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So welcome to the 225 podcast.
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My name is John Smith Theodore, and today we're still I'm so excited to welcome Michael Patterson, formerly of the Pennsylvania Ballet, to our program today.
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And he has a lot to share with us about being a dancer in a ballet company, as well as now he's opened his own ballet school.
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And so I'm gonna let Michael tell you about his transition from dancer to studio owner and owning his own ballet school.
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So thank you, Michael, for being with us.
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I really appreciate you taking the time.
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I know what it's like to own a dance studio, and it's crazy.
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So thank you.
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Thank you for taking a few minutes to talk to us.
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Thank you for having me on.
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So tell us a little bit about your journey to becoming a dancer and why you think being on, you know, my my thing about the Teachers podcast is taught how to be a healthy dancer in mind, body, and spirit.
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So I want to hear a little bit about how you think your philosophy at your studio fits into that.
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And then also about your journey to becoming a dancer.
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Well, so I think my journey to becoming a dancer, I can really credit to the public broadcasting network or to PBS.
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Um I grew up in a very rural town in Pennsylvania, Titusville, Pennsylvania, on a dairy farm.
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And we had four TV stations, if you could imagine it.
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Um we had four TV channels, and one of them happened to be PBS.
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And I remember seeing uh Nutcracker with Gelsey Kirkland and Mikhail Barishnikov, and um which I can still picture the costumes and the sets and the TV I was watching it on.
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And I was six years old, and I told my parents that I wanted to do that.
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Um, and and growing up on a farm and being one of six children, um, we we didn't have a lot of money, and we weren't really allowed to do a lot of activities unless they included farm work.
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And so my parents also thought that because I was six that I would lose interest uh in in ballet, and um it wasn't until six years later when I was 12 that I asked them again, and I said, I really want to do this, um, that they allowed me to.
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Um, so my my journey to ballet began long before I started it.
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Um, and I'm I'm a firm believer of you end up where you're supposed to be, uh, regardless of the path.
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And for me, I think one of the things that I'm looking forward to discussing is how to how to continue the education that I received in a very nurturing environment.
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How do you give that to the next generation and support them the way that I was supported early on in my career?
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Um my journey has not been even by any means.
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Um, it's been up and it's been down, and I've had I've had those struggles that lots of dancers have.
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Um, but how do you relay that to the next generation and teach them how to be critical of what they're doing, but also forgiving at the same time.
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Um, and I think that's something that everybody struggles with, not just dancers, but people in their daily lives.
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So I agree.
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I mean that it that's the thought of it's never enough, you know, to be um, and as dancers, we're always looking to improve, critique ourselves.
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So therefore, you're always feeling like you're not enough and you're looking for critique from features or choreographers.
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And so you're always feeling like you're not enough, yet you need that feedback to continually improve.
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And so it's a fine line of how to nurture, especially a young dancer where they hear talk about language, but when you what they hear, you know, what what you intend to say and what they hear many times is something different.
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Depending on the person.
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Yes, absolutely.
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So tell me about um, you know, what was your favorite?
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So, how did you get to the Pennsylvania Ballet?
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So I I began my training in Erie, Pennsylvania.
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Well, actually, it started before Erie, Pennsylvania.
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I started at a school where we did jazz, ballet, tap, um, and acrobatics uh with a woman.
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Her name was Kathy Turner.
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Um, she was a wonderful person, and after my sister and I studied with her for a year, she told my mom that we were talented and that we needed to go somewhere else.
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Um, and she sent us to a school in Erie, and my mother wound up calling the wrong school.
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So um we wound up at a different school than the teacher had intended me to wind up at.
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But um, I studied with Sharon Fallone, who um I believe her career was at North Carolina Dance Theater in the Graham Company, and her background was much more Graham than ballet.
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Um but she she really taught me everything I I knew about ballet, how to be a kind person, how to be generous, and how to how to be meticulous and encouraged my artistry.
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Um and when I was a junior in high school, she encouraged me to audition for Juilliard.
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Um, and I had never heard of Juilliard.
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I, you know, I think there's a movie a long time ago that came out, and there was a dancer that was hoping to get into Juilliard, and this was either before or after my audition.
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And I remember children just they didn't understand ballet, they didn't understand where I was going every day.
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And it wasn't until I auditioned for Juilliard as a junior in high school and got in that people really kind of took notice of what I was doing and that it, wow, it must really mean something.
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Um, and Ben Harkervey, who was the director of Juilliard at the time, told me that if I wanted to go to Juilliard and be in a modern company, that this was definitely the place for me.
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And that if I wanted to be in a ballet company, I was looking at the school in Carlisle, Central Pennsylvania Youth Ballet, and he said that if I wanted to be in a ballet company, that that was definitely the place that I should go.
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Um, for me, at that time in my life, I desperately wanted to be in a ballet company, and so I made the decision to go to Central Pennsylvania Youth Ballet instead of Carlotte or instead of Juilliard.
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And it was while I was there toward the end of my senior year, um, Pennsylvania Ballet was doing Sleeping Beauty, and they had a few dancers that were injured in the ballet company.
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And Roy Kaiser, who was the director at the time, contacted the school in Carlisle and said that they needed more boys if they had them.
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And myself and another dancer went to Philadelphia and we learned parts in Sleeping Beauty.
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And you know, everything happens the way it's supposed to happen.
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And for me, my journey, I auditioned for a bunch of ballet companies, and I didn't have anything in writing as to where I was going.
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You know, I got into FAB for the summer, I um, but I didn't hear back from anybody offering me something, and so I went to Philadelphia and I did this performance of Sleeping Beauty, and it so happened that the other dancer that was brought in with me, we were learning opposite sides of the court couple's dance in the ballet in the opening of the I believe the third act, and we uh a dancer was double capped and did not realize it.
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And so I was learning one side, my friend was learning the other side, and the curtain goes up and nobody's on stage.
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The curtain goes up and nobody's on stage, and I run upstairs and I change into the person's costume and perform the role.
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I had to reverse everything on stage, and following the performance, I was offered a contract for the following year.
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Wow.
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Um, so you know, a lot of a lot of things happen um that we don't have control over, but we we wind up where we're supposed to be.
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I think it's true, we all have a path and we never know what how it's gonna end up, but you were in the right place at the right time, and what a it's a testament to your own ability to pick things up.
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And um so that's amazing.
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What was your favorite part of being in Pennsylvania Ballet like as your career?
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Is there a certain role that you loved doing, or was there a certain part of being in the company?
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I think the thing that I most enjoyed about being in the company, you know, from a young age, from when I first started dancing, I always enjoyed teaching.
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And I knew that in order to be taken seriously as a teacher, I needed to have professional credentials to back it up.
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So for me, I if I could have been a professional class taker for the rest of my life, I probably would have been.
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Um, but since that's not possible, um, I did a lot of the performances.
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I would say one of my favorite performances was um doing Trey McIntyre's Blue Until June or um Um Twilight Arts Nine Sinatra songs all the way.
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Um I danced at Potada at Ballet Austin, and it was just, I mean, there's there's nothing like losing yourself in a ballet.
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Um, but there's so many experiences that it's almost overwhelming to choose one.
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Um, I was with Pennsylvania Ballet, we also performed at the Edinburgh International Arts Festival.
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We did Chris Wheelden Swan Lake, and so like that in itself was just like an unforgettable moment having the Tchaikovsky Symphony Orchestra of Moscow Radio as our orchestra.
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Um it's not any one particular moment, but many experiences over the course of the years that really impacted my life.
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Um did your sister go on to dance?
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You said that your sister, you and your sister were both talented.
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Yes.
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So my my sister wound up uh dancing in Erie with with our local company.
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We had a very small company at the time.
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Um, and she did do some some work there, um, but then she moved on and went to college.
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So it's very cool that your parents listened to you and and you know, actually found found what you needed, you know, that they listened so because it's gotta be hard if you are on a dairy farm and you have to make the effort to get your I always say parents, you know, have to make an effort to get their kids to where they need to be.
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And so, you know, good for your parents that they listen.
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Yeah, as as one of six children, it was just you do one thing and you do it well, and you do it to the best of your ability.
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And when you don't enjoy it anymore, we'll find something else for you to do.
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But you know, with with six kids, there's limited time to get you from point A to point B.
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And I really think that that helped shape me into the person that I am today, is that I dedicated so much time to something, and it's something that I encourage parents to do that if your child has an interest to indulge it as much as possible because that is how they will learn to work hard.
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And if they don't enjoy something, have them move on to something else because it's when you love something, you're willing to do almost anything it takes to continue it.
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It's true.
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Um so now you have your own ballet school.
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How how wonderful! What's the name of it?
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Uh it's the Patterson School of Ballet, and it's located in Erie, Pennsylvania.
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So back to where you back to where you came from.
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That's that's amazing.
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So tell me about your school and you know, um what made you decide.
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You said you always liked teaching, so it must have been something you wanted to do for a long time.
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Yes.
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So um I opened the school in August of 2014, but I started teaching almost immediately after I joined Pennsylvania Ballet.
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Um, a very dear friend of mine, Gabriela Yadanich, was in the company, and her mother was the founding principal dancer of the company, and she invited me to come and teach at her school after I did a guesting for her.
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And I remember she called me one day and said, Oh, somebody's coming to watch you teach.
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And it was probably about a half hour before class.
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And I said, Okay, well, you know, who's who's coming to watch class?
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And she said, Barbara Weisberger.
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And Barbara Weisberger was the founder of Pennsylvania Ballet, and here I am, 19 years old, you know, teaching a class, and Barbara Weisberger is watching.
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And I still remember um her coming up to me at the end of class, and she said, You give a great class, but maybe one less condu.
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And um, you know, and I I was I was so appreciative of her her opinion and her expertise, and um, she had built such a wonderful company and established it from nothing.
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Um, and so that was my first experience teaching at another school.
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And I started the school in August 2014, and it it was really challenging to start the school from almost nothing and build it up over the years.
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But um in the past nine years, we've had kids go on to some professional companies.
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Um, in the beginning, it's harder because you're you're changing uh training that isn't quite where it should be.
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Um, but this past year I had four graduating seniors, well, three graduating seniors and one about to graduate.
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Uh one joined Sacramento Ballet as a trainee, one joined Milwaukee Valley as a trainee, one joined Ballet Met in Columbus as a trainee, and one joined New York City Ballet this fall for the 75th anniversary.
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So you must be very proud.
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Um that's a big deal.
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Um, it is hard to start a studio.
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Uh I don't know if you started it from scratch or bought somebody else's, but it's just hard because no matter what, you're getting kids that come from someplace else and you have to take away from what they've already learned that sometimes you have to work on new habits and you know developing better techniques, things like that.
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It can be hard.
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Um I give you a lot of credit.
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Um tell me a little bit about you know, I'm sure it's different when you were a dancer versus now, but what kind of messages do you send to your dancers uh regarding taking care of themselves both mentally and physically as a dancer?
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I think for children, I think the hardest thing to emphasize is that the mirror is a tool.
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The mirror is not a reflection of who you are.
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Um and the mirror is a tool to change what you have control over in that particular moment.
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Is my knee straight enough?
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Is my foot pointed enough?
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Not, oh, I have an ugly foot, oh my legs are too short, oh my chest is too big.
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Those are those are things that you do not have control over.
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And I think that that letting students know that sometimes is yes, we all have these thoughts about what we like and what we don't like about ourselves, but what can I fix right now?
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And and how students are trained is really important for their body development.
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Right.
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Um, numerous teachers that I have had over the years say if you jump it, if you jump people too much, it makes their thighs bulky.
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Um, I'm a firm believer that if a student is trained well, there's not a lot to worry about that.
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Um, but as a dancer, you know, your body is your your instrument, it's your vehicle for you know presenting what you have to the audience.
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And my students, I say, you know, it's the maintenance.
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The older you get, the more maintenance there is on your body in order to keep it running.
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And it's not really about I don't talk to the children about their weight.
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Um, because I think that if if they're working properly, that that's not a problem.
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And I know for some people, I mean, there are schools where people make them count calories, there's schools where they bring nutritionists in, and and I think that if if schools do bring a nutritionist in, it shouldn't be for the children.
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Um you know, it's it's parents are in charge of what their kids are eating.
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So if people want to understand how to how to um take care of the body, um, especially when you're an elite athlete, that you're talking to the wrong person if you're talking to children.
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Um, along with body positivity, like I know that there are companies that I will never be tall.
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So if I'm looking at a company and all the dancers are tall, I I will never be happy there.
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Um, you know, if there's a ballet company and everybody has beautiful, crazy feet, and I have a nice foot, it's not great, my body doesn't fit with that company.
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And and I think teaching kids that there is a place for you, there's a place where your body's going to be accepted, where you are going to be accepted, is so important because if you don't feel like you belong, you will always be unhappy.
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I I love that.
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I mean, I think first of all, I like your your the mirror is a tool because you know kids use it as a way to pick themselves apart or compare themselves to other kids.
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It's true that it's a tool.
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And it's a tool we have to learn to use, and a tool we have to learn to not use, and be able to be away from the mirror.
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And uh and then the other part is that we're gonna be able to do that.
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When I speak to students, you know, I think I told you I always speak about how to be a healthy dancer and mind, body, and spirit.
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You know, I never talk about eating disorders or anything about that.
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Um and but if I talk to parents, I absolutely talk about the warning signs or teachers, um, because I think that that's who needs to be aware.
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Um and so thank you for that, because there are there are studios out there that still weigh students and you know it can be very hard for kids.
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And you're right, you have to find the right place.
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There's a place in dance for everyone, but you have to find the place for you.
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Yes, and I think too that you know, the thing that I stress to kids is that is a piano more beautiful than a violin?
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You know, is a violin more beautiful than a saxophone?
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You know, some people love the piano.
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I I took piano for a little bit and I hated every minute of it.
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You know, but some people love the piano, some people love a violin, and it just depends on where you are whether or not your instrument is going to be appreciated.
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Do you have the right audience?
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Um and I think that that is helpful in realizing that there is a place for you, but maybe it's not the right place where you currently are.
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What do you think parents and dance educators need to know to help young dancers?
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I think that the older I get, the more I try and remind myself of what it was like to have the teachers that I had.
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Um my teacher was very nurturing and I adored her.
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And I think that that was an important step in my training, but sometimes I feel that it didn't prepare me for what the world was like outside.
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Um, and then I have had teachers that were were very kind but could cut you like a knife, and I also see where that can go.
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And you're always trying to find this balance of what is enough encouragement, what is too harsh, what is too gentle, um, and what is not enough.
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And I think it's it's very much like being a parent.
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You're always trying to do what is best for the child, and I have to put my ego aside because I can very easily come down on somebody and say, you're not doing a good job, you're making me look bad.
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And that is something that's very dangerous for a teacher because at the end of the day, if somebody is going to be a dancer or going to be a professional, they have to do the work and they have to meet you halfway.
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I'm the person with the expertise, but you are the person that has to do the work.
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So it's it's a it's a partnership.
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And it's it's just like raising children.
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If your child doesn't want to clean their room, there's going to be turmoil.
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Um, you know, and it's is it is it worth beating up that child?
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Or or let them enjoy the experience.
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And I think sometimes teachers' egos can get in the way of them doing good.
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And as a dance teacher, sometimes you spend more time with kids than they spend with their parents, you know, so you have a huge influence on them and um and have a lot of opportunity to really um offer positive messages to them, you know.
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And it's like we started off, how do you how do you give constructive criticism and let them know that that's to shape them and make them a better dancer or human and that it's not criticizing them per se, you know, it's because I always used to tell uh my students, say thank you, because if I'm giving you a you know, a conrecting you, it's because I care.
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Yeah.
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And I think too that, you know, for kids, we do spend so much time with them sometimes, sometimes more than parents.
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And especially as they get older and they study more intensely.
00:27:57.680 --> 00:28:03.519
I think it's important for, I mean, my students know that I make mistakes.
00:28:03.839 --> 00:28:18.000
I I full-on admit them, they've seen me make them, but mistakes and failure are part of learning, and they're oftentimes the best teachers or the failures.
00:28:18.639 --> 00:28:25.039
Um, I have learned more from failing than I have from succeeding.
00:28:25.599 --> 00:28:32.319
Um, succeeding has taught me arrogance at times, and failure has taught me humility.
00:28:33.119 --> 00:28:35.039
Yeah, it's true.
00:28:35.599 --> 00:28:47.920
You know, we learn from the mistakes that we make in life, and as a dancer, that's why you're being, you know, given uh corrections is because you you want to improve.
00:28:49.839 --> 00:28:50.159
Yes.
00:28:50.960 --> 00:28:54.000
It's not to break you apart, but it's to make you feel better.
00:28:54.319 --> 00:29:00.079
What positive messages or message do you send to your dancers today?
00:29:01.519 --> 00:29:08.240
I I think the message to send to kids is to be grateful for what you have and not what you have not.
00:29:09.519 --> 00:29:17.119
Um the have nots will ruin your life much faster than the haves.
00:29:17.839 --> 00:29:25.599
And it's we have so many wonderful things in life, but it's easy to take them for granted.
00:29:26.240 --> 00:29:26.720
Yeah.
00:29:28.000 --> 00:29:29.599
I really like that.
00:29:30.639 --> 00:29:36.079
Use because it's like the glass half full or half empty.
00:29:36.240 --> 00:29:52.639
We have to focus on what we do have because it in in just in general, not only with dancers, but in general in life, like being appreciative of what we have and not always wanting something that we can't obtain or isn't possible.
00:29:52.960 --> 00:29:59.119
Um, you know, look, strive to be the best that you can be, but also recognize what your limitations are.
00:30:00.240 --> 00:30:13.680
Yes, yeah, and I and I think too that for kids, they kids don't see the struggles that other people have to go through.
00:30:14.000 --> 00:30:20.159
You know, for for a lot of children, they they are strong, but they have to get flexible.
00:30:20.480 --> 00:30:23.920
For kids that are flexible, they have to get strong.
00:30:24.159 --> 00:30:46.319
And so somebody has a struggle, and you don't always see what that struggle is, but everybody struggles, and it's figuring out what yours is and how to overcome it that really helps you you flourish not only as a dancer but as an individual.
00:30:46.639 --> 00:30:47.200
Yeah.
00:30:47.920 --> 00:30:50.159
That's true, very true.
00:30:50.879 --> 00:30:55.440
Michael, your students are lucky to have you, you know.
00:30:55.680 --> 00:31:08.319
Uh, and what a great uh transition from from dairy farm to dancer, and then going back to the community where you came from.
00:31:08.480 --> 00:31:10.720
The dairy farm, was it far from Erie?
00:31:12.079 --> 00:31:15.279
Uh it's about an hour from Erie, Pennsylvania.
00:31:15.599 --> 00:31:16.000
Uh-huh.
00:31:17.519 --> 00:31:18.159
Sorry.
00:31:18.319 --> 00:31:23.519
Um, the dairy farm is about an hour from uh Erie, Pennsylvania.
00:31:23.680 --> 00:31:29.759
So when I first started training in Erie, my parents would drive to and from Erie.
00:31:30.319 --> 00:31:36.319
You know, I think we started three or four days a week, and then it was six days a week.
00:31:36.639 --> 00:31:47.200
And then my mom went back to school, so she got an apartment in Erie, and my parents lived in separate houses so that my sister and I could continue to dance.
00:31:47.759 --> 00:31:59.839
And um, and it was really challenging, but I appreciate the sacrifices that they made because their sacrifices have given me the life that I have today.
00:32:00.159 --> 00:32:01.920
Yeah, it's very true.
00:32:02.159 --> 00:32:06.319
Um thank you, Michael, for taking the time to talk to us.
00:32:06.399 --> 00:32:10.720
I think you have so much insight, and I learned a lot from you.
00:32:11.039 --> 00:32:24.879
And um, it's why I love doing the podcast because I get to talk to different people, and everybody has something new to add uh information for me and for the listeners.
00:32:25.039 --> 00:32:26.240
So thank you so much.
00:32:26.399 --> 00:32:28.079
I really appreciate your time.
00:32:28.319 --> 00:32:33.680
Um and for the listeners of Tutu Thin, I want to thank Michael for being here with us.
00:32:33.759 --> 00:32:48.480
And as always, if you have any questions, please uh reach out to me on my uh my website at dontheodore.com or tutothin.com or Instagram at um tutu underscore thin.
00:32:48.799 --> 00:32:51.519
Thank you so much for listening and have a wonderful day.
00:00:49.119 --> 00:00:51.359
So welcome to the 225 podcast.
00:00:51.920 --> 00:01:03.600
My name is John Smith Theodore, and today we're still I'm so excited to welcome Michael Patterson, formerly of the Pennsylvania Ballet, to our program today.
00:01:03.759 --> 00:01:12.719
And he has a lot to share with us about being a dancer in a ballet company, as well as now he's opened his own ballet school.
00:01:12.960 --> 00:01:22.799
And so I'm gonna let Michael tell you about his transition from dancer to studio owner and owning his own ballet school.
00:01:22.960 --> 00:01:25.199
So thank you, Michael, for being with us.
00:01:25.359 --> 00:01:26.960
I really appreciate you taking the time.
00:01:27.120 --> 00:01:31.599
I know what it's like to own a dance studio, and it's crazy.
00:01:31.759 --> 00:01:32.400
So thank you.
00:01:32.719 --> 00:01:34.960
Thank you for taking a few minutes to talk to us.
00:01:36.159 --> 00:01:37.759
Thank you for having me on.
00:01:38.640 --> 00:01:52.719
So tell us a little bit about your journey to becoming a dancer and why you think being on, you know, my my thing about the Teachers podcast is taught how to be a healthy dancer in mind, body, and spirit.
00:01:52.960 --> 00:01:59.599
So I want to hear a little bit about how you think your philosophy at your studio fits into that.
00:01:59.759 --> 00:02:03.919
And then also about your journey to becoming a dancer.
00:02:05.520 --> 00:02:15.359
Well, so I think my journey to becoming a dancer, I can really credit to the public broadcasting network or to PBS.
00:02:15.919 --> 00:02:23.680
Um I grew up in a very rural town in Pennsylvania, Titusville, Pennsylvania, on a dairy farm.
00:02:23.919 --> 00:02:28.319
And we had four TV stations, if you could imagine it.
00:02:28.639 --> 00:02:32.960
Um we had four TV channels, and one of them happened to be PBS.
00:02:33.439 --> 00:02:47.039
And I remember seeing uh Nutcracker with Gelsey Kirkland and Mikhail Barishnikov, and um which I can still picture the costumes and the sets and the TV I was watching it on.
00:02:47.280 --> 00:02:52.960
And I was six years old, and I told my parents that I wanted to do that.
00:02:53.359 --> 00:03:08.079
Um, and and growing up on a farm and being one of six children, um, we we didn't have a lot of money, and we weren't really allowed to do a lot of activities unless they included farm work.
00:03:08.319 --> 00:03:27.039
And so my parents also thought that because I was six that I would lose interest uh in in ballet, and um it wasn't until six years later when I was 12 that I asked them again, and I said, I really want to do this, um, that they allowed me to.
00:03:27.359 --> 00:03:33.679
Um, so my my journey to ballet began long before I started it.
00:03:34.000 --> 00:03:41.439
Um, and I'm I'm a firm believer of you end up where you're supposed to be, uh, regardless of the path.
00:03:41.919 --> 00:03:55.280
And for me, I think one of the things that I'm looking forward to discussing is how to how to continue the education that I received in a very nurturing environment.
00:03:55.519 --> 00:04:03.519
How do you give that to the next generation and support them the way that I was supported early on in my career?
00:04:03.919 --> 00:04:10.159
Um my journey has not been even by any means.
00:04:10.319 --> 00:04:17.920
Um, it's been up and it's been down, and I've had I've had those struggles that lots of dancers have.
00:04:18.160 --> 00:04:30.639
Um, but how do you relay that to the next generation and teach them how to be critical of what they're doing, but also forgiving at the same time.
00:04:31.040 --> 00:04:37.759
Um, and I think that's something that everybody struggles with, not just dancers, but people in their daily lives.
00:04:38.959 --> 00:04:40.720
So I agree.
00:04:40.879 --> 00:04:52.480
I mean that it that's the thought of it's never enough, you know, to be um, and as dancers, we're always looking to improve, critique ourselves.
00:04:53.120 --> 00:04:58.560
So therefore, you're always feeling like you're not enough and you're looking for critique from features or choreographers.
00:04:59.040 --> 00:05:04.800
And so you're always feeling like you're not enough, yet you need that feedback to continually improve.
00:05:05.120 --> 00:05:22.080
And so it's a fine line of how to nurture, especially a young dancer where they hear talk about language, but when you what they hear, you know, what what you intend to say and what they hear many times is something different.
00:05:22.560 --> 00:05:23.600
Depending on the person.
00:05:23.920 --> 00:05:24.960
Yes, absolutely.
00:05:26.640 --> 00:05:32.080
So tell me about um, you know, what was your favorite?
00:05:32.480 --> 00:05:35.280
So, how did you get to the Pennsylvania Ballet?
00:05:36.960 --> 00:05:40.720
So I I began my training in Erie, Pennsylvania.
00:05:40.879 --> 00:05:43.439
Well, actually, it started before Erie, Pennsylvania.
00:05:43.600 --> 00:05:51.120
I started at a school where we did jazz, ballet, tap, um, and acrobatics uh with a woman.
00:05:51.200 --> 00:05:53.040
Her name was Kathy Turner.
00:05:53.520 --> 00:06:05.520
Um, she was a wonderful person, and after my sister and I studied with her for a year, she told my mom that we were talented and that we needed to go somewhere else.
00:06:05.680 --> 00:06:13.760
Um, and she sent us to a school in Erie, and my mother wound up calling the wrong school.
00:06:14.080 --> 00:06:21.840
So um we wound up at a different school than the teacher had intended me to wind up at.
00:06:22.160 --> 00:06:34.960
But um, I studied with Sharon Fallone, who um I believe her career was at North Carolina Dance Theater in the Graham Company, and her background was much more Graham than ballet.
00:06:35.520 --> 00:06:55.360
Um but she she really taught me everything I I knew about ballet, how to be a kind person, how to be generous, and how to how to be meticulous and encouraged my artistry.
00:06:55.920 --> 00:07:05.040
Um and when I was a junior in high school, she encouraged me to audition for Juilliard.
00:07:05.600 --> 00:07:08.879
Um, and I had never heard of Juilliard.
00:07:09.280 --> 00:07:22.000
I, you know, I think there's a movie a long time ago that came out, and there was a dancer that was hoping to get into Juilliard, and this was either before or after my audition.
00:07:22.240 --> 00:07:29.439
And I remember children just they didn't understand ballet, they didn't understand where I was going every day.
00:07:29.760 --> 00:07:45.680
And it wasn't until I auditioned for Juilliard as a junior in high school and got in that people really kind of took notice of what I was doing and that it, wow, it must really mean something.
00:07:46.080 --> 00:07:59.120
Um, and Ben Harkervey, who was the director of Juilliard at the time, told me that if I wanted to go to Juilliard and be in a modern company, that this was definitely the place for me.
00:07:59.520 --> 00:08:14.400
And that if I wanted to be in a ballet company, I was looking at the school in Carlisle, Central Pennsylvania Youth Ballet, and he said that if I wanted to be in a ballet company, that that was definitely the place that I should go.
00:08:14.800 --> 00:08:31.439
Um, for me, at that time in my life, I desperately wanted to be in a ballet company, and so I made the decision to go to Central Pennsylvania Youth Ballet instead of Carlotte or instead of Juilliard.
00:08:31.840 --> 00:08:45.039
And it was while I was there toward the end of my senior year, um, Pennsylvania Ballet was doing Sleeping Beauty, and they had a few dancers that were injured in the ballet company.
00:08:45.360 --> 00:08:54.399
And Roy Kaiser, who was the director at the time, contacted the school in Carlisle and said that they needed more boys if they had them.
00:08:54.879 --> 00:09:04.159
And myself and another dancer went to Philadelphia and we learned parts in Sleeping Beauty.
00:09:04.480 --> 00:09:09.039
And you know, everything happens the way it's supposed to happen.
00:09:09.120 --> 00:09:19.360
And for me, my journey, I auditioned for a bunch of ballet companies, and I didn't have anything in writing as to where I was going.
00:09:19.519 --> 00:10:00.399
You know, I got into FAB for the summer, I um, but I didn't hear back from anybody offering me something, and so I went to Philadelphia and I did this performance of Sleeping Beauty, and it so happened that the other dancer that was brought in with me, we were learning opposite sides of the court couple's dance in the ballet in the opening of the I believe the third act, and we uh a dancer was double capped and did not realize it.
00:10:00.559 --> 00:10:12.719
And so I was learning one side, my friend was learning the other side, and the curtain goes up and nobody's on stage.
00:10:16.480 --> 00:10:27.439
The curtain goes up and nobody's on stage, and I run upstairs and I change into the person's costume and perform the role.
00:10:27.519 --> 00:10:35.919
I had to reverse everything on stage, and following the performance, I was offered a contract for the following year.
00:10:36.159 --> 00:10:36.559
Wow.
00:10:36.719 --> 00:10:48.000
Um, so you know, a lot of a lot of things happen um that we don't have control over, but we we wind up where we're supposed to be.
00:10:48.399 --> 00:11:02.079
I think it's true, we all have a path and we never know what how it's gonna end up, but you were in the right place at the right time, and what a it's a testament to your own ability to pick things up.
00:11:02.319 --> 00:11:05.039
And um so that's amazing.
00:11:05.279 --> 00:11:10.719
What was your favorite part of being in Pennsylvania Ballet like as your career?
00:11:10.879 --> 00:11:16.959
Is there a certain role that you loved doing, or was there a certain part of being in the company?
00:11:18.399 --> 00:11:28.079
I think the thing that I most enjoyed about being in the company, you know, from a young age, from when I first started dancing, I always enjoyed teaching.
00:11:28.399 --> 00:11:35.919
And I knew that in order to be taken seriously as a teacher, I needed to have professional credentials to back it up.
00:11:36.159 --> 00:11:43.839
So for me, I if I could have been a professional class taker for the rest of my life, I probably would have been.
00:11:44.079 --> 00:11:50.159
Um, but since that's not possible, um, I did a lot of the performances.
00:11:50.399 --> 00:12:05.759
I would say one of my favorite performances was um doing Trey McIntyre's Blue Until June or um Um Twilight Arts Nine Sinatra songs all the way.
00:12:06.159 --> 00:12:16.799
Um I danced at Potada at Ballet Austin, and it was just, I mean, there's there's nothing like losing yourself in a ballet.
00:12:17.039 --> 00:12:22.399
Um, but there's so many experiences that it's almost overwhelming to choose one.
00:12:22.719 --> 00:12:28.399
Um, I was with Pennsylvania Ballet, we also performed at the Edinburgh International Arts Festival.
00:12:28.480 --> 00:12:42.959
We did Chris Wheelden Swan Lake, and so like that in itself was just like an unforgettable moment having the Tchaikovsky Symphony Orchestra of Moscow Radio as our orchestra.
00:12:43.199 --> 00:12:56.799
Um it's not any one particular moment, but many experiences over the course of the years that really impacted my life.
00:12:57.360 --> 00:12:59.919
Um did your sister go on to dance?
00:13:00.079 --> 00:13:04.240
You said that your sister, you and your sister were both talented.
00:13:05.039 --> 00:13:05.439
Yes.
00:13:05.599 --> 00:13:11.360
So my my sister wound up uh dancing in Erie with with our local company.
00:13:11.519 --> 00:13:13.919
We had a very small company at the time.
00:13:14.079 --> 00:13:22.159
Um, and she did do some some work there, um, but then she moved on and went to college.
00:13:22.639 --> 00:13:47.519
So it's very cool that your parents listened to you and and you know, actually found found what you needed, you know, that they listened so because it's gotta be hard if you are on a dairy farm and you have to make the effort to get your I always say parents, you know, have to make an effort to get their kids to where they need to be.
00:13:47.679 --> 00:13:51.360
And so, you know, good for your parents that they listen.
00:13:52.399 --> 00:14:02.000
Yeah, as as one of six children, it was just you do one thing and you do it well, and you do it to the best of your ability.
00:14:02.159 --> 00:14:07.120
And when you don't enjoy it anymore, we'll find something else for you to do.
00:14:07.360 --> 00:14:15.279
But you know, with with six kids, there's limited time to get you from point A to point B.
00:14:16.159 --> 00:14:36.480
And I really think that that helped shape me into the person that I am today, is that I dedicated so much time to something, and it's something that I encourage parents to do that if your child has an interest to indulge it as much as possible because that is how they will learn to work hard.
00:14:36.639 --> 00:14:48.240
And if they don't enjoy something, have them move on to something else because it's when you love something, you're willing to do almost anything it takes to continue it.
00:14:48.559 --> 00:14:49.679
It's true.
00:14:50.000 --> 00:14:54.399
Um so now you have your own ballet school.
00:14:54.559 --> 00:14:57.120
How how wonderful! What's the name of it?
00:14:58.319 --> 00:15:03.439
Uh it's the Patterson School of Ballet, and it's located in Erie, Pennsylvania.
00:15:03.839 --> 00:15:07.199
So back to where you back to where you came from.
00:15:07.519 --> 00:15:08.879
That's that's amazing.
00:15:09.519 --> 00:15:15.360
So tell me about your school and you know, um what made you decide.
00:15:15.519 --> 00:15:22.240
You said you always liked teaching, so it must have been something you wanted to do for a long time.
00:15:23.199 --> 00:15:23.679
Yes.
00:15:24.000 --> 00:15:34.799
So um I opened the school in August of 2014, but I started teaching almost immediately after I joined Pennsylvania Ballet.
00:15:35.120 --> 00:15:50.079
Um, a very dear friend of mine, Gabriela Yadanich, was in the company, and her mother was the founding principal dancer of the company, and she invited me to come and teach at her school after I did a guesting for her.
00:15:50.639 --> 00:16:00.559
And I remember she called me one day and said, Oh, somebody's coming to watch you teach.
00:16:00.719 --> 00:16:04.000
And it was probably about a half hour before class.
00:16:04.319 --> 00:16:10.159
And I said, Okay, well, you know, who's who's coming to watch class?
00:16:10.719 --> 00:16:13.839
And she said, Barbara Weisberger.
00:16:14.240 --> 00:16:25.439
And Barbara Weisberger was the founder of Pennsylvania Ballet, and here I am, 19 years old, you know, teaching a class, and Barbara Weisberger is watching.
00:16:25.599 --> 00:16:35.279
And I still remember um her coming up to me at the end of class, and she said, You give a great class, but maybe one less condu.
00:16:36.159 --> 00:16:53.120
And um, you know, and I I was I was so appreciative of her her opinion and her expertise, and um, she had built such a wonderful company and established it from nothing.
00:16:53.679 --> 00:17:00.000
Um, and so that was my first experience teaching at another school.
00:17:00.559 --> 00:17:13.599
And I started the school in August 2014, and it it was really challenging to start the school from almost nothing and build it up over the years.
00:17:13.920 --> 00:17:20.559
But um in the past nine years, we've had kids go on to some professional companies.
00:17:20.720 --> 00:17:29.680
Um, in the beginning, it's harder because you're you're changing uh training that isn't quite where it should be.
00:17:29.920 --> 00:17:38.079
Um, but this past year I had four graduating seniors, well, three graduating seniors and one about to graduate.
00:17:38.640 --> 00:17:53.119
Uh one joined Sacramento Ballet as a trainee, one joined Milwaukee Valley as a trainee, one joined Ballet Met in Columbus as a trainee, and one joined New York City Ballet this fall for the 75th anniversary.
00:17:53.440 --> 00:17:56.159
So you must be very proud.
00:17:58.000 --> 00:18:00.559
Um that's a big deal.
00:18:00.720 --> 00:18:03.359
Um, it is hard to start a studio.
00:18:03.519 --> 00:18:27.440
Uh I don't know if you started it from scratch or bought somebody else's, but it's just hard because no matter what, you're getting kids that come from someplace else and you have to take away from what they've already learned that sometimes you have to work on new habits and you know developing better techniques, things like that.
00:18:27.839 --> 00:18:28.639
It can be hard.
00:18:29.039 --> 00:18:30.879
Um I give you a lot of credit.
00:18:31.359 --> 00:18:50.240
Um tell me a little bit about you know, I'm sure it's different when you were a dancer versus now, but what kind of messages do you send to your dancers uh regarding taking care of themselves both mentally and physically as a dancer?
00:18:52.960 --> 00:19:02.000
I think for children, I think the hardest thing to emphasize is that the mirror is a tool.
00:19:02.240 --> 00:19:05.359
The mirror is not a reflection of who you are.
00:19:06.079 --> 00:19:13.279
Um and the mirror is a tool to change what you have control over in that particular moment.
00:19:13.839 --> 00:19:15.599
Is my knee straight enough?
00:19:15.759 --> 00:19:17.680
Is my foot pointed enough?
00:19:18.000 --> 00:19:24.399
Not, oh, I have an ugly foot, oh my legs are too short, oh my chest is too big.
00:19:24.559 --> 00:19:28.079
Those are those are things that you do not have control over.
00:19:28.240 --> 00:19:43.519
And I think that that letting students know that sometimes is yes, we all have these thoughts about what we like and what we don't like about ourselves, but what can I fix right now?
00:19:44.159 --> 00:19:50.159
And and how students are trained is really important for their body development.
00:19:50.639 --> 00:19:51.039
Right.
00:19:51.279 --> 00:20:00.720
Um, numerous teachers that I have had over the years say if you jump it, if you jump people too much, it makes their thighs bulky.
00:20:01.200 --> 00:20:07.920
Um, I'm a firm believer that if a student is trained well, there's not a lot to worry about that.
00:20:08.319 --> 00:20:20.319
Um, but as a dancer, you know, your body is your your instrument, it's your vehicle for you know presenting what you have to the audience.
00:20:20.639 --> 00:20:24.639
And my students, I say, you know, it's the maintenance.
00:20:24.879 --> 00:20:30.240
The older you get, the more maintenance there is on your body in order to keep it running.
00:20:30.480 --> 00:20:36.319
And it's not really about I don't talk to the children about their weight.
00:20:36.799 --> 00:20:43.519
Um, because I think that if if they're working properly, that that's not a problem.
00:20:43.839 --> 00:21:01.440
And I know for some people, I mean, there are schools where people make them count calories, there's schools where they bring nutritionists in, and and I think that if if schools do bring a nutritionist in, it shouldn't be for the children.
00:21:01.680 --> 00:21:06.480
Um you know, it's it's parents are in charge of what their kids are eating.
00:21:06.720 --> 00:21:24.240
So if people want to understand how to how to um take care of the body, um, especially when you're an elite athlete, that you're talking to the wrong person if you're talking to children.
00:21:24.799 --> 00:21:33.680
Um, along with body positivity, like I know that there are companies that I will never be tall.
00:21:34.480 --> 00:21:41.680
So if I'm looking at a company and all the dancers are tall, I I will never be happy there.
00:21:42.319 --> 00:21:53.920
Um, you know, if there's a ballet company and everybody has beautiful, crazy feet, and I have a nice foot, it's not great, my body doesn't fit with that company.
00:21:54.399 --> 00:22:11.200
And and I think teaching kids that there is a place for you, there's a place where your body's going to be accepted, where you are going to be accepted, is so important because if you don't feel like you belong, you will always be unhappy.
00:22:12.079 --> 00:22:13.119
I I love that.
00:22:13.279 --> 00:22:25.279
I mean, I think first of all, I like your your the mirror is a tool because you know kids use it as a way to pick themselves apart or compare themselves to other kids.
00:22:26.720 --> 00:22:28.079
It's true that it's a tool.
00:22:28.319 --> 00:22:35.599
And it's a tool we have to learn to use, and a tool we have to learn to not use, and be able to be away from the mirror.
00:22:36.079 --> 00:22:44.319
And uh and then the other part is that we're gonna be able to do that.
00:22:49.920 --> 00:22:59.279
When I speak to students, you know, I think I told you I always speak about how to be a healthy dancer and mind, body, and spirit.
00:22:59.440 --> 00:23:04.960
You know, I never talk about eating disorders or anything about that.
00:23:05.200 --> 00:23:15.839
Um and but if I talk to parents, I absolutely talk about the warning signs or teachers, um, because I think that that's who needs to be aware.
00:23:16.000 --> 00:23:24.879
Um and so thank you for that, because there are there are studios out there that still weigh students and you know it can be very hard for kids.
00:23:25.039 --> 00:23:27.359
And you're right, you have to find the right place.
00:23:27.440 --> 00:23:31.759
There's a place in dance for everyone, but you have to find the place for you.
00:23:32.720 --> 00:23:41.599
Yes, and I think too that you know, the thing that I stress to kids is that is a piano more beautiful than a violin?
00:23:42.319 --> 00:23:45.839
You know, is a violin more beautiful than a saxophone?
00:23:46.240 --> 00:23:48.960
You know, some people love the piano.
00:23:49.359 --> 00:23:53.279
I I took piano for a little bit and I hated every minute of it.
00:23:53.519 --> 00:24:02.879
You know, but some people love the piano, some people love a violin, and it just depends on where you are whether or not your instrument is going to be appreciated.
00:24:03.039 --> 00:24:05.200
Do you have the right audience?
00:24:06.240 --> 00:24:16.960
Um and I think that that is helpful in realizing that there is a place for you, but maybe it's not the right place where you currently are.
00:24:17.920 --> 00:24:26.720
What do you think parents and dance educators need to know to help young dancers?
00:24:29.599 --> 00:24:42.960
I think that the older I get, the more I try and remind myself of what it was like to have the teachers that I had.
00:24:43.599 --> 00:24:50.159
Um my teacher was very nurturing and I adored her.
00:24:51.119 --> 00:25:07.440
And I think that that was an important step in my training, but sometimes I feel that it didn't prepare me for what the world was like outside.
00:25:08.480 --> 00:25:20.159
Um, and then I have had teachers that were were very kind but could cut you like a knife, and I also see where that can go.
00:25:20.960 --> 00:25:34.720
And you're always trying to find this balance of what is enough encouragement, what is too harsh, what is too gentle, um, and what is not enough.
00:25:34.799 --> 00:25:38.319
And I think it's it's very much like being a parent.
00:25:38.480 --> 00:25:55.440
You're always trying to do what is best for the child, and I have to put my ego aside because I can very easily come down on somebody and say, you're not doing a good job, you're making me look bad.
00:25:56.480 --> 00:26:10.799
And that is something that's very dangerous for a teacher because at the end of the day, if somebody is going to be a dancer or going to be a professional, they have to do the work and they have to meet you halfway.
00:26:11.440 --> 00:26:18.399
I'm the person with the expertise, but you are the person that has to do the work.
00:26:18.639 --> 00:26:22.159
So it's it's a it's a partnership.
00:26:22.799 --> 00:26:25.440
And it's it's just like raising children.
00:26:25.519 --> 00:26:29.839
If your child doesn't want to clean their room, there's going to be turmoil.
00:26:30.639 --> 00:26:35.599
Um, you know, and it's is it is it worth beating up that child?
00:26:37.279 --> 00:26:40.079
Or or let them enjoy the experience.
00:26:40.240 --> 00:26:46.480
And I think sometimes teachers' egos can get in the way of them doing good.
00:26:47.680 --> 00:27:09.119
And as a dance teacher, sometimes you spend more time with kids than they spend with their parents, you know, so you have a huge influence on them and um and have a lot of opportunity to really um offer positive messages to them, you know.
00:27:09.279 --> 00:27:40.960
And it's like we started off, how do you how do you give constructive criticism and let them know that that's to shape them and make them a better dancer or human and that it's not criticizing them per se, you know, it's because I always used to tell uh my students, say thank you, because if I'm giving you a you know, a conrecting you, it's because I care.
00:27:43.680 --> 00:27:44.319
Yeah.
00:27:44.720 --> 00:27:53.440
And I think too that, you know, for kids, we do spend so much time with them sometimes, sometimes more than parents.
00:27:53.599 --> 00:27:57.440
And especially as they get older and they study more intensely.
00:27:57.680 --> 00:28:03.519
I think it's important for, I mean, my students know that I make mistakes.
00:28:03.839 --> 00:28:18.000
I I full-on admit them, they've seen me make them, but mistakes and failure are part of learning, and they're oftentimes the best teachers or the failures.
00:28:18.639 --> 00:28:25.039
Um, I have learned more from failing than I have from succeeding.
00:28:25.599 --> 00:28:32.319
Um, succeeding has taught me arrogance at times, and failure has taught me humility.
00:28:33.119 --> 00:28:35.039
Yeah, it's true.
00:28:35.599 --> 00:28:47.920
You know, we learn from the mistakes that we make in life, and as a dancer, that's why you're being, you know, given uh corrections is because you you want to improve.
00:28:49.839 --> 00:28:50.159
Yes.
00:28:50.960 --> 00:28:54.000
It's not to break you apart, but it's to make you feel better.
00:28:54.319 --> 00:29:00.079
What positive messages or message do you send to your dancers today?
00:29:01.519 --> 00:29:08.240
I I think the message to send to kids is to be grateful for what you have and not what you have not.
00:29:09.519 --> 00:29:17.119
Um the have nots will ruin your life much faster than the haves.
00:29:17.839 --> 00:29:25.599
And it's we have so many wonderful things in life, but it's easy to take them for granted.
00:29:26.240 --> 00:29:26.720
Yeah.
00:29:28.000 --> 00:29:29.599
I really like that.
00:29:30.639 --> 00:29:36.079
Use because it's like the glass half full or half empty.
00:29:36.240 --> 00:29:52.639
We have to focus on what we do have because it in in just in general, not only with dancers, but in general in life, like being appreciative of what we have and not always wanting something that we can't obtain or isn't possible.
00:29:52.960 --> 00:29:59.119
Um, you know, look, strive to be the best that you can be, but also recognize what your limitations are.
00:30:00.240 --> 00:30:13.680
Yes, yeah, and I and I think too that for kids, they kids don't see the struggles that other people have to go through.
00:30:14.000 --> 00:30:20.159
You know, for for a lot of children, they they are strong, but they have to get flexible.
00:30:20.480 --> 00:30:23.920
For kids that are flexible, they have to get strong.
00:30:24.159 --> 00:30:46.319
And so somebody has a struggle, and you don't always see what that struggle is, but everybody struggles, and it's figuring out what yours is and how to overcome it that really helps you you flourish not only as a dancer but as an individual.
00:30:46.639 --> 00:30:47.200
Yeah.
00:30:47.920 --> 00:30:50.159
That's true, very true.
00:30:50.879 --> 00:30:55.440
Michael, your students are lucky to have you, you know.
00:30:55.680 --> 00:31:08.319
Uh, and what a great uh transition from from dairy farm to dancer, and then going back to the community where you came from.
00:31:08.480 --> 00:31:10.720
The dairy farm, was it far from Erie?
00:31:12.079 --> 00:31:15.279
Uh it's about an hour from Erie, Pennsylvania.
00:31:15.599 --> 00:31:16.000
Uh-huh.
00:31:17.519 --> 00:31:18.159
Sorry.
00:31:18.319 --> 00:31:23.519
Um, the dairy farm is about an hour from uh Erie, Pennsylvania.
00:31:23.680 --> 00:31:29.759
So when I first started training in Erie, my parents would drive to and from Erie.
00:31:30.319 --> 00:31:36.319
You know, I think we started three or four days a week, and then it was six days a week.
00:31:36.639 --> 00:31:47.200
And then my mom went back to school, so she got an apartment in Erie, and my parents lived in separate houses so that my sister and I could continue to dance.
00:31:47.759 --> 00:31:59.839
And um, and it was really challenging, but I appreciate the sacrifices that they made because their sacrifices have given me the life that I have today.
00:32:00.159 --> 00:32:01.920
Yeah, it's very true.
00:32:02.159 --> 00:32:06.319
Um thank you, Michael, for taking the time to talk to us.
00:32:06.399 --> 00:32:10.720
I think you have so much insight, and I learned a lot from you.
00:32:11.039 --> 00:32:24.879
And um, it's why I love doing the podcast because I get to talk to different people, and everybody has something new to add uh information for me and for the listeners.
00:32:25.039 --> 00:32:26.240
So thank you so much.
00:32:26.399 --> 00:32:28.079
I really appreciate your time.
00:32:28.319 --> 00:32:33.680
Um and for the listeners of Tutu Thin, I want to thank Michael for being here with us.
00:32:33.759 --> 00:32:48.480
And as always, if you have any questions, please uh reach out to me on my uh my website at dontheodore.com or tutothin.com or Instagram at um tutu underscore thin.
00:32:48.799 --> 00:32:51.519
Thank you so much for listening and have a wonderful day.
