[00:00:00.00] - Scott Robison
He would bite it. He would start telling us stories about being in Iraq and living on a fob and doing different stuff. I just mess with him all the time. Tell me what it was like when you were in the shit all the time. Then I just got back Iraq, and then Navy Seals had put me in for a NAM, Navy Achievement Medal. The general is like, Scott, put your stuff on. We're going to have an award somewhere. You put all your stuff on. I'm like, alright, sir. I put all my stuff on. I come walking out the door and he's looking at me. He's like, What is all that? I'm like, Hey, I just wanted to look good for the award somewhere. Don't say nothing. But I went to the PX and I bought all these tabs and badges, and I just wanted to look really good. He's like, You can't do that. That's stolen valor. I'm like, Nobody's going to know. I just wanted to look good. Just let it go. Just let it go. He's like, Oh, no, that's stolen valor. You can't do that. He was yelling for the secretary, I want to see Robinson's ORB.
[00:00:45.12] - Scott Robison
He's stolen valor. He pulls out the ORB and he looks at it. He's like, Oh, shit.
[00:00:51.11] - John S. Berry
I think that's something about assumptions we make. It's that sometimes we look at people and what they've done based on their badges or rank, or at least in the military, and their accomplishments, I think that's the person, but that's not the person. And yet, those first impressions are extremely important. I just saw you today mentor a young veteran who has some trade skills and is looking for a job. You said, I'll get you a job. What advice do you give, Scott?
[00:01:20.10] - Scott Robison
I told him to comb his hair, shave his beard, clean up, go get the nicest jacket he has, build a little bit of a resume. I said, Go find a company. Don't just send them a resume. Don't just send them something online. Go there, knock on the door and ask to speak to the owner. Not just a secretary, not want to drop a resume, but go put your best foot forward and tell them, hey, these are my skills. This is what I like to do. I'd like a job. Sometimes all you have to do is ask. We've done that with other people. They do the same thing. They clean up a little bit, put the best sports coat they can get on or go get one from wherever they can get, look the part, and come up with a plan and plan of action and go ask. More than likely, those owners are going to give a job. I go back to my dad. My dad had a business for 40, 50 years, and he said, if somebody sent a resume in, he wouldn't read it. But if they came in, knocked on the door, walked in with their resume, he would stop what they're doing and give them an interview.
[00:02:10.08] - Scott Robison
Give them that opportunity. They may not fit, but he would give them that interview and give them that opportunity. I think most owners want people to come work for them. They want people that are assertive. Walk in, look them right in the eye and tell them you want a job and tell them why you deserve the job, and you're probably going to be successful.
[00:02:25.03] - John S. Berry
Yeah, and that has withstood the test of time. I think a lot of people will say, well, that's something that may have It worked in the 1960s, but it doesn't work now. But it works now more than ever, and I think it does for a few reasons. I think, number one, it shows that this person has guts to come in and ask for something. Number two, it shows that they have the initiative to do something. They're not just going to send in a resume. They are going to get out of bed, shave, get on makeup, whatever it is, and show up as if they have a job, act confident, be respectful, be polite, and ask for the job. I think that that initiative is greatly missing, and it always has been. People love people with initiative. But the third thing is, from the perspective of the employer, and I used to be this when we were a much smaller organization, I was not good at forecasting when we would need our next team member. And so inevitably, what would happen is someone would leave the organization for one reason or another. Sometimes they had a better opportunity, sometimes they got in trouble, and then all of a sudden, we're down an employee at that skill level.
[00:03:25.12] - John S. Berry
And it's like, oh, my gosh. As a business owner who's doing the work, I'd find that I was working in the business and on the business. So daytime was for people, nighttime was for paper. I didn't have time to send out help wanted ad. And back then, of course, they didn't have all the job boards they have now. But I didn't have time to do that. And so, when someone came to me, and usually it was through referrals, but someone came to me and they took the initiative, a lot of times I wanted to hire them. And the reason why I wanted to hire them was because I needed somebody at that time. I saw somebody with initiative, and I saw somebody who had the guts to ask for what they wanted. To me, those are the three critical things that I was really looking for. When that would happen, I would almost always hire the person, or at least I really wanted to hire that person.
[00:04:14.09] - Scott Robison
Quite often, people from Camp Cowboy, people come to the ranch, and they know we have a ranch, and I get calls all the time. Hey, are you hiring? The answer is no. But if somebody comes out here, looks me in the eye, or looks my son in the eye and says, hey, I need a job. I need a little work; I will give them. I'll find something for them to do. It's not for long term. I don't want them to be here long term. Just something to get some money in their pocket, get on their feet, and then figure out what we can send them down the road and get another job. But if somebody comes out and has initiative to come see me, look me right in the eye, face to face, said, I want a job, we hire them. We always hire them, something. We'll give them a temporary part-time job, or we'll find something for them to do, or I'll find somewhere else they can work. But the guys that pick up the phone and call me are like, are you hiring? The answer is no. It's always no.
[00:04:54.16] - John S. Berry
Yeah, and don't be misled. Scott is not just a founder of Camp Cowboy, and his son, Lane, actually runs it and does a great job. But Scott's involved with Camp Cowboy, but he's also involved with several other businesses. So, he doesn't have a whole lot of time, and no one has spare time, but he doesn't have a whole lot of time to do it. But it is of his own generosity and his desire to continue to build our veteran community that he does this, that he wants veterans to get jobs, and he will help them. And the other side of the coin, I learned this when I was a lawyer studying in law school, studying negotiations. Before I became a lawyer was, a lot of times you don't know the cards the other person is holding. It may be that that employer needs you just as much as you need a job. The only way you're going to find out is if you ask. Let me tell you something. If you're going to be successful, you have to get used to hearing the word no. Not everything is a fit. One thing that I greatly admire about you, Scott, is that you are always looking for new opportunities, always looking for ways to help, always looking for ways to connect people.
[00:05:57.00] - John S. Berry
Where did that come from? Where did you learn that skill?
[00:05:59.07] - Scott Robison
Man, I don't I know. Maybe it goes back from the military school. You and I both went to a New Mexico Military Institute, and you have so many different leaders that they're above you and below you and everything else. It's a leadership factory. Throughout your time there, you figure out, hey, these are the good leaders. These are the one to emulate. These are the bad leaders. These are the ones. You learn from them, but this is not what I want to be like. Maybe part of that is connecting with your buddies when your new cadets there and having that camaraderie and figuring it out or figuring out what's good leaders and what's bad leadership there. But that was the start. Now, I don't know, maybe it's just the way my brain works or whatever, but I just look for opportunities all the time. My brain, if you're around a group of people and this guy's like, I have a business that does this. I'm like, well, you should probably be working with this business that does that. Perfect connection. I don't know, for some reason, I just see that and make the connections. Maybe because in the military, I looked at so many different technologies.
[00:06:53.14] - Scott Robison
I think over the 8, 10 years there, I probably looked at over 300 different technologies. Quite often, I don't forget a lot of those. I have a big basket of companies that I'm like, oh, you should be working with this company, or this company does that and that company does this. I can connect the dots. It's easy for me.
[00:07:09.01] - John S. Berry
Well, I imagine after so many years of practice and doing it, that it becomes second nature. One thing that you have done extremely well, and it's one thing that I'm jealous of. I haven't been able to master this yet. But here you are, you live on this beautiful ranch, and yet when I see you're still working all the time, but you make the time to ride horses, you make the time for social events. And yet when you're here, you're also in this nice, peaceful, serene environment conducting business. And you figured out a way to do that. So how were you able to do that? I mean, you have an office, but you're not a person who takes lot of phone calls. It does a lot of office work.
[00:07:46.17] - Scott Robison
Man, I find that at the Ranch, your more business in that little guest house that you're hanging out here, more business goes on there than probably anywhere that I know of. But I think it's when you bring people together, you bring companies or people you think you might want to work with and you spend a day with them, whether hanging out in the guest house or riding a horse or shooting a gun or going fishing or hanging out, you decide if you want to... If this is somebody you want your life that you want to do stuff with and you get to know them, it's a lot easier than sitting in a boardroom on a Zoom call or doing phone calls. But getting to know the people is more important. I said most business I see is based on relationship. You have a good relationship, there's loyalty amongst you, then that's people you want to do business with. You don't often find that on a Zoom meeting or a first call or a second call or a PowerPoint slide brief or whatever else, but getting to know them, and then you can figure out what makes them tick.
[00:08:34.08] - John S. Berry
I've seen you do this for years. I read Stanley McChrystal's book on character recently, and he talked about, well, what would you do differently going into Afghanistan to change things? He said, go whitewater rafting. But his whole thing was get together, maybe drink some beer, but build trust with the stakeholders, the key players, before you dive into the business side of it. And you do that well. It's social, but it's also business. You mix them both. But you mix them to a degree where people come here, they feel relaxed, they feel like they can trust. I think our last guest just said, the things happen at the speed of trust. And you were able to really... There's an element I have trust here. What I've heard from some of the Camp Cowboy students was they come here, and a lot of them are dealing with post-traumatic stress disorder and other problems in their life that are service-related. Sometimes it's a physical issue, sometimes it's a financial issue. They come here and they said, this place is so serene. People are so trusting and trustworthy that the outside world just melts away. They feel like they're now in this great environment.
[00:09:41.08] - John S. Berry
I can't remember who said it, but environment really is your looking glass. That's how you see the world. How is it that you're able to keep yourself in that environment where you seem to always be happy, always have something going on, always giving back, and you don't seem to burn out? You have more energy than most people I know when you're older than me.
[00:09:57.12] - Scott Robison
Well, I don't know. Well, just barely. No, I'm I guess I am older. No, man, I think if you live life with a little levity, live life enjoying yourself. We always talk with the camp cowboy people. There's nothing you can do about anything that's already happened in your life. Nothing at all in the past. Good, bad, or different. You can learn from it, but nothing you can do to change it. But all you can do is worry about today and what you can do tomorrow. So, if you concentrate, hey, what person can I be today? What can I enjoy today? Enjoy every single day. I try to enjoy every single day. Do something fun, enjoy the people I'm around, and then look what person you can be tomorrow. Focus on that and not You're focused on going backwards and you're going to be successful.
[00:10:32.15] - John S. Berry
And we've already done the after-action review with your great examples of leadership and poor examples of leadership. So, we won't do that in this episode. If you want to hear Scott's examples, go back to the previous episode. Listen to all of them. But, Scott, I did want to end this with, what is the Camp Cowboy motto and what does it mean to you?
[00:10:47.01] - Scott Robison
Make a difference every day. If you make a small difference in somebody's life, good, bad, and different, little difference, just talking to them, taking 10 minutes and visiting with them, or largely find them a job or find a good path or give them an azmith, you make a small difference, you're better off for it. I truly believe in that every day. If I get up, I see somebody, I try to engage them, talk to them. I don't care if that person can't help me or not, but you make the difference in the smallest person's life where it's, we're having breakfast this morning, you make fun of the ladies at the, I'd say not dining facility, but the cafeteria.
[00:11:19.13] - John S. Berry
Well, you didn't make fun of them. You let them make fun of you.
[00:11:21.11] - Scott Robison
Well, you let them make fun of me, but they laugh. You ask for the good-looking man discount, and the lady giggles like, Man, this chubby old dude's asking for a good-looking discount, but you actually got it. She did give me 10% off because I was with Pretty Boy here, and it worked out pretty well. Just make somebody's life, make them laugh a little bit, and you're better off for it. I challenge everybody on this podcast to try to make a difference in somebody's life, just a little or big. It doesn't matter. But make a difference in somebody else's life and you'll be better off for it.
[00:11:55.15] - Speaker 3
Thank you for joining us today on Veteran Led, where we pursue our mission of promoting veteran leadership in business, strengthening the veteran community, and getting veterans all of the benefits that they earned. If you know a leader who should be on the Veteran Led podcast, report to our online community by searching at Veteran Led on your favorite social channels and posting in the comments. We want to hear how your military challenges prepared you to lead your industry or community, and we will let the world know. And of course, hit subscribe and join me next time on Veteran Led.
He would bite it. He would start telling us stories about being in Iraq and living on a fob and doing different stuff. I just mess with him all the time. Tell me what it was like when you were in the shit all the time. Then I just got back Iraq, and then Navy Seals had put me in for a NAM, Navy Achievement Medal. The general is like, Scott, put your stuff on. We're going to have an award somewhere. You put all your stuff on. I'm like, alright, sir. I put all my stuff on. I come walking out the door and he's looking at me. He's like, What is all that? I'm like, Hey, I just wanted to look good for the award somewhere. Don't say nothing. But I went to the PX and I bought all these tabs and badges, and I just wanted to look really good. He's like, You can't do that. That's stolen valor. I'm like, Nobody's going to know. I just wanted to look good. Just let it go. Just let it go. He's like, Oh, no, that's stolen valor. You can't do that. He was yelling for the secretary, I want to see Robinson's ORB.
[00:00:45.12] - Scott Robison
He's stolen valor. He pulls out the ORB and he looks at it. He's like, Oh, shit.
[00:00:51.11] - John S. Berry
I think that's something about assumptions we make. It's that sometimes we look at people and what they've done based on their badges or rank, or at least in the military, and their accomplishments, I think that's the person, but that's not the person. And yet, those first impressions are extremely important. I just saw you today mentor a young veteran who has some trade skills and is looking for a job. You said, I'll get you a job. What advice do you give, Scott?
[00:01:20.10] - Scott Robison
I told him to comb his hair, shave his beard, clean up, go get the nicest jacket he has, build a little bit of a resume. I said, Go find a company. Don't just send them a resume. Don't just send them something online. Go there, knock on the door and ask to speak to the owner. Not just a secretary, not want to drop a resume, but go put your best foot forward and tell them, hey, these are my skills. This is what I like to do. I'd like a job. Sometimes all you have to do is ask. We've done that with other people. They do the same thing. They clean up a little bit, put the best sports coat they can get on or go get one from wherever they can get, look the part, and come up with a plan and plan of action and go ask. More than likely, those owners are going to give a job. I go back to my dad. My dad had a business for 40, 50 years, and he said, if somebody sent a resume in, he wouldn't read it. But if they came in, knocked on the door, walked in with their resume, he would stop what they're doing and give them an interview.
[00:02:10.08] - Scott Robison
Give them that opportunity. They may not fit, but he would give them that interview and give them that opportunity. I think most owners want people to come work for them. They want people that are assertive. Walk in, look them right in the eye and tell them you want a job and tell them why you deserve the job, and you're probably going to be successful.
[00:02:25.03] - John S. Berry
Yeah, and that has withstood the test of time. I think a lot of people will say, well, that's something that may have It worked in the 1960s, but it doesn't work now. But it works now more than ever, and I think it does for a few reasons. I think, number one, it shows that this person has guts to come in and ask for something. Number two, it shows that they have the initiative to do something. They're not just going to send in a resume. They are going to get out of bed, shave, get on makeup, whatever it is, and show up as if they have a job, act confident, be respectful, be polite, and ask for the job. I think that that initiative is greatly missing, and it always has been. People love people with initiative. But the third thing is, from the perspective of the employer, and I used to be this when we were a much smaller organization, I was not good at forecasting when we would need our next team member. And so inevitably, what would happen is someone would leave the organization for one reason or another. Sometimes they had a better opportunity, sometimes they got in trouble, and then all of a sudden, we're down an employee at that skill level.
[00:03:25.12] - John S. Berry
And it's like, oh, my gosh. As a business owner who's doing the work, I'd find that I was working in the business and on the business. So daytime was for people, nighttime was for paper. I didn't have time to send out help wanted ad. And back then, of course, they didn't have all the job boards they have now. But I didn't have time to do that. And so, when someone came to me, and usually it was through referrals, but someone came to me and they took the initiative, a lot of times I wanted to hire them. And the reason why I wanted to hire them was because I needed somebody at that time. I saw somebody with initiative, and I saw somebody who had the guts to ask for what they wanted. To me, those are the three critical things that I was really looking for. When that would happen, I would almost always hire the person, or at least I really wanted to hire that person.
[00:04:14.09] - Scott Robison
Quite often, people from Camp Cowboy, people come to the ranch, and they know we have a ranch, and I get calls all the time. Hey, are you hiring? The answer is no. But if somebody comes out here, looks me in the eye, or looks my son in the eye and says, hey, I need a job. I need a little work; I will give them. I'll find something for them to do. It's not for long term. I don't want them to be here long term. Just something to get some money in their pocket, get on their feet, and then figure out what we can send them down the road and get another job. But if somebody comes out and has initiative to come see me, look me right in the eye, face to face, said, I want a job, we hire them. We always hire them, something. We'll give them a temporary part-time job, or we'll find something for them to do, or I'll find somewhere else they can work. But the guys that pick up the phone and call me are like, are you hiring? The answer is no. It's always no.
[00:04:54.16] - John S. Berry
Yeah, and don't be misled. Scott is not just a founder of Camp Cowboy, and his son, Lane, actually runs it and does a great job. But Scott's involved with Camp Cowboy, but he's also involved with several other businesses. So, he doesn't have a whole lot of time, and no one has spare time, but he doesn't have a whole lot of time to do it. But it is of his own generosity and his desire to continue to build our veteran community that he does this, that he wants veterans to get jobs, and he will help them. And the other side of the coin, I learned this when I was a lawyer studying in law school, studying negotiations. Before I became a lawyer was, a lot of times you don't know the cards the other person is holding. It may be that that employer needs you just as much as you need a job. The only way you're going to find out is if you ask. Let me tell you something. If you're going to be successful, you have to get used to hearing the word no. Not everything is a fit. One thing that I greatly admire about you, Scott, is that you are always looking for new opportunities, always looking for ways to help, always looking for ways to connect people.
[00:05:57.00] - John S. Berry
Where did that come from? Where did you learn that skill?
[00:05:59.07] - Scott Robison
Man, I don't I know. Maybe it goes back from the military school. You and I both went to a New Mexico Military Institute, and you have so many different leaders that they're above you and below you and everything else. It's a leadership factory. Throughout your time there, you figure out, hey, these are the good leaders. These are the one to emulate. These are the bad leaders. These are the ones. You learn from them, but this is not what I want to be like. Maybe part of that is connecting with your buddies when your new cadets there and having that camaraderie and figuring it out or figuring out what's good leaders and what's bad leadership there. But that was the start. Now, I don't know, maybe it's just the way my brain works or whatever, but I just look for opportunities all the time. My brain, if you're around a group of people and this guy's like, I have a business that does this. I'm like, well, you should probably be working with this business that does that. Perfect connection. I don't know, for some reason, I just see that and make the connections. Maybe because in the military, I looked at so many different technologies.
[00:06:53.14] - Scott Robison
I think over the 8, 10 years there, I probably looked at over 300 different technologies. Quite often, I don't forget a lot of those. I have a big basket of companies that I'm like, oh, you should be working with this company, or this company does that and that company does this. I can connect the dots. It's easy for me.
[00:07:09.01] - John S. Berry
Well, I imagine after so many years of practice and doing it, that it becomes second nature. One thing that you have done extremely well, and it's one thing that I'm jealous of. I haven't been able to master this yet. But here you are, you live on this beautiful ranch, and yet when I see you're still working all the time, but you make the time to ride horses, you make the time for social events. And yet when you're here, you're also in this nice, peaceful, serene environment conducting business. And you figured out a way to do that. So how were you able to do that? I mean, you have an office, but you're not a person who takes lot of phone calls. It does a lot of office work.
[00:07:46.17] - Scott Robison
Man, I find that at the Ranch, your more business in that little guest house that you're hanging out here, more business goes on there than probably anywhere that I know of. But I think it's when you bring people together, you bring companies or people you think you might want to work with and you spend a day with them, whether hanging out in the guest house or riding a horse or shooting a gun or going fishing or hanging out, you decide if you want to... If this is somebody you want your life that you want to do stuff with and you get to know them, it's a lot easier than sitting in a boardroom on a Zoom call or doing phone calls. But getting to know the people is more important. I said most business I see is based on relationship. You have a good relationship, there's loyalty amongst you, then that's people you want to do business with. You don't often find that on a Zoom meeting or a first call or a second call or a PowerPoint slide brief or whatever else, but getting to know them, and then you can figure out what makes them tick.
[00:08:34.08] - John S. Berry
I've seen you do this for years. I read Stanley McChrystal's book on character recently, and he talked about, well, what would you do differently going into Afghanistan to change things? He said, go whitewater rafting. But his whole thing was get together, maybe drink some beer, but build trust with the stakeholders, the key players, before you dive into the business side of it. And you do that well. It's social, but it's also business. You mix them both. But you mix them to a degree where people come here, they feel relaxed, they feel like they can trust. I think our last guest just said, the things happen at the speed of trust. And you were able to really... There's an element I have trust here. What I've heard from some of the Camp Cowboy students was they come here, and a lot of them are dealing with post-traumatic stress disorder and other problems in their life that are service-related. Sometimes it's a physical issue, sometimes it's a financial issue. They come here and they said, this place is so serene. People are so trusting and trustworthy that the outside world just melts away. They feel like they're now in this great environment.
[00:09:41.08] - John S. Berry
I can't remember who said it, but environment really is your looking glass. That's how you see the world. How is it that you're able to keep yourself in that environment where you seem to always be happy, always have something going on, always giving back, and you don't seem to burn out? You have more energy than most people I know when you're older than me.
[00:09:57.12] - Scott Robison
Well, I don't know. Well, just barely. No, I'm I guess I am older. No, man, I think if you live life with a little levity, live life enjoying yourself. We always talk with the camp cowboy people. There's nothing you can do about anything that's already happened in your life. Nothing at all in the past. Good, bad, or different. You can learn from it, but nothing you can do to change it. But all you can do is worry about today and what you can do tomorrow. So, if you concentrate, hey, what person can I be today? What can I enjoy today? Enjoy every single day. I try to enjoy every single day. Do something fun, enjoy the people I'm around, and then look what person you can be tomorrow. Focus on that and not You're focused on going backwards and you're going to be successful.
[00:10:32.15] - John S. Berry
And we've already done the after-action review with your great examples of leadership and poor examples of leadership. So, we won't do that in this episode. If you want to hear Scott's examples, go back to the previous episode. Listen to all of them. But, Scott, I did want to end this with, what is the Camp Cowboy motto and what does it mean to you?
[00:10:47.01] - Scott Robison
Make a difference every day. If you make a small difference in somebody's life, good, bad, and different, little difference, just talking to them, taking 10 minutes and visiting with them, or largely find them a job or find a good path or give them an azmith, you make a small difference, you're better off for it. I truly believe in that every day. If I get up, I see somebody, I try to engage them, talk to them. I don't care if that person can't help me or not, but you make the difference in the smallest person's life where it's, we're having breakfast this morning, you make fun of the ladies at the, I'd say not dining facility, but the cafeteria.
[00:11:19.13] - John S. Berry
Well, you didn't make fun of them. You let them make fun of you.
[00:11:21.11] - Scott Robison
Well, you let them make fun of me, but they laugh. You ask for the good-looking man discount, and the lady giggles like, Man, this chubby old dude's asking for a good-looking discount, but you actually got it. She did give me 10% off because I was with Pretty Boy here, and it worked out pretty well. Just make somebody's life, make them laugh a little bit, and you're better off for it. I challenge everybody on this podcast to try to make a difference in somebody's life, just a little or big. It doesn't matter. But make a difference in somebody else's life and you'll be better off for it.
[00:11:55.15] - Speaker 3
Thank you for joining us today on Veteran Led, where we pursue our mission of promoting veteran leadership in business, strengthening the veteran community, and getting veterans all of the benefits that they earned. If you know a leader who should be on the Veteran Led podcast, report to our online community by searching at Veteran Led on your favorite social channels and posting in the comments. We want to hear how your military challenges prepared you to lead your industry or community, and we will let the world know. And of course, hit subscribe and join me next time on Veteran Led.
