WEBVTT
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Everybody to embrace the squiggle.
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Today, our guest is someone who truly understands the power of culture and the courage it takes to redesign your path.
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Born in Columbia with a deep ambition to build a meaningful career and make a difference, she moved to the US and built her professional foundation and human resources.
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Over time, she realized that real success doesn't happen by accident.
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It happens when people and processes come together through a strong, authentic culture.
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That insight led her to take a leap of faith and found Culture Redesigned, where she now partners with organizations to create environments where people feel valued, connected, and inspired to perform at their best.
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Today we're going to talk about reinvention, leadership, how culture can transfer not only workplaces, but the people within them.
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Please join me in welcoming Adriana Vicaro to our Embrace the Squiggle.
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Welcome, Adriana.
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I'm so excited to have you.
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I'm so happy to be here.
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Thank you for having me, Colleen.
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Yeah, and you and I, we were just talking.
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We met in a business accelerator program through CWE, I don't know, three years ago or so, something like that.
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I don't even remember.
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I feel like time flies, maybe even longer.
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And just have stayed in touch.
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And you've always been on my list to get on the podcast, and we finally made it happen.
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Thank you.
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And I want to say you are a true collaborator.
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So thank you for your generosity always.
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Yeah.
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And I always tell folks if if my whole life, if I could get paid just to connect people with each other, I that would, you know, I would be a gazillionaire at this point.
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And and I do get that there are people who do that for a living, right?
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They they spend their life kind of making their living by referrals and getting paid by that.
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Um I don't know.
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It feels a little icky to me because this is just what I naturally do.
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I love connecting people, and the podcast is just one of those many ways.
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All right.
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So let's jump in.
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So you grew up in Colombia.
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So what does little Adriana think she was going to be when she grew up?
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Like when you were a little kid growing up, what were you thinking life might be like?
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I was absolutely confident I wanted to be an obstetrician.
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I wanted to be a doctor.
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My brother is a doctor, my sister is a doctor, and I thought I wanted to deliver babies.
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I had complete confidence until I got to high school.
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Nice.
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And by then, were when did you move to the US?
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I I forget in the timeline there.
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I I was already an adult.
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I was 24 when I moved to the US.
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Yeah.
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So you finished your schooling in Colombia.
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Yes.
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And so you got to high school and thought, oh, maybe I don't want to deliver babies.
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And it's so funny.
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My brother actually took me um on a shift and I saw a delivery.
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And I I actually couldn't even see the full delivery.
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I'm like, yeah, I can, I can do this.
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It is kind of horrifying.
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You know, it's it's not a pretty sight delivering a baby.
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It's not, it's not as glamorous as people might think it is.
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As you might imagine.
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Yes.
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So it was, um, I think it was my senior year, and it was that panic.
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Like in my whole life, I thought I was going to be a doctor.
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Um, so it's like, well, what what what else do I want to do?
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So I went, I went into business school.
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Um, and then I really liked psychology as well.
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So I did a master's in uh human behavior and psychology.
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And then through life situations, I ended up moving here um and started a career in in HR, right from the start, from from recruiting all the way up.
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Nice.
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What did you study in college?
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Um, so in Colombia, I did uh business administration, and then I did a master's degree in human behavior.
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And then when I moved here, I got an MBA um from Nichols College.
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And just, you know, I would I needed a job, and the first job that I could find was um recruiting for a staffing agency.
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And then I ended up, you know, moving around HR and just kind of like staying in that sphere of HR.
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Um and my last job before I opened my business was vice president of human resources.
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I love that.
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You know, human resources is it's a tough field.
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And it's I I don't think people realize how stressful jobs and human resources are.
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Um Gallup, when they do their polls every year about one of the most burned-out professions, everybody always guesses the nurses and the teachers, right?
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Those are always in the top three, but no one ever realizes that human resources are also in that top three.
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It's a really stressful job.
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It is.
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And I think I think when you are caring about everyone else, a lot of times we forget to care about ourselves.
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And it's funny, I also read that study, a different study, and it was um air air traffic controllers, yes, and then HR people uh under that.
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So that that was unexpected.
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Yeah, and um I I spoke at an HR conference about two weeks ago, and it my talk was actually about who's taking care of the HR people.
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And we were talking about burnout and how do you take care of yourself as an HR person because the level of burnout is so, so high.
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And, you know, it's everything from the fast, high pressure nature of the job to, like you said, everyone's coming to HR with their problems.
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President of the company, they come to HR with their problems, and then someone in the audience yelled, and if someone needs a pizza party, they come to HR, right?
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It's it's almost like HR is this weird umbrella for all of the not good stuff that happens at the workplace.
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And sometimes it's um seen as a um non-revenue providing position, which it really bothers me because we're in charge of retention, productivity, cohesion of a team, organizational design.
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So every time I hear like, well, if we need to cut people, it should be in HR, it's like, should should it be?
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Really?
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Yes, I don't think so.
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Right.
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And so tell us about how you landed where you are now.
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So you went from this career in HR, and now you're running a company that's really helping businesses figure out how to redesign their culture.
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So some of those problems don't land in HR in the same way.
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Right.
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Yes.
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Um, so two I had two seven-year um kind of like positions at two different national companies.
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And after the first one, there were some things I couldn't get done in terms of culture.
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Culture has always been a priority to me.
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So I went to the next company, which was completely different.
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It was family-owned, they were grown, and then it was almost like I faced the same challenge, and that's when I think the light bulb went on for me.
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I realized that when you're in charge of the entire organizational development, people and culture, HR department, you have to concentrate on what's urgent, and what's urgent is usually, unfortunately, not culture.
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So I was, you know, benefits and I was doing who we need to hire and who we need to move and who we need to promote.
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But I always wanted to work on culture, so that's when I realized, you know what, I can become the partner that can concentrate on culture while the head of HR or the business owner is concentrating on operations and the infrastructure to make everything work.
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Um, so I that's when I started my business, and it was so it's funny, but it's funny now, I guess.
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It wasn't funny back then.
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Um, I was really good at process and operations, and I was really good at HR.
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I had never sold anything to anyone.
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Um, so it it was funny, you know.
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I kind of like start my business and like, you know, build it and they'll come.
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Does not happen.
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Um, so I have to sort of reinvent and recognize that I needed to develop my own uh, you know, business development skills and join programs like the one I did with you.
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And I think that's something I'll I'm still working on.
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I'm an introvert, I'm I'm a reader.
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I kind of like find my comfort zone is like data and processes.
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So being forward-facing has been a journey uh and one that that I now enjoy, which is funny how you you can almost reinvent yourself.
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And now when I get a close, when I when I make a sale, is it's a different level of pride because it was never what came natural to me.
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Um, so that has been really interesting.
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I love that.
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So I I ended up in an interesting conversation in another um business accelerator I'm in.
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I'm doing the Goldman Sachs 10,000 Small Business Program now.
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And in the first session, the leader of it said, let's define the culture of how of our group, right?
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Every group is different.
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What's going to be the culture of our group?
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And somebody raised their hand and said, Well, what is culture?
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And it was so interesting because we ended up having like a half-hour conversation about what is culture.
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And I love your kind of definition of it.
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Like, what do you when somebody comes to you and you say, like, we're culture redefined, what like what is culture for a company?
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And like, how would you define that?
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I love that that question because I've I've had different meanings throughout my career, and I I have found this one that I think is easily relatable.
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My definition of culture is how we act, react, and interact in a company.
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Oh, I love that.
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Act, react, and interact.
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Yes, it's easy.
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And that's easy to remember.
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It is easy to remember, and I feel like a lot of times we think we define the the values and design a poster and put it on the wall and put it on the website, and oh, our culture work is done.
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And I always like to remind people that was the beginning.
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Now we have to take those values and really make them mean something.
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We have to make them rooted in how we operate, not only when someone is watching, but when nobody is watching, right?
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Like how we operate when we are by ourselves, when we have an emergency, when when no one is there to tell us what to do, values should come and guide our behavior.
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I love that so much.
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I know um one of the companies I worked with, they talked about culture of how they get stuff done.
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And I always thought that was like a nice, simple way.
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And people are like, what do you mean how they get stuff done?
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Like they're SOPs.
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I'm like, no, no, no.
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It's really about how do we work together to get the work done.
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And I think sometimes it was too simple for people.
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But I love that act, react, and interact.
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I love it.
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The first time I heard that it was actually uh I heard this from a pastor, and then I looked it up because I wanted to quote it correctly, and um I really couldn't find who said it first, but it had been used by multiple people in kind of like preaching uh for for different churches, too.
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So not even like the same type of religion.
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Uh, but it is interesting that it made me think almost of like discipleship when you demonstrate what you expect from others.
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Uh like those basic principles, timeless principles, they always come back.
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If there's one thing we've learned from this podcast, it's that careers are rarely a straight line.
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And honestly, that's a great thing.
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At Maxity, we help people embrace this quickly.
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Whether that means developing a good leaders, navigating career transitions, or helping teams work better together.
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Because your strengths are often the best guide to work.
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And if you'd like to learn more about our coaching, training, or speaking, visit maxiday.com.
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That's M-A-S-A-D-Y.com.
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So important.
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And the whole, I mean what you just said too about the expectations.
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I find when I go in and start working with a team, and if things aren't working, the first thing I say to everyone is, do you know your role?
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Do you know your expectations?
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Like, do you know what your really truly what your job is here?
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And people always say yes, and then when I ask them to tell me what it is, they get it wrong.
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Inevitably.
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And so that whole, do people actually know what's expected of them at work every day?
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It's amazing how often leaders think the answer is yes, of course.
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Everyone knows here what their job is.
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But when you ask that frontline staff, the answer is quite often wrong.
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Yes, and is I think it always connects to who's accountable for what, who's responsible for what, um, support systems, then there is sometimes there is miscommunication or misalignment on was I supposed to do that, or was someone else is that someone else owned the process and I didn't know?
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I feel like it seems clear from the top, but then when you are at their level is is definitely we can always use some more clarification.
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Absolutely.
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So I'm trying to think of how to even phrase my question, but I um my question is kind of about like how does a company know they need you?
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Right?
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Because I think often people don't realize that their culture is is broken, or they think they have a great work culture, or um my my husband always talked about work culture at his place, and he did a presentation at a conference once that said something about like, you know, it was the title was something about foosballs and pizza parties, right?
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That it's like foosball tables and pizza parties does not define a culture.
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That does not mean you have a great place to work because you threw a foosball table in the break room.
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So, how how do companies know that their culture needs fixing?
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Or what are the signs, right?
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That their culture needs fixing.
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I love that you said uh pizza party because uh I usually tell them that that's not I call it culture confetti is like an instant of the yes, yes, and we're back to the same, yes.
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Um, so I think they usually I would like people to know they should work on culture before they really feel the urgency.
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Uh, but most of clients that come for actual culture programs, they're having problems with retention, they're having problems with performance, uh, or they're actually having a hard time hiring people.
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We uh I did have an experience with a client, and we the first um kind of like assessment we did, we were asking current employees, we were only asking five questions, but one of the questions was would you recommend this place to someone you care about?
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And for that particular client, they have 60 people, and 45 people said absolutely not, not even no, or maybe, but absolutely not.
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And I think super big red flag, yes, and I think sometimes the the chief executive officers have such a positive intent and such a positive intention that they imagine their aspiration of culture is actually what's happening in the place, and I usually invite them to use some data like this was your aspiration and it's positive, and I understand it.
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Can we go and evaluate the experience of people and identify if there is a gap so that we can bridge it?
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And maybe there is no gap, and sometimes part of their aspiration is being met, but other parts are not being met.
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So my work is really making sure their aspiration becomes reality.
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And sometimes we need to adjust our aspiration as a company evolves, as companies get bigger.
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I see a lot of organizations that wanted a family environment and wanted to make all these statements that you're one of us.
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And but now, you know, there are 600 people and you don't even know the name of your employees.
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So can we really say we are a family-oriented atmosphere?
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Maybe we need to revisit what we can be to still be friendly and still respect that each person has a family and still create cohesion.
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So important.
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You know, I there's a leader I've been coaching for a while now.
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Um, she's great, she's one of my longtime clients, and all of her strengths from a Gallup Clifton strengths standpoint are all relationship building, right?
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She is a relationship builder.
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Like her, the reason she's been so successful as a leader has been her ability to build relationships.
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And a few years ago, she got promoted.
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Yeah, she's been promoted over and over and over again.
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So she's a very high level at the company now.
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But the first promotion where she went from managing or overseeing, you know, like 150 people to 600 was really hard for her because she was that relationship builder, right?
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She wasn't the like we're a family, but she was the person who knew everybody's name, knew everybody's kids' name, knew their birthday, knew where they went on vacation.
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And when she realized she had 600 people under her, if she tried to do that same type of leadership, she didn't actually get any work done.
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She was working 12, 13, 14 hours a day.
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There were some days that she was working till one in the morning because she'd spend all day on the relationship building and then have to good then go from like, you know, 6 p.m.
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to one in the morning to do her actual work.
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And so have you coached leaders in that and and or helped people figure out how to make that switch and have it still feel okay to them?
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Yes, I think I think reinvention sometimes we I try to invite them to create a new identity and then think from that place of identity.
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Like, what will this next person do?
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How will they approach their day?
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I do have an executive I'm coaching right now, and she's extremely um empathetic.
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And I again I think that is part just like you said, and she's in a um Gallup strength, she's a learner, so she's um is she's a fascinating individual, and I think her ability to learn and transfer that knowledge is what allow her to again get promoted multiple times.
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She's now uh chief executive officer of a government agency, and we are trying to find a way to redesign how she approaches work because she will not have the capacity with all the units she's responsible for to transfer all her knowledge to every person on a one-on-one basis.
00:19:50.960 --> 00:20:13.680
So we're trying to design, you know, how can how can you still be the person that transfers knowledge and take care of yourself so you're not she she was working on average of 72 hours a week about two months ago, so it's it's not sustainable, not nobody can ever do that and actually be a functioning human being, right?
00:20:13.839 --> 00:20:43.359
And it also I think we we realized um that it created some sort of expectation of the team that she didn't have, but but because they saw her working so much, it was almost it almost felt wrong for them to like log out at five because they knew she'll be working, which she never intended anyone else to work extra, but when we started asking questions, it was like, Well, you're logged in until 11 p.m.
00:20:43.599 --> 00:20:45.119
How can we log out at five?
00:20:45.440 --> 00:20:50.240
Um, and he's like, Oh, oh, look at you creating this environment.
00:20:50.480 --> 00:20:51.119
Yes.
00:20:52.400 --> 00:21:03.839
I recently started working with a team, um, had a they had a new VP come in um and for this team, and the VP sent a Team's message at 10 p.m.
00:21:04.079 --> 00:21:05.440
on a Saturday night.
00:21:06.319 --> 00:21:10.640
And the team's message was Does anyone want free tickets to the Patriots game tomorrow?
00:21:10.799 --> 00:21:13.359
I have four extra tickets.
00:21:15.200 --> 00:21:18.000
And only one person responded.
00:21:18.720 --> 00:21:21.039
They took the tickets, went, had a great time.
00:21:21.119 --> 00:21:25.440
And on Monday, this new VP called them into the office and said, I'm glad you got the tickets, right?
00:21:25.519 --> 00:21:27.440
I'm I'm glad I was able to give them to you.
00:21:27.680 --> 00:21:34.000
She's like, But that was a test actually to see who was looking at their team's messages at 10 o'clock on a Saturday night.
00:21:35.759 --> 00:21:41.279
And she said, you know, if you're looking at your team's messages on Saturday night, then you are working too much.
00:21:42.559 --> 00:21:43.599
That's clever.
00:21:43.839 --> 00:21:48.720
Yeah, it was really funny because the person was like, but but I got to go to the Patriots game because of it, right?
00:21:48.799 --> 00:21:50.079
They were excited about it.
00:21:50.480 --> 00:21:59.759
And right, it was it was so interesting because the VP said, Listen, I the new person said, Listen, I I never expect anybody to be on team.
00:22:00.240 --> 00:22:01.440
Outside of work hours.
00:22:01.839 --> 00:22:08.240
She's like, if there is really truly an emergency, which she was like, you know, we're not trauma surgeons.
00:22:08.400 --> 00:22:11.759
If there really truly is an emergency, I will call your cell phone.
00:22:11.839 --> 00:22:18.240
Like, we have each other's cell phones for a real emergency, not made up emergencies.
00:22:18.480 --> 00:22:19.440
And I loved that.
00:22:19.599 --> 00:22:21.519
And I was like, this is so fantastic.
00:22:21.599 --> 00:22:22.720
What a great new leader.
00:22:22.960 --> 00:22:24.720
I wish every leader would think about that.
00:22:24.880 --> 00:22:25.039
Yeah.
00:22:25.279 --> 00:22:26.079
Yes, yes.
00:22:26.240 --> 00:22:32.160
And I think when you said we're not uh save like hard surgeons, it's it's interesting.
00:22:32.400 --> 00:22:57.359
I've had clients um, you know, that their job is saving lives, and they're even the um almost the ability to stay calm and collected in moments of chaos, to me was such a refreshing experience because I had been always saying to my clients, you know, we're not saving lives, and then I'm here with the hospital saving lives.
00:22:57.599 --> 00:23:05.759
Um, I also work with American Red Cross, and it's like, well, we are saving lives, and we cannot do that correctly if we don't take care of ourselves.
00:23:06.000 --> 00:23:26.319
So hearing that from people that are actually saving lives, it almost like changed the narrative for me, and to see their level of evolution and how they stay really calm and collected, and and we cannot do the same in a in our environment is like, well, if they can do it, uh we can do it.
00:23:26.480 --> 00:23:27.839
So that has been interesting.
00:23:28.000 --> 00:23:56.640
I've also worked with I have a client, they're they serve um victims of uh sexual trafficking, and I think they're like being available for the people they're serving is something that at that point I almost feel like it's not even a burden because their day doesn't look is not they're not on the clock and performing 24 hours.
00:23:57.119 --> 00:23:59.839
So if if someone calls at 9 p.m.
00:24:00.559 --> 00:24:08.079
it is received differently, and I almost have to adjust myself because we get used to most of my clients are corporate clients.
00:24:08.240 --> 00:24:20.960
So when I when I I'm sort of like out of my comfort zone and I've been able to learn what is normal, it depends on the industry, the people you're serving, and your own capacity as well.
00:24:22.319 --> 00:24:28.400
Yes, and you know, the thing that you said about if you don't take care of yourself, you can't take care of your clients.
00:24:28.799 --> 00:24:32.319
Such an important lesson for people to learn.
00:24:32.559 --> 00:24:36.799
And, you know, I I took my goddaughter to Disney this week.
00:24:36.880 --> 00:24:43.839
And so we were on the plane, she's seven, it was her mom, the child, and myself, and we're on the plane.
00:24:43.920 --> 00:24:52.720
And when the flight attendant stopped at our seat and said, Remember, put it on yourself as the mother, and then the child, and the child literally, she's very smart.
00:24:52.799 --> 00:24:54.000
She was like, What?
00:24:54.240 --> 00:24:57.359
Like you do yourself and then me.
00:24:57.680 --> 00:24:59.119
And she was questioning it.
00:24:59.279 --> 00:25:06.799
And the flight attendant stopped and said, Listen, if your mom isn't breathing correctly, she's not gonna be able to help you correctly.
00:25:07.920 --> 00:25:09.839
Right and really kind of shut it down.
00:25:10.000 --> 00:25:22.319
And it was really interesting because it's that whole idea, and I know people always joke about that, like when they talk about, you know, put the oxygen mask on you first, and every mom's like, never, I'd always put on my kid first.
00:25:22.400 --> 00:25:25.119
And they're like, You're gonna be passed out, right?
00:25:25.279 --> 00:25:25.440
Right?
00:25:25.519 --> 00:25:32.799
It it doesn't take that long without oxygen for you to be passed out, and then your kid now can't put it on themselves, nor can they put it on you.
00:25:32.960 --> 00:25:34.079
So now we're all in trouble.
00:25:34.240 --> 00:25:40.720
So yes, you know, that whole if you if you're not taking care of yourself, you can't take care of others.
00:25:40.960 --> 00:25:56.000
And I don't want to I don't know, stereotype us as women, but I think as women we sacrifice ourselves more for others than men typically do.
00:25:56.240 --> 00:26:00.400
Oh, absolutely, yes, yes, yes, and it's a hard lesson to learn.
00:26:01.279 --> 00:26:15.440
Yes, I think sadly, and I I mean there is more uh awareness now, um, but I I feel a lot of us have learned that lesson by not being able to function anymore.
00:26:15.599 --> 00:26:23.039
Um, and I think I love the awareness, and I love that there is more self-care and there is more um, it's like normalized.
00:26:23.119 --> 00:26:50.720
I I don't know if it's my upbringing in a different country or the Latin culture, I'm not sure what it is, but I I find it refreshing to feel less guilt about or less guilty about taking a day off or or doing things that might have been seen in maybe in my culture as oh, you know, weak or um lazy, or you know, it's no, it's not, it's it's self-care.
00:26:51.039 --> 00:26:51.680
100%.
00:26:52.079 --> 00:26:57.920
And I think I feel like the next generation is getting a lot better with this.
00:26:58.160 --> 00:26:59.519
Yes, yes.
00:27:00.000 --> 00:27:17.839
You know, I um was was at a women's con women's leadership conference yesterday, and we had a conversation about generations at one point, and folks were saying, you know, that the early 20-year-olds right now, when they're coming into work, people leave at five.
00:27:18.640 --> 00:27:21.279
You get an hour for lunch, they're taking their hour for lunch.
00:27:21.440 --> 00:27:24.000
If the work's not done at five o'clock, they still leave.
00:27:24.160 --> 00:27:26.960
They go home, they come back the next day, the work is still there.
00:27:27.200 --> 00:27:30.880
You know, again, these are not people who are doing, you know, open heart surgery.
00:27:30.960 --> 00:27:37.839
It's not like they're gonna walk out in the middle of a surgery or you know, hang up on a domestic violence client in the middle of a call.
00:27:38.240 --> 00:27:41.440
But they it was a lot of bankers at this particular conference, right?
00:27:41.519 --> 00:27:46.640
Everyone's like, there's there's nothing, nothing, nothing that we do that is worth it.
00:27:46.880 --> 00:27:50.720
I love that you say generational, and and uh that is true too.
00:27:50.799 --> 00:27:52.160
That is a factor I have.
00:27:52.319 --> 00:28:02.640
My oldest is uh is 18 now, and um, you know, he's freshman in college and he has a lot of work and you know, adjusting.
00:28:02.799 --> 00:28:10.559
And the other day I call and he's not answering the phone, so I I can make his phone ring as if I was looking for one of my devices.
00:28:10.799 --> 00:28:11.839
Then he answers the phone.
00:28:11.920 --> 00:28:14.240
I'm like, I thought something happened, like, why didn't you answer?
00:28:14.400 --> 00:28:18.160
And he's like, Mom, I'm taking care of myself, I was meditating.
00:28:18.240 --> 00:28:23.680
And you know, this is an 18-year-old boy, and I'm I'm like, Oh, oh, oh, good for you.
00:28:23.759 --> 00:28:26.880
I'm like, forgive me, keep your phone and not disturb.
00:28:27.039 --> 00:28:28.480
Forgive me, I'm gonna let you be.
00:28:28.640 --> 00:28:36.160
But it was refreshing to like you wouldn't find me at that age meditating or like trying to take care of myself.
00:28:36.319 --> 00:28:41.920
So I was very proud and at the same time sort of confused and shocked.
00:28:42.000 --> 00:28:43.920
So I have to like, I'm like, this is good.
00:28:44.000 --> 00:28:45.920
This is like there is no problem here.
00:28:46.480 --> 00:28:48.880
Yes, yeah, it and it is so different.
00:28:48.960 --> 00:28:54.960
I think um my best friend and I were having the conversation one day that we were just talking about summers in college.
00:28:55.200 --> 00:29:02.079
And when she and I were in college, I worked at a day camp Monday through Friday, and then I waitressed at Friendlies at night.
00:29:02.240 --> 00:29:06.240
She worked at a grocery store Monday through Friday during the day, and then waitressed with me at night.
00:29:06.400 --> 00:29:06.559
Right.
00:29:06.640 --> 00:29:08.400
We both had two jobs all summer.
00:29:08.480 --> 00:29:21.440
We we like did not see our parents the whole summer because we were working, and her kids were home the summer, and one of them had a job for like six weeks at a camp that was, you know, like nine to two for six weeks.
00:29:21.680 --> 00:29:26.960
The other one, you know, had a part-time job that ended up only being like six hours a week.
00:29:27.200 --> 00:29:28.960
And she's like, you know, what the hell are you doing?
00:29:29.119 --> 00:29:30.160
Like, go out and get work.
00:29:30.240 --> 00:29:35.039
And both kids were like, oh yeah, we're just burnt out from like we we need some downtime.
00:29:35.279 --> 00:29:37.200
And they spent time taking care of themselves.
00:29:37.279 --> 00:29:41.519
And she and I were talking, we're like, wow, like I don't remember doing that.
00:29:41.680 --> 00:29:48.799
I said, but you know, the flip side was I remember coming home for December break every year.
00:29:49.279 --> 00:29:55.519
And within like two hours of getting off the plane, I would have bronchitis and I would be sick for a week and a half.
00:29:55.599 --> 00:29:59.119
And it was almost like my body would push through everything.
00:29:59.359 --> 00:30:04.079
And as soon as I slowed down, I'd be in bed for a week.
00:30:04.960 --> 00:30:13.920
And so, you know, this whole different idea of like, okay, let's nip this in the bud, like let's take care of ourselves regularly, it's fabulous.
00:30:14.079 --> 00:30:20.960
But it's, I think also when you have a bunch of Gen Xers around and we're all like, uh, that's not how you do it.
00:30:21.839 --> 00:30:22.880
Oh, absolutely.
00:30:23.039 --> 00:30:25.200
I love the example of summer job.
00:30:25.359 --> 00:30:28.480
My son um got an ice cream truck.
00:30:28.720 --> 00:30:35.519
And years ago, my my first summer here, I was able to get an ice cream truck and I work seven days a week.
00:30:35.759 --> 00:30:39.839
And then I'm telling my son, you know, because he's the same company, and it's like, oh, how funny.
00:30:39.920 --> 00:30:42.000
20 years ago, you're gonna have the job I had.
00:30:42.160 --> 00:30:45.359
And then he's telling and I'm like, You're not, you know, you're not gonna have days off.
00:30:45.519 --> 00:30:50.720
And my son is like, no, I told him I will work five days a week and I'm gonna have two days off.
00:30:50.880 --> 00:30:52.319
And I'm like, Oh, and he was okay.
00:30:52.400 --> 00:30:55.519
He's like, Yes, mother, that's like what people do.
00:30:56.559 --> 00:30:58.640
Like, I don't know, I don't understand such things.
00:30:58.799 --> 00:31:01.039
Like, what do you mean you're gonna have days off?
00:31:01.359 --> 00:31:04.000
Yes, but it's the summer, everyone wants ice cream.
00:31:04.160 --> 00:31:05.519
No, not his problem.
00:31:06.079 --> 00:31:06.960
Yep, yeah.
00:31:07.119 --> 00:31:08.160
Oh, I love it.
00:31:08.319 --> 00:31:18.960
Okay, so let's end with you know, what is the advice your like first piece of advice you give to a leader who realizes that maybe their culture is not what it should be?
00:31:20.480 --> 00:31:29.440
My advice will be understand the experience because you cannot fix something if you don't know really what's happening.
00:31:29.680 --> 00:31:38.000
Um, so I like to say there is a claim of culture, what we say we do, and there is a norm, which is what actually happens.
00:31:38.160 --> 00:31:41.759
And in between those two has to be an infrastructure.
00:31:42.160 --> 00:31:53.680
I will say start building the infrastructure, but to do that, you need to understand where where you are today, so that it can be a cohesive experience, and it's like turning a gigantic boat.
00:31:53.839 --> 00:31:56.880
Like you cannot just, oh, I fixed the culture today, right?
00:31:57.039 --> 00:32:04.720
It's slow motion, pivoting, sustaining small change until you get to a place you can you feel good with.
00:32:05.279 --> 00:32:06.000
I love that.
00:32:06.240 --> 00:32:11.119
All right, we always love to end with some rapid fire questions for our guests.
00:32:11.440 --> 00:32:15.920
So my big one lately has been like, what's your morning beverage?
00:32:16.000 --> 00:32:17.839
Are you a coffee or tea person?
00:32:18.400 --> 00:32:20.559
Coffee baby from Colombia.
00:32:21.680 --> 00:32:22.640
That makes sense.
00:32:22.799 --> 00:32:24.079
That makes sense.
00:32:24.400 --> 00:32:27.279
Um, are you a morning person or a night owl?
00:32:28.079 --> 00:32:32.079
I am I've educated myself to become a morning person.
00:32:32.559 --> 00:32:33.200
Yes.
00:32:34.720 --> 00:32:35.359
All right.
00:32:35.680 --> 00:32:41.599
Um, what is um like what are you streaming or like binging these days?
00:32:41.759 --> 00:32:43.039
Are you a podcast person?
00:32:43.200 --> 00:32:45.359
Are you a watching things on Netflix person?
00:32:45.519 --> 00:32:47.680
Like what are you what are you enjoying these days?
00:32:47.920 --> 00:32:49.200
I I enjoy them all.
00:32:49.440 --> 00:32:59.599
So on Netflix, I am watching Seal Team, and I'm getting a lot of leadership formulas from it.
00:33:00.160 --> 00:33:05.440
And then for podcast, I love a little bit of optimism from Simon Sinek.
00:33:05.519 --> 00:33:14.960
And even though he doesn't have many episodes, I I repeat, and it's just it's just such a recharging experience when I'm in the car.
00:33:15.200 --> 00:33:16.400
Oh, I love Simon.
00:33:16.480 --> 00:33:19.759
I think he's so much of his work has been fantastic.
00:33:20.319 --> 00:33:24.160
Um, and what's a book that you'd recommend to our folks to read, right?
00:33:24.240 --> 00:33:30.559
If any of our listeners are thinking, like either fiction, nonfiction, like what's something that you love have loved reading?
00:33:30.880 --> 00:33:42.079
Um, so I recently read a book called Inner Excellence, and it was all about how athletes prepare their brain to perform.
00:33:42.559 --> 00:33:54.480
And again, even though I'm not an athlete, um, I think those principles before you give a speech, before you have a one-on-one, I found them extremely applicable.
00:33:54.640 --> 00:33:57.680
Um, so I've been I've been working on it.
00:33:58.000 --> 00:33:58.640
Fantastic.
00:33:58.720 --> 00:33:59.759
I'll have to grab that one.
00:33:59.839 --> 00:34:00.960
I haven't read that yet.
00:34:01.200 --> 00:34:02.720
Well, thank you so much, Adriana.
00:34:02.880 --> 00:34:08.239
So if our listeners want to find you and they want to talk to you about their culture, what's their best place to find you?
00:34:08.559 --> 00:34:08.960
Thank you.
00:34:09.119 --> 00:34:10.639
Um, so it is LinkedIn.
00:34:10.719 --> 00:34:17.199
Um I'm very active on that platform, Adriana Vaccaro, or they can visit my website, culturedesign.com.
00:34:17.280 --> 00:34:19.280
Um, there is a link to my email right there.
00:34:19.360 --> 00:34:21.199
And I do reply to all my messages.
00:34:21.280 --> 00:34:21.760
So yeah.
00:34:22.079 --> 00:34:22.639
Fantastic.
00:34:22.719 --> 00:34:25.039
And we will link those all in our show notes today.
00:34:25.280 --> 00:34:26.159
Well, thank you so much.
00:34:26.320 --> 00:34:27.920
This has been such a great conversation.
00:34:28.079 --> 00:34:29.920
I've so enjoyed catching up with you.
00:34:30.079 --> 00:34:34.400
And for all of you out there, I hope you squiggle into something great this week.
00:00:04.639 --> 00:00:06.799
Everybody to embrace the squiggle.
00:00:06.959 --> 00:00:13.199
Today, our guest is someone who truly understands the power of culture and the courage it takes to redesign your path.
00:00:13.439 --> 00:00:22.480
Born in Columbia with a deep ambition to build a meaningful career and make a difference, she moved to the US and built her professional foundation and human resources.
00:00:22.800 --> 00:00:26.480
Over time, she realized that real success doesn't happen by accident.
00:00:26.719 --> 00:00:32.000
It happens when people and processes come together through a strong, authentic culture.
00:00:32.240 --> 00:00:44.079
That insight led her to take a leap of faith and found Culture Redesigned, where she now partners with organizations to create environments where people feel valued, connected, and inspired to perform at their best.
00:00:44.399 --> 00:00:51.600
Today we're going to talk about reinvention, leadership, how culture can transfer not only workplaces, but the people within them.
00:00:51.840 --> 00:00:57.119
Please join me in welcoming Adriana Vicaro to our Embrace the Squiggle.
00:00:57.280 --> 00:00:58.320
Welcome, Adriana.
00:00:58.479 --> 00:01:00.000
I'm so excited to have you.
00:01:00.320 --> 00:01:01.600
I'm so happy to be here.
00:01:01.759 --> 00:01:03.200
Thank you for having me, Colleen.
00:01:03.439 --> 00:01:05.760
Yeah, and you and I, we were just talking.
00:01:05.840 --> 00:01:12.640
We met in a business accelerator program through CWE, I don't know, three years ago or so, something like that.
00:01:12.719 --> 00:01:13.519
I don't even remember.
00:01:13.599 --> 00:01:16.000
I feel like time flies, maybe even longer.
00:01:16.319 --> 00:01:17.840
And just have stayed in touch.
00:01:17.920 --> 00:01:22.480
And you've always been on my list to get on the podcast, and we finally made it happen.
00:01:22.879 --> 00:01:23.359
Thank you.
00:01:23.519 --> 00:01:27.280
And I want to say you are a true collaborator.
00:01:27.439 --> 00:01:29.840
So thank you for your generosity always.
00:01:30.159 --> 00:01:30.480
Yeah.
00:01:30.640 --> 00:01:39.439
And I always tell folks if if my whole life, if I could get paid just to connect people with each other, I that would, you know, I would be a gazillionaire at this point.
00:01:39.519 --> 00:01:42.400
And and I do get that there are people who do that for a living, right?
00:01:42.480 --> 00:01:47.920
They they spend their life kind of making their living by referrals and getting paid by that.
00:01:48.159 --> 00:01:49.439
Um I don't know.
00:01:49.599 --> 00:01:52.239
It feels a little icky to me because this is just what I naturally do.
00:01:52.400 --> 00:01:56.879
I love connecting people, and the podcast is just one of those many ways.
00:01:57.280 --> 00:01:57.680
All right.
00:01:57.760 --> 00:01:58.719
So let's jump in.
00:01:58.799 --> 00:02:00.400
So you grew up in Colombia.
00:02:00.560 --> 00:02:04.480
So what does little Adriana think she was going to be when she grew up?
00:02:04.640 --> 00:02:08.800
Like when you were a little kid growing up, what were you thinking life might be like?
00:02:09.120 --> 00:02:14.960
I was absolutely confident I wanted to be an obstetrician.
00:02:15.120 --> 00:02:16.319
I wanted to be a doctor.
00:02:16.639 --> 00:02:21.840
My brother is a doctor, my sister is a doctor, and I thought I wanted to deliver babies.
00:02:22.080 --> 00:02:26.080
I had complete confidence until I got to high school.
00:02:27.199 --> 00:02:27.520
Nice.
00:02:27.599 --> 00:02:29.759
And by then, were when did you move to the US?
00:02:29.840 --> 00:02:31.759
I I forget in the timeline there.
00:02:32.000 --> 00:02:33.439
I I was already an adult.
00:02:33.520 --> 00:02:35.280
I was 24 when I moved to the US.
00:02:35.360 --> 00:02:35.520
Yeah.
00:02:36.319 --> 00:02:38.240
So you finished your schooling in Colombia.
00:02:38.479 --> 00:02:38.719
Yes.
00:02:38.879 --> 00:02:43.039
And so you got to high school and thought, oh, maybe I don't want to deliver babies.
00:02:43.360 --> 00:02:45.199
And it's so funny.
00:02:45.360 --> 00:02:50.560
My brother actually took me um on a shift and I saw a delivery.
00:02:50.719 --> 00:02:53.439
And I I actually couldn't even see the full delivery.
00:02:53.520 --> 00:02:55.840
I'm like, yeah, I can, I can do this.
00:02:56.800 --> 00:02:58.639
It is kind of horrifying.
00:02:58.800 --> 00:03:01.520
You know, it's it's not a pretty sight delivering a baby.
00:03:01.599 --> 00:03:04.879
It's not, it's not as glamorous as people might think it is.
00:03:05.199 --> 00:03:06.159
As you might imagine.
00:03:06.319 --> 00:03:06.639
Yes.
00:03:06.719 --> 00:03:11.599
So it was, um, I think it was my senior year, and it was that panic.
00:03:11.759 --> 00:03:14.719
Like in my whole life, I thought I was going to be a doctor.
00:03:14.879 --> 00:03:18.000
Um, so it's like, well, what what what else do I want to do?
00:03:18.159 --> 00:03:20.800
So I went, I went into business school.
00:03:21.039 --> 00:03:24.240
Um, and then I really liked psychology as well.
00:03:24.319 --> 00:03:27.919
So I did a master's in uh human behavior and psychology.
00:03:28.080 --> 00:03:38.560
And then through life situations, I ended up moving here um and started a career in in HR, right from the start, from from recruiting all the way up.
00:03:38.960 --> 00:03:39.360
Nice.
00:03:39.520 --> 00:03:41.280
What did you study in college?
00:03:41.919 --> 00:03:49.599
Um, so in Colombia, I did uh business administration, and then I did a master's degree in human behavior.
00:03:49.759 --> 00:03:54.719
And then when I moved here, I got an MBA um from Nichols College.
00:03:54.960 --> 00:04:03.520
And just, you know, I would I needed a job, and the first job that I could find was um recruiting for a staffing agency.
00:04:03.680 --> 00:04:10.000
And then I ended up, you know, moving around HR and just kind of like staying in that sphere of HR.
00:04:10.159 --> 00:04:16.000
Um and my last job before I opened my business was vice president of human resources.
00:04:17.120 --> 00:04:17.920
I love that.
00:04:18.079 --> 00:04:21.920
You know, human resources is it's a tough field.
00:04:22.399 --> 00:04:30.160
And it's I I don't think people realize how stressful jobs and human resources are.
00:04:30.399 --> 00:04:40.160
Um Gallup, when they do their polls every year about one of the most burned-out professions, everybody always guesses the nurses and the teachers, right?
00:04:40.240 --> 00:04:46.160
Those are always in the top three, but no one ever realizes that human resources are also in that top three.
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It's a really stressful job.
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It is.
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And I think I think when you are caring about everyone else, a lot of times we forget to care about ourselves.
00:04:59.600 --> 00:05:09.279
And it's funny, I also read that study, a different study, and it was um air air traffic controllers, yes, and then HR people uh under that.
00:05:09.680 --> 00:05:11.759
So that that was unexpected.
00:05:12.079 --> 00:05:22.000
Yeah, and um I I spoke at an HR conference about two weeks ago, and it my talk was actually about who's taking care of the HR people.
00:05:22.079 --> 00:05:30.560
And we were talking about burnout and how do you take care of yourself as an HR person because the level of burnout is so, so high.
00:05:30.959 --> 00:05:39.680
And, you know, it's everything from the fast, high pressure nature of the job to, like you said, everyone's coming to HR with their problems.
00:05:40.000 --> 00:05:47.519
President of the company, they come to HR with their problems, and then someone in the audience yelled, and if someone needs a pizza party, they come to HR, right?
00:05:47.600 --> 00:05:54.639
It's it's almost like HR is this weird umbrella for all of the not good stuff that happens at the workplace.
00:05:55.279 --> 00:06:10.319
And sometimes it's um seen as a um non-revenue providing position, which it really bothers me because we're in charge of retention, productivity, cohesion of a team, organizational design.
00:06:10.480 --> 00:06:15.839
So every time I hear like, well, if we need to cut people, it should be in HR, it's like, should should it be?
00:06:16.079 --> 00:06:16.720
Really?
00:06:17.439 --> 00:06:18.959
Yes, I don't think so.
00:06:19.839 --> 00:06:20.240
Right.
00:06:20.399 --> 00:06:24.079
And so tell us about how you landed where you are now.
00:06:24.240 --> 00:06:32.160
So you went from this career in HR, and now you're running a company that's really helping businesses figure out how to redesign their culture.
00:06:32.560 --> 00:06:36.079
So some of those problems don't land in HR in the same way.
00:06:36.319 --> 00:06:36.639
Right.
00:06:36.959 --> 00:06:37.439
Yes.
00:06:37.600 --> 00:06:46.240
Um, so two I had two seven-year um kind of like positions at two different national companies.
00:06:46.319 --> 00:06:50.959
And after the first one, there were some things I couldn't get done in terms of culture.
00:06:51.120 --> 00:06:53.680
Culture has always been a priority to me.
00:06:53.839 --> 00:06:56.959
So I went to the next company, which was completely different.
00:06:57.120 --> 00:07:06.240
It was family-owned, they were grown, and then it was almost like I faced the same challenge, and that's when I think the light bulb went on for me.
00:07:06.560 --> 00:07:23.279
I realized that when you're in charge of the entire organizational development, people and culture, HR department, you have to concentrate on what's urgent, and what's urgent is usually, unfortunately, not culture.
00:07:24.399 --> 00:07:31.360
So I was, you know, benefits and I was doing who we need to hire and who we need to move and who we need to promote.
00:07:31.600 --> 00:07:50.399
But I always wanted to work on culture, so that's when I realized, you know what, I can become the partner that can concentrate on culture while the head of HR or the business owner is concentrating on operations and the infrastructure to make everything work.
00:07:50.560 --> 00:07:56.240
Um, so I that's when I started my business, and it was so it's funny, but it's funny now, I guess.
00:07:56.399 --> 00:07:57.920
It wasn't funny back then.
00:07:58.480 --> 00:08:03.040
Um, I was really good at process and operations, and I was really good at HR.
00:08:03.279 --> 00:08:06.079
I had never sold anything to anyone.
00:08:06.240 --> 00:08:08.560
Um, so it it was funny, you know.
00:08:08.639 --> 00:08:13.120
I kind of like start my business and like, you know, build it and they'll come.
00:08:13.439 --> 00:08:14.959
Does not happen.
00:08:16.399 --> 00:08:28.319
Um, so I have to sort of reinvent and recognize that I needed to develop my own uh, you know, business development skills and join programs like the one I did with you.
00:08:28.480 --> 00:08:30.879
And I think that's something I'll I'm still working on.
00:08:31.040 --> 00:08:33.360
I'm an introvert, I'm I'm a reader.
00:08:33.519 --> 00:08:37.759
I kind of like find my comfort zone is like data and processes.
00:08:37.919 --> 00:08:48.320
So being forward-facing has been a journey uh and one that that I now enjoy, which is funny how you you can almost reinvent yourself.
00:08:48.480 --> 00:08:58.399
And now when I get a close, when I when I make a sale, is it's a different level of pride because it was never what came natural to me.
00:08:58.559 --> 00:09:00.960
Um, so that has been really interesting.
00:09:01.679 --> 00:09:02.480
I love that.
00:09:02.639 --> 00:09:09.519
So I I ended up in an interesting conversation in another um business accelerator I'm in.
00:09:09.600 --> 00:09:13.200
I'm doing the Goldman Sachs 10,000 Small Business Program now.
00:09:13.440 --> 00:09:20.960
And in the first session, the leader of it said, let's define the culture of how of our group, right?
00:09:21.120 --> 00:09:22.000
Every group is different.
00:09:22.240 --> 00:09:24.399
What's going to be the culture of our group?
00:09:24.879 --> 00:09:29.360
And somebody raised their hand and said, Well, what is culture?
00:09:29.919 --> 00:09:36.639
And it was so interesting because we ended up having like a half-hour conversation about what is culture.
00:09:37.120 --> 00:09:39.840
And I love your kind of definition of it.
00:09:39.919 --> 00:09:46.159
Like, what do you when somebody comes to you and you say, like, we're culture redefined, what like what is culture for a company?
00:09:46.240 --> 00:09:48.080
And like, how would you define that?
00:09:48.399 --> 00:09:59.759
I love that that question because I've I've had different meanings throughout my career, and I I have found this one that I think is easily relatable.
00:10:00.080 --> 00:10:05.840
My definition of culture is how we act, react, and interact in a company.
00:10:06.080 --> 00:10:07.120
Oh, I love that.
00:10:07.360 --> 00:10:09.120
Act, react, and interact.
00:10:09.279 --> 00:10:10.159
Yes, it's easy.
00:10:10.240 --> 00:10:11.519
And that's easy to remember.
00:10:11.840 --> 00:10:28.879
It is easy to remember, and I feel like a lot of times we think we define the the values and design a poster and put it on the wall and put it on the website, and oh, our culture work is done.
00:10:29.120 --> 00:10:32.879
And I always like to remind people that was the beginning.
00:10:33.120 --> 00:10:37.919
Now we have to take those values and really make them mean something.
00:10:38.080 --> 00:10:46.240
We have to make them rooted in how we operate, not only when someone is watching, but when nobody is watching, right?
00:10:46.320 --> 00:10:57.360
Like how we operate when we are by ourselves, when we have an emergency, when when no one is there to tell us what to do, values should come and guide our behavior.
00:10:58.720 --> 00:11:00.080
I love that so much.
00:11:00.240 --> 00:11:06.480
I know um one of the companies I worked with, they talked about culture of how they get stuff done.
00:11:06.720 --> 00:11:08.960
And I always thought that was like a nice, simple way.
00:11:09.039 --> 00:11:10.879
And people are like, what do you mean how they get stuff done?
00:11:10.960 --> 00:11:11.759
Like they're SOPs.
00:11:11.840 --> 00:11:12.720
I'm like, no, no, no.
00:11:12.799 --> 00:11:17.440
It's really about how do we work together to get the work done.
00:11:17.759 --> 00:11:21.759
And I think sometimes it was too simple for people.
00:11:22.639 --> 00:11:25.919
But I love that act, react, and interact.
00:11:26.320 --> 00:11:27.279
I love it.
00:11:27.759 --> 00:11:47.600
The first time I heard that it was actually uh I heard this from a pastor, and then I looked it up because I wanted to quote it correctly, and um I really couldn't find who said it first, but it had been used by multiple people in kind of like preaching uh for for different churches, too.
00:11:47.679 --> 00:11:50.080
So not even like the same type of religion.
00:11:50.240 --> 00:11:59.679
Uh, but it is interesting that it made me think almost of like discipleship when you demonstrate what you expect from others.
00:11:59.840 --> 00:12:04.879
Uh like those basic principles, timeless principles, they always come back.
00:12:07.279 --> 00:12:12.320
If there's one thing we've learned from this podcast, it's that careers are rarely a straight line.
00:12:12.480 --> 00:12:14.879
And honestly, that's a great thing.
00:12:15.039 --> 00:12:17.840
At Maxity, we help people embrace this quickly.
00:12:18.240 --> 00:12:24.480
Whether that means developing a good leaders, navigating career transitions, or helping teams work better together.
00:12:24.639 --> 00:12:27.200
Because your strengths are often the best guide to work.
00:12:27.919 --> 00:12:33.519
And if you'd like to learn more about our coaching, training, or speaking, visit maxiday.com.
00:12:33.679 --> 00:12:36.879
That's M-A-S-A-D-Y.com.
00:12:39.440 --> 00:12:40.080
So important.
00:12:40.320 --> 00:12:43.759
And the whole, I mean what you just said too about the expectations.
00:12:44.559 --> 00:12:52.960
I find when I go in and start working with a team, and if things aren't working, the first thing I say to everyone is, do you know your role?
00:12:53.200 --> 00:12:54.720
Do you know your expectations?
00:12:54.879 --> 00:12:58.799
Like, do you know what your really truly what your job is here?
00:12:59.440 --> 00:13:04.000
And people always say yes, and then when I ask them to tell me what it is, they get it wrong.
00:13:04.240 --> 00:13:05.200
Inevitably.
00:13:05.360 --> 00:13:10.720
And so that whole, do people actually know what's expected of them at work every day?
00:13:11.039 --> 00:13:15.840
It's amazing how often leaders think the answer is yes, of course.
00:13:15.919 --> 00:13:17.679
Everyone knows here what their job is.
00:13:17.840 --> 00:13:23.120
But when you ask that frontline staff, the answer is quite often wrong.
00:13:23.440 --> 00:13:44.559
Yes, and is I think it always connects to who's accountable for what, who's responsible for what, um, support systems, then there is sometimes there is miscommunication or misalignment on was I supposed to do that, or was someone else is that someone else owned the process and I didn't know?
00:13:44.960 --> 00:13:55.679
I feel like it seems clear from the top, but then when you are at their level is is definitely we can always use some more clarification.
00:13:56.559 --> 00:13:57.519
Absolutely.
00:13:57.840 --> 00:14:08.639
So I'm trying to think of how to even phrase my question, but I um my question is kind of about like how does a company know they need you?
00:14:08.960 --> 00:14:09.200
Right?
00:14:09.360 --> 00:14:30.559
Because I think often people don't realize that their culture is is broken, or they think they have a great work culture, or um my my husband always talked about work culture at his place, and he did a presentation at a conference once that said something about like, you know, it was the title was something about foosballs and pizza parties, right?
00:14:30.639 --> 00:14:33.919
That it's like foosball tables and pizza parties does not define a culture.
00:14:34.000 --> 00:14:38.480
That does not mean you have a great place to work because you threw a foosball table in the break room.
00:14:38.720 --> 00:14:43.360
So, how how do companies know that their culture needs fixing?
00:14:43.600 --> 00:14:45.120
Or what are the signs, right?
00:14:45.279 --> 00:14:47.279
That their culture needs fixing.
00:14:47.600 --> 00:15:00.399
I love that you said uh pizza party because uh I usually tell them that that's not I call it culture confetti is like an instant of the yes, yes, and we're back to the same, yes.
00:15:00.559 --> 00:15:10.559
Um, so I think they usually I would like people to know they should work on culture before they really feel the urgency.
00:15:10.720 --> 00:15:24.480
Uh, but most of clients that come for actual culture programs, they're having problems with retention, they're having problems with performance, uh, or they're actually having a hard time hiring people.
00:15:24.720 --> 00:15:41.279
We uh I did have an experience with a client, and we the first um kind of like assessment we did, we were asking current employees, we were only asking five questions, but one of the questions was would you recommend this place to someone you care about?
00:15:41.519 --> 00:15:49.519
And for that particular client, they have 60 people, and 45 people said absolutely not, not even no, or maybe, but absolutely not.
00:15:50.000 --> 00:16:18.799
And I think super big red flag, yes, and I think sometimes the the chief executive officers have such a positive intent and such a positive intention that they imagine their aspiration of culture is actually what's happening in the place, and I usually invite them to use some data like this was your aspiration and it's positive, and I understand it.
00:16:19.120 --> 00:16:26.399
Can we go and evaluate the experience of people and identify if there is a gap so that we can bridge it?
00:16:26.480 --> 00:16:33.759
And maybe there is no gap, and sometimes part of their aspiration is being met, but other parts are not being met.
00:16:33.840 --> 00:16:38.240
So my work is really making sure their aspiration becomes reality.
00:16:38.320 --> 00:16:45.600
And sometimes we need to adjust our aspiration as a company evolves, as companies get bigger.
00:16:46.000 --> 00:16:53.120
I see a lot of organizations that wanted a family environment and wanted to make all these statements that you're one of us.
00:16:53.279 --> 00:16:58.639
And but now, you know, there are 600 people and you don't even know the name of your employees.
00:16:58.720 --> 00:17:03.200
So can we really say we are a family-oriented atmosphere?
00:17:03.360 --> 00:17:12.480
Maybe we need to revisit what we can be to still be friendly and still respect that each person has a family and still create cohesion.
00:17:13.359 --> 00:17:14.160
So important.
00:17:14.319 --> 00:17:17.440
You know, I there's a leader I've been coaching for a while now.
00:17:17.519 --> 00:17:26.799
Um, she's great, she's one of my longtime clients, and all of her strengths from a Gallup Clifton strengths standpoint are all relationship building, right?
00:17:26.880 --> 00:17:28.240
She is a relationship builder.
00:17:28.400 --> 00:17:35.440
Like her, the reason she's been so successful as a leader has been her ability to build relationships.
00:17:35.759 --> 00:17:38.319
And a few years ago, she got promoted.
00:17:38.400 --> 00:17:40.640
Yeah, she's been promoted over and over and over again.
00:17:40.720 --> 00:17:43.359
So she's a very high level at the company now.
00:17:43.759 --> 00:17:57.119
But the first promotion where she went from managing or overseeing, you know, like 150 people to 600 was really hard for her because she was that relationship builder, right?
00:17:57.200 --> 00:18:05.119
She wasn't the like we're a family, but she was the person who knew everybody's name, knew everybody's kids' name, knew their birthday, knew where they went on vacation.
00:18:05.440 --> 00:18:14.799
And when she realized she had 600 people under her, if she tried to do that same type of leadership, she didn't actually get any work done.
00:18:15.039 --> 00:18:18.559
She was working 12, 13, 14 hours a day.
00:18:18.640 --> 00:18:27.759
There were some days that she was working till one in the morning because she'd spend all day on the relationship building and then have to good then go from like, you know, 6 p.m.
00:18:27.920 --> 00:18:30.559
to one in the morning to do her actual work.
00:18:31.279 --> 00:18:39.599
And so have you coached leaders in that and and or helped people figure out how to make that switch and have it still feel okay to them?
00:18:40.000 --> 00:18:52.720
Yes, I think I think reinvention sometimes we I try to invite them to create a new identity and then think from that place of identity.
00:18:52.799 --> 00:18:55.440
Like, what will this next person do?
00:18:55.599 --> 00:18:57.279
How will they approach their day?
00:18:57.440 --> 00:19:04.240
I do have an executive I'm coaching right now, and she's extremely um empathetic.
00:19:05.599 --> 00:19:26.880
And I again I think that is part just like you said, and she's in a um Gallup strength, she's a learner, so she's um is she's a fascinating individual, and I think her ability to learn and transfer that knowledge is what allow her to again get promoted multiple times.
00:19:27.039 --> 00:19:50.880
She's now uh chief executive officer of a government agency, and we are trying to find a way to redesign how she approaches work because she will not have the capacity with all the units she's responsible for to transfer all her knowledge to every person on a one-on-one basis.
00:19:50.960 --> 00:20:13.680
So we're trying to design, you know, how can how can you still be the person that transfers knowledge and take care of yourself so you're not she she was working on average of 72 hours a week about two months ago, so it's it's not sustainable, not nobody can ever do that and actually be a functioning human being, right?
00:20:13.839 --> 00:20:43.359
And it also I think we we realized um that it created some sort of expectation of the team that she didn't have, but but because they saw her working so much, it was almost it almost felt wrong for them to like log out at five because they knew she'll be working, which she never intended anyone else to work extra, but when we started asking questions, it was like, Well, you're logged in until 11 p.m.
00:20:43.599 --> 00:20:45.119
How can we log out at five?
00:20:45.440 --> 00:20:50.240
Um, and he's like, Oh, oh, look at you creating this environment.
00:20:50.480 --> 00:20:51.119
Yes.
00:20:52.400 --> 00:21:03.839
I recently started working with a team, um, had a they had a new VP come in um and for this team, and the VP sent a Team's message at 10 p.m.
00:21:04.079 --> 00:21:05.440
on a Saturday night.
00:21:06.319 --> 00:21:10.640
And the team's message was Does anyone want free tickets to the Patriots game tomorrow?
00:21:10.799 --> 00:21:13.359
I have four extra tickets.
00:21:15.200 --> 00:21:18.000
And only one person responded.
00:21:18.720 --> 00:21:21.039
They took the tickets, went, had a great time.
00:21:21.119 --> 00:21:25.440
And on Monday, this new VP called them into the office and said, I'm glad you got the tickets, right?
00:21:25.519 --> 00:21:27.440
I'm I'm glad I was able to give them to you.
00:21:27.680 --> 00:21:34.000
She's like, But that was a test actually to see who was looking at their team's messages at 10 o'clock on a Saturday night.
00:21:35.759 --> 00:21:41.279
And she said, you know, if you're looking at your team's messages on Saturday night, then you are working too much.
00:21:42.559 --> 00:21:43.599
That's clever.
00:21:43.839 --> 00:21:48.720
Yeah, it was really funny because the person was like, but but I got to go to the Patriots game because of it, right?
00:21:48.799 --> 00:21:50.079
They were excited about it.
00:21:50.480 --> 00:21:59.759
And right, it was it was so interesting because the VP said, Listen, I the new person said, Listen, I I never expect anybody to be on team.
00:22:00.240 --> 00:22:01.440
Outside of work hours.
00:22:01.839 --> 00:22:08.240
She's like, if there is really truly an emergency, which she was like, you know, we're not trauma surgeons.
00:22:08.400 --> 00:22:11.759
If there really truly is an emergency, I will call your cell phone.
00:22:11.839 --> 00:22:18.240
Like, we have each other's cell phones for a real emergency, not made up emergencies.
00:22:18.480 --> 00:22:19.440
And I loved that.
00:22:19.599 --> 00:22:21.519
And I was like, this is so fantastic.
00:22:21.599 --> 00:22:22.720
What a great new leader.
00:22:22.960 --> 00:22:24.720
I wish every leader would think about that.
00:22:24.880 --> 00:22:25.039
Yeah.
00:22:25.279 --> 00:22:26.079
Yes, yes.
00:22:26.240 --> 00:22:32.160
And I think when you said we're not uh save like hard surgeons, it's it's interesting.
00:22:32.400 --> 00:22:57.359
I've had clients um, you know, that their job is saving lives, and they're even the um almost the ability to stay calm and collected in moments of chaos, to me was such a refreshing experience because I had been always saying to my clients, you know, we're not saving lives, and then I'm here with the hospital saving lives.
00:22:57.599 --> 00:23:05.759
Um, I also work with American Red Cross, and it's like, well, we are saving lives, and we cannot do that correctly if we don't take care of ourselves.
00:23:06.000 --> 00:23:26.319
So hearing that from people that are actually saving lives, it almost like changed the narrative for me, and to see their level of evolution and how they stay really calm and collected, and and we cannot do the same in a in our environment is like, well, if they can do it, uh we can do it.
00:23:26.480 --> 00:23:27.839
So that has been interesting.
00:23:28.000 --> 00:23:56.640
I've also worked with I have a client, they're they serve um victims of uh sexual trafficking, and I think they're like being available for the people they're serving is something that at that point I almost feel like it's not even a burden because their day doesn't look is not they're not on the clock and performing 24 hours.
00:23:57.119 --> 00:23:59.839
So if if someone calls at 9 p.m.
00:24:00.559 --> 00:24:08.079
it is received differently, and I almost have to adjust myself because we get used to most of my clients are corporate clients.
00:24:08.240 --> 00:24:20.960
So when I when I I'm sort of like out of my comfort zone and I've been able to learn what is normal, it depends on the industry, the people you're serving, and your own capacity as well.
00:24:22.319 --> 00:24:28.400
Yes, and you know, the thing that you said about if you don't take care of yourself, you can't take care of your clients.
00:24:28.799 --> 00:24:32.319
Such an important lesson for people to learn.
00:24:32.559 --> 00:24:36.799
And, you know, I I took my goddaughter to Disney this week.
00:24:36.880 --> 00:24:43.839
And so we were on the plane, she's seven, it was her mom, the child, and myself, and we're on the plane.
00:24:43.920 --> 00:24:52.720
And when the flight attendant stopped at our seat and said, Remember, put it on yourself as the mother, and then the child, and the child literally, she's very smart.
00:24:52.799 --> 00:24:54.000
She was like, What?
00:24:54.240 --> 00:24:57.359
Like you do yourself and then me.
00:24:57.680 --> 00:24:59.119
And she was questioning it.
00:24:59.279 --> 00:25:06.799
And the flight attendant stopped and said, Listen, if your mom isn't breathing correctly, she's not gonna be able to help you correctly.
00:25:07.920 --> 00:25:09.839
Right and really kind of shut it down.
00:25:10.000 --> 00:25:22.319
And it was really interesting because it's that whole idea, and I know people always joke about that, like when they talk about, you know, put the oxygen mask on you first, and every mom's like, never, I'd always put on my kid first.
00:25:22.400 --> 00:25:25.119
And they're like, You're gonna be passed out, right?
00:25:25.279 --> 00:25:25.440
Right?
00:25:25.519 --> 00:25:32.799
It it doesn't take that long without oxygen for you to be passed out, and then your kid now can't put it on themselves, nor can they put it on you.
00:25:32.960 --> 00:25:34.079
So now we're all in trouble.
00:25:34.240 --> 00:25:40.720
So yes, you know, that whole if you if you're not taking care of yourself, you can't take care of others.
00:25:40.960 --> 00:25:56.000
And I don't want to I don't know, stereotype us as women, but I think as women we sacrifice ourselves more for others than men typically do.
00:25:56.240 --> 00:26:00.400
Oh, absolutely, yes, yes, yes, and it's a hard lesson to learn.
00:26:01.279 --> 00:26:15.440
Yes, I think sadly, and I I mean there is more uh awareness now, um, but I I feel a lot of us have learned that lesson by not being able to function anymore.
00:26:15.599 --> 00:26:23.039
Um, and I think I love the awareness, and I love that there is more self-care and there is more um, it's like normalized.
00:26:23.119 --> 00:26:50.720
I I don't know if it's my upbringing in a different country or the Latin culture, I'm not sure what it is, but I I find it refreshing to feel less guilt about or less guilty about taking a day off or or doing things that might have been seen in maybe in my culture as oh, you know, weak or um lazy, or you know, it's no, it's not, it's it's self-care.
00:26:51.039 --> 00:26:51.680
100%.
00:26:52.079 --> 00:26:57.920
And I think I feel like the next generation is getting a lot better with this.
00:26:58.160 --> 00:26:59.519
Yes, yes.
00:27:00.000 --> 00:27:17.839
You know, I um was was at a women's con women's leadership conference yesterday, and we had a conversation about generations at one point, and folks were saying, you know, that the early 20-year-olds right now, when they're coming into work, people leave at five.
00:27:18.640 --> 00:27:21.279
You get an hour for lunch, they're taking their hour for lunch.
00:27:21.440 --> 00:27:24.000
If the work's not done at five o'clock, they still leave.
00:27:24.160 --> 00:27:26.960
They go home, they come back the next day, the work is still there.
00:27:27.200 --> 00:27:30.880
You know, again, these are not people who are doing, you know, open heart surgery.
00:27:30.960 --> 00:27:37.839
It's not like they're gonna walk out in the middle of a surgery or you know, hang up on a domestic violence client in the middle of a call.
00:27:38.240 --> 00:27:41.440
But they it was a lot of bankers at this particular conference, right?
00:27:41.519 --> 00:27:46.640
Everyone's like, there's there's nothing, nothing, nothing that we do that is worth it.
00:27:46.880 --> 00:27:50.720
I love that you say generational, and and uh that is true too.
00:27:50.799 --> 00:27:52.160
That is a factor I have.
00:27:52.319 --> 00:28:02.640
My oldest is uh is 18 now, and um, you know, he's freshman in college and he has a lot of work and you know, adjusting.
00:28:02.799 --> 00:28:10.559
And the other day I call and he's not answering the phone, so I I can make his phone ring as if I was looking for one of my devices.
00:28:10.799 --> 00:28:11.839
Then he answers the phone.
00:28:11.920 --> 00:28:14.240
I'm like, I thought something happened, like, why didn't you answer?
00:28:14.400 --> 00:28:18.160
And he's like, Mom, I'm taking care of myself, I was meditating.
00:28:18.240 --> 00:28:23.680
And you know, this is an 18-year-old boy, and I'm I'm like, Oh, oh, oh, good for you.
00:28:23.759 --> 00:28:26.880
I'm like, forgive me, keep your phone and not disturb.
00:28:27.039 --> 00:28:28.480
Forgive me, I'm gonna let you be.
00:28:28.640 --> 00:28:36.160
But it was refreshing to like you wouldn't find me at that age meditating or like trying to take care of myself.
00:28:36.319 --> 00:28:41.920
So I was very proud and at the same time sort of confused and shocked.
00:28:42.000 --> 00:28:43.920
So I have to like, I'm like, this is good.
00:28:44.000 --> 00:28:45.920
This is like there is no problem here.
00:28:46.480 --> 00:28:48.880
Yes, yeah, it and it is so different.
00:28:48.960 --> 00:28:54.960
I think um my best friend and I were having the conversation one day that we were just talking about summers in college.
00:28:55.200 --> 00:29:02.079
And when she and I were in college, I worked at a day camp Monday through Friday, and then I waitressed at Friendlies at night.
00:29:02.240 --> 00:29:06.240
She worked at a grocery store Monday through Friday during the day, and then waitressed with me at night.
00:29:06.400 --> 00:29:06.559
Right.
00:29:06.640 --> 00:29:08.400
We both had two jobs all summer.
00:29:08.480 --> 00:29:21.440
We we like did not see our parents the whole summer because we were working, and her kids were home the summer, and one of them had a job for like six weeks at a camp that was, you know, like nine to two for six weeks.
00:29:21.680 --> 00:29:26.960
The other one, you know, had a part-time job that ended up only being like six hours a week.
00:29:27.200 --> 00:29:28.960
And she's like, you know, what the hell are you doing?
00:29:29.119 --> 00:29:30.160
Like, go out and get work.
00:29:30.240 --> 00:29:35.039
And both kids were like, oh yeah, we're just burnt out from like we we need some downtime.
00:29:35.279 --> 00:29:37.200
And they spent time taking care of themselves.
00:29:37.279 --> 00:29:41.519
And she and I were talking, we're like, wow, like I don't remember doing that.
00:29:41.680 --> 00:29:48.799
I said, but you know, the flip side was I remember coming home for December break every year.
00:29:49.279 --> 00:29:55.519
And within like two hours of getting off the plane, I would have bronchitis and I would be sick for a week and a half.
00:29:55.599 --> 00:29:59.119
And it was almost like my body would push through everything.
00:29:59.359 --> 00:30:04.079
And as soon as I slowed down, I'd be in bed for a week.
00:30:04.960 --> 00:30:13.920
And so, you know, this whole different idea of like, okay, let's nip this in the bud, like let's take care of ourselves regularly, it's fabulous.
00:30:14.079 --> 00:30:20.960
But it's, I think also when you have a bunch of Gen Xers around and we're all like, uh, that's not how you do it.
00:30:21.839 --> 00:30:22.880
Oh, absolutely.
00:30:23.039 --> 00:30:25.200
I love the example of summer job.
00:30:25.359 --> 00:30:28.480
My son um got an ice cream truck.
00:30:28.720 --> 00:30:35.519
And years ago, my my first summer here, I was able to get an ice cream truck and I work seven days a week.
00:30:35.759 --> 00:30:39.839
And then I'm telling my son, you know, because he's the same company, and it's like, oh, how funny.
00:30:39.920 --> 00:30:42.000
20 years ago, you're gonna have the job I had.
00:30:42.160 --> 00:30:45.359
And then he's telling and I'm like, You're not, you know, you're not gonna have days off.
00:30:45.519 --> 00:30:50.720
And my son is like, no, I told him I will work five days a week and I'm gonna have two days off.
00:30:50.880 --> 00:30:52.319
And I'm like, Oh, and he was okay.
00:30:52.400 --> 00:30:55.519
He's like, Yes, mother, that's like what people do.
00:30:56.559 --> 00:30:58.640
Like, I don't know, I don't understand such things.
00:30:58.799 --> 00:31:01.039
Like, what do you mean you're gonna have days off?
00:31:01.359 --> 00:31:04.000
Yes, but it's the summer, everyone wants ice cream.
00:31:04.160 --> 00:31:05.519
No, not his problem.
00:31:06.079 --> 00:31:06.960
Yep, yeah.
00:31:07.119 --> 00:31:08.160
Oh, I love it.
00:31:08.319 --> 00:31:18.960
Okay, so let's end with you know, what is the advice your like first piece of advice you give to a leader who realizes that maybe their culture is not what it should be?
00:31:20.480 --> 00:31:29.440
My advice will be understand the experience because you cannot fix something if you don't know really what's happening.
00:31:29.680 --> 00:31:38.000
Um, so I like to say there is a claim of culture, what we say we do, and there is a norm, which is what actually happens.
00:31:38.160 --> 00:31:41.759
And in between those two has to be an infrastructure.
00:31:42.160 --> 00:31:53.680
I will say start building the infrastructure, but to do that, you need to understand where where you are today, so that it can be a cohesive experience, and it's like turning a gigantic boat.
00:31:53.839 --> 00:31:56.880
Like you cannot just, oh, I fixed the culture today, right?
00:31:57.039 --> 00:32:04.720
It's slow motion, pivoting, sustaining small change until you get to a place you can you feel good with.
00:32:05.279 --> 00:32:06.000
I love that.
00:32:06.240 --> 00:32:11.119
All right, we always love to end with some rapid fire questions for our guests.
00:32:11.440 --> 00:32:15.920
So my big one lately has been like, what's your morning beverage?
00:32:16.000 --> 00:32:17.839
Are you a coffee or tea person?
00:32:18.400 --> 00:32:20.559
Coffee baby from Colombia.
00:32:21.680 --> 00:32:22.640
That makes sense.
00:32:22.799 --> 00:32:24.079
That makes sense.
00:32:24.400 --> 00:32:27.279
Um, are you a morning person or a night owl?
00:32:28.079 --> 00:32:32.079
I am I've educated myself to become a morning person.
00:32:32.559 --> 00:32:33.200
Yes.
00:32:34.720 --> 00:32:35.359
All right.
00:32:35.680 --> 00:32:41.599
Um, what is um like what are you streaming or like binging these days?
00:32:41.759 --> 00:32:43.039
Are you a podcast person?
00:32:43.200 --> 00:32:45.359
Are you a watching things on Netflix person?
00:32:45.519 --> 00:32:47.680
Like what are you what are you enjoying these days?
00:32:47.920 --> 00:32:49.200
I I enjoy them all.
00:32:49.440 --> 00:32:59.599
So on Netflix, I am watching Seal Team, and I'm getting a lot of leadership formulas from it.
00:33:00.160 --> 00:33:05.440
And then for podcast, I love a little bit of optimism from Simon Sinek.
00:33:05.519 --> 00:33:14.960
And even though he doesn't have many episodes, I I repeat, and it's just it's just such a recharging experience when I'm in the car.
00:33:15.200 --> 00:33:16.400
Oh, I love Simon.
00:33:16.480 --> 00:33:19.759
I think he's so much of his work has been fantastic.
00:33:20.319 --> 00:33:24.160
Um, and what's a book that you'd recommend to our folks to read, right?
00:33:24.240 --> 00:33:30.559
If any of our listeners are thinking, like either fiction, nonfiction, like what's something that you love have loved reading?
00:33:30.880 --> 00:33:42.079
Um, so I recently read a book called Inner Excellence, and it was all about how athletes prepare their brain to perform.
00:33:42.559 --> 00:33:54.480
And again, even though I'm not an athlete, um, I think those principles before you give a speech, before you have a one-on-one, I found them extremely applicable.
00:33:54.640 --> 00:33:57.680
Um, so I've been I've been working on it.
00:33:58.000 --> 00:33:58.640
Fantastic.
00:33:58.720 --> 00:33:59.759
I'll have to grab that one.
00:33:59.839 --> 00:34:00.960
I haven't read that yet.
00:34:01.200 --> 00:34:02.720
Well, thank you so much, Adriana.
00:34:02.880 --> 00:34:08.239
So if our listeners want to find you and they want to talk to you about their culture, what's their best place to find you?
00:34:08.559 --> 00:34:08.960
Thank you.
00:34:09.119 --> 00:34:10.639
Um, so it is LinkedIn.
00:34:10.719 --> 00:34:17.199
Um I'm very active on that platform, Adriana Vaccaro, or they can visit my website, culturedesign.com.
00:34:17.280 --> 00:34:19.280
Um, there is a link to my email right there.
00:34:19.360 --> 00:34:21.199
And I do reply to all my messages.
00:34:21.280 --> 00:34:21.760
So yeah.
00:34:22.079 --> 00:34:22.639
Fantastic.
00:34:22.719 --> 00:34:25.039
And we will link those all in our show notes today.
00:34:25.280 --> 00:34:26.159
Well, thank you so much.
00:34:26.320 --> 00:34:27.920
This has been such a great conversation.
00:34:28.079 --> 00:34:29.920
I've so enjoyed catching up with you.
00:34:30.079 --> 00:34:34.400
And for all of you out there, I hope you squiggle into something great this week.
