was like oh right before I met Tim and Reggie
1671
01:19:36.680 --> 01:19:38.200
I got really into
1672
01:19:38.280 --> 01:19:42.360
Conceptually into the idea of these long form video or like
1673
01:19:42.920 --> 01:19:49.320
Self-film projects and I actually started one in 2024 before all of my life fell apart and I have a little bit of the
1674
01:19:49.640 --> 01:19:50.920
Devolution
1675
01:19:51.080 --> 01:19:53.080
So that's gonna be fun to post one day
1676
01:19:53.160 --> 01:19:55.160
But the idea of like a time capsule
1677
01:19:55.720 --> 01:20:01.240
Like this is a moment captured in time and what a crazy thing that I'm gonna get morbid. Sorry
1678
01:20:01.720 --> 01:20:05.560
Like we could in 30 years. Let's give ourselves 70 years
1679
01:20:05.640 --> 01:20:08.040
We're gonna technology's gonna be crazy. We're gonna live forever
1680
01:20:08.440 --> 01:20:13.800
But like we will die and somebody could go back and find like your greatest hit
1681
01:20:14.040 --> 01:20:16.280
Yeah, you know, not to like maybe not your voice
1682
01:20:16.680 --> 01:20:18.680
We'll speak tasteful about the funeral. Should we?
1683
01:20:18.920 --> 01:20:24.520
But like it's there and so I'm really into the idea of this as like a long form art project
1684
01:20:25.000 --> 01:20:28.680
We were turned to and like we're we're making something that means something to us
1685
01:20:29.080 --> 01:20:32.840
But there will be I'm studying some other people as well. There's gonna be
1686
01:20:33.080 --> 01:20:37.080
It's gonna get worse before it gets better. Oh, I think it's definitely gonna get worse
1687
01:20:37.080 --> 01:20:39.080
It's gonna people you're gonna go into the sludge
1688
01:20:39.160 --> 01:20:45.640
Yeah, you're gonna feel like everything you said is stupid and everybody hates you and like nothing
1689
01:20:45.640 --> 01:20:48.760
Yeah, and then give it like another year or two maybe a little more
1690
01:20:49.560 --> 01:20:53.080
These days as well and it's accelerated. Yeah, so I don't know
1691
01:20:53.080 --> 01:20:57.560
I know you watched a lot of sci-fi and I grew up watching a lot of sci-fi
1692
01:20:58.280 --> 01:21:00.120
So
1693
01:21:00.120 --> 01:21:06.360
Adrian's house one time and many things I did strangely but one of the things was I
1694
01:21:07.000 --> 01:21:11.240
Watch like almost a whole season of Star Trek the next generation
1695
01:21:11.800 --> 01:21:13.800
It's an unheard show
1696
01:21:13.800 --> 01:21:16.120
And yeah, I couldn't get that off of that show anyway
1697
01:21:16.840 --> 01:21:21.400
You watch the last sci-fi growing up. I want and next generation was one of the big shows
1698
01:21:22.600 --> 01:21:24.600
Jean-Luc
1699
01:21:25.480 --> 01:21:29.400
And it's firing figure even nowadays in my life. Yeah, sometimes we need to do that
1700
01:21:30.200 --> 01:21:32.200
24 yes
1701
01:21:34.040 --> 01:21:37.240
Maybe because of all the sci-fi I see
1702
01:21:37.800 --> 01:21:42.840
Yeah, the potential and I'm like we can do it and AI is like one of those tools that can get us to be there
1703
01:21:42.920 --> 01:21:44.920
I just don't trust the
1704
01:21:45.720 --> 01:21:47.720
politician
1705
01:21:49.080 --> 01:21:51.080
That are
1706
01:21:51.320 --> 01:21:57.800
Managing it right now. So maybe the revolution is like and who gets to manage the AI who gets to take control of it because right now
1707
01:21:57.800 --> 01:21:59.800
I don't trust them
1708
01:21:59.960 --> 01:22:01.960
And I don't know how that culture changes
1709
01:22:02.200 --> 01:22:07.960
Yeah, the tech Ann Arkey. Have you heard about it? Yeah, I mean the happening guys put that one in there
1710
01:22:07.960 --> 01:22:11.560
Yeah, I thought that's a good idea. Well, I'm so sorry. Could you write that one down to you?
1711
01:22:12.520 --> 01:22:17.160
Tech Ann Arkey. We're gonna need anyway. We're probably, you know, we probably need to wrap this
1712
01:22:17.880 --> 01:22:21.560
So I guess you brought up something which I think is something that we should bring back around
1713
01:22:21.560 --> 01:22:24.040
It's happened. I have this problem where we can never end the podcast
1714
01:22:25.080 --> 01:22:26.920
the capsule
1715
01:22:26.920 --> 01:22:28.920
in and I grew up
1716
01:22:29.400 --> 01:22:31.160
I'm gonna tell you out there make
1717
01:22:31.880 --> 01:22:38.520
Videos for yourself where you're talking to yourself. Mm-hmm. It's like a journal, but it allows you to process
1718
01:22:39.800 --> 01:22:41.800
A thing like prompt yourself with a question
1719
01:22:42.600 --> 01:22:46.440
It's a captain vlog. Oh, yeah, it's like captain's log starting whatever
1720
01:22:47.080 --> 01:22:51.480
And then you start to go through sometimes we loop around the same ideas over and over
1721
01:22:51.960 --> 01:22:55.720
And we we experience this when we're doing your your pva
1722
01:22:55.880 --> 01:23:01.240
We do this thing in 40 hard to call the vision accelerator and we did one for Dylan or like personal vision and
1723
01:23:01.880 --> 01:23:07.400
And where we're going and sometimes we loop around the question in kind of a dark mysterious space
1724
01:23:07.880 --> 01:23:13.880
And it never feels solved until you lay it out there and you're like oh, I these all these make sense together
1725
01:23:13.880 --> 01:23:18.760
All these ideas. I'm having make sense. They're not a confusing circle. They're actually a path
1726
01:23:19.640 --> 01:23:25.480
And so I took this course because I was terrible talking line. I still am not great at talking on on camera
1727
01:23:25.800 --> 01:23:32.200
So I took this course where I just had to make these videos every day and in talking to myself basically who I was talking to
1728
01:23:32.680 --> 01:23:38.280
I started to process things in a different way because I started talking things out and they got out of me
1729
01:23:38.520 --> 01:23:41.560
And they weren't like jumbled up inside of me bouncing around
1730
01:23:42.200 --> 01:23:46.600
My own thoughts not everyone else's thoughts my own thoughts and when you talk on camera
1731
01:23:46.600 --> 01:23:49.000
It's kind of like makes all the other noise
1732
01:23:49.640 --> 01:23:52.520
It's frightening how it makes all the other noise like
1733
01:23:53.320 --> 01:23:55.320
Silent
1734
01:23:55.720 --> 01:23:59.560
You don't know what to say kind of thing but that you just let that uncomfortable place be there
1735
01:24:00.120 --> 01:24:02.120
And it's almost if I bring you back to the word
1736
01:24:02.680 --> 01:24:04.680
It's like a remote
1737
01:24:05.240 --> 01:24:11.160
Conversation with yourself through space and time used to do it with journals and how much
1738
01:24:11.560 --> 01:24:16.520
Discovery was made through journals so much and research and just like the archive that you existed
1739
01:24:16.840 --> 01:24:22.840
The people who we remember are the ones who wrote their ideas that figure old people your grandparents
1740
01:24:22.920 --> 01:24:25.720
Your mentors beg them to record themselves talking
1741
01:24:26.440 --> 01:24:31.960
About their story about their their their their life because I think if we lose that
1742
01:24:33.000 --> 01:24:35.000
We will be a drift
1743
01:24:35.240 --> 01:24:38.760
There's no way we'll get back great use case for otter. I have several
1744
01:24:39.080 --> 01:24:42.040
I've been even like there's some friends of mine. I asked before I do it
1745
01:24:42.040 --> 01:24:48.520
I'm like do you mind if I record this and it's like a little podcast for myself. Yeah, do you listen to um
1746
01:24:49.240 --> 01:24:55.720
We're talking about this is I gonna go not yet. I am. I've got this idea. Yeah. Well, I honestly
1747
01:24:55.720 --> 01:25:00.120
I'm telling you I'm gonna like devise something with it. I think one of these days, but
1748
01:25:00.760 --> 01:25:05.160
Yeah, life stories are where it's that that's that's how we get back to novel storytelling
1749
01:25:05.400 --> 01:25:09.080
And not just like the remix of the remix. Yeah, although we live in remix culture
1750
01:25:09.160 --> 01:25:13.560
And there's something if you lean into it. There's something really cool. Yeah, and I'm not and I'm not
1751
01:25:13.640 --> 01:25:15.880
I don't ever want to say that you can't find
1752
01:25:16.520 --> 01:25:22.200
Ingenuity and creativity in the remix. Yeah vintage shopping. There you go. Yes, my favorite
1753
01:25:24.040 --> 01:25:27.160
Right, so I really enjoy this conversation
1754
01:25:28.680 --> 01:25:30.680
We never know
1755
01:25:31.800 --> 01:25:35.480
It's so much fun. I feel like you just sit here all day. I know that's how you feel
1756
01:25:35.480 --> 01:25:37.480
But they are definitely feeling like they're wasting their time
1757
01:25:39.560 --> 01:25:46.520
We only want to record like around an hour of content and I book a two-hour window and we are almost to the end of a guy
1758
01:25:47.720 --> 01:25:50.200
No way did we really talk that long that one by fast
1759
01:25:50.360 --> 01:25:55.000
Well, I appreciate everyone out there who's listening and we do value your time
1760
01:25:55.480 --> 01:25:59.400
And we hope this was interesting helpful to you in it in some way, but we'll see you next time
1761
01:26:00.280 --> 01:26:02.280
Hi
1762
01:26:03.240 --> 01:26:05.240
I love you
1763
01:26:08.200 --> 01:26:12.600
Thanks for listening this podcast was created and developed by our hosts
1764
01:26:13.160 --> 01:26:18.040
Reggie Tidwell, Tim's Grogs, Mary Green, and Dylan Garcia
1765
01:26:18.840 --> 01:26:22.040
Today's episode featured special guest, Adrienne Mugan
1766
01:26:22.840 --> 01:26:24.840
Produced by me, Mary Green
1767
01:26:25.160 --> 01:26:27.400
Live production and editing by Will Kennedy
1768
01:26:27.960 --> 01:26:29.960
Graphic design by Dylan Garcia
1769
01:26:30.600 --> 01:26:32.200
Set design by Megan's Grogs
1770
01:26:32.920 --> 01:26:36.840
Today's episode is presented lovingly by 40 hearts
1771
01:26:37.560 --> 01:26:39.560
Creators of enduring value