Encouraging Creativity, Managing Time, The Environment | Ébru Kuyak

Michael J. Morgan: Okay. And we're live. And I might look put together today, but I just got out of the shower and ran down here. So some of this water here is blood, sweat, and tears. Um, leading up to the live, super happy. You joined super happy to see everyone today. Um, today I'm going to be interviewing Hebrew kayak and, um, I have some announcements, so today's August 11th.

We've been doing this for almost 28 episodes. I think, uh, we're going to be hitting 28 episodes in a few weeks. We have seven more interviews left, um, which includes today. And, uh, after that, we're going to do, uh, a enter kind of entrance through another phase. That phase is going to be another 28 IgG lives, but they're going to be different formats.

So they're going to be a group recaps of all of the previous interviews. So we're doing 28 interviews and then we're going to do a group recaps of those 28 interviews, which really means that like myself, um, Christian, um, potentially a few other people and potentially guests will be joining. We'll do like a four way IgG live discussing a previous episode.

So we're going to do one episode per live. Uh, and that's going to help me figure out notes for the book and ideas for the book and that sort of thing. If you're interested in joining that, let me know. We'll have rotating guests. Um, you know, if someone, uh, if there's an interview you're interested in that you want to talk about and recap with us, uh, I would love that.

So, um, just send me a DM and let me know if you're interested, I'm going to invite some people to live and then we'll get started and I will send everyone an invite. So give me one second. I'm going to spam all of my friends in the known universe, and then we'll get started. Um, some other announcements.

I'm just looking double tasking here, multitasking here. Um, so we have Hebrew and then, uh, next week is going to be Elmer Quintero after that Shenice Ariel Molly Fletcher, and then Rory O Flarity, uh, he's going to be technically the last guest. And then we're switching into this sort of in-between phase where I'm going to be interviewing Christian as the last actual interview, and then we're going to flip it and he's going to be interviewing me about everything that we've done over the past several months.

And then after that interview, we're going to begin the recaps. So there's going to be 28 of them, like I said, and, uh, yeah, that's that. So I just sent a whole bunch of invites going to send my second batch and then we'll get started on all this. So thank you for being patient as always. Imagine that there is theme, intro music being played, uh, in the meantime.

And, uh, just bear with me for a second while I finish inviting people, almost they're hitting that 50 person limit that Instagram likes to give, and then we'll begin. Hope everyone's having a great week

interviews. We will be switching by the way to a Wednesdays. I have a, sorry, we're doing Wednesdays now. We're probably gonna be switching to Thursdays as I'll be teaching a class in a few weeks, uh, that are on Wednesdays now. So I can't really do more than one thing in one day or more than like three hours of talking.

And one day I'm going to invite Hebrew. Thanks to everyone that's joining so far and let's get started.

Ébru Kuyak: Hello. Let me put you on a stable location. Hi.

Michael J. Morgan: Hey, how are you? I'm doing well. I haven't seen you in so long. It's good to see you.

Um, I'm in a basement of my aunt's house right now. Uh, east coast. Yeah, it'll be here for a minute. It has been awhile, I think about seven months.

Ébru Kuyak: So I'm seeing you seven months ago?

Michael J. Morgan: Yeah, I guess so now that can help. Yeah. Uh, let's see. Okay. So I know I can check the dates here. So in April, may, June, April, may, June, July, August five months, five and a half months

Ébru Kuyak: that cannot happen to, that's not true, right?

Michael J. Morgan: For sure. Because I was in San Diego, April 14th and I, that means I left. I was there for a month and, uh, yeah. Wow. Time flies.

Ébru Kuyak: Thanks scares me so much because we just sit in my living room. It was just a month and a half

Michael J. Morgan: ago. Really? Yeah. Yeah. If I were to guess, I'd say it was three months ago. Yeah. I'm, I'm

Ébru Kuyak: all a more optimistic

Michael J. Morgan: like, oh, it was last week yesterday.

Ébru Kuyak: I still want to be, uh, you know, during COVID there was a lot of things about what, 20, 20. Oh. It's like, mid-year, it's already the end of the year. And last night, right before I go to bed, I saw, um, I mean that, it was like in four months, it's 2022 and I felt bad. So hard. Yes,

Michael J. Morgan: yes. That cannot be through. Yeah.

Wait. That was wow. Okay. Well, two years have just like been compressed in time. Um, that's unbelievable. It's pretty scary. Um, yeah. Well, it's so good to see you, even though it's been so long, it doesn't feel like it's been too long because I have had to look at your photo as I'm editing these posts. So I feel like I see you every week.

Yeah.

Ébru Kuyak: Can we talk to you? Um, but it's been off. Yeah. Crazy. Yeah. It's good to see you soon.

Michael J. Morgan: And uh, how's everything going over there? How's LA

Ébru Kuyak: um, how does it lay? I mean, uh, this is my favorite season and that lady right now it's like summer, but it's still breezy still. It's I I'm really enjoying also I'm trying to, uh, I mentally make it better because I couldn't take the vacation I supposed to take.

So I am stuck in LA,

Michael J. Morgan: so I mean,

Ébru Kuyak: I'm enjoying it,

Michael J. Morgan: you know, you're making, getting into the head space of being on vacation while the staycation, they call it

Ébru Kuyak: staycation. Uh, yeah. And you don't know how long you gonna stay? Neither. So that's little too.

Michael J. Morgan: Maybe that's the best kind of a case in.

Ébru Kuyak: Maybe not for someone like me, you know, I like to get going and

Michael J. Morgan: yeah.

Where were you, where were you going to travel?

Ébru Kuyak: I was hoping to be in France by now. I am perfectly, uh, talking to you from, uh, Hollywood.

Michael J. Morgan: Uh, I

Ébru Kuyak: just learned that I live in the Dell and then I, um,

Michael J. Morgan: do you know, where is it?

Ébru Kuyak: It's the Dell it's. Um, it is, uh, yeah, I just learned to, I've been living here for four years.

Michael J. Morgan: So the neighborhood? Yeah. Okay. The Dell, the Dell, is this a new neighborhood or this is a neighborhood that's existed for no, it's the neighborhood

Ébru Kuyak: that it existed, but I didn't even know someone, very local Toby it's.

Um, they call this RA, um, because it's right below, um, you know, totally with assignments that hill, they call here the Dell, but I was always thinking this, I live in Beachwood canyon

Michael J. Morgan: until I feel like some of these lines are drawn. Very ambiguously. You can kind of say that you live wherever you want. If you're on the.

Who knows.

Ébru Kuyak: I was going to tell you about LA LA is pretty nice right now, but I'm a little scared about the season, because if you see the scene, the news, you probably did fires everywhere. And, uh, even in the places that was not usual together, uh, forest fire or fires, and this year, I'm a little scared about LA because we get wildfires every year and those places who usually doesn't get it, God, this year, I'm like, uh,

Michael J. Morgan: uh, it's time to move south.

I would say

you got to move, uh, out of the Dell

to move out of the Dell. Um, well, yeah, that is scary. And the air quality out there really trips me up, especially, uh, during the season, I feel like New York has seasons of snow and rain and like a little bit of summer and then like cloudiness, but like LA has like cool, like warm, warm, cool. And then fires, like that's the other seasons.

Um, and then some range, like a week of rain every year.

Ébru Kuyak: Yeah. I don't know which is, um, which is worse.

Michael J. Morgan: Yeah, it's hard to tell. I mean, air quality is a thing, you know, I got used to the, the winter out here for the first time. Um, everyone's joining and they're like, why are they talking about the weather, how late, but, um, um, and we'll get started soon, but this is very important information for everyone. Um, you know, I got used to the winters out in New York.

Last time I was here, I was like, I made it a point to go for walks every day, even though it was snowing or like really cold. And it was kind of nice. It was quiet the way the sound is absorbed when, um, the snow is on the ground. It like, it, it kind of ups, it absorbed sounds. It's not very reflective and there's like a stillness to the environment.

Ébru Kuyak: I, I, yeah, I like, uh, New York winter now, before it gets too harsh, I like to feel Venter because there's no winter here. It's like a joke. Christmas

Michael J. Morgan: is kind of boring and everything is so green and yeah. Or they have those like fairs, like the, the holiday fairs or whatever. And it's like fake snow. It's not the same.

It's not, I mean, I remember, yeah. Maybe like import snow from, or, you know, I've heard that they can scientifically manipulate weather. So what if they just like gave LA like at night. They meaning whoever manipulates weather, um, gave LA a snow storm one year. That'd be nice. I don't know how it would go, but it would be interesting.

It would be worth to try. Yeah. I was getting shot. Look, it's been a crazy year. Why not? Yeah. Yeah.

Ébru Kuyak: Why not? Just also manipulating the better, like that's probably not.

Michael J. Morgan: We could use the surprise. I think everyone, I mean, it's almost 20, 22, so why not?

Ébru Kuyak: Yeah. It's almost 20, 22. Thanks. Thanks for

Michael J. Morgan: reminding me.

Yeah, yeah. Get on it then on your resolution start writing them them now your new year's resolution.

Ébru Kuyak: Um, yeah, maybe I should actually, because I never do. And I did one last year and most of it came through. Maybe I should just start to write now, like, be more thoughtful about my positions.

Michael J. Morgan: Um, what was your resolution last year?

Ébru Kuyak: There were a bunch,

Michael J. Morgan: uh, about anything you'd like to share.

Ébru Kuyak: Uh, anything I would like to share, uh, uh, the way, um, I had the shift about working plus you were helping me a little bit to understand too. I mean, on the understanding process, um, uh, I understood things better. And that's, uh, that was one of the, uh, part of the resolutions.

I was like, I just wanted to know which direction I wanted to go more. So even though maybe I'm not going there yet, I know the direction, at least that was a, that was a clarifying. Um,

Michael J. Morgan: that's big, like knowing your, your direction. Um, I've heard a lot of artists speak about recently this idea of like finding the self.

And I think that's another way, like a more poetic way of saying, like knowing what, like how to make decisions properly, uh, that aligned with me. And what I want is that similar for you? Like kind of knowing what the next step looks like and how to make better decisions based on like what your, what you want your life to look like?

Ébru Kuyak: Oh, decision-making is hard topic for me, even though I know what I want, it's just giving up. Um, it might be one of my biggest, um, personal challenges that, um, give up this film thing. Like, I, for example, I want to have. If I want to make furniture and I want to paint, I want to, I think this is a very common thing for a creative mind.

We want to create many things we want to do, but also these, each individual thing, for example, it's a thing that, you know, some, some other people just do one of them and it's, it's a serious, but I want to do all of them. And I have seven days and 24 hours like everyone else. And I don't, um, I don't feel I have to give up one of them, but at least I have to make decisions, uh,

uh, prior, uh, um, not prioritize. Yeah, break. Now I have to make some decisions, let's say so, uh, to be able to function better. So to me, giving up is just the giving up. One of them is it's scary and I, I cannot make those decisions. I just run away.

Michael J. Morgan: Right? Yeah. Avoiding decisions is a decision.

Ébru Kuyak: The best skill I have actually

Michael J. Morgan: good.

Okay. That's one way of solving things, um, or resolving things. It might cause more problems, but it can resolve things also. Um, so you were saying. Your resolution was to know your direction and get, get clear on that. And, um, decision-making, uh, plays a role in that because knowing like, trying to achieve the goals that you have, you need to make decisions.

And you're talking about, trade-offs like, I want to do this and that and that, but if I do, um, painting, then I can't do drawing at the same time and I can't do interior design or furniture. Like, so all these things have trade-offs. Um, but in trying to figure out how do you balance them, um, on an ongoing basis?

Is that sort of where, where you're at? You'd say, wait,

Ébru Kuyak: you are Scott. Think to break up one second.

I'm on my wife. Let me,

Michael J. Morgan: yeah, hold on. What I'll do is I'll turn the camera off. Can you hear me?

Ébru Kuyak: I can hear you upside down.

Michael J. Morgan: Okay. I'm going to turn the camera back on. Okay, good.

Ébru Kuyak: Yeah. Yeah. Okay. What was the.

Michael J. Morgan: So I was just kind of summarizing where you're at, where you're saying, you know, to achieve the goals that you've set out in your resolutions.

It requires making decisions and making trade-offs and deciding between those trade-offs because you have a lot of things you're interested in and want to do a lot. Yeah. Um, and I feel like that's a big, that's definitely a big, like, uh, the, one of the big artists challenges is, is being so excited for creativity and generating ideas and bringing ideas to life that we're like, oh, I can do that in music.

Oh, I can do that in writing. I can do that in teaching. Like I'm in the same place, you know? And I think it's, it really does come down to prioritization and it comes down to straight offs. And I think at the same time, I find for me, it's like being okay with the trade-off happening, like saying, okay, I'm not going to work on a record for indefinitely until like, there's time that opens up.

Or I am going to play a show, but I'm like going to rehearsal a little and like, that'll be that for the time being, um, like kind of putting some boundaries around certain areas so that I can devote more time to other areas sort of like pushing different buttons at different times, you know,

Ébru Kuyak: or grieving that layout, uh, that.

It serves you better, but what I was thinking, actually, this is something I just noticed lately. Um, so I have my schedule. Um, so I make my weeks that I can a little bit pain on certain days I can do, you know, I have my projects and I have to go to the site visits and I also need office time to

Michael J. Morgan: make things

Ébru Kuyak: work.

So, but if it's my office, time that day, I just want to paint so bad. Yeah. It's like, it's my, I have those ideas. And every time I pass by the door off my like utter failure, I'm like, oh, like I could just do this. And so attempting to, and then, uh, let's say Sunday's my paint day. And I, I will paint because that's the only day I could give that week.

But I have this idea that if I don't sketch it today or like, if I don't turn into, um, like more cup or something, I might, um, uh, not lose, but I, I might lose the flow of that thinking. So I haven't been present, present, uh, Doing that exact thing that time. So this has been happening quite a bit right now, especially after COVID I was working more from home and everything is at home right now.

Like my little room studio, like a ten-year with every call that's in the home. Um, my working environment is my room. So everything is so close to each other. So everything else is so tempting, but last five, four or five months, maybe this ha this became more clear to me. So I'm like, okay, so this week, these are the things that I learned about time management to, uh, this week.

I need to do these things. These things need to get done. Okay. But if I tell, I need to do this Monday, either we'll never do that, or she will find a great reason to postpone it or something is more prior to that date. It needs to happen. So when I do it this week, these things needs to get done and just give my self rooms that if I have a better, like, if I have a reading anxiety idea or moment to paint, I go paint.

Then I have that room off. What are you call that

Michael J. Morgan: fluidity and just, yeah, there's some fluidity or, or space or flexibility in the schedule.

Ébru Kuyak: Make a schedule and I, I'm not really good about time management. I think this is a very common thing for other, like all other creatives too, because our mind doesn't work in that way.

So, or being organized is very another tick to me. This is something that I am hoping. Um, I think it's really tough to manage your, um, manage a creative their time. That's why we need, um, you know, uh, business people or like other people and our team queue.

Michael J. Morgan: Okay,

Ébru Kuyak: let me help you work in this space. Okay. This is your aria that you create or draw whatever you do here.

And I'll tell you what we need to do next. And I'll call, you know, I'll call you for that moment. I don't know.

Michael J. Morgan: So you were saying that being one of the topics I chose for you is environment because well, you design environments. So I thought that would make sense. Um, and you were saying the environment has a big effect on you right now, being at your home, being that you have, um, a room where you paint, you have a room where you work, uh, and then place to sleep the kitchen.

And then in area that. Um, those all start to feel like one sort of homogenous thing. And then it becomes harder to like, know the difference of what mode am I even in? Am I working, even though I could play, even though I could sleep or cook, like, there's this, there's so many options of what to do. And so managing your schedule and time, given that you're so excited and passionate about all these different activities that become a cyclical.

Ébru Kuyak: Yeah, absolutely. Because I think in psychology, there's really an effect of leaving a place or going to a certain changing your location to do something, um, or using the same location to do same thing over and over it, um, preps you to, um, certain mindset. Um, so my environment is like my brain right now, it's preview, uh, organic.

So it's very like word everything is, but that's also, uh, it's also a personal choice. I really like to be that way this way, but also I just can see that it could be more beneficial for me if I was just walking out and there was an office down there that I can just go and use for. Just to, for example, reply emails.

So I CA that's separation could help me, but I I'm enjoying this way, merge version better, but yeah, definitely. I can see an improvement on the and time management improvement, especially. Uh,

Michael J. Morgan: well, I know about that, having that, we talked about the need for context, where people listening. Um, I was helping Gabriel out with a climb management, uh, sort of project management template, I guess you could say for, for all of the, for your entire, uh, interior design business.

Um, so what are all the phases? What are all the steps? What feeds into the next, how long did these things take? Um, and it's definitely, I see, you know, I see the things you output and how you like to think, and then I saw how, how draining and taxing that was of like, damn, this is like, so much to think about, you know, can I just paint like, yeah.

Ébru Kuyak: And like my optimism as one of my biggest challenge about everything I'm like, oh, I'll just do this in. I can do this in two hours or that's like, I don't even think about it. And in my head, it's just like, oh, two or four hours work. And then when you start to learn like a break down, okay. That takes only sending this only takes 30 minutes.

And then there's a full, loving conversation. Then clients needs to be weighted and oldest things. It's 16 hours of work for me, but takes that much space. So understanding that was enlightening.

Michael J. Morgan: Great. And that's, it always is, you know, when I work with clients that is always the most difficult part, but also the most regulatory part is like, you know, for example, we said, oh, we saw each other three months ago or a month ago.

And it was like, no, it was like eight months ago. Um, we aren't necessarily good at, um, estimating time, like just across the board, not just like creative people, but people in general, because there's a lot of things where we just forget about and we overlook or we underestimate and then things we overestimate.

Um, so it's always interesting to see people really break down their process and realize, oh wow, this, this actually takes quite a while. Even though like I'm in one Headspace for what seems like. A minute. It's actually like weeks, you know what I mean? Cause it just, you're in such a flow state and you're kind of doing the things you're used to doing.

Um, so coming up for air and what's that, or you think you're doing it, uh, or, yeah. Right, right. Um, so let's talk about environment a little bit. I mean, I think time management is one sort of environment. It's sort of the environment in which your, your work lives in like these blocks of time where you're devoting to, to the work, but then there's also the environments that you're creating and helping to create.

And you just mentioned this sort of organic environment that you're living in, where things are, are being built upon very naturally in the shape of, of you and your lifestyle. But you're also building environments for other people that I assume might have other shapes they might not be as organic per se.

So I'm wondering how you think about environments, uh, and creating environments for yourself and for other people.

Ébru Kuyak: Hmm.

Yeah, this is, this is, this is a subject that I really care about. I really care for my environment, uh, and same for others because, um, it has a huge effect, a huge effect in. Let's start with, um, individual's life. So, um, they trust or hire me to achieve to, um, to one of their goal. And that's potentially has having a better space, but better is different for everyone.

For example, some people think, uh, better is looking good or better. Some people cares about function more, or some people just looking for, um, change or I don't know, they need a change in they're looking for a change, but for now my job here is to read the, um, I think it's very, uh, like Terapeak, I am really trying to understand what, uh, people I work with is looking for because they usually use, for example, those very, um, words, popular words that they hear, uh, from, you know, the society, which doesn't really mean what they are meaning.

So for example, client says, oh, I want to do something very sophisticated. Let's talk about what sophisticated means for you, because for one client might be something, you know, um, Kelly Wessler and another one is about house. So what is sophisticated, you know, um, do you want rich, so I'm just doing all these breakdowns for them.

It's like client mind is becoming like a creative mind when they start to do a project, they get into that collateral and it's very like, uh, confusing. Um, it's, uh, it's neat. It needs to be simplified. So I'm like, um, let's talk about what you want to achieve in your space environment. Um, so then according to their goal, I do everything, um, best, I believe it's gonna happen for them.

So I am here to do. This better for you. So if I, so I'm known with my nose to my client, I say no. And when I was speaking worse English, I was more direct and it's so embarrassing there. But, uh, no, I, I found these little ways to say nicer knows, especially America. Um, so, uh, if I believe something is better for the client, I totally take initiative.

And I'm like, Hey, like we shouldn't do this because this is not better for your, this is not going to create a happier environment for you, even though it looks nice today. Um, it is something so trendy that you are into this today because it's so trendy, but because of it's so trendy today, it might become untrendy very soon.

Hey, this is dangerous. So I am very passionate and patient to explain these to people, to give them a better I'm admiring Indiana. So this is something I really care because I did this for my house too. Um,

and for clients almost same level, even more for my clients, because I really, because they want to trust me and I really want to deliver something. I can deliver, even though it doesn't make my life easier, even though it takes most of the time or a lot more time than needs to be. So I've known that my nose, uh, and this become became a joke like, uh, so for example, all my client has that moment that they always repeat an experiment.

They meet with my other friend or my client. Uh, but yeah, that's something I believe in repeat, I think for others in modern. So there's a lot of things that, you know, uh, other things that other designers care too, like sustainability and everything, but those are like on the breakdown, we are more educated today about these things, uh, you know, materials and stuff, but I'm really, um, showing up to explain people and educate people.

If you know, they are interested, Hey, this is why this is better for you. This is what that word means for you. You

Michael J. Morgan: know, I have many questions. Yes. That's that was great. And now I have many questions as a result, I'm going to take a sip and then we'll get into them. So. You mentioned the discomfort of bringing clients into like the creative world, so to speak.

So ultimately like people that aren't in a very generative creative Headspace, you're tasked with bringing them into it, but not bringing them too deep into it where they're like overwhelmed and afraid, um, and sort of reject the process. Um, how do you think about that when you are like interacting with them?

Like, what are some techniques that you've used to kind of help bring them in, but protected them?

Ébru Kuyak: Yeah, this is a big, uh, and this is another learning thing for me, even though I have right now, good enough experience with doing, you know, same thing over and over. It's so different for every, um, other person. Some people want to know every little detail about something. Some people gets more scared when you include them, how you describe to a process, they don't, they just don't want to get more options or information, just choose for me.

And this is something, um, this is my statistics I do on my end. Um, I really collect this information because I mean, ultimate goal is to serve something better. Um, To my comment, or I will say two worlds, but it's going to be very general. But the ultimate goal is to educate myself, you know, put, uh, projects out there that eventually good for, you know, uh, benefits to others.

Like, um, so

I don't know. I don't have a short answer for that. So many examples. Um,

Michael J. Morgan: uh,

Ébru Kuyak: now I'm really trying to listen to people and, uh, sense them if they know, um, if I understand this, that, you know, they don't like they, don't not, they don't appreciate, but they don't, they don't get happier to be presented more options.

And I don't just drag them into that thing. And I'm trying to make the decision by myself for them the best decision I think for them. But I knew he liked. It's very personal thing. I change people's living spaces and I am doing this to a direction that I really believe that has a huge improvement for their life.

I don't decorate people's places. I don't bring accessories and, you know, um, just make it look it, I just take off as much as I can from people's environment to create, um, more refinement for them, more function, maybe more peace, you know, I I'm so into all sort of all these psychological, uh, uh, effect. So that's, I think that's what I see.

I do, um,

um, different, um, I, I offered different and I,

yeah, really, um, And using the scale to really sense them, to, you know, understand them and get what they are looking through, if they are sorry. Uh, if they are open to learn, I am so here that, explain them, Hey, why we should, you know, why I'm taking this piece out or why I want to put this, um, this way, even though you think it's like completely shorting the wrong to you, because you never thought something like that because you haven't seen something like this on your Instagram feed or, you know, uh, but it in through doubt,

Michael J. Morgan: right?

So funny.

Ébru Kuyak: Um, but I am really there to understand them and explain them. It depends on what they are looking for.

Michael J. Morgan: I love that. So we're talking about the discomfort that people make, might feel entering into any creative process. Um, and sometimes the head creative or the person kind of leading a lot of this lateral thinking and divergence like yourself, uh, needs to make a trade off in a way of, do I educate.

Or do I, um, kind of just present a refined ideas, you know, based on how comfortable people might be in the creative process, are they looking for, for answers? Are they looking for even more questions and are comfortable kind of exploring those with you and wondering why you've made decisions and going down paths together, uh, which is on one end of the spectrum and the other being like, just like, should it be red or black?

Like, I'll leave it up to you. You know, like you, you decide and you sell me what to do. That's

Ébru Kuyak: sometimes change doodle. Like for example, it starts one way. And then people, I got this old lot because maybe I'm so happy to, you know, share it or, um, yeah, I am really willing to share why, how, and sometimes I got a project that the client is just like, just, uh, make this for me.

And the client was also someone who was really, uh, busy and I was hesitant to even it's, uh, I, you know, I narrowed down a lot and I was coming to a, um, let's sit on picking some furniture for them that, uh, the main store or main, um, bed or main chair in the room. Um, I need their personal input because comfort is also very, uh, something subjective.

Uh, so for me, comfort starts from my eyes. So when I see it, if I'm not comfortable seeing it, I don't care sitting on it. It's super comfortable. But so these are all, when you're making someone's home, like living space, this is such an important thing that, uh, getting a feedback from them. So there were clients sometimes like, okay, you just do it.

And I want to ask this question. And then a couple of times, uh, it was like, okay, you choose. Okay. So, um, but this is, I'm asking you because, um, and then, and like towards, sorry, uh, more the project, uh, start to, uh, um, on the process, he really started to appreciate all those selections and he's like, yeah, I really liked this, but what do you think is the best?

And then I started to do for him. Hey, I think two is my favorite option, but what do you like, we can introduce if you are willing to change your wall color. So then in the end of that project, or like towards the end, he was so enjoying. Uh, to be part of decision making, because I think he appreciate understood how, um, personal it was, even though he was not thinking that he was just thinking, uh, furniture, you know, many people think that way too, uh, you know, furnishing a space.

It's not a rocket science, so anyone can buy a piece of furniture and put in a house or space they live in too. But how to create a better serving space, more balanced or more functional there's so much element. I think this is almost science because this is almost psychology. So how we, or how people like me, we care about serving better, like improving people's lives, starting from their houses or homes.

Uh, we really take this, uh, science, uh, serious. So, uh, I review more, um, or see more psychological information than design information today. So,

Michael J. Morgan: um, Okay. Okay. A lot. They're great. I've been taking notes and listening. So, um, well, one, I'm going to send you after this. Uh, there's a, uh, uh, journal of psychology on, um, creativity and the aesthetics and the arts, which, um, they publish every quarter and it's, uh, it's all studies rooted in what you're talking about.

So, um, creativity, uh, aesthetics and the arts in general, whether that's communication, um, using art or, you know, uh, how the lyrics of Bob Dylan changed over time and what that meant. Like, there's all sorts of really interesting studies there, but, um, I totally agree. I think there is a psychology, uh, there's psychological underpinnings to anything that anyone's receiving and responding to.

So what you're saying is, um, the clients that enter into the creative process initially that are like, this is a very binary answer. Like you could just like put this couch in or that couch and it doesn't really matter. It doesn't really have an effect. Just decide for me, here's the money. Like, just go for it.

I don't care over time, as they say. The decisions you're making the trade-offs are making the reasons for making changes and doing the things they're doing. They realize the level of ownership one can have over creative choices and then become interested in like, understanding why, and which is kind of the first part of learning.

And then also like trying to implement it even themselves. But through you, like you being the, the final decision maker,

does that make sense? Does that sum it up? Absolutely. Yeah. I was

Ébru Kuyak: just the thing, uh, yeah, exactly. You described better

Michael J. Morgan: than me. Well, I mean, all I had to do is just repeat back what you said. So you did a good job, but I want to make sure if there's anything you wanted to clarify there. Um, I think it's great.

Um, and I've seen that firsthand myself. Um, there's a few things that stood out that I wanted to mention. You said, um, bringing refinement, peace and comfort. I like that. Um, and then this really stood out to me. You said, you know, that you're improving lives, starting from people's homes. And I thought that was interesting as a creative, like where, like you're always, you're, you're bringing some change into the world and like, depending on what you choose as your profession or where you devote your energy to that is sort of where.

Life improvement starts from that origin points. Uh, I thought that was really interesting. I never really thought of it like that, but it's like, I've chosen design is like the origin point through which I can improve the world and you've chose interior design to do that. So I was really, uh, it's just a nice nuance that I heard you say and wanted to mention.

Okay, well we have a bunch of topics. So what are we going to say? Sorry. Oh, I

Ébru Kuyak: was just going to say, I think design is more understood. Uh, it's being more understand today, uh, where it says, I don't know, even five years ago within my time, but it, in general, I think it's pretty younger stated because everything is this.

I mean, design is not less important than engineering or medicine to me because it has effect to people's life direct effect to people's life. Um, like think about everything. Everything around us is design everything. Even our lives like, you know, I just watched social dilemma like this week and I was mindful, nothing is brand new information that I didn't know or saw before, but I just didn't enjoy really sewing all these examples and, you know, like, um, Define it, uh, uh, how you say, um, confirming information and then, uh, if just like our lives design from somewhere that you are familiar with this world more than me, and then it's design is something we cannot really understand because yes, it starts from home.

It affects people's psychology. It's um, it has so many, but today design is not about just shiny, uh, or, you know, nice, boring objects. It's like the whole thing. Everything is design. So I, um, taking it seriously. Um, now I'm really taking it. I'm taking it seriously. And I should, because I really, um, I believe.

Yeah. It has a great effect to people's life for the world

Michael J. Morgan: to, yeah, I do too. Um, we were just in Manhattan and my buddy and I, who is, who was studying architecture and was a practiced architect for awhile. Uh, who's now switched into digital design. Uh, we were walking around and I'm like, we're looking at these like very stereotypical sort of, uh, buildings that like, like these sort of new buildings that pop up in urban inner is that like, just look the same.

They always say, and like, we're walking past when I'm like, you think that's improving like the, like the overall wellbeing of the city, like that image, seeing this driving down the block and it's like, it was horrendous. It was so generic and so unfortunate in many ways. Um,

Ébru Kuyak: yeah, I agree. I agree. So, uh, this is w we spoke about environment, but this is another thing I really deeply care about.

I am. If I don't have something, um, there's so much product out there so much, especially today design product, and probably don't have anything new to say. Or special for me to bring up there. I try to, uh, make things less like those buildings, they, the designers, maybe we should, uh, you know, uh, we should all Prague together.

Like we should leave, sorry, design. This would be wrong, but I tried to design less and, um, it never like, it, it refers to refinement and conference. I just don't like, maybe that's not the word design, but, um, but I really think that there's a lot of unfortunate product and things out there that, uh, we would be better, uh, or we wouldn't be less without it.

Um,

Michael J. Morgan: right, right. And I think it could improve even the slightest bit of someone's day, seeing something beautiful. And I don't have the science behind this, but seeing something beautiful as opposed to walking down the street and it's almost designed to like, not really be looked at, it's just designed to walk past in a way, or, I mean, it's not designed to like yeah, exactly.

Like blinders. Yeah. So I thought about that thought about our upcoming interview at that point. And, uh, it was like how unfortunate there's so much of that. Um, the new things

Ébru Kuyak: are like, basically they are dangerous to me. Um, so I'm very grateful off coming from a very entrant culture, super historical. Like it's just, it's even though it's not, um, style I would do, or I would, um, you know, present the world, I dunno, in 18th century, it sound like all of these motors and, uh, decorations, because I'm totally not doing any decorative things.

And my rich design neutrals. I really appreciate seeing them in same in friends or Istanbul because over time, time brings an amazing value to everything. But I have a really interesting, um, dynamic about loving and, or liking and disliking new things because most of the time I dislike new objects a lot.

Uh, I have a really great, uh, a weird relationship with plastic objects. Um,

Michael J. Morgan: is it positive relationship or a negative? Totally

Ébru Kuyak: not positive. Um, but. For example, coming from a very old culture, like being very used to, uh, passing by like, you know, a building from nine, 1400, that's your baby, you know, uh, texture that you're seeing.

I mean, my usual doctor is coming from never to, for example, living in LA it's a brand new environment. Everything is new, but I really appreciate the newness here. Like for example, some buildings, you know, a lot of new things here, um, in the different like, uh, because it's,

um, it has a different dynamic to my life. Like I, I come from the, this, I like this minimal as a, maybe here more, or I appreciate the freshness or newness of these things, but objects and, uh, architecture. I am very opinionated about like a lot of them too,

Michael J. Morgan: I would assume so. And, um, I don't want this to become.

To insider baseball for most people where they're like, all right, bunch of designers, not liking design, I've seen it before. But, um, I do think that you have a point there around the context of a new building in LA versus opening a building that looks just like that in Istanbul. Like I think it would be totally like out of place.

It wouldn't fit the rest of the environment. And it says something very different there than it would in downtown. And it looks

Ébru Kuyak: even more odd when we building the, in this stumble like that. There's a perfect, um, like very, I, I mean, I can, I even say anymore, it's the perfect homogenous, you know, uh, view in this stumble because there was so much those new building pop-ups for years, but let's say you're in a neighborhood that everything is kind of like, uh, 30, 40 years old, and then they just pop up this architecture.

It's like, I can not even describe in a positive way. I, I mean, uh, it's different seeing something like this in LA, because there's a pink building on the side and there's a, you know, Frank Gehry building on left side, maybe you don't know, you know? Um, but in Istanbul, it's not like that. It's so disturbing.

It's, um, it's discomfort.

Michael J. Morgan: Yeah, it's a good, you need to have some respect for the history, the context, the environments, uh, when making these creative decisions as well. Um, and I've been teaching a class and I'm teaching, uh, context to them as they're learning about design and they're entering into this, like they'll always lean towards asking a question where they hope for an answer to, and I'm always, I now it's become a joke where I always start by saying, well, it depends.

Um, and it does, because it depends on the context, you know, like it, a pink building in LA is like, oh, this is like the coolest hip, new building of all time. And then you put that in another city. Um, and it's like atrocious and it's disrespecting the culture and whatever, whatever. So yeah. Context, even

Ébru Kuyak: normal, it's even normal here, like supermarket or, you know, um, it's not even, um, fashion store would be even more normal.

Um, but it's those, um, those elements are more normal than that labor and says, yeah. And it's really disrespect to, to in another culture maybe. I don't know. It's yeah, it's a, um, you should maybe into one of our, uh, Landscape, uh, things in Turkey, uh, things, sorry. Um, how you say, uh, the people who make decisions for, you know, government, but for the landscape department,

Michael J. Morgan: you tell me, I don't know.

I'm not from that. Well, um, I think environments, that's a great topic to talk about with you, because this is something you're continually thinking about and like having your own and building others. And we're talking here, we're, we're critiquing some environments and some, um, designs that exist in environments and how it affects that environment.

And I'm wondering, you know, some of this just comes down to personal taste and other comes down to, um, the effect. It might actually have, um, building, you know, in a building in a certain neighborhood and maybe it's, you know, they need to knock down other buildings and it has a social effect or something like that.

So there's sort of these. Objective reasons to dislike a design or, or like it, and subjective reasons as I want it to talk about the taste a little bit so more on the objectives or subjective side, uh, taste and inspiration. Um, both of those concepts either together or separately, because, um, I think you have made a lot of beautiful choices with the work that you've done, but I'm wondering, like where does that all start?

What's the origin of taste for you as a creative, uh, in the end? How do you think about inspiration on a ongoing basis?

Ébru Kuyak: case is a,

uh, taste is a very personal thing. Um, um, taste is not something

I,

for a creative person or a designer who this is something we, I think, always think that we don't have enough. My,

Michael J. Morgan: uh, and you think in general, like across the industry, we don't have enough taste?

Ébru Kuyak: No, no. Uh, like as an individual, like we always try to get better or get better or maybe one step back, maybe this is, I will say.

I all invite, did I make the right choice? Could I get darker? You know, or if I did a couple of shades darker, could I do the opposite? You know, could I give a different effect on some, I mean, paste is something, uh, great to have for a designer to start, but it's a very, um, challenging thing to control to take under control.

I think because, um, let's say here in Nevada, I just, uh, I work with people from many different cultures, which I, I mean, I enjoyed the most probably, uh, but every culture, uh, comes with,

um, their own correct tourist sticks. And, um,

I mean, sometimes you really need to, uh, to be able to put your case on a side and observe what, you know, Okay. One step back. Uh, me coming from an ancient culture. I'm so used to this and I'm so used to like traditional, um, decorative things like my grandma's house. This is a very, uh, generous thing for many Turkish, you know, um, kids or people, but we had the pattern solver on top of a purge and that Turkish rug pattern, which is even more heavily pattern.

And then coffee table, then pattern, um, cloth or decorative objects and flowers on top of it and maybe something on the side and pillows. So everything, I mean, right now it comes more like we even have characters on top of it. So for people, um, this type of client today doesn't come to me. It's obvious that we cannot work well.

Sometimes I have clients who wants to have transition or totally changed direction with their new home or new living. Imagine like five people living in the same house and then they retire. And now mom and dad is moving to. From a huge California house to a more like Scandinavian. We can even call a part ish property and they want to get rid of all those old, um, furniture they used to, like, they use 50 years, they are different style.

That's their style also, but they want to move into either more minimal or, you know, organic, modern, like something simpler. So here for me, it's so interesting to take and they want to take a couple of pieces, right. To really open all my receptors and under, okay. I am looking at that object and that object is so different than what I'm used to, but how can I see it with my own pace without this liking it.

And if I can use this in this project, so this is the, um, challenge I'm trying to explain. I don't know if this makes sense, but I can't. I, I come across to this pretty often, uh, because it's very personal again, India, and like people liked things because it has a meaning for them. It might be even a fluffy toy that they want to, you know?

Right. And that's challenging to, you know, uh, without judging. And understand and accepting and using. So, um, so your tastes as a designer might be a tricky thing to manage

Michael J. Morgan: something. Yeah. That's a great point. It's more for, I think for the service based creative arts, um, the commercial arts, I guess you could say where we're serving a client in many ways.

Um, yeah. Like understanding people's reference points and what is important to them and what they deem good or great or meaningful. Um, and then figuring out the same things for yourself and your own personal, your body of work and your aesthetic, and then figuring out how to integrate those two.

Sometimes integrating means totally putting aside your taste. Um, so as in, you might have totally said no to this thing, and now it's actually helping you get more creative. Cause now you need to open up and say, well, how do I integrate this thing with these other things that they want? Um, so in a way, I guess, uh, finding a way to integrate your tastes and other spaces and even more creative, uh, exercise.

Yeah.

Ébru Kuyak: I mean, change happens on my side too. You know, how we talked about client, they started in a certain way, and then they change over the process sometimes when I see an object and their existing environment, because most of the time I was at, uh, my client's previous houses too, because they want to show me what they have and if we can bring anything into a new architecture or something.

So I see objects in the current Amar, like, uh, existing or their yeah. Existing environment. And that has a very psychological, um, uh, effect with the surroundings around it. So to me, I am like trying to, you know, uh, the eyes are Photoshopping at that at the same time. I'm like, okay, take this object, you know, and then blue around.

And can I see just by so and so then, um, it really opens up a path that I can be challenged are great on the design and creativity, things, things, and sometimes there's a project that there was a, uh, your traditional brown leather, very traditional, uh, that I would not probably think. I would ever come to an object like that to work with.

And then I just, uh, took a picture of it, printed put on my wall while I was working on that project. I was always looking at, and then I fold the shadow. You know, I just clear that, uh, um, uh, around the, and in the end I designed the house. It was like she for minimal, but super minimal that the chair, by the way, I'm saying traditional, but it's not like in a negative way.

It was so old and antic too, that it had a value for those. Uh, my client was, uh, they recorded oh, very old couple and, uh, it had a value for them. And then I just designed everything that object from their old generations, you know, came to them. Now, it was just displayed in their new home. It was kind of like an exhibition will, you know, um, effect to, um, yeah, it had almost a exhibition effect.

So I really liked that scene now, even though I didn't like it in the beginning and I look almost like we cannot use this.

Michael J. Morgan: That see, I love that because that, that is this adaptability that needs to be had. I think, like I said, it more in the commercial arts, but I think in any collaboration at all, uh, there's adaptability that needs to be had.

And I think what you're talking about here is like, understanding whether it's one piece or one idea or one background that someone may have that they're bringing to the project, like learning to understand that and appreciated and respected so that you can highlight it or use it, um, within the work, in a way that isn't, um, just sort of like putting it, like where it stands out awkwardly, but it feels integrated in the work and it respects, um, the things they respect about it,

Ébru Kuyak: but

Michael J. Morgan: summer.

Cool. All right. Um, well, let's talk about collaboration then, because, um, unless you have more things to talk about taste, do you have anything else that you want to say about taste and inspiration,

Ébru Kuyak: inspiration, uh, inspiration as a,

do I have anything for someone like me? I get inspired from everything, so it's not any, um, everything,

Michael J. Morgan: uh,

Everything

Ébru Kuyak: like human and traction, you know, uh, a piece of old furniture, uh, I mean, nature and the sea nature, um, someone else's bore or, you know, a coupler floor, uh, like everything, um, other cultures deeply. I I'm so curious. Um, I'm so, so, so curious about everything, um, uh, everything I don't know, and that's a lot,

Michael J. Morgan: so

Ébru Kuyak: ration is a great topic.

I think if okay. If I'm having a challenge about time management that's because I am getting inspired a lot, so I am getting inspiration, you know, so this, this is, uh, and I'm very sincere about this. So for me, maybe on the, um, timeline, uh, time chart or with the timetable

Michael J. Morgan: that we, um,

Ébru Kuyak: uh, we should really add that inspiration time or preparing for project, because I think to me, that is taking the most time and that's the most valuable time that I in the.

In the beginning for a project. When I tell clients, Hey, I will start your project in the four weeks. It doesn't mean that I don't care about your project. In the first four weeks, I do many other P like I do multiple houses at the same time, and they are a hundred percent different than each other. All of them, a hundred percent.

So I don't need to disconnect from one household two or one architecture, one project to another, to be able to function better, which is actually even more beneficial to work with same houses, you know, at the same time. But when I start to hear about your project too, that you mentioned me, you started to mention my brain.

So that channel is open today and it will start to think about it and more, I think about it before I started to, um, build things or, you know, draw things or make decisions for you, it's way better. But I understand that it's a fast living culture, so I can not tell everyone, Hey, like I can start your project in two months, but if I do, you know, I promise you, it will be because also we start to interact with the clients.

Um, here's another example, um, always decisions during the project, best decisions happen. Um, later on, because I start to get to know people and then instead of in the beginning, they, you know, um, I, they let me to make decision for them if I do towards the end, because I know you right now, like much better than, uh, in the beginning.

So now I can make those decisions, you know? Um, but yeah, let me give me some time to get inspired for your project and, um, to work with you, you know, it's, uh,

so important inspiration for my life. For me functioning personally and professionally, it is everything like, that's why I don't have off day. It's not because if I got used to American culture, you guys work nonstop. I'm coming from like summer, uh, you know, summer off. So, um, but I don't feel like because if I'm free, I mean, I spend most of, yeah, I spent all my free times getting inspiration.

So.

Michael J. Morgan: I think you, I think you're becoming too Americanized. You're like never stop working. Um, no, I totally get what you're saying. I mean, I was just asked to teach another class and like, before we ever agreed on pricing or, uh, before I knew much of anything about it, I was already like, all right, who are the students?

I'm going to reach out to them. I want to understand what they want out of this. Like just trying to get as much inspiration and then thinking about the topic and how I would just personally like to, to speak about it and what I would like to share about that. And yeah, there's internal inspiration even.

And then also just, I mean, even internal inspiration for me is thinking about other people and how like, it would, might have an effect on another person. Um, and then just getting feedback and, um, seeing how other courses were done and things like that. So I'm, yeah, I never really thought about how important inspiration is because it's almost subconscious for me now where I'm just absorbing so much.

Um, yeah. But yeah, that's a great point. That's a really great point. Um, but there is, you know, there's still that said, I think there's still a balance of like, when do you turn that off? And you know, like, not turn it off forever, but like, how do you like. You know, like things can come in without needing to be processed deeply or, you know, uh, all the time and yes, you might miss something that's a trade off, but, you know, having that, uh, that, that self-compassion and forgiveness,

Ébru Kuyak: you know, when I mentioned about like, I want to paint when I want, I need to work.

Yeah. Uh, so if I'm looking for inspiration yeah. Just forget about that. Like, if I'm looking for an inspiration or this new furniture piece, I'm going to belt. Yeah. Find that inspiration. Like you can go visit any, you know, um, exhibition, museum, nature, you know, restaurant anywhere. That's not nothing you will see as a, uh, furniture inspiration.

But if I am taking a day off and just going to rose bowl or something, I'm not trying, uh, my intention is not going to get inspired for my furniture, but because my mind thinks it's free at the moment. Um, it's just looking to everything like observing everything and Aveda, I come home. Okay. So it's not like, oh, I found so many ideas, but while I am seeing something that I'm already processing and a nice step, if we talk about this visual.

Uh, it's just there right now. Um, it's safe, secure, and I will just use it. Not that, that's how I think I am

also trying to, you know, learn myself, find about myself. So these are the things I'm still learning to. Do I get this far? I just wait better than at this way. Uh, I was thinking traveling was inspiring me more, uh, than, you know, something. No, definitely like everything re thing.

Michael J. Morgan: Yeah. I've also been thinking about inspiration and motivation and like kind of where they overlap.

Um, I spent four weeks or weekends working through curriculum, leading up to the class and I didn't really like socialize too much. And then like I had two more classes left to right. And I went out that weekend before I was just like, I have to like, hang with friends. So I went into Brooklyn and hung out with friends and came back and felt very inspired.

Not because we talked to really about it or anything like that. It was more so for me, the inspiration was in like that human interaction and realizing like that's ultimately what, um, I'm being hired for, to interact with people and like. Hmm, the motivation of wanting to be with friends, wanting to have time for that, wanting to connect with individuals that I'm teaching.

Like that motivated me and inspired me, I guess, you know what I mean? Like, there's kind of like the motivation to like, get it done, to do and see the effect it has and then the inspiration of like other classes and, and, and, um, being even inspired by the people that wanted to learn, you know, um, and friends and things like that.

Maybe I'm not saying this clearly enough, but

Ébru Kuyak: I do the same thing. I get inspired from my coins all the time. That's why I'm like, uh, let's talk more or I try to open up a subject about like, when I mentioned about like, trying to explain them how, why I am trying to give this. So it's like me explaining something to them, but he started to, um, uh, give like, uh, input and then that's how I take my information from them, you know, like, um, to me it's a great, um, game this, um, because it's also learning another thing like we were talking about.

Do I scare clients when I, you know, being really, uh, Informative. Um, sometimes I really manage the words too. Like how I, uh, speak to who would I use? Which words it's not like I use more sophisticated words, one to another. Uh, it's more like which words, like it's like speaking, you know, Turkish to a Turkish car or like English though.

There is certain things that I have to manage because I will give the information. So you probably notice this with your students. Like if you only give, um, the way that they will take it, they will take it. If you are just, you know, if I'm just speaking Turkish to you, what we're going to get from this conversation, you will just be like, okay, this sounds okay.

Yeah. Like, so it's exactly the same thing. So I try to manage. Um, but I,

Michael J. Morgan: yeah, yeah. It's, it's, I think another thing you're getting to is like the level of detail in which we get into as well. Um, you know, like when communicating with others and when trying to communicate ideas. Some people want more detail around a certain thing and want that detail in a certain way in a certain form.

Yeah,

Ébru Kuyak: absolutely. Um,

Michael J. Morgan: it gets into explaining the creative process sort of a topic that we haven't really talked about too much, but yeah. Like how do you present the creative process to people that are, uh, you and I kind of touched on this with that discomfort that clients have, but over the last few interviews, we haven't, um, sort of presenting that to the rest of the world.

Some of that is people just experiencing it, but another part of that is communicating it and knowing what level to, uh, to speak to it.

Ébru Kuyak: Yeah. Communicating, it's a, uh,

Michael J. Morgan: it's a thing.

Ébru Kuyak: Yeah. I think that's something I believe I can do a little bit, even though I'm not speaking in just language properly, but, um, I, yeah, I really, uh, yeah, that's still even not, that's the only way, but that's the most effective way.

Um,

that you can re um, give some. Uh, get something as an input or, you know, information or anything make decision you can't like if you cannot communicate prob properly there, the, I mean, even you make the decision in the end, they did, I do the best decision. So that's where I sometimes feel like hanging in the process because I, for me to be able to, to, uh, make sure that I am making the best decision right now, I should, I want to feel I communicated the client and these are the decisions or factors why I am making this decision for their home equal for their life almost.

So I want to feel secure about, you know, um, because it's just so many details. Like again, people just thinking it's furniture. No, unfortunately it's not a furniture. It's the sofa or furniture that you're seeing everyday. You're sitting every day and you know, it affects again, your probably comfort that you didn't.

I say this today, comfort starts from you from stealing, but. My client or people who work with me, we talk about it. They're like, yeah, like comfort definitely starts from seeing it. So once right now they saw it. They cannot see the comfort anymore, you know? So it's um, yeah,

Michael J. Morgan: I have a total shift in topics.

Um, I want to talk about personal roadblocks. It's one of my favorite topics to talk to creative people about. Cause it seems like we have more of them than, than most people. So

we, our own personal roadblocks. Um, we'd love to hear about that. Um, sort of, especially as it relates to your work and relates to being a creative person, whether it's now, whether it was in the past, um, sort of what's been your journey with the personal roadblocks and how they affect you as a creative person or talking about me that we're not talking about me.

So,

Ébru Kuyak: no, uh, um, I think my biggest personal block is me. Um, that's more, um, so are you asking this for internally or externally? Like the roadblocks?

Michael J. Morgan: I mean, either one really, it's more internally the way I'm thinking about it, sort of the things that are hindering their creative creative process, or have hindered their creative process, um, or added to it, you know, eventually,

Ébru Kuyak: um, what is my biggest one and, uh, uh, perfectionism that's something, um, that is a real roadblock because every time when I start to design something, it's not, I am designing a, something I want to design the best of whatever that, so that's a lot of pressure that I put from the beginning.

So, um, we creatives face to MTP. Right. So it's empty and you have to create something. This is when I heard first, um, there was a great story of, uh, one of my friend told me, uh, for partners to partner, one of them were creative and the other one handles the, um, business part or something, something, uh, more on the backstage part.

And they get different credits from the same business and they get different, um, uh, profits and everything. So they talked to this, um, business, uh, person and she says, you know what? I I'm happy this way because I never placed it. That empty paper. So when I heard story, oh my, oh, yes. Um, it is a lot of pressure to create something.

Especially if you care about the environment, I care about the people you were when, if you are a caring person. So which I am DB. And every time when I'm cleaning something, I want to create the best for that project. Those people also create the best version in,

in a category or something. So. I'm not saying I am doing this, but I am trying to do this. And this month, starting from, with this mindset, is it huge pressure? And this is thanks to my chirp over time. Like, um, she started to explain, I mean, that made an improvement in my daily routine because every time it was like that and think about it every day, I create something everyday I make decision.

So every day there was a stress over that I was not able to redefine. What was that stress and distress. You're trying to d