WEBVTT
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So just if you are listening to this, even if there's one person listening who's like, wow, I don't really know.
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Just stick stick around and find out.
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Like, you do not know what tomorrow will look like.
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And man, you might hear the funniest joke you've ever heard in your entire life three weeks from now.
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You might eat at your favorite restaurant nine years from now, your favorite restaurant of all time.
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You might watch your favorite movie in 15 years.
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You might meet the love of your life in like three days.
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Like, please don't leave before you get to experience all that stuff.
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Are you ready?
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It is time for season three of the Voices of Experience podcast, a podcast dedicated to sharing powerful stories from patients and their families, showcasing the importance of patient-centered care.
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Our host, Amber Brown, comes each and every week ready to help you along your journey.
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Sometimes there's a solo show.
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Sometimes she brings on a guest, and it is all focused on centering the patient voice in each and every conversation.
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We are brought to you by Tampa General Hospital's Patient and Family Advisory Council.
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We're diving into real life experiences, offering insights into the challenges, triumphs, and transformative moments in healthcare.
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Let's get started.
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Thank you very much for having me.
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So, Johnny, um, on the show, we like everyone to start by introducing themselves.
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So please tell the audience a little bit about yourself and how you're an advocate for mental health.
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Yeah, I grew up in Tampa with basically all the mental health cards stacked against me.
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So all of the challenges that might lead to mental health conditions later, like abuse or bullying, things like that.
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I faced a lot of that when I was young and I didn't have great coping mechanisms.
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So my probably my healthiest coping mechanism was music.
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Whenever I got frustrated or stressed or scared, I could pick up a guitar or grab my walkman.
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I had like the CD player with the foam headphones.
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And other than that, all my other coping mechanisms were pretty unhealthy.
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I would get like really angry.
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I would throw stuff and punch stuff because I understood, like, well, that's that's how men express emotion is you can.
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There's this famous Bill Burr quote, like, you can men can either be angry or fine.
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Those are the only two things that are allowed.
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So for me growing up, I was angry or I would tell people I was fine.
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And I really wasn't interested in mental health until I started treatment when I was 16.
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And I was so convinced it wouldn't work for me.
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I'm like, no, I'm too screwed up.
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Like, you don't know anything.
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And then slowly it started making a difference.
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And I went to school for psychology and became really not only fascinated with how and why the brain changes, but also trying to get support to people who are convinced that all the existing options won't work for them.
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Yeah, no, that's really impactful.
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And thank you for being vulnerable and coming on and sharing your story.
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Um, a lot of times people are not open to talk about this, and a lot of us in the United States, across the world, deal with mental health, but it is a stigma and a lot of people don't want to talk about it.
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So I appreciate you being here.
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Um, is there a specific moment in your life where you realize that your experience could help others?
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I feel like one of the it's not one night, but it was a series of nights.
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So I was, I spent most of my life touring in a metal band.
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So I was on tour.
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Uh, my band was called Dark Sermon at the time, and we're like, I wrote all the lyrics and sang.
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So I'm writing lyrics about depression and self-harm and and hallucinations, all of these things that I'm experiencing.
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But I would dress them up in these really like fancy metaphors, and then I would think, like, wow, no one knows what I'm talking about.
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It's so artistic.
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And then I would go on tour and play, and people would come up to the merch table afterwards and go, like, hey, this song about hallucinations, I really feel that, or this song about suicide really touched me.
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And I'm like, Oh, you guys know what I'm talking about.
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And it was cool because other people were finding peace.
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And and I wasn't the songs that I was writing wasn't like, you may feel suicidal, but keep on going.
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The songs were just like, I feel suicidal.
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And then people felt so relieved to know that they weren't alone and feeling that.
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And when I reflect on my relationship with music, I felt the same way.
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I wasn't comforted by people telling me, keep going, you got this.
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I was comforted by other people sharing that they were also experiencing the same difficulty.
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And it made me feel like, okay, if they used their lived experience with the same hardship as me, if they just shared about it and it helped me feel better, then I can share about what I went through to help other people.
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Yeah, that's a really good example.
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I really appreciate the fact that you utilize a medium like music to tell your story and it resonated with others.
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And this is kind of uh an example of that.
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This podcast is another venue in which we want to create a space for patients or people like yourself to come on and be able to have a voice of some sort.
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So um definitely resonate with that, and thank you for being vulnerable again.
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So, why do you think people feel like it's very difficult to talk openly about mental health?
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Well, part of it is how we dress it in media.
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So, like I remember when I was I was diagnosed with schizophrenia when I was 16.
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And it's like the scariest, it's a scary word.
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Like, if I tell people like, oh, I grew up with depression, they're like, Oh, I get that, that must be hard.
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Or I have anxiety, it must be hard.
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And then I'm like, I grew up with schizophrenia, and they're like, oh, that really freaks people out.
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Yes.
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And it freaked me out too, because when I was diagnosed, all I could picture was like in movies where they'd have like someone in a strait jacket or something, or or you'd find out that someone like uh robbed a convenience store or something, and it's like, oh, the person was living with schizophrenia or something.
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So you you have this image in your head of like people with schizophrenia are like criminal, or they're they're they can't get a job or drive a car or have a girlfriend or something.
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So when I was diagnosed with schizophrenia, I felt like I was being diagnosed with you'll never have a car or a job or a girlfriend, like you're not gonna be a productive member of society.
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And all of that was inherited primarily through media and the way we talk about mental health.
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But I think then going to school and learning about some of these diagnoses, you're like, oh, wait a second.
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My picture of what these diagnoses look like doesn't really line up with the science.
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So I think advocacy is great because it gives people like sometimes I'll meet with someone, they're like, Oh, I don't believe you had schizophrenia or that you hallucinated.
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I'm like, okay, you don't have to believe it.
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Yeah.
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But it's like important that people interact with people and go, oh, I know people with that diagnosis, and it helps them.
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It helps people break away from the the Hollywood version of the diagnosis and gets them closer to what it looks like in real life.
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Yeah.
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No, that's huge.
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I think it goes across the board for like really any healthcare diagnosis that we talk about in society.
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Um, there's always some type of stigma.
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You have all these commercials, all these different media outlets, you have TikTok, you have Instagram, all these things coming at you.
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Um, and depending on who you are as a person, you know, you may digest that and think that, for example, when you see a commercial and there may be a medication that can help you, but then there's all these uh these side effects that you could get, right?
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Um, and people get scared to either take the medication or to feel comfortable talking to their doctor about the diagnosis or whatever it is, because they're worried they're gonna have like, you know, they're gonna die, right?
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Because this medication said it on TV, um, versus becoming educated into what's happening with them.
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So the fact that you went, sought help, right, you were able to get diagnosis and then figure out what does that mean for you, Johnny?
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What is that, you know, how does that define you?
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Or really, how does it not define me, right?
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And it's not anyone's job to tell you, like, I don't believe you have schizophrenia, right?
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It's their job to listen, to support, advocate, and to maybe be able to understand that your journey is not their journey, right?
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Yeah, it's funny when people say that it's like, well, people don't believe that the earth is round.
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Like it doesn't really change that.
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So like it doesn't, it used to, I used to get sort of like indignant, like you think I wanted this diagnosis, you think I chose this, and now I'm like, it doesn't really matter what you think.
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Like I'm just sharing what's real in my life, and if you don't believe me, it doesn't bother me, it's totally fine.
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Right.
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And I definitely have felt that with certain diagnoses where like some I think are more socially accepted, which is good.
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That means there's progress.
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And I think others, there's maybe less social acceptance.
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So I'm always trying to be a champion for like, let's include generalized anxiety and bipolar in the same conversation.
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And that way you have something that feels a little more palatable to most people socially, and then something that feels a little more taboo, and you can blend them and help people understand like, oh, this is all under the behavioral health umbrella.
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You don't have to be scared of certain terms.
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Correct.
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I appreciate you even bringing that here to the podcast, just that example alone.
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It should bring insight to someone listening to understand that behavioral health, mental health, no matter what the diagnosis is, it all falls under that same umbrella.
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And all of it should be treated equally, respect respectfully, and understand that those are someone's experiences and they shouldn't be isolated or separated just because of societal norms, right?
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October 10th is coming up, and that is mental health, World Mental Health Awareness Day.
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And so on this episode, um, as you all have heard from Johnny so far, we're really diving into mental health and really understanding um why he's an advocate and in his story.
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And so, Johnny, a lot of times people will say, I'm fine, right?
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When you ask them, like, is something wrong or are you okay?
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Um, but they're really struggling.
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So, what are some signs that family members or friends or even co-workers can pay attention to with someone dealing with mental health?
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Yeah, first I'm definitely guilty of the fine thing, especially when I first started treatment and I would sit down with my therapist once a week because I don't want to go at all.
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So she'd be like, How was this week?
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And I'm like, It was fine.
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How are you feeling?
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I'm fine.
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And then now I notice it even in in my friendships.
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I'll like ask my friend, Hey, how are you doing?
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He's like, I'm fine.
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I'm like, How are you doing?
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How are you doing?
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How are you?
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And you have to like drill down.
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And I think there are moments where people will tell me they're fine, but I can smell that they're not fine.
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So a few litmus tests that I always recommend basically boil down the pattern recognition.
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So I think sometimes people think, oh, if Johnny normally sleeps, they'll think like because someone's eating more or eating less that it's a problem.
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But generally for me, I would say it depends on how they normally eat.
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So, like, what is their baseline?
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So, for example, if you know me and I have a huge appetite, like all the time.
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Like every time we hang out, I'm chowing on something, and then we hang out and four or five times in a row, you see, I'm not, I'm skipping dinner.
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And you're like, wow, that's actually really that is a deviation from the norm for him.
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Right.
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Whereas the same might be true for somebody else, where they almost never eat.
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And then every time you see them, they're eating something, you're like, what change?
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But I wouldn't necessarily take that one example and say, okay, something's going wrong.
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I would say if you recognize multiple pattern breaks across different areas of life.
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So for example, if I eat a lot, I play guitar a lot, I'm trying to use things that are like generally true of me, and I exercise a lot.
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And I'm pretty social, so I see my friends pretty frequently.
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And then you notice I'm not really playing guitar, I'm not seeing my friends, I'm not exercising.
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And you go, wow, that's a lot of pattern breaks layered on top of each other.
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Generally, that's how I will identify things because sometimes, like, if I skip a meal, I'm not hungry.
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It's fine.
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If I skip a workout, it's because my back hurts.
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It's not a big deal.
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But if I'm skipping multiple or I experience multiple deviations from norms and different categories of my life, generally I would say that could be an indicator that something is happening.
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I like those examples.
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Thank you for that.
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And I I do encourage you all listening that if you see kind of those pattern deviations within family members, coworkers, or those around you, please talk to them and ask them like what is truly going on.
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It could save a life.
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So, as you all know, this is part of Tampa Journal Hospital healthcare.
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And it's very important as healthcare professionals that we create an environment where a patient feels safe to communicate what's really going on emotionally with them.
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Can you give an example or can you give some advice to healthcare professionals on how they can do that?
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Yeah, the uh well, I'll tell you a few things that didn't make me feel great.
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Okay.
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And then you can do the opposite, I guess.
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So there were two things in treatment that kind of really turned me off.
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And I think both are very well-intended.
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They're like doing these things to be kind, but they didn't feel kind to me.
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So I'm just sharing from my perspective.
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I'm not sharing like, here's what you should do as a clinician.
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I'm just sharing what it felt, I mean, voices of experience.
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It was just my experience.
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So I'm there are two things that jump out at me that made me feel like, oh, this doesn't feel like the type of environment where I'm cool sharing all this.
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The first is the like, oh, you poor baby type of mentality.
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That I can't tell you.
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Like, I grew up, I was powerlifting, I played in a death metal band.
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If you poor babied me, it just immediately turned me off.
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I felt like so emasculated and like, oh great, now I'm like a a pity case.
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Like this person doesn't even take me seriously because it man, I'm always awful.
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I don't, I didn't want that.
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And it made me feel like almost like I was being spoken down to, which didn't feel great.
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And the other thing that some people would do on the other end of the spectrum is they would try to like hyper-normalize it.
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Like I remember I was sharing with a clinician that I went to early on.
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This is one of my first doctors I ever saw for anything I was facing on the mental health side.
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And I didn't know how to explain to him that I was suicidal, like how I felt.
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So I gave him this poem that I wrote, and it was called The Wedding.
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And it was a poem about me marrying my own death.
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It was like a love poem for me dying, and it was like, I don't know how to explain to someone like I I want to die, and I look forward to it, and I'm excited about it, and I'm planning it like someone would look forward to a wedding and plan for it.
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And I I hand it, I hand this wedding or I hand this poem to him, and I'm thinking, like, surely this will explain to him how abnormal what I'm experiencing is because I don't know how to put it into words, but this poem will explain it.
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So I give it to him, I'm like 16 years old.
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I give him the poem and he reads it and he like nods, and he looks up at me and he goes, What you're experiencing is very normal.
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Everybody goes through this, and I was like, Oh, that's the worst news ever.
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If everybody feels like this and this is normal, I don't want to be around anymore.
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So it was like some people would give me so much pity that it made me feel disconnected, like not treated like a human.
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And then on the other side, some people tried so hard to normalize it that it like there was almost no compassion or even recognition that it was difficult.
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And what I always tell people is like, if you can just say something like, I had this one therapist who just said, That sucks.
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And I was like, Yeah, it really does.
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Yeah.
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So it was like a perfect balance of like, I feel that that hurts and that's awful, but I don't think that you're like gonna be put out for the rest of your life and you can't overcome it.
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It was like this harmony of empathy and encouragement.
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Yeah, yeah.
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I really liked how you broke it down on like each side of the spectrum.
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And I think at some point, if someone has dealt with a mental health battle and has spoken to someone, they've probably gotten both sides of those spectrum.
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Um, unfortunately.
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And I think as members of society, when we're communicating with someone that is going through something we can't resonate with or understand, we have a tendency to kind of go one way or the other.
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And it's like, ah, I don't know how to respond to that.
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But I appreciate you at least bringing that to life so someone can have a little bit more introspect and be like, okay, let me see how I can communicate with this, and maybe just saying that sucks, or thank you for telling me, yeah, you know, tell me more, or something that makes the person the other person feel heard or just listen to versus trying to find a solution or whatever it is.
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Sometimes people just want to be heard at the moment.
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Yeah, so I appreciate you bringing those examples.
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So, how can someone, Johnny, maintain hope when they're dealing with uncertainty or pain or major life challenges?
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So I have this phrase that has really helped me with this.
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I hope it helps somebody listening.
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The phrase is tomorrow might be better.
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And I clung to this phrase for like years.
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I still do sometimes.
00:18:01.839 --> 00:18:15.119
Like when I have a really awful day or week or month or year, I will say to myself, like, tomorrow might be better because if someone says you tomorrow's gonna be better, I'm like, you don't know that.
00:18:15.279 --> 00:18:20.960
So don't even try to make an exclusive claim, an absolute claim about tomorrow, because like it feels like a lie.
00:18:21.279 --> 00:18:22.799
You don't know that, you can't prove it.
00:18:23.279 --> 00:18:26.799
Just like if I say tomorrow's gonna suck, I don't know that either.
00:18:27.119 --> 00:18:29.440
So, what helps me is the word might.
00:18:29.680 --> 00:18:30.799
Tomorrow might be better.
00:18:30.880 --> 00:18:48.720
And I'm not saying the rest of your life might be better, even though I generally have a belief that there's a pretty good chance that will be the case, but tomorrow might be better feels like bite-sized and realistic, and it helps me acknowledge like the difficulty that I have faced up to this point in my life.
00:18:48.880 --> 00:18:57.519
There is no rule in the book that says that tomorrow will be bad because today was bad.
00:18:57.680 --> 00:19:05.440
So I always try to look at the future as like just like I've been wrong about almost everything in my life to date.
00:19:05.599 --> 00:19:12.319
Like I was wrong about who I thought I was gonna marry, what city I was gonna live in, what car I was gonna drive, what part of town, like what I was gonna do for work.
00:19:12.400 --> 00:19:13.680
I've been wrong about almost anything.
00:19:13.839 --> 00:19:18.640
So why would the outcome of tomorrow be like the first thing I'm right about?
00:19:18.960 --> 00:19:19.759
That's a good point.
00:19:19.839 --> 00:19:21.279
I like the way you illustrated that.
00:19:21.359 --> 00:19:21.920
It's really good.
00:19:22.079 --> 00:19:22.880
And I like that quote.
00:19:23.039 --> 00:19:24.079
I'm actually gonna steal it.
00:19:24.240 --> 00:19:24.880
So thank you.
00:19:25.039 --> 00:19:26.799
Uh tomorrow might be better.
00:19:26.960 --> 00:19:28.640
Um, that's a really good one.
00:19:28.880 --> 00:19:36.400
You know, so on this podcast, we really like to highlight great work or just innovation that some of our guests do.
00:19:36.480 --> 00:19:43.519
And you created Cope Notes, which is a platform that says daily text messages designed to improve mental and emotional health.
00:19:43.759 --> 00:19:49.200
Can you talk a little bit about that tool and just elaborate a little bit to our audience about it?
00:19:49.519 --> 00:19:56.640
Yeah, the so I fell in love in treatment and in school with peer support and health education.
00:19:56.799 --> 00:20:01.359
So peer support is talking to people who have been through it firsthand so they understand what you're going through.
00:20:01.440 --> 00:20:08.240
And health education is exactly what it sounds like, like learning how to be healthier because you have the knowledge.
00:20:08.400 --> 00:20:16.640
So, for example, imagine somebody who is struggling to lose weight but doesn't know how to exercise properly.
00:20:16.720 --> 00:20:16.799
Yeah.
00:20:16.960 --> 00:20:19.680
So they don't know about form, they don't know what exercises to do.
00:20:19.759 --> 00:20:22.960
Like if you put them in the gym, they're like, I literally have no idea what to do.
00:20:23.119 --> 00:20:28.400
Health education would be you can use these weights to do these exercises and you're equipping them with knowledge.
00:20:28.480 --> 00:20:35.279
But imagine they're receiving that health education from someone who was like, oh yes, I did all this stuff to lose weight myself.
00:20:35.440 --> 00:20:35.839
Oh, yeah.
00:20:36.000 --> 00:20:38.880
And I had actually the same thyroid condition that you have.
00:20:39.039 --> 00:20:41.200
And someone goes, Oh, no way, really?
00:20:41.359 --> 00:20:42.480
Okay, so this is possible.
00:20:42.640 --> 00:20:46.240
Like you're not telling me this is what you think might help.
00:20:46.400 --> 00:20:48.000
You're telling me this is what helped you.
00:20:48.079 --> 00:20:48.799
It's really powerful.
00:20:48.880 --> 00:20:50.160
It's the whole point of your podcast.
00:20:50.319 --> 00:20:57.680
So uh what we do is we send text messages that contain health education content written by peers with lived experience.
00:20:57.839 --> 00:21:03.039
So if you think about therapy, that might take like an hour for a therapy session.
00:21:03.200 --> 00:21:11.440
And what we do is we chop up that therapy session into like bite-sized pieces of health education content and we deliver it in non-clinical settings.
00:21:11.599 --> 00:21:15.920
So you might get a two-sentence text message while you're cooking dinner.
00:21:16.000 --> 00:21:24.000
And the next day you get one while you're getting out of the shower and you're still soaking wet, and you check the time on your phone and you see, oh, I have a text from Cope Notes.
00:21:24.079 --> 00:21:26.880
And each day it comes at a different time with a different message message.
00:21:26.960 --> 00:21:32.640
And over time, it's proven to reduce stress, anxiety, and depression in less than 10 seconds per day.
00:21:32.799 --> 00:21:38.720
So it's great for people like younger me who I didn't want to go to therapy or take the medication or read the books.
00:21:38.799 --> 00:21:42.319
It's like, okay, well, will you at least read two sentences?
00:21:42.480 --> 00:21:44.079
And it's like, well, yeah, I could probably do that.
00:21:44.480 --> 00:21:44.880
Interesting.
00:21:44.960 --> 00:21:45.839
I like the idea.
00:21:45.920 --> 00:21:53.279
And to your point, as a a millennial, I'm always checking my phone really quick and I don't have time to read paragraphs per se.
00:21:53.680 --> 00:21:54.559
I definitely don't.
00:21:54.799 --> 00:22:01.759
So I think to your point, that innovation of the two sentences, um, it we Love daily motivation, right?
00:22:01.920 --> 00:22:05.920
You see quotes on Instagram or different platforms that people create and post.
00:22:06.079 --> 00:22:11.039
Um, but I think the fact that it comes to you, you don't have to go into an application or anything like that.
00:22:11.200 --> 00:22:13.839
Can I can see why it can reduce anxiety and stress.
00:22:14.000 --> 00:22:25.039
I I mean, for myself, waking up in the mornings or just getting ready for my day-to-day, getting a quick reminder, you know, that things are gonna be okay, or here's ways you can, you know, get through today, right?
00:22:25.200 --> 00:22:25.440
Yeah.
00:22:25.599 --> 00:22:27.359
Um, I think that is very impactful.
00:22:27.519 --> 00:22:29.039
So I appreciate you sharing that.
00:22:29.279 --> 00:22:33.119
Do you have any examples of any feedback that you've gotten regarding code notes?
00:22:33.519 --> 00:22:38.240
Yeah, this is anytime I want to quit, because this is hard to like build something.
00:22:38.559 --> 00:22:40.319
As you know, you're building something right now.
00:22:40.720 --> 00:22:41.359
And me too.
00:22:41.519 --> 00:22:44.960
So there are days when you wake up and you're like, I just am gonna throw in the towel.
00:22:45.039 --> 00:22:45.920
I'm so exhausted.
00:22:46.000 --> 00:22:48.319
This is way more complicated than I thought it would be.
00:22:48.559 --> 00:22:51.279
And there are day I face maybe a day like that.
00:22:51.359 --> 00:22:54.559
Once every couple months, I have a day where I wake up and I'm like, this is too hard.
00:22:54.640 --> 00:22:55.920
I'm in way over my head.
00:22:56.079 --> 00:22:59.279
And then I'll look at our reviews and testimonials.
00:22:59.359 --> 00:23:18.400
And there are stories from people who are like, this text like there's literally a story of a guy who was about to jump off the top of a building and saw the there was a text that we had sent him that mentioned seashells.
00:23:18.960 --> 00:23:24.400
It was something like when you go to a beach and you're looking for seashells, you find them.
00:23:24.960 --> 00:23:29.599
When you go to the beach and you're not looking for seashells, you you are like, oh, I didn't really see any seashells today.
00:23:29.680 --> 00:23:31.039
And it's it's just your attention.
00:23:31.119 --> 00:23:33.599
You went to the same beach, but your attention was different.
00:23:33.680 --> 00:23:35.359
So you kind of find what you're looking for.
00:23:35.519 --> 00:23:37.680
I can't remember the exact text, but that was the idea.
00:23:38.079 --> 00:23:41.279
Was like you can shift your focus and that might change your experience of today.
00:23:41.440 --> 00:23:45.440
And so we sent him this message like a month prior, two months prior.
00:23:45.680 --> 00:23:50.400
And then he's climbing to the top of this building to jump off and he sees the ledge.
00:23:50.960 --> 00:23:53.200
Do you know the type of concrete that has seashells in it?
00:23:53.519 --> 00:23:57.039
No, it's like a little bit of concrete, but like seashells mixed in.
00:23:57.279 --> 00:23:57.440
Okay.
00:23:57.680 --> 00:24:00.720
And so he's climbing to the top and he grabs the ledge and there's seashells in it.
00:24:00.880 --> 00:24:05.759
He remembers the message and then he gets down, calls his mom, his mom takes him to rehab.
00:24:06.400 --> 00:24:08.799
And he sent us a message after he got out of rehab.
00:24:08.960 --> 00:24:10.400
And I here's the thing.
00:24:11.599 --> 00:24:17.200
The the real Hollywood story would be we texted him right when he was on top of the building.
00:24:17.359 --> 00:24:19.920
And we came in at just the right time and we're the hero.
00:24:20.079 --> 00:24:20.960
But we're not the hero.
00:24:21.039 --> 00:24:24.960
We told him something like six weeks before this happened, and he remembered it.
00:24:25.359 --> 00:24:27.279
And that's the power of health education.
00:24:27.920 --> 00:24:31.599
Part of it, some people are like, wow, this text came in at the perfect time.
00:24:32.960 --> 00:24:34.480
That's that's all God.
00:24:34.559 --> 00:24:37.759
Like, we're not, we don't know exactly when to text you.
00:24:38.000 --> 00:24:47.039
But the brain has an uncanny ability to interpret stimulus based on what's going on in your life, and it can recall stuff.
00:24:47.119 --> 00:24:49.200
And that's why I'm so passionate about health education.
00:24:49.279 --> 00:25:01.200
Like, I might send you a text message today that feels totally irrelevant, and seven months later you use that tool, you're like, oh, I remember this, and it helps you face that thing.
00:25:01.440 --> 00:25:04.079
That is real like patient empowerment.
00:25:04.160 --> 00:25:07.920
Like you're making people, you're improving their self-efficacy.
00:25:08.160 --> 00:25:08.400
Yeah.
00:25:08.559 --> 00:25:09.599
Yeah, that's huge.
00:25:09.759 --> 00:25:19.920
And you know, what I what comes to mind as you were talking through that, a lot of times if you were to shift that to more of a real-world like help worker burnout, like we had COVID recently, right?
00:25:20.000 --> 00:25:24.640
And a lot of people had to adjust and figure out life after that, during and after.
00:25:24.880 --> 00:25:28.400
And some people are still struggling with getting back into the groove of things.
00:25:28.559 --> 00:25:47.200
And it makes me think about if a healthcare worker has a tough patient or just a tough caseload, and they, you know, have a text message that maybe they've received a few weeks before or days before, and they're able to go back and remember those things to help them navigate right through the day-to-day the why.
00:25:47.359 --> 00:25:48.160
Why are they here?
00:25:48.319 --> 00:25:49.200
Why are they a nurse?
00:25:49.279 --> 00:25:49.920
Why are they a provider?
00:25:50.000 --> 00:25:50.960
Why are they a physician?
00:25:51.119 --> 00:25:54.559
Um, remembering your why, remembering why you chose to do what you do.
00:25:54.720 --> 00:25:58.559
I think that's another component that cope notes could be for someone.
00:25:58.640 --> 00:26:01.039
Um, and I think of myself as a healthcare worker.
00:26:01.200 --> 00:26:04.000
I work in administration, I have a clinical background as well.
00:26:04.160 --> 00:26:12.400
And I think to myself, you know, there's any moment during the day where someone can remind me of my why, other than myself, I'm grateful for it.
00:26:12.480 --> 00:26:17.039
Because sometimes as human beings, we need that moment where someone's like, hey, you chose to do this for a reason.
00:26:17.279 --> 00:26:19.759
So you know, like keep at it, right?
00:26:19.920 --> 00:26:20.640
Don't give up.
00:26:20.799 --> 00:26:26.079
Um, so I really, really like your concept of cope notes, and I wish you all the success in that work.
00:26:26.160 --> 00:26:26.880
I really do.
00:26:27.200 --> 00:26:32.079
So we're gonna talk a little bit as we begin to wrap up the episode about resilience.
00:26:32.319 --> 00:26:35.599
So how what does resilience mean to you?
00:26:35.759 --> 00:26:39.440
And maybe talk about how that definition has changed over time for you.
00:26:40.319 --> 00:26:51.839
Yeah, there's uh so I called cope notes cope notes, like I named it that because my idea at the time was like, I just need to get through this, like I just need to cope effectively.
00:26:52.079 --> 00:26:59.039
Um, but then since then I've learned a lot about like I have a keynote that I'll do for like corporate groups called Beyond Coping.
00:26:59.200 --> 00:27:03.839
And it's like, okay, there there is coping, which is like I just need to get through this.
00:27:03.920 --> 00:27:07.519
And then what is maybe even better than that?
00:27:07.680 --> 00:27:11.039
Like, how can you leverage this awful thing that is happening?
00:27:11.119 --> 00:27:18.079
And awful thing could be you had a bad day, awful thing could be a loss or getting laid off or a diagnosis, anything.
00:27:18.319 --> 00:27:22.400
How can you leverage that to accomplish things that you never could before?
00:27:22.559 --> 00:27:35.279
And for me, I think about like uh there is a powerful storytelling component that keeps people resilient, even in moments when they don't feel resilient.
00:27:35.359 --> 00:27:36.720
Like for me, I'm not joking.
00:27:36.880 --> 00:27:44.799
When I lost my home in uh Hurricane Milton, and it was devastating, like one of the most difficult things I've ever been through in my life, and I have not had an easy life.
00:27:45.039 --> 00:27:46.400
It was so brutal.
00:27:46.559 --> 00:27:52.799
And I remember I was like, just try to imagine some type of positive outcome from this.
00:27:52.880 --> 00:27:57.200
And I'm I'm standing outside the wreckage of my home and I'm like, I don't know.
00:27:57.519 --> 00:28:10.400
My I find out that I have a great step-uncle who has a mansion that I can go live in or something, and I'm just trying to imagine like in what way could this possibly lead to something positive.
00:28:11.039 --> 00:28:14.960
And I think part of it is like effectively coping in the moment.
00:28:15.119 --> 00:28:23.759
We're like, okay, I know I need to breathe slowly, or I know I need a glass of water, or I know I need to go to sleep and rest, like those things.
00:28:23.839 --> 00:28:35.039
But then beyond that, I think part of resilience is using your imagination, just like you worry about tomorrow, that's imagination, using that same imagination to build a future that is positive.
00:28:35.200 --> 00:28:48.640
Even if you know it's like ridiculously pie in the sky, like well, what is extremely unlikely to happen, it still helps you ideate and stretch that maybe if you lost your home, you could find a better place.
00:28:48.799 --> 00:28:55.119
And even if I said I don't want a better place, it helps me picture a future that isn't as dark as today.
00:28:55.359 --> 00:28:55.599
Yeah.
00:28:55.839 --> 00:28:59.440
You know, you mentioned earlier about how powerful the brain is.
00:28:59.599 --> 00:29:04.079
And the fact that you are able to shift your mindset to more of a positive approach.
00:29:04.240 --> 00:29:16.799
I think that is what helps us as human beings be able to navigate those difficult situations in our life because it does your brain is powerful and how your mindset is in that moment will kind of drive the outcome, future state.
00:29:16.960 --> 00:29:18.480
So I'm glad you brought up that example.
00:29:18.559 --> 00:29:20.160
And sorry to hear about your home.
00:29:20.400 --> 00:29:22.799
We all Milton was a tough one for us.
00:29:23.039 --> 00:29:24.240
Yeah, I'm I'm not worried about it.
00:29:24.319 --> 00:29:27.519
I live in a I live in my great stepuncle's mansion now.
00:29:27.680 --> 00:29:29.440
So I'm I'm real comfortable.
00:29:29.599 --> 00:29:30.960
I'm happy it happened.
00:29:32.079 --> 00:29:32.960
That's amazing.
00:29:33.119 --> 00:29:36.640
Well, as we begin to close, you know, this was a very powerful episode.
00:29:36.799 --> 00:29:39.440
I want to thank you for coming on and really being vulnerable.
00:29:39.599 --> 00:29:42.240
And you've gave you given me so much insight today.
00:29:42.319 --> 00:29:48.880
And I know our listeners are gonna have a lot of great messages and tools for success to take away from this episode.
00:29:49.279 --> 00:29:54.640
If there's one message from today's conversation that you want our listeners to take away, what would it be?
00:29:54.960 --> 00:29:56.319
I'm very straightforward.
00:29:56.480 --> 00:29:57.920
Don't kill yourself.
00:29:58.160 --> 00:29:58.720
Don't.
00:29:58.960 --> 00:30:03.279
And I'm saying, I'm not saying you can't, you can, but don't.
00:30:03.599 --> 00:30:08.559
Because there were so many days in my life where I'm like, this is it, it's never gonna get better.
00:30:08.720 --> 00:30:14.000
Like, I don't care what you tell me, my life is doomed because of a diagnosis or because of a situation.
00:30:14.160 --> 00:30:18.079
And I've been wrong every single time I have thought that.
00:30:18.240 --> 00:30:25.680
And I am one of probably three billion people who are in that same camp who are like, I'm so convinced that things will never get better.
00:30:25.920 --> 00:30:30.480
So just if you are listening to this, even if there's one person listening who's like, wow, I don't really know.
00:30:30.720 --> 00:30:32.960
Just stick stick around and find out.
00:30:33.119 --> 00:30:35.680
Like, you do not know what tomorrow will look like.
00:30:35.759 --> 00:30:40.720
And man, you might hear the funniest joke you've ever heard in your entire life three weeks from now.
00:30:40.880 --> 00:30:45.279
You might eat at your favorite restaurant nine years from now, your favorite restaurant of all time.
00:30:45.440 --> 00:30:47.200
You might watch your favorite movie in 15 years.
00:30:47.279 --> 00:30:50.079
You might meet the love of your life in like three days.
00:30:50.240 --> 00:30:53.359
Like, please don't leave before you get to experience all that stuff.
00:30:53.599 --> 00:30:54.720
That's amazing, Johnny.
00:30:54.799 --> 00:30:55.440
Thank you for that.
00:30:55.599 --> 00:31:00.240
For those listening to the episode, we want to thank you for tuning in to the Voice of Experience podcast.
00:31:00.400 --> 00:31:01.759
This was a powerful episode.
00:31:01.839 --> 00:31:10.640
And for those who are maybe suffering uh with suicide or depression, um, there is a hotline, 988, that you can call if you do need any help.
00:31:10.799 --> 00:31:19.440
But also reach out to those around you, reach out to a mental health specialist, find out who can help you and get the help and just stick around, as Johnny said.
00:31:19.920 --> 00:31:26.640
For those listening to our podcast, we are online at www.voiceovexperience p fact.com.
00:31:26.799 --> 00:31:30.559
We're also on social media at the voice of experience p fact.
00:31:30.640 --> 00:31:33.519
And until next time, let's keep the conversation going.
00:31:43.039 --> 00:31:48.079
Thank you for joining us on this episode of the Voices of Experience podcast.
00:31:48.319 --> 00:31:52.240
We hope you found the conversation enlightening and inspiring.
00:31:52.559 --> 00:31:56.799
If you enjoyed the episode, be sure to subscribe and leave us a review.
00:31:56.960 --> 00:32:03.680
It helps others find our show and supports the incredible work of our patient and family advisory council.
00:32:04.160 --> 00:32:06.319
Stay connected with us on social media.
00:32:06.480 --> 00:32:12.000
You can find the PFAC podcast on social media at Voices of Experience PFAC.
00:32:12.559 --> 00:32:19.920
For more information about PFAC and how to get involved, visit our website by clicking the link in the show description.
00:32:20.240 --> 00:32:34.400
Until next time, let's keep the conversation going and continue to advocate for patient-centered career.
00:00:00.080 --> 00:00:04.559
So just if you are listening to this, even if there's one person listening who's like, wow, I don't really know.
00:00:04.799 --> 00:00:07.040
Just stick stick around and find out.
00:00:07.200 --> 00:00:09.759
Like, you do not know what tomorrow will look like.
00:00:09.839 --> 00:00:14.880
And man, you might hear the funniest joke you've ever heard in your entire life three weeks from now.
00:00:14.960 --> 00:00:19.440
You might eat at your favorite restaurant nine years from now, your favorite restaurant of all time.
00:00:19.519 --> 00:00:21.280
You might watch your favorite movie in 15 years.
00:00:21.359 --> 00:00:24.160
You might meet the love of your life in like three days.
00:00:24.320 --> 00:00:28.239
Like, please don't leave before you get to experience all that stuff.
00:00:57.920 --> 00:00:59.359
Are you ready?
00:00:59.520 --> 00:01:15.280
It is time for season three of the Voices of Experience podcast, a podcast dedicated to sharing powerful stories from patients and their families, showcasing the importance of patient-centered care.
00:01:16.239 --> 00:01:23.760
Our host, Amber Brown, comes each and every week ready to help you along your journey.
00:01:24.319 --> 00:01:26.480
Sometimes there's a solo show.
00:01:26.719 --> 00:01:35.599
Sometimes she brings on a guest, and it is all focused on centering the patient voice in each and every conversation.
00:01:35.840 --> 00:01:41.120
We are brought to you by Tampa General Hospital's Patient and Family Advisory Council.
00:01:41.359 --> 00:01:50.799
We're diving into real life experiences, offering insights into the challenges, triumphs, and transformative moments in healthcare.
00:01:51.040 --> 00:01:52.640
Let's get started.
00:02:27.919 --> 00:02:29.840
Thank you very much for having me.
00:02:30.159 --> 00:02:33.680
So, Johnny, um, on the show, we like everyone to start by introducing themselves.
00:02:33.840 --> 00:02:37.759
So please tell the audience a little bit about yourself and how you're an advocate for mental health.
00:02:38.159 --> 00:02:45.039
Yeah, I grew up in Tampa with basically all the mental health cards stacked against me.
00:02:45.199 --> 00:02:52.319
So all of the challenges that might lead to mental health conditions later, like abuse or bullying, things like that.
00:02:52.560 --> 00:02:56.400
I faced a lot of that when I was young and I didn't have great coping mechanisms.
00:02:56.560 --> 00:02:59.199
So my probably my healthiest coping mechanism was music.
00:02:59.599 --> 00:03:05.599
Whenever I got frustrated or stressed or scared, I could pick up a guitar or grab my walkman.
00:03:05.840 --> 00:03:08.000
I had like the CD player with the foam headphones.
00:03:08.639 --> 00:03:12.159
And other than that, all my other coping mechanisms were pretty unhealthy.
00:03:12.240 --> 00:03:13.919
I would get like really angry.
00:03:14.080 --> 00:03:20.719
I would throw stuff and punch stuff because I understood, like, well, that's that's how men express emotion is you can.
00:03:21.039 --> 00:03:25.520
There's this famous Bill Burr quote, like, you can men can either be angry or fine.
00:03:25.680 --> 00:03:27.280
Those are the only two things that are allowed.
00:03:27.360 --> 00:03:31.840
So for me growing up, I was angry or I would tell people I was fine.
00:03:32.000 --> 00:03:36.800
And I really wasn't interested in mental health until I started treatment when I was 16.
00:03:36.960 --> 00:03:39.199
And I was so convinced it wouldn't work for me.
00:03:39.280 --> 00:03:40.879
I'm like, no, I'm too screwed up.
00:03:40.960 --> 00:03:42.080
Like, you don't know anything.
00:03:42.240 --> 00:03:44.159
And then slowly it started making a difference.
00:03:44.319 --> 00:03:58.879
And I went to school for psychology and became really not only fascinated with how and why the brain changes, but also trying to get support to people who are convinced that all the existing options won't work for them.
00:03:59.120 --> 00:04:00.719
Yeah, no, that's really impactful.
00:04:00.800 --> 00:04:04.000
And thank you for being vulnerable and coming on and sharing your story.
00:04:04.159 --> 00:04:13.680
Um, a lot of times people are not open to talk about this, and a lot of us in the United States, across the world, deal with mental health, but it is a stigma and a lot of people don't want to talk about it.
00:04:13.759 --> 00:04:15.199
So I appreciate you being here.
00:04:15.360 --> 00:04:20.800
Um, is there a specific moment in your life where you realize that your experience could help others?
00:04:22.959 --> 00:04:29.199
I feel like one of the it's not one night, but it was a series of nights.
00:04:29.360 --> 00:04:32.800
So I was, I spent most of my life touring in a metal band.
00:04:33.040 --> 00:04:35.120
So I was on tour.
00:04:35.279 --> 00:04:40.319
Uh, my band was called Dark Sermon at the time, and we're like, I wrote all the lyrics and sang.
00:04:40.480 --> 00:04:47.120
So I'm writing lyrics about depression and self-harm and and hallucinations, all of these things that I'm experiencing.
00:04:47.279 --> 00:04:53.680
But I would dress them up in these really like fancy metaphors, and then I would think, like, wow, no one knows what I'm talking about.
00:04:53.759 --> 00:04:54.480
It's so artistic.
00:04:54.639 --> 00:05:04.399
And then I would go on tour and play, and people would come up to the merch table afterwards and go, like, hey, this song about hallucinations, I really feel that, or this song about suicide really touched me.
00:05:04.480 --> 00:05:06.399
And I'm like, Oh, you guys know what I'm talking about.
00:05:06.639 --> 00:05:11.680
And it was cool because other people were finding peace.
00:05:11.920 --> 00:05:17.839
And and I wasn't the songs that I was writing wasn't like, you may feel suicidal, but keep on going.
00:05:18.000 --> 00:05:20.560
The songs were just like, I feel suicidal.
00:05:20.879 --> 00:05:24.560
And then people felt so relieved to know that they weren't alone and feeling that.
00:05:24.639 --> 00:05:28.560
And when I reflect on my relationship with music, I felt the same way.
00:05:28.639 --> 00:05:32.560
I wasn't comforted by people telling me, keep going, you got this.
00:05:32.720 --> 00:05:37.279
I was comforted by other people sharing that they were also experiencing the same difficulty.
00:05:37.360 --> 00:05:48.319
And it made me feel like, okay, if they used their lived experience with the same hardship as me, if they just shared about it and it helped me feel better, then I can share about what I went through to help other people.
00:05:48.639 --> 00:05:50.079
Yeah, that's a really good example.
00:05:50.319 --> 00:05:57.600
I really appreciate the fact that you utilize a medium like music to tell your story and it resonated with others.
00:05:57.680 --> 00:05:59.680
And this is kind of uh an example of that.
00:05:59.759 --> 00:06:09.120
This podcast is another venue in which we want to create a space for patients or people like yourself to come on and be able to have a voice of some sort.
00:06:09.279 --> 00:06:12.879
So um definitely resonate with that, and thank you for being vulnerable again.
00:06:13.199 --> 00:06:21.120
So, why do you think people feel like it's very difficult to talk openly about mental health?
00:06:22.319 --> 00:06:25.920
Well, part of it is how we dress it in media.
00:06:26.160 --> 00:06:29.600
So, like I remember when I was I was diagnosed with schizophrenia when I was 16.
00:06:29.839 --> 00:06:32.240
And it's like the scariest, it's a scary word.
00:06:32.319 --> 00:06:36.480
Like, if I tell people like, oh, I grew up with depression, they're like, Oh, I get that, that must be hard.
00:06:36.800 --> 00:06:38.240
Or I have anxiety, it must be hard.
00:06:38.319 --> 00:06:42.480
And then I'm like, I grew up with schizophrenia, and they're like, oh, that really freaks people out.
00:06:42.639 --> 00:06:42.879
Yes.
00:06:43.040 --> 00:06:59.519
And it freaked me out too, because when I was diagnosed, all I could picture was like in movies where they'd have like someone in a strait jacket or something, or or you'd find out that someone like uh robbed a convenience store or something, and it's like, oh, the person was living with schizophrenia or something.
00:06:59.680 --> 00:07:09.759
So you you have this image in your head of like people with schizophrenia are like criminal, or they're they're they can't get a job or drive a car or have a girlfriend or something.
00:07:09.920 --> 00:07:18.720
So when I was diagnosed with schizophrenia, I felt like I was being diagnosed with you'll never have a car or a job or a girlfriend, like you're not gonna be a productive member of society.
00:07:18.959 --> 00:07:23.680
And all of that was inherited primarily through media and the way we talk about mental health.
00:07:23.839 --> 00:07:28.319
But I think then going to school and learning about some of these diagnoses, you're like, oh, wait a second.
00:07:28.639 --> 00:07:32.720
My picture of what these diagnoses look like doesn't really line up with the science.
00:07:32.879 --> 00:07:40.480
So I think advocacy is great because it gives people like sometimes I'll meet with someone, they're like, Oh, I don't believe you had schizophrenia or that you hallucinated.
00:07:40.639 --> 00:07:42.800
I'm like, okay, you don't have to believe it.
00:07:42.959 --> 00:07:43.120
Yeah.
00:07:43.360 --> 00:07:52.560
But it's like important that people interact with people and go, oh, I know people with that diagnosis, and it helps them.
00:07:53.439 --> 00:08:00.399
It helps people break away from the the Hollywood version of the diagnosis and gets them closer to what it looks like in real life.
00:08:00.560 --> 00:08:00.800
Yeah.
00:08:01.040 --> 00:08:01.759
No, that's huge.
00:08:01.920 --> 00:08:06.720
I think it goes across the board for like really any healthcare diagnosis that we talk about in society.
00:08:06.879 --> 00:08:08.560
Um, there's always some type of stigma.
00:08:08.720 --> 00:08:13.920
You have all these commercials, all these different media outlets, you have TikTok, you have Instagram, all these things coming at you.
00:08:14.000 --> 00:08:25.199
Um, and depending on who you are as a person, you know, you may digest that and think that, for example, when you see a commercial and there may be a medication that can help you, but then there's all these uh these side effects that you could get, right?
00:08:25.519 --> 00:08:34.960
Um, and people get scared to either take the medication or to feel comfortable talking to their doctor about the diagnosis or whatever it is, because they're worried they're gonna have like, you know, they're gonna die, right?
00:08:35.039 --> 00:08:40.000
Because this medication said it on TV, um, versus becoming educated into what's happening with them.
00:08:40.159 --> 00:08:47.600
So the fact that you went, sought help, right, you were able to get diagnosis and then figure out what does that mean for you, Johnny?
00:08:47.759 --> 00:08:50.559
What is that, you know, how does that define you?
00:08:50.720 --> 00:08:52.960
Or really, how does it not define me, right?
00:08:53.039 --> 00:08:58.320
And it's not anyone's job to tell you, like, I don't believe you have schizophrenia, right?
00:08:58.399 --> 00:09:05.679
It's their job to listen, to support, advocate, and to maybe be able to understand that your journey is not their journey, right?
00:09:05.919 --> 00:09:11.120
Yeah, it's funny when people say that it's like, well, people don't believe that the earth is round.
00:09:11.440 --> 00:09:12.799
Like it doesn't really change that.
00:09:12.879 --> 00:09:21.679
So like it doesn't, it used to, I used to get sort of like indignant, like you think I wanted this diagnosis, you think I chose this, and now I'm like, it doesn't really matter what you think.
00:09:21.840 --> 00:09:27.120
Like I'm just sharing what's real in my life, and if you don't believe me, it doesn't bother me, it's totally fine.
00:09:27.279 --> 00:09:27.440
Right.
00:09:27.679 --> 00:09:35.679
And I definitely have felt that with certain diagnoses where like some I think are more socially accepted, which is good.
00:09:35.759 --> 00:09:36.799
That means there's progress.
00:09:36.879 --> 00:09:39.840
And I think others, there's maybe less social acceptance.
00:09:40.000 --> 00:09:47.120
So I'm always trying to be a champion for like, let's include generalized anxiety and bipolar in the same conversation.
00:09:47.200 --> 00:09:58.960
And that way you have something that feels a little more palatable to most people socially, and then something that feels a little more taboo, and you can blend them and help people understand like, oh, this is all under the behavioral health umbrella.
00:09:59.039 --> 00:10:00.720
You don't have to be scared of certain terms.
00:10:00.960 --> 00:10:01.440
Correct.
00:10:01.679 --> 00:10:06.399
I appreciate you even bringing that here to the podcast, just that example alone.
00:10:06.639 --> 00:10:14.960
It should bring insight to someone listening to understand that behavioral health, mental health, no matter what the diagnosis is, it all falls under that same umbrella.
00:10:15.039 --> 00:10:27.679
And all of it should be treated equally, respect respectfully, and understand that those are someone's experiences and they shouldn't be isolated or separated just because of societal norms, right?
00:10:27.840 --> 00:10:33.840
October 10th is coming up, and that is mental health, World Mental Health Awareness Day.
00:10:34.000 --> 00:10:44.399
And so on this episode, um, as you all have heard from Johnny so far, we're really diving into mental health and really understanding um why he's an advocate and in his story.
00:10:44.559 --> 00:10:47.759
And so, Johnny, a lot of times people will say, I'm fine, right?
00:10:47.840 --> 00:10:50.240
When you ask them, like, is something wrong or are you okay?
00:10:50.399 --> 00:10:51.759
Um, but they're really struggling.
00:10:51.840 --> 00:10:57.759
So, what are some signs that family members or friends or even co-workers can pay attention to with someone dealing with mental health?
00:10:58.080 --> 00:11:06.000
Yeah, first I'm definitely guilty of the fine thing, especially when I first started treatment and I would sit down with my therapist once a week because I don't want to go at all.
00:11:06.159 --> 00:11:07.440
So she'd be like, How was this week?
00:11:07.519 --> 00:11:08.320
And I'm like, It was fine.
00:11:08.720 --> 00:11:09.279
How are you feeling?
00:11:09.440 --> 00:11:10.080
I'm fine.
00:11:10.240 --> 00:11:13.519
And then now I notice it even in in my friendships.
00:11:13.679 --> 00:11:15.200
I'll like ask my friend, Hey, how are you doing?
00:11:15.279 --> 00:11:15.919
He's like, I'm fine.
00:11:16.000 --> 00:11:17.120
I'm like, How are you doing?
00:11:17.440 --> 00:11:19.360
How are you doing?
00:11:19.519 --> 00:11:20.080
How are you?
00:11:20.240 --> 00:11:21.600
And you have to like drill down.
00:11:22.320 --> 00:11:28.399
And I think there are moments where people will tell me they're fine, but I can smell that they're not fine.
00:11:28.559 --> 00:11:35.200
So a few litmus tests that I always recommend basically boil down the pattern recognition.
00:11:35.519 --> 00:11:47.200
So I think sometimes people think, oh, if Johnny normally sleeps, they'll think like because someone's eating more or eating less that it's a problem.
00:11:47.440 --> 00:11:50.960
But generally for me, I would say it depends on how they normally eat.
00:11:51.039 --> 00:11:52.399
So, like, what is their baseline?
00:11:52.480 --> 00:11:55.679
So, for example, if you know me and I have a huge appetite, like all the time.
00:11:55.840 --> 00:12:02.960
Like every time we hang out, I'm chowing on something, and then we hang out and four or five times in a row, you see, I'm not, I'm skipping dinner.
00:12:03.039 --> 00:12:08.000
And you're like, wow, that's actually really that is a deviation from the norm for him.
00:12:08.159 --> 00:12:08.320
Right.
00:12:08.559 --> 00:12:12.320
Whereas the same might be true for somebody else, where they almost never eat.
00:12:12.399 --> 00:12:15.279
And then every time you see them, they're eating something, you're like, what change?
00:12:15.600 --> 00:12:19.919
But I wouldn't necessarily take that one example and say, okay, something's going wrong.
00:12:20.080 --> 00:12:24.799
I would say if you recognize multiple pattern breaks across different areas of life.
00:12:24.960 --> 00:12:33.919
So for example, if I eat a lot, I play guitar a lot, I'm trying to use things that are like generally true of me, and I exercise a lot.
00:12:34.240 --> 00:12:36.960
And I'm pretty social, so I see my friends pretty frequently.
00:12:37.120 --> 00:12:41.679
And then you notice I'm not really playing guitar, I'm not seeing my friends, I'm not exercising.
00:12:41.759 --> 00:12:45.200
And you go, wow, that's a lot of pattern breaks layered on top of each other.
00:12:45.519 --> 00:12:51.279
Generally, that's how I will identify things because sometimes, like, if I skip a meal, I'm not hungry.
00:12:51.679 --> 00:12:52.080
It's fine.
00:12:52.240 --> 00:12:54.080
If I skip a workout, it's because my back hurts.
00:12:54.159 --> 00:12:54.960
It's not a big deal.
00:12:55.120 --> 00:13:05.200
But if I'm skipping multiple or I experience multiple deviations from norms and different categories of my life, generally I would say that could be an indicator that something is happening.
00:13:05.440 --> 00:13:06.559
I like those examples.
00:13:06.639 --> 00:13:07.200
Thank you for that.
00:13:07.279 --> 00:13:18.240
And I I do encourage you all listening that if you see kind of those pattern deviations within family members, coworkers, or those around you, please talk to them and ask them like what is truly going on.
00:13:18.399 --> 00:13:19.679
It could save a life.
00:13:20.000 --> 00:13:24.159
So, as you all know, this is part of Tampa Journal Hospital healthcare.
00:13:24.399 --> 00:13:32.000
And it's very important as healthcare professionals that we create an environment where a patient feels safe to communicate what's really going on emotionally with them.
00:13:32.240 --> 00:13:36.879
Can you give an example or can you give some advice to healthcare professionals on how they can do that?
00:13:37.840 --> 00:13:42.559
Yeah, the uh well, I'll tell you a few things that didn't make me feel great.
00:13:42.639 --> 00:13:42.799
Okay.
00:13:42.960 --> 00:13:44.960
And then you can do the opposite, I guess.
00:13:45.039 --> 00:13:49.679
So there were two things in treatment that kind of really turned me off.
00:13:49.840 --> 00:13:55.279
And I think both are very well-intended.
00:13:55.600 --> 00:13:58.559
They're like doing these things to be kind, but they didn't feel kind to me.
00:13:58.639 --> 00:14:00.000
So I'm just sharing from my perspective.
00:14:00.080 --> 00:14:02.240
I'm not sharing like, here's what you should do as a clinician.
00:14:02.480 --> 00:14:04.720
I'm just sharing what it felt, I mean, voices of experience.
00:14:05.200 --> 00:14:06.080
It was just my experience.
00:14:06.559 --> 00:14:14.799
So I'm there are two things that jump out at me that made me feel like, oh, this doesn't feel like the type of environment where I'm cool sharing all this.
00:14:14.960 --> 00:14:20.480
The first is the like, oh, you poor baby type of mentality.
00:14:20.720 --> 00:14:21.840
That I can't tell you.
00:14:21.919 --> 00:14:27.200
Like, I grew up, I was powerlifting, I played in a death metal band.
00:14:27.519 --> 00:14:30.799
If you poor babied me, it just immediately turned me off.
00:14:30.960 --> 00:14:35.679
I felt like so emasculated and like, oh great, now I'm like a a pity case.
00:14:35.759 --> 00:14:40.879
Like this person doesn't even take me seriously because it man, I'm always awful.
00:14:41.200 --> 00:14:42.399
I don't, I didn't want that.
00:14:42.559 --> 00:14:47.919
And it made me feel like almost like I was being spoken down to, which didn't feel great.
00:14:48.080 --> 00:14:53.600
And the other thing that some people would do on the other end of the spectrum is they would try to like hyper-normalize it.
00:14:53.759 --> 00:14:58.000
Like I remember I was sharing with a clinician that I went to early on.
00:14:58.080 --> 00:15:03.279
This is one of my first doctors I ever saw for anything I was facing on the mental health side.
00:15:03.440 --> 00:15:08.000
And I didn't know how to explain to him that I was suicidal, like how I felt.
00:15:08.240 --> 00:15:11.759
So I gave him this poem that I wrote, and it was called The Wedding.
00:15:11.919 --> 00:15:16.720
And it was a poem about me marrying my own death.
00:15:16.960 --> 00:15:30.320
It was like a love poem for me dying, and it was like, I don't know how to explain to someone like I I want to die, and I look forward to it, and I'm excited about it, and I'm planning it like someone would look forward to a wedding and plan for it.
00:15:30.639 --> 00:15:42.080
And I I hand it, I hand this wedding or I hand this poem to him, and I'm thinking, like, surely this will explain to him how abnormal what I'm experiencing is because I don't know how to put it into words, but this poem will explain it.
00:15:42.159 --> 00:15:44.000
So I give it to him, I'm like 16 years old.
00:15:44.240 --> 00:15:51.279
I give him the poem and he reads it and he like nods, and he looks up at me and he goes, What you're experiencing is very normal.
00:15:51.919 --> 00:15:57.039
Everybody goes through this, and I was like, Oh, that's the worst news ever.
00:15:57.360 --> 00:16:01.679
If everybody feels like this and this is normal, I don't want to be around anymore.
00:16:02.159 --> 00:16:09.519
So it was like some people would give me so much pity that it made me feel disconnected, like not treated like a human.
00:16:10.240 --> 00:16:18.720
And then on the other side, some people tried so hard to normalize it that it like there was almost no compassion or even recognition that it was difficult.
00:16:19.200 --> 00:16:25.120
And what I always tell people is like, if you can just say something like, I had this one therapist who just said, That sucks.
00:16:25.279 --> 00:16:28.000
And I was like, Yeah, it really does.
00:16:28.159 --> 00:16:28.320
Yeah.
00:16:28.480 --> 00:16:37.120
So it was like a perfect balance of like, I feel that that hurts and that's awful, but I don't think that you're like gonna be put out for the rest of your life and you can't overcome it.
00:16:37.200 --> 00:16:42.720
It was like this harmony of empathy and encouragement.
00:16:42.960 --> 00:16:43.759
Yeah, yeah.
00:16:44.000 --> 00:16:47.200
I really liked how you broke it down on like each side of the spectrum.
00:16:47.519 --> 00:16:55.840
And I think at some point, if someone has dealt with a mental health battle and has spoken to someone, they've probably gotten both sides of those spectrum.
00:16:56.159 --> 00:16:57.440
Um, unfortunately.
00:16:57.600 --> 00:17:06.880
And I think as members of society, when we're communicating with someone that is going through something we can't resonate with or understand, we have a tendency to kind of go one way or the other.
00:17:06.960 --> 00:17:09.920
And it's like, ah, I don't know how to respond to that.
00:17:10.240 --> 00:17:30.720
But I appreciate you at least bringing that to life so someone can have a little bit more introspect and be like, okay, let me see how I can communicate with this, and maybe just saying that sucks, or thank you for telling me, yeah, you know, tell me more, or something that makes the person the other person feel heard or just listen to versus trying to find a solution or whatever it is.
00:17:31.039 --> 00:17:33.119
Sometimes people just want to be heard at the moment.
00:17:33.440 --> 00:17:36.079
Yeah, so I appreciate you bringing those examples.
00:17:36.880 --> 00:17:45.440
So, how can someone, Johnny, maintain hope when they're dealing with uncertainty or pain or major life challenges?
00:17:46.480 --> 00:17:51.759
So I have this phrase that has really helped me with this.
00:17:51.920 --> 00:17:53.680
I hope it helps somebody listening.
00:17:53.920 --> 00:17:57.200
The phrase is tomorrow might be better.
00:17:57.599 --> 00:18:00.559
And I clung to this phrase for like years.
00:18:00.720 --> 00:18:01.759
I still do sometimes.
00:18:01.839 --> 00:18:15.119
Like when I have a really awful day or week or month or year, I will say to myself, like, tomorrow might be better because if someone says you tomorrow's gonna be better, I'm like, you don't know that.
00:18:15.279 --> 00:18:20.960
So don't even try to make an exclusive claim, an absolute claim about tomorrow, because like it feels like a lie.
00:18:21.279 --> 00:18:22.799
You don't know that, you can't prove it.
00:18:23.279 --> 00:18:26.799
Just like if I say tomorrow's gonna suck, I don't know that either.
00:18:27.119 --> 00:18:29.440
So, what helps me is the word might.
00:18:29.680 --> 00:18:30.799
Tomorrow might be better.
00:18:30.880 --> 00:18:48.720
And I'm not saying the rest of your life might be better, even though I generally have a belief that there's a pretty good chance that will be the case, but tomorrow might be better feels like bite-sized and realistic, and it helps me acknowledge like the difficulty that I have faced up to this point in my life.
00:18:48.880 --> 00:18:57.519
There is no rule in the book that says that tomorrow will be bad because today was bad.
00:18:57.680 --> 00:19:05.440
So I always try to look at the future as like just like I've been wrong about almost everything in my life to date.
00:19:05.599 --> 00:19:12.319
Like I was wrong about who I thought I was gonna marry, what city I was gonna live in, what car I was gonna drive, what part of town, like what I was gonna do for work.
00:19:12.400 --> 00:19:13.680
I've been wrong about almost anything.
00:19:13.839 --> 00:19:18.640
So why would the outcome of tomorrow be like the first thing I'm right about?
00:19:18.960 --> 00:19:19.759
That's a good point.
00:19:19.839 --> 00:19:21.279
I like the way you illustrated that.
00:19:21.359 --> 00:19:21.920
It's really good.
00:19:22.079 --> 00:19:22.880
And I like that quote.
00:19:23.039 --> 00:19:24.079
I'm actually gonna steal it.
00:19:24.240 --> 00:19:24.880
So thank you.
00:19:25.039 --> 00:19:26.799
Uh tomorrow might be better.
00:19:26.960 --> 00:19:28.640
Um, that's a really good one.
00:19:28.880 --> 00:19:36.400
You know, so on this podcast, we really like to highlight great work or just innovation that some of our guests do.
00:19:36.480 --> 00:19:43.519
And you created Cope Notes, which is a platform that says daily text messages designed to improve mental and emotional health.
00:19:43.759 --> 00:19:49.200
Can you talk a little bit about that tool and just elaborate a little bit to our audience about it?
00:19:49.519 --> 00:19:56.640
Yeah, the so I fell in love in treatment and in school with peer support and health education.
00:19:56.799 --> 00:20:01.359
So peer support is talking to people who have been through it firsthand so they understand what you're going through.
00:20:01.440 --> 00:20:08.240
And health education is exactly what it sounds like, like learning how to be healthier because you have the knowledge.
00:20:08.400 --> 00:20:16.640
So, for example, imagine somebody who is struggling to lose weight but doesn't know how to exercise properly.
00:20:16.720 --> 00:20:16.799
Yeah.
00:20:16.960 --> 00:20:19.680
So they don't know about form, they don't know what exercises to do.
00:20:19.759 --> 00:20:22.960
Like if you put them in the gym, they're like, I literally have no idea what to do.
00:20:23.119 --> 00:20:28.400
Health education would be you can use these weights to do these exercises and you're equipping them with knowledge.
00:20:28.480 --> 00:20:35.279
But imagine they're receiving that health education from someone who was like, oh yes, I did all this stuff to lose weight myself.
00:20:35.440 --> 00:20:35.839
Oh, yeah.
00:20:36.000 --> 00:20:38.880
And I had actually the same thyroid condition that you have.
00:20:39.039 --> 00:20:41.200
And someone goes, Oh, no way, really?
00:20:41.359 --> 00:20:42.480
Okay, so this is possible.
00:20:42.640 --> 00:20:46.240
Like you're not telling me this is what you think might help.
00:20:46.400 --> 00:20:48.000
You're telling me this is what helped you.
00:20:48.079 --> 00:20:48.799
It's really powerful.
00:20:48.880 --> 00:20:50.160
It's the whole point of your podcast.
00:20:50.319 --> 00:20:57.680
So uh what we do is we send text messages that contain health education content written by peers with lived experience.
00:20:57.839 --> 00:21:03.039
So if you think about therapy, that might take like an hour for a therapy session.
00:21:03.200 --> 00:21:11.440
And what we do is we chop up that therapy session into like bite-sized pieces of health education content and we deliver it in non-clinical settings.
00:21:11.599 --> 00:21:15.920
So you might get a two-sentence text message while you're cooking dinner.
00:21:16.000 --> 00:21:24.000
And the next day you get one while you're getting out of the shower and you're still soaking wet, and you check the time on your phone and you see, oh, I have a text from Cope Notes.
00:21:24.079 --> 00:21:26.880
And each day it comes at a different time with a different message message.
00:21:26.960 --> 00:21:32.640
And over time, it's proven to reduce stress, anxiety, and depression in less than 10 seconds per day.
00:21:32.799 --> 00:21:38.720
So it's great for people like younger me who I didn't want to go to therapy or take the medication or read the books.
00:21:38.799 --> 00:21:42.319
It's like, okay, well, will you at least read two sentences?
00:21:42.480 --> 00:21:44.079
And it's like, well, yeah, I could probably do that.
00:21:44.480 --> 00:21:44.880
Interesting.
00:21:44.960 --> 00:21:45.839
I like the idea.
00:21:45.920 --> 00:21:53.279
And to your point, as a a millennial, I'm always checking my phone really quick and I don't have time to read paragraphs per se.
00:21:53.680 --> 00:21:54.559
I definitely don't.
00:21:54.799 --> 00:22:01.759
So I think to your point, that innovation of the two sentences, um, it we Love daily motivation, right?
00:22:01.920 --> 00:22:05.920
You see quotes on Instagram or different platforms that people create and post.
00:22:06.079 --> 00:22:11.039
Um, but I think the fact that it comes to you, you don't have to go into an application or anything like that.
00:22:11.200 --> 00:22:13.839
Can I can see why it can reduce anxiety and stress.
00:22:14.000 --> 00:22:25.039
I I mean, for myself, waking up in the mornings or just getting ready for my day-to-day, getting a quick reminder, you know, that things are gonna be okay, or here's ways you can, you know, get through today, right?
00:22:25.200 --> 00:22:25.440
Yeah.
00:22:25.599 --> 00:22:27.359
Um, I think that is very impactful.
00:22:27.519 --> 00:22:29.039
So I appreciate you sharing that.
00:22:29.279 --> 00:22:33.119
Do you have any examples of any feedback that you've gotten regarding code notes?
00:22:33.519 --> 00:22:38.240
Yeah, this is anytime I want to quit, because this is hard to like build something.
00:22:38.559 --> 00:22:40.319
As you know, you're building something right now.
00:22:40.720 --> 00:22:41.359
And me too.
00:22:41.519 --> 00:22:44.960
So there are days when you wake up and you're like, I just am gonna throw in the towel.
00:22:45.039 --> 00:22:45.920
I'm so exhausted.
00:22:46.000 --> 00:22:48.319
This is way more complicated than I thought it would be.
00:22:48.559 --> 00:22:51.279
And there are day I face maybe a day like that.
00:22:51.359 --> 00:22:54.559
Once every couple months, I have a day where I wake up and I'm like, this is too hard.
00:22:54.640 --> 00:22:55.920
I'm in way over my head.
00:22:56.079 --> 00:22:59.279
And then I'll look at our reviews and testimonials.
00:22:59.359 --> 00:23:18.400
And there are stories from people who are like, this text like there's literally a story of a guy who was about to jump off the top of a building and saw the there was a text that we had sent him that mentioned seashells.
00:23:18.960 --> 00:23:24.400
It was something like when you go to a beach and you're looking for seashells, you find them.
00:23:24.960 --> 00:23:29.599
When you go to the beach and you're not looking for seashells, you you are like, oh, I didn't really see any seashells today.
00:23:29.680 --> 00:23:31.039
And it's it's just your attention.
00:23:31.119 --> 00:23:33.599
You went to the same beach, but your attention was different.
00:23:33.680 --> 00:23:35.359
So you kind of find what you're looking for.
00:23:35.519 --> 00:23:37.680
I can't remember the exact text, but that was the idea.
00:23:38.079 --> 00:23:41.279
Was like you can shift your focus and that might change your experience of today.
00:23:41.440 --> 00:23:45.440
And so we sent him this message like a month prior, two months prior.
00:23:45.680 --> 00:23:50.400
And then he's climbing to the top of this building to jump off and he sees the ledge.
00:23:50.960 --> 00:23:53.200
Do you know the type of concrete that has seashells in it?
00:23:53.519 --> 00:23:57.039
No, it's like a little bit of concrete, but like seashells mixed in.
00:23:57.279 --> 00:23:57.440
Okay.
00:23:57.680 --> 00:24:00.720
And so he's climbing to the top and he grabs the ledge and there's seashells in it.
00:24:00.880 --> 00:24:05.759
He remembers the message and then he gets down, calls his mom, his mom takes him to rehab.
00:24:06.400 --> 00:24:08.799
And he sent us a message after he got out of rehab.
00:24:08.960 --> 00:24:10.400
And I here's the thing.
00:24:11.599 --> 00:24:17.200
The the real Hollywood story would be we texted him right when he was on top of the building.
00:24:17.359 --> 00:24:19.920
And we came in at just the right time and we're the hero.
00:24:20.079 --> 00:24:20.960
But we're not the hero.
00:24:21.039 --> 00:24:24.960
We told him something like six weeks before this happened, and he remembered it.
00:24:25.359 --> 00:24:27.279
And that's the power of health education.
00:24:27.920 --> 00:24:31.599
Part of it, some people are like, wow, this text came in at the perfect time.
00:24:32.960 --> 00:24:34.480
That's that's all God.
00:24:34.559 --> 00:24:37.759
Like, we're not, we don't know exactly when to text you.
00:24:38.000 --> 00:24:47.039
But the brain has an uncanny ability to interpret stimulus based on what's going on in your life, and it can recall stuff.
00:24:47.119 --> 00:24:49.200
And that's why I'm so passionate about health education.
00:24:49.279 --> 00:25:01.200
Like, I might send you a text message today that feels totally irrelevant, and seven months later you use that tool, you're like, oh, I remember this, and it helps you face that thing.
00:25:01.440 --> 00:25:04.079
That is real like patient empowerment.
00:25:04.160 --> 00:25:07.920
Like you're making people, you're improving their self-efficacy.
00:25:08.160 --> 00:25:08.400
Yeah.
00:25:08.559 --> 00:25:09.599
Yeah, that's huge.
00:25:09.759 --> 00:25:19.920
And you know, what I what comes to mind as you were talking through that, a lot of times if you were to shift that to more of a real-world like help worker burnout, like we had COVID recently, right?
00:25:20.000 --> 00:25:24.640
And a lot of people had to adjust and figure out life after that, during and after.
00:25:24.880 --> 00:25:28.400
And some people are still struggling with getting back into the groove of things.
00:25:28.559 --> 00:25:47.200
And it makes me think about if a healthcare worker has a tough patient or just a tough caseload, and they, you know, have a text message that maybe they've received a few weeks before or days before, and they're able to go back and remember those things to help them navigate right through the day-to-day the why.
00:25:47.359 --> 00:25:48.160
Why are they here?
00:25:48.319 --> 00:25:49.200
Why are they a nurse?
00:25:49.279 --> 00:25:49.920
Why are they a provider?
00:25:50.000 --> 00:25:50.960
Why are they a physician?
00:25:51.119 --> 00:25:54.559
Um, remembering your why, remembering why you chose to do what you do.
00:25:54.720 --> 00:25:58.559
I think that's another component that cope notes could be for someone.
00:25:58.640 --> 00:26:01.039
Um, and I think of myself as a healthcare worker.
00:26:01.200 --> 00:26:04.000
I work in administration, I have a clinical background as well.
00:26:04.160 --> 00:26:12.400
And I think to myself, you know, there's any moment during the day where someone can remind me of my why, other than myself, I'm grateful for it.
00:26:12.480 --> 00:26:17.039
Because sometimes as human beings, we need that moment where someone's like, hey, you chose to do this for a reason.
00:26:17.279 --> 00:26:19.759
So you know, like keep at it, right?
00:26:19.920 --> 00:26:20.640
Don't give up.
00:26:20.799 --> 00:26:26.079
Um, so I really, really like your concept of cope notes, and I wish you all the success in that work.
00:26:26.160 --> 00:26:26.880
I really do.
00:26:27.200 --> 00:26:32.079
So we're gonna talk a little bit as we begin to wrap up the episode about resilience.
00:26:32.319 --> 00:26:35.599
So how what does resilience mean to you?
00:26:35.759 --> 00:26:39.440
And maybe talk about how that definition has changed over time for you.
00:26:40.319 --> 00:26:51.839
Yeah, there's uh so I called cope notes cope notes, like I named it that because my idea at the time was like, I just need to get through this, like I just need to cope effectively.
00:26:52.079 --> 00:26:59.039
Um, but then since then I've learned a lot about like I have a keynote that I'll do for like corporate groups called Beyond Coping.
00:26:59.200 --> 00:27:03.839
And it's like, okay, there there is coping, which is like I just need to get through this.
00:27:03.920 --> 00:27:07.519
And then what is maybe even better than that?
00:27:07.680 --> 00:27:11.039
Like, how can you leverage this awful thing that is happening?
00:27:11.119 --> 00:27:18.079
And awful thing could be you had a bad day, awful thing could be a loss or getting laid off or a diagnosis, anything.
00:27:18.319 --> 00:27:22.400
How can you leverage that to accomplish things that you never could before?
00:27:22.559 --> 00:27:35.279
And for me, I think about like uh there is a powerful storytelling component that keeps people resilient, even in moments when they don't feel resilient.
00:27:35.359 --> 00:27:36.720
Like for me, I'm not joking.
00:27:36.880 --> 00:27:44.799
When I lost my home in uh Hurricane Milton, and it was devastating, like one of the most difficult things I've ever been through in my life, and I have not had an easy life.
00:27:45.039 --> 00:27:46.400
It was so brutal.
00:27:46.559 --> 00:27:52.799
And I remember I was like, just try to imagine some type of positive outcome from this.
00:27:52.880 --> 00:27:57.200
And I'm I'm standing outside the wreckage of my home and I'm like, I don't know.
00:27:57.519 --> 00:28:10.400
My I find out that I have a great step-uncle who has a mansion that I can go live in or something, and I'm just trying to imagine like in what way could this possibly lead to something positive.
00:28:11.039 --> 00:28:14.960
And I think part of it is like effectively coping in the moment.
00:28:15.119 --> 00:28:23.759
We're like, okay, I know I need to breathe slowly, or I know I need a glass of water, or I know I need to go to sleep and rest, like those things.
00:28:23.839 --> 00:28:35.039
But then beyond that, I think part of resilience is using your imagination, just like you worry about tomorrow, that's imagination, using that same imagination to build a future that is positive.
00:28:35.200 --> 00:28:48.640
Even if you know it's like ridiculously pie in the sky, like well, what is extremely unlikely to happen, it still helps you ideate and stretch that maybe if you lost your home, you could find a better place.
00:28:48.799 --> 00:28:55.119
And even if I said I don't want a better place, it helps me picture a future that isn't as dark as today.
00:28:55.359 --> 00:28:55.599
Yeah.
00:28:55.839 --> 00:28:59.440
You know, you mentioned earlier about how powerful the brain is.
00:28:59.599 --> 00:29:04.079
And the fact that you are able to shift your mindset to more of a positive approach.
00:29:04.240 --> 00:29:16.799
I think that is what helps us as human beings be able to navigate those difficult situations in our life because it does your brain is powerful and how your mindset is in that moment will kind of drive the outcome, future state.
00:29:16.960 --> 00:29:18.480
So I'm glad you brought up that example.
00:29:18.559 --> 00:29:20.160
And sorry to hear about your home.
00:29:20.400 --> 00:29:22.799
We all Milton was a tough one for us.
00:29:23.039 --> 00:29:24.240
Yeah, I'm I'm not worried about it.
00:29:24.319 --> 00:29:27.519
I live in a I live in my great stepuncle's mansion now.
00:29:27.680 --> 00:29:29.440
So I'm I'm real comfortable.
00:29:29.599 --> 00:29:30.960
I'm happy it happened.
00:29:32.079 --> 00:29:32.960
That's amazing.
00:29:33.119 --> 00:29:36.640
Well, as we begin to close, you know, this was a very powerful episode.
00:29:36.799 --> 00:29:39.440
I want to thank you for coming on and really being vulnerable.
00:29:39.599 --> 00:29:42.240
And you've gave you given me so much insight today.
00:29:42.319 --> 00:29:48.880
And I know our listeners are gonna have a lot of great messages and tools for success to take away from this episode.
00:29:49.279 --> 00:29:54.640
If there's one message from today's conversation that you want our listeners to take away, what would it be?
00:29:54.960 --> 00:29:56.319
I'm very straightforward.
00:29:56.480 --> 00:29:57.920
Don't kill yourself.
00:29:58.160 --> 00:29:58.720
Don't.
00:29:58.960 --> 00:30:03.279
And I'm saying, I'm not saying you can't, you can, but don't.
00:30:03.599 --> 00:30:08.559
Because there were so many days in my life where I'm like, this is it, it's never gonna get better.
00:30:08.720 --> 00:30:14.000
Like, I don't care what you tell me, my life is doomed because of a diagnosis or because of a situation.
00:30:14.160 --> 00:30:18.079
And I've been wrong every single time I have thought that.
00:30:18.240 --> 00:30:25.680
And I am one of probably three billion people who are in that same camp who are like, I'm so convinced that things will never get better.
00:30:25.920 --> 00:30:30.480
So just if you are listening to this, even if there's one person listening who's like, wow, I don't really know.
00:30:30.720 --> 00:30:32.960
Just stick stick around and find out.
00:30:33.119 --> 00:30:35.680
Like, you do not know what tomorrow will look like.
00:30:35.759 --> 00:30:40.720
And man, you might hear the funniest joke you've ever heard in your entire life three weeks from now.
00:30:40.880 --> 00:30:45.279
You might eat at your favorite restaurant nine years from now, your favorite restaurant of all time.
00:30:45.440 --> 00:30:47.200
You might watch your favorite movie in 15 years.
00:30:47.279 --> 00:30:50.079
You might meet the love of your life in like three days.
00:30:50.240 --> 00:30:53.359
Like, please don't leave before you get to experience all that stuff.
00:30:53.599 --> 00:30:54.720
That's amazing, Johnny.
00:30:54.799 --> 00:30:55.440
Thank you for that.
00:30:55.599 --> 00:31:00.240
For those listening to the episode, we want to thank you for tuning in to the Voice of Experience podcast.
00:31:00.400 --> 00:31:01.759
This was a powerful episode.
00:31:01.839 --> 00:31:10.640
And for those who are maybe suffering uh with suicide or depression, um, there is a hotline, 988, that you can call if you do need any help.
00:31:10.799 --> 00:31:19.440
But also reach out to those around you, reach out to a mental health specialist, find out who can help you and get the help and just stick around, as Johnny said.
00:31:19.920 --> 00:31:26.640
For those listening to our podcast, we are online at www.voiceovexperience p fact.com.
00:31:26.799 --> 00:31:30.559
We're also on social media at the voice of experience p fact.
00:31:30.640 --> 00:31:33.519
And until next time, let's keep the conversation going.
00:31:43.039 --> 00:31:48.079
Thank you for joining us on this episode of the Voices of Experience podcast.
00:31:48.319 --> 00:31:52.240
We hope you found the conversation enlightening and inspiring.
00:31:52.559 --> 00:31:56.799
If you enjoyed the episode, be sure to subscribe and leave us a review.
00:31:56.960 --> 00:32:03.680
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00:32:04.160 --> 00:32:06.319
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00:32:06.480 --> 00:32:12.000
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00:32:12.559 --> 00:32:19.920
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00:32:20.240 --> 00:32:34.400
Until next time, let's keep the conversation going and continue to advocate for patient-centered career.
